"Displacement by natural means": the Russian language in the Republic of Kazakhstan

War veterans of Alma-Ata. Source: YouTube

Kazakhstan precedent

Despite the fact that the Russian language is relatively safe, the area of ​​its use is gradually narrowing.

If in the second half of the last century up to 500 million people spoke Russian, then by 2020 there were about 260 million Russian speakers in the world. decline.

But the pressure on Russian speakers is exerted also abroad. First of all, in the countries of the former Soviet Union, where at certain times up to 70% of Russian-speakers lived. The main motive for such a struggle is simple - an attempt to break away from the "Russian world", oust Russian culture and demonstrate loyalty to the West.

Source: vse.kz

The latest and most disturbing news come from Kazakhstan, the majority of the population (up to 90%) of which uses Russian in everyday life.

First, the local minister of education announced that from 2023, all schools in the republic will be taught only in Kazakh. By the way, only 39% of the population speak Kazakh fluently, most of whom live in the southern territories of the republic. And the Kazakh version of the Unified State Exam - the Unified National Test - is passed in Kazakh only by 51% of school graduates.

At the same time, the Russian language in Kazakhstan is the official language, which, of course, does not equalize it in rights with the state language, but it does not deserve such an attitude either.

An interesting point of view about the reasons for such a demarche, expressed by the portal lenta.ru. The whole thing, no matter how trite, comes down to money. Moreover, they were misappropriated.

In 2020, Education Minister Askhat Aimagambetov was involved in a $ 16 million corruption scandal. Now, with such "patriotic" statements, the minister is trying to simultaneously divert attention and get political dividends from the nationalist factions.

But the Kazakh authorities do not stop there either. By 2023, it is planned to finally translate the Kazakh language into the Latin alphabet, which, of course, will create difficulties not only for Russian speakers, but also for the titular nation.

What to do, for example, with a huge layer of Kazakh culture, which has survived in the Cyrillic alphabet?

To translate the collected works of the legendary Abai Kunanbayev into a new manner?

It is likely that by the notorious 2023 Nur-Sultan will finally get rid of the Russian language as an official one. It will remain, at best, the status of a regional one.

The artificial and painful for the population the elimination of the Russian inevitably leads to the growth of nationalism within the state. The thugs who felt the state support for their own chauvinism can really turn around. Moreover, at the beginning of the year, anti-Russian parties won many seats in the Kazakh parliament.

Thus, the Ak Zhol faction generally proposes to recognize the 1930 famine as an act of Kazakh genocide. Fortunately, parliamentarians don't have to come up with anything new - they just write off the Ukrainian scenario. In June of this year, some statesmen did just that, proposing to equate the soldiers of the Turkestan Legion of the Wehrmacht with the veterans of the Great Patriotic War.

Among the ideas of the Ak Zhol activists is the renaming of the republic's cities in the Kazakh manner. Interesting is the fate of, for example, Petropavlovsk, which until 1921 had nothing to do with Kazakhstan, but now the name Abylai-khan is tipped to him. Actually, before 1921, Kazakhstan as such did not exist at all.

"Russian fascism"

Now in the union republic there are signs of a struggle against "Russian fascism".

This is the term used by Kuat Akhmetov and his team when they conduct "language patrols" in Kazakhstani shops. The scheme is simple - find Russian-speaking sellers and, armed with a camera, fluently ask in Kazakh for something from the shelf.

"You must know Kazakh and you must serve in Kazakh",

- such phrases are thrown by activists in response to misunderstanding.

Various public organizations got involved in the case. Thus, on the Til Maydani online party channel, combat veterans from Alma-Ata amicably declare:

“We wanted to say that speaking Kazakh is a manifestation of patriotism and love for the Motherland of the Republic of Kazakhstan. And we do not agree with the statement "cave nationalism". " The fact that Russian and Kazakh, according to the country's constitution, are used "equally, in the same way, regardless of any circumstances."

The veterans do not agree with the definition that Dauren Abaev, the first deputy head of the Presidential Administration of Kazakhstan, dubbed "language raids". In particular, he said:

“Without a doubt, such precedents are unacceptable and outrageous. The overwhelming majority of our citizens condemn such manifestations of "cave-like" nationalism. "

It should be said that Russian-speakers are still adequately responding to the attacks of nationalists. One of the shopkeepers in Aktau resists:

“You don't like Russians, but what have we done to you? We've built a city for you! If it weren't for us, you wouldn't be here. "

The valiant Kazakh men from the Til Maydani Online Party channel later forced the woman to apologize for her words and filmed it:

“I was in a nervous state and said very bad words that they were spitting, that the Russians had built this city. This is wrong, please forgive me. I did not want this. I have been living in Kazakhstan for a long time, I love Kazakhstan and the Kazakh people ”.

It should be noted that the channel's videos are popular - the number of likes for videos about "Russian fascism" is much higher than dislikes. That is, the soil for such excesses in the neighboring republic has been created, and at least the channel has its grateful viewers.

Kuar Akhmetov and a Russian-speaking girl-seller in one of the shops in Kazakhstan. Source: fondsk.ru

So far, the official Nur-Sultan responds only through the mouth of the aforementioned Dauren Abayev to the activities of the "language patrol", which carefully studies the price tags in stores.

In Russia, however, they are seriously concerned about the germs of Kazakh nationalism. The head of Rossotrudnichestvo Yevgeny Primakov comments:

“In Kazakhstan, a nationwide cry of pain is heard if suddenly someone in Russia dares to remind about the origins of modern Kazakhstani statehood, and not about the legend of the“ Golden Horde ”, and we here in Russia personally, publicly sympathize with Kazakhstan. But do we hear a direct condemnation of local Natsiks from the Kazakh state? No, we do not hear such condemnation. "

From words to deeds - Kuar Akhmetov was banned from entering Russia for 50 years. After such provocations on his part, I think this is for his own good.

At the same time, local residents of the republic complain about the inaccessibility of language courses in the Kazakh language and the lack of appropriate textbooks. That is, even if they wish, it is very difficult for Russian-speakers to switch to the state language of Kazakhstan. And here the inhabitants of the republic are in a much less advantageous position than the Russian-speaking in Ukraine. Still, learning related Ukrainian is immeasurably easier than a completely excellent Kazakh.

It is necessary to take care of the spread and preservation of the language of the titular nation, and no one will ever reproach the government of Kazakhstan for this. But it is necessary to act with the instruments of "soft power", always offering options for the development of events.

Tough scenarios with the total translation of schools into the Kazakh language will invariably cause confrontation between residents of different nationalities.

Such processes inevitably lead to the discontent of a part of the population - few will withstand public insults in fascism and occupation. Kazakhstan is gradually losing Russian-speaking citizens. Thus, over the past four years, about 180 thousand people have received a Russian passport. However, perhaps this is the real reason for such a zealous displacement of the Russian language?

Comments

[Vladimir Vladimirovich Vorontsov]

***
"When the black Dzungar comes, the red-haired Russian will seem like a brother to you" ...
***

[Stas157]

What to do, for example, with a huge layer of Kazakh culture, which has survived in the Cyrillic alphabet?

Let's not get upset about the Kazakh culture, more than the Kazakhs themselves. Can we pay attention to ourselves better? The popularity of the Russian (and indeed any) language does not happen out of nowhere. This is primarily a matter of perspective.

If the young people of Russia itself have not seen their future in their country lately and are happy to go abroad (to study and to work), then what can we say about the youth of Kazakhstan? Why do they need Russian? Is it really free to teach in Russia? And they don't pay much for work. No attraction.

[EvilLion]

I'll tell you a secret, but the Russians didn't go anywhere much even in the 90s, but you still believe in this nonsense.

[Stas157]

Quote: EvilLion

I will reveal a secret, but the Russians did not really go anywhere even in the 90s, but you still believe in this nonsense.

For you, this is probably a secret, but the number of Russian people who want to get the coveted American Green Card is growing every year. And much more than in the notorious terrible 90s! Strange, huh? We are all well in the country! Is not it? This year, which has not yet ended, there have already been 533 applications from Russia. Surprisingly, for the country, the president of which announced a national idea - patriotism.

[EvilLion]

And many have already left? I understand that in Kievisho you have a national idea, to call yourself non-Russians and sit on the neck of the European Union, but Russia has something to do with it.

[Stas157]

Quote: EvilLion

I understandwhat do you have in Kievisho

You don't understand a damn thing. What does Kiev and Ukraine have to do with it? Your training manual says so: in a difficult case, call your opponent Ukrainian?

[Tatyana]

The development of Soviet Russia - the first socialist in the world. State was twofold - CONFLICT - character.
On the one hand, the Russian people, who believed in the communist. the idea of ​​the Bolshevik-Leninists, and. being the carrier of the HOLD, and not the shtetl-marginal national mentality, on all fronts building really built up socialism within the whole country as its whole multinational. Homeland. In principle, he had nothing left to do.
But at the same time, on the other hand, in the former tsarist nat. outskirts, where feudal relations and own nat prevailed. the proletariat was absent (there were no carriers of the proletarian mentality there), power from the Bolshevik-Leninists and under their control received the petty national bourgeoisie and former local feudal lords.
National industry was built by the hands of Russian and Russian-speaking peoples.
In this case, everything that was created truly national for the years of the Council. power in the once backward tsarist nat. suburbs - it is only the local national party and Soviet bureaucracy, as well as the national creative intelligentsia that serves it (social scientists, writers, artists, etc.).
This nat. the party and Soviet bureaucracy and the intelligentsia objectively retained the national bourgeois-feudal mentality not only in relation to their own working people, but also in relation to those who came, in their opinion, "Hump the Russians at them" up to the time of the so-called Gorbachev "new thinking".

TOTAL. National problems in the USSR not only existed from the very beginning of Soviet power, but also bore a national-bourgeois class character in relation to the Russian people. AND the counter-bourgeois coup of 1991 in the USSR as a whole only raised from the bottom to the surface the national-bourgeois deformations that had already taken place during the construction of socialism in Russia, which the Soviet leadership tried not to give wide publicity.

[Ross xnumx]

Quote: Tatiana

National problems in the USSR not only existed from the very beginning of Soviet power, but also worn in relation to the Russian people ...

National policy, and with it the division of territories based on nationality in the USSR, led to what the decision of God to force people to speak in different languages ​​led to.
In a single state, the state language MUST be the language of the state-forming (titular) nation. And this is not nationalism or fascism. With all due respect to small nationalities, I hasten to notify that it was the Russian people who gave many of that statehood, which they still cannot properly denounce with the help of Roman numerals and Latin ... Physicians are shitty. Some (in the 80s of the last century) had to be taught to use the bathroom ...
We do not need to repeat the mistakes of the USSR. It's time to build a new socialism in a single country and take more care of the literacy of your own people, ending the dominance of Anglicisms that litter Russian speech.

[1961osa]

As the grandmother said on the virgin lands, on the bus, when there were riots when Kolbin was appointed first secretary of the Central Committee of the CPSU of Kazakhstan, "What are they speaking out, we taught them with the army sitting!"

[certero]

Quote: ROSS 42

a single state, the state language MUST be the language of the state-forming (titular) nation.

it was so in the Soviet Union. Russian was the main state language of interethnic communication

[Ilgizl]

Absolutely right. And now, local bai and khans, under national slogans, are taking possession of new riches, slowly returning the Middle Ages ...

[frols]

It is possible, you, to be called differently, but then they will give a ban here, I will simply speak out you are not Russian.

[dorz]

However, perhaps this is the real reason for such a zealous displacement of the Russian language?

As one famous Englishman put it: there are bandits countries and confused countries. We can add that there are terpily countries. Who are we?

[Anzhey V.]

2014 - 310 thousand
2015 - 350 thousand
2016 - 313 thousand
2017 - 377 thousand
2020 - 380 thousand

These are data on those who have left Russia irrevocably only in recent years.

[SovAr238A]

Quote: EvilLion

And many have already left? I understand that in Kievisho you have a national idea, to call yourself non-Russians and sit on the neck of the European Union, but Russia has something to do with it.

In Russia, a Green Card is issued annually in the amount of 3-5 thousand submitted applications.
And in fact, about 8-10 thousand people are leaving, since the applications are mainly families.
Normal families with small children.
And oddly enough, but having left for America, young families give birth to 2-3 children.
Not to be afraid of.
And we have one.


As well as a huge number of people trying to enter the United States semi-legally (on work, study and tourist visas) and illegally and try to legalize themselves there. there are about 50 thousand of them.

[QWERTY]

Then piss off. I would permanently deprive such immigrants of citizenship and the possibility of entering the Russian Federation. Left - it means forever.

[SovAr238A]

Quote: ytsuken

Then piss off. I would permanently deprive such immigrants of citizenship and the possibility of entering the Russian Federation. Left - it means forever.

I do not argue with the fact that if you leave somewhere, then you must accept the way of life, of the country where you are leaving ...
The trouble lies elsewhere.
Those who come to us think differently.
For them, slaughtering sheep in the yards, maintaining their usual way of life, developing national diasporas is the norm!
They do not accept our way of life, but introduce their own.
In 5-8 years, chador and niqab will be commonplace in Russia.
Pork in the school cafeteria will be banned.
And the Russians will be beaten in the same way as the French and Germans are beaten in Germany and France.

[user]

For you, this is probably a secret, but the number of Russian people who want to get the coveted American Green Card is growing every year.

You know, they also write a lot on the fence. Yes, there was a departure in the 90s, but since those times everyone who wanted to left. Of course, if you do not remove the pan, it seems so.

[user]

These are data on those who have left Russia irrevocably only in recent years.

You yourself then believe what you wrote. Today's youth are much more practical than you think, but in the US and the EU, everything has changed a lot since the early 90s. Yes, many who left then constantly come to visit, you can hear a lot of interesting things from them.

[ivan2022]

The fourth wave, however. And since the beginning of the 90s already 10 million. By the way, usually the departure is activated after the next elections. It is when. it becomes clear that nothing is encouraging
will not be exactly. So the authorities. in the course and the process suits them quite well. But now the shaft has gone without elections. USA, Germany, Canada. As for "who wanted to leave," it's about Israel.

[Vasilenko Vladimir]

Quote: ivan2022

It is when. it becomes clear that nothing is encouraging

and what is encouraging for you? !!!
aleshka - prezik?

[Lech from Android.]

Lies.
I can print as many such graphs with inverse proportions in the editor and put them on the Internet.
Please provide undeniable documentary evidence.

[Serge-667]

Actually, the Russian Federation is in third place in terms of emigration.
Rosstat to help.

[Ross xnumx]

Quote: Lech from Android.

Please provide undeniable documentary evidence.

Quote: Serge-667

Rosstat to help.

https://rosinfostat.ru/migratsia/

[ccsr]

Quote: Stas157

For you, this is probably a secret, but the number of Russian people who want to get the coveted American Green Card is growing every year.

And you do not distort the words of the author who spoke about RUSSIAN, and not about all the citizens of Russia, among whom, as we know, two hundred different nationalities. So it is more important for us to preserve the Russian ethnos in Russia than to bother with the problems of emigration, the same Crimean Tatars, Jews or Chechens, for example, to Turkey, Israel or the EU.
As for Kazakhstan, it is very good that the Russian language is being squeezed out - the shepherds must graze sheep, and not build airplanes and launch rockets. Therefore, we ask all the citizens who are fluent in Russian and who consider themselves Russian in spirit to go to Russia - here they will live in a normal environment, with prospects for the future.
By the way, the worse the titular nations of Central Asia are fluent in Russian, the less chances they will have to adapt in Russia, which means they will be destined for the fate of a servant working in the least prestigious jobs. That is why we should not bother too much with the Russian language in these backward post-Soviet republics - it plays into our hands. Well, the fact that the Kazakh Natsiks are following the path of the Svidomo is that all the literate people saw during the reign of Nazarbayev - he himself was an inveterate Russophobe, although he was currying favor with Putin.

[Rubi0]

The problem is that the Russian Federation, in comparison with the same Israel, did nothing practically so that your words about 'welcome to all Russian speakers' were true. There is no banal law on repatriates, as a result, getting a green card in the USA is easier than getting a temporary residence permit in the Russian Federation, I’m not talking about a residence permit or citizenship

[l7yzo]

moreover, to a Russian, but to a southerner or a Tajik through the diaspra - in no time)

[ccsr]

Quote: Rubi0

The problem is that the Russian Federation, in comparison with the same Israel, did nothing practically so that your words about 'welcome to all Russian-speakers' were true.

This is not entirely true, although I do not deny that it is time for Russian people to remove all restrictions on obtaining Russian citizenship. The latest actions to return Old Believers or the issuance of passports to residents of Donbass just suggests that the authorities have begun to look at this problem differently - you can hardly refute this.

Quote: Rubi0

There is no banal law on repatriates,

This is a big omission of the current government - I do not argue with that.

Quote: Rubi0

as a result, getting a green card in the USA is easier than getting a RVP in the Russian Federation,

I don’t know how matters stand with American citizenship, but now Russian citizenship is much easier to obtain than 15-20 years ago.

Quote: l7yzo

moreover, to a Russian, but to a southerner or a Tajik through the diaspra - in no time)

This is the problem of the venality of our lower-level officials, and not the omission of the authorities - know how to separate flies from cutlets. So our Russian people can also be corrupt - I know this very well, I had to face it.

Quote: Evgesha

"Welcome" - probably laughing!
When a Russian begins to apply for citizenship of the Russian Federation, I assure you, this is still that hemorrhoid !!!!!

No, I'm not laughing, but I would like to know where you were personally when Russia was in complete shit, there was a war in Chechnya and there was a huge national debt - then for some reason you were not very eager to obtain Russian citizenship. Moreover, some pointed their fingers at us - they say, what a miserable life in Russia, and we in Ukraine live well without war. And now, when our life has stabilized, and you have sipped grief in your republics, then suddenly everyone wanted to be automatically given citizenship - why on earth, explain.
So there is a procedure for obtaining citizenship, it must be observed, I do not see a tragedy here for those who want to become a citizen of Russia by conviction, and not because of the sausage.

Quote: Evgesha

To prove that you are a native speaker, you must provide documents that your relatives - parents or grandparents lived on the territory of the Republic of Ingushetia or the USSR within the borders of the RSFSR until 1991 !!!!

Of course it is necessary - in Russia we do not need those who are not Russian, but strive here for pensions and benefits, like ordinary parasites. So you had thirty years to decide on your Russianness - so you had to come to us in the nineties, but then you were not eager to come here. And now you need to put everything on a silver platter - why on earth? For me, our Old Believers from Latin America are even more Russian in mentality than those who did not care about the problems of Russia in difficult years, and who were not eager to join us.

Quote: Evgesha

And my grandmother's archive burned down in the village during a fire in 1987. No photos or documents left.
And hell to prove it !!!!!!

So there were archives not only in the village councils - over the course of his life, a person, as a rule, filled out questionnaires several times, including to district, regional and other higher organizations. So there is no need to blame everything on fire in the age of computerization - I was looking for data on my deceased grandfather, sent inquiries to some pre-war villages, and everyone answered me clearly. I don’t know why you don’t want to do this.

[Rubi0]

About pensioners seeking benefits, and you read the law passed last year which gives a little relief, there they made concessions only to those who received a school certificate before the age of 91. For a minute, such people are at least under 50, so the question is not stupid, who do you want to tighten with such laws? Most likely, on the contrary, they prescribed it so that no one went, a person under 50-60 years old will not go anywhere, or yes, he agrees for benefits and a pension. Where is the struggle for the youth? Tajiks are complete Moscow because there is a cunning intergovernmental agreement that puts them in a more advantageous position than the same immigrants from Ukraine, Kazakhstan or Moldova. Poles are handing out cards to Poles, Germany has adopted special conditions for able-bodied youth, and the Russian Federation really collects some pensioners, but with a USSR certificate

[ccsr]

Quote: Rubi0

For a minute, such people are at least under 50, so the question is not stupid, who do you want to tighten with such laws?

And that these "pensioners" twenty years ago did not go to Russia to work in order to receive all the benefits now? I am not going to drag anyone into Russia - I just expressed my opinion about the Russian people who are experiencing oppression in the former Soviet republics, including in terms of language. Let them come to us - we have a normal environment for the Russian people, they will be welcome here.

Quote: Rubi0

Where is the struggle for the youth?

What other struggle do you need if in the same Baltics the Russians do not want to return to Russia? Or don't you even know that?

Quote: Rubi0

Tajiks are complete Moscow because there is a cunning intergovernmental agreement that puts them in a more advantageous position than the same immigrants from Ukraine, Kazakhstan or Moldova

I do not know about this, but I know that many people from Donbass, South Ossetia and Abkhazia receive Russian citizenship, and no one will particularly hinder them.

Quote: Rubi0

and the Russian Federation really collects some pensioners, but with a certificate of the USSR

And these people have more merit to Russia, because it is the legal successor of the USSR, and the foundation of Russia's wealth was laid just then. I believe that this is a tribute to justice for those who created a great power. It is not clear what makes you indignant in this.

[Andrey Grad]

We are RUSSIANS in the Baltics, on the outskirts, in White Russia we have been living for 300 years without a break, we did not leave Russia, it was Russia that retreated to the east. We have 5-6 generations of Russian ancestors buried here, and you suggest that we abandon our houses, the earth, the graves of our ancestors and run away?
Even those who are thinking about moving to the Russian Federation, a reasonable question arises, if Russia now cannot retain its ancestral western territories, which it owned for more than 300 years with the majority of the Russian population on them, then where is the guarantee that having moved to the Russian Federation, in a few years this process will not be repeated and we will be told that our new land is no longer Russia?

[ccsr]

Quote: Andrey Grad

We have 5-6 generations of Russian ancestors buried here, and you suggest that we abandon our houses, the earth, the graves of our ancestors and run away?

Well, if you live there comfortably, then why would you go to Russia? You are of the first class in the Baltics, Central Asia and Ukraine, so stay there, of course, no one is forcibly pulling you into Russia.

Quote: Andrey Grad

, then where is the guarantee that having moved to the Russian Federation,

No one will ever give you any guarantee - it is a matter of your choice, how and where your descendants will live. Moreover, many people want to see Russia backward and subdued, that is why we need Russian people who will not give up their nationality, and no sausage can buy them. So stay where you live, there you can live peacefully, just don’t hope that we will fight for you - defend your dignity yourself, and not as in Ukraine some Russians quickly became “Ukrainians” and went to kill Russians in the Donbass.

[Andrey Grad]

Who are you to decide for all of Russia and for ALL Russians who should move where and for whom Russia to fight, and for whom not.
The Russian Federation is fighting not only for its Russians, but also in Syria, for example.
Specifically, we do not hope for you, for the narrow-minded, greedy, envious, who are ready to betray all Russians and forget that they are your blood relatives, so that new sanctions are not introduced for you and the Schengen is not covered.
We survive without you for 30 years under Nazi occupation, despite genocide and repression, assimilation, we remain RUSSIAN on our BALTIC RUSSIAN land.

[ccsr]

Quote: Andrey Grad

Who are you to decide for all of Russia and for ALL Russians who should move where and for whom Russia to fight, and for whom not.

An ordinary Russian person who has seen much more in life than you, and therefore I have my own opinion. By the way, at least I survived the collapse of the USSR, the death of colleagues in Afghanistan and some friends who did not survive the nineties, that's why I perfectly understand what Russia needs in order not to repeat the history of the USSR. What have you seen in this life?

Quote: Andrey Grad

The Russian Federation is fighting not only for its Russians, but also in Syria, for example.

It is a big mistake that we are losing our people in a foreign country, due to the fact that economic interests have become higher than the lives of our compatriots.

Quote: Andrey Grad

Specifically, we do not hope for you,

You are doing the right thing - at least try to defend your rights in relation to the Russian language yourself.

Quote: Andrey Grad

We survive without you for 30 years under Nazi occupation,

Just don't tell me about it, because it was with your tacit consent that the Nazis seized power over all these thirty years. Continue to endure - only will your descendants forgive you, or will they no longer be Russian?

Quote: Andrey Grad

we remain RUSSIAN on our BALTIC RUSSIAN land.

And without pathos, you can find out - what keeps you personally in a state hostile to Russia?

[Andrey Grad]

You are an ordinary Russian person with a narrow outlook, but you have replaced yourself as an intellectual analyst. Do not judge by yourself about the interlocutors.
Do not write what you do not know, namely about our supposedly tacit agreement.
Our struggle against the occupying Nazi regime was constantly going on at demonstrations, and on the information field, and in the legal field, but YOUR Moscow officials working in the embassies not only did not help us, but on the contrary, conspired with the local Nazis. As an example, tomorrow a monument to the Major General of the Red Army, who died here in 1944, will be demolished in a small town in Latin. Despite the protests of local Russians, officials from the Russian embassy gave their consent to the demolition.
We RUSSIANS have been living in the Baltics for more than 300 years, and the artificially created Nazi regimes are not even 50 years old, independently, without artificial support from the West, these pseudo-states cannot exist either economically or politically, they are deeply subsidized, up to 30% of budgets are subsidized by the EU ANNUALLY ! Without these subsidies, they will last a couple of years and that's it.
Geographically, for development, the Baltic territories can only be of interest to Russia; for the EU, the Baltic is a remote eastern corner, not interesting either for life or for investment, only as a military buffer against Russia.
As soon as there is a serious choice, the West will abandon the Baltic states.

[ccsr]

Quote: Andrey Grad

Do not write what you do not know, namely about our supposedly tacit agreement.

Your blah blah blah has been going on for thirty years now, and there is no point. Continue further in this spirit, the Europeans will help you with rights, there is no need for you to hope that the citizens of Russia will arrange your life and defend your rights - you are a NATO member and, by definition, are our enemies.
If you don't want to be an enemy, think about your descendants, and don't cling to European "freedom".

Quote: Andrey Grad

but YOUR Moscow officials working in the embassies not only did not help us, but, on the contrary, conspired with the local Nazis.

Lies - you yourself are afraid to speak out against your Nazis, which is why you pour crap on the Russian embassy, ​​which has no right to interfere in the internal affairs of other states.

Quote: Andrey Grad

We RUSSIANS have lived in the baltics for over 300 years,

All this is nonsense, because your children will become non-Russian, just as now the descendants of those who fled to the West after the October Revolution have become citizens of other countries, and will never return to Russia, because it is more satisfying for them to live the way they grew up.

Quote: Andrey Grad

Geographically, for development, the Baltic territories can be interesting only to Russia,

They are absolutely uninteresting - Russian ports do not need Baltic competitors. Enough, you lived well in the nineties through transit and banking, now you are learning how to make money yourself.

Quote: Andrey Grad

for the EU, the baltics is a remote eastern corner,

These are not our problems - we have enough of our own problems with our distant regions for us to think about you.

Quote: Andrey Grad

As soon as there is a serious choice, the West will abandon the Baltic states.

Well, all the more why are you holding on to the Baltics, especially since you are second-class citizens in these countries?
After all, because of the "sausage" you do not want to move to Russia, so that you would not tell us about your Natsiks there, but you are afraid to admit it.

[Andrey Grad]

You are either an enemy writing lies to divide the Russian people, or a shell-shocked nerd, it is not clear which is worse.

[ccsr]

Quote: Andrey Grad

You are either an enemy writing lies to divide the Russian people, or a shell-shocked nerd, it is not clear which is worse.

True, it hurts your eyes - they did not expect that they would tell you directly what they think of people like you in Russia. If you dreamed of becoming a Russian, you would have moved to Russia long ago, like Old Believers who have suffered more than you. So keep crying into your vest ...
By the way, you are an ordinary hamlo, and already on this basis Russia does not need you.

[asasin Asasievch]

Stick your saucer into your hollow.
Flat.

[Evgesha]

No, I'm not laughing, but I would like to know where you were personally when Russia was in complete shit, there was a war in Chechnya and there was a huge national debt - then for some reason you were not very eager to obtain Russian citizenship. Moreover, some pointed their fingers at us - they say, what a miserable life in Russia, and we in Ukraine live well without war. And now, when our life has stabilized, and you have lost grief in your republics, then suddenly everyone wanted to be automatically given citizenship - why on earth, explain.

[/ Quote]
I beg your pardon, but what do you want to clarify ?? It is not entirely clear from your message what you are waiting for. And what does Ukraine have to do with it ... an article like about Kazakh ...
Are you adequate, you are our dear ???

Of course it is necessary - in Russia we do not need those who are not Russian, but strive here for pensions and benefits, like ordinary parasites. So you had thirty years to decide on your Russianness - so you had to come to us in the nineties, but then you were not eager to come here. And now you need to put everything on a silver platter - why on earth? For me, our Old Believers from Latin America are even more Russian in mentality than those who did not care about the problems of Russia in difficult years, and who were not eager to join us.

It’s clear that you don’t need the Russians, so you’ll get Kyrgyz on your streets !!!! If you yourself are a DARMOED - then people are not judged by themselves !!!!
And no one demands any conditions for themselves - the proto process of obtaining civilization for ethnic Russians is done moronic !!!
In Kazakhstan, for example, there are a lot of programs for oralmans, like for returnees to Kazakhstan .. there are kapets conditions, payments, billions of money are spinning there. But the main thing is that everything is supported and formalized at the state level.
In the 90s, Kazakhs living in the Russian Federation in the Tyumen region, left their families in place and themselves went to take shape as an oralman. They were accepted, quickly formalized documents for them, bought them in their own apartment at the expense of the state. They were provided with work, lifting, etc. The Tyumen Kazakhs in 2-3 months, having collected all possible benefits and payments, sold the apartment, made a pen to Kazakhstan and returned with the money back to the Russian Federation !!!!
Nobody demands that. Make it easy for a Russian to become a citizen and that's it.
And do not tell pensions !!! In the same Kazakhstan, a pensioner receives a pension more than in the Russian Federation !!!! And given the cho prices in general in Kazakhstan are lower, the pensioner lives better than in the Russian Federation.
So no one in Russia runs for pensions !!!!!

[Quote] So there were archives not only in the village councils - over the course of his life, people usually filled out questionnaires several times, including to district, regional and other higher organizations. So there is no need to blame everything on fire in the age of computerization - I was looking for data on my deceased grandfather, sent inquiries to some pre-war villages, and everyone answered me clearly. I don’t know why you don’t want to do this.

You are really chtoli.
documents burned down in 1987 !!!!!!!!
Then the current road to the village was unpaved, and the bus went there three times a week, and then, if there was no rain !!! I remember getting to the UAZ-452 after the rain, I was about 5 years old, so I still have extreme memories.
And I was a student - so it happened to get on the URAL truck crane - that was the norm then.
The documents were burnt, the grandfather died, the grandmother died - and some of the data became, in principle, unknown !!!!! If they have changed several places of residence in 10 years. According to my mother's stories - it turns out 5 crossings in 10 years !!!!
Where can I find the data right now?
You damn it, do not confuse the data on the soldier, the data on which are on the artillery registration, and ordinary civilians.
The wife began to look for data on her relatives - in the archive about the place of birth there was only one record from her great-grandfather - the Russian Empire. Everything!!!!
And here you are broadcasting about computerization. Damn completely crazy about their computerization and digitalization !!
In reality, your adequate perception of objective reality is violated.
You need to drink the tablets, go to the water, mash the mumzelka ...

[ccsr]

Quote: Evgesha

Where can I find the data right now?

Your ancestors have changed five places in ten years, and you are sure that there are no traces of their stay anywhere - don't tell me. I figured out my ancestors even from the tsarist census, when kind people threw off the scan of those sheets for me - there all adults are listed by surname and first name.

Quote: Evgesha

Don't you fucking confuse the data on the fighter,

And I don’t confuse it - the question was just about the pre-war period, when I only knew the village and the village council where he lived.

Quote: Evgesha

- in the archive about the place of birth, there was one entry from her great-grandfather - the Russian Empire. Everything!!!!

And he did not participate in the censuses of the Russian Empire? There, on the sheet, the province, county, parish, settlement are indicated.

Quote: Evgesha

And here you are broadcasting about computerization. Damn completely crazy about their computerization and digitalization !!

No, you just need to learn to use the achievements of progress, including scanned documents from different times.

Quote: Evgesha

You need to drink the tablets, go to the water, mash the mumzelka ...

You also need to stop whining, and at least achieve something in this life with your own hands, like the same Old Believers, and not hope that the citizens of Russia will do it for you.

[andreykolesov123]

Quote: Rubi0

The problem is that the Russian Federation, in comparison with the same Israel, did nothing practically so that your words about 'welcome to all Russian speakers' were true. There is no banal law on repatriates, as a result, getting a green card in the USA is easier than getting a temporary residence permit in the Russian Federation, I’m not talking about a residence permit or citizenship

Jews from Israel can easily draw up documents in Russia, but few use this opportunity.

[1961osa]

I managed April 2002 with no money in the light version, received it in August at 11 o'clock, at 14.00 I was already working in my specialty (builder). The eldest daughter also got into a simplified one, and the youngest got all the torments of a stupid and uneducated administration, he quarreled with them, sometimes they went with her granddaughter, she was 3 months old.

[iva12936]

I agree, my classmate with his family (from Kazakhstan) received Russian citizenship, he is still a crap.

[Vasilenko Vladimir]

Quote: Evgesha

When a Russian begins to apply for citizenship of the Russian Federation, I assure you, this is still that hemorrhoid !!!!!

arrived in RV on March 8, 2009 received a passport at the end of September, did not pay anyone or anything, and there was no hemorrhoid

[alystan]

So it is more important for us to preserve the Russian ethnos in Russia than to bother with the problems of emigration, the same Crimean Tatars, Jews or Chechens, for example, to Turkey, Israel or the EU.

But the representatives of this very Russian ethnos are also leaving ...

shepherds should graze sheep, not build airplanes and launch rockets.

Rocket builders will suck their paws after their work if you follow your logic ?!

By the way, the worse the titular nations of Central Asia will be fluent in Russian,

That is why, probably without coordinating this issue with you, Russia is restoring the abandoned work of providing assistance in the training of teachers and teachers of the Russian language for Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan and Uzbekistan, and also opening branches of Moscow State University and other well-known Russian universities there.
Perhaps the last is the demand of the Russian elite, who wants to acquire servants exclusively with higher education and diplomas from prestigious Russian universities !?
Before talking about the Nazis of the inveterate Russophobe Nazarbayev, you would at least remember the history of the appearance of neo-Nazism in the USSR and then tell a little about the inveterate ns-skinheads. They began to talk about the emergence of nationalist movements in the USSR already in the late 50s (under Khrushchev?), But they preferred to operate underground and switched to an open form shortly before its collapse. At present, some of the Russian neo-Nazi organizations are members of the international "World Union of National Socialists" (founded in 1962). In 2012, six Russian organizations were officially registered members of the union. They considered themselves to be a radical wing using terrorist methods of struggle, skinhead groups from the Werewolf Legion (liquidated in 1996), Schultz-88 (liquidated in 2006), White Wolves (liquidated in 2008-10 years), "New Order" (ceased to exist), "Russian goal" (ceased to exist), etc. This is, if you believe the official data, but nothing prevented many of them from going underground again?
And you want that on the wave of all this obscurantism the same Kazakhstan would not "want" to have its own Natsiks? By the way, whoever does not want to see a connection between openly Nazi groups and quite legally existing sports fan-clubs - I will say that it is and rather the fans are the same "skinheads" who temporarily hid in the mass of sports fans. Remember the events of seven years ago, at least in Odessa!

[l7yzo]

So the saddest thing is that they feed on us, earn money, they study for us (mostly the budget) and shout that the Russians ... all the troubles are because of them.

[1961osa]

Kazakh migrant workers who speak Russian poorly are practically absent in Russia, but who speak Russian more than Russians, since we were taught and we spoke purely literary language in the virgin lands.

[ccsr]

Quote: alystan

But the representatives of this very Russian ethnos are also leaving ...

And what do you want to prove by this - leaving is not the worst thing yet. For example, in Ukraine, Russian people are destroying the Russian people of Donbass - this is a tragedy for our people, and you remembered some kind of sausage emigrants.

Quote: alystan

Rocket builders will suck their paws after their work if you follow your logic ?!

This is your logic, and our ract builders have been working in this industry since the fifties, and now this continues continuously.

Quote: alystan

That is why, probably without coordinating this issue with you, Russia is restoring the abandoned work of providing assistance in the training of teachers and teachers of the Russian language for Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan and Uzbekistan, and also opening branches of Moscow State University and other well-known Russian universities there.

This is another mistake of the authorities and Putin as the head of state - they simply do not want to see what is happening in real life. They study Russian in order to come to us and stay here forever, outweighing their relatives, but we don't need that. We need them only as temporary guest workers and nothing more. It’s a pity that you don’t get it.

Quote: alystan

They began to talk about the emergence of nationalist movements in the USSR already in the late 50s (under Khrushchev?), But they preferred to operate underground and switched to an open form shortly before its collapse.

I saw these nationalists in Russia - they are 80% mummers, and only 10% of the strength are ideological, so no one in Russia really listened to them. And hysterics with Russian nationalism were raised by those who wanted to plunder Russia as before, having Israeli citizenship and relatives in Europe - of course you have not heard about the Seven Banks.

Quote: alystan

If you believe the official data, but nothing prevented many of them from going underground again?
And do you want that on the wave of all this obscurantism the same Kazakhstan would not "want" to have its own Natsiks?

I want you to fantasize less about the times of Khrushchev, where there was practically no nationalism, and the foam that arose after the collapse of the USSR had no serious impact on life in Russia, and now even more so, unlike Kazakhstan.

Quote: alystan

At present, part of the Russian neo-Nazi organizations are members of the international "World Union of National Socialists" (founded in 1962).

Stop telling fairy tales - point specifically to their current political activities, otherwise it's all blah blah blah ...

[alystan]

The World Union of National Socialists (WUNS) is an organization founded in 1962 as an umbrella group for neo - Nazi organizations around the world.
https://ru.abcdef.wiki/wiki/World_Union_of_National_Socialists
Current membership - 26 countries, including Russia and Belarus - Russian National Unity, RNE AP, National Socialist Organization

Only Iran, Turkey and Japan do not represent Christianity from this list.

and the foam that arose after the collapse of the USSR had no serious impact on life in Russia

You probably “don't know or have forgotten” what skinheads did in the 90s ?! Then nothing will prevent you from refreshing your memory if you wish, the Internet will help you. You will find something to refute my information, I will gladly take note of it.
At the same time, pay attention to the nationality of the victims and with what cruelty they killed them.
And so yes, this did not affect life in Russia, just that crime swept the country.

[ccsr]

Quote: alystan

Only Iran, Turkey and Japan do not represent Christianity from this list.

Once again I ask the question - what role do they play at least in the political life of Russia at the level of municipalities?

Quote: alystan

You probably “don't know or have forgotten” what skinheads did in the 90s ?!

I lived then, and sometimes I saw who went to Terletskie ponds. lived in the Perovskiy district - a pitiful sight to be taken seriously as a political movement, so they were dispersed together with RNU.

Quote: alystan

And so yes, it did not affect life in Russia,

Here I am about the same to you, but there are scumbags in any country and a healthy state, if it does not support nationalists, easily copes with them.

[ANB]

... Well, the fact that Kazakh Natsiks follow the path of Svidomo

Let them return the North and speak at least Mongolian. And so everything is true.

[SKIF555]

Who wants - he goes! But none of the younger 3 aunts and 2 uncles (there are six of them) who have been burned out for 30 years, disabled in Germany, can not afford the Dacha (this is where the tool is folded and the plot so that they do not rub their asses when a picnic). Was worn out by the ancestors, the Elder - Russia St. Petersburg - did not go - You will not believe in the 90s (mother) - to arrange haymaking on 27 acres - it was like in Germany - they also planted the house - not without the help of builders, but everything inside ourselves with Batya. So count it. This whole collective farm has already taken its brains out and the landscape.

[alystan]

I will try to supplement and correct you a little.
Putin remembered (only now!) About patriotism and presented it as a national idea !?
Only 30 years later! All this time, everything good and the best was destroyed in us, they "stuffed" into us real information shit from anti-Soviet and anti-socialism, making all this practically state policy:
- the Ministry of Education purposefully destroyed the world's best education system (primary, secondary and higher) and began to do the same with science;
- the Ministry of Culture "created" and continues to do the most obscene things with our money (I don’t want to delve into the topic).
This is what relates to the topic covered in the article. Well, who should like vulgar modern Russian films, plays and performances from the pop industry in the near abroad, if we ourselves do not like all this (I put it mildly) ?! The people begin to become "dumb" and stupid, mainly young people and children who speak a mixture of Russian and English (mostly) languages, and we are touched by this and even start to imitate !?
And green cards for people who believed in the fairy tale about the American dream, given their very recent relative well-being and our continuous problems, became a strong incentive and desire to improve their lives at least in this way! And people still want to "win" this card, despite the disastrous turn of events in the United States. Probably they think or believe that order and a paradise idyll will quickly return there, just like in old beautiful Hollywood films. True, I have serious doubts about the relativity of how honestly these same green cards are played - I have several acquaintances who were lucky enough to be lucky and their whole families managed to become their happy owners.
Is this really possible, considering all the requirements of the American Immigration Service, which must be fulfilled by each and every candidate in order to get at least a chance to participate in the drawing of this lottery ?!
But Americans would not be Americans if they did not continue to do everything that they have skillfully done for decades, despite the seriousness of the situation of their seemingly indestructible and unshakable system. Which is probably what they are doing, taking into account objective and subjective reasons: the diplomatic staff of the embassy in Moscow was reduced - they stopped issuing visas not only to ordinary citizens, but they could not even "extend" diplomatic visas to two dozen employees of the Russian diplomatic mission in the United States, BUT green cards are is it different and they will continue to play them and draw up all the necessary documents for the "winners" !?
A question to the Russian authorities - how long will the Americans be allowed to fool the heads of people and, with their "soft cunning", decompose (= destroy) Russia from within ??? !!!

[fiberboard]

No, from time to time Putin remembers patriotism when he needs it. Only he has nothing but words. There is a good Russian proverb: "The dog barks, the wind blows away." There is no sense in his words.

[Ingvar 72]

Quote: fiberboard

There is no sense in his words.

And as experience shows, there will be no sense. What are the publicized amendments to the Constitution, especially about the Russian language. Zero sense, the language is fouled with Anglicisms every day.
Regarding the article, you should not wait for respect from the outside without respecting yourself.

[Azis]

His personal secretary, who is the husband of the former skater, speaks exclusively in English. Then we load Google to translate it into Russian. And the Federal Antimonopoly Service should engage in advertising so that the Russian language sounds and is visible!

[Vasilenko Vladimir]

Quote: fiberboard

No, from time to time Putin remembers patriotism when he needs it.

and the president should personally remind you of patriotism, don't you ?!

[l7yzo]

A very good comment - but why is the USA again to blame? It's like "everything around .... I'm the only one D'artagnan"

[Lech from Android.]

And who else ... if the United States undertook to rule the entire globe .... please be so kind to get all the bumps from this world.

[ultra]

And in the lottery "Russian Lotto" there are even more people who want to win. Even those who win a green card (4000-5000, and the win does not guarantee a visa to the United States), not all will use it. It's one thing to apply, but to actually immigrate is something else.

[businessv]

Quote: Stas157

For you, this is probably a secret, but the number of Russian people who want to get the coveted American Green Card is growing every year. And much more than in the notorious terrible 90s!

And this is natural! After all, if there is a choice between a capitalist country with established laws and well-established rules of life and a country of wild capitalism, in which you do not know what laws will be adopted tomorrow, and you want to do business today, then the choice is obvious! And it is unlikely that young people like a country in which any ideology is prohibited by the Constitution. How can you live without ideals, especially at a young age? Therefore, for many of them the states are becoming an ideal - they just print money there when there is not enough money, and in general it is good there! And state-sponsored NPOs regularly shape the direction of thought of our youth. Only those who lived there and drank striped charms begin to understand what kind of country it really is. Only people who lived under socialism still hope that something can change in our country, but this is only because of the ideology of universal equality and brotherhood instilled in childhood. Until we have an idea that unites us all, nothing will change for the better, because before we were the only socialist country in the world, and today we are one of all, and even then not in the forefront, although we are still the richest for resources!

[l7yzo]

But you know, I have no acquaintances in the United States who work and who have no money for food. There the cars are cheaper than ours, the transfer depends on the state, somewhere it is cheaper, somewhere it is more expensive. Apartment rent - 700-2000 thousand per month. In a fold it is quite for the salary. The food is like ours for the price - if GMO - then finally a penny, if environmentally friendly - then it is already expensive (but they monitor it and if it says environmentally friendly - then it is). Salary - about 3 thousand. If you get a job through the diaspora - then when you settle down - more.
Yes, expensive medicine - but you can go to the neighboring countries for medical treatment. We also have it now - medicine is available only in large cities. And the price tag - oh, how it began to bite. That, for example, to treat teeth - they began to travel to Turkey, Israel or to the same Europe. A friend went to Germany to have an operation - it's cheaper there)))

[ccsr]

Quote: l7yzo

Apartment rent - 700-2000 thousand per month.

In general, a normal apartment in a decent area of ​​the city cannot cost less than $ 2000 per month - this is usually the minimum rate.

Quote: l7yzo

Salary - about 3 thousand. If you get settled through the diaspora - then when you settle down - more.

Guaranteed or so, can you fly out of it in a year or two?

Quote: l7yzo

Yes, expensive medicine -

Why don't you point out that the minimum insurance starts at $ 600 per person in the United States, that with a salary of $ 3000 and a family of three does not leave money even for rent of $ 700, because there is nothing to eat? So someone will have to refuse insurance - you probably did not know that?

[businessv]

Quote: l7yzo

But you know, I have no acquaintances in the United States who work and who have no money for food.

And I have both working people and homeless people. No one dies of hunger, but for people aged 45 and older, if they did not come by invitation, it is very difficult to get a job. And if women can still get a job cleaning premises, caring for children (Russian-speaking as a rule), then men are very problematic. I wrote exclusively about young people - all politics there is focused exclusively on promising segments of the population.

[RussianRu]

This is just participation, but how many actually got the green card? From year to year, the same unlucky ones participate in the lottery. So the gain is not that big.

[Glagol1]

Unfortunately, those who leave Russia are by no means the worst. We lost a lot of talents and just worthy people. And the government contributes to this - it robs the population with a low ruble exchange rate, the RDN have been falling for 7 years in a row, new taxes, the luxury tax have already been torn down from Skoda, totalitarian laws are being actively promoted, hyper-corruption in all echelons of power, the opposition has been defeated, ecology is in deep out (Norilsk, Komi , fires in Yakutia, etc.), in the zomboyaschik only zombie programs, from all this people leave. And from the outside, looking at all this, Russia is less and less respected in the world.

[nemez]

Where there were more than half of the Russian population, they stayed. Now they also leave, for example Karaganda. What will these churks do with the empty cities?

[Hypertension]

Quote: nemez

What will these *** do with the empty cities?

Populate. Mambets will come in large numbers, Kazakhs with demographics seem to have everything.
In general, hell knows what's going on. Even with huge China close at hand, Kazakhs bite a helping hand (in the past, present, and possibly in the future).

[Kisa]

Quote: Hyperion

In general, hell knows what's going on.

for some reason, neither the author nor the commentators noted what was lying on the surface - a patriot from a nationalist differs in the same way as a spy from a scout, depending on which side of the border you absorb propaganda .... Moldovans Georgians Ukrainians Belarusians there they have their patriots and all these countries in fact shared territory with a big brother, passports are being handed out or in the process ... there are a lot of patriotic bawlers on VO campaigning to return Baikonur to the owner ... and what are you surprised after that that Kazakhs are switching to Latin ... yes, they are stupidly afraid

[1961osa]

Yes, they are almost all mambets, especially when they get together!

[boriz]

They will settle in, then there is no problem. Who will work?

[alystan]

German,
I'm wondering, what do you want them to call people like you after your exquisite epithets in the style of writing on fences and in toilets?

[1961osa]

From the 90s to the 2000s, the Germans left for their homeland by 100 thousand, every year, the Russians who had relatives and money, They abandoned their apartments at home if they could not sell. There are those who pump money and invest in production in Russia or those who spin and earn and live, as well as no one to go and no money, well, pensioners. 2002 I left Kustanai, any apartment with us cost 1000 $, I was able to sell my expensive district, a good center and buy it in Russia, and I do not regret that I moved to Russia, to my historical homeland, Bryansk !!!

[tovarich-andrey.62goncharov]

What are you doing ?! And for a lie?

[boriz]

The whole problem is that I knew quite a lot of those who left.
What is: "did not leave much"?

[sifgame]

It is unlikely that you will believe once you write this, but they go here to study in Russia and pay more for work here. In the same Omsk and Novosibirsk, there are absolutely a lot of them, but they even get to the Volga region. If this garbage continues to continue, it is necessary to create a base of these utyrkas, and if they find themselves in Russia, create maximum difficulties for them by publicly covering their activities and transferring materials to all structures involved and not involved. The state should simply prohibit entry to such and their relatives for life.

[Tank jacket]

Last hour's news: Ermek Taychibekov in Kazakhstan received 7 years of strict regime, as his lawyer told us. A public figure was convicted for raising questions about the rights of Russians in this state. It turns out that talking about the rights of Russians in Kazakhstan is fraught with prison, unless, of course, you are Nazarbayev or Tokayev, who periodically pretend to be defenders of Russian-speaking people. So far, a creeping war with Russian identity is going on in the country, and the sensational "language patrols" in the Russian media are only a small part of this several decades-long sweep.

[Nikolay1987]

In Russia, however, they are seriously concerned about the sprouts of Kazakh nationalism.

Under capitalism, the emergence of nationalists is a consequence, not a cause. If nothing is changed, then what happened in Ukraine will happen in the remaining countries of the former CIS.

[Region-25.rus]

In Russia, however, they are seriously concerned about the sprouts of Kazakh nationalism.

well, the Foreign Ministry and the government will once again express another "concern" and ...... I think this will end

[Okolotochny]

and thinking

And you do not think, but watch the article and news, they banned the Kazakh and Kyrgyz "language patriots" from entering Russia.

[Region-25.rus]

banned Kazakh and Kyrgyz "language patriots" from entering Russia.

well that's it. Now the governments of Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan will grab their heads in horror and cancel all their innovations, and their Nazis are being jailed. Aha.

[Okolotochny]

Not transplanted. But others will think a little when placing such videos. And this is all the legacy of the past. When territories with a predominantly Russian-speaking population were "presented" to national territories in exchange for their "love and loyalty." Got it? How is "love"? How is "loyalty"?

[Region-25.rus]

But others posting such videos will think a little

Are you seriously? Those who post such videos (in any country) usually have little friendship with the thought processes. As practice shows (by the way, mine is personal too)

[Revival]

"But others will think a little when posting such videos."

How many are there in millions))
We are tormented so effectively to deny entry

[sifgame]

What do you suggest? Here the law was put forward, all these Natsiks should not be allowed into Russia. The law is correct and it will be adopted as quickly as possible, since the EP has put forward, but it is not sufficient, it is necessary to apply not only to specific fools but also to their families. Parents, sisters, brothers and children must be subject to this law.

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Okolotochny

And you do not think, but watch the article and news, they banned the Kazakh and Kyrgyz "language patriots" from entering Russia.

Brilliant - now they will definitely love their Russian speakers!

[Okolotochny]

So do you propose to "love"?

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Okolotochny

So do you propose to "love"?

you just have to put pressure on the local authorities so that such "patriots" are punished demonstratively at the local level (fines, terms), there are more than enough levers for this. Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan, not Western countries, will go to a meeting if they really ask.

[sifgame]

They will never love, no one achieves this, if you do not understand. And you have to answer, because they behave disgustingly towards the Russians there, and then they go to work or study in Russia, so now let this stupid person go, for example, to Uzbekistan to earn money

[Daniil Konovalenko]

I remember that before the Maidan, before the Orange Revolution, Ukrainian "language patriots" were also banned from entering Russia.

[Revival]

This is a move, this is a blow!
Irreparable damage can be said

[Okolotochny]

Is that the only thing you can offer? Well, sit on the fifth point exactly and do not rock the boat!

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Nikolay1987

Under capitalism, the emergence of nationalists is a consequence, not a cause. If nothing is changed, then what happened in Ukraine will happen in the remaining countries of the former CIS.

I agree with you, it's all about capitalism. We have over there Pyotr Tolstoy, the vice-speaker of the State Duma, has been publicly stirring up interethnic tensions for a long time, "giving in to the Turks" and no one will besiege him. Under the USSR, there were no ethnic strife, as in the same Yugoslavia

[kytx]

There was strife
I personally came across Ukrainian Natsiks in the mid-80s, and they were still children, that is, someone in the family had already shit in their heads.
By the way, this was the only case of interethnic conflict in my life.

[Hypertension]

Quote: Stirbjorn

Under the USSR, there were no ethnic strife

Were. They were simply not disclosed. The same December events in Alma-Ata. In the Union, locals were put in positions specifically on the basis of a quota, so that they would not get overwhelmed, and the competence of a local manager was a secondary matter. The main thing is that he is his own for the nationals.
Nationalism is always and everywhere. Somewhere more, somewhere less. Once it increases, sometimes it decreases, but does not disappear anywhere. It can be said to be instinct. The "friend or foe" system. And when it breaks down, as in Europe, for example, the consequences of this are disappearance and assimilation.

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Hyperion

Were. They were simply not disclosed. The same December events in Alma-Ata.

Were at the local, everyday level. And as a rule, where there was no normal education. But they quickly gave me a hat if they threatened to go into something serious. But after the collapse of the USSR, when chaos came, all these small-town Nazis raised their heads

[Hypertension]

Quote: Stirbjorn

But they quickly gave me a hat if they threatened to go into something serious.

That's it. Forcibly held. In the 58th events in Grozny. The troops were brought in. And then mostly Russians were punished. There were also many slogans about friendship and solidarity about the Warsaw Pact countries. As soon as they let go of the reins - fuck! They rushed towards the West, only the heels sparkled. And it’s not for me to explain how they treat the USSR in Poland or the Czech Republic.

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Hyperion

And it’s not for me to explain how they treat the USSR in Poland or the Czech Republic.

Progressive Poles and Czechs were quite friendly and built socialism together. But after the collapse of the Social Bloc, all sorts of degradants climbed out. These were not the reins released, but the collapse of the entire system. Interethnic strife, a direct consequence of capitalism. With such a system, it was and will always be. Including among their gonfalon-bearers.

[Hypertension]

Quote: Stirbjorn

Progressive Poles and Czechs

From your point of view, they are progressive. And from the point of view of the haters of the socialist structure, they are traitors, mankurt and collaborators. How many people, so many opinions.
If everything was so good, if the "friendship of peoples" was developing so intensively in the USSR, then why, as soon as the Union collapsed, interethnic wars flared up and the slogans "Russians go home" flew. Where was the glorified internationalism that "every Soviet person has in his blood"? The answer is simple: nationalism has not disappeared anywhere. He was simply suppressed. And when the lid of the "international cauldron" cracked, all the steam went out and flew out. And now, without hesitation, almost all (except for Belarus) former republics of the USSR howl and whine about "Russian occupants".

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Hyperion

then why as soon as the Union collapsed

Management system crisis. The party nomenclature did not want to move along with progress. Capitalism also did not immediately replace feudalism. Rollbacks (restoration of absolute monarchies) were in France, and in England, and other countries. Sooner or later, humanity will come to socialism if it does not roll back into the past.

Quote: Hyperion

And now, without hesitation, almost all (except for Belarus) former republics of the USSR howl and whine about "Russian occupants".

And in Russia, someone whines about "Soviet occupants", and especially zealous ones single out from the Soviet - Jewish, Latvian, Chinese, etc. occupiers.

[Rubi0]

There were also over the roof, look at all the conflicts around Russia imeeno for this reason, they just broke out. The same Karabakh, Ossetia and even Donbass for which everything is a miracle from western Ukraine.

[alystan]

Especially if we all stupidly fulfill the directives and requirements of the West, which instructs how we should live and how to behave with our former friends and compatriots. At the very top are all those who have settled well and are satisfied with everything - and below we, ready to rip each other's heads off because of our everyday troubles. And, as they say, the enemy does not sleep, he acts and sometimes both with some and with others carries out his destructive work.

[nikvic46]

Of course, this is caveman nationalism. This is not the first time I have heard nationalism "in the good sense of the word." The line between nationalism and chauvinism is too fragile. I regard all these attempts as national swagger. I must be a patriot, not a Nazi.

[samarin1969]

After Odessa and Lugansk, the former "brothers" with impunity engaged in a rigid "self-identification". It turns out that for the Kremlin, geopolitics exists only on the economic plane.

[Uran53]

Corporation RUSSIA (like any other commercial enterprise) is focused solely on making a profit.

[EvilLion]

Kid, you haven't seen full-fledged corporations yet. We are still very godly, and no corporation can conduct business without the permission of the state and serious investments in public welfare.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: EvilLion

We are still very godly, and no corporation can conduct business without the permission of the state and serious investments in public welfare.

This is when the state regulates the laws of corporations, and when the state itself is a corporation, then who will regulate ?!

[EvilLion]

Apparently, it is necessary to come to / to Ukraine and start explaining to a couple of tens of millions of madmen that speaking on a piece of paper in the mobile language and being called Mykolami instead of Nikolaev will not lead to any good. As practice shows, it is useless to explain. Svidomo Nazism will disappear only when ordinary citizens, not soldiers and investigators during interrogations, will beat in the face for MOV.

[parusnik]

These are flowers, berries in front. Judging by the activation of the nationalists, Nazarbayev is very bad.

[Silver bullet]

These are already berries, and the flowers were in the "saints" of the nineties

[serg.shishkov2015]

In * Artek * a third of my detachment was from Kazakhstan - both Russians and Kazakhs! Kazakhs knew almost nothing in their native language! Only Russian!

[Free Island]

Kazakhs, after Ukraine decided to trade their booty too? Happy trades

[faiver]

Kazakhs, following Ukraine

- in the sense of Kazakhs? and the rest of the former "union republics" do not do the same?

[saygon66]

Now we are not ordered to talk about it! The interests of Lukoil, Gazprom and others are not everywhere .... Those involved in the circle of these very interests are guaranteed to get rid of the "sin" of nationalism.

[faiver]

Everything is absolutely logical, Kazakhstan is an independent state, the building of its own statehood will continue to be opposed to Russia, the further the more.
Russia is far from all right with the national question and inside the country, what can we say about abroad

[The leader of the Redskins]

I observed what was described in the article in Turkmenistan back in 2003-2004. Even under Turkmenbashi. They just switched to the Latin alphabet.
A paradoxical situation developed - sometimes a good specialist could not take a position due to the fact that he could not write a job application!

[faiver]

You have observed this abroad, but this was and still is in Russia, in the national regions.

[Sergej1972]

In Russia, in all the remaining autonomous regions, in the autonomous region and in a third of the republics, Russians are absolutely dominant. They can be more correctly called pseudo-national entities, but you will not argue that the Khanty and Mansi in the Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug, the Nenets in the NAO and Yamalo-Nenets Autonomous Okrug, the Jews in the Jewish Autonomous Region, the Karelians in Karelia, the Khakass in Khakassia, the Mordovians in Mordovia, the Crimean Tatars in the Crimea monopolized power, the media , business and Russians are not given a pass?) In another third of the republics, Russians either make up a relative majority, or are the second largest group, from a third to almost half of the population. And the office work is everywhere in Russian, teaching in universities, in the middle and senior grades of school, in the absolute majority, is also in Russian. Even where Russians are in a clear minority, as, for example, in multinational Dagestan, Russian still dominates. In the binational regions such as Karachay-Cherkessia and Kabardino-Balkaria, the situation is similar. The same is true in the republics of Mordovia and Mari El, where Mordovians and Mari are not only a minority and strongly Russified, but at the same time they have two local languages, Erzya, Moksha, mountain and meadow Mari. In Chuvashia, the Chuvash are numerically predominant, but the Russian language also dominates. Plus, by themselves, our national subjects, on average, are several times, or even an order of magnitude, inferior to the former Soviet republics in terms of population. That is, the very nutritional basis for nationalism is much less. Although there are problems, I do not deny this, and there are problem regions. Chechnya with Ingushetia, Tuva, partly the same Dagestan. Or little Adygea, where the Adyghe people, constituting a quarter of the population, occupy disproportionately large positions in the total number of local officials.

[tasha]

"Everything is absolutely logical

I agree. Especially if you look at what is happening in our country from the side of the sovereign state of Kazakhstan.

[tatra]

Anti-Sovietism is ALWAYS equal to Russophobia, and especially, after the destruction of the USSR, the enemies of the USSR in the West, in Europe, on the territory of the USSR have proved this.
And the enemies of the USSR, who seized the RSFSR, including the Russians, immediately began to destroy not only the Soviet, but also the Russian, and to impose foreignism, slandered the history of Russia, began to inspire the Russian people that they had nothing to be proud of in their history, but only need to "repent".

[EvilLion]

I don’t understand, are you really people, or robots? Because only robots can speak only slogans.

[tatra]

If you are not able to answer anything intelligently, if you are not able to refute my words, do not answer.

[EvilLion]

If you have in your head some Masons, Reptilians, Zionites, or someone else out there who captured Russia and the Russians, because it's easier to believe in this than in our own folk stupidity, and we have enough of it, then they will communicate with you appropriately.

And so, it is enough to listen to only the psychoses associated with the Second World War, and it will become clear that Mikhalkov's kin and other penal battalions are not imported. No one is rewriting our history like we are. But it is easier to believe in enemies, because it even gives a feeling of exclusivity, like Samsonov, that the whole world hates us like us.

[Operator]

Taliban will help Kazakhs to know their place.

[faiver]

Does Kazakhstan border on Afghanistan?

[Okolotochny]

It borders Turkmenistan, where the border with Afghanistan is very transparent.

[well]

Will be, a matter of time :)

[ccsr]

Quote: Operator

Taliban will help Kazakhs to know their place.

Most likely, the Chinese will do it even earlier.

[Daniil Konovalenko]

Most likely, the Chinese will do it even earlier.

They have already done, they are actively investing in their favor, of course.

[Uran53]

As far as I know, the lands on which the Kazakh SSR appeared arose on the Cossack lands, on which the Kyrgyz lived compactly in the south. And like Ukraine, Kazakhstan emerged as a separate republic thanks to the Bolsheviks. And after independence, they became the "titular" nation. How Russians are treated in Kyrgyzstan has been known since the 90s. In Kazakhstan, the scenario is milder, but the result will still be the same: a mono-national state supported by the Russian Federation, as it is well known to the whole world: "Russia is a generous soul."

[sniperino]

Quote: Uran53

How Russians are treated in Kyrgyzstan has been known since the 90s. In Kazakhstan, the scenario is milder, but the result will still be the same: a mono-national state supported by the Russian Federation,

The difference is that in Kyrgyzstan the process is initiated by the Nazis, and in Kazakhstan, judging by the assessment of some experts, by the state. In these cases, it is easier to influence government policy than the attitudes of citizens, but something needs to be done to achieve this.

[Uran53]

In Kazakhstan, the same anti-Russian policy is being pursued as in Ukraine or Kyrgyzstan (the manuals are the same). Did the Nazis pass the law on the transition to the Latin alphabet? And the number of Russians in Kazakhstan is constantly decreasing. No, this is a deliberate policy of the state. It's just that in Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, Russians immediately began to survive, and those who did not leave were cut out. And in Kazakhstan, Russians are surviving gradually, and so far without a lot of blood, fortunately. But this is more a matter of time.

[tasha]

The main motive for such a struggle is simple - an attempt to break away from the "Russian world", oust Russian culture and demonstrate loyalty to the West.

The author, it seems to me that you did not list all the motives and set the wrong priorities. If you just think - what is so special about how you write "Russian world" to Kazakhs. Right now, at the moment? What are the values, moral principles, cultural achievements, technical innovations?

And, I will also note. Kazakhs living in Kazakhstan know two languages. Russian and at some level - Kazakh. Why do Russians who have lived in Kazakhstan all their lives know only one? Just out of respect for the people they live next to?

[Darkness]

Good comment. Now hold on, run over.

[Boris55]

Quote: tasha

Just out of respect for the people they live next to?

This is how it all begins and ends with pogroms and murders of Russians. I perfectly remember the 90s and how aircraft flew to us with our citizens from all the former ...

Quote: = taskha

and what is so special about how you write "Russian world" to Kazakhs

Grateful Kazakhs take revenge on the Russians for the fact that the Russians gave them writing and education. The nomadic tribes became sedentary, the rudiments of statehood appeared.

Only the Russian civilization preserves the identity and culture of all peoples living on its territory.

[tasha]

This is how it all begins.

Explain your thought, please ...

[Boris55]

Quote: tasha

Explain your thought, please ...

This is called "Overtone Windows". What it is?

The first step is to recognize through language that you are strangers here.
Next, you have no right to anything here.
The next one is a suitcase, railway station, Russia.
The next one is to promise them everything they want, and then we'll wake them up.

You can easily find and read more details about "Windows of overtones" in the internet.

[tasha]

There is also an expression from the Internet: "To pull an owl on the globe."

[Igoresha]

Grateful Kazakhs take revenge on the Russians for the fact that the Russians gave them writing,

well. you know, the Kazakhs did not ask for this about themselves.
And people are the same everywhere:
In 2017, a similar thing happened in the city of Strunino, Vladimir region. There, an Armenian entrepreneur Mamud Shavershyan has been distributing bread free of charge to the poor for more than eight years. Residents began to write complaints about the businessman to the presidential administration and the prosecutor's office. Citizens were convinced that free bread was not the entrepreneur's own initiative, but an order of the head of state, and they were entitled to more than they received. The story caused a public outcry.

[Andrey Grad]

"Only Russian civilization preserves the identity and culture of all peoples living on its territory."
---------------------------------------------------------
This disservice with good intentions harms both the people of the small nations themselves, and, as a result, the Russian Federation. In a globalized world of competing nations, only large nations have the weight and chances of development. The Russian Federation, instead of increasing the nation quantitatively, on the contrary splits it into small nations. And the "caring" policy of preserving small peoples does not give the people of these small peoples a chance for development, they cannot receive a good world-class education in their places of residence in their local languages, they do not have access to developed science, culture and simply to a wider outlook.
The Russian Federation as a state, in turn, because of this fragmentation into small nations, loses part of its human potential from which gifted, promising minds could have emerged.

[ccsr]

Quote: Andrey Grad

The Russian Federation as a state, in turn, because of this fragmentation into small nations, loses part of its human potential from which gifted, promising minds could have emerged.

This is a cheap distortion, because many different peoples have lived on such a vast territory since ancient times, and even immigrants, from Germany, came, or Jews from Europe. So it is not necessary to lie that it was the Russian Federation as a state that created these peoples - this is a natural historical process.
As for giftedness, such people are born to different nations, and this does not in any way affect what nationality a person is, because his further development is provided by the surrounding society. But Russian society, in contrast to Western countries, has always made it possible for people of all nationalities to achieve success in Russia, which some "advanced" national minorities have used since tsarist times, shouting at all corners about the infringement of their rights.

[Andrey Grad]

You, besides yourself, read texts, you would learn to understand others, and not come up with a gag. Where did I write "the Russian Federation as the state created these peoples"? - Don't write it, don't invent it.
I argue that artificial support for the languages ​​and cultures of small peoples (allocation of funds from the budget, the provision of quotas) is precisely not a NATURAL process of evolution that hinders the development of the entire society.
It's like in the economy, when the state, having received profit from advanced, modern technologies, invests it in outdated, unpromising technologies.

[ccsr]

Quote: Andrey Grad

I argue that artificial support for the languages ​​and cultures of small peoples (allocation of funds from the budget, the provision of quotas) is precisely not a NATURAL process of evolution that hinders the development of the entire society.

What is the conclusion of such a "theoretician", especially with regard to Russia and the USSR?
Or do you think that national contradictions in a multinational country, which will result in massacres or confrontation of different ethnic groups, will contribute to the development of the whole society?
Well, well, apparently the collapse of the USSR did not teach you anything, since you want to create a mono-ethnic state like in Ukraine - so why should you understand?

Quote: Andrey Grad

It's like in the economy, when the state, having received profit from advanced, modern technologies, invests it in outdated, unpromising technologies.

Have you studied any course of social sciences and where, in order to blindly drag the laws of some sciences onto the social ones? This is ridiculous, even for those who are not aware of historical materialism and political economy. You would have begun to operate with Newton's laws to build a modern society ...

[Uran53]

In the Tribaltic it began the same way. And then the Russians became "non-citizens." Second-class people. Do you know Tatar or Komi language? After all, you live in the same country, don't you?

[tasha]

Do you know Tatar or Komi language? After all, you live in the same country, don't you?

The example is wrong. Can you guess why?

[sniperino]

Quote: tasha

Do you know Tatar or Komi language? After all, you live in the same country, don't you?

The example is wrong. Can you guess why?

If you live in Tatarstan or Komi, it will do

Quote: tasha

Just out of respect for the people they live next to

The duty of a Tatar and others to know the great and mighty nation-wide does not exempt them from the need to respect them, right?

[tasha]

The duty of a Tatar and others to know the great and mighty nation-wide does not exempt them from the need to respect them

Now you have puzzled me. I could not comprehend the meaning of your message.

[sniperino]

The duty of a Tatar and others to know the great and mighty nation-wide does not exempt them from the need to respect them

Should a Russian, born and living in Tatarstan, know Tatar at least at some level?

[tasha]

At least on some - yes. It depends on the person. A smart person - will strive to somehow replenish his vocabulary.

[sniperino]

Quote: tasha

It depends on the person.

And also from language policy, from upbringing and a number of other factors. English in our schools is taught from mercantile and pragmatic reasons, so we have Westerners. The mental development of bilinguals is partly due to the difference in the languages ​​they learn: the more differences in languages, the more effectively the second language affects the development of mental abilities. From this point of view, for a Russian, mastering the 2nd language Tatar (Kazakh, Arabic, Chinese), even at a low level of everyday communication, will give more than mastering English at the same level. Most of those who studied English at school do not even reach it. Thus, we deprive: 1) the school - a resource for the upbringing and mental development of schoolchildren, 2) language policy - a resource for strengthening trust in interethnic relations within the country, 3) international politics - a resource for the development of interethnic ties and cooperation in the Eurasian space. Well, the 5th column of the Anglo-Saxons has a constant supply not only from Soros.

[Andrey Grad]

In a globalized world of competing nations, only large nations have the weight and chances of development. The Russian Federation, instead of increasing the nation quantitatively, on the contrary splits it into small nations. And the "caring" policy of preserving small peoples does not give the people of these small peoples a chance for development, they cannot receive a good world-class education in their places of residence in their local languages, they do not have access to developed science, culture and simply to a wider outlook that replaces local nationalism.
The Russian Federation as a state, in turn, because of this fragmentation into small nations, loses part of its human potential from which gifted, promising minds could have emerged.

[Aleksandr21]

Quote: tasha

If you just think - what is so special about how you write the "Russian world" to the Kazakhs. Right now, at the moment? What are the values, moral principles, cultural achievements, technical innovations?

The answer is simple: money, economy. What economic association is Kazakhstan now part of? The EAEU, and Russia is the main trade partner of Kazakhstan and also the guarantor of its security (remember at least the territorial issues of China to Kazakhstan, or the spread of radical currents in the countries of the former USSR ...), also Kazakhstan receives technologies from Russia (production of Sputnik 5 on the territory of Kazakhstan), cooperation with IT companies from Russia, etc. therefore, Kazakhstan has a lot to lose. And all this flirting with nationalists and the artificial squeezing of the Russian language will not lead to good ... + the authorities in Russia must react harshly to such cases, up to a sanction against state institutions of Kazakhstan (for inaction, or for encouraging such a state policy: grants , state support, etc.) .... i.e. I adhere to this position: if you are an opponent of everything Russian, then do not be surprised that tomorrow the Russian market will be closed for your goods, services, etc. and this is true.

[Most polite]

Are you my friend id..t ?? However, the question is rhetorical
I do not want to go deep into the analysis of this article, tk. it is complete shit and this whole topic of Kazakh nationalism got out on the front pages of the Russian media only because of the upcoming elections in your country, but you can talk more specifically about the EAEU and the Customs Union.
The only reason why the Russian Federation has an advantage in trade with Kazakhstan is the length of the border and the impossibility of delivering our oil to Europe without your pipelines. Now Russia is number 1 in trade, followed by China for the same reasons, and Italy with South Korea ..
But in reality, the economic union with you bears only losses, and only for us.
Pressure from Russian manufacturers with a greater financial mass (not to be confused with higher technologies and business efficiency) led to massive bankruptcies of small and medium-sized Kazakhstani companies.
According to the Statistics Agency of the Republic of Kazakhstan, the rise in prices for food products in the period before Kazakhstan's accession to the CU was smooth, and only after the CU is it characterized by a sharp increase (+ 21,6% and + 3,5% in relation to the 2006 level).
It was believed that the CU stimulates the free flow of capital, labor, investment, thereby increasing competition. But taking into account Russian realities, exclusively monopoly has increased.
So that Kazakhstan has something to lose, leave it for domestic consumption, in reality the situation is completely different.

[EvilLion]

The Russian world brings the Kazakhs, at least, not sliding into feudalism. But if the Kazakhs want to live in yurts, and under feudolism, then let them live, and the Russians and Chinese in 50 years will be white bangs in Kazakhstan.

Why do Russians who have lived in Kazakhstan all their lives know only one?

Probably because this is actually more than enough. I also know only a few words in Tatar. For the Kazakhs themselves, who are more educated and more ambitious and aspired to the union level, where the thread to Moscow, the Kazakh language was also not needed in FIG.

You can jump and put on skullcaps as much as you like, but some plant simply cannot work without full office work in Russian, both due to terminology and due to standardization. There are not many languages ​​in the world that are suitable for an industrial society. And to modify the Kazakh and Kazakhs, so that it would be possible to conduct office work on it, or teach scientific knowledge, it will take decades, but you have to live right now, and without Russians, Kazakhstan is doomed.

[tasha]

The Russian world brings the Kazakhs, at least, not sliding into feudalism.

We know some of these "kulturtragers" ... We were also convinced that they were bringing enlightenment to wild peoples.

and the Russians and Chinese in 50 years will be white bangs in Kazakhstan.

Ha ha ha. "White bwans" Chinese - I understand that you used a figure of speech, but it's still funny. So can Kazakhs make Chinese a second language? More promising ...

[hagen]

Quote: tasha

Just out of respect for the people they live next to?

Language is such a thing that "out of respect" is not learned. It is necessary that it be practically in demand, and in demand on a massive scale, that is, in many places, not only in everyday life. Multilingualism in the country is a difficult situation. Management needs to find a balance in the regulation of these processes so that no part of the population is affected. And since the former republics of the USSR had no experience of statehood before 1917, it is extremely difficult for them to establish and control this balance. All the more so since the power in Central Asian countries is now again in vogue clannishness and familialism. It cannot be disregarded that "partners" in this field are feeding local nationalism with various grants.

[sniperino]

Quote: Hagen

Language is such a thing that "out of respect" is not learned. It must be practically in demand

Do you think that respect is practically not in demand? I would argue the opposite: this is the most demanded "piece".

[hagen]

Quote: sniperino

Do you think that respect is practically not in demand? I would argue the opposite: this is the most demanded "piece".

Respect is always in demand in the system of relationships, but it is not a motivator for language learning. Another group is made up of people who are in love with the culture of the native people and study the language for deep penetration into it. But there are always very few of them. Love for anything, a strong feeling, and not quite equal to respect.

[nemez]

And why the people who were not allowed to perish are so related to those who helped them to survive? The so-called northern Kazakhstan also slaughtered the land.

[ccsr]

Quote: tasha

Just out of respect for the people they live next to?

And the Russians were strongly asked when they were forced to go there to raise virgin lands, to build a cosmodrome or aviation enterprises? Maybe out of respect for the Russians, for this it is necessary to treat their self-sacrifice for the sake of these shepherds differently? We didn’t think about it, you are our fighter for the rights of the aborigines ...
By the way, how many languages ​​a Russian was obliged to know if he was thrown into different republics, for example, during his military service, or work in construction and installation organizations throughout the country.

[tasha]

Maybe out of respect for the Russians, for this it is necessary to treat their self-sacrifice for the sake of these shepherds differently?

Please write how the hypothetical Alibek should relate to the hypothetical Vasily in Kazakhstan? And how should Vasily relate to Alibek?

[ccsr]

Quote: tasha

Please write how the hypothetical Alibek should relate to the hypothetical Vasily in Kazakhstan?

Do not interfere with his life and receive a good education in Russian. More is not required of them.

Quote: tasha

And how should Vasily relate to Alibek?

It makes no difference - this is not the problem of the Russian ethnos, but of the Kazakh, how they will treat themselves. Stop humiliating yourself in front of all underdeveloped peoples - everyone must go their own way.

[tasha]

Stop humiliating yourself in front of all underdeveloped peoples - everyone must go their own way.

"- You should not be. Not all peoples have the right to the future. Lower races breed the infection of communism. You should not be. And the mission will be fulfilled. Today or tomorrow. Today or tomorrow!"

[ccsr]

Quote: tasha

"- You should not be. Not all peoples have the right to the future. Lower races breed the infection of communism. You should not be. And the mission will be fulfilled. Today or tomorrow. Today or tomorrow!"

I don’t know where you led this, but the historical example of South Africa is apparently unknown to you. And it should be taken into account when ethnic groups of different mentality collide.

[tasha]

You, of course, are right ... And when some other ethnic group considers that the Russians are an underdeveloped, uncultured people and they urgently need to bring the light of civilization - will this be true?

Regarding South Africa. If you drive the indigenous population into reservations, do not give the opportunity to acquire the necessary knowledge and raise their cultural level, then of course the dependence of this population on a more developed minority as a result will be very high ... "Four classes are enough for a Slav" ...

[ccsr]

Quote: tasha

You, of course, are right ... And when some other ethnic group considers that the Russians are an underdeveloped, uncultured people and they urgently need to bring the light of civilization - will this be true?

It is strange that you do not know about this from history since the time of the campaigns of the knight-dogs to Russia - the West has always thought so, wake up at last, and do not engage in demagoguery. Whether they acted right or not, their bones will answer you, as well as the remains of the French in 1812 and other Europeans after 1945.

Quote: tasha

Regarding South Africa. If you drive the indigenous population into reservations, do not give the opportunity to receive the necessary knowledge and raise their cultural level,

Someone drove the Kazakhs into the reservations, or, on the contrary, were they taught in the best universities of the USSR according to the national quota, to the detriment of the more capable Russian people? Will you deny that too?

Quote: tasha

"Four classes are enough for a Slav" ...

Your cheap speculation does not impress me - we ourselves have always known and know what we need, and are ready to die for it or endure inconvenience and hardship. We stood on this and we stand - you cannot understand this, apparently ...

[tasha]

You write:

but the historical example of South Africa is apparently unknown to you. And it should be taken into account when ethnic groups of different mentality collide.

I believe that the historical example of South Africa in relation to Kazakhstan is not appropriate and I explain why.

I reject your accusations of demagoguery. Unfortunately, I have no desire to paint you in detail on the thoughts that you began to ascribe to me, sorry. Be rude to someone else. Good luck.

[ccsr]

Quote: tasha

I believe that the historical example of South Africa in relation to Kazakhstan is not appropriate and I explain why.

You can explain whatever you want, but in fact in Kazakhstan the same processes began as in South Africa, no matter how much you want to hide it.

Quote: tasha

I reject your accusations of demagoguery.

And nevertheless, it is present in your texts, no matter how much you want to disguise it.

Quote: tasha

Good luck.

Have a nice one you too.

[Most polite]

Thank you Mikhail for your voluntary or involuntary support of the Kazakhs as having the right to respect from neighbors and to equal relations in the dialogue between the two countries, the Russian Federation and the Republic of Kazakhstan.
PS although the overwhelming Nazism in the comments is not suppressed by the moderators, it’s better, complete clarity and certainty than all these fake speeches and toasts about brotherhood and centuries-old friendship. IMHO.

[Terran ghost]

and this should be differently related to their self-sacrifice for the sake of these shepherds?

Well, this is ... the British in India, during their reign, also built a decent number of schools, hospitals and even universities for the local population.
PS: There really is such a difference that there is still no land border between Great Britain and India (and therefore, there is no situation "in direct accessibility for a land military operation"). Therefore, the attitude towards the former metropolis in India is now quite normal, in general ...

[ccsr]

Quote: Terran Ghost

Well, this is ... the British in India, during their reign, also built a decent number of schools, hospitals and even universities for the local population.

So, in respect of this, they made English the second state language - you certainly have not heard about this. It is because of this that a huge number of Indians have become world-class programmers.

Quote: Terran Ghost

There really is such a difference

There is only one difference that you do not want to notice - the British generally did not consider the Indians as people, and destroyed them in case of disobedience. And we have many mixed married couples living in Kazakhstan, and their leaders were full-fledged members of the USSR government and the Central Committee of the CPSU. Can you tell us anything about the destruction of Kazakhs by order of the Soviet government?

[Terran ghost]

So, in respect of this, they made English the second state language - you certainly have not heard about this.

First, I heard. Secondly, not even that "just in respect." Actually for understanding
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7c/Indian_states_by_official_language.png
in about half of India's states, Hindi is not a native language. And the attempt to impose it on ethnic groups for which it is not native caused strong protest. English already actually had "international status" at that time, therefore it was a kind of compromise.

[ccsr]

Quote: Terran Ghost

English already actually had "international status"

Those. you forbid the Russian language to have an "international" language status in the post-Soviet space - so why should I understand you? If yes, then on what basis, enlighten ...

[Terran ghost]

so what do you understand?

From what in my message on the period of development of the independent Republic of India in 1947-1970s did you draw such conclusions? This time.
Two. The "status of an international language" is enshrined in practice, and not issued by some unknown "regulatory body" in a directive manner.

[ccsr]

Quote: Terran Ghost

Two. "The status of an international language" is consolidated by practice,

Well, if you say so, then tell us in what language textbooks for higher schools on medicine, physics, chemistry, mathematics and other exact sciences were published in Kazakhstan - can you give scans of these books? In Ukraine, chemistry is still taught at the Shevchenko University using Russian textbooks - somehow it does not work for them with translation into MOV ...

[garrett]

Why do Russians who have lived in Kazakhstan all their lives know only one? Just out of respect for the people they live next to?

those. if I live in Kazakhstan and do not know the Kazakh language, do I disrespect someone or something? pay taxes, abide by laws, work for the good of the country and still don’t respect ??? some kind of perverted concept of respect you have

[tasha]

some kind of perverted concept of respect you have

I believe that every intelligent person should strive for this. You think otherwise. Your business, personal ...

[garrett]

I believe that every intelligent person should strive for this.

those. in your opinion you are smart and I am not? A bold statement, but oh well ... But as a matter of fact, I explained to you my vision of RESPECT, you no. Samdurak response is not accepted

[tasha]

those. in your opinion you are smart and I am not?

On the one hand - "on the thief and the hat is on fire."
On the other hand, I believe that "every smart person should strive for this." You, in turn, may think that "every smart person should not strive for this." Is that okay for you? You and I don't seem to be at school, there are no teachers or students here. There is an exchange of views.

I will also add that paying taxes and obeying the laws is the duty of a citizen of any country.

[garrett]

"on the thief and the hat is on"

do you randomly choose sayings? I understand that you are trying to petrosyan and what kind of context you are putting there (like Samduk knows about it), well, at least work a little

On the other hand, I believe that "every smart person should strive for this"

Explain why you think so? Do you think the Swiss, Canadians, Swedes, Dutch do not respect their country? Find out what percentage in Quebec does not know English, and the Franco-Swiss probably generally hate Switzerland, the Austrians, horror, do not have their own language at all, bastards spit in German. In UWB, there is no state language at all, from the word at all ... they probably also do not respect it)
And in general, how does the knowledge of the language and respect in your head intersect?

I will also add that paying taxes and obeying the laws is the duty of a citizen of any country.

captain obviousness (s)

[tasha]

Explain why you think so?

I explain - this is my personal opinion, formed taking into account my personal life experience and my knowledge.

pay taxes, abide by laws, work for the good of the country and still don’t respect ???

I believe that paying taxes and obeying the laws is the duty of a citizen of the state and does not in any way apply to my understanding of respect.

And in general, how does the knowledge of the language and respect in your head intersect?

That's how it intersects. If people live next to you - speakers of another language, with different traditions and customs, and if you voluntarily (!), Without coercion or self-interest, study their language, traditions and customs, then this will be respect.

[garrett]

If people live next to you - speakers of another language, with different traditions and customs, and if you voluntarily (!), Without coercion or self-interest, study their language, traditions and customs, then this will be respect.

and if you don't study, is that disrespectful? For disrespect, what should I do? Punish!
I'm just deliberately bringing your logic to a radical version, because some mambet from a distant village will take everything that way.
Let's turn the picture over. Let's say they live in my city

people - speakers of another language, with different traditions and customs

who do not know Russian. Why should I have butthert from the fact that they cannot really explain themselves in the store, on the street, etc.?
Language is only a means of communication and nothing more. It has nothing to do with respect or disrespect, but as a means for splitting society along linguistic lines (see Ukraine) - it itself.

[tasha]

and if you don't study, is that disrespectful? For disrespect, what should I do? Punish!

Disrespect still needs to be shown. Then - you can punish, but - with respect ...
There is respect, there is no respect, there is - just politeness.

[tasha]

Alexey, I looked here on the Internet: "The duty of every citizen of the Republic of Kazakhstan is to master the state language, which is the most important factor in the consolidation of the people of Kazakhstan." From the law on state. language from 11.07.1997.

So ... If you want it, you do not want it - if you are a citizen of Kazakhstan, then you need to study slowly.

[garrett]

So ... If you want it, you do not want it - if you are a citizen of Kazakhstan, then you need to study slowly.

Michael, do you read my sheets or not? I am a citizen of Russia and I sincerely do not want situations like in Ukraine or Kazakhstan in the language sphere to occur in my country. I don’t understand this problem, well, for example, a Chechen doesn’t want to study Russian - but for God's sake, this is his right, he wants to get a higher education on it - please (here, of course, the question arises where so many professors can find those who know the Chechen language). It is impossible to force to learn a language if the language is economically or linguistically attractive and will be learned that way. For example, here is a quote from the Head of Salem Social Media (the largest producer of Kazakhstani media content - TNT at minimum salaries): Using your own material as an example, how do you assess the demand for content in Russian and Kazakh?

- The numbers show a clear picture, and we adapt our work to them: 80% of the content is done in the Kazakh language. In Russian, we produce only spot projects for the urban audience. It is useless to spend effort and money on Russian-language content - the Russian market with its capabilities is dragging the Russian-speaking audience. In Russia, one episode of the series costs $ 200 thousand, and we have $ 5 thousand.
We are trying to convey this to advertisers, many of whom still live with the stereotypes of the 1990s that the Russian-speaking audience is more solvent.

Those. Russian-language content is of higher quality, therefore, urban Kazakhstani youth watches all sorts of TV shows, BWD and stand-ups (accordingly, they learn the language).

[tasha]

I am a citizen of Russia

Alexey, according to the comments to your article, I didn't think so. Wrong.

Those. Russian-language content is of higher quality, therefore, urban Kazakhstani youth watches all sorts of TV shows, BWD and stand-ups (accordingly, they learn the language).

I am not sure that this can be concluded from this text. It turns out that the demand for Russian-language content is completely covered by Russian products. What does this mean? That it is increasing or decreasing? I don't really understand media topics.
What is BWD?

[garrett]

I am not sure that this can be concluded from this text.

Mikhail, here I agree with you, this is just a phrase torn from an interview. In more detail, you can see the statistics of YouTube, or better Apple Music, or Spotify. There you will see what content Kazakhs consume more (spoiler - Russian).
Moreover, Kazakhstan can be conditionally divided into two parts - north / east, predominantly urban Russian-speaking population (regardless of nationality) and west / south, predominantly rural non-Russian-speaking population, of course smaller in number. Because of this, the consumption of Russian-language content differs by region.

What is BWD?

Freak show, called "What happened next"

[Konnick]

it is necessary to study slowly. hi

Forcibly cute will not be

[tasha]

dura lex sed lex
The law is already from 1997! I do not know if there have been any protests in Kazakhstan against this article in the law during these twenty years.

How do you feel about any "obochechnik"? They break the law. And the fight against them sometimes takes on ugly forms, how can we go without it.

[Victorio]

Quote: tasha

some kind of perverted concept of respect you have

I believe that everyone clever man should strive for this. You think otherwise. Your business, personal ...

===
I think a smart person \ ki will develop / promote / encourage the study of his own language, and not prohibit / restrict / infringe on someone else's language

[tasha]

I agree. This is what the Kazakhs are doing. Develop, promote and encourage learning of their language. Moreover, the study of the Kazakh language is the duty of every citizen.

[Victorio]

Quote: tasha

This is what the Kazakhs are doing. Develop, promote and encourage learning of their language.

===
I doubt it very much, and you can hardly find confirmation. and while national activity / raids, speculation and the Nazis' rise to power will continue, the Russians will wipe themselves off, adjust and leave. into open confrontation, resistance, and self-defense is not expected. good or bad is another matter.

[asasin Asasievch]

At least obscene. Shishin amski.

[Terran ghost]

those. if i live in kazakhstan and don't know kazakh language

If you are a citizen of Kazakhstan and at the same time, for any personal reasons, on principle, refuse to learn the state language ...

[garrett]

Language is only a means of communication and nothing more. If I don't need Kazakh, why should I study it? (Russian by the way has equal rights with him, he is the second state if Th). The UWB does not have a state language at all, in Switzerland 4, in the Netherlands 3, in Sweden, Finland, Canada, Belarus, Belgium, Malaysia, New Zealand, 2 official languages. There is no Austrian language, Australian language and nothing ... somehow with respect it seems not bad with them. Language has nothing to do with respect or disrespect, but as a means for splitting society along linguistic lines (see Ukraine) - it itself.

[Terran ghost]

second state if th

Things are a little more complicated, in fact, if you look at the official docs.
Constitution of the Republic of Kazakhstan, article 7
Quote: "1. The Kazakh language is the state language in the Republic of Kazakhstan.
2. In state organizations and local self-government bodies, the Russian language is officially used along with the Kazakh language.
3. The state takes care of creating conditions for the study and development of the languages ​​of the people of Kazakhstan. "
The second paragraph of this article essentially says only that on the territory of the Republic of Kazakhstan the Russian language is used on an equal basis with the state (Kazakh) language in state authorities and institutions, as well as in local self-government bodies. That is, residents of Kazakhstan have the right to receive state and municipal services in Russian, communicate (verbally and in writing) in Russian with state and municipal departments, including the police and courts.
At the same time, a citizen of the Republic of Kazakhstan who is NOT a state or municipal employee is generally not required by law to speak Russian.

There is no Austrian language, Australian

Well, Austria has a long tradition of its own statehood (moreover, this tradition is noticeably older than the state tradition of Germany itself as a single state), and with Australia - well, between them and Great Britain there is an ocean that divides the nationalities according to the principle "here we are, and there overseas - they. " If these two countries had a land border, I would not rule out that then the Australian dialect of the English language would be formalized "in a separate language." Purely for political reasons. And what - "the Montenegrin language separate from Serbian" was recently formalized. Moreover, he was not even embarrassed by the absence of an official literary norm in the newly created Montenegrin language.

There is no state language at all in the USA

Formally, there is no single state language in the United States. That is, there is no constitutional or statutory norm on the state language established by federal legislation.
At the level of individual states, there are such norms. Moreover, where a significant in size Hispanic diaspora, Spanish is used along with English.
Moreover, due to the peculiarities of the American economy with a low percentage of state participation in it ... it is not surprising that a Hispanic resident of the United States by birth can speak poor English simply because he exists both at home and at work in a Hispanic environment ...

[garrett]

Colleague, you want to argue with me and do not know what to argue with? I wrote exactly this, just not expanded. If you really want to delve into this topic, then go to pedivikia in the article "list of officially multilingual countries and regions"

[Victorio]

Quote: Terran Ghost

The second paragraph of this article essentially says only About,

====
suggests that those who wrote the constitution out of ignorance or deliberately provided the Nazis with freedom of action. Given the recent events in Ukraine, where the Russian had no less strong positions, we can say with confidence that the situation with the Russian will deteriorate and worsen.

[tasha]

the situation with the Russian will get worse and worse.

Maybe. We can treat this as we like, but from the point of view of the sovereign state of Kazakhstan, such a policy is justified. I think so, I could be wrong, of course ...

[sniperino]

Quote: Garrett

pay taxes, abide by laws, work for the good of the country and still don’t respect

White Yankees in America were interested in the language of the Indians, considering them non-humans, no more than the language of dogs. Refugees in Europe do not want to learn the language of the aborigines, because they do not respect, even despise them. And migrant workers are forced to learn the language, although they pay taxes, comply with laws, work for the good of the country, but they are still forced. Learning a language is a testament to your respect for its native speakers.

[asasin Asasievch]

At least obscene. Shishn play.

[Rubi0]

And what is the practical value of this, the transfer of knowledge, technology, is it economically profitable to learn the language spoken by a percentage of the world's population? If your neighbor plays the guitar, you don't learn to play it out of good neighborliness, at least I’ll give you some drumming because it’s not doing you any good, right?

[tasha]

And what is the practical value of this, the transfer of knowledge, technology, is it economically viable?

Explicitly? No...

[Evgesha]

OU respected to learn the language only out of respect - you just got stoned !!!
The language is taught only when there is a need to use it !!! Everything. There are no other reasons !!!
And why do the Russians living in Kazakhstan have to learn some more language ??
You don’t need anyone other than Russian !!
If 70-80% of Russians lived in the northern regions of the Kazakh SSR, then what language did they speak ??

[Humpty]

Quote: tasha

Why do Russians who have lived in Kazakhstan all their lives know only one? Just out of respect for the people they live next to?

If you are from Russia, then justify to me why you don't know Kalmyk and Buryat? Maybe you don't respect them?
You may know the Kazakh language, you may not know it, use it to familiarize yourself with the Russian, like whipping an eggnog with a boot. This does not prevent people from being respected.

Quote: tasha

And, I will also note. Kazakhs living in Kazakhstan know two languages.

There are quite a few of them. There are also many Russians who know two languages.
To whom is Macbeth in the original, to whom is Macbeth.

[ultra]

Quote: tasha

Just out of respect for the people they live next to?

Language is not taught out of respect.

[Darkness]

By the way, in Lviv (at the church!) I saw a quote from Sheptytsky: "nationalism does not smitten with hatred." I was surprised.

[Gardamir]

It all depends on who is in charge of the leadership in Russia. With a true patriot, the islanders of the Tonga islands will know the Russian language well.

[Boris55]

Quote: Gardamir

With a true patriot, the islanders of the Tonga islands will know the Russian language well.

And so they know English well.

Do you want us, like them, to suppress and unify everyone who is at least somehow interesting to us? This is the path of Western and Eastern civilization - not ours.

[Gardamir]

suppressed and unified everyone for themselves

In Soviet times, many nations studied Russian because they respected Russians. And now who will respect the Russians, who are ready to trade in their own country for a penny.

[Boris55]

Quote: Gardamir

And now who will respect the Russians, who are ready to trade in their own country for a penny.

Russians with passports and those who trade not in their homeland are respected by few in Russia either.

[Terran ghost]

In Soviet times, many nations studied Russian

Which nations are they?

[avia12005]

By the way, Mustafa Shokai in Kazakhstan began to be heroized under Nazarbayev. And instead of the St. George ribbon, they were forced to wear the blue colors of the Kazakh flag. So everything follows the well-worn Ukrainian track. God forbid, but I would like to ask, where will the Kazakhstan House of Trade Unions be?

[Avior]

... The main motive for such a struggle is simple - an attempt to break away from the "Russian world", to oust Russian culture

A small phrase that clearly illustrates the failure of Russian foreign policy in the countries of the former Soviet Union.
Logically, it should have been strictly the opposite - there are all grounds for the same Kazakhs in the development of the use of the Russian language, it is clear that the level of development of technology and science in Russia is much higher than in Kazakhstan - in practice, the Russian language is being squeezed out, regardless of the advantages that it gives usage:(((

[Erich]

it is clear that the level of development of technology, science in Russia is much higher than in Kazakhstan

Yes, now the Kazakhs are cooperating well both with the West and with China, I don't think that against the background of this cooperation, Russia has anything to offer Kazakhstan))

[Avior]

I am not saying that savages live in Kazakhstan and are not engaged in science, I have acquaintances scientists and teachers from Kazakhstan - Kazakhs by nationality. But simply by virtue of the size and, accordingly, the volume of work, Russia is of natural interest to the Kazakhs, and this is a resource that was not used, but rather wasted.

[Okolotochny]

This "failure" is very easy to correct - transit through the territory of the Russian Federation from "unfriendly" countries is prohibited. This list can be riveted already at a run. Fortunately, there is a list of countries that have imposed sanctions against us. Transit to Central Asia including. Kazakhs on my knees will crawl and ask.

[Avior]

And to dissolve the Customs Union? And the CIS too?

[Okolotochny]

And they will not go anywhere. Just as our politicians are talking nonsense for them, so they howl and squeal. As themselves, so are silent. So to declare that in matters of national prestige and security we play every man for himself. And they will swallow it. They have no other choice. I remember how in the early 90s in Tatarstan and Bashkiria, demonstrations were held with slogans for independence. Until the stoned ones were told that being in the center of Russia and going into confrontation with it was a shot in the temple.

[Avior]

But Kazakhs are not in the center of Russia. They are quickly reorienting themselves to China.

[Strashila]

Does China need them?

[Avior]

Oil, gas, manganese, coal, and much more.

[ultra]

The CIS is definitely an absolutely useless education. The TS is beneficial to Russia from an economic point of view.

[Daniil Konovalenko]

This "failure" is very easy to correct - transit through the territory of the Russian Federation from "unfriendly" countries is prohibited.

Right! and to join Baikonur, without paying rent and lands on which the remnants of missiles fall.

[Swordserg]

Nothing. The virus and the climate do not care about nationality and material condition. Heat, typhoons will burn out the steppes and blow away yurts along with horses and people. And the illiterate population will die out from the infection because the level of education is clearly visible by the number of Natsiks. So in 20 years on this planet will remain mostly healthy, educated and united by a common goal - to survive.

[EvilLion]

They are not supposed to know Russian. Knowledge of Russian in the future will be a determining factor in determining the status of a full-fledged person, or national.

[Mungut]

The situation is fully expected. The end of this trend will be when national formations in Russia begin to declare their election. The concepts Russian, or God forbid, the titular nation, are comparable to fascism.

[Erich]

The Kazakhs have their own country, they themselves will figure out what language to speak to them and what policy to adhere to. What they consider more promising for themselves, they will do.

[Agent cooper]

Small peoples saw how the Kremlin guarantor "protected" the Russian population in Ukraine and decided to do the same at home. Reap the benefits. Russia probably did not know more cowardly than the president.

[agond]

Refusal from the Russian language in favor of the Kazakh language is a guaranteed loss of large amounts of information with a subsequent slowdown in the country's development, and even if they start learning English instead, this will not fundamentally change anything.

[Victorio]

Quote: agond

Rejection of the Russian language in favor of the Kazakh this is a guaranteed loss of large amounts of information with a subsequent slowdown in the country's development and even if they start learning English in return, this will not fundamentally change anything.

===
the idea behind the Natsiks, they are passionate, stubbornly, and not without support, go to power / troughs, and think in categories here and now, what will happen next, after them, is the tenth thing. all this has already happened in the baltics, and then in the ukraine.

[Anika]

Not everything is written correctly, but something is coming in Kazakhstan, indeed, there have been a lot of Nazis lately, or they began to be promoted, maybe Turkey and Azeibarjan are sponsoring, they are promoting Turan, for Turan there is one obstacle - Russia

[nikolaj1703]

Afghanistan is not far away, you run to ask for help from Russia, but they won't understand there, they don't know Kazakh

[well]

Quote: Boris55

Grateful Kazakhs take revenge on the Russians for the fact that the Russians gave them writing and education.

And Russian lands.

[Strashila]

what difficulties, for a couple of months to close the border for entry, to send 200 thousand Kazakhs to Kazakhstan to learn the language.

[leks]

Quote: EvilLion

And many have already left? I understand that in Kievisho you have a national idea, to call yourself non-Russians and sit on the neck of the European Union, but Russia has something to do with it.

Even if there are a million applications for Green Cards!
The chance of winning this card is less than one percent on the SNG. From this one percent, subtract those who fail the consulate interview, as well as those who fail to raise the required amount of dollars to pay the fees, and those who eventually return disillusioned with the American dream.
It was easier to get to the EU and the US on a tourist visa and stay there asking for asylum as a victim of the regime, etc. The fact that people are trying to leave is a normal phenomenon for any country, and even more so at the present time. Somewhere the number is greater, and somewhere less.

[well]

Quote: nemez

And why the people who were not allowed to perish are so related to those who helped them to survive? The so-called northern Kazakhstan also slaughtered the land.

Envy. A nation that has not been able to build a state on its own is likely to experience an inferiority complex. And he is trying to get rid of this complex with a desire to humiliate the Russian people, which created Kazakhstan, gave written language, built cities, economies, etc.

[Konnick]

It's not really jealousy. Our periphery also suffers from this. This is the province's pure envy of capitals. This I call provincial swagger. This is some kind of complex, but not inferiority, but rather the opposite. I am also from the provinces, but now I live in Moscow and when I visit other cities sometimes I feel this attitude latently. I do not want to call it nationalism, because not only representatives of local nationalities suffer from this, but also Russians. It's a wild mixture of envy and invented exclusivity. Once, as a student, he lived in the same room with a Russian from Baku. And I was greatly struck by his unhealthy "praise" of everything Azerbaijani with the capital Baku aplomb, which was in sharp contrast to the behavior of other natives of Azerbaijan, Armenians and Azerbaijanis themselves. It was back in Soviet times. An interesting paradox, the Baku Armenians were much more educated than their fellow tribesmen from Armenia.
In Kazakhstan, the trouble is in the form of preferences of the titular nation, which our autonomous republics also suffer from. It is this preference that indulges the myth of exclusivity. This was most strikingly manifested in Ukraine and partly in Belarus.

[Klingon]

Quote: nemez

Where there were more than half of the Russian population, they stayed. Now they also leave, for example Karaganda. What will these churks do with the empty cities?

They will start grazing camels again

[Klingon]

Ungrateful creatures, if it were not for the Russians, they would still have grazed the rams in the steppe, moreover, now the Chinese would have them in all the holes

[Leonid Gennadievich Lobanov]

Kazakhstan chooses "Latin" .. When the Lord decides to punish - deprives the mind. This is not a choice of "letters" - this is a civilizational, spiritual choice. Kazakhstan wants to be with Babylon / West / - with the world, and not with Spiritual Israel - Russia. They innocently believe that “strength and progress” is the West. Exclusively out of ignorance and spiritual blindness, “frozen” in the mentality of the 90s. And they make their choice at the most “successful” moment, when the West begins to inevitably plunge into fire. But Scripture warns that prosperity and prosperity in recent times (and only material determines their choice) were bestowed only on “Ephraim / Russia / and the allied tribes.” All Russian-speaking states that spun off from Russia (did not have their own statehood) inherited its set of genes and are doomed to get sick her childhood illnesses: war, revolution, civil war, counterrevolution. But already independently. The prophet Isaiah speaks about the collapse of the USSR / OT ch. 18 - chapter on Russia /. “For before picking the grapes, when it fades, and the bunch begins to ripen, He will cut off the branches with a knife and take away and chop off the branches. ”“ Branches ”- in the coordinates of meanings - are thrown into the fire. Who will follow Georgia and Ukraine? Which country will burn down like Ukraine is burning down now, or will it burn like Georgia? In what order? But all this will happen and will happen on the counter streams of history: the rapid degradation and disintegration of Europe / after the Kiev earthquake /, and the loss of any influence of the United States, engaged in extinguishing internal “fires”. So, the "reformers" will have to rely solely on rabid nationalism within the countries - the aspirants to "independence" - in the absence of monetary support from the "elites" by the West, which will also appropriate the money they stole /. It was a good republic - Kazakhstan - while Germans, Russians and Koreans felt themselves there as well ... Well, for this there is already one country / for the whole world / - Russia. (I have two evidences that NATO planes will take off from the territory of Kazakhstan and bomb the neighboring regions of Russia. Now this is impossible to imagine ..)

[Sergey Gusak]

That again Russian people are offended?

[APASUS]

They practically copy Ukraine. After all, it was after the abolition of the language law that unrest began in the east of the country.
Well done Americans - they don't eat bread in vain. Look at the steps of Ukraine in this area. You don't even need to guess what will happen next.

[asasin Asasievch]

Distribute to all Russians (by mat) Russian passports. And that's all.

[tech3030]

As China begins to bend the Kazakhs, they will remember about Russia, only this cannot be forgiven to anyone, neither the Kazakhs nor anyone else!

[Petrik66]

the data that are cited is incorrect, since we are not talking about Russians and not about Russians. Many leave the territory of the Russian Federation in transit. About 76 thousand left for the EU per year (2019). Let them go. And those who are ready to sit on the priest evenly and endure all sorts of smaller brothers, well, that means they have such a fate. Those who wanted to, who felt the strength to start all over again, moved to their homeland long ago. If the Soviets want to be smacked by the local Papuans, then let them endure. And so, all my life I have lived somewhere in the CIS, and then I came and demand a Russian pension, social programs, etc. Before you had to think.

[SKIF555]

And who is this in the OSSB (KazBat) - like a marshal? Dzhigit (in a green beret) - Who are you? Are the rewards overweight? Who was the battalion commander ??? Time and place ............ There are no border guards, Starshak - no, Exits - no - what kind of someone is that? - Not everyone was handed - Marshal - CLOWN.

[Ulrich]

Oh, this "cave nationalism" .... Well, how can you not be outraged by the fact that in another country, in the service svere they require knowledge of the language? It’s just to forbid workers to talk to each other in their own way at work — that’s right, there’s no nationalism, and so on.
https://twitter.com/A_Vit_/status/1427186524794363905

By the way, at the University, the teacher at the very first lesson of the French language for everyone began to teach only in French (more than half of the group did not understand anything at all in French). At first, everyone was shocked, at 3-4 lessons they already began to instinctively understand what they were talking about, in lesson 5-7 they already began to answer something, and by the end of the year almost the whole group was already fluently speaking at a basic level. And here more than 30 years have passed and still nothing, even though it is Kazakhstan, even the Baltic countries or somewhere else. The phrase of Zadorny suggests itself: "Well, stupid!"

[1536]

India, for example, was able to become one of the advanced countries in Asia thanks to the preservation of English as the state language and the language of interethnic communication, along with Hindi. And this is despite the fact that 447 (!) Different languages ​​are spoken on the territory of India. Canada also has 2 official languages ​​- English and French, which does not prevent the population of Canada from living in peace and not throwing tomahawks at each other. And this is despite the fact that Canada is essentially an English dominion, which, it would seem, should have left an imprint on language policy, knowing the attitude of the British to everything that is not British. In Finland, although Finnish is the official language, no one forbids speaking Swedish and Russian. And people also understand each other very well. The listed countries are the advanced states of Asia, Europe, America.
One gets the impression that many territories of the post-Soviet space are deliberately dragged into the Middle Ages, with its feudal fragmentation and disunity of peoples, in order to protect themselves in this way from competitors in the future, and then they are led to it.

[Vadim Kraft]

Well, now, with the Taliban coming to power in Afghanistan, these WIPES will have a great opportunity to show their "patriotism" on the Kazakh-Afghan border, when the Afghan border approaches the Kazakh one. Then we will see how these WIPED men will demand that the Taliban speak Kazakh ... although I think we will not see this, this is not to intimidate women.

[Serg serg]

They wiped their ass before the arrival of the Russians)))

[Victorio]

One of the shopkeepers in Aktau resists: “You don't like Russians, but what have we done to you? We've built a city for you! If it weren't for us, you wouldn't be here. "
===
as an ex-resident of the city of Shevchenko (now Aktau) - this is true

[Alexander Koshkin]

Is it worth defending the borders of states professing Russophobia?

[Bulair]

I have only one question: How many schools in Russia where instruction is in the Kazakh language?

[Serg serg]

Is Kazakh recognized as an official language in Russia?

[Vadim Kraft]

How much is in Afghan? :) Soon we will see what kind of patriots you are in Kazakhstan, but if it turns out that you are not patriots, then there will be no Kazakhstan. Just do not then howl "Save Russia" - the guys themselves.

[Serg serg]

The Russians will leave and everything will rise. An old joke says: a Kazakh needs to be given a briefcase and a hat and appointed a boss. They are not capable of more. An example already exists in the republics of Central Asia. Did you want independence? Got. Most of the Russians have left. Now all these proud descendants of the Basmachi hang out in Russia at construction sites and as taxi drivers. They are not even able to defend their country from the Taliban. Already howling "save the Russians." A familiar song and the harsh truth of being.

[AC130 Gunship]

There is a different situation than Uzbekistan or Tajikistan. The Kazakhs have oil. They will definitely not go to Moscow to taxi with a bare ass.

[Serg serg]

The presence of oil does not add to the brain. Arabs also live off oil. But mostly white people work there as managers and engineers. The kirdyk will also leave their oil wealth. The towers will be overgrown with saxaul.

[evgen1221]

But so that the Saudis do not leave, for example, there are no taxes on doing business with them by foreigners, plus they pay inappropriately and create conditions.

[mediumpro]

Pts. it is a pity that the Russians cannot offer organized resistance to everyone who does not respect the Russian language. Moreover, all kinds of tribes from the south never knew what statehood was. Pts. waiting for this hour.

[Vadim Kraft]

Quote: Alexander Koshkin

Is it worth defending the borders of states professing Russophobia?

I think we in Russia should see how they will defend their freedom and independence, but if they climb up to us, we will recapture Fort Verny, the truth is that we liberate from the Taliban, our land will already be, and not Kazakh, and this will be fair if they will not be able to defend their homeland, why do they need a country.

[Azis]

Knew Shevchenko (Novoaleksandrovsky, Novo-Petrovsky). Thanks for Fort Verny!

[AC130 Gunship]

Russians have been fleeing Kazakhstan for over 20 years. Everyone with a head on their shoulders will soon leave. Why live with savage neighbors? The Kazakhs have oil, the Ukrainian scenario with the price of hydrocarbons does not threaten them. Let them go to themselves in peace ... You will not be lovely

[sagitovich]

I believe that language determines consciousness. I am a Bashkir, my friends are Russians, Ukrainians, Tatars, Germans, Komi. We all perfectly understand each other in actions, thoughts, intentions. We are united by our native Russian language.

[Ela myaushkina]

Это называется национализация, свойственная для постсоветских стран. И разумеется они хотят, чтобы все кто живет на территории оного государства, знали бы национальный государственный язык. И в этом нет ничего плохого. Просто как еще на это посмотреть, с какого угла и точки зрения. В той же России много национальностей живет, да никто не запрещает им говорить на своем родном языке, но русский язык надо знать всем, как государственный. Как и в Казахстане казахский. И политики использования сразу нескольких государственных языков нет и не будет. России это не нужно, как нынче и Казахстану. Это не некоторые страны ЕС, где используются аж несколько государственных языков. Не помню в какой стране ЕС это так.

От чего напрашивается вопрос, почему тогда в России для другой национальности учить русский, это хорошо. А тому же русскому например, учить казахский в Казахстане, это плохо? Двойкен стандартен?

Поэтому если где-то еще знают русский язык и разговаривают на нем, из ряда бывших постсоветских стран, это остаточное явление от СССР. Со сменой поколения, окончательно уйдет. Поэтому не стоит возмущаться когда русского заставляют учить национальный язык страны где он живет вне России, к примеру пусть тот же казахский в Казахстане. Он обязан его знать. Ибо не в России живет. А в Казахстане, где нынче национальный и государственный казахский. И никто не обязан и не должен с ним говорить на русском языке. Ибо это не Россия.

Хотя русскоговорящему или русскому человеку проживающему вне России, так же родившемуся там и имеющего гражданство другой страны, например тот же Казахстан, и национальный и государственный язык этой страны где он живет, иностранным не должен считаться. Но если он его не может учить или не хочет, и его это возмущает, у него есть один путь - отправиться в Россию. Другого пути у него нет.

[Konnick]

От чего напрашивается вопрос, почему тогда в России для другой национальности учить русский, это хорошо. А тому же русскому например, учить казахский в Казахстане, это плохо? Двойкен стандартен

А смысл в этом есть? Смысл забыть русский?
Возьмите например Индию. Они сохранили язык колонизаторов. Они поняли что английский язык это язык техники, науки, медицины и мировой литературы наконец. Придумывать новые слова по примеру страны недостатка кружевных трусиков? Это там додумались переводить техдокументацию на мову. Ко мне приезжали в командировку инженеры с Дарницкого вагоноремонтного завода, в уже далекие "святые" 90-е, жаловались что их заставляют переводить технические термины на украинский, я ради смеха спросил как будет называться вагонная тележка , они сказали "ВОЗОК" и сами рассмеялись. Представляю что у них может творится с медициной. Украинский язык использовался только в быту, как и казахский. Стандартен? Ради чего? Ради того чтобы как-то самоутвердиться?
Ну и расскажу еще случай. Работала у меня в то время мордовка, я ее на впечатлении от "заморских" гостей спросил как по мордовски желудок, печень и прочие элементы человека, она говорила одно и тоже слово, не помню уже, я догадался и сказал это слово "ливер" что-ли? Она сказала да.
И смысл здравый в развитии казахского языка среди русскоязычного населения отсутствует., как и в запрете на уровне государственного русского. Украинцы уже отказались от Гагарина, Чехова, Менделеева, даже Гоголя причислили к иностранным русским писателям.
Добавлю, неужели казахи хотят забыть русскую культуру, того же Пушкина, на досуге посмотрите видео про американца, ставшего моим дальним родственником
https://youtu.be/FUzEuCirekA
Как он относится к русскому языку из-за Пушкина даже обратился в православную веру.

[Ela myaushkina]

Казахстан, это не Россия. У него как бы своя история и культура, свой язык и так далее. Разве нет? Сотвественно и казахский язык должен быть государственными национальным языком. Остальные все иностранными. И любой гражданин живущий нынче в Казахстане, должен знать именно Казахский как государство образующий. Разве нет? Причем тут русский язык, русская культура и история и все такое?

Почему в том же Казахстане присуствовал русский язык как его и знали... тому есть простое объяснение. Все бывшие постсоветские страны раньше входили в СССР, где помимо национального вторым языком был русский. В той же Грузии к примеру до развала СССР, вторым языком так же был русский. Теперь основной это Грузинский, а второй английский, но не обязателен для изучения. Что так же нынче и во всех постсоветских странах. И это нормально. Не будь СССР и не входи эти страны в СССР, все было бы иначе, и история так же пошла бы иначе, и никто никакого русского отродясь и не знал бы в тех бывших постсоветских странах. Логично? Логично.

[Konnick]

В той же Грузии к примеру до развала СССР, вторым языком так же был русский. Теперь основной это Грузинский, а второй английский

и что? Русский стали забывать, а английский не выучили. Русский язык это бореального времени язык, язык от которого произошли другие индоевропейские языки и это не пафосное мнение. Тот же санскрит, да у нас большинство рек переводится с санскрита лучше чем с современного русского. Хотя если вдуматься в гидронимы мы поймем названия. Я всегда привожу в пример псевдоним одной певицы, красивый псевдоним, по официальным источникам в переводе с саамского самка оленя, Ваенга - важенка, она взяла этот псевдоним как Ленин с реки Лены, а Елена с реки Ваенга. С места где она родилась. Но таких названий рек и озер европейской части России уйма, а в южной Европе южнославянские имена типа Воиньга, часто встречались раньше , какая самка оленя???

Voynga, Voihna, Voyka, War, Voynega, Voytech, Vojts, Vojciech, Vuytsa, Vujana, Vuya - militant. The name Voina is mentioned in 1174, 1234 and 1402 among the southern Slavs. 1258 (Wojtech, Wojciech) at the Poles. 1457, 1592, 1606 (Voyka, War, Voihna, Voytsa, Vuytsa, Vuyana), Bulgarian.

Подробнее: http://kod-imeni.ru/slavyanskie_drevneslavyanskie_imena/vladislava.html

А если разобрать это слово на части и использовать санскрит, то Ваен это воин, война, а Га это дорога, гать. Дорога на войну. А есть у нас река с более правильным произношением , более древним Войнинга, дорога воинов, и течет эта река во Владимирской области и впадает в Оку. Более позднее произношение укорачивало слова до самого современного War (Во). И за что не учить русский? Я бы еще сказал почему Волга называется Волгой, очень просто, это Путь к свободе, на ВОЛю.

[Ela myaushkina]

Это все понятно и хорошо. Но зачем всему миру кроме России русский? Зачем его знать как и учить им? Тому разве есть какие либо причины и обоснования, поводы? Русский обычно ограничивается в рамках России и стран бывшего союза, а следом и носителями русского языка из постсоветского пространства и СНГ. Не более.

[Konnick]

Это все понятно и хорошо. Но зачем всему миру кроме России русский?

Я достаточно хорошо знаю английский, сын свободно говорит на английском и говорит что что-то объяснить по технике или науке нет проще языка чем английский, где на русском три предложения, на английском одно. Да потому что он один из самых молодых языков, усовершенствованный временем, англичане слишком занятой народ чтобы выдумывать сложный язык.. Но такого богатства слов и смысловых выражений нет ни в одном языке мира, только в руссском.

За темной прядью перелесиц,
В неколебимой синеве,
Ягненочек кудрявый — месяц
Гуляет в голубой траве

Переведите это на английский и все...никакого пения и визуального воображения.

Четыре черненьких чертенка чертили черными чернилами чертеж...

[Ela myaushkina]

Но вы не ответили на мой вопрос. Зачем всему миру кроме России русский? Он к ним исторически никак не относится и никакого отношения не имеет.

[ccsr]

Quote: Ela Myaushkina

Зачем всему миру кроме России русский?

Зачем вы занимаетесь передергиванием фактов, если никто из русских не поднимает вопрос о навязывании русского языка другим народам? Нас единственное волнует, чтобы русские люди в любой стране мира имели ПРАВО общаться на своем родном языке без ограничений, а в тех бывших республиках СССР, где проживает большое число носителей русского языка, он был бы на уровне второго государственного, как английский в Индии.

Quote: Ela Myaushkina

Он к ним исторически никак не относится и никакого отношения не имеет.

Как же не имеет - пастухи-казахи со своим языком не смогли построить Байконур, а вот разрушить Ленинск и всю остальную инфраструктуру у них легко получилось.
Так как вы не знаете даже европейских стран, где используют многоязычие, то обсуждать в с вами вопрос о государственных языках просто бессмысленно - вы девственно наивны в этом вопросе, и в канадском Квебеке вам быстро это объяснят, если там начнете спрашивать по английски.

[Ela myaushkina]

А теперь вопрос. А на каком основании в бывших советских республиках помимо национального и госудаство образующего языка как основного, должен быть вторым русским, да еще на уровне второго государственного. На каком основании? Почему? Потому что раньше эти республики были в составе СССР? Или есть какие либо другие причины и поводы?

Никто русским и русскоязычным не запрещает разговаривать на русском во всем мире. Пожалуйста общайтесь. И обычно это между собой происходит, между русскоговорящими. Но национальный и государствообразующий той страны, где находятся и живут русские и русскоязычные, они должны знать как и говорить на нем, если конечно не находятся там в качестве туристов временно.

[V means B]

А на каком основании мы тогда должны пускать их к себе на заработки, давать какие-то преференции в торговле и т.д. и т.п.? Если уж отсоединились и стали все из себя независимыми, и национально самосознаными, то и живите у себя стройте светлое будущее и всё такое. Учите английский, китайский и езжайте работать в страны, где эти языки используют. Не приезжайте в Россию, к угнетателям русским. Минус я вам поставил.

[Ela myaushkina]

Это явно националистичный троллинг обидка, не более того) Текст не по вопросу и не по существу, не связанный с моим вопросом выше, да и не вам адресованный. И вам минус)

[V means B]

Это экстраполяция, так что вполне имеет место связь с вашим вопросом. А если уж на то пошло то пусть официальные власти казахстана найдут в себе смелость заявить, что все должны в обязательном порядке знать казахский язык, а кто не хочет, не может, то пусть либо уезжают из страны, либо постоянно ходят с переводчиком иначе им будет очень тяжело жить в стране. Как например турки, которые открыто говорят, что у них в стране есть только турки и нет никаких курдов, а есть горные турки, или других.

[Konnick]

то все понятно и хорошо. Но зачем всему миру кроме России русский? Зачем его знать как и учить им?

https://youtu.be/FUzEuCirekA

[Konnick]

Продолжу, так как вспомнил. По последним археологическим данным самое древнее, древнее всяких шумерских, спицевое колесо нашли на Южном Урале. А древнее русское слово ТЕЛЕГА, можно перевести на современный русский как Дальняя Дорога. И Теле это не греческое слово, а русское, возможно телепаться это тоже из древности. Дальний путь.

[Konnick]

Шумбрат) Myaushkina, Маяшкина, это чисто мордовская фамилия, хотя есть и евреи с такой фамилией ну очень мало. Вы хотите чтобы русские в Мордовии учили эрзянский и мокшанский языки. Об этом надо было раньше думать и развивать свою культуру, науку и государственность аж с 10-го века. И это объективная действительность к сожалению, многие языки исчезли с своими народами, это история.

[Ela myaushkina]

Привет) Но я не имею никакого отношения к Мордовии)

Я скажу так. До конца этого столетия, исчезнут многие народы как их языки, либо трансформируются во что-то другое и иное, влившись куда-то. Это неизбежный процесс, как и нормальный. Не бывает ничего постоянного и неизменного. Все меняется, транформируется, эволюционирует, либо исчезает.

[Konnick]

Привет) Но я не имею никакого отношения к Мордовии)

зато Ваша фамилия имеет, хотя правильно ее писать как Маяскина, поинтересуйтесь своими корнями.

[Machnamh]

Quote: Ela Myaushkina

Я скажу так. До конца этого столетия, исчезнут многие народы как их языки, либо трансформируются во что-то другое и иное, влившись куда-то.

А вы знаете, что вербальное общение это крайне обеднённое общение? Им вообще разве можно выразить всю глубину мыслей и бытия вообще? Слушаем себя, собеседника не очень, понять услышанное как правило тоже не можем, ибо и не представляем и слушаем не внимательно... Мы можем чувствовать свою боль, но совершенно не можем чувствовать боли собеседника. Из-за этого и большинство бед. Это надо чувствовать хотя бы в своей какой-то виртуальной песочнице так сказать. Информация собеседника должна усваиваться сразу и в полном отображении. Таким я вижу настоящее общение будущего. Без никаких словесных языков в современном понимании... Так можно будет общаться не только с людьми, но и с животными --- объяснять, доказывать и опровергать их аргументы

[1961osa]

Кому там из русских нужен казахский язык? Это смешно.иностранный ,да ,но не казахский же,казахи северных областей свободно говорили на русском и казахский был для дома ,так он и должен был быть.Они разговаривали днем только на русском и были высокообразованными по сравнению с южными забитыми ,местными партийными баями ! России давно нужно принять закон который бы действовал "О переселение русских ,хоть от куда ,в Россию" Льготы, подъемные. жилье ,примерно как переселялись немцы из Казахстана в Германию.В бывших республиках остались русские, кому не куда ехать и нет денег на переезд и на жизнь хотя бы несколько месяцев.Ну и пенсионеры. Льготы при получении гражданства русским ,не только с Украины, а вообще ото всюду!

[Tank hard]

Цитата: 1961osa

Кому там из русских нужен казахский язык?

Послушайте, не будьте уже маленьким. Казахстан признан мировым сообществом как независимое государство и имеет право на свои дела. А вот почему русских ещё не репатриировали в Россию, или хотя бы не раздали им всем гражданство РФ, это уже дурно пахнущий вопрос.

[Turist1996]

Я вообще не понял: какого фига Петропавловск на Транссибе оказался в Казахстане?!
И Усть-Каменогорск с Риддером? И Семипалатинск.
Это все в Томской губернии было!

[Tank hard]

Quote: Turist1996

Я вообще не понял: какого фига Петропавловск на Транссибе оказался в Казахстане?!
И Усть-Каменогорск с Риддером? И Семипалатинск.
Это все в Томской губернии было!

Генеральные секретари компартии Советского Союза, раздавали земли бывшей Российской Империи как им хотелось. Теперь имеем то, что имеем....

[storm]

Китай активно занимает Среднюю Азию и в ближайшее лет 15 от "искуственного образования под брендом Казахстан" ничего не останется.
Пастухи станут служить "великому дракону"...
Северные Русские области опять отойдут к России, на том кровавый большевистский эксперимент по разрушению Великой России завершится.

[evgen1221]

Проблемма возвращения в рф еще и в том( помимо вышеперечисленного в комментах), еще и в создании положительного имиджа страны нашими властями и особенно деятелями культуры. Да это пропаганда, да тут она на благо и что же по факту. Неуклюжие потуги и засилие чернухи в фильмах. Ктонибудь в кинотеатрах по всей америке чтолибо похожее на зулейху,сволочей и иже с ними и с вывертами про ужасный нкведэ видел?точнее а пропустят ли в широкий прокат и какой рейтинг дадут?а на экпорт фильм пойдет? По этому у них одни супермены и лубок, но он черт возьми хорошо работает на создание образа страны возможностей и положительно сказывается на желании туда эмигрировать, плюс админмеры чиновников с самого верха(все в связке и на один план работают). Что у нас-чернуха,безнадега и кто в лес кто по дрова а кто мимо крокодил. А люди помимо инэта и по фильмам судят об стране( будучи зарубежом),и что они чаще видят-геморрой, бесперспективняк и чернуху. Тут и зимбабве выглядит привлекательнее.

[Vasilenko Vladimir]

все это началось не вчера, но по какой-то причине властям РФ было выгодно на это закрывать глаза
более того все это идет о высшего руководства РК

[Vadim Kraft]

Quote: Ela Myaushkina

Хотя русскоговорящему или русскому человеку проживающему вне России, так же родившемуся там и имеющего гражданство другой страны, например тот же Казахстан, и национальный и государственный язык этой страны где он живет, иностранным не должен считаться. Но если он его не может учить или не хочет, и его это возмущает, у него есть один путь - отправиться в Россию. Другого пути у него нет.

В принципе русские в Северном Казахстане, бывшей Южной Сибири не против отчалить в Россию вместе со своей землей. Если Казахи будут прямо сильно настаивать...

[seacap]

Самостийные 2.0. реакция, вернее паралич и полнейшая несостоятельность РФ 2.0 в способности контролировать и управлять, по сути, своими территориями. Полнейшее отсутствие воли и хоть какой-то вменяемой политики у одуревшей от бабла, вседозволенности и безнаказанности нашей знати, с чего-то вдруг решившие, что они элита, но до ануреза боящиеся принять хоть какое-то решение для защиты интересов РФ даже в целях самосохранения.
На всем постсоветском пространстве, при нормальной, адекватной, а главное национальной и компетентной власти РФ, все эти князьки, шахи и эмиры местного разлива, территорий РФ, по недоразумению и из-за предательства руководства СССР названных гособразованиями, должны у Кремля в туалет сходить спрашивать разрешения. А если это сборище "ньюбояр" где нет ни одного министра с образованием и опытом работы по профилю, а лишь "эффективные менеджеры",которые не в состоянии принять ни одного решения самостоятельно, вместо национального правительства своими действиями больше соответствуют колониальной администрации по обслуживанию интересов заокеанской метрополии, то и сложно ожидать что-то другое отличное от "Незалежной 2.0" со всеми вытекающими последствиями продолжающегося геноцида славян. Которым еще в 45-м необходимо было объявить и заставить весь мир, по примеру евреев, лелеять и почитать свою "Катастрофу", которая и на несколько порядков пострашнее была и продолжается в наше время, что самое страшное уже руками национальной знати и руководящего сословия, за наш же счет.

[saint06]

Обезьянки ещё и разговаривать умеют?

[Asiat-s]

Всё так предсказуемо и тривиально… Ничего нового всё это было во многих странах и у многих народов. Это как детская болезнь, которой любой молодой этнос должен переболеть. Сначала начинают с поиска своей идентичности, но, когда обнаруживается, что таковая из себя ничего особенного не представляет и вообще почти не просматривается на временной исторической линии, переходят к придумыванию и переписыванию этой истории. Параллельно начинаются движения в сторону насаждения своего "национального/этнического" языка, его видоизменения (изменения шрифта, алфавита).
В конечном итоге это приводит к махровому национализму и, как итог, – к краху, деградации и потере того, что имелось.
«Почему казахи стали переписывать историю»
https://wakeupnow.info/index.php/ru/chief-menu-history/1877-pochemu-kazakhi-stali-perepisyvat-istoriyu
«Как Чингисхан стал казахом»
https://video.wakesoft.info/v/28?channelName=GS
«Who are you Kazakh? Brother, friend or...»
https://wakeupnow.info/index.php/ru/one-menu-facts-opinion/2840-kto-ty-kazakh-brat-drug-ili
А ведь всего-то нужно – отбросить амбиции, эмоции и разумно, непредвзято посмотреть на историю своего этноса. Беспристрастно посмотреть на аналогичные факты у других, в том числе и в современной истории, и не наступать на «грабли», на которые уже кто-то наступил. Понятное дело, СВОИ ошибки (удар граблями по лбу) они более доходчивы, но стоит ли оно того? Иные «грабли» могут и совсем зашибить.

[Tank hard]

Почему до сих пор не принят закон о репатриации русских из стран ближнего зарубежья в Россию? Почему называют русскоязычные а не русские? Кого то стесняются, боятся обидеть? Почему в Абхазии получали паспорта и гражданство РФ, а русские из республик бывшего СССР этого лишены? Так много этих-"почему"... А может русские просто не нужны России?

[MBRSS]

Почему.....Почему....Почему Почему

потому что вы на выборы не ходите. А если и ходите, то голосуете за ЕР и Путина. Значит вас всё устраивает, зачем тогда вопросы )))

[Tank hard]

Quote: MBRBS

потому что вы на выборы не ходите. А если и ходите, то голосуете за ЕР и Путина. Значит вас всё устраивает, зачем тогда вопросы

Вот всегда меня веселили индивиды вроде Вас, они всегда и всё про меня знают. Как я живу, во что верю и за кого голосую.))

[Sebastian Aristarkhovich Pereira]

Большой Желтый Брат уже готовит для "Великих Казахов" цитатники Мао и планирует количество риса для их нормированного кормления.....так же ,как воспитывает и кормит сейчас уйгуров !

[boni592807]

О чем спор, коллеги?! Прошлое прошло, будущее зависит от настоящего.
Столыпин "о народе и навозе", то процесс успешно идет того, кого НЕТ НИГДЕ и своего ни ДОМА, угла даже диаспору НЕЗЯ в отличии от "шалунов" и "заселенцев по импорту" из бывшего СССР. .Что делать? Например:[/b] Как минимум "вспомнить" РИ, СССР и РФ. Пр. см. 1. Татьяна, Вчера, 15:36, НОВЫЙ - "...Развитие Советской России – носило двоякий – ПРОТИВОРЕЧИВЫЙ - характер. ....русский народ, поверивший в коммунист. идею большевиков..., и. являясь носителем ДЕРЖАВНОГО, ...национального менталитета, на всех фронтах обществен. строительства действительно созидал социализм в рамках всей страны ..своей многонац. Родины. In principle, he had nothing left to do. 2. Нарушался ..ПРИНЦИП /b] - в РИ, СССР -" ... от каждого по способности, каждому по труду"..СКОко в бюджет "братья" и кто, как ЖИЛ...
."БЛАГОДАРНОСТЬ" БЫЛА, ВОЗРОСТАЛА(как 80-90-е), терпимой - ПОКА им хватало..Напрашивается вывод( - пора забрать СВОИХ(коренных) и СВОЁ( слова ВВП). .ДА, Хороший амбарный замок на свою дверь(границы) . Прочистить ДОМ и за СВОЙ счет отправить ГОСТЕЙ по ИХ домам, что бы е устраивалИ своих межнац разборов, драк с понажевщиной и стрельбой, уголовно- террор-х "шалунишек" вроде банды ГТА(Моск обл), ячеек ИГИЛ и т.п., и вооруж-х "болкировок" ОВД МВД РФ с угрозами убийства сотруднику МВД РФ и его семье. Пусть эти "арийцы" и "собствееники" себе рассказывают о "своей" культуре( имеют право)ДОМА.....R.S.. Тут к нам РФ к ВВП, едет тётушка Меркель, с предложением "сложить усилия" Запада=сша(нагадили) и РФ(за них разгребать). Заняться проблемой Афганистана - помочь беженца(завести в РФ) .. "друг" Макрон,- борец против "агрессии России". - ДАВАЙ Russia "ВМЕСТЕ" решать Афганскую проблему Интересно, В РФ - опять "озадачатся" и подставят шею РФ, ради "слиться" единым порывом с "цивилизованным" Западом?! Разгребать их навоз. Никогда не думал, что буду хвалить партнеров - США. ВДУМАЙТЕСЬ, The New York Times (США): полная стенограмма выступления президента Байдена по Афганистану..17.08.2021. https://inosmi.ru/politic/20210817/250324152.html.......1. Мы отправились в Афганистан почти 20 лет назад с четкими целями: найти тех, кто...совершил теракты против нас, .... Мы это сделали. 2.Наша миссия в Афганистане ...не предполагала строительство государства. ...Нашим единственным жизненно важным национальным интересом....сегодня является ..предотвращение нападения террористов на нашу родину, Америку. 3. Мы разработали потенциал по борьбе с терроризмом, позволяющий обнаруживать загоризонтные цели, который позволит нам держать в поле зрения прямые угрозы Соединенным Штатам в регионе .. 4., мне по наследству досталась сделка, .президент Трамп заключил с «Талибаном»....американские войска должны были .. выведены из Афганистана к первому мая 2021 года, в....Сущ-ла ... суровая реальность — либо выполнение соглашения о выводе наших войск, либо эскалация конфликта и отправки еще тысяч американских военнослужащих обратно в бой в Афганистане, ... конфликт продлился бы на третье десятилетие...5.Так что же случилось? Политические лидеры Афганистана сдались и бежали из страны. Афганская армия потерпела крах, порой даже не пытаясь сражаться. Во всяком случае, события прошлой недели подтвердили, что прекращение военного участия США в Афганистане сейчас было правильным решением.... 6.Американские войска не могут и не должны участвовать в войне и погибать в войне, в которой афганские силы не желают сражаться сами за себя. Мы потратили более триллиона долларов. Мы обучили и обеспечили оружием и техникой афганские вооруженные силы численностью около 300 тысяч человек. Очень хорошо обеспечили. Вооруженные силы, превосходящие по численности вооруженные силы многих наших союзников по НАТО. Мы обеспечили их всеми средствами инструменты, которые им могли бы понадобиться. Мы платили им жалование, обеспечивали содержание их ВВС, которых нет у талибов. У талибов нет военно-воздушных сил. Мы обеспечивали им огневую поддержку с воздуха. Мы предоставили им все возможности самим определять свое будущее. Мы не могли им дать лишь воли к борьбе за это будущее. ..7.Я всем сердцем верю в следующее: неправильно приказывать американским войскам активизировать свои действия и идти в атаку, когда собственные вооруженные силы Афганистана этого делать не хотят.......Китай и Россия, больше всего хотят чтобы USA продолжали бесконечно направлять миллиарды долларов ресурсов и внимания на стабилизацию обстановки в Афганистане....8..Когда в июне я принимал в Белом доме президента Гани (Ghani) и председателя Абдуллу (Abdullah), ..у нас были очень откровенные беседы. Мы говорили о том, как Афганистан должен подготовиться к ведению своих гражданских войн после ухода американских военнослужащих. Чтобы искоренить коррупцию в правительстве, чтобы правительство могло функционировать в интересах афганского народа. ... Ничего из этого они не смогли сделать.
9. ИТОГ (ВДУМАЙТЕСЬ И СРАВНИТЕ С РФ) - ...Поэтому мне снова остается спросить тех, кто утверждает, что мы должны остаться: сколько еще поколений дочерей и сыновей Америки я должен по вашему желанию отправить сражаться в гражданской войне в Афганистане, когда афганские войска этого не делать не будут? Сколько еще жизней, жизней американцев, это стоит, сколько бесконечных рядов надгробий на Арлингтонском национальном кладбище? ..Я четко сформулировал свой ответ: я не повторю ошибок, которые мы совершили в прошлом... .....Я не могу и не буду приказывать нашим войскам бесконечно сражаться в гражданской войне в другой стране, принося жертвы, получая ранения, которые могут разрушить их жизнь, оставляя семьи, убитые горем и утратами. Это не в интересах нашей национальной безопасности. Это не то, чего хочет американский народ. Это не то, чего заслуживают наши военнослужащие, которые очень многим пожертвовали за последние два десятилетия.
С уважением к сказавшему ВЫШЕ, он понимает, что ЭТО ТРЕНД ему не простят, но выбрал ГЛАВНОЕ свою СТРАНУ...
..., сколько "влили" в бывших братьев по СССР - в их страны, сколько в их оборону, во сколько обходятся РФ(коренных россиянам) гости - от демпинга в получении работы, школы, д.сады, захват целых отраслей в хоз-ве РФ, пенсиии им и много другое... А "шалости" от Москвы до Якутии(см. сводки МВД и ФСБ РФ). А теперь СНОВА РФ хотят "подарить проблемы Афгана и Ср.Азии
...мнения специалистов по данному направлению ..."ОДКБ уже не нужна": , 4 октября 2020 г. 04:15 , https://cont.ws/@sam8807/1798511, призвал серьезно изменить политику России в бывшем СССР....Эксперт называет это результатом неэффективной внешней политики Москвы. Он обращает внимание, что Россия потратила на Украину более 100 млрд долларов за счет скидок на газ и прочих преференци й, тогда как США устроили Майдан за 5 млрд долларов "и печенье от Нуланд". "Что это за политика? Надо очень серьезно подумать, кто это продвигает, кто этим занимается. Нужно проанализировать ситуацию, нужны кадровые и другие изменения", - сказал Багдасаров...К примеру, такие структуры, как СНГ и ОДКБ, за последние годы проявили себя как крайне неэффективные и "виртуальные", ...Если...российское присутствие в Южном Кавказе и ряде стран Азии необходимо сохранить, сделать это можно, если конвертировать военное и специальное присутствие в политику и экономику. Если же этого не будет сделано, потребовать обратно потраченные на отдельные страны деньги и ресурсы. Good luck ...

[Pacquale Pestrini]

Можете меня заминусовать, но русский язык будет выживаться по всем окраинам Империй получившим независимость, прибалты начали первыми, украинцы счас делают то, что у нас делали лет 20 назад, Азия начнет делать то же что и небратья лет через 10. Я сам из Эстоний, и просто диву даюсь, как Украина все делает так же счас, как эстонцы 20-25 лет назад

[Alecsandr]

Тут и в России русский вытесняется естественным путём.Молодые певцы только элавью песни предпочитают.По-русски им петь не комильфо,понимаешь

[SB]

Там чясто толпами казахи бегают. То подратся хотят 15 на 1 а при получении предупредительного ножом наченают панику то что кроме кулока и числа не успели вооружится) весело в общем они борятся с русскими сами боятся а лезут)

[G.K]

Казахстан это государственное образование без истории существования.

[tank64rus]

Казахстан пошёл по пути Украины, что видно из всех гонений на русский язык. РФ, как и с Украиной скорее всего "озаботится" словами.

[l7yzo]

[quote=ccsr][quote=l7yzo]Аренда квартиры - 700-2000 тыс в месяц. [/quote]
In general, a normal apartment in a decent area of ​​the city cannot cost less than $ 2000 per month - this is usually the minimum rate.

Да ну вас, пугаете странными ценниками - 60-80 тыс рублей на Manhattane за номер/комнату с отдельной ванной или общей. И дальше пошло поехало, понакидали всякого в кучу. Медицина - ваще не убедили, устроиться на работу после 45 - офисникам - да , а если работать руками - ваше легко.

[victor_47]

Правильная национальная политика государства заключается в формировании единой нации: общего языка, общей культуры и общих национальных традиций. Всё это необходимо для максимально эффективного развития страны и прочности её устройства. Через такое формирования наций прошли и французы, и немцы, и итальянцы, и китайцы, да и другие нации, которые ныне считаются единым народом. Но вот бред мировой революции, потребовал от большевиков имитации союзных и национальных республик, дабы к ним могли присоединяться другие страны, после победы в них "социалистических революций". В розовых мечтах был "Всемирный Советский Союз". При этом даже единый русский народ был искусственно разделён на три республики. Плоды этой национальной политики способствовали разрушению СССР и пожинаются нами до сих пор.

[MBRSS]

Quote: Tatiana

Национальные проблемы в СССР не только были с самого начала Советской власти...

а до начала этой самой власти их не было? В Российской Империи?

[MBRSS]

Quote: ccsr

милости просим всех граждан свободно владеющими русским языком, и считающих себя по духу русскими, в Россию - здесь они будут жить в нормальной обстановке, имея перспективы на будущее.

только не вводите людей в заблуждение, давая такие гарантии от лица всех россиян. Как правило, переезд в рос. города оборачивается финансовыми потерями, т.к. жизнь в России дороже и жильё дороже. Хорошая работа тоже вовсе не гарантирована.

[tank64rus]

Вытеснят русский будут скоро учить пушту и дари,только там оценка будет другая. Восток дело тонкое :"Провинившийся язык отрубают вместе с головой." этого хотят так и будет, если Россия уйдёт.