Russian Su-35 "flew": Indonesia chose French Rafale fighters

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Indonesia seems to have finally decided on the purchase of fighters and it will not be Russian Su-35s, but French Rafale. According to French media reports, Paris and Jakarta signed an agreement of intent, which negotiates the purchase of French fighters.

According to available information from open sources, Indonesia has signed a preliminary agreement for the acquisition of 36 new French Dassault Rafale fighters. The signing took place in early June in secrecy during a visit to Jakarta by French Defense Minister Florence Parly. The final conclusion of the contract is expected in 2022.



Thus, the statement of the Chief of Staff of the Indonesian Air Force, Marshal aviation Fajara Praseto about his intention to purchase French fighters, which he made back in February this year. Speaking at the annual meeting of the country's Air Force, Praseto said that 2021 French Rafale fighters and eight American F-2024EX will be purchased between 36 and 15.

It is already known about French fighters for Jakarta, it remains to hear about the signing of a contract for American fighters, since the marshal promised their arrival by 2022.

Thus, it can be stated that the Russian Su-35s are "flying through". The contract for 11 Russian fighters, signed on February 14, 2018, is "frozen", since Indonesia is apparently not going to finalize it. The threat of US sanctions has finally turned Jakarta towards Western producers.
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    1. +2
      16 June 2021 12: 49
      Russia ought to behave more aggressively and more aggressively in such matters.
      Our competitors do not shun the dirtiest tricks to push Russia out of the arms market ... it's time to wake up.
      1. +43
        16 June 2021 12: 53
        Yes, yes, we urgently need to return all the palm oil back and threaten never to buy it again! wassat
        1. +13
          16 June 2021 13: 28
          Throw this idea to Volodin and he will accuse you of contributing to the collapse of our dairy industry
          1. +3
            17 June 2021 08: 08
            Throw this idea to Volodin

            hmm ... that's how the FBK is done, you want to take their place. "Vlast" in Russia expressed itself to the wave unequivocally - "We can ... criticize ourselves, only we can"
            This is something of "anti-state activity" and terrorism.
      2. -27
        16 June 2021 12: 54
        Russia ought to behave more aggressively and more aggressively in such matters.

        What for ? ))))
        When China subjugates Indonesia, these Rafali are not a hindrance to him, they could tinker with Sushki, but Rafali is so-so))))
        1. +8
          16 June 2021 13: 15
          your logic is lame ...

          China has the Su-35 itself, and they have been making the entire line of Su-27 for a long time, that is, they know this aircraft up and down, all its strengths and weaknesses.
          But they don't have such information about Rafali ... and the Frenchman has a radar with AFAR and a more advanced BREO, as well as a more modern and diverse range of weapons. So you will have to tinker with Rafals, a more than a dangerous opponent.
          1. -23
            16 June 2021 13: 23
            your logic is lame ...

            This is lame for you)))
            The flare on the radar of an aircraft with AFAR is farther than that of an aircraft with PFAR.
            Roughly speaking, as soon as you turn on AFAR, everyone will immediately see you)))
            All stealth aircraft fly with the AFAR turned off, trying to get external target designation, because with the AFAR turned on, the F-22 / F-35 glow like Christmas trees on the radars. )))
            1. +14
              16 June 2021 13: 41
              oh how! I thought it would unmask ANY radar. and the difference is just in the design.
              1. -20
                16 June 2021 13: 50
                oh how! I thought it would unmask ANY radar. and the difference is just in the design.

                Radar operating in radiation mode - emits))))
                Radar operating in passive mode - only registers)))
                1. +9
                  16 June 2021 13: 55
                  I think you are wrong in principle. the radar is the emitter. at least pfar at least afar. do not confuse you with the signal receiver - something like a passive missile guidance head, which the target is illuminated by the fighter. Yes, experts will forgive me for bloopers - this is not my element.
                  1. +9
                    16 June 2021 14: 41
                    It seems to you right.
                    PFAR has no advantages over AFAR, except for the price and lower manufacturability. Both work for emission and reception, or only for reception, just PFAR has one emitter, AFAR has many.
                    Accordingly, the PFAR is forced to emit one more powerful signal, it is easier to find it, jam with interference, it is narrower, the resolution is lower, etc.
                    1. -5
                      16 June 2021 18: 39
                      Accordingly, the PFAR is forced to emit one more powerful signal, it is easier to find it, jam with interference, it is narrower, the resolution is lower, etc.

                      False, AFAR generates a signal of higher power than PFAR, hence it is easier to detect by radars.
                      The only advantage of AFAR over PFAR is in the detection range, due to the higher emitted power.
                      1. nks
                        +2
                        17 June 2021 16: 16
                        If you knew even a little about the radio model, you would not have written such nonsense. The radiation power (in general, in almost all radars it is regulated depending on the mode) is a characteristic that is not directly related to the type of antenna. By the way, the N035 Irbis PFAR is advertised as the most powerful fighter radar in the world.
                        https://web.archive.org/web/20160202065300/http://kret.com/product/10147/
                2. +7
                  16 June 2021 14: 41
                  Quote: lucul
                  Radar operating in radiation mode - emits))))
                  Radar operating in passive mode - only registers)))

                  Only this has nothing to do with AFAR or PFAR.
                  Aircraft with AFAR (European, American, Japanese, Indian, Chinese, and now Papuan) fly without turning on their radar because they are able to receive information from external sources.
                  , and these sources (AWACS aircraft) are available.
                  But the planes with PFAR (Russian) do not receive external information from where. Therefore, you have to turn on your radar and glow like a Christmas tree.
                  1. -10
                    16 June 2021 18: 40
                    Therefore, you have to turn on your radar and glow like a Christmas tree.

                    At AFAR, the radiation power is higher)))
            2. +2
              16 June 2021 13: 48
              Can't AFAR work in passive mode? wink
              But the cost of ammunition from the French will be higher, respectively, the amount of ammunition will be less.
              I will also happily forget about palm oil. Although...
              1. +4
                16 June 2021 14: 24
                The question about afar, paphar is not so critical. But here's a bunch
                36 French Rafale fighters and eight American F-15EX will be purchased.
                more optimal, because it uses the same NATO standards and weapons and data exchange systems
                1. +3
                  16 June 2021 16: 48
                  Sadly, for Indonesia, this is truly the optimal combination of supremacy fighters and fighter-bombers.
                  It is possible that they will also be given a loan for the purchase. If only they gave up Russian weapons.
                2. 0
                  16 June 2021 17: 39
                  If the Indonesians are very friendly with China, the characteristics of the Rafals will be very interesting to him.
                  And the characteristics of the F-15EX will be of interest to all of us. bully
              2. +1
                16 June 2021 17: 17
                I will also happily forget about palm oil. Although...

                Ohh, if only. Its in our products in bulk and without Indonesia.
                1. -2
                  16 June 2021 17: 34
                  This is true, but Indonesian had a large share.
            3. +2
              16 June 2021 22: 33
              Quote: lucul
              your logic is lame ...

              This is lame for you)))
              The flare on the radar of an aircraft with AFAR is farther than that of an aircraft with PFAR.
              Roughly speaking, as soon as you turn on AFAR, everyone will immediately see you)))
              All stealth aircraft fly with the AFAR turned off, trying to get external target designation, because with the AFAR turned on, the F-22 / F-35 glow like Christmas trees on the radars. )))

              Wow, there is still a person on the VO website who does not know about the LPI mode ...
              But he knows how to scream loudly ...
              1. -6
                17 June 2021 09: 59
                Wow, there is still a person on the VO website who does not know about the LPI mode ...
                But he knows how to scream loudly ...

                Aha-ahah woke up))))
                The AWACS aircraft has a detection range of 300 km, and it can issue target designation to an aircraft operating in LPI mode (passive mode).
                But the trouble is that the Russians have an S-400 with a missile range of 400 km, which means that the AWACS aircraft will not be able to approach the target closer than 400 km. That is, it cannot issue target designation to a 5th generation aircraft in stealth mode. In fact, the S-400 negates all the capabilities of the AWACS aircraft.
                Therefore, in any scenario, the aircraft will use AFAR.))))
                1. +5
                  17 June 2021 10: 53
                  Quote: lucul
                  radius range

                  Radius range is something! After that, what can you talk to about?
                  1. -6
                    17 June 2021 11: 22
                    Radius range is something! After that, what can you talk to about?

                    Aha-ahah))) On the merits of the question, have something to say? Aha-ahah)))
                2. +1
                  17 June 2021 11: 49
                  Quote: lucul
                  Wow, there is still a person on the VO website who does not know about the LPI mode ...
                  But he knows how to scream loudly ...

                  Aha-ahah woke up))))
                  The AWACS aircraft has a detection range of 300 km, and it can issue target designation to an aircraft operating in LPI mode (passive mode).
                  But the trouble is that the Russians have an S-400 with a missile range of 400 km, which means that the AWACS aircraft will not be able to approach the target closer than 400 km. That is, it cannot issue target designation to a 5th generation aircraft in stealth mode. In fact, the S-400 negates all the capabilities of the AWACS aircraft.
                  Therefore, in any scenario, the aircraft will use AFAR.))))


                  You don't understand what LPI is. And that an AWACS plane is not needed for its operation ...
        2. +1
          16 June 2021 14: 44
          Not. First, Indonesia and China are friends against Malaysia. Secondly, they now have another round of warm friendship, since China, unlike others, helps with the submarine, and practically free of charge, quickly.


          Well, the only enemy against which Indonesia is building an army and navy is the neighboring palm superpower Malaysia. And she has Shershni, Su-30MKM (from Irkut) and MiG-29. And they, too, are going to buy something interesting on a used one with modernization or new. Prioritize the Hornets that they like. But there is still no serious money. Russia and China (well, here it is clear, the enemy) Malaysia is not considering a future tender for the purchase.
      3. +1
        16 June 2021 12: 56
        It's not enough to wake up. You also need to have leverage and a good supply of money for ... How can I put it softer? To stimulate the correct decisions of local princelings. winked And we have neither one nor the other.
      4. +7
        16 June 2021 13: 02
        More palm oil?
        Can Indonesian Officials Freeze Accounts?
      5. -3
        16 June 2021 13: 09
        Sanctions. Well, or a new kind of competition. Impudence doesn't work here
      6. +1
        16 June 2021 14: 20
        Quote: Lech from Android.
        Our competitors do not shun the dirtiest tricks to push Russia out of the arms market ... it's time to wake up.
        We woke up, what shall we do? Apparently, only we and Erdogan, who have personal accounts for the coup, are not afraid of American sanctions.
      7. +5
        16 June 2021 14: 28
        Quote: Lech from Android.
        it's time to wake up.

        Can you offer anything specific, besides loud slogans?
      8. -4
        17 June 2021 06: 44
        So let Russia distribute dryers for free - and Rafali will be out of work
    2. +3
      16 June 2021 12: 49
      The threat of US sanctions has finally turned Jakarta towards Western producers.

      Here's fair competition and democratic values ​​in all their glory
      1. +3
        16 June 2021 14: 01
        Even our leaders don't bother about "fair competition" and "democratic values", but about palm oil, it's a very good idea
    3. +8
      16 June 2021 12: 56
      I suppose the French will not pay with palm oil and cocoa.
      1. +4
        16 June 2021 13: 04
        And, I suppose, those "candy wrappers" which, instead of palm oil, would also not hurt us ...
      2. 0
        16 June 2021 16: 08
        I am sure they will pay with palm oil, they have nothing more to pay. A rare case when I am glad that we did not enrich ourselves at the expense of a palm tree
      3. 0
        16 June 2021 22: 39
        in geyrope they eat more palm oil than ours. Because it is beneficial. Because it is very cheap compared to sunflower, rapeseed, etc., etc.
    4. +7
      16 June 2021 12: 59
      Eh, failed to change to palm oil.

      Interestingly, the French will also take palm oil, or is this just our option?
      1. +8
        16 June 2021 13: 08
        Quote: Revival
        Eh, failed to change to palm oil.
        Interestingly, the French will also take palm oil, or is this just our option?

        France continues to use palm oil in the food (40% of imports) and industrial (60%) industries. At the same time, according to statistics, in 2017 France doubled imports of palm oil to 629 (303) thousand tons, which amounted to 6% of the total imports of these products in the EU.
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. 0
          19 June 2021 10: 38
          What's wrong with palm oil? Margarine is made from it, which is used in many confectionery products.
    5. +3
      16 June 2021 13: 01
      Another fact of no foreign policy and +1 lost sales market! To compete in the modern market, it is not enough to have the best product, you still need your own payment system and your own strong, demanded currency in the world (Yesenin at one time in the USA and Europe easily paid in rubles)
      We cannot defend athletes at the Olympics, there will be more ...
      An urgent joke is needed / Putin's quote how we will defeat everyone, will soon be announced after meeting with Biden
    6. -3
      16 June 2021 13: 03
      Our troops will get more.
      1. +1
        16 June 2021 14: 51
        Quote: Trickster
        Our troops will get more.

        And by what means?
        More precisely, at whose expense?
        The fact that the sale has been canceled in our budget will not add money.
        But from the sale that took place, both the design bureau, and the manufacturing plants, and the country's budget would have been in profit. Accordingly, it would also be easier to find money for additional aircraft for our army.
        1. 0
          17 June 2021 04: 59
          Quote: Jacket in stock
          Quote: Trickster
          Our troops will get more.

          And by what means?
          More precisely, at whose expense?
          The fact that the sale has been canceled in our budget will not add money.
          But from the sale that took place, both the design bureau, and the manufacturing plants, and the country's budget would have been in profit. Accordingly, it would also be easier to find money for additional aircraft for our army.

          That is, to "olympiads", "mandials", other "forums", to "3 churches per day", to kickers of the ball, to the "keen fund" for all sorts of "Vikings", "indestructible" and other "tankers from the ruble" - money in the budget, the fifth point is chew, and for defense - "we are poor"?
          1. +2
            17 June 2021 05: 02
            You do not understand.
            This is different ...
            wink
    7. -3
      16 June 2021 13: 08
      And why is "French" better than "dry" ?! Except overpriced ...
      1. +10
        16 June 2021 13: 14
        Apparently better, both the AFAR and the digital board are better there, at least the Indian pilots who tested Rafal speak of it with greater sympathy in comparison with the Su-30 MKI.
        1. 0
          16 June 2021 13: 51
          The Su-35 is planned to be modernized, and it looks like very soon, since the Aerospace Forces is going to buy them in the presence of the Su-57 that has entered production. And there they seem to want to shove the Squirrel. So while Indonesia has only intentions, a new option needs to be proposed. prisoner contract, and I hope there are penalties. We need dumping, not at a loss, of course, but besides oil Indonesia has something to offer, at the same time we will bypass the lift system.
        2. -4
          16 June 2021 15: 02
          Quote: Sailor
          pilots who tested Rafal speak of it with greater sympathy in comparison with the Su-30 MKI.

          Well so.
          Drying is a thing of the past.
          Even our planes in the army are newer and more advanced. They had been planning to modernize it for a long time, but they still did not get together.
          And Rafale is almost the most modern, not counting stealth.
          1. 0
            16 June 2021 18: 53
            Quote: Jacket in stock
            And Rafale is almost the most modern, not counting stealth.

            you haven’t read Chinese advertising brochures yet ... this is where the most advanced aircraft are lol
        3. -3
          16 June 2021 18: 51
          Quote: Sailor
          Apparently better, both the AFAR and the digital board are better there, at least the Indian pilots who tested Rafal speak of it with greater sympathy in comparison with the Su-30 MKI.

          well, well, yes ... Indian pilots will sing and dance to something else laughing
      2. -11
        16 June 2021 13: 18
        And why is "French" better than "dry" ?! Except overpriced ...

        The funny thing is that Indonesia is long in size, and Rafal will need to reconnect on every large island with an airfield, well, or take 5 PTB aboard)))
        When Drying already flies from end to end of the country)))
        1. nks
          +3
          16 June 2021 14: 12
          Already with 2PTBx2000l Rafal has parity in range with the Su-35 with full fuel, and with 3 it surpasses it. 5ptb - this is for the configuration of a tanker with an ESD.
          1. +2
            16 June 2021 16: 11
            If I'm not mistaken, PTB reduces ammunition and maneuverability
            1. nks
              +1
              17 June 2021 16: 07
              All characteristics are interrelated. There is a maximum take-off weight, there is a maximum load on external harnesses, the number of suspension points, each of which has its own limitations on the weight of the load and limitations on overloads depending on the weight of the aircraft. Not spreading too much, I will just mention that the su-35 and su-30 have 12 suspension points, and the rafal has 14, the max external load for the su-3 is * 8 tons, and for the rafal it is 9,5, while the su-3 * 8 tons on an external sling can be taken only at ~ 50% of fuel, and at 100% filling ~ 5 tons - these are all official data of manufacturers. At the same time, at 100% refueling (those even without weapons) according to the airplane flight control of the su-3 * max, the overload is limited to 7g, although, of course, when reaching the line of attack, a significant part of the fuel will already be depleted. Rafal, on the other hand, has a more durable glider - this is the only MFI in the world that demonstrates aerobatics with overloads up to 11G, and its external load is not limited by the internal fuel supply.



              https://twitter.com/Amitraaz/status/1203283895321427974
      3. +4
        16 June 2021 14: 38
        Additional problems. The country depends on assets and supplies from abroad of machinery, materials, equipment. It is also a classic palm superpower. And if they stop buying palm oil, they will fail in the 90s.

        In general, the Su-35 is not worth such costs, according to Indonesia.
    8. +3
      16 June 2021 13: 08
      Quote: Runoway
      To compete in the modern market, it is not enough to have the best product, you still need your own payment system and your own strong, demanded currency in the world.

      Well, what did you want after the mediocre collapse of the USSR? The achievements of our ancestors quickly rolled over and ended up under the west. But it’s not easy and not fast to restore your former level.
      1. -1
        17 June 2021 05: 11
        Quote: IGOR GORDEEV
        But it’s not easy and not fast to restore your former level.

        Yes, in fact, no one needs it.
        1. 0
          17 June 2021 07: 07
          Quote: lisiy prapor
          Quote: IGOR GORDEEV
          But it’s not easy and not fast to restore your former level.

          Yes, in fact, no one needs it.

          In order not to look unfounded - give at least your arguments.
          1. 0
            17 June 2021 07: 44
            The arguments are as simple as mooing. In addition to resource flows to the "hated west", "3 churches a day", shit films from the "kin fund" in the Russian Federation, nothing is produced. Rosatom is building nuclear power plants at an accelerated pace ... all over the world, but not in Russia. The auto and aviation industry is completely screwdriver production, I generally keep quiet about electronics. Since 2020, medicine in the Russian Federation has not been doing anything except covid (all other diseases in the Russian Federation have disappeared). Do you need to say anything about education? Although you most likely did not live in the USSR, and I am just wasting my time, I am writing to pump it into the void.
            1. 0
              17 June 2021 10: 30
              Quote: lisiy prapor
              Do you need to say anything about education? Although you most likely did not live in the USSR, and I am just wasting my time, I am writing to pump it into the void.

              In my opinion, commentators like mine with a lot of experience on the site are quite mature people, most of whom were born in the USSR.
              I well remember the end of the 80s, the "legendary" 90s and their widespread devastation.
    9. -3
      16 June 2021 13: 14
      Yes please! Not only are Rafal and the American much more expensive, but then problems will also begin with the supply of spare parts, if Jakarta does not dance to their tune. The experience of others apparently teaches nothing. Nu, nu ... And we will somehow survive the loss in the purchase of 11 aircraft.
    10. +1
      16 June 2021 13: 19
      The threat of US sanctions has finally turned Jakarta towards Western producers.
      Also this ... everything is clear, predictable.
    11. +3
      16 June 2021 13: 19
      You just need to do better, and not stagnate. The Indians also chose the Frenchman despite the fact that he is more capricious in service, which means in their opinion he is better, so Indonesia decided to choose a plane for money, not palm oil, despite the costs. I think we should think about it.
      1. nks
        +4
        16 June 2021 14: 10
        Quote: Sailor
        The Indians also chose the Frenchman, despite the fact that he is more capricious in service.

        Quite the opposite - Rafale is perhaps the most problem-free in terms of servicing MFIs in the world (the super hornet can even more or less compete with it here). For example, it does not need a thorough overhaul during the entire warranty period of the airframe, like the SU-3 *, which must be capitalized every 1500 hours of flight. At the same time, the su-30 has a guarantee of 3000 hours, the su-35 has a guarantee of 6000 hours. Rafal had 7000 hours in the first series, and now it is already 9000 hours.
      2. +3
        16 June 2021 14: 36
        And Egypt bought another pack of Raphales, although it can compare. And on the Su-35 to Egypt everything died out. Either they want to surreptitiously, so that without sanctions, or they also climb ahead of the treaty, and the Egyptians change their minds.
      3. +2
        16 June 2021 14: 53
        Hindus simply hoped to gain access to French technology and overpaid. And somehow it didn't work out very well with access.
    12. -9
      16 June 2021 13: 39
      French fighter manufacturers just gave a thicker envelope than ours. And as a result, they received a contract from the Indonesian army ...
    13. +4
      16 June 2021 14: 04
      Recently, Rafalah has got some successful contracts! India, Egypt, Croatia, Switzerland, Greece, and Indonesia. And also a candidate for a tender for the Finnish Air Force! There is also talk about Ukraine, although it is unlikely there ... The Frenchman is clearly good, albeit expensive! Worthy of the heir to the Mirages!
      1. 0
        16 June 2021 14: 31
        Rafale and EF are the best multirole air superiority fighters. Cruising non-afterburner supersonic, high maneuverability, advanced avionics and weapons.
        Similar in class:
        The EF on weapons and electronics is lagging behind, and there are many participants in the project.
        Gripen is too light
        Not everyone is allowed to buy the F-35 and turn up until the end of the decade.

        Everything else is of a different class.
        1. +1
          16 June 2021 19: 08
          It is logical! hi Here's another I can not understand! I mentioned only indisputable facts! There are no subjective opinions there! With all that, there are strange people who are negative! Why do they disagree, what is their problem ?! request
    14. +1
      16 June 2021 14: 04
      Western sanctions only make us stronger, you tell the workers of KnAAZ. How many yards have you gone?
      1. -5
        16 June 2021 14: 52
        They already have enough downloads. They do not suffer from unemployment. The plans for the development of the domestic aircraft industry are enormous.
        1. +4
          16 June 2021 15: 00
          That is, a hundred other green million in the Russian economy is nothing? You understand that military products built on money from the budget are the withdrawal of money from the economy. So let other countries withdraw money from their economies into ours. Let another country pay for these development plans, and we will cut income.
          1. -3
            16 June 2021 15: 22
            Yes, this is nothing. Russia has a stable positive foreign trade balance. She doesn't need to think: "Where can I get some more currency?" Russia's tasks are much larger and are associated with the development of its own large infrastructure projects. For example, agriculture in the Russian Federation already brings in more money from exports than arms sales. And barter with Indonesia for palm oil, as the comrades rightly noted above, is from the evil one.
            1. +2
              16 June 2021 15: 35
              A food import partner can be replaced in a year, you bought and sold in your own country, you cannot just change your arms partner, you are attached to him and you won’t just jump off. The countries of the former Warsaw Pact NATO members still use Soviet weapons. And the palm tree is the same money, no one minds when the country buys dollars or euros. If India had not paid for the development at one time, we would not have had the T-90 tank. The kopeck protects the ruble, the old generations were also not fools.
              1. -1
                16 June 2021 15: 44
                The former OVD countries still use Soviet weapons, but for some reason they are not tied to Russia, but on the contrary, they actively supply these weapons to any ISIS or Ukraine, which for some reason are not tied to Russia either. That T-90 from the 90s and the current T-90M, created without any Indies, are completely different machines. Now it is not the 90s and foreign customers no longer decide the fate of promising developments. Moreover, the export of weapons is just a nice bonus to orders from our own Ministry of Defense, and rightly so.
                1. +3
                  16 June 2021 15: 59
                  It is necessary to sell wisely, without the sale of licenses, the prohibition of copying, spare parts only from the manufacturer, and the USSR did not do this because it did not expect that everything would be so sad. Apply for patents. A nice bonus is always a bonus when you hand over a product for a foreign buyer and it's really bad for you.
                2. +2
                  16 June 2021 16: 34
                  Quote: Roma-1977
                  That T-90 from the 90s and the current T-90M, created without any Indies, are completely different machines.

                  Very funny.
                  We still have our own tanks and fighters only because India provided us with the existence of design bureaus and factories.
                  And along with them, the existence of the production of related and related ammunition, electronics, chemistry, non-ferrous metals and so on, so on, so forth.
                  And ships, by the way, too.
            2. +1
              16 June 2021 15: 37
              Why then did we participate in the competition since we don’t really need it?
              1. +1
                16 June 2021 15: 40
                Reminds of a scene from the movie - Grenades on the wrong system.
              2. -1
                16 June 2021 15: 51
                Capitalism. There is never a lot of money. I mean that the current situation is far from the one when unique technologies went to people with honest eyes for food.
                1. +1
                  16 June 2021 16: 05
                  Do not say soon food will be more expensive than weapons or already more expensive once we earn more on food, as you say. And no one says that technology is being sold, only aircraft and spare parts. The French probably will not supply their technologies either.
            3. 0
              17 June 2021 07: 09
              With agriculture, almost according to Sholokhov: Give your wife to your uncle, and go to your aunt. Explain?
    15. +1
      16 June 2021 14: 11
      I’ll honestly say to this Russian failure I don’t even know how to react - on the one hand, it seems like we lost, on the other hand, to pay with palm oil for the fighters ... so-so profits
      1. +2
        16 June 2021 20: 59
        Well, now we will take this palm oil from them for money.
    16. 0
      16 June 2021 14: 41
      Quote: Yarik
      Throw this idea to Volodin and he will accuse you of contributing to the collapse of our dairy industry

      Do cows produce palm milk using Volodin's technology? Nifiga self technology wassat drinks
      Looks like I'm a veterinarian of the Soviet school behind the times wassat
    17. -5
      16 June 2021 14: 55
      Rafali is simply better, soon our aviation industry will resemble our Roscosmos with Rogozin and trampolines.
      1. 0
        19 June 2021 10: 32
        The French simply paid bribes to corrupt Indonesian officials - that's the whole success of the mediocre and expensive fighters.
    18. -1
      16 June 2021 15: 12
      One can only envy the French. They are actively pushing their technique, in contrast to our vymerymuschikh. But this is a business, nothing personal. Whoever is smarter and bolder is with broth, and sucker with palm oil ...
      1. 0
        16 June 2021 19: 14
        that is, you have identified the French as fuckers? laughing
        1. -2
          16 June 2021 19: 17
          The French will get money from the Indonesians, and the suckers run around with those who have no analogues. hi
          1. -1
            16 June 2021 19: 19
            well well ... wait and see lol And you keep licking the fifths of the Europeans laughing
            1. -1
              16 June 2021 19: 28
              You lick it, instead of soberly approaching the problems. It is not the first time that the Russian Federation with its products has been overturned in the international arms and military equipment markets. Because the Russian Federation does not know how and does not want to learn how to do business, as its "partners and friends" do. And having sold something, it cannot normally approach the MTO issue.
    19. The comment was deleted.
    20. 0
      17 June 2021 10: 00
      Did I understand correctly that we merged the planes, and now we are merging combat planes?
    21. 0
      17 June 2021 10: 32
      The French have been quite successful lately with Rafal. Even the United States is outperforming with its modern versions of F16 and F18 .....
    22. 0
      19 June 2021 10: 30
      The Indonesians decided to step on the same rake as the Indians - to buy expensive Rafali, and then pay an equally expensive service. it seems to me that it could not have done without kickbacks from the French, otherwise there is no way to explain such an obvious fact.

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