Modern cart and countermeasures

198
Modern cart and countermeasures

Today, the fighting in Ukraine has shown how effective light armored vehicles can be. The Armed Forces of Ukraine demonstrate simply excellent possession and use of light armored and armed vehicles, with the help of which assault groups create tension and practically mark the path for heavy equipment.

At one time, we laughed at how the Ukrainians tried to drag almost all the weapons available in the ground forces to the base of a wheeled off-road vehicle.



I am 200% sure that the Western allies did not do without some adjustment, and the tactics of using light armored vehicles today in the Armed Forces of Ukraine are simply excellent.


And the fact that since 2014 the Ukrainians have been creating a wide variety of “jihad-mobiles” in the workshops, as they say, made it possible to fill their hands and at the present time they are quite able to get something meaningful.

Fortunately, platforms from all over Europe (and not only Europe) were given more than enough. It is worth noting here that yes, the same Humvee that all the allies gave, it is not a military vehicle until you pile up some weapons on it. Therefore, they gave it with an eye to the fact that the Ukrainians would give mind to technology.


And they gave. Today, the Armed Forces of Ukraine have at their disposal a decent amount of light armored vehicles, equipped not only with automatic cannons and machine guns, but also with ATGMs, air defense systems and mortars. For any, as they say, taste. Both factory and handicraft production. There were enough Samodelkins in Ukraine at all times.


The use of light armored vehicles (LBT) is justified. In conditions of large distances, faster and more maneuverable vehicles overcome the distances between points much faster than tracked vehicles and, in some cases, even more passable due to lower specific pressure on the surface. In the conditions of the vast field spaces of Ukraine, it is very useful.

In principle, an infantry platoon planted on such carts is already being drawn. 6 vehicles for 5 people, one with MANPADS crews, one with ATGMs, the rest with grenade launchers, machine guns, automatic guns. You can fasten "Cornflower", it will also work very effectively. And as a result, we have quite a mobile unit capable of carrying out a fairly wide range of tasks. And given that it’s more difficult to get into a nimble car than into slower ones Tanks and infantry fighting vehicles, it is also safer than just advancing in an open field. Plus, in addition to speed and maneuverability, the car also has much more fuel autonomy.

Overall it turned out perfect. weapon for deep raids, coverage, strikes from the rear, reconnaissance and the like.

The tank on the battlefield is still good. True, there are more methods against this crowbar. And tank operations in the conditions of Ukraine are somewhat more difficult to carry out, primarily because of the large line of contact, which is not easy for both sides to saturate with tanks.

Nobody says that Ukraine has no problems with tanks. They still have their own, they have donated by both the Europeans and the Russian army. But even despite the generous "Russian Lend-Lease", the Armed Forces of Ukraine frankly lack such. Therefore, “crutches” were invented in the form of modern carts, and only later it turned out that LBT has its own niche, where it can be used very effectively.

Moreover, it is worth noting that "carts" are far from always handicraft and self-made. Moreover, handicraft does not dare to call the combat module attached to the Humvee with automatic weapons, and even in factory conditions. There are still enough factories in Ukraine for such operations, here it rather limits the entire number of modules that the Ukrainian industry can produce.

Given that the United States and European allies have donated more than 2015 Humvees to Ukraine since XNUMX, there is work to be done. And the fact that after such alterations, the seemingly non-lethal transport Humvee easily turns into a combat vehicle.


And as a result, flying squads on SUVs with DRGs have become a very unpleasant phenomenon on the battlefields, even "self-made" carts have value, we are generally silent about those made in the factory. The Ukrainian theater of operations, and these are mainly steppe areas, small forests and forest belts, is most suitable for high-speed and less vulnerable to artillery armored jeeps. This is how mobile installations with ZSU-23-2 in the bodies, put forward on the route of Russian bombers, shot down two Su-34s that were trying to break through to targets at low altitude.

With regards to ground use, carts are used in exactly the same way as "jihad-mobiles": under the cover of darkness, he advanced into the forest belt, and then the same tactics - he jumped out, shot back, and went back.

Carts are very actively used as bait in counter-battery work. A pair of such cars begins to "nightmare" out of the forest, until someone on the opposite side can't stand the nerves and he does not cause artillery fire on this forest. The job is done, at least the gunners will have to change positions, which leaves the infantry for some time without fire cover.

But the main task of the carts is the offensive. The Armed Forces of Ukraine now have only two types of offensive tactics.

The first is the classic concentration of forces with heavy equipment on a narrow section of the front and inflicting a heavy frontal strike. Indeed, a classic of the Second World War.

The second is just the use of carts due to the lack of heavy equipment. The LBT is being used as a breakthrough and circumvention tool. The attack is not on the forehead, but on the flanks. Carts at speed bypass positions and fortified points, creating a threat of encirclement, or at least the appearance of such a threat. LBTs are also very well suited for delivering infantry to new positions behind enemy lines. Or fixing a gap in the defense, where the Ukrainian infantry and even equipment later entered. Pure water realization of numerical advantage.

So, by the way, it was north of Balakleya, where the Armed Forces of Ukraine took advantage of the "holes" in the front line, threw masses of infantry and carts there. And they all succeeded.

I won’t dare to call it a full-fledged platoon tactical group, but how Ukrainians use LBT probably depends very much on how well the head of a particular commander works and on the fleet of vehicles that he has at his disposal. That is, a smart one and with a dozen armored vehicles will do things, but a company of tanks will not save a fool.

But Ukrainians are rapidly getting smarter, that's the problem. They have very good teachers. And, not being able to supply the Armed Forces of Ukraine with the proper number of tanks (or not wanting to part with the Abrams and Leopards), American and British specialists taught the Ukrainians how to effectively use what they have at hand. Given that, in addition to the donated Humvees, the Armed Forces of Ukraine had at their disposal enough armored vehicles of the Raptor, Kozak, Novator, and Varta types. Of course, the Humvee is already a LBT classic, but Ukrainian cars were also taken quite well, if not in quality, then in quantity.


But if we talk about quality, then, perhaps, the Humvee, proven over the years and wars, is quite a worthy car. We also have our own examples, from the "Patriot" with a large-caliber "Kord" and ASG-30 to the "Tiger", in which you can generally stuff a lot of things.


The Tiger, of course, is a little different from the Humvee, since it weighs from 5 to 7,5 tons versus 4,5 for the American. It is not very correct to compare these cars, they are of different classes. The “shot” is even heavier, up to 12 tons, it is in the same class as the Cossack-2 (15 tons) and Varta (15,5 tons), but from the lighter armored vehicles, the Ukrainians got only the Novator, which is also a lot to carry on - 8,8 tons.

So the old Humvee is really the king of the cart class here. Everything else is heavier and larger in size, although the Russian KAMAZ "Shot" with the BM-30-D "Spoke" module is a smart solution within 12-15 tons.


But this is no longer a cart, because there is already a guidance channel, a thermal imager, and a laser rangefinder in the package. This is no longer a cart.

Yes, we generally do not have such a thing as light armored vehicles or carts. It is not spelled out in the charters of the Armed Forces of Ukraine either, but it is used very successfully. The main thing is efficient. Although our “musicians” easily use LBT as well as Ukrainians, but that is a more flexible system, not like the army.

And here a completely logical question arises: what can the army oppose to carts with DRGs? Which work the same way as in the NWO zone?

Actually - not so much.

The main method of counteraction could be the constant patrolling of places where such groups could pass on LBT, with the help of drones. Alas, it is clear that this is impossible due to the lack of such or not everywhere, but only where they are.

If it is impossible to control from the air, patrols / secrets can be set with direct access to the gunners by radio. That is, having noticed the enemy, such a group will simply and uncomplicatedly call for artillery fire in a given area of ​​​​concentration of fire. Naturally, the area along which it can be convenient for the enemy to break through to the rear must be covered by artillery.

Here, as knowledgeable people who used such tactics during the Chechen wars explained to me, it is difficult to destroy the enemy, but it is quite possible to force them to abandon their plans under artillery fire. And already on the way back, in the event of the start of a withdrawal, the DRG can be met tightly and unfriendly.

Another option was suggested by a participant in the fighting in Afghanistan. Ambush with grenade launchers. It is also possible with an RPG, but it is better to install one (and preferably two) SPG-9 on some hill, well disguised. Given that the grenade launcher is also equipped with a PGN-9, a night infrared sight, such an ambush is quite viable in the dark. "Spear" is able to cover the territory with a radius of one kilometer, it's pretty decent.

Of course, ideally there would be interaction with the army aviation, because a car that goes at a speed of 70-80 km / h is not a target for artillery and mortars. You can only get there by accident. But the realities of today say that it is not harmful to dream.
In general, a modern cart and the lightly armored vehicles that follow it are quite modern, as it increases the variability in the use of infantry.

Yes, in the Russian army there is not even such a thing as “light infantry”, there are no dedicated units that are able to perform tasks, playing from the use of LBT, but the variety of tactical schemes that can provide an advantage requires that they nevertheless appear.

Although our army does not have a lot of things and will not appear soon (such as order), the use of LBT by parts of the Armed Forces of Ukraine shows that a well-built and implemented use of lightly armored vehicles can help achieve success where there are no tanks and other heavy equipment.

It's a matter of time and understanding of the need. We have the technique in theory, it remains to deduce the methods of correct application.
198 comments
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  1. +23
    10 October 2022 04: 35
    The author completely overlooks such weapons as heavy machine guns. NSV Utes on the machine is a very effective weapon against light armor, plus it is quite suitable for firing at fairly high-speed targets, well, it disguises itself, works with nightlights and even aiming radars. Yes, and not as expensive and complicated as the ATGM, which means it is suitable for mass training.
    1. +20
      10 October 2022 04: 54
      Quote: Vladimir_2U
      The author completely overlooks such weapons as heavy machine guns. NSV Cliff on the machine is a very effective weapon against light armor,

      It seems that in vain they rushed to "refuse" from the 14,5-mm Vladimirov machine gun!
      1. +2
        10 October 2022 04: 57
        Quote: Nikolaevich I
        It seems that in vain they rushed to "refuse" from the 14,5-mm Vladimirov machine gun

        As an infantryman, he is very heavy.
        1. +7
          10 October 2022 05: 20
          Modern cart and countermeasures
          Old Man Makhno laid the foundations - and is still relevant!
          1. +4
            10 October 2022 05: 37
            Quote from Uncle Lee
            Old Man Makhno laid the foundations - and is still relevant!

            Little in common, except perhaps the name.
            1. +2
              10 October 2022 05: 52
              Little in common, except perhaps the name.

              Makhno used carts with machine guns massively, and not one by one.
            2. +5
              10 October 2022 06: 10
              Quote: Vladimir_2U
              Little in common

              Yah ! The very fact of installing a machine gun on "wheels" and mass use!
              1. 0
                10 October 2022 06: 52
                Quote from Uncle Lee
                Yah ! The very fact of installing a machine gun on "wheels" and mass use!
                Well, Christmas trees, a machine gun on wheels from the very beginning. I'm talking about tactics. A lightly armored vehicle slips through the oporniki without fear of machine-gun fire, such a number would not have passed with Makhno's carts, and they were also used to defeat naked infantry and cavalry.
                1. +4
                  10 October 2022 12: 20
                  Quote: Vladimir_2U
                  Well, Christmas trees, a machine gun on wheels from the very beginning.
                  From its inception, the machine gun was considered an artillery weapon, had a serious carriage and learned to fire from closed positions. The fact that this is an infantry weapon was not immediately realized.
                  1. +2
                    10 October 2022 15: 13
                    The machine-gun and cartridge carts have been designed, tested and found to be so developed that it is considered possible to start bulk orders for them ...
                    - From the most comprehensive report on the Ministry of War on the activities and condition of all branches of military command for 1909.
                    1. +2
                      10 October 2022 17: 30
                      Quote: Andriuha077
                      From the most comprehensive report on the Ministry of War on the activities and condition of all branches of military command in 1909
                      The Maxim machine gun was created in 1883.
                      1. 0
                        10 October 2022 20: 37
                        Many interesting things are being developed and understood much later than they were created.
                        Once with biplanes, now with drones


          2. +13
            10 October 2022 07: 00
            Hi Vladimir! smile

            You are mistaken, for the first time "Maxim" machine guns were installed on a horse-drawn cart by "volunteers" of Cecil Rhodes (5 or 6 "carts") in the eighties of the nineteenth century and in the battle with the Ndebels, the Lobengulas mowed down almost all of his army.
            In our country, the tactics of using "machine-gun carts" were developed by General Brusilov even before the appearance of all these dads.
            The Germans in the First World War successfully used their own version of the "cart", also "long before and regardless of." smile
            1. +3
              10 October 2022 08: 23
              Quote: Sea Cat
              even before the appearance of all these dads.

              Hi Konstantin hi So I do not dispute the birthright of the "cart"! In the Red Army, too, there were carts, as a branch of service. I'm talking about the continuity of the use of carts in Ukraine, from Makhno to Zeleboba! They like to race with the breeze and shoot in black!
              1. +5
                10 October 2022 08: 46
                I think Old Man Makhno would be offended for putting him on the same level as Bandera. wink
                1. +6
                  10 October 2022 11: 50
                  Quote: Sea Cat
                  Father Makhno would be offended

                  Makhno was a nugget of peasants, and Zeliboba was a puppet on strings!
                  1. +8
                    10 October 2022 13: 04
                    puppet on strings

                    No, not on strings.
                    He is one of those dolls that are pulled on like a glove, with a point on the middle finger. laughing
                    hi
                    1. +1
                      10 October 2022 14: 16
                      Quote: OldMichael
                      point on the middle finger

                      And don't jump! lol
                  2. +1
                    10 October 2022 17: 28
                    According to modern sources, they are not much different. The first was controlled by the Anglo-Saxons in civilian life, and the second is controlled by them at the moment.
            2. +1
              10 October 2022 18: 10
              How were carts used in the above cases? Was the fire fired from a moving wagon, a stopped wagon, or was the machine gun brought to the position and unloaded there?
              This is a big difference.
              1. 0
                10 October 2022 19: 09
                I won’t say anything about the Germans, I don’t know, I didn’t see instructions, I didn’t read descriptions.
                "Volunteers" Rhodes used machine guns in different ways. On the march, they fired on the attacking Ndebels on the move, during the main battle, machine guns on wagons were thrown to the most threatening areas, fire was fired both from the ground and from the wagon.
                1. +1
                  11 October 2022 17: 01
                  And carts in the Red Army were used for flank detours, together with the cavalry, firing on the move, and not just from a stopped cart, there was a group use.
                  And carts were specially adapted for this.
                  Big difference
                  1. 0
                    11 October 2022 17: 17
                    the fire was fired ........... and from the wagon.


                    That is, right off the bat, perhaps the flanks were covered. There is not a lot of information, and in general this is the first mass use of machine guns in a real battle, there was no knowledge, no tactics of use, everything went experimentally, and therefore, in my opinion, it is not correct to compare the "pioneers" with those who came to the ready. In addition, there is some difference between the regular units and the "volunteers" of Rhodes, and their opponents were different.
                    1. 0
                      11 October 2022 17: 25
                      And you do not consider the option that they appeared independently of each other.
                      Just the time has come and the idea itself asked.

                      Moreover, different leashes have been used in war since ancient times.
                      1. 0
                        11 October 2022 17: 42
                        And you do not consider the option that they appeared independently of each other.

                        Funny, but how do you imagine it?

                        In November 1893, Great Britain invaded the Ndebele country with the help of the British South Africa Company, declaring the threat from Lobengula's army as the reason for the war. British volunteers actively used Maxim machine guns, which led to heavy losses among the Ndebele warriors.

                        In 1901, the 7,62-mm Maxim machine gun on an English-style wheeled carriage was adopted by the ground forces, during this year the first 40 Maxim machine guns entered the Russian army.

                        As they say: "Where is the river, and where is the estate" (c))))))
                      2. 0
                        11 October 2022 17: 53
                        And where is the connection with the cart from the times of the Civil War in Russia - did the Red Army know about the use of carts in Africa, were there serious reasons to use this experience?
                      3. 0
                        11 October 2022 18: 09
                        in the Red Army knew about the use of carts in Africa, were there serious reasons to use this experience?

                        I have no idea, and there is no one to ask. request But in general, I was talking about who was the first to think of using a wagon as a self-propelled firing point with a machine gun. Someone was the first, and then everyone else.
                      4. 0
                        12 October 2022 13: 57
                        What is there to think about?
                        Artillery limber, how many centuries at that time ...
                      5. 0
                        12 October 2022 14: 04
                        What is there to think about?


                        But milestones do not work, that's what we're talking about.
            3. 0
              29 December 2022 10: 41
              A tachanka is a vehicle for transporting a machine gun, and not at all for firing from it.
          3. +5
            10 October 2022 08: 38
            Old Man Makhno laid the foundations - and is still relevant!
            Only in the absence of a solid front line. So far so in present-day Sumeria.
            1. +2
              11 October 2022 20: 06
              Quote: Aviator_
              Only in the absence of a solid front line. So far so in present-day Sumeria.
              Without solid line front -
              First - "empty areas" need to be mined - the enemy will not be able to clear mine instantly and not noticeably.
              Second - all "empty areas" must be "at gunpoint" MLRS - Grad, Hurricane, Tornado - release fast и lot shells and cover large area - "Carts" will not have time to leave.
              hi
          4. +6
            10 October 2022 09: 12
            in the tank and mechanized divisions of the Wehrmacht during the Second World War, there was a motorcycle battalion. His task included reconnaissance of roads and the search for weaknesses in the enemy's defenses, where the bulk of German equipment rushed. Those. the tactics of light forces in the west has been worked out since 1941, today it is only being improved with the development of weapons. The experience of the Second World War says that either a front cemented by infantry and artillery, without weak points, or other mobile forces can cope with mobile forces, under competent control! The bypassing supporters of the DRG on carts, in the rear, should be caught by their counter-drg, which should overtake them, tie them up in battle and either destroy them on their own, or with the help of, for example, helicopters or UAVs, or a motorized rifle reserve on wheeled armored personnel carriers, which can also quickly arrive at the desired point front. soldier
            1. 0
              10 October 2022 19: 58
              Quote: Eroma
              in the tank and mechanized divisions of the Wehrmacht during the Second World War, there was a motorcycle battalion. His task included reconnaissance of roads and the search for weaknesses in the enemy's defenses, where the bulk of German equipment rushed. Those. the tactics of light forces in the west has been worked out since 1941, today it is only being improved with the development of weapons. The experience of the Second World War says that either a front cemented by infantry and artillery, without weak points, or other mobile forces can cope with mobile forces, under competent control! The bypassing supporters of the DRG on carts, in the rear, should be caught by their counter-drg, which should overtake them, tie them up in battle and either destroy them on their own, or with the help of, for example, helicopters or UAVs, or a motorized rifle reserve on wheeled armored personnel carriers, which can also quickly arrive at the desired point front.

              We also had motorcycle regiments. And from the age of 43, motorcyclists reinforced with BA-64s and armored personnel carriers were actively used in the forefront. We just put it all under the table.
              1. 0
                10 October 2022 21: 26
                In fact, the effectiveness of these forces is highly dependent on the resilience of the defenders! If the oporniks held the defense tightly, counting on artillery and aviation, and there would be an armored reserve in the rear, then it seems to me that carts would be of little use. Well, they went around the opornik, and in the rear there was a tank skating rink, what should the carts do? Just tick back! lol this is probably why in the USSR such forces were not considered seriously, because the Soviet approach to war was very different from today soldier
                1. +2
                  11 October 2022 17: 15
                  So carts are just the tip of the iceberg - this is only a means of transportation and a carrier of weapons. And most importantly, it is a trained and numerous infantry, a cat. and moves on these very "carts". Actually, the entire effectiveness of carts is based on the fact that their landing force can quickly gain a foothold behind enemy lines, and these very carts are nothing more than consumable cheap vehicles / weapons carriers. At the same time, the higher the level of development of the country, the better these carts - they have light armor, more or less serious weapons. But, I repeat, only in total these elements (cart + infantry + mobility) give the most effective and highly mobile units.

                  The reference to the fact that "the USSR was not seriously considered" is incorrect:
                  Firstly, we considered - we look at what the airborne battalions rode (hint, not everyone had armor according to the state).

                  Secondly. This is yet another scam. For example, in the USSR, before Afghanistan, subsonic attack aircraft were not seriously considered and our analogue of light infantry, mountain rifle units, was disbanded. The latter urgently had to be created after Chechnya. And such "did not consider" - a cart and a small cart. For somewhere they could not, somewhere they did not want to, but somewhere they made a mistake. And the concept was completely different.

                  Third,
                  Quote: Eroma
                  rear tank skating rink, what should carts do

                  it didn’t work like that even during WWII, although many thought so - that the Germans, that we fully felt it because 1) the infantry is already here - dug in in the rear and smashes logistics, 2) the opposing forces are surrounded and knocked out by artillery and all the same infantry, 3) a tank rink may well not come to the rescue - Air Force / art / entrenched infantry and even its own rink.
                  1. 0
                    11 October 2022 18: 00
                    Captivatingly! good thank you hi Your description fits the action of air assault units, but instead of helicopters, carts! belay
                    1. 0
                      11 October 2022 18: 12
                      Yes. So they are similar in many ways. The difference is largely in transport (although not a fact, judging by the Yankees and Rhodesians, as one of the trendsetters in the LP) and in numbers. Actually, that without a cart, that with it this ordinary light infantry. It cannot replace motorized riflemen with infantry fighting vehicles, but it can help significantly.
                      1. 0
                        11 October 2022 19: 31
                        To fight, it turns out that we need a reserve of motorized riflemen on wheeled armored personnel carriers with mortars in order to quickly wet the LP! Tracked vehicles too slow against LP and tanks seem to be redundant
                      2. 0
                        12 October 2022 16: 25
                        Quote: Eroma
                        To fight, it turns out that we need a reserve of motorized riflemen on wheeled armored personnel carriers with mortars in order to quickly wet the LP! Tracked vehicles too slow against LP and tanks seem to be redundant

                        Yes, or their own light infantry, or good artillery spotters, or a strong air force (in fact, it was air supremacy that brought victory to the carts of Chad over the motorized rifle and tank units of the Libyan army).
                        There are a few more points about the cat. It's worth saying:
                        1. LPs on carts in developed countries are much better prepared than conventional motorized rifles.
                        2. LP companies on carts are more numerous than our motorized rifles + motorized rifles are inextricably linked with their armor and its loss is a loss of stability and firepower of the squad.
                        This can be partly cured by adding a 4th vehicle and increasing the platoon-company-battalion.
                        3. LPs perform very well not only in mobile warfare, but also in forests / cities (both due to numbers and training, and due to the ability to act independently of armor) - this directly confirms the experience of the Soviet-Finnish (our and Finnish skiers ), WWII and WWII, the Yankees and, as according to a number of indirect reports, the Wagner and Akhmat detachments - now.
                        4. An armored personnel carrier does not have to be classic - the same new serial BA Spartak and Akhmat can carry a rather "fat" landing.
          5. +7
            10 October 2022 09: 12
            Old Man Makhno laid the foundations - and is still relevant!

            This is all effective with a focal line of defense, and most importantly - in the summer! Let's see how this whole zoo will operate in the fall and winter through the mud and snow..

            In addition, the main component of the success of such tactics is actions along country roads, which for some reason our army did not consider it necessary to mine .. Come on, mine - at least they just dug it with an excavator ..
            1. +1
              10 October 2022 17: 22
              Also a method. It's called an anti-tank ditch. At the Paris-Dakar rally, the natives dug holes, covering them from above, they probably believed that the prey would belong to them. But we need a stable connection with artillery, not to let the ditches calmly sprinkle.
          6. +6
            10 October 2022 10: 19
            Even before the "father", for more than three thousand years, they began to use a chariot with archers hi
          7. 0
            9 November 2022 17: 47
            Yes, not Makhno. Machine-gun gig, the standard of the first world. Machine guns calculation, 5 people plus a driver.
        2. +2
          10 October 2022 05: 40
          Quote: Vladimir_2U
          As an infantryman, he is very heavy.

          Duc, on their "carts"! Our carts against their carts! wink
          1. 0
            10 October 2022 05: 54
            Quote: Nikolaevich I
            Duc, on their "carts"! Our carts against their carts!

            Well, the problem right there is not that the armored vehicles do not have enough firepower, but that there is nothing to oppose their light armor to our oporniks!
            1. AUL
              +5
              10 October 2022 08: 03
              Well, how can there be nothing to oppose? After all
              the Russian KAMAZ "Shot" with the BM-30-D "Spoke" module is a smart solution within 12-15 tons.
              They are in the army - like dirt! It's just not enough to drive everything!
              (If cho is bitter sarcasm...)
            2. 0
              10 October 2022 19: 38
              Quote: Vladimir_2U
              Well, the problem right there is not that the armored vehicles do not have enough firepower, but that there is nothing to oppose their light armor to our oporniks!

              Well I do not know! In theory, any combat-ready armored personnel carrier (70-80-82) with a KPVT or something larger is a very formidable opponent for a "cart". The armor is really so-so, but in terms of means of destruction, full parity, if not a priority hi
              Question as usual... in use request
              1. 0
                11 October 2022 07: 28
                Quote: Adrey
                Well I do not know! In theory, any combat-ready armored personnel carrier (70-80-82) with a KPVT or larger is a very formidable opponent for a "cart"

                Only the whole trouble is that on most of the oporniks there were no armored personnel carriers!
            3. 0
              10 October 2022 21: 32
              After all, oporniki don’t storm carts, there’s quite something to oppose them! The carts of the rear are making nightmares, cutting off the ops, in the absence of reserves, this is death to the ops! And at the same time, the carts are paving the way for the main forces, bypassing the supporters!
              1. 0
                11 October 2022 07: 30
                Quote: Eroma
                After all, oporniki don’t storm carts, there’s quite something to oppose them!

                But there was nothing, RPGs would not take a quick target, PCs were not terrible for armored vehicles, but they crushed everything with machine guns and threw out troops, or yes, they bypassed with resistance.
                1. +1
                  11 October 2022 09: 09
                  As I understand it, this tactic turned out to be a complete surprise for our command and commanders! which is surprising, given the Syrian experience fool
                  Complete disregard for the engineering equipment of the positions. I would cut down all the trees around and scatter them around the positions, this is not a problem for tracked vehicles, but wheeled vehicles would at least lose speed! Here are your chances for a grenade launcher! request
                  And the very idea of ​​​​oporniks with a garrison in the infantry squad is criminally erroneous! negative for example, during the Second World War, the Germans determined for themselves that tanks should be used in battle, no less than a company! Since a smaller number leads to useless losses, and the company, although it suffers the same losses, manages to complete the task! It's the same with the defender, it's very easy to create a total superiority in strength over an infantry squad and suppress it with fire! They are attacked by a platoon in several armored vehicles, what can they even do? belay And if the opornik defended a platoon on an infantry fighting vehicle, how many carts need to be driven in order to suppress them with fire? It is already necessary to deploy a full-fledged attack with a company, and the company is no longer so mobile, then Arta will have time to aim! soldier
                  1. -2
                    11 October 2022 09: 17
                    Surprises, crime, engineering training...
                    All this would be fair if not for a single reinforced concrete fact - the Armed Forces of Ukraine at that time had a MULTIPLE numerical advantage.
                    1. +1
                      11 October 2022 09: 30
                      Quote: Vladimir_2U
                      The APU at that time had a MULTIPLE numerical advantage.

                      It still has it and this is a question for the planners of the NWO, what were they thinking about? And the local command had to build defenses based on the fact of the multiple numerical superiority of the enemy, and not scatter forces over stupid oporniks! And again, in such a situation, mines are everything, and we completely scored on this, the opornik is placed to block the minefield! And the enemy is bypassing our positions without worrying at all, they are chasing Google maps, we have not created any obstacles! This is sloppiness, the most important factor leading to losses!
        3. 0
          10 October 2022 21: 27
          Quote: Vladimir_2U
          As an infantryman, he is very heavy.

          Well, on a tripod, the KPVT weighs, somewhere, 88 kg; and the "cliff" is -41 kg ... Yes, it is twice as heavy ... but the DShKM on a wheel "running" without a shield weighed even much more than the KPVT! And nothing! Have and rejoice! By the way, DShKM on a tripod weighs almost the same as KPVT on a tripod! And you ... "very heavy"! No.
          1. 0
            11 October 2022 07: 36
            Quote: Nikolaevich I
            And you ... "very heavy"! no

            Which is not very appropriate! A cliff for two people carrying 20 kg per nose and KPV 88 is for four already! Well, I forgot about Kord.
    2. +1
      13 October 2022 18: 27
      The author loses sight of one more smallness, as simple as a crowbar. All this beauty works in conditions when there are no normal troop densities. It is from this that one should proceed when analyzing the successes of carts. With a normal density of troops, but echeloned in depth, it will be interesting to look at dashing breakthroughs.
      1. 0
        14 October 2022 05: 02
        Victor hi , you don’t know such Max Shvedov, from U-U?
        1. +1
          14 October 2022 05: 25
          No, it’s not familiar, however, it’s just that the BUS is remembered as a defense is being built with a normal width of the front and with an extended one, and there is mining of the area and what’s not there.
          1. 0
            14 October 2022 05: 36
            Quote: saigon
            No, not familiar though

            Okay.
            Quote: saigon
            it’s just that the BUS is remembered as a defense is being built with a normal width of the front and with a stretched one, and then there is the mining of the area and what is there.

            Yes, they screwed up all this despite half a year of the war, so Balakleya happened and beyond.
            1. +1
              14 October 2022 11: 11
              Yes, the bright belief that BTG is a tool for victory just kills me.
              You can shake with words even the heavens, even the rocks, but until they again begin to operate with divisions, such Mui Ne will be.
              What is completely forgotten how to build defenses with stretched sections?
              It is difficult to understand that all patrols, even on an armored personnel carrier, even on an LBT, and even in the end, on brooms, go along the ROADS (a district of the Kharkov region), in a word, I just keep quiet.
              Place mines, armored personnel carriers for shooting gaps between the hell with it platoon supporters, field guards are described in the charters.
    3. +1
      16 October 2022 16: 08
      But what about the BRDM-2? Two machine guns, armor, speed, cross-country ability, ability to swim! Slightly heavier than the Humvee, but the value is incomparably higher.
  2. -3
    10 October 2022 05: 13
    Destroy crossings, bridges, repair bases, fuel depots.

    In general, it’s funny to read: another super-weapon of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, after the Turkish maize, which is essentially an ersatz of normal technology.
  3. +11
    10 October 2022 05: 15
    Today, the fighting in Ukraine has shown how effective light armored vehicles can be.
    Already several decades ago, on the battlefields in Africa, the tactics of the "Toyet war" were being worked out and it was no longer possible not to notice it, but no, for someone it is still a DISCOVERY. As if there was no our special operation in Syria, where we had to counteract precisely such tactics.
    The main method of counteraction could be the constant patrolling of places where such groups could pass on LBT with the help of drones.
    It is much more efficient to use, together with UAVs, reconnaissance and signaling equipment 1K18 "Realiya-U", 1K124 "Tabun", 1K119 "Realiya-1/10, which it is time to get from warehouses, blow off the dust and apply
  4. +4
    10 October 2022 05: 18
    A small digression into the history of "carts".

    Actually a cart.


    Jeep from World War II


    We also had attempts to do something similar, but, apparently, they did not receive development. All-wheel drive GAZ-64 with a machine gun Ds-39


    Vietnam


    Modern "Jihadmobile" with checkpoint


    There are even similar monsters
  5. +3
    10 October 2022 05: 37
    There were also reports about Russian "carts" even before the NWO! These are: 1. armored buggy "Squadron"


    2.Military buggy from Chechnya "Chaborz" M3/M6...


    3. Light armored car "Punisher" (Falcatus)

    Only now there is such a bad Russian ...: They can do it, "crow" and ... forget!
    1. +7
      10 October 2022 07: 07
      Only now there is such a bad Russian ...: They can do it, "crow" and ... forget!

      Unfortunately you are right. The story is the same with serious armored vehicles, they released several pieces for parades, and now they are driving the "half a five" to the war, on which I served back in the late sixties.
      It turns out like in the old Soviet joke: "All the steam goes off the whistle." request

      Good morning, Volodya! smile
      1. +1
        10 October 2022 09: 42
        Quote: Sea Cat
        All the steam goes off the whistle"

        Hello, Kostya! Alas, it also happens ... unfortunately more often than it would be "liked"!
    2. 0
      10 October 2022 20: 08
      And more:

      Peruvian lobo.


      Impact ALSV


      Our Sarmat-2.


      And the late Scorpio.

      The feature of "carts" is the high mobility of fire weapons and troops. At the same time, this very landing is not tightly tied to the vehicle. And, accordingly, it can operate in isolation from the vehicle or with their support, if they are able to move through difficult terrain, like the same buggies and light armored cars. And here it doesn’t matter what kind of vehicle: an ordinary Toyota, a buggy, a light or medium armored car - they are only a means of transportation and a carrier of weapons - and the infantry plays the main violin.
  6. +7
    10 October 2022 05: 37
    The successful use of carts is a consequence of backwardness and chaos in the RF Armed Forces, minefields and barriers are forgotten. And, they would have tried to oppose the amers or the Israelis in this way: yes, they would have been smeared across the fields by drones and helicopters.
    1. +1
      10 October 2022 20: 51
      The one who compiled the staffing of the BTG clearly did not think that it could be stretched for 10 km in defense. And for these 10 km one! sapper squad -4 sergeants 8 soldiers. Although it is called an engineering platoon. Physically, it is simply impossible to mine all the holes with a squad. The staff is taken from here https://rostislavddd.livejournal.com/501408.html
  7. -6
    10 October 2022 05: 51
    Article sucked from the finger. Some military commissar launched another "news" about the "new tactics of the terrorists of the Armed Forces of Ukraine." Some picked up and developed this fake about not only DRGs, but also regular enemy units penetrating in jeeps.
    Some pathetic babble about the penetration of mobile groups on 4-wheeled vehicles into our rear, which can be stopped by an automatic burst on the wheels when attacking a checkpoint.
    What and who are these carts with suicide bombers attacking? Calling fire on themselves in a counter-battery fight? Already funny...
    All this news about the "leakage" in small groups is another trend from military correspondents suffering from creative gagging.
    1. +3
      10 October 2022 05: 56
      Quote: Konnick
      Some pathetic babble about the penetration of mobile groups on 4-wheeled vehicles into our rear, which can be stopped by an automatic burst on the wheels when attacking a checkpoint.

      It seems that people like you in the General Staff of the RF Armed Forces sat in Balakleya and beyond ...
      1. -1
        10 October 2022 06: 05
        It seems that people like you in the General Staff of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation sat in Balakleya and beyond ..

        Yes, the General Staff was confused by such tactics and we had to retreat, even the tanks were abandoned under the pressure of carts ... wassat
        1. +1
          10 October 2022 06: 54
          Are you completely unaware of the coverage of strongholds and breakthroughs without resistance to the rear bases?
          1. +1
            10 October 2022 07: 44
            Are you completely unaware of the coverage of strongholds and breakthroughs without resistance to the rear bases?

            Do not know. Can you tell me about breakthroughs to bases that are not guarded. I also want to know about the coverage of "carts" strong points.
            1. +2
              10 October 2022 09: 04
              Quote: Konnick
              Do not know. Can you tell me about breakthroughs to bases that are not guarded. I also want to know about the coverage of "carts" strong points.

              And how do you think they captured tanks and villages? They rolled up at speed, fired, and if necessary, they dropped the landing, but if necessary, they went around further! Because the opnik with 10-15 people in the village has a maximum of PCs and grenade launchers! And rembaza is no better. Full of such shots in the cart!
              1. -4
                10 October 2022 09: 29
                And how do you think they captured tanks and villages? They rolled up at speed, fired, and if necessary, they dropped the landing, but if necessary, they went around further! Because the opnik with 10-15 people in the village has a maximum of PCs and grenade launchers! And rembaza is no better. Full of such shots in the cart!

                Why don't we capture it?
                That you all fall for such nonsense.
                1. +1
                  10 October 2022 09: 43
                  Quote: Konnick
                  Why don't we capture it?
                  That you all fall for such nonsense.

                  So I read your comment and begin to understand the meaning of the word "finished".
                  The multiple numerical superiority of the ukrotroops in the theater of operations is also nonsense invented by the military commanders ?!
                  1. +3
                    10 October 2022 14: 17
                    Quote: Vladimir_2U
                    The multiple numerical superiority of the ukrotroops in the theater of operations is also nonsense invented by the military commanders ?!

                    Yes, what are you saying .... That is, 450 is less than 000, this is a new word in mathematics. Yes, you are almost Lobochevsky
                    1. 0
                      10 October 2022 14: 30
                      Quote: svp67
                      That is, 450 is less than 000, this is a new word in mathematics. Yes, you are almost Lobochevsky

                      And which side is which number? And, not Lobachevsky?
                      1. 0
                        10 October 2022 14: 33
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        And which side which number

                        Of the 750 Armed Forces of Ukraine and NSU, 000 are now on the front line, the rest are undergoing additional training and in reserve, 450 are our troops, but these are figures before the arrival of the mobilized, and they have now gone to the front in large numbers.
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        And, not Lobachevsky?
                        That is, you don’t want to be Lobochevsky, well then, you are LobAchevsky-Second, not the first
                      2. 0
                        10 October 2022 14: 49
                        Quote: svp67
                        Of the 750 Armed Forces of Ukraine and NGU, now 000 are on the front line, the rest are undergoing additional training and in reserve, 450 are our troops, but these are figures before the arrival of mobilized


                        Ezhkin cat, so what am I talking about ?! what is not clear here?
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        Multiple numerical superiority ukrovoysk on TVD

                        Are you thumping? I'm even a little jealous... wink
                      3. +2
                        10 October 2022 14: 54
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        Are you thumping?

                        No, but with such news, I no longer exclude such an option ... unfortunately
                      4. 0
                        10 October 2022 14: 57
                        Quote: svp67
                        No, but with such news, I no longer exclude such an option ... unfortunately

                        Better not, we'll be healthier.
                        I hope the question has disappeared to the numbers?
                      5. +1
                        10 October 2022 15: 01
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        Better not, we'll be healthier.

                        I'd love to
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        I hope the question has disappeared to the numbers?

                        And it didn't happen to me.
                2. +2
                  10 October 2022 14: 19
                  Quote: Konnick
                  Why don't we capture it?

                  And this is a question for the command why our troops go into frontal attacks on settlements, and do not surround them, although where it was possible to do this, the enemy did not much experience the fate of the fight in the environment, retreated
                  1. 0
                    10 October 2022 14: 26
                    And this is a question for the command why our troops go into frontal attacks on settlements, and do not surround them, although where it was possible to do this, the enemy did not much experience the fate of the fight in the environment, retreated

                    And the key settlements that are part of the defense line of the Armed Forces of Ukraine are difficult to bypass. They have artillery defenses there, where the destruction zone covers a couple of tens of kilometers, which can be overcome only after a successful counter-battery fight.
                    1. 0
                      10 October 2022 14: 29
                      Quote: Konnick
                      They have artillery defenses there, which can only be overcome after a successful counter-battery fight.

                      But is it easier to go in the forehead, the artillery of the Armed Forces of Ukraine does not work there?
                      1. 0
                        10 October 2022 14: 44
                        But is it easier to go in the forehead, the artillery of the Armed Forces of Ukraine does not work there?

                        Equally bad and 7-month butt at Maryinka and Avdeevka showed this.
                      2. 0
                        10 October 2022 14: 50
                        Quote: Konnick
                        Equally bad and 7-month butt at Maryinka and Avdeevka showed this.

                        There, in eight years, a continuous line of defense has been created, to which even the Mannerheim line is far away, so there is no particular surprise, and nevertheless there is the possibility of carrying out operations to encircle settlements. As I understand it, our command held back an insufficient number of troops, since during the encirclement much more troops are required to organize the inner and outer encirclement rings. I hope that now such an opportunity will appear
                      3. 0
                        10 October 2022 15: 16
                        There, in eight years, a solid line of defense was created, to which even the Mannerheim line is far away

                        There is no continuous line of defense there, only communication passages for artillery observers and spotters.
                        How far have gone the myths created by Basurin to justify why Donetsk is still being shelled. Show me from the air Marinka or Avdeevka with a line of defense more powerful than the Manerheim line. And at least one reinforced concrete pillbox, no matter machine gun or artillery. Show in the photo. Photo in the studio.
                      4. 0
                        10 October 2022 15: 33
                        Quote: Konnick
                        There is no continuous line of defense there, only communication passages for artillery observers and spotters.

                        There is. And this is clearly visible in the pictures from space.
                        Message moves are called so because they link different elements of positions.
                        Quote: Konnick
                        And at least one reinforced concrete pillbox, no matter machine gun or artillery. Show in the photo.

                        Are you strange, that is, you don’t know how houses turn into long-term firing points? Then what can you talk about
                        Here in Maryinka, the artillery of the Russian Federation is working on one of these SDs, it is clearly visible that these positions dominate this area, as well as a network of trenches and communications

                        Here is a video from seven years ago, Ukrainian
                      5. -4
                        10 October 2022 15: 34
                        You do not know how houses turn into long-term firing points? Then what can you talk about

                        Now I realized that talking is useless laughing
                        Houses made of manure and sticks are turning ... turning into the Manerheim line wassat
                      6. +5
                        10 October 2022 15: 50
                        Quote: Konnick
                        Houses made of manure and sticks are turning ... turning into the Manerheim line

                        I look at you in general ... Actually, houses made of concrete, brick and steel. And yes, they turn into very strong fortifications. And if you don’t understand anything in engineering, then find any Manual on Engineering Training on the Internet and read at your leisure, you will discover a lot of interesting things for yourself
                        I offered you to watch two videos, did you pay attention to what a large multi-level pillbox they rebuilt on a clean floor, at 02.33? So, such a bunker is only the "tip of the iceberg", around it there should be smaller bunkers and bunkers, all according to the classics.
    2. -1
      10 October 2022 06: 09
      An automatic burst can stop a lot of things and whom. And, it seems, there are enough machine guns ... Well, did you have to run yourself, barely stopped? Machines of the wrong system? Or Ukrainians are fighting wrong?
      1. 0
        10 October 2022 06: 17
        Or Ukrainians are fighting wrong?

        So read the article, it’s according to the modern, and not according to the charters, it’s dishonest

        LBTs are also very well suited for delivering infantry to new positions behind enemy lines. Or fixing a gap in the defense, where the Ukrainian infantry and even equipment later entered. Pure water realization of numerical advantage.

        Yes, and the abbreviation is suitable for LBT, and we are all engaged in LGBT, i.e. we strengthen the armor of infantry fighting vehicles and armored personnel carriers. Checkmate us with these LBT. Our army was not ready for such "tactics" belay
    3. +3
      10 October 2022 06: 21
      Quote: Konnick
      Some military commissar launched another "news" about the "new tactics of the terrorists of the Armed Forces of Ukraine." Some picked up and developed this fake about not only DRGs, but also regular enemy units penetrating in jeeps.

      The military correspondents have nothing to do with it, it really happened that Ukrainian DRGs were able to massively penetrate into our rear, and precisely using "carts". I repeat once again, this is far from a new tactic, it has already been fully worked out in the same Libya and Syria. The DRG succeeded in cutting off the supply routes and causing great confusion in our rear units, which in no other army are particularly resilient. Panic began, which was partially transmitted to the advanced units, and when it turned out that the supply was broken in all units, as the rear men fled to the east, the front also collapsed.
      1. 0
        10 October 2022 06: 26
        The military correspondents have nothing to do with it, it really happened that Ukrainian DRGs were able to massively penetrate into our rear and it was using "carts"

        Give examples. Where when. Like an interview with someone. Not the articles of "military correspondents", at least Khodakovsky, he at least participates in the database.
        1. +4
          10 October 2022 06: 31
          Quote: Konnick
          Give examples. Where when. Not the articles of "military correspondents".

          In those days, it was enough to watch the videos posted by the Ukrainians, and they were enthusiastically filmed on the porches of the village administrations, in order to understand how deep they went. None of our military commanders helped them. And they were able to make such raids only thanks to their "carts". And tanks and motorized infantry followed in their footsteps.
          1. +1
            10 October 2022 06: 41
            they were able to make such raids only thanks to their "carts". And in their wake were tanks and motorized infantry

            May be enough? And not vice versa? Otherwise, it turns out like in the game "Zarnitsa", they ran, captured the flag and won.
            And here we drove to Kupyansk, took a picture at the stele, and then the tanks drove up ...
            1. +2
              10 October 2022 07: 20
              Quote: Konnick
              May be enough? And not vice versa?

              No, not vice versa ... Namely, "carts" or RDGs went forward and only then, tanks and infantry.
              If you closely followed the development of events at that time, you might have noticed that there were many moments when Ukrainians posted photos or videos in some settlement, and then our fighters filmed there, with the story that there was no one in this at the point, that is, the RDG entered an empty village, took plenty of pictures and moved on. In the same way, they recently starred against the background of the Energodar sign, but semi-rigid assault boats played the role of carts there.
              1. -1
                10 October 2022 08: 08
                In the same way, they recently starred against the background of the Energodar sign, but semi-rigid assault boats played the role of carts there.

                Haven't you read about barges? There was a landing on the barges, and our helicopter pilots with guided missiles from 10 km hit the bow and stern. Is that how they wrote it? I don’t want to believe the military officers after such messages. Solid "one grandmother said." They even composed interviews with helicopter pilots. It's a pity the self-propelled barges turned out to be abandoned technological pontoons for the construction of the bridge.
                1. 0
                  10 October 2022 10: 20
                  There was even a detailed video. With a blow to a local landmark - the remains of the concrete section of the bridge from the time of 1943.
                2. 0
                  10 October 2022 10: 41
                  Quote: Konnick
                  Haven't you read about barges?

                  I tell you about Foma, and you tell me about Yerema ... Landing and barges are one thing, but that "photo shoot" is completely different. It took place at a different time.

                  By the way, there are still about two dozen similar barges that were used in those landings in the creeks near Nikopol. And honestly, I don’t understand why they haven’t been destroyed yet, although there are all possibilities for this.
                  1. 0
                    10 October 2022 15: 20
                    Quote: svp67
                    And honestly, I don’t understand why they haven’t been destroyed yet, although there are all possibilities for this.

                    But why?
                    As there are fewer barges - wait, prepare rockets ...
                    1. +1
                      10 October 2022 16: 01
                      Quote: Hitriy Zhuk
                      But why?

                      And imagine such an order of ships, in four columns of five barges. Of the 20 barges, ten with the main landing force inside, and the remaining 10, five each, go on the flanks and take on all missile attacks from our helicopters. perish, but save the main forces. And these will be very large forces that cannot be so easily coped with.
          2. +3
            10 October 2022 16: 12
            Then it was reconnaissance, during the Great Patriotic War they did it on three-wheeled motorcycles.
        2. +2
          10 October 2022 09: 00
          Quote: Konnick

          Give examples. Where when.

          A breakthrough in the Kharkiv region in September. For 3 days, a breakthrough of 40-50 km, a complete collapse of our front, the abandonment of large cities, including Izyum, as a result, the loss of Liman and the entry of the enemy into the LPR. How it was:

          Breakthrough of the northern face in the Kherson region in 1-2 days for 20-30 km in September. Loss of the security belt for crossings, creating a threat to the operational environment of the entire Kherson group.

          In both operations, the tactics of breaking through our defenses with enemy armored vehicles, throwing highly mobile equipment into the breakthrough were used. What ensured the defeat of our rear and the threat of encirclement. Classic blitzkrieg tactics.
          1. +1
            10 October 2022 09: 09
            In both operations, the tactics of breaking through our defenses with enemy armored vehicles, throwing highly mobile equipment into the breakthrough were used. What ensured the defeat of our rear and the threat of encirclement. Classic blitzkrieg tactics.


            I saw these videos. They dropped a bunch of fighters and left, having previously shot at the bushes, this is probably so that everyone can hear where they are. And most importantly, I did not see the results of these "raids" in these videos, maybe you are aware of this?
            And the classic tactic of blitzkrieg consisted in the close interaction of aviation with tank formations, which did not allow organizing defense, smashed headquarters and communication centers, captured bridges and transport hubs.
    4. KCA
      +3
      10 October 2022 08: 02
      They tried to break through yesterday, they spotted it from a drone in time and as a result -6 tanks and -10 LBT, carts for some reason, they didn’t even manage to escape, they showed 2 Hurricanes and a full salvo, you have to leave very quickly, 2 salvos completely cover the football field, and also the QUO of the RSs is large and the scattering of fragments, and they beat for 30 km, 2/3 of the fuel definitely remained
      1. +2
        10 October 2022 11: 55
        everything is simple - a cart is effective when it operates alone, when there are no minefields and a low density of troops - LBS slipped through and went to empty villages to nightmare the rear
  8. +1
    10 October 2022 06: 08
    For some reason, the Chechens have all this ... Yesterday I watched how Kadyrov held a review of his own .... For some reason, there is a completely different army ....
    1. 0
      10 October 2022 15: 23
      A significant, if not larger, part of the participants in this review are not Chechens, but volunteers from different regions who were trained at the center in Gudermes.
      1. 0
        10 October 2022 23: 31
        No matter who, look at the outfit
  9. +7
    10 October 2022 06: 40
    Such attacks take place when there is a lack of people and a mess in parts. If minefields and engineering barriers are installed in the defense zone, then the actions of such detachments become problematic.
    If the troops on the defensive also have a modern command and control system, reconnaissance UAVs and massively kemikaze drones, then those who sit in the LBT themselves turn into game. Attack UAVs in adequate numbers are also a good way to deal with such breakthroughs.
    1. -3
      10 October 2022 10: 29
      We need highly mobile barrier detachments.
      1 machine gunner, a couple of grenade launchers, 3-4 footmen. You can add a sniper.
      1. 0
        10 October 2022 11: 59
        and what will your squad do when you first need to notice the enemy, then transfer it to the op, then they transmit data to your flying squad and it goes to look for the enemy ... you just need more ops and more heavy weapons on them
        1. 0
          10 October 2022 12: 04
          1. he is not mine (detachment), the methodology and principle of operation of such detachments has long existed and has been worked out.
          2. "opornikov" - the Maginot line is a vivid example of what happens.
          1. 0
            10 October 2022 12: 34
            Maginot's problem was that it could be bypassed, and when we have one platoon at the front for 10 km, it's not surprising that they don't go there in parade formation.
            1. 0
              10 October 2022 15: 06
              Are you going to put every hundred meters?
              1. 0
                10 October 2022 16: 22
                for this there are platoon strongholds, with a distance between them of 2-2,5 km and the presence of a sufficient number of heavy weapons on them, they will be able to stop carts and adjust fire on them .. Carts are effective not because they are a prodigy, but because they probe lbs-find places where the density of troops is lower and try to slip through-slip through-we have a video in the cart about the taken administrations-if they run into, then we have a video in the cart with several smoky carcasses .. your proposal with flying squads will just be ineffective. because if the enemy slips through, you will not have time to catch up with him and hit him, and if they meet him, then they will destroy him anyway. and I’m still “simplifying” this, in fact the company should keep 2 km of the front, if it is completely blocked according to the charter, then about 1 000 hp are needed for 50 km. on LBS, and another 000 thousand in the second tier with gain + Rotation .. i.e. for guaranteed cover of the LBS, we need to allocate about 30 K personnel, while it will be possible to forget about any offensive by the Armed Forces of Ukraine. Well, another 200-200 thousand for offensive operations, i.e. for normal functioning, in addition to those 250-100 thousand that we seem to have on the LBS and 150 K mobilized, it should be enough at the current stage ..
  10. +9
    10 October 2022 07: 22
    The tachanka is good as long as there is no solid front line. Then the cart becomes a mass grave. Plus, the specifics of factory carts, the reinforced anti-mine bottom eats off the weight of the side armor. And the same 14.5 / 30mm leaves no chance for the crew.
    1. +1
      10 October 2022 10: 43
      well, look at the "Squadron" ... there is a reservation (about 3 tons in weight), there is protection against mines due to a narrow capsule and widely spaced wheels; true minus that single and seems to be underloaded ass
  11. KCA
    +4
    10 October 2022 08: 12
    Somehow I doubt that with the ZSU23-2 you can hit the plane, albeit at low altitude, but they flew at least 500 km / h, and they don’t go to the target in a straight line, they maneuver, you need to be able to shoot very well at a fast target, okay from "Shilka", "Tunguska" or "Shell" they have at least a radar and automatic aiming, but in their minds figure out a lead ... It doesn’t always work out with a duck from a gun, it is, of course, much smaller than an airplane, but also closer and flies much less than 500 km / h
  12. +2
    10 October 2022 08: 41
    Well, in general, carts with machine guns, as far as I know, appeared among the British in the Anglo-Boer War long before Makhno, the British combed the savannahs with a chain, and when the Boer cavalry detachments tried to break through a rare chain, they fell under the crossfire of machine guns from carts traveling in the second echelon behind chains, but in general, I think high-speed buggies with armor protection in modern warfare are more useful than infantry fighting vehicles and infantry fighting vehicles, and the speed is higher and visibility is better and it’s easier to leave the car ...
    1. 0
      10 October 2022 09: 09
      Quote: 1984
      but in general, I think high-speed buggies with armor protection in modern warfare are more useful than infantry fighting vehicles and infantry fighting vehicles, and the speed is higher and the view is better and it’s easier to leave the car ...

      No better and no worse. For different types of operations and different theater operations, different equipment is needed.

      For example, the US has 3 different types of troops in the army:

      11 tank brigades in the Army and 5 in the National Guard (Abrams, BMP / BTR Bradley);
      7 striker/motorized rifle brigades in the Army and 2 in the National Guard (BTR/BMP Stryker);
      13 light (5 infantry, 5 airborne, 3 air assault) brigades in the Army and 20 in the National Guard (buggies, cars, armored cars, MRAPs, helicopters, planes).

      Accordingly, depending on the tasks and conditions, one or another connection is used. Light infantry is the most versatile type. Stryker and light brigades are reinforced with "light" tanks.
  13. +1
    10 October 2022 09: 12
    The idea is far from new. You could say it's from a museum.

    1. +1
      10 October 2022 09: 56
      This tactic was used in the Toyota War, the last phase of the Chadian-Libyan conflict.
      Apparently developed under the capabilities of Chad in resources by the French.

      “The Libyan group at that time had mainly Soviet weapons, including T-55 tanks, BMP-1, Mi-24 helicopters, MiG-23 fighters, air defense systems.

      About 400 off-road vehicles were the main strike force of the CNNS - mainly Toyota Land Cruiser 40 and 70 series pickups, armed with Milan anti-tank systems and recoilless guns.

      Using guerrilla tactics with deep detours and flank attacks (fortunately, the desert terrain provided an excellent opportunity for this), the highest maneuverability and speed of their impromptu combat vehicles, good knowledge of the area, the Chadans defeated the Libyan group in two battles.

      The losses of the Libyans amounted to about two thousand people, about 200 tanks and the same number of infantry fighting vehicles, two anti-aircraft batteries, 11 L-39 aircraft. Part of the weapons, primarily anti-aircraft systems and aircraft, was captured by the Chadians after the stampede of the Libyan soldiers."


      In 2013, the French troops themselves helped defeat the Malian Tuareg military in the battle for Kona.
      Using 4 Mirage 2000 aircraft and 2 Gazelle helicopters.


      The main danger, if you use the tactics of counteracting aviation to such mobile groups in Ukraine, is apparently in MANPADS.
      1. -1
        10 October 2022 10: 14
        Let's distinguish industrial designs from ersatz.
        1. +2
          10 October 2022 10: 30
          I'm talking about tactics.

          In the west, there are smaller and lighter factory armored vehicles, and much more mobile

          Why we don't is the question.
          Not needed or again a miscalculation.
          1. -1
            10 October 2022 10: 46
            Yes, the question is in tactics, where and how to use such machines with such weak protection?
            1. 0
              10 October 2022 11: 05
              Like reconnaissance.
              In addition to heavier vehicles.
              Like wheeled tanks.
              1. -1
                10 October 2022 11: 30
                So the BRDM was made for this. Why change? request
                1. 0
                  10 October 2022 14: 42
                  As a staff vehicle, for patrolling, etc. like an UAZ, but armored. Beyond intelligence.
                  i.e. Such light armored cars replaced Jeeps like Willis.
    2. +2
      10 October 2022 10: 16
      BRDM-2. Good, by the way, the car was in due time.

      There are also upgraded versions of this machine.


      1. -1
        10 October 2022 10: 29
        So the idea itself is good. And KPVT is even better than Kord.
        1. +2
          10 October 2022 10: 52
          Yeah, that's just the embodiment in metal, controlling the guidance of a 14,5-mm machine gun, through the rotation of the flywheels, this is the decision of the second half of the 19th century.
          1. -1
            10 October 2022 11: 27
            So no religion forbids installing an electric drive.
            1. +2
              10 October 2022 11: 36
              Some kind of interference, since they haven’t been installed since the 60s of the last century. Although there is a solution with a drive on the Muromteplovoz website, for unknown reasons it is not in demand.
              1. -1
                10 October 2022 11: 53
                Probably the reason is common, our management feels sorry for the money. This is not New Year's illumination, where there is more room for theft.
  14. 0
    10 October 2022 09: 23
    And what are the problems to make a cart from "Loaf"?
    1. +4
      10 October 2022 10: 10
      Even without a machine-gun module on the roof, she capsizes, she has seen enough in the army how our "nurses" tumbled.
      1. 0
        10 October 2022 17: 42
        The bottom line is the chassis, not the shape of the body. Any car can be tumbled.
  15. 0
    10 October 2022 10: 54
    I am 200% sure that the Western allies did not do without some adjustment, and the tactics of using light armored vehicles today in the Armed Forces of Ukraine are simply excellent.
    Standard ISIS tactics in Syria. sad
    1. +2
      10 October 2022 11: 38
      There was also information from there that with the help of a drone, one 120-mm mortar, about 90 enemy vehicles were destroyed.
  16. +3
    10 October 2022 10: 57
    This tactic of using light armored vehicles is effective only with weak defenses. That is, these are oporniki at a great distance from each other with small light infantry without the required number of PTGCs. At the same time, there is neither proper reconnaissance to open up the enemy, nor coordination with artillery, nor mobile "fire brigades".
  17. +1
    10 October 2022 11: 52
    to solve the problem of carts, you need to corny ranks of oporniks so that the distance between them does not exceed 2-2,5 km. They also need to be equipped with heavy weapons: 2 anti-tank missiles, 2 AGS, 2 DShK per opornik. carts ... And if 82 mm mortars are also at hand, then light armor will not like it either
    1. 0
      10 October 2022 17: 31
      And Two White Senior Elephants... To drive the young around all your plazas and rovelins... Otherwise they will oversleep the enemy's offensive... One question - where can I get so many elephants?
      Sincerely
      1. 0
        10 October 2022 17: 48
        at the moment, there are from 50 to 100 thousand such elephants in the NWO. According to Khodakovsky, the first mobs have already gone as replenishment to combat units and this is the best option for the current day
        1. 0
          10 October 2022 17: 58
          These same elephants and their friends - chests on February 26 wrote a report. They went to serve in the infantry division - to spoil the paving stones at parades ...
          Sincerely
          1. 0
            10 October 2022 18: 27
            Well, then we have ghosts now fighting in the NWO)
  18. +1
    10 October 2022 12: 17
    And here a completely logical question arises: what can the army oppose to carts with DRGs?
    Mines, blockages, dug up strips in the fields.
  19. +2
    10 October 2022 12: 41
    patrolling places where such LBT groups could pass with the help of drones
    Scatter autonomous signal devices with geophones?
  20. 0
    10 October 2022 12: 49
    I think it would be very effective to use hedgehogs or garlic. The cost is low. Installation is easy. Scatter thicker along country roads and fields between strong points.
  21. +2
    10 October 2022 12: 57
    Who is stopping us from building our carts? Or again, they didn’t share something at the milestone ..............
    From the experience of my life: a well-trained shooter from RPG 7, easily levels the sudden appearance of a cart. I once saw a master who from an RPG fell into the edge of the commander's hatch on the T-64
    1. +2
      10 October 2022 16: 19
      The edge of the hatch, apparently, stood motionless, and the armored vehicles move, sometimes quickly. The most effective weapons available are heavy machine guns and automatic guns, and ATGMs are not bad either. Tanks with modern SDA are even better, especially if they are nearby.
      1. 0
        11 October 2022 08: 19
        Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
        The edge of the hatch, apparently stood motionless,

        I was at the training camp about 5 years ago. So, of all the grenade launchers, only two got into the tank. I didn’t count how many grenade launchers really were.
    2. 0
      10 October 2022 20: 17
      Quote: APASUS
      Who prevents us from building our carts

      Because without trained light infantry, they are either weakly effective or suffer heavy losses. And they are not applicable in nuclear weapons (but this is a separate issue) + our chauvinism (they have "police wars" and "drive Papuans" there - and we have our own way) + the peculiarity of building the armed forces.

      Give infantry - we get an analogue of the Soviet motorcycle / cavalry regiment of the Second World War or the German motorcycle formation (regiment / battalion) of WWII. Or, if you look closer to the present, our special forces in Afghanistan, the Rhodesian light infantry, etc.

      To be fair, they have their own carts - there are entire battalions in pickup trucks and UAZ pickup trucks - in motorized riflemen and airborne forces. UAZs shone in the NWO - they were definitely used with anti-tank systems.
  22. 0
    10 October 2022 13: 07
    Quote: Sea Cat
    for the first time, "Maxim" machine guns were installed on a horse-drawn cart by "volunteers" of Cecil Rhodes (5 or 6 "carts") in the eighties of the nineteenth century, and in the battle with the Ndebels, the Lobengulas mowed down almost all of his army.

    Many thanks for the explanation. Interesting Facts.
  23. +2
    10 October 2022 14: 19
    In principle, it is worth seriously considering this topic. Of course, you can say for a long time that "such tactics only work against a deliberately weak enemy" or "where will we use this tactic? We have forests and swamps." But as we see in Ukraine, the tactics, although not ideal, are not useless.

    You need to be able to fight not "as expected" but with all known tactics. After all, no one, ever in a war, will allow his opponent to act as he is used to. Therefore, you need to be able to act in different ways and in different conditions.

    So here, the concept of lightly armored, mobile and well-armed vehicles is good for different purposes. With the right organization between units, they can "pluck" the enemy's defenses and find his weak points. They are also useful when breaking through defenses. Acting in conjunction with tank units, they will not only divert part of the enemy’s fire, but also, together with tanks, destroy the rear. Only tanks destroy the rear of the enemy troops, surrounding him and destroying him. Then such lightly armored vehicles leave for a slightly deeper rear and occupy / destroy infrastructure (nearest railway tracks and interchanges, block highways, destroy or capture warehouses, etc.). Light armored vehicles have disadvantages, but they can be solved by planning joint work with heavy armored vehicles or aircraft.

    So these modern "carts" should definitely not be discounted. In the right terrain (and any flat terrain suits it), and with the right organization and equipment, they can do a lot of problems.
  24. +1
    10 October 2022 15: 09
    "Shot" with the module BM-30-D "Spoke"

    Here we have a couple of thousand of them.
    There is fuel in the Russian Federation, it would be possible to supply it as a regular army "bibika".
    1. +2
      10 October 2022 16: 23
      "Typhoon-VDV" with the module BM-30-D "Spoke" is even better, the engine is more powerful there, it can also be used as an artillery tractor. But, in the absence of a maid, .. you have to have fun with the janitor.
  25. 0
    10 October 2022 16: 27
    Ukrainians use carts not as "miracle weapons". And the success of light infantry is facilitated by the close interaction of units during the battle. The success of light infantry is primarily due to high-tech NATO intelligence - Terbatov meat, which is thrown at defensive formations in order to open firing points and fire patterns. Further, mercenaries in pickups go to the junction and nightmare artillery in the rear. The thing is that, according to our "wise" charter, the BMP-2 operator is trained to shoot at the landmarks marked on the tactical diagram and is not capable of "aiming" a fast-moving pickup truck. The modern motorized rifle squad does not have anything for mounted shooting on a regular basis. I consider it necessary for each motorized rifle squad to strengthen the ACS.
    Sincerely
    1. +1
      10 October 2022 16: 55
      You don't have to worry about the BMP-2. Gunners-operators are trained there to shoot at moving targets. And in a modern motorized rifle unit there is a BMP-3, the SDA of which, according to data from the open press, makes it possible to conduct mounted fire from a 100-mm gun.
      1. 0
        10 October 2022 17: 17
        You and I read different textbooks on tactics. As I remember my childhood now: "Landmarks should be marked on the tactical scheme, it is desirable that the marked landmarks during the battle could not be destroyed by artillery fire. Each landmark must be shot. During the battle, the squad leader gives the command to transfer fire from one landmark to another " . As for the BMP - 3 ... Please tell me what kind of target designation tool does the squad leader have to transmit real-time data to the BMP combat module? Binoculars?
        Sincerely
        1. +1
          10 October 2022 17: 39
          Fire on a moving target is completely different. According to the risks on the sight and the size of the target, the approximate distance and speed are determined. And then, in advance, a queue is given, according to the tracers, and if it is visible, then according to the breaks, the fire is corrected in case of a miss. But I won’t say about the BMP-3, I don’t have detailed information on the SDA, I’m behind the times. But the fact that the possibility of conducting mounted fire is and is incorporated in the SDA, I read. And besides binoculars, there are also artillery spotters, as well as UAVs.
          1. 0
            10 October 2022 18: 03
            Fire on a moving target is completely different. According to the risks on the sight and the size of the target, the approximate distance and speed are determined.
            You can also use a match or a thumb ... Do you seriously think that the BMP operator will have the proper situational awareness for independent distribution and selection of targets in a defensive battle?
            What are you attached to this SLA. We need other magic Three letters - ASU!!!
            Sincerely
            1. +1
              10 October 2022 19: 29
              We need to know, not think. As I understand it, this is also not a lot for you. So why crush water in a mortar?
              And do not take the BMP-3 designers for idiots, people understand something.
              1. 0
                11 October 2022 09: 24
                What does the BMP designer have to do with it !!!??? Tactical ACS is not their concern !!! However, I have big doubts about what you "know" ... Who prevented Kharkov from being rolled into rubble? Who owns the phrase "Kharkov is a Russian city"? Who sang the assana with impregnable ROP? How did they show themselves under Liman? Who said that "against the BMP - 2 carts have no chance"? What is this article about then? One thing pleases - your conclusions cost Belisarius his career ...
                Sincerely
                1. +1
                  11 October 2022 09: 30
                  Stop throwing big words around. Behind the abbreviation ACS there should be something concrete, except for childhood dreams. Not knowing the capabilities of the BMP-3 self-propelled guns, to say that there is nothing strange there. Trying to arrange a skirmish on the content of terms without owning the question is not for me.
                  1. 0
                    11 October 2022 09: 35
                    Stop throwing big words around. Behind the abbreviation ACS there should be something concrete, except for childhood dreams.

                    Have you heard about ESU TZ? By the way, quite bespectacled "children" from "Constellation" developed ...
                    Sincerely
                  2. 0
                    11 October 2022 09: 38
                    Regarding the terms ... In what places is "Kharkov - the Russian city" now? Why did the "infantry" try to capture Kharkov, acting in parade columns? Who convinced our military leadership that they would be greeted with flowers there?
                    Sincerely
                    1. +1
                      11 October 2022 09: 48
                      Are there too many questions for me? You really, be so kind as to address.
                      1. 0
                        11 October 2022 09: 51
                        Excuse me, have you ever written in VO that "Kharkov is a Russian city"? Correctly?
                        Sincerely
                      2. +2
                        11 October 2022 11: 13
                        So what? I don't understand attempts to make me responsible for defeats. Are the shores completely lost?
                      3. -1
                        11 October 2022 11: 33
                        Have mercy! Where can you take any "responsibility" from? You live well without it ... As one philosopher said: "The world is ruled by ideas." And your idea seized the masses in trousers with stripes ... And Leo Tolstoy said that a bad deed begins with bad thoughts ...
                        Sincerely
                      4. +2
                        11 October 2022 11: 40
                        What idea of ​​mine has seized the masses, can you clarify? I’m raking in batches on the minus forum, the most successful and timely statements are crushed en masse.
                      5. -1
                        11 October 2022 11: 52
                        You are welcome!
                        1 "Kharkov is a Russian city" - therefore, it is not necessary to disassemble it into rubble
                        2 "A cart has no chance against BMP 2" - so light infantry is not needed.
                        3 "Company opornik is impregnable" - therefore it was possible to create a "Melian curtain" from them in the north.
                        Sincerely
                      6. +1
                        11 October 2022 13: 40
                        The cart not only against the BMP-2 has no chance. Both the BMP-30 and the BTR-3A are equipped with 82-mm automatic cannons, and now the Shot and Typhoon Airborne Forces are also equipped with the Spitz module.
                        And you again propose to throw forward infantry without armor under Ukrainian artillery with impeccable communications and densely equipped with reconnaissance and attack drones. This is something!
                        And the oporniks, with proper organization and artillery support, really look impregnable, judging by how hard our advance near Donetsk is going.
                      7. 0
                        11 October 2022 15: 55
                        The cart not only against the BMP-2 has no chance.

                        And what happened under Balakleya?
                        Both the BMP-30 and BTR-3A are equipped with 82-mm automatic cannons, and now with the "Spoke" module, the "Shot" and "Typhoon Airborne Forces" are also equipped

                        And what about their use in defense is written in the charter, which was studied by the mobilized, even if the "guard" did not cope?
                        Where did the Ukrainians get the "ideal connection"???
                        Sincerely
  26. 0
    10 October 2022 16: 33
    Remote mining on possible paths of advancement, with the same petals. Rubber, I think it will tear to shreds ...
    1. -1
      10 October 2022 17: 11
      Mining anti-personnel and anti-tank was done in accordance with the charter. But the Terbatovites were allowed on the mines ...
      Sincerely
  27. 0
    10 October 2022 17: 12
    In general, it is very similar to the T-60 tank, which the Germans highly appreciated, calling it "indestructible locust."
  28. 0
    10 October 2022 17: 41
    I don’t understand, where did the Chechen buggies go, which they seem to have riveted by the hundreds? or also parted in parades ??
  29. +2
    10 October 2022 18: 12
    Quote: Konnick
    And how do you think they captured tanks and villages? They rolled up at speed, fired, and if necessary, they dropped the landing, but if necessary, they went around further! Because the opnik with 10-15 people in the village has a maximum of PCs and grenade launchers! And rembaza is no better. Full of such shots in the cart!

    Why don't we capture it?
    That you all fall for such nonsense.

    Because from the side of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, at least an infantry company or a troop battalion with a mortar battery sits in the defense of the village. You won't get lost there...
  30. 0
    10 October 2022 20: 06
    And ideally, either strike UAVs or kamikaze UAVs should patrol. For any cart, 10 kg of adjustable bombs or kamikaze warheads will suffice by the ears.
  31. 0
    10 October 2022 20: 09
    Hello. About the effectiveness in the words of the author of the article: "Today the fighting in Ukraine showed how effective light armored vehicles can be. heavy equipment." He himself answers why: "So, by the way, it was north of Balakleya, where the Armed Forces of Ukraine took advantage of the "holes" in the front line, threw infantry masses and carts there. And they succeeded." Everything is much more prosaic, lack of personal composition and drones.
  32. 0
    10 October 2022 20: 12
    Already in 1941/42, they were able to special. British Army and SAS units use the regular army "JEP". They installed combined Bren machine guns and were able to destroy the airport and fuel depots. They came, jumped out, destroyed and left. The Germans paid a lot for these units. But somehow everyone forgot, but the time and the need for the army reminds. Let's try! am
    1. 0
      11 October 2022 17: 51
      Any wheeled vehicle can drive fast (70 and above kilometers per hour) only on roads, that is, possible routes for fast movement are limited by the presence of roads, which means that roads must be mined and, in general, it is necessary to mine more often and thicker. ,
  33. 0
    12 October 2022 21: 01
    As an option, it is possible to use a high-speed excavator - trench digger with KPVT machine guns against LBT
    Let me explain. A high-speed excavator quickly digs a trench in the right places. A post with a machine gun, communications, and possibly mines is set up along this trench.
  34. 0
    9 November 2022 17: 25
    The author did not provide for the simplest and most effective method of fighting against the "wiser Ukrainians" on carts. Deprivation of stocks of fuel and lubricants. Under zero. We don’t know where the oil depots and refineries are? We know. Without fuel, all these jihad-mobiles will move on native Ukrainian traction. On the wolves.
  35. 0
    15 November 2022 20: 25
    Silly article. Any carts are extinguished:
    1. Modern ATGMs with seeker
    2. Rapid-fire machine guns and small-caliber anti-aircraft guns - Tunguska, Shilka, at least ZU-23. Yes, and thirty with BMP / BMD / BTR will completely crumble them. And what a tasty target for turntables and attack aircraft! As in a dash!
    Yes, and minefields can be thrown for them.
    These carts are suitable only for reconnaissance and sabotage, and no more.
  36. 0
    23 November 2022 08: 01
    . ,, That's how mobile installations with ZSU-23-2 in the bodies, put forward on the route of Russian bombers, shot down two Su-34s that tried to break through to targets at low altitude. ,, And you can link to these events, pliz.
    1. 0
      15 February 2023 16: 45
      This is fantastic ... Already starting with the "bomber route")))
  37. 0
    9 December 2022 13: 39
    All the successes of such armored vehicles occur only due to the lack of aviation action.
    A helicopter with birdies will burn an unlimited number of these carts without entering the range of their weapons. and now let's move on to the fact that we simply do not have so many guided weapons for helicopters. If these armored cars tried to act against some American army, they would burn out and that's it
  38. 0
    15 February 2023 16: 38
    Against such carts, they once again put ZUShki on motorbikes ... Although even the second beha has a good rate of fire, it may well stop them ...
  39. 0
    24 February 2023 11: 13
    The main way to counter carts is to form a full-fledged front line, at least to the operational depth, while observing the number of "bayonets" and guns per kilometer of the front ...
    Carts, even with light armor, are still quite vulnerable and can survive maximum machine-gun fire ...
    I don’t understand, North Korea, Iran offered their military units, and the same Iran has units with real combat experience, why we refuse ...
    Maybe they won't be effective offensively, maybe they won't be able to hold the first line of defense, but they will be able to create the necessary depth of defense. The front line, at least 30-40 km deep, should be saturated with troops, and in places where an enemy offensive is expected, there should be even more orders. Then all these Tachanki will sharply become ineffective. Yes, they will still be applicable as mobile vehicles, like swinging mortars, but as soon as a solid line of defense appears, to the required depth, there is nothing for carts to catch on the offensive.