Military Review

Shoigu's formula: a new trip to Siberia

236

The idea of ​​developing the Siberian expanses on the basis of the creation of scientific and industrial centers, voiced by the Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation Sergei Shoigu, sounds bright. But with a detailed analysis, the question arises - does an extraordinary initiative have real prospects?


Taiga project


Siberia will grow by cities! One would like to alter the famous saying of Mikhail Lomonosov. The leader of the United Russia list, Russian Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu, announced a large-scale project for the new development of the expanses of Siberia and the Far East.

Its zest is the construction from scratch of several large cities, scientific and industrial centers with a population of 300-500 thousand, and better - up to a million people. The accompanying line is the construction of transport infrastructure, which will additionally connect the West and the East of the country. Moreover, the leader of "Edra" believes that the capital of Russia should also be moved to Siberia.

You can understand Sergei Kuzhugetovich - he comes from Siberia, the taiga is his home, he understands and feels it. In addition, the situation obliges - elections are on the way, people's confidence in the "leading" party is at a minimum, its rating is frankly low. Of course, it is possible to draw the numbers during the voting. But how to live on - the problems roll in a shaft.

Shoigu's formula: a new trip to Siberia
Photo: mil.ru

And here the prospect is clearly visible - the spaces are huge, the territory definitely has resources and potential. After all, the state has voiced calls to go to the East before. The development of virgin lands, the construction of the BAM are global projects, which, despite certain problems and shortcomings, were nevertheless implemented.

Citizens actively responded to the country's appeal - they really went to new jobs: some for dreams, some for love, some for a “long ruble”. But the main thing here was that it was the state that was responsible for financing and creating all the necessary infrastructure for projects. The State Planning Commission system, the five-year plans really worked.

What about now? Planning, as a government approach, has sunk into oblivion. The country's modern economy is based on the interests of certain business groups that operate with the main volumes of finance in the country. The state also has money, but the liberal paradigm stifles any strategic approach.

Look at how persistently the privatization of highways, including federal ones, is going on. They did not want to make the Central Ring Road a public highway, on the Minsk highway they quietly snatched a piece of the highway, turning it into a private business. The strategic road to the south - M4 "Don" is all in business barriers. In other words, after voicing a bright idea about Siberian cities, the question immediately arises - at whose expense will this banquet be?


Photo: Avtodor Group of Companies

It was smooth on paper ...


Very serious things have been declared. Sergei Shoigu says that this is not just about the construction of new settlements in the taiga, but about the development of Siberian macroregions. According to him, new scientific, industrial and economic centers should become

"New poles of attraction, both for the population of all of Russia, and for our numerous compatriots in the CIS countries and far abroad."

Want to be specific? An industrial center "Copper and Electrical Engineering" can be created between Bratsk and Krasnoyarsk, in the same area it is possible to create an "Aluminum Valley", focused on the production of high value added products from aluminum. In southern Siberia, it is possible to organize the extraction and processing of coking coal, near Kansk - to establish coal-chemical production of plastics. The Forest and Building Materials cluster can be created near Lesosibirsk.

All this smells strongly of rhetoric that was widespread in the USSR in the 70s of last year: about territorial production complexes, an associated settlement system, about the location of productive forces and an industrial base as the basis of development. But now it just doesn't work, the basis of the economy is completely different.

In the USSR, new satellite cities and industrial centers were created without looking back at anyone, let alone external competition. The country strove to create a complete set of industries necessary for the national economy.

Modern Russia, on the other hand, has gone crookedly and obliquely into a post-industrial format. This does not mean that it will abandon industrial production, but it will no longer rank them as priorities. The time is different.

Shoigu's formula, in principle, can work, but in the presence of several factors at once. A clear motivation, the availability of human and financial resources, and whatever one may say, a favorable situation in the world markets - the manufactured products must be exported somewhere.

The Minister of Defense spoke about the motivation in sufficient detail.

“Conditions for people living in Siberia should be completely different. After all, why did the idea of ​​building new cities, new agglomerations arise? Because modern cities need proper zoning. Instead of dirty industrial zones and endless traffic jams, there should be well-planned spaces - both for work and for recreation, and at the same time ensuring mobility, ”Shoigu said.

In other words, people should go for new apartments in cozy areas, career prospects and the wonderful nature of Siberia. This may also include preferential mortgages, tax preferences for businesses and a few more "goodies".

Yes, they forgot about the ravines ...


But according to experts, primarily economic geographers, motivation can be quite decent, but the main problem is where to get human resources. Our population mobility is still low. If people do go, then to recognized centers of attraction. These are Moscow, St. Petersburg, and partly the Krasnodar Territory.

This means that, at best, the local population will go to new cities, if they appear. But the problem is that depopulation has been going on in Siberia and the Far East for a long time. During the post-Soviet period, Siberia has lost about 10% of its population, the Far Eastern Federal District - more than 20%.


Siberian tract. Painting by N.F. Dobrovolsky "Crossing the Angara near Irkutsk"

The influx of people is possible only from the existing large cities in Siberia, which themselves are fighting not even to preserve, but to minimize the decline in their numbers. Look at compatriots abroad? The idea is good, but nothing more.

For all 30 years, the Russian Federation has been indifferent to the interests and needs of Russian speakers in the CIS countries. No repatriation program has been implemented. Why would this mechanism work now. And to populate new settlements with migrants from Central Asia will not even be a mistake, but a complete failure of the “bright idea”.

The next problem is financial. During the discussion of the idea with the President of the Russian Federation, the sacred phrase has already sounded: there is no money. But Shoigu said that Vladimir Putin responded as follows:

"They will never be, if you do not start doing something, there will never be money."

In fact, the state has money, in its reserves there are hundreds of billions of dollars, not rubles, but it is terrified of investing it alone. It is easier to convert the profit into gold and foreign currency than to create something real on public funds on your own.

It was no coincidence that the Minister of Defense said that

"The main locomotive of capital investments in the implementation of macroeconomic projects in Siberia, along with state funds, should be private capital."

In other words, those same business groups will take government funds, build new production facilities on them, and, of course, become their owners.

And people who risked breaking away from their homes in new cities will become hostages of the interests of a narrow circle of businessmen in many respects. Whatever one may say, at the first stage, the life of new cities will depend on the well-being of the city-forming enterprises.

And those, in turn, will depend on the situation in world markets. Who can predict whether products from Siberian aluminum, by-product coke or timber processing plants will be in demand in the future? No one.

Road 2.0


But in this "nebula" around Shoigu's idea there are still grains of reason. It is reasonable to start a new development of the Siberian expanses on the basis of further development of the transport infrastructure. The leader of the "United Russia" within the framework of the new "Siberian" program spoke about the project "Cedar tract". The highway should become one of the branches of the Chinese "Silk Road".

"Kedrovy trakt" will pass exclusively through the territory of Russia. It will be a safe transit route, free from the problems of the main Chinese project.

"Cedar tract" is relevant. For twenty years now, the Asia-Pacific region has been simply beating its head against the Russian “gates” with an appeal: give us a modern transport corridor to Europe. It is beneficial to everyone, Russia can make a lot of money on the logistics of goods.

Recent problems on the Suez Canal have made this topic even more relevant. At the just held Eastern Economic Forum, representatives of Asian countries said that they are ready to send significant volumes of goods through the Russian Federation. But our country is still not able to "digest" them.

As one of the Vietnamese businessmen noted at the WEF, the port infrastructure of the Primorsky Territory (the main sea gate of Russia in the Far East) is radically lagging behind the needs of trade. For example, in Vladivostok, it is urgently required to build another port specialized for receiving sea containers.

Container ships from Vietnam are now idle at sea for several months, waiting for reloading in Russian ports. And behind the underdevelopment of the port infrastructure, the problems of the rest of the transport sector are hidden.

Thus, in the east of the country, first of all, modern transport routes are needed, on which "nodes" in the form of settlements will necessarily appear. At first, they will concentrate the population involved in servicing infrastructure and traffic flows.

And already at the next stages, these "nodules" are able to grow, realizing the potential of the adjacent territories, including the resource one. And here is the word for project financing - if investors have an interest in a particular product based on a specific resource base, it will be realized. The availability of transport infrastructure will be a big plus for any endeavor.

And here it is worth taking a closer look at the "Golden Path" project, which has been stubbornly promoted for several years by Oleg Bezrodny, now the president of the "Rustime" association. He advocates in every possible way for the development of the Siberian expanses, but with the help of the creation of a modern broadband highway, which should run from Voronezh to Primorye.

Every hundred to two hundred kilometers, it is proposed to create service centers for servicing transport and passenger flows with elements of tourism and recreation. These "crystals" can just grow over time into something more significant. This approach will be a logical development of territories, in contrast to the infusion of huge funds into the construction of large cities in the middle of the taiga. Better to start small.
Author:
Photos used:
file.liga.net, gallery30.ru, kubnews.ru, kt.kz
236 comments
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  1. Vladimir_2U
    Vladimir_2U 14 September 2021 11: 10
    +6
    Too large-scale for today's Russia and too costly for the current "elite" of Russia.
    1. Kuz
      Kuz 14 September 2021 11: 17
      +43
      Taiga project

      Project "Shaiga"
      1. Sling cutter
        Sling cutter 14 September 2021 11: 29
        +8
        Quote: Kuz
        Project "Shaiga"

        I went for a walk in the taiga and found myself a puck. wassat
        1. military_cat
          military_cat 14 September 2021 17: 44
          +11
          It is surprising how the ruling elite does not have really meaningful ideas that could attract people before the elections. This is called "intellectual bankruptcy" - what they are proposing looks absolutely helpless and out of touch with reality, as if they do not see how rapidly existing built cities outside Moscow, St. Petersburg and several millionaires are emptying out.



          I have no doubt that they are not planning to put anything of the proposed into practice, but I am even surprised at how much their idea of ​​a supposedly attractive image of the future for the electorate is in fact ridiculous and meaningless.
          1. bayard
            bayard 15 September 2021 06: 35
            +4
            Quote: military_cat
            I have no doubt that they are not planning to put anything of the proposed into practice, but I am even surprised at how much their idea of ​​a supposedly attractive image of the future for the electorate is in fact ridiculous and meaningless.

            Perhaps this will happen ... but there is one "but" - in Eastern Siberia, new projects are really being launched, very large-scale. And as always in the modern Russian Federation, they are ... raw materials. But this time not oil / gas, but:
            - coal (a lot, very good in VERY large volumes) and there is a buyer for it, these are China (long-term application for 35 million tons per year) and India (45 million tons per year) ... despite the fact that the annual coal production in the modern Russian Federation is about 56 million tons per year ... this means that only these two consumers will need to increase coal production by 2,5 times, build new railways, coal ports, and infrastructure. And taking into account that they are going to build a large metallurgical plant near Bolshoy Kamen, for which coke is needed ... then apparently a coking plant / plants will also have to be built (after all, it is possible to sell not only coking coal, but also the actual products of coke - some kind of redistribution )),
            - copper (huge reserves), and these are mines, beneficiation, non-ferrous metallurgy and (as a result) electrical production on site (yes, at least the same cables, electric motors and other accessories,
            - iron ore, and hence ferrous metallurgy.
            All this will require energy - nuclear, hydro, thermal power plants.
            Well, once there was such a "booze" - wood processing.
            AND TRANSPORTATION INFRASTRUCTURE.
            It's just that there are buyers for these very unmeasured wealth now, and they are long-term and for very (!) Large volumes.
            Well, how to miss this?
            And for this you have to populate Siberia with someone, so that all this works and brings the "right people" a very correct profit.
            That this will really be implemented ... look at the projects of the SMP and NOVATEK ...
            Now four floating nuclear power plants are being ordered to power new coal mines (for the first two buildings they will build in China).
            And the shipyard in Bolshoy Kamen is being completed and tankers are being built there, etc. ... and the Kola shipyard (no less than the Far Eastern one) is being built at an accelerated pace ... And they don't even advertise much - money loves silence ... and they invest BIG money there.
            The right people.
            For yourself .
            Well, and before the elections, you can grind up nonsense - about Siberian cities with a million inhabitants and preferential mortgages ...
            I'm afraid that people there will be about the same as with the attracted specialists in Bolshoi Kamen - when we arrived at the end of the world, and there is no normal salary, no housing (rent for your own money or huddle in a hostel) ... And back not If you leave, you still have to earn money for a ticket ... But how to make money when there is strike after strike? Due to the mess and low \ untimely wages.
            This is capitalism.
            But they can bring in Asians.
            Yes - it's sloppy in planning and ugly with people, but ... the business will take its toll.
            1. tech3030
              tech3030 15 September 2021 07: 23
              +5
              On "KAMAZ" Uzbeks are brought to work, but they all died there !? Four hundred people !!! What the heck !?
              1. bayard
                bayard 15 September 2021 16: 15
                +2
                Uzbeks are cheaper, they don't need a social package, then pensions ... and for the local people there is an excuse to "cut down the sturgeon in Wishlist".
                This is capitalism, and it has a childish, evil face.
                And also the opposition of local and non-local - divide and rule, and the divided will never agree.
                Dialectic. request
                Russian business has a very peculiar national flavor ... and it has nothing to do with "national interests", "May decrees" and "projects about megacities in Siberia."
              2. alystan
                alystan 18 September 2021 11: 49
                -1
                Firstly, Kamaz is Tatarstan, the Tatars are Turkic-speaking, for some time now Putin has been trying to restore the severed economic ties with Uzbekistan, and so on.
                Secondly, and you probably did not know or forgot about this, but back in Soviet times, the so-called limiters were "imported" from all the republics - to new or old enterprises, it does not matter, wherever there was a shortage of workers for that or for some other reason "newcomers" were working.
                Thirdly, they didn’t want to work at that time and don’t want to work today (you can try to find the reason yourself), and in many specialties there are simply no people willing to work.
                And what a heh - this is to the local authorities, they write below that Uzbeks or other visitors are much cheaper for the local budget. Perhaps so, but the simple unwillingness of their own to work, too, cannot be ignored. People can "get mad" with fat, because a person quickly gets used to good things, and here's a "forgotten old solution" to help you - to send a "buyer" to Sr. Asia for workers. Apartments are not needed - dormitories, salaries without any deductions are more profitable for the employer, no headaches with lazy people and other lovers to shirk from work ...
                1. tech3030
                  tech3030 18 September 2021 17: 11
                  0
                  "Apartments are not needed - dormitories, salaries without any deductions are more profitable for the employer, no headaches with lazy people and other lovers to shirk from work ..." They will settle here themselves and drag all their relatives. There is no need to broadcast speeches from TV here, I am not a fan of United Russia and hucksters who will find a thousand excuses for their actions. When people will be paid for their work normally, then they will go to enterprises, otherwise we have something of the "middle" class to hell!
                2. bayard
                  bayard 18 September 2021 17: 59
                  +2
                  Quote: alystan
                  Firstly, Kamaz is Tatarstan, the Tatars are Turkic-speaking

                  Tatars is an artificial word invented by the Germans for a collective designation. These peoples themselves called (and some call) themselves differently. And not all Turks in Russia are Turkic-speaking, many, and perhaps most of them are quite Russian-speaking and do not know their native language. Many are generally Orthodox.
                  My godfather is Bashkir, does not know Bashkir, Orthodox, Russian wife, wonderful children. Yes, and I myself come from those lands where Russians and Bashkirs always lived side by side, and my grandfather generally knew several Turkic dialects and in former times was often invited as a translator.
                  And some of the so-called. "Tatars" are not Türks at all. Neither ethnically (by genotype) nor in appearance ... although they often bear Turkic names and even profess Islam. I'm talking about the so-called. Transcaucasian Tatars. I knew them, communicated - I served there - in Azerbaijan. Eyes blue, gray, green, light brown hair, high ... Shamil - such was our warrant officer. He looks Russian, and all his relatives are Transcaucasian Tatars ... What kind of Tatars, I say, you are the direct descendants of the Transcaucasian Avars / Albanians. Your ancestors were brought out of Transcaucasia by your prince Bayan (after the defeat and seizure of their lands by the Arabs of the warlike prophet Muhamed) and the place of their future settlement was decided by the council of Russian princes ... The same Russians. Among the Russian princes and governors there were many Bayans (great conqueror means).
                  So the Turks are, in principle, our brothers in blood, with an admixture of Chini and partly Dravidian roots in the female line. Before, this general military class was - the border guards of the Great Northern Empire. as did the Cossacks later.
                  So I have no bias in the perception of our Turks - I come from the Soviet Union.
                  Quote: alystan
                  Thirdly, they didn’t want to work at that time and don’t want to work today (you can try to find the reason yourself), and in many specialties there are simply no people willing to work.

                  Here the nature of the problem is different - employers do not want to pay fairly for labor and pay all insurance, tax and other deductions due to the law. And they resort to strikebreaking - in fact, they rob the State and the working population of their own country. Cost reduction is the pursuit of any capital at all times. And the State is obliged to cut their (capital) sturgeon. It was always and everywhere ... but not in the modern Russian Federation - here the power was seized by capital.
                  How does it all end?
                  Look at Europe - migrant workers from Africa and Asia were also brought there, and what is there now?
                  Look at the USA - it's the same there. In addition, in an effort to reduce production costs as much as possible, capital brought up to 80% of the industrial potential of the United States to the countries of Southeast Asia, especially to China, where there was the cheapest labor and the least taxes and environmental restrictions. And what happened to their economies?
                  The modern Russian Federation is going the same way - into the abyss.
                  There is no social contract between labor and capital.
                  Complete dictatorship of capital.
                  Therefore, the constant desire to deceive hired workers, to bind them with debts and other obligations, not to pay taxes to the State (offshore registration, attraction of foreign labor force, refusal to deal with social issues, labor protection and medical support.
                  Quote: alystan
                  Apartments are not needed - dormitories, salaries without any deductions are more profitable for the employer, no headaches with lazy people and other lovers to shirk from work ...

                  This is not laziness, this is a refusal to work for food on credit.
                  The difference in exchange rates and living standards makes it attractive for guest workers (strikebreakers) from Central Asian states to work in the Russian Federation. They really do not need to purchase housing on a mortgage, pay utility bills ... and the maintenance of a family is more expensive in the Russian Federation. And taxes on his salary must be paid, and to the Pension Fund, and the social package must be provided.
                  Or are you in favor of wild capitalism rampant over a wicked labor force?
                  These Gaster in the Russian Federation live on bird rights, sometimes in terrible conditions, they are not covered by Russian social guarantees ... But the employer receives super profits. As a result, everyone suffers except the employer.
                  But with such an approach, neither a strong state, nor a strong economy can be built - everything will fall apart from the first poke, because it is built on injustice, for which no one will fight and go to hardships.
                  It is a parasitic form of society when parasites rule.
                  This situation ALWAYS leads to the death of the organism (in this case - society) ... Either the organism is released, cleansed of parasites and continues to live a healthy full life.
            2. Spring fluff
              Spring fluff 18 September 2021 10: 22
              -1
              It's nice to see a commentary with numbers, and not naked emotions like many people have. According to the Ministry of Energy in the Russian Federation, 400 million tons of coal were mined last year https://minenergo.gov.ru/node/435: "According to the Central Dispatch Office of the Fuel and Energy Complex, 2020 million tons were produced in 402,1." I am not an expert in the coal industry. Please tell me - where can I see your figures on the demand of China and India in the procurement of our coal?
              1. bayard
                bayard 18 September 2021 18: 02
                0
                Quote: Spring Fluff
                Please tell me - where can I see your figures on the demand of China and India in the procurement of our coal?

                Look at Martsenkevich, he devoted a whole issue to this issue. I did not compare with the data of the Ministry of Energy, perhaps the figure of 56 million tons referred to the current export volumes.
                It seems that the volumes have already been contracted with China, an application has been received from India.
                1. Spring fluff
                  Spring fluff 18 September 2021 19: 18
                  0
                  thanks, I'll look
          2. Barberry25
            Barberry25 16 September 2021 20: 09
            0
            laughing you most importantly do not forget your words in 15 years ...
            1. military_cat
              military_cat 16 September 2021 20: 28
              0
              And you write your forecast for the sake of interest, in 15 years we will compare who was closer.
              1. Barberry25
                Barberry25 16 September 2021 20: 33
                +1
                laughing Yes, I remember my words as well as I remember that it was decided to build large plants by analogy with the Amur GZP and they are being built and that villages and cities will be built to serve them, and that cities of a million will eventually be built, But this will take 30 years 40 ... But here the situation is such that in ANY case we will have to settle Russian immigrants from other countries somewhere, so there will be an offer for them ..
        2. Vitaly Lebedev_2
          Vitaly Lebedev_2 14 September 2021 21: 46
          +2
          And with drunk Putin's shish kebab
          1. AleksUkr
            AleksUkr 15 September 2021 08: 58
            -7
            Were you with him, dumbass? Envy is a very bad thing. Shortens life. Watch out ...
      2. Ashes of Claes
        Ashes of Claes 14 September 2021 18: 19
        +9
        In short, no matter how you turn it, it's a shoiguev proposal.
    2. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 11: 18
      +7
      Quote: Vladimir_2U
      Too big for today's Russia

      it's not big, it's stupid
      1. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U 14 September 2021 11: 19
        -9
        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
        it's not big, it's stupid

        Is the country's transport connectivity stupid? Do you have any complaints about Transsib?
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 11: 22
          +20
          Quote: Vladimir_2U
          Is the country's transport connectivity stupid?

          stupidly stupid to build cities, without taking into account future employment, a city is not just a place where people live
          1. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U 14 September 2021 11: 26
            -8
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            stupidly stupid to build cities, without taking into account future employment, a city is not just a place where people live

            Even Shoigu's cities are tied to transport.
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 11: 33
              +18
              Quote: Vladimir_2U
              Even Shoigu's cities are tied to transport.

              and how many city residents will be tied to work with the transport infrastructure?
              5%, 10%?
              and the rest will suck their paws? !!!
              there will be no industrial giants, these cities will be empty without having time to be filled with residents, people do not need something to live, and without work they will not go to these cities, plus everything you need to introduce mandatory distribution of graduates of budgetary places in universities
              so that all these projects, an absolutely impossible election promise, are at the level of Yavlinsky's nonsense "loans, houses, roads"
              all that will actually be done is one-time additional payments to pensioners and the cancellation of maintenance for light vehicles
              1. Vladimir_2U
                Vladimir_2U 14 September 2021 11: 49
                -5
                Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                and how many city residents will be tied to work with the transport infrastructure?
                5%, 10%?
                and the rest will suck their paws? !!!
                Without the creation of enterprises, an absolutely correct remark, BUT: the presence of a certain highway already implies an easier supply of raw materials and export of finished products, and giants are not necessary for the development of a manufacturing economy, even without taking into account post-industrial. Plus, the city on the highway will become a local transport hub. It is a pity that without the Plan, such cities are truly utopian.
                1. sniperino
                  sniperino 14 September 2021 16: 15
                  -8
                  Quote: Vladimir_2U
                  It is a pity that without the Plan, such cities are truly utopian.
                  The city project involves a project for the socio-economic development of the adjacent region; it is its resource base, and the city is the locomotive of the region's development.
                  1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 21: 17
                    +1
                    Quote: sniperino
                    and the city is the locomotive of the development of the region.

                    the rarest idiocy, the last time I heard this from the grief of the "economist" Yavlinsky, they say we will give cheap loans and tomorrow thousands of enterprises will start working
                    the locomotive of development has been and will be large industrial enterprises and no other way
                    that's when these hulks start working (with a state-guaranteed workload), people working for them and receiving money will go to spend it in shops, entertainment establishments, etc.
                    1. sniperino
                      sniperino 14 September 2021 23: 14
                      -3
                      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                      rarest idiocy
                      Change the idiotic picture of a dormitory city to a normal city with large enterprises, scientific centers, etc., and everything will be fine.
                      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 15 September 2021 07: 58
                        -1
                        the first thing from which I have to change some pictures
                        second. so all the same not a city but an enterprise?
              2. Nazar
                Nazar 16 September 2021 10: 02
                +2
                Vasilenko Vladimir - you are right, what nafig new cities, from old, more or less equipped Siberian cities, people flee at the first opportunity, and S.K. "cities" will quietly become history, as will 25 million high-tech jobs hi
          2. Vadim237
            Vadim237 14 September 2021 15: 37
            -7
            No one is going to build these cities in a pure field without industrial enterprises under construction - copper mining, rare earth metals and everything else, and in the procession they will begin to build other enterprises, technoparks, and so on.
          3. AleksUkr
            AleksUkr 15 September 2021 09: 01
            -2
            Get a job as an advisor and assistant. They may propose to build an outdoor toilet. And even heated. You don't have enough intelligence for more.
      2. Sling cutter
        Sling cutter 14 September 2021 11: 34
        +6
        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
        it's not big, it's stupid

        It is foolish to hear such statements from Khuzhenetovich, because nothing will happen, but the idea itself is correct, but not under the current government.
        They are not eternal, they will die sooner or later and will cease to interfere with the development of the country.
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 11: 35
          +8
          Quote: Stroporez
          but the idea itself is correct

          there is nothing right in it, this is a cart in front of a horse, you do not need to think about cities, but about factories and factories, but cities will appear around them
          1. Sling cutter
            Sling cutter 14 September 2021 18: 16
            +4
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            there is nothing right in it, this is a cart in front of a horse, you do not need to think about cities, but about factories and factories, but cities will appear around them

            Colleague, I was referring to cities with guaranteed employment and infrastructure.
            If we return at least half of the money stolen over 20 years, then we will rebuild the country 2 times !!!
        2. Region-25.rus
          Region-25.rus 14 September 2021 14: 54
          +6
          They are not eternal, they will die sooner or later and will cease to interfere with the development of the country.
          their children will come to replace them. Educated "there". And this generally does not care about the country. They will go to work.
          1. Vadim237
            Vadim237 14 September 2021 15: 39
            -1
            Most of these children who study "There" are in the same place after training and will remain for permanent residence.
            1. Svarog
              Svarog 14 September 2021 17: 36
              +5
              Quote: Vadim237
              Most of these children who study "There" are in the same place after training and will remain for permanent residence.

              Who needs them there .. nonsense at dad's expense who left .. They will come here as soon as dad gets old, to their home and divided zones of influence ..
            2. Region-25.rus
              Region-25.rus 14 September 2021 17: 58
              +2
              I will add my comment
              They will go to work.
              when you need personal intervention in the business. If arrived suddenly will fall (as an example). And on the ground there will be hired Gauleiters. Make sure (we) plow better
          2. Sling cutter
            Sling cutter 14 September 2021 18: 14
            +1
            Quote: Region-25.rus
            their children will come to replace them. Educated "there". And this generally does not care about the country. They will go to work.

            Nah, we'll make them work! yes
        3. frog
          frog 14 September 2021 18: 41
          +3
          They are not eternal, they will die sooner or later and will cease to interfere with the development of the country.

          What about children? And the grandchildren? And what about the presidential personnel reserve?
          1. Sling cutter
            Sling cutter 14 September 2021 19: 03
            +3
            Quote: frog
            What about children? And the grandchildren? And what about the presidential personnel reserve?

            They will improve their qualifications at the shock construction sites of the national economy, we have broken it so much for 20 years that they will have to restore it in shock for another 10 years.
            1. frog
              frog 14 September 2021 19: 46
              +1
              It's not gonna go wink Because there are no initial components for the formula repeat
        4. AleksUkr
          AleksUkr 15 September 2021 09: 04
          -3
          So suggest a development plan! And sitting on the porch can be very clever. You don't need much gray matter. Yes and no you have it ...
          1. Sling cutter
            Sling cutter 15 September 2021 10: 14
            +2
            Quote: AleksUkr
            So suggest a development plan! And sitting on the porch can be very clever. You don't need much gray matter. Yes and no you have it ...

            Colleague, those who now run the Russian Federation do not have seven spans in their foreheads, ordinary middle peasant hucksters come from the 90s, but they are cunning, insidious, pathologically greedy and these are all their "talents".
            PySy.
            And sitting on the porch can be very clever. You don't need much gray matter. Yes and no you have it ...

            And when you wrote this, what did you think? Do you develop fine motor skills? Do you learn about your thoughts from what you have written? wassat
      3. YOUR
        YOUR 15 September 2021 06: 05
        0
        He speaks of only one thing, there is a lot of money in the budget, they do not know where to invest and how to get it out of there.
    3. Niko
      Niko 14 September 2021 11: 26
      +15
      Siberian mosquitoes are starving, so the government thought, "can we share it? Let them also drink blood to the people."
      1. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U 14 September 2021 11: 27
        -9
        Quote: Niko
        Siberian mosquitoes are starving, so the government thought, "can we share it? Let them also drink blood to the people."
        Greta Thunberg is applauding you while standing! laughing
      2. Region-25.rus
        Region-25.rus 14 September 2021 14: 54
        +5
        Siberian mosquitoes are starving
        mosquitoes are a trifle. Vile is much worse.
    4. ZeeD
      ZeeD 14 September 2021 11: 27
      .
      They talked about the Crimean Bridge in the same way ...
      1. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U 14 September 2021 11: 29
        +13
        Quote: ZeeD
        They talked about the Crimean Bridge in the same way ...

        Say what? That people from Russia will not go there to live?
        1. ZeeD
          ZeeD 14 September 2021 11: 32
          .
          What is too difficult and costly for today's Russia, there will be no it, drank, etc.
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 11: 42
            +16
            Quote: ZeeD
            Which is too difficult and costly for today's Russia

            the question is not in complexity and cost, but in existence, if tomorrow you will even be given a free apartment in a new city in the middle of the Siberian taiga, but at the same time you will not work anywhere and the prices for products will be your average for the country, you are unlikely to go there
            1. ammunition
              ammunition 14 September 2021 12: 40
              +12
              Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
              tomorrow you will even be given a free apartment in a new city in the middle of the Siberian taiga,

              Nobody will go for nothing. If Bryansk, with a favorable climate, oak forests and black earth, has lost 30 inhabitants over the past 60 years .. then .. There is already snow in Severobaikalsk, Neryungri, Aldan .. now .. at this moment it is already snowing. .. and already right up to June. And a month ago there was an African heat. .. Yeah..
              1. faiver
                faiver 14 September 2021 13: 42
                +2
                There is already snow in Severobaikalsk, Neryungri, Aldan.
                - there is no snow now, come back in a month ...
            2. ZeeD
              ZeeD 14 September 2021 12: 55
              .
              And who, somewhere, offered to drive a crowd of people into a new city without giving work? Where did you get the idea that they do not understand this or want to do it differently?
              1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 13: 06
                +2
                Quote: ZeeD
                And someone somewhere offered to drive a crowd of people into a new city without giving work

                this follows from the statement of the problem
                1. ZeeD
                  ZeeD 14 September 2021 13: 33
                  -7
                  A city around businesses. In the proposal, they were generally called "scientific industrial centers". And the brains are leaking from those who have not read, but put a stamp.
                  1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 15: 12
                    +6
                    name at least one enterprise in this "project"
                    1. Vadim237
                      Vadim237 14 September 2021 15: 44
                      -6
                      “At the same time, the minister noted that new cities in Siberia could be built between Bratsk and Krasnoyarsk, as well as in the Kansk and Lesosibirsk regions. high value added products for aluminum processing ".
                      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 21: 07
                        +2
                        Quote: Vadim237
                        can be created

                        intelligible staging NO ?!
                        if the PROJECT announced that a production plant would be built (no matter what), with a capacity of such and such, with such and such a number of jobs, there would be no questions
                      2. sniperino
                        sniperino 14 September 2021 23: 44
                        -3
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        if the PROJECT announced that a production plant would be built (no matter what), with a capacity of such and such, with such and such a number of jobs, there would be no questions
                        Have you already been introduced to the project? What Shoigu voiced is just a project idea.
                        The plans for the construction of scientific and industrial centers are related to the programs for the development of the resource base and the development of transport networks. Sites for the construction of new cities should be correlated with the resource potential of the region and programs for the development of transport networks, he explained.
                        “This is not just about the construction of new settlements in the taiga, but about the development of Siberian macroregions and the whole country”
                        A project competition is yet to come, if I understand anything about social design.
                    2. YOUR
                      YOUR 15 September 2021 06: 09
                      +3
                      The defense budget is not implemented from year to year. Remarkable samples of weapons are simply pushed into some distant dusty box. It’s as if it’s not the work of the Ministry of Defense, he thinks on a larger scale, think instead of 12 Il-76, only 2 were able to build, what nonsense, here we will troit cities.
                    3. Nazar
                      Nazar 16 September 2021 10: 27
                      0
                      Vadim237 - Take an interest in the size of the "growth" of the population in Kansk or Lesosibirsk, and even in Krasnoyarsk itself over the past two or three years, and you will understand what new cities are there; from the old ones, the people are running ahead of the locomotive.
            3. Region-25.rus
              Region-25.rus 14 September 2021 18: 48
              +5
              that they do not understand this or want to do it differently?
              and pressure with taxes. mortgages, low salaries and at the same time genuinely surprised that "people don't want to multiply" this is apparently a sign understanding the situation?
          2. sniperino
            sniperino 14 September 2021 17: 08
            -9
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            if tomorrow they even give you a free apartment in a new city in the middle of the Siberian taiga, but at the same time you will have no place to work and food prices will be your average for the country, you are unlikely to go there
            In the middle of the Siberian taiga, to build a residential area for 300-500 thousand inhabitants and distribute apartments in it for free to everyone - whose project is this? Your? For some reason, you think Shoigu is very stupid, the people with whom he discussed this idea before expressing it publicly ... And yourself, probably, very smart.
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 21: 13
              +5
              Quote: sniperino
              you think Shoigu is very stupid, the people with whom he discussed this idea before expressing it publicly ... And yourself, probably, very smart.

              Well, based on what is happening lately, from space to sports, I think I agree with you, not everything is in order in the government

              for example, someone came to a "smart" head in the middle of Kaliningrad, in a swamp a stadium for 35 seats for 17 lard, in an enclave where their own football team is regularly on the verge of departure from the FNL
              and there are a lot of such "brilliant" projects in the Russian Federation, and all were discussed by "smart" officials
              1. Nazar
                Nazar 16 September 2021 10: 22
                0
                Vasilenko Vladimir - yes, there is a lot of such "trouble" with these stadiums in the country - he himself built a football (!!!) stadium in Ulan-Ude with stands for 10 spectators (!!!) We have winter for 000 months a year what kind of football is that? Now this stadium is like a suitcase without a handle - it has been empty for years and it takes a lot of money to maintain it. And about the "rationality" of our leaders and the "thoughtfulness" of their decisions, we have here for many years an example looming before our eyes - they broke several billion rubles into the Special Economic Zone - they decided to develop tourism on Lake Baikal - they built kilometers of pipelines, power grids and electricity. substation, pl. depot and dumped a large area for the construction of hotels ... but there were no investors and there are no investors, who will invest in a large hotel if the swimming season on Lake Baikal is one month! Small hotels and guest houses are profitable, and what was built for big budget money turned out to be useless to anyone, who thinks that everything will be different with shoigugrads - huh? what would? request
    5. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 11: 41
      +5
      Quote: ZeeD
      They talked about the Crimean Bridge in the same way ...

      a stupid comparison, the need for a Bridge was understandable, but building a city without employing future residents is stupidity
      1. ZeeD
        ZeeD 14 September 2021 12: 56
        .
        Where did you get the pro "no job"? Or "I have not read, but I condemn"?
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 13: 05
          +4
          Quote: ZeeD
          Where did you get the pro "no job"? Or "I have not read, but I condemn"?

          I read it and, unlike you, decided not to shout about Urya to think about it, once again it is not necessary to build cities, but factories and plants around which cities will arise
          1. ZeeD
            ZeeD 14 September 2021 13: 31
            .
            If they had read, they would not have written such nonsense. They suggested building around enterprises.
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 15: 13
              +8
              enterprises name, uto prepares projects?
              1. ZeeD
                ZeeD 14 September 2021 15: 44
                -8
                Maybe the name of the city to voice? Residents lists?
                1. sniperino
                  sniperino 14 September 2021 17: 39
                  -5
                  These should be either national projects for each city, or one project, but projects need to be developed on a competitive basis. This could be done by political parties, at least some benefit from them. And they will practice building a country on cities.
                2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 21: 14
                  +2
                  that is, do you agree that all these are projections?
                  1. sniperino
                    sniperino 15 September 2021 00: 13
                    -1
                    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                    that is, do you agree that all these are projections?
                    It depends on what you call the word "project". If this is a necessary stage of social design (as a draft design in technology, architecture), then yes, but not even projections yet, but only the outlines of a design idea.
          2. AleksUkr
            AleksUkr 15 September 2021 09: 11
            -3
            You mumbled a lot. "Good offer. First the plant, and then the infrastructure. For example, the Germans, first a toilet, change houses and other delights, and only then an enterprise. Learn, son.
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 15 September 2021 10: 39
              +3
              Quote: AleksUkr
              You mumbled very much

              we didn't drink at broodershaft
              Quote: AleksUkr
              "Good offer. First the plant, and then the infrastructure. For example, the Germans, first a toilet, change houses and other delights, and only then an enterprise. Learn, son.

              that is, not a city, but a project of a plant and a change house for builders?
  2. Cloud4CRY
    Cloud4CRY 14 September 2021 12: 38
    +15
    Such projects were within the power of the USSR, now China is building such cities without any fuss. And for us this is the same theory as an aircraft carrier.
    1. spirit
      spirit 14 September 2021 15: 06
      +1
      China has already offered help in the construction of these cities) But our authorities themselves do not develop the region and are afraid of foreign investments in the economy of that region like fire, since people will come with them who will assimilate and send Moscow in 10 years, as Texas sent at one time a weakened Mexico.
      1. Vadim237
        Vadim237 14 September 2021 15: 47
        -6
        In the last WEF with the Chinese, 90 agreements were signed with investments in the amount of 150 billion dollars on this "How to fear foreign investment in the economy of that region" Nonsense.
        1. sniperino
          sniperino 14 September 2021 17: 58
          0
          Quote: Vadim237
          Nonsense.
          Kiev intelligence school. Isho is studying ...
  3. Flooding
    Flooding 14 September 2021 12: 38
    0
    Quote: Vladimir_2U
    too costly for the current "elite" of Russia.

    it's not that it's expensive
    the elite do not smell profits yet
    1. Vladimir_2U
      Vladimir_2U 14 September 2021 12: 40
      +1
      Quote: Flood
      the elite do not smell profits yet

      And there can be no profits here, even with ideal layouts, such cities may not come out soon enough.
      1. Flooding
        Flooding 14 September 2021 12: 51
        -3
        Quote: Vladimir_2U
        there can be no profits here

        So you wrote about the "elita" or about the statesmen?
        1. Vladimir_2U
          Vladimir_2U 14 September 2021 12: 58
          +1
          Quote: Flood
          So you wrote about the "elita" or about the statesmen?

          Well, how do you think the elite in quotation marks, and even the "current" one, can be statesmen in my eyes? Obviously not.
          1. Flooding
            Flooding 14 September 2021 13: 15
            +2
            Quote: Vladimir_2U
            Well, how do you think the elite in quotation marks, and even the "current" one, can be statesmen in my eyes?

            that's why I wrote about the profits that are primarily of interest to this elite
  4. zenion
    zenion 14 September 2021 15: 14
    +5
    It is much more promising to buy two or three overseas football teams and make jerseys.
  5. bandabas
    bandabas 14 September 2021 20: 06
    +2
    As Mark Zakharov has about the "elite" - "This is not the people? This is worse than the people! These are the best people of the city!"
  6. Yngvar
    Yngvar 15 September 2021 12: 22
    +2
    So this is why the Chinese are cutting down the taiga, the construction site is being prepared under the charter of Asian migrants! Will the existing cities be destroyed or will they begin to rebuild?
  7. Muddy Seeing ORACLE
    Muddy Seeing ORACLE 17 September 2021 17: 49
    0
    That would have a population of at least 500 million, then this project would have been implemented, and so, with the current demography, only money wasted ...
  • Detnix
    Detnix 14 September 2021 11: 10
    +11
    There will be no new cities, all this is a pre-election fake of a cardboard marshal.
    1. ZeeD
      ZeeD 14 September 2021 11: 28
      .
      So he is not elected anywhere ...
      1. IS-80_RVGK2
        IS-80_RVGK2 14 September 2021 12: 49
        +6
        And this has something to do with it? He is not a spherical Shoigu in a vacuum, but a man of the system.
      2. Cosm22
        Cosm22 14 September 2021 14: 31
        +8
        But the super-idea of ​​Siberian super-cities flew into the media for some reason exactly on the eve of the elections.
        Why?
        Pure coincidence, of course, we understand.
        But seriously, all this is an ordinary pre-election PR campaign, a non-binding verbal stuffing. Which will be forgotten immediately after the elections. However, hopes that such stuffing will correct the rating of the ruling party are not only futile, they are stupid.
        Even Ravshan Askerovich and Dzhamshut Farukhovich will not appreciate such an initiative of Kuzhugetovich at its true worth.
        1. zenion
          zenion 14 September 2021 15: 16
          +1
          This is not a verbal injection, not a verbal outburst. It is necessary to analyze and understand what is the disease?
          1. AleksUkr
            AleksUkr 15 September 2021 09: 14
            -3
            Go to the Hee-Hee Academy. There they will do the analysis for baby. It may even reach the head, if, of course, it is still in place.
        2. Vadim237
          Vadim237 14 September 2021 15: 50
          -6
          In the media, especially on TV, they mentioned it in a skid, and this news in no way affects the elections, neither negative nor positive.
          1. Cosm22
            Cosm22 14 September 2021 16: 59
            +6
            How is it casually?
            So, even on Topvar, the civil initiative of the RF Minister of War has already been lit three times?
            1. Vadim237
              Vadim237 15 September 2021 00: 34
              -2
              This attention was not focused - and on Topvar here this topic will pop up for a long time.
      3. Region-25.rus
        Region-25.rus 14 September 2021 15: 22
        +6
        So he is not elected anywhere ...
        but he does not need it. EDRu needs. and he is far from the last there .. uh-uh-uh .. member (party)
    2. bandabas
      bandabas 14 September 2021 22: 13
      +2
      The entire population is considered idiots.
  • rocket757
    rocket757 14 September 2021 11: 11
    +4
    The question, of course, is an interesting one, BUT, where is the money, there people will settle down ... and this is, among other things, important.
  • Svarog
    Svarog 14 September 2021 11: 13
    +15
    Very serious things have been declared. Sergei Shoigu says that this is not just about the construction of new settlements in the taiga, but about the development of Siberian macroregions. According to him, new scientific, industrial and economic centers should become

    "The main locomotive of capital investments in the implementation of macroeconomic projects in Siberia, along with state funds, should be private capital."

    Really for so many years, people who are in power have not become clear .. does anyone still take their campaign statements seriously? What are the new cities? Look at how much the owners of our natural resources have caused harm to the environment .. only this year .. They do not want to invest a penny even in their own enterprises .. squeeze out the remnants of the legacy of the USSR as much as possible ..
    And it’s not the city today that’s the main thing .. demography is the top priority question .. Migrants even in Tatarstan are already having a showdown .. while among themselves .. but their number is impressive, they detain 300 people each ..
    In short, there are no words .. it’s nauseous from all these muzzles that don’t want to do anything useful for the country for 30 years .. they only hang noodles ..
    1. paul3390
      paul3390 14 September 2021 11: 17
      +11
      they don't want to do anything useful for the country

      The imperative of behavior among the noneshnaya type of elite is only one - personal loot. And only that, by any means. For only money is not the only measure of the value of an individual. And you - want this audience to think about the state .. On feijoa is it for her ??
      1. Svarog
        Svarog 14 September 2021 11: 49
        +7
        Quote: paul3390
        And you - want this audience to think about the state .. On feijoa is it for her ??

        When will they get drunk .. that’s the question .. Although the question is rhetorical .. it’s clear .. that they will never .. drink blood until their fangs are pulled out ..
    2. Tank hard
      Tank hard 14 September 2021 13: 18
      +1
      Quote: Svarog
      ... Even in Tatarstan, migrants are already having a showdown ... while among themselves ... but their number is impressive, they are detaining 300 people each ..

      Is that what you mean? Nizhnekamsk in Tatarstan? On the video, they talk about this from 1:10 of the time. Yes ... Tin ...
      1. Svarog
        Svarog 14 September 2021 17: 45
        +6
        Is that what you mean? Nizhnekamsk in Tatarstan?

        Yes, Nizhnekamsk is Tatarstan ..
        Recently, there was another case when a migrant raped a girl .. and after this incident, they caught a migrant who tried to rape ..
        In general, tin .. where we are rolling .. this is definitely not our power .. These are mediocrities who need to be judged.
    3. bandabas
      bandabas 14 September 2021 22: 24
      +2
      After the elections, we will rally again. We have the poorest country in the world. Shame on the party of crooks and thieves. And their hangers-on.
  • paul3390
    paul3390 14 September 2021 11: 13
    +9
    Kozhugetovka is just another Skolkovo .. A banal project drank government dough. There is nothing real - this deep idea does not lie .. There are no people on this. And those that have - do not and will not have the slightest motivation to go to the taiga. It would be better if the existing cities, ruined for 30 years, Panuvania tried to raise.
    1. KCA
      KCA 14 September 2021 12: 08
      -7
      Why don't you like Skolkovo? Such projects do not pay off in a day, the last injection by the state there was in 2015, since then they have been spinning themselves, increasing revenues, from 10 to 17 years the total revenue of residents is 400 billion, for one 2020 160 billion, it's time to change the record, Skolkovo, everything will be stolen
      1. paul3390
        paul3390 14 September 2021 12: 38
        +10
        Skolkovo was declared as a science city, like our Silicon Valley. And - where is the high-tech exhaust? Breakthrough development know-how, etc.? They took the liberal fashion - measure everything for the loot. Proceeds can be got by and stupidly renting out space for example. Or by pasting your stickers on Chinese smartphones. There are a lot of ways, while doing nothing useful. So - turn the advice to yourself, change the record .. Look at the real result, not the type of financial indicators.
        1. KCA
          KCA 14 September 2021 13: 13
          .
          If you find a VO website, then you own the Internet, can't you find high-tech developments at Skolkovo? Write "Skolkovo developments" in the search engine and study. They made fun of the stupid lease of space, who will allow them? Here, too, in the SEZ "Kronstadt" is building a plant for the production of UAVs, did they rent the area for a shopping center? Each applicant to become a resident of the SEZ is considered by a whole commission, and not Vasya Pupkin permits for a lemon
          1. paul3390
            paul3390 14 September 2021 13: 16
            +11
            Well - since you are so advanced, can you illuminate us orphans with your knowledge? Can you give examples of these very real developments? I emphasize - real, not re-glued Chinese? Who will allow - you are laughing. For loot - we will hand over anything to anyone. With all the permissions you need. What are you, Putinists, elves - you are just a miracle at times ...

            Well, here are examples of high technologies from their own website ..

            3D Smile has developed transparent aligners that correct the bite.
            The developers of TRY.FIT have presented a new 3D scanning technology that selects the perfect pair of shoes.
            Scooter Shering Project
            The CaterWil project is the production of wheel-and-track wheelchairs-transformers.


            And so on and so on .. This is all of course great and probably necessary - but where is BREAKTHROUGH technologies here ??? In addition, the degree of localization in Russia is not indicated anywhere .. I am sure that most of them are just handicrafts made from imported cubes ..
            1. KCA
              KCA 14 September 2021 13: 48
              -8
              I wonder what you wanted from private firms? They are interested in what will be on sale, this is what the ERA Technopark is developing and no one will tell you, because these are not private traders, but the Ministry of Defense. And why did you bring the most crappy developments, consumer goods, why didn't you write about the Russian Quantum Center? Here are a few of them from the wiki

              2013: Scientists from the Russian Quantum Center and the Laboratory of Superconducting Metamaterials MISIS under the guidance of Professor Alexei Ustinov for the first time in Russia measured a qubit [55], [56], [57], [58]. By July 2013, 43 articles had been published in leading journals [59].
              2015: Scientists from the Russian Quantum Center, MIPT, MISIS and ISSP RAS created the first superconducting qubit in Russia [60].
              2017: Scientists of the Russian Quantum Center created the world's first quantum blockchain [61].
              Or about this:

              The Russian Quantum Center, Sberbank and the Skolkovo Foundation will build on the territory of the innovation center the largest in Russia secure quantum communication line with a total length of about 250 kilometers, including several communication lines where information will be transmitted using lasers within the line of sight
      2. bandabas
        bandabas 15 September 2021 18: 25
        +1
        The project has existed for a long time. Chechen Republic. All Nadterechye was Russian. And the guarantor from Pykhtotin killed the Russians. Yes, he himself does not hide.
  • Andrei from Chelyabinsk
    Andrei from Chelyabinsk 14 September 2021 11: 16
    +18
    As I said earlier, this whole idea is not worth a damn.
    Russia already has large cities in Siberia and Transbaikalia. And their condition is not so pleasing, I say for the same Ulan-Ude, where after the 90s many city-forming industries collapsed, so the people for the most part do not live, but survive.
    Do you want to move the economy and social sphere? Take it and build an industrial cluster there. Small, but cost effective. On the basis of the existing infrastructure, and, albeit torn apart, but still the available labor resource, it will be much easier than "from scratch" in an open field. Only now ... it will be difficult, because the result of such construction, positive or negative, will be visible literally in a few years. And those who fail this construction will have to answer. It is clear that they will be smeared, but it will still be a little uncomfortable in front of the people.
    Whether it's a new city! The funds for the development are colossal, and the result will be ... but who knows when, it’s still to build the city itself, while the enterprises in it, in general, it will take so long that the other president will have to deal with the failure, and which one from him will there be demand?
    And the money - here they are ...
    1. paul3390
      paul3390 14 September 2021 11: 22
      +12
      D. Medvedev in his blog once again "ran over" to Stalin. The answer to him:

      “Want to“ kill Stalin, ”Dmitry Anatolyevich? Really want to? I'll tell you where to start.
      Destroy corruption without executions, raise industry without the Gulag, strengthen defense, restore science and education, solve the issue of healthcare, demography, security, and law. Do it. Inspire the people. Convince him that you need him and do not give him offense.
      What you need to do for this, you yourself know. You know very well.

      And then - no one will remember Stalin. They will remember you. And only you. "
      (C)

      PS This applies to all our type of statesmen. Starting with the smallest .. Do for the country and the people at least a tenth of what Comrade Stalin did. And you will see how people react. But you just don’t need it .. Putting you with the device both on the country and on the people. Your own money is much more expensive ..
    2. Vladimir_2U
      Vladimir_2U 14 September 2021 11: 23
      -3
      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
      And their condition is not so happy, I say for the same Ulan-Ude, where after the 90s many city-forming industries collapsed, so that the people for the most part do not live, but survive.
      Well, what about "survives" is debatable, but very many enterprises in Ulan-Ude were missing after the 90s.
      1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
        Andrei from Chelyabinsk 14 September 2021 12: 03
        +8
        Quote: Vladimir_2U
        Well, what about "survives" is debatable

        But the fact is that there are essentially 2 large enterprises left, a locomotive and car repair shop and helicopters. And the crime is such that Chelyabinsk has a rest in the 90s ...
        1. Vladimir_2U
          Vladimir_2U 14 September 2021 12: 16
          -1
          Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
          But the fact is that there are essentially 2 large enterprises left, a locomotive and car repair shop and helicopters.
          Well why, "Tidy", "Lopastnoy", "Stalmost", although of course Ulan-Ude has lost a lot in economic terms.

          Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
          And the crime is such that Chelyabinsk has a rest in the 90s ...
          In the UU of the 90s, when the explosion of a single grenade was discussed for years and the redistribution of property in Chelyab is very poorly comparable, believe it or not. So UU now and in the 90s are two different cities and the current one is better.
    3. NDR-791
      NDR-791 14 September 2021 11: 27
      +7
      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
      After the 90s, many city-forming industries collapsed, so that the people for the most part do not live, but survive.

      And the people have a good memory. Tomorrow, the built production in the new city will turn out to be unprofitable and that's it ... go and collect the cones. Although, what the hell is production ??? Here that is, consider that there is no.
      1. Vadim237
        Vadim237 14 September 2021 15: 58
        -5
        If a tax amnesty is introduced for several years, everything will be profitable in such cities and investments will pour in like a river, and people will take it off.
    4. Vadim237
      Vadim237 14 September 2021 15: 56
      -5
      These cities are likely to be built by engineering troops; they are already building 6000 objects throughout the country with the involvement of 35000 builders.
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 11: 17
    +5
    Siberia will grow by cities!
    with all due respect, stupidity is not utter, ANY settlement did not appear out of nowhere, it is either a parking lot on a trade route, or a place of mining, or a scientific center
    if we say that we will build a city here only because I liked it so much, the city will die sooner or later, or it may not be born at all
    1. Nikolay1987
      Nikolay1987 14 September 2021 12: 01
      -2
      So he says that there will be clusters "Copper", "Aluminum", etc. That is, they will create in new (in terms of logistics and location to fossil) places, a complex of related enterprises, for which it would be better to work not on a rotational basis, but full-fledged monocities with access to one or several main highways passing through the entire country.
      For me, you need at least 2 capitals for such a country. Western and Eastern. From Europe to the Urals (or Novosibirsk) and from the Urals to Vladivostok. If there is a redistribution of the budget across 2 capitals, each of which is responsible for its own region, there will be a redistribution of the population between them. And there people will go for the same salary at a cost to a 3-room apartment in a new monotown than to a studio-room of 17 sq. meters in a human.
      1. sniperino
        sniperino 14 September 2021 18: 20
        0
        Quote: Nikolay1987
        2 capitals
        One. In Ekaterinburg. As a symbol of the Herazian vector of development of the new Russian state.
  • Sling cutter
    Sling cutter 14 September 2021 11: 18
    +12
    Well, this is not a man, but a hidden genius of some sort. He sat there for 30 years in power, and then he just "cut through" him.
    The question is, where will he get 3-5 million people to populate his frntazia and for what price will they agree to move there?
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk 14 September 2021 11: 20
      +9
      Quote: Stroporez
      The question is, where will he get 3-5 million people to populate his frntazia and for what price will they agree to move there?

      so, mortgage is preferential laughing wassat
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 11: 24
        +2
        Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
        so, mortgage is preferential

        and from what to give?
        when the Union was building cities, he erected them around scientific and industrial points
      2. Sling cutter
        Sling cutter 14 September 2021 11: 27
        +10
        Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
        so, mortgage is preferential

        Yes, there are also microcredit organizations, such as "quick money" laughing
        Before the elections, pins them, of course, not like a kid wassat
        Hi Andre! drinks
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk 14 September 2021 12: 00
          +3
          Quote: Stroporez
          Hi Andre!

          Good day! drinks
      3. paul3390
        paul3390 14 September 2021 11: 29
        +11
        preferential mortgage

        You have to be very optimistic to take out a mortgage in the taiga .. what
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk 14 September 2021 12: 01
          +5
          Quote: paul3390
          You have to be very optimistic to take out a mortgage in the taiga ..

          Shoigu does not stop such trifles :)))
        2. Daniil Konovalenko
          Daniil Konovalenko 14 September 2021 12: 16
          +2
          Well, let's say ... well, they built it .. well, doctors, specialists, policemen went there, and on what conditions will the janitors, cleaners ... sanitaries ... which is a penny ...
          1. paul3390
            paul3390 14 September 2021 13: 57
            +7
            And it is necessary to transfer the government and the Duma to Kozhugetovka. I can assure you that they will be trying hard for themselves. In an instant, everything you need will appear!
          2. Sling cutter
            Sling cutter 14 September 2021 18: 20
            +1
            Quote: Daniil Konovalenko
            Well, let's say ... well, they built it .. well, doctors, specialists, policemen went there, and on what conditions will the janitors, cleaners ... sanitaries ... which is a penny ...

            The guards are an atavism, the same misunderstanding as everything that happens in the Russian Federation.
        3. faiver
          faiver 14 September 2021 13: 51
          +7
          do you want a mortgage? Then take the Far Eastern hectare bullywherever "Only by plane / helicopter can you fly"
          1. Sling cutter
            Sling cutter 14 September 2021 18: 28
            +5
            Quote: faiver
            do you want a mortgage? Then take the Far Eastern hectare, where "You can only fly by plane / helicopter"

            So it is better to give to the Duma members and the government in those parts of the hectare, each one hectare and oblige that in 1,5 years, on each hectare there will be a hut, there will be at least three children, well, and the harvest, so that there is at least 100 centners per hectare. in favor of the state.
      4. IS-80_RVGK2
        IS-80_RVGK2 14 September 2021 12: 58
        +4
        You have forgotten about our traditional non-economic compulsion. Let's drive the liberote into a nyugulag and voila. Double benefit.
    2. The leader of the Redskins
      The leader of the Redskins 14 September 2021 11: 29
      +6
      30 years? ... And then I got up and eh! ... Hinting at the similarity of the current warrior with Ilya Muromets?))) laughing
      1. Sling cutter
        Sling cutter 14 September 2021 11: 37
        +7
        Quote: Leader of the Redskins
        ... Do you hint at the similarity of the current warrior with Ilya Muromets?)))

        Nooo, he is old, too old, besides, he is a knight of the Maltese order and loves shamans. wassat
  • aybolyt678
    aybolyt678 14 September 2021 11: 21
    +4
    Better to start small.
    no, why? if you build a modern capital, like Washington, let Moscow try to remain the business center of Russia, and New Moscow a political one? I think Moscow in this situation will fall into desolation quickly.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 14 September 2021 16: 00
      -6
      It will not come because Moscow is a very large financial and logistic center with a population of 13 million, this cannot be taken away by any other city constructions.
      1. Sling cutter
        Sling cutter 14 September 2021 18: 33
        +4
        Quote: Vadim237
        It will not come because Moscow is a very large financial and logistic center with a population of 13 million, this cannot be taken away by any other city constructions.

        Easily!!! Let's equate Maskvastan with an ordinary regional center with a salary of 25 tyrs, we will stop deducting money for the maintenance of parasites, and for living in the regions we will introduce additional payments by belts and that's it! All the flies / s / r / ans will immediately return to their native shrine and start working hard for the good of the country. good
        1. aybolyt678
          aybolyt678 14 September 2021 20: 05
          +3
          Quote: Stroporez
          All the flies / s / r / ans will immediately return to their native shrine and begin to work hard for the good of the country.

          +++ captivates your optimism smile however, I have a question: - have you ever seen such a picture when two or three idiots giggle and scoff at the team paralyzing its work ?? I am sure that you will answer - yes! Now imagine the same picture only on a national scale? laughing smile while we have such a giggling "Elite" no one will work! national pride will not allow ..... IMHO, of course, however, the transfer of the capital will separate some idiots from others and the people, I hope, will become easier
          1. Sling cutter
            Sling cutter 14 September 2021 21: 41
            +1
            Quote: aybolyt678
            no one will work with us such a giggling "Elite"! national pride will not allow ..... IMHO of course, however, the transfer of the capital will separate some idiots from others and the people, I hope, will become easier

            When the choice is made by the invention of Joseph Ignace Guillotin and work for the benefit of the previously robbed, 100 out of 100 choose hard but useful work good yes
        2. Vadim237
          Vadim237 15 September 2021 00: 40
          -2
          "Let's equate Maskvastan with an ordinary regional center with a salary of 25 tyrs, we will stop allocating money for the maintenance of parasites." This is how? There are more than 100 offices of the largest Russian companies, there is a huge sales market for the production of finance, operations and logistics - and all these people will not leave here as they have already settled down - and the standard salary for everyone will not work for everyone, it will always be different. So with "Easy" - by.
      2. aybolyt678
        aybolyt678 14 September 2021 20: 08
        +2
        Quote: Vadim237
        Moscow is a very large financial and logistics center

        these finance and logistics are heavily tied to power. And the power will just be in the distance ...
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 15 September 2021 00: 43
          -2
          It is tied to people like me - but not like power. Therefore, the removal of power to another place on the economy of Moscow will not in any way affect that the Gazprom office moved from Moscow to St. Petersburg and that something has changed in Moscow financially - yes nichrome.
          1. aybolyt678
            aybolyt678 15 September 2021 08: 04
            +1
            Quote: Vadim237
            Therefore, the removal of power to another place will not affect the economy of Moscow in any way.

            If Moscow loses the status of the capital, will the tiles be changed there 3 times a year ???
  • Proton
    Proton 14 September 2021 11: 22
    +9
    Soon all these dreams will come to naught, elections are on the nose. Then new promises will appear, just in time for the presidential elections.
    What prevented the development of infrastructure in Siberia earlier? Cost of roads, factories, factories?
  • PPD
    PPD 14 September 2021 11: 23
    +2
    you can understand - he comes from Siberia, the taiga is his home, he understands and feels it.

    And when a pile of woods burned, not far from the "home" - which were not extinguished, or were extinguished sluggishly?
    Did he "understand and feel" her too?
    Something I haven't heard from him on this topic, and there was no concern either.
  • Skay
    Skay 14 September 2021 11: 23
    0
    The US experience suggests that the country's economic development begins with the development of the road transport network. It will be necessary to somehow export goods for sale from the taiga.
    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 14 September 2021 11: 34
      +4
      Quote: Skay
      It will be necessary to somehow export goods for sale from the taiga.

      first, these goods need to be produced
      1. Skay
        Skay 14 September 2021 13: 35
        -1
        first, these goods need to be produced

        To produce goods, you need to bring production facilities there.
    2. Grandfather
      Grandfather 14 September 2021 11: 43
      +11
      I have a railway network in the Urals, an interchange, the city is dying in connection with the liquidation of 5 factories ... why build in the taiga from scratch?
      1. IS-80_RVGK2
        IS-80_RVGK2 14 September 2021 13: 00
        +6
        Because the pre-election noodle on the ears.
  • Essex62
    Essex62 14 September 2021 11: 25
    +7
    The highway is up-to-date and promising. The project of policies, in the middle of the taiga, the stillborn child of the edrosov. No one will go (en masse) to feed midges and angry mosquitoes. Time is not right, people are different. We have raised a competent consumer.
  • Daniil Konovalenko
    Daniil Konovalenko 14 September 2021 11: 29
    +13
    Big cities, Empty trains, No shore, no bottom - Start all over again. Cold war And time, like water, He did not go crazy, You did not know anything. Nobody writes to the colonel ...
  • Old Horseradish
    Old Horseradish 14 September 2021 11: 31
    +6
    Rave. Everything is as usual.
    1. Grandfather
      Grandfather 14 September 2021 11: 40
      +3
      it's time to change MO, this is everything ...
  • Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx 14 September 2021 11: 51
    +12
    During the post-Soviet period, Siberia has lost about 10% of the population,

    During this time, Kuzbass lost 15% of the population (from 3 to 100).
    Building cities with a million inhabitants in Siberia is a utopia, and everyone who is here knows this. survives lives. Today's economic formation is not able to populate Siberia and the Far East without deciding on the development goals of the country. The development of nuclear energy in empty Siberia is possible. It is possible to organize the production of high-tech products: machine tools, road and construction equipment, timber processing (along with the restoration of forest lands) ...
    It is on such a basis that it is possible to build (restore small towns) with expanded production (mining, etc.) on a rotational basis. This will be the state approach.
    Only cities with more than 100 inhabitants do not need to be created. It is enough to develop regional centers as centers for training specialists and training personnel.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 14 September 2021 16: 04
      -2
      The infrastructure there is worn out by 70% and more somewhere communications by 90% - it's easier to build new ones than to patch up and revive the old ruins of the dead.
      1. Svarog
        Svarog 14 September 2021 17: 50
        +3
        Quote: Vadim237
        The infrastructure there is worn out by 70% and more somewhere communications by 90% - it's easier to build new ones than to patch up and revive the old ruins of the dead.

        Funny reasoning .. so every 50 years you need to abandon cities and build new ones nearby? For the infrastructure will be worn out .. Vadim, how old are you, if it's not a secret .. I read you and sometimes wonder ..
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 15 September 2021 00: 56
          0
          The biggest mistake of the USSR was their construction with the expectation of one city-forming enterprise after the end of the resources for the operation of which these cities die out automatically and become half-corpses of such hundreds and thousands throughout the country - and there is no point in developing some of them because of that. the same wear and tear of 70 percent or more on infrastructure and communications, it is advisable to leave them and relocate people to new modern cities, since to revive corpses is a waste of money, all the more to demolish the old and build a new one or immediately build a new one.
          1. Essex62
            Essex62 15 September 2021 10: 32
            +1
            An effective manager is just that. Bravo, a very bright idea. A family with grandmothers, cats, bugs, small children and belongings rose on the wing, abandoned their home, built for several generations, and rushed into obscurity. For their meager ones, because no one promises lifting with the prospect that half will not reach. And let's leave that city, let the infrastructure rot. That's right, Vadik is not to chop off core assets, what for is she a burden.
            Have you spied the idea of ​​mattresses? Detroit, for example.
  • New Year day
    New Year day 14 September 2021 12: 00
    +9
    An industrial center "Copper and Electrical Engineering" can be created between Bratsk and Krasnoyarsk, in the same area it is possible to create "Aluminum Valley", focused on the production of high value added products from aluminum. In southern Siberia, it is possible to organize the extraction and processing of coking coal, near Kansk - to establish coal-chemical production of plastics. The Forest and Building Materials cluster can be created near Lesosibirsk.

    I immediately remembered Chubais from Skolkovo. Great experience, the result is not important, the process is important.
    There was another builder - Ostap Bender:
    "- Yes! - he shouted. - Chess enriches the country! If you agree to my project, then you will descend from the city to the pier by marble stairs! Vasyuki will become the center of ten provinces!
    - But money! - the Vasyukins moaned. - They all have to pay money! Many thousands of money! Where can I get them?

    - All taken into account by a mighty hurricane! - said O. Bender. - Money will give fees!

    - Who will pay such crazy money here? Vasyukintsy ...

    - What kind of Vasyukins are there! Vasyukins will not pay money. They will receive them! It's all extremely simple. After all, chess amateurs from all over the world will come to the tournament with the participation of such great veltemasters. Hundreds of thousands of people, wealthy people, will strive for Vasyuki. Firstly, river transport will not be able to lift such a number of people. Consequently, the NKPS will build the Moscow-Vasyuki railway line. This is the time. Two are hotels and skyscrapers for accommodating guests. Three is the raising of agriculture in a radius of a thousand kilometers: guests need to be supplied - vegetables, fruits, caviar, chocolates. The palace in which the tournament will take place is four. Five - construction of garages for guest vehicles. To transmit the sensational results of the tournament to the whole world, it will be necessary to build a super-powerful radio station. This is sixth. Now, regarding the Moscow-Vasyuki railway line. Undoubtedly, it will not have such a capacity to transport everyone to Vasyuki. From here follows the airport "Bolshiye Vasyuki" - regular dispatch of mail planes and airships to all corners of the world, including Los Angeles and Melbourne. "
    1. Dym71
      Dym71 14 September 2021 12: 43
      -3
      Quote: Silvestr
      I immediately remembered Chubais from Skolkovo.

      laughing
      This is because you are from Moscow, and this is not all of Russia, we have special economic zones (technoparks) in the regions with positive experience, when the inviting party (in my case, the Tula region) is responsible for providing infrastructure for the future resident and investors come, build factories, launch production, but at the same time pull labor from nearby cities, despite additional transport costs, so why not go further and start building in a complex manner? Maybe this is Shoigu's idea?
      1. New Year day
        New Year day 14 September 2021 12: 52
        +5
        Quote: Dym71
        but at the same time they are pulling labor from nearby cities, despite the additional transport costs, so why not go further and start building in a complex manner?

        It reminds me of the dragging of doctors from Russia to Moscow because of money.
        Quote: Dym71
        Moscow, and this is not all of Russia

        How did this affect medical care in the rest of Russia? I know it's bad. Is the population pretty? - No.
        1. Dym71
          Dym71 14 September 2021 14: 08
          -1
          Quote: Silvestr
          It reminds me of the dragging of doctors from Russia to Moscow because of money.

          I have not heard anything about such a state program request
          1. New Year day
            New Year day 14 September 2021 14: 24
            +3
            Quote: Dym71
            I have not heard anything about such a state program

            So this is not a state program, but the realities of life: doctors and nurses work for us from the Tula region. Who is in their places now?
            1. Gardamir
              Gardamir 14 September 2021 15: 07
              +2
              Who is in their places now?
              Azizovs, Ibragim Zade, ...
            2. Dym71
              Dym71 14 September 2021 15: 35
              -1
              Quote: Silvestr
              So this is not a state program, but the realities of life

              That's right, this is how we are discussing an article about what is planned:
              It is necessary to plan sensibly, but it is bad, it will work out without planning

              Quote: Silvestr
              from the Tula region we have doctors and nurses. Who is in their places now?

              They come from the region to the city, from other regions, met doctors from Uzbekistan (even smart ones came across yes ) young people are accepted, by 2024 it is planned to staff 95% of medical workers of the middle and junior level, but I am not writing that everything is fine with us, there are a lot of problems, for example, in one of the regional hospitals of the city there is no ENT, you can turn to a specialist only in paid polyclinics, everything is there.
              In general, not everything here is as hopeless as it was in the nineties, that's what I mean, although, to be honest, I myself consider a huge amount of pre-election agitation for all these plans. hi
      2. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 14 September 2021 16: 29
        +3
        Quote: Dym71
        Maybe this is Shoigu's idea?

        And Shoigu's ideas should concern the RF Armed Forces. That is why he was given the position of MO. For some reason, he was not puzzled by the question of why the indexation of pensions for military pensioners and salaries of military personnel is below the inflation rate. For some reason, he was not puzzled by the question of why the Russian Aerospace Forces, having been fighting for six years in Syria, cannot decide on what basis the US troops are in Syria and how the American base in Syria is still a center for training militants.
        I spoke and I will repeat it again. There is no need to build new cities without defining the tasks of the city-forming enterprises.
        The construction of a nuclear power plant in Siberia provides electric and thermal energy, which makes it possible to reduce the cost of any production and change the quality of housing.
        On the territory of Siberia, there is a lot of land and forest land reclamation work.
        The presence of metals, coking coal makes it possible to manufacture metal structures.
        On the ground, people themselves know what they can produce and under what conditions. Enough of these "dreamers" who are not even scientists (they, at least, check on dogs) ...
        1. Dym71
          Dym71 14 September 2021 17: 01
          -1
          Quote: ROSS 42
          For some reason, he was not puzzled by the question of why the indexation of pensions for military pensioners and salaries of military personnel is below the inflation rate. For some reason, he was not puzzled by the question of why the Russian Aerospace Forces, having been fighting for six years in Syria, cannot decide on what basis the US troops are in Syria and how the American base in Syria is still a center for training militants.

          The Tula governor will now be responsible for these questions.
          Quote: ROSS 42
          I spoke and I will repeat it again. There is no need to build new cities without defining the tasks of the city-forming enterprises.

          Quote: RUSSTRAT
          The development of Siberia will require not only three to five XNUMX thousand cities, but a radical change in the management of the country's economic development as a whole.

          https://russtrat.ru/russkiy-geopoliticheskiy-kod/8-avgusta-2021-0010-5410
        2. IS-80_RVGK2
          IS-80_RVGK2 14 September 2021 17: 25
          +1
          Quote: ROSS 42
          why the indexation of pensions of military pensioners and salaries of military personnel is below the inflation rate.

          Well, they at least have it. And then, after all, some of them are not indexed at all for 5 or even 7 years.
        3. Svarog
          Svarog 14 September 2021 17: 54
          +3
          Quote: ROSS 42
          And Shoigu's ideas should concern the RF Armed Forces. That is why he was given the position of MO. For some reason, he was not puzzled by the question,

          And you haven't noticed yet ... we all do everything ... just not their immediate business .. They take an example from their leader ..
          1. Ross xnumx
            Ross xnumx 14 September 2021 18: 55
            +1
            Quote: Svarog
            And you haven't noticed yet ... we all do everything ... just not their immediate business .. They take an example from their leader ..

            That's right ... This is the most striking feature of Russian officials of any rank: either do not their own business, or do nothing ... laughing
      3. Svarog
        Svarog 14 September 2021 17: 52
        +3
        Quote: Dym71
        Tula region) is responsible for providing infrastructure for the future resident and investors come, build factories, launch production, but at the same time, they pull labor from nearby cities.

        The Tula region and Tula itself is a tough thing .. as we got stuck in the 90s .. well, at least five years ago I was there more than once .. a terrible city .. investors are investing .. but people don’t get anything ..
        1. Dym71
          Dym71 14 September 2021 21: 36
          0
          Quote: Svarog
          The Tula region and Tula itself is a tin.

          No doubt, we don't have Monte Carlo here, but the city is changing for the better.
          Quote: Svarog
          well, at least five years ago I have been there more than once ... a terrible city ..

          So take a walk now, virtually:
  • Lynx2000
    Lynx2000 14 September 2021 12: 05
    +4
    Taiga project

    what Tyu ... there is already a municipal urban district Taiga in the north of the Kemerovo region.
    You can understand Sergei Kuzhugetovich - he comes from Siberia, the taiga is his home, he understands and feels it.

    wink Sergei Kuzhugetovich is not the son of a hunter, but rather the opposite, he did not live in the taiga. I agree with the opinion about the pre-election PR, the elections will be held, the "development of Siberia" will be forgotten.
    An industrial center "Copper and Electrical Engineering" can be created between Bratsk and Krasnoyarsk, in the same area it is possible to create "Aluminum Valley", focused on the production of high value added products from aluminum. In southern Siberia, it is possible to organize the extraction and processing of coking coal, near Kansk - to establish coal-chemical production of plastics. The Forest and Building Materials cluster can be created near Lesosibirsk.

    In the city of Zarinsk, Altai Territory, since the early 1970s, the Altai by-product coke plant, now OJSC Altai-koks, has operated. I will tell you the beautiful places there, the forest, the Chumysh River. Kansk is a relatively clean city, only chemical production was not enough.
    Container ships from Vietnam are now idle at sea for several months, waiting for reloading in Russian ports

    I wonder what is the source of such information? Waiting / parking in the queue for loading / unloading a vessel is a frequent occurrence in all ports of the world, but to be idle for several months at sea - you have to invent something like that ?! Find the document - "Code of customs of the port", is available for each port, incl. seaside.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 15 September 2021 01: 00
      0
      "Project Taiga" is in the 70s in the USSR they wanted to connect two river beds by creating a channel between them with the help of 300 atomic explosions in Siberia. Later, this delusional project was abandoned.
  • rocket757
    rocket757 14 September 2021 12: 11
    +3
    At first glance, and at the second glance, too, the story, so far, is not sad, but somehow not real.
    The country is big, the people seem to exist, but there is no one to work, there is no one to move!
    Even with a long ruble, there are very few people to lure ... except from completely embarrassed places / territories.
    Not everyone has sucked in Moscow, yet.
    A bright, inspiring call to create now is NOT REAL.
    Although, if you think about it, there is a method of influence, quite feasible, but even in nightmares, our guiding ones, will not be dreamed of !!! For they will just be scared ...
    1. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 14 September 2021 16: 36
      +5
      Quote: rocket757
      Although, if you think about it, there is a method of influence, quite feasible,

      You're right. One of them is that the head office of the production should be located at the location of the production.
      Saury is not found in the Moscow River and there is no need to “dazzle the Mule”. There are no cosmodromes, oil rigs and gas fields ... In the USSR they knew how to attract the population to uninhabited areas. And today they do not know how to rid the capital of parasites, speculators and illegal migrants ...
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 14 September 2021 18: 39
        +2
        Quote: ROSS 42
        ... In the USSR, they knew how to attract the population to uninhabited areas

        Everything was different, but the unifying, bright idea was still alive !!! And without her, after all, no way, yet.
        1. Ashes of Claes
          Ashes of Claes 14 September 2021 19: 39
          0
          Quote: rocket757
          Everything was different, but the unifying, bright idea was still alive !!! And without her, after all, no way, yet.

          Rough age. Rough morals. There is no romanticism. (with)
          1. rocket757
            rocket757 14 September 2021 19: 46
            0
            Quote: Ashes of Klaas
            Rough age. Rough manners

            Everything and everywhere is very different!
            Quote: Ashes of Klaas
            No romanticism

            I will not argue that there was a complete substitution of the goals, aspirations of a person, but each romanticism had its own prerequisite, before the foundation! Even weeds do not grow on bare ground.
            1. Ashes of Claes
              Ashes of Claes 14 September 2021 22: 04
              0
              Quote: rocket757
              Everything and everywhere is very different!

              Really?
              What and where?
              Quote: rocket757
              I will not argue that there has been a complete substitution of the goals, aspirations of a person

              Well, in vain. But it did happen. Change, not substitution. Welcome to the post-industrial world.
              Quote: rocket757
              every romanticism had its own premise

              Romance has only one "prerequisite" - youth. With her freedom from material anchors. It passes quickly.
  • Keyser soze
    Keyser soze 14 September 2021 12: 14
    +4
    If this was a normal business project, then I would structure it like this:

    1. Correct the existing infrastructure to an excellent state.
    2. Correcting existing production in the area of ​​environmental friendliness.
    3. Correct the existing cities to excellent condition and assess their development potential.
    4. Opening new production facilities where there is this potential.
    5. Give generous subsidies to both residents and newcomers.
    6. Build new cities in strategic directions, when I saw that other measures had worked and turned Siberia into the Garden of Eden, and a crowd from New York, London and Moscow was bursting there. good
    1. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 14 September 2021 13: 05
      +1
      Quote: Keyser Soze
      If this was a normal business project, then I would structure it like this:

      Will we take the money for all this from the bedside table? Just a masterpiece plan.
    2. Tank hard
      Tank hard 14 September 2021 13: 26
      0
      Quote: Keyser Soze
      If this was a normal business project, then I would structure it like this:

      You would have to structure in Bulgaria. We have enough miracles without you.))
    3. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 14 September 2021 16: 43
      +4
      Quote: Keyser Soze
      If it were a normal business project, then I formulated its main theses as follows: ...

      Even foreign citizens know, they only write poorly in Russian, but here Russians are talking all sorts of crap ...
      Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
      Will we take the money for all this from the bedside table? Just a masterpiece plan.

      You will read at your leisure the reports of the Chairman of the Accounts Chamber about unclaimed trillions and materials from criminal cases on embezzlement of billions of rubles ...
      I have a suspicion that the majority of Russians will change their attitude towards honest work at the sight of parasites dangling on a rope ... from birth and by vocation ...
      1. IS-80_RVGK2
        IS-80_RVGK2 14 September 2021 17: 29
        0
        Quote: ROSS 42
        Even foreign citizens know, they only write poorly in Russian, but here Russians are talking all sorts of crap ...

        What the hell is that. Remind you how the people were happy about the modernization of something about 100 BMP-1?
        1. Ross xnumx
          Ross xnumx 14 September 2021 18: 52
          +3
          Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
          What the hell is that.

          Crap about the lack of money ...
          Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
          Will we take the money for all this from the bedside table? Just a masterpiece plan.

          The real plan of a Bulgarian is to take tentative steps, to see what this leads to ... And in the Russian Federation, only oligarchs have enough money ... I am simply ashamed in front of the inhabitants of countries where the sun, air and water are made of minerals ... I am amazed even at the Israeli stubbornness with which they grow paprika, the smell of which is simply stunning, as well as the smell and taste of tangerines ... I still do not know how the Cuban people survive sideways UWB ...
          BUT!!! stop I am taken aback by the impunity, rudeness, lies and arrogance with which a bunch of worthless people who think they know themselves are in a hurry to get drunk, snatch, hide what does not belong to them by any right.
          1. IS-80_RVGK2
            IS-80_RVGK2 14 September 2021 19: 37
            0
            Quote: ROSS 42
            Crap about the lack of money ...

            So there is really no money. You have to be realistic, no one will give you money for these plans. Even state ones.
        2. Vadim237
          Vadim237 15 September 2021 01: 02
          -1
          people rejoiced at the modernization of something about 100 bmp-1? And these 100 modernized BMP 1 were exported.
    4. sniperino
      sniperino 14 September 2021 18: 54
      0
      You sold Bulgaria, but you didn’t cope with the level of corruption, and you didn’t even get the Schengen. Do you have any normal structured projects in this regard?
  • fiberboard
    fiberboard 14 September 2021 12: 15
    +5
    All this smells very much of a big scam. First: where to get the able-bodied population? Central Russia has long been depopulated during the Stalinist repression, collectivization, and industrialization. During the Khrushchev and Brezhnev experiments in the development of virgin lands, the creation of industry in the union republics of the USSR, in the construction of the BAM. Secondly: who will be the main beneficiaries of these projects? Usmanovs, Rottenbergs, Deripaska? It's no secret that the Americans put their own conditions on Deripaska and he actually handed over Rusal to them. So what-to foul your territory for the profits of Uncle Semp and his local performers? Alexander the Third, without noise, din, shouting, built the Transsib, Nicholas II really finished it. Putin asks where to get the money? Maybe someone pays very little taxes because they are close to Putin?
  • p0pulivox
    p0pulivox 14 September 2021 12: 16
    -3
    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
    Quote: ZeeD
    They talked about the Crimean Bridge in the same way ...

    a stupid comparison, the need for a Bridge was understandable, but building a city without employing future residents is stupidity

    Yes, to put it floridly - this is a project.
  • sash-sash
    sash-sash 14 September 2021 12: 16
    +1
    Some nonsense. What are the "city-forming enterprises" ?! Besides recycling the floor. minerals - which are nearby - everything else will be unprofitable both due to logistics, and for the simple reason of a lack of qualified personnel. Well, what serious specialist will make his way somewhere, where Uncle Makar did not go with the calves, to work and live? Yes with your family?
    Siberia in the version of development that all these "hands-drivers" are talking about will NEVER be mastered by cities.
    These are the ones that are, and must be raised, brought out of the complete depression.
    Only this, too, according to the results, is extremely conjectural.
    We fell into a hole dug by the thoughtless "exploration of the vastness" of the times of socialism. What to do here is generally incomprehensible.
    There was (once) a beautiful theory of development, which suggested gradually exporting the "surplus population" to more or less favorable regions of the country, somewhere closer to the Krasnodar Territory. Increase the population density there, reduce logistics (primarily transport) losses, i.e. copy the advantages of "small Europe".
    But what about the retention of a huge territory in fact?
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 14 September 2021 16: 08
      -2
      No one will covet this territory anyway - as well as the territory of Alaska, Canada and other northern countries - on the permafrost under extreme climatic conditions, few people will live, everyone strives to go where it is good and warm.
    2. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 14 September 2021 17: 40
      +2
      Quote: sash-sash
      We fell into a hole dug by the thoughtless "exploration of the vastness" of the times of socialism.

      She is insane for those who do not want to think.
      Quote: sash-sash
      What to do here is generally incomprehensible.

      Previously, what was interesting was clear. Now, no. Of course, the communists are to blame for this, and not those crooked and stupid infantiles who for 30 years have not been able to do anything but plunder the Soviet legacy in the economy.
      1. sash-sash
        sash-sash 14 September 2021 18: 12
        0
        Enlighten the fool! Open the tablets of wisdom!
        1. IS-80_RVGK2
          IS-80_RVGK2 14 September 2021 18: 28
          0
          What kind of tables are there. This is elementary. You are trying to stretch the realities of the present day onto the past. And it doesn't work that way.
  • Maximillian von Adelheid
    Maximillian von Adelheid 14 September 2021 12: 26
    +1
    Posh newspeak - "zoning"!
    Zones for the next labor armies !!
    Nothing is new. Get ready for new taxes, duties, fees, etc. laughing
  • nikvic46
    nikvic46 14 September 2021 12: 35
    0
    The inflow to Siberia has been going on for centuries, and the outflow for years. When a new facility was being built in the USSR, a railroad was being extended there, and an airfield was being built, only preparation for the construction of a new one would cost a lot of money. And the rest was correctly indicated by the author.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 15 September 2021 01: 07
      -1
      According to the project for the development of transport infrastructure in Russia, 2030 airfields and airports will be built and modernized by 198.
  • Rage66
    Rage66 14 September 2021 12: 42
    +2
    Strategic road to the south - M4 "Don" all in business barriers

    The author of the article!
    Who owns the Avtodor Group of Companies?
    You are Pop Gapon. Provocateur.
  • A. Privalov
    A. Privalov 14 September 2021 12: 57
    +4
    Over the past three or four days, the second article on the topic.
    The mood of the readers is not optimistic. Everyone agrees that it seems like it would be good, but judging by the comments, there is no special faith in the reality of the plans ...

    I remember well the new cities in the USSR: Magnitogorsk, Komsomolsk, Norilsk, Angarsk, Bratsk ... I even visited three of them for work in the first half of the 80s. The places there are beautiful, but it was not very easy to live, and the climate, and the supply and the industry all around oppressing people ...
    By the way, to this day, none of these cities, over the years of its existence, has reached 0,5 million inhabitants.
    1. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 14 September 2021 17: 35
      +2
      Quote: A. Privalov
      The mood of the readers is not optimistic. Everyone agrees that it seems like it would be good, but judging by the comments, there is no special faith in the reality of the plans ...

      And what should this optimism be based on? In a stagnant economy? Double-digit inflation? On the growing income and wealth gap? All these grandiose plans are empty electoral chatter.
      1. A. Privalov
        A. Privalov 14 September 2021 19: 06
        0
        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
        And what should this optimism be based on?

        I do not know.
        You certainly know better.
      2. Ashes of Claes
        Ashes of Claes 14 September 2021 19: 16
        0
        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
        All these grandiose plans are empty electoral chatter.

        yes it is understandable. Choosing a talking head for this populist empty is pretty funny - secretary of defense.
    2. Ashes of Claes
      Ashes of Claes 14 September 2021 19: 27
      0
      Quote: A. Privalov
      I remember well the new cities in the USSR: Magnitogorsk, Komsomolsk, Norilsk, Angarsk, Bratsk.

      Eh, and for some reason I suddenly remembered Aksyon's "Our Golden Piece of Iron" ... A monument to Soviet romanticism "in the depths of Siberian ores." I will reread, perhaps.
  • Maks1995
    Maks1995 14 September 2021 14: 29
    0
    The elections will pass and everyone will calm down. And the doctors will nourish where they are needed ...
  • Mishka78
    Mishka78 14 September 2021 16: 26
    +1
    Quote: ZeeD
    So he is not elected anywhere ...

    At the head of the federal list of "United Russia", five people will go to the Duma elections - Russian Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu, Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov, chief physician of the Kommunarka hospital Denis Protsenko, co-chairman of the ONF Central Headquarters Yelena Shmeleva and child protection commissioner in RF Anna Kuznetsova. The candidates were proposed by Russian President Vladimir Putin and approved at the party congress on June 19.

    https://www.interfax.ru/russia/783918
    Elected. Although the goat understands that he is just a locomotive and will refuse the mandate after the elections.
  • Ashes of Claes
    Ashes of Claes 14 September 2021 17: 23
    +4
    No, well, when the practitioner Sobyanin says that the future belongs to large agglomerations - this is logical. The manager of a metropolis cannot think otherwise. Everything is clear here. Well, and this one where with his urban fantasies? If secretary of defense begins to mumble in the spirit of "Kings and Cabbage", then the thought involuntarily creeps in - is he trying on his seat on the presidential chair? How old will he be there in 2024? 70? With the current successes of geriatric science .... Yes, with the global trend towards the old-fashioned government .... Normal. Now he will be pumped up with charisma, they will write down in the summary of some victories over someone in Africa, they will douse them with populist syrup - and the people will carry their voices to the ballot boxes for the next savior of the Fatherland in a cap with braids.
    1. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 14 September 2021 18: 34
      0
      Quote: Ashes of Klaas
      No, well, when the practitioner Sobyanin says that the future belongs to large agglomerations - this is logical.

      Why only Sobyanin? Many people talk about this. I think so, for example. Because it makes sense.
      Quote: Ashes of Klaas
      Well, and this one where with his urban fantasies?

      There where everything is. Save the sinking power system.
  • Ryaruav
    Ryaruav 14 September 2021 20: 29
    0
    under no modern conditions this idiot's formula will work
    1. Ashes of Claes
      Ashes of Claes 14 September 2021 21: 53
      +1
      Quote: Ryaruav
      under no modern conditions this idiot's formula will work

      The Western matrix is ​​a kaleidoscopic flashing of politicum. Politicians come, go, are forgotten. We have a patriarchal craving for the iconization of pigs in yarmulkes ... the same faces 5..10..20 years old is the norm, the slave hawked and asked to reset it a little more. This, in a cap made of a Faberge egg, is also being promoted and promoted, everything is molded from the redneck of the Savior of the Fatherland and the brilliant defand manager, they impose this face on the plebs with the slogan "Yes, he is also a statesman !!"
      Damn, how long can you, huh?
  • von_Tilsit
    von_Tilsit 14 September 2021 23: 31
    0
    "Crookedly-obliquely in a post-industrial society"? Postindustry is high-tech. Name the brand of at least one Russian smartphone or computer. There are none. But there is a clear line on reducing the number of students through the elitization of higher education.
    Postindustry is a service sector. And she, too, is practically nonexistent. In view of the prohibitively low incomes of the population and the infrastructure killed in the trash.
    But there is projection, bragging and fear of losing a place at the trough. And the feeling of a black hole ahead.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 15 September 2021 01: 14
      -2
      On the Internet, type in and see drives, smartphones, laptops, software, and so on.
      "But there is a clear line on reducing the number of students through the elitization of higher education." This is where it can be seen?
  • Valentin reutov
    Valentin reutov 15 September 2021 00: 07
    +1
    and again these models of cities (see photo at the beginning) - top view - from close-minded architects. In Siberia, there should not be MULTI-STOREYS, in Siberia there should be no detached houses, but only a RIBBON-CONTINUOUS one with WARM transitions.
    The TOP view (so beloved by narrow-minded architects) of Siberian cities will be UGLY - without the Fascinating patterns of avenues and microdistricts, without the RESIDENTIAL HIGHESTS that are so profitable for capitalist developers. However, office skyscrapers are permissible - this is the business of business owners building an office for themselves.
    In Siberia, there should not be residential buildings with THREE GLASSES (and now it is allowed). Let them think over the technology of windows with two glasses and the same WARM.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 15 September 2021 01: 16
      -1
      The first picture has nothing to do with the topic at all, they just took some kind of photo of the city layout.
      1. Valentin reutov
        Valentin reutov 15 September 2021 09: 44
        0
        exactly such squalor as in the first photo and BUILD.
        And they will clean the sidewalks, pay a MILLION for those killed by icicles. People will wear fur coats and felt boots to get bread. Three glasses in the windows will transmit ultraviolet light with ALREADY such a wavelength that it is safe for tuberculosis and dust mites
  • aleks700
    aleks700 15 September 2021 06: 21
    0
    Who should build in Siberia? Not even Central Asians. Chinese people. They are of course friends and partners if they are on their side of the border. So we vote for eer for the settlement of Siberia by the Chinese.
  • Alexander Ra
    Alexander Ra 15 September 2021 08: 46
    0
    Adults and seemingly serious people are playing pre-election games, the words of one person are discussed at the national level, in essence they are not confirmed by anything. What was said "above" is significant, but the rest of the whole country, as usual ... is silent. Honoring the throne, the greatness of the pyramid.
    1. Valentin reutov
      Valentin reutov 15 September 2021 09: 46
      -2
      Well, why, the idea is VICIOUS and must be IMPLEMENTED, but not anyhow, but ADEQUATE.
  • Diviz
    Diviz 16 September 2021 09: 42
    0
    We saw the Stolypins. Who will live there _-robots Chinese liberals Europeans soldiers. Well, maybe the army itself will build towns. The authorities cannot define themselves with the people. All right, Stolypin sent peasants to the fertile lands to develop.
  • Barberry25
    Barberry25 16 September 2021 20: 08
    0
    what kind of nonsense have I read? the author would have written about "no communism! one capitalism! there are no major projects and will not be" ... well, yes, here the Amur GZP was recently launched, but this is apparently by laughing
  • alystan
    alystan 17 September 2021 15: 33
    -1
    Want to be specific? An industrial center "Copper and Electrical Engineering" can be created between Bratsk and Krasnoyarsk, in the same area it is possible to create an "Aluminum Valley", focused on the production of high value added products from aluminum. In southern Siberia, it is possible to organize the extraction and processing of coking coal, near Kansk - to establish coal-chemical production of plastics. The Forest and Building Materials cluster can be created near Lesosibirsk.

    But what about the fact that all the listed wealth in fact belongs to our sworn enemies, as it were?
    The same aluminum "went away" under the outstanding business executive Deripaska. It is not known whose copper, whose forest? Is Shoigu going to build all this "charm" at the expense of public money and hand over the raw materials and finished products to the owners? Ai cunning "tugarin serpent"!
  • _Ugene_
    _Ugene_ 17 September 2021 23: 07
    0
    I don’t understand, is Shoigu the Minister of Defense or Construction? And what does the development of the Siberian expanses and the Minister of Defense have to do with it? Or is Putin preparing him as his successor, which is why they assigned him to this project, so to speak, to kill two birds with one stone?
    1. V means B
      V means B 18 September 2021 09: 51
      -1
      He is a candidate for confusion)
  • V means B
    V means B 18 September 2021 09: 49
    0
    Quote: Ashes of Klaas
    In short, no matter how you turn it, it's a shoiguev proposal.

    This is how new words are born)
  • V means B
    V means B 18 September 2021 10: 23
    -1
    It looks like "Mr." Defense Minister "Shoigu" has a brain.