Military Review

On the comparison of aircraft of "different generations" of the Second World War

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Today, the countries with the most powerful and well-armed air forces are trying to saturate the fleet of these same air forces with a new generation of aircraft. So far, only three countries in the world have independently developed and started production of generation 5 fighters. These are the USA, China and the Russian Federation. At the same time, dozens of Chinese J-20s continue to fly on Russian-made engines.


The presence of the new generation aircraft provides a hefty air superiority in the case of using their basic functions. Today, the number of Generation 5 fighters is led by the United States, with the total number of F-22s and F-35s in the hundreds.

And what about the superiority of more modern fighters over less modern ones during the Second World War? Although the official division into generations did not yet "legally" exist, it was de facto. After all, there were aircraft during the war years that were developed in the mid-thirties, and there were those that were created during the war.

In the video on the SkyArtist channel, a variant with the Soviet I-16 and Yak-1 against the Messerschmitt Bf.109 is considered. So, the Yak-1 made its first flight in 1940, and the Messer three years earlier.

Boris Yulin argues about the comparison of aircraft of "different generations" that were operated during the war years:

12 comments
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  1. serguei france
    serguei france 12 September 2021 23: 17
    +1
    Comrade Yulin, I agree with your reasoning, but a logical question arises: how our pilots on aircraft of the old generation destroyed before November 1941 as many enemy aircraft as the Luftwaffe had on June 22, 1941. By the way, the greatest losses of the Germans in aviation were in 1941. Erns Udet committed suicide in November 1941, seeing his losses and the fact that it was not possible to destroy the Soviet aviation. That is, our pilots inflicted enormous damage on German aviation even on outdated aircraft. Please reveal this aspect.
  2. swzero
    swzero 13 September 2021 07: 29
    +1
    The yak-1 has very little chance against the bf-109f. Oddly enough, the Ishaks of the last series have more of them. The donkey is stronger than the Yak on the vertical, both horizontally, and in the roll and in dynamics (and the cannon donkey is also in the armament). The yak had only a high maximum speed, but for example near the ground, and taking into account the acceleration characteristics, the difference in real speed was small. Actually, in 42, the pilots demanded to restore the release of seagulls and donkeys for this reason - on donkeys and seagulls the pilots had more to survive against the Fredericks and Gustavs, than on new coffins like Yak-1 and Lagg-3 and Mig-3, especially against the background of the fact that their build quality in '42 dropped dramatically and already not high performance characteristics, they became quite sad. The I-41 could improve the situation with materiel in 42-180. But young efficient aviation managers cut off his oxygen. I will also note that the main problem of our fighter aviation was still not performance characteristics, but the lack of normal radio communications and normal VNOS service. The lack of the ability to interact in battle, build up forces, direct aircraft to the target - this reduces efficiency much more than performance characteristics. As a result, ours not only flew on coffins, but also numerically inferior often in local air combat.
    1. Doctor
      Doctor 13 September 2021 07: 52
      0
      The yak-1 has very little chance against the bf-109f. Oddly enough, the Ishaks of the last series have more of them. The donkey is stronger than the Yak on the vertical, both horizontally, and in the roll and in dynamics (and the cannon donkey is also in the armament). The yak had only a high maximum speed, but for example near the ground, and taking into account the acceleration characteristics, the difference in real speed was small. Actually, in 42, the pilots demanded to restore the release of seagulls and donkeys for this reason - on donkeys and seagulls the pilots had more to survive against Fredericks and Gustavs, than on new coffins like Yak-1 and Lagg-3 and Mig-3, especially against the background of the fact that their build quality in '42 fell significantly below the plinth, and without that high performance characteristics, they became quite sad. The I-41 could improve the situation with materiel in 42-180. But young efficient aviation managers cut off his oxygen. I will also note that the main problem of our fighter aviation was still not performance characteristics, but the absence of normal radio communications and normal VNOS service. The lack of the ability to interact in battle, build up forces, direct aircraft to the target - this reduces the effectiveness much more than performance characteristics. As a result, ours not only flew on coffins, but also numerically inferior often in local air combat.

      Air Force organization and tactics are key.
      For example, the "North" army group was supported by 670 aircraft, and in the NWF 1150.
      With a twofold superiority, it was quite possible to neutralize the superiority in performance characteristics.
      1. swzero
        swzero 13 September 2021 11: 02
        0
        Tactics stupidly rests on normal radio communication and VNOS (including radar). Flying in pairs in dispersed orders without normal communication is not possible. The allocation of hunters and air clearing groups is also. So they flew on patrols and direct escort, giving the initiative to the enemy and not being able to build up strength in battle. Pokryshkin's new tactics became possible only due to the presence of excellent radio stations on the aerocobra. When in the same place, on the Kuban in the spring of 43, Savitsky, in his corps flying on yaks, tried to use them, nothing really came of it. Those. the key step between the planes of the 30s and 40s was not in LTTH, but in the appearance of normal communication, and later radar, which made it possible to radically change the tactics of use. The same miserable harrikeins, which IMHO according to LTTH were much worse than donkeys, thanks to communications and radar, showed themselves quite well in the battle for Britain. Even though the Germans did not have a radar on the outer front until 43, the surveillance and radio interception service was very well developed - for each radio station on the plane, there were several radio stations on the ground. We could only dream of this at the beginning of the war due to the lack of materiel - both the quality and the number of radio stations were completely insufficient.
        1. serguei france
          serguei france 13 September 2021 13: 55
          0
          And your reflections have a great reason, especially since the I-16 was produced in 1942, and they flew even longer. Without communication, it was already difficult to fight in that war, an indisputable fact.
          1. swzero
            swzero 13 September 2021 15: 09
            0
            The I-16 was not produced in 42. The evacuated plant N458 at the beginning of 42 assembled 83 UTI-4 units in a tank. These were the last serial I-16s. In parts, they fought for themselves and in 43 year. For example, in 4 Guiap KBF. And they fought quite well. Judging by the memoirs of Golubev, they managed to solve the problems with radio communication by this time, which had a positive effect on efficiency.
            1. serguei france
              serguei france 13 September 2021 18: 07
              0
              "And they fought quite well." ...
              1. swzero
                swzero 13 September 2021 21: 30
                0
                Well, according to the recollections of the pilots, donkeys of late types with emils could quite normally butt - if not on an equal footing, then with good chances of success. Against Frederick, of course, everything is much worse - only to meet in the forehead, to catch at the exit from the attack with a set is much more difficult. But again, it all depends on the situation. For example, when escorting attack aircraft in 41-43, our fighters (even new ones) could do the most they could to turn head-on at the attacking Frederick / Gustav, or build a defensive circle over the silts (if the silts are also in a circle). Actually, for these purposes, a donkey and even a seagull were better suited than yaks and even more so laggi. Firstly, the star defended the pilot in frontal attacks, and secondly, the maneuverability and power-to-weight ratio are higher - it is easier to fend off enemy attacks and return to duty. In a battle between fighters, again not being able to echelon the battle formations and greatly yielding in vertical maneuver, it all came down to a defensive circle / swarm (the Germans met such a description) and meeting the attackers head-on. Those. here again donkeys and seagulls did not look better. But as for the interception of strike vehicles, then yes, for example, against the ju-88 and bf-110, bf-109e (in 41, the emil was already used mainly as a fighter-bomber / attack aircraft), gulls and donkeys sometimes had problems with in order to catch up - here the new aircraft had the advantage. The Stuky and Henkeli donkeys were quite catching up. You can read on the topic of Golodnikov's interview in "I fought in a fighter", the memoirs of Golubev from 4th Guyap and, for example, Rechkalov (although he fought on a seagull).
                1. swzero
                  swzero 13 September 2021 21: 53
                  0
                  Well, Archipenko also has memoirs about how he fought on a seagull.
                2. serguei france
                  serguei france 13 September 2021 22: 02
                  0
                  June 22: Except for our destroyed planes at the airfields, the Germans claim that they shot down 322 of our planes in air battles and antiaircraft guns. "'However, amid chaos, confusion and outright bungling, Soviet pilots managed to meet the enemy with dignity. According to some reports, in air battles that unfolded from the Baltic to the Black Sea, they shot down 244 enemy aircraft in a day." if this is true, then everything was not so bad.
                  1. swzero
                    swzero 13 September 2021 22: 43
                    0
                    I think if it were not for the disabled vehicles at the airfields (I’m not even talking about the morning of June 22, but about the systematic attacks of the Germans throughout the day and in the following days), the Germans would have laid down most of their aviation in June. But alas - again, everything rests against the materiel - we did not have anti-aircraft guns in the required quantities to cover the airfields. If our airfields were covered by the Ministry of Defense, as the German Germans left half of the shock troops there on 22 June. Well, again, they did not have time to deploy a normal network of airfields before the war (due to the lack of construction equipment and vehicles, including the lack of technologies for building pre-fabricated airfields), which is why the planes were not even able to take out from under the blow.
                  2. swzero
                    swzero 13 September 2021 22: 53
                    0
                    As for the losses, there are, for example, interesting memoirs of V. Dirikh from the KG-51 "Edelweiss" flying the newest Ju-88s. On June 22, his squadron lost 15 full crews as a whole, and for example, only its 3rd group - 14 aircraft irretrievably (shot down or written off due to damage) - or 50% of the number:
                    In the evening, after the last plane landed at 20.23, the squadron commander, Oberst Lieutenant Schulz-Hein, at his headquarters in Polyanka Castle, in Krosno, summed up a disappointing result.

                    Sixteen flight personnel (15 full crews) were killed or missing; in group III alone, due to damage, 14 aircraft were unserviceable or crashed and were completely destroyed - loss of 50%. In other groups, the situation was a little more comforting. ...
                    By the way, the official German data does not recognize the loss of such a quantity of ju88. This is by the way about the reliability of the official German losses. But it is worth noting - part of the losses are due to our own new cluster fragmentation bombs, which were very dangerous for German aircraft, but at the same time were very effective in strikes against airfields