Military Review

The timing of the receipt of the modernized Su-30SM2 fighters in the Russian Aerospace Forces has been disclosed

125

The Russian Aerospace Forces can receive the upgraded Su-30SM2 fighters in 2023; it is at the end of next year that special flight tests of the new aircraft should be completed. This was announced by a source in the aviation industry.


According to a representative of the Russian defense industry, the modernized Su-30SM2, which received the AL-41F-1C engine from the Su-35 fighter, has now begun special flight tests, which should be completed by December 2023. The fighter must make more than 150 flights; to date, no more than 10% of the required volume has been completed.

In the process of performing SLI on the Su-30SM (D) and Su-30SM2 aircraft, it is envisaged to issue a preliminary opinion, which will allow, according to the decision of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, to supply Su-2023SM30 aircraft with AL-2F-41S engines in 1

- leads "Interfax" source words.

The fact that the Ministry of Defense is launching a program to modernize the Su-30SM combat aircraft to the level of the Su-30SM2 became known in August last year. Work as part of the "experimental overhaul of the Su-30SM aircraft of the Ministry of Defense with simultaneous modernization" was supposed to start in December 2021, but no information has been received.

According to preliminary information, the first batch of modernized Su-30SM2 should be delivered to the Aerospace Forces by the end of this year. How many planes it will have is not reported. Also, the Ministry of Defense has not yet officially announced information on the total number of Su-30SM combat fighters planned for modernization. To date, the Aerospace Forces and the Navy have about 130 Su-30SM, which have been delivered since 2013.

Simultaneously with the modernization of the combatant Su-30SM, the Ministry of Defense will also purchase new-built Su-30SM2 fighters. The contract for the supply of 21 new Su-30SM2 fighters was signed in 2020, it is planned that the new aircraft will strengthen the sea Aviation.

The modernized Su-30SM2 fighter is maximally unified with the Su-35 fighter. In the course of modernization, combat fighters will receive the AL-41F-1S engine and the Irbis radar, the avionics, electronics will be improved, and the arsenal of weapons will be expanded.
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  1. JD1979
    JD1979 3 January 2022 17: 06
    +25
    Those. a spent, serial engine that feels fine in the Su-35 body needs to be tested for 2 years in an almost twin ..., again, a serial one. Either I don’t understand something, or it’s possible to cut a lot more on "tests" than in mass deliveries of equipment.
    1. alexmach
      alexmach 3 January 2022 19: 10
      +8
      Those. a spent, serial engine that feels fine in the Su-35 hull needs to be tested for 2 years in an almost twin ..., again, a serial one.

      Well, when the engine is replaced, the load on the airframe will at least increase. Plus the deflected thrust vector in planes in which it has not previously deflected ...
      But 2 years really take a long time. Could you have covered these 150 flights in one year? Although, again, what kind of maintenance and analysis she does in the interflight period is not clear ...

      Well, there are 2 questions as far as I understood - the release of new and the modernization of existing fighters .. it is not clear what they are experiencing ... are not both options. The release of new ones is not completely clear why it is needed, the modernization of the existing ones may not yet burn due to the fact that this very motor resource has not yet been selected for old engines.
      1. Volkof
        Volkof 3 January 2022 23: 41
        +5
        The article, as well as the author's head, is a complete mess ...

        The Ministry of Defense will also purchase new-built Su-30SM2 fighters. The contract for the supply of 21 new Su-30SM2 fighters was signed in 2020, it is planned that the new aircraft will strengthen the naval aviation.

        Under this contract, the naval aviation will supply ordinary Su-30SM, but modernized under the Sych program. Someone glued the CM2 index to these planes, that's where all the confusion comes from ...
        According to a representative of the Russian defense industry, the modernized Su-30SM2, which received the AL-41F-1C engine from the Su-35 fighter, has now begun special flight tests, which should be completed by December 2023.

        And this is not reliable information. Nothing took off anywhere. The Su-30SM2 should take off at the end of 2022 ... Then tests and state acceptance until the end of 2023 ... And only then the release of new ones and the modernization of old ones ...
        What is the overhaul life before 1 repair for the Su-30SM in years 8 + 1 or 9 + 1? The first large batch of Su-30SM was delivered in 2013.
      2. EvilLion
        EvilLion 4 January 2022 12: 00
        +1
        150 Flights per year - that's 2 kopeck days for one flight, while you need not just fly, but prepare a detailed report for each, and have time to spare for force majeure and elimination of defects.
      3. Volkof
        Volkof 4 January 2022 13: 42
        +1
        Each engine has its own attachment points to the airframe of the aircraft and a specific configuration, or rather a line-up ... To control the engine, their sensors and systems are used and they can be very different even for AL-31 and AL-41 with all the consequences ... 30SM2 is a different aircraft and it may turn out that simple Su-30SM is not profitable, and maybe it will be impossible to modify on the engine and airframe up to the Su-30SM2 ... Do not listen to the statements of incompetent "storytellers", and the military the same .... This also applies to Indian aircraft .... The period until the end of 2023 is not so long ...
        1. Volkof
          Volkof 4 January 2022 14: 26
          +1
          But here is some encouraging first-hand information about the Su-35S engine:
          As a power plant, the aircraft received two TRDDF 117S developed by NPO Saturn. The 117S is a development of the AL-31F engine installed on Su-27 aircraft and is distinguished by an increased afterburner (from 12500 kgf to 14500 kgf) and non-afterburner (from 7700 to 8800 kgf) thrust, as well as a doubled assigned resource. The engine gained the ability to control the thrust vector by deflecting the nozzle at an angle of up to 2 ° from the neutral position. Joint deflection of the nozzles provides control of the aircraft in the longitudinal, transverse and track channels.


          https://www.sukhoi.org/products/samolety/256/
    2. EMMM
      EMMM 3 January 2022 20: 59
      +2
      So it is written that the composition of avionics and weapons have changed. A proven engine and a new armament system in an old glider still need to be tested.
    3. 1Alexey
      1Alexey 4 January 2022 01: 10
      0
      Quote: JD1979
      Those. a spent, serial engine that feels fine in the Su-35 hull needs to be tested for 2 years in an almost twin ..., again, a serial one.

      The article contains conflicting information on this score.

      On the one hand, it says:
      According to a representative of the Russian defense industry, the modernized Su-30SM2, which received the AL-41F-1C engine from the Su-35 fighter, has now begun special flight tests, which should be completed by December 2023.

      And then it really turns out about 2 years.

      But on the other hand, the same article says:
      According to preliminary information, the first batch of modernized Su-30SM2 should be delivered to the Aerospace Forces by the end of this year.

      At the same time, nowhere in that paragraph is 2023 mentioned, the question arises: what then is meant by the words "this year"? Usually, in such cases, such words mean the year the article was written (i.e. 2022), then it turns out 1 year.
      1. JD1979
        JD1979 4 January 2022 08: 23
        +1
        Quote: 1Alexey
        And then it really turns out about 2 years.

        Oh, I don’t know the protocols ... but trying to reason logically, I just can’t understand what can be done for 2 years watching the sex of "dinosaurs"? when one is 30 years old and the other is + -15? And after 2 years, scratch the back of your head and ... let's cram a younger egg into our lizard, it's not cool for an electromechanic anymore and ... we announce the next 2-3 years of watching a home p ... already with F-1, without "C ".
    4. PROXOR
      PROXOR 4 January 2022 02: 12
      +1
      I am worried about something else. AFAR WHERE ?!
    5. EvilLion
      EvilLion 4 January 2022 11: 58
      0
      You cannot screw a new nut on an airplane without a complete certification program. Do not understand the issue, do not write nonsense.
      1. Volkof
        Volkof 4 January 2022 13: 04
        +1
        You are very mistaken about the "nut"! In the USSR, every year, a set of modifications was performed on almost all aircraft. Moreover, it was carried out in military units, but by factory brigades, as a rule, when performing routine maintenance in the TEC. For example, on the Su-17M3, 7 such complexes of improvements were performed! Serious work was carried out. Systems were changed, new ones were installed, new wires and harnesses were laid, sometimes new air intake pipes were installed for cooling ... The work was carried out mainly qualified, but the military was responsible for the quality and control of the work performed, oddly enough ... There were many opponents of such work in parts ...
        In addition, by order of the Air Force commander, it was allowed, as an experiment, as directed by the chief engineers of the air armies, to carry out modifications on the aircraft by the military himself in order to increase the combat effectiveness of the aircraft, but only on the 1st aircraft of each type of equipment ... For example, on the SU-17M3 the sighting system was not perfect. Due to the departure of the parameters of the analog computer, for high-quality shooting and combat use in automatic and semi-automatic modes, it was necessary to perform adjustments on the ground before each series of combat use ... For this, the military installed an error compensation system that the pilot could use independently in the air without additional adjustments ... On the Su-17M4, the sight was digital and the aircraft demonstrated tremendous accuracy in combat use without any lengthy and constant adjustments ... after all, it has a sighting complex with a Su-17M4 ...
        1. EvilLion
          EvilLion 4 January 2022 14: 51
          +1
          It's just that in the USSR, the attitude towards accidents was much easier, and it was done faster, in practice, in industrial design, any deviation from the project in which case would raise questions, and no one wants to answer, therefore, serious people do not allow partisans.

          And in the USSR, before they began to finish the planes in parts, they were tested in a new form in the design bureau. According to the approved instructions.
          1. Volkof
            Volkof 4 January 2022 15: 08
            -1
            On the newest Su-35S and Su-30SM2 from open sources, there will be a Baguette-53-31m series 1 on-board computer with a single-core processor with a clock frequency of 0,4 GHz and a "newest" 32-bit OS ?! The task for the development of which was received in 2017? !! We see clearly ... Even taking into account the military execution, the increased requirements for external influences, it's still wild.
            Now all the gamers will choke with laughter ... And then they ask why the Indians take "Rafale" !!! What do you think is on the SU-57? And what about the F-35?
    6. Hermit21
      Hermit21 4 January 2022 12: 38
      +1
      Because the new engine and airborne radar is a new purge, flight tests in full.
  2. yuriy55
    yuriy55 3 January 2022 17: 14
    +1
    The modernized Su-30SM2 fighter is maximally unified with the Su-35 fighter. In the course of modernization, combat fighters will receive the AL-41F-1S engine and the Irbis radar, the avionics, electronics will be improved, and the arsenal of weapons will be expanded.

    And on the engines of the Su-35S, the Su-57 is still flying ...
    If the Su-30 is such a good glider, then wouldn't it be wiser to upgrade its Irbis and Izdelyem 30 radars and expand the arsenal of weapons with the latest long-range air-to-air and air-to-ground missiles?
    1. 9PA
      9PA 3 January 2022 17: 20
      +4
      Probably more likely the export version will be
    2. 210ox
      210ox 3 January 2022 17: 27
      -6
      Tell me, what about the "Irbis" SAFAR? Why am I asking, or rather, I'm worried about the lag in avionics. Moreover, it seems critical. The winner is the one who first discovers the enemy.
      1. Jacket in stock
        Jacket in stock 3 January 2022 17: 43
        +10
        Quote: 210ox
        and "Irbis" SAFAR?

        No. This is PFAR.
        The most powerful transmitter in airborne radars, shines for the entire universe, probably somewhere aliens on Alfa Centaur see in their radio telescopes and are surprised - "where is this from, and what kind of geographic news ...".
        1. mark1
          mark1 3 January 2022 18: 02
          0
          Quote: Jacket in stock
          The most powerful transmitter in airborne radars


          This is bad ?
          1. Jacket in stock
            Jacket in stock 3 January 2022 18: 49
            -1
            Quote: mark1
            This is bad ?

            Yes, bad.
            AFAR can emit an ultra-wideband signal that looks like ordinary "white" noise. If you do not know the signal parameters in advance, it is very difficult to identify them.
            It is simply impossible not to notice the working radar station of our aircraft, and they can be seen from the other side of the Earth.
            1. mark1
              mark1 3 January 2022 18: 52
              +16
              It is not worth showing knowledge where there is none.
            2. Yarhann
              Yarhann 3 January 2022 19: 12
              +10
              another sofa radio technician))) educate us further with your nonsense))) very funny))))
            3. Rash
              Rash 4 January 2022 01: 41
              +2
              Here is a stupid person.
            4. Hermit21
              Hermit21 4 January 2022 12: 41
              +1
              Oh, tales of LPI, smelling of mothballs. :) A similar mode was worked out on H011, and modern open source software learned to distinguish a broadband signal "yesterday".
          2. SovAr238A
            SovAr238A 3 January 2022 20: 53
            0
            Quote: mark1
            Quote: Jacket in stock
            The most powerful transmitter in airborne radars


            This is bad ?


            Highly.
        2. Bad_gr
          Bad_gr 3 January 2022 18: 33
          +4
          Quote: Jacket in stock
          The most powerful transmitter in airborne radars, shines for the entire universe, probably somewhere aliens on the Alpha Centaur see in their radio telescopes and are surprised -...
          At one time, when the GDR and the FRG united, the F-16 and MiG-29 were simultaneously in the German air force. So, in joint exercises, the F-16 could not work with its own locator, as it was clogged with the radiation of the MiG-29 locator (all other things being equal, where the F-16 locator took the receiver sensitivity, the MiG-29 locator compensated with the transmitter's radiation power).
          1. Hexenmeister
            Hexenmeister 3 January 2022 20: 20
            +14
            Only not F-16, but F-15, and not high sensitivity, but poor selectivity and low dynamic range!
            1. Pete mitchell
              Pete mitchell 3 January 2022 20: 38
              +6
              Quote: Bad_gr
              At one time, when the GDR and the FRG united, the F-16 and MiG-29 were simultaneously in the German air force.
              Quote: Hexenmeister
              Not the F-16, but the F-15 ...
              Let's make a reservation right away: the luftwaffe has never been in service with either -16 or -15: well, it happened. 15 if I am not mistaken flew into Spandal; The 16s still live there ...
              The 29th "with crosses" strangled both those and others in the BVB, with the DVB it was much more difficult: against the R-73 with the Slit in combination with the maneuverability of the 29th you can't trample ...
              1. Hexenmeister
                Hexenmeister 3 January 2022 21: 03
                +5
                Well, everything is correct, these were American planes, and it all started with the F-15, which at the preliminary preparation stage "merged" due to massive false marks, and it did not come to the DVB, under the pretext of "low flight safety" in such conditions ...
                1. Momento
                  Momento 3 January 2022 23: 45
                  -1
                  both egypt and poland have both f-16 and mig-29 ... but they sort of fly?
                  1. Hexenmeister
                    Hexenmeister 4 January 2022 11: 06
                    +1
                    The events described were immediately after the "unification" of Germany, that is, the very end of the 80s, and Egypt and Poland did not have any such aircraft. In addition, one should not confuse the aircraft of "that" time with the present.
          2. Gardener91
            Gardener91 3 January 2022 20: 49
            +6
            Quote: Bad_gr
            (all other things being equal, where the F-16 locator took the receiver sensitivity, the MiG-29 locator compensated for the transmitter's radiation power).

            At the 29th, the RLPK works in conjunction with the KOLS on the range channel. And so, yes, when intercepting at long ranges (especially in PPS), letters were spread on the participating sides, so as not to interfere with each other. Those in the know will understand what I mean, and so much ..
    3. El Chuvachino
      El Chuvachino 3 January 2022 17: 34
      -6
      Su-57 flies on engines other than the Su-35.
      1. Bad_gr
        Bad_gr 3 January 2022 18: 36
        +9
        Quote: El Chuvachino
        Su-57 flies on engines other than the Su-35.

        Yes, they are different. The engine control system is different: on the Su-57 it is completely digital, on the Su-35 it is digital-analog.
        1. El Chuvachino
          El Chuvachino 3 January 2022 18: 40
          -4
          What are you talking about traction, weight, dimensions and other differences did not mention?
          1. Bad_gr
            Bad_gr 3 January 2022 18: 54
            +6
            Quote: El Chuvachino
            What are you talking about traction, weight, dimensions and other differences did not mention?
            In Wik they write:
            The AL-41F1 engine is distinguished from the AL-35F-117S engine for the Su-41S (product 1S) by an increased thrust force, a sophisticated automation system, a fully digital control system, a new turbine and improved flow characteristics [1] [45].

            In general, as already mentioned, the engines are different.
            1. The comment was deleted.
      2. yuriy55
        yuriy55 3 January 2022 18: 38
        -7
        Quote: El Chuvachino
        Su-57 flies on engines other than the Su-35.

        Yes, it is clear ... One has digital control, the other has mechanical control and the difference in thrust on afterburner ... Here the principle of so-called modernization is more important, because in fact it is no longer advanced ...
        The question is, who needs such a modernization? Let them work on a new one, not patch old holes ... I guess. And these promised extended-range missiles ... and AFAR ...
        Maybe I'm not entirely right, but such a modernization looks like a mockery of the defense industry complex against the background of the planes, yachts and submarines of the Russian oligarchs ...
        1. El Chuvachino
          El Chuvachino 3 January 2022 19: 01
          +12
          Quote: yuriy55
          Let them work on a new one, not patch old holes ... I guess.

          Famously you call one of the best engines in the world today "old holes". I'm afraid to ask if you have anything to do with aviation to make so many harsh statements and tell how it is better for the thousands of people involved to design and build airplanes.
          1. yuriy55
            yuriy55 3 January 2022 20: 33
            -6
            Quote: El Chuvachino
            Famously you call one of the best engines in the world today "old holes".

            Quote: yuriy55
            Let them work on a new one, and not patch old holes ...

            I mean, the new Su-57, Su-75 and other PAKDA ...
            You have some strange peculiarity of pulling out phrases ... A harmful habit of the committee ... As for the best and "analogs will subdue" - this is proved by participation in hostilities, and not in parades ... I suppose ...
            Success and good salaries to people who build airplanes.
            Try so that we no longer intersect unnecessarily, you are not my interlocutor ...
            1. El Chuvachino
              El Chuvachino 3 January 2022 23: 20
              +4
              Try to continue to express yourself more clearly, competently without teenage ellipsis and not to admit stupidity like those that you wrote above, then you will not have to make comments to you.
        2. 1Alexey
          1Alexey 4 January 2022 01: 31
          +1
          Quote: yuriy55
          Let them work on a new one, and not patch old holes ...

          I think that the reason is in the 90s, when we almost did not produce new weapons and, at the same time, we reduced the good ones that were still available.
          Of course, it would be more logical to produce the most modern samples, but they need more time, and the war can start at any moment. So you have to modernize outdated weapons in order to quickly collect the required amount.
        3. sportline
          sportline 4 January 2022 12: 13
          0
          In general, in terms of thrust-to-weight ratio and operational characteristics, they are the best. Likewise motors from GE and PW.
        4. Volkof
          Volkof 4 January 2022 14: 00
          +1
          I agree with you in many ways! I will say more, there are so few new aircraft in the Air Force that it would be better to rivet simple Su-30SM without stopping and prepare new SU ...There are only 26 new aircraft in naval aviation in all four fleets and this is 26 Su-30SM ?! It would be funny, but very sad from this ...
          1. Jacket in stock
            Jacket in stock 4 January 2022 15: 57
            0
            Quote: Volkof
            it would be better to rivet simple Su-30SM without stopping

            Ага.
            Better yet, Yak3 and La5, you can do a dozen of them a day.
            1. Volkof
              Volkof 4 January 2022 16: 04
              0
              No need to joke stupidly and run into rudeness ...
              Read:
              https://bmpd.livejournal.com/4240466.html
              https://dfnc.ru/aviazcia/aviatsiya-vmf-rossii/
              Maybe it will help ...
              1. Jacket in stock
                Jacket in stock 4 January 2022 16: 16
                -2
                Quote: Volkof
                Read:
                https://bmpd.livejournal.com/4240466.html
                https://dfnc.ru/aviazcia/aviatsiya-vmf-rossii/
                May help

                Well, I read it. And once again I remembered that the Su35 is the design of 2008, the Su30SM in general of the last century, and did not go very far from the same Yak3.
                It's time to modernize both, the Su30 is already long overdue. There is no real benefit from them in the troops, except that the pilots do not forget their skills, and nothing else, by and large.
          2. 1Alexey
            1Alexey 5 January 2022 17: 50
            0
            Quote: Volkof
            I will say more, there are so few new aircraft in the Air Force that it would be better to rivet simple Su-30SM without stopping and prepare new SU

            It is important to find a "golden" mean here, so as not to get into the situation that had developed by the beginning of the Second World War, when we had much more fighters than the Germans, but at the same time most of them were technically very much behind the Germans and the Germans easily shot them down (large aircraft losses at the beginning of the war were not only at airfields).
  3. mark1
    mark1 3 January 2022 17: 17
    +3
    So what year will deliveries start at 22 or 23?
  4. Jacket in stock
    Jacket in stock 3 January 2022 17: 20
    +2
    Hmm.
    It would be funny if it were not so sad.
    Modernization by installing a ten-year-old engine and radar on the aircraft ...
    But it will be considered in the category "new equipment".
    1. OgnennyiKotik
      OgnennyiKotik 3 January 2022 17: 46
      +10
      There are no questions about the engines, unification with the Su-35 is an unambiguous +. Moreover, the AL-41 is an excellent engine, it will still be relevant for a couple of decades. The question is, why didn't they do it right away?
      Here is the radar is sadness. Changing a very outdated radar for an outdated one is strong.
      1. mark1
        mark1 3 January 2022 18: 36
        +3
        Quote: OgnennyiKotik
        Here is the radar is sadness.

        Why are you sad? What parameters sadden you?
        1. Yarhann
          Yarhann 3 January 2022 19: 18
          +1
          You know, I haven't read it from the region, but I condemn it))) although still, let's wait for an answer from the next sofa radio technician who, of course, will enlighten us as to how it really is)))
          1. sportline
            sportline 4 January 2022 12: 53
            +3
            Well, imagine that you are an official from the Ministry of Defense. You tell the Tsar that the Su-35 is an awesomely unrivaled Aircraft with a radar that takes this aircraft to the upper stage of the development of aircraft construction. You tell him what he would give money for the development and purchase of this machine. He squeaks in his soul to allocate this money and then bam! After 5 years, it becomes clear that the radar does not correspond to the spirit of the times, and because of it, not a single foreign buyer wants to buy this very Su-35. Before you is a problem:
            1) tell the Tsar the truth about the need for new large investments in this plane and take off with a bang from service.
            2) lie to the Tsar and continue to tell tales about the unmatchedness of the Su-35 and keep the seat.
            Which do you prefer?
            1. Yarhann
              Yarhann 4 January 2022 19: 22
              -4
              Well, about the kings, then you tell the gray-haired schoolchildren - in fact, I understand that there is nothing to say. with your kids everything is so simple - if only it were like that in life - I love the wonderful stories of the shkolota))) how it really is
        2. SovAr238A
          SovAr238A 3 January 2022 21: 05
          +2
          Quote: mark1
          Quote: OgnennyiKotik
          Here is the radar is sadness.

          Why are you sad? What parameters sadden you?


          Well, here are my 5 kopecks.
          Absence of PoI.
          Lack of transmission of designation to missiles by the same LPI.
          Lack of broadband communication between aircraft of the same group via the same LPI.
          Lack of simultaneous operation in different frequencies.
          AFAR can indeed precisely counter the ARGSN of V-V missiles ...
          1. mark1
            mark1 3 January 2022 21: 42
            +1
            Can you tell me the range in LPI mode? Maybe the OLS will be enough for such a range? In addition, this mode is susceptible to interference.
            1. SovAr238A
              SovAr238A 3 January 2022 23: 02
              -1
              Quote: mark1
              Can you tell me the range in LPI mode? Maybe the OLS will be enough for such a range? In addition, this mode is susceptible to interference.

              What is the interference on the PoI?
              By what means are you going to jam the PoI?
              What are you talking about?
              1. mark1
                mark1 3 January 2022 23: 06
                +1
                Quote: SovAr238A
                By what means are you going to jam the PoI?

                Broadband, my friend.
                1. Momento
                  Momento 3 January 2022 23: 47
                  +2
                  broadband jammers operate for a couple of kilometers. and energy requires figs knows how much. About this article was published recently.
                  1. Hexenmeister
                    Hexenmeister 4 January 2022 15: 26
                    -1
                    that is, for the radiation from the radar of a broadband signal, energy is not needed, but from the side of the jammer of the same broadband signal, but in the form of interference, suddenly it was required, and even awesome ???
                    1. Momento
                      Momento 4 January 2022 19: 31
                      +1
                      Afar emits a non-broadband signal. afar divides the radar into several parts and each part uses its own range. this is possible because afars have many emitters. and if there is lpi, then these frequencies are also constantly changing. The jammer must cover the entire range with a solid line.
                      1. this
                        this 5 January 2022 18: 40
                        -1
                        Oh, only in this mode it becomes very weak, a bunch of low-power multi-frequency radars, the range is greatly reduced.
                2. SovAr238A
                  SovAr238A 6 January 2022 00: 12
                  +1
                  Quote: mark1
                  Quote: SovAr238A
                  By what means are you going to jam the PoI?

                  Broadband, my friend.

                  Explain to us how you find out that the LPI is working in this particular area of ​​the sky?
                  Explain to us how and with what you will jam both the centimeter and millimeter ranges at the same time?
                  Did you know that broadband electronic warfare jamming all fish in the radius?
                  Do you know that AFAR is excellent at working in RTR, REP, EW modes?
                  For the design itself allows ...

                  It seems to me that you do not know any of this ...
          2. Hermit21
            Hermit21 4 January 2022 12: 47
            -2
            PFAR can do exactly the same thing as AFAR: noise-like signal, jamming, mapping, tracking on the passage, passive mode, etc. And yes, AFAR does not know how to allocate PPM blocks for individual tasks - this makes no sense at all.
            1. Momento
              Momento 4 January 2022 19: 43
              +1
              pfar is the last century. he has no advantage with afar. some disadvantages. one emitter. even on ships they are now being actively changed to afar. and the air defense is actively changing. afar and gives more information and its quality is better. and if the pfar was good, why should we sculpt afar on the su-57?
              1. Hermit21
                Hermit21 5 January 2022 08: 18
                -1
                pfar is the last century. he has no advantage with afar

                Cheapness. Greater ease of manufacture. And they can, I repeat, the same thing.
                afar and gives more information and

                Which radar "gives more information" depends not on its type, but on the characteristics of the web and the power of the on-board computer.
                and its quality is better

                This, too, has nothing to do with the type of radar. You can make both shitty AFAR and excellent PFAR, and vice versa.
                Why sculpt afar on the Su-57?

                Because AFAR is the future. Or already behind radio-photonics. But this does not mean that one can indiscriminately find fault with the PFAR, talking about allegedly some kind of backwardness and inefficiency.
              2. this
                this 5 January 2022 18: 42
                -2
                The Su-57 does not have Afar, but the CAR in general, maybe even more abruptly, has already been muddied.
            2. SovAr238A
              SovAr238A 6 January 2022 00: 13
              -1
              Quote: Hermit21
              PFAR can do exactly the same thing as AFAR: noise-like signal, jamming, mapping, tracking on the passage, passive mode, etc. And yes, AFAR does not know how to allocate PPM blocks for individual tasks - this makes no sense at all.

              Can not.
              Do not lie.
              The AFAR principle itself does not allow.
              At least read the device, what is the difference ...

              And AFAR can just separate the PPM blocks for different tasks and different directional patterns and different ranges. - simultaneously.
              1. Hermit21
                Hermit21 6 January 2022 08: 52
                -1
                What can't? Where am I lying?
                And AFAR can just separate the PPM blocks for different tasks and different directional patterns and different ranges. - simultaneously

                Nope. This bike dates back to those years when the possibility of such a functioning was just being considered. In fact, the issue of electromagnetic compatibility practically kills this idea. Let's say you allocate 1000 PPMs from 200 to create interference, let each PPM be 2 W of average signal power. In total, you get a 400 W interference, which must be emitted in the X-band, since the enemy's radar also works in it, and your own radar too. Question: how can you normally receive a signal when an interference transmitter is working in a decimeter from the receiver? But for the enemy's radar, these 400 watts will not always seem powerful enough. At the same time, removing 200 PPM from the canvas for another function, you kill the detection range by 1/5: let's say, it was 200 km, now it is 160. Is it worth it?
                Another thing is to alternate the modes of view, illumination and jamming on the entire canvas. Actually, this is the only way they do it in practice.
          3. this
            this 4 January 2022 13: 33
            0
            It cannot counteract, from the constant radiation of the ARGSN rocket in general, only a game with the Doppler effect will help, such as the target is moving away or, on the contrary, very close, you cannot hammer in with strong interference, and will aim at them. The radar on the rocket turns on in a few seconds, then only the maneuver will save, which began even before that moment.
            1. Hexenmeister
              Hexenmeister 4 January 2022 15: 23
              0
              Can't resist
              For this, there are specialized systems on board that counteract even better because they are specialized for this
              from the constant radiation of the ARGSN rocket in general, only a game with the Doppler effect will help ...
              Themselves then realized that they wrote ??? And here the radiation of some kind of "ARGSN" and the characteristics of the onboard radar ??? Aiming at a hindrance ??? Well-Well, rather a normal missile with an active radar seeker will aim at the interference from afar than at the "specialized" interference, for example, from "Sorption".
              1. this
                this 4 January 2022 16: 47
                0
                They work well before, not when homing is enabled.
                1. Hexenmeister
                  Hexenmeister 4 January 2022 18: 44
                  0
                  Again verbiage ... against whom is it good "before" and against whom is "after"?
                  1. Yarhann
                    Yarhann 4 January 2022 20: 04
                    -1
                    oh yes, I've even lost the essence of the dialogue)))
                  2. this
                    this 5 January 2022 17: 38
                    0
                    If the rocket's radar is switched on in an active mode, then you will destroy it with electronic warfare, even the old S-200v missiles were shot down by Israeli planes over the Levan, but those of them definitely have electronic warfare. enemy, which is being done.
                    1. Hexenmeister
                      Hexenmeister 5 January 2022 18: 04
                      0
                      We are discussing fighter radars in this thread, not missile radars. However, if, as you write:
                      the rocket's radar went into active mode
                      then this means that the rocket radar began to emit a signal in the direction of the target, and it will receive all information about the target from the REFLECTED signal, but by the reflected signal, according to your statements:
                      while it is aiming along the reflected beam, then the enemy's radar can also be obscured, which is done
                      therefore, electronic warfare will be effective against any radar seeker (both active and semi-active) used at the final stage of missile guidance, and none:
                      then fuck him with electronic warfare
                      1. this
                        this 5 January 2022 18: 36
                        0
                        Well, firstly, not everyone, here everything depends on the radar-rocket system, the electronic warfare works somewhat on the rocket, how much more on the radar, and the radar on the rocket can generally be perceived as a backlight flashlight for accurate guidance, so if it works and captured the target, then the defeat will definitely be near, and will not shy away somewhere in the distance. The electronic warfare fog can be directed to the semi-active head as well as to the radar, which cannot give out the exact location for two stars, but the seeker, which already sees the volumetric target, is navryatli.
                      2. Hexenmeister
                        Hexenmeister 5 January 2022 21: 46
                        0
                        Electronic warfare works somewhat on the rocket, how much more on the radar
                        The weakest link in the fighter's radar set and the radar seeker, will always be exactly the seeker, and it will be less stable against the effects of electronic warfare, and not the fighter's radar, which is much further from the source of electronic warfare, plus it is also constantly working in the review mode, in contrast to GOS, which always "looks" at the target.
                        but on the homing head, which already sees the volumetric target, they navryatli.
                        Electronic warfare is designed to suppress any radar seeker, and this type of seeker does not have any "volumetric" information about the target !!!
      2. Momento
        Momento 3 January 2022 19: 33
        +2
        put tested equipment - a minimum of tests and problems in operation. you can understand. but even the Indians want to replace them with the Israeli radar in their su-30mcs. and the Indians do not agree with the snow leopard.
  5. Flooding
    Flooding 3 January 2022 17: 26
    +2
    The Russian Aerospace Forces can receive the upgraded Su-30SM2 fighters in 2023; it is at the end of next year that special flight tests of the new aircraft should be completed.


    Izvestia on December 29 wrote:
    "Su-30SM2 aircraft will enter the Baltic Fleet in 2022"

    https://iz.ru/1271119/2021-12-29/samolety-su-30sm2-postupiat-na-baltiiskii-flot-v-2022-godu
    1. storm
      storm 3 January 2022 18: 22
      +6
      In 22g, the first newly manufactured Su-30SM2 under the contract for 21 units should go to the BF. for the Navy.
      Most likely, the new and modernized Su-30SM2 are somewhat different if the upgraded ones require additional tests up to 23g, and new ones will arrive in combat units as early as 22g.
  6. rocket757
    rocket757 3 January 2022 17: 48
    +2
    The beginning of the year ... if not a mess, then a very messy one!
    They say a lot, there are a lot of plans ... time will pass, everything will settle down, it will become more or less clear.
    1. Aag
      Aag 3 January 2022 19: 28
      +2
      Quote: rocket757
      The beginning of the year ... if not a mess, then a very messy one!
      They say a lot, there are a lot of plans ... time will pass, everything will settle down, it will become more or less clear.

      Look how many life-affirming news appeared on New Year's Eve (including on "VO")!
      I agree, I'm glad ... The mood is ... Again, TV takes longer than usual ... That's just, - some of the "Christmas tree gifts", upon closer examination, should have taken place a year earlier, or even earlier ...
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 5 January 2022 10: 49
        +1
        Holidays ... everyone wants more positive!
        Nothing, the holidays will end, the amusing couples will evaporate from the body, then we will objectively reason and we will, the majority, at least.
  7. storm
    storm 3 January 2022 18: 01
    +9
    The modernization of the Su-30SM to the SM2 level had to be carried out back in 2015. when the Su-35S was adopted.
    But it's better late than never ...
    1. demiurg
      demiurg 3 January 2022 18: 57
      +8
      Modernization should be carried out when the replaced parts have no resource left. And it is advisable to guess for the next repair. It makes no sense to shoot another working engine right now, if another factory repair is brewing in a year and a half.

      And then the lyrics.

      People got drunk then. 4 cars a year is not enough. The French Rafaley do less a year and do not suffer. The Swedes of the Grippens rivet by the piece a year, and nothing, the world has not collapsed from this. The Americans will produce about the same number of new Needles.

      The Gooney business is alive and well. The manual does not change at all over the years. It is only the name of the thing that changes for what they are suffering.
      ... we won't be able to release ....
      ... single issue ... (by the way, the discussion goes here)
      ... the USA has more, it needs 50/100/500 ...
      And the obligatory mention of saws. Without this, mayonnaise is not given to mivina.
      1. Jacket in stock
        Jacket in stock 3 January 2022 19: 11
        -2
        Quote: demiurg
        Modernization should be carried out when the replaced parts have no resource left

        This is called renovation.
        And modernization is when the equipment of the last century is changed to a new one with a corresponding increase in capabilities.
      2. SovAr238A
        SovAr238A 3 January 2022 21: 08
        +1
        Quote: demiurg
        Modernization should be carried out when the replaced parts have no resource left. And it is advisable to guess for the next repair. It makes no sense to shoot another working engine right now, if another factory repair is brewing in a year and a half.

        And then the lyrics.

        People got drunk then. 4 cars a year is not enough. The French Rafaley do less a year and do not suffer. The Swedes of the Grippens rivet by the piece a year, and nothing, the world has not collapsed from this. The Americans will produce about the same number of new Needles.

        The Gooney business is alive and well. The manual does not change at all over the years. It is only the name of the thing that changes for what they are suffering.
        ... we won't be able to release ....
        ... single issue ... (by the way, the discussion goes here)
        ... the USA has more, it needs 50/100/500 ...
        And the obligatory mention of saws. Without this, mayonnaise is not given to mivina.


        Now think about such a thing as a manufacturing process.
        When will you make the engines? when the cancer hangs on the gover?
        Assemble the engine - you need to start work in 2 years.
        And if you need the engines only after 5 years - what to do with the workers from the factories?
        To the market? Sell ​​clothes? As it was in the 90s ...
        So they did not return to the factories in the 90s.
        And you will not return them, and you will destroy the entire industry.
        Economy and economics are two big differences.
        Don't try to talk about what you just don't know.
    2. Momento
      Momento 3 January 2022 23: 51
      +2
      in 2015 there was probably no mass production of engines and radars. so everything is normal. I wonder if there will be an upgrade of the old Su-30 or just the release of new ones?
  8. p0pulivox
    p0pulivox 3 January 2022 18: 41
    0
    Quote: Canis Aureus
    Quote: . PIXY.
    1 aircraft in the army, even if it has not been adopted for service, and 4 that have not yet left the assembly line, this is not a series, but a piece production. It is a fact.

    There is no need to breed Russophobia and antipatriotism.

    belay
  9. Igor Valimukhametov
    Igor Valimukhametov 3 January 2022 20: 25
    -4
    And where to hurry? Two years of testing a tried-and-true engine many times - there was no smarter excuse? Miraculous things are happening in our military-industrial complex. We build a corvette for seven years, and then it burns out from welding, then we test the Armata for seven years, then to announce it. unnecessary in large quantities, then we sink the last aircraft carrier, and before that it almost burned down. Maybe it's time to clean out "effective", thieves managers from there?
    1. dreamshake
      dreamshake 3 January 2022 22: 02
      -1
      Armata was launched into series for several days, aircraft carriers are a relic of the past with hypersonic weapons and long-range supersonic UAVs, the Su-57 is being brought to mind, taking into account the great unification of the main nodes with the future 75m and being built along the way. What's wrong?
    2. EvilLion
      EvilLion 4 January 2022 12: 03
      +1
      It is not the engine that is tested, but the aircraft as a whole.
  10. EMMM
    EMMM 3 January 2022 21: 02
    +1
    As I read this news, I think how many billions of rubles in the form of empty Su-57 gliders are today in the KnAAPO warehouse without engines.
    1. Sergey3
      Sergey3 4 January 2022 08: 59
      0
      Why are there no motors? Please enlighten. For some reason, I thought that the AL-41F-1C engine had been serial for a long time.
  11. Zaurbek
    Zaurbek 3 January 2022 22: 08
    +4
    + an overhead container with optics and here it is a single tactical bomber fighter. For some reason, they pushed the second OLS down into the MiG35 ... ... and they save on the Su30 cm3, although the Su35S pilots wrote that they perfectly detect targets on the ground through the OLS .... But dimensions interfere
  12. Zaurbek
    Zaurbek 3 January 2022 22: 30
    +3
    In general, it was right to make a 2-seater Su35 ... .. it has the most modern glider. Apparently, export Su30 haunts
    1. 1Alexey
      1Alexey 4 January 2022 01: 57
      +3
      Quote: Zaurbek
      In general, it was right to make a 2-seater Su35 ... .. it has the most modern glider.

      Then it's better to make a 2-seater Su-57. In my opinion, it is he who has the most modern glider.
      1. Zaurbek
        Zaurbek 4 January 2022 09: 48
        0
        From T10 I mean ..... Su27 ... Su30, Su34, Su35
  13. Lonely loner
    Lonely loner 4 January 2022 04: 47
    0
    A radar on the likeness of "Squirrels" put there, please.
  14. FRoman1984
    FRoman1984 4 January 2022 07: 52
    -1
    Replacing the very old Bars radar with the old Irbis. Yes, modernization.
    Apparently "Belka" could not be put into production. It is curious that, after all, they installed one single serial Su-57.
    1. EvilLion
      EvilLion 4 January 2022 12: 05
      -1
      Apparently you have nothing to do with the "squirrel" to say anything at all.
  15. Sergey3
    Sergey3 4 January 2022 08: 55
    0
    I don’t understand one thing, why test a serial engine for so long?
    1. this
      this 5 January 2022 18: 50
      -1
      With planes, this is not a car for you, the scribe did not calculate the alignment there, the car will just stop, but the plane will fall. In general, with all airplanes, it takes a long time, they don't have it quickly, because they are tough, and even they do not save from disasters.
  16. V means B
    V means B 4 January 2022 10: 03
    0
    And su-57 again in any way?)))))))