Military Review

Groundhog Day for Dory the Fish

111
Almost all the media have already paid attention to the talks held in Brussels. Someone issued (as usual) in the style of “Hurray, we are breaking!”, Someone was pessimistic, but to be honest, it was difficult for me to take any position at all. Mainly because it was very poorly understood what was happening in general, although I tried very hard.


In general, the impression was that the American (and European) delegation consisted entirely of Dory fish, whose memory does not work at all. And every round of negotiations began with the same thing.


This also applied to the Russian-American talks on January 10, and the Russia-NATO talks on January 12, I am sure that everything will be exactly the same at the Russia-OSCE talks on January 13.

Dory fish simply will not let events develop in some other way. Not out of spite, no. It's just the way the program works. And the program, you understand, if it is laid down, it will work clearly and smoothly. American... Five seconds of RAM (in our case, a day) - and that's it. You can start over.

It is clear that the situation is uncomfortable to the point of disgrace. The peace initiatives with which Russia came out so inopportunely, they are so inconvenient for the West that I am sure that their jaws cramped during discussions.

But you can't lose face in the eyes of the whole world. The initiatives are peaceful... Moreover, these initiatives and the result, without hiding their interest, were looked at by those who seem to be on their own, but for whom it is very important how the whole thing ends. We will not point fingers at the Asia-Pacific region, but everything is monitored very carefully there.

And here the United States and its relatives had only one option left, which, I must say, they played just superbly. A variant of the Dory fish, whose memory is completely erased after a short period of time.

Therefore, it is impossible to say that the negotiations were full-fledged. But to say that they ended in complete failure - too. This is judging as a whole. The parties met, talked, fixed the existence of differences in approaches and agreed to talk later. When they think.

This applied to both negotiations, I am sure that in conversations with the OSCE everything will proceed according to the same scenario.

If you look at the particulars, then the United States is definitely in the black. They just really dragged out the time and reduced the whole essence of the negotiations to zero. For what is the point of starting negotiations at all, if their result is a foregone conclusion?

Many media outlets and individual experts happily speak in the style of what is good, since the negotiations took place at all and took place in an atmosphere of mutual attention.

Excuse me, but what were the participants supposed to do, throw shoes at each other?

Russia cannot regard these negotiations as positive in any way. No one really listened to our side, they were not even going to do it. Mrs. Sherman made no secret of the fact that she had a bunch of much more important things to do at home than listening to the opinion of the Russian delegation. Having rolled up a half-hour press conference, Sherman kept chasing two postulates: we (the United States and NATO allies) are ready to engage in dialogue with Russia and support peace initiatives, but if Russia attacks Ukraine and continues to foment conflict there, then we will continue to kill the Russian economy with sanctions and we will not talk to Russia at all.

The reset Stoltenberg looked more sane, but it did not bring any benefit at all. But his press conference was at least more informative. 40 minutes from Stoltenberg, unlike Sherman, brought some interesting moments. But it makes sense to decompose everything that the head of NATO issued.


- Differences remain between NATO and Russia, negotiations and discussions are “an important positive signal”.

If translated, it will turn out “I don’t see anything, I don’t hear anything, I don’t want to understand anything.” But the view will continue to be made.

- NATO does not consider Ukraine a threat to Russia, while Russia is a threat to Ukraine and an aggressor.

- Only Ukraine and 30 allies can decide when Ukraine will join NATO. Russia cannot have the right to "veto" the expansion of the alliance.
Nothing new, nothing surprised the head of NATO.

- NATO calls on Russia to withdraw troops from Georgia and Moldova.

Blimey. This is new. Moldova should be understood as the PMR, which for some reason is not eager to say goodbye to the peacekeepers, and Georgia should be understood as South Ossetia, apparently. Well, if as a "peace initiative", then it can be credited.

- NATO “will always do what is necessary to protect and protect all allies, and constantly evaluates the need to adjust the presence in different parts of the alliance.

We've been hearing this for quite some time now. But in the light of the latest submissions from the Dory fish, I would like to ask: when did Ukraine, Georgia and now Moldova manage to join the ranks of NATO allies?

- Termination of the INF Treaty was caused by gross violations on the part of Russia, including its deployment of medium-range missiles. But the alliance is ready for new arms control talks.

The fact that before that the United States unilaterally withdrew from the ABM limitation treaty and began to actively talk about deploying ABM systems near Russian borders is behind the scenes. And the fish Dory clicked in the head. Zeroed out.

- If Russia uses military force against Ukraine, it will face serious consequences.

About this and Sherman hollowed. With the same admirable perseverance. In general, the issue of Russian aggression against Ukraine has become a lifesaver. All the dialogues boiled down to the fact that when discussing any issue, the Americans "dumped the program" and started talking about the immediate consequences for Russia.

The most difficult moment. Indeed, a kind of "Groundhog Day" for Russian diplomats and the military. Every question ended the same.

At the same time, the Americans have already arrived in Brussels with a set of threats "in case of aggression." Disconnection from the SWIFT system, personal sanctions against Putin, blocking Nord Stream, and so on. Moreover, when the negotiations were going on, unrestrained American newspapers were already voting about new sanctions. The Washington Post, The Wall Street Journal, The New York Times, The Chicago Tribune - all the leading American media have noted.

In general, it didn't work out very well. The parties simply voiced their desires to each other and that was it. Now, as they said in the American part, the time has come for coordination with the governments.

Both sides' initiatives failed. The United States was not very surprised that the Russian side did not immediately accept the American proposals, but they themselves did not really listen to what ours were offering.

Not for that, as they say, we went.

But a fair question arises: in general, why was the whole garden fenced? Solely then, just to show the whole world that the United States is capable of dialogue.

And no one says that the dialogue must be fruitful, right? No one takes into account the opinion of the Russian side that relations with NATO are now at a critically low level.

However, many in the world can see and draw conclusions that NATO does not plan to take into account the interests of countries that do not plan to join the alliance in its activities. And that the block will still expand its sphere to any direction of the world, if it deems it necessary.

Dead end? Perhaps yes. And the blame for this does not lie with Russia, since the blocks that blocked the path of the negotiation process were prepared by the American side in advance.

Russia's main demand for non-expansion of NATO on the territory of Georgia and Ukraine will never be fulfilled. Fundamentally. And the Americans stated this before the negotiations.

The second, no less (and perhaps more) important issue, about the non-deployment of strike weapons on the border with Russia, NATO also does not want to solve.

As a result, the situation with the easing of tension looks exactly at a dead end. It is obvious that if Russia received weighty confirmation that Ukraine and Georgia would not be NATO members, and Poland, Romania, Bulgaria and other countries of the bloc would not deploy "peaceful" cruise missiles and missile defense systems, then one could talk about everything else. After listening, of course, to the representatives of Moldova and Georgia, on whose territory the occupying Russian troops are stationed, and discussing the possibility of withdrawing these troops.

However, for the United States, the interests of what seems to be the NATO bloc are much more important, although in fact it is more significant to infringe on the interests of Russia. A good demonstration of their peace-loving intentions.

On the other hand, did any of the sober-minded people seriously expect that the Americans would rush to comply with Russia's proposals and demands? Of course not.

In fact, we are returning to the times of the Cold War, there is nothing to be done about it. For starters, the war is still only in the political arena. Further, it will become clear where peace-loving aspirations can go.

However, one should not so much rely on political methods to reduce tensions. It would be quite optimistic to think that it is possible to persuade the US to abandon its plans through negotiations.

Groundhog Day, performed by Dory the fish, will continue for a very long time.
Author:
111 comments
Ad

Subscribe to our Telegram channel, daily additional materials that do not get on the site: https://t.me/topwar_ru

Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. Lech from Android.
    Lech from Android. 14 January 2022 05: 30
    +27
    NATO's indulgence since the 90s, when Russia did nothing to stop NATO's eastward advance, and led to the logical result.
    The Anglo-Saxons have come up with a universal phrase ... Russia will face serious consequences if it does this or that ... in the continuation of this phrase you can insert anything ... any gesture of Russia ... this is a dead end in relations with the West.
    Either Russia breaks down and keeps silent and does nothing against these bezpredelschikov, or Russia forces the Anglo-Saxons to reckon with their interests by all available means and measures ... the moment of truth has come.
    1. Real Pilot
      Real Pilot 14 January 2022 19: 54
      +2
      Dory the fish... What a cute comparison! repeat
      And this, in fact, is a predatory fish with the alternative name "blue surgeon". And those who want to cut off pieces of Russia have enough appetite ... Well, with the flowers of preferences, a full bouquet.

      But it seems that American training over the years has given rise to a new round of evolution in European politics. A terrible hybrid appeared: gluppy fish. Simultaneously rosy and stupid, but outwardly like people.
    2. SovAr238A
      SovAr238A 17 January 2022 22: 15
      +1
      Quote: Lech from Android.
      NATO's indulgence since the 90s, when Russia did nothing to stop NATO's eastward advance, and led to the logical result.
      The Anglo-Saxons have come up with a universal phrase ... Russia will face serious consequences if it does this or that ... in the continuation of this phrase you can insert anything ... any gesture of Russia ... this is a dead end in relations with the West.
      Either Russia breaks down and keeps silent and does nothing against these bezpredelschikov, or Russia forces the Anglo-Saxons to reckon with their interests by all available means and measures ... the moment of truth has come.

      War? For extermination?
  2. vervolk
    vervolk 14 January 2022 05: 41
    .
    it is already quite obvious that Russia is "leading" the whole situation. The West is at a loss and does not understand what is happening and why all this is needed. They repeat memorized mantras and in fact, they are only trying to buy time "here and now." For a long time, they did not take into account the interests of Russia at all, and when the Russian Federation nevertheless announced those, what did the West do? He returned to the last paradigm he could remember. That is, negotiations with the decrepit Union of the times of Gorby. All these "new thinking", "detente" and "need to negotiate". In general, the "search for consensus", in which the West made Mr. Gorby at once, buying him for free with a Nobel Prize and advertising pizza huts. Gorby surrendered everything he could at international negotiations, from the unification of Germany and the withdrawal of troops to the dissolution of the Department of Internal Affairs, the surrender of military bases and the collapse of the Union itself. But it was just chatter. the West at that time also inadequately assessed the Union and the modern Russian Federation. Only then did he overestimate military power and the consolidation of society, and now, on the contrary, he catastrophically underestimates it. In general, the tradition of inadequate assessment of Russia's capabilities, established by Napoleon and Hitler, continues. But that's not the main thing now. Something else is much more interesting. Negotiations, as expected, "have reached an impasse." Now the ball is in the RF half of the field. Many Vo commentators, who are poorly informed about Russian reality, are of the opinion that there will be "nothing" further, there will be some diplomatic statements, patrolling of the North Atlantic by submarines and the number of flights of "strategists" will increase, and that's all. then they will trumpet on the domestic market about a big victory to calm the population. and that's where it all ends. In my opinion, this is not the case for two main reasons. Firstly, then such information stuffing would take place closer to the presidential election in 24. To get an ideological effect comparable to the brilliant return of the Crimea. Secondly, right now and now the Russian Federation has a local military-technological and military superiority over the West. Perhaps there is also an agreement on joint actions with China, where Comrade Xi is really "running out of time" in connection with the upcoming CPC Congress. Given the latest trends in Chinese politics to copy the Russian Federation in everything, Taiwan may be preparing to return to its native harbor. And it is better to do this together with similar actions in the Donbass. And then the term for the active response of the Russian Federation to the "ultimatum" may be shifted to three times February, knowing the commitment of the Chinese comrades to numerological research ...
    1. Lech from Android.
      Lech from Android. 14 January 2022 06: 11
      +5
      I also had an idea ... why did the Kremlin suddenly start a movement before the presidential election ... smile two years are left, and no candidates for the highest post are seen or heard ... one GDP is only on the field ... the rest were driven under the plinth.
      1. Stils
        Stils 14 January 2022 07: 26
        +7
        Quote: Lech from Android.
        I also had an idea ... why did the Kremlin suddenly start a movement before the presidential election ... smile two years are left, and no candidates for the highest post are seen or heard ... one GDP is only on the field ... the rest were driven under the plinth.

        Putin seeks to sever relations with the West and impose sanctions against it before the presidential election.
        The result is known in advance, and not the recognition of Putin by America and the West as president should take place only after this gap.
        The example with Kazakhstan portends a total tightening of the screws and excludes any receiver.
        1. paul3390
          paul3390 14 January 2022 10: 46
          +31
          Putin seeks to sever relations with the West

          To do this, it is vital to do three things.
          1. To carry out reindustrialization, finally starting to produce at least the most necessary things ourselves.
          2. Carry out a total cleansing of the elite type from pro-Western liberals and just thieves.
          3. Enlist the support of the people, stop robbing them and provide them with at least basic life benefits and hope for a better future.

          And where is all this? Forgive me - but they don’t prepare for war like that! From this conclusion - all this is bullshit, our Elbasy is not going to seriously butt heads with the West ..
          1. Non-fighter
            Non-fighter 14 January 2022 11: 35
            +13
            Carry out a total cleansing of the elite type from pro-Western liberals and just thieves.

            And then what will be left of the elite???
            1. man
              man 14 January 2022 12: 36
              +4
              made me laugh, thanks laughing laughing laughing
            2. paul3390
              paul3390 14 January 2022 12: 46
              +4
              There was no elite - why feel sorry for them?
          2. Reserve officer
            Reserve officer 14 January 2022 13: 54
            +9
            Pavel, in your comment the very essence of the necessary transformations. This is exactly what was done in the 30s in the USSR, this is what ensured the Victory in the Great Patriotic War.
            And now the situation in the country rather resembles the state of Russia before 1914.
            1. paul3390
              paul3390 14 January 2022 15: 03
              +2
              And now the situation in the country rather resembles the state of Russia before 1914

              Exactly. And it will all end, just like it did then. It remains only to pray that the Bolsheviks will be able to pull Russia out of this shit this time too ..
          3. Avarron
            Avarron 15 January 2022 22: 15
            0
            People are buying up huts in Moscow and there are not enough new foreign cars for everyone, but at the same time their basic needs are not met. Hand face.
          4. The comment was deleted.
      2. Region-25.rus
        Region-25.rus 14 January 2022 12: 35
        0
        before the presidential election.
        ....Putin laughing
    2. Kamarada
      Kamarada 14 January 2022 07: 47
      +4
      I agree with you that it looks like the right moment has come or is about to come. Those who yell about the fact that Russia cannot answer pi with anything. N. Dosam or do not understand or stupidly afraid. I am sure the answer is what and how. But here the rush is not needed, but the desire and steel Faberge are needed. Now I remember how V.V. Putin said for a long time that this ruin must be carefully dismantled, otherwise it will collapse on the heads of many. Looks like we've reached the cornerstones now. In any case, I wish everyone endurance and without panic.
    3. lot
      lot 14 January 2022 07: 49
      -9
      Looks like a fan of the teachings of the stand-up sage I am Kedmi.
      Well, you can't mess with anything... laughing
      flicker and flicker, oh well.
      1. Ashes of Claes
        Ashes of Claes 14 January 2022 22: 37
        +2
        Quote: lot
        Looks like a fan of the teachings of the stand-up sage I am Kedmi.
        Well, you can't mess with anything...

        hell, minuses stumbled over Yashenka .... laughing
        We love the people of the media "shoulder". But the scent, I must say, did not disappoint the old Jew - he will have a feeder (at least until 2024). The BBC would probably pay less. There, unfortunately, the bullshit about "the head of one of Israel's special services" would hardly have worked. It is easier to monetize a bluff with us. Traditions)
        1. Tomato
          Tomato 16 January 2022 22: 14
          0
          I read that in Israel they are proud of Yasha. A private jet is sent for him. How appreciated.
    4. Ashes of Claes
      Ashes of Claes 14 January 2022 11: 53
      +14
      Quote: vervolk
      it is already quite obvious that Russia is "leading" the whole situation.

      Well ... There is a certain category of comrades who, in every uncertain fart from the Kremlin, tend to hear the thunder of victorious drums. Fountains of optimism should also be given a rest, following the advice of K. Prutkov.
      Quote: vervolk
      Given the latest trends in Chinese politics, copy the Russian Federation in everything

      Seriously? So we, it turns out, are the trendsetters of political fashion and the founders of trends?
    5. Keyser soze
      Keyser soze 14 January 2022 20: 53
      +5
      Considering the latest trends in Chinese politics, copy the Russian Federation in everything ...


      You got a little excited. Breathe deeply. So good.
      About the Chinese - the Chinese write from 3500 years ago and their civilization and all 5000 years. Well, straight from the Neolithic. Not only will they not copy anything in politics, from anyone, but they also look at all non-Chinese as if they were cows .... blah ... yes, they understand, in general. laughing
  3. KKND
    KKND 14 January 2022 05: 43
    +7
    As expected, the Americans rejected almost all of the demands put forward by the Russian side. We are waiting for a response from Russia.
    1. Ashes of Claes
      Ashes of Claes 14 January 2022 12: 04
      +4
      Quote: KKND
      We are waiting for a response from Russia.

      answer to what? To NATO's response? We will continue to maintain instability in the Donbass, what else?
  4. Jacket in stock
    Jacket in stock 14 January 2022 05: 49
    +20
    What kind of fish, what are you talking about?!
    On the contrary.
    They perfectly remember that we surrendered to them 30 years ago and almost all this time obediently carried out all their commands.
    They are just annoyed that the "trained dog" suddenly got pissed off.
    1. for
      for 14 January 2022 06: 08
      +1
      Yes, there is nothing they are not furious about, it’s just that no one has canceled the manufacture and sale of weapons, just like ours.
    2. Lech from Android.
      Lech from Android. 14 January 2022 06: 19
      -3
      They're just annoyed
      that the "trained dog" suddenly became enraged
      .
      Well, it's you in vain ...
      here Sullivan recently became enraged at the information throw that Russia could deploy its armed forces in Latin America ... it would really be a punch in the gut.
      1. Ashes of Claes
        Ashes of Claes 14 January 2022 11: 55
        +13
        Quote: Lech from Android.
        here Sullivan recently got pissed off about the information that Russia could deploy its armed forces in Latin America.

        About how ... Already "furious" ... Yes, what really - sculpt that he was taken away from the briefing with a stroke. Well, or locked himself in a toilet cubicle shouting "The Russians are coming!"
      2. man
        man 14 January 2022 13: 10
        -5
        I present his reaction to our missiles in Serbia smile
        1. Ashes of Claes
          Ashes of Claes 14 January 2022 18: 34
          +5
          Quote: mann
          I present his reaction to our missiles in Serbia

          yes-ah, yesterday's article by a local analyst would have brought him to colic if he had read such bullshit.
    3. yuriy55
      yuriy55 14 January 2022 07: 51
      +5
      Quote: Jacket in stock
      They are just annoyed that the "trained dog" suddenly got pissed off.

      good
      So far - the best!
  5. Mihail55
    Mihail55 14 January 2022 06: 23
    +29
    Only the development of their national economy will make it possible to shut the throats of all these sanctioners! We have become a DEPENDENT country!!! A new generation has already grown up, which cannot live without imported gadgets... has the market done everything????
    1. Redsun
      Redsun 14 January 2022 09: 19
      +2
      Without imported gadgets, the population of Russia cannot live almost to the same extent as Europe and the USA. they are all made in China. In addition, several good initiatives to revive our microelectronics have recently taken place. So pass here. Another thing is that in many production areas we really still depend on Western supplies.
      1. Dartik
        Dartik 14 January 2022 14: 52
        +2
        Quote: redsun
        Without imported gadgets, the population of Russia cannot live almost to the same extent as Europe and the USA. they are all made in China. In addition, several good initiatives to revive our microelectronics have recently taken place. So pass here. Another thing is that in many production areas we really still depend on Western supplies.

        Like China, it depends on the US and the EU. In microelectronics, the Russian Federation has little chance for something, as not enough money is allocated, and lobbying for Western interests in this area is high, the same company Core that fulfills Western interests in the Russian Federation. China may succeed, as they have a lot of money.
      2. The comment was deleted.
    2. Ashes of Claes
      Ashes of Claes 14 January 2022 11: 59
      +7
      Quote: Michael55
      Only the development of their national economy will make it possible to shut the throat of all these sanctioners!

      in theory, of course. But no one has a sane recipe for this "development". And so yes...
      Quote: Michael55
      A new generation has already grown up that cannot live without imported gadgets... has the market done everything????

      So you propose to take away their gadgets?
  6. Lair
    Lair 14 January 2022 06: 28
    +25
    Maybe let's face it? Russia's demands on NATO - not to accept new members to the bloc (and not just Ukraine and Georgia), withdraw troops to the borders as of 1997 (i.e., withdraw troops from almost all of Eastern Europe) - it is obviously impossible for the bloc to fulfill, since it will be equivalent his dissolution. Roughly speaking, Putin asked NATO to voluntarily self-destruct. Therefore, Russia's inadequate demands could not cause a different reaction from NATO.
    1. unaha
      unaha 14 January 2022 07: 17
      +19
      Quote: Lair
      Maybe let's face it?

      Quite right. But to face the truth is unpleasant. It is much more customary to simply blame the "treacherous West."
      And ignore the statistics: support for joining NATO in Ukraine has grown from 12,5% ​​in 2008 to 59% in 2021, it has grown significantly in Finland.
      In general, attitudes towards the Russian Federation have deteriorated almost everywhere.
    2. vervolk
      vervolk 14 January 2022 07: 21
      -7
      This is exactly what it was intended to do, apparently. It is obvious. That's not the question...
    3. The comment was deleted.
      1. Kamarada
        Kamarada 14 January 2022 10: 54
        -7
        How do you know what will happen next? . Wait and see. And if you pinch the freaks of Faberge.? What are you croaking then?
      2. man
        man 14 January 2022 13: 20
        +1
        as an option, you can call Biden on the mat
  7. Lepsik
    Lepsik 14 January 2022 06: 49
    0
    This means that it is necessary to cut off from Maidaniya and Saakia regularly piece by piece the lands that do not belong to them, keeping the smoldering territorial problem there.
  8. Sergey Nikiforov
    Sergey Nikiforov 14 January 2022 07: 21
    +9
    Roman, but after all, in response to the demand to return NATO to the borders of 1997, they may demand the return of Crimea, the territories of Georgia. Is this the decision of the people of these territories ..? Well, the Baltics wanted to join NATO. In my opinion, this is different. This is the beginning of the election campaign in 2024. You are a smart person and perfectly understand what and how
    1. Scientist
      Scientist 14 January 2022 09: 05
      -1
      So after all, this can be demanded to return Kosovo. And if a referendum was indeed held in Crimea and one can refer to all sorts of UN documents, then there was nothing of the kind in Kosovo.
      1. Avior
        Avior 14 January 2022 10: 07
        +7
        demand the return of Kosovo

        From whom to demand? Who took Kosovo?
        you can refer to all sorts of UN documents

        At the request of Serbia and the UN General Assembly, the legality of the declaration of independence of Kosovo was examined by the International Court of Justice and confirmed its legality, although this conclusion is not binding.
        1. Scientist
          Scientist 14 January 2022 23: 16
          0
          I had in mind the right to self-determination and a referendum as an expression of the will of the people.
          1. Avior
            Avior 15 January 2022 11: 59
            +1
            According to international rules, nations have the right to self-determination, and not just residents of a certain territory.
            And this is enshrined in both the Ukrainian constitution and the Russian one.
            1. Scientist
              Scientist 15 January 2022 23: 17
              -1
              In the English text People, not Nation.
              1. Avior
                Avior 16 January 2022 00: 11
                +1
                Why don't you like Russian? It has equal power with English, so there is not the slightest point in delving into the subtleties of the English language.
                Nations and peoples in UN documents are used as synonyms
                Develop friendly relations among nations based on respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of peoples

                Can you quote from a document confirming that UN documents give the population of Crimea the right to self-determination and a link to the document?
                1. The comment was deleted.
                2. Scientist
                  Scientist 16 January 2022 09: 04
                  -1
                  However, in English (as well as in Russian) there are two different words. And people who wrote in this way and not otherwise understood this difference very well.
                  By the way, I fully admit that such a wording was chosen precisely for the possibility of the desired interpretation in the desired situation.
                  1. Avior
                    Avior 16 January 2022 10: 12
                    +2
                    People in English is people in Russian.
                    In this context, it is used as a synonym for nation, which is obvious from the text.
                    This is how Article 1 of the UN Charter, which I cited, looks like in English
                    To develop friendly relations among nations based on respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of peoples


                    There is the same thing as in Russian - the nation and the people are used as synonyms.
                    There is not the slightest point in discussing the subtleties of the English language in the presence of an equivalent Russian version. The UN has seven official languages ​​and Russian is one of them.
                    So, what UN document do you have in mind in the case of Crimea. As long as you have a set of common words. No quotes, no links.
                    1. Scientist
                      Scientist 16 January 2022 12: 19
                      -1
                      You don't know Russian well. Nation and people are not synonyms. For example, the Yakuts or Ingush are not a nation, but a people. Moreover, the word people has other meanings, in contrast to the word nation.
                      1. Avior
                        Avior 16 January 2022 14: 58
                        +1
                        In legal practice, words have their own meaning, which does not always coincide with everyday or literary.
                        And even so, I don’t see any quotes and links from you to the UN documents that you wrote about above
      2. Sergey Nikiforov
        Sergey Nikiforov 14 January 2022 10: 27
        +1
        And to whom did you join Kosovo.?
        1. Scientist
          Scientist 14 January 2022 23: 12
          0
          And here they joined? It was illegally separated from Serbia.
          1. Avior
            Avior 16 January 2022 00: 13
            +2
            You wrote that someone should return it. And who specifically should return, they did not write.
            1. Scientist
              Scientist 16 January 2022 09: 08
              -2
              Those who organized the division of Serbia and who are now actively suppressing any attempts to return are the United States and NATO. Or, alternatively, the UN. Since his decisions are most often determined by the United States.
              1. Avior
                Avior 16 January 2022 10: 03
                +1
                These are common words. You can write what the world behind the scenes took with the same success, there are no grounds for this either.
                The person who took it can return it. So who took it - the US, NATO or the UN? And what did it mean?
                1. Scientist
                  Scientist 16 January 2022 12: 25
                  -1
                  If you were robbed, then the police usually return things (if they still exist), and not the criminal at all. Or do you think it's not possible? Not properly?
                  1. Avior
                    Avior 16 January 2022 14: 55
                    +2
                    In my opinion, to a stranger they turn to you.
                    But in essence, there is a court decision, although it is advisory in nature.
  9. Speedy
    Speedy 14 January 2022 07: 25
    +3
    Our demands were obviously impracticable, which means that the matter naturally lies elsewhere. In general, the game of experienced magicians is on the face here. Everyone is looking where the magician needs. Maybe it’s real as long as we scare the West and arrange zircon launches, rotate armies around Ukraine, the Chinese comrades will return the Taiwan Special District to their native harbor.
  10. lot
    lot 14 January 2022 07: 39
    -4
    but to be honest, it was difficult for me to take any position at all

    That's the trouble, still without a position?
    But the article is ready. N. Drozdov would envy.
  11. Cypa
    Cypa 14 January 2022 07: 51
    -5
    Superiority OVER the West
    Secondly, right now and now the Russian Federation has a local military-technological and military superiority over the West. Perhaps there is also an agreement on joint actions with China, where Comrade Xi is really "running out of time" in connection with the upcoming CPC Congress. Given the latest trends in Chinese politics to copy the Russian Federation in everything, Taiwan may be preparing to return to its native harbor. And it is better to do this together with similar actions in the Donbass. And then the term for the active response of the Russian Federation to the "ultimatum" may be shifted to three times February, knowing the commitment of the Chinese comrades to numerological research ... [/ quote]
  12. Woodman
    Woodman 14 January 2022 08: 02
    +11
    on the territory of which the occupying Russian troops are stationed
    I think in this phrase one of the words should be in quotation marks ...
    In fact, we are returning to the times of the Cold War, there is nothing to be done about it.
    As for me, we didn’t get out of this war.
    - Only Ukraine and 30 allies can decide when Ukraine will join NATO. Russia cannot have the right to "veto" the expansion of the alliance.

    Nevertheless, Russia has already used this same veto on entry. According to the NATO charter, in the current state, Ukraine (like Georgia and Moldova) cannot be accepted into the bloc.
    1. Avior
      Avior 14 January 2022 10: 09
      +6
      According to the NATO charter ...

      this is a common misconception. Formally, there are no such restrictions in the NATO charter.
      1. Woodman
        Woodman 14 January 2022 10: 19
        +4
        Quote: Avior
        Formally, there are no such restrictions in the NATO charter.

        And the truth is not. Did not know. Thank you. But, which is characteristic, there has not yet been a precedent for the admission of such countries to the bloc.
        1. Avior
          Avior 14 January 2022 11: 00
          +5
          There is an informal requirement that those who join should not have territorial claims against other countries, but formally the NATO countries recognize Crimea as the territory of Ukraine, and South Ossetia as Georgia, so there are no claims, formally the rule is fulfilled.
          In the current situation, there was simply no such precedent.
  13. yuriy55
    yuriy55 14 January 2022 08: 07
    +9
    Groundhog Day, performed by Dory the fish, will continue for a very long time.

    Do you remember how Phil Connors was able to get rid of the daily return on Groundhog Day?
    yes Right. He became better and people were drawn to him, and Rita Hanson herself "bought him" ...
    I think that such a position of the West has once again shown (and proved) that no one in the West wants to talk to Russia in the form in which it is. Therefore, it is necessary to reorganize so as not to scour ONLY IN SEARCH OF WILD PROFIT AND PROFIT, but to look for reliable partners. Help the citizens of your country understand that:
    My country is widespread,
    There are many forests, fields and rivers in it.
    I do not know another such country,
    Where man breathes so freely!

    If someone is not ready to do this, if someone of all achievements sees the right to build a palace as the main one; to award a “Hero of Labor” to a “worker” who has not driven a “rusty nail” anywhere, or to try to force him to love himself against his will and rule forever, then treat with understanding the possible contempt on the part of those (and voters among them) who placed more hopes than your untimely and miserable handouts.
  14. nikvic46
    nikvic46 14 January 2022 08: 25
    0
    The main thing for us is the non-deployment of nuclear weapons in Ukraine and Georgia. And NATO in 1997 went into the realm of legend, when we also wanted to join NATO. It is impossible to embrace the immensity. Foreign policy has gone somewhere. We even answer the "yellow" newspaper with thunder and lightning. Every aggressive speech on our TV sites in the West is expected like manna from heaven. Here, they say, what they are. Ukraine and Georgia, and we need to work on them.
  15. bandabas
    bandabas 14 January 2022 08: 34
    0
    In chess, this position in the game is called "mutual zugzwang".
    1. Pilot
      Pilot 14 January 2022 09: 50
      +5
      So, chess players have only checkers as a taxi driver. laughing
      1. bandabas
        bandabas 14 January 2022 18: 54
        0
        As it applies to checkers too.
  16. alexvmar
    alexvmar 14 January 2022 08: 40
    0
    Just for the sake of interest, but the author Roman Skomorokhov was present at the negotiations and heard every time what they were talking about? Or is it a speech based on press releases?
  17. Azim77
    Azim77 14 January 2022 08: 50
    +11
    Groundhog Day for Dory the Fish

    I have some experience of working with Americans. Perhaps I am mistaken, there are those who live in the USA and may object. But from personal observation, many of their full-time office workers usually have this approach to business:
    1. They are very fond of negotiations, discussions, meetings.
    2. They are very fond of "drawing" routines, regulations, procedures.
    3. They must show activity at work! This imitation of vigorous activity is one of the main factors in evaluating the work of an employee.

    At the same time, their workflow is divided into 2 areas:
    1. filling the agenda with "empty" and repetitive tasks
    2. activity in case of a really serious problem or threat to business.

    US diplomats and the same Sherman are, first of all, performers, office workers.
    With this in mind, this meeting was just an agenda with a discussion of "empty" tasks for them, because. they see no threat to their business. No matter how embarrassing it is. They just have more reserve and status. The struggle is not in their rear, but far from it. Another thing, if it were like in the Caribbean crisis. There, the threat was clear and they had, and the memory was, and the words were of value.

    Hence the usual formula for working with them - hit first, and then bargain. They are not gentlemen, they do not believe the words.
    1. expert
      expert 14 January 2022 11: 57
      +4
      I want to support you.
      I don’t know how in the field of diplomacy, in everyday life, in Germany, I constantly encountered this.
      Even at parent meetings and school. Despite the fact that it is impossible to speak personally about children, those present turned any, the smallest question of a general order, into a problem and were ready to procrastinate it for hours.
      At work, it's generally like a blueprint.
      There are practically no employees who are ready to take responsibility for making a decision that goes even one iota beyond the scope of something long prescribed and really outdated.
      The most surprising thing is if a higher-ranking employee said “no” to you, the Germans just “wash their paws” in their blood and sit quietly. Everything, they answered you, no way! Trying to continue to fight to demand something is considered a violation of the report card or just natural bad manners.
      I think it was from this position that Russia's demands were treated at the past meetings. We are you, strange Russians
      already said NO!
      And a hypertrophied desire to turn a clear, clear decision-making into many hours of chatter in a vicious circle.
      Although, of course, there is progress, and life goes on...
  18. Scientist
    Scientist 14 January 2022 09: 25
    +5
    In fact, we are returning to the days of the Cold War.

    So after all, it was only Bullseye who believed that he "ended" the Cold War. She didn't think it would end. Because it was and is being led not with the communist Union, as they said, but with Russia. And the so-called Great Game of the 19th and early 20th centuries is not a cold war but against imperial Russia? This is a war of two civilizations, and one of them, the Anglo-Saxon, has rich experience in destroying others.
    1. Kronos
      Kronos 14 January 2022 10: 14
      +2
      Imperial Russia ended in 1917. As for civilization, now in Russia exactly the same capitalism and there are no special differences in civilization from the United States.
      1. Scientist
        Scientist 14 January 2022 23: 06
        0
        Do not confuse the content of the supermarket and civilization.
  19. carpenter
    carpenter 14 January 2022 09: 34
    +2
    Mrs. Sherman made no secret of the fact that she had a bunch of much more important things to do at home than listening to the opinion of the Russian delegation.
    Here the war is on the nose, and the "God's dandelion" has affairs at home.
    So at home (we read in the USA), things are not very good, so do your "household chores", sit on your continent and don't pretend to be "above God", and Europe and Russia will sort it out somehow without you, and even more so China understands the Pacific region: without American ears.
  20. prior
    prior 14 January 2022 09: 42
    -5
    If diplomats cannot agree, your word is "Comrade Mauser." angry
  21. wow
    wow 14 January 2022 10: 14
    -5
    Why talk to this granny about something? Children, grandchildren she has, hardly .... She will not be able to understand that it is very harmful for children to play in a radioactive sandbox ...
  22. BMP-2
    BMP-2 14 January 2022 10: 55
    +2
    Another Groundhog Day. It remains to find the "Mirror for the hero."
  23. Boris63
    Boris63 14 January 2022 10: 56
    0
    What the "partners" say at the press conferences has been recorded for a long time and is repeated every day. But what was said at the talks themselves, most likely we will never know. "Partners" do not want to lose their face, so they talk to the public like parrots. Ours, without some kind of Joker in their pocket, would not put forward such demands. The West was given to understand about it and they are now digesting it, repeating boring mantras, because so far they cannot say anything new.
    1. Kronos
      Kronos 14 January 2022 11: 17
      -4
      That's what they always say when there's no success. In fact, we won this is simply not visible!
  24. Pavel57
    Pavel57 14 January 2022 11: 26
    0
    The position of the US and NATO may be changed by a deepening economic or military-political crisis. Otherwise Groundhog Day will continue without prospects of detente. Russia's arguments can only be heard if the deadly threat is realized. Now this is not possible. Conclusion - rates will continue to grow.
  25. Basarev
    Basarev 14 January 2022 11: 47
    +9
    Why should the NATO delegation obey Russia at all? For more than half of the world's GDP, a measly 2% is clearly not a decree.
  26. Mapping
    Mapping 14 January 2022 12: 49
    0
    Until we start acting tough, no one will listen to us.
  27. Illanatol
    Illanatol 14 January 2022 14: 07
    0
    Quote: Ashes of Klaas
    So we, it turns out, are the trendsetters of political fashion and the founders of trends?


    Yes, in a way. The main troublemakers on the planet who do not give final shape
    Pax Americana.
    If they were small and insignificant, they would not pay attention to our frondism.

    Russia is still too weak to really bend its line on a planetary scale. But to justify someone else's raspberries on the same scale is quite capable and turns out well.

    In fact, the US position is not very advantageous. China will really benefit from any increase in conflict with the Russian Federation.
  28. BAI
    BAI 14 January 2022 14: 18
    +5
    Does it make sense to start negotiations at all, if the result is a foregone conclusion?

    The point is in the very fact of the negotiations and precisely in their predetermined failure (the requirements are deliberately unfulfillable for the United States and NATO). And this is needed then to justify the use of the RF Armed Forces in the conflict in Donbass, where the situation is tense to the limit and can explode at any moment. When everyone is sure of the inevitability of a war, it will surely begin.
    1. UltraRed
      UltraRed 14 January 2022 15: 31
      -2
      All these "ultimatums" and "negotiations" on the part of the leadership of the Russian Federation are a moral indulgence before the collective West (which they really wanted - but did not take) before the admission of the PRC to the CSTO. Then, under the "nuclear umbrella of the Russian Federation", "the solution of the Taiwan issue" will follow.
      For some reason, the Americans do not fully believe in this ... Just as they did not believe in Putin's violation of the "Washington consensus" in 2010. Then they miscalculated - the result - "Vanguards", "Daggers" and "Sarmat" are on the way (which is the main thing).
      The most disgusting thing in this situation is that both the USA and the Russian Federation rely on some "hidden trump cards", which, apparently, are not fully voiced. It smells like 1914 ...
      If the adherents of dispersionism in the REAL elite crowd of the Anglo-Saxons nevertheless seriously decided to provoke a nuclear war ... Then it is somehow sad ...
  29. Dartik
    Dartik 14 January 2022 14: 59
    -1
    The sanctions of the West are already ready against the Russian Federation in the event of an attack on Ukraine, but they are very tough and drag on most civilians. Our people are already living in tension, and here if they are deprived of the main benefits of civilization, then this is the point of no return. I just can’t understand that the Russian Federation really planned to attack Ukraine, if the United States was so upset and began to prepare sanctions, because it was possible before.
  30. Victor Tsenin
    Victor Tsenin 14 January 2022 17: 14
    0
    >consisted entirely of Dory fish, whose memory does not work at all.

    Of course, she smiled about the fish) However, this is the good old position they have, I see it here, I don’t see it there, I remember it here, I don’t remember it there.

    For example, I recall the situation with the executions of refugees by the NATO country - Poland, they did not see the fish, or maybe they have already forgotten.

    The memory of the fish is activated when Iran joins the CSTO, when an air defense umbrella appears over the base of the Russian Federation over Venezuela, when the brave fighters against imperialism acquire tangible quantities of excellent and reliable weapons from Russia. With such factors, Dory and the company will turn into people.
  31. AML
    AML 14 January 2022 19: 27
    +1
    Quote: paul3390
    Putin seeks to sever relations with the West

    To do this, it is vital to do three things.
    1. To carry out reindustrialization, finally starting to produce at least the most necessary things ourselves.
    2. Carry out a total cleansing of the elite type from pro-Western liberals and just thieves.
    3. Enlist the support of the people, stop robbing them and provide them with at least basic life benefits and hope for a better future.

    And where is all this? Forgive me - but they don’t prepare for war like that! From this conclusion - all this is bullshit, our Elbasy is not going to seriously butt heads with the West ..



  32. Patzi
    Patzi 14 January 2022 19: 49
    -1
    Personally, I think that because of the refusal of the West to agree with Russia on the security of its borders. Russia must take the lead in the next steps to neutralize the provocations of NATO and Washington.
  33. lopvlad
    lopvlad 14 January 2022 20: 03
    +1
    Groundhog Day for Dory the Fish


    Р ° СќС,Рѕ РѕРμРіР ° жоооР"Р Р Р Р РѕРѕРѕРμ С ‡ С С РѕРѕРѕРμРѕРѕР ° Сџ РёРѕС С сР ° С,С,СѓРєС СѓСђР ° Рё РіРѕРμРѕРѕС <Рμ Р · РІРμР · РґРѕРѕРѕРѕР РѕСѓР ° ° S,RѕR№ SЃS,SЂR ° RЅS <C ‡ ‰ SЊRμR№ RіRѕRІRѕSЂSЏS RμR№ RіRѕR "RѕRІRѕR№ SЏRІR" SЏRμS,SЃSЏ SЌS,R ° F "RѕSЂRo RЅR ° C ... RѕRґSЏS,SЃSЏ RЅR ° S,RμSЂSЂRoS,RѕSЂRoRo RoSЃRєRѕRЅRЅRѕR№ Р СѓСЃРё РSP° УкраиРРЅРµ Рё РёР·-Р·Р° наших озабоченностей оттуда РЅРµ СѓРНРґСѓСѓРґСѓСѓ
  34. Dkuznecov
    Dkuznecov 14 January 2022 21: 19
    +2
    "The So-Called Author"...
    Enough with the joke already
    "He also stuffed your pants and soiled your jacket."
    Themselves are good. There are no goats. There are no speechwriters.
    There is no clear logic. Ryabkov's attempts are depressing.
    That's why we go through the woods.
  35. Dkuznecov
    Dkuznecov 14 January 2022 21: 22
    0
    Quote: Cypa
    right now and now the Russian Federation has a local military-technological and military superiority over the West.

    I'll try to be polite, but I feel like
    you ate henbane.
  36. Living7111972
    Living7111972 14 January 2022 22: 01
    +2
    Build planes, ships, put the boys to drive tractors (like us in the USSR) ...
    Give our children a job, a sense of pride for which will be pride for themselves and the country.
  37. spartak2014
    spartak2014 14 January 2022 23: 10
    +2
    As Israel should, attack NATO bases IN NEIGHBOR COUNTRIES.
  38. Radikal
    Radikal 15 January 2022 00: 06
    0

    Groundhog Day, performed by Dory the fish, will continue for a very long time.

    This day is permanent, since October 1917! Another question is how this was answered in different periods of time! It is necessary to voice these periods, or is it clear? sad
  39. AC130 Gunship
    AC130 Gunship 15 January 2022 04: 01
    +6
    The author, what are you, really believed that the stupid Americans and / or NATO would suddenly come and say: yes, like, they were wrong. And the last 30 years have been going the wrong way and, most importantly, the wrong way. We'll fix everything now. We quickly export missiles from Poland. We exclude the Balts from the bloc. We export military advisers from Georgia, etc., etc. Did you really believe in all this?
  40. pylon101
    pylon101 15 January 2022 05: 24
    -2
    Through negotiations, ultimatums, threats, we gain time. The time factor is very important.
    How we manage them is up to us.
  41. p0pulivox
    p0pulivox 15 January 2022 13: 25
    -1
    Quote from Cartograph
    Until we start acting tough, no one will listen to us.

    To start acting tough, you need to be clearly aware of your goals, as well as have the necessary resources to achieve them (and to solve the problems that arise), high unity of society, and it is desirable to have normal allies ... What of this is available?
    1. Drako
      Drako 15 January 2022 17: 36
      +1
      The desire to live - and children to live - that's your goal, and the unification of society, society is again a resource, but you don't need to look for allies, you need to take it and say, - dear, help us on the way, while I ask in a good way , I do not offend.
      1. p0pulivox
        p0pulivox 15 January 2022 17: 53
        -2
        You see, this sounds a bit too general/abstract...
        1. Drako
          Drako 15 January 2022 17: 55
          0
          So this is a guide and not for thinking.
          1. p0pulivox
            p0pulivox 15 January 2022 17: 58
            -2
            A guide to action must be based on something, otherwise everything will hang in the air!
            1. Drako
              Drako 15 January 2022 18: 02
              +1
              Historically, it seemed to help, so why invent something if you can use something that has already been beaten up on.
  42. Kesha1980
    Kesha1980 15 January 2022 21: 12
    -1
    We read our demands to NATO, we think, and NATO's answer becomes obvious - unacceptable. This is the whole point of our demands - in the end, "officially puppet" and become "opposite" NATO.
    Now, "catching forced allies" and being in an official (!) confrontation - I won't be surprised if, according to a joint scenario with the United States, with the "dedicated West."
    Chess players, plin!
  43. faterdom
    faterdom 16 January 2022 00: 52
    +1
    One small moment, which lately everyone is somehow omitting, as if it never happened.
    In response to what was the so-called "Putin's ultmatum" put forward?
    And in response to the fact that Biden was very eager to meet, so that even Nuland, being under sanctions from our side, came to us in exchange for lifting the bans on one of ours.
    And Biden one-on-one with a whole crowd talked with Putin, and wanted something so interesting from him that Putin demanded to drive NATO under the bunk. What is impossible today, as rightly noted by many authors, because even public opinion in the States and Europe is so unprepared for this that for any current politician this is political death, or even an accusation of treason.
    On the other hand, it is unlikely that Biden would begin to importunately beg Putin for something that is not vital for America.
    So the question rather sounds like this: what Biden wanted and now he definitely won’t get, or he will get it with a negative sign.
    We will soon see, all sorts of miracles happen in this world - Kim is already testing hypersonic missiles, and it seems that they are more successful than the Americans. Or Iran and India in the CSTO, and China - a privileged ally, who still squeezed Taiwan into its native harbor - then what will the world layouts, military and economic, look like?
    Impose sanctions?
    Like Lithuania to China, such, or what? Well, well, only then mind not crying!
  44. demiurg
    demiurg 16 January 2022 10: 26
    -1
    Put in neutral waters opposite New York, Los Angeles and New Orleans three container ships, each with a displacement of two hundred thousand, and place Iskanders on the upper decks. Fill the holds with reinforced foam concrete. Announce that this is a defense against Guatemalan extremists.

    And watch the US reaction.
  45. Tomato
    Tomato 16 January 2022 22: 29
    -2
    I understand that I will say something that will cause thunder and lightning. But.
    I open the "Ranking of countries by GDP".
    USA - 20.
    Russia - 1. 483 times less. Why did someone decide that the United States should speak on an equal footing?
    Does Russia speak on an equal footing, does it really respect countries 14 times weaker? Ah, here's a good example. The Ukrainian economy is 10 times smaller than Russia.
    I foresee the answer - the nuclear triad. The USSR did not help.
  46. amr
    amr 17 January 2022 21: 29
    -1
    Quote: vervolk
    Given the latest trends in Chinese politics to copy the Russian Federation in everything, Taiwan may be preparing to return to its native harbor

    very interesting version!
  47. SovAr238A
    SovAr238A 17 January 2022 22: 14
    +2
    The author simply did not understand one thing.
    The Americans and NATO simply do not consider Russia to be someone who can set conditions for them.
    They really consider us weak both in the economy and in real military confrontation.
    They consider us at the level of the Upper Volta.
    How many years ago.
    And the communique signed by us that 5 countries undertake not to fight with nuclear weapons gives them even more confidence.