The signing of a contract for the construction of a new series of submarines of the Varshavyanka project was announced

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The signing of a contract for the construction of a new series of diesel-electric submarines is expected in the near future. According to a source in the Russian defense industry, the agreement will be signed within the framework of the Army-2022 international forum.

According to available information, it is planned to sign a contract for a series of diesel-electric submarines of project 636.3 "Varshavyanka", the details of the planned contract have not yet been disclosed, it is known that the submarines will traditionally be built by the Admiralteyskaya Verf shipyard.



A contract is expected to be signed for the construction of several Project 636.3 submarines. There will be more than two

- leads TASS source words.

For which fleet a series will be built, it is not yet clear. Earlier, another source reported that six Varshavyankas would be built for the Northern Fleet, the decision to build has already been made, but the contract has not yet been signed. Prior to this, there was information that a series of submarines of project 677 "Lada" would be built for the Northern Fleet, since the lead submarine "St. Petersburg" was already serving in the fleet. In addition, the first two production Ladas, Kronstadt and Velikie Luki, are to be included in the Navy this year, and two more, Vologda and Yaroslavl, are laid down on June 12.

Last year it was reported that a series of submarines for the Baltic Fleet would be laid down at the Admiralty Shipyards, and there was even information that the first submarine had already been named Petrozavodsk. Currently, the Admiralty Shipyards is completing the construction of a series of Varshavyankas of six units for the Pacific Fleet, today the fifth and sixth serial submarines Mozhaisk and Yakutsk are being completed.
  • Admiralty Shipyards
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  1. +13
    15 August 2022 20: 28
    With the advent of Caliber DPLs in the arsenal, they began to play with new colors.
    1. +7
      15 August 2022 20: 39
      And why is a contract bad for a foreign country? The shipyard will earn some money. Submarines are a must for the Baltic. I don’t know who has an opinion, but for me the LADA would be more suitable for the Baltic, it is more compact.
      1. +4
        15 August 2022 21: 16
        What will we buy with the money of a foreign contract? Who will sell us what we need? Or spend on gum and jeans? Or will we buy some chicken legs for something? Maybe we will make the necessary weapons for our native country in difficult times that they smell like gunpowder? And money in the country with gas for $ 2 per cubic meter and oil at $ 100 per barrel for a long time has nowhere to go, and in foreign currency!
        1. +4
          15 August 2022 21: 48
          I have not heard anything more stupid for a long time ... People who work there need money. This money will then be returned in taxes and something else will be built from it. The economy will develop.
          1. +12
            15 August 2022 22: 39
            The people who work there need money.

            We have the cost of the resource does not affect the people who work there. And the main part of the funds from the sale of energy resources now settles in foreign accounts, look at the statistics on the withdrawal of capital - there are more than two hundred billion dollars a year. There is nowhere to put the currency in the country - we cannot buy the goods we need, and people are not given cash from their accounts. For it seems to be there, but it is not in the form of pieces of paper. Why is such a trade necessary? Let the capitalists sell their goods on our market for rubles and take gas and oil with the proceeds, then it will be fair.
            1. 0
              16 August 2022 08: 45
              And what about oil and gas? Are we talking about the products of a shipyard, or are you just substituting the subject of conversation?
          2. +3
            16 August 2022 07: 24
            It's nonsense you said, I repeat the question of how we will be paid for our products and what can we buy with this money? This relatively worked before the sanctions, when with the proceeds we could buy something we needed abroad, and then with very large restrictions. products for our country in a threatening period. You will say, but we get rubles for this and pour it into the economy! And where did the rule come from that we have the right to print rubles for our economy only as much as we have currency? And it came from the holy 90s when the country was under the control of the West .. And what prevents us today from printing the same rubles for the economy on our own, not paying attention to the presence of foreign exchange reserves? It goes without saying that the press is right, and not as much as you want (although our economy is very much under-monetized, which does not allow it to grow), but what does foreign exchange reserves have to do with it? We can just as well print rubles and pay salaries to the workers that these submarines produce, there is no difference (in the current situation) where these rubles come from sales for foreign currency or just from a printing press .. The mantra that every ruble should be backed by a dollar is very tightly stuck in the brain and no matter how people do not want to refuse this deity.
            1. -1
              16 August 2022 08: 52
              Are you serious now? Do you really think that there is no difference between money printed and received from a foreign trade deal? Have you studied economics? There about issue and inflation, for example?
              1. 0
                16 August 2022 09: 35
                It’s time for you to explain something, you have one economy, a shambles for St. Valinor and no more, the whole economic theory went to dust after February 24, when the West completely nullified all agreements and concepts of law .. You didn’t understand anything about what happened ..
                1. -1
                  16 August 2022 10: 46
                  There is no need to disguise your ignorance under some kind of political beliefs or try to convict me of something. I'm a shitty liberal) Worse than you are a diversified person.
                  If you simply print money, then nothing but rising inflation and a fall in the purchasing power of money can not be obtained. This is a basic course in economics, taught in the first courses of the university.
                  1. 0
                    16 August 2022 11: 44
                    Each ruble must be provided with goods. Then it has weight. The dollar is not backed by goods. So why is it needed at all?
                    1. -3
                      16 August 2022 13: 23
                      The dollar is just the goods and secured. World commodity. The dollar is not just money - a currency - but an ACCEPTED WORLDWIDE exchange and settlement equivalent. In simple terms, the notorious "conventional unit" is "u / e".
                      1. +1
                        16 August 2022 14: 41
                        With the number of printed candy wrappers, he is not provided with anything other than the "word of honor of the bankers", the Fed and the stock exchange crooks. I'm talking about the REAL value of the monetary unit. Real Production, Real Commodity Produced - Money - Real Commodity Produced.
                      2. -1
                        16 August 2022 16: 51
                        Your scheme worked until the dollar became cu. now, yes, you are right, he is not secured, but at the same time, he does not need this in the existing economic relations in the world, as long as he is taken and not secured ..
                      3. +1
                        16 August 2022 16: 56
                        but at the same time, he does not need this in the existing economic relations in the world

                        Did the latest series of global financial crises, mostly artificial, teach you anything? At least analyze the processes?
                        Or do you think "enemies out of spite" are trying to create alternative settlement options in national currencies? From a bad head, in your opinion, are the states trying to oust the dollar system?
                      4. -1
                        16 August 2022 18: 38
                        an attempt, as they say, is not torture .. yes, they go .. but at the present time, in fact .. as it IS available, the dollar is still the same. when it doesn’t, your concept will work again .. but for now, it doesn’t work ..
                      5. 0
                        16 August 2022 19: 05
                        The fact that 80% of the world's turnover goes through the dollar system in no way cancels the fact that the dollar itself, as the national currency of the United States, is not backed by goods. And it works even as an example of the ruin of developing countries and countries with frankly weak economies.
                        The fact that dollar injections are a political and economic instrument to a greater extent than a market instrument does not negate the above.
                        If it didn't work, there would be no dollar expansion. It is impossible to cancel purely economic laws only by political will or targeted financial aggression.
                      6. 0
                        16 August 2022 19: 07
                        I already said .. I repeat ..
                        Quote: Level 2 Advisor
                        You are right - he is not secured, but at the same time, he does not need this in the existing economic relations in the world, as long as he is taken and not secured ..
                      7. +1
                        16 August 2022 22: 09
                        - he does not need this in the existing economic relations in the world,

                        And why are the existing economic relations so special that you suddenly resolutely deny economic laws and the laws of evolution of these very relations in accordance with these laws? Who canceled them?
                      8. 0
                        16 August 2022 23: 24
                        special in that never in the entire history of mankind - there was no currency in the world, which the dollar is now .. which everything is measured, everyone is calculated and which belongs to one country .. and by the way, this is convenient for many countries .. from minuses - it is not backed by anything, but they take it anyway - this is a plus .. but on the other hand, what currency is now secured and freely convertible? no .. there are features in this that have never been in the whole history, when money is almost just paper .. and the most unpleasant thing is that bang bucks - every single country will suffer, therefore there are doubts that there will be extensive support from the world community for this .. and without it - it’s extremely difficult to bring down a buck ..
                      9. +1
                        16 August 2022 23: 45
                        Yes, what else cu???
                        There is no c.u.
                        There is simply collusion of the financial system.
                        Calculations in dollars are convenient only for those who make a gesheft on interest.
                        As long as banks and bankers will pursue purely supranational, supranational and supramarket interests, the dollar will be that magical paper dollar.
                        Interstate settlements in foreign currency are the same absolutely artificial product as stock trading. If you want, sotonicism expressed in terms of money.
                        This is not a feature at all, it is the scourge of the modern market. Interfering with the normal natural development of the world.
                        And the objective laws of economic development, which do not depend on the system or the level of development, will sooner or later remove this issue from the agenda.
                        Otherwise, the system will go more and more into a hang, until it simply collapses from the inside.
                        Once upon a time, Wall Street also considered themselves masters of the world.
                      10. 0
                        17 August 2022 08: 01
                        You yourself write everything -
                        Quote from Alex
                        Yes, what else cu???
                        There is no c.u.
                        There is simply collusion of the financial system.
                        Calculations in dollars are convenient only for those who make a gesheft on interest.
                        As long as banks and bankers will pursue purely supranational, supranational and supramarket interests, the dollar will be that magical paper dollar.
                        Interstate settlements in foreign currency are the same absolutely artificial product as stock trading. If you want, sotonicism expressed in terms of money.
                        This is not a feature at all, it is the scourge of the modern market. Interfering with the normal natural development of the world.
                        And the objective laws of economic development, which do not depend on the system or the level of development, will sooner or later remove this issue from the agenda.
                        Otherwise, the system will go more and more into a hang, until it simply collapses from the inside.

                        this scourge is a modern feature ..
                        that's why you make specific predictions - if such a situation has NEVER happened before? past experience - does not work as before, you know? in power in the world, in fact, not a specific country, but a bunch of globalists .. in which I completely agree, that this is bad for the entire planet .. but there is nothing permanent in the world - it is clear that the situation will change, but when? and in which direction (for better or worse) I can’t predict .. in my opinion, without a nuclear war or some kind of meteorite, it’s unlikely that anything will work out .. with the power in the world and the money that these people have .. unfortunately I don’t see other ways that can work .. one country, even the Russian Federation, won’t pull them .. and the rest will be “killed / bought”
                  2. +2
                    16 August 2022 15: 14
                    Quote: ZeeD
                    If you simply print money, then nothing but rising inflation and a fall in the purchasing power of money can not be obtained.
                    And no one talks about the distribution of money to the population. Money needs to be invested in the real sector of the economy (in industry). We have all the enterprises of Russia in debt, as if in silks (omit the oil and gas sector). Looks like something is wrong with the economy... This was the case until February 24.02.2022, 2014, and until XNUMX. Economics textbooks with liberal ideology. Liberalism has outlived itself.
                    1. 0
                      16 August 2022 18: 41
                      It is not liberalism that has become obsolete, but what is being slipped to us under its name. If you look at the definition of liberalism and compare it with what is now called liberalism, your hair will stand on end.
                  3. +1
                    17 August 2022 07: 05
                    And no one is going to print money out of thin air, only in the USA they do it, and it was the air trillions printed during the pandemic that dispersed the prices of oil, gas and everything else today, my question is, how will we get a secured ruble by selling for dollars? What makes you think that this will be a security? Previously, we could still buy a dollar for this, but now there is nothing! That is, that we will print the ruble that we will sell real products for it for dollars, the security will be the same! You categorically do not want to understand this, living in the world of the royal dollar. But everything has changed whether you like it or not... You didn't graduate from HSE?
        2. -1
          16 August 2022 00: 08
          Quote: max702
          What will we buy with the money of a foreign contract? Who will sell us what we need?

          There would be money, but how to buy what you need - there will be ways ... For this, there are appropriate services.
          1. +1
            17 August 2022 07: 08
            There are hundreds of billions of money in the accounts, but what's the point? We can’t buy what we need, and for decades! Do not sell! That is, the money for which we sell our real goods is not a means of payment! That is, we deliver our goods for free!
            1. +1
              17 August 2022 08: 21
              Quote: max702
              We can’t buy what we need, and for decades! Do not sell! That is, the money for which we sell our real goods is not a means of payment! That is, we deliver our goods for free!

              Right! And that was until they gave permission for gray imports! And what do you think, the most modern equipment for the production of microelectronics appeared in the USSR?
              However, it appeared that he himself used it!
              1. 0
                17 August 2022 08: 51
                The USSR was frankly poor for much needed, there was simply no currency, although there was an opportunity to buy, now there is a lot of money, but they don’t sell the most necessary things to us! Since the time of the USSR, the world bourgeois international has very well strengthened control over the most important areas of technologies that are interesting to us and other things. now not those times, control has become more global ..
        3. -1
          16 August 2022 03: 49
          Quote: max702
          What will we buy with the money of a foreign contract?

          Che-thread useful for the country, depending on whom to sell and how the terms of the contract will sound. Why not help the same Iran with their age-old habit of trying to block the Persian Gulf under all incomprehensible circumstances?
          1. +3
            16 August 2022 07: 28
            Do not sell! They didn’t sell us at the best of times, remember Opel, Tatra, electronic enterprises and technologies, the darkness of everything! iPhones and chicken legs with other consumer goods will sell us something worthwhile NO!
        4. 0
          17 August 2022 16: 01
          And why buy, "effective" guys from the government and the Central Bank know how to use gold reserves. They have a lot of experience in this matter, as much as 300 Baku lards. wassat
          1. +1
            17 August 2022 16: 08
            These more than 300 lard were pledged to the West so that we would not particularly twitch and dance to their tune, only in this case they were ready to cooperate with us and had it on their own terms, we took the risk of losing these hundreds of billions, but in the future everything we will return and much more .. Everything is ahead ..
            1. 0
              17 August 2022 17: 37
              These 300 lards were "pledged" by the brainless "market people" who rule in the Ministry of Economic Development, the Ministry of Finance and the Central Bank.
      2. +1
        15 August 2022 21: 19
        Only for the LADA project there is no propulsion device that was intended for it (there is VNEU, which they cannot create for decades already (((Nuclear reactors can, but there is none (
        1. +1
          15 August 2022 21: 44
          Once there is a hint of a foreign contract. But doesn't Iran want to replenish its submarine fleet?
        2. -2
          15 August 2022 21: 53
          And as you wanted, a 2000 horsepower Stirling engine, while being silent and there was no industrial production of lithium-ion batteries until recently. Has already!
        3. -1
          16 August 2022 00: 13
          Quote: Normann
          Only for the LADA project there is no propeller that was intended for it

          Now "Lada" is diesel, like Varshavyanka. But with the same armament, it has smaller dimensions and a smaller crew.
          VNEU seems to have been abandoned, in light of the advent of modern batteries.
          1. +2
            16 August 2022 04: 21
            [quote] VNEU seems to have been abandoned, in light of the advent of modern batteries. / quote]
            Modern batteries appeared with the Japanese, and we abandoned VNEU. And it's amazing!
            1. +1
              16 August 2022 11: 47
              At the moment, this VNEU will occupy half the space of the boat. Nafik she need such a? Problems of an oceanic nature, with a long stay under water, we can perfectly solve with nuclear-powered ships.
              1. +3
                16 August 2022 19: 49
                Quote from Alex
                At the moment, this VNEU will occupy half the space of the boat.

                1. We are working on VNEU. Ruby saws it on the ECG, and Malachite finishes off the GTD ZTs. Rubin has an attempt to make a prodigy of direct conversion from the chemical elements of electricity. And the Malahitovites are throwing away running diesel engines, whether they will leave them as backup DGs is a question, because. their turbine will be all-mode: it sucks atmospheric O2 under the RDP, and goes to the PP using the supply of onboard O2 in cryogenic tanks. Under water on the turbine - up to 20 or more (!) Knots. It seems like the 750B project is already ready for sale. The Ministry of Defense does not buy, because in connection with "newly discovered circumstances" very underwater launch CRBD are needed to chill the Chukhons and the descendants of Charles XII.
                With 677D, apparently with 5-6 buildings, the whole thing will end. Then they will rivet Kalina, but only with VNEU they will finish it and take it seriously. They will be equipped with the Northern Fleet and Pacific Fleet in the 500M sea zone, they will "spoil" the Virgins and pull on Sorya ... ensuring the deployment of our anti-aircraft defense systems SN.
                Quote from Alex
                Problems of an oceanic nature, with a long stay under water, we can perfectly solve with nuclear-powered ships.
                Maybe, of course, "we can", but that's just not very many of them with us. And against us in the Atlantic the United States, small-shaven, the Germans, and the paddling pools will also insert their 5 pfennigs.
                Therefore, new nuclear submarines will not interfere with us. They can even be very useful for thinning out MABM ships, fighting NK, etc., not to mention strikes on the coast and naval base.
                AHA.
              2. +2
                16 August 2022 20: 18
                At the moment, Varshavyanka can go under batteries (that is, in low noise mode) 400 miles at 3 knots, compared with diesel submarines of the 70s, this is a good indicator, and in 2022, when Soryu in low noise mode and underwater position can go 4700 miles at 20 knots is archaism. What combat missions can she solve with such characteristics? She will not be able to fight Japanese Soryu or Virginias in the Pacific Fleet, she cannot fight salmon, Virginias and old Norwegian submarines, she cannot fight Swedish and German submarines in the Baltic, she cannot fight new Turkish submarines in the Black Sea Fleet. Nafik need it in this form?
                Problems of an oceanic nature, with a long stay under water, we can perfectly solve with nuclear-powered ships.

                Awesome statement! Now at the Pacific Fleet from MAPL there is a half-dead Kuzbass and one new Yasen-M, what tasks are they able to solve in the area of ​​​​Kamchatka, Chukotka, the Sea of ​​\u12b\uXNUMXbOkhotsk, the Kuril Islands, Sakhalin and the Far East against XNUMX Japanese Soryu, and dozens of salmon and Virginia?
                1. -1
                  16 August 2022 22: 21
                  The tasks of anti-submarine defense should be solved by surface ships, aviation, space and systems for monitoring the underwater situation. Your submarines with VNEU didn’t nafik there, but cheap 636.3, just as an extra. elements of the PLO system fit perfectly.
                  I don't see the point at all in anaerobic facilities like those used by the West.
                  Until a mover based on fundamentally new ideas is built and tested. In the meantime, it is enough to engage in the development and PRODUCTION of high-performance batteries and normal diesel engines, both for the submarine fleet and for surface ships.
                  These here, "I want to be like them," have never led to anything good.

                  And by "ocean tasks" is meant not a race for poachers and tracking down Japs, but the ability to complete tasks in ANY point of the world's oceans. Diesel-electric submarines and boats with VNEU-, such a thing in the fight against multi-purpose Virginia. And even more so, they will not pull any "ocean" tasks.
      3. -5
        15 August 2022 21: 54
        To whom ? Algeria digests, Vietnam similarly. Indonesia is lost. Iran .... builds itself and even its Air Force needs to be re-equipped in the first place. There are no other options for at least 4. Exotic like the DPRK, perhaps.
    2. -11
      15 August 2022 21: 46
      Diesel-electric submarines will play in a new light with the advent of anti-aircraft missiles for TA
  2. +1
    15 August 2022 20: 28
    I think that Varshavyanka is what we need. Not very expensive, well mastered project. So it would be with drones.
    1. +3
      15 August 2022 20: 41
      In Poland, the name is not mad?
      1. +10
        15 August 2022 21: 03
        Absolutely to the point!)
    2. +9
      15 August 2022 22: 19
      Quote: Alien From
      I think that Varshavyanka is what we need

      Well, if we need obsolete and uncompetitive ships, then yes.
      1. +1
        15 August 2022 22: 41
        Maybe you have other information. Ordinary inhabitants are content with what they give. I know you support the fleet with all your heart, and so do I. hi
        1. +11
          15 August 2022 23: 20
          Quote: Alien From
          Maybe you have other information

          Yes, there is nothing unknown. In fact, it was like this - only Ladas, which began to be developed already in the 2011s of the last century, should have been included in the SAP for 2020-80. When it became clear that the Lada was not taking off, it was decided, in order not to leave the Black Sea Fleet completely without boats, to put 6 diesel-electric submarines 636.3 there. A forced decision, simply because it is better to have at least something than to have nothing. And it was right - 12 years ago ..
          But with the "Frets" did not work out at all, sorry for the play on words. And so 636.3 went to the Pacific Fleet, and now, it seems, to the Northern Fleet. What could be considered reasonable in 2008 is difficult to consider as such in 2022. Yes, 636.3 can still do something, but in fact it is outdated now, and they are only going to be laid down, and then more than a dozen years later serve...
          1. -3
            16 August 2022 09: 05
            Can I find out from shipbuilders from Chelyabinsk what is outdated of project 636.6?
            1. +1
              16 August 2022 16: 16
              Quote: Vladimir Michailovich
              Can I find out from shipbuilders from Chelyabinsk what is outdated of project 636.6?

              Are you short or long? In short, compare the SSGN 949A "Antey" and "Ash-M" - you will get an approximate difference between 636.3 and "Lada". More specifically, the combination of the noise level with the capabilities of the HAC does not give 636.3 advantages in mutual detection with nuclear submarines / submarines of the 4th generation.
              1. 0
                16 August 2022 22: 41
                Not so much a "combination" as exactly noise. Hydroacoustics, if desired, can be finished to an adequate level and above. In particular, it is possible to solve problems with GPBA (replacing ceramics with fiber), electronics, and information processing.
                But sitting in a tractor, it's hard to hear a bicycle anyway.
      2. -3
        15 August 2022 22: 57
        obsolete and uncompetitive ships

        depending on how to look at diesel-electric submarines 636.3 - if as a carrier of SLCM Caliber - the very thing (!)
        where are they obsolete(?)
        - the main task at the Pacific Fleet is the patrol area:
        inland Sea of ​​Okhotsk, Kuril Islands - under the cover of air defense, BPRK, PLO aviation
        - for these tasks - the very thing (!) - no longer needed (!)
        The fleet does not need goldfish - we need a massive and cheap diesel-electric submarine SLCM carrier
        * massive, cheap, trouble-free, underwater T-34
        1. +8
          15 August 2022 23: 12
          Quote: Romario_Argo
          depending on how to look at diesel-electric submarines 636.3 - if as a carrier of SLCM Caliber - the very thing (!)
          where are they obsolete(?)

          Roman, firstly, the calibers on diesel-electric submarines are not even a secondary one, it is a third-rate weapon that, by and large, they do not need at all. Because to use these calibers in a real combat situation, it is with a 90% probability that the ship will sign a death warrant.
          Quote: Romario_Argo
          the main task at the Pacific Fleet is the patrol area

          From whom to patrol something? 636.3 today is hardly competitive with Virginia and the latest Japanese submarines.
          1. -2
            15 August 2022 23: 55
            to use these calibers in a real combat situation, it is with a 90% probability that the ship will sign a death warrant

            Using ANY weapon on a submarine is a deadly risk. But the end justifies the means. Moreover, diesel-electric submarines can quite successfully troll almost all of Europe and Japan.
            1. +4
              16 August 2022 08: 13
              Quote: Jager
              But the end justifies the means.

              Right. And when the NAPL strikes the nuclear submarine in its waters, this risk is more than justified and minimized. But risking a submarine for the sake of launching three or four calibers to destroy some kind of ground building is clearly unjustified. If the distances allow you to "calibrate" the target from our coastal waters, then any corvette / frigate will cope with this, the submarine is useless
              1. 0
                16 August 2022 08: 17
                By the same logic, you can fasten the "Caliber" to the railway car and not bother with specialized carriers at all))
                1. +3
                  16 August 2022 19: 10
                  Quote: Jager
                  By the same logic, you can fasten the "Caliber" to the railway car and not bother with specialized carriers at all))

                  Quite right. And you know what got in the way? INF Treaty. And now he's gone, and...
                  1. -2
                    17 August 2022 01: 01
                    This INF Treaty did not interfere in any way. In fact, the agreement was nothing more than the result of Gorbachev's betrayal.
              2. 0
                16 August 2022 10: 42
                And when the NAPL strikes the nuclear submarine in its waters, this risk is more than justified

                you know everything yourself
                DEPL 636.3 for the Kuriles is the very thing - to wait for the passing Virginia
                and launch 3-4 PLUR 91R "Answer" (Caliber)
                we have planned missile firing in our territorial waters
                1. +2
                  16 August 2022 16: 17
                  Quote: Romario_Argo
                  DEPL 636.3 for the Kuriles is the very thing - to wait for the passing Virginia

                  And wait for the noise of the attacking torpedo - the virgin will find Varshavyanka earlier
                  1. -2
                    16 August 2022 20: 53
                    Andrei, don’t be stupid, the PLUR will drop a torpedo 100 meters from the attacked nuclear submarine
                    and by circulation, in 5 seconds Virginia will go to the bottom
                    from where the PLUR flew in, they won’t know for sure
                    1. +1
                      16 August 2022 22: 23
                      Quote: Romario_Argo
                      Andrew, don't be stupid

                      Roman, take care of yourself.
                      Quote: Romario_Argo
                      PLUR will drop a torpedo 100 meters from the attacked nuclear submarine

                      Yes. The covers of the torpedo tubes will silently open, the container with the PLUR will silently fire, it will float up, silently turn on the engine and rush up...
                      You are talking utter nonsense, and tell me something else about stupidity ...
                      1. 0
                        17 August 2022 06: 59
                        yeah
                        PLUR Answer has a range of 300 km, even if there is a salvo from 100 km
                        and the Virginia nuclear submarine will enter the Sea of ​​​​Okhotsk for 3-5 islands in the strait, and the control center will be received from the underwater situation control system
                        nothing, the nuclear submarine will not hear for 100 km, where there are still a lot of civilian ships sailing
                      2. 0
                        17 August 2022 09: 06
                        Quote: Romario_Argo
                        PLUR Answer has a range of 300 km

                        Roman, tell drugs at least "sometimes", if you really can't say "no".
                        The answer has a range of 50 km. The diesel-electric submarine will "see" the "Virginia" at a distance many times smaller.
                        Quote: Romario_Argo
                        The control center will be received from the underwater situation control system

                        Which exists only in your wild imagination.
            2. 0
              16 August 2022 10: 47
              ANY weapon for a submarine is a mortal risk

              if in detail on examples, then already no risk
              Kuril Islands - our hydrographers have already measured all the depths, underwater hollows, between the islands
              launch 3 or 4 PLUR 91R Response to the Virginia nuclear submarine in our territorial waters
              this is normal - Virginia has NO PLUR - only torpedoes
              The Virginia nuclear submarine will only hear bursts of torpedoes from the PLUR at a distance of 100 meters from its hull and after 5 seconds - it is destroyed - there will be no response
              especially since Americans don't know everything our underwater - beds near the Kuriles
              1. +1
                16 August 2022 16: 19
                Quote: Romario_Argo
                The Virginia nuclear submarine will only hear bursts of torpedoes from the PLUR at a distance of 100 meters from its hull

                In fact, she will hear the opening covers of the TA on Varshavyanka.
                Quote: Romario_Argo
                Americans DO NOT know all our underwater - beds near the Kuriles

                Submarines have long ceased to seek to lie on the ground ...
                1. -1
                  16 August 2022 20: 57
                  Andrey, once again I ask you not to need that ,,,
                  what TA covers (?) - PLURs will be released through a couple of islands from the nuclear submarine Virginia
                  by third-party target designation, interfaced through the CICS via Zeus communication or the receiving antenna of retractable devices
                  lots of options. they have no chance in our waters - only if we let go again
                  1. +2
                    16 August 2022 22: 26
                    Quote: Romario_Argo
                    Andrey, once again I ask you not to need that ,,,

                    And once again I ask you not to smack nonsense - it hurts her
                    Quote: Romario_Argo
                    PLURs will be released through a couple of islands from the nuclear submarine Virginia
                    by third-party target designation, interfaced through the CICS via Zeus communication or the receiving antenna of retractable devices

                    Did they understand what they said?
                    Quote: Romario_Argo
                    lots of options. they have no chance in our waters - only if we let go again

                    True, in real life everything is exactly the opposite, but what do you care about boring reality ...
                    1. -1
                      17 August 2022 07: 00
                      I perfectly understand what I am writing about. it's all gone for you
                      1. 0
                        17 August 2022 09: 08
                        Quote: Romario_Argo
                        I perfectly understand what I am writing about.

                        About the non-existent EGSONPO, about PLUR flying 300 km, about the control center on the submarine, which allows you to get from 300 km to 100 m from the submarine, about underwater communications that allow you to transfer the control center .... wassat
              2. 0
                17 August 2022 01: 07
                In your reality, boats confront each other in a vacuum - without the use of satellite intelligence, RTR, aviation and acoustics. With the current development of detection tools, the submarine can more or less feel calm only under the thickness of the Arctic ice.
          2. -2
            16 August 2022 00: 18
            Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
            firstly, the calibers on diesel-electric submarines are not even a secondary one, they are a third-rate weapon that, by and large, they do not need at all.

            On the Black Sea, launching Caliber in Ukraine is just that. AWACS can't see them and Harpoons can't hit.
            1. +3
              16 August 2022 04: 27
              On the Black Sea, launching Caliber in Ukraine is just that. AWACS can't see them and Harpoons can't hit.

              They are seen by PLO Poseidon aircraft and the Turks hear very well when they start a diesel engine, and without diesel engines they will travel 200 km and fse.
              1. -2
                16 August 2022 10: 55
                without diesels, they will travel 200 km and fse

                strange
                in Moscow, city scooters pass on 1 charge for 6 hours at 60 km/h
                stun gun Alligator is discharged in 33 minutes: 100 volts and 000 amperes
                у DEPL 636.3 - 2 battery PIT
                and speed tests 25 knots - 4 days, Varshavyanka went without surfacing
                - although the declared maximum is only 20 knots
                1. +3
                  16 August 2022 18: 50
                  Quote: Romario_Argo
                  and on tests at a speed of 25 knots - 4 days,

                  Go to the manufacturer's website - 400 miles three knots. Your recommended 25 knots in 96 hours gives you 2400 miles.
                  Nothing you have errors, 500% wassat
                  1. -1
                    16 August 2022 20: 45
                    see the test analytics yourself
                2. +1
                  16 August 2022 20: 03
                  in Moscow, city scooters pass on 1 charge for 6 hours at 60 km/h

                  You forgot to clarify that the batteries of the new generation scooters are lithium-ion and are not made by us. And on Varshavyanki there are acid-base batteries.
                  Batteries of the same generation as on scooters were installed by the Japanese on their Soryu submarine, which, according to various sources, can travel about two thousand miles on batteries. But they were able to solve the problems of lithium-ion batteries, and for 30 years we have not been able to make a working VNEU.
                  and on tests at a speed of 25 knots - 4 days, Varshavyanka went without surfacing
                  - although the declared maximum is only 20 knots

                  You forgot to clarify that she was running in diesel mode under water and any modern corvette, frigate or destroyer equipped with a modern GAK will hear her for a thousand kilometers.
                  And in low noise mode, on batteries and at a speed of 3 knots, Varshavyanka will cover a maximum of 400 miles. For comparison, Soryu with VNEU in low noise mode in a submerged position can cover 4700 miles at 20 knots.
                  1. -1
                    16 August 2022 20: 49
                    on Varshavyanka there are domestic not only lithium-ion, but also refueled with hydrogen from the reforming of diesel fuel (80% water)
                    1. 0
                      17 August 2022 08: 35
                      Lithium ion are in this world only on the last two Soryu. And the second option works on VNEU of German boats, our similar option for Lada still does not work, otherwise Lada would be with VNEU
                      1. 0
                        17 August 2022 08: 54
                        we do not need VNEU
                        reforming diesel fuel (80% water) - for hydrogen batteries
                        no refusal theme like AK
                        anyway, diesel-electric submarines are limited by provisions and fuel
              2. +1
                16 August 2022 20: 06
                Quote: ramzay21
                and without diesels, they will travel 200 km and fse.

                Colleague! you are under the nickname with the flag of the Soviet Navy! - then you should definitely know that 636.3M goes under AB 650, and this is definitely not 200 km! For 677D, they made an AB 2 times larger in capacity, so 1000M, I hope, with God's help, it will master ...
                And she will have a better "Lira" than 885 Irtysh-Amphora will have. Therefore ... everything will depend on the training of the crew and LUCK!
                drinks
                1. The comment was deleted.
                2. 0
                  17 August 2022 08: 32
                  Colleague! I'll get better, 200M radius and it can pass, as the manufacturer assures 400M at 3 knots. about 650, especially about 1000 miles, I have not heard and it is hardly possible without replacing it with lithium-ion batteries, which have problems with a fire hazard.
                  But if our designers can someday create non-flammable lithium-ion batteries, then Varshavyankas will be able to travel one and a half thousand miles and not at all at three knots, and such Varshavyankas will be able to withstand modern threats.
                  Now you will not envy the crews of Varshavyanka, especially in the Pacific Fleet.
                  PS I did not go on diesel engines. drinks drinks
            2. +4
              16 August 2022 08: 09
              On the Black Sea, Buyans from the Sea of ​​​​Azov can launch calibers across Ukraine, frigates from the Black Sea can, submarines are not needed for this from the word "absolutely"
              1. -2
                16 August 2022 10: 40
                PL is not needed for this from the word "absolutely"

                so what (?) - we put the stars on the hull of the TA diesel-electric submarine pr.636.3
          3. -2
            16 August 2022 10: 38
            disagree,
            Calibers are not only SLCMs, but also PLUR and anti-ship missiles
            among other things,
            R&D is underway on the possible installation of the Paket-PL anti-torpedo complex on Project 636.3
            said above - Ave 636.3 cheap, mass, underwater T-34
            and let the Virginia nuclear submarine commanders think 100 500 times how to enter our territorial waters
            especially if a Torpedo lies in wait for them or even worse - PLUR in our straits of the Kuril Islands
            1. +2
              16 August 2022 18: 53
              Quote: Romario_Argo
              disagree,

              You might think that something depends on your consent
              Calibers are not only SLCMs, but also PLUR and anti-ship missiles

              using anti-ship missiles is just suicide, and PLUR on NPLs is not the best substitute for a good 533-mm torpedo.
              Quote: Romario_Argo
              and let the Virginia nuclear submarine commanders think 100 500 times how to enter our territorial waters

              The question is that they go there as if they were at home. And it's rare to get them
              1. 0
                16 August 2022 20: 47
                this is your opinion in the Ministry of Defense, it’s definitely not interesting to anyone
                again,
                about. Iturup + several dozen small islands
                The Virginia nuclear submarine was already there - there was already an attack on it
                next time we’ll sink and it’s the PLUR on the flat, so that they don’t know where it came from
                1. 0
                  17 August 2022 01: 10
                  Well, I doubt very much that the American submarine was alone)))
                  1. 0
                    17 August 2022 06: 55
                    How many,
                    2nd NPS Virginia (?)
                    it’s worse for them - doubly unacceptable damage - the loss of 2 nuclear submarines
                    in the Kuriles everything is dotted with our hydrophones, target designation is stable
                    1. +1
                      17 August 2022 08: 12
                      I am 100% sure that our narrow-eyed neighbors could not do without.
                      Yes, and the drowning of an enemy nuclear submarine off its own shores is to arrange an underwater Chernobyl.
        2. BEV
          +2
          16 August 2022 05: 36
          Tell me where did you find plo aviation on toff, and air defense?
          Noisy with the acoustics of the last century, slow-moving, it will become easy prey for Yaps and Yankees. The most important lead in detection, but it is not. And so by the way ask when we are Jap. P was last discovered.
          1. +1
            16 August 2022 20: 33
            Quote from B.E.V.
            Noisy with the acoustics of the last century, slow-moving, it will become easy prey for Yaps and Yankees. The most important lead in detection, but it is not

            1. By noise. It all depends on hydrology. But they are not very noisy either. 18-20dB at 4,0kts Natural sea background =30dB.
            2. Acoustics. Probably they will already put something newer than the MGK-400M. Maybe the flank canvases of the HAC will be installed and the GPBA will be stuck in the "tail" for greater persuasiveness. Then we'll see who can sneak through the straits unnoticed. Virgie will trample on 10-12 knots due to currents, and this is another "SINGLE"!
            3. Slow. And she doesn’t need to run in the veil to distill with an atomic carrier! She needs to take aim and "quietly" launch the UET-1M at the pre-empted point ... And then let the Yankees break away from her if she has time to detect it!
            4. Anticipation in detection. Well, it's the Yankees who will climb into the Sea of ​​​​Okhotsk. There, back in my time, the 608 or 607 station was deployed. Any hydrophones will be better than on a submarine. Yes, and the BC with its computing power will also help ... So, Virgie is unlikely to climb into the "mine" field just like that ... Everyone should live like a hotz.
            AHA.
      3. +1
        16 August 2022 06: 32
        Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
        Quote: Alien From
        I think that Varshavyanka is what we need

        Well, if we need obsolete and uncompetitive ships, then yes.

        Who and when came up with the phrase "more in number, at a cheaper price"? By chance, not Griboedov in the first half of the nineteenth century? Relevant even now.
        1. 0
          16 August 2022 17: 13
          Quote: Nagan
          By chance, not Griboedov in the first half of the nineteenth century?

          Yes. In "Woe from Wit"
          Oh! Let's move on to education.
          What is now, just as of old,
          Trouble recruiting teachers regiments,
          More in number, cheaper price?
          Not that they are far in science;
          In Russia, under a great fine,
          We each admit being told
          Historian and geographer!
  3. +11
    15 August 2022 20: 39
    And not a word about VNEU .... so we will build boats inferior to Western ones and what is even more insulting to Eastern models!? Is it really a drum for the leadership and we initially build obsolete submarines!? 877 the project was developed back in the 70s of the last century !!!More 40 years ago!!! And 636 at 90 ... even somehow ashamed of our designers .... And now minus. I know that there are a lot of cheers for patriots on the site.
    1. 0
      15 August 2022 20: 53
      Quote: Magic Archer
      And not a word about VNEU .... so we will build boats inferior to Western ones and what is even more insulting to Eastern models!? Is it really a drum for the leadership and we initially build obsolete submarines!? 877 the project was developed back in the 70s of the last century !!!More 40 years ago!!! And 636 at 90 ... even somehow ashamed of our designers .... And now minus. I know that there are a lot of cheers for patriots on the site.

      "Better a tit in the hands than a duck under the bed." laughing
      What we can, then we build! hi
      1. +3
        15 August 2022 20: 59
        So that's the point, read articles 3-5 years ago. They boasted that Lada would be the first. But in the end, where is she!? Is everything really that bad??!
        1. +3
          15 August 2022 21: 09
          Quote: Magic Archer
          Is everything really that bad??!

          laughing I think it's worse than we think! Just don't tell anyone about it.
          soldier
    2. -7
      15 August 2022 20: 59
      Quote: Magic Archer
      I know that there are a lot of cheers for patriots on the site.

      Is it that important to you? Then this is your disadvantage.
    3. -6
      15 August 2022 21: 02
      Quote: Magic Archer
      And not a word about VNEU .... so we will build boats inferior to Western ones

      And who has boats with VNEU, remind me? And how much ?
      1. +6
        15 August 2022 21: 05
        Let me remind you. The Swedes were the first. Then the Koreans, the Japanese and even the Chinese. Plus the projects of the French, Germans and others
        1. -7
          15 August 2022 21: 15
          Quote: Magic Archer
          Let me remind you. The Swedes were the first. Then the Koreans, the Japanese and even the Chinese. Plus the projects of the French, Germans and others

          This is known to me. How many boats with VNEU are in service and from whom? And don't forget to tell about Japan, about their concepts. are they with VNEU or what?
          1. +4
            15 August 2022 21: 18
            I don’t understand, you have nothing to do!? If you know what these questions are for ??? Or do you think that building obsolete boats is what the fleet needs !?
            1. -6
              15 August 2022 21: 24
              Quote: Magic Archer
              I don’t understand, you have nothing to do!? If you know what these questions are for ??? Or do you think that building obsolete boats is what the fleet needs !?

              This is nothing for you. And therefore, the question is, what kind of tasks can 636 boats perform on the Black Sea theater of operations? And why are they outdated for such tasks?
              1. +5
                15 August 2022 21: 33
                But what, they only go to the Black Sea!? But what about the Pacific Flotilla and the Northern Fleet!? They will also perform tasks there)? Or is it still worth recognizing that the boats are old) ?!
                1. -1
                  15 August 2022 21: 41
                  Quote: Magic Archer
                  What about the Pacific Fleet?

                  Omg! What is this connection?
                  1. -5
                    15 August 2022 21: 53
                    Sorry, of course, if you are already interested in the terms (fleet, flotilla, squadron), then you should probably go to Wikipedia. And yes, by the way. And what kind of car do you have, if not a secret?
                    1. -1
                      16 August 2022 13: 08
                      Quote: Magic Archer
                      .And yes, by the way. And what kind of car do you have if it's not a secret?

                      Not a secret. KIA assembled in Russia. And about the terms. Well, it characterizes. And Vicki has nothing to do with it.
                      Well, God be with them. We drove. Even at the Pacific Fleet 636th boat has something to do. Cover the deployment of SSBNs for example. In addition to the DBK and surface pennants. When you write about the fleet, remember that the Russian Federation is not a maritime power (in the civilizational sense). And now the SVO just showed it. Our probable enemy is on the mainland, hence the doctrine of the development of the Armed Forces.
                      And the fact that there are a lot of jambs is that all countries have, I assure you.
      2. +4
        15 August 2022 21: 36
        at least the Japanese, they have 12 submarines of this type, there are still Swedes, even the Chinese have already overtaken ...
        1. +2
          15 August 2022 21: 45
          Quote from kasy
          at least the Japanese, they have 12 submarines of this type

          However, the development of the same japps, this concept does not have. The bet is again on high-tech and capacious batteries.
          1. +1
            15 August 2022 23: 54
            the question is not that there is no development of the concept, but that the Yaps have 12 submarines with VNEU ...
            1. 0
              16 August 2022 13: 12
              Quote from kasy
              but the fact that the Yaps have 12 submarines with VNEU ...

              Well, there is and there is. So what? Does it provide any benefits?
              Of all the troubles with the fleet, this is the least.
              1. 0
                16 August 2022 13: 42
                gives advantages - the submarine does not need to emerge, so a trifle ... and the Japanese fleet itself is powerful
                1. 0
                  16 August 2022 17: 56
                  Quote from kasy
                  gives advantages - the submarine does not need to emerge

                  Learn materiel. What else can I say.
    4. 0
      15 August 2022 21: 04
      I agree with you, but this is the reality.
    5. -2
      15 August 2022 21: 25
      Quote: Magic Archer
      now minus. I know that there are a lot of cheers for patriots on the site

      where are they?
      I don't see any of them or any cons.
      As they say, fear has big eyes.
      here you are cheers-patriots and imagining.
    6. +5
      15 August 2022 21: 54
      Quote: Magic Archer
      And not a word about VNEU .... so we will build boats inferior to Western ones and what is even more insulting to Eastern models!? Is it really a drum for the leadership and we initially build obsolete submarines!? 877 the project was developed back in the 70s of the last century !!!More 40 years ago!!! And 636 at 90 ... even somehow ashamed of our designers .... And now minus. I know that there are a lot of cheers for patriots on the site.

      And it’s nothing that Arleigh Burke has been building his USA since 1988 to this day and will build more, and the project is from the early 80s. i.e. the project is also 40 years old. and no one will dare to say that they have almost 70 obsolete destroyers.
      Let them build 30 Warsaw women rather than several "unparalleled" boats and scatter them over all the fleets. When VNEU is brought to mind, then they will build it. VNEU is being built by those who do not have nuclear weapons in such numbers as we do.
      The advantage of a large series is that it will be easier and faster to upgrade them later on one project.
      1. +4
        15 August 2022 22: 30
        Quote: navigator777
        And it’s nothing that Arleigh Burke has been building his USA since 1988 to this day and will build more, and the project is from the early 80s. i.e. the project is also 40 years old. and no one will dare to say that they have almost 70 obsolete destroyers.

        The obsolescence of a ship is determined not by the date of its project, but by the ability to solve the assigned tasks. Arly Burke solves his problems quite satisfactorily. 636.3 are essentially a means of combating enemy submarines in the BMZ, but for this they are outdated. The original 877 "Halibut" could target the "Los Angeles", but it no longer danced against the "improved Los Angeles". Well, 636.3 have been modernized, of course, they probably will be able to against the "improved moose", only now it's the era of the next generation, Seawolf, Virginia. With these nuclear submarines, our 636.3 can hardly fight right now, but they are just being laid down, and have been serving them for more than a dozen years.
        Quote: navigator777
        The advantage of a large series is that it is easier to upgrade them later

        Everything that could have been modernized there has long been modernized, but this is the third generation with all the consequences. And the fourth generation, which were supposed to drive "Virgins" were supposed to be "Lada". Yes, only now ... it seems they did not.
        1. -3
          15 August 2022 23: 56
          Well, of course, everything is fine and right with them, but with us everything is hopelessly outdated, we need a new one, but in short it is gone and everything is gone ...
          1. +3
            16 August 2022 08: 19
            Quote: navigator777
            Well, of course, everything is fine and right with them, but with us everything is hopelessly outdated

            Alas, but in terms of NAPL, things are exactly the same.
    7. 0
      15 August 2022 22: 04
      Magic Archer:

      - And in them, and in the whole fleet - the Russian base of electronic components? There are displays, thermal imagers, electronic optics of periscopes .... and all sorts of other nonsense, processors, memory ...

      - After all, partners, they are, they monopolize the entire production process ...
    8. +2
      16 August 2022 00: 17
      Quote: Magic Archer
      And not a word about VNEU .... so we will build boats inferior to Western ones and what is even more offensive to Eastern models !?

      This VNEU is not at all an analogue of a nuclear reactor. And will not allow scalding under water at maximum speed. Not a panacea, in short. And, pay attention. VNEU is installed by those who do not have nuclear reactors for submarines. Your tasks. Varshavyanka are quiet, fairly autonomous, and well-armed. But if Zircons are also put on them ...
      1. BEV
        -2
        16 August 2022 05: 42
        Quiet were considered 40 years ago. Alas, the time is up.
        1. -2
          16 August 2022 08: 02
          Quote from B.E.V.
          Quiet were considered 40 years ago. Alas, the time is up.

          Between what was built 40 years ago and what is now, there is little in common, the projects were reworked several times and the low-noise technology did not stand still for 40 years
    9. 0
      16 August 2022 11: 00
      And not a word about VNEU

      we do not need VNEU - we have a breakthrough in the field of batteries
      both lithium and hydrogen refueling, by reforming diesel fuel consisting of 90% water
      scooters in moscow ride you for 6 hours on a single charge at 60 km/h
      diesel-electric submarines have two battery pits - they give out 25 knots with a supply for 4 days
  4. nnm
    +2
    15 August 2022 20: 39
    It will be interesting to know the opinion of professionals in this matter.
    1. +5
      15 August 2022 20: 46
      Professional submariners fled from VO. There is a closed club of sailors submariners St. Petersburg. But the articles are not closed.
    2. 0
      15 August 2022 21: 01
      Probably the Lada project was not fully implemented, so Varshavyanka is being built.
  5. -3
    15 August 2022 20: 40
    they would pay money to normal people there ... one laugh
  6. +1
    15 August 2022 20: 43
    At one time there was a wonderful project, but time is inexorable. So the continuation of the production of these honored pensioners illustrates the long-established patterns of interaction between our military-industrial complex and the Moscow Region: take what we give, there will be no other anyway.
  7. -1
    15 August 2022 21: 14
    And what about VNEU there? Frets going to build?
    1. 0
      15 August 2022 21: 37
      one submarine "St. Petersburg" seems to have been launched, or it is undergoing tests, those who know will correct me, there were some shortcomings and they seem to be eliminated
  8. +1
    15 August 2022 21: 15
    These boats are outdated and do not meet the requirements of modern warfare.
    1. +4
      15 August 2022 21: 54
      And what are the requirements of modern warfare, I would like to know? It seems that for many years no one has fought with anyone using the submarine fleet.
      Well, there were missile launches from submarines ...
      I want to understand without a hitch.
      1. +9
        15 August 2022 23: 27
        Quote: ZeeD
        And what are the requirements of modern warfare, I would like to know?

        The first and main task of our NNSs is to counter enemy nuclear submarines in the near sea zone. For this diesel-electric submarine, with all its disadvantages, has a big plus - low noise. And even having not the most powerful GAK, it has an advantage in the detection distance of enemy nuclear submarines. Why are halibuts called black holes? Los Angeles is going to our naval base, waiting for the SSBN to go out on patrol so that it can sit on its tail, and suddenly - rraz! - impulse from nowhere. In a real battle, it would be a torpedo. That is, a Russian submarine is nearby, but they didn’t see her on the los until she launched a training attack.
        The Varshavyankas knew how to do this against boats of the 3rd generation, Lada - they should be able to against the 4th. Now the US Navy is being saturated with 4th generation nuclear submarines, which the Varshavyankas cannot cope with, and we ... are building the Varshavyankas.
        Quote: ZeeD
        It seems that for many years no one has fought with anyone using the submarine fleet.

        In 1982, the Argentinean San Luis launched torpedo attacks on the ships of the KVMF. She did not achieve success due to defective torpedoes, but, perhaps, she still managed to torpedo the nuclear submarine of the British Splendit
      2. BEV
        -1
        16 August 2022 05: 46
        The main advantage for pl is in detection. Our GAK no longer has it. Damn low frequency backlight.
        1. 0
          16 August 2022 08: 22
          Both true and false. NAPL operates where enemy nuclear submarines should work as covertly as possible, no one, I think, will unmask their positions with any active illumination
      3. +1
        16 August 2022 08: 03
        The use of Caliber missiles cannot be the main task of diesel-electric submarines. Equipping with such missiles is a necessary measure, because. The United States at one time forbade placing them on land, where they can be used much more efficiently. There are too few missiles on such a boat for one salvo to solve any real problem, except for propaganda, and at the same time it deprives diesel-electric submarines of the main advantage - stealth.
        A modern boat should not unmask itself, being at a depth for weeks without recharging ascents, then it will be able to solve the main tasks - anti-aircraft defense and minelaying in coastal areas.
    2. -4
      15 August 2022 22: 10
      Quote: S. Viktorovich
      These boats are outdated and do not meet the requirements of modern warfare.

      Very modern, they were turned into drums with Caliber installed on them, or maybe Zircons will be stuck in time. In Europe, they don’t think like you, for some reason they are not very calm from the fact that the “outdated” Varshavyanka can be calibrated with a nuclear warhead, you can say from the pier.
  9. +3
    15 August 2022 21: 39
    I would also like to hear how things are going with VNEU.
  10. +1
    15 August 2022 21: 54
    but I like Varshavyanka more than Lada, Lada is following the western school of submarine construction - a single-hull design with extremities, a superstructure and a wheelhouse fence, so it has a displacement of 1.3 times less, and it seems to be quieter, BUT a double-hull has its advantages, first of all, the frames on the outside and not inside a strong hull, and this improves habitability, secondly, greater survivability, according to Soviet standards, a submarine should float with a flooded compartment and adjacent ballast tanks, the ability to break ice is also important for the northern fleet, and this can only be achieved by excess displacement, and as for VNEU, I think replacing batteries with lithium-ion ones will be sufficient without it ....
    1. +9
      15 August 2022 22: 53
      Quote: 1984
      a single-hull design with extremities, a superstructure and a cabin fence, therefore, it has a displacement less than 1.3 times, and it seems to be quieter, BUT a double-hull has its advantages, firstly, the frames are outside and not inside a strong hull, and this improves habitability, and secondly, greater survivability

      Let's still be realistic - will this better survivability help the Varshavyanka when hit by a standard 533-mm torpedo?
      Varshavyankas were built in such a way that they could detect third-generation nuclear submarines before they themselves were discovered, which is why they were called "black holes" but they no longer surpassed "improved moose". Lada has the latest HAK, which, combined with reduced noise, made it possible to detect fourth-generation nuclear submarines earlier than they could detect Lada. In theory. And just like that, they could perform the tasks of non-nuclear submarines for a very long time, but Varshavyanka can hardly do this even today
  11. +3
    15 August 2022 22: 37
    How much can you? 21st century in the yard! They began to make them even under the USSR.
    1. -1
      16 August 2022 08: 07
      Arleigh Burke destroyers also began to build back in the USSR, built, are building and will continue to build, are they fools according to your project of the early 80s to build? We are accustomed to finding fault with all of ours, but we must not find fault, but build and modernize them in dozens, so that for every enemy boat that enters our waters, there are several of ours.
      1. +1
        16 August 2022 09: 18
        Quote: navigator777
        Arleigh Burke destroyers also began to build under the USSR, they built, they build and will continue to build, are they fools according to your project of the early 80s to build?
        Kaptsov explained everything about Arly Berk: they build different ships under the same name, calling them Series 1, Series 2, Series 2a, Series 3, where they change what does not correspond to the time.
  12. -3
    15 August 2022 23: 31
    Another milking of the budget under the guise of the development of the Navy.
    1. +2
      16 August 2022 09: 40
      Quote: 1984
      a single-hull design with extremities, a superstructure and a cabin fence, therefore, it has a displacement less than 1.3 times, and it seems to be quieter, BUT a double-hull has its advantages, firstly, the frames are outside and not inside a strong hull, and this improves habitability, and secondly, greater survivability,

      The difference in displacement between single-hull boats and Varshavyanka, with a similar amount of ammunition, differs not by 1.3 times, but by 2 times, the boat is, as it were, inside a "light hull", that is, a huge water tank (1600 tons of water 40% of the underwater displacement) this "light case", in fact, it has an area many times larger than a durable case and, despite the difference in metal thickness, their weights are close. This whole structure made of water and metal is very heavy and, despite its huge size, there is little room for armament batteries. The large size of the boat does not contribute to stealth, and the two hulls have significant differences in the reflection of echolocation signals, the reflected signal of 2 hulls cannot be confused with the signal of 1 hull, so there has never been and never will be any "black hole" .. Despite for a huge reserve of buoyancy of 40%, the boat cannot emerge after breaking the ice, by the way, due to its large dimensions, it is dangerous to swim under the ice on it. and in general it is in vain to think that two hulls somehow significantly increase the survivability of the boat even in peacetime.
      By the way, 2-hull boats are more difficult to upgrade than 1-hull ones,
  13. -1
    16 August 2022 09: 11
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    The original 877 "Halibut" could target the "Los Angeles", but it no longer danced against the "improved Los Angeles".

    Where did such revelations come from, what caused them? The noise generated by the PLA is always !!! more than the noise from a submarine running on batteries, due to the operation of a steam turbine ...
  14. -1
    16 August 2022 09: 11
    Quote: navigator777
    Arleigh Burke destroyers also began to build under the USSR, they built, they build and will continue to build, he’s fools according to your project of the early 80s to build

    PLA Los Angeles has been under construction since 1978 and nothing.
  15. -2
    16 August 2022 18: 12
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    and GAK does not give 636.3 advantages in mutual detection with nuclear submarines / submarines of the 4th generation.

    It is not clear where the firewood comes from, where do you get such valuable information - in Klimov's opuses?
    And here's something else that prevents equipping project 636.6 with a new HAK? What's wrong with the contours of 636.6, that it is moving into the category of obsolete ones? And in general, comparing the 949 project - a double-hulled hippopotamus and project 885? And once again you are able to understand that is the noise level of a PT powered by a nuclear power plant several times higher than that of an electric motor powered by a battery?
    1. +1
      16 August 2022 19: 38
      Quote: Vladimir Michailovich
      It is not clear where the firewood comes from, where do you get such valuable information - in Klimov's opuses?

      Read Semenov. He has a track record VVVAUSh. Anti-submarine aviation. Navigator Be-12. Navigator Il-38 77 OPLAP (Nikolaevka). ZNSh and NSh of the 122nd OPLAE in 317 OSAP (Yelizovo). Senior officer of the anti-submarine warfare department of the KVF (Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky). Senior officer of the anti-submarine warfare department of the Pacific Fleet (Vladivostok).
      Quote: Vladimir Michailovich
      And here's something else that prevents equipping project 636.6 with a new HAK?

      Is there a new HAK? Yes, it stands on the "Lada", "Lira" is called, a potentially chic thing with three antennas (two onboard). And at 636.3 they put Rubicon-M, which is not bad ... but nothing more than that, and according to the performance characteristics, it is up to the passport performance characteristics of the "Lyra" as to China on all fours, and through Paris.
      So your question "something-who interferes" is from the category of rhetorical ones - they DO NOT PUT it, and this is a sad fact.

      Quote: Vladimir Michailovich
      something is wrong with the contours of 636.6, that it moves to the category of obsolete?

      And what's with the wraps? It is double-hulled - already a minus for low noise
      Quote: Vladimir Michailovich
      And in general, a comparison of the 949 project - a two-hull hippopotamus and pr.885?

      Given that you want to understand the difference between 885M and Antey, but not between Varshavyanka and Lyra. And she's about the same.
      Quote: Vladimir Michailovich
      And once again, are you able to understand that the noise level of a PT powered by a nuclear power plant is many times higher than that of an electric motor powered by a battery?

      Are you able to understand that it is important to reduce the noise level not to infinity, but to disguise it as natural noise?
      Quote: Vladimir Michailovich
      Where did such revelations come from, what caused them? The noise generated by the PLA is always !!! more than the noise from a submarine running on batteries, due to the operation of a steam turbine ...

      It is not the noise itself that is important, the DISTANCE OF MUTUAL DETECTION is important.
      Nuclear submarines are noisier than diesel-electric submarines, but nuclear submarines have a much more powerful and sensitive HAC. As a result, the nuclear submarine may be noisier, but detect diesel-electric submarines before it detects it.
      Quote: Vladimir Michailovich
      PLA Los Angeles has been under construction since 1978 and nothing.

      The last, 39th, Los Angeles entered service in 1989. The last improved moose went into operation in 1996, that is, for a second, 26 years ago.
      The first virgin entered service 18 years ago, in 2022.
      We continue to build diesel-electric submarines that can fight improved moose, but they won't be able to - with virginia even after 2022... Is everything all right? Doesn't press anything?
  16. -1
    16 August 2022 22: 36
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    Everything is fine? Doesn't press anything?

    Thanks for work.
    Once again, where are the firewood from? What can the PLO pilot say about the GAS PL? And why can’t Lyra be put on Varshavyanka all of a sudden? Lada is also double-hulled, by the way.
  17. 0
    21 August 2022 14: 28
    Still good batteries for them, not lead and autonomy increase. Roll up the diesel engine in a noise-protective casing and reduce the exhaust noise level. And you can go further!

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