Military Review

Castles and donjons

172
Castles and donjons
"Storm of the castle of love" is a very popular story of the Middle Ages. 13x12,5 cm. Ivory. 1320–1350 Pay attention to how the castle of that time seemed to the creator of this carved little thing. Two towers, a wall, a gate, and a donjon behind. Castle Museum Willeveck. Pays de la Loire (Lands of the Loire)



Beautiful old castles.
Battlements of their gray towers
As if pouring a little visible light,
And he is strange and terrible,
Silent fire of past victories
Their proud face is decorated.
Underground bridges and ditches, -
closed estates,
Here at night you can hear the cry of an owl
Ghosts roam here.

"Jane Wilmore's Castle". Reader by stories Middle Ages
(Grade 6), part 2, M., 1998, p. 282–283

Ancient castles and fortresses. Literally, another material about castles just came out, and immediately VO readers began to contact me: “write more”, and someone asked specific questions, how castles of different eras differed, what, say, were the features of their architecture, then I want them to delve deeper into this topic.

Actually, there are a lot of my notes on castles on VO, but they will have to be searched for on the profile among 1 articles on 780 pages, which will take time. Therefore, it makes sense in the next material to tell a little about the general history of castles, and only then talk about something completely new ...


The first stone castle in England, built at Chepstow in 1067–1071. The two towers in the photo were added in 1200. Photo by Rory Lawton

The Normans built the first castles in Europe


So, castles began to be built primarily in Normandy already in the XNUMXth century. The reason is this: after the death of Charlemagne, a huge empire collapsed. The sons and grandsons of Charles got deeper into territorial strife, the central government withered and collapsed, and the raids of the Vikings, who on their boats rose up the rivers farther and farther into the depths of France, became more frequent.

So it happened that in the north and west of France, people, both the poor and the nobility, were faced with the need to take care of their own protection. In an effort to protect their possessions from enemy encroachments, the nobles began to recruit knights and other warriors to their service, and surround their dwellings with walls and ramparts, turning an ordinary house into a fortress.

Such castles or fortresses in Latin texts were called differently, but the essence of all the names was the same: castrum, castellani, munitio, municipium or oppidum - these were fortifications that were also symbols of power at the same time. Riders from such a castle could control the area around it within a radius of 15-20 km, and this distance allowed them to return back on the same day.


Motte and bailey: XNUMXth century Norman wooden castle.
Illustration by A. Sheps from the book “Knights. Locks. Weapon» (Rosman, 2005)

Initially, the fortifications were very simple and functional. It was based on a mound, natural or artificial (motte), surrounded by a courtyard (bailey) with one or two rows of log palisades. In the center of such a fortification, there was a large square-shaped wooden house, three or four floors (the first one was often completely filled with earth!), Connected by a staircase with a basement for supplies in the thickness of the embankment itself.

The houses of the peasants and artisans who served the master were inside the outer fence and were also protected. The high cost and laboriousness of stone construction at the early stage of castle construction determined the relatively low frequency of its use.


The tower of the Counts of Flanders in Ghent began to be built in the 1180s. And here's what it looks like cutaway. Below is a prison and rooms for visitors of low rank, as well as a kitchen; above the donjon itself with halls for housing and a chapel. But the gallery at the top with battlements and turrets could only be built on in the XNUMXth century.
Illustration by A. Sheps from the book “Knights. Locks. Weapons (Rosman, 2005)

Soon the wooden donjon tower (from Norwegian donjon - tower) became the lord's house. The term was used not only to refer to these towers themselves, but could also serve as a synonym for the entire barrow (motte) or the castle grounds. Otherwise, donjons are called "big towers".


Orford Castle - in the county of Suffolk in the southeast of Great Britain, from which only one donjon has survived, but what a! Photo geograph.org.uk


In this photo, the holes in the base of the tower attract attention. These are the openings of the latrines for draining sewage. In fact, they tried to merge them into the moat, but here all the "grace of the womb" came out behind the tower outside the castle wall. Outhouses on such towers were built on different floors, one above the other. The top one was sometimes made right under the open sky. Photo geograph.org.uk

Then the donjons, as well as the walls surrounding them, began to be built of stone, and again it was in Normandy, as there is written evidence relating to the large tower of the ducal fortress of Rouen, built in the middle of the 942th century by Duke Richard I the Fearless (996–XNUMX ).


The same donjon is a bird's-eye view. Photo geograph.org.uk

According to the chronicles, he also ordered the construction of a fortified palace in Bayeux, and the heirs of the duke, inspired by his example, continued the tradition. In England, conquered by the Normans in 1066, the construction of castles was continued due to the need to keep the subjugated Saxons in check. That is, they, in the language of modernity, exported stone castle construction, first to England, then to Southern Italy and Sicily.

Of course, in the same England, the houses of the noble Saxons - Tans, were also fortified and had a fence, but they cannot be attributed to castles, since belonging to a castle was determined by the number of storeys of the building. Roughly speaking: there are walls and a tower - that means a castle, there are walls, but there is no tower - just a fortified estate, especially if all the buildings are wooden, and the area is small!


Donjon Orford. Chapel. Photo by Richard Nevell

It is possible that the Normans built towers also because they had a strong psychological impact on the local population, accustomed to one-story houses with a gable thatched roof, like a skyscraper on a provincial. In particular, this is how the castles of the Normans were assessed by a contemporary of the conquest, Orderic Vitalis (1075–1142), who saw in their stone masses the key to the success of the conquest.


Donjon Orford. Upper hall. Photo by Richard Nevell


The stone towers, which later became known in England as keeps (from the word “keep”, first appeared in 1586), originally had a very complex internal architecture, as we can see from at least these plans for the donjon of Orford Castle, made in 1840. On the left to the right: from the first floor to the roof

Moreover, they began to build stone castles immediately after the conquest, already in 1067. It was from stone that William Fitz-Osburn built his castle in Chepstow in 1067-1071, to which in 1200 the Earl of Pembroke added two more towers, and his sons added a gatehouse and a barbican (a building that defends the drawbridge). And it was Chepstow that became the first castle in Great Britain, which was completely built of stone.


Interestingly, the main tower of Chepstow (completed in 1072) is distinguished by the fact that it has a very thin wall from the side of the river, that is, the attitude of the builders to saving materials was very reasonable. Photo by Jeffrey L. Thomas


Plan of Chepstow Castle 1825

By the beginning of the 600th century, there were at least XNUMX castles in England. And at the end of the century, it was the donjon that became the object of creative experiments of builders and customers - polygonal and round donjons appeared.

Donjons - towers for life in a difficult situation or a symbol of power?



Donjon of the French castle of Chambois. Photo by Romain Breguet


And this is his machicolation - throwing stones at people's heads and pouring stuff like that ... Photo by Romain Breguet

Some castles in the same England were built by kings in order to curb the willfulness of their feudal lords. So, in the 1165th century, Hugo Bigot, Earl of Norfolk, controlled the lands in the Orford area in Suffolk and was one of those barons who refused to obey the authority of King Stephen, and then Henry II Plantagenet. Henry did not like this autocracy, and in XNUMX he began to build a castle in Orford, the tower of which has survived to this day and is remarkable in two respects - its unique shape and unusually complex internal construction.


Donjon Chambois in section

But most importantly, all the records and accounts related to the construction of the castle have been preserved. Thanks to them, it is known that its construction in the years 1165-1173 cost 1 pounds, most of which was spent in the first two years. Since food was ordered for the castle in 413, it is obvious that by this time its construction was largely completed, since people settled there.


"Castle Storm". The castle itself, as you can see, has several towers, and one is central, higher than the others. Miniature from Ancient History before Caesar, 1325-1350. Naples, Italy. British Library, London

The spread of castle building, however, did not mean at all that absolutely all castles of the early Middle Ages copied the “motte and bailey” scheme and looked like one another like two drops of water.

So, William the Conqueror in 1060 in Cana built an impressive castle with an area of ​​​​about 30 hectares. And it was precisely the castle - that is, the place where the residences were. Moreover, at first the walls did not have towers, but they were completed only in the XNUMXth century, and for some reason at different distances from each other.


Since 1150, polygonal and round towers have come into fashion. For example, a similar polygonal donjon tower 28 meters high was built at Conisbrough Castle in Yorkshire. Photo by Rob Bendall


Donjon of Conisbrough Castle in section


And this is how its internal structure and decoration was modeled in our days. The drawing shows the donjon around 1180 and its three main chambers. Historic England (illustrated by Peter Urmston)

In the XNUMXth century, donjons increasingly began to be built round, but their walls were strengthened with buttresses. Inside, on one floor there was one large room, and in the thickness of the wall - fireplaces and latrines. However, at the same time, the seigneur's own living quarters could already be located in the courtyard of the castle, and he and his family moved to the tower "chambers" in case of a threat of attack.


View of the castle from a bird's eye view. The tower, as can be clearly seen, was covered with a roof. Photo english-heritage.org.uk


Today, some rooms in the castles have been restored, and we can judge how they looked at that distant time. This is how, for example, the chamber of the owner of Chepstow Castle looked like. Photo english-heritage.org.uk


And this is the well in the basement of the donjon of Orford Castle. Photo by Ashley Dice

By the way, already at that distant time, at least, the nobility began to take care of their cleanliness and even take a bath. Although this required firewood to heat water, a cloth to lay on the bottom of a wooden bath, aromatic oils - that is, the pleasure was both troublesome and expensive. In any case, it is known that the English king John the Landless (1167-1216) took a bath ... once a month and it cost him five pence, which was the weekly earnings of many categories of British workers of that time.

By the way, it was from 1150 to 1250 that the period of a real construction boom began, when castles began to be built throughout Europe not by tens, but by thousands! So in the end, more than 15 thousand castles were built in it.

But not all of them appeared in these years. Later, they were also built in considerable numbers. But what kind of castles they were will be discussed in the next article.
Author:
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  1. 3x3zsave
    3x3zsave 26 September 2022 06: 38
    +5
    and it cost him five pence, which was a weekly wage for many categories of British workers of that time.
    Where does that come from?! A visit to a public bath in Paris during the time of Saint Louis cost a citizen 4 deniers and was not considered a luxury. I understand the difference of 50 years and the corresponding inflation, I understand that England was a poorer country than France, I understand that the purchasing power of a penny was greater than that of a denier ... But such a monstrous gap in the incomes of the third estate !!!
    Thank you, Vyacheslav Olegovich!
    1. Korsar4
      Korsar4 26 September 2022 06: 58
      +5
      Hindered by the lack of a single tariff scale?

      Probably, the market could equalize the prices of nearby towns and villages.

      How common were fairs back then?
      1. kalibr
        26 September 2022 07: 06
        +6
        Quote: Korsar4
        How common were fairs back then?

        There is a book to read on the history of the Middle Ages, ed. prof. Skazkina (1956), and so there is the material "Fair in Provins". I've never seen better...
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 26 September 2022 07: 17
          +4
          Thank you, Vyacheslav Olegovich! Will seek.
      2. 3x3zsave
        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 07: 36
        +6
        Hello, Sergey!
        For your questions, I can suggest reading “Medieval France”
        Polo de Beaulieu Marie-Anne.
        I can mail it.
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 26 September 2022 08: 00
          +4
          Hello Anton!
          Drop it please.
          So slowly begin to get acquainted with your Middle Ages. From the threshold.
          1. 3x3zsave
            3x3zsave 26 September 2022 08: 13
            +4
            Drop it please.
            Gone. Accept.
            1. Korsar4
              Korsar4 26 September 2022 09: 35
              +4
              Arrived. Received.
              Thank you, Anton.
              1. 3x3zsave
                3x3zsave 26 September 2022 09: 48
                +5
                Please always reach out. There will be something unclear, call, I will explain. There is no tariff scale there, but there is a table with a taxation cadastre for residents of one of the streets of Paris. Well, a little about the fair.
                1. Korsar4
                  Korsar4 26 September 2022 15: 25
                  +3
                  While I deal with the tariffs of the day today. Daily allowance for students - 50 rubles. And they don't want to give them.
              2. Catfish
                Catfish 26 September 2022 13: 24
                +5
                Hello, Sergey!
                Anton is like a good library director, he will always advise what you can read and at the same time send literature. smile
                1. 3x3zsave
                  3x3zsave 26 September 2022 14: 45
                  +3
                  The Chukchi is not a reader, the Chukchi is a librarian.
                  1. Catfish
                    Catfish 26 September 2022 15: 10
                    +3
                    Hello Anton! smile

                    There's a continuation of "Technical Support" has not yet come out? drinks
                    1. 3x3zsave
                      3x3zsave 26 September 2022 15: 13
                      +3
                      Hi Uncle Kostya!
                      It turned out, but for the money. That is, personally I would pay Oleg, but I will not give a spear to the copyright holders!
                      1. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 15: 22
                        +3
                        Well, that's right, we'll wait until it becomes publicly available. smile
                      2. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 15: 25
                        +3
                        I think it won't. If "Flibusta" lay down under Litres ...
                      3. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 15: 35
                        +5
                        Well, how are we going to get out? Read something hunting.
                      4. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 15: 45
                        +3
                        Try asking Phil. He uses some of his resources.
                      5. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 16: 22
                        +4
                        Try asking Phil.


                        I'll ask on the phone tonight.
                      6. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 17: 02
                        +3
                        How clever you are, uncle! Seryoga never answered me with his voice, only in writing.
                      7. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 17: 38
                        +4
                        But you, thank God, did not lie in the hospital.
                      8. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 17: 43
                        +3
                        Lying around, but in those days, even with Kolya, I was on "you" and exclusively in writing.
                      9. ArchiPhil
                        ArchiPhil 26 September 2022 18: 18
                        +4
                        Quote: 3x3zsave
                        by voice

                        I become terribly tongue-tied on the phone. There is such a sin! Hello Anton! hi
                      10. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 18: 25
                        +3
                        Didn't notice any sloppiness. smile
                      11. ArchiPhil
                        ArchiPhil 26 September 2022 18: 38
                        +3
                        Quote: Sea Cat
                        noticed

                        Sent "Dead zone." bully
                      12. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 18: 43
                        +3
                        Sent "Dead zone."


                        Received and replied to your email.
                      13. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 18: 25
                        +2
                        "Everyone has their own shortcomings" (C)
                        Hello, Sergey!
                      14. ArchiPhil
                        ArchiPhil 26 September 2022 18: 17
                        +4
                        Quote: Sea Cat
                        in the evening on the phone

                        No need for a phone call! bully Today I have a hockey derby!!!
                        CSKA-Spartak. Ask. What is the essence of the question? And since I'm not a big fan of "domestic", then?
                        Yes! Good evening, friends! hi
                      15. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 18: 24
                        +3
                        Hello, Sergey!
                        I wish success to your team, but I'll call you about the book one of these days, I'm not in a hurry. smile drinks
                      16. ArchiPhil
                        ArchiPhil 26 September 2022 19: 24
                        +3
                        Quote: Sea Cat
                        your team


                        Thank you!
                      17. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 19: 34
                        +3
                        Well, with such support, victory is already guaranteed! drinks
                      18. alexey sidykin
                        alexey sidykin 3 October 2022 16: 59
                        0
                        Well, not quite laid down. I'm still downloading via VPN on Flibuste.is
                      19. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 3 October 2022 17: 57
                        +1
                        Thank you Alexey!
                        Unfortunately, nowadays there is little worthy domestic fiction.
                      20. alexey sidykin
                        alexey sidykin 4 October 2022 08: 46
                        0
                        And it’s not better abroad either ... you are tormented until you find the right one.
                2. Korsar4
                  Korsar4 26 September 2022 15: 26
                  +4
                  Hi Constantine!

                  And the diversity of books and interests makes the library unique in its kind.
                  1. Catfish
                    Catfish 26 September 2022 15: 36
                    +4
                    This is true, and that is the value of our communication.
                    1. Korsar4
                      Korsar4 26 September 2022 17: 18
                      +6
                      Let's make Anton the Father-librarian.
                      Let the books sorted by headings.
                      1. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 17: 36
                        +4
                        Let's make Anton the Father-librarian.
                        How everyone wants to put me in a monastery! Did I somehow seduce one of the wives of my comrades? Or vice versa, will the light of my women blind my eyes?)))
                      2. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 17: 40
                        +4
                        Did I somehow seduce one of the wives of my comrades?


                        One thing does not interfere with the other, women, they also love to read, especially about love. wink
                      3. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 17: 58
                        +4
                        You will be the first contender for the Rector Father. History has a chance to stay.
                      4. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 18: 00
                        +3
                        You will be the first contender for the Rector Father.
                        A very dubious honor.
                      5. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 18: 03
                        +4
                        But you can all detach the necessary manuscripts to rewrite. Or brew a healing potion.
                      6. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 18: 23
                        +2
                        Or brew a healing potion.
                        Perhaps I will reveal a terrible secret, but the entire "folk pharmacology" was destroyed by graduates of medieval universities.
                      7. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 20: 33
                        +1
                        Herbalists, as far as I know, came through the Arab world. There are amazing masterpieces.
                      8. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 20: 50
                        +1
                        Do you think European culture did not have its own natural pharmacology? In vain.
                      9. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 21: 24
                        +1
                        Of course there were. Only, for example, the herbalist Dioscorides, as far as I remember, returned to Europe through the Arabs.
                      10. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 21: 33
                        +1
                        Serezha, let's first deal with the basics, and then I'll explain to you about medicine, okay?
                        It's just another way, from understanding the particular to the general, it is much longer and more difficult.
                      11. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 21: 47
                        +1
                        OK. Only it’s easier for me to start from those islands of knowledge about which I have at least some idea.
                      12. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 22: 05
                        +1
                        Well, I kind of showed you the bumps for the jump, master the wings, you will become a pterodactyl, like me.)))
                      13. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 22: 08
                        +1
                        And de Beaulieu - a self-instruction manual for aerobatics?
                      14. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 22: 26
                        +1
                        No, just a bump. She also makes mistakes. And some of her mistakes are completely incomprehensible to me!
                        In addition, there are different schools of study of the Middle Ages. At first (and to the end, by the way) they are divided according to nationality, then according to the academic presentation, then according to philosophism. What I suggested to you is an elementary school, from which, however, I myself have not yet climbed out.
                      15. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 22: 35
                        +1
                        It's okay to start with the ABC. We can do it no worse than Pinocchio.

                        Although, maybe a few soldi to choose from?
                      16. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 22: 51
                        +1
                        I can suggest in parallel: Simon Roux "Daily life of Paris in the Middle Ages."
                        No, you can quite simply turn to Andrey Martyanov, but everything is so chewed up there, you can feed a baby weaned from the breast.
                      17. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 23: 56
                        +1
                        Suggest. Arrange a competition between authors.
                      18. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 27 September 2022 00: 31
                        0
                        How difficult it is with neophytes! Okay, I'll try to get through to Martyanov.
                      19. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 23: 05
                        +1
                        And one more thing.
                        The Middle Ages is a very difficult period to understand, throughout Eurasia, from Ireland to Japan.
                      20. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 23: 58
                        +1
                        I already want to make a comparative tablet of the Middle Ages and the Renaissance. And in Russia, what followed the Middle Ages?
                      21. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 27 September 2022 00: 37
                        +1
                        Pffff!
                        Seryozha, is it okay that famine, plague and war lie between the Renaissance and the Middle Ages?
                      22. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 27 September 2022 08: 01
                        +1
                        Were there three such ditches? And can you really draw the line?
                      23. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 27 September 2022 08: 07
                        0
                        No. Let's do this, call in the evening and talk?
                      24. Ruslan67
                        Ruslan67 27 September 2022 00: 24
                        +2
                        Quote: Korsar4
                        You will be the first contender for the Rector Father.

                        I have a son-in-law yes Insists on everything from horseradish to strawberries...
                        All drinks
                      25. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 27 September 2022 00: 45
                        +1
                        Tell him that he will be the first to defend the kavunas! No, I understand that this is the husband of my beloved daughter, but you can blurt out ...
                      26. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 27 September 2022 08: 03
                        +1
                        It will always come in handy.
                        Sources of calories in this life will not interfere. Especially in winter.
                      27. Kote Pan Kokhanka
                        Kote Pan Kokhanka 26 September 2022 20: 36
                        +2
                        Quote: 3x3zsave
                        Let's make Anton the Father-librarian.
                        How everyone wants to put me in a monastery! )

                        Uh-huh, in the female! laughing
                      28. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 20: 52
                        +1
                        Thanks, Vlad! At least someone understands me!
                      29. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 17: 42
                        +4
                        It will not work, he has already stalled with the library, and he himself is more and more about the ladies. yes
                      30. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 17: 52
                        +2
                        Then it makes sense to contact the author directly.
                      31. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 18: 04
                        +4
                        Such a position in the monastery is not provided, except that the Father-economy.
                      32. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 18: 26
                        +5
                        This position is not provided for in the monastery.


                        They will introduce it specially for Anton. wink
                      33. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 20: 31
                        +3
                        Then the monastery will be special. I wonder what denomination.
                      34. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 20: 56
                        +2
                        I wonder what denomination.


                        And such a special wink . and there will be no end to those wishing to become monks. laughing
                      35. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 21: 25
                        +2
                        They already have big plans with Vlad. They plan to remove the abbess.
                      36. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 21: 46
                        +2
                        So it depends on which abbess, it would be a sin to offend another in this way. wink

                      37. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 21: 52
                        +3
                        It seems to me, gentlemen, that you are preparing an offer for Anton that he cannot refuse.
                      38. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 22: 16
                        +2
                        And what man would refuse such grace? laughing

                      39. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 22: 23
                        +2
                        I confess constantly
                        I pray for sobriety, yes, yes
                        And only some half a glass
                        I allow sometimes.
                        Eh, sometimes, eh, sometimes,
                        Eh, sometimes, sometimes
                      40. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 22: 31
                        +2
                        Pour full glasses.
                        Who lies that we, brother, are drunk?
                        We are just merry, by God!
                        Well, who is lying so shamelessly?
                      41. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 22: 37
                        +2
                        Darby McGraw! Darby McGraw! Darby, give me the rum!
                      42. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 22: 59
                        +2
                        Fifteen people on the dead man's chest,
                        Yo-ho-ho, and a bottle of rum!
                        Drink, and the devil will bring you to the end.
                        Yo-ho-ho, and a bottle of rum!


                      43. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 23: 00
                        +1
                        Come on, little bird
                        One more cup
                        We are not in Switzerland
                        We live with you.
                        They are shy
                        And they drink with thimbles
                        And we will take our souls in Russian
                      44. Catfish
                        Catfish 26 September 2022 23: 03
                        +1
                        They took "Zhigulevskoye" and "Dubnyak",
                        The third invited the stoker
                        Accepted, added again, -
                        Then the stoker opened our eyes
                      45. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 26 September 2022 23: 55
                        +1
                        Spins, turns the ball blue,
                        Spinning, spinning overhead
                        Spinning, spinning, wants to fall
                        Cavalier wants to steal a young lady
                      46. Catfish
                        Catfish 27 September 2022 07: 23
                        +2
                        If the truth is screaming
                        cough bothers you
                        don't forget to take a sip
                        these wonderful drops.
                        Let them stand before you
                        past examples ...
                        Drops of the danish king
                        drink, gentlemen!
    2. kalibr
      26 September 2022 06: 59
      +5
      Where does it come from... In this case, it is taken from Philip Steele's book, consultant Brion Davidson. Medieval castle. Kingfisher Publishing House, London, 1995. Reissue of BMM MO Moscow 1997. Used a large amount of photos from museum archives. And since the photo was used, then the information was not taken from the ceiling. About the bath. king on page 40. By the way, the translation in the Russian edition is good, I compared it, I was interested back then! Now I have it just like a rarity on the shelf. And then I admired her design ...
      1. 3x3zsave
        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 07: 04
        +3
        Okay, I'll try to find it. Thank you!
    3. alexey sidykin
      alexey sidykin 3 October 2022 16: 55
      0
      And aromatic oils laughing They probably accounted for the lion's share of the cost. fellow
  2. Luminman
    Luminman 26 September 2022 06: 44
    +4
    Unfortunately, real knightly castles built in the so-called. The Dark Ages, alas, have not reached our time, they were all hidden during the strengthening of royal power. And everything that is now available is either a remake or a heavily rebuilt old one ...
    1. kalibr
      26 September 2022 07: 00
      +5
      Quote: Luminman
      heavily remodeled old...

      Not just heavily rebuilt, but rebuilt in the old place!
      1. Luminman
        Luminman 26 September 2022 07: 08
        +5
        Not just heavily rebuilt, but rebuilt in the old place!

        Yes, that would be better...
    2. alexey sidykin
      alexey sidykin 3 October 2022 17: 05
      -1
      And it is hardly possible to call them, those fortifications, castles in the classical sense.
      1. Luminman
        Luminman 3 October 2022 17: 07
        0
        And it is hardly possible to call them, those fortifications, castles in the classical sense.

        They were called castles, but with a completely different architecture, because at that time the barbarians almost did not know how to build ...
        1. alexey sidykin
          alexey sidykin 3 October 2022 17: 18
          0
          Quote: Luminman
          And it is hardly possible to call them, those fortifications, castles in the classical sense.

          They were called castles, but with a completely different architecture, because at that time the barbarians almost did not know how to build ...

          I agree ... almost, because they did not know how to build from stone. There were no problems with the tree.
  3. north 2
    north 2 26 September 2022 09: 27
    +6
    wells in such castles were arranged in special well towers or well houses in the bailey near the castle. If it was a well tower, then, of course, it was the lower tower. The well in the well house was, as it were in Russian, in the front garden near the castle, because the water was not so deep on the bulk mound and the soil was not the same as that of a mountain cliff, and it was not a big problem to provide water. In castles of the early XNUMXth century, such as Kaiserburg in Nuremberg or in castles several centuries later, like Karlstejn in the Czech Republic, well towers were like a hearth with fire for primitive man - sacred. In such a castle as Karlštejn, on a high small mountain plateau, water was taken out almost from a depth of a hundred meters, and losing such a well tower was equivalent to the death of the castle. And in general, such castles strike not with splendor, but with the asceticism of the interiors.
    But most of all I would like to see, from the same times as the castles presented by the author of the article, the Krak des Chevaliers castle in Syria. Told those who have been there before, which is impressive.
    By the way , now that castle is also not destroyed by the war . They say that when the militants settled in it, our VKS with one rocket hit exactly in the loophole of the castle tower and so made a hole in the wall through which Assad's soldiers entered and destroyed the militants who had settled there. And the whole huge castle remained intact
    Thanks to the author for the article.
  4. Nephilim
    Nephilim 26 September 2022 10: 19
    +6
    By the way, already at that distant time, at least, the nobility began to take care of their cleanliness and even take a bath. Although this required firewood to heat water, a cloth to lay on the bottom of a wooden bath, aromatic oils - that is, the pleasure was both troublesome and expensive. In any case, it is known that the English king John the Landless (1167-1216) took a bath ... once a month and it cost him five pence, which was the weekly earnings of many categories of British workers of that time.

    The nobility began to take care of their cleanliness much earlier. Few could really afford a bath in the modern sense, especially since in those days it was considered more of a medical procedure. And they bathed regularly. And the Merovingians, and the Carolingians, and their subjects. Charlemagne loved the steam bath and bathed with his courtiers and even bodyguards.
    Source: Herbert Schutz, 'The Carolingians in Central Europe, 750-900.
    Under Philip Augustus, there were no less than 26 public baths in Paris, moreover, the royal authority controlled their work and monitored the construction of new ones to meet the needs of a growing population.
    Johan Callmer, 'Urbanisation in Northern and Eastern Europe, ca. AD 700-1100'. In Joachim Henning (ed), 'Post-Roman Towns, Trade and Settlement in Europe and Byzantium, Vol. one'.
    1. 3x3zsave
      3x3zsave 26 September 2022 10: 36
      +3
      Under Philip Augustus, there were at least 26 public baths in Paris,
      Wash all the same a little later, under St. Louis. But in any case, the guild of bath attendants is recorded in the "Book of Crafts", therefore, it existed until 1268.
      1. Nephilim
        Nephilim 26 September 2022 12: 07
        +4
        Wash it all the same a little later, under St. Louis

        Under Saint Louis, already 32.
        1. 3x3zsave
          3x3zsave 26 September 2022 12: 34
          +4
          Thanks for the clarification. I have no opportunity to dispute, in the version of the "Book" that I have, the number of members of the guild is not indicated, and I have no other reference materials.
          1. Nephilim
            Nephilim 26 September 2022 13: 39
            +3
            You know, the study of this issue, I mean personal hygiene in medieval Europe, despite its seeming triviality, the process is quite complicated. Especially considering the fact that the compilers of medieval chronicles and medical treatises, where the main information is drawn from, did not have a common opinion about the benefits and harms of bathing.
            1. 3x3zsave
              3x3zsave 26 September 2022 13: 51
              +5
              For a wide audience, it is enough to debunk the black myth about the unwashed Middle Ages, and whoever wants to delve into the issue of medieval hygiene, everyday life, and personal life will study at a more serious level.
              Otherwise, we will never know "how much the chicken cost in Paris".)))
              1. Nephilim
                Nephilim 26 September 2022 14: 03
                +4
                For a wide audience, debunking the black myth is enough

                For a wide audience, debunking this myth is a frustrator.
                1. 3x3zsave
                  3x3zsave 26 September 2022 14: 08
                  +5
                  I don't think that everything is so neglected. Here I managed to captivate Sergey - already bread!
                  1. Nephilim
                    Nephilim 26 September 2022 14: 13
                    +5
                    As Cicero argued in his speech in defense of Lucius Cornelius Balbus the Elder, the existence of exceptions confirms the existence of the rule.
                    1. 3x3zsave
                      3x3zsave 26 September 2022 14: 19
                      +3
                      I think that an individual approach is needed here if there is a desire to get a good interlocutor. Choose the topic in the era that is closest to the interests of man, and build on this.
                  2. Korsar4
                    Korsar4 26 September 2022 17: 31
                    +3
                    I'll get out of the forest. The possible story about three pfennigs on a stump was very hooked.
  5. 3x3zsave
    3x3zsave 26 September 2022 10: 22
    +3
    its construction in 1165-1173 cost 1 pounds,
    Very budget friendly! Especially considering that a quarter of a century later, the construction of Chateau Gaillard cost the treasury 10 times more. Old Harry knew how to count money, unlike the kids.
  6. Edward Vashchenko
    Edward Vashchenko 26 September 2022 15: 06
    +4
    Vyacheslav Olegovich, greetings,
    yesterday I was in the Central Children's Library, I saw already three books “Knights. Locks. Weapons,” I tell my son: I personally know the author!
    hi
    1. kalibr
      26 September 2022 17: 58
      +4
      Good afternoon Edward! And interestingly in the yellow cover they were in black and silver? The last one is very beautiful, I like it better. And by the way, about books. My new book just came out

      Publishing House AST. 448 pp. 600 illustrations. True, the drawings are black and white, but they are tinted so well that they look no worse than color ones!
      1. Edward Vashchenko
        Edward Vashchenko 27 September 2022 05: 55
        +1
        Good morning,
        in yellow cover.
        Congratulations on the release of the book!!!
        hi
        1. kalibr
          27 September 2022 07: 24
          +1
          Yellow is worse than black, but more yellows were released. Thanks for the compliments!
  7. Trilobite Master
    Trilobite Master 26 September 2022 15: 08
    +8
    Today I was interested in something "Storm of the castle of love." smile
    Having carefully studied the image, I came to the conclusion that the plot depicted on the product has nothing to do with the assault.
    So what do we see?
    Below, two knights, similar to each other as brothers, are galloping towards each other with some kind of clubs in their hands. Are they going to fight? It doesn't have to be, there's no evidence for that. Just two knights very similar to each other are riding towards one another. Question: what are they doing there, why did they make an appointment with each other?
    The answer lies in the shapes located at the edges of the image. Two men, obviously not of the knightly class, are sitting in trees with some kind of pipes in their mouths. What are they doing there? Obviously they are watching something. Why do they need pipes? To give a signal at the moment when some event they expect will happen. And now, apparently, the event happened, they begin to blow and the knights below, having heard their call, rush to the castle.
    What is it they saw?
    This becomes clear when we take a closer look at the figures above. Two ladies and two men in poses that leave no doubt that in a few minutes, real debauchery will begin up there. The hand of one of the men is already directly on the chest of one of the women, the hand of the second is also clearly not where it should be according to the rules of courtly love.
    Three ladies are sitting below these figures, clearly observing the situation in the district - a sort of a kind of "guard of love" so that no one disturbs the people above.
    So what we have.
    The two pairs of lovers met in the tower, leaving a "guard post" of three ladies on the ground floor.
    The spies, having climbed the trees, managed to visually fix the meeting and give a signal to the deceived husbands, who jump with clubs (and not with swords or other weapons) to catch their unfaithful spouses "on the hot".
    At the same time, the men below look like brothers, and the tower itself, in which events take place, has a specific shape of two components, one higher than the other...
    Coincidence? I do not think.
    I am sure that now we can confidently name the main characters in this picture.
    The knights on horseback are Louis, King of Navarre, Count of Champagne and Charles, Count of Agnouleme, Count de la Marche, the ladies above are Marguerite and Blanca of Burgundy, the men above are Philippe and Gauthier Donnay, and one of the ladies below is Joan of Burgundy.
    We have before our eyes an illustration to the well-known "Case of the Nelskaya Tower".
    What will be the objections?
    laughing
    1. 3x3zsave
      3x3zsave 26 September 2022 15: 18
      +3
      What will be the objections?
      Absolutely none! Bravo, Michael!
      1. Trilobite Master
        Trilobite Master 26 September 2022 16: 22
        +3
        Thank you, Anton. hi
        I'm surprised that no one noticed these egregious coincidences and shocking details. laughing
        1. 3x3zsave
          3x3zsave 26 September 2022 16: 34
          +3
          Well, I immediately attacked the economic crimes of this material.)))
    2. mihaylov
      mihaylov 26 September 2022 15: 55
      +4
      Quote: Trilobite Master
      I am sure that now we can confidently name the main characters in this picture.

      Michael, I'm shocked: this is a real historical detective story! hi
      1. 3x3zsave
        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 16: 02
        +4
        real historical detective!
        Here you go! And then Umberto Eco, you know, "The Name of the Rose" ...
        1. mihaylov
          mihaylov 26 September 2022 16: 04
          +5
          Quote: 3x3zsave
          Here you go!

          Maybe we will finally find out who killed Kennedy? drinks
          1. 3x3zsave
            3x3zsave 26 September 2022 16: 06
            +4
            Required!
            And who framed Roger Rabbit.
          2. Trilobite Master
            Trilobite Master 26 September 2022 16: 20
            +5
            Quote: Mihaylov
            Maybe we will finally find out who killed Kennedy?

            Petrov and Boshirov, of course. What doubts can there be?
            And what, comrades, would Fomenko be a noble of me? laughing
            1. mihaylov
              mihaylov 26 September 2022 16: 31
              +5
              Quote: Trilobite Master
              And what, comrades, would Fomenko be a noble of me?

              Don't, don't go to the dark side drinks
              1. 3x3zsave
                3x3zsave 26 September 2022 16: 49
                +4
                I always knew that Fomenko looked like this:
                1. Trilobite Master
                  Trilobite Master 26 September 2022 17: 21
                  +7
                  This is Nosovsky.
                  Here is Fomenko:

                  What the hell? How many characters now need to be printed for the administration to decide that the comment "carries useful information"?
                  Is it just me or everyone?
                  1. 3x3zsave
                    3x3zsave 26 September 2022 17: 25
                    +4
                    Everyone has. The rules of the game have changed again.
              2. kalibr
                26 September 2022 18: 13
                +4
                Quote: Mihaylov
                to the dark side

                "The dark side is more accessible" - Master Yoda
            2. 3x3zsave
              3x3zsave 26 September 2022 16: 33
              +3
              would a noble Fomenko of me turn out?
              Why swear at once?
              I would say - Chesterton!
            3. kalibr
              26 September 2022 18: 04
              +3
              Quote: Trilobite Master
              would a noble Fomenko of me turn out?

              Five plus!
    3. Seal
      Seal 26 September 2022 17: 18
      +3
      Hmm, what only people will not dream of.
      Guys in the trees? So by the muzzles of their faces it is clear that they are more like some kind of cherubs than men.
      Riders on horseback, well, obviously they are going to strike each other.
      Three ladies on the balcony So this author shows that there are those ladies who are waiting for the turn of suffering love to reach them too. Otherwise, why would the riders fight? Of course, for a place in the queue for the ladies. Perhaps both counted on the same.
      1. Trilobite Master
        Trilobite Master 26 September 2022 17: 52
        +3
        Do you want me to seriously object to you? fool
        Okay, please. laughing
        Quote: Seal
        it's more like cherubs

        Where are your "cherubs" obligatory for them wings in the picture? Why are they as tall as a grown man? Why did they need to climb trees?
        Quote: Seal
        Riders on horseback, well, obviously they are going to strike each other.

        Why do you think so? Did one of them take a swing at the other? It is obvious that the riders do not show any intention to fight. Besides, why fight? Clubs? wassat
        Well, if we assume that they have spears in their hands (although these are clearly clubs), then why are these spears directed not at the enemy, but over his head?
        Quote: Seal
        This is how the author shows

        Record of the interrogation of the author with his testimony to the studio, please. However, if you say that he was personally interrogated and he "showed" you, then I, perhaps, will be silent. laughing
        Quote: Seal
        Why would riders fight? Of course, for a place in the line to the ladies

        A typical example of the inability to think. I immediately see two gross errors. smile
        The fact that the horsemen are going to fight still needs to be proven, but you proceed from the fact that this fact has already been proven - an unambiguous conclusion from a controversial premise is a clear mistake.
        But, let's say they really are going to fight, although there is no trace of this. Where did you get that because of the ladies? It could be, for example, a duel due to some kind of manor or an accusation of treason. Or maybe it's just a tournament match?
        You put forward a single hypothesis and did not even consider the rest that can be put forward - a clear mistake.
        Quote: Seal
        Perhaps both counted on the same

        Or maybe it's two homosexuals measuring sticks. laughing
    4. Nephilim
      Nephilim 26 September 2022 17: 24
      +4
      Beautiful version! And presented well, talentedly. Alas, the fortification on the mirror case has nothing to do with the Nelskaya Tower.
      1. Trilobite Master
        Trilobite Master 26 September 2022 17: 56
        +5
        smile
        Damn ... Or maybe it still has? Such a scientific discovery is lost... Thanks to him, we would be able to accurately indicate in which room of the Nelskaya Tower adultery was committed... smile
        1. Nephilim
          Nephilim 26 September 2022 18: 10
          +4
          Thanks to him, we would be able to accurately indicate in which room of the Nel tower adultery was committed ...

          And in what position too. But this allegorical plot was recorded at least 100 years before adultery.
          And it is doubtful that in those days one of the Parisian carvers would have ventured in hot pursuit to perform such allegories.
          1. Trilobite Master
            Trilobite Master 26 September 2022 18: 23
            +4
            That is, after all, "Storming the Castle of Love"? .. crying
            What a pity ... Well, then,
            The nut of knowledge is hard, but still
            We are not accustomed to retreat!

            We'll have to make new discoveries... later. smile
            1. Nephilim
              Nephilim 26 September 2022 18: 41
              +4
              That is, after all, "Storm of the Castle of Love"?

              Yes, a popular event in those days. Once it even came to a real war due to the fact that the ladies were not divided. The Fifth Crusade was nearly thwarted. The Pope had to intervene.
              1. 3x3zsave
                3x3zsave 26 September 2022 21: 18
                +1
                Once it even came to a real war due to the fact that the ladies were not divided. Almost the Fifth Crusade was not thwarted. The Pope had to intervene.
                By the way, yes.
                1. Nephilim
                  Nephilim 26 September 2022 21: 47
                  +1
                  By the way, yes.

                  So already in those years they wrote.
                  Love has a high gift -
                  magical power,
                  That in winter, in the cruel frost,
                  She raised flowers for me.
                  Howling winds, streams of rain -
                  Everything was nice to me.
                  Here's a new line song
                  Curl light-winged.
                  And love is so strong
                  And so full of fire
                  Like ice floes, like spring,
                  Awakened to life.
                  1. 3x3zsave
                    3x3zsave 26 September 2022 22: 02
                    0
                    Ventadorn. I have long believed that the Aquitanian cultural expansion changed medieval Europe on a par with the Crusades.
    5. kalibr
      26 September 2022 18: 03
      +4
      Shocked, to be honest. I just translated the title of the story, and it was very popular, even without looking at the images. There is a castle, there are ladies, there are flowers, there are horsemen - everything. But you looked out for such details and substantiated everything in such a way that ... in a word, one can envy the way your head works, Mikhail. By the way, I'm working on an article by order. But slowly. I'm picking up the rest...
      1. Trilobite Master
        Trilobite Master 26 September 2022 18: 14
        +5
        I just wanted to smile a little at my colleagues... smile
        However, I think that in my design there are fewer mistakes and assumptions than, for example, in the "decoding" of the carpet from Bayo, which Fomenko showed us. smile
        We are waiting for the article. I'm sure it will be interesting, thanks.
  8. Seal
    Seal 26 September 2022 17: 02
    +2
    An interesting message.
    The reason is this: after the death of Charlemagne, a huge empire collapsed.
    Weird. It seemed that, according to logic, it should be the other way around - the huge Empire could have huge funds for the construction of castles. But where do the many small fragments of the empire get the money from?
    And here's another. It is said that there were Merovingians before the Carolingians. They also had an empire, albeit smaller than that of Karl Magnus, but also decent. And this Merovingian (Merovean) Empire disintegrated no less effectively than the empire of Charles. But castles were not built under the Merovingians for some reason, right?
    1. 3x3zsave
      3x3zsave 26 September 2022 17: 16
      +2
      The Merovingians successfully used the legacy of the Roman Empire, which was completed by the Carolingians. When doyuzali suddenly came a threat from the north and east.
      1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
        Kote Pan Kokhanka 26 September 2022 20: 49
        +1
        The Saxons had an interesting approach in confronting the Vikings. The latter built wooden "boogie" in key places. More of course Fords or even blockhouses in the modern sense, but quite an effective tool.
        1. 3x3zsave
          3x3zsave 26 September 2022 21: 27
          +1
          They built something built, but in the end ... "Danish money."
      2. Seal
        Seal 27 September 2022 17: 45
        +1
        And what kind of heritage is this in the territories subject to those whom official history calls the Merovingians (Merovei)? Or was it so actively "used" first by some, then by others that they wiped it into dust?
    2. Luminman
      Luminman 26 September 2022 19: 45
      +1
      Quote: Seal
      a huge Empire could have huge funds to build castles

      They built castles - burgs (bourges). And how they built it! From Spain to the lands of the Polabian Slavs and the Danube...
      1. 3x3zsave
        3x3zsave 26 September 2022 20: 02
        +4
        "Burg" is not a castle, a burg is a fenced area. Exactly the same as "Gardariki" - "the country of "gardens"" (there is nothing derogatory in the word "garden" if we understand its original meaning)
        1. Luminman
          Luminman 27 September 2022 03: 01
          +1
          "Burg" is not a castle, a burg is a fenced area

          Speaking in today's terms, it was originally something like a checkpoint that protected the state of Charlemagne from the raids of the Vikings, Hungarians and Slavs. And only then a fenced area in the form of a city ...
  9. lisikat2
    lisikat2 26 September 2022 17: 42
    +1
    Good evening everyone.
    Vyacheslav Olegovich, I'm sorry, but we are not up to your castles.
    Veryn "kid" went to the military registration and enlistment office as a friend. Faith is confused.
    We need a girl - a surgical nurse. 2 volunteers drew lots.
    A warning came to the E-mail that Ukrainian nationalists entered the clinic, they will kill Russians
    Surnames for O 12 people, +3 Russians recently from there. Some people are already panicking.
    1. Korsar4
      Korsar4 26 September 2022 18: 00
      +4
      Hold on girls.

      I have a strange feeling that the country is sharply divided into estates.
      That is, it was before, but now it has manifested itself.
      1. kalibr
        26 September 2022 18: 19
        +3
        Quote: Korsar4
        That is, it was before

        How it was!
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 26 September 2022 20: 36
          +1
          But when it shook, the factions suddenly split sharply.
          1. kalibr
            26 September 2022 20: 46
            +2
            Quote: Korsar4
            But when it shook, the factions suddenly split sharply.

            And people in difficulties always stray in flocks. It is so easier for them to understand each other perfectly. This means that it is easier to negotiate and ... survive!
            1. Korsar4
              Korsar4 26 September 2022 21: 20
              +1
              Yes. Only, how many estates can be distinguished now? And it is still completely unpredictable how they will interact.
              1. kalibr
                27 September 2022 07: 19
                +2
                Quote: Korsar4
                how many classes can be distinguished now?

                Much more than in the USSR. That's all I can say.
              2. kalibr
                27 September 2022 07: 23
                +2
                Quote: Korsar4
                how they will interact.

                I had a dream that the members of the groups, in difficult circumstances, acquired weapons and were trying to be the first to shoot at others. I saw him for a long time ... but who knows, maybe a dream in his hand?
      2. lisikat2
        lisikat2 26 September 2022 21: 00
        +2
        Sergey, I have a feeling that the country is not divided into estates, but worse: headless, thinking, vicious dogs.
        V.V., to put it mildly, came to me, but I'd rather support him than Washington and Kyiv will dictate to me: whom to choose.
        100% Crimea will not be enough for them, they WANT something else.
        P C
        Desertion began: I know the case, a former officer, I bought a certificate that he had a headache.
        I did not start the war and was against it, but now: the girls are going to the front, and the men are hiding behind us?!
        We have 70% of girls and NVP truant. Of all of us, only knows how to shoot. We decided: if their DRGs appear, Vera will be the eldest.
        Will I ask my uncle to show me how to shoot?
        True, he said: if you are afraid, take your girlfriends to the mountains, and there you will find figs
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 26 September 2022 21: 21
          +2
          Katya, when you see the enemy, then it's easier.
    2. kalibr
      26 September 2022 18: 10
      +3
      I understand you, Katya. The personal is always more important than the public. But society often needs what individuals do not need. Can you imagine that I will also write some kind of horror movie? Think I can't? I can! But I do not write, because there are many of them even without me. People need a breather. Tranquilizers in the Russian Federation sold out 15% more ... People are nervous. And they are nervous even without me ... So let me write about something that does not cause any negative emotions in anyone.
      1. lisikat2
        lisikat2 26 September 2022 21: 03
        +1
        We will read, but add something romantic
    3. Nephilim
      Nephilim 26 September 2022 18: 50
      +3
      Faith is confused.

      And what happened?
      1. lisikat2
        lisikat2 26 September 2022 21: 07
        +1
        Her pupil, Karlik, and a friend went to the draft board, and his wife left for Narva.
        Son on the western border, tutor to the front, his wife to her place in Estonia
        1. Nephilim
          Nephilim 26 September 2022 21: 24
          +2
          In one moment, everything collapsed instantly,
          And you can't even influence...
          1. Korsar4
            Korsar4 27 September 2022 07: 56
            +1
            Where is this from? Or yours?

            You can find many root causes, but what's the point.
            1. Nephilim
              Nephilim 27 September 2022 08: 15
              +1
              Where is it from?

              I do not remember, from life, probably.
          2. lisikat2
            lisikat2 27 September 2022 14: 39
            0
            It is precisely said "you cannot influence", the most offensive
            1. Nephilim
              Nephilim 27 September 2022 14: 53
              +1
              most offensive

              Nothing gets away with:
              nor the smallest hook
              from the given road,
              nor the burden of trifles,
              nor the friendship of those wolves,
              who are bipedal.
              Nothing gets away with:
              no false gesture, no sound
              because falsehood is dangerous echo,
              nor greed for money,
              no tricky steps
              fraught with success.
              Nothing gets away with:
              nor a forgotten friend,
              with whom it is uncomfortable
              not a baby ant
              your soles
              ruthlessly crushed.
              Such is the cursed circle:
              nothing gets out of hand
              and even if it goes
              nothing for nothing
              and a man crazy
              disappears unnoticed...
              1. lisikat2
                lisikat2 27 September 2022 15: 40
                0
                Where are these verses from? I liked the meaning
                1. Nephilim
                  Nephilim 27 September 2022 19: 42
                  0
                  Where are these verses from?

                  Russian poetry.
                  I liked the meaning

                  I touched the souls of strangers
                  Like strings, but my strings.
                  I kinda shook them up
                  Quiet ringing, forgotten rumble.
  10. starley
    starley 26 September 2022 18: 24
    0
    Paper lives 200 - 300 years.
    It is unlikely that accounts from a thousand years ago could be preserved.
    Most likely the castles were built not so long ago.
    1. kalibr
      26 September 2022 18: 54
      +4
      Quote: starley
      Paper lives 200 - 300 years.
      It is unlikely that accounts from a thousand years ago could be preserved.
      Most likely the castles were built not so long ago.

      So they didn’t write on paper then, but on parchment - dressed leather. And on all documents and books there are dates, and they coincide with the dates on STONE EFFIGIES.
  11. Seal
    Seal 27 September 2022 17: 40
    +1
    Quote: Trilobite Master
    Or maybe it's two homosexuals measuring sticks.
    Well, if you judge this like a professional .... I will not argue with you. Not my topic. I can only note that, as you know, homosexuality often goes hand in hand with drugs. What, they say, causes such fantasies ...... hi
  12. stankow
    stankow 2 October 2022 20: 52
    0
    And how did they shoot from loopholes with parallel walls? Two meters long? What did the loophole the size of a door cover? Will 3-4 loopholes be enough on one wall of the tower? Where are the gourds?
  13. Andrey Krasnoyarsky
    Andrey Krasnoyarsky 4 October 2022 08: 39
    +1
    One thing is clear: only very rich lords could afford such stone shelters, and not any knight or even baron.
    1. Turkir
      Turkir 6 October 2022 00: 23
      0
      Perhaps it depended not so much on money as on the amount of population that this lord owned.