Dromons in defense of Constantinople

70
Dromons in defense of Constantinople
The battle of the Russians with the dromon. Artist D. Pashkov


This article continues a series of articles on the sieges of the capital of Byzantium - Constantinople.



It will focus on the most important mechanism for dealing with the besiegers - about navy. Since the sea washed the capital of the Roman Empire from three sides, not only was the threat to the city often stopped by the fact that the fleet struck at the besiegers, but the besiegers themselves used ships to fight the capital.

In my articles, I have already talked about the sieges in the period from the founding of the city to the tenth century inclusive. In each of these periods, the fleet contributed to the fight against the besiegers. But also on different historical stages, especially since the emergence and formation of the Eastern Roman Empire with its capital in Constantinople, the military fleet has undergone a number of changes and transformations.

The strengthening of the power and strength of the fleet occurred from the end of the XNUMXth century, the Roman fleet dominated the Mediterranean, especially in its eastern part during the XNUMXth - early second half of the XNUMXth century.

And as Kekavmen wrote in "Advice to Vasileus":

“After all, if the fleet becomes useless, then you yourself will turn into nothingness and fall.”

Siege of Constantinople and fleet


When the committee of the federates Vitalian raised an uprising, in 516 he sent a Danube flotilla of 200 ships with a landing force and captured the harbor on the Thracian coast of the Bosporus, 11 km from the capital. But other rebels against the emperor Phocas managed to take the capital on October 5, 610 by the forces of the fleet, which was headed by the future emperor Heraclius.

And sixteen years later, the Byzantine fleet saved the empire from a double siege, from the troops of the Sasanian Iran and the Avars, preventing them from connecting. In the Golden Horn, the fleet defeated a flotilla of Slavic one-trees, which, by order of the Avar Khagan, were to land at the walls of Blachernae.

But, if before the capture of the eastern part of the empire of the Romans by the Arabs, the Byzantines had undivided dominance at sea, which was practically not threatened by anyone, then after the Arabs, using the human and technical resources of Egypt and Lebanon, they built their navy.

Many researchers claim that the Arabs created ships based on their experience of sailing around Arabia and merchant trips to Iran and India. But their knowledge by this time in navigation, in comparison with the Romans, was minimal. And they successfully took advantage of someone else's experience. Even the naval infrastructure that they inherited from the Romans, they simply renovated at first, and only later began to make changes and innovations, as when polishing the mirror of the famous lighthouse in Alexandria, with which they allegedly could burn Byzantine ships.


Dromon battle. Pseulo-Oppian. Kinegetics code. Constantinople. XNUMXth century Marchian Library. Venice

The dromon was taken as the basis of the warship. The first innovation that the Arabs introduced, as is often written in the literature, was the protection of the upper deck. With which it is difficult to agree. Here is what Procopius of Caesarea wrote about the campaign of the Roman fleet against the vandals in Libya:

“They had dromons, long ships adapted for naval combat, in the amount of ninety-two; they had one row of oars each, and they had a roof on top so that the rowers who were here were not hit by the arrows of enemies.

The further conquest of the Mediterranean coast led to the fact that more and more inhabitants of the coast, experienced sailors, joined the ranks of the Arab fleet, who created, of course, under the leadership of Arab commanders, pirate fleets that for centuries inspired fear in the Christian world.

But during the two sieges of Constantinople, the fleet was able to inflict a sensitive defeat on the Arabs in 673-677. and in 716-718. After such activity of the Arab fleet, the Romans began to pay increased attention to the development of the fleet, although this was not always possible. The fleet had to operate away from the capital, fighting numerous pirate fleets from Africa and even from Spain. The fleet was engaged in the transfer of contingents to the western themes of the empire. And with the advent of the “Ros”-Russian fleets near Constantinople, the work increased.

Nevertheless, until the 70s of the XI century, the fleet succeeded in this successfully. The importance of the fleet for the defense of the capital was also understood by enemies, such as the Bulgarian Tsar Simeon the Great. He sent an embassy to Egypt in 923 to draw the Arab fleet into the siege of Constantinople.

How was the fleet of the empire completed at that time?

marine theme


Theme structure from the XNUMXth to XNUMXth centuries was formed on the basis of a territorial community. And the main warrior was a warrior-peasant, a stratiot. They carried out a "stratum", i.e. military service, and had a "stratum" - a land plot from which the service was carried out, later the owner could pay epirius from this plot, so as not to serve himself. The transition to Epirius took place from the end of the XNUMXth century to the second half of the XNUMXth century. The same strata (only "sea strata") were among the sailors, that is, the inhabitants of the coastal territories of marine themes: this is the theme of the Kivirreots, a territory at the tip of the southwest of Asia Minor, about. Samos and the islands of the Aegean Sea.

According to the short story of Constantine VII, the maritime stratum was equal to the land stratum in the amount of four liters per liter, while the strata of the imperial fleet were equal to two liters. The fact is that the stratiots of the marine themes themselves fully equipped the ships, and the stratiots of the basileus fleet served on ships prepared by the state.

Ibn-Khaukal reported that in all sea villages there was a collection from the “smoke” (hearth) of one denarius, rather, one nomisme. Then the sailors are given 12 coins each, the rest of the money is taken by the “sea prefect”, the drungari, and after the campaign he uses it according to his own understanding. Food is given to the sailors from the drungaria or “what God sends and the basileus will grant”, and all the wealth captured on the campaign and the ransom from the prisoners are transferred to the emperor.

Thus, it was the responsibility of the seaside themes to equip the thethemic fleet with ships, warriors, and oarsmen.

Rowers were formed into certain detachments, which were called "ousia" or "uziakos", they consisted of 108 or 110 rowers, which formed the crews of dromons or helands. Often these warriors were on ships as amphibious assault or marines, in modern terms.

Thus, stratiotes from marine themes served as warriors on ships, as well as sailors and rowers. During the collapse of the theme system in the XNUMXth century, stratiots preferred to serve as rowers so as not to spend money on weapons.

Armament of sailors


Emperor Leo VI the Wise (r. 886–912), about whom I already wrote in the article “How Byzantium Almost Became an Empire of the Slavs and Greeks,” wrote Tactics. The article in this "Tactics", devoted to naval military affairs, unlike many other articles, is of an independent nature. Here is what the emperor writes about the weapons that the sailors were supposed to have:

“Except for the stratiotes oared on the upper tier, all the rest - from the first to the last in order - must be cataphracts and have weapon, like shields, menavls, bows, arrows in large numbers, swords, riktarii-spears, shells, klibaniya [klivanii], covering if not the back, then at least the chest, helmets, bracers. They are especially necessary for the stratiotes located in front, when they engage in combat when attacking and fighting the enemy in hand-to-hand combat. Those who do not have shells and quilts, in any case, let them wear the so-called neurons, which are made from double felt. Those who are stationed on dromons behind all, let them use bows and large stones or shells that fit in the palm of their hands, when there is no other weapon left to throw at enemies.

Let's dwell on some of the types of weapons listed.

Leo VI described defensive armament as follows:

"If possible, also have the oblivions, which are now called cleavages (κλιβάνιον), and they are shiny and radiant."

Likewise, Nikephoros II Phocas (r. 963-969) considers zabu to be part of the cleavage, that is, it is a protective type of weapon, lamenar or lamellar, judging by the images that have survived to this day. Contrary to the assertion of researchers (J. Dennnison), that this is chain mail (coat of mail). This is confirmed by Leo the Deacon, who emphasizes the armament of the Russians of Svyatoslav, “a torus made of movable joints” (άλυσἰδοτος θώραξ) - chain mail, in contrast to the armament of the Romans. Thus, the "marines" had to be in cleavage or cleavage, plate or scale armor.

But the “neurik” is a very interesting equipment, which is defined as a protective jacket made of a double layer of felt, this type of equipment is found a lot in the military literature of this period, most likely, this protection is much shorter than the cavadium, “made of felt and leather”, because on deck he would have hampered the movements of a warrior.

I would also like to dwell on such a type of weapon as menavla or monavlata, from the distorted Latin name of the hunting spear - venabulus. This weapon, according to Nicephorus Uranus, was 2,7–3,7 m long. Monavlata or menavla under Emperor Nicephorus II Fok was a heavy spear of an infantry unit that stopped the heavily armed Arab cavalry.

And Leo VI pointed out that it should be used in naval combat, its peculiarity was striking from the lower tier of oars at the ship and sailors of the enemy. It was not excluded and its throwing towards the enemies.

And what actually happened with the weapons of the sailors, not on the pages of Tactics, but in life? First of all, all hand-held throwing devices were used, of course, bows and such exotic things, as we saw above - heavy shells.

Sailors from two personal imperial helands, when the emperor sent them to war with the rest of the fleet, were supplied with shields, spears, the best helmets and all the necessary weapons. And as the author of Naumachiai Sirian Magister wrote, stratiots in the fleet should be armed like the first row of ground units, i.e., be fully equipped with protective weapons.

Seamen training


Initially, all sailors in the fleet were people from areas of intensive navigation, so to speak, natural sailors and rowers. For example, from Egypt. They were the basis of the commands of the Byzantine fleet during the period of the conquests of Justinian the Great, they also formed the basis of the Arab fleet after the conquest of Roman Egypt by the Saracens. The same can be said about the inhabitants of other seaside themes. The fleet of the Romans lost its importance with the capture of coastal themes and islands by Byzantium by the 90s of the XNUMXth century: there are no sailors, there is no coastal infrastructure, and there is no fleet.

Particular attention was paid to the training of rowers, they had to be able not only to row to the beat at the command of the helmsman, but also to swim and dive.

Each team had to have sailors responsible for the survivability of the ship. In the event of a hole, they had to be able to repair it with improvised means, before help arrived. All the stratiotes who fight on the upper deck, notes the emperor Leo, had to be strong and courageous, especially those who fight hand-to-hand.

Weak warriors should be sent to the lower tier. But Sirian the Magister writes about scout sailors who land on land and were supposed to be swift and vigilant, armed only with daggers.

Emperor Leo requires constant training of soldiers, both in hand-to-hand combat, and in the work of managing the ship, and in actions in the ranks.

The commanders of warships were, as Vasilevs Leo writes, in the imperial fleet - archons, and on thematic ships - drungaria and turmarchs. Above several imperial ships stood a commander, who was called an archon or comite, and above the thematic three or five dromons, a strategos. Later they were called Komites-Drungarii. How to manage a strategist with a detachment of ships, both Sirian the Magister and Leo VI wrote.

At the head of the imperial fleet was the drungari of the fleet, which from the XNUMXth century was called the "catepan of the fleet" or "duka of the fleet". Emperor Romanus Lakapis was a drungar of the fleet before, as Constantine the Bogryanogenny wrote, “entered the palace and found himself, I don’t know how to put it, the owner of the kingdom.”

At the head of the thematic fleets were the thematic leaders: the stratigi or duks of the themes. They were accompanied by "protonotaries", civilians, not military persons, who were in charge of finances and naval property.

The commanders were supposed to be "pilots", people who knew well the peculiarities of navigation in a particular area, reefs and shallows, the wind rose. There is a lot of evidence about how the fleet, caught in a storm, was either completely destroyed, or its ships were scattered over long distances. Therefore, knowledge of the wind rose was an important condition prescribed in Tactics. The fleet of the Romans fought not only at oars, but also under sail. Under such conditions, in the same Sirian Magister we read:

at the moment when we have the winds as allies, as is often the case with the trade winds [dry winds of the Aegean - Approx. ed.] and coastal winds.

Based on practice, often the fleet did not move in formation, but at random, which made it possible for the enemy to destroy the dromons one by one, so the Tactics required to observe the formation. The same requirements were for the formation in battle, since it happened that the ships entered the battle as they arrived at the battlefield, and not lined up in a certain order.

We know about several types of formation in battle, as well as different arrangements of ships, depending on their size: the largest dromons could be located either in the center of the formation or along the flanks. The formations were carried out in a crescent or semicircle, with the aim of covering the flanks, in one or two lines or in separate detachments, depending on the situation. It was necessary to use the features of the terrain, for example, to wage a battle between two islands, to carry out a feigned flight. All these tactics were used later, in the same fleets of the Italian republics.

Dromon


The main combat unit throughout the entire period of the existence of the Roman fleet was the dromon. It was both the name, in fact, of the ship, and the generic definition for warships.

There is a lot of controversy surrounding the names of Byzantine ships. We emphasize that our main knowledge comes from written sources, and they do not allow us to speak unambiguously about Byzantine ships and dromons, in particular. There can be many guesses and assumptions, most of them have the right to exist, but in history as a science, a hypothesis is not a key research method.

It is only clear that the dromon originates from the ships of the previous Greco-Roman period.

Dromons were large and small, some were used to fight the Arabs, who had similar ships, but small ones - against, for example, the Ross. And they were used on the rivers for landing. There were dromons that could carry horses.


Scheme-reconstruction. How horses were transported on dromon or helandia. As Emperor Leo wrote: “to equip ships carrying cargo and horses, as if playing the role of a convoy.” Source: John H. Pryor, E. M. Jeffreys. The age of DROMΩN The Byzantine Navy ca 500–1204. Leiden-Boston. 2006

Since the XNUMXth century, ships have had a new name - helandia. Helandia (judging by the fact that Constantine Porphyrogenitus described two imperial helandia) was the same dromon, but more elegant and richly decorated. Then the authors, depending on taste, used one or the other name, as well as a later name - "galley", which, again, was artificially formed. Most likely, the dromon began to be called a galley in a later historical period.

Let's not forget that a number of future maritime republics, such as Venice and Amalfi, for a long time - until the middle of the XNUMXth century, were cities subordinate to Byzantium, and their fleets were formed within the framework of the Roman Empire.

Here is how Emperor Leo VI describes the “model” dromon:

“Each dromon should be designed for at least 25 transverse benches, on which the rowers should be seated. Of all the benches, 25 are at the bottom and likewise 25 at the top; there are 50 benches in total. Two rowers sit on each of them - one on the right and one on the left.


This diagram shows the arrangement of the rowers on the dromon. Source: John H. Pryor, E. M. Jeffreys. The age of DROMΩN The Byzantine Navy ca 500–1204. Leiden-Boston. 2006

Given the strict succession of Byzantium from the Roman Empire, which has been repeatedly observed with other military institutions and terms, it can be argued that the dromon was the successor of the liburnum.

As Vegetius, an author of the early fifth century, wrote:

“As for the size of the ships, the smallest liburnians have one row of oars each; those that are slightly larger, two each; with a suitable size of the ships, they can get three, four and five rows of oars.


Odysseus on a ship. Mosaic. XNUMXrd century Carthage. Museum of Bordeaux. Tunisia. Author's photo

Vegetius objects to those who would be surprised, where did such ships with four and five rows of oars come from among the Romans at this time? Indeed, we practically do not meet them either in the late Roman period, and even in the period of Byzantium: there was no need for such ships.

We see new three-row ships in large numbers only in the XNUMXth century, as both Nikita Khonian and Anna Komnenos wrote about.

If there was one row of oars on the dromon, then its length should have been fifty or sixty meters, if in two rows - forty meters. The width of the dromons was about 4,5 meters, the draft was a little more than a meter, and the displacement was about 100 tons.

The lower row of oars was protected from water by leather cuffs, similar to non-return valves and protected from water and friction. The oars of the upper row were guided by pegs. All oars were fastened with belt loops (zevglas), which also kept the oar from falling if the rower was killed. In the bottom row, rowers worked blindly, flutists set the pace since the time of the ancient Greeks.

In practice, most likely, dromons were of different sizes, and single-row dromons, in all likelihood, were the vast majority, but outstanding ships attracted special attention. Small dromons could be called "moners" or galleys.

Titmar of Mirzenburg describes such a fire-bearing dromon,

"which cannot be quenched by anything but vinegar..."

This ship took hostage the Emperor Otto II himself:

The Salandria, on the other hand, are ships of amazing length and speed, which had 2 rows of oars on both sides and numbered 150 sailors.

The ships had names. So, the imperial dromons or helandias were called "Dromon of Basileus" and "Follower".


Imperial drone. Osprey Publishing. Hood. Giuseppe Rava

If we exclude the richly decorated helandia of the emperor, then we have a number of other types of sea vessels - for example, pleasure farmers, but the dromon remains the key one.

Dromon armament


There is an ongoing dispute around the dromons, whether they all had “Greek fire” on board or were “fire-bearing” dromons and without “Greek fire” siphons. We will devote a separate story to this issue.

How did the dromon defend itself? And what weapon did he have?

The dromon had a powerful ram, it was installed exactly along the waterline and could also be used as a boarding bridge.

During this period, control over the ship's draft was an important issue. In the battle with the Sicilians of King Roger, the Venetians did not control such a situation when their dromons used up all their weapons, floated on the surface of the water, which did not even reach the second lane. And so, when all the soldiers crowded around the sides facing the enemy, the ships sank.

On large dromons on the deck, xylocastrons were built, towers made of wood, in the Roman period they were built of brick. The towers were covered with leather.

At the stern, bow and sides of the dromons, toxobolists were to be installed, which throw small arrows, “flies”.


On the deck of the dromon. Artist D. Pashkov

Various throwing weapons were used, of course, only those that could fit on the deck. With their help, before landing, they cleared the coast from enemy troops. On board there could be a device called a “crane”, an angular structure that could rotate around its axis and had a chute through which liquid hot resin could be poured onto an enemy ship.

Millstones, triboles, pots of fire, wooden pieces with driven nails, wrapped in tow, which were thrown on fire, were thrown from the ship. And even such exotic as pots with snakes. There is always a question about fire safety on the ship. Little is said about this in Tactics.


Dromon. Reconstruction by J. Prior. Source: John H. Pryor, E. M. Jeffreys. The age of DROMΩN The Byzantine Navy ca 500–1204. Leiden-Boston. 2006

Thus, the Byzantine fleet, consisting of dromons, was used both to move troops and to participate in naval battles. The fleet reached the peak of its development at the end of the XNUMXth - beginning of the XNUMXth centuries. This is what the fleet was like during this period. Leo the Deacon describes the expedition against Cyprus, captured by the Arabs:

“There were ships: with liquid fire - 2, dromons - 000, cargo ships with provisions and military equipment - 1.”

And as Kekavmen prophetically said: while there was a fleet, both Byzantium and its capital Constantinople existed.

To be continued ...
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  1. +6
    30 September 2022 04: 51
    Thanks Edward!

    I realized once again how specialization of a person literally crystallized in Byzantium.
  2. -2
    30 September 2022 04: 56
    Erdogan will capture or partly capture Bulgaria.
    If the little brother will go against the Angles in support of the uhria.
    Fleet - for the south and coastal states.
    North, steppe cavalry
  3. 0
    30 September 2022 05: 11
    Ancient and medieval ships have different designs, so it is unlikely that the galley grew out of a dromon.

    This is evidenced, in particular, by the presence of a tyrant on a dromon, the light hull of an ancient vessel could really be broken through by them, but there is no more solid medieval galley.
    1. 0
      30 September 2022 20: 35
      Quote: Maxim G
      Ancient and medieval ships have different designs, so it is unlikely that the galley grew out of a dromon.

      This is evidenced, in particular, by the presence of a tyrant on a dromon, the light hull of an ancient vessel could really be broken through by them, but there is no more solid medieval galley.


      It's probably more difficult.
      Dormon is not a specific type of vessel, such as ancient birkmas and triremes. Dividing, even as they say, not into rows of oars, but rows of rowers.
      Dormon is a class of warship (in the understanding of the sailor of the 18th century - a rank ship). Hence the differences in sources and vague descriptions. In fact, a collective image, however, like the later galleys. However, one must understand that 25 benches and two decks of rowers are serious. The classic large galleys of the 18th century had from 23 to 28. Rarely 30. 33-35 are the flagship galleys of the Spanish and royal galleys of the French fleets. By the way, I do not agree with Edward, while I am sincerely grateful to him for the article. Still, the oars of the rowers on the dormon passed through one port. It is possible that just the imperial helands are the forerunners of the first galleys, which were rowed by three rows of rowers on the same bench.
      Now for the hull. Edward is right dormon heir to liburna, not triremes. The latter had a developed body with frames. These are the first ships of classical construction. Even the famous caravels of Spain cut their hair from skin to frame, and not vice versa. So over the five centuries of history, dormon acquired a serious body, on which a ram could be carried. At the galleys, by the way, he grew into a spy (boarding bridge).
      Well, somewhere like that.
      1. +1
        1 October 2022 08: 05
        What ram?
        The ancient ones could have 2: underwater and surface (as a limiter) ...
        And the functions of a ram in ancient times and a spy in medieval times are different: one for ramming, the other for boarding.

        As for the fact that the galley grew out of a dromon, the question is what was the early dromon and the late one, if the researchers write the truth that its hull was becoming heavier and the set played an increasing role, then it is quite possible that the galley grew out of it.
  4. +6
    30 September 2022 06: 51
    We look forward to continuing, thanks Edward!
  5. +8
    30 September 2022 06: 54
    Interesting article dear Edward.
    There was an article on this site.
    "Rowers and Oars"
    July 29 2013
    To the author's conclusion:
    Vessels "Some are larger, others are smaller, but in general they are similar in type and all, of course, with one row of oars" (c)
    And it's hard to disagree with him. There are quite a lot of works on the topic of the multi-tiered courts of antiquity, which prove that their nature could not be.
    1. 0
      30 September 2022 20: 47
      At least one trireme "Olympia" floats! In museums and on the water, there are also several double-row biremes.
      Alexander strikes me. Modern "non-throwers" themselves invented it and they themselves "throw it down" !!!
      Ancient authors write about rows of rowers, not floors and decks. In fact, ancient ships did not have a deck, and the rowers sat on benches with an elevation. Perhaps only the early biremes and triremes had a significant difference in height.
      By the way, all Byzantine galleys until the 17th century had oars through one port.
      1. +1
        1 October 2022 07: 17
        Good morning!
        In my comment, I mentioned an article published on this resource.
        Let's discuss it, and then we will decide whether there were multi-tiered ships of antiquity.
        Edward's article dealt with the defense of Constantinople from the sea.
        Here the author describes the strategy and tactics of the Romans, there are no questions.
        1. 0
          1 October 2022 08: 13
          Dear Alexander, I mean that a multi-tiered ship and rows of rowers are “two big differences”! hi
          1. +1
            1 October 2022 09: 17
            Okay, how do you imagine the second row of rowers?
            1. 0
              1 October 2022 13: 50
              Quote: ee2100
              Okay, how do you imagine the second row of rowers?

              The difference in landing did not exceed half the height of a person sitting on a bench.

              This is one of the sources that have come down to us.

              This is a reconstruction of a cross section of a trireme. Moreover, the trireme itself refers to the times of the Persian-Greek wars. Later, the tranits (top row) have a coal miner, through which the oar passes.
              Perhaps after that the length of the oars becomes the same. On the old versions of the trireme, it varied from 4,16 to 4,50 m.
              The peculiarity of this planting did not allow increasing the number of rows over five. So it is more likely that in later courts there were several people per oar, although this is less efficient than one person per oar.
              Who decided this - the Venetians, whose galleys until the 17th century had one oar per rower planted three in a row. Moreover, they were more efficient than the Spanish with four rowers per oar.
              So the later Dormons had a system of distribution of oars and rowers apparently similar to the Venetian one.
              1. 0
                1 October 2022 14: 08
                I saw this drawing. One of the questions is the distance of the opening of the first row from the waterline.
                And how will they row with such crowded oars, if the oar is 4.16-4.50 m?
                1. 0
                  1 October 2022 20: 40
                  Quote: ee2100
                  I saw this drawing. One of the questions is the distance of the opening of the first row from the waterline.
                  And how will they row with such crowded oars, if the oar is 4.16-4.50 m?

                  Talamites according to sources rowed during battle and in calm weather. The height of the freeboard of the trireme was about 2,5 meters. On the reapers, a row of oars passed through ports with leather plugs over the lower wels. About 1,2 meters above the water.
                  The distance between the rowers of one row is 1,1 meters. So there was no crowding of oars.
                  1. 0
                    1 October 2022 22: 54
                    If you wish, you yourself will find on the Internet confirmation that there were neither many longline nor many row rowing vessels, but that if there are such images on some fresco or vase, then this is not a document. A vase is a vase, and a fresco is a fresco and nothing more.
                    Another thing is surprising - the calculations confirming this statement have been known for a long time, but historians do not notice them point-blank.
                    Here is E. Vvshchenko, my comment was ignored, although I am sure that he knew about the calculations of the optimal length of the oar, and also took care of the weight of the oar, for example, the second tier or deck.
                    And these stories about multi-tiered or in-line ships will be repeated, perhaps for more than one century.
                    I do not think that all historians are not so friendly with the head and that they cannot understand simple calculations. It is customary in their environment to think so, period!
                    But he will take real documents, such as maps, where, for example, Tartaria is indicated. And what do modern historians say about this? Or an optical illusion or stupid cartographers! I see Moscow, but no Tartaria!
                    Below I will give a couple of pictures. The artist draws what he was ordered, but no one is interested in how it works.


                    You believe that it was so, but I trust calculations and common sense.
                    1. 0
                      2 October 2022 04: 45
                      Alexander, didn’t you think that the calculations were made deliberately with an error for the sake of getting a “sensation”?
                      By the way, in the lower figure on the trireme, external frames came from somewhere. Yes, and the position of the rowers should be in reverse order. In fact, in 1978, a Carthaginian trireme was found off the coast of the Apennine Peninsula and the issue with the latter was closed.
                      The built Olympia and almost a dozen biremes empirically proved this fact.
                      Everyone believes what they want - "the earth is flat"!
                      1. 0
                        2 October 2022 06: 02
                        Good morning. The dog woke up and had to walk it, well, I read your answer. I am not an alternative at all, friends can confirm.
                        Thought I wouldn't repeat myself, but...
                        - in nature, there are certain laws that are not subject to time and some of them concern a person, or rather his body, and based on this, it is necessary to consider, in this case, the oar, its length, weight and the optimal efforts that a person makes to manage it. Height, average rower, let it be 170 cm.
                        - the oar is a lever (“give me a lever”) and in order to control it, the rower must have a stop. And from here, standing rowing is impossible.
                        - paddle. The paddle consists of a handle and a blade, this is simplified. If the paddle is long, the ones we are talking about, then it should be balanced and the center of the paddle should be. point of contact with the oarlock or side. To do this, the paddle is balanced accordingly and the so-called. Valek, which is located after the handle.
                        The length of the roll is calculated from the length of the rower's body and arms, and it is optimally 1 meter.
                        - the rowing process itself is simple: a person, bending, brings the oar as far forward as possible along the course of the vessel, lowers it into the water and, resting his feet, dismantling his back, draws the oar along the side, and then takes the oar out of the water.
                        In addition, it should be noted that the oar does not fall into the water perpendicularly, but at an angle of 60 °. And then here it turns out that the place at the side of the vessel is only for one person.
                        The longer the paddle, the heavier it is, the harder you need to make the roll, which means that the mass of the paddle increases and the effort expended on each cycle increases.
                        And further. An increase in the length of the oar reduces the leverage, which automatically affects the efficiency of rowing and, as a result, the speed of the vessel. Optimum paddle length 4 meters
                        Maximum rowing efficiency is achieved when the roll is located at chest level with the oar lowered into the water.
                        The optimal height of the oarlock above the waterline, in this position, is 1 meter.
                        Location of the second tier of rowers. Let's say. It turns out that the bottom row will not see the oars and its position relative to the water, which will lead to a rhythm failure and a slowdown.
                        There is no point in talking about the third tier.
                        In my comment, I referred to the article "Rowers and Oars". Therefore, I will not repeat the calculations of the weight of the oars.
                        And one more not unimportant, but interesting moment. Let's say that there were the second and third tiers. There were also corresponding oars. And how were they inserted into the oarlocks? From the side or from inside the ship? What happened with the command "sushi oars"?
                        Where and how were they stacked when the ship was sailing? Or during a storm?
                      2. 0
                        2 October 2022 11: 42
                        And from here, standing rowing is impossible.

                        The Spaniards, alas, did not know about this! On their prams and royal galleys, there were up to 5-6 rowers in a row per oar. The last one had to run.
                        It turns out that the bottom row will not see the oars and its position relative to the water, which will lead to a rhythm failure and a slowdown.

                        On the Greek galleys, the flutists set the pace of rowing. In addition, the triremes did not have an oarlock in the modern sense, but there was a port into which the oar blade passed, leather plugs of the port and a strap for attaching the oar to the port. Moreover, the first and third were the property of the rower, and the second policy or trierarch.
                        Let's say that there were the second and third tiers. There were also corresponding oars. And how were they inserted into the oarlocks?

                        From the inside - the triera did not have a deck as such. At best, the Curonians over the rowers. Moreover, the top rows did not need plugs. The oars were held in the loop of the rower's leather oar. With the advent of the coalman, the need to make oars of different lengths disappeared. On dormons, it is possible that all three oars of the rowers of one bench passed to one port. This was later repeated by the Venetians. True, they abandoned the linearly elevated seating arrangement, putting everyone on the same bench.
                      3. 0
                        2 October 2022 13: 42
                        I am not a sailor, but as far as I know, a flat-bottomed sailing and rowing vessel used as a floating artillery battery.
                        There is no point in this dispute. everyone will still have their own opinion.
  6. +1
    30 September 2022 10: 23
    Since the XNUMXth century, ships have had a new name - helandia. Helandia (judging by the fact that Constantine Porphyrogenitus described two imperial helandia) was the same dromon, but more elegant and richly decorated.

    It is strange that the author, using illustrations from such a fundamental work as "The age of DROMΩN The Byzantine Navy ca 500–1204", judging by the article, did not read the book itself, since quite a lot is devoted to the question - what is helandia? attention and the authors are inclined to conclude that the helandium is a rowing transport vessel for transporting horses.
    1. +7
      30 September 2022 11: 59
      Helandium-helandia is used in different, often conflicting contexts. Reducing everything to a transport vessel for transporting horses is at least strange.
      1. +2
        30 September 2022 12: 47
        And I didn't take it. I just gave the opinion of the author, who, let's say, is "in the subject."
        1. +5
          30 September 2022 13: 02
          I'm just talking about the author, who identified helandia as horse carriers.
          galea-galley.livejournal.com/20095.html&ved=2ahUKEwiAi9H1kbz6AhXQR_EDHbvUAIcQFnoECBEQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3Hac_4v5HyVl5X_fPUf9ua
          Here, for example, is an analysis of versions, without delving into historiography.
          Based on what you read, everything is complicated, but helandia is rather a warship in the broad sense, often a synonym for dromon.
          1. +4
            30 September 2022 13: 12
            Yes, the author of "The age of DROMΩN The Byzantine Navy ca 500-1204" just does not draw any categorical conclusions. He takes this issue very seriously. Up to a comparison of the weight and size characteristics of horses and ships. And he emphasizes that about horse carriers, based on the information available, is the most plausible, but only a version. Version! You read the original.
            1. +4
              30 September 2022 13: 59
              I'll try to read it, but I can't promise. Byzantium, unfortunately, somehow does not enter.
              1. +2
                30 September 2022 14: 09
                I agree that Byzantium is a specific topic. But here it is rather a question of the history of shipbuilding.
    2. +8
      30 September 2022 12: 09
      and the authors tend to conclude that the helandium is a rowing transport vessel for transporting horses.

      Some tend to one version, others do not.
      I read all the sources on this topic, I didn’t have such an opinion, for example, are the vessels that burned Igor’s flotilla called helands?
      This is a popular science article, not a historiographical one.
      Dear Nephilim,
      Do you have any personal bias towards me? When you write that "someone, something" did not read?
      The text contains a number of quotes from this work, not only "pictures" ... if you haven't noticed laughing
      Best regards,
      hi
      1. +4
        30 September 2022 12: 45
        I have read all sources on this topic

        Well, you got excited. I understand that reputation is sacred, but reckless statements can greatly undermine it.
        Do you have any personal bias towards me?

        What personal prejudices can I have towards you if I have never seen you and do not know who you are? So all my comments relate exclusively to the topic of the article.
        1. +4
          30 September 2022 14: 05
          Your comments often take the form of personal attacks. So I asked, rather, a rhetorical question.
          It's up to you how to write, but the form and presentation of comments and opinions indicates the level of culture of the participant in the discussion, or its absence.
          hi
          1. +1
            30 September 2022 14: 18
            Your comments often take the form of personal attacks.

            Have you come across such a term as gestalt psychology? If not, I recommend Frederick Perls' An Essay on the Psychology of Self-Knowledge.
      2. +5
        30 September 2022 14: 58
        If you memorize one new word from each article - what kind of lexicographer can you become.
        It remains to be seen how long the word "helandia" will last in memory. unless actively used.
        1. +5
          30 September 2022 15: 21
          Sergey,
          good day,
          the most important question: why?
          hi
          1. +6
            30 September 2022 15: 24
            Good afternoon, Edward!

            I will answer.
            Open the box of Byzantium if necessary, and there are the characters with all the equipment.
            And the smells of Byzantium.

            And the picture will come to life - at least a little bit.
            1. +5
              30 September 2022 15: 27
              And the picture will come to life - at least a little bit.

              1. +2
                30 September 2022 20: 19
                Immediately three pictures came to life.
                The main thing is not to rush.
            2. +6
              30 September 2022 15: 41
              And the picture will come to life - at least a little bit.

              How poetic good
              1. +3
                30 September 2022 20: 19
                As in fairy tales - sprinkle with living water.
            3. +2
              30 September 2022 19: 03
              Good evening, Sergey! smile

              And the picture will come to life -


              I can imagine what an anthill reigned in the narrow streets of this city. Yes

              1. +2
                30 September 2022 20: 20
                Hi Constantine!

                Do you think it is more crowded than in modern Beijing or Moscow?
                1. +3
                  30 September 2022 20: 39
                  I do not know, but the city gives the impression of being compressed into a tight spring. smile
                  1. +3
                    30 September 2022 23: 42
                    And only on the hippodrome free space?
                    1. +3
                      1 October 2022 06: 58
                      Well, at least somewhere you can feel "free"? wink
                      1. +1
                        1 October 2022 07: 45
                        Only if half the city isn't going there.
                      2. +2
                        1 October 2022 07: 49
                        Only if half the city isn't going there.


                        So it's not every day of the gathering. wassat

                      3. +2
                        1 October 2022 08: 02
                        Then of course. And the hippodrome watchman sometimes enjoys freedom.
                      4. +2
                        1 October 2022 08: 17
                        Watchmen are never free, they are always vigilant, however, like watchmen. laughing
        2. +9
          30 September 2022 15: 30
          It remains to be seen how long the word "helandia" will last in memory.
          Helands full of mullets?
          This is how I remembered the identity of the Guelphs and Ghibellines.
          1. +5
            30 September 2022 15: 53
            Quote: 3x3zsave
            Helands full of mullets?

            But it’s interesting that the word “scow” doesn’t happen from “helandia” by any chance?
            Good afternoon Anton! hi
            1. +6
              30 September 2022 16: 00
              Hello, Sergey!
              I can not say anything. Just gave a variant of the mnemonic marker.
              1. +6
                30 September 2022 16: 08
                Quote: 3x3zsave
                I can not say anything. Just gave a variant of the mnemonic marker.

                But it turned out that I read on the Internet:
                The name of this small vessel was borrowed from French, where chaland comes from the Greek khelandion, which has the same meaning.
            2. +7
              30 September 2022 16: 12
              Quote: Mihaylov
              the word "shaland" does not happen from "helandia" by any chance?

              Etymological dictionaries state that this is so.
              Scow. The name of this small vessel was borrowed from French, where chaland comes from the Greek khelandion, which has the same meaning.

              Krylov's dictionary
              scow "flat-bottomed vessel", southern. (Dal), Ukrainian. scow. Loans. from the French chaland "cargo ship", which comes from cf. lat. chelandium, late Greek. χελάνδιον;

              Fasmer's dictionary
              Scow. Loan in the XNUMXth century from the French lang. French chaland < Gr. chelandion

              Shansky dictionary
              smile
              1. +7
                30 September 2022 16: 14
                Quote: Trilobite Master
                Etymological dictionaries state that this is so.

                My premonitions did not deceive me ....
                Greetings Michael! hi
                1. +6
                  30 September 2022 16: 52
                  Hello, Sergey.
                  It is surprising that the word, according to dictionaries, came to us after all from French, and not directly from Greek, although Greece is closer.
                  1. +4
                    30 September 2022 17: 02
                    Quote: Trilobite Master
                    It is surprising that the word, according to dictionaries, came to us after all from French, and not directly from Greek, although Greece is closer.

                    Yes, but this is probably due to the prevalence of the French language at one time in Russia, although it could really and directly get from Greek into the Russian language: many Greeks lived in the south.
                  2. +6
                    30 September 2022 17: 05
                    Michael, good afternoon
                    and there was nothing to call "scows".
                    Borrowing in the language only what is happening.
                    hi
                    1. +3
                      30 September 2022 19: 06
                      Greetings, Edward.
                      But when it appeared, it would be more logical to borrow from neighbors, especially since there are more Greeks on the Black Sea coast than the French. smile
                      By the way, in our places the word "scow" was used in the meaning of "trailer" to a car, that is, one had to hear constructions like "Kamaz with a scow" or "Zil with a scow". But this is from childhood, now they don’t say that.
                      And large boats on Ladoga are called lifeboats or barges.
                      1. +2
                        30 September 2022 22: 52
                        I can’t say for sure, but the local Greeks did not use the term scow, they used the felucca. However, I can’t say for the whole of Odessa, but in the Crimea the “scow” was not used.
                        As for the trailer, I myself was surprised when I was sent to load a scow during the excavations in Staraya Ladoga, I decided that there would be something on the Volkhov, but the trailer turned out to be in the fortress.
                        hi
                  3. +3
                    30 September 2022 20: 12
                    It is surprising that the word, according to dictionaries, came to us after all from French, and not directly from Greek, although Greece is closer.
                    I think it comes directly from Greek. Such an analogy - two types of flounders live in the Black Sea - kalkan and flounder-glossa. And in Greek, flounder is called glossa. Why shouldn't the name of the ship, given the large number of Black Sea Greeks, be transferred into Russian?
              2. +2
                30 September 2022 20: 23
                Turns out he never learned a new word. But I figured out how to remember it.
          2. +2
            30 September 2022 20: 22
            Through a mullet, a sailor's bone or werewolves?
  7. +6
    30 September 2022 10: 28
    Thus, the "marines" had to be in cleavage or cleavage, plate or scale armor.

    Good afternoon, Edward!
    Not marine, of course, foot soldiers, but still:


    Well, a little bit later... hi
    1. +5
      30 September 2022 12: 33
      Sergey,
      wanted to ask
      Is this Mistra?
      1. +4
        30 September 2022 12: 39
        Quote: Eduard Vaschenko
        Is this Mistra?

        Yes, Mistra, Church of St. Sophia, XV century:

        Inside, such an interesting coat of arms has been preserved:
      2. +4
        30 September 2022 12: 53
        Quote: Eduard Vaschenko
        Is this Mistra?

        I found another photo of a fresco from this church:

        The right one, in my opinion, is in chain mail, or does it seem to me?
  8. +6
    30 September 2022 10: 30
    “I entered the palace and found myself, I don’t know how to put it, the owner of the kingdom.”

    You can put it more simply: "The king, just the king." laughing
    which bore the name "ousia" or "uziakos",

    Maybe ouzo? (joking of course) drinks
    1. +5
      30 September 2022 12: 02
      Hello, Sergey!
      Yeah, of course, ouzo, but also other synonyms laughing
  9. +3
    30 September 2022 11: 20
    We emphasize that our main knowledge comes from written sources,

    Edward, were there any archaeological finds of Byzantine warships? hi
    1. +5
      30 September 2022 12: 03
      Yes, they were, in Turkey, relatively recently, but did not write about it so as not to overload)
  10. +5
    30 September 2022 16: 24
    And as Kekavmen prophetically said: while there was a fleet, both Byzantium and its capital Constantinople existed.


    Exactly! The same can be said about Great Britain: while there was a fleet there was GREAT Britain, now there is only a memory of its former power. Do not put on a par with Trafalgar pornography in the Falklands. laughing


    Thank you Edward for a new interesting work. good
  11. +2
    30 September 2022 18: 08
    sea ​​stratum was equal to land stratum in the amount of four liters liters
    It was boiling!
    Creamy Shore
    Poked on Nav
    And the grunts grunted
    Like mumziki in mave...

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