Chinese Sohu: Exercises "West-2021" showed that the core of the Russian army is still Soviet-designed weapons

The Chinese press is discussing the results of the strategic joint exercises "West-2021", which, as you know, were held at the training grounds in Russia and Belarus. Chinese journalists agree that the main purpose of these exercises was to demonstrate the capabilities of the Russian Armed Forces to NATO countries, the infrastructure of which is constantly moving towards the borders of the Russian Federation and Belarus and is being systematically improved.

The Chinese edition of Sohu indicates that during the exercises Russia used certain new weapons, “however, all the same, the maneuvers showed that the core of the Russian army is still weapon Soviet development ".

From, to put it mildly, ambiguous material on the mentioned information resource:

The Russian army is now facing troubles and problems. Due to a lack of funds and a number of technical obstacles, despite the presence of modern developments - Tanks T-14 "Armata", self-propelled howitzers "Coalition-SV" - there are not many new weapons in the troops. Basically, these are technically advanced weapons of the old, Soviet design. These weapons have undergone a certain modernization in recent years, but nevertheless, their characteristics cannot be compared with the advanced weapons of the NATO countries.

At the same time, the author does not report in the Chinese edition what specific "advanced weapons of the NATO countries" he is talking about. Maybe about the Abrams tanks, which were developed back in the 70s of the last century and which, like many tanks in Russia, were repeatedly improved and modernized? Or maybe Sohu is referring to the American B-52 strategic bomber, which will soon celebrate the 70th anniversary of its first flight?

This is to the fact that it is difficult to find a power that would bring exclusively modern technology to the exercises - not even the one that belongs to the modernized options, but just the very latest - just "out of the pencil" of the designer ... And it is difficult ( more precisely, it is impossible) to find a power whose arsenal of weapons would not consist of a significant percentage of the developments of previous decades.

However, the Chinese author is not embarrassed by this, and in his article he points out that “in order to participate in a military conflict, for example, in Syria, Russia has to open part of its old equipment, which was previously stored in hangars under special seals”:

For example, they opened warehouses with T-62M tanks.

The fact that there are enough T-62 tanks in Syria itself, the author of the Chinese Sohu, also, apparently, is not particularly interested. And he seriously believes that all the T-62 tanks that are in the SAR have recently appeared there exclusively from Russian military "warehouses".

Comments

[Jacket in stock]

to participate in a military conflict, for example, in Syria, Russia has to open some of its old equipment, which was previously stored in hangars

well, Duc
That is why it was kept.
If the capabilities of the old technology are fully consistent with the existing tasks, why something new, complex and expensive.

[Egoza]

Quote: Jacket in stock

If the capabilities of the old technology are fully consistent with the existing tasks, why something new, complex and expensive.

And, most importantly, their own, domestic, dear, and not foreign and very expensive "super-duper"

[Nexcom]

And, most importantly, their own, domestic, dear, and not foreign and very expensive "super-duper"

and not copied from all over the world, than the Chinese partners sin ...

[knn54]

Where, besides parades and exercises, did the Chinese clones of Soviet technology participate?

[alex neym_2]

And how many of the latest, modern development of China itself is in service with its army? It seems that the Chinese are spanking copies from all over the world, including the "outdated SOVIET" one, which is enough even for export in huge quantities, but of a "higher" quality (a fake, it is a fake) and a lower price.

[donavi49]

Modern in the war in Nigeria, Ethiopia, Sudan. More globally - the last Pakistani-Indian, Iranian-Iraqi, 91/2003 / war with IS in Iraq, Libya, WHO against the Tamil Ilama tigers - Chinese Type 59/69 participated everywhere.

Well, they also consistently take the # 2 place after Russia in the ARMY, and the gaps are very small.

[Silver bullet]

They participated in the tank biathlon in Alabino for several years in a row, but so far their super duper tanks cannot jump above 2 places (heads).
And they buy Soviet planes and engines, air defense systems and much more. It is evident that the journalists are not “vkurse”, or they are clumsy trolling.
Let them talk about their strategic aviation and submarine fleet.
And the quality of the surface fleet will be demonstrated by the Battle of Taiwan.

[Nexcom]

They participated in the tank biathlon in Alabino for several years in a row.

... on which their skating rink fell off, which was very clear. I'm not making jokes, I'm just reporting a fact that I personally saw.
besides, the engine got covered a couple of times - they changed the tank to their own reserve one. and a copy (unlicensed) of a Soviet tank gun also refused.

[Overlock]

Quote: Silver bullet

And the quality of the surface fleet will be demonstrated by the Battle of Taiwan.

There will be no battle

[Cananecat]

Quote: knn54

Chinese clones of Soviet technology participated?

The Chinese author is not embarrassed that his country does not have its own massive development in the field of weapons ...

[Nexcom]

The Chinese author is not embarrassed that his country does not have its own massive development in the field of weapons ...

How will he be embarrassed if they do not hesitate to copy (steal) everything that falls under their Chinese eyes and what their Chinese hands can reach? And then calling it FeignFeN 100500 and slightly changing the appearance, they sell it all over the world?

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Nexcom

if they do not hesitate to copy (steal) everything that falls under their Chinese eyes and what will their Chinese hands reach? And then calling it FeignFeN 100500 and slightly changing the appearance, they sell it all over the world?

And you try to take off yourself, and then throw everything Chinese out of your apartment from work!
Curious to see what you have left

[Nexcom]

the fig leaf will most likely remain. and a quilted jacket, still Soviet, good, it has not yet been demolished.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Nexcom

the fig leaf will most likely remain. and a quilted jacket, still Soviet, good, it has not yet been demolished.

That's it, the Soviet padded jacket, because the current Russian Federation could not create anything, could not, did not want to, and she had and still have other tasks - the disposal of the Soviet heritage, including the population.

[Nexcom]

It would be more correct to say that in the Russian Federation, a group of certain persons created such conditions when it became unprofitable to develop and produce.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Nexcom

It would be more correct to say that in the Russian Federation, a group of certain persons created such conditions when it became unprofitable to develop and produce.

It is a profound delusion to think about some kind of "groups", fifth columns and agents, the whole system of power is linked by one chain / goal to plunder, sell, ensure future life in the West, and this can be done calmly under false patriotic slogans, imitating activities and caring for the country.

[Nexcom]

The system of power is precisely created by a certain group of people. Do you disagree?
Well, not the system itself created itself regardless of who is at the helm? it is the steers who create all the conditions to make it easier for them to steer and fill their pockets.

Here's an example: a new head came to our place, and changed the system - he replaced the old workers left over from the old head with new ones, loyal to his person. changed the conditions under which the premium was previously paid. did everything so that those who are not included in his social circle did not receive any promotions. and those who enter - have become not subject to jurisdiction, they are not mistaken, they are poorly informed by negligent workers who poorly carry out the highest and deeply progressive decisions. introduced new prices for unfastening "to the treasury" from projects. in other words - he created a new system for himself.

by the way does not resemble anything?

[sleeve]

I read, I read ... I waited and waited. When will we move from the Chinese theme to "sold Russia"? Here it is! Read on, where is there about "Great China"?

[Sling cutter]

Quote: sleeve

I read, I read ... I waited and waited. When will we move from the Chinese theme to "sold Russia"? Here it is! Read on, where is there about "Great China"?

Would you like to laugh? Well, let's laugh together! Compare and give here the main economy. indicators of China and the Russian Federation and we will laugh until we drop

[sleeve]

And then you give me demographic data and labor productivity, plus the number of employees, and we just laugh out loud. And add there the costs of the "climatic coefficient", before that, look at the map of the location of the industry of the PRC and the Russian Federation. And when we are already crying completely, almost to the point of dehydration (before that we will deduce a confident figure of real GDP, taking into account the "leveling costs" for climate and distance), then I will beg you to simply explain to me how, with such a concentration of power in the hands control of the CCP has achieved "such" results ?!

[Sling cutter]

Quote: sleeve

And then you give me demographic data and labor productivity in return, plus the number of employees and just laugh out loud

This. Yes! I'll just give you a Finnish woman with her climate and demography as an example.
My specialty is the main robotization and automatic robotic complexes, there were serious developments in this area at the beginning of the 90s, this is the question of demography and labor productivity. In the XNUMXs, serious designers suggested building entire factories based on automation. They were told, "Come on, fick," so if they fumbled in offshores, then yes, otherwise they don't need it and cut to hell with what was and scrapped it.
On the basis of our department, tourism managers are now being trained, heavy machine-economists and two buildings for doctors.
So funny?
And it will make you even funnier that under the USSR they were not fools who were in charge and understood the climate, so the TARIFFS for energy were LOW !!!
In the price of products, labor force, taking into account automation, is a fig and a mere trifle, in comparison. with energy costs and the price of materials.
And what do we see in the Russian Federation? The price of electricity in China is 70 kopecks, but what is the price for its producers ????, etc.
In general, I’m nervous, I’ll go to work, I’ll drive it away, I’ll break my anger at some thread

[sleeve]

Yes, I'm going to work myself, the same I take off my anger ... Finka is not an option, the same requests for a climatic map and the density of the location of industry. Plus, there is a terrible misfortune (for a simple Western man in the street) in the Russian economy - an incomparable share of services and the real sector. In short, I'll go \, discussions of this kind are not particularly fruitful for the mood))

[Sling cutter]

Quote: sleeve

I'll go orchestly \, discussions of this kind are not particularly fruitful for the mood))

I agree!

[standan]

And what, nowadays Finka is walking in the advanced powers? What does it produce so technologically advanced with a population less than in St. Petersburg? Tell.

[Grits]

Quote: Stroporez

Would you like to laugh? Well, let's laugh together!

And here's the difference. These are Blagoveshchensk and Heikhe in the Soviet era and at the present time. Find the differences in Blagoveshchensk and the Chinese city. Here we are.

[standan]

Next, the population of Heihe is declining sharply.
https://zen.yandex.ru/media/id/5d0caf1ff56fb600afe255c4/kitai-jdet-znachitelnaia-depopuliaciiarazoblachenie-feikov-pro-zaselenie-sibiri-i-dalnego-vostoka-kitaicami-5d739e49f557d000aee1a8b2
https://zakonvremeni.ru/analytics/7-3-/49601-kitajskij-dalnij-vostok-pusteet-eshche-bystree-chem-rossijskij.html

[Vadim237]

Judging by this photo, Blagoveshchensk was completely rebuilt during the period and the quality of Chinese construction is generally better to be silent.

[Vadim237]

"Because the current Russian Federation could not create anything" - They created a lot of things in armored vehicles, in aviation, shipbuilding, air defense, etc. how is this technique now - the day before yesterday.

[DymOk_v_dYmke]

Quote: Vadim237

Because the current Russian Federation could not create anything "- They created a lot of things in armored vehicles, in aviation, shipbuilding, air defense, etc., but in view of the limited budget, this new weapon goes to the troops in small batches. this technique is now the day before yesterday.

Also refer to those who claim that the Soviets did not know how to do anything except galoshes.

[Vadim237]

They know how to cut budget money better than anyone else - and galoshes and they are very expensive, besides, they are capricious in operation and difficult to maintain.

[Overlock]

Quote: Nexcom

and a quilted jacket, still Soviet, good, it has not yet been demolished.

This is from old stocks. Now even their Chinese sew

[Overlock]

Quote: Nexcom

if they do not hesitate to copy (steal) everything that falls under their Chinese eyes and what their Chinese hands can reach

Do you want to say that Russia does not conduct military and industrial espionage?
Remind me about the first Soviet atomic bomb? Did you think of it yourself or did someone help? This is a global trend and no one is an exception.

[DymOk_v_dYmke]

Quote: Overlock

Remind me about the first Soviet atomic bomb? Did you think of it yourself or did someone help?

Both that and that.
However, it was done.

[Mar.Tirah]

Quote: knn54

Where, besides parades and exercises, did the Chinese clones of Soviet technology participate?

I support. That there are too many references to this publication as an authoritative one? The only attack the Chinese had on our territory, and they acted precisely with Soviet weapons donated by the Soviet leadership. And it was from Soviet weapons that they received retribution. I hope the current leadership of Russia will not step on the same rake, and will not have to correct mistakes with the heroism of ordinary Russian soldiers?

[Overlock]

Quote: Mar. Tira

That there are too many references to this publication as an authoritative one?

When this publication praises Russia, do you not have such questions?
Sohu: Russia has figured out how to "hack" the protection of American aircraft carriers
https://politros.com/221065-sohu-rossiya-pridumala-kak-vzlomat-zashitu-amerikanskikh-avianoscev

[Mar.Tirah]

Quote: Overlock

When this publication praises Russia, do you not have such questions?

Flattery has never been good enough, first of all to those who are greedy for it. Moreover, it is not supported by anything, based on the fantasies and speculations of "specialists" from the Middle Kingdom. By the way, such people themselves have a dime a dozen. they themselves begin to feel dizzy.

[Sling cutter]

There is no secret that nothing conceptually new has been created in the Russian Federation.
At the moment, almost everything conditionally new is the use of the modernization potential of Soviet developments.
This is especially noticeable in the high-tech types of the Armed Forces, Su-27, Varshavyanka, T-72 - this is the Soviet base, the rest is interpretation.
The Chinese simply stated the obvious, which was a surprise only for nontalagmetic turboputriots, and the message of the article and the bulk of the comments boils down to "samitakie".

[avg avg]

Tell us, pliz, about the conceptually new types of weapons in the armies of the world. In order to understand where we should strive for sivolapy!

[Overlock]

Quote: avg avg

on conceptually new types of weapons in the armies of the world.

Watch the newsreel of the last war in Karabakh

[sleeve]

Where is the smiley about neighing ?! Newsreel of the war in Karabakh ?! Pictures of the shooting of the Zulu with a machine gun? Bushmen attack on a square armed with rifles? First tanks near Fleur village? Seriously? You were asked about one thing, and you unsubscribed with a fashionable slogan and that's it? Three dozen UAVs in the absence of electronic warfare, fire system countermeasures, continuous detection zone (not only electronics), and even the simplest camouflage methods in the form of a hundred years of famous "smoke smoke" at different levels - is this a conceptually new war? Here it is the expert community, our darling ... Conceptually new types of weapons are hypersound, these are ultra-long-range air defense systems, I agree, this is the same UAV system, but Karabakh is not an indicator, this is Iskander's "tactical surgery". And further, further, further ...

[Sling cutter]

Quote: sleeve

Conceptually new types of weapons are hypersonic, these are ultra-long-range air defense systems, I agree, this is the same UAV system,

Well, here you are, in fact, all the "advanced" areas and identified.
And now compare where we have breakthroughs and what China does not have, what we have.
I will indicate right away that we do not have microelectronics and element base, just as there is practically no heavy bean, as the basis of mechanical engineering, by the way, there are no designers either.
We persistently torture IL-76, but we can even produce it piece by piece.
All these Tornadoes, Soncepeki are Soviet developments and all the "newest" ammunition for them was "drawn" back in the 80s.
As an example of "managerial", mowing under the design, thoughts of the IL-112.
Even now, I will not talk about the 90s (the factories were still working before the 20s), let's take the past XNUMX years.
Our starting capabilities at the beginning of the XNUMXs in terms of potential were much better than in China + dollar rain for hydrocarbons.
But nothing! Production has been destroyed along with those chains, the "brains" have died out or gone, the last enthusiasts are already 60+, but the youth are gone.
All this talk about greatness is a fake for the plebs, there cannot be a high-tech army, with those. backwardness of the country as a whole.

[sleeve]

And here you can not argue. Fascinated by the liberal economic dream, the "kids" of the 90s did not go into real engineering. The generation that has now sat down at their desks in polytechnics and vocational schools will "grow up" only in 10-15 years as a designer and professional workers. Here I will not argue with you a fact. This failure, expressed in 25 years, 10 years of which have passed, we probably will not estimate in percentage terms of losses. Unless missiles are falling, ships are slowly being built ... Well, about "Soviet developments" ... The USSR did not leave us something at all, "out of necessity." Electronic warfare and cunning things from this opera are "finished off, finished", and for the most part they are created anew, proceeding from the hunger for the element base and all that other stuff in these 2000s. It's hard to argue with a constructive update in the Air Force, it flies this update. Production issue? Well, we touched it with you. I hope I'm right. Of the very "novelties" I will mention "Hephaestus". It's like a hint at what angle to look at the update. In principle, a new word in air warfare, and most importantly "0" electronic countermeasures to ammunition. And so "on trifles" will be typed. But! I nevertheless urge you to look more realistic at what is happening and measure the start of full-fledged modernization of the Armed Forces somewhere in 2010. All military power will have to be renewed. And while the decline of 20 years of degradation is now liquidated, by the end of this period of "liquidation" we should see the already untwisted flywheel of the military industry and military technical thought. In the meantime, this was enough to shake the whole district. I hope that my slogans are not very patriotic. So there are breakthroughs and they are expanding.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: sleeve

All military power will have to be renewed. And while the decline of 20 years of degradation is now liquidated, by the end of this period of "liquidation" we should see the already untwisted flywheel of the military industry and military technical thought. In the meantime, this was enough to shake the whole district. I hope that my slogans are not very patriotic. So there are breakthroughs and they are expanding.

If you do not take the last sentence, then not very much.

[Essex62]

Spot - yes. But there is no one to mass produce and nothing. And if tomorrow is a war?

[Vadim237]

Finish already your garbage sucked out of your finger to carry - it is better to type in the tyrnet enterprises of heavy mechanical engineering and the electronic industry in Russia and you will see that there are hundreds of them - and there are 22000 working machine-building enterprises all in operation and we develop new microprocessors, but their production in Russia is unprofitable in mind too small a sales market. And at the expense of the Il 112 - in the USSR, the same is not going smoothly with the new planes, the same Su 24 and Tu 22, the army generally supplied raw from which there were dozens of accidents and disasters.
Our starting capabilities at the beginning of the 2000s in terms of potential were much better than in China + dollar rain for hydrocarbons. And they probably forgot about anything as they paid foreign debts and there was no dollar rain from the sale of hydrocarbons in the 2000s, taking the same statistics on the value and exports for 2008-XNUMX.

[Vadim237]

And a little more about what kind of mechanical engineering we have "dead" "In 2018, the volume of output in mechanical engineering amounted to 8,0 trillion rubles ($ 128 billion), including the production of vehicles - 56%, the production of electrical equipment - 12%, other industries - 32%. The volume of Russian engineering exports reached the highest value in 2018, amounting to $ 29 billion "

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Vadim237

a little more about what kind of mechanical engineering we have "dead" "In 2018, the volume of output in mechanical engineering amounted to 8,0 trillion rubles ($ 128 billion), including the production of vehicles - 56%,

Uh-huh, right away you could not copy-paste and for greater "persuasiveness", digging your finger into, in, in ... the sky, gave out trans.means 56% and so on 32.
Now find the production of means of production, replenish your intellectual baggage and you will see comparative diagrams of the production of machine tools by year in comparison with the 1991th year. Then look at the export / import by year, from these data you will see that there are 1 (seven !!!) imported machines for one machine manufactured in the Russian Federation, Karl !!!
Where did you study, entrepreneur? It seems that there are no workers' schools for a long time.

[ada]

Quote: Stroporez

Where did you study, entrepreneur? It seems that there are no workers' schools for a long time.

And it's time to introduce a new one. Having worked in VK on preparing citizens for military service and studying sources of information from the media, including on the Internet, I come to the conclusion about the titanic efforts made by the Soviet government to combat illiteracy and build an education system (I would say - the system of education and science combined with the education system) and the catastrophic consequences of its destruction. I do not know what forces can do something similar now.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: ada

I come to the conclusion about the titanic efforts made by the Soviet government to combat illiteracy and build the education system (I would say - the system of education and science, combined with the education system) and the catastrophic consequences of its destruction. I do not know what forces can do something similar now.

Over the years of ebnoputinism, the Russian Federation has rolled back to the beginning of the last century, and only general mobilization under the banner of a universal idea / ideology can reverse this situation, i.e. all over again, the fight against illiteracy.
And if everything continues in the mainstream of Ebnoputinism, then we will generally plunge into the Middle Ages with the Black Book and the postulates of a flat earth.

[Vadim237]

No, it’s like you are stuck in the USSR - that’s what you are carrying all the snowstorms sucked out of your finger. "And if everything continues in the mainstream of Ebnoputinism, then we will generally plunge into the Middle Ages with the Black Book and the postulates of a flat earth." - The main thing is that everyone does not return to your illness - "The insanity of red borscht"

[Vadim237]

Wake up Vasily since the USSR riveted them until 1991 according to the plan, even if they didn’t need the fuck because of their simplicity and backwardness from the western ones, 30 years later, technological progress didn’t stand still - now they are producing as many and such as the customers order and they buy and open the market, whoever wants what and from whom he buys, they choose the western one and the ratio of 1 to 7 from the fact that we make our own will not change, and yes, some of them are already localized in Russia - and I no longer need to buy 100 machines for processing it is enough for me to buy one machining center that will replace all of them in processing and operations
Where did you study, entrepreneur? It seems that there are no workers' schools for a long time. Judging by you, you obviously went to church school. And yes, don't write anything to me about the machines - you are not just a stump in them but an Oak forest - however, like in everything else.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: avg avg

In order to understand where we should strive for sivolapy!

To recovery.

[Nexcom]

Well, they (copied weapons) sell it everywhere. and cheap. for example barmaley in dressing gowns and slippers are sold. They sell to Africa.
the shooter is definitely selling. grenade launchers. DShK so generally only Chinese go around the world.

but even the barmaley realized that it was better to buy the original and not the Chinese clone. although of course it is determined by the financial capabilities of the buyer ...

[Overlock]

Quote: Nexcom

even the barmaley realized that it was better to buy the original and not the Chinese clone

Sure?
By the volume of arms production and sales China is in second place in the world after the United States, ahead of Russia, ascertained by Western experts.
https://www.gazeta.ru/army/2020/01/27/12929750.shtml

[Essex62]

They also, through the packs, armed the barmaley with RPG-7, against us in Afghanistan. Communist China. Further only not in print.

[Overlock]

Quote: knn54

Where, besides parades and exercises, did the Chinese clones of Soviet technology participate?

Do you want to see them at war? Better not, let them only participate in parades

[rotmistr60]

the basis of the Russian army is still Soviet-developed weapons

And the Chinese army of Chinese design (?) And what they managed to steal in other countries. What is the problem? Weapons do not match modern wars? They correspond and completely. Few new developments seemed? This is how the rearmament is proceeding with high quality. Sohu is focused exclusively on criticism of the Russian for some reason, while unconditionally praising the Chinese. It is clear that each sandpiper praises his swamp, but you also need to know when to stop. China last fought in 1979 with Vietnam and was defeated.

[Polite Moose]

Quote: rotmistr60

Sohu is focused exclusively on criticism for some reason Russian

We can say that the Chinese edition has too narrow a view of things.

[Sidor Amenpodestovich]

Quote: Polite Elk

We can say that the Chinese edition has too narrow a view of things.

It happened evolutionarily.

[Doccor18]

The most interesting thing is not what he writes, but why it is being done ... Why does China need to artificially belittle the technical condition of the Russian army? For export contracts? So in Mir, everyone has long understood everything, and such articles will not change anything. Why then? Analytics, well, well ...

[Zaurbek]

I will reveal the secret that the basis of the Chinese army is also made up of Soviet-developed weapons ...

[donavi49]

Well, here you are wrong. They have really rearmed themselves seriously. Moreover, the army is in their tail, after the Fleet, the Strategic Nuclear Forces, the Air Force.

Let's not talk about cars, because Ukraine can make cars. Let's start with the armored personnel carrier - the main one is the ZBL-08 and its family. A huge assortment on one chassis, from various reconnaissance and air defense systems to wheeled tanks, engineers, bridges and conventional armored personnel carriers.

The Marines generally have a unique platform also in various designs.

Over the past 3 years, so many new BMPs have been riveted that the old type-86 (which were copied from the BMP-1 purchased on the BMP) are now dismantled for targets or donated, for example, to Nigeria.

MBT - new Type-99 and old 96, in the inner districts there are still Type-62 late, Type-69 late, Type 85, Type 88 and others. But every quarter they are actively written off and converted into targets / are recycled.

In general, if you take the ground forces, then again it is incorrect to say Soviet. This is the same Soviet as Italian, French, German. They initially chose Europe as a model in wheeled vehicles (and even the legendary three-axle vehicle, which was sold to the UN and more than 30 countries with the involvement of Europeans) and in the 80s they already had a human DO with an exit through the back door. They are trying to combine the caterpillar tracks of the Soviet and Western schools. For example, modular repair, with the transfer of the engine and transmission directly into the field, is very quickly applied to all equipment. Emphasis on LMS and communication. In doing so, they take on a dense layout and high firepower from the Soviet side.

[darkesstcat]

Is there a full article on the Chinese ground forces? It is interesting to read what they drive and what is the percentage of new technology.

[Zaurbek]

Yes, but what is the percentage of new technology and what are the groundwork for the Soviet one? Look at the exterior of the Aircraft Carriers ... Fighters ...

[Nexcom]

H-6 and its derivatives like never Tu-16 at all, yeah ...
it's so modern right from the Chinese partners .... And I won't even talk about the copies of the transport workers. Recently they just rolled out the "new" one. sir, however ...

And they do not really want to fly "their own". The fifth generation is still without Chinese engines.

[Zaurbek]

In some ways they have advanced further than us .... and do not forget, they simultaneously copy and master Western technology.

[Nexcom]

sooner or later they will learn to do their own thing - I have no doubt about that. but habit is second nature. tyrili and will tyrit.

[darkesstcat]

Everyone is tyrat, why make mistakes if others made them for you?

[Zaurbek]

They have already come to the point that they have to do their own ... By BMP and armored personnel carriers they are already ahead of us.

[Nexcom]

you are right, all countries except Zimbabwe, Congo, Zaire and the like are engaged in industrial espionage to one degree or another.
Aaa, Monaco is definitely not stealing developments yet. they just don't need it.

[darkesstcat]

You just need to look at the history of the Soviet weapons school, how they came from copying to their own pro-wu.

[donavi49]

Well, right there we are talking about SV? Which side to the Tu-16?

New aircraft carrier closer to Kiti Hawk with 3 catapults and no springboard

The destroyer is also its own, and there is more likely a western reference point - a single VPU set, integrated into the radar superstructure.

Again, if you take the Air Force, then there is a mix of our own, Western and Soviet / Russian. However, there are also direct clones - Su-27, MiG-21 (already everything), Su-30, Su-33. But for helicopters, they order either outsourcing, or a French school, or copy-paste from the Americans.

The fact that the transport is new is generally a classic. They have already been delivered more than Shoigu dreams of getting by the year 27, while this transporter flew later than 476 products, while this is the first aircraft of this class for China, they have not previously built such machines in the country, they only bought.

And here a different approach is still manifested. In Russia, they like to lay a project for which the industry is not ready, and many units and assemblies are also in the project or production is only planned. This leads to wild time-stretching, delays, cost overruns, teaspoonful release. China, on the other hand, uses a different approach, laying down those projects for which the industry is ready and already in the course of work, modernizing, creating a new project, already at a higher level using experience, everything that came out to be stolen. of all that came out to advance.

[Overlock]

Quote: donavi49

They have really rearmed themselves seriously. Moreover, the army is in their tail, after the Fleet, the Strategic Nuclear Forces, the Air Force.

All the same, do not persuade the "hat-takers". The process has been under way for a long time and China is in isolation. There are flaws in some positions, but for some reason I am sure they will be corrected

[Vadim237]

What process went on for them - they themselves will do little and develop from scratch, because it is not profitable for them it is much easier and faster for them - it is much easier and faster to steal from others what has already been worked out and create their own similar clone and hybrid, and this is in everything and they are from this will not go anywhere.

[Vadim237]

Theirs Type 99 is the same T 72B in body kits. All other equipment is entirely clones and hybrids of ours and the western ones.

[sleeve]

Exercises "West-2021" showed that the Russian army is still using gunpowder and the laws of physics. What do the Chinese comrades (who are not particularly comrades) blame for us? For the fact that a well-made weapon is still in service? Let me then admire the Chinese Air Force for example. Those who do not understand why they use Soviet technology, but on such a scale that our Air Force never dreamed of (and in the same age category, I have not seen a single MiG-19 without a pedestal). In general, have not Chinese comrades / non-comrades often started to urge us on, and look for dark spots? It looks especially funny when they enter into this business on a completely alien clearing of high technologies. Fight with the most modern iPhones and "talking cubes" jasper you are ours.

[rocket757]

Chinese Sohu: Exercises "West-2021" showed that the core of the Russian army is still Soviet-designed weapons

And what is wrong???
The ancestors left us a serious touch ... not for centuries, of course, but they have not yet raised everything, realized and used what is stored there in the storehouses!
For exercises, not a combat period, this is enough, although the process of re-equipment, retraining, should go on as usual !!! Standing in one place, at the achieved levels, is dangerous!

[bar]

the basis of the Russian army is still Soviet-designed weapons. "

The Chinese are simply jealous of the fact that Russia still has a Soviet design school, and that the Soviet groundwork for development has not been completely wasted. With Chinese econimics and Soviet developments, they would have moved mountains.

[skif8013]

If you remove everything that they brazenly stole from the Chinese army, then they will only have axes. And after that they dare to open their mouth ?! Without having their brains, they steal openly, windbag !!!

[novel66]

well, right, it is more reliable

[Bez 310]

"... the basis of the Russian army is still Soviet-designed weapons."
This is exactly what it is, and none of the incantations of the "best" Defense Ministry that "the RF Armed Forces have the highest percentage of modern weapons and military equipment among all the armies of the world" does not change the matter.

[75 Sergey]

Well, if they haven’t come up with anything better yet, then why not?

[Bez 310]

Quote: 75Sergey

Well, if they haven’t come up with anything better yet, then why not?

A bit wrong, right - if you still haven't been able to come up with anything.
Hence the question - why couldn't they?

[Viktor Sergeev]

And like the Chinese, something different or newer. The whole world is sitting on weapons 30 years ago, but modernized.

[75 Sergey]

And the basis of Chinese ... unfortunately.

[Prisoner]

Why doesn't it just work? Don't use Chinese.

[Cat]

Um .. And the basis of the Chinese army is the weapon of whose development?

[S WITH]

no need to be hysterical, the Chinese are absolutely right, for 30 years the liberals in power led by Putin have only learned to lay pipelines and buy yachts and palaces in NATO

[Cat]

don't be hysterical

You, apparently, do not really understand the meaning of the word "hysteria"

[Nafanya from the sofa]

And absolutely all Chinese equipment is either full clones, or damaged, or slightly modernized copies of Soviet weapons of the same time.
"I can't even see a log in my own eye"

[Zaurbek]

We can even say more: we cannot reproduce serially some of the USSR developments. IL76, for example, or GTU for ships or theater for transport workers.

[S WITH]

"Why produce? We will all be brought for resources" - Gaidar

[Vadim237]

From the Soviet - in the Il 76A 90, almost nothing remained there, even the chassis tires are made of other rubber.

[Zaurbek]

And yet ... ... 60 years have passed

[Sigbiern]

Well, as it were, he's right about something, a huge number of T62 tanks appeared there thanks to Russia, even the inscriptions (Don't let go of the hill) did not have time to be erased.

[Irek]

And you have copies of this "old" weapon.

[dimy44]

For some reason, all forum participants are fixated on comparing Chinese technology, but the author is clearly making fun of Russian technology in comparison with NATO technology

yet its characteristics cannot be compared with the advanced weapons of NATO countries.

It would be interesting to read competent comments in this direction (because he himself is not special in this).

[rotfuks]

What are the latest achievements of NATO all about? Is this the same military bloc that the Taliban, armed with small arms, flooded out of Afghanistan and even the NATO side special forces were forced to disguise themselves as women in order to reach the planes?

[S WITH]

NATO is conquering countries with the help of traitors and embezzlers, and Russia is full of them

[Aurora]

This zhirinovskian page pursuing its, or of anothers ?, agenda defaming chineses, like the windmill parks presented by topwar like ICBM's bases ... Where is the links to incriminated chinese websites, why this stupid public do not pose this simple question ... ?
Finally, the zhirinovskians site and his public want an alliance with confident 'true super-allies' of Russia, like USA, UK, Germany (with and without nazis), Turkey, South Korea, Taiwan and, for many russian otakus of Unit 731 , Japan .... And, sure, the Israeli regime too, very loved by topzhirinovskiwarriors, who plausing his greteast action for the Ilyushin Il-20, who caused less anger in this zhirinovskian public, than some unseeing chinese comments?

[rotfuks]

Tovarisch, have you misled anything? Don't write in hieroglyphs here. This is a Russian-language site.

[rocket757]

do we have many who want to quarrel with China?
Are there many people who want to be friends with the Yankees?
If you count, those who are for yanai are much less.
time passes, the world changes, the dark becomes obvious. The Yankees are a friend only to themselves and to no one else.

[sen]

The main secret of Russian weapons is that it is then most effective when a Russian soldier is attached to it.

[S WITH]

a Russian soldier is nothing if there is no People's Party and Comrade Stalin behind him

[Vadim237]

In modern war, the People's Party and Comrade Stalin are definitely not assistants to the soldier.

[ada]

In any war, even an American one, the soldier was helped and assisted by the People's Party, and some also had the GB (which seems to be the same for everyone, something like that ... in general, no one knows, but it seems to be for them , but for others - it seems like not, or not quite ...). But what if there will be a precedent?

[Vadim237]

"In any war, even the American one, the soldier was helped and assisted by the People's Party." And how did she help him in the war, maybe she saved from bullets or an explosion of an IED on the road or rocket artillery shelling?

[ada]

Quote: Vadim237

"In any war, even the American one, the soldier was helped and assisted by the People's Party." And how did she help him in the war, maybe she saved from bullets or an explosion of an IED on the road or rocket artillery shelling?

No, she either inspired righteous deeds or "gave the right direction and appropriate acceleration," in which there is no time to throw brains, but you can safely scatter them on the battlefield. "

[S WITH]

if you remember the words of Putin that in the USSR only galoshes were produced, it means that the army grew up armed with galoshes, there is no modern democratic Russian weapon, they only make it for export))

[vickul]

"Exercises Zapad-2021 showed that Soviet-designed weapons form the basis of the Russian army."
As, in fact, in China. And on small things all over the world natyril.

[Sakos]

https://zen.me/oP4O4xx5

[Andre]

No need to light up. Square-nested and that's it. And what can come. Let them wait with joy. To our tourists. Do you want to go to America? ..... Join the Rocket Forces.

[Teador]

UP TO THIS TIME, THE TRAINING IS CONDUCTED BY PEOPLE. And in the West, the technology has not been 45 years old. That would have driven 200 thousand people

[ada]

Quote: Teador

. is not 45 years old. to drive 200 thousand people

Almost 41st! It's time not only to drive the troops, but also peacefully sleeping, while you play with the technology, so that there is no bewilderment - how is it that we are not ready again?
Military exercises, as a type of training, are not only used in the system of combat training and combat readiness of the Armed Forces, but are also used to influence international relations.

[Vladimir Vlasov]

All the "rearmament" over the past 30 years is the renewal of the technology park of the 60s and 70s. But the false patriots squeal with happiness that this is the modernization and development of Russian weapons. Or maybe these pseudo-patriots are deliberately praising old technologies so that stupid officials get the impression that the "experts" know what they are saying?

[1536]

Yes, but the strategy and tactics of the Russian army generally come from the 10th-XNUMXth and XNUMXth centuries, drawing ideas from A.V. Suvorov, studying the maneuvers of Field Marshal Kutuzov, the offensive operations of G.K. Zhukov, and not forgetting about the experience of the wars in Korea, Vietnam, the Middle East, Africa and Afghanistan. But by and large, the Chinese comrades are apparently right. We can only guess if the USSR survived, how would its defense industry now equip our army, if even then it outstripped many American and European concerns in the production of weapons for XNUMX years ahead? You look, and the Chinese comrades could learn something for themselves.

[Sergey Melnik]

Well, the Chinese themselves have weapons of Soviet design, but the fact that the converted does not change the essence. Well, God himself ordered Russia to continue using Soviet developments and develop something new on its basis. There is a Russian engineering school and no matter what system it works, the main thing is to work

[Piast]

Whoever hums, they don't copy anything of their own, it's better to keep quiet

[nik131]

And when was the time to create new weapons, when after the collapse of the USSR there was a mess in the country?

[Borisych]

It seems that these Chinese journalists are not very knowledgeable about war and peace. I would like them to take up topics that are closer to them in spirit.

[Vadim237]

They would be better off with their equipment and weapons - solid clones and hybrids at their maximum of 5 percent.

[Codett]

That is, that is, in the presence of mostly Soviet, sometimes modernized, he himself saw two years ago in a convoy on the march along the BTR 60 highway and afigel, although mostly 80 Ki were open, but the MTO hatch was open at all, it was probably the summer, from the cars. ZIL 131 and 66, so the Chinese do not lie, we have a lot of old stuff. After that, I also saw t 72A without dz and Shilka with BMP 1, my friend's son served in the Dalniy. Well, according to the words of his son, a lot of faulty equipment is full and in general there are a lot of breakdowns that are constantly being repaired

[Vadim237]

This is all in service in single copies, everything remained in warehouses and is being sold slowly.

[Nikolay Sayenko]

and who will show the latest developments?