Military Review

Panzerfaust grenade launchers. "Miracle weapon" with low characteristics

203
Crate with Panzerfaust grenade launchers. Photo Wikimedia Commons

In the last months of 1943, the troops of Nazi Germany began to use the first rocket-propelled anti-tank grenade launchers of the Panzerfaust series at the front. According to the plans, this weapon was supposed to strengthen the infantry and become almost the main anti-tank weapon. However, not the highest tactical and technical characteristics seriously limited the practical use of such weapons - and it did not cope with the hopes that were placed.


Anti-tank "wonder weapon"


Development of the Panzerfaust began in 1942 and was completed the following year. Soon, the troops received the first serial products Faustpatrone 1. Later, the improved Panzerfaust 30 went into production. The first cases of the combat use of such weapons on the Soviet front date back to the end of autumn of the same year. In the fall of 1944, the first Panzerfaust-60 products were sent to the troops, and at the end of the year, the production of the next modification with the index "100" began. In the last weeks and months before the surrender, they managed to release a small number of Panzerfaust 150 grenade launchers. The Panzerfaust-250 was also developed, but they did not have time to establish its production.

In about a year and a half of serial production, the German industry managed to produce at least 8,2 million disposable grenade launchers of all modifications. The Panzerfaust 60 version became the most popular, occupying an intermediate position in the family. Weapons were actively distributed between army units, and from a certain time were supplied to the militia.

Making pomegranates for Panzerfaust. Explosives are poured into empty housings through funnels. Photo Waralbum.ru

Anti-tank grenade launchers were actively used on all fronts, and German troops constantly reported on the next success of such a "miracle weapon" in the fight against enemy tanks... At the same time, "Panzerfaust" regularly became trophies of the Allies and also found use. At the same time, there were ambiguous assessments.

Tabular data


All products of the Panzerfaust family used a common architecture, but had some differences that provided a difference in combat characteristics. Such differences were achieved mainly through the gradual modernization of the cumulative grenade with the refinement of its various components.

The first version of the grenade, used with the Faustpatrone 1 product, had a 100 mm warhead with a shaped charge weighing 400 g. The 70 g propellant charge provided an initial speed of only 28 m / s and an effective range of up to 30 m. obstacle - 140 mm.

Panzerfaust grenade launchers. "Miracle weapon" with low characteristics
Soldiers of the Berlin "Volkssturm" with grenade launchers. Judging by their faces, the characteristics of the weapon are not impressive. Photo of the Bundesarchive of the Federal Republic of Germany

In the Panzerfaust-30 modification, a new grenade was introduced with a reinforced warhead with a diameter of 149 mm and a penetration rate of 200 mm. The increase in the mass of the ammunition was compensated by an increase in the propellant charge, and the ballistic characteristics remained the same. The following grenades, such as Panzerfaust 60 and Panzerfaust 100, remained generally the same, but due to the enhanced propellant charge, the effective range increased to 60 and 100 m, respectively.

The last serial modification, "Panzerfaust 150", received a fundamentally new grenade with an improved charge and a caliber of 106 mm. Despite the smaller dimensions and weight, the penetration rate exceeded 280-300 mm. In addition, the lightweight grenade accelerated to 80-85 m / s and flew 150 m.

Grenade launchers at the front


From the end of 1943, Panzerfaust products of all versions were actively used on all fronts. They were seen as a more effective replacement for hand-held anti-tank grenades and as an addition to anti-tank artillery. Great hopes were pinned on such weapons, but on the whole they did not justify them. According to both German and foreign estimates, the overall effectiveness of the grenade launchers was significantly lower than other anti-tank weapons.

German militias in position. Whether it will be possible to hit and hit the tank is a big question. Photo of the Bundesarchive of the Federal Republic of Germany

The Red Army quickly noticed the emergence of new weapons from the enemy and took the necessary measures. The damaged vehicles were carefully studied, and measures were taken to capture captured grenade launchers for subsequent tests. Later, as the offensive progressed, the Red Army more and more often got hold of the Panzerfaust abandoned by the retreating enemy - and actively used them.

Rocket-propelled grenade launchers were intended to combat tanks in different conditions, including. in open spaces during combined arms combat. Practice has shown that in such a situation Panzerfaust shows very limited results. In urban conditions, such weapons worked better, but there was no fundamental difference. At the same time, new modifications with improved characteristics did not generally change the current state of affairs.

Language of numbers


The low efficiency was reflected in German documents. For example, in February 1944, German troops announced the destruction of more than 1200 Soviet tanks and self-propelled guns. Moreover, only 35 applications mentioned "Panzerfaust" - only 3%. If we take into account the specifics of such statistics and the peculiarities of accounting for other people's losses, then the real results could be even lower.

Similar statistics took place on the Soviet side. Thus, the historian A. Ulanov, in his article “Panzerfaust, the Almighty,” mentions the results of the operation of the 8th Guards Army, Colonel-General V.I. Chuikov in March 1945 Due to various objective factors and difficulties, in just three days the army lost 122 tanks and self-propelled guns. 98 armored vehicles were destroyed by artillery, and only 7 units were used by grenade launchers. or less than 6% loss of equipment.

Trophy Panzerfaust in the Red Army. Photo Waralbum.ru

Other characteristic information relates to the results of the work of the 2nd Ukrainian Front in February 1945. During the month, there were 160 combat damage to tanks and self-propelled guns, and only 2 were caused by Panzerfaust. Not only the number and proportion of such damage is noteworthy, but also their nature: one T-34 tank smashed a caterpillar, and the second one cracked its frontal armor from being hit. After the repair, the cars could return to service.

In the spring of 1945, the main battles took place in urban areas, in which grenade launchers are believed to be able to fully realize their potential. Indeed, the Red Army had to take special measures to protect armored vehicles from ambushes and other threats. However, the general statistics on the use of Panzerfaust again did not meet the expectations of the Nazis.

In a series of articles by Yu. Pasholok "Theory of armored delusions", the losses of the 1st Belorussian Front in April-May 1945, during the Berlin operation, are mentioned. So, in April, the front armored vehicles completed 20378 tank codes (the sum of days of combat operation of all vehicles). Damage received 3781 units. equipment, of which 911 had to be written off. German grenade launchers damaged 269 armored vehicles and destroyed 165 of them. Accordingly, cumulative grenades accounted for approx. 7% damage and 18% loss. The bulk of the losses (1846 in total and 719 irrecoverable) were again provided by enemy artillery.

The British are studying captured anti-tank weapons. Photo by IWM

In early May, before the end of the fighting, the front completed more than 1200 tank guides. Combat damage received 275 HP. equipment, incl. 50 went into irrecoverable losses. At the same time, the Panzerfaust damaged 42 vehicles (15% of all damage) and destroyed 20, i.e. 40%. These were almost the highest results of grenade launchers during the entire war. However, even in this case, the leading role in the anti-tank defense remained with the artillery. Thus, even in optimal conditions of combat use, the performance of grenade launchers remained limited.

Alternative application


German rocket-propelled grenade launchers immediately interested the Red Army. At the top, discussions began on the need to develop and produce their own weapons of this class, and at the front they tried to get captured samples and use them against the former owners.

It is known that the Red Army soldiers used Panzerfaust in the original role of anti-tank weapons. It was more effective than hand grenades, but limited ballistic performance made itself felt. In addition, by the time the first captured grenade launchers appeared, our main problems with anti-tank artillery had been resolved, and the need for manual weapons had decreased.

With all this, "Panzerfaust" showed itself as a good engineering weapon. Grenade launchers were used to suppress and destroy firing points, make passages in buildings, etc. In such situations, the limited range and accuracy of fire did not have a negative impact and made it possible to solve the assigned tasks.

Soviet tanks IS-2 in East Prussia. Panzerfaust grenade launchers are left on the sidelines and no longer pose any danger to them. Photo Waralbum.ru

Reasons for failure


According to various estimates, Panzerfaust grenade launchers were progressive weapons for their time. However, they failed to meet the expectations and demonstrate high performance indicators. In addition, such weapons showed the best results when used in an abnormal manner. Several prerequisites related to design, organization of use, etc. led to such results.

The main problem of the Panzerfaustos was their low ballistic characteristics, first of all, their short firing range. Even the Panzerfaust 100, which had 200 g of a propellant charge, could only throw a grenade at 100 m. This was due to the relatively large mass of the grenade and the overly simple design of the launch tube. The grenade launcher did not have a rear nozzle or counter-mass, which is why a significant part of the energy of the powder gases was wasted and was not transferred to the ammunition.

The grenade launcher had extremely simple sights that limited the accuracy of the fire. This problem was aggravated by the specifics of production. Product quality 1944-45 often left much to be desired, and accuracy suffered in the first place. At the same time, the loss of accuracy did not allow realizing the potential of a sufficiently powerful warhead, theoretically capable of hitting any Allied tanks.

Red Army soldier and trophies. Photo Warspot.ru

Finally, the methods of using grenade launchers became a negative factor. The Germans used the Panzerfaust in its original role as an anti-tank weapon, and in most situations its characteristics were insufficient for this. Risks for grenade launchers reached their maximum level, and the effectiveness of firing fell. At the final stage of the war, such weapons were issued to the militia with minimal training - and the results were predictable.

With limited results


Thus, the German Panzerfaust grenade launchers, produced in a large series, were widely used on the fronts of World War II and even left their mark on it. stories... However, this trace cannot be called unambiguous. Despite the presence of certain advantages, this weapon faced difficulties and problems that negatively affected its combat use.

As a result, "Panzerfaust" and other, more successful, hand-held anti-tank systems of German design did not have a noticeable effect on the course of the war and did not save Hitlerite Germany from defeat and surrender. During the war and after its end, the victorious countries carefully studied all captured samples, developments and technologies. They did not copy or develop the German grenade launchers, which again confirmed their low potential.
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  1. sen
    sen 2 January 2022 07: 23
    +2
    I read that our tankers often noticed holes from Panzerfaust only after leaving the battle.
    1. Aerodrome
      Aerodrome 2 January 2022 07: 30
      +2
      Quote: sen
      I read that our tankers often noticed holes from Panzerfaust only after leaving the battle.

      not holes, but traces of hitting, Grandfather told this. For his KV-1, "Faust" was like an elephant was shot.
      1. Split
        Split 2 January 2022 07: 51
        +6
        It is strange that for the declared 150-200mm penetration of the faust on hit, he could not take 75mm (EMNIP) of the KV-1 armor what even taking into account the given. Perhaps at a slight angle, the gas jet ricocheted. recourse
        Although I wrote below ... it seems like there was no metal funnel then, in fact it was a stream of gases from an explosion. At least the first cumulatives were just that ... but to be honest, I don't remember when they began to apply metal to the funnel repeat
        1. Saxahorse
          Saxahorse 2 January 2022 21: 31
          +14
          Quote: Split
          It is strange that for the declared 150-200mm of penetration of the faust on hit, he could not take 75mm (EMNIP) of the KV-1 armor, even taking into account the reduction. Perhaps at a slight angle, the gas jet ricocheted.

          Sheer nonsense. Everything was fine with the penetration of the Fausts. I saw a photo of ISU-152 in a Berlin museum, punched through from left to right. The ISU's side armor is 75 mm tilted, however.

          Faust's problem is not in penetration, but in scanty range. In an open field, a tank will finish you off within a kilometer, which is 30 meters. In the city, everything is more complicated, but in the assault groups the infantry goes forward, and extinguishes the clever men with fausts leaning out before they have time to aim. But the classic cannon blows the tower from a kilometer. Even in the city.
          1. Split
            Split 2 January 2022 21: 54
            +3
            You misunderstood, perhaps my comment ... I was just surprised myself that the type faust, according to the person of the type, could not break through the square. belay And they wrote below that by the mass appearance of the panzer, kv1, in fact, there were, if, then in scanty quantities
          2. bubalik
            bubalik 2 January 2022 21: 59
            +8




            ,,, on the site "Memory of the People" there are a lot of documents, where it is described that this is a formidable weapon, and special assault groups were created to use it.
          3. IVZ
            IVZ April 7 2022 21: 15
            0
            Sorry, but not only in range. Also in the state of industry in Germany at the end of the war, i.e. as a product. The shape of the funnel, the presence and material of its lining, type BB. All this did not always correspond to the CD. Fortunately.
      2. Bongo
        Bongo 2 January 2022 08: 12
        +37
        Quote: Aerodrome
        not holes, but traces of hitting, Grandfather told this. For his KV-1, "Faust" was like an elephant was shot.

        Sorry, but with all due respect to your grandfather, you are confusing something. German disposable RPGs were quite easy to overcome the 80 mm side armor of the IS-2, and at the same time, the cumulative jet still retained a high incendiary and destructive effect. Your grandfather's tank was less protected. In addition, by the time of the massive appearance of the Panzerfaust, almost all heavy KV-1S tanks in the active army had been supplanted by the ISs.
        1. Aerodrome
          Aerodrome 2 January 2022 14: 51
          +8
          Quote: Bongo
          Sorry, but with all due respect to your grandfather, you are confusing something.

          Apparently Sergei, grandfather got it from the first copies of "Faust", he took part in the assault on Koenigsberg, took Pillau, and then, after being wounded, he went home. maybe there was such military luck, but from Stalingrad, I changed only three cars. and then on malfunctions. 11 army. (they were all different, although they were called "KV-1")
        2. Alf
          Alf 2 January 2022 17: 35
          +6
          Quote: Bongo
          In addition, by the time of the massive appearance of the Panzerfaust, almost all heavy KV-1S tanks in the active army had been supplanted by the ISs.

          June 10, 1944, 21st Army LF, 26th Guards Breakthrough Tank Regiment, 32 KV-1S.
          September 1944, LF, 82nd Tank Regiment, KV-1S.
      3. sabakina
        sabakina 2 January 2022 08: 23
        +13
        Quote: Aerodrome
        Quote: sen
        I read that our tankers often noticed holes from Panzerfaust only after leaving the battle.

        not holes, but traces of hitting, Grandfather told this. For his KV-1, "Faust" was like an elephant was shot.

        In war, everything happens ...

        German shell in KV-1 armor.
      4. mr.ZinGer
        mr.ZinGer 2 January 2022 08: 34
        +7
        KV-1 in '45, some kind of discrepancy ?!
        1. Aviator_
          Aviator_ 2 January 2022 09: 03
          +12
          KV-1 in 45, some kind of discrepancy

          Why 45? Panzerfaust appeared in autumn 43, and KV fought until mid-44
          1. vladcub
            vladcub 2 January 2022 18: 48
            +12
            "until mid-1944" KV was replaced in production with IS, but the vehicles were not removed from the front. In some sectors of the front, they remained until the Victory.
            I know from the stories of veterans
          2. Oleg812spb
            Oleg812spb 2 January 2022 23: 12
            +4
            In mid-June 1944 specially assembled on the Karelian front KV-1 during the Vyborg-Petrozavodsk operation took part in the assault on the so-called. Karelian shaft, the defense of which was broken through in three days. Perhaps it was there that I had to "get acquainted".
        2. Aerodrome
          Aerodrome 2 January 2022 14: 55
          +3
          Quote: mr.ZinGer
          KV-1 in '45, some kind of discrepancy ?!

          what is the "discrepancy"? in what? the tank served after the war.
          1. mr.ZinGer
            mr.ZinGer 2 January 2022 19: 16
            -1
            And where did the KV-1 serve after the war? Share information.
            1. Aerodrome
              Aerodrome 2 January 2022 19: 19
              +5
              Quote: mr.ZinGer
              And where did the KV-1 serve after the war? Share information.

              Seriously ? do you need it? from the army of the 11th, several echelons with equipment and soldiers left for the Far East .. it’s too lazy to see. ? although, judging by the "name" you are "German", well ... so ... fat and lazy .. you have a pedal "zinger" ... left over from your grandfather ... so "heartburn" is gnawing at you ...
              1. mr.ZinGer
                mr.ZinGer 2 January 2022 19: 24
                -2
                Seriously though, it didn’t matter, but now it’s interesting. I did not find any information on the Internet using direct links. Keep tanks in operation,
                which have been taken out of production for two years, an incomprehensible logic.
                1. Sergej1972
                  Sergej1972 2 January 2022 20: 26
                  +6
                  When did the T-54/55 and T-62 cease to be produced? And when were they removed from service?
                  1. mr.ZinGer
                    mr.ZinGer 2 January 2022 21: 19
                    0
                    We have a lot of rarities in our reserve warehouses, but combat exploitation is completely different. You have seen references to the use of the KV-1 in 45 in the war with Germany, but I have not.
                2. Alf
                  Alf 2 January 2022 21: 05
                  +3
                  Quote: mr.ZinGer
                  Keep tanks in operation,
                  which have been taken out of production for two years, an incomprehensible logic.

                  What's the problem ? The crews are trained, the technique is mastered, the sea of ​​spare parts ...
                  1. mr.ZinGer
                    mr.ZinGer 2 January 2022 21: 14
                    0
                    The problem is in the same logistics, if the device is on conservation it is the same, but its active operation is another matter. But in the war with Japan, the KV-1 participated, the 48th separate heavy tank regiment, but the KV-1 was there since 42.
                    1. Alf
                      Alf 3 January 2022 18: 24
                      0
                      Quote: mr.ZinGer
                      The problem is in the same logistics, if the device is mothballed, it is the same, but its active operation is another matter.

                      Well, the parts do not disappear from the parts instantly. And especially when you consider the fact that the longest of all KVs held out precisely on the Lenfront, that is, in the direct line of sight of the manufacturer's plant.
              2. mr.ZinGer
                mr.ZinGer 2 January 2022 21: 33
                -1
                The 11th army was disbanded in 1943, no need to fantasize.
                Isaac Singer was an American Jew.
                We compensate for the lack of knowledge with vulgar wit.
        3. Slug_BDMP
          Slug_BDMP 2 January 2022 19: 58
          +5
          "... From 1940 to 1943, 4775 KV tanks of all modifications were produced. They fought on all fronts of the Great Patriotic War, first as part of mixed tank brigades, then as part of separate Guards tank regiments of the breakthrough. Until 1945, very few KVs survived. , used as battle tanks. Basically, after dismantling the tower, they served as evacuation tractors ... "https://modelist-konstruktor.com/bronekollekcziya/tyazhelyj-tank-kv
      5. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U 2 January 2022 08: 42
        +9
        Quote: Aerodrome
        My grandfather told this. For his KV-1, "Faust" was like an elephant had a grain of salt.
        The fuses are not very accurate, the distance in front of the funnel was small, which did not allow the jet to form, and this is very good!
        1. Nexcom
          Nexcom 2 January 2022 09: 21
          +9
          I read that our tankers called the traces of the faustpatron hits as witch burns (those hits that, by chance, did not lead to the destruction of the tank and the crew)
          1. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U 2 January 2022 09: 29
            +15
            Quote: Nexcom
            called witch burns
            Suck, "witch suck."
            1. Nexcom
              Nexcom 2 January 2022 09: 34
              +2
              Yes, probably the author I was reading then probably creatively corrected the original title. There, the author wrote about the burn.
      6. The leader of the Redskins
        The leader of the Redskins 2 January 2022 09: 35
        +8
        My grandfather, Vasily Semyonovich, a tank sergeant, compared the hit of a Panzerfaust on the forehead of a thirty-four: "... as if you went through with a grater." But hits on the side were often fatal ...
      7. YOUR
        YOUR 2 January 2022 10: 42
        +4
        This article is written about this, for example:
        in February 1944, German troops announced the destruction of more than 1200 Soviet tanks and self-propelled guns. At the same time, only 35 applications mentioned "Panzerfaust" - only 3%

        Key findings:
        During the war and after its end, the victorious countries carefully studied all captured samples, developments and technologies. They did not copy or develop the German grenade launchers, which again confirmed their low potential.

        But still, not quite so, they did not copy such a design, however, they adopted some experience, and even looked at the American bazooka, they had some of their own developments and turned out to be an RPG-2, and then an RPG-7
        1. mat-vey
          mat-vey 2 January 2022 11: 58
          +2
          Quote: YOUR
          and even looked at the American bazooka

          Back in 1942, they "looked" at "Bazooka" ...
        2. English tarantas
          English tarantas 2 January 2022 12: 46
          +9
          Still, Faust is a disposable recoilless hand grenade launcher, pipes from it, if possible, were sent to the factory to check for the possibility of re-equipping, but for its purpose it is disposable, and such things are now used all over the world by all and sundry.
          The author is wrong twice, firstly, the design was used, and secondly, the concept was used. If someone did not begin to copy specifically panzerfaust, this still does not mean anything.
    2. svp67
      svp67 2 January 2022 10: 15
      +4
      Quote: sen
      I read that our tankers often noticed holes from Panzerfaust only after leaving the battle.

      Not holes, but the so-called "Witch Suction", this is when the charge on the armor worked, but did not achieve a penetration ...
      1. Constanty
        Constanty 2 January 2022 12: 23
        +13
        In the photo - the trail of a hit (not completed by armor penetration) of a regular armor-piercing projectile, and not a cumulative jet. Anyway, on the turret of a German tank
        1. Split
          Split 2 January 2022 14: 10
          +5
          Yes, there it is obvious that it is not cumulative even for those who play WoT ... the cumul under the enormous pressure of the jets pushes, forcing the steel to plasticize and leaves a miniature hole (fans of all this immediately take a rest lol )
          1. svp67
            svp67 3 January 2022 09: 00
            +1
            Quote: Split
            Yes, there it is obvious that it is not cumulative even for those who play WoT ... the cumul under the enormous pressure of the jets pushes, forcing the steel to plasticize and leaves a miniature hole (fans of any such thing, take a rest)

            Yes, yes, yes .... Just for this to happen, the cumulative pestle must have time to form at a certain distance from the armor, a little earlier, a little later, and it will not break through the armor, but crumble


            Are they talking about this in the World of Tanks?
        2. svp67
          svp67 3 January 2022 09: 02
          +2
          Quote: Constanty
          In the photo - the trail of a hit (not completed by armor penetration) of a regular armor-piercing projectile, and not a cumulative jet.

          And these?

          1. Constanty
            Constanty 3 January 2022 15: 50
            +2
            He commented on the first photo of a German tank turret - there is no 100% cumulative projectile.
      2. Aerodrome
        Aerodrome 2 January 2022 17: 53
        +4
        Quote: svp67
        Quote: sen
        I read that our tankers often noticed holes from Panzerfaust only after leaving the battle.

        Not holes, but the so-called "Witch Suction", this is when the charge on the armor worked, but did not achieve a penetration ...

        from "forty-five" the trace looks like ...
        1. svp67
          svp67 3 January 2022 09: 03
          0
          Quote: Aerodrome
          from "forty-five" the trace looks like ...

          Why is there a "forty-five", write from the PTRD
        2. Constanty
          Constanty 3 January 2022 15: 52
          +2
          The footprint is too big for a 45mm (comparable to the size of a hand and fingers) - I personally would bet on the 76mm F-34. These guns did not have great penetration, especially with catastrophic quality of shells.
    3. WapentakeLokki
      WapentakeLokki 2 January 2022 13: 51
      +1
      in the book Mindlin Benjamin-The Last Battle - he is the most difficult ... the author himself fought on the IS-2 ... he called such hits `` witch sucking '' ... and, as I remember it is written in his book, often after the battle there was such a picture. .the tank is standing ... the engine is working .. in the armor there is a very small hole from the hit of faust ... and the crew is DEAD ... then the repairmen opened the hatches with their keys .. the crew got out and .. a spare took their place .. something like that ..
      1. Saxahorse
        Saxahorse 2 January 2022 21: 08
        +8
        Fairy tales and "war songs" in memoirs above the roof. Composed as far as fantasy is enough. Penetration with a cumulative jet strikes only those who are directly hit and hit.
        1. WapentakeLokki
          WapentakeLokki 3 January 2022 12: 46
          +1
          well, clear-red ... is it possible to believe the brow who PERSONALLY was inside the IS-2 during the storming of Berlin and with OWN eyes saw how his comrades were DEADLY removed from the tank ... a sharp increase in pressure in a closed room, you are not even a ry ear ... but what aplomb ... that you are veterans, you are probably a WOT veteran yourself ...
          1. Saxahorse
            Saxahorse 3 January 2022 23: 19
            +2
            Quote: WapentakeLokki
            is it possible to believe the brow who PERSONALLY was inside the IS-2 during the storming of Berlin and saw with OWN eyes

            Well that is you are beautiful inside that IS-2 was sitting mean? wassat

            The destructive factors of weapons in the army are taught. For a shaped charge, this is the jet itself with a temperature of 400-600 degrees Celsius and small secondary fragments of punctured armor or equipment pierced by the same jet. There is no significant increase in pressure after penetration. Yes, and it cannot be, there is a hole with a finger the thickness of everything. Teach materiel sofa warrior ..
            1. WapentakeLokki
              WapentakeLokki 4 January 2022 19: 29
              +3
              but you were right .. I went through the book and found that episode .. there is a small hole in the armor and the crew is dead ... struck by a spray of burnt metal .. so call me ... I myself did not shoot from the border at the armor and therefore a mistake came out ...
              1. Saxahorse
                Saxahorse 5 January 2022 20: 40
                +3
                Understood. I also apologize that I answered bluntly.
  2. The comment was deleted.
    1. Split
      Split 2 January 2022 07: 40
      +3
      But what's the difference in NG .... at least something you can read drinks and then finally a beggar what
      1. Toucan
        Toucan 2 January 2022 07: 45
        +13
        Quote: Split
        But what's the difference in NG .... at least something you can read drinks and then finally a beggar what

        This topic has already been chewed and chewed, and the author's style of presentation is such as if he was faced with the task of giving out as much text as possible. Hence a lot of water and repetition.
        Quote: Split
        I don’t remember ... then, it seems, a metal funnel had not yet been placed on shaped charges ... the jet was essentially a concentrated flow of gases from an explosion ... Yes ... no?

        You are mistaken, all anti-tank cumulative ammunition of the VM period used a metal lining of the charge.
        1. Split
          Split 2 January 2022 07: 59
          0
          Thank you colleague for the explanations! fellow Happy New Year! drinks
        2. Vladimir_2U
          Vladimir_2U 2 January 2022 08: 38
          +7
          Quote: Tucan
          You are mistaken, all anti-tank cumulative ammunition of the VM period used a metal lining of the charge.

          Only for the formation of explosives during manufacture and protection from moisture during storage, because 0,5-0,3 mm of ordinary, not even copper, tin did not give anything to armor penetration, for faust cartridges for sure.

          The grenade launcher did not have a rear nozzle or counter-mass, due to which a significant part of the energy of the powder gases was wasted
          First of all, because the grenade was not reactive, it was simply knocked out without further acceleration.
          1. paul3390
            paul3390 2 January 2022 11: 10
            +10
            In general, it's scary to even think about what it would be, if the nemchura had a couple of years of existence and the opportunity to finish experimental samples ... Here you have jet aircraft, anti-aircraft missiles, and grenade launchers, and a bunch of other things .. During we multiplied zero ..
            1. mat-vey
              mat-vey 2 January 2022 12: 00
              +2
              Quote: paul3390
              In general, it's scary to even think about what it would be, if the nemchura had another couple of years of existence and the opportunity to finish the experimental samples ...

              Do you think in the USSR during this time there was nothing to "finish"?
              1. paul3390
                paul3390 2 January 2022 13: 12
                +4
                It was, of course, but it must be admitted that in many areas - nemchura was then ahead of the rest of the planet .. Let's say ballistic missiles, or jet engines - we, alas, were far from them ..

                And tanks - if Aloizievich had time and resources, can you imagine how much of our blood the Tigers and Panthers would shed? If the same Panthers bungled not 5 thousand, but 15 thousand? And even with decent armor?

                I am not talking about jet aircraft at all .. No - on time, very on time, we still pushed them up ..
                1. mat-vey
                  mat-vey 2 January 2022 13: 19
                  +3
                  Quote: paul3390
                  And tanks - if Aloizievich had time and resources,

                  And if the USSR had time, then the KV and T-34 would be brought to mind and re-equipped on them, they would rivet communications equipment, set up the production of anti-tank shells ...
                  yes, they made the same armor more decently ... Well, maybe Cradle would saw its engine up to sawing, and the saddles in the floor were in a laboratory state ...
                  1. paul3390
                    paul3390 2 January 2022 13: 22
                    +3
                    I'm not saying that the USSR had nothing to oppose! And the fact that the Victory, say, in 1947, would have been given to us with significantly more blood ... But the end result would undoubtedly have been the same.

                    Let's say jet engines - a nemchura would be able to bring it to mind in a year or two, just like the FAU .. And we? Very unlikely ..
                    1. mat-vey
                      mat-vey 2 January 2022 13: 34
                      -1
                      Quote: paul3390
                      Let's say jet engines

                      Lyulka had an engine in 1943, but it was crude, and there were no funds and specialists for fine-tuning - the war ...
                      Quote: paul3390
                      like the FAU.

                      And what's the point of this FAU? And on cruise and anti-aircraft missiles in the USSR, all work was curtailed precisely because of the approaching war, resources and specialists were transferred to topics with a faster return ...
                      But what is really there - would have time to establish the production of aluminum and tungsten ... to teach people ... to cope with the army ..
                      1. Shiden
                        Shiden 2 January 2022 16: 05
                        +1
                        Well, to be more precise, at the beginning of the 45th year, the Red Army adopted a 10X cruise missile similar to the FAU1.
                      2. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 16: 12
                        +3
                        Quote: Shiden
                        Well, to be more precise, at the beginning of the 45th year, the Red Army adopted a 10X cruise missile similar to the FAU1.

                        “Despite the satisfactory results, the military remained dissatisfied. On their initiative, at the end of 1948, an inspection of the activities of the pilot plant 51 MAP began in terms of creating projectile aircraft and the expediency of spending on these works. inadequate speed, flight altitude and dispersion 10X, as well as the use of the Pe-8 as a carrier aircraft, and expressed a negative opinion about the development of this projectile in the troops. the launch of the 10X into mass production, so that in the future, using simple materiel, the army could accumulate experience for the transition to more complex technology. moreover, the 10X projectile never entered service with the Red Army.
                      3. Aviator_
                        Aviator_ 2 January 2022 18: 25
                        +3
                        Chelomey never managed to bring the PUVRD to mind on all these projects, including 10X.
                      4. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 18: 30
                        0
                        Quote: Aviator_
                        Chelomey never managed to bring the PUVRD to mind on all these projects, including 10X.

                        So PuVRD seems to be out of fashion at all?
                      5. Aviator_
                        Aviator_ 2 January 2022 18: 37
                        +4
                        Dead-end branch. However, at some recent air show in Zhukovsky, I saw a small target aircraft (meter by meter) produced by Kazan for air defense training. They put in PUVRD and in this ecological niche it turned out well.
                      6. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 18: 39
                        +1
                        Quote: Aviator_
                        However, at some recent air show I saw a small target aircraft (meter by meter) produced by Kazan for air defense training

                        So it seems that he was popular among modelers? For simplicity and cheapness?
                      7. Aviator_
                        Aviator_ 2 January 2022 18: 41
                        +2
                        I don’t know about the modelers, but the model at MAKS was beautiful.
                      8. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 18: 45
                        +1
                        What fell into
                        https://sheba.spb.ru/za/puvrd-avia-1951.htm
                        But I didn't get to the point. recourse , to something else spread ...
                      9. Aviator_
                        Aviator_ 2 January 2022 18: 47
                        +1
                        1951? This is a rarity! But, as far as I know, such models were never included in any sports categories of aircraft models.
                      10. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 18: 51
                        +1
                        Not not .. not mine was ... in the circle (house of pioners) ... All kinds of gliders ... rubber motors ... cord ...
                2. Alf
                  Alf 2 January 2022 17: 39
                  +4
                  Quote: paul3390
                  If the same Panthers bungled not 5 thousand, but 15 thousand? And even with decent armor?

                  Have you heard about the IS-3 and T-44?
                3. Aviator_
                  Aviator_ 2 January 2022 18: 22
                  +5
                  If the same Panthers bungled not 5 thousand, but 15 thousand? And even with decent armor?
                  Decent armor in the Reich ended with the loss of Nikopol. After that, they only tried to get out of the situation with its thickness.
          2. AUL
            AUL 2 January 2022 12: 14
            +5
            That's stacking up enough
            conflicting impression of the article and comments. On the one hand, it is recognized that the Germans opened a new direction in weapons systems, which received further development and turned out to be very promising. On the other hand, there are accusations that the new weapon did not immediately become a wunderwolf, it had flaws. But remember, the first tanks were also far from ice! So the first faust was far from RPG7!
            1. mat-vey
              mat-vey 2 January 2022 12: 30
              +2
              Quote: AUL
              On the one hand, it is recognized that the Germans opened a new direction in weapons systems

              But there is no need to "recognize" what was not - here the United States is ahead of the rest of the planet ...
              1. AUL
                AUL 2 January 2022 14: 14
                +2
                In fact, the Bazooka is a dynamo-reactive cannon, and the primacy of the amers is not in sight here. The first Fausts were also dynamoreactive. And then Offenror and Panzershrek went - they were already purely reactive.
                1. mat-vey
                  mat-vey 2 January 2022 14: 31
                  +3
                  Panzerfaust is a jet dynamo ... The M-1 did not have a jet engine as such - the charge burned out in the launch tube ... but not always ...
                  Quote: AUL
                  And then Offenror and Panzershrek went -

                  After we got acquainted with the "Bazooka" ....
                2. Nikolaevich I
                  Nikolaevich I 2 January 2022 16: 54
                  0
                  Quote: AUL
                  Actually, the Bazooka is a dynamo-reactive cannon,

                  This is not true ! The bazooka is just a "rocket launcher"! ... Learn the "materiel"!
                  1. AUL
                    AUL 2 January 2022 17: 40
                    -1
                    Quote: Nikolaevich I

                    This is not true ! The bazooka is just a "rocket launcher"! ... Learn the "materiel"!
                    On your advice, I learned. And here's what happened:
                    According to the principle of operation, the anti-tank rocket launcher belonged to dynamo-reactive weapons, had a caliber of 60 millimeters and consisted of a smooth-walled steel pipe with a length of 1,37 m open on both sides, an electric ignition device, a safety box with a contact rod, sighting devices and a shoulder rest. The mass of the grenade launcher is 8 kg.

                    The expelling powder charge of the M1 was attached to the grenade, so the grenade moved inside the pipe like a rocket, and after its departure it moved by inertia (the grenade did not have a sustainer rocket engine)... Sometimes not all of the powder charge had time to burn out by the time of departure, which led to burns to the face. (Unlike the M1, the "Faustpatron" expelling charge was attached to the tube, while the "Panzershrek" rocket engine worked all the way to the target).

                    And do you think that this is a rocket weapon, just because the charge is accelerated by the barrel with the help of the RD? But does it fly towards the target by inertia, like a conventional projectile?
                    1. Nikolaevich I
                      Nikolaevich I 2 January 2022 18: 48
                      -1
                      Quote: AUL
                      On your advice, I learned. And here's what happened:

                      What kind of nonsense are you telling me now? belay What is the "source" of this nonsense?
                      ((( Reactive The Bazooka / Bazooka M1 anti-tank grenade launcher was developed in 1942 as a lightweight, mobile and cheap anti-tank weapon to reinforce infantry. When developing a grenade launcher, the goal was initially to create a new, effective means of delivering a cumulative grenade warhead to the target, too heavy for throwing with a hand or using a muzzle (rifle) grenade launcher. The solution to the problem was to use a grenade for throwing solid rocket motor, and as a starting device, a simple steel pipe open at both ends was proposed. The anti-tank missile with a cumulative warhead received the M6 ​​index, and the launcher for it - the M1 index (the full official name is "2.36-inch Anti-Tank Rocket launcher M1"). )))
                      "Bazooka" -reactive grenade launcher, because uses rocket-propelled grenades, i.e. with a solid-propellant rocket engine (!) ... In the forties, they often said: "shoots rockets ..."! The rocket engine of the bazooka projectile "works" when the projectile moves along the "pipe" ... by the time the projectile leaves the "pipe", the engine should already "work out"! Further, the projectile flies by inertia (until the kinetic energy is "used up" ...) Due to the instability of the technological production of ammunition at the initial stage of production, the rocket engine of the ammunition sometimes did not "have time" to "burn out" while it was in the "pipe "(!) ..." burning "lasted for some time after departure ... That's for such a situation and needed" shields "! Don't talk more nonsense! Do not disgrace yourself!
                      1. AUL
                        AUL 2 January 2022 19: 56
                        -3
                        Quote: Nikolaevich I
                        What kind of nonsense are you telling me now? What is the "source" of this nonsense?

                        Could you name the source of your delirium? Or haven't you recovered from yesterday? Nevertheless, be careful with your words, monsieur!
                        My source is wiki. Of course, you may not like him, but he doesn't care! And advice to you:
                        Don't talk more nonsense! Do not disgrace yourself! laughing
                      2. Undecim
                        Undecim 2 January 2022 21: 21
                        +5
                        My source is wiki.

                        What is the source, such is the knowledge. That is, none.
                        Dynamo-rocket systems are systems that use a barrel to throw rockets. In these systems, the muzzle velocity is imparted to the projectile both due to active action, i.e., by creating an increased pressure in the projectile volume of the barrel bore, and due to reactive action, i.e., due to the presence of a reactive force created by combustion products escaping from the engine chamber.
                        That is, both the Panzerfaust and the bazooka are dynamo-reactive.

                        This is a bazooka rocket device. It is a rocket with a jet engine burning within the launch tube.
                      3. AUL
                        AUL 2 January 2022 21: 31
                        -1
                        Quote: Undecim
                        That is, both the Panzerfaust and the bazooka are dynamo-reactive.

                        Have you read what I claimed? Exactly what you are now convincing me of! But here
                        Nikolaevich I (Vladimir) is sure that
                        This is not true ! The bazooka is just a "rocket launcher"! ... Learn the "materiel"!
                        I'm not going to support the discussion with him, because when the interlocutor begins to be rude, he becomes uninteresting to me!
                      4. Undecim
                        Undecim 2 January 2022 22: 22
                        +3
                        Exactly what you are convincing me now!

                        Yeah, sorry, I was misinformed by the link to wikipedia. I do not consider this source, your will, as a source.
                      5. AUL
                        AUL 2 January 2022 23: 08
                        -1
                        IMHO, such an attitude towards Vicki has just become fashionable now. Yes, she is far from without sin, but point me to a sinless source of information! Each has an element of either personal interest, or political order, or age-related sclerosis, or banal incompetence. Fichtengolts alone is infallible! laughing
                      6. Undecim
                        Undecim 2 January 2022 23: 15
                        +4
                        Fichtengolts alone is infallible!

                        Feynman too.
                        but point me to a sinless source of information

                        You yourself pointed to the textbooks. I used the textbook Theory and Design of Rocket Engines. Of course, there is no complete guarantee of reliability, but a wiki is more reliable.
                      7. Nikolaevich I
                        Nikolaevich I 2 January 2022 22: 58
                        0
                        Quote: Undecim
                        My source is wiki.

                        What is the source, such is the knowledge. That is, none.
                        Dynamo-rocket systems are systems that use a barrel to throw rockets. In these systems, the muzzle velocity is imparted to the projectile both due to active action, i.e., by creating an increased pressure in the projectile volume of the barrel bore, and due to reactive action, i.e., due to the presence of a reactive force created by combustion products escaping from the engine chamber.
                        That is, both the Panzerfaust and the bazooka are dynamo-reactive.

                        This is a bazooka rocket device. It is a rocket with a jet engine burning within the launch tube.

                        By and large, this is so! So to say, in a "generalized sense"! But historically there was a certain difference in the designation of grenade launchers, designed to launch "rockets" (rocket-propelled grenades) and recoilless grenade launchers! The first received the name "rocket-propelled grenade launchers" or RPG (anti-tank rocket launchers ... grenades, if single use!) In RPGs, the "throwing" of ammunition (projectile, grenade) is carried out by a rocket engine that "works" for a certain time and accelerates the projectile during movement thereof along the "trunk" (PU, "pipe" ...)! With solid propellants with insufficient "burning" speed (outflow of powder gases ...), the grenade launchers had to be made "long-barreled"! ("Bazooka", "Panzershrek", RPG-29 "Vampire" ... RPG-18 Fly with a "telescopic ,, barrel") When improving the solid propellant rocket, it was possible to "shorten" the ,, trunks ,, (RPG-22, RPG- 26, RPG-27, RPG-32 ...) Solid propellants of rocket-propelled grenades are designed so that the operation of the engines ends by the time the grenades leave the "barrel" ...
                        The recoilless guns that appeared and became widespread in the 40-50s of the last century received from the military the definition of “guns with a dynamo-reactive principle” or “dynamo-reactive cannons” (DPR Kurchevsky ... 30s.) In these guns (and grenade launchers of the same principle), the projectile was thrown mainly due to the combustion of the propelling powder charge, as in the "classic" guns, but the outflow of powder gases from the breech of the gun through the nozzle "removed" or reduced the recoil when fired. And this propellant charge was required 3-4 times more than with a "normal" shot ... The military often could not afford this; that is why the "range" of firing from recoilless guns was less than that of "classic" guns! To increase the range, it was necessary to introduce active-rocket-propelled grenades, where the solid propellant was triggered after the release of the grenade from the "trunk" (RPG-7) ... In general, RPG-2 and RPG-7 ... "Karl Gustav" ... according to the principle actions do not differ from 82-mm and 107-mm recoilless guns B-10 and B-11 ... But no one called B-10, B-11 "rocket weapons", except, sometimes, "dynamo-rocket guns "... But also no one called rocket-propelled grenade launchers (grenades), for example, RPG-27, RPG-29" dynamo-rocket launchers "! As well as the RPG-7 "rocket-propelled grenade launcher"! For RPG-2, RPG-7> these are "hand-held anti-tank grenade launchers", as well as SPG-82, SPG-9> "anti-tank grenade launchers"! I stood on that and am going to stand! And therefore, do not fool me!
                        PS You can find fault with my presentation; but I present it in a simplified way, omitting the "nuances" ... Still, this is an answer, not a "whole" article!
                      8. Undecim
                        Undecim 2 January 2022 23: 08
                        +4
                        You know, in such cases, in order not to start a lengthy discussion, I tend to use some special edition, for example, the Military Encyclopedia of 1994, volume 2, pp. 494-495.
                      9. Nikolaevich I
                        Nikolaevich I 3 January 2022 07: 17
                        +1
                        Quote: Undecim
                        so as not to start a lengthy discussion

                        Perhaps you are right ... is it worth starting a "lengthy discussion" because of the article about "wonder weapons with low performance"? As for the encyclopedias ... Even in the "Great Soviet Encyclopedia" there were mistakes ...! I also ask you to excuse me for some "harshness" at the end of my previous answer, tk. by the end of the answer, I already forgot who I was answering ... repeat (starting from Monday I stop "celebrating" ... starting a "new life"! yes )
                      10. Undecim
                        Undecim 3 January 2022 10: 55
                        +5
                        (starting from Monday I stop "celebrating" ... starting a "new life"!

                        So Christmas is coming soon! Maybe not interrupted so as not to lose shape?
                      11. Nikolaevich I
                        Nikolaevich I 3 January 2022 11: 57
                        +1
                        Quote: Undecim
                        So Christmas is coming soon! Maybe not interrupted so as not to lose shape?

                        Interesting offer ! I think about it myself! After all, not only Christmas is coming, but also my birthday! One thing only worries ... will my "vinbar" be enough for this period? After all, there are such copies (!) ... collected all year ... with a break for tasting! recourse
              2. Aerodrome
                Aerodrome 2 January 2022 17: 49
                -5
                USA is a bunch of swindlers, and nothing of their own has ever happened.
          3. English tarantas
            English tarantas 2 January 2022 12: 50
            +2
            First of all, because the grenade was not reactive, it was simply knocked out without further acceleration.

            If I'm not mistaken, the counter-mass and nozzles are used to eliminate rollback, or rather to create an equal and uniform balance of multidirectional forces, the nozzle so that the grenade launcher does not vomit forward, the counter-mass so as not to vomit back.
            1. Vladimir_2U
              Vladimir_2U 2 January 2022 13: 43
              +1
              Quote: English tarantass
              nozzle so that the grenade launcher does not vomit forward, protivomass so as not to vomit back.

              About the nozzle is strictly the opposite, it is this that provides recoillessness, or rather the outflow of gases through it, but counter-mass in grenade launchers is rarely used to reduce or eliminate the action of reactive gases behind the grenade launcher.
              1. English tarantas
                English tarantas 2 January 2022 17: 01
                +1
                It seems like it happens that the counter-mass flies back, in general, the only grenade launcher that I can definitely remember uses the counter-mass so that there is no stream of fire, but again, this is a counterweight instead of a grenade, so that when the nozzle is closed behind, the counter-mass pushes the launcher forward, in general, both it is true at the same time.
                And definitely not about the nozzle. It allows gases not to burst out abruptly. There it turns out if you make a straight pipe instead of a nozzle, then a lot of pressure will persist longer than if part of the pipe was a nozzle, which means that the pipe would be pushed forward, if the nozzle was simply removed, thereby shortening the grenade launcher, then there would be a rollback, since time flows which should remain the counteraction of the inertia of the grenade less than it should be (provided that we change only what I indicated). In rifles, the stems were used to reduce the pressure on the edge of the barrel, and to blur the recoil, so that the gases escaped not abruptly, but gradually, and the recoil was softer, the gun pulled less to the side. As far as I know, I believe that the principle is the same in grenade launchers.
          4. Castro Ruiz
            Castro Ruiz 3 January 2022 00: 18
            +2
            The Panzerrohr was already hitting the jet.
  3. Split
    Split 2 January 2022 07: 38
    0
    I don’t remember ... then, it seems, a metal funnel had not yet been placed on shaped charges ... the jet was essentially a concentrated flow of gases from an explosion ... Yes ... no? what and only later, after the 2nd, metal funnels appeared and the cumulative jet was formed precisely by the jet of the flowing metal from the pressure of the gases from the explosion
    1. Evil troll
      Evil troll 2 January 2022 08: 39
      +3
      The gas jet during the explosion is the experiments of the Soviet physicist Sukharevsky in the mid-twenties. His theoretical calculations on directed explosions were useful in construction, but no one could even think about tank shells then. The work was naively published in print ... And the Germans in 1938 already had a cumulative projectile with a metal funnel.
      1. Split
        Split 2 January 2022 08: 59
        0
        Thank you colleague good , I was already briefly explained above, and I myself have googled a little on the topic now lol
      2. Aviator_
        Aviator_ 2 January 2022 09: 09
        +4
        The cumulative effect itself was discovered purely empirically at the end of the XNUMXth century, and since that time there have been attempts at its military use, of course, not for armored vehicles, which were practically absent. And the effectiveness of this then non-optimal scheme was low.
      3. Bolt cutter
        Bolt cutter 2 January 2022 12: 25
        +6
        experiments of the Soviet physicist Sukharevsky
        Max von Foerster, who served as a lieutenant at Westfälischen Pionier-Bataillon Nr. 7, and later became the director of the Wolff & Co explosives factory, in 1883 published his work on focusing the energy of an explosion using what was then called the "void effect" - the Hohlraum effect.
        1. Catfish
          Catfish 2 January 2022 14: 27
          +6
          Alex, hello! hi

          And in the USSR there was the development of the "Rocket Rifle" designed by B.S. Petropavlovsky, in 1931 he made one of the world's first grenade launchers. It's a pity that the designer died unexpectedly, and his followers, coupled with high bosses, ruined a good idea.



          A ready-made sample of this "gun" for testing.
          1. Bolt cutter
            Bolt cutter 2 January 2022 14: 37
            +2
            Good day! In the USSR, a lot has been developed. But the very idea of ​​a rocket launcher then, as they say, was already in the air.
            1. mat-vey
              mat-vey 2 January 2022 14: 48
              +1
              Quote: Bolt Cutter
              ... But the very idea of ​​a rocket launcher then, as they say, was already in the air.

              Dynamo rocket cannons Kurchevsky back in the early 30s "dabbled" (and dabbled before) ... But RDX in the USSR in marketable quantities was not a solved problem for the chemical industry of the USSR, and without it you cannot make a cumulative charge (50 to 50 RDX with TNT)
              1. Shiden
                Shiden 2 January 2022 16: 09
                +1
                And yet you are right, as Comrade Stalin said about this: "They spilled out the baby with dirty water"
            2. Catfish
              Catfish 2 January 2022 15: 20
              -1
              And the Germans were the first to implement it.
              1. Bolt cutter
                Bolt cutter 2 January 2022 15: 25
                +6
                Bazooka appeared on the battlefield a year earlier. (42 years old) It was by improving it that the Germans received the Panzerschreck.
                1. Catfish
                  Catfish 2 January 2022 15: 34
                  +3
                  The British PIAT anti-tank grenade launcher was adopted in 1942.


                  But, somehow, neither he nor Bazooka found such fame as the German Faustpatron.
                  1. Bolt cutter
                    Bolt cutter 2 January 2022 15: 37
                    +8
                    PIAT
                    It is spring loaded, not reactive. The spring was manually cocked. A sort of anti-tank slingshot. The calculation (2e) included the loader, but it was a little tough with blacks then in England, so this wonderweapon did not show itself properly laughing
                    According to the recollections of those who applied, recoil like a horse's hoof sad
                    1. Catfish
                      Catfish 2 January 2022 15: 49
                      +7
                      A sort of anti-tank slingshot.


                      Precise definition. laughing
                      1. Alf
                        Alf 2 January 2022 17: 41
                        +5
                        Quote: Sea Cat
                        A sort of anti-tank slingshot.


                        Precise definition. laughing

                        More precisely, an anti-tank crossbow. Great !
                    2. mat-vey
                      mat-vey 2 January 2022 16: 15
                      +1
                      Quote: Bolt Cutter
                      It is spring loaded, not reactive.

                      "The design of the weapon is relatively simple. It is a pipe with a diameter of 76 mm. And a length of 610 mm. A tray for installing a rocket-propelled grenade is welded to the front of the pipe, and a T-shaped shoulder rest is attached to the rear. The charge ignited after breaking the primer throws the grenade forward and at the same time returns the bolt-striker to its original position, putting it on a combat platoon.Thus, PIAT can be attributed to a semi-automatic weapon. its complete descent from the tray, a jet of hot gases (unmasking trail) was not formed behind the gun, which made it possible to fire from cover. "
                      1. Bolt cutter
                        Bolt cutter 2 January 2022 16: 32
                        +2
                        By design, it was a mortar with an over-caliber mine, which fundamentally differed from the aforementioned Bazooka and Panzerfaust. (I also read Wikipedia yes ).
                      2. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 16: 42
                        +1
                        Quote: Bolt Cutter
                        By design, it was a mortar with an over-caliber mine, which fundamentally differed from the aforementioned Bazooka and Panzerfaust. (I also read Wikipedia yes ).

                        I don't know what's in Wikipedia, but there is a knockout charge ... 2,7 g of nitrocellulose gunpowder ... so it's not at all a "slingshot"
                      3. Bolt cutter
                        Bolt cutter 2 January 2022 16: 44
                        +1
                        I don't know what's on Wikipedia, but
                        So you are from the design-development team wassat ?
                      4. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 16: 46
                        0
                        Quote: Bolt Cutter
                        I don't know what's on Wikipedia, but
                        So you are from the design-development team wassat ?

                        I have the same internet laughing
                      5. Bolt cutter
                        Bolt cutter 2 January 2022 16: 51
                        +1
                        I remembered your "wise" argument on the topic of coconut and palm oil and the key differences between them
                        coconut - palm
                        wassat
                      6. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 17: 01
                        0
                        Quote: Bolt Cutter
                        coconut - palm

                        Well, botanists thought so all the time ...
        2. Nikolaevich I
          Nikolaevich I 2 January 2022 17: 12
          +1
          In 1864. Russian military engineer Boreskov in practice showed a strong destructive effect of mines with a cumulative recess in sapper work ... In 1865, a detonator capsule with a conical cumulative recess appeared, which has an increased initiating ability ... But in fact, there are "reports" of the military engineers, sappers, noticing the peculiarities of explosions of charges with grooves, which later received the name "cumulative", already from the 18th century!
    2. bk0010
      bk0010 2 January 2022 11: 54
      0
      Quote: Split
      I don’t remember ... then, it seems, a metal funnel had not yet been placed on shaped charges ... the jet was essentially a concentrated flow of gases from an explosion ... Yes ... no?
      The USSR did not understand the physics of shaped charge destruction. To increase the armor penetration, they tried to increase the temperature of the jet. The temperature rose, but the armor penetration did not. As with physics we figured out, so we have a "chip flooded".
      1. Aviator_
        Aviator_ 2 January 2022 18: 33
        +4
        The USSR did not understand the physics of shaped charge destruction.

        They did not understand anywhere until Academician Lavrentyev, with the help of the TFKP, proved that the effect there was not "burning through", but of pushing through the armor. In terms of time, it seems, the middle of the 40s, I don’t know more precisely.
        1. bk0010
          bk0010 2 January 2022 19: 40
          +1
          Quite possibly, I only read about ours. But what has the TFKP (if this is the theory of functions of a complex variable) I did not understand, when I went through it, they did not say a word about the description of cumulative effects.
          1. Aviator_
            Aviator_ 2 January 2022 19: 49
            +4
            It was the theory of functions of a complex variable that helped to understand the effect of cumulation. There are many applications of the TFKP, from wing theory (where linear-fractional functions were used for conformal mapping) to residue theory, with the help of which integrals are taken. Not everything is included in a specific curriculum, especially since the history of the development of science is usually saved in the curriculum, and this reduces the interest of students. But how can you tell the sleeping studiosus that Gauss and Cauchy, to put it mildly, could not stand each other, then their sleep disappears for a while (according to the testimony of Academician A.N. Krylov, Gauss said that Cauchy was sick with mathematical diarrhea, and Cauchy replied that Gauss had a mathematical constipation). Cauchy in his works did indeed sometimes have many mistakes.
  4. Kozak Za Bugra
    Kozak Za Bugra 2 January 2022 07: 54
    +6
    At the word "panzerfaust" I remember a Red Army soldier who scored a dozen Germans in hand-to-hand combat with panzerfaust.
    1. Cowbra
      Cowbra 2 January 2022 08: 31
      +2
      Moreover, he was a Jew, so mockery is squared - a Jew scored 10 fascist clubs with a fascist club like pigs)))) Tobish is subhuman, tfu, nonhuman
    2. Alex013
      Alex013 2 January 2022 11: 52
      +7
      Vasily Vataman, they wrote that he sent 14 fascists to the next world with panzerfaust)
      1. Alex013
        Alex013 2 January 2022 11: 55
        +4
        I was a little wrong. From 8 to 13. Happy New Year everyone!!!
  5. Bongo
    Bongo 2 January 2022 08: 05
    +25
    Panzerfaust grenade launchers. "Miracle weapon" with low characteristics

    Of course, the Panzerfaust were not a "miracle weapon", but they looked much more dignified against the background of manually thrown anti-tank grenades.
    The article itself is overblown, contains ambiguous conclusions and wording.
    1. Split
      Split 2 January 2022 08: 48
      +2
      My colleague agrees, tk. throwing a grenade at 30-40 meters .... and the ligaments are generally not realistic - you still need to be able and have physical training (I found it at school in the Soviet time, it was a mandatory exercise). .. and at the end of the war they were given them to Hitler's opponents .... there was no question of the effectiveness of the speech negative so there wasn’t much of a difference ... the fausts, in fact, were effective only in urban combat - this is evidenced by the statistics of losses of our equipment - when urban battles had already become the main ones
      1. Bongo
        Bongo 2 January 2022 08: 54
        +9
        Quote: Split
        My colleague agrees, tk. throwing a grenade at 30-40 meters .... and the ligaments are generally not realistic - you still need to be able and have physical training (I found it at school in the Soviet time, it was a mandatory exercise). .. and at the end of the war they were given them to Hitler's opponents .... there was no question of the effectiveness of the speech negative so there wasn’t much of a difference ... the fausts, in fact, were effective only in urban combat - this is evidenced by the statistics of losses of our equipment - when urban battles had already become the main ones

        Forgive me, so as not to be unfounded, it won't be difficult for you to present the statistics of the Panzerfaust efficiency in relation to German cumulative anti-tank grenades, in the field and during urban battles?
        1. Split
          Split 2 January 2022 09: 07
          -2
          Forgive me too, but it will make it difficult ... of course I could be mistaken, correct if it doesn't make it difficult ... such grenades should have been put on the tank itself ... I just can't imagine a grenade ... it's like a knife weighing throw half a kilo with a sharp point at a target at a distance of several tens of meters belay
          1. Bongo
            Bongo 2 January 2022 09: 20
            +7
            Quote: Split
            I'm sorry too, but it will make it difficult ...

            Anatoly, and I about the same. yes If there is no confirmed data, then similar statements:
            Quote: Split
            ... there was no talk of efficiency, so there wasn’t much of a difference ...

            Not worth doing. No.
            1. Split
              Split 2 January 2022 09: 47
              -1
              Colleague drinks wassat
              I just remember there was an article on VO, it was already written above that the topic was well-worn and that it was in urban battles that there were maximum losses from the Fausts ... what am I getting at ... The training of troops at 45 was no longer the same ... those there were almost no soldiers who passed through Europe in 39-40, the share of the "militia" was growing .... well, I can't imagine how to learn the ballistics of Faust in a couple of shots .... 80m / s is the speed of an ordinary arrow from a bow .. .. but since it's difficult to shoot from it (usually I mean, not blocky) ... I can't imagine how you can even hit a tank with such sights of that time even from hundreds of meters
              1. Bormanxnumx
                Bormanxnumx 2 January 2022 12: 40
                +3
                [
                80m / s is the speed of a normal bow arrow.

                An ordinary bow has an arrow speed of 50-60m / s, and children 10-12 years old after a couple of trainings begin to hit the meter board set at 18m. But this is all lyrics, since archery and arrow ballistics have nothing to do with a shot from a faustpatron.
                1. Split
                  Split 2 January 2022 12: 58
                  -1
                  Gravity has not yet been canceled, the grenade has even greater resistance to the air flow than the arrow ... and, accordingly, the lowering of the trajectory is significant ... the only question is how long the powder engine worked to ensure a more or less direct flight of the grenade (well, or mines as it was called)
                  1. mat-vey
                    mat-vey 2 January 2022 13: 38
                    +3
                    Quote: Split
                    the only question is how long the powder engine has been running

                    Where does the Panzerfaust have a powder engine? There is an expelling charge - from here and problems with the range ..
                    1. Split
                      Split 2 January 2022 14: 06
                      -1
                      To be honest, I was not aware of the propulsion system .... but then the topic of arrows also becomes relevant .... how to get from hundreds of meters with such ballistics?
                      ZY I didn't notice the post about the dynamo propulsion ... I didn't even have to shoot with an RPG ... in this my knowledge is minimal
                      1. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 14: 19
                        +4
                        Quote: Split
                        I didn't even have to shoot with an RPG

                        The fact of the matter is that the RPG-7 is a completely "different machine" ... it has a minimum expelling charge - set the initial speed of the grenade, and then the grenade engine starts ... Hence such a significant difference in the firing range ...
                      2. Split
                        Split 2 January 2022 14: 37
                        0
                        I am aware of this, colleague! Yes, it's enough to see that large-caliber commotion, there was a vidos with an RPG ... it is very noticeable that the grenade first flies out and then the engine is triggered and accelerates sharply, especially in slow-motion shooting noticeably
                      3. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 14: 43
                        +1
                        So this is what is fundamentally, but the whole world dabbled with dynamo rocket cannons in the 30s, including the USSR ...
                      4. Split
                        Split 2 January 2022 14: 52
                        +1
                        Yes, especially Tukhachevsky indulged in belay
                      5. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 14: 53
                        +1
                        Quote: Split
                        Yes, especially Tukhachevsky indulged in belay

                        So it was he who pushed where necessary and not necessary "Kurchevsky's dynamo-jet cannons"
                      6. Split
                        Split 2 January 2022 15: 00
                        0
                        So I'm talking about the fact that he tried to break through until the age of 37 emnip repeat
                      7. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 15: 04
                        +3
                        Quote: Split
                        So I'm talking about the fact that he tried to break through until the age of 37 emnip repeat

                        And I almost ditched the cannon artillery ... I had to catch up in emergency mode in wartime before wartime ...
                      8. Split
                        Split 2 January 2022 15: 45
                        +3
                        As well as the passion in the future with missiles, which again almost killed the artillery .... My grandfather was at first an artilleryman .... then for his skills - a sniper ... after being wounded - a radio operator (already with Japan). He went through the whole war (born 24)
                      9. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 2 January 2022 16: 21
                        +3
                        Quote: Split
                        As well as the passion in the future with missiles, which again almost killed the artillery .... My grandfather was at first an artilleryman .... then for his skills - a sniper ... after being wounded - a radio operator (already with Japan). He went through the whole war (born 24)

                        And I had one at the beginning of the war as a tanker, and then hit the artillery - a breakthrough division from B-4 ... hand ... but retrained to be left-handed wink
                      10. ycuce234-san
                        ycuce234-san 3 January 2022 19: 31
                        0
                        Quote: mat-vey
                        But the second one from the connection after a serious injury, you will not believe in sappers !!! Being almost without fingers on his right hand ... But he retrained to be left-handed


                        Then the way of thinking itself did not include the long familiar to us - the ability to fully control a very complex technique with physical limitations.
                        Now the wheelchair operator driving the car does not look unusual.
                        Therefore, special "kit-kits" were not mass-produced for re-equipping the controls of mobile equipment, machine tools, dispatching consoles, and the equipment was not initially adapted for this. Specialized sets of hand tools were not produced.
                        Although, for example, the use of such devices would allow these experienced soldiers to be military drivers and repairmen - for example, tank welders, who were in great shortage on the front lines.
                      11. Split
                        Split 2 January 2022 14: 52
                        0
                        Yes, especially Tukhachevsky indulged in belay
                  2. The comment was deleted.
                2. Split
                  Split 2 January 2022 13: 01
                  0
                  Yes, I was a little mistaken, only the block type has such speeds of about 80 m / s
                  But to be honest, while shooting from this I experienced no less pleasure than from a firearm ...
                  Unique piece of engineering! good
      2. Denimax
        Denimax 2 January 2022 15: 46
        0
        A bunch of grenades, it looks more like a throwing mine. It must be thrown in front of the tank in such a way that the delayed action fuse would go off under the bottom of the tank. On early tanks, the bottom was 5-6 mm thick, it had to break through. IMHO
        1. mat-vey
          mat-vey 2 January 2022 16: 23
          0
          Quote: Denimax
          On early tanks, the bottom was 5-6 mm thick, it had to break through. IMHO

          And don't forget about the caterpillars ...
          1. Denimax
            Denimax 2 January 2022 19: 50
            -2
            Against caterpillars, although it is considered a well-known purpose. But I have great doubts, too much should rest on luck to be able to talk about any effectiveness of the weapon.
    2. The leader of the Redskins
      The leader of the Redskins 2 January 2022 09: 43
      +2
      While still a student, I read a fiction book (although there was a postscript that was based on historical material), as if a Soviet material engineer was involved in the creation of the "faustpatron", who was taken out of the occupied territory. The problem was the tube launcher. For the declared strength, it came out either heavy or expensive, depending on the alloys used. Under pressure and threats, the engineer coped with the task. Later, he transferred his developments to the Soviet side through agents that came to him during the war.
      PS Grandfather, Pyotr Ivanovich, in 1945 jammed fish from "Faust" on the Oder. With a smile, he recalled how carps with their bodies and water soared to a ten-meter height!))) laughing
  6. Old electrician
    Old electrician 2 January 2022 08: 08
    +11
    Once at the "Polyana" over a glass of tea the people got into a conversation, and our relaxed political officer told about the combat everyday life of the military-political school in his cadet years.
    Live fire from RPG-7 is in progress. Shooting from a prone position. One cadet calls up the firing officer and asks
    - Why can't you shoot ?! What's wrong with the grenade launcher ?!
    This picture is a must see! He rested the end of the RPG-7 pipe on his shoulder like a butt, but this woodpecker's hand did not reach the pistol grip.
    - Really! Impossible to shoot!
    The firing leader silently took the grenade launcher from him. From a standing position, I swung at the target, and then also silently like "tra-la-la" across his back with an RPG-7 pipe ...
    1. Nexcom
      Nexcom 2 January 2022 09: 23
      +4
      Your chief of firing was cruel. PU from seven is heavy.

      PS in our training one "Caucasian" with a loaded grenade, holding his finger on the trigger, mechanically turned with a grenade launcher on his shoulder towards an officer who was standing at a distance, who was swinging something to him - the officer went to bed so briskly right away. and while lying down he pointed with his hand - like turn to the side, to the side.
      when he turned aside, the officer ordered to defuse the seven and how he swore ..... "the sky was hot" (c). Well, of course, he gave this "arrow" for this.
      1. mr.ZinGer
        mr.ZinGer 2 January 2022 10: 21
        +2
        A similar case happened with my brother, he taught the "Partisans" in the course "Shot".
        1. Nexcom
          Nexcom 2 January 2022 10: 34
          +1
          in our case, we were conscripts for training.
      2. Alf
        Alf 2 January 2022 17: 45
        +1
        Quote: Nexcom
        Your head of shooting was cruel

        Well, what if the words do not reach?
        1. Nexcom
          Nexcom 2 January 2022 18: 12
          0
          The question is eternal and somewhat philosophical. I am at a loss to answer.
          1. Alf
            Alf 2 January 2022 18: 19
            +1
            Quote: Nexcom
            The question is eternal and somewhat philosophical. I am at a loss to answer.

            To such a question there is a simple answer - It does not reach through the head, it will come through the ass.
  7. Nikolaevich I
    Nikolaevich I 2 January 2022 08: 17
    +12
    It repeats all the time: "rocket-propelled grenade launchers" .... But the "panzerfaust" were not like that ... they were "dynamo-reactive" grenade launchers! That is, the "closest relatives" of the so-called recoilless guns! But "Ofenror", "Panzershrek" is yes ... rocket-propelled grenade launchers!
    1. Nikolaevich I
      Nikolaevich I 2 January 2022 09: 04
      +7
      There is a story that grenades of "faustpatrones" (or, as they were often called then, mines ...) in the Red Army were also adapted for firing from Mosin rifles! At first I did not believe it, but this video stubbornly "proves"!
      1. Split
        Split 2 January 2022 09: 26
        0
        Russian ingenuity has always decided good drinks gygy
  8. mr.ZinGer
    mr.ZinGer 2 January 2022 08: 43
    +1
    [/ i] So, in April, the front armored vehicles completed 20378 tank codes (the sum of days of combat operation of all vehicles). Damage received 3781 units. equipment, of which 911 had to be written off [i]
    And there are figures for other operations for comparison.
  9. Avior
    Avior 2 January 2022 09: 18
    +4
    ... the first rocket-propelled anti-tank grenade launchers of the Panzerfaust series

    I will correct the author - Panzerfaust are not reactive, as he writes several times. They had a propellant charge, not a jet engine in a grenade. And this is their fundamental nuance, which does not allow to significantly increase the range of the shot.
  10. viktortarianik
    viktortarianik 2 January 2022 09: 22
    +4
    And yet, with all the flaws inherent in the new weapon, "Panzerfaust" has become a more progressive weapon in comparison with the grenade. My father, who fought the entire war in tanks, said that especially in cities, they were very afraid of this new item.
  11. Amateur
    Amateur 2 January 2022 09: 29
    +12
    One paragraph - Panzerfaust is a good pt-weapon.
    The next paragraph is bad
    The next one is good.
    Etc. The author was still undecided.
    What is 30 meters at the PF of the first issues against a half-liter with a Molotov cocktail in the Red Army at the same time. So, complete nonsense.
    A powerful enemy must be treated with respect. The more significant is the victory of the Soviet soldiers over the German-European bastard
    1. bk0010
      bk0010 2 January 2022 11: 57
      +4
      Quote: Amateur
      One paragraph - Panzerfaust is a good pt-weapon.
      The next paragraph is bad
      The next one is good.
      Everything is relative. Panzerfaust is much worse than a normal AT cannon and much better than a bunch of grenades.
    2. Saxahorse
      Saxahorse 2 January 2022 21: 14
      -1
      Quote: Amateur
      What is 30 meters at the PF of the first issues against a half-liter with a Molotov cocktail in the Red Army at the same time. So, complete nonsense.

      This is .. I understand that the New Year, but half a liter against a tank is not the same as in a sauna on NG. Compare 500 mg of fuel with cumulative ammunition in terms of effectiveness .. To put it mildly, you are wrong. wassat
      1. Amateur
        Amateur 2 January 2022 21: 56
        0
        Didn't you know that until 1944, in addition to anti-tank grenades, the soldiers of the Red Army were armed with Molotov cocktails
        https://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9A%D0%A1_(%D0%B7%D0%B0%D0%B6%D0%B8%D0%B3%D0%B0%D1%82%D0%B5%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%BD%D0%B0%D1%8F_%D0%B6%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%BA%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%82%D1%8C)
        1. Saxahorse
          Saxahorse 3 January 2022 00: 14
          0
          No, I didn't know. The article you cited indicates that the ampulomet was removed from service in 1942. laughing

          Although napalm was used in aviation for a long time and successfully. However, there is not a word about the effectiveness of napalm against armored vehicles, and even more so about the superiority of the KS over cumulative warheads, all the more there is nothing.
  12. alexandr_vd
    alexandr_vd 2 January 2022 11: 37
    +1
    I was shooting at the training camp from the 2nd and the XNUMXth.
    The deuce is simpler and more reliable. But the range is shorter
    You need to train more on the seven. And still, the consumption of grenades over long distances is greater ...
  13. Knell wardenheart
    Knell wardenheart 2 January 2022 12: 12
    +4
    Quite a good weapon for a complex of means, the Germans hardly expected that each concript would turn into a tanker's nightmare. They needed a means of increasing defensive stamina - and here it is, + 3% + 7%, quite a bonus to defense. There were no special technological bells and whistles in the PF, the chemical industry was already idle due to the knocking out of the fleet and bomber aircraft - from the point of view of the resources allocated for this, the fat could justify itself. The Germans realized at the end of 1943 that the era of their offensive had sunk into oblivion, they would have to defend themselves, and the tool turned out to be quite at the level.
  14. Constanty
    Constanty 2 January 2022 12: 15
    +9
    They did not copy or develop the German grenade launchers, which again confirmed their low potential.


    This is at least an exaggeration - like the entire article, written with an assumption made in advance.

    After the war, the Panzerfaust was copied, for example, in Poland, where 5000 Pc-100s were hardly produced - a copy of the Panzerfaust 100.

    In the USSR, the development of the RPG-1 and RPG-2 is largely a development of the Panzerfaust 150 ....

    And one more remark - despite the low parameters, as a soldier, I would rather fight with Panzerfaustom tanks than

    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 2 January 2022 12: 41
      +2
      The first technical requirements for the development of a hand-held large-caliber anti-tank rocket launcher in the Main Artillery Directorate (GAU) appeared on December 11, 1942.
      1. Constanty
        Constanty 2 January 2022 12: 59
        +2
        The work on RPGs in the USSR was resumed only in 1944. Work was carried out on the development of a reusable hand grenade launcher with an over-caliber grenade. However, the beginning of serial production of RPGs required the solution of a number of design and technological problems and considerable investments, which was especially difficult in wartime.

        In 1944-45, field tests of the grenade launcher were carried out, which after that received the official name "RPG-1 hand-held anti-tank grenade launcher", and the grenade - PG-1. Preparations for serial production and production of pilot batches of grenade launchers and grenades began. Work on the RPG-1 continued until 1948 (the finalization of the grenade was delayed), but it was not possible to finalize it, and it was not accepted into service.

        http://army.armor.kiev.ua/hist/rpg.shtml
        1. mat-vey
          mat-vey 2 January 2022 13: 13
          -2
          Well, how did option "A" differ from option "B"? And in general, if two different options were "copied" to the fig ... and why experiment with the shape and technology of the funnel, and the same with the charge ...
          And they were familiar with dynamo-jet "guns" even before the war ...
          There were problems with the production of hexogen, but without it, at least copy, at least design, there will still be nothing to make ...
  15. English tarantas
    English tarantas 2 January 2022 12: 38
    +6
    Great hopes were pinned on such weapons, but on the whole they did not justify them. According to both German and foreign estimates, the overall effectiveness of the grenade launchers was significantly lower than other anti-tank weapons.

    German rocket-propelled grenade launchers immediately interested the Red Army. At the top, discussions began on the need to develop and produce their own weapons of this class, and at the front they tried to get captured samples and use them against the former owners.

    Everything you need to know about the author.
    Kirill, of course, Panzerfaust is not a Pak40 and not a howitzer and not a thing, but let's compare him with his classmates, and it seems to me that Panzerfaust is clearly better than PKG, Molotov II ... and everything than hitting a tank that flies over your head, how to stop a tank on a narrow street?
    If we take into account the specifics of such statistics and the peculiarities of accounting for other people's losses, then the real results could be even lower

    The funny thing is that the pantsefaust hit is visible, usually several people see it and the results of the hit are visible, so most likely most of the applications of the faust patrons are true, at least the very fact of the defeat is for sure, and whether the tank that was taken away (if taken away) to the rear could be repaired or not, no one knows anymore. But the guys from the assault aviation, tankmen, anti-tankmen just loved to lie, only yesterday I watched Sdvizhkov's lecture about the battles for Gorshechnoye, almost a division was destroyed by railroad transport and stories, but in fact two second grooves.
  16. Undecim
    Undecim 2 January 2022 14: 25
    +3
    I have never understood the meaning of writing such articles that do not carry any informational load.
    He dreamed of how a new "spit" would finally dirtiest an empty space, but I, for my part, pondered a burdensome series of articles, each of which would begin with the words: "on the one hand, it must be confessed" and would end with the words: " this we will talk another time "...

    Saltykov-Shchedrin M.E., Well-intentioned speeches, 1876
  17. Alexfly
    Alexfly 2 January 2022 14: 32
    +6
    Yes, panzerfaust is much better than throwing grenades. Who among you throws a grenade of 800 grams at 30 meters, and you still have to hit ...
    1. Undecim
      Undecim 2 January 2022 15: 47
      +6
      Which of you will throw a 800 gram grenade at 30 meters

      Weight of Soviet anti-tank grenades during the Great Patriotic War:
      RPG-40 - 1,2 kg, armor penetration up to 20 mm.
      RPG-41 designed by Puzyrev - 2,0 kg, armor penetration 25 mm.
      RPG-41 designed by Dyakonov ("Voroshilovsky kilogram") - 1,3 kg, armor penetration 25 mm,
      RPG-43 - 1,2 kg, armor penetration up to 75 mm.
      RPG-6, 1,13 kg, armor penetration up to 120 mm.
      1. Alexfly
        Alexfly 3 January 2022 12: 46
        0
        Well, it’s too weak to throw this mallet at least 15 meters ...
  18. Sergey Tkach
    Sergey Tkach 2 January 2022 16: 37
    +4
    By March 45 the Germans had
    anti-aircraft rocket launcher Luftfaust was developed. Only did not have time for the war.
    1. Aerodrome
      Aerodrome 2 January 2022 17: 56
      +1
      Quote: Sergey Tkach
      By March 45 the Germans had
      anti-aircraft rocket launcher Luftfaust was developed. Only did not have time for the war.

      with them, a lot of things did not have time for the war, the victory would have been delayed for an indefinite time.
    2. Undecim
      Undecim 2 January 2022 18: 14
      +6
      By March 45 the Germans had
      anti-aircraft rocket launcher Luftfaust was developed. Only did not have time for the war.

      I did it, but in small quantities.



      Berlin. April 1945.
      1. Alf
        Alf 2 January 2022 18: 21
        +1
        Quote: Undecim
        By March 45 the Germans had
        anti-aircraft rocket launcher Luftfaust was developed. Only did not have time for the war.

        I did it, but in small quantities.



        Berlin. April 1945.

        And what confirms this in the photo?
        1. Undecim
          Undecim 2 January 2022 18: 40
          +8
          And what confirms this in the photo?


          1. Alf
            Alf 2 January 2022 18: 43
            +4
            Hmm .. Thanks, I heard about him, but did not see.
            1. Undecim
              Undecim 2 January 2022 18: 55
              +7
              In the book "World War II Data Book Hitler's Secret Weapons 1933-1945" there is a figure of 10 produced by Fliegerfaust B. Judging by the fact that a lot of them were found in Berlin, including factory closures, the figure corresponds to reality.
              1. Alf
                Alf 2 January 2022 21: 02
                +2
                Quote: Undecim
                figure of 10 produced by Fliegerfaust B

                Vika says that 10 launchers and 000 missiles were ORDERED, but how much DONE is a question.
                1. Undecim
                  Undecim 2 January 2022 22: 29
                  +4
                  Vika is a so-so source. The original says "were completed", that is, it was completed.
                  1. Alf
                    Alf 3 January 2022 18: 21
                    +1
                    Quote: Undecim
                    Vika is a so-so source.

                    Perhaps I will not argue. Anyway, thanks! hi
          2. Saxahorse
            Saxahorse 2 January 2022 21: 21
            +1
            The dude in the photo is brutal to the point. But his "six-barrel" - complete bullshit, which was confirmed by subsequent work in the USSR. wassat
          3. Sergey Tkach
            Sergey Tkach 3 January 2022 00: 00
            +2
            This is not Luftfaust. This is Fligerfaust ...
            1. The comment was deleted.
            2. Undecim
              Undecim 3 January 2022 00: 54
              +3
              Can you point out the differences?
              1. Sergey Tkach
                Sergey Tkach 3 January 2022 09: 34
                +1
                Differences in the number of barrels and caliber
                1. Undecim
                  Undecim 3 January 2022 11: 00
                  +2
                  There is no difference. This is the same weapon, which until February 1945 was called Luftfaust.
  19. Aleksu
    Aleksu 2 January 2022 18: 10
    +2
    The Fritzes had good artillerymen, and they fired at our tanks, and fired panzerfaust if someone breaks at the range of the shot, therefore, the effectiveness is low in terms of numbers.
  20. Zug
    Zug 2 January 2022 18: 26
    +2
    Judging by the reviews of our fausts, they were more than
  21. vladcub
    vladcub 2 January 2022 19: 02
    +3
    I knew the mechanic driver T34-85. I asked him about the Faust patron. He said that God had mercy on him: he did not fall under the fast patron, but he died. The German from the top fired from the Faust cartridges and ...
  22. Chervony Biker
    Chervony Biker 3 January 2022 21: 13
    +2
    I don’t know by what criteria, now the effectiveness of the "faust patron" is being evaluated. But at the end of the war, according to the recollections of my grandfather. They tried to have this contraption by a couple of pieces. in the back of each Studebaker of its 37mm anti-aircraft battery. Even in the rear compartment of Kettenkrad, who carried the field kitchen, they carried these gizmos from the heels. I think the very approach in assessing the "faust" is not sure. Do not compare it with the effectiveness of a tank or a cannon. An individual infantryman in single combat with a tank has a better chance with a Faust cartridge than just an anti-tank grenade. And nothing more was required of him.
  23. Nikolay Sayenko
    Nikolay Sayenko 3 January 2022 23: 30
    0
    The idea, as time has shown, is good. But the Red Army did not give them time to improve, and therefore it turned out to be zilch!
  24. Illanatol
    Illanatol 10 January 2022 14: 01
    0
    The author did not mention whether these "fausts" had grenade retainers? Was it possible to shoot from them at an angle downward?
  25. Illanatol
    Illanatol 11 January 2022 13: 58
    0
    Quote: Aerodrome

    with them, a lot of things did not have time for the war, the victory would have been delayed for an indefinite time.


    Unlikely. Soldiers are fighting, not weapons. And Germany ran out of soldiers.
  26. Eroma
    Eroma 11 January 2022 19: 25
    0
    As for the effectiveness of Faust patrons: and thank God they were useless drinks