USC has decided on the future of the last frigate of the "Admiral's" series of project 11356

The hull of one of the unfinished frigates of project 11356 on "Yantar" 2018

The United Shipbuilding Corporation has decided on the fate of the last frigate of Project 11356, which remained unfinished at the Yantar shipyard in Kaliningrad. According to the head of the USC Alexei Rakhmanov, the ship will be sold abroad.

According to Rakhmanov, foreign customers are showing interest in the ship, so it was decided to sell it abroad. True, the head of the USC did not clarify whether the frigate will be completed or will be sold in the form in which it is now. In addition, he did not name the potential buyers of the ship.

The ships of this project have shown themselves in real work, and foreign customers are showing a serious interest in them. I am sure that we will agree with them on the fate of the frigate

- he said in an interview RIA News.

Recall that the "admiral" series of frigates of project 11356 provided for the construction of six ships, but was limited to only three. The Russian fleet managed to get into service with three frigates: "Admiral Grigorovich", "Admiral Essen" and "Admiral Makarov", three more were left without a power plant after the break in relations with Ukraine. The hulls of the ships "stuck", as to finish building for the Russian fleet nobody was going to them.

In 2018, Russia signed a contract with India for the construction of four Project 11356 frigates for the Indian Navy, with the condition that two of them will be built at the Kaliningrad Yantar, and two more at the Indian shipyard. Thus, the hulls of two unfinished Project 11356 frigates, Admiral Butakov and Admiral Istomin, went into completion, while Admiral Kornilov remained on Yantar, the Indians preferred to build from scratch.

Comments

[Borik]

While everything is in a fog. One thing is encouraging that it will not rust like the body of the "Fog"

[knn54]

India has a chance to get stealth ships equipped with vertical missile launchers. BrahMos.
In addition, the frigate, judging by the armament, has an OPTIMAL combination of anti-aircraft, anti-submarine and anti-ship defense capabilities.
They are head and shoulders above other ships of the Indian Navy.

[Bashkirkhan]

Quote: knn54

India has a chance to get stealth ships equipped with vertical missile launchers. BrahMos.
In addition, the frigate, judging by the armament, has an OPTIMAL combination of anti-aircraft, anti-submarine and anti-ship defense capabilities.
They are head and shoulders above other ships of the Indian Navy.

Why this set of words of yours is not clear. 6 such ships are already in India + 4 are under construction. Including two 11356 Indians are building in Goa under license. Here is the essence of the publication to push the hull of the same type of frigate hanging in the water area of ​​the plant to India for currency until it decays.

[donavi49]

They are head and shoulders above other ships of the Indian Navy.

Here the Indians will be surprised. Firstly, they have their own Shivalik, which they made after Talvar type themselves, but with a similar set of weapons UKSK-8 + Calm beam + Cannon + RBU + 2 hangars for a helicopter (which they wanted, like the Americans on Perry).

Then they realized that saving on matches is evil. Talvara / Shivaliki in modern warfare, under the blow of even primitive threads, exoset clones will very quickly cross over. But yes - it’s cheaper, we saved money and bought a beam air defense system as in the tube 70s. A series of 12 Shivaliks was stopped at 3 and they began to make a 17A project already - VPU 32 missiles Barak, UKSK-8, RBU, Cannon, Israeli and their own based on European equipment (radar, CIC, REB, GAK), 2 hangars per helicopter, system with sustainer diesel engines MAN and turbines LM2500.

Well, they have 3 Calcutta destroyers and they are still completing the improved ones - 32 SAMs + 2 UKSK-8 (16 Brahmos) + cool radar.

[antivirus]

everything flies into "hypersound".
art and CR platforms are decreasing.
and the size of the UDC grows.



everything flows, everything changes ..... you cannot enter the same sea twice .... and there will be no 2 terms of WE and the outskirts will not last more than 50 years.

[zwlad]

and the outskirts will not hold out for more than 50 years.

Unfortunately you are wrong. The Americans are there for a long time.

[Alex777]

I give 2-3 g maximum to the States. Then they will not be there.

[Seryoga64]

since no one was going to finish building them for the Russian fleet.

You can read nothing except this phrase

[venik]

"...As the head of the USC Alexei Rakhmanov said, the ship will be sold abroad... ... "
========
It is a pity of course ..... The fourth would not really interfere with the Black Sea Fleet, especially since they have proven themselves very well ..... But apparently Saturn and Zvezda do not have time to build a GTZU for 22350, so they had to do something sacrifice.....

[Alex777]

Selling the building and spending money on the construction of the 22350M is the right decision. IMHO.

[venik]

Quote: Alex777

Selling the building and spending money on the construction of the 22350M is the right decision. IMHO.

========
When the ship is at a high level of readiness, such a decision seems to be rather forced..... In addition, the question here is not so much about money, but about production potential (including engine building) .....

[Alex777]

There, the degree of readiness is such that there is as much trouble in completing it as when building a new 20350.
And the difference in the capabilities of these frigates is multiple.
The customer himself will receive engines and gearboxes from Ukraine and that's it.

[seti]

Quote: venik

It is a pity of course ..... The fourth would not really interfere with the Black Sea Fleet, especially since they have proven themselves very well ..... But apparently Saturn and Zvezda do not have time to build a GTZU for 22350, so they had to do something sacrifice.....

Everything is correct. The production of our GTZU and gearboxes is just expanded. They go a lot, and we stamp ship hulls faster than they are created. Apparently the emphasis is on the project 22350 frigate and in the future 22350M. You need to understand that project 11356 at one time was, as it were, a forced measure.

[venik]

Quote: seti

The production of our GTZU and gearboxes is just expanded. They go a lot, and we stamp ship hulls faster than they are created. Apparently the emphasis is on the project 22350 frigate and in the future 22350M. You need to understand that project 11356 at one time was, as it were, a forced measure.

=========
Everything is true! And the fact that 11356 is, as it were, a "transitional" version - too (although the ship itself is not bad!) It is a pity that almost ready ships had to be sold. Of course: 22350 and even more so 22350M are more powerful and modern machines (there is nothing to argue about!), But when will they reach the Black Sea Fleet? In 10 - 15 years? And with frigates in the Black Sea Fleet, the situation is not the best: they are needed there "the day before yesterday"! This was what he was talking about ...

[Alex777]

It is a very expensive pleasure to maintain and supply a variety of types.
24 Calm missiles will be enough only for some Defender to drive from a tervod.

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: venik

".
It is a pity of course ..... The fourth would not really interfere with the Black Sea Fleet, especially since they have proven themselves very well ..... But apparently Saturn and Zvezda do not have time to build a GTZU for 22350, so they had to do something sacrifice.....

Inventing an engine for him in the amount of one piece or completely remodeling the body ...
It is not worth it.

[venik]

Quote: Jacket in stock

Inventing an engine for him in the amount of one piece or completely remodeling the body ...
It is not worth it.

========
Hello to you! The "Saturn" turbines are very close both in terms of mass-dimensional characteristics and the rest of the performance characteristics to the "mashproekt" ones ...

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: venik

Hello to you

Have a nice one you too.
A little below everything has already been described in detail, there are completely different power plants. And it was impossible to fence a garden in principle.

[venik]

Quote: Jacket in stock

A little below everything has already been described in detail, there are completely different power plants. And it was impossible to fence a garden in principle.

========
I do not know what is "below" there, but see the characteristics of the "Saturnovsky" and "Mashproekt" engines for yourself:

Weight and dimensions - you will find it yourself (on the Internet).
You, what, seriously think, what for 1 year, "Saturn" was able to develop a shipborne GTU "from scratch"??? And" Saturn "and" Zarya-Mashproekt "since the times of the Soviet Union and until recently have closely cooperated and cooperated! And therefore, the" Saturn "GTUs are very similar, since they have a related origin! - to seriously rework the design to install "Saturn" engines instead of Ukrainian ones!

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: venik

I do not know what is "lower" but

Well tada read

A small educational program for wrestlers. At 11356 power plant of the COGAG system. This means that there are two pairs consisting of a cruising gas turbine engine and an afterburner. They are different. On frigate 22350 GEM of the CODAG system. There, instead of a gas turbine engine, there is a diesel engine as a cruising engine.

[venik]

Quote: Jacket in stock

Well tada read
A small educational program for wrestlers. At 11356 power plant of the COGAG system. This means that there are two pairs consisting of a cruising gas turbine engine and an afterburner. They are different. On frigate 22350 GEM of the CODAG system. There, instead of a gas turbine engine, there is a diesel engine as a cruising engine.

==========
Well, tady carefully look at the plate above: it is clearly visible that the Ukrainian engines DP71DM71, used as marching, are very close in terms of performance characteristics, as well as in terms of mass-dimensional x-kams (not shown in the table) to the "Saturn" M70FRU-2 (in fact, they are interchangeable, with minimal alterations). As for the "afterburner" D090, they are also similar to the "Saturn" M70FRU (in fact, they were developed this way, since it was originally planned to install Ukrainian GTU D22350 on Project 090!).
Second. You have a mistake: on the 22350 project, the power plant is not CODAG, and CODOG !! Those. sustainer diesel engines and afterburner turbine do not work jointly, apart (!), which is definitely a drawback (hopefully surmountable in the future).

[Jacket in stock]

As far as I remember, the main plug there was not in the turbines, as such, but in the combined propulsion system, and the turbine, and the gearbox, and all together.

[venik]

Quote: Jacket in stock

As far as I remember, the main plug there was not in the turbines, as such, but in the combined propulsion system, and the turbine, and the gearbox, and all together.

========
It seems that such a problem existed even at the design stage: making a CODAG system is much more difficult than CODOG or even COGAG: the revolutions of diesel engines and turbines at maximum power do not coincide there, therefore, they decided to limit themselves to the CODOG option, although this is a much less efficient system.
As for the turbines, this is a well-known thing: after the Ukrainians refused to supply turbines and gearboxes, they had to feverishly master production in Rybinsk. To do this, they took the Ukrainian project, quickly "pissed off" it, increasing the resource and efficiency, making some changes and putting it into production. Therefore, the "Saturn" turbines are almost one-to-one to the seats on the "pots".
But with gearboxes - a problem: "Star" - is sewn up in full! Moreover, they still slipped gearboxes for pr. 20386 (that's for sure - at the wrong time!) ..... We have to think about something! Either expand the capacity at Zvezda or organize / build new production facilities.

[prior]

And why, in the absence of Ukrainian engines, it is impossible to put aircraft engines on the frigate. They are put on helicopters.
They put several pieces on the Caspian monster, so it jumped out of the water and flew.
Put a couple of pieces on each side, hell who will catch up. even without hydrofoils.
Noise is not the main thing for a warship. And in the port he and the tugs to the pier will be parked.

[vl903]

Quote: prior

And why, in the absence of Ukrainian engines, it is impossible to put aircraft engines on the frigate. They are put on helicopters.
They put several pieces on the Caspian monster, so it jumped out of the water and flew.
Put a couple of pieces on each side, hell who will catch up. even without hydrofoils.
Noise is not the main thing for a warship. And in the port he and the tugs to the pier will be parked.

an aircraft engine is very difficult to get to work in a ship. in addition, the resource before overhaul or
even just those maintenance of an aircraft engine is tens and hundreds of hours, and for a shipboard, tens of thousands of up to overhaul and maintenance can be done on the go. therefore, for a ship, it is better to make an engine from scratch. for a boat it is possible sometimes from a car or an aircraft engine

[prior]

Then I don’t understand why we haven’t taken Little Russia back yet ?! It's not expensive at all.
And we would have shipyards of Nikolaev and engine factories of Zaporozhye and much, much more.
And the Americans will provide us with hemorrhoids anyway ...

[vl903]

Quote: prior

Then I don’t understand why we haven’t taken Little Russia back yet ?! It's not expensive at all.
And we would have shipyards of Nikolaev and engine factories of Zaporozhye and much, much more.
And the Americans will provide us with hemorrhoids anyway ...

so the Americans, therefore, squeezed the outskirts and genocides - there were 80 military factories --- they are like rubbing it into dust with carpet bombing for 30 if only Russia did not get it ((((

[prior]

It's nothing that is dust. We will restore and reconstruct by the forces of the captured Bandera.

[evgen1221]

Only after we bang yao from the sofa.)))

[Normann]

And you can also land on the moon, at the same time.)

[Eug]

Aircraft engines are very different from ship engines both in terms of speed and torque, therefore, a completely different gearbox is needed.

[Adimius38]

There is nothing to be done, since the loss of Ukraine for Russia will haunt for a long time, and fairy tales from our chief officials about import substitution have remained fairy tales for the electorate. the power plant for 11356 was never created

[g1v2]

A small educational program for wrestlers. At 11356 GEM of the COGAG system. This means that there are two pairs consisting of a cruising gas turbine engine and an afterburner. They are different. On frigate 22350 GEM of the CODAG system. There, instead of a gas turbine engine, there is a diesel engine as a cruising engine. And the afterburner gas turbine engines are the same for both projects. So the afterburner gas turbine engines were replaced, which were used for both projects. And no one replaced the marching ones, because there are diesel engines at 22350 instead. For the Indian contract, the engines will be supplied by the Ukrainians. Nobody will organize a new production, build a test bench for the two turbines of the unfinished Admiral Kornilov. Therefore, in recent years, they have been looking for someone to attach it, maybe Zarya-mashproekt is ready to supply a gas turbine engine for a foreign customer. And the first power plant based on the import-substituted afterburner engine M90FR has already been delivered to Admiral Golovko.

[donavi49]

In fact, you are also wrong .

On 11356 on old turbines from the 70s = DT-59 and DS-71.
At 22350 on Kolomna diesel engines and new M-90F / R turbines.

Wagon and trolley problems. That is, they are different, different loads, different places of supply, different reinforcements. Even afterburner turbines cannot be replaced with one another, and this bottleneck in all BOCs, for example, in 1155, which, after modernization, are already running into the end of the turbine residual resources.

In fact, there are 2 real options:
- Alteration of the living under the power on M55R as in 22350. This will require a large amount of work in all areas - development, design, construction. And at the same time, such a unit will probably even lead to a decrease in performance from the standard, on economical moves, for sure.
- Conversion into an experimental vessel on a string of electric / diesel / gas turbine running. That is, initially to invest with an eye to using the obtained data and proven technologies on frigates of a new generation. Let me remind you that when France, Italy, South Korea, Japan, Germany already have frigates with a quiet electric search in their composition, Russia does not have them, only in construction with very vague prospects (the corvette / experimental ship Mercury is the first ship according to this scheme).

[Xnumx vis]

Quote: Adimius38

Nothing can be done, since the loss of Ukraine for Russia will haunt for a long time,

Great Russia without Little Russia is only a part of large Russia. That is why probable opponents tore Ukraine away from Russia. This is their age-old dream. I am sure the lads of Russia, Ukraine and Belarus will return.

[Kushka]

Well this is what kind of enemy enemies invaded us in 1991 in
very-very Belovezhskaya Pushcha. Yes, even among as many as three!
Well this is skoko-skoko they have a bubble ..... ugh you .... there were cruisers and tanks for three?
Locked in the closet of the President of the USSR, like a snotty kid (the one that Raikin's husband),
poured into glasses, and the newly "baked" President of Russia
(successors to the USSR, for a minute) as Tsar and Grand Duke
said - Ukraine - TAKE THAT !.
And for me Belarus, take THAT HOW TO PULL!
"This is for you, and this is for you, I do not wear this size" (C)
"And I am the president, and you are the president -" and they will cure you and they will cure me "(C)
So the country has grown to pieces.

[Xnumx vis]

Quote: Kushka

Well this is what kind of enemy enemies invaded us in 1991 in
very-very Belovezhskaya Pushcha. Yes, even among as many as three!

And this was a nice person, the main communists of that time. Think about it.

[Kushka]

+++++ You didn't want to make your post a long list
divisions of the adversary - 1st navel in the Central Committee, 2nd navel of the Central Committee, 3rd preparatory collective farm.
3 high-ranking communists destroyed a superpower
for one booze! What such a powerful superpower it was!
It's a shame! If only Kravchuk once from his inlaid
Silver shot Remington, well, at least from the starting pistol!
Well, at least once! Ritually!
And so, without firing a shot!

[bukhach]

Quote: 30 vis

... I am sure the lads of Russia, Ukraine and Belarus will return.

Blessed is he who believes ...

[Xnumx vis]

Quote: Buhach

Quote: 30 vis

... I am sure the lads of Russia, Ukraine and Belarus will return.

Blessed is he who believes ...

I may be blessed in your opinion, but the reunification of the Russian land is inevitable.

[Kushka]

There is nothing unrealizable, (especially "blissful") in your confidence. Even in recent history, this happened regularly (both in that direction and in the opposite direction) For example, under the king, everyone was in a place,
but at the entrance the VORs scattered in different directions. Lenin, although not for long, managed to reunite all three subjects, but already in 1920, after defeat in the Soviet-Polish war, Ukraine and Belarus had to be ceded to Poland (with a surcharge!). Stalin (in September, by the way) successfully rolled everything back, but, as in the case of Lenin, only for a couple of years. Hitler attacked in June 1941, took away Belarus in a week, and again in September he was already in Kiev. The victory in Germany in 1946 again united the fraternal peoples and their lands into one big country, but 46 years later, in 1991, three men sat down in Belovezhskaya Pushcha, uncorked a bottle, and cut the country into three separate pieces for a snack, one for themselves beloved everyone.
Count how many times, and this is only for the last 100 years.

[bukhach]

Do not like "blessed" - is it okay to dream? Or does it offend you too Damn it with two, you will be reunited, the "non-brothers" have not rested in fui, you need to take your own where your own people live, let the rest burn with a blue flame and stop wailing about the brotherhood, sick of such speeches.

[Xnumx vis]

Our everything! "Non-brothers" And, as they say in the army - "If a subordinate is a snatch, then this is your fault. Get a reprimand and punishment! That's all. You have scattered dear lands and people!

[Kushka]

Quote: Alex777

Selling the building and spending money on the construction of the 22350M is the right decision. IMHO.

The tankers have an anecdote about how the Leitekha sold the turret and the engine, which made him
"given" the title of commander of a tank corps. Then we went further - to drive the body. Well, that's right - there are no corps commanders in the fleet.

[eehnie]

This is a good solution for this ship.

By the same way, the development of new modernizations for the projects to remain in the Russian Armed Forces in the long term allow the modernization of the current ships, but also allows to the recovery of some ship from early decommissions (always a bad business economically ), and to complete units of the projects to continue, which production was frozen, and to complete orderes that remained uncompleted. It likely would help the Russian industry.

[TermNachTer]

The Indians will be sold. It is a pity that the Russian fleet would not have been superfluous either.