The roads we choose

117

Many Russians know and understand well what is being done in Ukraine. But there is also a certain group among the inhabitants of Russia, which incorrectly, inadequately and biasedly judges what is happening there.

This is not about the opponents and enemies of both parts of one now divided people - they, together with the West and the Americans, are making (and will always do) all efforts to embroil us, discredit and prevent the revival of the torn unified state, the reunification and strengthening of the Russians.



No, we are talking about those who sincerely do not understand and are mistaken about Ukraine and the people inhabiting it.

It seems like a lot is being told and reported about Ukraine now. But someone because of their busyness or because of a lack of free time, sometimes because of laziness, and some out of stubborn unwillingness to know anything about what they supposedly know so well, often miss useful information.

Although, it must be admitted, there are also many incorrect and untrue things that are written and said in Russia today about Russian-Ukrainian relations and about Ukraine.

The main question that many Russians do not understand: as a fraternal republic, the descendants of Ukrainian brothers who fought side by side, elbow to elbow during the war against fascism and died next to the Russians, jointly restoring the USSR after the war and building developed socialism together, suddenly became hostile turning into Bandera?

I suggest to benevolent people who sincerely want to understand what is happening in Ukraine, the reflections of a person who has lived for many years (over 60) in the Russian city of Novorossiya, which is still part of Ukraine today.

Land with Russian trees


During the years of my life, I got to know my current fellow countrymen well, I understand quite well many in the district, microdistrict, thoroughly living nearby. I am well aware of their advantages and disadvantages, negative and positive qualities, character traits of my neighbors.

What?

Roughly those that Bulgakov's Woland spoke about. If we exclude some local flavor, then my fellow countrymen are not much different from the inhabitants of Taganrog, Rostov, Krasnodar and Kerch - from the inhabitants of southern Russia.

If, for example, you communicate with my fellow countryman and a citizen of Rostov or Krasnodar on general topics, you will probably not find any differences, that is, you will not even distinguish one from the other.

And if you walk around the city, talk to the townspeople on Russian language, you will also see little difference.

And how many “Russian trees” there are in our city - birches! But in our hot climate it is not easy to grow them, they require careful nursing and care ...

But there are two features that are not present in today's cities of Russia: the presence of a pro-Western-pro-American Russophobic Ukrainian government and Bandera.

I must say right away that we have few Bandera supporters. And the people, contrary to the statements of Bandera and their supporters, did not "United" against Russia and Russians, Russians. Despite all the Bandera lies.

As one of them told me:

“We know that you are 80% here, and we are only 20. But we will make you”!

They keep aloof in our country, wary, restrained and do not particularly “speak out” to their neighbors. Feel the detachment and responsive alertness of others.

Some disappear for a while (it is clear where), then reappear.

Some "wiped" drink themselves (a couple of them have already gone to the next world).

Bandera are divided into two categories. Alien (judging by the conversation - from the western regions) who rent or bought apartments, and local... Almost nothing is known about the newcomers. About the locals (of whom there are very few) - we know almost everything.

How did they all become and are becoming Bandera?


Who are they?

Three generations have to be considered here.

first (senior) - they were ordinary Soviet citizens, like all Soviet people. Exactly the same as most Russians. The processes of their degeneration began after the collapse of the USSR.

Second (the average) - those who were born shortly before 1991 and after. They do not remember anything or know little about the USSR, the Soviet period, they have an idea of ​​this only according to the words of others, often distorted.

The third (young, who is just entering life) - those who were born shortly after 2014. These people do not know anything at all and (unless fundamental changes take place in Ukraine) it is unlikely that they will know anything truthful, both about the USSR and about Russia.

It should be emphasized here that the formation of personality in Ukraine after 1991 is taking place under the powerful pro-American, pro-Western, anti-Russian, Russophobic pressure of the comprador authorities.

It is good if the parents speak Russian and the normal "coloradas", "scoops", "rashists" and "vata": they, of course, will explain everything correctly to the children.

And what if they are pro-Westerners / Probanderists and in a newfangled way they are “pushing in Ukrainian style”? Poor, unhappy children - with crippled brains and a future ...

It is also fortunate that, despite all the Russophobic attempts of the ukrovlast, so far normal parents in Ukraine are the majority.

And what will happen tomorrow, the day after tomorrow, in 10 years (if Ukraine lasts so long in its current state)?

What unites all Bandera supporters?


What is the root cause of people becoming Banderites?

These are unrealized dreams, resentment against the Soviet regime, the USSR and their successor Russia, and its inhabitants, the Russians. Personal or for ancestors (parents, grandfathers).

The specific reason, which is rarely given out, is known only to the Bandera people themselves. Each has its own wormhole. But it is so.

And also - a lackey, groveling desire to bend over, to curry favor with today's actual masters of Ukraine - the Americans, the West, the comprador authorities. That the West encourages in every possible way, promoting its minions.

I am not talking about the genetic Russophobia of others: this is a special, clinical case.

And what is interesting: many Russians also have victims of the unjust and excessively harsh actions of the Soviet regime in their family. What did not prevent the generation of winners from defending the Soviet power and the USSR in the Great Patriotic War, rebuilding the country after the war, building developed socialism - this does not prevent the current generation of Russian patriots from loving their homeland - Russia.

I emphasize: to love not the current rulers and power, but your own Country... Authorities change, rulers come and go, and Russia is eternal.

The sub-American comprador government of Ukraine is strenuously inviting Ukrainians (residents of the country of Ukraine, not Ukrainians by nationality) into its ranks of Bandera, promising them all sorts of benefits and trying to bribe them with considerable benefits. But the majority of Ukrainians (for some reason) do not want to receive them.

Why?


Because most Ukrainians are not behind Western and Bandera "values", but loyal to Russia and the majority of Russians. Bye. But time is working against Russia in this matter.

The roads we choose ...
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  1. -5
    20 October 2021 18: 14
    The people on the territory of the USSR for all 103 years of the Soviet and post-Soviet periods are divided, figuratively speaking, into "red" and "white", regardless of nationalities. In October 1917, the country was seized by the "reds" and created their own pro-Soviet ideology, but the "whites" did not go anywhere, and in their Perestroika they seized the country and created their own evil, aggressive, slanderous, anti-Soviet / Russophobic ideology, but the "reds" too did not go anywhere.
    And I believe that there are many normal people in Ukraine. BUT "whites" are "gagging" them, carry out political repressions against them, kill them.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. +4
      20 October 2021 18: 55
      Quote: tatra
      In October 1917, the country was captured by the "reds" and created their own pro-Soviet ideology, but the "whites" did not go anywhere.
      So much for the whites in Russia ...
      ..... "Alexei Navalny became a laureate of the Sakharov Prize. This was reported by the European People's Party, which nominated the Russian oppositionist. Other contenders were a group of Afghan women and the former interim president of Bolivia, Janine Agnes."
      1. -12
        21 October 2021 07: 19
        The article prepares Russia for certain events in Ukraine, apparently for a liberation campaign to the East.
        Because the majority of Ukrainians are not for Western and Bandera "values", but are loyal to Russia and the majority of Russians.

        Most in Russia and on Ukraine is deeply on the drum, they are worried about prices and earnings.
        But time is working against Russia in this matter.

        It's clear. We need to buy some stew.
        1. 0
          25 October 2021 20: 31
          Civil. They didn’t ask why Russia can, but Ukraine is not allowed? Did they build something in Ukraine that differs from what is being done in Russia, all one to one? At least Ukraine is building something ideological, maybe a little thieves, but they do not have such "national" reserves that they could steal as if you are harvesting from your garden.
    4. The comment was deleted.
    5. +2
      21 October 2021 10: 47
      Quote: tatra
      but the "whites" did not go anywhere, and in their Perestroika they seized the country and created their own malicious, aggressive, slanderous, anti-Soviet / Russophobic ideology

      By my disadvantages, I see "white" Russophobes on the site 7 out of 17.
    6. +1
      25 October 2021 20: 26
      O'Henry wrote "it's not about which roads we choose, but what makes them choose within us." Some choose the road for the whole people. Others choose the path of robbery, no matter who, the main thing is to fill their pockets. And the people, that the people, Bolivar will not stand two. The Sharks-Johnson came to power. They robbed not only the railway and everything that moved along it, they even stole capitalism, without having built anything with their own hands, they created feudalism with a hint of hell.
  2. nnm
    +14
    20 October 2021 18: 15
    Honestly, dear colleague, I do not quite understand what the article is about. About the point that in any nation there are normal people, but there are also those who are not worthy to be called people? Well, this has always been said and perceived as an axiom. The question is in the state trend, education, TV and so on, which at the official level systematically instills and fosters Russophobia.
    And you did not quite correctly write them not "only 20", their "ALREADY one in five".
    That is, one in five already sees the SS Hauptmann as his idol, one in five believes that I tortured his ancestor with Feycomor, and so on.
    But since 2014 (when this trend intensified) nothing has passed. And schoolchildren will graduate with new educational programs .... in 10 years, you will have "ONLY 20".
    1. 0
      20 October 2021 18: 38
      To start.
      The author did not enter into the article what he understands by the concept Bandera?

      Is this a dissenter?
      The one who is marching in early January with a portrait and a torch?
      Who speaks mov and agree with the government?
      Vladimir Mashkov made a very "soft bed". I, frankly, expected after the story about birches and the further continuation of the comparison of everyday life, languages, moods ...
      And he broke into the usual political agitation. The one that pours from the TV, which, by the way, he mentioned ...
      It's a pity.
      1. +10
        20 October 2021 19: 54
        The author did not enter into the article what he understands by the concept of Bandera?
        A person who hates Russia and Russians, actively opposing Russia and Russians. This is brief and rough.
        1. -1
          21 October 2021 21: 19
          Quote: t-12
          The author did not enter into the article what he understands by the concept of Bandera?
          A person who hates Russia and Russians, actively opposing Russia and Russians. This is brief and rough.


          And how will you determine whether a person hates Russia and Russians or not? "Proletarian consciousness"? So, with my proletarian self-awareness, I sense that a third of the commentators hate Russia and the Russians, which means they are Bandera supporters, and deserve the highest measure of social protection
          1. +1
            21 October 2021 22: 24
            How will you determine
            First, I’ll ask this person. Whether he hates Russia or not.
            1. -2
              21 October 2021 22: 53
              Quote: t-12
              How will you determine
              First, I’ll ask this person. Whether he hates Russia or not.


              And what kind of Russia should a person hate to be considered a Bandera? Russia is both the name of the country and the name of the state
              1. +1
                21 October 2021 23: 34
                Okay, let's replace "Russia" with "Russian people".

                Those. Does this person hate Russians (regardless of the social system in Russia, the names of members of the government, etc.). Does the Muscovites want knives, or is it at least neutral towards Muscovites.
                1. -1
                  22 October 2021 00: 03
                  Quote: t-12
                  Okay, let's replace "Russia" with "Russian people".

                  Those. Does this person hate Russians (regardless of the social system in Russia, the names of members of the government, etc.). Does the Muscovites want knives, or is it at least neutral towards Muscovites.


                  But how can this person practically hate Russians and want them to be knives (with all the will), if: "Russians are the second largest ethnic group in Ukraine, in 2001 they accounted for 17% of the country's population (more than 8 people)"?
                  Nationality is not written in the Ukrainian passport, in Russian-speaking regions everyone speaks Russian (and in Ukrainian-speaking regions everyone speaks Ukrainian). And the Ukrainian educated youth is 70 percent bilingual. How can this person distinguish a Russian from a Ukrainian in order to hate him and want to be knifed?
                  1. +1
                    22 October 2021 00: 22
                    Jews in Germany were also a significant ethnic group, but this did not prevent (and even helped) the hatred of Jews. "Jews are everywhere, they are to blame for our troubles, hate them."

                    How to tell? He who does not jump is a Muscovite. You can also ask whose Crimea. You can ask something about history (whether a person considers the history of the Russian people to be his history).
                    1. -2
                      22 October 2021 00: 38
                      Jews in Germany were also a significant ethnic group, but this did not prevent (and even helped) the hatred of Jews. "Jews are everywhere, they are to blame for our troubles, hate them."


                      It is true, but a Jew from a German could be easily distinguished - from civil registration records with the participation of a rabbi, to banal male circumcision. And how to distinguish a Russian from a Ukrainian?

                      How to tell? He who does not jump is a Muscovite. You can also ask whose Crimea. You can ask something about history (whether a person considers the history of the Russian people to be his history).


                      So you will never figure out either Ukrainian or Russian smile
                      Nobody rides in Ukraine - everyone walks on foot. To the question of whose Crimea the majority will answer "Legally Ukrainian, in fact Russian", and "History of the Russian people" does not exist - there is an academic discipline "History of Russia", and why would a reasonable person consider the history of the country his personal history?
      2. +7
        20 October 2021 20: 02
        Yes, Leader-Nazariy-Igor, VERY disappointed with you, your desire to "not aggravate", to chat about everyday life, languages, moods, the desire to settle in. You still do not understand who the "European integrators", "independent government" and the Banderaites are? Oh well. And I'm so sorry that I was mistaken about you ... laughing
        1. -13
          20 October 2021 20: 13
          Yes. Probably wrong. My late father supported (with his soul) the Maidan. I believed in the best, bright. His choice was. I have no right to condemn.
          He spoke with regret about those who repeated the chants of Kiselev, Solovyov, Skabeeva, Popov ...
          His uncle was tortured in the Carpathian forests the real Bandera.
          And you, like that, in one fell swoop ranked him as an inhuman.
          "Bow to the ground" to you for this!
          1. +16
            20 October 2021 20: 24
            Quote: Leader of the Redskins
            And you, like that, in one fell swoop ranked him as an inhuman.

            DO NOT juggle. I did not consider your father (about whom I knew nothing at all) to be a Bandera. Although I do not respect and do not approve of everyone who supported the Maidan: whether they wanted it or not, it was they who all brought to power the current rulers of Ukraine, selling and killing Ukraine and Ukrainians, leading the country to collapse. Although some of them have settled down quite well now and will work in the future.
            1. -6
              20 October 2021 21: 17
              Who?!!!
              Whom do you rank among the Bandera supporters? !!
              Here is my father, judging by your text, just fell under the criteria you specified. Well, just not "disappeared for a while (it is clear where)".
              The years were not the same, and he did not suffer cruelty to his neighbors. Hatred is not sprayed.
              But your article is a spit at me and at those who think differently from you.
              Have you been out of your city for the last five years? Where to?
              Hardly.
              So I have been, probably, during the indicated period, in many settlements of Ukraine. Relatives, excursions and so on ... So I did not notice what you described. Change, of course. In one of his articles he pointed out about them. And many of them are not pleasant to me. But to call even 20 percent of those whom I met Bandera would not turn my tongue. Even in a foreign country. We seem to look at the world in different ways.
              1. +3
                21 October 2021 16: 58
                Quote: Leader of the Redskins
                We seem to look at the world in different ways.

                Nazarius-Igor! Leader! Hopefully not "white"? (Joke: if you were Biletsky, you would not be allowed into Russia, but detained).

                Yes, of course, you and I look at the world in different ways. I live the life of a simple pensioner. Your life, judging by your statements, is completely different. You have moved from emotional stories first to conciliatory Kotoleopold's articles, and now to more aggressive (in the spirit of the commentator's wild horde of VO) rhetoric. And, as Volodya Vysotsky wrote, "stars on shoulder straps" poured down on you ... No, I do not blame you. Just stating a fact. In the end, as Yuri Levitansky wrote, "everyone chooses for himself ...".

                And I will not run into you, accuse you of something, as you do me. I just invite other people to take a closer look at you, take a closer look and draw conclusions about you, your orientation. Although, I am sure, and this will cause a storm of your indignation: few people like it when the truth is told about him, and not sweet lies

                Grandfathers and grandmothers (my father's uncle, probably, too) you had wonderful, were Soviet people and honestly fought for the Soviet power and the USSR.

                Dad, according to your own words, "believed in the best and brightest", why he supported Euromaidan and "falls under the criteria." You do NOT judge "dad's choice". You can, of course, not condemn, but disagree, disapprove! You just don't judge. Do you agree?

                Language does not dare to call you and Bandera Bandera. It turns out - In your - in Ukraine they don't seem to exist. Talk about them - In your - is "to suffer with cruelty and to spray hate". Strange "blindness" and tolerance towards explicit Russophobes. Why did it happen?

                Bandera does not have to speak Mov (there are also Russian-speaking Bandera), agree in everything with the comprador government, marching with portraits of Bandera and torches. But, as you have already been told, it is imperative to despise, hate Russia, Russians and some other nations and peoples, support marches, Russophobic actions and government statements, and be a Ukrainian Nazi (loudly or quietly). Do you share (in your soul) these views?

                You, judging by your words, are not poor, not constrained in means and freely, you move a lot in Ukraine, Europe, Russia. I think you are great and get along with the current ukrovlast, if not the member itself. Is that so?

                You never "notice" what I have described. But the changes are reluctant to admit. And how not to recognize them if they Yes and Ukraine disintegrates and dies (although externally while everything looks decent)! But "many of them (changes) are not pleasant to you." Just unpleasant! Why? Because they don't concern you! You don't judge them either. Unpleasant - that's all! Your life and your relatives, you wrote, are quite good and successful even under this power, and the "changes" do not concern you. Am I badly wrong?

                Therefore my article for you - "a spit in you and in those who think like you." It is quite natural (with your parties).

                Yes, everyone chooses a woman, religion, freedom ...
            2. +1
              21 October 2021 00: 11
              Quote: Vladimir Mashkov
              Quote: Leader of the Redskins
              And you, like that, in one fell swoop ranked him as an inhuman.

              DO NOT juggle. I did not consider your father (about whom I knew nothing at all) to be a Bandera. Although I do not respect and do not approve of everyone who supported the Maidan: whether they wanted it or not, it was they who all brought to power the current rulers of Ukraine, selling and killing Ukraine and Ukrainians, leading the country to collapse. Although some of them have settled down quite well now and will work in the future.

              Sorry to interfere. But I categorically cannot call myself Bandera! Although, though !!! At the first stage of the Maidan, I REALLY wanted the people in Kiev to give Yanukovych's organized crime group a good start !! Well, I really wanted to !!! For one simple reason, that he and his "overseers", well, they just got the entrepreneurs. Before ordinary people, they presented themselves as "their own on the board," and with entrepreneurs they behaved like "masters of life." After the moment when Yanyk was ready to leave six months later and signed under this, and Poroshenko, Yatsynyuk and Pasteur Turchinov decided to continue the Maidan, then I realized that they decided to take advantage of the Victory of the first stage of the Maidan and, therefore, had already stopped supporting him. And then, all the more ...
              Something like this. So I'm not a Banderovets.
              hi
              1. +3
                21 October 2021 04: 18
                Is this naivety squared? You really wanted that, as you said, the organized criminal group would shake him and the consequences of calculating it well, nafig him? Or did you not see who is in charge of all this? And what do they want? In the very first days from Russia, everyone practically shouted that this would all end. That all goes to this. All forecasts and warnings came true literally point by point!
                1. +1
                  21 October 2021 08: 17
                  Quote: carstorm 11
                  Is this naivety squared? You really wanted that, as you said, the organized criminal group would shake him and the consequences of calculating it well, nafig him? Or did you not see who is in charge of all this? And what do they want? In the very first days from Russia, everyone practically shouted that this would all end. That all goes to this. All forecasts and warnings came true literally point by point!

                  Unfortunately, this is perhaps naivety. But at that time it seemed to me that this was the only chance to change something in this unfortunate country. Probably, everything is all right with the officials? Honest, fair, obeying the letter of the Law? Under Yanyka, we had real bandits in power, against whom no one and nothing could do, if he himself was not a member of this organized crime group! Therefore, at the initial stage, many supported the Maidan. But already at the moment when the Leaders of the Maidan began to "behave", then it became clear that the results of the Maidan were taken advantage of by scoundrels who would use this to their advantage.
                  1. +2
                    21 October 2021 09: 26
                    That always happens. We wanted the best, but it turned out as always. A peculiar form of masochism, as for me. And in Ukraine, before that, the orange apparently taught few people.
                    1. 0
                      21 October 2021 09: 46
                      Can you suggest another option? For me, the Chinese way "Tiananmen" is the best. True, I think that 95 percent of officials would have been put in a short period of time. But, in my opinion, this is the only way to solve the problem.
                  2. nnm
                    +3
                    21 October 2021 12: 51
                    And when on TV channels the oligarchs started yelling "onizhedeti", when everywhere it was rushed about gilyaks for us, or when "Svoboda" started shooting the police, and even when Kashinsky saved his snipers from the crowd, did you still firmly believe that this was a fight with Yanukovych?
                    Apparently, neither Nulland with cookies, nor McCain, nor the CIA director in Kiev told you about anything during the events ...
                    It's strange why we already told you about these mistakes then, but not only did you not understand yourself, did not hear the sales of others ...
          2. 0
            21 October 2021 05: 24
            Quote: Leader of the Redskins
            His uncle was tortured to death in the Carpathian forests by real Bandera.
            And you, like that, in one fell swoop ranked him as an inhuman.

            There is a more accurate, albeit offensive, name about such - useful and d and o s.
          3. 0
            21 October 2021 22: 23
            Quote: Leader of the Redskins
            My late father supported (with his soul) the Maidan. He believed in the best, brighter ........ His uncle was tortured to death in the Carpathian forests by real Bandera. And you, like that, in one fell swoop ranked him as an inhuman

            So after all, "the main thing is not the roads that we choose, but what inside us makes us choose the road!" Both your father and the Banderaites (who cannot be counted among the same type) were forced to choose one and the same way, which was in their souls. Once we chose one road, it means that it was one thing !!! What ? The desire to "make friends with America and go to Nimechchin".

            There is an important statement by the philosopher and writer Alexander Zinoviev; "No matter how the Russians spit on the communist period of their history, no matter how zealous they are in destroying everything that has been achieved during this period, no matter how they crawl on their knees and grovel before the West, no matter how neither imitated everything Western and no matter how they adopted all the vices of the West, Russia will still never become part of the West " The same can be said about Ukraine. You will never become the West!
            But the moment of understanding what Zinoviev understood neither you nor the mass of other commentators has yet arrived. You will still be wallowing in front of the West for a long time and spitting on your own history, just to slavishly please the West ... which you will finally wake up to.
      3. 0
        21 October 2021 21: 01
        Quote: Leader of the Redskins
        The author did not enter into the article what he understands by the concept of Bandera?

        I, too, have always been very interested in this question. VO is full of commentators (in this thread too) who call / promise to hang Bandera. Here are the criteria by which they are going to determine - who is Bandera and who is not / who should be hung, and who should not be hung yet?
        1. 0
          22 October 2021 01: 09
          As one of the options, monitoring the content of pages in social networks, including comments on various forums. Not satisfied? Stigma in the gun? :)))
          1. -2
            22 October 2021 01: 19
            Quote: VORON538
            As one of the options, monitoring the content of pages in social networks, including comments on various forums. Not satisfied? Stigma in the gun? :)))


            Can you give an example? Which of the VO commentators and for what comment should be hung up because he is a Bandera member?
    2. +6
      20 October 2021 19: 03
      One people. Blood alone. Grandfathers and grandmothers, fathers and mothers, brothers and sisters. Children. 30 years ago, Western hangers-on destroyed the Country for the sake of their mercantile interests. Everyone knows their names.
    3. +2
      20 October 2021 22: 54
      I disagree with many things in the article. First of all, IMHO, the role of propaganda in some strange way is both underestimated and exaggerated. I will try to explain it with a family example. My late mother-in-law had a falling out with her father-in-law just before the war. The father-in-law said that the Germans would never attack the USSR, because the German workers would not allow an attack on the socialist country, while my mother-in-law heard rumors about an attack by Germany, I don’t know for what reason, that were circulating in Leningrad about the attack. However, the German workers obediently fired at the Soviet workers, so the mother-in-law was right. But at the same time, as soon as the Germans suffered an attack, out of nowhere, it turned out that most of the people suffered from fascism, and in their hearts were devoted to either Soviet communism or Western capitalism, depending on which zone they found themselves in. This later the charm of the hamburger turned out to be stronger than the charm, I find it difficult to say which of the Soviet. In short, it's better not to say what Mayakovsky said: "We are ordinary people, you put shoes on us, and we are already for your power." At present, Ukraine is "shod with the West," so the prospects for the renewal of good relations between Ukrainians and Russians should not be expected. All the more comical seem the fabrications of our president about one people, as if he was stuffing himself into relatives. In 2014, most Ukrainians were loyal or indifferent to Russia. So instead of wagging the tail, it was necessary to fight for Ukraine, if, of course, the goal was to preserve the brotherhood of peoples. And on the other hand, in order to clearly show what will happen to those loyal to Russia, they burned the people in Odessa, and repulsed the desire to love Russia, to which the Russian authorities responded, oh, oh, how bad it is. But as a result, the sanctions were ravaged in full, and Ukraine was finally and irrevocably lost.
    4. -2
      21 October 2021 12: 31
      Quote: nnm
      in 10 years, you will already be "ONLY 20".

      You are certainly right about the trend. About 20%, I'm sure you're wrong. Even if there will be these "10 years". In what I very much doubt and hope that ukroreykh will die sooner. smile
      1. 0
        22 October 2021 00: 08
        Ukraine is now interesting to the West only in the aspect of how it is possible, and whether it is possible, in a fairly short time, to reformat the mentality of an entire country. And the emphasis is, essno, on the younger generation. Goebbels would have envied.
        1. 0
          22 October 2021 14: 16
          Quote: Kuroneko
          Ukraine is now interesting to the West only in the aspect of how it is possible, and whether it is possible, in a fairly short time, to reformat the mentality of an entire country. And the emphasis is, essno, on the younger generation. Goebbels would have envied.

          Not only. First of all - in the form of a blunt tool - a log - with which the Americans constantly annoy Russia. Otherwise, you're right.
  3. +2
    20 October 2021 18: 19
    Because the majority of Ukrainians are not for Western and Bandera "values", but are loyal to Russia and the majority of Russians. Bye. But time in this matter is working against Russia.
    ... People dream of something though ... better for themselves. This is fine.
    Satisfy your Wishlist, at the expense of others, especially wishing evil, to others ... the way to nowhere !!! It must be remembered that BOOMERANG ALWAYS RETURNS!
    We all lose! At both sides.
  4. +1
    20 October 2021 18: 23
    Apparently a reminder to
    our soldiers did not interfere with the Bandera themselves hanging on the posts as the time comes.
    1. nnm
      +11
      20 October 2021 18: 34
      I'm embarrassed to ask, when will it come?
      People believed us almost 8 years ago. Several thousand of their lives ago, several hundred grief-stricken parents who saw nothing but war in their lives, children ago.
      But is it still not time to stop this war with one decision of Russia? Is it still not clear that millions of brothers who believe in us are more important than any possible sanctions?
      1. +1
        20 October 2021 18: 42
        Neither I nor you are professional diplomats, heads of state. apparatus, officers of the general. headquarters. Accordingly, we can discuss this situation only on the basis of grains of information without having a holistic understanding of the events taking place.
        1. nnm
          +5
          20 October 2021 18: 57
          That is yes. Can not argue.
          But, apparently, after 8 years of discussions, not only such poorly competent people as you and me, but also much more informed, cannot say how people in the LDNR differ from the inhabitants of Crimea.
          1. -1
            20 October 2021 20: 04
            In Crimea, everything went quickly and peacefully. This will not work with eastern Ukraine, you will have to fight, but Putin does not want to fight, Chechnya was enough for him. Plus the impending sanctions. Plus a cynical economic calculation: there is a fleet and a resort in the Crimea, and what about Donetsk and Lugansk?
            1. nnm
              +5
              20 October 2021 20: 07
              Well, at least they didn't call it a subsidized region, and thanks for that.
        2. -3
          20 October 2021 20: 23
          Accordingly, we can discuss this situation only on the basis of grains of information, without having a holistic understanding of the events taking place.

          For a discussion, critical thinking and a sober analysis of what is happening are enough. There is enough information. If you devalue your analytical, thinking abilities, then speak only for yourself.
  5. The comment was deleted.
  6. +4
    20 October 2021 18: 42
    Quite superficial. Probably the rest for more research and a longer article. But all the same +. Are you by any chance Yekaterinoslav? And that is, there ... Position nambe one ... Position number one.
  7. -6
    20 October 2021 18: 42
    Well, finally, at least someone separates the State from the current government
    1. +2
      20 October 2021 20: 34
      Quote: 75Sergey
      Well, finally, at least someone separates the State from the current government

      You are mistaken, for which you are given disadvantages. The state and the power of this state are one and the same, temporary. But Motherland, Fatherland and country are equivalent other, eternal. And they can have different states and authorities.
      1. -10
        20 October 2021 20: 55
        Do not distort.
        "The state is a special organization of society, ensuring unity and integrity, guaranteeing the rights and freedoms of citizens", as we see nowhere is it said about the government, but the people are the basis.
        And for cons to me ...
        .
  8. +1
    20 October 2021 18: 45
    Another attack on the fan, for what, why? Work out +1001500 comments. So everyone here probably already knows
    1. 0
      20 October 2021 20: 36
      Quote: Orsis338
      Another attack on the fan, for what, why? Work out +1001500 comments. So everyone here probably already knows

      This article is not for you. About you - in the second paragraph. smile
  9. +5
    20 October 2021 18: 55
    These are unrealized dreams, resentment against the Soviet regime, the USSR and their successor Russia, and its inhabitants - the Russians.

    I agree, in many ways, but not always. My friend is here. There are many of them, but this one is the brightest. The school, the beginning of the institute, is the USSR, then it is vile and independent, where a technician with a higher education was not needed. and away we go - to sell some kind of left-handed sales, to install ventilation, well, Afonya, count it. But he is to blame - the damned scoop and bloody Muscovites. And he smacks such sherry !!! Not a dumb guy, but! For example - why the heck close the town-forming enterprises in Mariupol - the metallurgical plant and the port !!! Ukraine is rich in black earth ...
    I ask - okay, where are you going to go? Can you milk a cow? Or at least dig the beds? And that here the water is half iron and that there is a zone of risky farming - you yourself know. The water there is really alles. Try to dilute the alcohol - at the bottom there is a sediment with a finger
    1. 0
      20 October 2021 20: 08
      Conflict between town and village. Rural people do not need factories (more precisely, they do not understand why factories are needed).
      1. +2
        20 October 2021 20: 19
        The fact of the matter is that he is urban, as I say, he will not even dig up a vegetable garden "with a lift"
        1. +4
          20 October 2021 20: 48
          So he didn’t work at the plant, but he was a bargainer. What is a factory for him? So, an incomprehensible reinforced concrete box. Those. he was born in the city, and the psychology is rural.

          Or, for example, Moscow / Minsk IT specialists and other creative oppositionists. They did not work at large enterprises, they know about heavy industry only from YouTube.
          1. ANB
            0
            21 October 2021 06: 11
            ... Moscow / Minsk IT specialists and other creative oppositionists. They did not work at large enterprises, they know about heavy industry only from YouTube.

            No no. It is not necessary to drag all the IT specialists. I myself did not work at the enterprise, but I saw everything live and my sister and husband are working.
            1. -1
              21 October 2021 09: 33
              I don’t involve everyone, but how many Russian programmers make software for the industry? Well, 10% maximum. The rest make software (websites, etc.) for trade, advertising, delivery and other services.
              1. -2
                21 October 2021 20: 20
                In general, Russoft says the opposite.
                Sites, shops, etc. - this is 5-7 percent of the turnover
                90% is just big business, banks, ERP, accounting of everything that is possible and so on.
                The rest is special software for all sorts of satellites and the military.
  10. +4
    20 October 2021 18: 57
    I will refuse to read Mashkov ... I simply don’t understand anything in his articles. Each paragraph is in itself and the connection, between them, only through the whisper of the stars ... bully
    1. +1
      20 October 2021 20: 41
      Quote: Keyser Soze
      I will refuse to read Mashkov ... I simply don’t understand anything in his articles. Each paragraph is in itself and the connection, between them, only through the whisper of the stars ... bully

      So I said at the beginning: I am not writing for people like you. And what to do now if you, Herr, won't even read me and I don't even know. I'll probably die. Either from laughter, or from joy. laughing
      1. -9
        20 October 2021 22: 02
        Quote: Vladimir Mashkov
        So I said at the beginning: I am not writing for people like you.

        then write to "Murzilka", there you will find your own kind laughing
        1. 0
          21 October 2021 19: 52
          Quote: Silvestr
          Quote: Vladimir Mashkov
          So I said at the beginning: I am not writing for people like you.

          then write to "Murzilka", there you will find your own kind laughing

          Dohtor, in vain are you trying to kick me, spit a brown substance at me, or spray bile. I AM good I know who you are and I’m not upset at all, but only my confidence that I’m doing everything is getting stronger! Your swearing is like a medal to me! laughing
          1. 0
            23 October 2021 19: 21
            Quote: Vladimir Mashkov
            in vain are you trying to kick me, spit a brown substance at me or spray bile

            It hurts laughing
            Quote: Vladimir Mashkov
            that I'm doing everything right!

            And what are you doing? As long as you demonstrate a complete lack of understanding of the processes in your city, let alone speak for the country, and throw slogans full of absurdity.
            Where was your Kharkiv AntiMaidan? Who works for the war at the Kharkov factories? Who participated in the ATO from Kharkov? You have no answer, which confirms your primitive understanding of the situation in your city.
  11. +11
    20 October 2021 18: 59
    And it seems to me that the author is sincerely mistaken in saying that the majority of Ukrainians are loyal to Russia and that time is playing against it. Time is playing against all of us, and the majority in Ukraine has long ago become obsessed, though not wanting to admit it even to themselves.
    As for the Russian language, it was already almost native to most of the now former USSR.
    And it was very cool to come wherever you want without experiencing any communication problems.
    And now that, everyone hates everyone for various reasons. But this is a little different, albeit painful ...
  12. -2
    20 October 2021 19: 15
    So far, I have the first question: having chosen the title of the article, identical to the story of O. Henry ... Bolivar cannot stand two, right? Or ... But that's not even the point of that story.
    I just don't catch the threads. Or the author has chosen the wrong title. Remembering the same O. Henry, here the Pharaoh and the chant are more likely closer.
    1. 0
      21 October 2021 20: 09
      Quote: Kuroneko
      Or the author has chosen the wrong title.

      The author chose the title correctly!

      Let me explain. Of course, I read O. Henry's story. A long time ago, as a child. And then I watched a movie about him. But the story itself has nothing to do with my article. But the title of the story is the most direct. Both the story and my article talk about our life choices: in life we ​​always choose what to do. In my article we are talking about the fact that most Ukrainians Not for sale Americans, the "independent" current comprador government of Ukraine and Does not become American lackeys - Bandera, despite the promised various benefits.

      The title expresses the essence of the article VERY well!
      1. +1
        21 October 2021 20: 18
        Okay, your arguments are accepted. But in fact, for the poor, not yet zombified Ukrainians, the story of the Pharaoh and the chorale are really more suitable.
        Read it if you haven't already.
        And the name "The Roads That We Choose" is beautiful, of course. But Henry does not convey the essence and message of the story, alas.
        By the way, I myself am about a third Ukrainian. Although one fig Russian, of course. =)
        PS I have two good friends in Ukraine. With one, unfortunately, I lost contact. Fuck knows what could have happened. The second serves in the ATO, but fortunately, a radio operator. It doesn't kill people. As he told me himself, he went to serve out of despair. I couldn't find a job. And there somehow, but they pay.
        This is all sad.
        1. 0
          23 October 2021 11: 54
          Quote: Kuroneko
          The second serves in the ATO, but fortunately, a radio operator. It doesn't kill people. As he told me himself, he went to serve out of despair. I could not find a job. And there, somehow, but they pay.

          In Germany, former Nazis are still being tried. Some did not personally kill anyone. They just served in concentration camps.
          As for your friend, then, I believe, the time will come for him, who "just sold" and helps to kill those who are NOT sold, will be detained, investigated, determined the degree of participation and "thanked" for his "merits". Perhaps they will just let go. Indeed, in the ATO there are so many "just cooks", "just drivers", "just radio operators". laughing
  13. +1
    20 October 2021 19: 15
    No, we are talking about those who sincerely do not understand and are mistaken about Ukraine and the people inhabiting it.

    Yes, we, to our great regret (or joy), do not understand why the processions of fascists or some kind of nationalists do not take place in Russia explicitly, then why do they take place in Ukraine? Probably, this is happening with the full connivance of the Ukrainian authorities?
    The attitude of the Ukrainian people to the people of Russia is expressed in the choice of a government under which all this happens. In Russia, no one chases after people who do not speak "Russian", despite the fact that it just jars.
    1. +4
      20 October 2021 21: 06
      The places (not even states) where such processions take place were not completely listed.
      The Baltics, especially Lithuania, you can also add latent Natsiks in Belarus, just waiting for a convenient moment and hour to organize their marches. Let us add here, as potential hotbeds, Armenia with a monument in the center of Yerevan to Hitler's collaborator Garegin Ter-Harutyunyan (aka Garegin Nzhdeh), as well as Kazakhstan, where a mass movement is being spun with might and main to recognize the same traitors who served in Nazi units as national heroes. So the Uzbeks recently acquitted one of the leaders of the Basmach gangs. It remains to wait only for marches and they will be, albeit small in number at first, but everything in due time. If only you do not put a barrier to such obscurantism!
  14. +4
    20 October 2021 19: 25
    Until 2014, everything was fine, independence was fine, the governments arranged and the zhovto-blakite arranged the trident, instead of the gray ones came black ... "Vanya, I am yours forever." We chose the same roads to capitalism with all the consequences, with the difference that there is no oil and gas in Ukraine. If there was gas, now they would have built some kind of stream and wouldn’t blow their heads. And they would spit on everyone.
    1. +2
      21 October 2021 13: 16
      Quote: parusnik
      there is no oil and gas in Ukraine

      There is both, but it is necessary to explore, to extract, in the case of gas, to integrate new fields into the existing system of GTS and UGS facilities, but is it necessary when you can sit on the transit and not blow your head?
  15. +1
    20 October 2021 19: 26
    The birches were frankly touched. Apparently, never a Ukrainian wrote
    The author even confuses the concepts of "Bandera" and an adherent of sovereignty, that is, "statesman".
  16. +2
    20 October 2021 19: 28
    ... rulers come and go, but Russia is eternal.

    The rulers are the rulers of strife. You just need to look into the recent past. Russia is We (You). And the main thing for us is not to be deceived. This is razor-blade walking. From crisis to crisis; from turmoil to turmoil; from revolution to revolution. And you’re not alone with yourself. The world is big, there are many "helpers". They are waiting, you know.
  17. +2
    20 October 2021 20: 05
    Because the majority of Ukrainians are not for Western and Bandera "values", but are loyal to Russia and the majority of Russians. Bye. But time is working against Russia in this matter.

    Something I did not understand what it is for. Russians, do something to make us Ukrainians loyal, and we choose? Otherwise it will be too late! So what?
  18. +7
    20 October 2021 20: 20
    Another nonsense of an offended Kharkiv resident! Plays with words and concepts like a clown.
    ... we have a few Banderites ...

    How much? How does the author think?
    Examples.
    1.In 2014, the following battalions were created in the ATO from residents of the Kharkiv region:
    - "Kharkiv-2" - a volunteer operational special police company, created in April 2014 in the structure of the Main Directorate of the Ministry of Internal Affairs of Ukraine in the Kharkiv region,
    - Battalion "Sarmat" (21st armored troop-carrier; full name: 21st battalion of territorial defense of the Kherson region "Sarmat" of the Armed Forces of Ukraine) - a volunteer armed formation created on the territory and from the inhabitants of the Kherson region, officially subordinated to the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine,
    - Battalion "Kharkov" (22nd armored troop-carrier; full name: 22nd separate battalion of territorial defense "Kharkov" of the Armed Forces of Ukraine) - an armed formation created on the territory of and from residents of the Kharkov region, officially subordinated to the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine,
    - 15th reserve battalion (Kharkov).
    The author says few of them. And if you count all the ATO battalions, then out of 30, Western Ukraine will have somewhere 4-5. And the rest are from Russian-speaking Ukraine. Is that not enough? Or a lot?
    Well, if the author claims that
    ... About the locals (of whom there are very few) - we know almost everything.
    , then let him tell you who is restoring military equipment from the ATO at the factories of Kharkov - local or alien? Hedgehog is understandable, local. So we are waiting for the story of how 20% force 80% to work for the war in Donbass.
    2. Next.
    ... many Russians there are also people in the family who suffered from the unjust and excessively harsh actions of the Soviet regime. What did not prevent the generation of winners from defending Soviet power and the USSR in the Great Patriotic War, rebuilding the country after the war, building developed socialism

    So what happens? With his scribble, the author deleted from the history of 2021 Ukrainians - Heroes of the USSR, 26 twice Heroes of the Soviet Union, the famous Kovpak, Kozhedub and hundreds of thousands of Heroes, but without a Star, the author spat on 1 million 377 thousand Ukrainians who died in the war, just as he forgot that 10 out of 41 marshals of the Soviet Union were born in Ukraine. And after the war, the Ukrainians lay on the stove, and only the Russians were restoring the country. And where in the history of the country are the other nationalities? - It turns out that there were no Uzbeks, Tajiks, Kazakhs and all other nationalities in the history of the country who built a common house with blood and sweat.
    Why it happens? The answer is banal - the author himself does not understand what he is writing and, at the heart of everything, does not understand the processes, although he has been living in Ukraine for 60 years. There is a resentment. Resentment at all, their fellow citizens, Russia, which by no means will conquer Ukraine, at America, which crap, at life.
    The author simply does not understand who the Banderaites are! Is Bandera the one who walks with a torch, or the one who votes for Poroshenko or Zelensky, and at work repairs military equipment for the war in the ATO, or are they still those who went to the above-mentioned volunteer battalions? Or are all of the above and there are Bandera? And if most of the country votes for Zelensky, then it turns out that it is also Bandera? Then what are the words
    We have a few Banderaites ..
    ?
    By the way, who are the "Russians"? I would like to hear the author's definition in the above aspect.
    The generally accepted following is "Russians are a civil nation, a community of citizens of the Russian Federation of various ethnic, religious, social and other affiliations" And where are the 14 republics of the USSR? Or Kazakhs with Uzbeks. for example, are they also Russians?
    Before touching on such serious topics, you need to KNOW the real part of the life of your city, your country, and not make "Yaroslavna's lament" and be responsible for your fellow countrymen.
    1. +4
      20 October 2021 21: 28
      The author is clearly offended by something. I do not know what, I will not write or suggest, even. But this stuffing ... This is a clear wedge in the relationship of two kindred peoples! Let the Ukrainians read this article and, I am sure, there will be more supporters of independence and those who hate the Russian Federation!
    2. -2
      21 October 2021 03: 52
      Good comment.
      And the author's article shows through with a continuous resentment in relation to his compatriots and Russia.
    3. +4
      21 October 2021 09: 55
      Did you live in the occupied territory? If not, then it's not up to you to judge. When masses of people are intimidated, not everyone joins the guerrilla. Many are in the police. Or is it not so? And without a clear real policy of Moscow, not declarations (We are one people), the number of policemen will only increase. Until the number of Bandera members reaches the number of all of Ukraine.
  19. 0
    20 October 2021 20: 54
    What is the root cause of people becoming Banderites?

    These are unrealized dreams, resentment against the Soviet regime, the USSR and their successor Russia, and its inhabitants, the Russians. Personal or for ancestors (parents, grandfathers).

    Thank you neighing, how simple everything is)))
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    2. 0
      21 October 2021 14: 05
      Quote: burger
      Maybe it's all about the age of the author? The USSR has not been and will not be for a long time, but it still dreams of returning there. RF is not the USSR and never will be.

      In vain you accuse me of insanity. Though I am in the middle of the eighth decade, I think better than other young people. And so far I have a wonderful memory, I also remember well the funeral of Joseph Vissarionovich. smile
      1. +1
        21 October 2021 17: 33
        God forbid, I did not say that you are insane. Do you know such an anecdote? The Chukchi are asked when he lived the best, under Stalin, Khrushchev or Brezhnev? He answers of course under Stalin. The questioner is surprised, at the same time there were war, hunger, repressions, what was good then. The Chukchi replies: "Then the Chukchi was young and the girls loved him."
        I got the impression that in the Russian Federation you see the USSR of your youth. But this is a completely different country. Unfortunately, one cannot return to the years of his youth and one cannot return the USSR.
        1. +2
          21 October 2021 19: 24
          Quote: burger
          I got the impression

          Oleg, I've been watching your "impressions" for a long time. For some reason, they almost always false... Maybe you need to learn, expand your knowledge and horizons? As for the USSR and modern Russia, I seem to understand better than yours and well, comparing, I understand both the disadvantages and advantages of the USSR and the Russian Federation.

          I have been living for a long time, I have watched the living and the leaving for a long time. Yes, unfortunately, most go away physically and mentally. But those around me who respect me mark my good physical and mental state. You know, there is a saying: "Wisdom comes in old age." And the addition to it: "But only diseases and insanity come to the majority." The addition does NOT apply to me. I hope not yet, but to the end. Which will surely happen someday. I really hope that it will NOT be long and painful for me and those close to me.

          As for youth and old age, it is wonderful that Yura Vizbor once said about this, that in life every age is beautiful. And someone, I don't remember who, added that a real person at every age finds occupations suitable for their age and works tirelessly. This is the guarantee of a long and fruitful full life.

          All the best and a fulfilling life to you! smile
  21. 0
    20 October 2021 22: 24
    Yes, time is hurrying. And until the Bandera infection has entered the souls of people, it is necessary to end the Nazi present. The best option is to calibrate the government along with Ze and the Nazi camps. A bad option is a war of all against all. Then the Balts will have to be calibrated, along with their mercenaries.
  22. -2
    20 October 2021 23: 04
    I don't believe them. They smile and hold a stone behind their backs. They are our antipodes. We forgive, they do not, we move away, they remember, we are good, they are evil, we are big, they are small. It is a pity that the Bolsheviks gave them so many territories in the northeast, east, southeast, south, Odessa, and the entire west. They would sit at 1/4 of their current territory, 15 million of the population and would not blather. Horses
    1. -6
      20 October 2021 23: 54
      The Bolsheviks did not give any territory to YOU, to their enemies. After you captured the USSR, you divided it among yourself, because you hate each other, and did not want to live together in one country.
  23. -2
    20 October 2021 23: 31
    What 20% does the author write about?))) In the cities of the east, southeast and south, people who consider themselves to be Banderast, 2 - 3% is the maximum. And in the rest of the territory, with the exception of Zapukra, there are not so many. Now in Banderland, being a posriot (banderast), an actystom is a business, not an ideology. Those jerks who in the photo, on the screensaver, were brought to the rally not by Bandera's ideas, but by UAH 300, who promised, but may not give. When the sponsors run out of money, the Banderas in Ukraine will run out.
    1. -1
      21 October 2021 00: 27
      Nikolay, and you live in Ukraine that you reason like this and cite figures or quote experts from the box. Otherwise, it turns out that the author of the article is not like a resident of Ukraine and is not afraid to write such an article, because what they say about Ukraine he would have suffered in the dungeons of the SBU for a long time .Well, but what the author wrote is complete nonsense once counted on the Russian electorate who will believe in any nonsense "Crucified boys, bullfinches, two slaves, foamed grandmothers and others" And you know why the author writes this way because he knows that he will not have it called FREEDOM OF SPEECH.
      1. 0
        21 October 2021 09: 36
        So I live in Ukraine, in Zaporozhye. And unlike the afftor - the theoretician, I observe all this up close. We have our own - "city madmen", calling themselves Banderast, for the whole city (800 thousand), if there are two or three hundred, the rest only for money. When in April 2014, on the Avenue of Glory, a rally of dissent was dispersed - 700 freaks were brought from Zapukra, on Dnipropetrovsk buses. And then they brought the ultras of the FC "Dnepr" for the procession along Lenin Avenue. Moreover, Kolomoisky himself has never been a Banderast, the fact that he wore a Zhidobanderovets T-shirt and financed the Dnepr, Dnepr-1 carbates is a business and the politics associated with it, but not an ideology. If Uncle Vova forgives him tomorrow and allows him to live, he will become a supporter of the "Russian Spring"))) because he now has a very difficult situation - in the USA and Israel, criminal cases have been brought against him, and in Banderland they are trying to write him down as an oligarch, with all the consequences)))
      2. +2
        21 October 2021 10: 46
        People in Ukraine are persecuted for any disagreement, such as their boxer Usik or cyber athletes from the Ukranians who play for the Russian team.
      3. 0
        21 October 2021 14: 22
        Quote: Shiden
        what the author wrote is complete nonsense just a few times ..

        Write the truth I'm not afraid, just tired fear mad dogs and their servants. A little, of course, I disguise myself, but the disguise is weak, the hope is more that there are many of us and that they will not have time to destroy and transplant.

        About Ukrainian "freedom of speech" is VERY funny. Ask the political refugees Shariy, Vajra, Rogers, Ishchenko, Bondarenko and many others about them. And Oles Buzina could enlighten you well on this issue. If I was alive.

        Why are you so bad, write with errors? Foreigner? Where? What special service? laughing laughing
        1. 0
          21 October 2021 17: 36
          Yes, a foreigner from Ukraine does not serve anyone, but unlike you, I don’t pour slop on my country and homeland and people, and on the characters you listed above, Shariy is oppressed and lives in Spain, even a party named after itself participated in the elections, and the fact that he shot at a person and fled from the court beyond the cordon, you call it political persecution. And yes, these characters will lick that boot that will pay well.
          1. -2
            21 October 2021 19: 35
            Quote: Shiden
            Yes, a foreigner from Ukraine

            It's clear. So the article is about you.
            You, by any chance, are not in the title photo?
            What valuable information can you tell about Oles Buzin? Have you heard about such a Man?
            Whose boot are you licking?
            And how old are you? Judging by his literacy, he is still a primary school student.
            1. 0
              21 October 2021 21: 17
              Of course about me about a man who loves his people, his country, his homeland, albeit not ideal, but homeland. You don’t have me in the photo, unlike you with a higher education, and I respect the rights of others, but I don’t forget about my duties as a citizen of Ukraine. But you stubbornly want me to lick someone's shoe, but I’m not young and you don’t need to teach me in my life.
              1. -2
                22 October 2021 20: 13
                Well, here, vuiko, you told everything about yourself. That is to say - self-exposed. Let's summarize? Who are you and what are your views. By your the same words and comments.

                You are an uneducated and illiterate old Banderite, who VERY regrets that he is not next to the curses and threats to Russians and Jews by scumbags-Bandera on their marches with Bandera's portraits and torches, who VERY hates (possibly hates) ) Olesya Buzina and me.

                Say that you love the country and the people? You're lying. The country Ukraine is not only a territory. These are the people who inhabit it. And not only of Ukrainian nationality, but of all 130. Do you love them all? No. You only love Ukrainians by nationality. Moreover, not all (Oles Buzina, Bondarenko and Ishchenko are also ethnic Ukrainians), but only those who support your crazy ideas of nationalism. But most Ukrainian people DO NOT support you or your ideas! Do you love them too? I know - no. Moreover, you - tiny minority, a handful of Bandera renegades - you are helping the "best" representatives of your so "beloved" nationality, entrenched in the government, to sell and destroy Ukraine and Ukrainians. And this is your "patriotism", "love" for the people, country, homeland? Don't be ridiculous, "responsible and loving citizen of Ukraine"!

                Say you don't serve anyone and don't lick anyone's shoe? But what about the loyal observance of all orders of the Americans and Bandera's ingratiating themselves with the West and the Americans, constantly begging for handouts from them? After all, they manage in / in Ukraine as they want and they support you! No you lick NOT ALONE boot! You substitute the ass! After all, without them you are nothing that will instantly be crushed.

                Yes, and about the "slop". Since when true about Bandera - slop for Ukraine and its people? However, you, Bandera, only yourself consider both Ukraine and the Ukrainian people. laughing Although you are just a pitiful handful, a minority, an insignificant part of the Ukrainian people.

                I don’t understand: how and why did you get into the VO? After all, no matter how the Russians quarreled among themselves, they all VERY do not like Bandera. They would sit on Ukraina.yuey and scold them with their brothers-in-arms ... Vorogov excitedly. And you were brought to VO. You are probably a masochist.

                And I also don't understand why the harsh and strict moderators of VO you, Banderaites, still endure ... Maybe for the sake of pluralism?
                1. 0
                  22 October 2021 23: 20
                  E to you burst that hooked that without knowing you personally told the truth. So it seemed your real face, hypocrisy and rushing out of you, living in Ukraine, you throw mud at Ukrainians just because they do not want to be Russian, and those 130 nations, you will also throw mud at them because you do not give a damn about them and their opinion. And who is a xenophobic husband. You are so afraid for your skin, do not be afraid because you live in a democratic country where individuals like you have rights and for citizens of Ukraine only responsibilities. Maybe severe and strict moderators of the VO and tolerate me because I do not break the rules which they also installed, although I'm interested and you read the rules of the site, I think not.
                  1. 0
                    23 October 2021 09: 58
                    Quote: Shiden
                    E to you burst that hooked that without knowing you personally told the truth. So it seemed your real face, hypocrisy and rushing out of you ...

                    Eh, Shiden, Shiden ... Again, Vitaly, stupid!
                    Well, here's how to talk to you, conduct a dialogue? I will give you specific answers to your words - you fully ignore my answers and again, like a blind person or a talking black grouse zombie, drag on your sad song about your love and my dislike for Ukraine and Ukrainians, falsely accuse me of many sins, insult me! This is not surprising: you simply have no answers to my words, you simply have nothing to answer me. That is why you are lying, you are falsely accusing me.

                    You me accuse me of being a hypocrite, defiling and xenophobic? Yes, you just described it exactly yourself!

                    And you are lying about the Rules: you are violating points b), c), h). Moderators spare you.

                    No, a normal conversation with you is completely impossible and useless due to your complete inadequacy! They say that wisdom comes over the years. This is definitely not about you, wisdom has bypassed you far.
                    1. -2
                      23 October 2021 20: 40
                      So complain to the moderators it's not a tricky thing if you saw a violation in my comments. That you are a hypocrite, it is in your article that you are veiled, you recorded everyone in Bendera, and Russians, Uzbeks, with the Balts, Moldovans, Bulgarians, citizens of Ukraine who serve the Armed Forces of Ukraine in Ato. Here you asked them Bendera’s or patriots of their homeland. And about who killed Elderly so I'm not a prosecutor and not a court to give you an answer. And yes, therefore, the case was on trial, those suspected of committing this crime were acquitted for lack of proof of evidence.
                      1. -1
                        23 October 2021 21: 01
                        Quote: Shiden
                        So complain to the moderators, this is not a tricky thing

                        Yes, not tricky. But, unlike you, Banderaites, I am NOT engaged in hypocrisy, provocations and complaints. I write and comment. Do you understand? Is it getting there? smile

                        As for the rabble - Nazis of different countries and peoples - who are in the ATO, they DO NOT serve, but curry favor... Before the Americans, who need this destruction of Ukrainians for the sake of false accusations of Russia. Why liars? Because the war is still going on between the two parts of Ukraine!

                        "Court" acquitted Medvedko for lack of evidence? Isn't it funny yourself?
                        laughing

                        That's it, the conversation is over! This can go on forever. You will put forward new and new inventions, which I will easily refute. I'm just tired of your ... how could it be softer? ... extreme inadequacy.
                      2. -2
                        24 October 2021 21: 25
                        You do not write, you compose, you do not comment, but insult, you do not argue, but prove to yourself and others that your opinion is higher, correct, but when the opponent expresses his opinion, you slide into insults. That is, you have not lied now, the citizens of Ukraine are scum the concept of the rights and obligations of a citizen is not known. So who is lying who is hypocritical in the comments you wrote 130 nations living in Ukraine and if their opinions and views do not coincide with yours, then they are not complete. If there was a civil war as you claim it would have ended quickly but you probably did not serve in the army. That's why you believe what an expert, a politician, a propagandist will tell you on TV, after all, you have problems with logic. This is how the court is not an instance for you, and then you accuse a person of a crime just because he has different views, this is not slander.
  24. +2
    20 October 2021 23: 51
    A possible attempt to describe the current situation in Ukraine in terms of the division of residents into the concepts of Bandera / non-Bandera without a deeper analysis of all the events that took place throughout the post-Soviet space will only lead to the fact that the reader will either misunderstand the author of the article, or, in general, will not understand that the thought that the author wanted to convey. I myself have thought many times to write something like this, but I was constantly stopped by this very thought, which I voiced above. Thanks for trying. I give you a big plus for your decision.
    hi
    1. -4
      21 October 2021 00: 14
      What is there to analyze? The ideology of the enemies of the communists who seized the republics of the USSR is the inculcation of anger and hatred, both towards the communists and their supporters, and towards each other.
      1. +2
        21 October 2021 00: 27
        To put it simply, yes. Although I would not speak only for the communists, this is a particular. I would speak for statesmen, in the truest sense of the word. They can be not only communists. Among them, by the way, there was also enough "dirt".
  25. +2
    20 October 2021 23: 55
    But interestingly, Koch, Evgeny Kiselev - Bandera? And then their friends Gref and Chubais, Akhedzhakova? Makarevich?
    Not Bandera. But those close to class are anti-Russians.
    Although it is not even class-based, it is Nazis and accomplices. That is, a biological phenomenon, when people on a subconscious level are afraid, something or hate.
    1. 0
      21 October 2021 04: 27
      Quote: faterdom
      these are the Nazis and accomplices.

      If not worse! And it couldn't get any worse!
  26. -1
    21 October 2021 04: 12
    Uv. the author did not understand
    His mistake is that he judges the population of his country a priori by enlisting all Ukrainians who support in one way or another the independence of their country from Russia, which indirectly (Donbass) and directly (Crimea) wants to drag Ukraine into a suffocating embrace (especially if you read local comments wink in Bandera i.e. most of the patriots of Ukraine are equated with Bandera. Well, then there is a logical chain for the residents of Ukraine from which it follows that if:
    * we don't want to go to Russia → Russia considers us to be Bandera people → Russia crawls on us (we are the same for them) → more people in this regard do not want to go to Russia (losses from the war in Donbass, well, they simply see the difference between Novorossiya / ORDO (as you like) → even more "Bandera" (who want to move as far as possible from Russia and now the cycle repeats
    And then they are surprised that the Ukrainian South-East is fighting the most in Donbass.
  27. +2
    21 October 2021 08: 19
    The whole idea of ​​Ukrainians, if we ignore the psychiatric cases of those who believe in some incomprehensible Ukrainian people, is based on pretending to be non-Russian and dumping somewhere richer. The irony is that now Europe is no longer a beacon of civilization, and a Ukrainian for a European is something from the category of a rootless gypsy, Russians in Europe may not be loved, but, at least, they are obliged to reckon with them, and he is a gypsy. there are gypsies.
  28. +4
    21 October 2021 09: 49
    The peoples of not only Ukraine, but all the former republics of the USSR have been thrown de facto by Russia to the mercy of fate and given over to the Russophobic authorities of these states. There is no policy in this direction. Moscow time after time tries to come to an agreement only with such authorities, and they throw it over and over again. Probably someone in the Kremlin likes it. Sadomasochism.
    1. +5
      21 October 2021 12: 29
      Quote: avia12005
      The peoples of not only Ukraine, but all the former republics of the USSR have been thrown de facto by Russia to the mercy of fate and given over to the Russophobic authorities of these states. There is no policy in this direction. Moscow time after time tries to come to an agreement only with such authorities, and they throw it over and over again. Probably someone in the Kremlin likes it. Sadomasochism.

      So everything is correct. The elite of the entire post-Soviet space left, either from the KGB clan, or from the Tsekhovik clan, or from the MVD clan, or the Soviet party nomenklatura, or from the Bandits. They clearly divided the territories, the spheres of business, prescribed the rules of the game, taken, in my opinion, from unwritten gangster concepts. Those who disagreed were dug in. This is what, in my opinion, the former Soviet Republics now represent. The territory where everyone lives according to the modernized gangster laws. Ordinary people, this is a "man" or whatever they call simple hard workers in the zone, "tolerated", they are not interested in terms of intelligence or his "wants". His task is simple. Sit quietly, breathe straight. If anyone is not satisfied with what, then there is everything for this, from courts to Nat./Rus. guard. Everything.
      hi
  29. -1
    21 October 2021 13: 05
    The road that Ukraine is choosing is extremely clear - to become the spearhead (trident) of the West in the war with Russia, and I think that none of the more or less sane citizens has any doubts that it will be and will be in the very near future. Too many problems have accumulated, too many threats arise for Russia and they are multiplying like a snowball. Therefore, no matter how much you back down before the "partners", no matter how much you smooth out the corners, everything that is happening now painfully resembles 39 \ 40 years of the last century, and the desperate attempts of the current leadership of the country to better prepare for the inevitable .... All this is sad, but it is a fact. I really do not want to repeat the mistakes of the past and I really want to gorge themselves that if suddenly someone twitches at us, then, unlike the last century, they will really be crushed by "little blood" but really "mighty blow", so that those who conceived it, there was no more temptation in their thoughts to repeat the aggression against Russia. We'll fill up.
    1. 0
      21 October 2021 14: 38
      Quote: pomor23
      The road that Ukraine is choosing is extremely clear - to become the spearhead (trident) of the West in the war with Russia

      To become a beneficiary from confrontation with Russia, like the Balts and Poland, is to snatch your piece and not bear any responsibility.
      1. +1
        21 October 2021 15: 04
        The top of the junta and the like will become the beneficiary of the confrontation with Russia, while the rest, not anointed ones, will become an instrument, and then a sacred sacrifice brought to the altar of democracy.
  30. -1
    21 October 2021 14: 22
    Every year on May holidays I went to Ukraine to visit friends. Until 2014.
    For me personally, Ukraine as a state ended in May 2014 in Odessa.
    Individual Ukrainians still have a place to be, but every year, not even a year, but a month, there are fewer and fewer of them. They just disappear from the horizon.
    They live on the sly, the authorities of Poroshenko, Zelinsky, fart into the sofa and did not plan and will not continue to do anything except how to continue doing this.
    In principle, I understand them, but I do not accept them. Some even began to say hello "glory to Ukraine".
    This is their choice. Their right. As a man in the street, I am ready to accept any number of Ukrainians on the territory of the Russian Federation, but they themselves are not interested.
    The mentality of 90% of Ukrainian citizens is roughly the following: Russia should come and drive out the evil Bandera. Resume gas supplies are pending. Restore production. Resume using the sacral tube. And then blame it on, and we ourselves will figure out who to put in power, what to do and where we should go - to the EU or to Nata.

    , excuse me.
    1. -1
      21 October 2021 19: 57
      I completely agree with you.
  31. -1
    21 October 2021 20: 38
    To be honest, what the article did not really understand Except for one thought that time is working against us Ideologists that we have, that they still have one school Both those and others use the same method of education And here, as many people understand, we are losing With them , unfortunately, all upbringing is based on confrontation with Russia And here everything is just Crimea, Donbass, the dead who are brought from there This is all very well played out and this is the result, a generation is growing that, to put it mildly, do not like Russia very much, I have many colleagues in Afghanistan, and on long-distance service, who remained in Ukraine with almost everyone, I maintain good relations, naturally we constantly come to the topic of our relationship And you know what I paid attention to. young people yourself, but something tells me that we have lost Ukraine forever, with all the ensuing consequences, and it's sad
    1. -1
      21 October 2021 21: 37
      Quote: Sergey Nikiforov
      But something tells me that we have lost Ukraine forever, with all the ensuing consequences and it is sad


      Not only you think so. If in 1954 the USSR loudly celebrated the 300th anniversary of the reunification of Ukraine with Russia, then in 3014 our descendants will (some sadly and some joyfully) celebrate the 100th anniversary of the separation of Ukraine from Russia
  32. -1
    24 October 2021 14: 51
    Can anyone explain to me why the maydanuts shouted: "Moskalyaku to Gilyaka!" Is this the purpose of the Maidan? That is, for a good life, Little Russians need to kill all Russians?
    For those who consider Yanukovych a "pro-Russian" president, I can remind you that since Yushchenko's time in the SBU, an entire floor has been given to specialists from the CIA.

    Quote: tatra
    In October 1917, the country was captured by the "reds" and created their own pro-Soviet ideology, but the "whites" did not go anywhere.

    The point is that ideology German, only slightly combed by Ulyanov to Russian realities. This ideology was created by the Russophobes Marx and Engels, who hated Russia.
    I understand that you belong to the Bolsheviks. Well, there you go ...

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