Military Review

"The Big Two". Union of Russia with China - pro et contra

89
"The Big Two". Union of Russia with China - pro et contra

The Winter Olympics in Beijing is still going on, and the most important thing has already happened. Russia and China, together with the entire international community, have strengthened their allied relations.


From West to East


The beginning of 2022 for Russia turned out to be very stormy. The stakes on the "playing" field called "Ukraine" have risen almost to the limit. The United States began to stir up the “frozen” conflict in the Donbass, pushing the authorities in Kiev to take active military action in every possible way.

It is clear that "square" is nothing more than a tool in dexterous and hard-working hands, and the goal is to finally subjugate Europe through the destruction of economic and political ties with Russia. Moscow had to dare and show its "teeth" - an ultimatum was issued by the US and NATO on security guarantees under the brief motto "stop, otherwise ...".

And then another surprise was the "almost revolution" in Kazakhstan. Russia had to act: the CSTO operation was carried out quickly and professionally. Moscow has shown that it controls the situation on its eastern flank. Opponents of the Russian Federation, whom it is not necessary to enumerate, wiped themselves and hid. But we must understand that the problems in Kazakhstan have not disappeared. Attempts to shake up the situation in this place will definitely be made.

Of course, in such an environment, it was necessary to slightly open the “valve” and, if possible, relieve tension. And Vladimir Putin made a smart geopolitical move - he went to visit his friend Xi Jinping at the opening of the XXIV Winter Olympics. It turned out, as in healing gymnastics: if the West is an inhalation, then the East is definitely an exhalation.

The meeting of two leaders is an epoch-making event in any case. The head of China, due to the coronavirus pandemic, practically did not meet with the leaders of other countries for two years. And although the president and the general secretary did not shake hands, it was immediately clear that old allies had met.

It's not even that Putin came to support China's global sports project. All attempts by the collective West to prevent the Olympics by and large were unsuccessful. Heads of more than 30 states and international organizations came to the opening of the sports holiday.

But the main action in Beijing was outside the sports theme - Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping held three-hour talks. Their outcome was the signing of a joint statement on contemporary international relations.

The situation in the world is such that Russia and China are forced to adapt to each other and form, if not a single, then a common political agenda on many topical issues. Thus, both sides confirmed their unwillingness to see the expansion of NATO and the further deployment of American missiles in Europe and Asia.

The PRC, importantly, supported the “categorical” proposals put forward by Russia from the US and NATO on security guarantees in Europe. The parties also stated that they are seriously concerned about the creation of the AUKUS (US, UK and Australia) alliance. It is clear that this is Russia's contribution to the common political "treasury".

Many experts generally believe that the new military alliance is aimed primarily at containing China. Therefore, another “contribution” of Moscow is also important: confirmation of the position in relation to Taiwan. It is considered an integral part of China, the Russian Federation opposes its independence in any form.

2.0 Union


However, as is known, there was no breakthrough at the other political "pole". Beijing never agreed to recognize Crimea as part of Russia. The problem is that the peninsula joined the Russian Federation through a referendum. And the Taiwanese authorities are ready to hold a referendum, but in the opposite direction - on the recognition of independence from China.

Beijing is clearly not happy with such a scenario, and Crimea has, in fact, been left out of the allied document. Nevertheless, the two countries' own statement says that the new type of Russian-Chinese relations "superior" the military-political alliances of the Cold War.

Various formulations of the new union immediately appeared. For example, the cute Big Two. The West also reacted to the meeting between Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping. The head of EU diplomacy, Josep Borrell, called the cooperation between Russia and China "a powerful authoritarian alliance."

The wording is harsh, but at the same time understandable - the collective West desperately needs to formulate an ideological base for the onslaught on Russia and China. Indeed, in the days of the Soviet Union, the opposition was clear: capitalism VS socialism.

But now everything is different. The Russian Federation has been trying for 30 years to live according to capitalist rules, at the very least, but our country has joined the system of the international division of labor, and integrated into the global financial system, the trade sector.

China also works according to capitalist laws, socialist postulates are only a framework for the country's stability and a program for the future. Almost all TNCs have settled in China, European and American companies live and live in China. What an attractive market!


Photo: panthermedia/vostock-photo

Therefore, the West has to paint enemies in haste. Now his world is divided into two camps: democracy versus authoritarianism. The conflict is far-fetched, and from this the seams sewn with white threads are visible everywhere. After all, Europe had a great chance to draw Russia to itself to the fullest. And our country was ready for it.

It is no coincidence that Vladimir Putin recently remembered that Russia intended to become a member of NATO in the 90s. Ending the military confrontation on the continent is a truly great project.

Yes, the trouble is that world politics is run by small people with the mentality of usurers. The United States, which considered itself the main winner in the Cold War, did not need a united Europe from edge to edge. "Divide and Conquer" is an eternal formula.

Europe + Russia is, after all, an autonomous system that does not need an overseas “master”. And we must understand that the current onslaught on Russia directly correlates with the dynamics of economic and political problems in the United States itself.

With China, the situation is somewhat different. The Celestial Empire is clearly moving towards its goal - to become the No. 1 leader in the world. If not politically, then economically for sure. Moreover, Beijing managed to work in the “soft power” mode for quite a long time, avoiding direct political and military conflicts.

The United States once realized that the huge "industrial site" for the assembly of Western technological products had disappeared. And in its place, an economic monster appeared, which deftly collected a huge layer of technologies, began to develop them independently, and even shows exorbitant growth rates.

He must be stopped! But how? military and political pressure. Therefore, Taiwan appeared here, the confrontation in the South China Sea, the hasty formation of AUKUS, the Uighur factor, etc.

In such a situation, Russia and China, while actively developing economic cooperation in recent years, have somehow found themselves in the same "military-political" boat. And now politics and economics are tightly connected, at least for Russia.

China, are you with us?


The Russian Federation and China now have to dynamically develop a common mechanism for responding to emerging threats. After all, even until recently, to be honest, many European subjects and problems in Beijing were deeply “off the mark”.

Now the Celestial Empire has to learn, adopt Russia's experience in surviving in the new cold war. Moscow will have much more practice here than Beijing. And at the same time, Russia is beginning to support Chinese concepts and slogans, even at the level of terminology.

Sinologists point to a number of bright points. Thus, the first sentence in the joint statement: “today the world is undergoing large-scale changes, humanity is entering a new era” are the postulates formulated by Xi Jinping. The declaration also speaks of a "community with a common destiny for mankind."

This concept also appeared under Comrade Xi. Therefore, the Chinese leitmotif will now be heard more and more strongly. The mouthpiece of the "Big Two" will soon become a powerful information tool, primarily for China.

If we evaluate the new union strategically, then we must clearly understand that Russia will have to get out of the Ukrainian conflict that is brewing more and more on its own. China will, of course, support our country with diplomatic measures and statements, but nothing more.

Moscow will have to resolve the situation itself, when the third most powerful army in the world has practically lost space for its maneuver, and the United States and NATO are almost telling Russia how and where to move troops on its territory.

Another key point is that close economic cooperation with China is now vital for our country. Beijing simply does not have such sharpness. If for the Russian Federation the PRC is, in fact, the No. 1 foreign economic partner, then for the Celestial Empire the foreign economic mosaic is much more diverse. Russia's share fluctuates around a few percent.

In other words, cooperation in the economy will develop, but China will choose the most profitable projects, primarily resource ones. And the Russian Federation will have to make concessions somewhere. For example, Beijing is very interested in the development of the Arctic, and Moscow will be forced one way or another to expand the "corridor" of China's presence in this region. Although until recently it seemed that the Arctic “field” was only Russian.

Another important point is that now there is a confrontation, first of all, technologies. Technological tools for waging economic and real wars will be used constantly. Therefore, dependence on the products of the hostile side is associated with huge risks.
It so happened that Russia found itself sandwiched between two technological giants: the United States with its satellites and China. If the former is an established technological center, then China is a developing center. Russia, of course, has its own technological breakthroughs: production weapons, space technology, nuclear equipment.

But all this is of an “island” nature; our country does not have a continuous technological background. This is clearly shown by the structure of Russian exports to China - they are predominantly raw materials. The prospect of becoming a "raw material appendage" in the "Big Two" is unlikely to appeal to a country that claims an independent role in the world.

Mentality and exoticism


Do not discount the psychological factors. Whatever one may say, Russia has all its eyes turned to the West, to Europe. Although we are different, we understand and gravitate towards each other, connected by numerous threads.


China, for the majority of Russians, is still a big and incomprehensible exotic. We do not yet fully realize what a monster looms over us in the East - a country with a population of 1,5 billion and an economy that is about to surpass America's.

You can treat Vladimir Pozner differently, but you should listen to his opinion about China:

“As for the Russia-China bloc, I believe that this is impossible. China doesn't need it. China today is such a powerful power and so independent, making its own decisions, that it does not need any bloc.”

The TV presenter believes that for the PRC, an alliance with Russia is secondary. Beijing aims to become the dominant power in the world. Russia in the current situation, of course, still needs to rely on China. But we must understand that this "mountain" is constantly moving.

Therefore, it is better to talk about a “dynamic alliance” for now, where each side has its own vector of movement. And our country will still have to decide on its place on the planet. The formula “and who is here with Vasya and me?”, Alas, will not work.
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  1. Maks1995
    Maks1995 15 February 2022 13: 14
    +20
    What a naivety.
    An attempt to explain everything with giant provincial town templates.

    IMHO. China did not give up economically weak, corrupt Russian Federation. Gas, wood, minerals supplies - and okay. Money doesn't smell.
    No Crimea, no LDNR, no investments. No major news from the GDP trip.
    Blah blah can be different, but there is no union.

    It will somehow resolve the issue with Taiwan, and will develop further.
    1. Anachoret
      Anachoret 15 February 2022 13: 19
      +1
      It is clear that this is not an alliance, but a ride) and we are now traveling in the same direction with China, but everyone has their own destinations) and you need to understand that China under Deng Xiaoping already turned away under a pretty pretext) so it’s not much to be touched by masks it’s worth it, but it’s also not worth refusing, and losing one’s own from such cooperation)
      It is not necessary to strive to be the first) you can be the second, provided that with the third with a pair (who wants to become the first) you can always bend the first and change the leader)
    2. knn54
      knn54 15 February 2022 13: 23
      -2
      The BEST friendship is to be friends against someone.
      Although (there was an article on VO recently about a Russian analyst and intelligence officer, General Vandam) it remains to "pull up" Germany ..
      The Anglo-Saxons over the past centuries have been DEADLY afraid of the union of Russia, Germany and Japan.
      Now China has entered the arena.
      1. Maks1995
        Maks1995 15 February 2022 14: 25
        -1
        Everyone is so afraid of everyone. Everyone is friends in a circle against those who have pulled ahead.
        And if now the Saxons are well known, then others will come up ...
      2. ViacheslavS
        ViacheslavS 16 February 2022 12: 39
        0
        If you look at history, we were on the same side with the Anglo-Saxons in many big wars (and the two largest ones), the world is unstable and the agenda has changed many times. Yes, even after the Second World War, the British sold us (USSR) a jet engine.
    3. lis-ik
      lis-ik 15 February 2022 17: 50
      +6
      Quote: Max1995
      What a naivety.
      An attempt to explain everything with giant provincial town templates.

      I read the first sentence of the article and ended it. There was really no point in reading further, I moved on to reading the comments.
    4. ammunition
      ammunition 15 February 2022 19: 16
      -6
      Quote: Max1995
      China did not give up economically weak, corrupt Russian Federation.

      China is extremely interested in the existence of a strong and independent Russian Federation. For China, it is a matter of life and death. Although China does not show the appearance ...
      -------------------
      China has a very precarious and vulnerable position against the Anglo-American world. He is weak and vulnerable. Alone, he is doomed to be driven into a stall. China desperately needs a strong Russia!!!.. China knows that no threat comes from Russia (and never has). China knows that Russia is protecting and shielding China from the evil directed by the Anglo-Americans.
      You say - "VVP"? .. But 200 years ago, China's GDP was 10 to 15 times the GDP of the UK .. and despite this, the UK knocked China out of world history for as much as 150 years.
      ------------
      Are you afraid of China????? But your fears can have some basis in only one case - if the world power and strength of the Anglo-Saxons disappeared.
      1. Maks1995
        Maks1995 15 February 2022 22: 27
        +1
        "in the existence of an independent RF" - is interested.
        "strong" is relative.
        "very strong" - no. Recall the history of the battle for Damansky - what if you have to return it? What about gas, timber, food, metal? And Chinese consumer goods?

        And by the way, GDP is not that GDP, but another
        1. ammunition
          ammunition 17 February 2022 18: 15
          0
          Quote: Max1995
          Recall the history of the battle for Damansky - what if you have to return it?

    5. sniperino
      sniperino 16 February 2022 13: 22
      0
      Quote: Max1995
      No Crimea, no LDNR ... Will somehow resolve the issue with Taiwan
      Recognizing the Crimea and the LDNR will somehow resolve the issue with Taiwan.
      1. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 16 February 2022 13: 35
        -2
        Quote: sniperino
        Recognizing Crimea and LDNR

        Can you name at least one intelligible reason why China should do this?
        I don’t understand why the Zaputins are hyping about the recognition of Crimea, at a time when hundreds of Russian companies have not recognized it?
        Excuses in the style that these companies work there, but do not roll through cunning schemes, because this is akin to how to climb to your own wife through the window.
        1. sniperino
          sniperino 16 February 2022 13: 41
          +1
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          Quote: sniperino
          Recognizing Crimea and LDNR
          Can you name at least one intelligible reason why China should do this?
          The answer is at the end of the sentence. Haven't read it? Or do you think that everyone will immediately recognize Taiwan as part of China?
          1. Ingvar 72
            Ingvar 72 16 February 2022 14: 34
            -3
            Explain how Russia's recognition of Taiwan will help China? Does Russia have weight in the world? Will this somehow affect the speed of recognition of Taiwan as Chinese by other countries of the Western world?
            Maybe enough populist statements? China, unlike Russia, lives by its own interests.
            1. sniperino
              sniperino 16 February 2022 14: 38
              0
              Quote: Ingvar 72
              Explain how Russia's recognition of Taiwan will help China?
              As well as the recognition of Crimea and the LDNR by China will help Russia. No more, but no less.
              1. Ingvar 72
                Ingvar 72 16 February 2022 14: 44
                -2
                A cuckoo praises a rooster for praising a cuckoo! laughing Where is the pragmatism?
                But the lack of recognition of Crimea by our companies clearly infringes on the rights of Crimeans.
                1. sniperino
                  sniperino 16 February 2022 15: 25
                  0
                  Quote: Ingvar 72
                  But the lack of recognition of Crimea by our companies ...
                  And the fish do not have fleas due to the lack of wool ... If there was wool, there would be fleas!
    6. smart ass
      smart ass 17 February 2022 09: 01
      +1
      The friendship of China with Russia is like the friendship of a high school student with a second grader .... suspicious at best
  2. tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 15 February 2022 13: 15
    +4
    Russia and China, together with the entire international community, have strengthened their allied relations.

    I want it to be like this:
    1. Uncle lee
      Uncle lee 15 February 2022 14: 01
      +3
      Quote: tihonmarine
      whatever it is, like this:
      "Russian and Chinese - brothers forever" "It was and will not be! How unfortunate it is ....
      1. Cosm22
        Cosm22 15 February 2022 14: 26
        +8
        Well, at least someone understands this simple truth.
        And some pearls in the article amused.
        “Moscow had to dare and show its “teeth” - an ultimatum was issued by the US and NATO on security guarantees under the brief motto “stop, otherwise ...”. And??? Where is the continuation? What else? What is the result? Russia was politely refused (And thanks for that.) Now what to do with this ultimatum?
        "And then another surprise was the "almost revolution" in Kazakhstan. Russia had to act: the CSTO operation was carried out quickly and professionally. Moscow showed that it controls the situation on its eastern flank." What was the purpose of the operation? On the 7th to bring in troops, and on the 11th to quickly withdraw them? Evil enemy tongues claim that "quickly and professionally" Russian troops were withdrawn from Kazakhstan after an unequivocal call from Beijing. Of course they lie, you bastards.
        But the information noise in our media around Kazakhstan for some reason subsided at once. As per command.
        1. p0pulivox
          p0pulivox 15 February 2022 20: 44
          +2
          By and large, the Chinese leadership imposes on our (and the leadership of the Central Asian republics, by the way, too) the rules of the game, it just does it without "noise and dust" ... close relations with Russia, and now we are being driven into the "embrace" of China. Regarding the so-called. ultimatum to the West from Russia, it brought more negative than positive consequences. And so far it turns out that the answer promised in our appeal (and the consequences predicted here in significant and numerous comments for the adversary) turns out to be more like a fig in your pocket ...
        2. nerd.su
          nerd.su 16 February 2022 15: 16
          0
          Quote: Cosm22
          Evil enemy tongues claim that "quickly and professionally" Russian troops were withdrawn from Kazakhstan after an unequivocal call from Beijing.

          Are there any other sources of this assertion besides your words?
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 15 February 2022 14: 57
        -2
        Quote: Uncle Lee
        It was and never will be! How sad is that....

        That's why I want the impossible. And I remember well when I came to the first grade and studied for 7 years with Chinese children.
        1. sniperino
          sniperino 16 February 2022 16: 43
          0
          Quote: tihonmarine
          That's why I want the impossible.

          Relations between Russia and China are at the highest level in history
          https://russiancouncil.ru/papers/Russia-China-2020-Report58.pdf ИНСТИТУТ МЕЖДУНАРОДНЫХ ИССЛЕДОВАНИЙ ФУДАНЬСКОГО УНИВЕРСИТЕТА не стал бы подписываться под этим докладом, если бы он был совсем оторван от действительности.
      3. sniperino
        sniperino 16 February 2022 14: 44
        0
        Quote: Uncle Lee
        "Russian and Chinese - brothers forever" "It was and will not be!
        1. It didn't happen. 2. Nothing lasts forever under the moon. 3. Today, relations are no worse than they were under Stalin, although without pathos, without oaths of eternal love and friendship.
    2. Per se.
      Per se. 15 February 2022 14: 19
      +7
      Quote: tihonmarine
      I want it to be like this
      Alas, in vain did the Soviet Union pull China out of the mud. Only the help and international cover of the USSR allowed China to industrialize and get a nuclear bomb. Your "Great Pilot", was far in his mind if Mao Zedong said, - "Russia seized too many lands ... More than 100 years ago they cut off the lands east of Baikal, including both Boli (Khabarovsk) and Haishenwei (Vladivostok), and the Kamchatka Peninsula. This account has not been repaid, we have not yet settled with them on this account.

      China has territorial claims to all neighboring countries, and the fact that the Russian government unilaterally handed over to the Chinese in 2005, during the "demarcation of the border", a territory with a total area of ​​337 square kilometers, only obscured the problem. In 2012, the Chinese wanted already "disputed" territories in the Altai Territory.

      It was not in vain that the West began to make an eastern anti-USSR out of "red" China (after the failure with the Third Reich, a western anti-USSR), turning a blind eye to the "commies". Now the PRC is the world's counterfeit factory, where global corporations make a lot of money that exceeds the income from licensed goods. That is why China has not become like the DPRK, turning a blind eye to terry piracy, copyright infringement, without sanctions, boycott and blockade. China will not fight with the United States, the Chinese military will not go along the bottom of the ocean to the Yankees, next to the rich and empty lands of Russia.
      In Chinese history textbooks, it is very often recalled that almost all of Siberia, including Western Siberia right up to the Tomsk region, is temporarily lost Chinese territories. And in the bookstores of the PRC, geographical manuals are sold, which show Russian territories (including Primorye, Sakhalin Island, Eastern Siberia, etc.) as allegedly belonging to China since the time of the first Qin dynasty in the XNUMXrd century BC. BC. And this is not just propaganda, but a kind of reproduction of national archetypes.

      As a slightly modified Chinese proverb says, "You can only buy by mistake, but you can't sell or rent by mistake."
      What our authorities are doing is short-term opportunistic tactics, before Beijing's long-term, systemic strategy.
      The well-known Russian historian Boris Tkachenko put it this way.
      “China is our biggest neighbor, it is such a big, roughly speaking, fat pig that has sprawled in our underbelly of Siberia and the Far East. I have no faith in a strategic partnership between Russia and China. I think this is a contrived thing. With us, all this boils down to declarations, it seems that we have proclaimed a partnership. Partnership must be expressed in concrete deeds. How did China help us? Yes, nothing. So far, they are interested in us as a supplier of the latest developments in the field of military technologies and equipment, as a source of raw materials. But the time will pass when everything will be sucked out of here.
      1. Terran ghost
        Terran ghost 16 February 2022 09: 32
        0
        turn a blind eye to terry piracy, copyright infringement, without sanctions, boycott and blockade

        As they say, for the umpteenth time. First, the deadline for any patents for ANY inventions and utility models is 20 years. All consumer, industrial and technical (including military and "double") products that were created before 31.12.2001/XNUMX/XNUMX are in the world heritage and can be legally produced by any manufacturing company without paying any license fees. And it's honest, right, and fair. This is the key to the development of human civilization in general and individual countries in particular.
        The second point, no less important, is that patents are obtained or confirmed (if a patent of international validity is obtained) in each specific country. And for a fee. The rule here is usually very simple - there is no patent for an invention or utility model valid in a particular country, no one will even talk to you on the subject of the alleged "copying a new invention without an agreement and paying royalties."
        Now the PRC is the world's counterfeit factory, where global corporations make huge money that exceeds the income from licensed goods.

        What other global corporations are cashing in on the sale of "counterfeit" (far from the fact that they are actually counterfeit) variations of their own products? What is it like?
        In fact, the reason for the transfer of production to China by corporations from North America and Western Europe in the late 1980s and early 1990s was simpler and more prosaic - the labor force in China at that time was very cheap, plus the environmental legislation that was actually absent there.
        1. Per se.
          Per se. 16 February 2022 11: 04
          +1
          Quote: Terran Ghost
          What other global corporations are cashing in on the sale of "counterfeit"
          You seem to be aware that numerous transnational corporations operate in China. It is to these very corporations that "Chinese counterfeit" brings additional profits to licensed goods. Therefore, cheap labor is only one of many factors.

          Speaking of clones, copying, no matter how you remember the plot with our Su-27SK, where only a licensed assembly from Russian components was legal.
          However, as it turned out, in parallel with the assembly of Su-27SK fighters from Russian kits, the Chinese were simultaneously copying this aircraft in Shenyang. This "pirated" copy received the local designation J-11B. The Chinese installed engines developed on their own, which, according to some reports, are also a kind of “pirated” copies of our AL-31F engine.

          About the S-300, it can be noted that the modernized Chinese HQ-9A complex is only a conceptual copy of our S-300PMU-2. Therefore, it was decided to purchase several S-300PMU-1 divisions in our country. After purchasing the system, specialists from the Academy of Defense Technologies began to study it, and a few years later the PLA received its first air defense system of this class and capabilities. After another 5 years, they bought the S-300PMU-2 in the amount of 16 divisions, and the HQ-9A modification immediately appeared. Now they are operating brand new S-400s, and suddenly the HQ-9B appears ... So, in China, they copy-clone a lot.
          However, if you are "drowning" for China, or in any way trying to scam our great political strategists and effective managers from buying and selling, with a momentary benefit ... Then everything is correct.
          1. Terran ghost
            Terran ghost 16 February 2022 11: 19
            0
            However, as it turned out, in parallel with the assembly of Su-27SK fighters from Russian kits, the Chinese were simultaneously copying this aircraft in Shenyang. This "pirated" copy received the local designation J-11B.

            Are you sure that in relation to the design of both the aircraft as a whole and the individual components or assemblies used in it, there were at least some patents that were valid specifically in China? If there were none, then there will be nothing to present - copying comes out very legal.
            For example, a similar situation - in the case of the Tu-4 aircraft ("nee" B-29 "Superfortress"), Boeing did not even try to make any claims to the Soviet Union - there were no corresponding patents in the USSR.
            However, if you "drown" for China

            I "drown" for the public domain and strict observance of the terms of the "patent deal", which implies a purely limited period of exclusive rights to inventions and utility models (ie, specific products) established with the help of patents.
            1. Per se.
              Per se. 16 February 2022 14: 48
              +1
              Quote: Terran Ghost
              For example, a similar situation is in the case of the Tu-4 aircraft ("nee" B-29 "Superfortress")
              Let's then remember our P-1 (German V -2), a lot of trophies that we got, for example, in Korea (the same F-86 "Saber" with an interesting filling, first of all, the AN / radio range finder was of particular interest APG-30 with an antenna in the form of a horn, coupled with an optical sight) or Vietnam (as a valuable trophy air-to-air missile, with a thermal guidance head).
              Here, only, for China, a special case, the Chinese even have their own understanding of the word "copy", like fanzhipin (fǎngzhìpǐn) and fuzhipin (fùzhìpǐn). In their concept of "copy", "identity" and many other words of this topic are at odds with the European, and often lead to conflict situations. By and large, in China, if not all, then the vast majority is a copy, a clone. As far as all this goes "legal", I will not argue.
              I will also not mourn the "suffering of the poor" transnational corporations, when licensed goods are often produced "during the day", and counterfeit goods are driven "at night", on the same equipment. This is how the CIA fights drug lords, and they themselves make money on drugs.
              You are for "public domain and strict adherence to the terms of the "patent deal""Congratulations, that's a good thing.
              1. Terran ghost
                Terran ghost 16 February 2022 15: 17
                0
                Let's then remember our R-1 (German V -2)

                Well, with the military equipment of the defeated Nazi Germany, the situation is still special. There, the supreme rights of the victorious powers (USSR, Great Britain, USA, France) were formally enshrined in relation to Germany, which included the right to unlimited study and use of German military technologies. The United States won even this with a special operation "Paperclip" (Operation Paperclip), in which not only from the American and British zones of occupation in post-war Germany, blueprints, those. documentation and samples of equipment, but also a campaign was carried out to invite some scientists and engineers of the defeated Nazi Germany to work in the USA.
                like a valuable trophy air-to-air missile, with a thermal guidance head

                Yes. K-13, she is "nee" one of the relatively early modifications of the AIM-9 "Sidewinder". And again - there were no patents valid on the territory of the USSR. It was not helpful for a very simple reason - in order to patent an invention or utility model, it is required to disclose to the patent issuer what the know-how and design features of the product that are planned to be protected by the exclusive rights granted by the patent are. But often in the national patent laws of different countries there may be clauses that, in fact, legalize, under certain conditions, patent infringement "for national security purposes" (for example, in the form of "compulsory licensing", when an invention or utility model is used without a license agreement, but with payment royalties ("royalties") ... at state rates and tariffs for such;) ).
                PS: And even more - due to the fact that during patenting the essence of an invention or the design of a utility model is disclosed, there are even cases when attempts are made on the commercial market and on the territory of the United States or Western European countries that are valid (that is, the validity period of which has not yet been expired) bypass the patent. This is usually done in the following way - it is checked whether it is possible to make enough small changes to the design protected by a patent .. in order to then expose the resulting product by its own independent development.
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 16 February 2022 12: 06
        0
        Quote: Per se.
        Alas, in vain did the Soviet Union pull China out of the mud

        If in that post-war period, not the USSR, but the Yankees and Tommy, would have got into China, now China would be the same as the whole of Europe, only there!, 5 billion people.
        1. Per se.
          Per se. 16 February 2022 14: 16
          0
          Quote: tihonmarine
          If in that post-war period, not the USSR, but the Yankees and Tommy would have climbed into China
          When the "Yankees and Tommy" got in there, China was sitting on opium and degenerating. All industrialization in China became possible only thanks to socialism, the help of the USSR. The West would not have invested so much, but he used what raised China from the plow with the help of the Soviet Union. I repeat once again - how did China become a powerful power in general? Leaving aside the ancient "dust of centuries" with the achievements of Chinese emperors, in the twentieth century, China was a third-rate country that did not shine in the world. Only the help of the USSR allowed China to rise. Without the Soviet Union, our support and military cover, no one would have allowed China to do this, and China itself would not have mastered it. All industrialization, all growth, the merit of help from the USSR.

          The United States, according to the "Marshall Plan", allocated about 13 billion dollars to post-war Europe. Germany itself received 1,3 billion, remaining to this day a de facto occupied country.
          The USSR provided assistance to China alone in the amount of $ 3,4 billion, this does not take into account the cost of technologies donated to China, the remuneration of Soviet specialists in the PRC (this payment was made by the Soviet side) and scholarships to Chinese students who studied in the USSR. The share of other countries of the socialist bloc in aid to China was only 18%, thus 82% of this disinterested aid was provided by the Soviet Union. Most of the transfers were non-refundable; China returned in total, according to the historian, only 15% of all loans.
          In addition, Port Arthur (with all military equipment) and Dalny with all the infrastructure were given to China. This emphasized the independence of China, its sovereignty.

          How did the Chinese "national communists" repay us? The events in Damanskoye, after which the West began to make from China an eastern version of the anti-USSR instead of the defeated Hitler one.

          So, you need to be very careful to "make friends" with the Chinese "brothers", strengthening your army and navy, and the economy as a whole.
      3. ViacheslavS
        ViacheslavS 16 February 2022 12: 43
        0
        In Chinese history textbooks, it is very often recalled that almost all of Siberia, including Western Siberia right up to the Tomsk region, is temporarily lost Chinese territories.


        Can you provide scans from these textbooks?

        Now the PRC is the world's counterfeit factory, where global corporations make huge money that exceeds the income from licensed goods.


        Something mixed up in a bunch of people, horses, corporations, on the contrary, are losing profits from counterfeit goods, and for this China was beaten on the hands more than once.
        1. Per se.
          Per se. 16 February 2022 15: 02
          0
          Quote: ViacheslavS
          Can you provide scans from these textbooks?

          This is a strong move. Here and now, copies with hieroglyphs, and even, go, authenticated by seals from the Ministry of Education...
          Let's stick to our opinion. Thank you for your attention.
          1. ViacheslavS
            ViacheslavS 16 February 2022 19: 32
            0
            So wait, you made a statement that verbatim:

            In Chinese history textbooks, it is very often recalled that almost all of Siberia, including Western Siberia right up to the Tomsk region, is temporarily lost Chinese territories.


            Do you have any confirmation of this fact or where did you get this information from. I'm not trying to refute or dispute, just an interesting source.
    3. nikvic46
      nikvic46 15 February 2022 17: 08
      +3
      By memory. "If the sky were paper and the river ink, then even then we would not have enough space to express gratitude to the Soviet Union for its help to fraternal China." What words were spoken to us.
    4. lis-ik
      lis-ik 15 February 2022 17: 53
      +5
      Quote: tihonmarine
      I want it to be like this:

      What would happen like this, you have to be not a raw materials appendage with compradors in power, but at least a country with an ideology and industry, then the president will not bow, as a manager from raw materials workers will travel
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 15 February 2022 18: 03
        +3
        Quote: lis-ik
        at least a country with an ideology and industry, then the president will not bow, as a manager from raw materials workers will travel

        So it is so, but you can’t return the past, it remains to remember childhood, the lot of old people.
      2. Terran ghost
        Terran ghost 16 February 2022 09: 36
        -1
        at least a country with an ideology

        And what kind of ideology do you personally need?
    5. Terran ghost
      Terran ghost 16 February 2022 09: 35
      0
      I want it to be like this

      China always acts in the interests of .. China itself. And firstly, and secondly.
      Then (in 1949 - the first half of the 1950s), China stupidly needed technology from the USSR. And preferably at a very cheap price or for nothing.
  3. The comment was deleted.
  4. Gardener91
    Gardener91 15 February 2022 13: 17
    +6
    Yeah, if a crocodile ate your enemy, it does not mean that he is your friend. Posner is right, although he has ceased to respect him, China is an independent and self-sufficient power. China does not need anyone in close cooperation. An example of this is the situation in Crimea.
    1. carstorm 11
      carstorm 11 15 February 2022 13: 29
      +1
      If you read carefully, then recognizing the Crimea and the referendum, they will step on their own foot. Why shouldn't Taiwan do it then? So there are reasons.
      1. Blackmokona
        Blackmokona 15 February 2022 13: 59
        -7
        Heh heh. Taiwan did not break away from the PRC, it was the PRC that broke away from Taiwan.
        A bit of world history.
        1. carstorm 11
          carstorm 11 15 February 2022 14: 02
          -5
          And how does this prevent Taiwan from holding a referendum?)
          1. Blackmokona
            Blackmokona 15 February 2022 17: 43
            +1
            What is the referendum for? What is the purpose and question on it? winked
        2. Nyrobsky
          Nyrobsky 15 February 2022 17: 31
          +1
          Quote: BlackMokona
          Heh heh. Taiwan did not break away from the PRC, it was the PRC that broke away from Taiwan.
          A bit of world history.

          If a bit of world history, it turns out that part of Russia was "otukrainili", and part of China was "defrosted". In both cases, these two artificial neoplasms claiming to be subject in international relations (Ukraine and Taiwan) are cut off from the "mother" and created with the participation and support of third countries.
          Today, China is carefully studying Russia's experience in confronting the United States over the solution of the Ukrainian problem, since the solution of the Taiwan problem will follow almost the same patterns, only with some adjustments based on geographical features.
          1. Terran ghost
            Terran ghost 16 February 2022 09: 51
            -2
            part of China "thawed out"

            Hmm... the only problem is that Taiwan's official name is "Republic of China". And yes, "the whole joke" is that the current government of Taiwan may well prove its formal succession from the government of the Republic of China, which existed in 1912-1949. Moreover, until relatively recently, the government of Taiwan considered the People's Republic of China an "artificial neoplasm" and laid claim to its entire territory.
            claiming subjectivity in international relations (Ukraine

            "Subjectivity in international relations" was formally given to the Ukrainian SSR by the government of the USSR under the leadership of I.V. Stalin (Dzhugashvili) in 1945, including the Ukrainian SSR in the UN as a formally sovereign state.
            1. Nyrobsky
              Nyrobsky 16 February 2022 14: 05
              +2
              Ukraine is an artificial state, no matter who gives it statehood. It must be admitted that it had chances, and not small ones, to become a full-fledged state, but alas, as it turned out, it was not a horse's fodder. She spent all the years of her independence not on strengthening, but on fighting against her statehood, and very successfully. The damage it has inflicted on itself is comparable to the damage received in the Second World War, and without any intrusions from outside.
              Tellingly, Ukraine is not unique in this matter. Russia in the 90s experienced a similar experience with the collapse of the economy and the war in the Caucasus, but changed its mind in time and began to get out of the "suffocating" tutelage of the United States. Ukraine, on the other hand, is drifting in the direction determined by the mattresses and is degrading more and more as a state, having passed the point of no return. Hopelessness.
              1. Terran ghost
                Terran ghost 16 February 2022 14: 41
                -2
                artificial state, whoever gives it statehood

                Only there is one small detail - the statehood (and sovereignty) of the Ukrainian SSR was consistently given to the CPSU (b) - CPSU and the highest state authorities of the USSR. And I’m talking about sovereignty literally, Article 76 of the Constitution of the USSR affirmed the status of all the union republics that were part of the USSR as sovereign Soviet socialist states, and article 72 of the same Constitution postulated the right of the union republics to freely secede from the USSR.
                she had chances, and not small ones, to become a full-fledged state

                And what, in your opinion, is a full-fledged state?
                1. Nyrobsky
                  Nyrobsky 16 February 2022 15: 12
                  0
                  Quote: Terran Ghost
                  Only there is one small detail - the statehood (and sovereignty) of the Ukrainian SSR was consistently given to the CPSU (b) - CPSU and the highest state authorities of the USSR. And I’m talking about sovereignty literally, Article 76 of the Constitution of the USSR affirmed the status of all the union republics that were part of the USSR as sovereign Soviet socialist states, and article 72 of the same Constitution postulated the right of the union republics to freely secede from the USSR.

                  There was no Ukraine as of 1917, just like Ukrainians. Your little detail from the VKPB and the CPSU, really small, is also disputed by the Ukropostan "learned historians" themselves, who reject everything Soviet as heresy. Be consistent and, in addition to demolishing monuments to the person who gave birth to Ukraine within the existing borders, refuse Soviet gifts. And it turns out like in gentlemen of luck - "I remember here, but I don't remember here."
                  Quote: Terran Ghost
                  And what, in your opinion, is a full-fledged state?

                  Anything but Ukraine. Ukraine is an anti-example.
                  1. Terran ghost
                    Terran ghost 16 February 2022 15: 55
                    -1
                    Be consistent and besides the demolition of monuments to a person

                    Who are you addressing "be consistent"? :) But in general, the prohibition of a pre-existing state ideology in itself does not exclude succession. For example, in modern Italy, the activities of Benito Mussolini are condemned, and the ideology of fascism he created is prohibited (the Constitution of the Italian Republic directly prohibits the creation of a fascist party in the country), but nevertheless this does not negate the fact that the modern Italian Republic is the legal successor of the Kingdom of Italy .
                    as of 1917 did not exist

                    On account of the fact that for the historical period you have indicated, Ukrainians as a people (according to your opinion, as I understand it) did not exist ... well, not everyone would have agreed with you then.
                    "... recently it has been said that the Ukrainian republic and the Ukrainian nation are an invention of the Germans. Meanwhile, it is clear that the Ukrainian nation exists, and the development of its culture is the duty of the Communists. You cannot go against history. It is clear that if the cities of Ukraine still still dominated by Russian elements, then over time these cities will inevitably be Ukrainianized. (c) I.V. Stalin (Dzhugashvili). "Final speech on the report on the immediate tasks of the party and the national question at the X Congress of the RCP (b)", 10.03.1921/21/5 ( https://c5ch.newcastle.edu.au/stalin/t04/t2_XNUMX_XNUMX.htm )
                    1. Nyrobsky
                      Nyrobsky 16 February 2022 17: 49
                      0
                      Quote: Terran Ghost
                      You can't go against history.

                      Well, don't go. Return to the protectorate of Russia and live well and calmly, as in the fat Soviet years, when, as you think, you fed the entire union.
                      Quote: Terran Ghost
                      It is clear that if Russian elements still predominate in the cities of Ukraine, then over time these cities will inevitably be Ukrainized." (c) I.V. Stalin (Dzhugashvili). at the X Congress of the RCP (b)", 10.03.1921/XNUMX/XNUMX

                      As I understand it, you don’t have other trump cards, except for those related to the period of "advice"? Well, you stubbornly disown everything Soviet! Or rather, almost everything, except for Soviet gifts. As for the cities, here is the census in Odessa in 1894. Underline the column Ukrainians with a red line.
                      1. Terran ghost
                        Terran ghost 17 February 2022 15: 43
                        0
                        Well don't go

                        To whom are you so stubbornly addressing your appeals, at least?
                        Well, alas, so far I mostly see arguments from you, mostly of an emotional nature. But in the issues under discussion, emotions do not matter at all. But they have very much - formal norms of constitutional law.
                        Return to protectorate

                        What else protectorate? What are you about. Again we open the Constitution of the USSR of 1977 and read.
                        Quote: "Article 70. The Union of Soviet Socialist Republics -
                        a single union multinational state formed on
                        basis of the principle of socialist federalism, as a result
                        free self-determination of nations and voluntary association
                        equal Soviet Socialist Republics."
                        Quote: "Article 71. In the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
                        are combined:
                        Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic,
                        Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic...."
                        I will not quote the entire list of 15 union republics so that there is no "wall of text". But the essence is clear, the Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic and the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic are EQUAL union republics that voluntarily united into the Union of the SSR, possessing sovereignty (Article 76 of the same Constitution) and the right to freely secede from the USSR (Article 72 of the same Constitution). What kind of "protectorate" is this?
                        except for Soviet gifts

                        What other gifts? According to the norms of the Constitution of the USSR of 1977, the Union of the SSR is a union federal state, consisting of union republics with equal rights and voluntarily joining it (again, Article 70 of the Constitution of the USSR, which I have already cited).
                        The specific composition of the territory of the Ukrainian SSR is defined in Article 77 of the 1978 Constitution of the Ukrainian SSR. Of course, there is not a word about any "gifts" (and indeed they, these words, cannot be there).
                        then here is the census in Odessa in 1894

                        And what such an antiquity then you slip me.
                        Here, for example, is the USSR census for 1926 - http://www.demoscope.ru/weekly/ssp/ussr_nac_26.php?reg=1
                        Here - for 1939 - http://www.demoscope.ru/weekly/ssp/sng_nac_39.php?reg=0
                        And here - for 1959 - http://www.demoscope.ru/weekly/ssp/sng_nac_59.php
                        in all three, Ukrainians are the second largest ethnic-national group in the Soviet Union.
      2. Gardener91
        Gardener91 15 February 2022 15: 32
        +1
        Quote: carstorm 11
        then recognizing the Crimea and the referendum, they will step on their own feet.

        Rather, China wants to have more, with views of the Far East. Therefore, "restraint" in the recognition of the Crimea. Nobody can be trusted.
  5. Victor Tsenin
    Victor Tsenin 15 February 2022 13: 21
    +2
    >And Vladimir Putin made a smart geopolitical move - he went to visit his friend Xi Jinping at the opening of the XXIV Winter Olympics.
    The visit was planned much earlier, in the context of linking to cooperation, everything is correct, in the context of Kazakhstani and Ukrainian events - it is drawn.

    >that doesn't need any block.
    Posner is not an authority and a specialist in geopolitics. The block is important for the PRC, the form is variable.
  6. evgen1221
    evgen1221 15 February 2022 13: 24
    +12
    Belief in the mythical union of the impoverished Volta with missiles and a completely disorganized economy with a strong ally? But they need it, they supply and praise the beads for beads, that’s where they belong, if they themselves can’t and don’t want to. That's the whole story. They benefit from us for their state as a whole, we, only for a select few.
  7. 210ox
    210ox 15 February 2022 13: 24
    +4
    I have a negative attitude towards Posner, but in this case he is right. China needs us as suppliers of raw materials, to divert certain US and EU forces from China. The meeting of our leaders in Beijing is just diplomacy and political correctness. To China their plans for the future.
    1. carstorm 11
      carstorm 11 15 February 2022 13: 31
      -10
      And why do we need China?) If they grapple with the Europeans and the states, we will only benefit from this.
      1. 210ox
        210ox 15 February 2022 13: 38
        +1
        We need China first of all as a supplier of what we cannot do. About the conflict between China and the United States or Europe, it is too early to talk about it. Faster we will enter the clinch with them, or rather we have already entered. China could also divert the forces of the West from this fight. But! And so, yes. I agree with you.
  8. Woodman
    Woodman 15 February 2022 13: 26
    +3
    China today is such a powerful power and so independent, making its own decisions, that it does not need any bloc.”
    I would put it differently: China does not yet have such problems in which it would need a formal military-political alliance with Russia. Mainly because China habitually avoids open confrontation with the US. And in those areas where such a confrontation did occur, China, out of habit, is cautious and prefers, albeit "snarling", to retreat.
    In general, the situation is such that for both Russia and China, the ideal option is not an alliance, but extremely friendly neutrality. Such neutrality covers China from the north and Russia from the east and south.
    I have little idea of ​​the Chinese divisions covering the western border of Russia, as well as the Russian bases somewhere in the Shanghai area. Both countries are strong enough to cope on their own.
    And in the event of the outbreak of a big war, the reaction of the leaders of states will be important, and not pieces of paper with treaties.
    1. Terran ghost
      Terran ghost 16 February 2022 09: 55
      -1
      Mainly because China habitually avoids open confrontation with the US.

      What do you mean by "open confrontation"? Well, yes ... I advise you to look at the structure of China's exports and imports by country. Everything in this regard is very revealing.
  9. Uncle lee
    Uncle lee 15 February 2022 13: 27
    0
    “And who is here with Vasya and me?”
    And it’s not Vasya, but Wa-Xiao and it’s not a fact that he is with us ...
  10. Sergey28
    Sergey28 15 February 2022 13: 32
    +4
    For once I agree with the posner.
  11. nnm
    nnm 15 February 2022 13: 33
    +6
    Any union is a priori better than enmity. Yes, we all understand that China only needs resources and military technology from us. But we also need them in order to obtain all the same technologies. Yes, we want other relationships, but we have what we have. And you have to play with the cards that you have in your hand. And don't get addicted.
    Is it good to have two areas of cooperation - both Asia and Europe, so as not to depend on only one buyer? Yes, well, without a doubt, and it would be foolish not to take advantage of such a chance. Plus, there are prospects for the development of the Northern Sea Route, the Silk Corridor, etc.

    But about how in Kazakhstan we brilliantly suppressed the uprising (instead of asking about its causes and analogies with Elbasy) and how brilliantly Putin went to China, selling oil and gas (in other words, just resources) for 80 billion dollars, this is the personal opinion of the author.
    1. Terran ghost
      Terran ghost 17 February 2022 14: 58
      0
      China only needs resources and military technology from us

      As for the second .. I would, alas, not be so sure. That is, in the 1980s-1990s-2000s, yes, China certainly needed Soviet / Russian military technology. But now in the 2020s, it will be indicative, for example, to stupidly compare the number of 5th generation fighters in service in our country (Russia) and in China.
  12. Old Horseradish
    Old Horseradish 15 February 2022 13: 46
    +8
    The union of the metropolis and the sub-colony is certainly cool, but why shouldn't the author write about contracts, such as a lease for 49 years? Territories in Siberia and the Far East to the Chinese. Then who will kick them out of there? And the scale of the lease is cosmic.
    1. Repellent
      Repellent 15 February 2022 14: 05
      -5
      Quote: Old Fuck
      why shouldn't the author write about contracts, such as a lease for 49 years? Territories in Siberia and the Far East to the Chinese

      Why don't you give a link to the "contracts"? It is not searched for by search ... Maybe they don’t exist, contracts? wink
      1. Old Horseradish
        Old Horseradish 15 February 2022 14: 23
        +5
        What's up with your hands? The entire internet is busy. Here's a sneak peek.
        1. Repellent
          Repellent 15 February 2022 14: 32
          -3
          Quote: Old Fuck
          The whole internet is busy

          Quote: Old Fuck
          contracts, such as leases for 49 years

          So where are the contracts? The video, from the 14th year, something was handed over, something was taken away, something is being collected ... the devil will break his leg.

          Where are the agreements? Active?

          Quote: Old Fuck
          What's up with your hands?

          Norm is with my hands. And do not poke, do not harness until wink
          1. Old Horseradish
            Old Horseradish 15 February 2022 15: 23
            +2
            I understand that it is useless to explain to you, so this is not for you:
            1. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 15 February 2022 18: 17
              +5
              Quote: Old Fuck
              I understand that it is useless to explain to you, so this is not for you:

              It can know who lives in Transbaikalia. I know a lot from my living relatives. After talking on Skype, it was as if he had drunk a glass of quinine.
    2. Old Horseradish
      Old Horseradish 15 February 2022 14: 14
      +2
      In parallel with this, the General Staff turned the arrows and stated that “... Russia is able to effectively counteract the US fleet in the Black and Baltic Seas, but it still lacks ships and aviation in the Far East, said Stanislav Gadzhimagomedov, Deputy Chief of the Main Operational Directorate of the General Staff of the Russian Federation. ."
      Everything you need to know about our defense capability in the East.
  13. sen
    sen 15 February 2022 13: 58
    +1
    "The Big Two". Union of Russia with China - pro et contra

    So where else can Russia go, and so at least a temporary, but strong ally.
  14. Mikhail Sidorov
    Mikhail Sidorov 15 February 2022 14: 15
    -1
    It is difficult to disagree with many theses. But what about Posner? Is this a famous sinologist?
  15. Vavilov
    Vavilov 15 February 2022 14: 44
    +3
    why would China trust us so much and get closer, if our entire "elite" with children, wives and servants, rushes to London, and not to Beijing, where there are guarantees that China will "raise" us and we will not throw it away, again rushing to West, they are Asia! point projects are possible, well, resources are cheap, again with the transfer of shares to wives, the Chinese behave reasonably, with order in their heads and inside the country, everything is fine with them, unlike us
    1. Terran ghost
      Terran ghost 16 February 2022 14: 45
      -2
      where are the guarantees that China will "raise" us

      And why should China "raise" Russia at all? Alas, China's practical interest in our country fits into the desire to gain access to the supply of natural resources in the maximum possible quantity at the lowest possible price.
  16. rocket757
    rocket757 15 February 2022 15: 10
    +1
    "The Big Two". Union of Russia with China - pro et contra
    DON'T CHECK, DON'T KNOW!
    Such times, the words of the majority, even big politicians, state faces do not mean, they do not cost ANYTHING!
  17. DienBienPhu
    DienBienPhu 15 February 2022 20: 23
    +1
    China has many advances in the field of semiconductors, we must cooperate with them, because when the US technology embargo falls, only China is our only way out.
  18. p0pulivox
    p0pulivox 15 February 2022 20: 32
    +3
    Various formulations of the new union immediately appeared. For example, the cute Big Two.
    Yes, whatever you call it: even a "big two", even a "big and a half", the essence of this does not change. Figuratively speaking, China chooses in the relations of this so-called. Union is what he needs, and Russia is what remains ...
  19. iouris
    iouris 16 February 2022 16: 32
    0
    China will not ally with anyone. Especially with the Russian Federation.
    1. Terran ghost
      Terran ghost 17 February 2022 15: 03
      0
      with whom he will not enter into an alliance.

      Well, why, in theory, it can even enter. It's just that the ratio of the economic "weight" of the parties is such that such an alliance is possible only on the terms that China will dictate. And these conditions can be quite unattractive to the other side oh oh
  20. 75 Sergey
    75 Sergey 17 February 2022 08: 59
    0
    All these alliances for the time being, it's just that some guys agree with others to play now against third ones.
    Russia is simply obliged to become the center of attraction, not the West and the East, but Russia!
    1. Terran ghost
      Terran ghost 17 February 2022 15: 00
      0
      just bound to become the center of gravity

      There is only one small question. And due to what "to become the center of attraction"? For comparison, the USSR at one time had (up to a certain point) an ideology that was quite attractive to other countries, China now has the opportunity to "bask in the rays" of its economy, the United States has both an economy and an ideology.
      1. 75 Sergey
        75 Sergey 17 February 2022 19: 23
        0
        And what is the problem, under Stalin, China was drawn to the USSR, and many others. Under Khrushchev, a rollback began, because. there was no politics and naked ambitions of the leader.
        With changes, Russia can become a full-fledged center of gravity.
        1. Terran ghost
          Terran ghost 18 February 2022 15: 28
          0
          under Stalin, China was drawn to the USSR

          True, for purely mercantile reasons. Then, in 1949-mid-1950s, China needed technology and industrial equipment. Very cheap or preferably for free.
          Under Khrushchev, a rollback began, because. there was no politics and naked ambitions of the leader.

          As for "naked ambitions" by the way, this is true. Mao Zedong began to show just such at that time.
          When making changes

          What changes and where?
  21. Free wind
    Free wind 17 February 2022 09: 17
    0
    Russia China friends. are you out of your mind?
  22. Ilgizl
    Ilgizl 18 February 2022 22: 41
    -1
    Mr. Posner, who is a citizen of France and in Russia only a loot-chopping liberal looking at the blessed west with all the fibers of his soul.
    China benefits more from cooperation with Russia. WE, at our own expense, built gas pipelines to them, and also to the Turks. We supply resources and much at a low price, since here the consumer can more stand in a pose and dictate terms. In return, they drive us laptops/smartphones/cars and other overpriced pieces of plastic, as the Chinese themselves buy chips for the production of electronics (that is, no parity in mutual trade).
    The power of China is in the National Socialist policy pursued, while the Union around the world wasted its economic potential without receiving anything in return, at least they sold dollars. Therefore, the Chinese, without giving away anything just like that, will become the No. 1 economy without even selling dollars.
  23. acetophenone
    acetophenone 20 February 2022 19: 20
    0
    Quote: tihonmarine

    I want it to be like this:

    It is strange that the leaders are dressed in winter clothes, and the people - in summer .... Do they exist in different streams of time?