How to put Ilyushin on the wing?

184

Continuing the conversation about the huge problems of the Russian transport aviation, as an example, we can cite the recent report that within the walls of the Ulyanovsk Aviation Enterprise "Aviastar-SP", on the newest production line, a new military transport aircraft Il-76MD-90A was assembled.

This is the first aircraft assembled in Ulyanovsk this year. Hopefully YET first.



In total, eight cars were assembled.

What is the problem here? The assembly has been updated, the aircraft are being assembled and placed at the disposal of the Aerospace Forces. What, as they say, is missing?

It is the planes that are missing. As part of the state order, 2020 Il-39s were supposed to arrive in the VKS by 76. And at the end of 2021 there are only 8 of them.

31 one plane “hovered”, “did not take off”, “moved to the right”. Meanwhile, using the calculator, we get that 8 out of 39 is 20%. The remaining 80% are somewhere outside the framework of the agreement, which was frankly failed.

It turns out that under a contract signed in 2012, the Ministry of Defense received 13 aircraft. Now the contract has been revised, and by 2028, within 7 years, Aviastar-SP will have to build and deliver 14 Il-76MD-90A aircraft. That is, 2 per year.

Perhaps the figure has been adjusted intelligently because 2020 cars were built in 3. It is not yet entirely clear how the situation will continue.

Sergey Sheremetov, director of Aviastar-SP, believes that thanks to the modernization of production, the company will be able to produce up to 12 aircraft per year.

It would be just fine if this is what happened.

In fact, when the first Il-2019MD-76A was solemnly handed over to the military transport aviation of the Russian Aerospace Forces in April 90, everyone expressed extremely positive emotions. At that time, no one knew that out of five cars, which would have to come to the disposal of BTA, one after another, only three would be assembled.

However, it is still sadder than it really seems.

The contract for 39 aircraft was signed in 2012. On October 5, in the presence of V.V. Putin.

Moreover, in the future, the VTA VKS announced the figure of 100 such aircraft. That is, the total number is 139 cars. This, you see, is a very pleasant prospect.


According to the contract, the first aircraft were to be transferred to the Aerospace Forces in 2014. But not in five years, in 2019. By that time, the Aerospace Forces had to fly at least 20, or even 25 aircraft.

However, this did not happen.

The planes did not go into production. But the cost of one car "slightly" increased. From 3,5 billion rubles to 5 billion. Aviastar-SP lost its then General Director Sergei Dementyev, but this also did not greatly affect the process.

Something really went wrong at all.

Meanwhile, for the Ulyanovsk enterprise it does not look very nice. Ulyanovsk today is proudly called the aviation capital of Russia, and in principle, not without reason. Aviastar-Aircraft Production is indeed the largest manufacturer of aviation equipment.

Yes, there is Irkursk, there is Kazan, there was Voronezh ... We will talk about Voronezh, by the way.

But in fact, the plant that produces large-tonnage aircraft from the Ilyushin Design Bureau, which was transferred (to the great happiness) from Tashkent to Ulyanovsk, is a very large manufacturer. Which, we note, was also not very lucky.

Until 2012, Tu-204 was produced in Ulyanovsk, several dozen were produced, after which the aircraft “could not withstand competition with foreign counterparts.” And Russian airlines continued to buy used Boeings.

And the Il-76, in principle, remained the only lifebuoy for Aviastar-SP. It must be said that Aviastar seems to be trying with all its might to survive, cooperatively participating in work on the MS-21, and on the Il-112V, and on the Il-114-300. Repairs "Ruslans" An-124.

But all these projects (except for the repair of the Ruslans) were written with pitchforks in the sky. In fact, what Ulyanovsk can do best is to build the Il-76 in all its variations.

Hence the second life of the far from new Il-76 (after all, since 1975 in service) in the form of deep upgrades such as Il-76M, Il-76MD, Il-76MDM - this is a chance for survival. Not only the Il-76 model itself, but also the Aviastar-SP.

And here the modernization of the Il-76MDM is very timely. The reconstruction has already been mastered, it remains only to extend the service life of the aircraft through modernization.

In general, if you look at the plane, outwardly no changes are visible. Yes, there are fairings behind which the new antennas are located. But most of the modernization involves the installation of more modern equipment inside the aircraft.

Airborne forces this plane will be very useful.

But the aforementioned Il-76MD-90A is somewhat different. This is actually a new set of equipment that was built into the old IL-76 hull. This is a new plane.


Other avionics, other materials in construction, other engines and control systems. Apparently, this was precisely the stumbling block on which Aviastar stumbled. There is a clear inability of the enterprise itself to master the production of the machine in the required time frame.

Gentlemen, "effective" managers can promise mountains of gold and fulfillment of desires as much as they want, but if on-site workers do not have time to understand the processes and assemble cars, then there will be no planes.

The failure of contracts for the supply of much-needed equipment cannot be explained in any other way. Of course, the modernization of production is a very useful and necessary business. Especially if it can really provide 12 cars a year. Well, not 12, at least 8. But not two or three.

The commander of the military transport aviation, Lieutenant General Vladimir Benediktov, estimated the needs of the military transport aviation at more than 100 units. This is without taking into account the Airborne Forces, the Ministry of Emergency Situations, the FSB, the National Guard (possibly) who also use these aircraft.

It turns out not very nice statistics. If we roughly estimate the country's total need for this type of aircraft at 150 units, then even in the case of the promised 12 aircraft per year, the production of such a mass will end in 2034-2035.

The fact that by that time all the modernized Il-76 "tech" production will have already been decommissioned is unambiguous. There is no doubt about that, no aircraft simply can be effective after such a lifetime, no matter how much it is upgraded.

And here the Il-76MD-90A is really the only way out for all operators. But if Aviastar continues to produce 2-3 planes a year, things will start to smell like a catastrophe in some 8-10 years. When the modernized Il-76 will say "everything."

What can be done here, except for emergency measures at Aviastar itself?

It may be recalled that there is another plant in the country, initially focused on the production of large aircraft. This is the Voronezh aircraft building association, a plant that at one time produced Tu-144 and Il-86.

Today, in fact, a huge enterprise is doing about the same thing as Aviastar: everything and nothing. All the same "cooperation" in the MS-21 and Il-112V, and as a means of survival, VASO produces aircraft for the presidential flight detachment on the basis of the Il-96.

And that is all.

In reality, the producer is dying. But work on the Il-76MD-90A can pull the Voronezh plant out of the abyss where it has been falling for the last 10 years. To return life to the plant, to give people work and a decent salary, to keep the engineering staff.

So far, only “effective” managers are getting well at the enterprise. The rest exist, nothing more.

The promises of the Ministry of Defense to order the flying tankers are still promises. An enterprise of this magnitude will not survive on the construction of aircraft for Putin.

If Aviastar-SP is unable to ensure the production of aircraft in adequate quantities, it may make sense to load two similar factories with work. Of course, there will be very, very many problems here, but the way out can be effective.

Today the Ilyushin firm is openly in a fever. Unsuccessful (there is no other opinion yet) work for a large amount of time on the Il-112V, the obsolete Il-76 of the last century ... and in budgets.

But for this it is simply necessary to do something with the factories. Because an aircraft manufacturing enterprise that is not able to produce aircraft is nonsense, with which you really need to do something.

Unfortunately, there is not so much time left for this, as much as the “old men” of the Il-76 can give. This is no more than 10 years. Further, they will have to be replaced by other planes.
184 comments
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  1. +3
    20 September 2021 05: 17
    If there is an effective manager like Rogozin at the head of the corporation, then business will be successful.
    1. +31
      20 September 2021 05: 50
      The aircraft industry is just an industry, that is, a particular, and more obvious, but still just a separate puzzle of the general picture of chaos and collapse.
      1. +37
        20 September 2021 06: 06
        How to put Ilyushin on the wing?
        Replacing the priest (pictured) poorly sanctifies the production - or the sprinkler is defective, Chinese, or counterfeit holy water crying
        1. +2
          20 September 2021 06: 13
          Quote from Uncle Lee
          Replacing the priest (pictured) poorly sanctifies the production - or the sprinkler is defective, Chinese, or counterfeit holy water

          You are this, not this! Do not loosen your grip! You are clearly forced to say that
          1. +10
            20 September 2021 06: 18
            Quote: Stroporez
            Do not loosen the scrap

            I didn't even think! On the contrary - to replace the sprinkler, St. refresh water! feel
            1. 0
              20 September 2021 06: 22
              Quote from Uncle Lee
              I didn't even think! On the contrary - to replace the sprinkler, St. refresh water!

              So you will get to the censer! What a fronder you are wassat
              1. +13
                20 September 2021 06: 25
                "There is a stench and twilight in the church,
                The clerks smoke incense.
                No! And in the church it's not like that
                It's not all right. "

                Here I agree ...
                1. -1
                  20 September 2021 06: 31
                  In religion and its guides to the masses, there is the same confusion and vacillation as in aircraft construction, although a clear rapprochement begins with these distant spheres of human activity.
                  1. +8
                    20 September 2021 07: 34
                    Quote: Stroporez
                    a clear rapprochement.

                    Religious procession under the "Aviamarsh"! belay Great! lol Ukraine smokes nervously on the sidelines! crying
                    1. +5
                      20 September 2021 12: 52
                      Quote from Uncle Lee
                      Ukraine smokes nervously on the sidelines!

                      There, too, priests marched under the march of the Nazis, but ... made up competition.

                      How to sprinkle the missiles before the start of steel, the missiles began to fall ... now it is clear why in August the airplane fall ... they prayed.
                      Or a sprinkler of the wrong color ...
                      1. +1
                        20 September 2021 12: 54
                        Quote: bayard
                        sprinkler of the wrong color

                        Defective caught!
                      2. Alf
                        +1
                        20 September 2021 20: 50
                        Quote: Uncle Lee
                        Quote: bayard
                        sprinkler of the wrong color

                        Defective caught!

                        Chinese ...
                      3. -1
                        20 September 2021 22: 09
                        And why do commentators pull all the skirt over their knees like at a venereologist's appointment?
                        1. There are no civilian products in Ulyanovsk.
                        2. The state has no money to speed up production.
                  2. Alf
                    0
                    20 September 2021 20: 50
                    Quote: Stroporez
                    In religion and its guides to the masses, there is the same confusion and vacillation as in aircraft construction, although a clear rapprochement begins with these distant spheres of human activity.

                    Didn't the priests take off from their holiness?
          2. +4
            20 September 2021 08: 16
            the guarantor and its deficits. In the full video, he hopefully mentioned that Ilyich is to blame for this? And then the topic is somehow not disclosed.
          3. PPD
            +3
            20 September 2021 11: 15
            Do not loosen the grip!

            This is before him.
            Either in the 19th or in the 20th century, opinions differ. There is an opinion that now the movement along a zigzag sinusoid is approximately up. Although not accurate .. laughing
          4. -6
            20 September 2021 20: 15
            I will answer at once to two of your previous messages - collapse and chaos (the first) - what do you suggest? Are you really against spiritual bonds (in a good sense of the word)? I poke at Putin and the existing government, but when you are rushing against the spiritual bonds (one might say spiritual community) of the Russian people ... you arouse in me at least irritation and suspicion that you are not Russian.
            1. Alf
              +5
              20 September 2021 20: 57
              Quote: Sergey Averchenkov
              but when you are rushing against the spiritual bonds (one might say spiritual community) of the Russian people ...

              Church-institution of faith. Believe it or not, no one will say a word to you; if you want it, don't believe it, it's also your own business. But I dare to remind you that in Russia the church is officially separated from the state. And when the ROC begins to climb into the state, this is no longer true. For example, this should not be.

              These are no longer braces, it is called differently.
              1. 0
                20 September 2021 21: 02
                I myself am an atheist and meant something completely different ... Russian spring ... There is a Russian spirit, there is a smell of Russia ... and so on. Moreover, if some Russians are pagans in me, this will not cause any rejection.
                1. Alf
                  +1
                  20 September 2021 21: 05
                  Quote: Sergey Averchenkov
                  I myself am an atheist and meant something completely different ... Russian spring ... There is a Russian spirit, there is a smell of Russia ... and so on. Moreover, if some Russians are pagans in me, this will not cause any rejection.

                  I absolutely agree with you.
                  1. 0
                    20 September 2021 21: 06
                    That's nice - thanks.
                    1. Alf
                      +2
                      20 September 2021 21: 08
                      Quote: Sergey Averchenkov
                      That's nice - thanks.

                      Not at all, it's always nice to talk to a sane person. hi
              2. +3
                20 September 2021 21: 18
                These are no longer braces, it is called differently.


                This has been called pharisaism since time immemorial.
                1. +2
                  21 September 2021 01: 30
                  Quote: dauria
                  called Pharisaism.

                  From all of the above, the conclusion was drawn - the church is not of help to aircraft construction! negative
                  1. +1
                    21 September 2021 05: 13
                    Well, explain to me, sirom, how the church helped the aircraft industry? Scientific research, technical support, intelligence? Not ? Funny and sad .....
                    1. 0
                      21 September 2021 09: 52
                      Well, explain to me, sirom, how the church helped the aircraft industry?


                      Polikarpov was a deeply religious person. He did not advertise, but did not hide it either.
                      This is under the Soviet regime, doing a serious job. This alone was enough to push the person aside.
                      So "atheism" can do as much harm as the church. wink
                      1. +2
                        21 September 2021 10: 28
                        Just above Alf has covered this issue well ... hi
                      2. 0
                        21 September 2021 11: 12
                        Just above the Alf ...

                        An atheist and an alien are the same thing for biology. The human brain is so arranged by natural selection and evolution - it needs protection from irreversible damage. Faith is one of the defenses. An atheist - or he is lying that he has never asked God for anything in his life. Or life didn't really take it by the collar. Or really an alien - a person with an already damaged brain.
                        Normal brain function is when “I don’t believe now, there’s no time.
                        All over the world, aviation is developing, and people's faith in God does not bother anyone. wink
                      3. +1
                        21 September 2021 12: 31
                        Quote: dauria
                        Atheist and alien

                        Alf (nickname) is not even an alien, but Vasily, the USSR! No need to juggle. Faith is a personal matter of a person, but you don't need to impose your faith on anyone .... Moreover, there are so many of them, religions and trends in them.
                        Cheers!
                      4. 0
                        21 September 2021 15: 03
                        but don't impose your faith on anyone ..

                        You guys are lousy atheists. laughing Confusing medicine and pharmacies where it is sold. The medicine (faith) is vital, there is no substitute. Pharmacies (religions) offer it. They both compete and impose. Otherwise they will not survive. Turn on the TV - continuous advertising of retail chains, banks, parties. So why take offense at churches of all stripes? Okay, at least they do without shooting while they are being held by the collar.
                      5. +3
                        21 September 2021 15: 09
                        Quote: dauria
                        The lousy atheists of you

                        I do not impose anything on anyone! Unlike advertisements on TV, radio and elsewhere.

                      6. Alf
                        +2
                        23 September 2021 20: 49
                        Quote: dauria
                        Pharmacies (religions) offer it. They both compete and impose. Otherwise they will not survive

                      7. Alf
                        +2
                        23 September 2021 20: 44
                        Quote from Uncle Lee
                        Alf (nickname) is not even an alien, but Vasily, the USSR!

                        Thanks to ! I took this nickname in memory of my Doberman.
                      8. 0
                        21 September 2021 18: 55
                        He did not ask, even when his son was killed, he did not curse. You are either stupid if you do not understand that there is no God, or you are pretending ... I think you are pretending - most likely you are an agnostic (your faith, just in case, what if there is?) from faith. In short, demagoguery.
                      9. 0
                        22 September 2021 07: 48
                        Talk about things that you have not the slightest idea ... Discuss. Just do not impose your opinion
                      10. Alf
                        +2
                        23 September 2021 20: 47
                        Quote: dauria
                        An atheist - or he is lying that he has never asked God for anything in his life.

                        Every person believes in something. But the "dense" peasants said so, We believe in God, but why do we need the church? And there is a second wisdom, real wisdom - faith not in the church, faith in the soul. 273 * also shines in the church, but about his faith I am tormented by vague doubts.
              3. -3
                21 September 2021 12: 50
                you are a Jew, yes.
        2. +1
          20 September 2021 10: 25
          It is NECESSARY that finances and their flows are not controlled by liberals. They have all the tasks they solve with the prefix NOT. Do not allocate, do not give, no. As citizen Medvedev said, the representative of our state: there is no money, but you are holding on.
          1. +9
            20 September 2021 10: 36
            Quote: SKVichyakow
            IT IS NECESSARY that finances and their flows are not controlled liberals. They have all the tasks they solve with the prefix NOT.

            There are no liberals, there is a corrupt government and shifting responsibility to some mythical liberals is sheer stupidity.
            1. +2
              20 September 2021 16: 42
              The entire financial bloc consists of liberals, + Nabiullina. To deny this is sheer stupidity.
              1. 0
                20 September 2021 16: 44
                Quote: SKVichyakow
                The entire financial bloc consists of liberals, + Nabiullina. To deny this is sheer stupidity.

                It is sheer stupidity to forget who appointed them! And this is not gone out and not the 125th convoy!
                1. 0
                  20 September 2021 17: 22
                  Wow. And what "smart" one put them there? And why did we forget that they are liberals, like the red-haired Chubais ?.
                  1. 0
                    20 September 2021 17: 27
                    Quote: SKVichyakow
                    Wow. And what "smart" one put them there?

                    Appointed by the president is his authority.
                    Quote: SKVichyakow
                    And why did we forget that they are liberals, like the red-haired Chubais ?.

                    Patamushta many fellow citizens have a short memory, like aquarium fish.
                    1. -3
                      20 September 2021 19: 21
                      Thank you for your self-criticism. And why did he appoint them, because they are a brake on the development of Russia? Only for control with the United States, through them?
                2. Alf
                  0
                  20 September 2021 20: 59
                  Quote: Stroporez
                  Quote: SKVichyakow
                  The entire financial bloc consists of liberals, + Nabiullina. To deny this is sheer stupidity.

                  It is sheer stupidity to forget who appointed them! And this is not gone out and not the 125th convoy!

                  And who calls himself a liberal.
        3. 0
          14 December 2021 22: 10
          Uncle Lee - Old joke. but on the topic: GDP evokes the spirit of Stalin at a seance and complains to him - the economy is collapsing, no one knows what to do - is it possible to somehow rectify the situation?
          The IVS answers - follow the program of only three points and everything will work out, the points are as follows
          1. Shoot the entire government in full force.
          2. To send the entire State Duma, up to the cleaning ladies, to felling.
          3. Paint Lenin's mausoleum green.
          VVP was sincerely surprised - why paint the mausoleum? IVS - well, I knew that there would be no questions on the first two points. wassat
          With Aviastar, it's about the same - until the entire top of this sharashka sits on bunks - there will be no planes
      2. +12
        20 September 2021 06: 06
        We need really confident steps to ensure that the IL aircraft take their rightful place as in the skyand in budgets.
        just come on like this Roman: in the HEAVEN. "heaven" is like ... Paradise! Yes
      3. 0
        21 September 2021 13: 25
        The problem here is not in the production of the aircraft, but in the financing - how many aircraft the Ministry of Defense actually pays for and produces so much per year, and the same is with everything.
    2. -5
      20 September 2021 08: 31
      If there is an effective manager like Rogozin at the head of the corporation, then business will be successful.

      And, so Rogozin has to pull up a bunch of subcontractors?
      As the components were cut off for us from behind the hillock, everything got up. Because entire institutions in the West were engaged in the collapse of the aviation industry of the USSR, and it was not in vain that they ate their bread.
      Now almost everything has to be created from scratch.
      1. +1
        20 September 2021 09: 36
        They just need blah, blah, blah. Too lazy to go to the Aviastar website and read how it works. The assembly line has 10 docking pads for the fuselage elements, starting from the 8th it is already a full-size glider.
      2. Alf
        +4
        20 September 2021 21: 00
        Quote: lucul
        Because entire institutions in the West were engaged in the collapse of the aviation industry of the USSR

        Yeah, Westerners are to blame for everything ... And who introduced these values ​​HERE? American too?
    3. 0
      16 November 2021 15: 33
      They raised a cry that the wings were not right. But after all, it stands well on wheels and you can even walk it a little here, here, from here.
  2. +11
    20 September 2021 05: 37
    But for this you just need to do something with the factories.

    And the factories have nothing to do with it. We need to do something with the management, then the factories will start working
    1. +14
      20 September 2021 06: 54
      in Ulyanovsk, the entire management has good money - the line may be up to 20 per year, but they are so good. By the way, the workers are not enough, they are constantly recruiting workers
      1. +7
        20 September 2021 07: 56
        "all management has good money"

        It's all over the place. They get pretty good money, but on the checkpoints there is a constantly running line: turners are required .. milling operators .. operators .. locksmiths ..
        hi
        1. +5
          20 September 2021 09: 25
          Wanted, required, required!
          But ... where can I get them?
          There are not enough pre-retirees and retirees for everyone. Migrants? Well, yes ...
          Good morning Ivan!
          1. +7
            20 September 2021 09: 43
            Good morning Sergey! Migrants do not go to factories. They also need money. They are more in the markets, in public catering .. where there is real money
            1. +5
              20 September 2021 10: 55
              A migrant milling machine operator? Turner 6 grade? Well, probably there are some, but how old are they? wink
              1. +1
                20 September 2021 12: 02
                "Milling migrant?"

                Yes, it sounds funny))
              2. Alf
                +2
                20 September 2021 21: 07
                Quote: Phil77
                A migrant milling machine operator? Turner 6 grade? Well, probably there are some, but how old are they? wink

                Only if a migrant from a neighboring city.
                Otherwise it will be like with a taxi driver-
                Take me to Mirnaya Street.
                Will you show me the way?
      2. +1
        20 September 2021 09: 37
        Yes, at first they were laid off, and then they recruit. And where to get them specialists, young people have only recently gone to study.
        1. +11
          20 September 2021 10: 19
          There is a specific proposal: to set the retirement age - 100 years.
          This is how many specialists can be saved. wassat
          But seriously - "it's too late to drink Borjomi" and the elections have clearly shown this.
          The Kremlin is making a mess.
          1. +1
            20 September 2021 10: 30
            Yes, the elections really showed the full power of the Communist Party, to increase its presence in the Duma by 5-10 deputies according to party lists. And they frankly scored about single-mandate candidates. For that, the Communist Party is already overjoyed.
            1. +8
              20 September 2021 10: 35
              Time has also shown the absolute and complete uselessness of the Duma for the needs of the people. And what's the difference how many places will be taken by idlers from different parties ?!
          2. 0
            20 September 2021 19: 48
            Quote: prior
            But seriously - "it's too late to drink Borjomi" and the elections have clearly shown this.
            The Kremlin is making a mess.

            The turnout in the elections is about 50%, taking into account the three-day and, including remote, voting - this directly indicates that the people are tired of being turned on .... negative
  3. +13
    20 September 2021 06: 00
    Much has been said about effective managers, but not a word about specific reasons.
  4. +10
    20 September 2021 06: 06
    They say that someone deliberately destroyed our aircraft industry!?!?!?
    If only now, they began to purposefully restore it, REALLY !!!
    And, yes, the fish rots from the HEAD!
    1. -3
      20 September 2021 08: 31
      They say that someone deliberately destroyed our aircraft industry!?!?!?
      If only now, they began to purposefully restore it, REALLY !!!

      How much does it cost you guess? )))
      1. +2
        20 September 2021 08: 45
        Quote: lucul
        How much does it cost you guess? )))

        I'm a fortune teller what ... no one will give exact numbers, it is NOT POSSIBLE! But on some problems, especially important, significant, the layouts have already been shown, considered, by those who are experts in this ...
        These are already numbers ... of the scale available to the state or mega, mega, corporations. Those. collect all the yachts of the oligarchs, sell and ... 0, 0 **% of the required amounts.
        Boom with realists, we wish the impossible ... although, anything is possible, if ...
      2. Alf
        +3
        20 September 2021 21: 15
        Quote: lucul
        They say that someone deliberately destroyed our aircraft industry!?!?!?
        If only now, they began to purposefully restore it, REALLY !!!

        How much does it cost you guess? )))

        It costs a hell of a lot, but here's a "little" fact

    2. +2
      20 September 2021 09: 42
      If the owner of Aviostar started as a fitter, then there is nothing to worry about. hi
      1. Alf
        0
        20 September 2021 21: 17
        Quote: tralflot1832
        If the owner of Aviostar started as a fitter, then there is nothing to worry about. hi

        Do you know a lot of Russian billionaires who started from scratch?
        1. 0
          20 September 2021 22: 16
          hi I know one billionaire, the owner of Norebo. He started from scratch. Orlov Vitaly Petrovich, born in 1965. In 1991 he graduated from the Lenin Komsomol Higher Naval School, specializing in Navigation. In 2017, his fortune is estimated at $ 800 million.
          1. Alf
            +3
            22 September 2021 20: 25
            Quote: tralflot1832
            In 2017, the fortune is estimated at $ 800 million.


            Honest Russian business ...
            1. 0
              23 September 2021 06: 56
              Stepakhno is the 1st secretary for the Murmansk region of the Communist Party. For his electorate, he can say anything. The fishing business in Europe is very rigid and controlled by trade unions, any attempt by an entrepreneur to buy fish products at dumping prices from Russian fishermen is strictly suppressed. From refusal to unload fish to radical method, will fill the hold of solarium. The price for cod I can say is 1900 -2100 $ a ton. What is half the price, a fishmonger selling his fish at half price? , pay for the stevedoring work and the berth and, most importantly, a decent salary for the crew. The prices were quoted in 50-400, when I went to sea. You can believe him, but I was cooking in this boiler and I don’t believe a word of Stepakhno. Therefore, when the elections were held, and I was in the commission on the steamer, the communists gained a maximum of 2000%. In honor of the EP and for some reason the LDPR. When he was younger he always came to Murmansk and Severomorsk and believe me when there are no cameras at Oh, a completely different man. And Norrebo is one of the largest fishing companies in Russia, working on excellent ships and using modern technologies with a thousandth staff with a decent salary with five zeros a month, and then in position. The fishermen immediately stopped voting for the communists with the collapse of the USSR and they are unlikely to change their minds.
  5. +8
    20 September 2021 06: 08
    So emotional that continuous mistakes and misprints, how to blame unprofessionalism by showing it so much yourself?
  6. +9
    20 September 2021 06: 21
    Each problemma has a name, surname, patronymic (I.V. Stalin)
    1. +10
      20 September 2021 07: 46
      Each problemma has a name, surname, patronymic (I.V. Stalin)

      Somewhat wrong. "Every accident has a surname, name, patronymic and position" L.M. Kaganovich, People's Commissar of Railways.
    2. 0
      21 September 2021 13: 34
      The problem is in subcontractors and financing - how much Aviastar JV pays for so many planes, it produces the same situation and with components, how many sets have been delivered and assembled, and no matter where else you are going to transfer the construction of similar planes - without the above, it will be the same.
  7. +12
    20 September 2021 06: 25
    You can put on the wing if you specifically deal with business, the leaders.
    They talk and write a lot about the professional suitability of the tops, but who brought them to the enterprises?
    And the second question: there has not been a change in generations of ITRs, blue-collar occupations, training systems, etc. It takes 5 to 10 years to get a normal mechanic of mechanical assembly work. In the 90s, workers' professions were driven into the underground, and today we slurp the absence of engineers, mechanics, power engineers, locksmiths, electricians, welders, we are bringing tractor drivers from Tajikistan!
    1. +11
      20 September 2021 06: 49
      Quote: Vadim Ananyin
      today we are slurping the absence of engineers, mechanics, power engineers, locksmiths, electricians, welders

      And also doctors, agronomists, ..., ...
      The entire training system has collapsed. Moreover, the collapse did not begin in the 90s (inertia was still in effect in the 90s). The collapse began somewhere in the mid-to-late XNUMXs. And, as it should be, nonlinear, but with acceleration. Systems generally collapse with acceleration. The emergency house stood for itself, stood for several years - and then suddenly collapsed (literally in a matter of seconds, a real example of one of the buildings of the Krasnoyarsk Polytechnic University). Snow lay on the slope, lay - and then suddenly came down as an avalanche.

      In my opinion, it will take 15-25 years to restore the education system to the Soviet level, if you start right now. Here you write
      Quote: Vadim Ananyin
      It takes 5 to 10 years to get a normal mechanic of mechanical assembly work.

      And getting a good microbiologist, for example, takes about 15 years (5 years in a university + 10 years of work in a specialty). How long does it take to train a good engineer or doctor? And first you need to prepare those who will cook. Because the current generation of teachers (we who graduated from universities in the USSR and those whom we trained) are already largely demoralized. So 15 years is, perhaps, I am too optimistic. About 25 years, perhaps.
      1. Eug
        +12
        20 September 2021 07: 15
        In the undergraduate course, a comrade who is highly respected by students with extensive experience in developing complex control systems clearly explained to us that a qualified engineer can be considered one who goes through two cycles - concept, development, design, launch into production, operation, refinement and analysis - what was intended what happened in the end and why exactly what was intended did not work out. He allotted 14-16 years for this ...
        1. +2
          20 September 2021 07: 17
          Quote: Eug
          He allotted 14-16 years for this ...

          Willingly believe.
      2. +8
        20 September 2021 07: 30
        I completely agree with you. Different specialists require different preparation times. When they fouled all the Soviet clever people did not think how it would return, but the Soviet had to be modernized and not completely destroyed.
        1. +4
          20 September 2021 08: 45
          Quote: Vadim Ananyin
          When they fouled all the Soviet clever people did not think how it would return, but the Soviet had to be modernized and not completely destroyed.

          And it turned out again, "we will destroy the whole world to the core, and then ...."
        2. +5
          20 September 2021 11: 41
          They just perfectly understood everything, their goal was to destroy, Red Chubais said very frankly about this
      3. +10
        20 September 2021 07: 53
        And getting a good microbiologist, for example, takes about 15 years (5 years in a university + 10 years of work in a specialty). How long does it take to train a good engineer or doctor? And first you need to prepare those who will cook. Because the current generation of teachers (we who graduated from universities in the USSR and those whom we trained) are already largely demoralized. So 15 years is, perhaps, I am too optimistic. About 25 years, perhaps.
        It's not about time, but about the desire and organization of the process. It is clear that an engineer is not a locksmith, but he can be trained in a fairly short time. Only now there is no motivational part, young people do not have a spark for such professions, and they are paid more than modestly, first it is necessary to return respect for such work, for education. Then talented people will become engineers.
        1. +7
          20 September 2021 09: 28
          Quote: stalki
          It is clear that an engineer is not a locksmith, but he can be trained in a fairly short time.

          The participant with the nickname Eug disagrees with you, see.
          Quote: Eug
          In the undergraduate course, a comrade, very respected by students with extensive experience in the developer of complex control systems, clearly explained to us that a qualified engineer can be considered one who goes through two cycles - concept, development, design, launch into production, operation, revision and analysis - what was intended what happened in the end and why exactly what was intended did not work out. He allotted 14-16 years for this ...

          And I completely agree with this opinion. You need a specialist grow, long and hard. And in a "short time" you will only get a laboratory assistant who knows how to press the right buttons, but is not able to create something new, and is not even able to understand why the buttons suddenly stopped pressing.
          1. 0
            20 September 2021 13: 58
            And I completely agree with this opinion. A specialist must be raised, long and hard. And in a "short time" you will only get a laboratory assistant who knows how to press the right buttons, but is not able to create something new, and is not even able to understand why the buttons suddenly stopped pressing.
            And I mean talented people. So, you do not quite understand me.
            1. +4
              20 September 2021 14: 16
              Quote: stalki
              And I meant talented people.

              A talented person also needs to be trained. And even longer than a mediocre one.
              Quote: stalki
              So, you do not quite understand me.

              As a person who became a doctor of biological sciences & a professor precisely because of his talent, and who prepared four very talented candidates of sciences (two of whom were called to very decent foreign laboratories before their defenses), and who continues to train personnel here and now, I understand very well. Once again, spell it out. Talent for the realization of his talent must be prepared much longer and more thoroughly than mediocrity.
              1. 0
                20 September 2021 15: 53
                Once again, spell it out. Talent for the realization of his talent must be prepared much longer and more thoroughly than mediocrity.
                Longer in terms of prospects, but he will be able to work much more efficiently earlier than the rank and file.
                1. +3
                  20 September 2021 16: 11
                  Quote: stalki
                  Longer in terms of prospects, but he will be able to work much more efficiently earlier than the rank and file.

                  I understand your point, but I disagree. Practice (including my own) shows that using talent as an ordinary link is like hammering nails with a microscope. In principle, it is possible - but you will also break the microscope irrevocably, and you will not hammer in a nail well. Talents are creators of the new, and if they are used as ordinary performers, they will quickly fade. And the performers of them are worthless, to be honest - they are not interested in it.
                  If talent is locked into ordinary performers, then there will be one of three options
                  1. He stupidly escapes.
                  2. He performs a little (at the same time he will very quickly surpass less talented performers), and then he will run away.
                  3. He fulfills, reaches certain heights, becomes disillusioned with life (subconsciously he understands that he is capable of more), and then he gets drunk, or falls into religion, or something else - in general, he will die as a specialist and as a person.
                  Believe me, in my 56 years I've seen a lot of examples (1), (2) and (3).

                  Talent is a very capricious and rare thing. It must be carefully and for a long time nourished and cherished - but the result will surpass all expectations. ))
                  1. +2
                    20 September 2021 20: 25
                    Talent is a very capricious and rare thing. It must be carefully and for a long time nourished and cherished - but the result will surpass all expectations. ))
                    Okay, I give up there is a grain of truth in your words. But motivation is still important. For all. hi
                    1. +2
                      21 September 2021 04: 20
                      Quote: stalki
                      But motivation is still important.

                      And on this I completely agree with you. I would even clarify that motivation is not just important, but necessary. And financial motivation works best. Not even for mercantile reasons (although money is never superfluous), but for the reason “since they pay me money for this, I have to work this money 100%, even if the work is boring and uninteresting - otherwise I will no longer respect myself”. :)

                      PS
                      For "motivation" I gave you a plus. Because (again, in my rich experience), a talent without motivation (best of all - financial, but not necessarily financial) starts doing anything, and will not finish anything.
                      By the way, at one time I was amazed to learn that a number of literary and artistic masterpieces (where the authors are not even talents, but geniuses) were born exclusively due to financial motivation - to the point that the author lost at cards, faces a debt prison, it is necessary urgently earn ... laughing
        2. 0
          21 September 2021 00: 05
          But today we have achieved the result that no one will go to the engineers of ZRP Gouno, you need to think and strain your brain. And so live like a popuas - eat bananas
      4. Alf
        0
        20 September 2021 21: 19
        Quote: Sergey1964
        So 15 years is, perhaps, I am too optimistic. About 25 years, perhaps.

        The main thing is that the process continues.
    2. +10
      20 September 2021 08: 29
      Do you think the leaders understand this? Ours promised to bring a crowd of 4-grade locksmiths in three months. Six months have passed. There are 0 living specialists. Soon pensioners will leave, for whom the GDP has clamped down on indexation, there will be no one to work. No amount of programmed machines and production lines can replace the work of a locksmith making parts for handcrafted aircraft. Specialists of 5_6 categories come, they know how to sharpen, drill and other plumbing crap. But they will knock with hammers on our workpieces up to 12 m long and dump them.
  8. +6
    20 September 2021 06: 26
    Trepachev with large incomes - resign. The production should be headed by professional managers with engineering and design experience and education. Manturova - for the production of masks and rakes.
    1. +5
      20 September 2021 06: 52
      Quote: avia12005
      Production should be led by professional managers with engineering and design experience and education.

      Only they still need professional staff. See Vadim Ananyin's post and my answer to him.
    2. +4
      20 September 2021 06: 52
      Manturova - for the production of masks and rakes.


      Uh-huh, something similar already happened when the titanium was driven over the hill in the form of titanium shovels.
      He will not disappear on a rake - he will figure out how.
      1. 0
        20 September 2021 07: 32
        And the flag in his hands in this direction)
      2. +3
        20 September 2021 08: 40
        Quote: Nexcom
        He will not disappear on a rake - he will figure out how.

        Titanium rake.
      3. 0
        21 September 2021 13: 40
        From the titanium of the USSR, SR 71 was built in the USA - now titanium alloys are on free sale if you did not know and shovels are already being produced from it.
    3. +2
      20 September 2021 11: 08
      Then it’s production and technological experience and education. Looking for someone who grew up from a Manufacturing Engineer. And they are grown initially at the faculties of technology and production. They ripen already in the department of the chief technologist at the factories.
      The Design Engineer knows manufacturing only as a related industry with which he interacts. He's not a specialist here. He grew up in design and engineering departments. Matured in KB.
      1. +2
        20 September 2021 16: 29
        Then it’s production and technological experience and education.

        Both options are good here. But the design is still better, in my opinion - such specialists have a more "strategic" vision of projects as a whole. Without technologists, of course, also nowhere - but they enter development only at the second stage, solve more applied problems, be that as it may.

        In general, even a civil manager can be a good industry leader - if he has a mind, is honest, and really cares for his business (constantly delving into certain production moments). These qualities are the most important - be a manager even from a techie, even an "outsider". But this, of course, is not about the current fanfare ...
    4. Alf
      0
      20 September 2021 21: 24
      Quote: avia12005
      Manturova - for the production of masks and rakes.

      Aren't you afraid that the case will fail?
      1. 0
        21 September 2021 07: 10
        yes, let it be)) we will somehow survive, if we still tolerate it in aviation fellow
  9. 0
    20 September 2021 07: 07
    We need a normal leader who could argue with the ministers and the president if it goes to defend the well-organized work of the enterprise.

    And in our country they will be immediately arrested, fired, and the managers who adhere to the authorities remain. Who, like a Chinese dummy, agree all the time, even knowing the erroneousness of the government's decisions.
  10. +3
    20 September 2021 07: 15
    Aviastar, it will be possible to check on the second aircraft from the new assembly line. The first one left on August 30.08, 2021. It is not long until the end of September. Next to the plant, the Quantorium technopark has opened on the basis of the Governor's Lyceum and will train future aircraft manufacturers from schoolchildren.
  11. +4
    20 September 2021 07: 23
    Is there any positive news from Skomorokhov?
    1. Alf
      +2
      22 September 2021 20: 29
      Quote: avaks111
      Is there any positive news from Skomorokhov?

      And what does Roman have to do with it? He does not invent news, he voices what is happening in the state.
  12. Eug
    +1
    20 September 2021 07: 24
    As for me, it is necessary to recreate an analogue of the military-industrial complex, in what form - let the skulls think, I still see it in the form of a state holding with possible admission of non-state offices in the future. Everyone's problems (Roskosmos, UAC, USC, UEC and others) are practically the same, they need to be solved not at the corporate, but at the state level. But the belonging of the most important enterprises to the Ministry of Trade is nonsense.
    1. +5
      20 September 2021 09: 41
      Quote: Eug
      As for me, you need to recreate an analogue of the military-industrial complex

      There was a super-powerful military-industrial complex in the USSR. The result is a catastrophic lag in electronics, which is very useful from the point of view of the military-industrial complex. I am generally silent about the lag in genetics & molecular biology, which is useless from the point of view of the military-industrial complex (which to a large extent determine the potential of states in the 21st century).
      1. Eug
        0
        20 September 2021 12: 46
        And who says that it is necessary to repeat the approaches of "that" military-industrial complex? It's about the organizational form, but in no case about the approaches, they need to be radically changed. And no one says that it should be a crowded bureaucratic monster. Its task is to identify and solve the problems of development of both defense and basic economic sectors. Coordinating "head", flexible and intelligent ...
        1. 0
          20 September 2021 14: 22
          Quote: Eug
          Its task is to identify and solve the problems of development of both defense and basic economic sectors.

          As for the defense - I will not argue. But the defense industries and basic economic industries have very little overlap. For example, one of very the basic economic industries now are biotechnology (in the broad sense of the word, from the medical and food industries - to the extraction of metals from poor ores, bioconversion of waste, and bionanotechnology, which is rapidly developing right now). It is this industry that determines what we eat and how long we live. So, this branch has nothing to do with defense from the word "absolutely".
          1. Eug
            +2
            20 September 2021 15: 01
            Has - as one of the ways to create materials with unconventional physical properties. These are new materials for turbine blades (aviation, marine, energy), body armor, gunpowders (fuels), optical electronics, military medicine (recovery of the wounded, medicines, water purification, sanitary and hygienic measures), etc. So everything is interconnected.
            1. -2
              20 September 2021 15: 42
              Quote: Eug
              Has - as one of the ways to create materials with unconventional physical properties. These are new materials for turbine blades (aviation, marine, energy), body armor, gunpowders (fuels), optical electronics, military medicine (recovery of the wounded, medicines, water purification, sanitary and hygienic measures), etc. So everything is interconnected.

              Doesn't have.
              First, there were large-scale studies on this topic. With numbers, facts, examples and so on. The conclusion is unambiguous - the military-industrial complex is not the locomotive of progress. MIC is strong brake progress. For citizens of the former USSR, this conclusion seems absurd - but this is only because in the USSR titanic money and specialists were poured into the military-industrial complex in comparison with other industries.
              Secondly, as a specialist, I know that 100% of biotechnologies, which determine our life here and now, and will further determine life in this century, have nothing to do with the military-industrial complex.
              Thirdly, I (as a microbiologist & biotechnologist) had a relationship with the military (with those who commission research in the interests of the military-industrial complex). And we (we, because I was not the only one in the team there) even completed the order. So, nafig such customers. I have something to compare with - I also worked for civilian customers (and continue to work here and now). If the military-industrial complex suddenly turns to me with an order again, I will send them as politely as possible.
              1. Eug
                +1
                20 September 2021 16: 26
                You are talking about the real version, I - about how it should be. And I am not saying that the military-industrial complex is a generator of new technologies, but it is obligatory to monitor their emergence and the corresponding use of the structure of the military-industrial complex. Ideally, of course.
                1. +1
                  20 September 2021 18: 00
                  Quote: Eug
                  You talk about the real version, I talk about how it should be

                  I'm not arguing. And I sincerely (honestly, sincerely, and without the slightest hint of mockery - and in my circles they respect me, including for my pathological honesty), I respect your position and your point of view. But I believe that your position is a utopia. And yes, I know that my "I think" can be wrong. But at the current moment my "I think" I believe is correct and supported experimentally.
                  1. Eug
                    +1
                    20 September 2021 22: 27
                    I completely agree with you about utopia. Alas....
              2. 0
                20 September 2021 17: 26
                Each mouse praises its hole ... Biotechnologist, what will you feed in the near future?
                1. +2
                  21 September 2021 04: 09
                  Quote: Andrey VOV
                  Each mouse praises its hole ... Biotechnologist, what will you feed in the near future?

                  In the near future - what we are feeding now. Almost everything that you buy in grocery stores is made either by 100% biotech, or with a decent contribution from biotech.
                  By the way, are you aware that edible citric acid is not made from lemons, but produced biotechnologically (most often the producer is the Aspergillus niger mold)? The same goes for other edible organic acids. And in general, somehow, for the sake of entertainment, I walked through a grocery supermarket in order to find a product that biotech did not have a hand in. I wanted to show students at the laboratory on agricultural biotechnology, with a pedagogical purpose ("But here biotechnology did not have a hand! Let's think together how we can apply."). Not found.
              3. Alf
                +2
                22 September 2021 20: 33
                Quote: Sergey1964
                Doesn't have.

                1. The civilian industry spacecraft coating came out in the form of a non-stick cookware coating.
                2. The famous gel pens are again a cosmic product.
                3. I won't talk about the Internet ...
                4. As well as about jet passenger planes ...
                This is just what came to mind.
  13. +5
    20 September 2021 07: 24
    The article is very superficial, they said that there was a guard, but the reason was never revealed. Something tells me that if 2 more enterprises are additionally loaded with work, then the exhaust will be the same - 2-3 aircraft per year.
  14. 0
    20 September 2021 07: 28
    Why can't they do more?
  15. +17
    20 September 2021 07: 30
    How many words - and all in vain. The most important thing is missing - an analysis of the reasons that caused the delay in production.
    For example: no funding; cannot establish in-line assembly; there are not enough components (engines or duralumin or electronics); insufficiently qualified labor force, etc. Then, for each item, it will be possible to do something specific, which will lead to an increase in production. TAPOiCH at one time produced 3 aircraft per month.
    ps
    transferred (to the great happiness) from Tashkent to Ulyanovsk plant, producing large-tonnage aircraft Ilyushin Design Bureau

    Nothing was transferred from Tashkent to Ulyanovsk. Several hundred highly qualified specialists left for Ulyanovsk. And that's all.
    1. +2
      20 September 2021 08: 13
      Quote: Nafanya from the couch
      How many words - and all in vain. The most important thing is missing - an analysis of the reasons that caused the delay in production.

      .
      Recently, Roman has had at least three out of five articles in the format of a grandmother on a bench at the entrance.
      In essence, it is only muddy water. Everything is bad, something needs to be changed, the putinoids have pissed off the country, etc., etc. As a result, the people are systematically charged with negativity and the desire to demolish this state (country), to the delight of our overseas sworn partners and local liberals.
  16. -3
    20 September 2021 07: 46
    Woffka and his team. Quite expected. As in other areas, complete failure and powerlessness. But offshore companies are already bursting with dough.
  17. +4
    20 September 2021 07: 48
    So far, only “effective” managers are getting well at the enterprise. The rest exist, nothing more.
    This is the root of all troubles, and not only in production. The boss should receive a salary from the worker, and not as it is now. There are no results, but there are frenzied salaries for managers. And this is all called the market economy?
  18. +1
    20 September 2021 08: 07
    I believe that if they did not gather it, then the forces were thrown in a different direction. When you really want to, mega-bridges, nuclear submarines, and military camps beyond the Arctic Circle are being built at an accelerated pace. It is clear that cadres decide everything and there are a lot of pants wipers in our leadership. But if these shots are not taken by the gills, then apparently not so hot.
    1. +2
      20 September 2021 17: 12
      In essence, it is only muddy water. Everything is bad, something needs to be changed, the putinoids have pissed off the country, etc., etc.

      Quote: Al_lexx
      It is clear that cadres decide everything and there are a lot of pants wipers in our leadership. But if these shots are not taken by the gills, then apparently not so hot.

      So who should "take by the gills", if not from above ??? Who appoints these cadres? Who owns the UAC, after all?

      After all, you are actually contradicting yourself - first, accusing the author of "criticizing the authorities", and then himself voicing the problem that directly dependent on the government.

      Quote: Al_lexx
      When you really want to, mega-bridges, nuclear submarines, and military camps beyond the Arctic Circle are being built at an accelerated pace.

      They just did not completely lose their competence in these areas in the "troubled times", that's all.
      But in those dilapidated industries that "effective managers" are not able to restore (there is no way to come to the ready, you really need to think there !!!) - we even famously exempt imported foreign aircraft from VAT from hopelessness (https: // ria.ru/20190929/1559257526.html). An excellent "present" for domestic aircraft manufacturers, isn't it?
      1. -2
        21 September 2021 14: 31
        Quote: Citizen is simple (almost)
        So who should "take by the gills", if not from above ??? Who appoints these cadres? Who owns the UAC, after all?

        After all, you are actually contradicting yourself - first, accusing the author of "criticizing the authorities", and then himself voicing the problem, which directly depends on the authorities.

        You look for contradictions where there are none. The impression is that even without having read to the middle of the text, you are already with a saber bald, against all the bad ... smile
        Reread what I wrote again. Maybe you can figure out what there is. wink

        1. I do not accuse the author of criticizing the authorities. I reproach the author that he muddies the waters, raises a storm in the people's glass and thereby plays into the hands of our sworn partners who sleep and see in a sweet dream how our people are knocking down the barricades.
        2. I do not defend the authorities and have never defended them (sometimes I scold them, especially for education), because no (no where and never) power can satisfy everyone. And the tasks of the authorities are completely different, such as preserving the state (you propose that the supreme power become a supervisory body, i.e. replace the TFR and the prosecutor's office))). I say here that neither you nor me a priori can know the true reasons why certain projects are carried out in the format of the Stakhanov assault (there are enough examples), and which ones are in small steps.
        3. I almost surethat if cargo ilyukhs were immediately and urgently needed, they would be riveted like blown ones. I suspect the modernization is ongoing. Plus, they are waiting for a new engine. And what is being released now is something like a transitional version. I will repeat myself. We don't know all the reasons. For example, one of them is the insufficient moral and material interest of the workers. Now it is not fashionable to be a skilled worker. In my youth, being a 5th grade worker was prestigious and financially (by the way, I was and earned more than most middle-level engineers). Nowadays it is prestigious to be just such an effective talker in a Mercedes. Where do the working dynasties come from when there are buzovs, galkins, malakhovs and other dandruff dom2 (by the way, I don’t overwhelm the box, and I don’t have one, for almost 25 years now)?

        Yes, not all our managers are good. No question. But the phrase about "effective managers", who are to blame everywhere and for everything, has already turned into a mantra (like - all men, etc.), which suggests a certain narrow-mindedness of the interlocutors, when it is easier to churn out semantic clichés than to wrinkle a turnip and think about why this is so, and not otherwise. Everything that seems to us is always exactly what it seems. Maybe someone told us what it is and someone is interested, what would we think so?


        ZY If you know exactly which industries are dilapidated and which are not, then why are you not in the government, but sitting here on the forum? smile
        1. +1
          22 September 2021 00: 02
          I reproach the author for muddying the waters, raising a storm in a people's glass and thereby playing into the hands of our sworn partners

          The "sworn partners" have completely different "claims" to our government.

          And, you must agree, the fact of criticism of our government by "sworn partners" does not in any way negate our own right to criticize this power already from within the country.
          Or, in your opinion, we must now "in solidarity be silent in a rag" just because these would-be leaders of ours are also criticized by foreign politicians? Or, in your opinion, without our criticism, they will "correct themselves out of shame"? I don't understand this logic of yours, seriously.

          And no need here all these horror stories about the "barricades" that have set the teeth on edge, please. For this, it seems, no one here calls. Criticism of the authorities (fair criticism !!!) is not at all a call for some kind of disorder. This criticism only says that if the government is unable to cope with all these problems, let it either change or give way to others. Everything is exclusively in a peaceful way (if, of course, they really care for the country, and not just for their asses warmed up in the "bread places") ...

          Quote: Al_lexx
          For example, one of them is the insufficient moral and material interest of the workers. Now it is not fashionable to be a skilled worker.

          That's right, not fashionable. Because "poor", to put it mildly.
          And who is responsible for the salaries of state employees?

          Quote: Al_lexx
          Yes, not all our managers are good. No question. But the phrase about "effective managers" who are to blame for everything and everywhere has already become a mantra

          I would even say more - almost all state managers are worthless, they work only "for themselves." With rare exceptions.

          And the phrase about "effective managers" - so it is just right here, this is not a cliché, unfortunately. Planted from somewhere on the left, people at random "optimize costs", about which there are hurray-reports to the top. Then these people receive good salaries for their "imitation of violent activity" - solid promises. And at the exit of figs with butter.

          Quote: Al_lexx
          I am almost sure that if cargo ilyuhs were immediately and urgently needed, they would be riveted like blown ones.

          More precisely -- would do their best to pretendthat "riveted as undermined." A lot of things have already been "riveted" in hurray reports. But for some reason, everything with them is eternal in the future tense ...

          Quote: Al_lexx
          If you know for sure which industries are dilapidated and which are not, then why are you not in the government, but sitting here on the forum?

          Apparently, because I am not a politician, my work is much more loved and interesting to me. And I'm not even going to get close to this whole cesspool (especially the current one). Otherwise, in order to exterminate the current jackals, you will have to become a jackal yourself for a while. And this is not in my principles, the breed is not the same ...
          Suddenly how, huh? wink
  19. +3
    20 September 2021 08: 21
    Voronezh needs to be raised using the basic product - IL-96. Refuellers based on the 96th, IL-96-500 transporter, modernization of the passenger version for internal lines, with all kinds of benefits and preferences for customers
    1. +1
      20 September 2021 16: 56
      due to the basic product - IL-96. Refuellers based on the 96th, IL-96-500 transporter, modernization of the passenger version for internal lines

      Yes, these 96s are not needed, there is nothing to live in the past. The plane was almost obsolete at birth. Made for the harasteristics of the 767th, but with 4 engines. As a passenger carrier, it is more unprofitable than Boeing, Airbus and MS-21, if it will ever be. As a tanker and a military transport operator, he is unlikely to cope with the infrastructure of military airfields, the Il-76 in this sense is much more promising.
      with all kinds of benefits and preferences for buyers
      Why should these privileges be given to private cabbies and passengers at the expense of taxes, when it is possible to carry more economical planes without any privileges and also receive taxes to the budget?
      1. 0
        20 September 2021 17: 28
        Are you a specialist aviator or engineer? Boldly declare so ...
        1. +1
          20 September 2021 18: 13
          An engineer, not an aviator. The economic indicators of our, however, the Tu-204/214, not the Il-96, and foreign aircraft had to be compared in the working process.
          And all the rest are well covered in various publications. And global trends are quite obvious. Everything is obvious about passenger planes. Even for the A-380 there was no decent place, the B-747 is fading away, the A-340 has not become a bestseller, the MD-11 and the other three-engine wide-body ones have long been forgotten, they remain in noticeable quantities only in converted transporters.
          As for tankers, the same tendency for A-330, KS-46, KS-767 for Japan is twin-engine. It is clear that we do not have the corresponding Western engines to make a tanker or a transport vehicle with two engines, but the Il-96 is the last century.
          1. +3
            20 September 2021 18: 59
            You do not have the correct view - our production is being turned down and you are proposing to completely turn it down. IL-96 last century - quite right, but B-737 is the same last (mossy) century, but its economy was tightened. I will not cover the promising ways of the IL-96 development. It looks like you are aware of all the avian airs, but pay attention to what modifications I suggested starting to develop production - from those for which 4 engines are not a defect but a merit, and you can ch.z. government order to release a decent series
            1. +1
              21 September 2021 16: 23
              I understand what you are driving at. I myself am for our country to be a great aviation power. But this requires a state approach to business, a strategy for the development of the industry and, above all, state-oriented officials, starting with the president. And for a capitalist country like the Russian Federation, it is also a state-oriented business. But I am not sure that our government and our business need a highly competitive high-tech industry that requires huge investments and does not imply high margins. Now (for the last 30 years), we have favored projects focused on quick returns or on the presence of corruption prospects.
              The proposed path by you only masks complete degradation, it is good for a picture on TV to show that something is improving there. It is exactly what the KLA and the government are implementing. And no kind of production will save such an approach. 1 plane in a year or two is not what the plant was built for. 50 billion allocated for the redesign of the aircraft, designed in the 1980s, could be spent on projects that are really needed and have prospects.
              Production is bent - this is, of course, bad! But artificially prolonging the life of a useless model will simply postpone the death of this production and that's it. Nobody needs the IL-96, only to carry the GDP, but this is not a goal. And they didn’t pull up any economy, here you are in vain. And the engine is the same, a slightly different modification, and the fuel consumption is practically the same, the same 3 crew members, which has long been nonsense. No breakthrough. It is necessary to say thank you to the Il-96 and forget about the further development of this project. There is no need to spend budget money on it, especially since it is not known how much money is being laundered. It is necessary to look for other ways to save production, besides useless ones.
              The Il-96 does not need to be compared with the 737, the fourth generation is already flying, and each time it is a completely new aircraft only with the same index (as we had Tu-4 and Tu-22M, for example).
              Therefore, for Voronezh, the organization of the release of the new Il-76 would be quite an option as a transporter, tanker and special models (AWACS, VKP, etc.). Moreover, if you believe the article, the capacity of Ulyanovsk will not be enough to cover even the needs of law enforcement agencies, and the aircraft may have an export potential for the military transport aviation and cargo carriers of third world countries. You might think how much it is in demand to convert the previously built IL-96 into transport aircraft. It will also support the plant if such a project was once miscalculated. But building new ones is not a good idea.
              And with an industry-oriented approach, it is better to direct all efforts to the implementation of the MS-21 project, this is by all indications a world-class project. The Il-114 is badly needed to replace the An-24. And already there to send benefits, subsidies, etc. budget money.
  20. 0
    20 September 2021 08: 35
    So far, only “effective” managers are getting well at the enterprise. The rest exist, nothing more.

    Paradox or sabotage?
  21. +5
    20 September 2021 09: 15
    Well, with the black-haired man in the forefront, of course, we will raise him from our knees. At this rate, pilots will soon learn prayers instead of flight manuals.
  22. +2
    20 September 2021 10: 31
    Over the past 10 years, he changed 5 jobs.
    Moreover, the situation at each new job is worse than at the previous one.
    All enterprises have implemented a quality management system ISO 9001, but it works like in that joke about a basket of eggs.
    Who has not heard, I repeat.
    The man turned to the Lord with the question: "Why did you give me 32 teeth and only one member. Can you do the opposite?"
    The Lord pondered.
    "So can you or not?"
    After a long thought, the Lord replied: "I can, then I can. I just don't know where to sprinkle a basket with eggs."
    The quality management system imposed on the industry is the same basket of eggs. And he interferes with work, and does not allow a man to have sex.
    And who can cancel it? What's the point of her? And resources are spent on it immeasurably.
    Something like this.
    1. 0
      20 September 2021 17: 29
      Like you, I changed several places, but I never heard of this ISU, although I worked in real production and now I work ..
  23. +4
    20 September 2021 11: 05
    "Further they will have to be replaced by other planes."
    this has been heard everywhere for about 15 years.
    Then Karaulov was counting down the time when the industry dies out. THAT Indians entered the IL, waited 10 years, did not wait and left. then import substitution, etc.

    Zero sense. We can assemble a bit of IL, SU 57 or Armat by hand. And yet there is no mass ...
  24. 0
    20 September 2021 12: 32
    IL-76 will be relevant for a long time, especially in the new version. There is no alternative. It is not realistic to develop a new aircraft. The Il-112 has to be finished and finished, then we need an average one of 20 tons, and we need to think about the heavy, instead of Ruslanov. And here we have an aircraft with half a century of operating and application experience, but with new engines, avionics and simplified assembly. Do, and do, let 8 pcs. a year, and delight our friends. Overseas. This is not only a transport, but also a tanker, and AWACS, and VKP ...
  25. +1
    20 September 2021 14: 46
    About Ulyanovsk - everything is clear. The question is for Ilyushin. Where is the promised PAK TA? The same age as the Il76 - S141 - withdrawn from the US Air Force in 2006 15 years ago. And we can't screw all new (not really) engines to the old plane ...
  26. +1
    20 September 2021 15: 36
    at the enterprise only "effective" managers get good money. The rest exist, nothing more.

    Roman, excuse me, but this situation is not only at a single Aviastar, it happens at all enterprises. As it was said in a private conversation by a representative of the then owner about 15 years ago - why would we raise the salary of all 3000 workers by 2-3 thousand each, it would be more profitable to raise it by 25000 for the director, and he would force the rest to work for a minimum wage.
  27. 0
    20 September 2021 16: 28
    I have a stupid question: Why do we need a new plane to replace the IL-76, if we can do with modernizing the old one?
    Question: What fundamentally new can be obtained from the new aircraft model?
  28. 0
    20 September 2021 16: 45
    For example:
    1. to withdraw all foreign-made aircraft from foreign registration,
    2.Taxes of AK, which operate them, to raise, to exempt from taxes AK, working on domestic salolettes,
    3. In a couple or three years, prohibit foreign cars on domestic air transportation.
    4. to provide aircraft manufacturers with government orders.
    1. +1
      20 September 2021 17: 31
      Directly all at once to enter? And what to fly then, while there is no domestic fleet, these are thousands of aircraft ..
  29. 0
    20 September 2021 16: 49
    Ilyushin is the bomb that the Bolsheviks planted under Russia.
    If there were no Bolsheviks, there would be no Ilyushin.
  30. -1
    20 September 2021 17: 56
    Correct sentence. I agree with the author. Competent article!
  31. +4
    20 September 2021 18: 11
    Quote: prior
    Over the past 10 years, he changed 5 jobs.
    Moreover, the situation at each new job is worse than at the previous one.
    All enterprises have implemented a quality management system ISO 9001, but it works like in that joke about a basket of eggs.
    Who has not heard, I repeat.
    The man turned to the Lord with the question: "Why did you give me 32 teeth and only one member. Can you do the opposite?"
    The Lord pondered.
    "So can you or not?"
    After a long thought, the Lord replied: "I can, then I can. I just don't know where to sprinkle a basket with eggs."
    The quality management system imposed on the industry is the same basket of eggs. And he interferes with work, and does not allow a man to have sex.
    And who can cancel it? What's the point of her? And resources are spent on it immeasurably.
    Something like this.


    Well, I will add, as I studied this ISO system ...
    ISO 9001 is generally a useful thing.
    But!!!!
    When introducing this system in our country, they begin to do everything for the sake of production, but for the sake of this ISO .. Everything simply starts to become bureaucratic - any movement must be covered with a document !!!! And as a result, a lot of resources are spent on maintaining this system in operation.
    In general, what is ISO 9001 - and this is common sense put in a bureaucratic framework !!!
    You read the ISO documentation and everything is clear. and again BUT !!!
    But, when implementing ISO, they forget about why the implementation is in general.
    And then the question arises - is implementation done only for the sake of obtaining a certificate or is it being implemented in order to improve quality ???
    Working with a partner who has implemented ISO becomes problematic, he has instructions for every step from which no one leaves .. The people seem to become zombified. Step left to right - figs you !!!! Simply ISO begins to prevail on reality !!!
    And no matter how funny it sounds, but common sense, which is the basis of ISO, ceases to be it!
    1. +1
      21 September 2021 02: 30
      Quote: Evgesha
      they forget about why the implementation is in general.

      You have looked into the very essence. And unfortunately, this can be said about a lot of things, starting from the violent computerization of everything and everyone, and ending with the "everyone's favorite" 1C, including turning off analog TV when turning on digital broadcasting - it seems like a good idea, but in fact it is not always good ...
  32. +3
    20 September 2021 18: 11
    The author drives not childishly! Aviastar built the An-124 for which it was created, and the Il-76 has never been its competence, because Tashkent produced it and ... suddenly, they transferred, rather dragged and with great difficulty, the production of the Il-76 to Ulyanovsk and Aviastar became the coolest in the production of this resin ... And then, the newest production line ... as much as 3 resins a year ... Yes, much more of them were collected on stocks in the USSR!
    1. 0
      21 September 2021 13: 50
      In the USSR, funding was much more on orders and components were supplied regularly and not intermittently as it is now in view of the sanction of new certifications of their equipment and everything else.
  33. 0
    20 September 2021 19: 50
    Some of Skomorokhov's statements are simply a masterpiece!
    Since when is Aviastar the largest manufacturer of aviation
    technology in Russia? During its existence, this
    the plant produced less than a hundred aircraft. For this (by the way
    the most important) indicator, it is orders of magnitude inferior to any
    to another aircraft plant in the former USSR.
    This plant never worked fully, and it is not clear
    when it works.
  34. +1
    20 September 2021 20: 37
    hmm, the line was launched, debugging began .. but no, you need to chop everything up and transfer it to another plant .. ingenious ... and how do you differ from "effective managers"?
  35. 0
    20 September 2021 22: 25
    Everyone knows that the fish rots from the head, and our fish's head rotted long ago. Appoint stupid people like Rogozin at the head of entire industries and for which they can not ask only or a traitor. And all our problems with the military aviation and the air force and the navy and the country as a whole are growing from here.
  36. 0
    21 September 2021 08: 48
    Such powerful enterprises cannot be destroyed in a relatively short period of time. The collapse went on for years, even decades. A new generation comes and it needs to be trained, Teaches partly the older generation. 30 years have passed and we cannot develop and manufacture domestic wide-body aircraft. Now there is a big, very big problem in higher education. Time will pass and we will train personnel for our industry abroad. It is necessary to think about this now.
    1. +1
      23 September 2021 15: 37
      Whom to think about? Those who do not go to the polls, under the pretext "that everything has already been decided there," or those who were engaged in stuffing and falsification? There is no one with us, Friendly to think! Subservience and infantilism - this is the reality of Russia!
  37. 0
    21 September 2021 12: 05
    The article is emotional. Quite a fair claim. But I still do not understand what is missing from this list for a normal series?
    Other avionics, other materials in construction, other engines and control systems.
    Or maybe there are no skilled workers? Or is there a problem with finances?
  38. 0
    22 September 2021 00: 15
    Ilyushin has clearly a future as a brand, but needs to analyze well the demand in civil markets, prioritizing the offer towards the main demands over the marginal demands, identifying well in which size segments the main demand is of aircrafts, and in which size segments the main demand is of helicopters, abandoning the late if necessary because the development of aircrafts is too expensive to create redundant projects with only marginal demand.

    The Russian Armed Forces acting like customer, in the refered to the heavy auxiliary material, to be used by nature only in non-contested areas, would do well paying attention with open mind to the solutions succeding in the civil markets, in order to save budget for the combat material. Really need not to impulse redundant projects, instead of just taking civil products with minimum modifications for military use in non-contested areas ..

    And in the referred to the combat use of the transport aviation, something clearly necessary at least for the airborne troops, the Russian Armed Forces need to find the safest, most modern and most effective solution, contributing to its development and becoming the main customer. The project that I liked most for it would be the Il-PAK-TA.

    Actually we can say that the entire fleet of current auxiliary aircrafts can be considered outdated for missions of combat air transport in contested areas (the same for the United States and the rest of countries), but a good number of aircrafts like the Il-76 / 72/82 / Be-A50, the Il-62, the Il-86/80/96 and the Il-18/20/22/24 remain conceptually modern for auxiliary air transport purposes in non-contested areas (like the An -124, Tu-154, Tu-204/214, An-10/12, Tu-134, Su-SJ, Yak-42 and Tu-334). These aircrafts, some of them veteran, are not far conceptually of other modern current projects for auxiliary air transport like the Il-276, Il-90 and the Il-106 / PTS-80 / PAK-VTA (and like the MS-21 / Yak-242, SLON / PTS-160, CRAIC CR929, Tu-304 Frigate Freejet, Tu-330 and Tu-230), that would not do much better if used for combat air transport in contested areas.
    1. Alf
      +1
      24 September 2021 19: 31
      Quote: eehnie
      Ilyushin has clearly

      Is it possible in Russian?
  39. 0
    23 September 2021 15: 34
    Shoot! First son, then dad ...
  40. +1
    23 September 2021 18: 56
    For that we like to smear Ukraine))
  41. +1
    24 September 2021 13: 34
    "Gentlemen," effective "managers can promise mountains of gold and fulfillment of desires as much as they want, but if the local hard workers do not have time to understand the processes and assemble cars, then there will be no planes." "Effective" managers need to be removed from everywhere until they have ruined the whole of Russia. And real professionals should lead, as in the USSR, who went from the machine tool and from the plow to the leader. The Kalashnikov concern finally realized this and removed the showman.
    1. Alf
      +3
      24 September 2021 19: 29
      Quote: tank64rus
      And real professionals should lead, as in the USSR, who went from the machine tool and from the plow to the leader.

      And where to get these? (Sarcasm). Pros are not needed now, now the price is right for loyal slimes. So what if they are stupid, but loyal.
  42. 0
    27 September 2021 11: 40
    Rather not how, but who. An extraordinary person is needed here. A sort of Kutuzov of military transport aviation. Should feel "like a fish in water", both in the industry itself, and in "court intrigues" near those in power.
    As far as I understand, the country has gradually got rid of such people, tk. they hindered the emergence of a new class of oligarchs.
  43. 0
    28 September 2021 20: 30
    Everything is lost!!!!! laughing
    Skomorokhov was brought to us wink
  44. 0
    29 September 2021 12: 34
    Considering that fighters and bombers do not have such problems, then involve their leadership. And so in our country, huge structures are successfully functioning, linking many enterprises and tens of thousands of people in production cycles, and all this functions like a clock. And somewhere there is no order within one plant.
  45. 0
    29 September 2021 13: 49
    Rogozins, and son and dad to Siberia, to fill the foundations of future million-plus cities. Then maybe Ilyushin will take off !!!
  46. 0
    24 October 2021 21: 57
    There is a radical way - to call a foreign CEO with a team. Let him come and fix it if our hands grow incorrectly. This often helps - GAZ has significantly improved its performance by calling in the Swede. AvtoVAZ is ruled by the French. It is necessary to call a German to Ilyushin (from where Airbus has live assembly lines and production culture).
  47. 0
    14 December 2021 16: 32
    But all KB in a "heap" are collected or shifted, if you want! Rogozins, "Taburentkins", Slyusari there are different fussing around until the time allotted for them is up ... They are trying for their loved ones, so to speak!
  48. 0
    26 December 2021 20: 03
    Sorry for Ilyushin, the legendary bureau. But the problems of this company are only a consequence of the ruined economy and education.
    Even if they provide funding, there are few specialists, and if they can even design, then assembling the planes is already a huge problem. But if you give the task to design a BRAND NEW plane, then nothing but the "managers" saws will get.
    And in aircraft construction, as in mechanical engineering in general, new developments are constantly needed. Companies grow and develop only while they come up with and master new industries and technologies. Enterprises cannot exist for a long time if all their activities are only repairs and unsystematic modernization of equipment. The development and release of new technology is what propels the industry forward.