Military Review

"Secrets of the F-35 are known": critics of the stealth fighter program advocate its cancellation

86

The Pentagon's recent decision to purchase a 4th generation fighter jet for the US Air Force, reducing further purchases of the F-35 stealth, has sparked a strong reaction. Not only the procurement program for the newest aircraft was under threat (it was planned to acquire 1 units), but also the implementation of the F-783 on the world market.


Manufacturer optimism


Manufacturer Lockheed Martin was quick to announce favorable demand for it. The F-35 is said to be the go-to choice for Canada, Switzerland and Finland, which have not yet decided on a new fighter model. Declares "great interest" from unnamed "other countries":

We do not see any decline in interest [...] The plane does its job and sells itself.

However, Lockheed Martin is showing a positive attitude amid the ongoing US campaign against the F-35. Moreover, even individual congressmen got involved in this campaign.

The LM's optimism stands in stark contrast to the rising tide of criticism over the F-35's price versus its capabilities. Although originally conceived as a low-cost fighter, the total cost of the F-35 program could be about $ 1,7 trillion, including all development, procurement and maintenance costs.

- noted in the American edition of Defense News.



F-35 cost


As indicated, it was possible to achieve only a reduction in unit costs for the F-35A model to below $ 80 million, which roughly corresponds to the cost of a 4th generation fighter.

However, the operation and maintenance of the jet remains costly: the cost of a flight hour is currently around $ 33 in 2012 dollars.

- explained in the publication.

Chairman of the House Armed Services Committee, Adam Smith, who in March called the F-35 program a "rat hole" (in Russian - a "black hole"), repeatedly expressed frustration at the costs, demanding the cancellation of the stealth fighter program:

Some people argue that people like me who are willing to criticize the F-35 simply do not know the secret capabilities of the program. How can this be publicly refuted? We cannot talk about these details because they are classified. But I know the details mentioned. I have received classified materials many times.

In the United States, a desperate struggle unfolded to preserve the F-35 procurement program. More than 130 congressional legislators are calling for more funding. They were actively supported by American trade unions, which protect the interests of over 250 thousand workers, directly or indirectly involved in the production of the F-35.

However, critics of the program repeat their own, demanding either to revise it, or to completely curtail it.

Author:
Photos used:
US Department of Defense website
86 comments
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  1. Cat Alexandrovich
    Cat Alexandrovich 16 June 2021 18: 50
    +2
    I completely agree with the opinion of the Americans!
    1. figwam
      figwam 16 June 2021 19: 04
      -2
      We promise 4 Su-57s this year.
      https://ria.ru/20210616/minoborony-1737217815.html
      1. bayard
        bayard 16 June 2021 23: 30
        -4
        Quote: figvam
        We promise 4 Su-57s this year.

        Already only two are promised.
        1. Osipov9391
          Osipov9391 17 June 2021 00: 10
          0
          In the whole of Russia, at best, there will be 300-350 combat-ready fighters. Only SM, SMT, BM and other new construction / modernized ones fly.
          The rest is practically nonexistent. It is listed only formally. This applies to the Su-27, MiG-29, MiG-31 ordinary without letters. And they won't fly anymore.
          1. Rushnairfors
            Rushnairfors 17 June 2021 07: 36
            +2
            So we have almost nothing left for su27, 29 and 31, and those garrisons where they exist within 2-3 years will be re-equipped for su30 or 35 (and somewhere for su57). I think it's unreasonable to just throw away the su27 that has been upgraded to the level of cm, the money has been spent, the planes are in service, they fly, they solve problems in peacetime, let them smoke the sky for a couple of years
            1. Osipov9391
              Osipov9391 17 June 2021 12: 47
              0
              And the Su-27SM, which underwent modernization before 2011, is in fact a new aircraft in an old glider? Did everything change almost at the plant during modernization?
          2. Captain45
            Captain45 17 June 2021 10: 47
            +1
            Quote: Osipov9391
            In the whole of Russia, at best, there will be 300-350 combat-ready fighters. Only SM, SMT, BM and other new construction / modernized ones fly.
            The rest is practically nonexistent. It is listed only formally. This applies to the Su-27, MiG-29, MiG-31 ordinary without letters. And they won't fly anymore.

            So what? Now wrap yourself in a sheet and crawl to the cemetery? Have you personally traveled through all parts of the Aerospace Forces and counted the planes and tested them in action?
      2. Sergey Averchenkov
        Sergey Averchenkov 17 June 2021 05: 19
        +1
        So ... What does the SU-57 have to do with it? Topic about the F-35. I don’t understand you, even kill you ... This manner of conversation resembles a squabble between two women in the bazaar:
        - Oh, Valka, do you know that yesterday Kolka and Vaska had a fight at the "oblique"?
        - Look at yourself, yours burst into your brows yesterday and fell asleep under the fence.
      3. Charik
        Charik 17 June 2021 23: 09
        -1
        While Putin is in power, we do not need weapons, the Rothschilds-Rockefellers decide everything, they bought the whole country for a penny, so we swear on the Internet, the war is not planned, you think they just met bankers in the country who helped the Nazis to kill the Russian people-to be continued
    2. Thrifty
      Thrifty 16 June 2021 19: 10
      +10
      Give 6000 F35 over the next five years just for the US Army! And 3000 more for sale worldwide within the next 5 years! lol 400 free f35 uk-roine promise tomorrow, the first to be handed over by the three thousandth year lol
      1. xorek
        xorek 16 June 2021 19: 49
        +5
        Quote: Thrifty
        Give 6000 F35 over the next five years just for the us army! And, 3000 more for sale worldwide in the next 5 years.

        It will be bully ..Israel must recapture its investments .. bully
        They invested seriously, but something went wrong .. wink
        PS Five pieces are enough for Israel for advertising and PR ..
        Whoever does not buy 100500 will regret it. wassat
        1. NIKN
          NIKN 16 June 2021 20: 42
          +5
          Canada, Switzerland and Finland are said to have the F-35
          Or Rafal can choose, which is a trend, however ...
          1. xorek
            xorek 16 June 2021 20: 47
            +4
            Quote: NIKNN
            Canada, Switzerland and Finland are said to have the F-35
            Or Rafal can choose, which is a trend, however ...

            Or they can choose the S-400, which is much cheaper and angry hehe
        2. bobba94
          bobba94 16 June 2021 21: 27
          +3
          Israel receives annually from the States $ 3 billion in gratuitous military aid. The only thing is that only American weapons should be purchased for this $ 3 billion .... nothing needs to be fought back, this is a freebie ...
      2. Charik
        Charik 17 June 2021 23: 11
        -1
        and in the Russian Federation the retirement age is up to 100 years old, then they will pull
    3. Gunther
      Gunther 17 June 2021 03: 17
      0
      good article.
      Quote: Manufacturer Lockheed Martin
      We do not see any decrease in interest [...] The plane is doing its job and sells himself.

      Well, yes, the Saudis and the Emirates are in no hurry to buy the F-35?
      do not want to be on friendly terms with Israel?
      then the 5th fleet of the us navy is in a hurry with uncle donald trump to visit you)))

      The fat cats of the Pentagon, with the support of the moles of the Deep State, are trying to silence congressmen with increased social significance and Grandfather Bidon:
      At the end of January, the United States suspended the sale of 50 Lockheed Martin f-35s and 18 Reaper combat drones to the Saudis and the Emirates.
  2. mole
    mole 16 June 2021 18: 54
    +5
    It's just "business". One is trying to sell to another. Many copies of the "wunderwafe" are broken. Especially on this resource. Those who were "fascinated" by this product have recently diminished their ardor, no longer drown. These nicknames are known. But out of habit they continue to drown.
    1. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 16 June 2021 21: 08
      +2

      The horse is working ... What else is needed? laughing
      1. mole
        mole 16 June 2021 21: 21
        +2
        Quote: voyaka uh

        The horse is working ... What else is needed? laughing

        From you?
        It'S Nothing!
      2. Prax1
        Prax1 16 June 2021 23: 02
        .
        The Russian Aerospace Forces would have more such birds!
        1. Charik
          Charik 17 June 2021 20: 18
          -1
          America will not sell, the scratched technology may be fraudulent or incomplete, maybe Anka was "not given" or was specially sent in the wrong way, conscience does not allow to conduct an investigation of Navalny vidos, otherwise the stolen can be taken away and this is enough for the development of what is required, and if they walk under one Vasya, what's the difference who has which toys
      3. Charik
        Charik 17 June 2021 00: 35
        +1
        with such a load, yes, but only in the neighboring garden, is it GBU31v1 (MK84-in feathers)?
  3. RealPilot
    RealPilot 16 June 2021 18: 57
    +3
    Should we be happy or worried?
    It would seem that the fewer 5th generation fighters in the US Air Force, the calmer, safer and more reliable we are ...
    On the other hand, spending a lot of money and getting rather weak machines, in turn, reduces the real capabilities of our "potential" enemy!
    1. OgnennyiKotik
      OgnennyiKotik 16 June 2021 19: 06
      -1
      Quote: RealPilot
      Should we be happy or worried?

      If lovers like a star or an aviation pro, then rejoice at the purchase of a pregnant penguin.
      If you read more sites like thedrive, then worry about the 655+ produced 5th generation multifunctional strike fighters.
      It all depends on your worldview.
      1. Prisoner
        Prisoner 16 June 2021 19: 47
        +1
        "However, critics of the program repeat theirs, demanding either to revise it, or to completely close it." (c) Do you think the Americans who criticize this apparatus are watching the Zvezda channel?
        1. Guardian of the walls
          Guardian of the walls 16 June 2021 20: 51
          -4
          You see, this is the case here. In a democracy, any major defense project has critics among lawmakers. This is unusual for you, because in the State Duma you will never hear a bad word about the Armata or the SU-57. As a result, freedom of criticism is beneficial to any project and allows you to bring it to perfection.
          1. Prisoner
            Prisoner 16 June 2021 21: 09
            +3
            winked There are critics, there are lobbyists (bought by the firm). By the way, although I'm not used to being a citizen of an "undemocratic" country, thank you, God, I understood one important thing - there are pompous turkeys in VO, and there are normal lads. laughing
          2. ultra
            ultra 16 June 2021 21: 15
            0
            Not critics, but lobbyists and democracy are not at all involved here.
          3. Winnie76
            Winnie76 17 June 2021 08: 17
            0
            Quote: Guardian of the Walls
            As a result, freedom of criticism is beneficial to any project and allows you to bring it to perfection.

            LCS, Zumwalt floating excellence. Patriot flying excellence. This is an offhand from outright failures.
      2. Intruder
        Intruder 16 June 2021 22: 36
        +1
        It all depends on your worldview
        and filling the stomach in the morning !? laughing good
    2. URAL72
      URAL72 16 June 2021 19: 06
      +4
      That's right, we have nothing to worry about. But the penguin must be fat! So it needs to be fed.
      1. 3danimal
        3danimal 18 June 2021 04: 22
        0
        Too maneuverable for a penguin.
  4. Prisoner
    Prisoner 16 June 2021 19: 02
    +1
    No, no, no, they are busy. Great machine. laughing Produce, comrades on natE sell and you will all be happy.
  5. apricot
    apricot 16 June 2021 19: 04
    +2
    This is all politics. The flywheel is running and it is unlikely that we are talking about folding, there is more likely something different. In any case, many countries (whether they want it or not) will buy it. The United States has a lot of pressure opportunities (as in the movie, the diamond hand "will not take turn off the gas) ...
    The question haunts: how are the Chinese with a clone of this miracle?
  6. Aaron Zawi
    Aaron Zawi 16 June 2021 19: 05
    -1
    Again about this. request
    1. Thrifty
      Thrifty 16 June 2021 19: 12
      +4
      Aron, you will definitely get your 1200 f35 laughing
      1. Aaron Zawi
        Aaron Zawi 16 June 2021 19: 41
        +1
        Quote: Thrifty
        Aron, you will definitely get your 1200 f35 laughing

        Hardly. laughing But by the end of the decade I hope that there will be 100 already.
        1. poquello
          poquello 16 June 2021 19: 49
          0
          Quote: Aron Zaavi
          by the end of the decade, I hope that there will be 100 already.

          how much will it fly?
          1. Aaron Zawi
            Aaron Zawi 16 June 2021 19: 53
            +2
            Quote: poquello
            Quote: Aron Zaavi
            by the end of the decade, I hope that there will be 100 already.

            how much will it fly?

            So far, everyone is flying with us.
            1. poquello
              poquello 16 June 2021 20: 46
              -1
              Quote: Aaron Zawi
              Quote: poquello
              Quote: Aron Zaavi
              by the end of the decade, I hope that there will be 100 already.

              how much will it fly?

              So far, everyone is flying with us.

              but why is it flying there, both in time and in quantity
            2. xorek
              xorek 16 June 2021 20: 52
              +1
              Quote: Aaron Zawi
              Quote: poquello
              Quote: Aron Zaavi
              by the end of the decade, I hope that there will be 100 already.

              how much will it fly?

              So far, everyone is flying with us.

              Takeoff and immediately landing Aaron ...? laughing wink With your territories, there are enough "maize", all the same, you are afraid to fly into someone else's territory .... And so they hung up their missiles on them, take off, climb shooting and immediately get shekels at the peak at the airfield ..))))
        2. xorek
          xorek 16 June 2021 20: 57
          +1
          Quote: Aaron Zawi
          Quote: Thrifty
          Aron, you will definitely get your 1200 f35 laughing

          Hardly. laughing But by the end of the decade I hope that there will be 100 already.

          Why do you need so many of them in your territory of a pin .. For single Arabs on jihad mobiles are chasing? Maybe it's easier to negotiate and cheaper?
          1. 3danimal
            3danimal 18 June 2021 04: 25
            +1
            How will they agree? Agree to die and free the territory?
            (Which the so-called Palestinians will soon turn into a backwater)
  7. Avior
    Avior 16 June 2021 19: 05
    -3
    ... the cost of the F-35 program could be about $ 1,7 trillion, taking into account all the costs of development, procurement and maintenance

    The last word in this quote radically changes its meaning, since no one gives information about the cost in this form, then it cannot be compared with anything - is it a lot or a little?
    Separately, the phrase "can make up" - can make up and made up - everyone understands that these are two big differences.
  8. rocket757
    rocket757 16 June 2021 19: 08
    -1
    However, critics of the program repeat their own, demanding either to revise it, or to completely curtail
    ... We were in a hurry, did not shmogla ...
  9. V1er
    V1er 16 June 2021 19: 53
    0
    The penguin is the penguin.
  10. Shahno
    Shahno 16 June 2021 19: 53
    -4
    Well, yes, the situation is somewhat exaggerated.
    Ps. Problems that have not been solved before? Maybe the path is wrong, maybe something else, but one thing is clear, in their right mind to blame it .. This is at least strange.
  11. Shahno
    Shahno 16 June 2021 20: 03
    -3
    Quote: V1er
    The penguin is the penguin.

    Yes, call it a swallow .. What, from this you will produce 400 cars?
    1. V1er
      V1er 17 June 2021 10: 42
      -1
      Yes, call it a swallow .. What, from this you will produce 400 cars?

      Why do we need 400 dysfunctional machines? I even doubt that the penguin is a 5th generation aircraft. Rather, cut the 5th generation.
      1. 3danimal
        3danimal 18 June 2021 04: 26
        0
        An unobtrusive aircraft, more maneuverable than the Su-27. Almost half the price of the F-22.
        What doesn't suit you? Appearance?
        1. V1er
          V1er 18 June 2021 07: 31
          0
          An unobtrusive aircraft, more maneuverable than the Su-27. Almost half the price of the F-22.
          What doesn't suit you? Appearance?

          The American F-35 fighter has almost 900 defects that undermine its combat readiness. Bloomberg reports this with reference to the Pentagon's testing department.
          The fighter now has 871 defects, just two less than last year. The article clarifies that the flaws are related to the software and hardware of the aircraft, ten of them are potentially serious problems of the first category: we are talking about critical defects that can jeopardize the safety of pilots and reduce the effectiveness of military operations.

          This data is also supported by the fact that the US Army stopped ordering the F-35 and began to build the F-15. Aircraft developed in 1972.
          1. 3danimal
            3danimal 18 June 2021 08: 01
            +1
            This data is also supported by the fact that the US Army stopped ordering the F-35 and began to build the F-15. Aircraft developed in 1972.

            Fact manipulation, search for more information.
            The F-35 can NOT and should NOT replace the F-15. And the F-22 produced too little (195 instead of 700+).
            Therefore, the temporary option is the F-15 EX, with new engines (one of the leaders in specific thrust), AFAR radar and a huge payload (up to 22 AIM-120Ds were announced).
            The F-35 continues to be built at the Stakhanov pace. The highest saturation (percentage of the plan) is in the KMP. Their version after Harrier is generally the ultimate dream ..
            The fighter now has 871 defects, just two less than last year.

            It is worth listening to the opinions of the pilots, they are very positive.
            In any case, all the shortcomings will be resolved.
        2. Lozovik
          Lozovik 27 June 2021 08: 18
          0
          Quote: 3danimal
          An unobtrusive aircraft, more maneuverable than the Su-27.

          It’s not funny for yourself?
          1. 3danimal
            3danimal 4 July 2021 19: 31
            0
            Absolutely not. There is a video of him doing a 135 'turn in 3 seconds.
            (45 'per second).
            Against 36 '/ sec for the Su-27 without OVT.

            1. Lozovik
              Lozovik 4 July 2021 19: 49
              0
              In the first video, the skew loop insertion simply increases the pitch angle. There is a normal video with a bend:

              1. 3danimal
                3danimal 6 July 2021 09: 48
                0
                The F-35 there, in fact, makes the "Cobra on its side", faster than the Su-27.
                On yours you can see the F-35 is also turning faster than the F-16.
                What does not fit with the myth: "The F-35 has the maneuverability of a transporter" smile
                1. Lozovik
                  Lozovik 7 July 2021 16: 28
                  0
                  Quote: 3danimal
                  The F-35 there, in fact, makes the "Cobra on its side", faster than the Su-27.

                  Cobra on your side? Apparently I overestimate your knowledge (or mental capabilities). Okay, the video is probably too complicated, let's limit ourselves to photography.


                  What do we see? The F-35 travels with a distinctly wide angle of attack at the same altitude and speed. This means that to create Y, which is necessary for rectilinear horizontal flight, he needs to increment Cy by increasing α. What does this mean? The lower load-bearing properties of the F-35 hull and, as a consequence, lower maneuverability.

                  Quote: 3danimal
                  On yours you can see the F-35 is also turning faster than the F-16.

                  What are you looking at? The F-16 finishes the bend and goes back on course faster.

                  Quote: 3danimal
                  What does not fit with the myth: "The F-35 has the maneuverability of a transporter"

                  Not a transport aircraft, but worse than modern fighters.
                  1. 3danimal
                    3danimal 15 July 2021 10: 20
                    -1
                    What does this mean? On the lower load-bearing properties of the F-35 hull and, as a consequence, on the lower maneuverability.

                    This does not mean anything.
                    See the angle and speed of the maneuvers performed and compare with the Su-27.
                    Cobra on your side?

                    I made a reservation about the convention of these words. Will a “sharp turn in the horizontal plane” with a loss of speed suit you? (In the video from F-16 they perform the so-called stable turn)
                    but worse than modern fighters

                    With OVT smile , and even then not much, at speeds up to 0,6M.
                    Find the visible where the F-16 is turning 45 'per second.
                    I found data on the Su-27 - 36 'per second.
                    1. Lozovik
                      Lozovik 17 July 2021 11: 03
                      0
                      Quote: 3danimal
                      This does not mean anything.
                      See the angle and speed of the maneuvers performed and compare with the Su-27.

                      How do I look at a corner without instruments?

                      Quote: 3danimal
                      I made a reservation about the convention of these words. Will a “sharp turn in the horizontal plane” with a loss of speed suit you? (In the video from F-16 they perform the so-called stable turn)

                      Of course it will not suit, it is either an oblique loop (although it is unlikely at such an input height), or a combat turn.

                      Quote: 3danimal
                      Find the visible where the F-16 is turning 45 'per second.

                      It's impossible. Will there be at least one truthful statement?

                      Quote: 3danimal
                      I found data on the Su-27 - 36 'per second.

                      In which document?
                      1. 3danimal
                        3danimal 17 July 2021 21: 11
                        -1
                        In which document?

                        It says 23 '
                        https://russianknights.ru/su-27/
                        This is impossible

                        Watch the video in my post above.
                        Think about it:
                        There is a 27-year difference between the Su-35 and F-30. The corresponding developments during this time were implemented in the latter.
                      2. Lozovik
                        Lozovik 18 July 2021 09: 56
                        0
                        Quote: 3danimal
                        It says 23 '
                        https://russianknights.ru/su-27/

                        Do you know how to use documents at all? Open practical aerodynamics, find the required nomogram for an airplane with missiles at H = 200 m.Total, the maximum cornering speed of a forced turn ω = 31 ° / s at Vpr = 600 km / h, limitation on the permissible angle of attack and normal overload; maximum angular speed of the steady bend ω = 21 ° / s at Vpr = 850 km / h, limitation on normal overload.

                        Quote: 3danimal
                        Watch the video in my post above.

                        Can you read nomograms? Write
                        Quote: 3danimal
                        Find the visible where the F-16 is turning 45 'per second.

                        , if the maximum (and then theoretical, since at sea level) angular velocity is 2 times less?

                        Quote: 3danimal
                        There is a 27-year difference between the Su-35 and F-30. The corresponding developments during this time were implemented in the latter.

                        It doesn't matter, in order to do 135 ° in 3 seconds, you either need to be able to create lift at angles of attack over 50 °, or have an allowable overload under 20. But where I really care about experts who can compare the maneuvering characteristics of aircraft by eye from YouTube videos. request
                      3. 3danimal
                        3danimal 18 July 2021 10: 48
                        -1
                        nomogram for an aircraft with rockets at H = 200 m.Total, the maximum angular speed of a forced turn ω = 31 ° / s at Vpr = 600 km / h

                        Why 200m?
                        Why missiles?
                        Placing missiles in internal compartments changes the restrictions on maneuver.
                        Remind me what happens if you exceed W? Is the value universal for any glider?
                        It doesn't matter, to do 135 ° in 3 seconds, you either need to be able to create lift at angles of attack for 50 °

                        So the F-35 can do it.
                        compare the maneuvering characteristics of aircraft by eye from YouTube videos

                        There is an excerpt from an interview where PILOT announces the numbers: 135 'in 3 seconds. And visually, you can only assess the likelihood of his being right. (Or say 60 'there? smile )
                        You shouldn't take stories about super-little maneuverability as a dogma.
                      4. Lozovik
                        Lozovik 18 July 2021 11: 40
                        0
                        Quote: 3danimal
                        Why 200m?

                        Okay, I'll do an educational program. Nomograms were drawn up for the main heights of air combat. 200 meters lower boundary.

                        Quote: 3danimal
                        Why missiles?

                        Estimated combat charge, R-27 and R-73 missiles.

                        Quote: 3danimal
                        Placing missiles in internal compartments changes the restrictions on maneuver.

                        Air-to-air missiles do not impose additional restrictions on the Su-27.

                        Quote: 3danimal
                        Remind me what happens if you exceed W? Is the value universal for any glider?

                        W is the wind direction vector. laughing

                        Quote: 3danimal
                        So the F-35 can do it.

                        Great, now draw the profile of such a wing and its polar.

                        Quote: 3danimal
                        There is an excerpt from an interview where PILOT announces the numbers: 135 'in 3 seconds. And visually you can only assess the likelihood of his being right.

                        So he is wrong. Or just like you do not know what a bend is.
                      5. 3danimal
                        3danimal 18 July 2021 15: 46
                        -1
                        Air-to-air missiles do not impose additional restrictions on the Su-27.

                        Here you should study the educational program fellow
                        Influence on aerodynamics, extra mass, no?
                        So he is wrong. Or just like you do not know what a bend is.

                        Perhaps he should have called / written to you to replenish his meager knowledge smile
                        200 meters lower border.

                        In the exercises, the lower limit is much higher, from 500-1000m.
                      6. Lozovik
                        Lozovik 18 July 2021 22: 36
                        0
                        Quote: 3danimal
                        Here you should study the educational program fellow
                        Influence on aerodynamics, extra mass, no?

                        Hmm, another bottom has been broken. wassat Weight does not affect aerodynamic performance.

                        Quote: 3danimal
                        Perhaps he should have called / written to you to replenish his meager knowledge smile

                        You can start by defining the superelevation.

                        Quote: 3danimal
                        In the exercises, the lower limit is much higher, from 500-1000m.

                        What teachings? Stop talking nonsense, open the KBP IA, study the content of at least one exercise.

                        As I understand it, there will be continuous demagoguery in the future? Shouldn't you wait for Polars?
                      7. 3danimal
                        3danimal 19 July 2021 04: 41
                        -1
                        Weight does not affect aerodynamic performance.

                        Suspension of missiles imposes restrictions on the maximum overload during a maneuver. Wouldn't you argue with that?
                        What teachings?

                        It's about training air battles at close range.

                        Watch from 8: 30.
                      8. Lozovik
                        Lozovik 20 July 2021 06: 58
                        0
                        Quote: 3danimal
                        Suspension of missiles imposes restrictions on the maximum overload during a maneuver. Wouldn't you argue with that?

                        How can you be wrong about literally everything? No, with guided missiles ny add = 9, the main thing is that the mass of the aircraft is less than or equal to the calculated one.

                        Quote: 3danimal
                        It's about training air battles at close range.

                        Watch from 8: 30.

                        Why do I need a video? Show the document.
                      9. 3danimal
                        3danimal 20 July 2021 12: 47
                        -1
                        How can you be wrong about literally everything?

                        A counter question: how to draw categorical conclusions about its maneuverability from one photograph of a flying aircraft, while having a record of a very energetic turn over 90 ', declare its impossibility (after all, the aircraft is not maneuverable) smile
                        No, with guided missiles ny add. = 9,

                        Missiles affect aerodynamics (unless they are in internal compartments).
                      10. Lozovik
                        Lozovik 20 July 2021 18: 08
                        0
                        Quote: 3danimal
                        A counter question: how to draw categorical conclusions about its maneuverability from one photograph of a flying aircraft, while having a record of a very energetic turn over 90 ', declare its impossibility (after all, the aircraft is not maneuverable)

                        Read above. I will not repeat it again.

                        Quote: 3danimal
                        Missiles affect aerodynamics (unless they are in internal compartments).

                        Where did it come from? From the third?
                      11. 3danimal
                        3danimal 20 July 2021 21: 57
                        -1
                        From the third?

                        What? I spoke about this right away: a fighter with internal compartments has an advantage in this regard.
                        Read above.

                        What you write is akin to believing in religious dogma request
                        F-22 with OVT reached 70 'per second, would you say fantastic too?
  • 3danimal
    3danimal 18 July 2021 10: 53
    -1
    What do we see? The F-35 travels with a distinctly wide angle of attack at the same altitude and speed.

    Following this logic, the A-10 is a dogfight champion, a thunderstorm for both fighters. smile
    1. Lozovik
      Lozovik 18 July 2021 11: 42
      0
      Perhaps it is laughing

      1. 3danimal
        3danimal 18 July 2021 15: 51
        -1
        There are AIM-9M (possibly X on the latest versions), it is quite possible to shoot down a not the most sophisticated pilot.
        The pilot in the photo, judging by his trophies, is an ace.
  • Marachuh
    Marachuh 16 June 2021 20: 23
    +2
    Selling themselves? Seriously? And no sanctions for the purchase of equipment from Russia? Zvyzdaboly!
  • 123456789
    123456789 16 June 2021 20: 23
    -1
    Quote: RealPilot
    Should we be happy or worried?
    It would seem that the fewer 5th generation fighters in the US Air Force, the calmer, safer and more reliable we are ...
    On the other hand, spending a lot of money and getting rather weak machines, in turn, reduces the real capabilities of our "potential" enemy!

    Never put all your eggs in one basket. letters. Never put all yours laughing eggs in one basket.
  • 123456789
    123456789 16 June 2021 20: 53
    -1
    the cost of a flight hour is currently about $ 33 thousand in 2012 dollars

    in dollars of 1812 laughing
    1. 3danimal
      3danimal 6 July 2021 09: 52
      0
      The cost of a flight hour is less, from $ 18 to $ 23. (36,5 thousand $ - flight hour F-22)
      We look at the official report:

      https://comptroller.defense.gov/Portals/45/documents/rates/fy2019/2019_b_c.pdf
  • Shahno
    Shahno 16 June 2021 21: 00
    -4
    Quote: xorek
    Quote: Aaron Zawi
    Quote: Thrifty
    Aron, you will definitely get your 1200 f35 laughing

    Hardly. laughing But by the end of the decade I hope that there will be 100 already.

    Why do you need so many of them in your territory of a pin .. For single Arabs on jihad mobiles are chasing? Maybe it's easier to negotiate and cheaper?

    How many were the Arabs? And what about the Muslims? And all are negotiable. They do not even accept the obvious, that most of the prophets and apostles are at least not Muslims. And Jerusalem was founded by Semitic tribes who did not know Muslims.
    1. Fanur Galiev
      Fanur Galiev 16 June 2021 21: 38
      +3
      Strange, but I thought that the Arabs are the same Semites ...
  • Shahno
    Shahno 16 June 2021 21: 42
    -3
    Quote: Fanur Galiev
    Strange, but I thought that the Arabs are the same Semites ...

    So yes, Semites, but for some reason they are very influenced by Muslim radical ideas. What actually causes all these problems with Jerusalem.
    1. lisiy prapor
      lisiy prapor 17 June 2021 06: 27
      0
      Quote: Shahno
      So yes, Semites, but for some reason they are very influenced by Muslim radical ideas. What actually causes all these problems with Jerusalem.

      Let it be known to you that Judaism, Christianity and Mohammedanism are the essence of Abrahamic religions with the same Sumerian roots. It's like Catholics, Orthodox and other Protestants with Mormons and Amish combined - all Christians. By the way, no one has destroyed so much of the historical and cultural heritage of mankind, as all these scraps of Judaism.
  • Maks1995
    Maks1995 16 June 2021 22: 03
    -2
    That is all nonsense.
    Ato F35-mania has been going on in our media for 5 years already, and there is zero sense of convictions.
    Have done a lot, flies fine. In fact, the only real complaint is the expensive flight hour.
    So the F22 is even more expensive. Everything is classified here, you cannot compare, among the Europeans - they also wrote not weakly.
    The older the plane, the cheaper the flight comes out.
  • amr
    amr 17 June 2021 12: 42
    0
    Quote: voyaka uh

    The horse is working ... What else is needed? laughing

    Well, they envy! what can you do, we all envy ..
  • Antokha
    Antokha 17 June 2021 15: 03
    0
    Some people argue that people like me who are willing to criticize the F-35 simply do not know the secret capabilities of the program. How can this be publicly refuted? We cannot talk about these details because they are classified. But I know the details mentioned. I have received classified materials many times.

    I absolutely do not see how the words follow from the above quote
    "The secrets of the F-35 are known"

    The title of the note refers to the fact that, since the secrets of the aircraft are known, its advantage is lost, and the program can be minimized. Secrets here must be understood as technical. The content of the note is not at all about this, the secrets, if any, are not lost. Note minus for a false message.
  • Vladislav_2
    Vladislav_2 17 June 2021 18: 48
    0
    fu-35 "F35 is a complete copy of the Russian plane, but for $ 1,5 trillion!" .... THIS IS YAK-141 laughing which made its first flight in 1987. and in 91 he made the first landing on an aircraft carrier .... the mattresses stupidly "licked off the performance characteristics and built fu22 laughing... but HE did not "get along" with us ... that's what the MILITARY experts decided. why ... x / s request ... I heard that they want to return him again .... time will tell. All goodness and peaceful sky ...
    1. 3danimal
      3danimal 18 July 2021 16: 33
      -1
      a complete copy of the Russian plane, but for $ 1,5 trillion! ".... THIS IS YAK-141

      Study the topic better.
      So we can agree that all modern aircraft are copies of the Wright brothers' airplane.
      The only thing that the Yak-141 and F-35B have in common (only of this modification) is the rotary engine nozzle.
      Further - only differences.
      2 "hot" turbojet engines for the Yak, a "cold" lift fan (rotates through a clutch / gearbox from the main turbojet engine) for 35B, a completely different airframe, compartments for weapons and much more.