Drones in Global War: RQ-180 or "White Bat"

68

For quite a long time after the end of the Cold War, the United States government delayed funding defense projects aimed at confronting a high-tech adversary.

These words should not be misunderstood — they do not mean that the US military was unprepared for a large-scale engagement with a well-equipped enemy army. The point is that the advantages gained by the United States in the course of global modernization (associated, in particular, with the process of the so-called "digital revolution") of their army in the 80s of the last century, were gradually leveled, and the line of technological superiority was becoming more and more and was more blurred.



To a large extent, these financial restrictions applied to drones.

Despite their obvious value (in particular, in the eyes of the military), the US Air Force struggled to receive funds for projects not related to the development of weapons for local conflicts alone. According to civilian officials, the armed forces possessed an already sufficiently large and modern fleet of manned aviation - and heavy drones were redundant.

Perhaps the most outstanding breakthrough by the Pentagon's military administrators was funding for the RQ-4 Global Hawk strategic reconnaissance UAV project. The rest of the projects were cut - only those that were critically needed by the American army on the battlefield survived, such as the legendary RQ-1 Predator or its successor, the RQ-9 Reaper.

But by the end of the 2000s, the situation in the world began to change rapidly: Russia and China began to actively modernize their armed forces, including significantly expanding the capabilities of their own air defense. First of all, this seriously affected the strategic and operational intelligence capabilities of the US Air Force.

The new conditions required a response at a qualitatively different level - and this is how the project, now known as the "White Bat", was born.

It is worth noting that the programs for the development of unmanned reconnaissance aircraft using stealth technology did not appear out of the blue, and were conceptually formed back in the 1990s.

The US military was already prepared for a threat from, say, China at that time. For example, the commander of naval operations, Admiral Frank B. Kelso II, in the first half of the decade, repeatedly emphasized in his memoranda and doctrinal documents the need to prepare for confrontation with the PRC.

However, as mentioned above, with the collapse of the USSR, the US civilian authorities seriously tied the hands of Pentagon officials - all the development of new drones was carried out almost on an initiative basis in absolute secrecy and received funding from the so-called. the secret budget of the US Air Force, as well as the CIA (in general, the Central Intelligence Agency, with its high degree of independence from the civilian state apparatus, literally saved stealth drones: it was thanks to the CIA that both RQ-170 Sentinel and RQ-180 were embodied in metal).

The colossal scientific and technical groundwork for the stealth F-117 and B-2 aircraft, as well as extensive experience in the practical use of UAVs, allowed the Americans to implement projects of strategic reconnaissance drones in the shortest (less than 10 years, but possibly less) terms.

RQ-170 Sentinel


The first was the infamous RQ-170 Sentinel - although the exact time of the appearance of these devices is still unknown, tentatively this drone began to be operated in limited quantities by the US Air Force and the CIA in 2005.

Sentinel, apparently, was originally considered as a transitional link to a more functional, stealthy reconnaissance aircraft - this model was designed to work out the concept of a drone capable of operating over the territories of countries with developed and rich air defense. Unfortunately, there are no specific details of the operation of the RQ-170 in the public domain, but the Pentagon shed light on some interesting points in different years: UAVs regularly flew over the DPRK, some regions of the PRC, Pakistan (in particular, it was the RQ-170 that monitored behind the shelter of Osama bin Laden), as well as Iran (during which one device crashed near Tehran due to a technical malfunction).

In particular, it is reliably known that the 30th Reconnaissance Squadron of the US Air Force online watched the preparation and launch of the North Korean Hwasong-14 intercontinental ballistic missile in 2017. As you might guess, the launch pad is an object of strategic importance, and was covered by the North Korean air defense, but nevertheless, the RQ-170 Sentinel fulfilled its task of penetrating into the so-called. "Zone of prohibited access".

However, the design features of the RQ-170 imposed a number of restrictions on its ability to penetrate into areas protected by the most modern air defense systems. The Sentinel had some of the structural elements used in earlier stealth vehicles, but could not be considered completely unobtrusive.

In addition, the drone that fell near Tehran was examined by Russian and Iranian engineers - this finally put an end to the further development of the project (according to some reports, the crashed RQ-170 served as the impetus for the creation of the Russian S-70 Okhotnik).

In 2008, Northrop Grumman plants in Palmdale and Tonopah, as well as the legendary "Zone 51" located on the dried up Lake Grum in Nevada, appeared new buildings - aircraft hangars, in which, according to satellite images, it was possible to place an aircraft with a wingspan of 40 meters. It was no coincidence - the buildings were erected specifically for the new strategic reconnaissance aircraft RQ-180, whose prototypes entered the flight test stage.

"White Bat"



The White Bat is a conceptual and technical successor to the line of the legendary F-117 and B-2 stealths, which were created to work in conditions of opposition from the echeloned and saturated air defense of the Warsaw Pact countries.

The RQ-180 was designed for similar tasks, but adjusted for a qualitatively new level of development of Chinese and Russian anti-aircraft systems.

The White Bat is not a strike machine - its central mission is reconnaissance. This UAV is intended not only to complement the capabilities of optical satellites, but also to replace them in the event of an attack on the US satellite constellation as a tool for collecting intelligence at the operational-tactical level.

In addition, the functionality of the RQ-180 is closely related to the Long Range Strike Bomber program: acting in conjunction with the stealthy intercontinental bomber B-21 Raider, the White Bat, being undetected, will invade the so-called. “A2 / D2 restricted areas” and issue target designation to missile carriers (not only bombers, but also fifth-generation F-35 aircraft or URO ships).

Among other things, the RQ-180 is also considered by default as an electronic warfare platform - each drone is armed with means for carrying out electronic attacks.

It is worth mentioning the prospects of using the "White Bat" as an AWACS vehicle - according to the assumptions of many military theorists, classic long-range radar reconnaissance aircraft in the event of hostilities will not be able to actively work near A2 / D2 zones.

As an alternative, they are encouraged to use platforms made using stealth technology that can directly invade enemy territory - such as the RQ-180, which can “hack” into restricted areas with stealth bombers and stealth interceptors created in at the moment in the framework of the Penetrating Counter-Air program.


The RQ-180 is a completely classified project, like all the other stealths (including the old models such as the B-2 and F-117), and yet information about its flights to one point or another in the world appears from time to time.

More often than not, it is, albeit not immediately, but confirmed by the representatives of the US Air Force themselves or the think tanks associated with them.

According to the data, as of 2019, the US armed forces had seven White Bats, which were involved in a number of reconnaissance operations in the Pacific Ocean, the Korean Peninsula and even in the skies over the Syrian Arab Republic and China.

US military analysts suggest that the RQ-180 are now ready to implement the "stealth long-range strike" doctrine in conjunction with the US Air Force's B-2 stealth bombers. This dangerous tandem is directed towards the PRC - "White bats" were seen (visually) in the Philippines and the island of Guam.

However, the Air Force command announced that large-scale production of the RQ-180 will begin in 2026-2027 - that is, approximately at the same time when the US Air Force will receive the first large batches of B-21 Raider bombers and will have an impressive number of fifth-generation aircraft F-35.

A special emphasis should be placed on the control system of the "White Bat" - given that it is Northrop Grumman who is engaged in its development, which in parallel creates the latest software for existing UAVs in order to increase their autonomy, it can be assumed that the RQ-180 will either completely independent of the operator (in particular, when penetrating into the A2 / D2 zones, where the communication channel between the pilot and the vehicle can serve as an unmasking factor), or external control of the drone will be a routine formality - say, the vehicle itself will identify and select targets, and the operator only confirm her choice.

It is more likely that the initial design of this machine is based on the possibility of a completely independent flight and performing reconnaissance tasks.

The RQ-180 is definitely one of the most interesting developments of our time, and it requires special, close attention. After all, the "White Bat" was created and is being finalized to carry out missions in the zones of activity of the most advanced Russian air defense systems.
68 comments
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  1. +7
    3 January 2022 06: 15
    It would be interesting to know about the performance characteristics of this white mouse.
  2. -9
    3 January 2022 06: 38
    This is an old Soviet development by Arkady Raikin (the one in the assembly hall)
    1. +1
      3 January 2022 06: 57
      Quote: gorunov
      This is an old Soviet development by Arkady Raikin (the one in the assembly hall)

      Greek he ...
      1. +5
        3 January 2022 15: 37
        Quote: Aerodrome
        Quote: gorunov
        This is an old Soviet development by Arkady Raikin (the one in the assembly hall)

        Greek he ...
        eight people minus ... EIGHT! for the "Greek hall" of Arkady Raikin! and do you still believe in a "great country"? and into "space" and "ships"? The secret police are coming ... Bulgakov is right ... "The House is gone."
      2. 0
        4 January 2022 21: 41
        And the "Greek hall" is not the plagiarist Raikin, but the work of M. Zhvanetsky. Like most others. what R. read. But he was "modestly" silent about the author.
        There was a great soul ...
        1. 0
          9 January 2022 12: 50
          - Aren't you ashamed to slander?
          https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%96%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B5%D1%86%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9,_%D0%9C%D0%B8%D1%85%D0%B0%D0%B8%D0%BB_%D0%9C%D0%B8%D1%85%D0%B0%D0%B9%D0%BB%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87
          Creative activity
          During his student years, he took part in amateur performances, began to write miniatures and monologues, which he often performed at the student theater "Parnas-2", where his friends Roman Kats (Kartsev) and Viktor Ilchenko also performed. The name was invented by Zhvanetsky himself, by analogy with the mountain in Greece, where, according to myths, the Muses lived. His friend Roman Kartsev, who had worked since 1962 at the Leningrad Theater of Miniatures with Arkady Raikin, once successfully performed Zhvanetsky's monologue at a chef's concert. Arkady Raikin heard the monologue and inserted this monologue into the theater program. Prior to that, Zhvanetsky went to Raikin in Leningrad, but he brought only autographs from Raikin, and in 1964 Raikin invited Mikhail to his theater as head of the literary department.

          Together with Zhvanetsky, Raikin staged the Traffic Light program in 1969, in which Zhvanetsky's miniatures "Avas", "Scarcity", "The Age of Technology" were performed for the first time
          .
  3. -20
    3 January 2022 07: 39
    And where does the author want to live? Every article is all about the unsurpassed power of the American. Everywhere and in everything they are inaccessible, China will not be torn apart today tomorrow, they will fuck us with white mice that no one can find. And over Iran there was no technical accident, the drone was neatly intercepted by our Autobase and planted intact. Mousetraps are also prepared on white mice. Before that, I read from this author how oxygen was cut off to the Chinese in electronics. would rather stop cooperating with the United States than with China and new Chinese chips have been developed and are not much inferior in anything, and equipment is being developed. And about the restrictions on the market of rare earth metals to China is generally epic. China holds 90% of the market, in terms of reserves in the world 42%, Russia, in my opinion, 19%. Their factories have been closed and it takes five years to pick up the pace. But even today China can leave them without raw materials.
    1. +22
      3 January 2022 09: 55
      Quote: Igor Valimukhametov
      They intercepted the motor depot and planted it intact.

      Aaa laughing Where do you still come from like that? laughing
      At least read what Autobase is and why it was created laughing Experts laughing

      Passive location complex (ground-based electronic reconnaissance complex) "Avtobaza-M"
      It detects, recognizes, classifies, measures the angular coordinates of radio-electronic means, carries out trajectory tracking of air and sea objects by the radiation of their radio-electronic means (passive target radar) and transmits data on reconnoitered and accompanied radio-electronic means to a higher-level automated command post.

      www.ntc-reb.ru/autobaza.html
    2. -1
      29 March 2022 19: 50
      - all about the unsurpassed power of the American.

      How would they be a technical leader, so what are you commenting on on a laptop or tablet?
      Can you guess who developed Windows, android, processor?
      They have a full cycle of technologies for hardware and software, these UAVs are stuffed so that we never dreamed of.
      Yes, and the attitude itself is different, the Apple company recently built an office building to create a high-quality working environment for employees with fountains and parks, and Abramovich built a yacht for himself, he does not know such a word as an environment for employees.
  4. -17
    3 January 2022 08: 29
    I'm wondering when such articles are read not by know-it-alls of the forum, but by real specialists who caught all these stealths on their radars, they read it all with a smile ?? you shouldn't underestimate the enemy, of course, but you don't need to expose your stealths like manna from heaven.
    Moreover, these are weapons and platforms for attack, and now think about who is the most bastard on the planet and only wants to hit other countries and develops technologies primarily for attack, everything, as before, is saved only by the presence of nuclear weapons
    1. +14
      3 January 2022 10: 16
      Quote: 501Legion
      I wonder when such articles are read not by the know-it-alls of the forum, but by real specialists who caught all these stealths on their radars, do they read it all with a smile?
      Why smile? The fact that the F-117 destroyed the air defenses of Iraq and Serbia? Which, by the way, was mostly Soviet. At the same time, 1 plane was lost, foolishly, after it carried out the bombing, which is an unconditional success for the United States.
      If you ever saw the screen of a working radar station, you would not even have such a question. Not to smiles, at all.
      1. +17
        3 January 2022 13: 36
        Belief in invincible air defense is a young religion. The reasons for its appearance are economic problems and phantom pains for its former power. In the 90s, due to well-known reasons, the supply of the aircraft was very poor. And such a liquid commodity as aviation kerosene practically did not reach the army. Aviation was "idle". And this thing is very expensive.
        This is where the "invincible air defense" appears and the S-300 is his apostle ... Like, we have a problem with aviation, but the sky is locked. With the development of the Internet and, thanks to the fact that the guards were pinched their tail for a while, military forums appear where, in all seriousness, the following issues are discussed: C300 versus F-22, C300 and the entire arsenal of US cruise missiles, and other game. By dividing the number of launchers (launchers) by the NATO aviation fleet, conclusions are drawn that support the theory. In a patriotic frenzy, invincibility and echelonment are growing by leaps and bounds. Doubts about the invincibility of the C300 are equated with heresy. Even the most reasonable arguments are rejected with indignation, and a heretic who dares to encroach on dogma is given a general obstruction and is declared a NATO spy (then they had not quarreled with the Ukrainians, so NATO had to take the rap) In case of failure, in real application (that is, almost? always) in local conflicts. Accusations are poured in of the stupidity of the operators, inappropriate natural conditions and the cunning of the enemy (they were waiting on the left, and he flew in from above). The situation takes on the features of a banal religious sect ...
        Meanwhile, the country is looking forward to the even more invincible С400, С500, etc. ...
        In parallel, electronic warfare hysteria is developing. Autobase, Kolchuga and Khibiny reliably cover their native sky and discover the planes of the insidious enemy thousands of kilometers away. Iran "lands" an American UAV, for some reason, only one, although they flew there like minibuses on a schedule. The USS Donald Cook crew is resigning en masse, losing diapers charred by the Khibiny along the way. Photos of the miracle of devices, the size of a brick, are published and, in all seriousness, their ability to suppress GPS within a radius of tens of kilometers is declared. The patriotic public is delighted.
        Despite the fact that funding for the Armed Forces was gradually improving. Airplanes began to fly, soldiers, sometimes, began to do what they should actually do. Instead of a parade ground with crowbars of revenge or shaping a submarine into snowdrifts, new equipment began to enter the Armed Forces ... Religion strengthened, gained strength and, since then, has lived its own life. Well, and the fact that it has nothing to do with the real situation, if it worries, then not those who need it.
        1. 0
          3 January 2022 15: 54
          Well, let religion (father-in-law, blind faith, without factology and any reasonable evidence) have a place to be. Let's admit. But here's your article on otherwise, what's different? "Even the most reasonable arguments are rejected with indignation ..." so you did not bring one. Defenders of the S-400 air defense and other "believers" give at least some reason. There are all kinds of tests, some statistics. Maybe not entirely correct, but you just dumped emotions on the site, without the slightest factual and that, are you right now? Give examples that our air defense is incapacitated, as you shout about it, let’s speculate. And so you are the same fanatic, only from the other side.
          1. +10
            3 January 2022 21: 02
            What is "Horo" or who, I do not know. And God bless him.

            Please give at least one example when air defense has somehow significantly influenced the outcome of the confrontation. As far as I remember, either the PVL was "opened" and destroyed, or, especially, they did not pay attention ...
            Just don’t, about the fact that all are stupid, outdated, insufficiently echeloned and the ground, suddenly, is not flat ...

            Nobody denies the need for air defense. As a means against single aircraft, ballistic missiles, some primitive gizmos, etc., air defense is quite effective ... A good example is the Israeli "Iron Dome". An excellent system that has proven its effectiveness in practice, not in exercises. But, if the "dome" is taken seriously, with the use of modern means of air attack. The result will be (for the dome) sad. As, however, for the C300, Patriot and further down the list.
            Alas. The presence of a wide range of air attack weapons, as a result, air superiority, is the alpha and omega of success in modern warfare. Even more. The massive introduction of UAVs deprived the air defense of the main trump card, cheapness ...

            Well, as for the exercises and tests. They all end up with predictable results. The goals were achieved, the personnel confirmed their high skills ... etc.
            The USSR national team was the world champion in football. With one caveat. In friendly matches.
            1. -6
              3 January 2022 21: 32
              1. "If you want to win an argument, stick to grammar" apparently you did not have enough logical thinking to understand that this is just a typo and by the simplest iteration of letters to understand what kind of word is there. I will help. The word is good.
              2. You and the text cannot recognize and understand the meaning. This is already more difficult. Either something neurodegenerative (more often something like Parkinson's) or perhaps mental (not psychological) in some types of schizophrenia there is such a disorder of the perception spectrum that they cannot understand the essence of a simple text. I assumed in the text that you are right, if that. Moreover, my views are closer to your point of view than to the opposite. Only less radical. I am sure that there are no such wunderwaffe in the air defense system and it is clearly very rash to hope with closed eyes.
              I will explain my text, as much as possible, even easier. I wrote that when you criticize the apologists of the omnipotent air defense, you yourself do not give arguments. No. As if you are one D'Artagnan and everyone else is not. And I have to take your word for it. It doesn't work that way in the real world. Actually, it was written about this. That you did not give any reasons. And thus they occupied a diametrically opposite camp. All the fighters.
              You yourself came up with as if I deny something from your arguments and began to argue with me. (I will repeat again, I assumed that you are right, for example "Let's say" and Okay, let ... "which you did not recognize)
              You can again think of that I object to something and deny and smash, as it were, "my point of view" to smithereens))
              1. +5
                3 January 2022 22: 49
                You shouldn't have done that. I was still in Fido). To cling to grammar is bad form. Yes, and myself, it happened, as if I would write ... Even using "you" is unusual for me to use. Somehow it was accepted to "You".
                I thought it was "Horo", the nickname of your opponent that you mistook for me).
                In a word of 6 letters, 2 are missing XNUMX. Not only everyone can be guessed)
                The rest of the text will be written off to NG. Good luck)
          2. +2
            4 January 2022 10: 40
            Air defense is a purely defensive system; in principle, it is not capable of defeating a strike system such as aviation. This is a fence that requires more effort to overcome than just walking across the field. Powerful air defense limits the capabilities of aviation, requiring more concentration of forces to solve problems, or more time or better planning, mistakes lead to unnecessary losses, but nothing more. Everyone has known for a long time that a remedy against an airplane is better, this is a different airplane!
            Modern air defense is multichannel, range + electronic warfare, which does not allow the use of electronics for reference. The apparatus described in the article, as I understand it, is intended to create conditions, to use optics in the guidance system, which is not affected by electronic warfare. The power of air defense is limited by ammunition, this gives aviation the ability to use decoys, etc.
            This mouse, in order to see far away and be invisible to the optics of a short-range air defense system, flies somewhere high, an analogue of the U-2 apparently what
      2. -5
        3 January 2022 14: 59
        How zadolbali you are with this very Iraqi air defense system! Can you finally bother to explain to people about Iraq strangled by sanctions to the "Desert Saber" ?! About old equipment that has not been updated and we have not updated or serviced - including! And then we draw conclusions about the so-called power of the USAF.
        1. +11
          3 January 2022 17: 35
          Quote: 9lvariag
          How zadolbali you are with this very Iraqi air defense system! Can you finally bother to explain to people about Iraq strangled by sanctions to the "Desert Saber" ?!

          How can I explain what was not there? The sanctions were imposed in 1990, following the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait. In the 80s, even the French-German air defense systems Roland-2 were supplied.
          Quote: 9lvariag
          About old equipment that has not been updated and we have not updated or serviced - including!

          How was it not updated and serviced? Don't write nonsense. Iraq in the 80s was the favorite of the whole world. While he fought against Iran. Saddam's stupidity made him an outcast, for which he answered.

          Not only the Soviet Union, but the entire Western alliance, largely funded by the conservative Arab states, participated in the largest and most ambitious arms shipments in history to a third world state involved in the conflict. (...) The "Western package" for Iraq, however, pales in comparison to the Soviet one. Between 1986 and 1988, the Soviets supplied Iraq with weapons worth approximately $ 8,8 to 9,2 billion, including more than 2000 tanks (including 800 T-72s), 300 fighters, almost 300 anti-aircraft missile systems ( mainly "Scud B") and thousands of units of heavy artillery and armored personnel carriers "


          All these supplies made Iraq the 5th most powerful country in the world.
          The Iraqi Air Force consisted of 2 bomber, 13-17 fighter and 22 fighter-bomber and assault squadrons, which were armed with up to 750 fighters, bomber and attack aircraft, including:

          75 "Mirage F.1" (in 1981-1990 Iraq received 14 two-seat combat training "Mirage F.1BQ" and 94 single "Mirage F.1EQ", including 38 "Mirage F.1EQ5 / 6-200" equipped for carrying anti-ship missiles AM-39 Exocet and having equipment for refueling in the air)
          208 MiG-21
          123 MiG-23 (some sources mention the MiG-27, although most likely we are talking about the MiG-23BN)
          33 MiG-25
          41 MiG-29
          119 Su-7B / 20/22 (some sources mention the Su-17, but its export versions - Su-20 and Su-22 were used for sale abroad)
          25 Su-24
          61 Su-25
          15-16 bombers (8 Tu-16, including the Chinese N-6D (or B-6D), 8 Tu-22 - all in all, Iraq received 10 Tu-22, 6 Tu-16 and 4 (since 1987) N-6D)
          In addition, the Iraqi Air Force included 12 reconnaissance aircraft, 400 training aircraft (including combat training - 42 L-29 Dolphin and L-39 Albatross), 70 transport aircraft, 511 helicopters (576 according to another source, including 167 anti-tank and fire support).

          Iraqi air defense totaled:

          300 air defense systems S-75 and S-125
          114 "Cube"
          80 Wasp
          60 "Strela-10"
          100 "Roland"
          MANPADS "Strela-2", "Strela-3" and "Igla-1"
          7,500 anti-aircraft guns
          1. -1
            13 February 2022 18: 42
            So what? We learned how to copy-paste Wikipedia, but getting out of your comfortable lighthouse requires effort on yourself, although this concerns many!
            How can I explain what was not there? The sanctions were imposed in 1990, following the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait. In the 80s, even the French-German air defense systems Roland-2 were supplied.
            And it shy without maintenance and scheduled repairs? Clown, what is it, you have a direct road to a mechanic at a nuclear power plant? Keeping in mind that Western companies do not teach how to repair their goods and element base.
            300 air defense systems S-75 and S-125
            114 "Cube"
            80 Wasp
            60 "Strela-10"
            100 "Roland"
            MANPADS "Strela-2", "Strela-3" and "Igla-1"
            7,500 anti-aircraft guns
            Is it new and also from the late 1980s? Are you holding me for a loshara or is it just loneliness that stuck?
      3. +2
        3 January 2022 22: 13
        the problem is that they are about as visible as a bird on the radar. of course there are signs that distinguish birds and stealth, but they are more related to the behavior of the object than the reflection of the signal. ordinary bird radars are ignored because it is not worth counting all the birds. This is why China is investing in artificial intelligence radar. intellect and will, roughly speaking, make a selection of targets. in general, it seems to me that it should not be very difficult - wait and see.
      4. -7
        3 January 2022 23: 40
        Quote: OgnennyiKotik
        In this case, 1 plane was lost, due to stupidity

        Why foolishly? The "specialists" told me something completely different. Our ACS "Vozdukh" operating on selsyns turned out to be a big surprise for the Americans. Is the cost of the result of the fascist bombing known? I, I think, is not commensurate with the loss of a reptile (including a reputational one). And you (or the team) continue to drown for the Americans and Turks. Maybe the salary will be raised by 2 bucks. And yes, if you think that the ghoul was led and shot down by the Serbs, then think so further.
        1. 0
          10 January 2022 14: 22
          Another, alas, well-known anti-American hysteria with characteristic vocabulary.
          Well, about the F-117, shot down during the NATO military operation against Yugoslavia - one plane of this type was shot down. At the same time, during this military operation, several hundred combat missions were successfully carried out by F-117 aircraft. Well, yes, maybe for some it will seem like a revelation, but the leadership of the US Armed Forces actually knew from the very beginning that stealth technology meant stealth aircraft, and not its complete invulnerability.
      5. 0
        4 January 2022 13: 09
        What the F-117 destroyed, you do not write nonsense.
    2. -18
      3 January 2022 10: 31
      Quote: 501Legion
      I wonder when such articles are read by non-forum know-it-alls

      Minuses are given to you))), which means you have hooked on dung beetles)))
      1. +2
        4 January 2022 16: 39
        Quote: Sankiny
        Quote: 501Legion
        I wonder when such articles are read by non-forum know-it-alls

        Minuses are given to you))), which means you have hooked on dung beetles)))

        you "mikhan", you know better from the threshing floor.
    3. +5
      3 January 2022 17: 12
      The USA is not a bastard, but a Super Power. And we are very far from it, especially with regard to electronics and its derivatives.
      1. lot
        +1
        3 January 2022 18: 13
        No no no..! Standuper Kedmi said just now that we have Zircon, and those groups have a war on their nose and in general ..

        And a thousand commentators under the video confirm this.
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. +5
          3 January 2022 18: 45
          Good money probably pays Kedmi for such dregs.
  5. -17
    3 January 2022 10: 09
    In the creation of weapons, like nowhere else, the thieves' essence of America is visible.
    The Americans are inventing a weapon with which, as with the help of a master key, you can get into someone else's chicken coop, steal and get away with impunity.
    A global thief. They are not capable of a knightly duel.
    Everyone strives surreptitiously, from around the corner.
    Here is such a hehemon we have today. negative
    1. +27
      3 January 2022 10: 13
      Quote: prior
      The Americans are inventing a weapon with which, as with the help of a master key, you can get into someone else's chicken coop, steal and get away with impunity.

      Only very naive people consider war a "knightly duel" ... wassat
      1. -12
        3 January 2022 10: 28
        You may consider me naive, but I openly call a thief a thief,
        not a partner.
    2. lot
      +3
      3 January 2022 18: 32
      Well, yes: it's not a beginner to smear panties with a paint brush laughing
    3. +5
      3 January 2022 20: 37
      In order to become a "real" knight, then, in your opinion, the GRU and similar intelligence services must be eliminated!
    4. -1
      10 January 2022 14: 27
      a weapon with which, as with the help of a master key, you can climb into someone else's chicken coop, steal and get away with impunity.

      And what has to do with "stealing" and some "thieves' essence"? This is actually the key driver of all progress in the field of armaments - to create such a weapon that will allow defeating potential adversaries, while remaining invulnerable (unattainable) to their attacks.
    5. 0
      21 February 2022 10: 28
      Quote: prior
      In the creation of weapons, like nowhere else, the thieves' essence of America is visible.
      The Americans are inventing a weapon with which, as with the help of a master key, you can get into someone else's chicken coop, steal and get away with impunity.
      A global thief. They are not capable of a knightly duel.
      Everyone strives surreptitiously, from around the corner.
      Here is such a hehemon we have today. negative

      The British said about the same about German submarines. It’s dishonorable and all that ... In a war, honesty is not the main thing, the main thing is to inflict damage on the enemy. Anyone who believes in honesty gets Port Arthur and Pearl Harbor
  6. +15
    3 January 2022 10: 10
    Andrey, the topic is very interesting! But I got the impression of an understatement. There are many common phrases, but there is no information about the locations, characteristics (at least estimates), and who builds these devices.



    But when wish, something can be dug up even without intelligence. wink
    1. +11
      3 January 2022 14: 54
      Hello, dear Sergey!

      I deliberately wrote the article in as “general” as possible, so to speak, format. In Russia, unfortunately, neither the essence of the tasks of the UAV, nor the success of their practical application is still perceived sufficiently adequately, so I made a bet on the disclosure of the concept of this device, a description of its purpose, if you like.

      Thank you very much for the photos :)
      1. +6
        3 January 2022 15: 12
        Hello!
        Quote: Anjay V.
        In Russia, unfortunately, neither the essence of the tasks of UAVs, nor the successes of their practical application are still perceived adequately enough.

        I agree with that! Yes
        Quote: Anjay V.
        I deliberately wrote the article in as “general” as possible, so to speak, format ... so I made a bet on disclosing the concept of this device, describing its purpose, if you like.

        But this, in my opinion, is in vain! No. It is better to "dig deeper" so that thinking the reader could draw appropriate conclusions on the basis of the facts presented. For those who are used to relying on official information clichés, you still won't get through. Their brain does not perceive information that runs counter to the formed picture of the world.

        Quote: Anjay V.
        Thank you very much for the photos :)

        drinks
  7. -6
    3 January 2022 12: 48
    > during which one device crashed near Tehran due to a technical malfunction

    There are opinions that there was an interception of control, which is confirmed by the nature of the damage to the UAV, when landing on its belly. This reason seems to be more reasoned than an abstract technical malfunction.
    1. +10
      3 January 2022 13: 19

      For comparison, on the left is RQ-170 in the USA, on the right in Iran. Damage is clearly visible, torn off wings, traces of putty and repainted (maybe the cover was removed).


      Another photo of damage.

      In favor of the fact that the UAV simply went out of order, they say:

      1. Serious damage to the aircraft
      2. This was an isolated case.
      3. There is no understanding by what technical means it could be done
      4. Extremely high technical complexity of "interception", without real examples from UAVs of this class.
      1. +5
        3 January 2022 13: 56
        I cannot call such damage serious, i.e. with a crash of an aircraft, I visually have a completely different picture. And I do not know of other explanations for the sparing landing of a top-secret UAV, with the preservation of almost all the material part.

        I fully agree on the difficulty of interception, but the complexity is not identical to the impossibility)
    2. +10
      3 January 2022 15: 00
      There are opinions that there was an interception of control, which is confirmed by the nature of the damage to the UAV, when landing on its belly. This reason seems to be more reasoned than an abstract technical malfunction.


      There really is such an opinion, but in reality the RQ-170 had a threefold redundant control system. Such devices, if the signal with the operator is lost, are able to independently return to the airbase without any special difficulties. This case was seriously investigated in the United States, and the conclusion was unambiguous - a technical malfunction.

      In addition, as you understand, if the Iranians had intercepted control of the car, they would have put it on the runway, and not banged it on a vacant lot near Tehran, then they would have searched and collected the wreckage for almost half a day. It would be more logical to get the whole UAV.
      1. -4
        3 January 2022 16: 18
        Anzhej, this implementation of the landing was explained by the substitution of coordinates, in that case. Those. there was no command to sit down, but the UAV electronics believed that the device was in a different place, so it was on the belly.)
        I don’t bend my line, because I don’t know for sure, of course, I will only note that interception of both UAVs and even ships, not to mention modern machines, is not impossible, regardless of the degree of redundancy.
  8. +7
    3 January 2022 13: 05
    I am very skeptical about the invisibility and the resulting qualities of such devices in the context of modern air defense and especially the direction of its development in the present and future. As we know, complete invisibility is impossible. One way or another, the maneuvering apparatus will have some kind of EPR, somewhat different from different angles, and although approaching the ideal, it is still not such. Against a single radar, stealth tricks are quite justified for themselves, for weapons, as well. But in the case when the air defense / missile defense system is built into a kind of network centric, when it is at least a little echeloned, when, finally, machine algorithms are involved in the processing of incoming signals, stealth UAVs in peacetime have practically no chances to fulfill their mission. The semi-autonomous large object is an ideal target for interceptors - given also the well-known compromises between stealth and aerodynamics, once discovered, it will have no chance of escaping or breaking away. Considering the price of such devices and, most importantly, the damage from studying their technologies in the event of falling into the hands of the enemy, such products will be of little use against a modern enemy in a peaceful period (and in the relative depth of his territory). In the pre-war period, such devices will be relatively useful, however, as I noted above, in the case of a defense network centric, a more or less large-scale penetration of such devices will be detected early enough, which can eliminate the surprise factor of the entire operation of a large scale. In wartime, I have doubts that most of the potential. Such devices will be implemented because the equipped bases along the perimeter of our borders will be mostly destroyed, the surviving objects will be what is called "under the sword of Damocles." So a UAV of this type will be used with a greater probability with the AUG, which will somewhat reduce the scale of its usefulness as a global reconnaissance officer.
    This does not mean that the stealth uav recon is a bad idea. Rather, much already now points to the development of sufficiently effective measures to counter such a scheme (for technologically strong states), capable of devaluing the concept much sooner than its authors believe.
    1. +6
      3 January 2022 13: 50
      You need to understand that the RQ-170/180 was created for the requirements of the "US intelligence community", not for the Air Force or the Army. He's not for war. Too expensive and narrowly functional. Therefore, the X-45/47 projects were closed, the same happened with the French and British counterparts. We need massive, cheap UAVs that can be lost in batches without harm, and they are created. Naturally, they are also "stealth", but without fanaticism.
      Regarding air defense, you are missing one point, it is impossible to cover the entire perimeter of Russia or China with a network of radars capable of detecting RQ-170/180. There will be "holes" through which scouts can penetrate.
      1. +1
        3 January 2022 15: 01
        This is understandable, on the other hand, I am pointing not so much to the power and impenetrability of air defense, but to the inevitability of an increase in analytical processing of the data set on air defense and missile defense. The peculiarities of the operation of such devices will inevitably fall into the field of view of our radar facilities, because even though the world is large, it is already cramped in places and this facility will run with varying probability in some predicted points of the so-called "axis of evil". There, this UAV will be waiting in the same way as Powers and the same ill-fated stealth that fell into the hands of Iran were waiting. They will collect data, shove it into machine processing, etc., then the question of detection and identification will be directly tied to how many radar installations will get into the field of view of "stealth" in the course of its mission. As a rule, the most interesting objects from the point of view of reconnaissance are still covered with something, so in my opinion everything here comes down to the effectiveness of network centrics and analytics, and, of course, an array of any means of detection in principle. All this within the framework of significant spaces, in my opinion, would be great to limit the capabilities of such devices for precisely that invisible reconnaissance far from the borders. And near the borders - you are right, where it is more convenient to use budget devices.
        Of course, I do not know in what state at the moment we have analytical processing of data arrays on air defense, but I believe that in the development of air defense-missile defense systems, analytics should be one of the main cherries on the cake, and in any case we will develop this approach.
      2. +10
        3 January 2022 15: 35
        Quote: OgnennyiKotik
        Regarding air defense, you are missing one point, it is impossible to cover the entire perimeter of Russia or China with a network of radars capable of detecting RQ-170/180. There will be "holes" through which scouts can penetrate.

        Recently, one not very smart, but overly "patriotic" visitor to VO wrote in the comments:
        ... "Sky-UM" will detect any stealth or missile at a distance of 600 km ..
        wassat
        Of course, the VHF stations "Sky-UM", "Sky-SV", "Defense-14" and the modernized P-18 are indeed capable of detecting subtle targets in the decimeter and centimeter ranges. But even their detection range is reduced by 20-30%. However, meter-long standby stations are very cumbersome, and there are not as many of them as we would like, and they do not cost everywhere. Radars of the "Sky" family have not yet been built in sufficient numbers, most of the "Oborona-14" stations have been decommissioned, and the characteristics of the overhauled and modernized P-18 leave much to be desired. In addition, now we do not have a continuous radar field, but "holes", especially from the northern direction, are in abundance.
    2. -1
      10 January 2022 14: 37
      I am very skeptical about the invisibility and the resulting qualities of such devices in the context of modern air defense and especially the direction of its development in the present and future. As we know, complete invisibility is impossible.

      Actually, stealth technology does not mean invulnerability, and there was no mystery in this from the very beginning. It means stealth.
      Against a single radar, stealth tricks are quite justified for themselves, as well as for means of destruction.

      Actually, the situation is somewhat different - in principle, any radar station of any anti-aircraft missile system sees any aircraft with stealth technology. The only key moment - FROM WHAT DISTANCE she "sees".
  9. +6
    3 January 2022 17: 03
    Quote: . PIXY.
    And if you consider that the F-117 was shot down with the help of TOV (Television Optical Sight), then everything becomes even more sad ...

    - Actually, no. No television sight was used there - first the P-18, then the radar of the C-125 Neva / Pechora itself.
    It's just that the F-117 there, by mistake (or by a puncture by American intelligence), was too close to the Serbian air defense missile division. And he was shot down - quite naturally.
  10. +4
    3 January 2022 17: 06
    Quote: Knell Wardenheart
    I am very skeptical about the invisibility and the resulting qualities of such devices in the context of modern air defense and especially the direction of its development in the present and future. As we know, complete invisibility is impossible. One way or another, the maneuvering apparatus will have some kind of EPR, somewhat different from different angles, and although approaching the ideal, it is still not such. Against a single radar, stealth tricks are quite justified for themselves, for weapons, as well. But in the case when the air defense / missile defense system is built into a kind of network centric, when it is at least a little echeloned, when, finally, machine algorithms are involved in the processing of incoming signals, stealth UAVs in peacetime have practically no chances to fulfill their mission. The semi-autonomous large object is an ideal target for interceptors - given also the well-known compromises between stealth and aerodynamics, once discovered, it will have no chance of escaping or breaking away. Considering the price of such devices and, most importantly, the damage from studying their technologies in the event of falling into the hands of the enemy, such products will be of little use against a modern enemy in a peaceful period (and in the relative depth of his territory). In the pre-war period, such devices will be relatively useful, however, as I noted above, in the case of a defense network centric, a more or less large-scale penetration of such devices will be detected early enough, which can eliminate the surprise factor of the entire operation of a large scale. In wartime, I have doubts that most of the potential. Such devices will be implemented because the equipped bases along the perimeter of our borders will be mostly destroyed, the surviving objects will be what is called "under the sword of Damocles." So a UAV of this type will be used with a greater probability with the AUG, which will somewhat reduce the scale of its usefulness as a global reconnaissance officer.

    - This is you in vain! Stealth is the future and it is inevitable. And for those who do not have them - guaranteed tryndets ...
  11. +1
    3 January 2022 17: 08
    Quote: Bongo
    Quote: OgnennyiKotik
    Regarding air defense, you are missing one point, it is impossible to cover the entire perimeter of Russia or China with a network of radars capable of detecting RQ-170/180. There will be "holes" through which scouts can penetrate.

    Recently, one not very smart, but overly "patriotic" visitor to VO wrote in the comments:
    ... "Sky-UM" will detect any stealth or missile at a distance of 600 km ..
    wassat
    Of course, the VHF stations "Sky-UM", "Sky-SV", "Defense-14" and the modernized P-18 are indeed capable of detecting subtle targets in the decimeter and centimeter ranges. But even their detection range is reduced by 20-30%.

    - Reduced by 200-300 %%.

  12. 0
    4 January 2022 14: 57
    Quote: Anjay V.
    There are opinions that there was an interception of control, which is confirmed by the nature of the damage to the UAV, when landing on its belly. This reason seems to be more reasoned than an abstract technical malfunction.


    There really is such an opinion, but in reality the RQ-170 had a threefold redundant control system. Such devices, if the signal with the operator is lost, are able to independently return to the airbase without any special difficulties. This case was seriously investigated in the United States, and the conclusion was unambiguous - a technical malfunction.

    In addition, as you understand, if the Iranians had intercepted control of the car, they would have put it on the runway, and not banged it on a vacant lot near Tehran, then they would have searched and collected the wreckage for almost half a day. It would be more logical to get the whole UAV.

    - As an option: noticed visually and accordingly shot down - for example, guided a fighter. Although the RQ-170 LTH is really unique: stealth, speed up to 950 km / h and ceiling up to 15 km.
  13. 0
    8 January 2022 10: 01
    We would have something like that.
  14. +1
    9 January 2022 13: 04
    Quote: A009
    Well, let religion (father-in-law, blind faith, without factology and any reasonable evidence) have a place to be. Let's admit. But here's your article on otherwise, what's different? "Even the most reasonable arguments are rejected with indignation ..." so you did not bring one. Defenders of the S-400 air defense and other "believers" give at least some reason. There are all kinds of tests, some statistics. Maybe not entirely correct, but you just dumped emotions on the site, without the slightest factual and that, are you right now? Give examples that our air defense is incapacitated, as you shout about it, let’s speculate. And so you are the same fanatic, only from the other side.

    - Gliding range of small-diameter bombs GBU-39 (long standing as standard armament of the F-22) when dropped from a height of 11 km - 110 km, when dropped from a height of 15 km - 150 km, - this has been verified repeatedly, in particular at Iranian facilities in Syria... Now take a very close look at this picture:


    Here's a bigger one:

    Do you need comments? Or is that clear? The S-400 on the modern battlefield is just a "corpse on wheels." What's the use, her SAM has a maximum launch range of 400 km, if she can't see the F-22 closer than 20 km? Whereas for 120-150 km bombs will be dropped on it (one F-22 throws 8 such bombs at once), and the stealth plane will quickly turn around - and "remember what you called!"
    1. 0
      13 February 2022 20: 20
      KMB flight range up to 220 km. just in case. And they do not have RLGSN. Where did you get THIS from?
      1. 0
        23 February 2022 05: 11
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GBU-39_Small_Diameter_Bomb
        Operational
        range
        All SDB I variants more than 60 nmi (110 km)
        Of course, they don’t have RLGSN, they are guided by GPS.
  15. 0
    11 January 2022 13: 55
    Quote: Outsider
    Now take a very close look at this picture:


    And why do you need to believe this paper data? What makes you think that they correspond to the truth?
    Who will lay out the real performance characteristics in the open access, making the work of "Jamesbonds" easier?
    Well, let the bourgeoisie think so, the harder the disappointment will be.

    In a real war, the S-400 will only be part of an integrated air defense system. From planning ammunition, they will be covered by short-range air defense systems.
    1. 0
      23 February 2022 05: 13
      - Let's immediately remember how these short-range air defense systems covered Armenian armored vehicles and artillery in Nagorno-Karabakh from bombs from Bayraktars? Virtually nothing:
      1. 0
        April 10 2022 16: 00
        God, how did you get the US Padawans with your Karabakh. Ready to stick it with super glue to any topic of conversation.
  16. -1
    13 February 2022 19: 37
    Quote: Lesnik21
    The USA is not a bastard, but a Super Power. And we are very far from it, especially with regard to electronics and its derivatives.

    Oga, did the ruler tell you to tell at all crossroads?! And actually: derivatives of electronics, what is this? The fact that the calculation of all sensors of the device was put into one crystal is good only for disposable products.
  17. 0
    13 February 2022 19: 38
    Quote: Terran Ghost
    a weapon with which, as with the help of a master key, you can climb into someone else's chicken coop, steal and get away with impunity.

    And what has to do with "stealing" and some "thieves' essence"? This is actually the key driver of all progress in the field of armaments - to create such a weapon that will allow defeating potential adversaries, while remaining invulnerable (unattainable) to their attacks.

    It is almost impossible to assemble such weapons without violating existing agreements and without destroying the Earth's ecology! And you have a well-known proverb: you can’t fall in love with fate - but we’ll try it!
    1. 0
      23 February 2022 05: 16
      - You are saying something completely utterly utterly absurd, even absurd ...
      1. 0
        April 10 2022 16: 02
        No, well, where am I to the propagandists from the light-faced countries of common people. For you, the laws of nature are not written and chromokey is the norm of life for high-ranking officials in your countries.
        1. 0
          April 11 2022 01: 18
          - Would you say something on the case, but there is nothing to say to you ...
  18. 0
    21 May 2022 20: 20
    Quote: Outsider
    - Would you say something on the case, but there is nothing to say to you ...

    Can we read? Or are you one of the sectarians of "Professor" Sokolov, who foolishly proved that the Iskander OTRK is shnyaga, but the UAV from the trash Louckheed F-16A from the air dump in Palm Dale is quite a cheap means of "carrying the basics of American democracy to Russia"? Well, what did your Turkish "Bayraktars" help you with your son?
  19. 0
    21 May 2022 20: 29
    Quote: Outsider
    - Would you say something on the case, but there is nothing to say to you ...

    Everything is described above. UAV NGB program closed by congress. The SR-72 Aurora program is either a grandiose sawmill of green attendants, or another “well, I couldn’t”, like rollicking tales about Jeronimo & Voult SLAM shock orbital platforms
    https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supersonic_Low-Altitude_Missile
    . Moreover, even the historians of the PKO / PRO / URO do not want to voice all this now, so imbecile were the tasks set by the military-political circles of the SGA for scientists and designers.
  20. 0
    21 May 2022 20: 36
    Quote: Outsider
    - Would you say something on the case, but there is nothing to say to you ...

    It would be better to write how MEDUSA ended (one of the MRBM launch programs), Golden Arow, RC-747? Why, then, are these aircraft hung in clusters on the ADM MALD database, if these aircraft are so inconspicuous then? For fun, this kind of suspension (if someone is not aware of aerodynamics and radar visibility) is MINUS stealth & supersonic! Especially your fap fetish Fu-35.