Military Review

Il-112V: the causes of the disaster have been established

150

In the previous article, in fact, the opinion was expressed that the main reason for the Il-112V disaster in Kubinka was the haste of our Ministry of Defense, who passionately wanted to show the car at MAKS and Army-2021.

Actually, nothing has changed, but now there is an expert opinion on the causes of the plane crash. I must say that the conclusion does not answer all the questions, on the contrary, it adds new ones.

Having deciphered the data of the aircraft flight recorders, the experts came to a very unpleasant conclusion: the fire that began in the right engine led to the ignition of the skin and internal structures of the wing, but the transition of the machine to an uncontrollable lateral roll and overturning of the machine caused the destruction of the aileron thrust by fire. Aileron provoked the overturning of the car and the ensuing disaster.

The on-board recording device did not record any conversations in the last seconds of the disaster. The crew of professional pilots probably understood what happened and what was the reason for the plane no longer obeying the rudders.

The pilots really could not do anything in this situation, in the car, which completely lost control in these short seconds. Therefore, the pilots died in silence, without saying a word to each other.

What happened to the plane? Crew error is excluded, and such a first-class crew could not be so wrong.

A group of experts from the Interstate Aviation Committee and their colleagues from the Ministry of Industry and Trade found that the fault was a malfunction of the aircraft's right engine and the subsequent surge. This was followed by the loss of gas-dynamic equilibrium by the engine and, probably, the destruction of the turbine. Usually, the surge destroys the turbine blades first of all, and already the debris of the blades begins to destroy everything around.

Apparently, the turbine blades broke the fuel lines, after which the fuel began to ignite. All this happened a few minutes after takeoff, the plane had just begun to climb, and a fire had already started inside the wing and in the engine nacelle, caused by kerosene spilled from the broken fuel lines.

Why the alarm did not go off right away and the fire was first noticed by the dispatchers at the aerodrome tower is not entirely clear. But the fact is that it was the dispatchers who warned the crew about the fire that began on board, and only then the alarm went off.

The crew calmly replied that the situation was clear and began to fight for the plane. The automatic fire extinguishing system was first activated and a foamy composition was fed into the engine nacelle to extinguish the fire.

The first extinguishing did not give results, the fire continued, and the pilots already manually activated the second stage of the fire extinguishing system.

But this did not give the expected effect, since the spilled fuel was already burning inside the wing. The design problem of the Il-112V: the fire fighting systems were focused on extinguishing the fire inside the engine nacelles, and were not designed at all to ignite the fuel inside the wing.

In addition, the fire extinguishing system on the Il-112V was greatly reduced: only two fire extinguishers per side. Usually in "Ilakh" the system is installed on the planes, which extinguishes fire in SIX bursts. That is, on each side, in the case of the Il-112, there would be SIX fire extinguishers instead of TWO.

What caused such a reduction in security systems is a question.

On this, the fight against the fire was over simply because there was already nothing to extinguish it. Both foam cylinders were used up and the crew decided to land the burning plane as quickly as possible in order to extinguish the fire on the ground. Actually, this is the only thing that remained in such a situation.

The crew requested an emergency landing, which was given. The recordings recorded the clear and intelligible actions of the crew. The burning engine was turned off, the propeller was feather-air, and on the remaining engines the pilots were able to turn the plane and go towards the airfield. Under these conditions, they were able to find the ideal position of the rudders and thrust of the remaining engine and the plane began sliding (according to experts), at the end of which the plane would definitely land on the runway from which it took off.

About one and a half kilometers remained to the runway ...

But the fire, which continued in the wing, did its job and the pilots failed to accomplish their plans. In some 45 seconds after the start of the fire, the aileron thrust, a duralumin tube with hinges, which held the right aileron in the lower position, lost its properties. Further, the thrust collapsed. The destruction of the thrust led to the fact that the aileron got to the neutral position and ceased to compensate for the asymmetry of the left engine.

The plane began to roll to the right and lower its nose. Further, the overturning of the aircraft began, and it crashed into the ground.


Photo: frame from video

Obviously, the pilots understood what had happened. They could no longer influence the situation, so they simply silently entered the last bend of the plane.

The last bend lasted three seconds. Il-112V rolled over its right wing and fell to the ground.

The IAC experts considered that in such conditions it was simply impossible to get the plane out of the roll.


Photo: frame from video

Most experts believe that the reason for the tragedy was not the readiness of the prototype aircraft for such flights and the rush caused by the desire to show it to the general public.

In fact, I don't even want to imagine what could have happened in a similar situation if it had happened not over the forests of the Kubinka-Alabino region, but over the field of the MAKS or Army-2021 exhibition. And how many victims there would have been.

The actions of the heads of the Ministry of Industry and Trade are perplexing, who, according to some media reports, set the task for the members of the commission “to find out in detail whether there were any errors by the crew during the landing approach”.

The crew did everything in their power, and is it even worth trying to put on the dead pilots at least a fraction of the responsibility for what is happening. It would be more weighty to simply ask the competent employees of VASO about how and from what this prototype was assembled.

Sorry, you can't call the Il-112V a full-fledged aircraft. This is not an airplane, this is a prototype airplane. Which was collected on the initiative and at the expense of PJSC "IL" at the plant in Voronezh.

By coincidence, the author lives in this city and has several VASO employees in his social circle. Naturally, he could not help but ask the factory workers about the IL-112V. Answers cannot be translated.

And here are the questions.

1. Was there such a need for prototype flights at exhibitions?

The prototype did not spend much time in the air, the longest flight was just the flight from Voronezh to Moscow. All other flights lasted from 5 to 10 minutes. They did not risk it, circling over the plant, the whole city saw it. There are now residential areas around VASO everywhere, so such jumps were very, very justified, thank you.


For a whole year, from March 2019 to March 2020, the plane did not fly at all. They tried to bring it to mind, at the same time repairing the runway of the plant.

2. Has it been examined in detail, whether the identified shortcomings, which have been worked on throughout the year, have been eliminated?

3. What is the Il-112V made of? Duralumin grade D16, from which the aileron thrust was to be made, must withstand a critical temperature of 650 degrees. However, according to experts, the thrust lost its properties at 600 degrees.

4. Will JSC "UEC-Klimov" be held liable, which for so many years has not been able to ensure the performance of the Ukrainian semi-licensed engine, which it offers under the TV7-117ST brand? The engine is frankly not ready for operation on airplanes, but we obviously have 1941 again and no engines.

5. "Truncated" fire extinguishing system: who came up with this solution and why?

And the last question. Is the life of test pilots Hero of Russia Nikolai Kuimov, Dmitry Komarov, and test flight engineer Nikolai Khludeev really worth it for show at exhibitions and forums?

There is such a desire to advise our officials in the Ministry of Defense not to be like the figures from our Soviet past, who "at any cost" ordered the impossible to be done by the next anniversary or congress.

Today, no orders and condolences will return the pilots. We still need to think about people, not about solemn reports.
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  1. Commissar77
    Commissar77 4 September 2021 04: 34
    +28
    New technology will always fail. And in the USSR, new aircraft suffered disasters. The only thing in this case is that the test program was interrupted and the aircraft performed flights that it should not have performed. And this machine also had characteristics that were not at all impressive for a modern aircraft from the outset.

    And the reason is the same for which the plane with the Polish delegation fell. One dilettante dressed in power ordered to sit down, and the professionals followed his lead. And another dilettante, also clothed with power, ordered to take off on a damp plane, and the professionals signed their own verdict. They are great guys, they would have sat down, but someone, either in the design bureau, or in production, did all the blunders and did not leave them any chance. It's a pity, excellent specialists, fond memory.
    1. mmaxx
      mmaxx 4 September 2021 05: 46
      0
      No layman will order the tester to sit down and fly. They'll just send him. The test pilot is not the kind of figure you can command as you want. Yes, and any layman will understand this quickly in real life.
      1. bayard
        bayard 4 September 2021 10: 10
        +46
        Quote: mmaxx
        No layman will order the tester to sit down and fly. They'll just send him.

        This in the Soviet Union could have been sent, all the same, he would not have been left without work.
        And now the touchy dilettante has gone ... vengeful ... and very, VERY proud.
        And this is not pride in the Motherland.
        The former chief designer of the Ilyushin Design Bureau shouted that these engines should not be installed, that they were dog feces ... They were fired. request
        Rogozin, too, is proud, from him already many leading designers and specialists have fled ... but he is firm ... and proud of future "victories" ... "Nuclons", bases on the Moon and Mars, the revival of "Buran" in Khokhloma ... No.

        Ignorance has a face
        And do not confuse it with anything
        It can be mean and mean
        To all merciless in woe.
        Despising people worthy
        Above knowledge raises a sword
        To all truthful and restless
        Famously chops off the head from the shoulders

        And in his bourgeois swamp
        There is no room for big ideas ...

        The old song of the group "Soyuz" - founded by the former soloist of gr. "Earthlings" ...
        1. Stas157
          Stas157 4 September 2021 13: 00
          +15
          The crash of the only prototype of the Il-112 aircraft suddenly revealed a number of unpleasant problems that no one had noticed before. No, they were of course known (especially to specialists), but somehow it was not customary to talk about it. For those who criticize in our prosperous society are "righteously" branded as agents of the State Department.

          The newest, breakthrough aircraft, made in digital form, designed to replace the old An-24, An-26 and Ukrainian An-140, unexpectedly turned out to be raw and unsuccessful. That this is bad luck, an accident or a pattern that reflects the general picture?
        2. mmaxx
          mmaxx 5 September 2021 06: 05
          -1
          Don't thicken. I know the situation a little. Any amateur realizes that if the plane hits the ground, a LOT of money will be lost. And it depends on the tester. If he says no, then it will be so.
          1. bayard
            bayard 5 September 2021 07: 05
            +12
            In our forest, all animals are equal, but some are more equal than others ...


            There are people who do not recognize the word "no".
            Have you forgotten? Some who promised two Il-112 already this year in the Aerospace Forces belay put .
            Well, he promised (!) He was already "handsome gray", he promised to go to the exhibition.
            And the fact that these engines gave failures even during short (for 10 - 15 minutes) takeoffs and landings did not stop him.
            The prototype (not even an airplane) has just flown from Voronezh! Yes, after such a feat, it was necessary to put him on prophylaxis and complete fault detection ... and they decided to overtake him immediately to another airfield ... And we got a catastrophe!
            There, after all, not only the engine failed - on one, even a burning engine, the plane could be planted ... it was NOT an airplane at all
            Quote: mmaxx
            If he says no, then it will be so.

            A modern official will perceive your "no" as a challenge ... and another executor will carry out his order.
            Because there is NO RESPONSIBILITY.
            1. mmaxx
              mmaxx 5 September 2021 10: 37
              0
              Do you know that it was like this or just play?
              I work at a factory. There the test pilot's word is a sentence, not a law. Everyone runs to fulfill. The test pilot of the OKB is, like a BE, abruptly.
              1. bayard
                bayard 5 September 2021 17: 20
                +9
                Quote: mmaxx
                I work at a factory.

                Well, if you work for VASO, you know better why the prototype lost control.
                After all, the engine fire was only a pretext, a reason for the failure of the control system.
                Quote: mmaxx
                Do you know that it was like this or just play?

                I know that the engines on the product are not only not certified, but their development and fine-tuning have not been completed yet. And I know that for more than 30 minutes of flight, a one-time activation is prohibited by the DEVELOPER.
                And this is also kind of like "not a law - a sentence."
                And who violated this verdict from the developer?
                After all, a flight from Voronezh to Moscow will take about 1,5 hours?
                And what (!) After such a violation of the regulations for the operation of experimental units should have been done after arrival?
                Not just maintenance with passion, but a bulkhead with fault detection!
                "Safety regulations are written in blood."
                And in aviation, and in any production, department, service.
                And about "potryndet", so absolutely everyone is engaged in this on the forum, for those who are dedicated to the reasons for what happened are under a subscription.
                1. mmaxx
                  mmaxx 5 September 2021 17: 56
                  -5
                  No, not on VASO. It doesn't change much.
                  But if something happened, 20-30% of the comments, well, of course, Putin and all capitalism are to blame. As if planes did not fall before and were lighter than air.
                  All of this is both funny and completely unconstructive. And it just lifted. The eternal whining makes me sick.
                  Moreover, in the reign of Soviet power, there were no less whiners. Their consensus led to the 91st year. Even now, we will ponder and we will come completely.
                  1. bayard
                    bayard 5 September 2021 20: 30
                    +11
                    Quote: mmaxx
                    No, not on VASO.

                    Aviastar?
                    Komsomolsk?
                    Kazan?
                    Irkut?
                    Quote: mmaxx
                    It doesn't change much.

                    Actually, it does. We are not at all - pryndet? We consider a specific case.

                    Quote: mmaxx
                    But if something happened, 20-30% of the comments, well, of course, Putin and all capitalism are to blame.

                    I didn’t seem to say a word about Putin ... is this such a painful thing you have?
                    And the structure of society and the form of ownership are not so important to me as efficiency, professionalism, responsibility. That's what we are talking about.
                    I don’t know what plant you are from, but apart from combat aviation, our aviation industry has long been inactive.
                    Especially KB Ilyushin.
                    How is it with the release of the old Il-76?
                    Still nothing?
                    And other capitalists are quite successful with aviation - they build, fly, exploit ... Maybe there are other capitalists?
                    Or is it that our capitalists, ministers, managers have not managed to shine in aviation for 30 years?
                    In civil, transport, special, light ...?
                    Yes, and with the Su-57, too, somehow it's all wrong ...
                    WHY do you think?
                    As a person from a factory, sort of an aviation profile, how did you show up?
                    What do you and your colleagues lack in order to work efficiently and efficiently and build aircraft of all classes necessary for the Country?
                    I am already old enough to have my own opinion on this matter and consider it sufficiently qualified. And for this capitalist Motherland, I did something. As well as for the country in which he was born, he studied and served, defending its air borders.
                    So tell me - "a man from the factory", what prevents the aircraft building industry (since you are in it) to work ... at least more or less decently? So as not to burn with shame for what is happening?
                    And what is the role of management (along the entire vertical) that work in the industry is almost one continuous PR and shame.
                    Or the leadership has nothing to do with it and as Caesar's wife - "beyond suspicion"?
                    Quote: mmaxx
                    As if planes did not fall before and were lighter than air.

                    They fell before, just so that 5 planes a month ...
                    This is a complete and unenlightened mess.
                    Quote: mmaxx
                    Moreover, in the reign of Soviet power

                    it was difficult to even think about such a mess.
                    Even on the eve of the collapse of the Union, when perestroika, glasnost and democratization were already raging.
                    There is such a concept as "culture of power", responsibility, self-discipline, competence and professionalism.
                    In my life I had to communicate with ministers, their deputies, big businessmen and officials. I know what I'm talking about.
                    Quote: mmaxx
                    All of this is both funny and completely unconstructive.

                    Indeed, the activities of these figures evoke just such emotions.
                    Quote: mmaxx
                    And it just lifted

                    And such emotions are shared by many.
                    Quote: mmaxx
                    The eternal whining makes me sick.

                    And from empty bragging, promises and deceptions smile not sick?
                    You go out into the fresh air, catch your breath - it will feel better.
                    They have not been able to build a corn plant in the country for more than 10 years!
                    No engines ...
                    A whole line of helicopters on imported engines flies ...
                    What is the industry boasting about? MS-21? Il-76MD90A? IL-276? IL-114? IL-112? Ka-62?
                    Whose engines do Ansat and Ka-226 fly?
                    "Superjets" - the pride of the Motherland?
                    Be-200?
                    Maybe the AWACS aircraft were able to be born in almost a decade and a half?
                    Where is the A-100 Premier?
                    Where are the small aircraft?
                    Where is the result of the leadership of the leaders?
                    And what criterion is there to evaluate their work?
                    According to the written reports and the growth of their personal well-being?
                    Before the Russo-Japanese War, there were also many parades, beautiful plans, words and promises ... But the war came, and it turned out that the Fleet was not built ... And what was built is worthless ...
                    ... But the Tsar is, of course, a HOLY. Yes
                    And absolutely sinless. Yes
                    He rode a bicycle and a yacht "Standart" so cool, hosted parades and balls, rode horseback, flew with cranes .... sorry, that's about something else ... But there are more in common than differences. The king was young and handsome ... he had wonderful daughters ... and even gave birth to a son the day before ...
                    But this did not help at all for success in the war.
                    And how are we?
                    Will help ?

                    And so that for clarity about myself - I have been living in the war for the eighth year.
                    Quote: mmaxx
                    Even now, we will ponder and we will come completely.

                    Haven't you arrived already?
                    Where were you going?
                    To a bright future?
                    So we are already in it.
                    1. Sling cutter
                      Sling cutter 5 September 2021 20: 49
                      +8
                      Quote: bayard
                      And so that for clarity about myself - I have been living in the war for the eighth year.

                      Yes, Buddy !!! : Sorry for the familiarity hi
                      The comment is sore, from this clear, specific and without unnecessary pathos, in the very top ten.
                      It is a pity that the posriots can only read obliquely.
                      Thank you sincerely for your comment! Shake your hand tightly! soldier drinks
                    2. mmaxx
                      mmaxx 6 September 2021 01: 46
                      -11
                      I'm sobbing right now. And I'll get drunk for a week.
                      You just stay away from criminal reports. Well evo ....
                      1. bayard
                        bayard 6 September 2021 12: 00
                        +2
                        Quote: mmaxx
                        And get drunk for a week.

                        You are more careful with this - they will be fired.
                        The bosses will not keep alcoholics in production.
                        Capitalism. bully
                        It was in the Soviet Union that they showed sensitivity and care - they were brought up, they were dismantled at meetings, they were sent for treatment ... free of charge.
            2. NIKN
              NIKN 5 September 2021 13: 22
              +3
              What caused such a reduction in security systems is a question.

              5. "Truncated" fire extinguishing system: who came up with this solution and why?
              These are questions for the electorate.
              In fact, the extreme time on this unit was fought, not even a struggle, but rather a battle to reduce weight, because as it turned out, in the end it was overweight and no longer fit into the specified performance characteristics. That's the whole question, we have been re-optimized.
          2. kafa
            kafa 5 September 2021 15: 17
            0
            Thanks, Cap !
          3. bayard
            bayard 6 September 2021 12: 32
            +1
            Quote: mmaxx
            Do not thicken.

            I didn’t think so.
            Quote: mmaxx
            Any amateur realizes that if the plane hits the ground, a LOT of money will be lost.

            You think too highly of the sagacity of the layman.
            The current dabbler is sleek ... polished ... major ... and he often does not care at all about the result of production. He doesn't even understand him.
            DOES NOT UNDERSTAND ! Therefore, he is an amateur.
            Such a person often thinks that if an "airplane" has wings and engines, then by definition it will fly. And if it is assembled at an old eminent plant, where the Tu-144 and Il-96 were assembled, then there is no trace of itching at all. lol
            Well, he is an amateur.
            It is much more interesting for him to employ a harem of secretaries of a model appearance, to buy an apartment in the center of Moscow ... or a villa / castle in Europe ...
            MAKING A BUDGET for him is holiness. good
            Writing reports is an uncomfortable but necessary duty. Yes
            But the presentation of the result of their work and the costs of the STATE ... request no, it’s better to emigrate the day before to a prepared base behind the cordon ... or "go to another job" - if there are powerful patrons and connections.
            Like Serdyukov.
            Rogozin (both!).
            And others, whose name is legion.
            Remember the story of the Independent Pension Funds?
            And where are the managers of these funds with hundreds of billions of "non-rubles" collected from the population?
            There was no production at all, no labor, no costs.
            It's just that the Guarantor said - everyone should donate their money to these little boxes.
            People also passed. fool
            And the money-boxes with their leaders went to London. Yes
            NO extradition from London. bully
            And no ... criminal cases ... courts ... demands for extradition ... special services operations to return thieves and crooks to their homeland along with the loot ...
            WHY do you think?
            Because - SO NECESSARY!
            For this, they took power in 1991. Yes
            To live in sweetness. bully
            And that there is NO (!!!) responsibility.
            Remember (of course not) what change in legislation was made FIRST, after the seizure of power in 1991?
            MORATORIUM ON THE DEATH PENALTY!
            True, already in 1993, Yeltsin and Co. this moratorium interfered ... with the reprisals against the Supreme Soviet and its supporters.
            But they did not dare to cancel the moratorium - this is the main (!) Guarantee of impunity.

            Quote: mmaxx
            And it depends on the tester. If he says no, then it will be so.

            Do not tell my life experience.
            Modern bosses do not understand the word "no" from subordinates AT ALL.
            It's just an insult to him.
            Such a breed of anthropoid has now been bred from the family by the hands of drivers.
            But if you really are a plant worker, work conscientiously. Something depends on you too.
            Including QUALITY.
        3. The comment was deleted.
      2. atakan
        atakan 5 September 2021 15: 22
        +4
        And I wonder what kind of duralumin rods are there?
        All the rods that I have seen on airplanes and helicopters are made of steel, or is it a steel cable.
        And in general, every joint or problem has a name and a title.
        1. mmaxx
          mmaxx 5 September 2021 17: 50
          +1
          So it is a duralumin pipe. The ends are crimped, there is a thread to adjust the length. In the ears, bearings are bull's eyes. Probably so. Tensile is the same, but the pipe is more stable in compression.
          I would like to see the kinematics.
    2. bayard
      bayard 4 September 2021 05: 46
      +60
      I, like the author, are also surprised how the leadership of the Ministry of Industry and Trade and the UAC can set the task ... to find reasons to blame the crew ...
      In a normal country, this leadership would have long been sitting in the basements of the NKVD and answering the questions of the investigator.
      Demoted and deprived of all regalia and awards ...
      After all, the reason is transparent and obvious - the reason is in the HEAD.
      In this very leadership, which is not able or has no desire to organize the work properly. Which removes from their posts honored and competent designers and managers, for the sake of employing the "right" daddy's sons with a harem of secretaries ...
      These "effective" ones have got used since the post-Soviet times that the country is full of cool specialists who are out of work, to whom "throw a bone" and they will do everything ... But there are no more such ... have died out or are completely old ... Yes and what a really cool specialist will endure the mockery of a dilettante-dropout ... or just an ignoramus ... but with the correct pedigree ... Specialists from such leaders simply leave.
      They go where their knowledge, experience and qualifications are valued.
      Or they just leave - even as a taxi driver.
      I'm talking about all the specialists, not just the UAC.
      There are NO ENGINES in the country, not only for the Il-112 and Il-114. There are no engines in the country either for the Be-200 and An-124, for a whole line of helicopters ... "Product-30" is still not available either ...
      But what is there - there is no engine even for ... the resumption of production of the An-2 corn plant !!!
      For 7,5 years of IMPORT SUBSTITUTION!
      For 23 years of supporting the Ukrainian manufacturer to the detriment of its ...
      In 21 years of getting up from your knees ...
      And if there are NO engines, but what is life-threatening ... and a certain leader orders to show off ... and sends people to death ... DOES HE SHOULD ANSWER?
      We just had some kind of plane fall last month ...
      And window dressing.
      Not a single aircraft was brought to normal serial production ... the old Il-76 was not able to resume production ...
      When was the Su-57 adopted?
      And how many of them did the videoconferencing system put?
      ONE !
      To this day!
      MS-21?
      Transfer to the right again.
      IL-76MD90A how much should have been delivered this year?
      And how much was delivered?
      NO ONE !
      But they have new plans ... "checkmet" you know No. , which even the layout could not be assembled normally ...
      And the planes are falling.
      This is a systemic crisis.
      The old groundwork has ended ... but the new one has not been created.
      And the guilty seeks the "guilty" ...
      At the very least, this is called a complete service inconsistency.
      How many wonderful people have died in just the last month ...
      1. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 4 September 2021 07: 41
        +8
        Quote: bayard
        The old groundwork has ended ... but the new one has not been created.

        Although there are all the resources for this.

        There is no gold on the list, according to which Russia is in the top three in terms of production.
        1. bayard
          bayard 4 September 2021 08: 38
          +28
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          Although there are all the resources for this.

          I mean the human resource.
          And also about industrial potential and technical competence.
          Although I liked the idea of ​​peat (60% of the world's reserves), it is not yet exported in such volumes ... but in vain ... such a resource is lost. fellow

          And everything that you have given in the table, effective managers are actively exporting - they have enough intelligence for this. All projects are export oriented.

          Yes, and it was lucky with budget revenues this year - prices for gas, coal, metals ... yes, for almost everything, they have multiplied ... They also want to abolish pensions - they are also saving money, People are second oil, also a good resource.
          They also take out a lot of things from Africa, and negros run around naked there.
          And they starve regularly ...

          Trotsky dreamed of white blacks in Russia.
          His successors have a dream come true.
          1. ja-ja-vw
            ja-ja-vw 4 September 2021 19: 43
            +5
            Quote: bayard
            I mean the human resource.

            head of the UAC-Slyusar Yuri Borisovich
            Since the late 1990s, he was engaged in the production and recording business, headed the production center "Monolith"
            ...
            In 2006 and 2007, he directed the Five Stars television festival-competition of young performers in Sochi.

            Vice-President of the United Aircraft Corporation - Alexey Rogozin (son of Mitya Rogozin) Director General of the Ilyushin Aviation Complex. from 2017-to 2019
            In 2005 he graduated with honors from the Moscow State University of Economics, Statistics and Informatics.
            Since 2006 - an entrepreneur, has implemented a number of projects in the field of construction, development and real estate management.
            ...
            UEC General Director - Artyukhov, Alexander Viktorovich
            In 1996 he graduated from the Ufa State Aviation Technical University with a degree in Economics and Management in Mechanical Engineering.

            In 1998 he graduated from the Academy of Civil Service and Management under the President of the Republic of Bashkortostan with a degree in Financial Management
            -....

            Roskosmos everyone knows, the topic is hackneyed
            .....
            JSC Concern East Kazakhstan region "Almaz-Antey" -General Director, Chairman of the Management Board and member of the Board of Directors -Novikov, Yan Valentinovich
            In 1981 he graduated from the Yaroslavl Higher Military Financial School, in 1991 - from the Military Finance and Economics Faculty at the State Finance Academy.
            "served" in the army, but where? in the financial part of the construction battalion
            ...
            JSC "United Shipbuilding Corporation" (USC) -General Director Alexey Rakhmanov
            In 1986 he graduated from the automobile faculty of the Gorky Polytechnic Institute named after V.I. A.A. Zhdanov, specializing in mechanical engineer, in 1990 - Nizhny Novgorod Linguistic University, specializing in translator. In 2003, he received an MBA from the School of Business ...
            Well, this is even a techie, albeit an automobile.
            recourse
            and then we are surprised.
            1. vik669
              vik669 5 September 2021 14: 27
              +3
              Yes, the main thing is that he has a good person and whose grandchildren are already growing up and want to steer - and why be surprised because we have what we have and do not abandon our own!
        2. Pacquale Pestrini
          Pacquale Pestrini 4 September 2021 10: 05
          +7
          Resources are scarce if there are no brains. States like a vacuum cleaner collect gifted scientists from all over the world. Russia's problem is not a lack of resources, but a lack of intelligent brains that have flowed into Israel. The collapse of the Union finished off everything completely. Who just thought of scattering production and research institutes on the outskirts of the remnants of the Empire? Has the collapse of RI taught you nothing?
          1. Kronos
            Kronos 4 September 2021 12: 13
            +10
            Because there was a single country where all the parts were developed, it was a single mechanism, and placing everything in one place is a big risk in the event of a larger war, when the enemy will destroy the entire industry with one blow.
            1. Pacquale Pestrini
              Pacquale Pestrini 4 September 2021 20: 53
              -3
              So the experience of RI was, which they themselves ruined, if not for the revolutions and the hedgehog with them, there would be 500 Russians ...
              Now imagine if the Ukrainian defense industry remained on the territory of the RSFSR ...
              1. Kronos
                Kronos 5 September 2021 00: 59
                +2
                It would not be anyway, Mendeleev's forecasts are fantasies about if there will be the same number of rural residents and will give birth to the same number of children, that is, there is no consideration of any factors.
          2. BABAY22
            BABAY22 4 September 2021 14: 05
            +23
            We had an industrially developed country - the USSR. Destroyed.
            We have built a country of lawyers and economists. But what is interesting is that our engineers, even with the old Soviet education, even with the new Russian one, are valued all over the world, despite the planned collapse of this very engineering education.
            But has anyone heard about the success of our lawyers economists in the world? Our country now belongs to them. All around are managers (God forgive me) and lawyers. Where are their successes? White flag at the Olympics? Multibillion-dollar fines of "national property" in favor of freeloaders?
            Many questions have accumulated.
            1. Revival
              Revival 4 September 2021 16: 25
              +2
              What lawyers are you talking about?
              The problem is not with the lawyers.
              Unless of course you mean a very specific lawyer.
              The certainty of the Law is destroyed, one can know the law, but this does not help, because it is solved "as it should" ...
              And then they also tell you "this does not contradict .....", does not contradict anything in general ..
            2. Pacquale Pestrini
              Pacquale Pestrini 4 September 2021 20: 55
              -6
              You are confusing round with red. Everyone gave a shit about the Union, no one even defended it, everyone wanted sausages and jeans, got it?
            3. denis02135
              denis02135 5 September 2021 15: 35
              -2
              Dear Babay22,


              “We had an industrially developed country - the USSR. "

              Name 10 consumer goods produced in the USSR that would be competitive with Western ones.
        3. figwam
          figwam 4 September 2021 10: 34
          +16
          5. "Truncated" fire extinguishing system: who came up with this solution and why?

          Apparently this is how effective managers decided to deal with the excess weight of the aircraft.
        4. Maki Avellevich
          Maki Avellevich 4 September 2021 12: 48
          +3
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          Although there are all the resources for this.

          furs and hemp were forgotten.
        5. Akuzenka
          Akuzenka 6 September 2021 11: 55
          +5
          Kind of mild, colleague. Without a developed industry, everything that you have listed is not our resources, but those to whom they are sold. And bayard is entirely right. Moreover, these resources do not even belong to the state, they are all in private hands, which means they enrich someone, but not the country. There is no talk of industry. there is no industry for its processing into high-tech products.
      2. SHURUM -BURUM
        SHURUM -BURUM 4 September 2021 09: 06
        +16
        "The actions of the heads of the Ministry of Industry and Trade, which, according to some media reports, set the task of the commission members to" find out in detail whether there were any errors of the crew during the landing approach "
        With such a development of the catastrophe, this is the most disgusting invention of leaders who want to hide their ends in the water without any questions.
      3. Brancodd
        Brancodd 4 September 2021 09: 27
        -9
        In normal country

        Is it impossible without stamps? Could you announce a list of "normal" countries?
        1. bayard
          bayard 4 September 2021 09: 50
          +18
          For me, a normal country is one where there is the NKVD and the responsibility of leaders of any rank.
          I was born in such a country.
      4. dauria
        dauria 4 September 2021 13: 55
        -5
        I, like the author, are also surprised how the leadership of the Ministry of Industry and Trade and the UAC can set the task ... to find reasons to blame the crew ...


        But I am surprised by the author ... The conclusions of the commission are brought by the order "in the part concerning". All documents have numbers, dates, signatures and other bureaucratic wisdom.
        Can't wait to speak up? After all, the investigation is not over and all the writing is empty chatter.
        "Yesterday we dug a trench - We dug up two streams of cognac!" Nothing changes. Only in the past, no fees were paid for gossip.
      5. silverwolf88
        silverwolf88 4 September 2021 14: 10
        -6
        and you still whine about how bad everything is ... you are probably one of those who in the 90s ran with posters BOTTOM the Communist Party and glory to Yeltsin ... and now, of course, smart ones like girls with low social responsibility on the sidelines
        1. bayard
          bayard 4 September 2021 23: 36
          +3
          Quote: silberwolf88
          girls with low social responsibility

          Similar "girls" scribble similar posts.
          For denyuzhku, or for their own stupidity.
          For social responsibility is LOWERED.
          I am for RESPONSIBILITY. And not so much social as legal
          And criminal.
          Quote: silberwolf88
          you are probably one of those who are in the 90s

          Yes, I remember the 90s, I was in them. Moreover, I knew then a lot of those who now have long been household names ... and rather odious.
      6. Kuz
        Kuz 4 September 2021 15: 41
        +21
        Quote: bayard
        I, like the author, are also surprised how the leadership of the Ministry of Industry and Trade and the UAC can set the task ... to find reasons to blame the crew

        Why be surprised? The current leadership is not used to being responsible for anything, since the responsibility is blurred, and most often it is shifted to subordinates
        1. bayard
          bayard 4 September 2021 23: 47
          +8
          This disaster was a direct consequence of the criminal order to distill an absolutely raw prototype for an exhibition in the Moscow region. The prototype had never taken off in the air for more than 10 to 15 minutes before. The maximum permissible flight duration allowed for this PROTOTYPE of the engine (because there is NO engine itself, it is still being developed) is 30 minutes !!!
          And the plane that just made a flight lasting 1,5 - 2 hours, soon after this flight ... is again lifted into the air to be transferred to another airfield near Moscow ...
          Yes, after that flight, it was necessary to put it on for a couple of days for preventive maintenance and fault detection of the engines!
          And his back into the air.
          But if it was only in the engine ... Engine failures in flight had already happened on it, but it landed safely ... The result of the disaster was jambs and miscalculations in the glider itself, the control system, alarm system, fire extinguishing ...
          Nobody had the right to lift such an aircraft into the air!
          And the one who ORDERED him to lift and overtake ... must become known.
          Although this is already a category of untouchables.
      7. krops777
        krops777 4 September 2021 15: 54
        +5
        I, like the author, are also surprised how the leadership of the Ministry of Industry and Trade and the UAC can set the task ... to find reasons to blame the crew ...


        I am not surprised, you know, having worked in the structure of Russian Railways for more than 20 years, I went through this and became the "hero of the occasion" more than once, although sometimes I had nothing to do with refusals, the reason is still the same - defective management. and not what, status and pride does not allow to turn to specialists, it is easier to find an extreme and hang everything on him and so on until the next refusal, something like this.
      8. Agent cooper
        Agent cooper 4 September 2021 22: 28
        -1
        Vote for Putin and United Russia and there will be happiness.
      9. mmaxx
        mmaxx 5 September 2021 06: 12
        -4
        Yaroslavna's cry. This is the name of such a post in industrial language.
      10. mmaxx
        mmaxx 5 September 2021 18: 01
        -2
        Do something with no plans and no work. It may not be that fast and everything goes, but it goes the same.
        And especially wonderful people were flying the helicopter. They crashed the helicopter with people on the water. And that's all. Putin again?
    3. 75 Sergey
      75 Sergey 4 September 2021 07: 13
      -18
      Why are test pilots needed? To test aircraft, to identify deficiencies.
      1. Peak
        Peak 4 September 2021 07: 34
        +14
        transition of the machine to an uncontrolled side roll and the overturning of the car caused the destruction of the aileron thrust by fire


        What "G" (material) is the thrust made of so that the combustion temperature of kerosene could destroy it so soon?
        But this is a highly loaded element, which must have safety margins ...
        1. 75 Sergey
          75 Sergey 4 September 2021 08: 05
          +4
          Aluminum melts already at 450 degrees Celsius, the derivatives are not much better.
          The plane, I tell you, often all consists of this "g"
      2. Shiden
        Shiden 4 September 2021 07: 50
        0
        Sergei, you carefully read the author's comment, or you are for tsipilo, the phrase "find reasons to blame the crew" Or maybe the truth that is so hidden from the public behind slogans and promises by the authorities, because you cannot do anything only in the kitchen to grumble. Name exactly who of the authorities was punished for the crash of planes in August, no one but Vanya and Petya of aircraft mechanics will be punished.
        1. 75 Sergey
          75 Sergey 4 September 2021 08: 07
          -3
          If the aircraft mechanic did not overlook, then he should be punished and the one who is looking after him.
          Sorry, but it is stupid to punish the president for the miscalculation of the person responsible at the local level.
          1. Serge-667
            Serge-667 4 September 2021 08: 35
            +4
            Or maybe you should think about who made the program of performances?
          2. Shiden
            Shiden 4 September 2021 10: 28
            -4
            You know, I will not argue with your arguments, I will not punish someone, but Boyard wrote in a comment that this system is to blame and not a person, but a person in a non-system, society is called a hermit-savage. But by the silence of the president and his team, it is so clear that a series of disasters in August is not his miscalculation, the human factor is for a reason, you mean it.
      3. John22
        John22 4 September 2021 11: 12
        +14
        Yes, this is their job, but the designers must design the aircraft with a margin of safety and reliability. In order not to ruin the testers, but to create devices for centuries. Was it possible that looking at this parody of an airplane, codenamed Il-112, it was not clear to anyone other than me that it had, first of all, an abnormal wing. Very narrow, without normal mechanization and not designed for fire. During the war years, aircraft with burning engines flew tens of kilometers and the thrust or control cable did not burn out. Looking at the video of the crash, I immediately realized that the control of the ailerons was violated. Here, even without a commission, everything was clear. there should be demand from designers and managers.
        1. silverwolf88
          silverwolf88 4 September 2021 14: 12
          -6
          how smart you are and not in the government ... what a shame))
          1. Captain45
            Captain45 4 September 2021 15: 24
            +2
            Quote: silberwolf88
            how smart you are and not in the government ... what a shame))

            It has long been known that in our country all knowledgeable specialists work as taxi drivers or hairdressers. lol
        2. dauria
          dauria 4 September 2021 20: 52
          -1
          Looking at the video of the crash, I immediately realized that the control of the ailerons was violated.


          Oh how! Fire, stall and the classic start of a corkscrew are visible. And the commission will establish the reason. I don't think Skomorokhov is included in it. To the official conclusions (which may not be brought to everyone) is generally not worth talking about.
        3. MBRSS
          MBRSS 4 September 2021 21: 53
          +4
          Really ...., no one else, except me, understood that he had, first of all, an abnormal wing. Very narrow, no normal mechanization

          I didn't like the wing visually either, and I also wrote about it in the comments. Both short and narrow, and the flaps seem to be too small, and, apparently, there is not much fuel there. This is the first impression. And then it turned out that the engines were not powerful enough either. It is unclear how such a car will feel on a dirt road ...
      4. Kronos
        Kronos 4 September 2021 12: 17
        -7
        Ready for flight and efficient devices, I'm not saying that they actually put pensioners at the helm.
    4. MBRSS
      MBRSS 4 September 2021 21: 32
      +1
      Will the guilty be punished? And how will they be punished? - these are the questions!
      1. Sling cutter
        Sling cutter 4 September 2021 21: 51
        +8
        Quote: MBRBS
        Will the guilty be punished? And how will they be punished? - these are the questions!

        Uh-huh ... they'll put them in a corner .... They'll find the extreme uncle "pete".
        But "daddy's joy" will be appointed to the government, because daddy is no stranger to whistling about the "American drill".
    5. Starover_Z
      Starover_Z 6 September 2021 09: 44
      +1
      Quote: Military Commissar77
      And another dilettante, also clothed with power, ordered to take off on a damp plane, and the professionals signed their own verdict.

      It means that those "clerks" should be rolled on the next "raw" sides until the planes are brought to full readiness! Menachers become immediately, and Pilots with a capital letter - for decades!
      And the professionals are truly sorry ...
  2. Pessimist22
    Pessimist22 4 September 2021 05: 03
    +20
    Nobody will be punished, the bosses cannot be guilty.
    1. Volga073
      Volga073 4 September 2021 05: 42
      +8
      A couple of people and bunks should be ..
    2. antivirus
      antivirus 4 September 2021 06: 58
      -1
      6 in IL. and in ANakh - by 2?
      could it be?

      ...................................... did the half-ripped structure work as planned?
  3. mmaxx
    mmaxx 4 September 2021 05: 44
    +13
    The thrust itself may not have burned out. But it passes through the structure, all sorts of rocking arms, brackets, fittings ... When the surrounding structure burns out, even a tungsten thrust will not work correctly.
  4. Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx 4 September 2021 05: 56
    +10
    Today, no orders and condolences will return the pilots. We still need to think about people, not about solemn reports.

    This is the most important takeaway.
    Once again I express my condolences to the families and friends of the victims - MEN with a capital letter.
  5. 75 Sergey
    75 Sergey 4 September 2021 07: 07
    -4
    Haste - haste .... there was no rush, just a miscalculation, they did not overlook it, there were probably justifications for such a design.
    There would be a hurry if he went into the series in this form!
    Tests are for this purpose, in order to identify shortcomings.
    1. Cosm22
      Cosm22 4 September 2021 08: 15
      +13
      The test is the test of strife.
      If, in reality, instead of six bursts of fire extinguishing, only two were installed (and after all, a test flight is always more risky than an ordinary one), then such a product should not be allowed close to testing.
      This is not a test. It is a crime.
      1. mmaxx
        mmaxx 5 September 2021 06: 19
        -3
        Do you know how many fire extinguishing systems there should be? What are the general system requirements?
        Sometimes a fire cannot be extinguished even by the entire fire department.
        1. mmaxx
          mmaxx 5 September 2021 10: 40
          -3
          As far as I understand, all the supporters are minus.
  6. avia12005
    avia12005 4 September 2021 07: 09
    +14
    "The main reason for the Il-112V crash in Kubinka was the haste of our Ministry of Defense, who passionately wanted to show the car at MAKS and Army-2021" - what does the Ministry of Defense have to do with it ??? The aircraft did not pass tests, was not transferred to the Ministry of Defense. This is pure criminal negligence of the Ministry of Industry and Trade!
    1. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 4 September 2021 07: 46
      +11
      Quote: avia12005
      This is pure criminal negligence of the Ministry of Industry and Trade!

      And the same infamous Manturov recently promoted the SU-75.
      1. avia12005
        avia12005 4 September 2021 08: 28
        0
        I can't see him anymore am
      2. tank64rus
        tank64rus 4 September 2021 19: 27
        +3
        The most profitable minister In the government of the Russian Federation.
        1. avia12005
          avia12005 5 September 2021 07: 15
          -1
          There is something for him to receive money.
  7. cosmos-PS
    cosmos-PS 4 September 2021 07: 36
    +11
    The fire extinguishing system certainly raises questions. If indeed it is in a stripped-down form, then I wonder why? If this is connected with the task to reduce the weight of the aircraft and they solved it, including by means of a fire extinguishing system, then this is already a deliberate violation of the rules of standards, but not by designers, but by those who set these tasks for them, who may have a superficial relation to aircraft construction. But this is just guesswork and I may be wrong.
    1. svoroponov
      svoroponov 4 September 2021 17: 20
      +3
      The fire system has fulfilled its purpose. Only now the fire developed in that part of the wing, where it is not provided, including on other types. Don't think of constructors as fools. What is a broken turbine or compressor blades? The radial load on the blade is about 12 tons and even higher, if it collapses, it is like the rupture of a small artillery shell or a burst from a machine gun. The fragments pierced not only the pipelines, but most likely damaged the tanks in the wing and the electrical wiring. Even 6 stages of extinguishing such a fire may not be extinguished. And the cause of destruction can be a defect in the material of the blade and the ingress of a foreign object into the compressor, the same bird. And yet, in such a resonant case, when everything is clear, no one will tell the commission of inquiry what to check and who to appoint guilty. There is a certain order of investigation and a protocol of what and how to check and what examinations to conduct, moreover, such cases are investigated by an independent commission, which is appointed by the government and not by a departmental one.
      For this, dreamers and “well-wishers,” they need to scold the authorities to calm down, and not show their incompetence!
      1. Topgun
        Topgun 4 September 2021 18: 57
        -1
        about incompetence ...
        1 look at the vidos https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBqWS1hil18&t=28s&ab_channel=mzo
        designers make engines structurally redundant today !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - engines could be lighter !!!!!!!!!!! but now engineers are working more and more to ensure that nothing is scattered when the engine is destroyed
        2 aircraft manufacturers are booking gondolas because sales do not grow from disasters
        3 - most importantly, we are talking about MILITARY AIRCRAFT, what kind of birds? he must survive with a single defeat of MANPADS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
        1. svoroponov
          svoroponov 5 September 2021 19: 06
          -2
          Do you have any idea of ​​a jet engine? This is not a car engine. If the blades of a turbine or compressor are destroyed, more than one protection, with the exception of tank armor, will not hold the fragments. This is 1.
          Blowtorch-like fire very quickly under the pressure of air and kerosene
          destroys duralumin and deforms steel and titanium. The thrust may not have burned out, but it could simply have jammed from the thermal deformation of the metal. This is 2.
          And yet, there are fuel tanks to the right and left of the engine in the wing, if the pipelines at the exit from them are damaged by flying debris, or the damage can be through, then nothing will help. ... There are no fire extinguishers above the wing. This is 3.
          Well, about the layout and narrow wings - the plane is blown in a wind tunnel. In addition, there are solutions for weight, wing areas, wing mechanization, developed over decades. And yet, whoever says what, but the final decision to lift the plane into the air or not is made by the crew. If the crew commander knew about the shortcomings, then he had the right not to lift the board into the air. And no one could force him, not even the president's order. The plane is being tested.
  8. tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 4 September 2021 07: 49
    +7
    Usually in "Ilakh" the system is installed on the planes, which extinguishes fire in SIX bursts. That is, on each side, in the case of the Il-112, there would be SIX fire extinguishers instead of TWO.

    What caused such a reduction in security systems is a question.

    I am not connected with aviation, I am a seaman, but in our fleet and also in aviation, everyone knows that fire safety issues come first, and when building ships and aircraft, this is a priority task.
    1. Bad_gr
      Bad_gr 4 September 2021 12: 25
      +8
      Quote: tihonmarine
      ..... everyone knows that fire safety issues come first

      Everyone knew this before, as they had a specialized education. And now if you look at who is in charge of the UAC and, accordingly, sets the tasks:
      Chairman of the Board of Directors of the company - Anatoly Eduardovich Serdyukov
      (Graduated from the Leningrad Institute of Soviet Trade in 1984)
      General Director - Yuri Borisovich Slyusar.
      (1996 - Lomonosov Moscow State University, lawyer
      2003 - Postgraduate study at the Academy of National Economy under the Government of the Russian Federation, Candidate of Economic Sciences)
      In general, there was somehow a list of the top officials of the company, in the top ten with specialized education there is not.
      This is where everything dances: when the task of what the plane should be is set by a person with the education of an accountant.
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 4 September 2021 15: 41
        +2
        Quote: Bad_gr
        This is where everything dances: when the task of what the plane should be is set by a person with the education of an accountant.

        He's a stool seller. But airplanes are not "stools". A new plane will be built, but people will not be resurrected.
        1. svoroponov
          svoroponov 5 September 2021 19: 24
          -2
          About Serdyukov. The ego was set to direct the finances to the right place and not let them be sprayed where it was not necessary. In addition, he had to identify who in the troops is trying to master them not productively or trying to snatch more with a small return. If possible, remove unnecessary links of resource consumers. He basically fulfilled his task.
          And now admit it, because almost all of you gave gifts to doctors and teachers, and perhaps gave them to your own or other bosses.
          The question is, why? because they get paid for their work. This is how corruption begins. And before you hait someone, start with yourself.
          Some of you scold others, because in life, for one reason or another, you have not achieved what some have achieved, and what self-conceit about your abilities is. From this and envy and anger.
      2. Pacquale Pestrini
        Pacquale Pestrini 5 September 2021 09: 25
        +1
        However, the board of directors and the director are personally, first of all, managers, not scientists. It's not a fact that a brilliant design scientist knows something about logistics, financing ...
        1. Bad_gr
          Bad_gr 5 September 2021 12: 34
          +3
          Let's remember who previously commanded in the design bureau and compare the results of their work with our managers:
          Korolev (space), Glushko, Tupolev, Sukhoi, Ilyushin, Myasishchev, Beriev, Lavochkin, Kuznetsov (engines), Alekseev (ekranoplanes), etc.
          1. svoroponov
            svoroponov 6 September 2021 18: 05
            +1
            And who stood over them and who were they guided by?
            1. Bad_gr
              Bad_gr 6 September 2021 18: 16
              +1
              Quote: svoroponov
              And who stood over them and who were they guided by?

              The country's leadership set a task, and design bureaus and manufacturers issued products. Or do you want to say that the same Korolev went to the accounting department and coordinated his Wishlist with the chief accountant, and if he did not agree, he looked for parts for his rocket on the side at a cheaper rate?
              1. svoroponov
                svoroponov 8 September 2021 18: 44
                +1
                Well, not with the chief accountant, but with the financial department of the Armed Forces and the Ministry of Finance.
                And all design bureaus were guided by instructions and tasks set by the Ministry of Defense. And the top of the country determined the direction of development, terms and gave orders for financing, that is, gave permission to be included in the plan. In practice, this system is still in effect.
                By the way, if it was necessary, then yes, at the request of the design bureau, they connected all the resources, including those for finding the necessary, including abroad.
                Effective managers, in Russian, managers are
                and General Designer and other people, ranging from the head of the department to the foreman in production. The fulfillment of the task largely depends on them. Another question is that random or incompetent people, “foam” as they are called, fall into their place, but this is another question. In the 90s, in connection with the collapse of industry, the succession of training of specialists was destroyed, yes. But time passes, everything is restored, the foam is slowly leaving. So everything will be normalized in the State of Russia. You have to believe in it and blink it.
  9. donavi49
    donavi49 4 September 2021 08: 09
    +4
    IL-112V in Kubinka was the haste of our Ministry of Defense, eager to show the car at MAKS and Army-2021.


    That is, if he fell in Voronezh on the next test flight, would that be normal ??? The catastrophe developed so rapidly that Kubinka actually gave more chances to hold out (just a little short) than Voronezh.
    1. Captain Nemo
      Captain Nemo 4 September 2021 13: 01
      +5
      Is it okay to drive a raw plane far away for show, where it could also crash on the audience? Death during trials in Voronezh would have been more honest. Earlier, a lot of souls, ideological ones, went to aircraft designers. Now the designer is laborers who fulfill the whims of the oligarchs and their lackeys. Ideological rudeness and foolishness from the authorities do not tolerate for a long time - they quit. So the aviation industry hangs for 5 hours. Well, what kind of power did the "galosh" USSR have that we are still pulling on its reserves?
      1. donavi49
        donavi49 4 September 2021 14: 06
        +6
        Well, if we compare it with the USSR, then there was a real race to turn the plane on display for the holiday. And unprepared cars also flew. There were also disasters at the stage of final preparations.

        To drive far is so, but how else to drive the required mileage for tests? The ferry went well. If this is a marriage / excess of the structural load and cracks, then it would not have been noticed in Voronezh after the next mileage flight. No difference. Checks go on the fly.

        It is difficult to collapse on the audience, and if this happens, then this is a failure of the event administrators, who approved the initially dangerous plans for show flights and this is a prison with no options.
        1. Captain Nemo
          Captain Nemo 4 September 2021 14: 23
          -1
          Well, they would wind up the mileage at the factory airfield. Why did they drive a crude plane with a known defective engine for show? To powder the brains of the people. In the USSR, the show of raw airplanes was postponed, but now? Now they emphasize the weakness of the Russian Federation.

          An unguided aircraft does not care about the plans of the organizers.
          1. svoroponov
            svoroponov 4 September 2021 17: 28
            +1
            Even mass-produced engines that have been used for a long time have their limitations. Pilots (especially military ones) know about this and should take into account. But even with such engines in all countries there are periodically problems that lead to disasters.
          2. mmaxx
            mmaxx 5 September 2021 06: 24
            0
            After a certain program, new aircraft are transferred to the appropriate test center of the OKB. And the tests continue there. If the acceptance has confirmed the possibility of such a transfer, then that's it.
            At the plant, serial cars are tested to the end.
  10. Ros 56
    Ros 56 4 September 2021 08: 17
    +5
    The author would like to inquire about the history of the formation of the Su-24 wing.
    1. avia12005
      avia12005 4 September 2021 08: 32
      +8
      What, the Su-24 also fell in preparation for the parades, being not accepted into service? They fought tests.

      «Flight tests of Su-24 aircraft were accompanied by a large number of flight accidents. In total, 10 aircraft were lost, including: due to the fault of the design - 3 (breakage of the thrust of the pivot pylon, destruction of the rotation mechanism of the left wing console, failure of the aircraft longitudinal control system), all the rest - due to the AL-21F3 engine (titanium fires and explosions combustion chambers). In addition, 4 Su-24M aircraft were lost in flight tests. Unfortunately, this was accompanied by the death of people. Killed 13 test pilots and navigators of the OKB P.O. Sukhoi, NAZ and State Research Institute of the Air Force: S. Lavrentyev, N. Rukhlyadko, V. Krechetov, M. Yurov, V. Voloshin, Yu. Yumashev, V. Kuznetsov, L. Sorokin , A. Kosarev, V. Kondrat'ev, A. Vlasov, V. Nikitin, G. Gridusov. Eight people escaped and survived: A. Shcherbakov, V. Dashkov, V. Plotnikov, V. Glinchikov, A. Danilin, V. Lotkov, N. Sattarov, O. Tsoi. "

      Then there were 5-6 falls a year.
      1. Ros 56
        Ros 56 4 September 2021 13: 39
        +6
        The plane is absolutely fucked, it flies to the parade, or to the tests. People need to be friends with their brains.
        1. avia12005
          avia12005 4 September 2021 14: 26
          -3
          The plane is absolutely fucking good, whether it's tested or not. There are wings, the dvigun is standing, so it will fly into the sky. Brilliant.
      2. silverwolf88
        silverwolf88 4 September 2021 14: 18
        -2
        respect for the review ... this is also statistics on Yak 32 and other vertical takeoff they have not seen ... but this article is about nothing ... a storm in a glass of water with a controversial position how bad everything is in the state ... hidden liberalism
      3. datura23
        datura23 5 September 2021 04: 53
        0
        Every year, 1 ki fall 2-24 times, they take off and land exactly above my house.
        1. mmaxx
          mmaxx 5 September 2021 06: 26
          -1
          In general, it is surprising that it was not removed from service. Rare junk in terms of accidents.
  11. victor_47
    victor_47 4 September 2021 09: 02
    +6
    "5." Truncated "fire extinguishing system: who came up with this solution and why?".
    We saved on the weight of the aircraft in order to fit into the terms of reference for its own weight. Probably, there were other "economical" solutions.
  12. oldman.
    oldman. 4 September 2021 09: 04
    +6
    In the article:
    was fed into the engine nacelle foam composition for extinguishing fire

    Both cylinders with foam were spent

    That is, the onboard fire extinguishing system on the Il-112v uses foam as a working fluid ?!
    Is this a new innovative development or a "brilliant" guess of Mr. Skomorokhov himself?
    Who can explain?
  13. prior
    prior 4 September 2021 09: 59
    +4
    SYSTEM is to blame for the plane crash.
    And neither the hardware, nor the pilots, nor we, the commentators of this site, are able to fight the system.
    Alas.......
    1. silverwolf88
      silverwolf88 4 September 2021 14: 19
      -5
      oh how ... A LIBERASTIC APPEAL TO THE LEADERSHIP OF THE COUNTRY HOWEVER ...
      well, whine the nozzles, let it go ...
      1. Agent cooper
        Agent cooper 4 September 2021 22: 39
        0
        A visit to the successors of the Yeltsin cause? Those who rename the police to the police, Yeltsin centers open and Mistrals are ordered from NATO member countries. Is this your favorite government? Those who have Russia as an energy superpower rather than a technological superpower.
  14. askort154
    askort154 4 September 2021 10: 11
    +2
    The actions of the heads of the Ministry of Industry and Trade are perplexing, who, according to some media reports, set the task for the members of the commission “to find out in detail whether there were any errors by the crew during the landing approach”.

    This has been practiced for a long time, and not only here. In Soviet times, they gave instructions to commissions of inquiry, like - "Soviet equipment should not be bad." And in any disaster you can "find a crew error."
  15. faiver
    faiver 4 September 2021 10: 29
    0
    new aircraft have always been falling since their inception, test pilots have regularly died and are still dying, nothing can be done about it. And I do not see the fault of the designers, the fault lies only with the managers, as in the USSR it was necessary to time the commissioning of the object to coincide with Lenin's birthday or the anniversary of the October Revolution, and now only for some kind of exhibition or summit, and so on in all industries
  16. boris
    boris 4 September 2021 11: 03
    +3
    As for the engine, Skomorokhov wrote nonsense. This
    engine designed and manufactured in Russia, Ukraine here
    nothing to do with it. The problem is somewhat different. This particular
    the copy of the engine is initially sick. Hence the question -
    Why hasn't it been replaced with another copy in 2 years?
    1. SovAr238A
      SovAr238A 4 September 2021 12: 25
      +3
      Quote: borys
      As for the engine, Skomorokhov wrote nonsense. This
      engine designed and manufactured in Russia, Ukraine here
      nothing to do with it. The problem is somewhat different. This particular
      the copy of the engine is initially sick. Hence the question -
      Why hasn't it been replaced with another copy in 2 years?

      But because there is no other instance ...
      Only two engines were assembled from contraband Ukrainian components ...
      It was the right engine that repeatedly showed its "dampness" until the moment of the disaster.
      And there is simply nothing to replace.
      1. boris
        boris 4 September 2021 13: 35
        0
        Once again, especially for you - the engine is designed and manufactured
        in Russia, Ukraine has nothing to do with it
        1. The comment was deleted.
  17. Yuri Stepanov
    Yuri Stepanov 4 September 2021 11: 21
    +5
    It is necessary to introduce a rule that during the tests, the leadership would also be on board, then, I am 100% sure, each bolt will be serviceable. And there will be not 6, but 12 fire extinguishers and the draft will not melt.
  18. Living7111972
    Living7111972 4 September 2021 11: 26
    +1
    Enemies of the people are not fiction
    1. DWG1905
      DWG1905 4 September 2021 12: 19
      +2
      This is not a prototype, but a prototype. The prototype is what served as a model for creation. For example, when carrying out R&D, an experimental sample created in R&D can serve as a prototype. Conclusion If there is no understanding of how R&D is carried out, then there is no need to write articles. In our terminology, there is generally no word prototype. The prototype is a technically illiterate translation from English. Il's fault in the crash is actually not the fault of the developer and the engine manufacturers. There are questions about the fire system and the material of the rods, but it is necessary to look at the TTZ for the ROC, the act of the commission for the acceptance of the Technical Design and various technical solutions with the general customer, what to do and how.
  19. Yun Klob
    Yun Klob 4 September 2021 12: 09
    0
    The cause of the tragedy was "not the readiness of the prototype" (as in the text), but its "unreadiness".
  20. Fitter65
    Fitter65 4 September 2021 12: 18
    +9
    By coincidence, the author lives in this city and has several VASO employees in his social circle... Naturally, he could not help but ask questions to the factory workers about
    The accountant, the head of the ATI warehouse, the driver of the airfield tractor, the shift supervisor of the RSP at the airfield are also employees of VASO, but they hardly have the same knowledge and concepts on the topic as workers of the LIS plant. And not every employee involved in the direct assembly of the aircraft has complete information. Therefore, this stuffing on the fan from a person who heard something, somewhere, and spoke with someone over a mug of tea, is not worth a damn. I remember the libel written by the author about the disaster of two boards from the 277th Mlava Bomber Regiment, where this "specialist" wrote that the MSS helicopters located at the Khurba airfield did not have rescue winches, in the photo given by me
    we see there is a turntable PSS, and above the door of the winch, the author did not even react, was he afraid to confess his incompetence? Well, on the other hand, the main thing is to crow first, and there at least don't dawn ... Are there any explanations from the competent authorities regarding this accident? So we read them, and not the speculations of various pseudo-specialists.hi
  21. p0pulivox
    p0pulivox 4 September 2021 12: 27
    +4
    Quote: oldman.
    In the article:
    was fed into the engine nacelle foam composition for extinguishing fire

    Both cylinders with foam were spent

    That is, the onboard fire extinguishing system on the Il-112v uses foam as a working fluid ?!
    Is this a new innovative development or a "brilliant" guess of Mr. Skomorokhov himself?
    Who can explain?

    The fire extinguishing systems of the Soviet / Russian Armed Forces use extinguishing agents Freon 114B, composition "3,5" and Halon 1301.
    The system usually includes 2 (for example, L-410) or 3 stages (for example, Il-76) fire extinguishing systems.
    1. silverwolf88
      silverwolf88 4 September 2021 14: 22
      +4
      write correctly BUT the author and various sofa specialists do not know this
  22. Sotnikoff
    Sotnikoff 4 September 2021 12: 49
    +1
    Today, no orders and condolences will return the pilots. We still need to think about people, not about solemn reports.

    Is the novel offering to surrender again? To create something, there are victims, such is the test practice .. And whining, this is your profession. I hope that Skomorokhov got the honorar? wink
    1. avia12005
      avia12005 4 September 2021 15: 32
      -1
      You are funny, however. Since August 31, you have already made such comments on the site.
      1. Sling cutter
        Sling cutter 4 September 2021 21: 47
        +5
        Quote: avia12005
        however, you are greedy. Since August 31, you have already made such comments on the site.

        This is Meehan Malacholny wassat
  23. lelik613
    lelik613 4 September 2021 12: 49
    -2
    The Potemkin villages were named with the wrong name. There are more worthy fairytale characters of the present time.
  24. Galleon
    Galleon 4 September 2021 14: 50
    +2
    By coincidence, the author lives in this city and has several VASO employees in his social circle. Naturally, he could not help but ask the factory workers about the IL-112V. Answers cannot be translated.

    Very sorry. The frank opinion of aircraft manufacturers about-very much would clarify.
  25. iouris
    iouris 4 September 2021 16: 11
    +4
    There are no engines. There are no constructors. There is no technology. There are no competencies. To the ground. And now....? Excellent starting conditions. Who wants to excel? To the projectile!
  26. lopvlad
    lopvlad 4 September 2021 16: 30
    +2
    By coincidence, the author lives in this city and has several VASO employees in his social circle. Naturally, he could not help but ask the factory workers about the IL-112V.


    it's like asking questions to the body manufacturer about the quality and operation of the engine. The designer and manufacturer of TV7-117ST is "UEC-Klimov".

    Duralumin grade D16, from which the aileron thrust was to be made, must withstand a critical temperature of 650 degrees. However, according to experts, the thrust lost its properties at 600 degrees.


    But on this occasion it was just worth asking questions to the Vaso employees who, during the assembly of the aircraft, installed a counterfeit part, which in the end played a fatal role and claimed the lives of the pilots.

    Will UEC-Klimov JSC, which for so many years have not been able to ensure the performance of the Ukrainian semi-licensed engine, which it offers under the TV7-117ST brand, will be brought to justice?


    what Ukrainian engine are we talking about? TV7-117ST was created on the basis of TV7-117, which in turn was created on the basis of TV3-117, and all these engines were developed in Russia.

    TV3-117 - Developed in 1965-1972 at the V. Ya. Klimov Design Bureau (Leningrad) under the leadership of S.P. Izotov and S.V. Lyunevich.
    TV7-117 - Developed since the 1980s at the Ufa Design Bureau of the USSR Ministry of Aviation Industry under the leadership of A. Sarkisov.
    TV7-117ST - An improved version of TV7-117SM, Developed since 2014 by the Klimov company for use in the Il-112V and Il-114-300 aircraft, pilot production started in 2016.

    Probably the author of the article was misled and allowed to consider the TV3-117 engine Ukrainian by the fact that under the USSR it had been produced since 1972 at ZPOM Motorostroitel, now PJSC Motor Sich, Zaporozhye, Ukraine.
    INTEL processors, for example, are manufactured in China and Malaysia, but it never occurs to anyone to consider their creators to be Chinese or Malaysians.

    Regarding the TV7-117ST engine, the 7 years that have passed from the beginning of the development work to the finished engine is nothing.
    At the same time, the Il-112V is obliged to maintain control and ensure landing with one inoperative engine in accordance with the ROC.
    1. DenVB
      DenVB 4 September 2021 17: 14
      +1
      Quote: lopvlad
      employees of "Vaso" who, during the assembly of the aircraft, allowed to install a counterfeit part

      How do you know the part was counterfeit?
      1. lopvlad
        lopvlad 4 September 2021 18: 58
        0
        Quote: DenVB
        How do you know the part was counterfeit?


        we learn this from the author's text, namely from here
        Duralumin grade D16, from which the aileron thrust was to be made, must withstand a critical temperature of 650 degrees. However, according to experts, the thrust lost its properties at 600 degrees.

        because it is impossible to call a part that could not withstand the strength and temperature characteristics specified in the technical specification for the development of this part except as counterfeit.
        1. DenVB
          DenVB 4 September 2021 19: 03
          +5
          It's clear. No, the word "counterfeit" has a different meaning than what you mean by it.

          By the way, duralumin cannot withstand temperatures of 650 degrees. Already at about 500-510 degrees, it begins to lose strength. But these are already claims to the author, it is not entirely clear what sources he uses when writing articles.
          1. lopvlad
            lopvlad 4 September 2021 19: 17
            -2
            Quote: DenVB
            No, the word "counterfeit" has a different meaning


            any part that does not meet the technical characteristics indicated in the passport for this part is a priori fake (counterfeit). According to the characteristics that the thrust of the IL-112 ailerons should hold, this is to the author, but one thing is clear that in the event of an engine fire, these thrust should have withstood. Therefore, more questions arises to Vaso and the manufacturer of aircraft wing controls than to the manufacturer of the engine.
            1. DenVB
              DenVB 4 September 2021 19: 26
              +1
              Quote: lopvlad
              any part that does not meet the technical characteristics specified in the passport for this part is a priori fake (counterfeit)

              Or, more likely, defective.

              Quote: lopvlad
              Therefore, more questions arise for Vaso and the manufacturer of the wing mechanization.

              Or to a designer who did not quite competently design either the wing itself or the wing mechanization drives. The designer, as I understand it, is the Ilyushin Design Bureau. Or, more precisely, PJSC "Aviation Complex named after S. V. Ilyushin"
              1. lopvlad
                lopvlad 4 September 2021 19: 43
                -1
                Quote: DenVB
                Or a designer


                the Il-112V project is one of the weaknesses, since Russia does not have experience in developing transport aircraft in such a "weight". In the USSR, Antonov designed transport workers in Ukraine, and after the USSR we continued to buy them in Ukraine. the designers could overdo it.
                1. DenVB
                  DenVB 4 September 2021 20: 00
                  +2
                  Quote: lopvlad
                  Russia has no experience in the development of transport workers in such a "weight".

                  What, interestingly, is the experience needed for transport workers "in this weight"? They developed the IL-76. Moreover, it was developed and launched into production faster than it was spent on the Il-112. The Il-114, passenger, has been flying for a long time, but in the same weight category as the Il-112. There are no special secrets in the design of light transport vehicles. In the end, the An-8, An-10, An-12, An-24, An-26 were also once developed by Antonov and put into production in almost one decade - without any previous experience with machines of such classes. For example, An-24 - began to be developed in 1957, already in 1962 went into series. Antonov, apparently, knew some secret?
                  1. lopvlad
                    lopvlad 5 September 2021 00: 53
                    -1
                    Quote: DenVB
                    What, interestingly, is the experience needed for transport workers "in this weight"? They developed the IL-76.


                    incorrect comparison. Comparing the IL-76 with the IL-112 is tantamount to comparing a small car and an average truck, and if you miss the moment that one is a turboprop and the other is a turbojet.

                    Quote: DenVB
                    In the end, the An-8, An-10, An-12, An-24, An-26 were also once developed by Antonov and put into production in almost one decade - without any previous experience with machines of such classes.


                    the system in the country was different. When the design bureaus did not lack either funds or qualified employees. Now it took more than a decade to start producing in Ulyanovsk IL-76, previously produced in Tashkent.

                    Quote: DenVB
                    There are no special secrets in the design of light transport vehicles.


                    yes, you are probably a designer, offer your services for development and shame Ilyushin's design bureau "that we should build a house, we will draw we will live."
                    1. DenVB
                      DenVB 5 September 2021 01: 03
                      0
                      Quote: lopvlad
                      incorrect comparison. Comparing the IL-76 with the IL-112 is tantamount to comparing a small car and an average truck, and if you miss the moment that one is a turboprop and the other is a turbojet.

                      Well, your logic is generally clear. If tomorrow the Il-112V will start developing the Il-112B transport aircraft with a carrying capacity of 4 tons instead of 5, you will say: uh, this has never been developed in Russia, it’s a whole ton less, this is a completely different level of complexity.

                      Perhaps we can end the discussion here.
        2. mmaxx
          mmaxx 5 September 2021 06: 34
          0
          There are no such terms. There is a compliance with the CD. The plant must comply with these requirements. And that's all. But if the thrust is not from D-16, as in the CD, but from titanium, then it will be a marriage.
  27. The comment was deleted.
  28. tank64rus
    tank64rus 4 September 2021 19: 24
    0
    “The actions of the leaders of the Ministry of Industry and Trade, who, according to some media reports, set the task of the commission members to“ find out in detail whether there were any errors by the crew during the landing approach. ”Indeed.“ Naturally, I could not but ask the factory workers about the Il-112V. The answers cannot be translated. "The business of" effective managers "lives on.
  29. Maks1995
    Maks1995 4 September 2021 19: 53
    0
    Blessed memory of pilots
  30. zvonix
    zvonix 4 September 2021 22: 28
    -1
    We fought with an advantage in all ways. So we got two fire extinguishers instead of six.
  31. Pacquale Pestrini
    Pacquale Pestrini 5 September 2021 09: 21
    -2
    Quote: Pacquale Pestrini
    So the experience of RI was, which they themselves ruined, if not for the revolutions and the hedgehog with them, there would have been 500 Russians ...
    Now imagine if the Ukrainian defense industry remained on the territory of the RSFSR ...
  32. Konnick
    Konnick 5 September 2021 09: 54
    +1
    a fire started in the right engine led to a fire in the skin and internal structures of the wing

    A group of experts from the Interstate Aviation Committee and their colleagues from the Ministry of Industry and Trade found that the fault was a malfunction of the aircraft's right engine and the subsequent surge. This was followed by the loss of gas-dynamic equilibrium by the engine and, probably, the destruction of the turbine. Usually, the surge destroys the turbine blades first of all, and already the debris of the blades begins to destroy everything around.

    The crew requested an emergency landing, which was given. The recordings recorded the clear and intelligible actions of the crew. The burning engine was muffled, the propeller was feathering, on the remaining engines, the pilots were able to turn the plane and go towards the airfield


    Commission and author of the article, you decide on the engine. It collapsed or was muffled, what could be muffled there?
    It looks like the commission is still the one that made conclusions about "FIRE OF THE COATING AND INTERNAL WING STRUCTURES". What is the plane made of?
    1. svoroponov
      svoroponov 18 September 2021 19: 21
      0
      Everything is correct. Destruction of the engine - breakage of the turbine blades. Plugged - the stop valve cut off the fuel supply to it. All circuit breakers related to it are turned off.
      But, I repeat, if fragments of the turbine blades damaged the wing fuel tanks and
      fuel began to pour out, which, once it hit the combustion chambers of the turbojet engine, caused a fire, then shutting off the stop valve will no longer help. Even a fire system may not extinguish such a fire. By the way, even titanium rods may not help, there is a destruction and deformation of the attachment points in the wing structure. There are many similar accidents in aviation.
      Now, regarding the flight of the plane from Voronezh to Moscow. An ordinary test, designed as “Flight along the route” from one airfield to another. There is no crime or ostentation here.
      Plane display is the usual take-off and landing and flight in a circle. The flight route and altitude in the Moscow region were chosen so that in the event of an abnormal situation, the aircraft could not fall onto the residential infrastructure.
  33. Xscorpion
    Xscorpion 5 September 2021 12: 43
    +2

    1. Was there such a need for prototype flights at exhibitions?

    Well, there would be no exhibition, he would fly in another place. He still needed to be tested, and the pilots would still risk. And a fire in the engine could have happened a day earlier, or a day later, and not at the exhibition, but in another place. I don’t understand this emphasis at the exhibition. Does it sound beautiful that a new Russian plane crashed at the exhibition?
  34. Pacquale Pestrini
    Pacquale Pestrini 5 September 2021 14: 49
    -2
    Quote: Pacquale Pestrini
    So the experience of RI was, which they themselves ruined, if not for the revolutions and the hedgehog with them, there would have been 500 Russians ...
    Now imagine if the Ukrainian defense industry remained on the territory of the RSFSR ...
  35. The comment was deleted.
  36. kafa
    kafa 5 September 2021 15: 13
    0
    Sorry for the crew. If they were written off .... It would be a complete scribe.
  37. Rumen5252
    Rumen5252 6 September 2021 03: 43
    0
    Do not need such heavy words. Look, three pilots !!! As Grand Marshal Georgy Zhukov said: "Women will give birth again"
  38. Dmitry Vladimirovich
    Dmitry Vladimirovich 6 September 2021 08: 53
    -1
    The main complaint is about the engine.
    But such an engine failure should not cause catastrophic situations.

    Obviously problems with the fire extinguishing system.
    1. Old Hermit
      Old Hermit 6 September 2021 15: 27
      +1
      Quote: Dmitry Vladimirovich
      The main complaint is about the engine.
      But such an engine failure should not cause catastrophic situations.

      Obviously problems with the fire extinguishing system.


      It all started with a surge. Surge is the main and most dangerous enemy of gas turbines. During surge, compressor blades vibrate so violently that they fly.
      The engine caught a surge, everything else was only later
  39. starshina
    starshina 10 September 2021 17: 57
    0
    Incompetence ... corruption ... window dressing ... negligence ... negligence --- all this is present in the Russian aviation industry --- the question arises why the president and the government of Russia absolutely do not take any measures to fix it ??? How long will first-class pilots and citizens of the country die and when will responsible officials be punished for their incompetence and theft ???
  40. Sergei Krasnikhin
    Sergei Krasnikhin 29 June 2022 09: 38
    0
    As far as I remember this story with the production of the aircraft from the press data, they did not want to launch it in a series, due to the fact that someone lobbied for the assembly of Antonov aircraft at production facilities. About the sons who head Ilyushin, let the specialists - production workers write off. Attempts to lighten the aircraft due to the design and the lack of a powerful and reliable engine, these are the main causes of the disaster. I don't think he will go to series. Such a country needs Ilyushins, Tupolevs, etc., and not cash flow managers.