Not thanks, but in spite of. How our snipers get something other than SVD

125

SVLK-14S "Dusk". Photo by OrengunTeam.


In May I wrote an article about 0.338 Lapua Magnum rifles, under which commentators reported the incredible difficulty of getting 1 meters from a modern weapons, about the lack of need for another caliber, about the complexity of such weapons systems, etc.



While the spears in the comments broke, the brothers worked, and here we see news how "Ultra-long-range rifle" Dusk "helps snipers solve problems during a special operation". The article is based on a short video with the sighting of the .408 CheyTac caliber complex, posted on the OrengunTeam Telegram channel.

SVLK-14S "Dusk" manufactured by Lobaev Arms is a piece of high-class rifles that have a more tactically advanced brother DXL-4M "Sevastopol", the work with which the author observed with his own eyes.

What is the .408 Cheyenne Tactical Caliber?


The 408x10,36mm .77 rimless military centerfire rifle cartridge has been produced since 2013. It was developed by Dr. John D. Taylor and machinist William O. Wordman for shooting at a distance of 2 meters as a competitor to the .000 Lapua Magnum and .338 BMG cartridges. Claimed accuracy at 50 meters is 2 MOA (a minute of arc is approximately 200 cm for such a distance), the maximum range of the cartridge is 1 meters.

In the design of the .408 CheyTac cartridge, special attention was paid to thickening and strengthening the case to withstand the high pressure in the chamber. According to the official regulations of the CIP (Commission Internationale Permanente pour l'Epreuve des Armes à Feu Portatives), the .408 Cheyenne Tactical can withstand a maximum pressure of up to 440 MPa. This is a lot for a case made of brass, but still less than combined cases can withstand, so the cartridge has room to develop. In CIP-regulated countries (until 2021), .408 Cheyenne Tactical weapons are proof tested at 550 MPa.


Design of the .408 Cheyenne Tactical cartridge. Dimensions in millimeters.

Most factory-made .408 CheyTac ammunition uses carbide bullets rather than the jacketed lead-cored bullets found in most other rifle bullets. The oldest factory-made .408 CheyTac ammunition uses bullets designed by Warren S. Jensen and originally manufactured by Lost River Ballistic Technologies, which are machined on Swiss-style CNC lathes from solid rods of a proprietary copper-nickel alloy.

One of the noted disadvantages of using solid metal bullets is the heavy contamination of the rifle barrel after firing. Because the bullets are harder and more abrasive than conventional bullet jackets, they are made slightly smaller so that they can be effectively gripped by the rifling edges of the barrel. This inevitably reduces the tightness of the bullet in the barrel, allowing the propellant gases to touch the sides of the projectile, evaporating some of the material and depositing it in the bore.

Other manufacturers such as the Rocky Mountain Bullet Company/Vigilance Rifles, GS Custom Bullets, Lehigh Bullets & Design, Lutz Möller, and TTI Armory have developed lead-cored or full-metal bullets with improved BC.

Not thanks, but in spite of. How our snipers get something other than SVD

Separately from the table, I will give the performance characteristics of the cartridge, which is independently produced for their Lobaev Arms rifles:

• cartridge length 109,4 mm;
• cartridge weight 59,4 g (with a bullet 27,4 g);
• real bullet caliber 10,4 mm;
• bullet weight 27,2–32 g;
• sleeve length 77 mm;
• case weight 23,2 g;
• case neck diameter 11,1 mm;
• sleeve shoulder diameter 15,3 mm;
• liner base diameter 16,2 mm;
• sleeve flange diameter 16,3 mm;
• mass of powder charge 10,32 g;
• muzzle velocity 910–1 m/s;
• bullet energy 11 350 joules.



Bullets manufactured by Lutz Möller. LM-101 | 8,5mm MSG | LM-105 | 408-CT-MSG | 12,7mm MSG.

The Interview


I decided to replace my conclusion with a short interview with a reconnaissance sniper of the special forces of the Airborne Forces with ten years of experience.

– Why do you need a .408 CheyTac caliber?

- This caliber is needed to be out of reach of ordinary shooters, because it is a very accurate caliber that allows you to stay safe. Now, if the enemy spotted a sniper shot, then a lot of artillery flies to the intended location of his location. A large caliber makes it difficult for the enemy to calculate the shooter and adds very valuable time before the return flight.

- Are there any tasks for him in our troops?

- This caliber has one task - to hit the enemy's manpower.

Why .408 CheyTac and not 12,7mm like 50bmg or 12,7x108mm?

– 12,7 mm caliber ammunition is considered anti-materiel and is more suitable for destroying light equipment or shelters than enemy manpower. The .408 CheyTac allows for ambush, cover or sabotage activities. Usually, at long distances from the line of contact, the enemy feels quite relaxed, and the opportunity to hit a chest target is enough to cause significant damage to his activity.

- How much do our specialists need complexes from .338 Lapua Magnum and larger?

- Definitely needed, since the firing range is the survival rate of a specialist, in addition, such calibers have high armor-piercing.

- Do army shooters have similar needs?

– I don’t think that the .408 CheyTac is exactly what army shooters need, but there is definitely a need for the .338 Lapua Magnum. As for special units, the .408 CheyTac should be along with all the other possible calibers that may be needed to complete the task.

- What is the future of such calibers in our troops, and is there a chance to see such complexes under the GRAU index?

– I believe that it is very important to connect private companies to the supply, as competition among them allows new interesting and high-quality goods to appear. Unfortunately, we cannot normally buy rifles from Lobaev Arms or Orsis, as there is a large turnover of personnel in the troops that need to be trained. Train not only fighters, but also those who will command them, since at the moment not all commanders know how to use snipers and sniper units, and also do not understand their value. Therefore, I do not think that the GRAU index is somehow related to this issue, since it is easier to buy a rifle and ammunition directly from the manufacturer.

PS


My interlocutor started a Telegram channel dedicated to high-precision shooting. You can subscribe here. The channel is brand new, which means that the most interesting is yet to come.
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  1. +3
    17 July 2022 05: 34
    Not thanks, but in spite of. How our snipers get something other than SVD
    Ideally, this is how it should be. As long as they don't screw up. The official will never help. "What will Marya Alekseevna say? Who will be to blame?" request Until there is responsibility for what has not been done, there will be no help.
    1. +13
      17 July 2022 05: 55
      Quote: Mavrikiy
      Until there is responsibility for what has not been done, there will be no help.

      Responsibility for some comrades is a principle ... no matter what happens ... it’s better to ban and not let go.
      Because of this, it is difficult for everything new and promising to break through in our country.
      The same drones, small aircraft and much more, for example.
      Lobaev also pierced his famous brainchild with great difficulty.
      1. +17
        17 July 2022 08: 58
        Quote: Lech from Android.
        Lobaev also pierced his famous brainchild with great difficulty.

        Yes, Vladislav pushed around notably. And no one is usually to blame.
        Speaking of means of production - Lobaev does not have a single domestic machine tool in production, Italy, Germany, China and even Brazil. He said this with great regret. hi
        1. +1
          17 July 2022 23: 30
          That there is even, according to rumors, and the metal is not ours ....
        2. -1
          17 July 2022 23: 49
          Speaking of means of production - Lobaev does not have a single domestic machine tool in production, Italy, Germany, China and even Brazil. He said this with great regret.

          Is such precision required? Rigidity of the AIDS system. I would understand if the accuracy of a rifle when shooting in a vacuum and in the air were the same, but a gust of wind or a target moving at a distance of even about a kilometer is enough and all the pseudo-necessary accuracy flies into a ram. Somehow I was at the defense of my diploma, there was a special question of a 12-jaw chuck for processing the ZIL-130 brake baoaban instead of the standard 3-jaw chuck, the graduate spoke beautifully about improving the accuracy of the friction surface, and then the chief engineer of ZiL says, why such accuracy, a couple of good decelerations are enough and this difference of a few microns disappears ... the head of this graduate student shrunk and blushed, he was already looking forward to how he would defend his candidate's thesis with the same topic in a week. Accuracy for the sake of unnecessary accuracy ... The graduation project received a mark of "three".
          1. -1
            18 July 2022 15: 55
            That's why readers (who are not writers) downvote this post. A person, thinking, asks absolutely fair, correct questions. Even if, due to the specificity of the issue, something seems obvious to great experts and the questions of the "amateur" are strange, so explain. Moreover, this is a platform not only for snipers and gunsmiths, but for everyone who is interested and who empathizes.
            There are no bad questions, there is an inability to explain. If you can't explain, don't downvote.
        3. +4
          18 July 2022 07: 59
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          Lobaev does not have a single domestic machine in production

          Do we manufacture metalworking machines? - I'm not talking about "glued nameplates" on someone else's products
      2. +5
        17 July 2022 18: 45
        So half of the officials sold themselves to the enemy, and the second sympathizes with those who have sold out and sabotages the necessary decisions!
    2. -2
      17 July 2022 08: 13
      And what about the official? We are talking about rifles, cartridges, etc. What do you understand about long range shooting? I'm fine, but you're smart with us, you know everything, but not about the shot, but about the official. My limit is 300 meters, that's all, then I frankly smear.
  2. KCA
    0
    17 July 2022 05: 44
    Yes, business, we are developing a new cartridge, building a plant, or at least a new line at the plant, developing a rifle, setting up production, well, in 15 years we will meet, if someone throws money. Well, it’s faster with a rifle, but will we buy cartridges from NATO?
    1. +32
      17 July 2022 05: 58
      In China, they call a billionaire and explain that he became rich thanks to the COUNTRY, that money MUST be invested in his country and they recommend building a plant that the country NEEDED. And the rich man will get a new plant and income, and the state closes its problems! And ours only steal money and hide it behind a hillock, and the money works for our enemies!
      1. -12
        17 July 2022 07: 56
        Quote: maiman61
        And the rich man will get a new plant and income, and the state closes its problems!

        Now turn your head on - at least for a minute - and figure out:
        1) WHAT nafig income can be received in production PIECE (!!!) production???
        2) who will pay for piece production - salaries of engineers / workers, etc.?
        3) how much will the Chinese billionaire give to a responsible comrade - so that NOT to build such a plant?
        1. +14
          17 July 2022 08: 50
          What makes you think that piece goods are not profitable, piece Swiss watches are very profitable, piece cars are profitable and handmade weapons are also profitable. A handmade bullet that flies very accurately is also beneficial for both the hunter and the sniper, even if it is 10 times more expensive, because if you didn’t hit the first time, the target will not wait for another shot at it.
          1. 0
            17 July 2022 11: 55
            Quote: Pivot
            profitable piece cars

            To whom are they beneficial? Take the Lamborghini, for example. The company was founded by a tractor manufacturer, sold after 9 years, after which it periodically went bankrupt and changed owners. Now it belongs to Audi, which also does not earn money from supercars ...
            Quote: Pivot
            A handmade bullet that flies very accurately is also beneficial for the hunter

            This is what made me smile. For a hunter, even ordinary cartridges are not profitable, since the cost of spent ammunition is more expensive, say, shot ducks)))
            1. +1
              17 July 2022 12: 04
              Let's take Ferrari or Aston Martin for example. If Lamborghini was sold to Volkswagen, on the contrary, it’s good, by the way, I was on an excursion both at the Lambo factory and at the museum. Lambo still makes custom cars and Lambo is now a profitable business. Under Ferruccio, Lamborghini was unprofitable due to the unreasonable ambitions of the founder, he did his best to prove to Enzo Ferrari that he had made a mistake by not hiring the young Ferruccio Lamborghini, instead of developing production.
              1. +1
                17 July 2022 12: 16
                Only Lambo's operating profit is publicly available, that is, before taxes and interest. But, in general, I am not a financial specialist and I judge by indirect indicators - when an enterprise periodically changes owners ... it means that this is not such a tasty morsel ...
                PS. Happy for you that you were in Italy good
        2. The comment was deleted.
          1. +4
            17 July 2022 12: 03
            You don't seem to have anything to include.
            1. Manufacturers of exclusive rifles do not earn from them, but from mass production.
            2. See point 1! Hee hee hee.
            3. And somehow these "giver" are not translated in any way))) And those who wish are not translated, because you cannot keep honey in your mouth and not try it ... Yes
          2. +5
            17 July 2022 15: 53
            Quote: maiman61
            . "Givers" in China are shot by THOUSANDS every year! And I don't think there are many who want to get shot in the back of the head.

            I understand that there is nothing to include ..
            First write that they are shooting THOUSAND and immediately write about absence wishing.
            Clinic...
            When there are NO willing ones, the number of executions is zero. And strictly vice versa - if they are shot by the thousands, then those who want to take a bribe - in wagons. Spitting on the execution ...

            And then the "heavy cavalry" pulled up ....

            Quote: Ingvar 72
            For piece today mass tomorrow. And the piece is not always unprofitable. Especially in the topic of weapons development.

            Bulk?!! Oh well..
            Lobaevsky "Twilight" 2 years ago, according to his website, cost 1 rubles, "Tiger" (nee SVD) cost 700.
            Calculate on the calculator - how much it will cost to give at least 1 shooter to the "Dusk" regiment.
            About 1 sniper per platoon, like with SVD, we are not even talking

            Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
            They could immediately write that they are a supporter of a resource-based economy and not fool people.
            - I am a supporter of a balanced approach, and not "Let's build a factory that produces 100 rifles a year and 5 cartridges for them" !!!!!

            Z.Y.
            Quote: Pivot
            What makes you think that piece goods are not profitable, piece Swiss watches are very profitable, piece cars are profitable and handmade weapons are also profitable.
            - of course profitable! For there will always be pontorez- ready to give a lot of money for things - which are 99% show-offs
            1. The comment was deleted.
        3. +9
          17 July 2022 09: 03
          Quote: your1970

          Now turn your head on - at least for a minute - and figure out:

          You need to turn it on before yelling.
          For piece today mass tomorrow. And the piece is not always unprofitable. Especially in the topic of weapons development.
          And in China there is tacit support for promising areas. From the point of view of public interest, anything is better than investing in US Treasuries, or sporting events that have no analogues in the world in terms of value.
        4. +2
          17 July 2022 13: 09
          Quote: your1970
          Now turn on your head

          They could immediately write that they are a supporter of a resource-based economy and not fool people.
        5. +1
          17 July 2022 15: 56
          Googled the price of the sniper complex and what it includes, for example, for the US kms.
        6. Urs
          +9
          17 July 2022 17: 45
          Complete nonsense. Mr. Lobaev is far from a poor man, well, you can’t call him rich either.
          And just piece goods of the author's execution and do not require a large crowd of people. What you have in paragraph 2, this refers to small wholesale and mass production.
          And yes, to our pride, Lobaev, as a company, did not sell out to anyone, and maybe that's why they are not rich. Adherence to the principle of sufficient necessity helps any businessman to remain a person and a creative person.
          And about super-class rifles, to which I attribute the Lobaev brand, this is to some extent a work of art, author's piece copies. This is not for the troops, it is for specialists and very specific ones.
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      2. -1
        17 July 2022 19: 04
        So that was the calculation in 1991. Then the Americans played competently with this slicker Yeltsin. Since then we've been digging.
    2. +3
      17 July 2022 08: 27
      Well, LapuMagnum is already being produced, like rifles for it, the same SV-98-338 or SHF-338, in fact you need to transfer snipers to 338 caliber + in each sniper company to have a department with 408 caliber, well, you also need to take the appropriate optics ..And lower the SVD to the level of the department, where, in principle, it has a place with Hyperon on board
      1. -2
        17 July 2022 20: 46
        Gold words.
      2. 0
        7 October 2022 15: 11
        SVD can be given to senior shooters for "suppress-shoot" tactics, when the shooter / shooters suppress the enemy with fire, and the senior shooter destroys manpower with accurate shots. Although this tactic is only applicable in cities.
    3. +2
      17 July 2022 12: 12
      What for? We have Lobaev and Weapon Systems, they have produced excellent rifles in a few years, which neither ZID nor Kalashnikov could produce. It’s the same for sniper ammunition, a businessman who loves his job will come and will produce high-precision ammunition of the required caliber, and not a single state-owned plant will produce such ammunition, they simply are not interested, the volumes are not the same. There simply piece production is unprofitable.
      1. +1
        18 July 2022 08: 08
        Quote: Pivot
        a businessman who loves his job will come and will produce precision-guided ammunition of the required caliber,


        where will it come?
        machines - no, metal - the same problem,
        ammo? - so our factories have equipment from the Khrushchev era ...
        on what and what to produce???
        look back - china and he delivers with caution
        1. 0
          18 July 2022 09: 20
          For metal, it’s just not necessary, we have weapons alloys at a very high level. You will look at the equipment of the Weapon Systems and Lobaev, then you can talk about the machines. I’m just a metalworker, our main problem is not machine tools, but tools that do not change in time in large industries and this causes distortion of the bore.
          1. 0
            18 July 2022 19: 22
            The alloy still needs to be processed.
            Lobaev has all imported machines, there are no similar quality of his own now.
            Are barrels made by cold forging at the large enterprises mentioned?
            1. 0
              18 July 2022 19: 29
              I'm talking about cutting the bore, and about the processing of the bolt group, this is the most important thing. But accuracy is also important for other components and elements of the rifle. I don't want to spread demagoguery. But I will say one thing, high-precision rifles are definitely not assembly line production. Here, the issues of optics have not been touched upon, because. the price of good optics is equal to the price of a rifle, and if it is a teplok, then the price is much higher than rifles, but with this we have a lag.
      2. 0
        19 July 2022 15: 47
        well, because, for example, he will not be able to provide a large number of products and ammunition
        1. 0
          19 July 2022 16: 11
          Ammunition for high-precision rifles is needed many times less than for a machine gun.
          1. 0
            20 July 2022 14: 56
            here the question still remains the same ... how much production does he have? Yes, and there is a suspicion that his production is 99% of imported components and as soon as he receives a contract from the state, it immediately turns out that he is under sanctions and will not be able to perform. .Yes, and if we say to take a minimum of minimums, let's say 1 rifles for which you will need 000 rounds per year to maintain an understanding of which side the rifle shoots, this is already 500 rounds per year, without taking into account the need to have ammunition ... can the same Lobaev to provide such an amount of ammunition?
            1. 0
              20 July 2022 15: 30
              These rifles are not given to conscripts, their users have an understanding. I’m interested in you citing a bunch of facts so as not to do it, I’ll say, on the contrary, for something to start with, otherwise if you don’t start something, there will be no result.
              1. 0
                22 July 2022 12: 57
                captain obvious? Remind me how many regiments and brigades are in the Russian armed forces? How many special forces? And how many similar structures are in the FSVNG? I cited a bunch of facts that a small private office that makes exclusive products will not be able to meet the needs of the army and security forces in due to their lack of necessary capacities, about what needs to be done, I already wrote, there are already options for microwave-338 and sv-98-338, like domestic chamber chambers, they produce 338 already, and an order is needed for them
    4. 0
      17 July 2022 15: 22
      Will we buy ammunition from NATO?

      For the sake of objectivity: by analogy - and from whom to buy 9x19 Luger cartridges? They are produced in Russia. It is also possible with .406.
      Lobaev can cover the supply of machine tools request
      But for a small workshop, it is possible to deliver a dozen by roundabout paths.
      1. +1
        18 July 2022 12: 21
        Furthermore. The West on a pro scale buys a capsule from us ... For making them is difficult and not cheap
  3. +5
    17 July 2022 05: 49
    Unfortunately, we cannot normally buy rifles from Lobaev Arms or Orsis, as there is a large turnover of personnel in the troops that need to be trained.

    The author of this advertising booklet suggests arming conscripts with "rifles from Lobaev Arms or Orsis"?
    Because professional contract snipers are unlikely to have a "high turnover of personnel." It's a very specific profession.
    1. +25
      17 July 2022 06: 48
      No conscripts will be armed with them, now they are not even taught to shoot properly from a Kalashnikov, once or twice in a year of service. Conscripts in the army of the Russian Federation now play the role of such ,, hivi ,, no one spends either time or money (ammunition) on their training, an example of this is my two sons who have served their term, as well as the sons of my friends who also served a year. This threat to the NATO bloc, which has served for a year, needs to be taught from scratch.
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. +3
          17 July 2022 15: 49
          Quote: Nafanya from the couch
          Although advertising tends to exaggerate and deceive

          Quite right. And as for Vladislav Lobaev's company specifically, it is "on the rights of VERY advertising." I won’t touch on the technique, although I could put my 5 kopecks in spite of those who consider the only indicator of the need for the presence of this rifle in the weapon system to be only and exclusively its declared “sub-minute” at 2200 m. Let loud statements remain on the conscience of Vladislav and his advertising agents. But the moment of supply, support and maintenance is not taken into account at all, and this is wrong.
      2. +7
        17 July 2022 07: 59
        Putting such a tool into the hands of a conscript is like putting you at the helm of a formula 1 ballid. Maybe you will start off the meta, but you can’t drive for sure. They are born as a sniper and hone their skills for a very long time. So no one will really give such a tool to conscripts, so just hold it so that they know what it is.
        1. +17
          17 July 2022 08: 12
          Sergey Konavalov 2-put 1 people in turn at the simulator of a Formula 10 car, and five of them will be able to pass the track normally after a few training sessions, at least a couple of laps. People need to be able to select and cook, this is an axiom. In this process, the participation of the state should be mandatory and priority.
          1. 0
            6 October 2022 22: 43
            That's it!
            Just make shooting from a standing rifle a compulsory discipline at school so that the shooting category is in the certificate. And immediately there will be a choice of whom to train snipers from.
            Another thing would be to shove the change for rights B and C into a regular school, and also not give a certificate if you did not pass on the rights. ;)
        2. +7
          17 July 2022 15: 52
          Quote: Sergey Konovalov_2
          They are born as a sniper and hone their skills for a very long time.

          No need to stoop to myths. Snipers BECOMING as a result of thoughtful and painstaking, mostly independent, after reaching a certain high level, work. In general, the most stubborn and competent become good snipers.
          1. +1
            18 July 2022 12: 25
            It all starts (started in the USSR) in a shooting circle at school. Where in the personal file was a tick in the column focused on the VUS. And then the DOSAF school, competitions. Discharge for shooting from small things. In the army, you no longer had a chance ... SVD and that's it.
      3. +4
        17 July 2022 17: 19
        No conscripts will be armed with them, now they are not even taught to shoot properly from a Kalashnikov, once or twice in a year of service.

        You are absolutely right, my son's military service proceeded in exactly the same way. For some reason, many of the commentators here conclude that two years of the term must be returned. And what's the point? Well, they will hold the machine in their hands not once or twice during the entire service life, but two or four. Will the NATO bloc then end? If you teach military affairs, then a lot can be done in a year, but if you imitate training, as is happening everywhere now, including in military universities, then two, and five, and ten years will not be enough.
        1. -3
          17 July 2022 20: 45
          Strangely, I served 12 months, but in the second half I had to walk to the shooting range almost every week.
          1. 0
            17 July 2022 23: 36
            Eeee ..... And then how lucky))) Even in the union they shot twice a week. And a lot of friends who saw a machine gun one and a half times during their service. Moreover, many of them served not quite in the Navy. wink
            1. -5
              18 July 2022 08: 44
              Well, disassembly and assembly with cleaning between them almost every day.
              1. 0
                24 July 2022 14: 31
                It's different wink As you understand feel
      4. +1
        18 July 2022 13: 10
        Conscripts now are free laborers, without rights under the Labor Code of the Russian Federation, since the order cannot be violated and there is no schedule as such. All annual training related to military affairs on an urgent basis can be compressed to a maximum of 3 months or even less, depending on the unit and officers.
    2. +1
      17 July 2022 18: 17
      [/ quote] The author of this advertising booklet suggests arming conscripts with "rifles from Lobaev Arms or Orsis"? [quote]
      If you carefully read the article, you would understand that the author is not stupider than you in this matter and to joke here, as it were .... -
      - Do army shooters have similar needs?

      [/b] – I don’t think that the army shooters need the .408 CheyTac, but there is definitely a need for the .338 Lapua Magnum. As for special units, the .408 CheyTac should be along with all the other possible calibers that may be needed to complete the task.[b]
  4. +2
    17 July 2022 05: 55
    We will support domestic traditions and order weapons in line 4 caliber, as "our answer to Chamberlain."
  5. +5
    17 July 2022 06: 04
    10,36x77mm has been produced since 2013. It was developed by Dr. John D. Taylor and machinist William O. Wordman for shooting at a distance of 2 meters. as a competitor chambered in .338 Lapua Magnum and .50 BMG. Claimed accuracy at 2 meters is 200 MOA

    And where is his competitor?
    Accuracy is twice as bad as .338LM (0,5 MOA) and much less energy than .50 BMG.
    A failed cartridge, which is now being replaced by a 10x100 BWA with a more aerodynamic high energy bullet.

    It is clear that Lobaev wants advertising, but with this Chey-Tak, he obviously screwed up.
    1. +4
      17 July 2022 11: 06
      Quote: Genry
      Accuracy is twice as bad as that of .338LM (0,5 MOA)

      You are a little disingenuous, the .338LM cartridge provides 0,5 MOA at a distance of 1000m, and when shooting at long range, the dispersion begins to grow far from linearly. Therefore, it is far from a fact that at 2000m Lapua has 0,5 MOA.
      Look at the dispersion from the SVD, for example, after 600m it begins to increase far from linear: 100m - 1,66MOA, 500m - 1,86MOA, 1000m - 2,86MOA

      All this will fully apply to the Lapua cartridge, having a "hospital average" of 0,3-0,35 MOA at 300m (this is data from the shooting range) will not work to have 0,5MOA at 2000m. But the .408 CheyTac really brings 2-6 bullets out of 7 into a 10cm circle for 60km.
      1. 0
        17 July 2022 13: 58
        Quote: BORMAN82
        But the .408 CheyTac really brings 2-6 bullets out of 7 into a 10cm circle for 60km.

        With such hit probabilities, if the immobility of the target and the stability of the air shift are necessary, firing at a chest or walking growth target no longer makes practical sense. And this, when using "golden" bullets from a thermostable material and individual manufacture, when compared with mass jacketed bullets.
      2. 0
        17 July 2022 21: 18
        Borman, you can see in the subject. Answer, if not difficult, an amateur. Here we have the pop caliber 12.7. As I understand it, a massive cartridge is not suitable for high-precision shooting due to the spread of geometry, the instability of the hinge.
        But what prevents you from doing a small part on high-precision machines, using high-quality gunpowder and making high-quality barrels. Will it really be much worse than these lapua magnums and chitaks?
        1. +5
          17 July 2022 22: 33
          About "you can see in the subject") you flatter me, but I'll try to answer your question.
          The 12.7mm caliber itself is not pop, just the characteristics of the bullet (bullet weight, internal volume of the bullet to ensure the placement of an explosive, incendiary charge, its muzzle velocity) are optimized for the requirements for a heavy machine gun, which makes the weapon chambered for this cartridge quite heavy (it is necessary to provide acceptable for the shooter, the recoil characteristics and vibrations of the weapon when firing) For a sniper rifle, the requirements are slightly different - the flatness of the bullet flight path and reduced wind drift are higher, all this is ensured by a high initial speed and the use of bullets with a high transverse load (the ratio of weight to the cross section of the bullet - look what modern bullets have become long) Therefore, it is more effective to choose a reduced cartridge caliber, with a relatively heavy bullet (for its caliber) + high initial speed. This allows you to get good external ballistic characteristics and at the same time keep the weight of the weapon at an acceptable level. Therefore, it turns out that it is easier to make a specialized sniper cartridge than to "finish" a cartridge from a heavy machine gun.
        2. 0
          18 July 2022 05: 36
          We have PSVK and ASVK of 12,7 mm caliber, Pokrovskaya and army large-caliber sniper rifles and various cartridges for them.
    2. +4
      17 July 2022 17: 02
      as a competitor to the .338 Lapua Magnum and .50 BMG cartridges
      The CheyTac was designed to get around California's .50 or larger gun ban. I read somewhere.
  6. +1
    17 July 2022 06: 20
    Quote: maiman61
    In China, they call a billionaire and explain that he became rich thanks to the COUNTRY, that money MUST be invested in his country and they recommend building a plant that the country NEEDED. And the rich man will get a new plant and income, and the state closes its problems! And ours only steal money and hide it behind a hillock, and the money works for our enemies!

    Well, as always, take and share.
    Nothing new life teaches you.
  7. +4
    17 July 2022 06: 39
    Hiden advertisment?
    Buy only from Lobaev...
    If about SVO, then shooting for a kilometer or more is rarely used, since there is practically no direct line of sight at such a distance. The fact that many commanders do not understand, in the words of the author of the article, is the author, and not an imaginary incognito sniper:

    since at the moment not all commanders know how to use snipers and sniper units, and also do not understand their value.


    Commanders need sniper weapons in units to perform more mundane tasks - suppressing the most effective enemy fire, machine gunners, ATGM crews ... and not ghostly single targets kilometers from the unit. It is important for commanders to use snipers in combat. And here they offer a rifle for hundreds of thousands of rubles and cartridges for a thousand.
    It would be better for them to use RPK-74 machine guns with optics for grassroots units, or even better new RPK-16. The accuracy of the RPK at distances up to 500 meters when firing single shots is higher than that of the SVD. A thick barrel and a bullet speed of 960 m / s when exiting the barrel give such an advantage.
    1. +1
      17 July 2022 22: 36
      Quote: Konnick
      offer a rifle for hundreds of thousands of rubles and cartridges for a thousand.

      Rifle Yu offer a little more expensive than 1 million rubles. And the cartridge had a cost of 3 tr / piece. back in December 2020.
      1. -3
        17 July 2022 23: 24
        Rifle Yu offer a little more expensive than 1 million rubles. And the cartridge had a cost of 3 tr / piece. back in December 2020.

        And if you break or lose, then the mustache ... wow price tags, are they made of gold?
      2. +1
        18 July 2022 08: 25
        Quote: Ingenegr
        Rifle Yu offer a little more expensive than 1 million rubles. And the cartridge had a cost of 3 tr / piece. back in December 2020.


        And when you buy sausage in a supermarket, do you think about the final margin or its initial cost? - no, you just go and buy, but the fact that the supermarket has an average markup on sausages of 100% - does it bother you? - No
        And it's mass production...
        1. 0
          18 July 2022 14: 05
          Quote: Dedok
          And when you buy sausage in a supermarket, do you think about the final margin or its initial cost?

          Such a comparison is completely inappropriate. By the way, with this analogy, the "sausage" will most likely be cartridges. So, if necessary, daily, say, consume 300 g of sausage, and there is a choice of two varieties at a price of 400 r / kg and 4000 r / kg, the final choice is far from obvious - it entirely depends on the solvency of a particular buyer.
          Once again: the .408CT cartridge from Lobaev Arms in December 2020 cost 3000 rubles / piece, while the cost of the 12.7-mm 7N34 sniper cartridge was less than 200 rubles / piece. The cost of the SVLK-14S for private buyers today is more than 3 million rubles, while the 6V7M rifle costs the treasury a little more than 1 million rubles.
    2. 0
      21 July 2022 07: 50
      If about SVO, then shooting for a kilometer or more is rarely used, since there is practically no direct line of sight at such a distance. The fact that many commanders do not understand, in the words of the author of the article, is the author, and not an imaginary incognito sniper:


      Here is the confirmation from 21.07.22/XNUMX/XNUMX of the use of "Twilight" from "TASS"

      “Russian special forces in the zone of the military operation in Ukraine for the first time began to use the SVLK-14S ultra-long-range rifle. In particular, it was used by snipers near Kharkov and Kyiv, but rarely enough, since the terrain was not always suitable for its normal operation over long distances ", — said the source of the agency.
      According to him, the advantage of the "Twilight" is a combination of powerful cartridges, large caliber and high accuracy of shooting at ultra-long distances.

      “However, it is quite heavy, comparable in weight to the ASVK (Russian army large-caliber sniper rifle, created in 2004 - TASS note), and also for it [the rifle] is quite expensive cartridges, and it is difficult to get them, especially in combat conditions ”, he added.
  8. The comment was deleted.
  9. 0
    17 July 2022 07: 07
    As far as I know, under Serdyukov, we bought a lot of imported sniper rifles, like in Austria, Great Britain, Finland ... I read about it somewhere and showed it on TV
    1. +2
      18 July 2022 08: 27
      for this - thanks to him: many saw the difference between mass and small-scale production - once; as well as the use of modern metalworking machines - two.
  10. 0
    17 July 2022 07: 08
    I also think that for street fighting it is necessary to train a lot of snipers, a lot and more ATGM operators
    1. -1
      17 July 2022 10: 27
      In the city, it is better to be able to throw something explosive out the window, like MDZ bullets, and even better a grenade from a grenade launcher or an AGS. In order not to look closely, a sniper sits there or a grenade launcher. And everything in between up to 12,7 mm will be inseparable, and therefore does not give any special advantages.
  11. +7
    17 July 2022 07: 09
    Writes things necessary, but there are nuances. Specifically, Lobaev did not pull the quality of the rifle in the series, this is not his first entry into the market. About 6-8 years ago, very good things were written about his rifles on the Hansa. We'll see, but such PR is a little annoying.
  12. -3
    17 July 2022 07: 22
    I decided to replace my conclusion with a short interview with a reconnaissance sniper of the special forces of the Airborne Forces with ten years of experience.

    – Why do you need a .408 CheyTac caliber?

    I want to ask, how is it possible to jump with a parachute with such a gun, like Twilight? They won’t jump with a PC machine gun, and even with such a club ... or is that all for a red word ... Airborne ... special forces ... scout ... in general, a ninja
    1. +3
      17 July 2022 11: 27
      The PK machine gun is disassembled and placed in the GK-30, which is attached to the parachute suspension system, and for clubs like this one in the Airborne Forces and Special Forces there is such garbage - PDMM is called.
      1. -4
        17 July 2022 11: 46
        there is such garbage - PDMM is called.

        Which was used back in the 42nd near Vyazma?
        1. +4
          17 July 2022 11: 55
          Yes, they are still in use.
      2. -5
        18 July 2022 10: 20
        For example, these funny guys offered to throw a high-precision rifle from a height of several meters. Demanding that she then shoot!

        This is from Lobaev's telegram channel. And you want to say that you can skydive with such a karamultuk. Such an accurate rifle needs a special case like a Stradivarius violin. The game is not worth the candle.
  13. 0
    17 July 2022 07: 32
    Quote: Architect
    Quote: maiman61
    In China, they call a billionaire and explain that he became rich thanks to the COUNTRY, that money MUST be invested in his country and they recommend building a plant that the country NEEDED. And the rich man will get a new plant and income, and the state closes its problems! And ours only steal money and hide it behind a hillock, and the money works for our enemies!

    Well, as always, take and share.
    Nothing new life teaches you.

    Life teaches ... the first one who did this, to take away and divide, is Chubais, took from everyone and distributed to everyone a piece of paper. And what the liberals came up with about the socialist revolution, they then took away, yes, but they didn’t divide it, but gathered it into a single mechanism that made it possible to win the war and send a man into space.
    1. +3
      17 July 2022 08: 03
      Quote: Konnick
      what the liberals came up with about the socialist revolution, then they took it away, yes, but they didn’t divide it, but gathered it into a single mechanism,

      And they put an official at the head - who doesn’t care about the result, the main thing is to slightly overfulfill the plan ...
      1. -1
        17 July 2022 13: 16
        Quote: your1970
        And they put an official at the head - who doesn’t care about the result, the main thing is to slightly overfulfill the plan ...

        Who is to blame for the fact that yesterday's peasants, instead of thoughtfully reading what the classics of obscurantism wrote and controlling the work of an official, lived for all 70 years according to the principle "my hut is on the edge and the authorities know better"?
    2. 0
      17 July 2022 08: 33
      It was then that in 1985 all the achievements since 1913 were compared ...
  14. +1
    17 July 2022 10: 07
    Quote: Architect
    Well, as always, take and share.
    Nothing new life teaches you.
    Reply

    Yeah ... in the USA, the State Department summoned a well-known comrade of the owner of one social network you know to a party meeting and said this menacingly to him ... if you don’t work in the interests of the United States, then you won’t work at all ... the comrade understood everything and did what he ordered in Congress.
    Guess with three letters what it is about ... smile the Chinese only take an example from their older comrades in the United States.
  15. 0
    17 July 2022 10: 09
    Arsenal of the last century. The most important thing is the sniper's head, which should be located at a safe distance from the aiming line.
  16. -1
    17 July 2022 10: 23
    Quote: maiman61
    In China, they call a billionaire and explain that he became rich thanks to the COUNTRY, that money MUST be invested in his country and they recommend building a plant that the country NEEDED.

    In Russia, everything is exactly the opposite. Privatization of profits, nationalization of costs.
  17. -3
    17 July 2022 10: 51
    Why warn the enemy, especially the enemy?
  18. 0
    17 July 2022 10: 53
    No offense, but sniper weapon sufferers are like Mormon preachers in their stubbornness and belief that only they know the truth.

    How many enemy soldiers were destroyed by snipers during the NWO? Half a percent, and probably even less. And to resist, to invest scientific, technical and human potential so that instead of 0.32% it becomes 0.33%, my IMHO does not make sense, as long as there are places where investments will give a much greater effect.
    The Russian Federation has a lot of problems with communications, with UAVs, with real-time target designation.
    Well, yes, an article about Lobaev. How do the Russian troops suffer without it.
    1. +1
      17 July 2022 11: 55
      Yes, an article about Lobaev and about .408 caliber.
      The caliber is good, but not the only one in this niche. Therefore, this article is both an advertisement and an introduction to such phenomena as the above-mentioned caliber and manufacturer for those who did not know about it yet.
      According to the recognition of many snipers, a semi-automatic device under normal rifle patronage covers 90% of the tasks of the battlefield and SVD in capable hands ensures the fulfillment of all these tasks. It would be upgraded a little for the convenience of work and that's it.
      How many German army soldiers were destroyed by Soviet snipers? There was a MASS training of snipers and just well-aimed shooters, and this brought results. And it is necessary to saturate the troops with optics, and not wave their hands, why is this necessary.
      1. +2
        17 July 2022 18: 04
        Quote: Izotovp
        According to the recognition of many snipers, a semi-automatic device under normal rifle patronage covers 90% of the tasks of the battlefield and SVD in capable hands ensures the fulfillment of all these tasks.

        Were they really snipers? Not arrows? wink
        The main problem of all discussions around snipers and sniper weapons is a banal misunderstanding. Unfortunately, we still do not have a clear division between the two main groups of "shooters with optics" - sharpshooters and snipers. All of them are lumped together and called snipers. As a result, we either want to equip shooters with LM bolters, or they consider the rifle of the SVD shooter "sniper". smile
        The tasks of the battlefield are solved by a well-aimed shooter, who is part of a squad or platoon and destroys targets outside the effective range of machine gun fire. Its operating ranges are up to 800-1000 m, targets are group weapons crews, commanders, weapons are semi-automatic with optics. In short, "a man with an oar."
        Snipers are included in separate units, divisional or army subordination. Their task is to work on piece targets (highest command staff + valuable equipment), working ranges - from a kilometer, weapons - bolt action.
        1. -1
          17 July 2022 18: 32
          Unfortunately, we still do not have a clear division between the two main groups of "shooters with optics" - sharpshooters and snipers. All of them are lumped together and called snipers.
          It's all James Fenimore Cooper's fault.
        2. -1
          17 July 2022 19: 35
          We have no concept of a sharp shooter. We have a sniper armed with a self-loading rifle. It is attached to the squad and operates in the band of the entire squad / platoon on important targets. And there are separate sniper units armed with various sniper weapons. And they solve problems in the interests of a company, battalion, etc. Do not confuse the sporting accuracy of fire and the accuracy presented by the Ministry of Defense to various small arms. Including machine guns and pistols. There are completely different criteria and the probability of hitting a target at a certain distance with the first, second shot plays a role ... and so on. So don't overdo it.
          1. -1
            18 July 2022 15: 51
            Quote: Izotovp
            We have no concept of a sharp shooter. We have a sniper armed with a self-loading rifle. It is attached to the squad and operates in the band of the entire squad / platoon on important targets. And there are separate sniper units armed with various sniper weapons. And they solve problems in the interests of a company, battalion, etc.

            This is the problem: a detached sniper and a sniper of a separate unit are two completely different classes, with different requirements for training and weapons. And in our country, because of the same name, they are constantly confused, attributing to one the properties of others.
            It's like uniting orderlies and surgeons, calling them the common word "medic". smile
    2. 0
      18 July 2022 08: 31
      Quote: demiurg
      The Russian Federation has a lot of problems with communications, with UAVs, with real-time target designation.


      there are many problems, but this is one of the problems since the Chechen war, it was never considered a problem, but it should have been ...
  19. 0
    17 July 2022 11: 39
    Powerful rifles. But such requires the training of "piece" specialists. And such training cannot but be secret. Therefore, public discussions of the elements of the preparation and use of such weapons and specialists are classified as OBS. TTX weapons - only from public sources. And that's it.
  20. +3
    17 July 2022 11: 47
    Quote: maiman61
    In China, they call a billionaire and explain that he became rich thanks to the COUNTRY, that money MUST be invested in his country and they recommend building a plant that the country NEEDED. And the rich man will get a new plant and income, and the state closes its problems! And ours only steal money and hide it behind a hillock, and the money works for our enemies!

    How easy it is for you all!))) I heard from such people back in the early 80s that the Japanese have TVs hanging on the wall, and they don’t become an engineer unless some kind of innovation is invented! In general, another irresponsible nonsense is here for the badge!
  21. +2
    17 July 2022 11: 50
    Actually, SVD, a "front line" sniper rifle, i.e. weapons of the motorized rifle squad, the "long arm" of the infantry. And everything they write about here is rather a special sniper weapon, a different level and class.
    1. +2
      17 July 2022 18: 08
      Quote from: Infantrefir
      Actually, SVD, a "front line" sniper rifle, i.e. weapons of the motorized rifle squad, the "long arm" of the infantry

      More precisely, the shooter's rifle is DMR, in a bourgeois way. And it is not used by a sniper, but by a well-aimed marksman - Designated marksman.
      1. 0
        20 August 2022 09: 45
        SVDs are used by everyone from snipers to motorized rifle units. To the special forces of the GRU and the FSB. This is an excellent rifle, but it is not suitable for long-range shooting, but such tasks are quite rare. Spetsnaz usually operates in the mountains, in greenery, in the city - there are usually no such distances there.
  22. +1
    17 July 2022 11: 59
    Thanks for the good informative article. This topic is currently in the focus of attention and training of young snipers. Such a frame is generally scary to imagine. Thanks for the good article. am
  23. -1
    17 July 2022 12: 20
    Do you need an anti-sniper rifle? Need . What is needed for that . TTZ manufacturers for the cartridge and the product itself. What else ? Funding. And then money for the purchase of cartridges and products. And it all comes down to funding. At the top they think that this should happen on a voluntary basis, forgetting that since 1991 they have been living under capitalism, there is no money, there is no work.
    1. +1
      17 July 2022 17: 34
      If the sniper's position is revealed, then there are many methods other than another sniper to eliminate him. So it’s more logical to invest money not in “one-piece” super snipers with super-expensive rifles, which are still not enough for the entire theater of operations, but to create a system for constant monitoring of the battlefield, secure communications, and real-time target designation. If all this happens, then one conventional battery of guns will solve the problem of enemy snipers on several tens of kilometers of the front, while putting several dozen super snipers in ambushes, and even ensuring their timely change, will not be enough. Yes, and they will cover them quickly, already enemy artillery, if the enemy has all of the above listed by me.
      1. -5
        17 July 2022 23: 34
        If the sniper's position is revealed,

        Single sniper or pair easily, UAV with thermal imager. But it is difficult to calculate the sniper operating in the unit. It was in the cinema that Berenger disguised himself so that he was not visible at 5 meters, but in real life everything is different.
    2. +4
      17 July 2022 18: 17
      Quote: Alexander Ivanov
      Do you need an anti-sniper rifle? Need .

      What for? We need a sniper detection system. Or trained observers capable of detecting possible sniper positions and giving target designation.
      And there are even means of destroying snipers in exposed positions even at the MSO level. Two pieces for those who are on the BMP-2, and three pieces for those who are on the BMP-3.

      The main problem in fighting snipers is finding where they are shooting from. And then - "the number of the house is enough." smile
  24. -2
    17 July 2022 18: 09
    Why you need .408 CheyTac
    To be honest, I don’t understand at all why shooting from a rifle for two kilometers is needed. For a hired killer, this can be convenient. You can probably figure out how to use this opportunity for special forces. Accurate shooting is useful for the police, although not at such a range. But in combined arms combat? Any target worthy of a rare highly qualified specialist with a unique and expensive tool can be destroyed with the same success by a banal heavy machine gun, an automatic gun of an armored personnel carrier or infantry fighting vehicle, a guided anti-tank missile or a shot from a tank. All this is in any unit, while it shoots farther and much more efficiently.
    Perhaps this is the reason why we do not particularly develop this topic. Unlike the Americans, who are historically obsessed with the concept of "one shot - one kill."
    1. 0
      18 July 2022 08: 35
      Quote from: nik-mazur
      To be honest, I don’t understand at all why shooting from a rifle for two kilometers is needed.


      open the geographic map of the NWO - and you will see that now the confrontation is not taking place in the steppe, flat as a table ...
      that's where it is needed, it is psychologically annoying no less than shelling
      1. -3
        18 July 2022 19: 45
        Quote: Dedok
        ... psychologically annoying no less than shelling ...
        For several years to train a unique specialist, give him weapons at the price of half an armored personnel carrier, arrange for the supply of rare ammunition and send him to the steppe in order to psychologically strain the enemy? It's a little too luxurious, isn't it? Especially if a stray projectile from a howitzer flies over all this wealth from the other side. Despite the fact that harassing fire from a machine gun, AGS or artillery is much simpler and cheaper, but it strains and invigorates no less than single shots of super shooters.
    2. 0
      20 August 2022 09: 39
      Yes, that's exactly what it is. This is a special forces weapon. So the best sniper rifle in the army is a tank gun.
      The most important thing is that for such rifles and piece people, in addition to training, there must initially be talent and the highest level of professional suitability.
  25. -1
    17 July 2022 18: 36
    Who will explain the lack of development of the title theme in the article? I can have my conjectures without a title, but I want a consistent, reasoned presentation of the author’s own thoughts from the article. Well, "and where is all this," Valery?
    Who made the purchasing decision? I suspect private individuals. They chose, perhaps with Labaev, which system is more adequate in this particular situation. Or is there an opinion from the host? - I doubt it, because it has not yet been named and most likely will not.
    And if the guardians have bought it, but the position of the army has not been announced - is this a sufficient reason to suggest in public to speculate about the quality of the work of the military?
    Let's put it this way: if the role of a dedicated sniper unit in the structure of the army has not yet been manifested, then talking about the optimal or even adequate way to replenish with new hardware is first a criticism of the lack of a role, and then about the methods and roles of any persons. In other words, Valery, do you want to catch up with the public about sniping? Excuse me, but who are you?!
    It turned out that I read other articles of your authorship. Graphomania is all empty, not raising a single question on the merits of the case. Well, write more if you need editing.
  26. 0
    17 July 2022 20: 27
    It is high time to accept the bullets that fly out and then weave and dodge the threat of being knocked down by a stone. During the war, there was a song that I don’t know everything about, but I remembered something. Dark night, one bullet stuck in the wires, and the second chased the soldier all night until the morning. That's the kind of ammunition you need. Such a bullet hid behind the barrel and looks through the list and photo of whom it should hit. Like a naked gun. The bullet should be cunning, nimble and with direction.
  27. AML
    +2
    17 July 2022 22: 31
    Quote: maiman61
    In China, they call a billionaire and explain that he became rich thanks to the COUNTRY, that money MUST be invested in his country and they recommend building a plant that the country NEEDED. And the rich man will get a new plant and income, and the state closes its problems! And ours only steal money and hide it behind a hillock, and the money works for our enemies!


    It can be seen from the great love for the motherland that they are shot in batches and the goods are confiscated by echelons.
  28. +4
    17 July 2022 23: 20
    Instead of thinking about where the sniper's place is in the modern theater of operations, then develop the TTZ, then develop the rifle + cartridge complex, then debug it and put it into action. Instead, jumps start in all directions - and let's introduce this crap because expert A spoke out for her (but we should listen to expert B, C ...). Or the whole enlightened world hasn’t [insert terribly backward technology] for a long time, so let’s be like everyone else and introduce that trendy chip.
    In my humble opinion, all this is a consequence of the loss of a scientific approach (and the emergence of all sorts of scientific heresies), as well as a chronic unwillingness to fund fundamental science as the only source of new knowledge about the world.
    And just don't shout about the world that is developing with acceleration, that there is no time to think - we urgently need to implement / sell. The world and the truth is moving somewhere with acceleration, but the destination, somehow, does not look like development. In connection with the fragmentation of areas of knowledge (when instead of one knowledgeable specialist with broad views, a cohort of miserable educated people is formed that does not have a common picture and is unable to even realize its presence), we only have more and more ways to make the wrong choice when looking for a solution to the problem.
    Is it really so difficult to build a mathematical model of ballistics in the earth's atmosphere (I suspect that the model has been around for a long time), to conduct full-scale experiments that refine the model to the required conditions, and already having this model to think about how to make a thunderstick for shooting at 100500 kilometers, which a human being can use normal size, with normal vision and nervous system?
  29. +1
    18 July 2022 01: 55
    I read the title, didn't read it.
    You can not compare different guns with different purposes.
    Firstly, SVD is not for long-range shots. What does its caliber and optics say.
    Secondly, svd for the front line, where open battles are taking place. Its purpose is to shoot the enemy, where an ordinary machine gun without optics, and all sorts of stray things, i.e. this is a distance of 200 meters
  30. +1
    18 July 2022 07: 18
    Funny article. And where will they get cartridges (ammunition) for this caliber and Lobaev rifles? We do not produce cases in this caliber, we do not make bullets. Gunpowder, though fig, but has its own. Prozhekterstvo solid, as before the war.
    And Lobaev rifles are much worse than Orsis and foreign analogues
    1. 0
      20 August 2022 09: 03
      Is it worse than orsis. They are better than Orsis and have a much larger lineup. Well, orsis does not have more than 338 caliber ...
      And which imported ones are better than Lobaevsky ones?
      1. 0
        1 September 2022 07: 12
        Quote: Georgy Sviridov_2
        Is it worse than orsis. They are better than Orsis and have a much larger lineup. Well, orsis does not have more than 338 caliber ...
        And which imported ones are better than Lobaevsky ones?

        George, there are at least several of them, proven by wars. These are Accuracy International (AW, AX), Sako (TRG), Barrett. And why do you need a caliber larger than 338lm, if none of our plants produces, by and large, anything from a long-range line. I heard that the Novosibirsk Cartridge Plant produces 338lm in a meager amount. Someone produces 375 Cheytak, for example?
  31. 0
    18 July 2022 09: 28
    https://voenhronika.ru/publ/vojna_na_ukraine/snajpery_rossijskoj_armii_trebujut_vydat_im_vysokotochnye_vintovki_lobaeva_minobrony_rf_uvjazlo_v_bumagakh_oruzhie_na_front_ne_puskajut_2022/60-1-0-12455
  32. -2
    18 July 2022 11: 35
    Well, to be completely honest, the Poles still use the Mosin rifle as a sniper rifle. Only she is dressed in plastic
    1. +1
      19 July 2022 16: 34
      Quote: DeGreen
      Olyaks still use the Mosin rifle


      fired from SVT, Mosinki, Mauser
      SVT is really cool!
      1. -2
        19 July 2022 16: 50
        And I shot ABC-36 from a rarity.
  33. 0
    18 July 2022 13: 25
    "Mosinka" with a real birch butt is the ultimate dream.
  34. The comment was deleted.
  35. +1
    19 July 2022 14: 56
    Before the advent of St. 98, Vyatskiye Polyany gave birth to ko-91 \ 30ms in the amount of 25-50 pieces for the whole of Russia. The gun was a thick varmint stake stuffed into a mosquito box. The stock is wooden, brutal, everything is not clear for longer. If you take all the details separately, they are all of very good quality, but assembled into a shooter, full of junk, I must say, not very expensive.
    The ability of the local craftsmen is limited by the psychology of the production of machine guns, it should be noted that they are not bad, but the varmint rifle is something else.
    Of course, it is not structurally possible to assemble a gun with a hanging barrel on a Mosin receiver, so a support is soldered to the chamber, but everything seems to be fine here. Bad next.
    The Vyatka Polyans apparently did not analyze the existing structures, so they stuck the entire knot right into the tree.
    We got a potentially good gun with disgustingly low performance.
    It was possible to fix the gun by inserting an aluminum tire into the existing stock, on which the iron was fixed. The tire was filled with epoxy resin in wood. In stock, the gun collected 5 shots with an accuracy of 70mm per 100 m. Of course, no one needs such a gun for nothing. After modernization, 5 series of 5 shots showed 14mm at 100 m.
    At a distance of 750 m out of 3 series of 5 each, the gun showed an average accuracy of 16 cm with a Hornady bullet and 23 cm with a cartridge of the fmzh Barnaul.
    A registered letter was written to Polyany with a detailed description of the work carried out, targets were attached, etc. In response, silence, after 4 months they called there, the letter arrived, the letter was read. A high commission inside the plant did not consider it possible to install the tire in the plant, the project was closed.
    The cost of a gun with a $1 upgrade was deemed impossibly high.
    In total, 3 such guns were modernized. Only one showed an accuracy of 32 cm at 750 m, the rest had a higher accuracy.
    In Soviet times, Mr. Blum designed a cartridge of cal 9,3 x64, with an initial speed of 770m (with a bullet weighing 17,6 grams with a muzzle energy of 4750 J. There were attempts to use it in sniper business, but alas, to compose a decent gun with the forces Izhevsk and Polyan did not work out.
  36. Jan
    0
    19 July 2022 20: 38
    Again, "pennies for fish" ... Yes, Lobaev produces good rifles, but the author of the article forgets that this is piece production. Oh no, he remembers! But for some reason, he does not want to understand that "piece" is unacceptable for the army !!! It is clear that a weapon for a sniper should be of a special manufacture, but there is an economic feasibility! Which is lost in Lobaev's products as products for the army!
  37. 0
    19 July 2022 20: 40
    author --> author --> author, of course, well done, but the topic was not chosen correctly, and it smacks of Westernism, there are no prospects for 9 mm ammunition in the RF Armed Forces, since their own 12,7x108 mm sniper cartridge was created:
    https://topwar.ru/189341-rossijskie-127-mm-snajperskie-vintovki.html
    and stop procrastinating about Lobaev, you didn’t even hold his weapon in your hands, but I held the vaunted Orsis and, after squeezing out a mean tear, bought an imported bolt at 30-06. 98x9,3 to stir up ours, I don’t know why they didn’t bring it to mind, damn business around ...
  38. +1
    20 August 2022 08: 57
    There is also .375, it has even better ballistics than .408, but I don’t care what it flies in the carcass.
    In fact, there were a lot of rifles that were "cooler than the SVD."
    The same SV-98 bolter (by the way, it is also under .338). Under 7,62 * 54, probably no one does better.
    VSS and VSK-94. VSSK.
    KORD and V-94...
  39. The comment was deleted.
  40. 0
    5 November 2022 18: 27
    most .408 CheyTac factory ammunition uses carbide bullets rather than lead bullets.

    In Russian, it is customary to call "carbide" materials based on tungsten carbide used for tools, including mandrels for the production of barrels.
    Probably, they mean solid bullets made of copper alloys, solid in English literature

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