Design features of the AK-12

134



Continued, start here: AK-12 as a mirror of the status quo



.... I did not hold the AK-12 in my hands and can only judge by pictures and videos from the network. True, in our age of the Internet and information technology, it is paradoxical, but true, there is a lot of gossip, guesses of "geniuses", the chatter of "specialists" and "obsemznaek", but here quality and professional information, as they say, "a day with fire." Sometimes two people of opposing opinions search the web for information to confirm their views, and both find it, moreover, with an “iron” justification. In general, I noticed that the Internet disaccustoms many people not only to think, but to analyze information - it, as before, "...so they broadcast it on the radio" is taken as the last revelation from above. But in fact, they simply find a site to their liking, that is, one that meets their own views and misconceptions, and pass off these searches as their own in-depth analysis.

I remember how a budding (rare occurrence nowadays) graduate of the KGTA, a graduate student, praised the Zig-Sauer pistols - "... the most reliable pistols in the world - they do not have a fuse, only a safe trigger lever." I ask, what is the effect on reliability weapons renders a similar algorithm of the trigger mechanism? Oops. Confusion, an offended look, but I didn’t confuse him, in the next moment, an unconstrained and resolute disregard for any frivolous nonsense of someone who does not understand anything, and calm confidence in the future. From the word day, not the bottom. It seems to be.

But returning, finally, to the machine. What immediately attracts attention: improved ergonomics due to the butt adjustable in length, how much I dreamed about it, stuffing another lantern under the eye with the receiver cover, an abundance of Picatinny rails, including on the forearm and gas tube overlay, transferring the rear sight of a mechanical sight on the cover of the receiver as close to the eye as possible, the absence of a front sight in the usual place for AKs and its structural combination with a gas chamber, modeled on shorties of the "hundredth" series, and the absence of a ramrod under the barrel of the machine gun.

Mounting strips or Picatinny rails. It seems to be nowhere without them now. Back in 1998, during the period of work on the AEK-971, I insisted on their implementation, because in our country there was a stagnation in the development of weapons accessories, and not only accessories, there were no sanctions then, and in general, “the world is not full of fools." Then the proposal did not pass - "there is no such requirement of the customer."

Later, when I no longer participated in this work, this requirement appeared, and, judging by the works on other topics, even the length of the slats was stipulated, and in the fire order I had to not only stick on the slats, but completely change the design of the receiver and, abandoning it caps, to introduce a hinged trigger housing - by the way, it is finally very similar to the MP-44, well, to make a retractable buttstock with a swivel neck similar to the AEK-919K is not the best solution in terms of rigidity and ergonomic design for a full-size weapon, although it worked. Most likely, this decision will later be abandoned. I want to note that the fore-end almost escaped the innovative bullying and remained quite comfortable, the designers still had a sense of proportion.

The creators of the AK-12 were in a more difficult position - it was highly desirable for them to keep the production tooling, especially for stamp-welded parts (I'll try to tell you why below). Therefore, no radical exercises were allowed with the receiver, and the bar was fixed on the removable cover of the receiver along with the sight, taking care, probably, how to strengthen it and fix it on the weapon. True, the fact that it will not loosen during operation and will ensure the uniform position of the sights after assembly and disassembly ... Well, well.

However, observing the dreary process of removing the cover from the machine, you involuntarily think - what if, in combat conditions, you will have to eliminate the delay and separate this very cover from the machine, and, for example, a heavy expensive night light is also installed on it. The process of separation-installation is not so easy and fast, and it requires attention. In addition, in a stressful situation, the lid, along with all the aiming personal belongings, can not only be fatally dropped for these gizmos, but also lost altogether, and not only theoretically.

Without denying in general the usefulness of many well-made weapon accessories, I want to analyze only the method of attaching them to weapons for the time being. Early accessories, i.e. any optics designed for weapons with a removable or hinged receiver cover (read - AK, SVD), were mounted on a side rail located on the left side of the receiver. The bar was located in the shadow of the operational areas of the weapon and had a relatively smooth shape. Installing and removing the sight from this bar takes moments and is done with one hand movement. The positioning accuracy of the accessory on the side bar is certainly not inferior to Picatinny rails, because SVD optics are installed on such a bar, after all, ideologically and constructively, both mounts are very similar.

However, due to the fact that all foreign companies whose products could be purchased before the imposition of sanctions, and now Russian developers and manufacturers of accessories, are guided by world (read - NATO) standards, now everything is being developed for installation on Picatinny rail. Judging by the recommendations of TsNIITOCHMASH, it seems to have already been standardized with us. On the one hand, this is not bad, because it not only increases the export potential of weapons and newly developed accessories, but also expands (theoretically) the possibilities of completing standard weapons.

But the desire to blindly follow the gun fashion, which to a very large extent depends on purely marketing decisions, and to ensure the use of everything and everything from the very and not very necessary, sometimes turn the weapon into something similar to a careless bunch of chainsaws due to the abundance of these very strips. But the deterioration of ergonomics due to Picatinny rails on a plastic fore-end is not leveled by any accessories. The value of the plastic strips themselves is also in question. Reminds me of an old joke. What do a female programmer and a guinea pig have in common? The fact that a guinea pig, firstly, is not a guinea pig, and secondly, it is not a pig.

The use of various removable elements that allow you to hide unused straps and give the forearm and gas tube overlay more or less convenient shapes for holding the machine gun is unlikely, including for economic reasons. I once developed a multi-caliber magazine sniper rifle, while focusing on the design of the PGN Mini-Hecate. Then the guys from my group (2008, or something) were present at the sniper competitions in Chechnya and showed the participants a photograph of a prototype of our product.

The main remarks on the design of the eternally warring (and this is true) comrades were: if possible, remove all pockets, holes, slots and other “relief details” from the rifle, which we were so proud of (fashionably), because they collect and cut off along the path of the sniper pair, foliage, branches and other debris leave a trail and at the same time make noise. This is what I want to convey the idea of ​​the need to make weapons as streamlined as possible, despite the existing “brick with teeth” fashion.

More about planks. If the accessories developed in the Soviet era and intended for installation on the side rails had a mount that provides for quick installation and removal, then for reasons completely incomprehensible to me, such a mount for Picatinny rails is absent in principle and, apparently, is not even stipulated in the TOR for the development of accessories . True, something similar was brought from BelOMO for review, developed at the request of officers of local special services practicing concealed carrying of weapons, but then I did not like this design - it is inconvenient to use and does not provide a rigid fastening of accessories.

The use of rails with the length of the working part specified in the TOR forced the creators of both the AK-12 and the “balance” to move the rear sights of mechanical sights back. The location of the rear sights close to the eye (according to ergonomic requirements - no closer, it seems, 500 mm from the back of the butt - I forgot already) also will not add joy to anyone except near-arms aesthetes. That's how much they wrote and argued about this, however, I don't remember who, when and where, but I will still speak out again. You will have to reduce the width of the slot or the diameter of the hole in the rear sight (this is not a diopter, completely different laws of optics work there, and diopter sights are not used in military weapons, and the fact that they are often called diopter sights in the literature is a mistake of the authors of the texts), which means - a priori, they will have to be carefully protected from pollution or keep some kind of device (well, at least a match) on hand for prompt cleaning.

In addition, it becomes more difficult to aim in conditions of poor visibility and low light. Yes. Because less light hits the retina. Well, the clarity with which the shooter sees the front sight and the rear sight at the same time is deteriorating, which is also important (there is a recommendation for pistol shooters: the gaze must be focused so as to clearly see the sights, the target may have blurry outlines, and statements like “the whole world shoots and does not complain” does not cancel anything from the above.

However, let us recall the purpose of the automaton. Question: what accessories, in the best case, “shine” for shooters, senior shooters, grenade launchers, assistant machine gunners and grenade launchers, etc., etc. And, by the way, one must take into account such a factor - any, the most necessary, a perfect, etc. accessory requires additional training of personnel, getting used to it and developing a certain skill in operation and combat use, without which it will simply interfere, and in a combat situation it will be thrown out at best, at worst - they will not be in time. Well, yes, the army is striving to become professional, but I have some doubts that shooting training will reach such a very high level, rather, some necessary, and well, if sufficient, minimum will be determined for each category of military personnel. Still, the population of our country as a whole does not yet have the proper level of weapons culture.

- Night or day-night sights. Yes, they are. They come in the form of independent devices or attachments for daytime optics, but in fact, devices of the second type have not yet been used on Russian machine guns, due to the lack of this very daytime optics.

– Collimator and optical sights. Everything is not easy here, and for me it is not always clear. I will try to turn to the experience of other countries, because we did not have such a luxury to the linear parts. If we talk about built-in sights, then there are not so many samples of assault rifles that have been put into service as, relatively speaking, the main infantry weapon, are regularly equipped with removable or built-in optics. AUG 77th "Steyer", bullpup - built-in optical sight, L85 - English bullpup - built-in optical sight. The same sight is standardly installed on the latest Australian modification of the same AUG 77th Steyer, but already as a removable one (although I could be wrong here). G36 - a combined sight of optical and collimator devices. Well, maybe something else on the little things - I can't remember.

As you can see, these are mostly bullpups, on which it is almost impossible to provide an acceptable length of aiming line for a mechanical sight. In addition, after the adoption of the L85, someone from our army management liked its sight, and there was even a topic to develop something similar for the SA. True, the idea, in accordance with the TOR, degenerated into the creation of the cheapest optical tube (there were almost no fools: everyone understood how long the optics would live in the hands of a conscript soldier in the process of combat training, and even more so in combined arms combat) and a bracket for it mounting on a weapon with mechanisms for setting aiming angles and alignment when zeroing in on a weapon. From that work, I have a memory - an author's certificate of invention for a variant of the bracket design. But the possibility of installing optics and collimators is provided for on all modern systems.

And, perhaps, such sights, albeit in limited quantities, but will be adopted and even "reach the soldier", and he (the soldier) will be taught to use them correctly.
And here lies a small, but well-organized ambush. Well, this device flew out of him, yet optics are optics. You don’t have to drop anything, hit, scratch, slap, etc. - just splashes of dirty water with fractions of fuel and lubricants on the lens of the lens, it became necessary to switch to mechanics, and for this it is necessary to remove the optics from the bar, and this is a certain hemorrhoids for Picatinny. The same operation for the standard side bar is much easier and faster. It is significant that even the aforementioned rifles with built-in optics (except for the G36, but it has 2 sights) have rudimentary mechanical sights with the ability to use them without removing the optics.

– Combat lights and LCC. Unlikely. Although the lights, from my point of view, are needed. Some samples are placed on a Picatinny rail, some are attached to the barrel, but these interfere with the installation of underbarrel grenade launchers.

- Bipod and assault handles in the variants of something with something. Don't make fun of my horseshoes. Very, very unlikely, and not necessary.

And summing up the results, blah blah blah we have: you need a Picatinny rail to install a “night light” or optics and something to install a flashlight. Desirable easily removable and versatile. And best of all, for the role of such a device in AK-family assault rifles with a removable receiver cover, from my point of view, an adapter bracket is suitable, which is installed on the standard side rail of the weapon and has two Picatinny rails: the top one for sights and the side one for the flashlight.

And after all, for sure, such a bar is part of some kind of modernization kit. The inclusion of such an accessory in the delivery set makes it unnecessary to install Picatinny rails and all the changes in the design of the AK assault rifle associated with their introduction. It sounds blasphemous in modern times, but it still seems to work out better (at least in terms of cost-effectiveness) with something that was born under the name AK-12. Oops ... But I just wanted to touch on the topic of slats a little ....

No. More about the slats (that's attached). If you carefully study the samples of Western army weapons, it turns out that, as a rule, they have one or two built-in straps, and the rest are removable, and the ability to install them is usually used by either civilian, well, very cool shooters, or marketers when demonstrating the capabilities of the samples, well, sometimes fighters of various kinds of special forces units.

The design of the muzzle of the machine has undergone major changes. DTK - the muzzle brake-compensator is now attached not to the tide of the front sight (the album name, it seems, is the “front sight block”), but is installed on a separate part, which structurally represents the same front sight block cut off in the upper part (let's conditionally call it the DTK block ). The front sight itself is installed in a part that combines the front sight block and the gas chamber. This design of the muzzle of the weapon is standard for NATO assault rifles.

But there it is due to the need to fulfill the requirements to ensure the possibility of using rifle grenades standardized within NATO - “tromblons” with an inner diameter of the stabilizer tube of about 22 mm (they are still popular in the armed forces of some countries). Therefore, they have the same outer diameter of flame arresters and other muzzle devices - DU (22 mm), which are screwed directly onto the barrel until it stops with a certain tightening torque. Separate devices - remote control latches, I did not come across. If a certain position of the remote control is required along the angular coordinate, the position is selected either with a set of rings - spacers, or with a locknut, I have never studied this issue specifically, but I have never noticed the rocking of the remote control on the barrel of an imported weapon.

The use of such an arrangement for the AK-12 is most likely due to the need to provide access to the gas chamber for cleaning it and, as I suspect, still a subconscious look back at "the latest world achievements in the field of weapons design over the past ... decades." Farewell to the most famous and recognizable silhouette in the world. This is not pathos. This is sadness. At the same time, due to the reduction in the length of the sighting line, there was no alternative to the “rear” placement of the rear sight of the mechanics.

And one more personal memory. During the period of work on installing daytime optics on the PCM (the same optical tube - there was such a topic), it turned out that the positive effect of its use is noticeable only when the barrel is slightly heated. With more or less noticeable heating, the barrel "leads", especially the muzzle, but when using a regular mechanical sight with a front sight located close to the muzzle of the barrel, the removal of the STP is significantly less than with optics located in the receiver area - there is generally aimed shooting did not work.

On the AK-12, the DTK is attached with a bayonet connection. It used to be threaded, but the thread "burned" mainly because, contrary to the requirement of the "Instructions on Shooting", this assembly was very rarely disassembled and cleaned. Since the user's mentality does not change with the change of weapon model, it will be interesting to see how the new technical solution will show itself in operation. The fixation of the DTC along the angular coordinate is carried out by a spring-loaded yoke located in the block of the DTC, nothing has changed here. In addition, a tide is located on the DTK block for fixing a bayonet-knife.

But, if the information that the DTK body is made using a progressive cast billet (or powder?) Is correct, the question arises why the DTK block was needed at all. After all, this is in itself a difficult to manufacture part with an exact (tight or press) fit on the barrel on which it is pinned, and, in accordance with the recommendations of TSNIITOCHMASH, at a distance of less than 50 mm from the muzzle of the barrel (for small and normal calibers) it is desirable generally refrain from using pins, because they degrade the accuracy of the barrel. As a last resort, their symmetrical installation was recommended. As confirmation of the importance of this recommendation, I can say that in Germany the working length of the caliber for controlling the straightness of the bore and other basic parameters is 50 mm from the muzzle.

If it were possible to abandon the DTK block by placing an emphasis for the bayonet-knife and a latch in terms of the angle of rotation directly on the DTK (plus a hole or a small groove on the barrel for interacting with the latch, well, let's say, with a yoke or rocker arm), this would not only simplify and reduced the cost of the design of the machine, but would also give some effect of improving accuracy, in any case, no less than from a “posted” barrel with carefully preserved “vibrations”. Of course, for this you will have to be smart with the design of the DTK, due to a decrease in the landing diameter in the muzzle of the barrel of the machine gun, caused by the need to maintain some external dimensions of the gas chamber, to ensure, in turn, the possibility of installing an underbarrel grenade launcher. Although, of course, I didn’t work all this out, but it’s easy to fantasize.

O! About sore. Even while working on the AEK-971, I was infuriated by the need to ensure the compatibility of all newly developed products with accessories designed exclusively for AK: grenade launcher, bayonet, nightlights, and loopholes for armored vehicles. All these personal belongings were developed purely for the AK without any oncoming movement from the machine manufacturer (well, what is mass production and military acceptance, I remember something and am not surprised), so they turned out to be extremely inconvenient for use somewhere else, and in some, and even to a large extent, hindering the development of the automaton itself.

Well, with sights and some accessories designed for installation on a Picatinny rail, the issue seems to be resolved, subject to the mandatory development and implementation of a device for quickly removing and installing the accessory and optimizing the design of the machine for installing these rails. I think that other accessories, especially grenade launchers, need to be developed taking into account the possibility of their installation on Picatinny rails. At the same time, they can be installed on existing systems using adapters.

The AK-12 uses a rigidly fixed gas tube and a gas chamber, closed from the front with an easily removable (in theory, not yet burnt) plug-plug. By the way, if you lose it (the plug - it is small), the machine will turn into a magazine (non-automatic) carbine. Changes in the design of the gas tube and gas chamber are apparently caused by the desire to fulfill the requirements of the technical specifications for the length of the upper Picatinny rail (judging by the fact that the “balance” has an identical length rail, and according to the requirements for products on the Alatau theme, he led the development of an assault rifle , such a requirement existed), which is partially made on a plastic lining rigidly fixed to the gas tube.

Apparently, the use of collimators installed in the area of ​​​​the forearm, or still optics with night nozzles, is envisaged. At the same time, the forearm on the AK-12 does not come into contact with the barrel, which almost completely eliminates the influence of the shooter or the emphasis on the barrel during firing. However, the introduction of a plug into the design of the gas chamber can increase the number of gaps through which powder gases will leak. I don’t know how sensitive the machine gun is to such things, but judging by the increased rate of fire, the speed of the moving parts was added just in case, which is unlikely to add accuracy to the machine gun when firing automatic fire.

I remember that in the process of working on the AEK-971, I decided to improve the manufacturability of the gas chamber rack and placed the pins fixing it not from below, in the tides of the rack, but from above, from the side of the gas outlet in the barrel. The tightness in the connection of the barrel - the rack was 2 ... 3 weave, but the speed of the moving in the rearmost position fell by more than 1 m / s. The wall of the chamber was pushed away from the barrel by pins, and powder gases siphoned through this microscopic gap.

And finally, a ramrod. Traditionally, samples of Soviet and Russian small arms are regularly equipped with a metal ramrod. It can be collapsible, it can be located on a weapon or in a pouch, but it is always there, unlike the weapons of our sworn friends, who usually have a ramrod of a soft design - a bow on a string.

The metal ramrod is an important accessory that increases the operational reliability of the weapon. Without it, for example, the delay "non-extraction of the spent cartridge case" becomes almost unavoidable. Traditionally, on assault rifles of the AK family, the ramrod was located under the barrel. This arrangement allows you to conveniently place a fairly long non-separable structure, and therefore it is convenient and durable to use, well, if you don’t lose it, of course, the ramrod, provide convenient and quick access to it and, among other things, protect the barrel in some situations when shooting from the stop. The disadvantage of this placement is some deterioration in the accuracy of fire.

In general, a huge number of factors affect the accuracy of fire of an assault rifle, but the main ones are the quality of manufacture of the barrel and the ammunition used, the bumpiness and design of the remote control, the impact force of the moving parts in the rearmost position, and some more, but such as “freedom to vibrations of the posted barrel” and the location of the ramrod under the barrel, against the general background, and especially against the background of the first two factors, the accuracy of a single, and even more so automatic fire, is very weakly affected.

When designing the AEK-971, there was also a problem with the placement of the ramrod. Due to the design features of the machine with balanced automation, it has practically no recoil-reducing effect of powder gases on the front wall of the gas chamber, which is not weak for a small caliber. This required the use of a more efficient and, as a result, larger DTK, and even with a mount that reduces DTK chatter on the barrel.

Due to the increase in the dimensions of the DTK, it was not possible to place the ramrod under the barrel, and it was decided to make it collapsible with two knees with one knee in the butt, and use the return mechanism rod as the second. The solution is beautiful from an engineering point of view, but if it is necessary to quickly assemble the machine, when repelling a sudden attack while cleaning it, for example, the speed of this assembly is not weakly slowing down.

I watched a video demonstrating the location and manipulation of the AK-12 accessory, which includes a prefabricated ramrod. What can I say - just a gadget lover's dream. The predecessors were smarter - more convenient and cheaper.

In general, apart from the idea of ​​a stock adjustable in length, I did not find any big advantages in the AK-12 over the AK-74M, for example. From my point of view, there are actually more disadvantages. There is a feeling of some sort of not quite hack-work, but precocity, attempts to quickly make something fashionable, not very similar to AK, essentially without changing anything in the AK design (although this is still that design task), and then push it into service, using the strong influence of the Kalashnikov concern. And if this becomes a habit, or rather, if this habit is not eliminated, the Soviet (or Russian?) school of weapon design will die completely. And this is a brick not only in the direction of QC - its managers, to the best of their ability, find the best, from their point of view, ways to solve the pressing problems of their enterprise, they are paid for this, but also all participants in this most ordinary stories.
Our news channels

Subscribe and stay up to date with the latest news and the most important events of the day.

134 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. 0
    April 24 2022 05: 53
    the nameless author, apparently Igor Zavarykin ... only he knows how to write so long, in principle, nothing and about the same thing ...
    1. +14
      April 24 2022 06: 10
      Wow! Shoots a cartridge. And he is good with Kalashnikov. In Chechnya, the frame butt did not cause me any discomfort. AK12 is an ordinary Kalash (an excellent machine), only the picatinny rails were screwed on. Personally, I have always been glad that you can attach a grenade launcher. And for this, the picatini is, as it were, not needed. Attach a flashlight or a laser pointer ... For a sniper to hit by light, thank you. The only thing you can attach is a calimator, that's a really worthy thing. And so in simplicity, strength and reliability.
      1. +14
        April 24 2022 06: 38
        The only thing you can attach a calimator, that's a really worthy thing. And so in simplicity, strength and reliability.

        And a collimator sight in combat conditions is still a little thing ... a battery, constant dirt. An experienced shooter needs an ordinary sight, and even better optics, simple and reliable and, as the author writes correctly, with a side mount for one or two. In close combat, not up to a collimator sight, but optics are better at a distance.
        1. +13
          April 24 2022 06: 47
          Optics and Kalash? Kalimator allows not to narrow the vision, both eyes are open. And no one bothers to remove it when the battery runs out. Although it keeps for two weeks on good calimators.
          1. +2
            April 24 2022 06: 51
            And you in Chechnya did not have to see the PKK with a sniper scope, a frequent occurrence among the locals.
            1. +9
              April 24 2022 07: 18
              No. I served in intelligence. The PKK, in principle, was not held in high esteem. The same Kalash, just not comfortable. Either a Pecheneg (yes, yes they were) or an automatic machine. A third of the personnel had 7.62 to use PBS, and at 5.45 grenade launchers. Pragmatism. In the infantry, they may have been scolding ...
              1. +12
                April 24 2022 08: 00
                Looking at these Picatinny rails, you remember how you messed around with cleaning, and then there’s a “gift”, to clean the dirt between all the teeth of the rail, well, the muzzles will not understand that going out to “nature” is not the same as going to the shooting range.
                1. +12
                  April 24 2022 16: 26
                  Quote: Oleg Kolsky
                  Looking at these Picatinny rails-..........
              2. +1
                April 24 2022 08: 19
                Did you participate in the second company?
                1. +1
                  April 24 2022 08: 59
                  Well, if I mention the Pechenegs, of course the second)))
                  1. +1
                    April 24 2022 11: 39
                    About the Pecheneg somehow flew out, Easter, and it was a long time ago))
              3. +3
                April 24 2022 08: 26
                The PKK, in principle, was not held in high esteem. The same Kalash, just not comfortable

                RPK Yugoslav version as a sniper rifle. I'm talking about the locals, I meant the Chechens. On the contrary, they respected the PKK with optics. The cartridge is automatic, accuracy up to 300 is higher than that of the SVD due to a smaller impulse and a thick barrel. Here is pragmatism ... sniper fire, and automatic suppression is also necessary.
                In general, I am a supporter of using the 5,45 cartridge for a lightweight sniper. I remember the carbine Bars caliber 5,56, here is a simple, trouble-free and accurate machine.
                1. +1
                  April 24 2022 10: 51
                  Hmm ... And if the re-barreled SCS under 5,45 on a plastic stock? Its barrel length in calibers will increase by 40% (520/7,62 = 68 and 520/5,45 = 95)! Might even have to shorten it...
                  1. 0
                    April 24 2022 11: 19
                    The leopard weighs 2,7 kg and has interchangeable magazines for 5 rounds, the optics do not interfere. In addition, more precisely, a bolter, a classic. SCS has an extra kg.
                    1. +3
                      April 24 2022 11: 48
                      Steyr Scout is popular in the world in such a niche: a longitudinally sliding rotary shutter, weight 3,3 kg, length 1039 mm (barrel - 508), cartridge 5,56 × 45 mm. But as a civilian / hunting / special forces weapon.

                      How much a bolter in such a caliber is needed in army operation is not an easy question, after all, a rate of fire may be needed. And SCS (something based on it) could be a good substitute for SVD. Yes, the “power” is not the same, but there are no problems with cartridges ... Reliability also does not raise questions, and reworking for interchangeable magazines, lightening and other tuning is just a separate genre for this barrel in the weapons world. It is enough to google "tuning SCS".
                      1. -3
                        April 24 2022 12: 12
                        How much a bolter in such a caliber is needed in army operation is not an easy question, after all, a rate of fire may be needed. And SCS (something based on it) could be a good substitute for SVD.

                        A detachable magazine on the SCS is needed, it is difficult to load it with clips ...
                        And as for the bolter ... a simple, reliable cheap sniper. What about the rate of fire? In general, I am a supporter of submachine guns, or rather a complex light compact bolter with conventional optics and a submachine gun with an effective range of at least 200 meters. AKM and similar weapons leading the pedigree from Sturmgever are outdated, or rather the concept. Ersatz weapon of Germany. By the way, the name "Assault Rifle" was proposed by Hitler, he liked loud names. This weapon has nothing to do with the assault, it is a kind of symbiosis of a rifle and a machine gun. In this way, the Germans tried to compensate for the lag behind us in automatic weapons and saturate the troops instead of expensive and difficult-to-produce single MGs with a cheap machine gun. And there is no need for legends that Hitler was against the Sturmgwehr.
                      2. 0
                        April 24 2022 22: 10
                        The Shteer Scout has a luminous receiver, it is pinched and deformed simply if you fasten a heavy optical sight tightly. At one time I twisted it in the store, in cal. 223 with a box in the color of the red AKM store, thought for a long time - and refused to purchase it. Crows in the forest will laugh - an unreliable fragile thing with a barrel the size of a pencil, which begins (according to reviews) to scatter bullets randomly after the 3rd shot due to overheating.
                        He owned Bars 4-1 for several years, this shnyaga does not deserve discussion at all.
                        But the author ran into the Piccatina slats in vain - for example, I chose a bullet with a steel upper part with these slats in order to be able to put optics there. I even replaced the standard luminous bar with a home-made steel bar fabricated from the Nightforce blank. Different sights: collimators, changers, constants with tritium, nightlights ... whatever I want, without restrictions on weight and size. On the side bracket of the AK-shaped - in general, little can fit in principle, a flawed design, no dancing with a tambourine will help there.
              4. +2
                April 24 2022 10: 25
                RPK is a variant of the Marxist for the poor, subject to the availability of good optics.
                1. +2
                  April 24 2022 11: 22
                  Marxist variant

                  Universal, sniper rifle and light machine gun.
              5. 0
                April 25 2022 01: 29
                The scouts in Afghanistan had the same opinion, if a machine gun is needed, they take a PC, if something is easier, they take an ak. PKK was not in demand.
        2. NAP
          -1
          April 24 2022 20: 50
          Well, yes, you are so smart alone, that’s why I see that in most more or less rich countries, the armed forces use attachments and modules like laser sights, tactical flashlights and collimator, holographic sights with the same magnifier. And yes, often do you, Fedor Sanych LCU or a flashlight use the day in an open space? LCC with a flashlight allows you to work better in confined spaces and at close distances.
      2. -7
        April 24 2022 08: 35
        “I didn’t hold a machine gun in my hands, but I’ll speak out” - you could not read further, but I forgive the author for Andrey Cruz (in the previous article).
        1. +2
          April 24 2022 18: 14
          According to your logic, you have to be a submariner to discuss a submarine? A tanker to discuss a tank and a pilot to discuss an airplane?
        2. 0
          10 June 2022 20: 31
          "stuffing the lid of the receiver with another flashlight under the eye,"

          How did he stay alive, I can’t laugh, no one stuffed the black eye with the lid of the receiver, and he once again stuffed the black eye under his eye. Well, this is how you have to manage to shoot in order to get a black eye from the receiver, as possible, they shot in every way, but so that, respect and respect to the craftsman ...
      3. +2
        April 24 2022 08: 57
        A flashlight in urban battles is a necessary thing. If they are used correctly, then this is rather a plus than a minus.
      4. +5
        April 24 2022 12: 20
        These bars are the main "problem" of the AK-12. How many of them have not been shown trophy for the last 2 months, they are all "naked". They set up fashionable Picatinny, stamped good weapons, but they no longer began to equip them with attachments, or they could not. Maybe the specialists have something, but all the linear parts are just naked AKs. I only once saw something similar to a collimator - at the operator filming the assault on Gostomel with a helicopter landing. Why the current is not clear, whether it's a lot of money for all sights for linear parts, or it's an unbearable technical way to produce them in huge batches, or it's a pity for the money - "they will break them anyway" ... The point was to invest in all this fashionable - if it has not been brought to mind in all linear parts?
    2. +12
      April 24 2022 06: 17
      Quote: Aerodrome
      write basically nothing
      For me it's very interesting. Here it is for example:
      it was decided to make it collapsible two-knee with the placement of one knee in the butt, and use the return mechanism rod as the second.

      An elegant solution lol only everyone remembers how elegant trousers never turned into elegant shorts!

      a careless bunch of chainsaws due to the abundance of these same slats.
      But at the same time, the chainsaws themselves are quite licked.


      Farewell to the most famous and recognizable silhouette in the world. This is not pathos. This is sadness.
      At the same time, half the country's bureaucrats rushed about with "recognizable brands" and other marketing stuff. Ugh.

      And the article is great!
    3. -3
      April 24 2022 10: 24
      Quote: Aerodrome
      the nameless author, apparently Igor Zavarykin ... only he knows how to write so long, in principle, nothing and about the same thing ...

      I, too, thought that now I would see a noble gif with a minimum of text, with all the features ... and here, bang .. a particularly opposite surprise. ))
  2. 0
    April 24 2022 06: 34
    .
    On the one hand, this is not bad, because it not only increases the export potential of weapons and newly developed accessories, but also expands (theoretically) the possibilities of completing standard weapons.

    Just and there was a calculation for export. They thought it was going to rain.
    1. +2
      April 24 2022 07: 24
      Here I agree. But then it rained))) Kalashnikov is a popular product)))
      1. -1
        April 25 2022 10: 46
        And that's why everyone who can do it.
  3. +19
    April 24 2022 06: 49
    Normal article request
    Apparently, our Mr. Incognito is a gunsmith himself, because the argumentation of this or that decision is balanced. To commentators, I would recommend less snickering, because any weapon should be balanced to such an extent that it would be deadly, durable, easily digestible for soldiers and easy to manufacture. smile AK is generally ideal in terms of balance. But you can, of course, weigh it down with snot and then spit in battle ... What the author, in principle, points to.
    Material plus hi
  4. +7
    April 24 2022 06: 50
    I, also, did not hold the AK 12 in my hands, but after watching a couple of videos about this weapon, I noticed one property of the aforementioned buttstock - when folded, it does not fit close to the machine gun, but slightly "bulges". Who will explain - why was it done so? As they said in the video, this is not a factory defect, but it was conceived in the design bureau.
    1. +1
      April 24 2022 08: 05
      I kept it. I live in Naro-Fominsk, the Kantemirovskaya division is 100 meters from me, they are armed with AK12s. But with what love I remember the inserted IPP package into the frame butt and the tourniquet tied around. How many lives have been saved by this simple device...
      1. NAP
        0
        April 24 2022 20: 52
        Uh-huh, and if the soldiers didn’t wind regular harnesses and IPPs on butts, but placed them on their equipment, where they could get to quickly and efficiently, then there would be much more rescued ...
      2. 0
        April 25 2022 08: 43
        I read that many officers and doctors forbade inserting an IPP and winding tourniquets on butts. Because of these manipulations and under the influence of external factors, the harnesses quickly wore out and were torn at the most inopportune moment. And moisture could get into the IPP, and just any liquid.
    2. +2
      April 24 2022 18: 12
      Igor, hello! hi
      ... I did not hold the AK-12 in my hands

      I just don’t understand how you can judge, let alone write about a weapon that you didn’t even hold in your hands. request
  5. +7
    April 24 2022 06: 54
    Author in the studio! The article is good, why be modest.
    An abundance of Picatinny rails, this is the case when porridge can easily be spoiled with oil.
    1. IVZ
      +30
      April 24 2022 07: 02
      Zavarykin Igor. I'm not being modest, just when, at the suggestion of the moderator, I divided the article into parts, some forgot to sign. Sorry.
      1. +1
        April 24 2022 19: 45
        Sincere thanks for sharing your opinion!
  6. -2
    April 24 2022 07: 01
    Good morning.
    I am glad that I can ask a question to a person who is directly related to the topic of AEK. What do you think, if a 6 * 49 cartridge is used on AEK, its characteristics are impressive.
    1. IVZ
      +14
      April 24 2022 07: 16
      The cartridge is definitely not automatic, but the "balance" works best with low-impulse ammunition. With powerful ammunition, the effect of using balanced automation is reduced. I posted the third penultimate part for moderation, where the answers to your question are more detailed and justified. Well, i.e. hope so.
      1. +2
        April 24 2022 07: 42
        I'll wait. Thank you. And by the recoil momentum, you know that 7,62x39 has 0.8kg / s, and your balanced A 762 was created for this cartridge, the 6x49 cartridge has an impulse of about 1kg / s, and this is when firing from a barrel 720 mm long, and with a length barrel, like the AEK-415mm, the return will be in the region of 0,88. Not much difference from 7,62x39. It’s just that I don’t need it, no matter how we have to frantically catch up with the West if we adopt a new complex, and we already have both a cartridge and a machine gun, especially if we made a machine gun under 7,62x51 in metal, then with 6x49 difficulties will probably be less.
        1. IVZ
          +12
          April 24 2022 08: 11
          "As a person who has worked a lot with these ammunition (BCS, BC3, BC6 and again BC3, and recently 6,7 x 49), I want to say - no need. (life forced) no cutting. The phenomenon of capillarity again. And there is no production of components, and there are no imported analogues and civilians either, and this is an export potential and just money. And submachine gunners do not work at 720 meters. And the fighter wants to take more ammunition and preferably so that they are smaller and lighter. Yes, and the shells of the remnants of the needles from that time were recently re-pressed under 25x1000, burned during the tests and calmed down. " Quote from the third part - could not stand it. From my point of view, it is not necessary to make ammunition like amers. It just has to satisfy its purpose - to be a balanced automatic ammunition. If it were a matter of creating the most powerful cartridge, then an intermediate cartridge would never have appeared, and a small-caliber one too. At one time, my boss V.S. Raschetnov said that all our failed topics, for example, a cartridge with an arrow, an open chamber (trihedral telescope, cartridge), etc., were initiated by American disinformation. Joking. But all such topics were opened after the appearance of reports of such work in the United States. And they also stopped. As for the A6,7 submachine gun, it was made at the request of the Customer. I don't know the Customer's reasons. Did not participate in this work.
          1. +1
            April 24 2022 08: 42
            Thank you. From your answer, I have a question. You mentioned accuracy and I don’t understand why, while fighting for accuracy, the barrel does not thicken? In the slow-motion footage, you can see the barrel fluttering like a whip. Nevertheless, you do not add rigidity to the trunk.
            1. IVZ
              +8
              April 24 2022 08: 49
              In order to fit into the requirements of the TK in terms of mass, the DTK "balance" was made of titanium.
            2. +1
              April 26 2022 20: 37
              The barrel of the machine gun is made of chrome-molybdenum-vanadium steel. Its composition is a military secret. Thanks to this steel, the barrel does not bend during intense shooting and the internal mechanisms do not wedge, which is very important in combat. Those loads that AK can withstand, no Western analogue can withstand
          2. 0
            April 24 2022 09: 13
            And machine gunners do not work at 1000 meters

            But few people understand this, they understand the accuracy and firing range of Western automatic rifles.))) There were disputes here)))
            I see only one significant drawback with Kalash - a removable receiver cover. It's okay not to attach anything to it. Everything else - nothing "excessive", everything is in balance.
            And yes, the quality of domestic cartridges already needs to be seriously tightened up - imported ones (in the same caliber) have better accuracy.
            1. The comment was deleted.
            2. +3
              April 24 2022 16: 54
              Quote: lucul
              I see only one significant drawback with Kalash - a removable receiver cover.
              It wasn't there in the beginning.
              1. IVZ
                +2
                April 24 2022 19: 08
                The story develops in a spiral.
    2. -2
      April 24 2022 09: 18
      What do you think, if a 6 * 49 cartridge is used on AEK, its characteristics are impressive.

      The assault rifle is designed for a certain combat distance, the use of a 6 * 49 cartridge will increase the weight of the assault rifle and the fatigue of the soldier.
  7. +2
    April 24 2022 07: 15
    What I completely agree with the author is that the abundance of planks only adds tact and pathos to the weapon. However, this reduces ease of use and increases weight.

    From my sofa, I see the possibility of attaching a removable strap on the barrel for a flashlight / laser pointer, and similar mounting of two straps for a sight and something else. Everything else is from the evil one.
    [Center]

    But all the shortcomings of the AK-12 are more like PR. I am 100% sure that you can find an employee of the Kalashnikovsky enterprise who picks up no less a bunch of shortcomings from AEK. Or just wait until Aaron and the Professor authoritatively tell that both machines suck, Tavors and M-4 rule.
    1. IVZ
      +24
      April 24 2022 07: 45
      Of course. As a specialist, I am obliged to have my own opinion, but it is obligatory only for me, i.e. I don't force it on anyone. This platform is generally for discussion, which is what attracted me to it.
      1. +7
        April 24 2022 08: 40
        I'm not trying to judge or insult you in any way. Yes, you can see the insult that for some reason our good was not taken. It's ok, I'd be the same way.
        But unlike the same Timokhin, labels are not stuck on everyone and everything. And I love it.
    2. +1
      April 24 2022 07: 49
      I have just such a bar on Saiga-12, I have shot the collimator for 5 years already, I shoot and put it on every hunting trip, no problems! If you do not remove the butt, do not fold
    3. +1
      April 24 2022 09: 31
      Or just wait for Aaron and the Professor to authoritatively tell

      Pfffff.....))))
    4. 0
      April 24 2022 13: 43
      Quote: demiurg
      What I completely agree with the author is that the abundance of planks only adds tact and pathos to the weapon. However, this reduces ease of use and increases weight.

      From my sofa, I see the possibility of attaching a removable strap on the barrel for a flashlight / laser pointer, and similar mounting of two straps for a sight and something else. Everything else is from the evil one.
      [Center]

      But all the shortcomings of the AK-12 are more like PR. I am 100% sure that you can find an employee of the Kalashnikovsky enterprise who picks up no less a bunch of shortcomings from AEK. Or just wait until Aaron and the Professor authoritatively tell that both machines suck, Tavors and M-4 rule.


      It is heavy and bulky.
      1. 0
        April 27 2022 12: 39
        And short. A bunch of EoTech + Magnifier does not fit, except for short XPS / EXPS under an absolutely stupid CR123 battery
  8. 0
    April 24 2022 07: 44
    stuffing the receiver cover with another lantern under the eye

    Author, And with what weapon did you do it ???
    1. IVZ
      +8
      April 24 2022 07: 50
      AK-74. What was the matter no one understood. It was only me, although I actually know how to shoot.
      1. +3
        April 24 2022 08: 36
        Surprised. Honestly. I have never encountered such an incident, moreover, I don’t remember such an incident among my subordinates. Although they shot two days a week, 10 months a year. SVD - yes, it kicked with a sight in the eyebrow without an eyecup, in the RPG-7 it burned the cheek when the liner was broken, in the AK the finger was beaten off by the trigger when the trigger was incorrectly assembled, it was. But there were no black eye as a gift from the AKS-74 :)
        1. IVZ
          +11
          April 24 2022 08: 44
          Yes, everyone was surprised. With SVD, PKM, shorty "Kashtan" was never even close. but AK or AEK I start normally by the second store I catch. They joked "The neck is long."
          1. +1
            April 24 2022 18: 42
            Quote: IVZ
            They joked "The neck is long."

            Or they didn’t press the butt to the shoulder, at some point they shot from the hands. I saw this.
  9. 0
    April 24 2022 07: 58
    An interesting thing. Apparently every war needs its own weapons. Before the start of this one, I know that there were complaints about the AK-12, but with the start of the "special operation", there are fewer and fewer complaints. Maybe they really mastered it, understood what makes it different from their "big brothers" and began to use its advantages more fruitfully
    1. IVZ
      +1
      April 24 2022 08: 32
      What were the claims? Enlighten please if not difficult. I did not come across anything, but it's interesting. Thank you.
      1. +6
        April 24 2022 08: 51
        Quote: IVZ
        What were the claims?

        First of all, this is a design change, which led to the difficulties of its assembly and disassembly, relative to previous versions of the AK, the presence of small connecting parts that can be lost. The abundance of plastic raised doubts ... Somehow there were claims for reliability, but there seemed to be a factory defect in one of the first batches ...
        1. IVZ
          +2
          April 24 2022 08: 58
          Thank you.
  10. +2
    April 24 2022 08: 09
    Good article. Business. Respect to the author.
  11. 0
    April 24 2022 08: 16
    Don't know. I shot with AKS-74 for a year and a half. I have never hit myself with a black eye.
  12. +1
    April 24 2022 08: 49
    Quote: andrewkor
    I forgive the author for Andrey Cruz (in the previous article).

    Well, a lot can be forgiven for Cruz. One of my favorite authors. And in terms of educational program on weapons, the best. Kingdom of heaven to him.
  13. -1
    April 24 2022 10: 35
    AK 12, if evaluated from the point of view of energy efficiency, is undoubtedly a step forward. Even the modernization options for the AK 74 (AK 74 body kit) with slats and a folding adjustable butt also outperform the simple AK 74M. True, when landing with a parachute, some of the fighters spoiled their faces on this "washboard". But then they figured it out. Yes, and cleaning the machine now requires a toothbrush to pick out the dirt.))) But you can install both a flashlight and an optical sight. He is removed from the bar at a time. I am not a fan of collimators - apparently because I did not exploit them. And probably because I don’t like close contact. One thing strained in terms of the quality of the AK 12 is the appearance of a large number of SHP and MMG models of the AK 12 (I think this is all a marriage).
  14. 0
    April 24 2022 11: 22
    Thanks for the follow up. Have you read the articles by the editor-in-chief of the Kalashnikov magazine about the AK-12? He criticized the new design and workmanship of the product.
    1. IVZ
      +1
      April 24 2022 13: 34
      Unfortunately no. If it's easy to merge the link please.
      1. 0
        April 24 2022 13: 50
        https://youtu.be/a-b54qaNQK0
        They seem to have only 2 videos. But a curious look, although bilious)
        Do you have any plans for an article about your personal view, what should be the main machine gun (maybe as a result of articles about ak12)?
        1. IVZ
          +2
          April 24 2022 14: 01
          The article is not in the plan, but on moderation. Another thing was the attempt was too tough.
          1. 0
            April 24 2022 14: 05
            Why not on the teeth?
            1. IVZ
              +2
              April 24 2022 14: 15
              Because it is a very difficult task, it should be solved by a specialized research institute. I tried it and made sure.
              1. 0
                April 25 2022 12: 17
                I understand that whole offices are engaged in such things ... but I want to believe that a loner can still offer something. I hope that the time of singles has not passed.
                Can you tell me how many presenters are working on one rifle model?
                1. IVZ
                  0
                  April 25 2022 12: 39
                  Usually one.
    2. 0
      April 25 2022 06: 30
      https://www.kalashnikov.ru/proshhaj-kalashnikov/
      Ugh, b_t!
  15. 0
    April 24 2022 11: 55
    The author writes it is inconvenient to remove the receiver cover. What for? Cleaning can be done in a relaxed environment. Skewed - well, knocked out with your foot and shoot further. It's a bogus problem in my opinion.
    1. +2
      April 24 2022 13: 07
      Perhaps the ability to clean is a plus, but the lack of an opportunity is not a minus.
  16. 0
    April 24 2022 12: 16
    Why does the author consider the Russian soldier "Ivan the Fool" incapable of dealing with even the simplest collimator? American soldiers, NATO without exception have optics on their weapons.
    1. 0
      April 27 2022 11: 14
      It does not seem that the author thinks so. Our reality is that the army is equipped with conscripts who are serving an "honorable duty", which is why "they will either lose or break." In the USA, after all, there is a contract army, where people work with this equipment and equipment.
      1. 0
        2 May 2022 14: 47
        A conscript is not needed, but to teach how to handle is quite.
  17. +4
    April 24 2022 12: 22
    Thanks to the author!
    As for roughness, sure!
    Wade through the forest or greenery, jump out of the BMP hatch with weapons hung with washboards sucks. You will catch on at the most inopportune moment, you will get a fragment or a bullet.
    If you remember about pistols, from this point of view, PM and APS are out of competition. Slicked lines. You take it out / take it away without looking. Yarygin is an angular product in this regard.
    As for the scopes, I also agree. The last full-time machine gun was AK-74N with a night light 1PN58M. Remove / attach - three seconds. If the need for a nightlight has disappeared, and there is no box for the sight at hand, or you cannot be distracted, you can shoot through an open sight if necessary, you only need to move your eye a little lower. Is that possible with a picatinny rail? As far as I remember, one of the serious shortcomings of the first version of the Konstantinov sniper rifle, the commission in the 1961 competition recognized the impossibility of using a mechanical sight with an optical one installed. SVD had no problems with this initially.
    1. +1
      April 24 2022 15: 56
      Quote: Olgerd Gediminovich
      ...
      As for roughness, sure!
      Wade through the forest or greenery, jump out of the BMP hatch with weapons hung with washboards sucks. You will catch on at the most inopportune moment, you will get a fragment or a bullet.
      ...


      It is not clear why to integrate the strips directly into the design. It is enough to make them easy to install. For example, as in the KeyMod or T-bolt standards.






      And the forearm is smooth, and the straps can be installed.

      If these standards specifically do not suit us, develop something of our own "based on".
      1. IVZ
        +3
        April 24 2022 19: 00
        When the SCAR rifle, developed as a designer for special forces, was offered to participate in the competition held by the Bundeswehr to replace the G-36, a fixed version of this rifle had to be developed. Army weapons are almost never supplied as a DIY kit. More often additional options are created.
        1. 0
          April 27 2022 11: 16
          SCAR was not offered in the Bundeswehr.
          1. IVZ
            0
            April 27 2022 11: 48
            "FNAC. A carbine based on the SCAR Mk.16. Unlike the main model, it does not have the ability to quickly change the barrel. The carbine is also slightly lighter than the Mk.16, the front sight is attached somewhat differently and there is a bayonet mount. FNAC took part in the competition for replacement for the M4 carbine, but the winner was never announced." https://militaryarms.ru/ Was the same option considered as a possible participant in the competition to replace the G-36? But whether I participated, I won’t say, I just wasn’t interested.
            1. 0
              April 27 2022 12: 10
              Didn't participate. There, NCs run the show. (416 and 433). The MK-16, like its modifications, was not needed by NATO. Only the MK-17 took root under 7,62x51 from the American Navy Seal
  18. +6
    April 24 2022 12: 24
    Collimator and optical sights. It's not easy here
    Everything is simple here: they are needed. An experienced shooter does not need them? But the shooter needs to live to become experienced. But a worthless shooter (I) with a collimator aims significantly faster and more accurately (2 times, probably). Everything is clear about the optical sight: you need at least 4x fix (not PSO, but at least sealed so that water does not get into it), but better 2-8, otherwise the Americans with such sights will shoot ours at distances greater than 200 m .
    everyone understood how long optics would live in the hands of a conscript soldier in the process of combat training, and even more so in combined arms combat
    So make normal military optics that will live in the hands of a conscript! It's not easy, but it's possible.
    it is necessary to remove the optics from the bar, and this is a certain hemorrhoids for Picatinny
    Picatinny may well stand on a dovetail (I have a Nikon sight attached to the Tiger). But that's not the point: this is a military, not a hunting weapon, compatibility with standard accessories has not rested on you. Bad picatinny or weaver? No question: make your own mount for your scope, which would provide both a secure fixation, and easy replacement, and maintaining zeroing and (absolutely necessary!) The ability to simultaneously use a conventional front sight. Put two of them on the machine: one for a collimator optic (yes, two in one, there are such), the other for a night light. By the way, with a laser pointer indoors it is even better than with a collimator, you can shoot more or less accurately "from the belly".
    Bipod and assault grips in the options something with something
    The assault handle protects the hand from that idiot who screwed the bar onto the forearm. No, gloves are fine, but for example, gloves are uncomfortable for me.
  19. +1
    April 24 2022 13: 31
    Bravo, the author, everything is written in the case. And about the picatinny and about the "posted" barrel. Well, that's why when we have an original development we get AK and T-34 and 7,62x39, and when an imitation of someone, then such cadavers.
  20. +1
    April 24 2022 13: 46
    Tell me, as a complete layman, what difference will the average person see if an AK-74 is pulled out of his hands and given an AK-12? Will he shoot a little more accurately? Aim a little faster? Or perhaps the AK-12 is lighter and will tire less?
  21. 0
    April 24 2022 18: 17
    Question, the author proposes to leave the Soviet version of the side rail for attaching sighting devices to attach the Picatinny rail to it already?
    And it seems like on the last AK-12 the front sight is fixed on the DTK.
    1. IVZ
      +2
      April 24 2022 18: 29
      No. The author analyzes the design features of the sample and compares it with currently existing solutions.
  22. +1
    April 25 2022 04: 25
    I have a civilian analogue of the AK-12, TR-3, personal feelings: comfortable, fits perfectly on the shoulder, compared to a smooth Saiga with a frame butt; it is difficult to understand, it will be difficult for a conscript to mess with him; due to the shifted sight, it was impossible to put an optical sight without a raising bar, I had to buy more; haven't fired it yet, hunting season
    missed, I'll wait for autumn
  23. 0
    April 25 2022 07: 04
    Baryshev rested in Bose and his system passed unnoticed by the world. Just amazing momentum. They say that in order to calculate the Baryshev shutter, an unbelievable mathematical background is required. I led the topic on Hansa and proved that this is not so. However, a nuance emerged. Most of my interlocutors consider weapons in the program. And they refuse to think otherwise. This is more accurate, more reliable in terms of errors, but there is no algorithm for Baryshev. :) The benefit of just such a shutter (it can be called semi-free with a reservation, since the "semi-freedom" in it is limited) is that the recoil energy from the very first moment the bullet moves along the barrel is partially adsorbed not into the mass of the machine gun, but into the movable sprung gate. I can still discuss this topic, about the possibility of eliminating shortcomings in simple ways. But it seems that only I, a non-specialist, need this.
    1. IVZ
      +2
      April 25 2022 07: 51
      Weird, but great. Any reputable specialized office has a settlement and analytical bureau whose task is to carry out calculations of any complexity. And if your calculators can not cope, you can contact some research institute. Baryshev's system is a combination of semi-free locking with roll-out ... of moving parts and you can't say, rather with sequential roll-out of parts of moving parts. Disadvantages - shooting only from the rear sear (otherwise there will be no roll-out), sensitivity to pollution, a problem with a long shot and a wary attitude of colleagues.
      1. +1
        April 25 2022 09: 43
        After all, I provided the model "for stimulus" and exhaustive formulas from a physics textbook for the seventh grade, it seems, of a comprehensive school. Along the way, a sketch of a shutter device on the same principle, differing structurally. He showed the fundamental possibility of firing from a closed bolt. A couple of people moved in. But this is not the complexity of the model.
        Well, that is, he chewed it and put it in his mouth.
        Excuse me for being all about mine, but I consider it my duty to remind you of this undoubtedly valuable design decision.
  24. 0
    April 25 2022 07: 19
    I read it. Thank you. Interesting.
    But I would like to hear the opinion of specialists. I have read opinions on the Internet many times. That SVT was worse than the "Three-ruler". For the reason that the soldiers of the Red Army did not clean the first one.
    So maybe it’s easier for every fighter to teach in the morning that cap on the gas outlet tube is slightly unscrewed, and then wrapped, taught?
    1. IVZ
      +2
      April 25 2022 08: 23
      It's not about teaching, it's about teaching. It is much more difficult - the mentality sir ..
      1. 0
        April 25 2022 11: 36
        What mentality? You do not specify?
    2. 0
      April 25 2022 08: 25
      I would like to ask the designers of the AK-12 a couple of questions
      1 you have a picatinny rail longer than the barrel !!! why did you do this?
      2 if dirt gets on the bar and dries, then how is it picked out of the grooves, just with a screwdriver or what kind of scraper is provided?
      By the way, isn’t this wonderful bar sold separately somewhere, probably it can be screwed to the shovel handle in order to change the bayonet piece of iron to the shovel and vice versa
      And for those who like to downvote without bothering to argue, I had to make a quick-release mount for optics, and so for this, no "toothed" picatini is needed.
      1. IVZ
        +3
        April 25 2022 08: 45
        Sorry for being in charge of AK designers. The question should be addressed to the designers of these bars and the developers of the technical specifications for the machine, who scored their use. The trouble is that we missed the moment when it was possible to develop something of our own. We have lost our positions as equal trendsetters in arms fashion. And the cleaning of such places is done with pieces of wood.
        1. 0
          April 25 2022 10: 50
          Quote: IVZ
          . The trouble is that we missed the moment when it was possible to develop something of our own

          The gear rack known since the Middle Ages must be "developed" in a new way at the research institute, and bright minds are needed for this !!! ? I suspect that any normal toolmaker (whether it be his will, if for himself) will remove this picatinny so as not to pick with pieces of wood
          1. 0
            April 25 2022 11: 39
            Quote: agond
            And for those who like to downvote without bothering to argue, I had to make a quick-release mount for optics, and so for this, no "toothed" picatini is needed.

            Once again I am convinced that this site is dominated by fans of a positive rating, there is no argument, and those who did something on the topic under discussion with their own hands did not meet at all.
          2. IVZ
            0
            April 25 2022 17: 11
            A huge number of accessories around the world have been developed for mounting on a picatinny rail. If we develop something else now, these accessories will go to waste, and we will have to develop our own for a new bar, and they will be applicable only here. In principle, I also believe that the Picatinny rail should be changed to something more suitable for the army user, plus an adapter for the existing body kit as a temporary solution to the compatibility problem. But this is practically a political decision not of my level.
      2. 0
        April 25 2022 18: 44
        Planks are sold, of course, both in the form of a finished product and in the form of a blank. Edited mine locally. Piccatini is a classic option, there is also a Weaver bar - it is considered worse, not all brackets fit.

        1. 0
          April 25 2022 19: 56
          I repeated it many times and again I have to, if we consider the AK-12 a new machine gun, then the approach should be a new one, an open method of aiming, of course it is needed, but it should be based on an electronic sight, based on a camera for near ultraviolet, such cameras are many times smaller than usual and if, instead of a front sight, a tube with a diameter of 20-25 mm is welded, a very good camera should fit in it and no other removable sights with picatinny sights will be needed, by the way, the shorter the wavelength, the higher the resolution of the optical device, a vivid example of the bird's eye
          1. 0
            April 25 2022 20: 36
            Well, there was nothing left - to carry the battery behind the fighter on a cart, to this electronic sight. Since he's the main one. You can even screw a light guide into the optics, even screw in tritium capsules - all this fits in a standard case and does not burden the user, at the very least you can unscrew everything from the bar at any time and use the mechanics, and for the period of night time screw on a greenhouse or a night light with a minimum shift of the STP. Until it dawns and the need is gone. And in your version, you also need to carry an individual charging station, gasoline or diesel. Or pull the cables from the power source, yeah. Kind of sad.
      3. 0
        30 May 2022 12: 55
        Serrated bar - is it bad?
  25. +1
    April 26 2022 20: 32
    Convenient fire mode switch forgot to mention
  26. 0
    April 27 2022 08: 33
    Quote: kytx
    The scouts in Afghanistan had the same opinion, if a machine gun is needed, they take a PC, if something is easier, they take an ak. PKK was not in demand.

    In Afghanistan, there was nothing to hang on the RPK, now with a tune from the RPK you can make a serious blaster, and a thicker and longer barrel in some conditions decides!

  27. +2
    April 27 2022 11: 38
    I will argue with the author a little:
    1. The L85/L86 SUSAT sight is not built-in, it can be removed, this rifle is simply equipped with it instead of the “mechanics”, it is removed with a screwdriver and such and such a mother. The latest versions of the "lahi" (those that NK upgraded) are equipped with a picatinny rail, on which any sight is placed.
    2. The G-36 sight is such a muck - an optical tube of small diameter, the focal length is not very good, well, that's it. I have repeatedly seen photos of Bundeswehr fighters who have EoTech instead of a regular collimator on top of the optics, KSK generally has a Picatinny rail with mechanical sights (set from MP-7) instead of the standard one. The local special forces put quite "traditional" ACOGs, EoTechs and other magnifiers on it.
    3. I did not hold AUG in my hands.
    Regarding the "need" of a laser pointer or a flashlight: if you are in a building and constantly alternate rooms where there is lighting with dark nooks, where there may be a bad guy / stretching, the flashlight helps out and saves your life. In the "green" in low light conditions, the flashlight only interferes, the shadows from the foliage / bushes will not allow you to see anything at all, and your position will be given out at once. A laser is needed, only an IR for working with night vision devices, when you can’t aim at the sight because of the “night light” hanging on the face of the face. The handles are very good crap, but not all sorts of QDs, but normal ones like the Magpul RVGs, which are bolted to the picatini.
    Removing the scope from the picatinny is very simple - either unscrew a couple of thumbscrews, or flip the flag(s) of the quick-release mounts. A mechanical sight as a backup is needed, if the battery in the RedDot is dead or broken / broken / loved, you can fold back the rear sight and front sight and aim through them without removing the collimator.
    1. IVZ
      0
      April 27 2022 13: 10
      Quick-release mounts on the picatinny rail just did not meet. Thanks for enlightening me. The last AUGs (held in my hands) also with a bar for any sight. I just didn't see our father. developments, namely they will go to the army, had such mounts under the picatinny rails. However, a lot has changed in recent years. Give God.
      1. 0
        April 27 2022 13: 29
        Amerovsky army ACOG is fastened with two knurled nuts. To remove - a second of business.
        1. IVZ
          0
          April 27 2022 14: 05
          Amerovsky does not chirp me. They will not supply our motorized riflemen. And the mounts are still far from ideal in terms of convenience. Compared to ours for the side plank, they are very far.
          1. 0
            April 27 2022 14: 17
            Fasteners as fasteners. The bolt carrier handle is on the right, they are on the left, i.e. do not interfere, but it is reliable and simple. QD-shki (quick-detachable) is still a circus.
  28. +1
    April 27 2022 21: 41
    Good afternoon, colleagues. On points at the expense of reasoning on AK-12, I will explain the following:
    1. The sight on the AK-12 is mechanical, diopter, in any case, according to GOST 28653-2018 "Small arms. Terms and definitions". Based on modern requirements for shooting accuracy, it has no other alternatives among mechanical sights.
    2. Planks on the forearm - a harsh inevitable reality. The equipment installed on them (each) is already supplied. The lower and upper are quite successfully inscribed in the forearm and do not worsen (for me they even improve) the grip. The lateral ones are needed by a limited circle of specialists, therefore they are removable to save weight and dimensions.
    3. A removable receiver cover is, of course, not from a good life, but it fully satisfies all requirements.
    4. The front sight block has become a muzzle brake block to reduce weight (in general, if it’s not clear why something was done in the AK-12, consider it for the same). The DTK is removable, since it is not the only muzzle device that can (and should!) be installed on the muzzle. + it is necessary to clean the DTC sometimes.
    5. For the design of the gas tube, see item 4.
    6. Cleaning rod yes, collapsible. Yes, sometimes you need to get it urgently. According to experience, approximately 5 times for 50-70 thousand shots. Yes, they successfully placed it on 6P67-6P68, until the opposite is proven. It must be said, however, that with the advent of underbarrel grenade launchers, the problem of placing a ramrod on an AK was not solved better than in the AK-12.
    At the expense of the general conclusion: I feel the influence of long-standing brotherly love and absolute impartiality between representatives of different weapons schools in our country. We love each other so much that we can't eat or sleep. In the AK-12, all the tasks set for the industry have been solved: to increase combat effectiveness, integrate modern instrumentation systems and, which is very important, SAVE ACCEPTABLE WEIGHT. If, at the same time, the automaton is visually little different from the prototype, this indicates that the designer managed to fit an archaic, but proven and proven design into the new paradigm, which is not only difficult, but also an extremely useful task from many points of view.
    1. IVZ
      0
      April 28 2022 06: 57
      Sarcasm about brotherly love. You know better, but I won’t take it personally. In Soviet times, we designers were regularly supplied with chipboard information, including the "Information Collection" magazine. One of the issues was devoted to sighting devices of various types, and there an exhaustive explanation was given of how a diopter sight - a sight related to closed-type sights, differs from an open sight, at least with a round slot. GOST does not give such definitions. I still trust the specialists of that era more. As for the slats on the forearm, their convenience for me is doubtful, and judging by the comments to the article, not only for me. What is the gain in mass if you cut off part of the fly block and then build up the gas chamber? Grams. Even if you do not use titanium to make the fly pad. As for the ramrod, I agree out of respect for my colleagues. And of course, you can disagree with the conclusion, but I'm just expressing my personal opinion.
      1. +1
        April 28 2022 21: 10
        There can be no objectivity in structures that have been competing for so long, especially when it comes to specific things like small arms: strongly tied to the personality of the developer, and now also associated with the market economy. Faced repeatedly, and he himself is a sinner. Look for an interview with Shipunov A.G., it seems in the book "A Conversation with a Gunsmith": there a person is not shy in expressions. At the expense of GOST, I turn on the bore and quote excerpts: "174 diopter sight of small arms: Mechanical sight of small arms, the rear sight of which has a diopter." , "183 diopters small arms sight: A hole in the rear sight of a mechanical small arms sight through the center of which the line of sight passes." GOST is a law for an engineer and it is on its basis that documentation is developed. Therefore, in the documentation, the sight is diopter. On the forearm: believe me, it turned out well. Those users for whom it is intended (they are most likely not in the comments) are generally satisfied. There are, however, those who need even more slats on the forearm. For them, perhaps, something will also appear in the foreseeable future (google "AK-EVO" / "AK-EVO"). According to the block: a couple of grams of savings is a lot. When you need to take a machine gun weighing 3,6 kg, shove a bunch of straps, an adjustable stock and other offal into it and get a machine gun weighing 3,5 kg, there is a struggle for every gram. As for the conclusion: as I understand it, you know how hard it is: the development of military small arms, requiring complete dedication, and at the same time, often absolutely ungrateful (give the name of the AK-12 lead designer and guess the size of his salary). At the same time, to say that the product is premature (only 12 years of development), designers are chasing fashion and, in general, the design school is stagnating, in my opinion, is disrespectful in relation to their colleagues. PS The pins in the gas chamber are not just from the bottom: their location next to the gas outlet leads to the risk of a breakthrough of part of the gases into the gap between the gas chamber and the barrel during serial production.
        1. IVZ
          0
          April 29 2022 07: 49
          Worked in this system. I am familiar with its features. I know what corporate solidarity is, but I do not think that I was biased. You can disagree with my opinion, this is your right, but believe me, I did not try to offend anyone, I just expressed what I thought. Sorry if I'm wrong and good luck to you and your colleagues.
          1. 0
            April 30 2022 19: 53
            And forgive me if I was too harsh. This topic is somewhat personal for me. I wish you good luck and peaceful sky
  29. 0
    22 May 2022 11: 03
    However, watching the dreary process of removing the cover from the machine, you involuntarily think - what if in combat conditions you have to eliminate the delay

    But what, on 6P67 "Kord 5.45" the butt plate of the receiver is removed less drearily? and delays are easier to eliminate?

    but also to lose in general, and not only theoretically

    and in the same 6P67 the butt plate is tied to the receiver with a cable so as not to lose it, is it not otherwise?

    difficult to aim in conditions of poor visibility and low light

    as I understand it, the author has not heard about shooting with two eyes open, but she works "with a bang" with an aperture sight

    and for this it is necessary to remove the optics from the bar, and this is a certain hemorrhoids for Picatinny. The same operation for the regular side bar is much easier and faster

    the author has not heard about the "quick releases" on the Picatinny rail ...

    bracket-adapter mounted on a standard side rail of the weapon and having two Picatinny rails: the top one for sights and the side one for the flashlight

    light on the side of the receiver? Hard case. Firstly, it will interfere with folding the butt. Secondly, it will interfere with the position of the machine on the chest. And thirdly, the receiver and the barrel of the machine gun will "eat up" the entire right half of the illuminated field, and the reflection from the receiver will blind the shooter in the dark
    1. IVZ
      0
      22 May 2022 18: 56
      And what about "Kord" in general? Is he ideal for you? My shooting training is more advanced than that of an average motorized rifleman, for whom, by and large, the AK-12 was created, but I couldn’t accurately shoot with two eyes open at a more or less decent distance. However, this may be my problem. On those slats that I saw, the lantern stands above the crest of the folded butt.
      1. 0
        23 May 2022 15: 31
        > And where does "Kord" in general?
        well, you point out the design flaw of the Ak-12, I compare it with the design of Korda, which was created under the same TTT by your colleagues

        >but accurately shoot with two eyes open at a more or less decent distance
        it was about shooting with a diopter at dusk, but what kind of "decent" distances can we talk about? and at 100-150 meters from two eyes it’s not a problem at all to work with a diopter

        >I saw a flashlight above the crest of a folded butt.
        and all the same, the receiver, forearm and barrel "eat up" half of the illuminated field to the right of the axis of the weapon. Personally verified, I tried to put a flashlight on a weapon in this way. I had to carry it under the trunk.
        1. IVZ
          0
          23 May 2022 17: 03
          The shortcomings of the Korda design in no way offset the shortcomings of the AK-12, and it is possible to compare the newly adopted sample, no matter who it is designed, only with the predecessor of which it replaces, especially if this sample is made on its basis and, in essence, there is little different from him. Well, as for the sight ... The diopter sight was stubbornly rejected by the Customer on the basis of understanding the experience of using weapons in various conflicts and wars, and only now, when there is too much incomprehensible and illogical, he suddenly became in demand. I have a strong feeling that this is by no means due to increased professionalism and other tasty goodies. There is some kind of populist sporting of military weapons that is by no means beneficial to him. Once upon a time, reputable research institutes conducted research and gave recommendations to designers on various solutions and materials used. Now this is not the case, but I would like to understand on the basis of what research was the decision made on the sight of not a sports or amateur, but an army machine gun? What has changed so dramatically? However, the question is rhetorical. I don't want to and won't talk about it.
          1. 0
            23 May 2022 18: 02
            > and to compare the newly adopted sample, no matter who it was designed, can only be compared with the predecessor of which it replaces
            Excuse me, why can't it be compared with a direct competitor, with whom it was tested and put into service?

            >Diopter sight stubbornly rejected by the Customer
            At the same time, the same customer, since the time of Abakan, has been putting forward TTT in terms of accuracy and accuracy of shooting, performed only with a diopter

            > based on understanding the experience of using weapons in various conflicts and wars
            I understand that the rest of the world has not fought in your imagination since 1945 and did not comprehend the experience? there, even the Finns and Israelis, comprehend all the advantages of the Kalashnikov assault rifle, put diopters on it
            I'm not even talking about the Swiss you mentioned, as well as the forgotten Italians, Belgians, and so on.

            >What has changed so dramatically?
            Once again I urge you to look at the prototypes of the assault rifles tested during the Abakan competition. Almost all of them had diopters, but they were by no means designed by "athletes", and the supervision of TsNIITOCHMASH was in full growth ...
            1. IVZ
              0
              25 May 2022 06: 31
              In order not to be mistaken about "Abakan" I met with a direct participant in the events. "TsNIITOCHMASH supervision" did not apply to the process of designing samples, and the use of diopters was noted (recorded) as a drawback. In general, I don’t really understand where such “undoubted” judgments about the position of the GRAU on the patron, about the role of Klimovsk in “Abakan”, etc. come from. As for sarcasm about forgetfulness, it is not very appropriate. The samples you mentioned have never been interesting in terms of their designs. And to remember, or rather, to remember each piece of iron through, because the designer is still not a walking registry.
              1. 0
                25 May 2022 12: 55
                >the use of diopters was noted (recorded) as a disadvantage
                military who are accustomed to open sights
                but at the same time, the same military put up such TTTs that it was impossible to perform them without a diopter, which forced all designers to put them on. rather than the usual open mechanical

                >where so "doubtless" judgments about the position of the GRAU on the cartridge, about the role of Klimovsk in "Abakan"
                From the book of Dvoryaninov. Hope. the name tells you something.

                >more precisely remember each passage piece of iron
                so after all, diopters have been on ALL the main modern foreign machine guns and autorifles since the beginning of the 1950s, since the days of FAL, G3, M16 and other M16 :)
                I think it's hard to forget
  30. 0
    24 May 2022 23: 18
    Author, buy a civilian version of the ak-12 and make sure the side picatinny rails are removable. The lasta increases the weight of the weapon and does not allow you to fold the butt without removing the sight. The hanging trunk is a definite plus. In general, we get tr-3 (civilian ak-12) and enjoy.
  31. 0
    5 July 2022 11: 33
    In many respects I agree with the author about the open sight and the side bar. If the gun is used at the shooting range or hunting, when there is a car nearby, you can hang anything. Choosing between tr3 and 74m, I chose the latter. The variety of side crowns allows us to solve the problem of binding collimators and a flashlight, the magnifer is a strange weight, after overcoming a small swamp, a person had to disassemble this Lego at a halt for cleaning. In my case, the block with a collimator and a flashlight was in a case. The second block with op hung next to the first, later on he didn’t take it with him at all. I thought about attaching a telescope with a shock absorber, while I was looking, I found a damper on the butt plate of the required length, later I refused a new butt, because in the process I found out the suitability of the standard plastic one.
  32. 0
    20 July 2022 22: 15
    ".... I did not hold the AK-12 in my hands and I can only judge by pictures and videos from the network." You don't have to read further! hi negative stop

"Right Sector" (banned in Russia), "Ukrainian Insurgent Army" (UPA) (banned in Russia), ISIS (banned in Russia), "Jabhat Fatah al-Sham" formerly "Jabhat al-Nusra" (banned in Russia) , Taliban (banned in Russia), Al-Qaeda (banned in Russia), Anti-Corruption Foundation (banned in Russia), Navalny Headquarters (banned in Russia), Facebook (banned in Russia), Instagram (banned in Russia), Meta (banned in Russia), Misanthropic Division (banned in Russia), Azov (banned in Russia), Muslim Brotherhood (banned in Russia), Aum Shinrikyo (banned in Russia), AUE (banned in Russia), UNA-UNSO (banned in Russia), Mejlis of the Crimean Tatar people (banned in Russia), Legion “Freedom of Russia” (armed formation, recognized as terrorist in the Russian Federation and banned), Kirill Budanov (included to the Rosfinmonitoring list of terrorists and extremists)

“Non-profit organizations, unregistered public associations or individuals performing the functions of a foreign agent,” as well as media outlets performing the functions of a foreign agent: “Medusa”; "Voice of America"; "Realities"; "Present time"; "Radio Freedom"; Ponomarev Lev; Ponomarev Ilya; Savitskaya; Markelov; Kamalyagin; Apakhonchich; Makarevich; Dud; Gordon; Zhdanov; Medvedev; Fedorov; Mikhail Kasyanov; "Owl"; "Alliance of Doctors"; "RKK" "Levada Center"; "Memorial"; "Voice"; "Person and law"; "Rain"; "Mediazone"; "Deutsche Welle"; QMS "Caucasian Knot"; "Insider"; "New Newspaper"