Descendants of Scythian, Sloven, Rus and Vandal

236

According to supporters of the Norman theory, the first Russian state - Russia arose due to the vocation of the Normans-Normans, a tribe of German-Scandinavian origin. The Tale of Bygone Years reports that representatives of the northern tribes-lands — Slovenes, Krivichi, Chud, all — appealed to the Varangians to come to reign and own them. The reason for the call is the lack of order and law. Three brothers of princely blood — Rurik, Sineus and Truvor — responded to this call. Rurik became the founder of the famous princely dynasty, which ruled Russia before 1598, before the death of Fyodor Ivanovich. It should be noted that Tsar Vasily Shuisky, who ruled from 1606 to 1610 years, was also of the Rurik dynasty.

The question arises: who rules in the Russian lands before the calling of the Vikings? According to the Russophobes of the dead and alive, before the mission of Western civilizers and the baptism of Russia, we had a “wildness”, people “prayed for stumps”, walked in animal skins, did not know any written language or law. Unfortunately, practically no written sources have come down to us that would tell us about dorurik Russia. However, there is evidence of archeology, anthropology, linguistics, mythology, and a number of other related history Sciences, which speak about the many thousands of years of continuity of the population of Russia with previous cultures. The spiritual and material culture of Russia since the time of the first princes of the Rurik family, has direct analogies with the culture of Sarmatia, Scythia, and the Scythian times.

Foreign and domestic professional linguists, historians, mythologists and other specialists have long reported on the oldest roots of the Russian language from the Paleolithic (for tens of thousands of years deep into the history of mankind). Among them are such famous people as philologist-folklorist V. Ya. Propp, archaeologist and historian B. A. Rybakov, philologist and cultural historian E. M. Meletinsky, archaeologist and ethnographer Yu. E. Berezkin. Their and other objective studies refute the unfair ideas about the Russian people that are dominant and supported by the relevant media. Russian-American academician G. V. Vernadsky, son of the more famous scientist V.I. Vernadsky, in 1943 - the most acute period of the struggle of the USSR against Nazi Germany - released the volume “Ancient Russia”, and there the historian rightly led the history of Russia from the Paleolithic.

In the world and national science, a steady myth has been created about the “savagery” of the Russian people and the priority of the “right peoples” - the British, Italians, Germans and Jews. An image has been created in the information field, where it is necessary for some nations to have, including in the form of myths, legends and tales, a millennial history. In this regard, even the archaic ethnic groups of Africa, Oceania, or America (including the dead) were lucky; their history and mythology are colorful, with thousands of editions, films are being shot, costly studies are being conducted. However, the Russian people are "wrong", so we can not have ancient history and mythology. The line is clearly delineated - 988 year, when the Russians received religion and writing, they were “instilled” in Western culture. After this, Russo-Russians can be considered the people of the “second row”. Moreover, attempts to trim Russian history continue. In 1920, the centuries of “accursed tsarism” were cut from the “history of the USSR”, after 1991, the period of “bloody Stalinism” was cut out, and “new chronologies” were created.

Among the “fairy tales”, “unworthy attention lies”, and the most interesting “Legend of Sloven and Ruse and the city of Slovensk”, which has analogies in Greek and Muslim sources (in particular, the connection with the biblical “Prince Ros”). According to the Ioakimovskaya chronicle, published in the 18 century by the Russian historian, geographer and statesman V.N. Tatishchev, “The Tale of the Sloven and Ruse”, according to archeology, a centralized state existed before Rurik in Russia. Its founders, according to the "Tale", were the sons of Prince Scythian - the brothers Sloven and Rus. According to the Legend of both Slovene and Ruse, in 3099 from the creation of the world (2409 BC) princes with their families and subjects began to leave in search of new lands from the Black Sea coast and 14 for years searched for land for settlement. Finally 2395 year BC. er the settlers went to the great lake, it was originally named Moisko, and then Ilmer - after the sister of the princes - Ilmer. The elder brother Sloven with his family and subjects settled by the river, which they called Mutnaya (Volkhov) and set the city of Slovensk (the future Novgorod the Great). From this point on, the Scythians, the Skoles, began to be called Slovenes. The river flowing into Ilmer (Ilmen) was named on behalf of Sloven's wife - Shelon. Prince Rus founded the city of Rus - Staraya Russa. On behalf of their princes, the people inhabiting these lands began to be called Slovenes and Rus. Sloven and Rus, and the princes inheriting them, ruled a vast territory that reached the Arctic Ocean in the north and the Ural of the Ob River in the east. Mention is made of the campaigns of the Rus to Egypt, Greece and other countries.

One of the descendants of Sloven was Prince Vandal. It was under Prince Vandal that the Russian state was actually created, which received Rurik in control. It included “Slovenian”, Russian tribes and Finno-Ugric nationalities (all, Merya, Chud, Murom, Mordovians). Vandal has gained significant space in the west. Vandal had three sons: Izbor, Vladimir and Stolposvyat, each had its own hail. The dynasty of the descendants of Slovene and Vandal ruled the North up to Rurik. The descendant of Vladimir the Ancient (son of Vandal) in the ninth generation of Burivoi was the father of Prince Gostomysl. Gostomasl was able to restore order in the North, defeated the Varangians and expelled them (his father was defeated on the banks of the Kumeni River and was forced to retreat to the town of Byarma, possibly Perm). The prince became famous, not only as a great commander and a brave warrior, but also a wise and fair ruler who enjoyed the love of the people. However, none of his three sons and grandson Izbor (the son of Sloven) lived to the end of Gostomysl’s rule in order to inherit his power. The period of the new Troubles was brewing. It was then that the wise Gostomysl told people about a dream where a huge tree grew from the belly of his daughter Umila (she was given for the encouraging prince Godlaw), under the branches of which a whole city could hide. The priests of the Magi unraveled the meaning of the dream: the son of the Princess will take power and create a great power. Rurik and his brothers were called to the throne of the northern power.

As a result, the continuity of power was maintained. The descendants of Scythian, Sloven and Rus ruled the Russian land for several thousand years.

Descendants of Scythian, Sloven, Rus and Vandal

Map diagram. The most likely Paths of Slovene and Rusa from the Black Sea in the proposed zones of distribution of Fatyanovo and related cultures.
a - cultures of spherical amphoras and corded ceramics; b - cultures of Baltic naval axes; в - unexplored area; D - Dvina-Ilmen group; d - medium-non-Dnieper culture; e - Moscow-Klyazma group; g - Upper Volga group; h - Oka-Desna group; and - Nizhneokskaya group; k - Vyatka-Vetluzhskaya group; L - Balanovskaya group (Middle Volga)

Application. The legend of Slovenia and Ruse and the city of Slovensk (from the 1679 Chronograph of the Year, published in the Complete Russian Chronicles Collection. T. 31. L., 1977).

In the summer from the creation of the world 2244, in the second summer after the flood, with the blessing of Noah the forefather divided the whole universe into three parts by his three sons, Shem, Ham, and Afuta. Cast down from the negligence of Ham from the blessing of his father Noah, drank in wine. And then Noah cut short from wine, and reason, just make him the youngest son Ham, and say: “Damn Ham, let the lad be, and let his brother be a servant.” And bless Noah two of his sons, Shem and Afet, ilk covered in the nakedness of his father, an opaque sightedly, nakedness without seeing him. And bless Seth, the son of Arphaxad, may he dwell in the utmost of Canaan. To Afuta, with the blessing of his father Noah, having poured out on the western and northern countries even up to midnight. By the same time, the great-grandchildren Afetov Skif and Zardan separated themselves from their brethren and from their kind from the western countries, and touched the midday countries, and settled in Eksinoponte, and lived there for many years, and from this breed their sons and debuts and multiplied green and gentlemen. by the name of his great-grandfather Skiff Scythia the Great. And there was strife between them and civil strife and sedition, many and narrow for the sake of space. The chiefs, then, are the parents of their prince of a single father, the sons of pyatichis krovnitsa, the same names: 1) Words, 2) Rus, 3) Bulgarians, 4) Koman, 5) Easter. From the same tribe at the time of the last and the kagan, the syroyader, fled, about which the Greek history would later explain. We will return to the presenting position, the Prince of Bob Scythian Sloven and Rus, the wisdom and courage of his kind in all the overcomers, and beginning to reflect with our neighbors on our wisdom, recommending the same thing: "Or just a little universe, now under us? of our Afet, are parts of the earth of good and pleasing to human beings? Hearing more from our ancestors, it was blessed by our forefather Noah our great-grandfather Afet with a portion of the earth of all western and northern and midnight winds, and now, brotherhood and friends, listen to our advice, leave far away from As this enmity and disagreement, nowadays, for the sake of narrowness, is created in us, and we will move to slaughter, and go from the land of sowing and from our kind, and go through the universe of light that exists in the lot of our great-grandfather, but the idea and happiness of our forefather blessed will lead us Aphethe will give us good earth to inhabit us and our generation. " And love is this speech of Slovenov and Rusov by all people, and wei like the mouths of the decision: "Good advice from our princes and good speech and pleasing wise holders."

And in the summer from the creation of the world of 3099, Slovenia and Rus from their birth separate from Eksinopont, and come from their generation and from their brethren, and travel around the countries of the universe, supposedly because of eagles through the desert of many, it is a good idea to go to places to place. And in many places it is pochivahu, dreaming, but nowhere else would you find an introduction to your heart. 14 years of deserting the country obzhodhodu, dondezh came to him some great great, Moix zovagogo, followed by the same from Sloven Ilmer named in the name of their sister Ilmer. And then the magic led them to be the inhabitant of the place thereof.

And the oldest, Sloven, with his kind and with all, his ilk under his hand, gray on the river, then Mutnaya call, then follow Volkhov in the name of the eldest son of Slovenov, Volkhov call. Beginning of Slovenian city, others follow Novgrad the Great. And put a hail, and his name is named after the prince of his Great Slovenian, now Novgrad, from the mouth of the great lake Ilmer down the river Velichov, named Volkhov, and a half of the race. And from that time, the newcomers of the Scythians began to nominate themselves Slavs, and a river that had flowed into Ilmer, nicknamed the Slovenian Sheloni in the name of his wife. In the name of the younger son of Sloven’s Volkhovts, the preymen’s werewolf duct, the IL flows from the great rivers of the Volkhov and the packs turn into it. The greater son of Prince Sloven, Magus, is a lawless person and magician and lyut in people then, and creating many devilish dreams with many devils, transforming himself into the image of a beast, korodil, and lay in that river Volkhov, the water way, and not worshiping him as he devoured the devouring devil. the new ones are ruining and drowning. But for the sake of the people, then nevlaglasi, by the existence of the god of the accursed one, and his Thunder, or Perun, rekosha, is called Russian by the language of thunder Perun. Put it, a cursed magician, night for the sake of dreams and gathering devilish hailstones small in place of a certain, calling Perynya, the idea and the idol of Perun standing. And the wise nevlagos fabulously speak of this, verbally, in the gods he sat in an accursed manner. Our Christian true word with unwieldy testing of many tests about this damned sorcerer and Volkhov, was broken and demolished from demons in the Volkhov river and dreamed of demons in the damned body to be worn upwards through the Volkhov river and exploded to the volgogun of the Volkhov. Now it is called Perynia. And with a lot of weeping here from the infidels, a cursed byst with a great three-sided pagan burial was buried, and the grave sprinkled over him velmi high, just as the custom is pagan. And on three days each day of the damned treasury, the land and fire of the vile body of korkodilovo sagged, and his grave woke with him in the bottom of the hellish, ilk, and to this day, they say, the sign of the toy's pit is not full. The other son of Slovens, the small Volkhovets, living with his father in his great city, the Slovenes. And give birth to Volkhov's son Zhilotug, and the duct is named for his Zhilotug, in her that utopian there is still a child.

The other brother of the Slovens, Rus, settled in on the place of a certain distance from Slovensk Velikago, like the 50 stages of a salty student, and created a hail between two rivers, and his name in his own name, Rus, which is still called the Old Rus. The river is the only one called in the name of the wife of its Porus, another river of a name is named in the name of its daughter Polista. And the lines of many gradations Sloven and Rus postavisha. And from that time, by the name of their princes and their cities, the people of these Slavs and Rus. From the creation of the world to the flood of years 2242, and from the flood to the division of the language 530 years, and from the separation of language to the beginning of the creation of Slovenian Velikago, now Veliky Novgrad, 327 years. And all the years from the creation of light to the beginning of Slovenian 3099 years. It is also a word to Rus zhivyakhu among themselves in great love, and to prince tamo, and having taken possession of many countries of the local lands. Also for them their sons and grandsons to the princess by their knees and eternal fame and wealth with their own sword and bow. It possessed both the northern countries, and all over the Pomorie, even up to the limit of the Arctic Sea, and around the Yellow-Waters, and along the great rivers Pechera and Vymi, and behind the high and impassable stone mountains in the country, recommended by Skir, along the great river Obwe, and up to the mouth of the Belovodnya River, its water is white, ostensibly. Tamo bo take the road well the beasts, recommend a horse, that is to say a sable. Hozhdahu and on the Egyptian countries warrior, and much courage is shown in the Hellenic and barbarian countries, great fear from these then lie down.

Heads in Sloveneh during the time of Alexander the king of Macedon. The chief then in Slovyaneh and Rusekh riches bysa, they are the names: the first Velikosan, the second Asan, the third Aveshasan. These same goddam bravery and the wisdom of many superior. All the same universe then the autocrat was a multi-affiliated Alexander, the son of Philip of Macedon. About the same above Sloveneh and Russech from all countries is pitiful to the ear and to the autocrat himself in the ears of the conspiracy. The wise autocrat and the all-world king begin to think with his subjects: "What is the right thing to do with these raw men? Do many obscenities be rooted and rooted to this and subdue eternal work? But it is inconvenient for this far from the distance for the distant distance empty and inconvenient for the long distance for uncomfortable and uncomfortable. mountains. " But both of them sent for them the gifts of many and the writing, the king himself was decorated with all sorts of praise by the high-graded right hand of golden-fledged letters written. Scripture is the same name image sitsy:

Epistle of Alexander the king of Macedon.

"Alexander, the king of the king and over the kings of God the scourge, the most advanced knight, of the whole world is the possessor and of all, IL under the sun, the terrible sovereign, to the submissive me merciful spouse, to the disobedient fierce sword, the fear of the whole world, honest over the most honest, far-distraught and your unknown land, from our Majesty, honor and peace and mercy to you and to you to the brave people of the Slovenian, most influential tribe of the Russian grand duke and owner from the sea of ​​Varyazhsky and to the sea of ​​Khvalimskii, velembny and dear to me, to the brave Velikosan, wise Asan, Everlasting Avehasana, I congratulate you, as a very face to face you kindly kiss you, I sincerely accept as friends to my heart and most important subjects to our majesty and I give this sovereignty to your sovereignty. May your eternal work be with you and your descendant, your feet will never reach your limits. This great business is closed by this sheet and is signed by our high-ranking official and our natural kingdom. gilded coat of arms hung. Given your honesty to eternity in the place of our business in Great Alexandria with the will of the great gods Marsh and Jupiter, and the goddess Verwe, and Venus of the primord month of the beginning of the day. "And the royal hands of the king are at the top of the lines with golden-haired letters written the following:" We are Alexander, king of kings and the kings are the scourge, the son of the great gods of Jupiter and Venus in the sky, while Zemstvo Philip of the silnago king and Alimpiada of the queen, our highest rule of law, affirmed forever. "These princes of Slovenia-Rusta, because of such great honor, were granted by all the same people. "I’m the most honorable epistol of honoring Velum and depriving her idol of Veles and worshiping her honestly, and honoring the feast on the beginning day of the month of the month."

According to the same many who came summer, having admired these two princes, Laloch and Lahern, in these words in Slovenstem, and these packs of warriors, having started the lands of the Greek scepter. And the coming, and under the very same reigning hail, and much evil and bloodshed, will create the scepter of the Greek kingdom. And the brave prince Lakhern under the reigning hail killed byst near the sea, the place is still called Lakhernovo, on it the monastery is honorably rewarded in the name of the Most Pure Mother of God, and then there are many russians howling under the walls of the city of Padosha. The prince Laloch ulcers Velmi with the rest return to their own with many wealth. Zhyahyakh is by no means a mess, like cattle, not possessing the law. The blessed Apostle Andrew the First-Called testifies to them in his walk, as if they didn’t necessarily mean bad things. In Sinderekh, then the princes had two brothers, the common name was Diyulel, and the other Didiyadakh, the gods didn’t know their name, because the bee made them like a bee and the sides of the top of the tree. For a time he came to the land of Slovenian sent righteous wrath of God, demolishing people without a number in all cities and in merry, as there was no one to take away the grave of the dead. The remaining people are emptiness for the sake of beating out of the cities to faraway countries, the ovia on the White Water, now called Belo Yezero, the ovia on Yezer, Tinny, and all of them, but in different countries and having different names. Ovii Paki on the Dunav to his former native, on the old-timed country returned.

The first desolation of Slovenian. And the great Slovenesque and Rusa are desolate until the end for many years, like and divine the beast dwell and multiply in them. For some time, the packs came along with the Dunava Slavs and there were a lot of Bulgarians with them, and started up the packs in the cities of Slovenesk and Rusu to inhabit. And coming upon them the White Ugrians, and beating them to the end, and digging them out, and putting Slovenian land into final desolation.

The second desolation of Slovenian. According to the same time of desolation, I heard Scythian inhabitants about the fugitives of the Slovenstia about their land forefathers, supposedly lying empty and not bregom by anyone, and having started thinking about this zhalishasi velmas in themselves, what would their father inherit their land. And the packs coming from the Danube are a lot of them without a number, and the Scythians and Bulgarians and foreigners come to Slovenian and Ruska, and the gray paks near Lake Ilmer and renew the city in a new place, from the old Slovenian down the Volkhov, like booths, Bole, and the name Novgrad the Great. And put the elder and prince from the family of his own name Gostomysl. So also Rusu is put in the old place, and many grades are renewed. And razydoshasya kiizhdo to come to their latitude of the earth, and ovii same sedosha in the fields and narekoshasya clearing, that is to say the Poles, ovii Polochans river for paintings ovii mazovshane, ovii zhmutyanya, inii same buzhans on retse Bug, ovii Dregovichi, ovii krivichi, ovii chyud Iniya, Meriya, Inia of the Drevlians, and Inia of the Morava, Serbs, Bulgarians from the same genera, and the Inii of the North, and the Interns of the Lopi, and the Primors of the Mordva, and the Inii of the Muram, and the Enia in different naming names.

And so she began to expand the country she was velmie, and the common name is nicknamed. The son of the elder Prince of Novgorod Gostomysl, called the younger Sloven, put this city from his father in Chüd and tamo in his own name over the river in the place called by Hodnitsa, and adverb the name Slovenesk, and prince in it three years and die. And his son Izbor, the name of this city, his name, and his name, Izborsk. The same prince Izbor the serpent decimated die. The land of Ruskaya, then, by sacking off the vestments of Setovannaya and Paki, clothed in purple and fine linen, and to that no longer widowed, lamenting lower, but packs by this, and the children razlodi and opochshis many years of summer staying with the wise Gostomyslom. When they come to a great old age, they come, and they can’t already be discouraged, own such numerous nations, lower the miserable internecine bloodsheds of their kind, then he’s wise, gray-haired and clamoring, the whole ruler ruled himself, , and speak to them with a lax face: "O men and brethren, the sons of the same page, now I am already velmy, my fortress disappears, and the mind recedes, but just death. And now, our land is good and rich with all good, but not his sovereign sovereign of the family of Tsars. for the sake of insurrection in you is great and relentless and interstitial of evil. I pray you, listen to my advice, like your river. Upon my death, go beyond the sea to Prusskaya land and pray tamo living autocrats, liqueur give birth to Caesar Augusta, blood is real, may they come to you to reign and possess you, there is no shame for you to surrender to such subjugates in this being. " And love all the words of the elders, and always die, then all the hail be carried honestly to the grave, to the place that was said to be Volotovo, ide and buried it. After the death of this Gostomysl, sent to the Russian land, their ambassadors to the Prussia land. They, however, who went along and found Tamo the kurfistr or prince of the great, by the name of Rurik, the lineage of Augustus, and say this, let them be the princes. And the former prince Rurik was exacted, and he went to Russia for two of his brothers, with Truvor and s Sineus.

And Sede Rurik in Novegrad, and Sineus in Beleozero, and Struvor in Zborc. And after two years, Sineus died, then Struvor, and Rurik was autocratic, over the whole Russian land, holding the power of the 17 years. Novgorodians, however, who saw Rurik's nobility and courageous wit, prophesied to themselves, verbally: "Understand, brotherhood, that the imams must be under our single yoke of ours and our own self. will be ". Then Rurik kill a certain courageous Novgorod in the name of Vadim and other many Novgorodians and his advisers. But then the Novgorodians are wicked and ungodly, but more according to their prophecy, more than the grace of God, and to this day they have reigned from the Rurik seed a noble bend. Yako first obeyed them in wickedness and until Blessed Vladimir, he also was able to cognize the existence of God and enlighten by holy baptism and shine with piety motionlessly and relentlessly, the faith of Christ holds and necessarily possesses Vladimir noble children and grandchildren into birth and clan.
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  1. +1
    3 September 2012 09: 46
    Ndaaa ...
    Ukry rest ...
    Such insanity, as in this article, they can not come up with.
    1. SASCHAmIXEEW
      +12
      3 September 2012 10: 42
      Novel you seriously think. that the Slovenes appeared out of nowhere in 900g. But what about the country of Gardarik. Or is it also fiction?
      1. 0
        3 September 2012 11: 13
        Quote: SASCHAmIXEEW

        Novel you seriously think. that the Slovenes appeared out of nowhere in 900g. But what about the country of Gardarik. Or is it also fiction?


        Well hello ...
        None of the more or less serious researchers claim and can not argue that the Slavs appeared only at the end of the 1st millennium AD. Of course, they existed hundreds of years before.

        But if we talk about "civilization" (I specifically take this word in quotation marks in this case), they have no reliable information about it. Novgorod, as far as I know, can be traced in no way earlier than the end of the 8th century. Old Ladoga is dated by the methods of dendrochronology to about the middle of the same century. And all other settlements are about the same age, if not younger.
        About the existence of writing before Cyril and Methodius ("lines and cuts", runes, etc.) information is not very intelligible, moreover, there are no reliable texts written by these alphabets.
        The earliest reports of peoples that can be considered Slavic date back to the period no earlier than the first centuries of our era. And the "Gardariki" you mentioned generally appears in the sagas not earlier than the 12th century, and even if we take into account that they describe events that are more ancient, the age of this country by no means can go away earlier than the middle of the first millennium of our era.

        So what do we get in the bottom line? Delusional cheers-patriotic fiction?
        Well, this is not proof in my opinion ...

        And in general, I’m not catching up with what they are spraying with saliva, trying to prove the drop dead antiquity of the Slavs (Russians)? IMHO, on the contrary, we should be proud of the fact that for a historically short period we managed to go from almost wildness to the position of one of the leading countries in Europe.
        1. +18
          3 September 2012 11: 34
          ))))))))) Yes, I look YOU * a diligent student of Miller and Schlozer ..........
          1. +1
            3 September 2012 11: 47
            Quote: Benzin
            yeah i look YOU * a diligent student of miller and schlozer


            Are you Nosovsky and Fomenko?
        2. Green
          -12
          3 September 2012 11: 52
          Quote: Roman-75
          Well hello ...
          None of the more or less serious researchers claim and can not argue that the Slavs appeared only at the end of the 1st millennium AD. Of course, they existed hundreds of years before.

          But if we talk about "civilization" (I specifically take this word in quotation marks in this case), they have no reliable information about it. Novgorod, as far as I know, can be traced in no way earlier than the end of the 8th century. Old Ladoga is dated by the methods of dendrochronology to about the middle of the same century. And all other settlements are about the same age, if not younger.
          About the existence of writing before Cyril and Methodius ("lines and cuts", runes, etc.) information is not very intelligible, moreover, there are no reliable texts written by these alphabets.
          The earliest reports of peoples that can be considered Slavic date back to the period no earlier than the first centuries of our era. And the "Gardariki" you mentioned generally appears in the sagas not earlier than the 12th century, and even if we take into account that they describe events that are more ancient, the age of this country by no means can go away earlier than the middle of the first millennium of our era.

          So what do we get in the bottom line? Delusional cheers-patriotic fiction?
          Well, this is not proof in my opinion ...

          And in general, I’m not catching up with what they are spraying with saliva, trying to prove the drop dead antiquity of the Slavs (Russians)? IMHO, on the contrary, we should be proud of the fact that for a historically short period we managed to go from almost wildness to the position of one of the leading countries in Europe.



          That's right !!!
          In principle, there is nothing to add but a plus.
          1. 0
            3 September 2012 12: 03
            Quote: Green
            That's right !!!
            In principle, there is nothing to add but a plus.


            Thank you!
            They rarely add me, every such action is all the more pleasant.

            But, to be honest, I'm not writing here because of the pros or cons.
            1. Zmitcer
              -8
              3 September 2012 13: 31
              let me put a plus too. I personally wonder how it was. wink Although I am from a different cohort, I am interested in objective and truthful facts, and not in the fantasies of the cheers-patriots, whom we also have enough.
              1. +3
                3 September 2012 20: 57
                do not forget to ask for an autograph)
        3. not good
          +21
          3 September 2012 12: 06
          The fact that the Papuans do not believe in electricity does not prevent the light bulb from shining. The fact that the official version prevailed in the interpretation of ancient Russian history does not mean that this version is correct. The current interpretation arose with the advent of Orthodoxy in Russia, when paganism was cut down under the root, and many historical facts have been forgotten or changed for the sake of the current political moment. Any government, unfortunately, treats history as convenient, and this, often, ultimately does not allow even specialists, after many years, with 100% certainty to recover ovit istinu.Poetomu along with the official version of history is necessary to illuminate and alternativnye.i if a person is interested .on for himself formulates his version of the history of the motherland in addition to the politically correct.
          1. 0
            3 September 2012 12: 25
            Quote: Negoro
            The fact that the official version prevailed in the interpretation of ancient Russian history. This does not mean that this version is correct. The current interpretation arose with the advent of Orthodoxy in Russia, when paganism was cut down to the root, and many historical facts were forgotten or changed to suit the current political moment. Any the authorities, unfortunately, interpret the story as convenient for themselves, and this, often, in the end, does not allow even specialists, after many years, with 100% certainty, to restore the truth


            Okay, paganism was cut down. Books were destroyed. Knowledge carriers were killed. All these are quite possible options.
            But how could traces of material culture be destroyed, like the remnants of settlements, explain!

            Quote: Negoro
            Therefore, along with the official version of the story, it is necessary to cover alternative ones. And if a person is interested, he will formulate his own version of the history of the Motherland in addition to the politically correct one.


            Of course. There should be no monopoly on knowledge.
            However, in my opinion, it would be nice to back up any version with an evidence base. Where are the supporters of protorus?
            1. +10
              3 September 2012 14: 58
              Okay, paganism was cut down. Books were destroyed. Knowledge carriers were killed. All these are quite possible options.
              But how could traces of material culture be destroyed, like the remnants of settlements, explain!

              Dear colleague Roman, in the spring of 1987, in the south of the Chelyabinsk region, at the confluence of two rivers - Karaganka and Utyaganka - an amazing monument of ancient Aryan civilization dating back to the 18-17th centuries was unveiled. BC. It got its name from a neighboring peak - Arkaim. The find had a great future: it is the only monument of the Andronovo Aryan culture of almost complete preservation.
              The aerial photograph clearly shows its ring structure, similar to a chamomile flower. In fact, Arkaim is two inscribed circles, divided into sectors-dwellings, 25 m in the inner circle, 35 m in the outer and central square.
              The diameter of the bypass defensive wall is 150 m. The ends of the dwellings are adjacent to this wall from the inside, the ditch is 1,5-2,5 m deep from the outside. The wall is about 4 m thick. The exits of the outer steep dwellings face a single ring street 5,5-6 m, passing through the entire settlement parallel to the external defensive wall.
              The central area is well fixed on aerial photographs, an oval area of ​​27 x 25 m, oriented to the northeast. In ancient times, fire constantly burned in the very center. Archaeological evidence suggests that the village had four entrances. The sophistication of the layout created incredible difficulties for advancing the enemy deep into the territory. At the same time, the defenders of the fortress had very convenient positions and considerable freedom of movement. The architectural plan of Arkaim is so thought out that in order to get into the territory of the inner circle of the settlement, you had to go along the entire length of the ring street. Only at the end of it through a special gate could you penetrate the central square and the surrounding dwellings. And there was no other way! It is logical to say that such a route was not only defensive, but also ritual.


              According to recent calculations, Arkaim is about 4800 years old.
              Read about Arkaim here - http://tainy.net/14725-russkaya-civilizaciya-arkaim.html
              This is not a myth or a legend, it is a reality and a world historical and archaeological sensation of the late twentieth century.
              Video "Arkaim - the ancient civilization of the Aryans" - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apcGA5Mhnmg
              1. +1
                3 September 2012 15: 30
                Quote: Gamdlislyam
                ... in the spring of 1987 in the south of the Chelyabinsk region, at the confluence of two rivers - Karaganka and Utyaganka - an amazing monument of ancient Aryan civilization was opened, dating from the 18-17th centuries. BC. It got its name from a neighboring peak - Arkaim. The find had a great future: it is the only monument of the Andronovo Aryan culture of almost complete preservation.


                Gamdlislyam, thank you, you only confirm my words.
                The fact of the matter is that Arkaim completely preserved, in contrast to the mythical "Slavensk", "city of Russ" and the like!
                But, sorry, what does this prove? The reliability of Arkaim as a settlement with a very large age is beyond doubt. But then what? I saw his pictures more than once - a mound with traces of dwellings. It was built, to all appearances, was well, it was well planned, it was inscribed in the landscape, but nothing more. There is nothing like even Knossos there, as far as I understand. So how does the existence of Arkaim prove the antiquity of the "Rus civilization"?
                1. 0
                  3 September 2012 21: 13
                  So how does the existence of Arkaim prove the antiquity of the "Rus civilization"? Sir, is there any evidence refuting this?
                2. +16
                  28 November 2020 17: 48
                  Quote: Roman-75
                  Arkaim is quite well preserved, in contrast to the mythical "Slavensk", "city of Russ" and the like!

                  More than 100 copies of the Legends of Slovenia and Ruse and the City of Slovensk (with variants of names), dated mainly to the second half of the 1652th century, have survived to this day, including in the Chronicle of Patriarch Nikon 1658-1679, in the Chronograph of 1679 , Novgorod III Chronicle, the Mazurian chronicler Isidor Snazin. Modern editions are more often based on the list from the Chronograph of 1626. Historians suggest that the "Legend ..." was compiled by the founder of the Siberian chronicle, Metropolitan Cyprian (1634-XNUMX), although versions of the migration movements of Slovenia and Rus, their relationship were known long before the XNUMXth century. So, Arab-Persian authors from the XII century cited legends about the Rus and Slavs with the mention of the eponyms Rus and Slav, sometimes medieval authors retrospectively linked the Rus with earlier events before the VII century. As you can see, there is nothing mythical ...
              2. loc.bejenari
                0
                3 September 2012 15: 30
                you google - Tripoli culture - in Ukraine, ancient settlements measuring 2 by 3 kilometers of the same period
                your Arkaim still reach for them and reach
                only no one has thought of declaring Tripoli fortifications as progenitors of Slavic cities
                1. +3
                  3 September 2012 15: 34
                  Quote: loc.bejenari
                  only no one has thought of declaring Tripoli fortifications as progenitors of Slavic cities


                  Here, dear Yuri, you are wrong.
                  How did you think! And not only Slavic cities! The ukry pyramids were built and the Sphinx was piled, are you not in the know? lol
                  1. loc.bejenari
                    +4
                    3 September 2012 15: 52
                    about the pyramids yes, these are our protoukry zbuduvuals
                    won’t even then small zhovtoblakitni sharovary that dancing hopaku
                    and in Arkaimi-meshkaly these same-well-sworn Mos ...... whether there are proto-Russians
                    and along the streets bigals bears playing balalaikas laughing
                    1. 0
                      3 September 2012 16: 11
                      Quote: loc.bejenari
                      about the pyramids yes, these are our protoukry zbuduvuals
                      won’t even then small zhovtoblakitni sharovary that dancing hopaku
                      and in Arkaimi-meshkaly these same-well-sworn Mos ...... whether there are proto-Russians
                      and along the streets bigals bears playing balalaikas


                      That’s right to say something! good laughing
                    2. +1
                      3 September 2012 21: 15
                      What then. respected. with yours. "Protoukram" happened, why did they so quickly slide down to such a level? Not really, again these damned and damage they sent you?
                2. +12
                  28 November 2020 17: 56
                  Quote: loc.bejenari
                  no one has yet thought of declaring the Trypillian settlements as the progenitors of Slavic cities

                  Academician Rybakov interpreted many of its features as traces of Proto-Indo-European mythology and wrote down Tyropolitan culture as Proto-Slavic.
              3. +11
                28 November 2020 17: 48
                Quote: Gamdlislyam
                an amazing monument of the ancient Aryan civilization was opened

                In science this archaeological culture is called Arkaim-Sintashta. The significance of the discovery of Arkaim and other fortified settlements of this type is indisputable, since it provided completely new data on the migration routes of Indo-Europeans and made it possible to prove that a fairly highly developed culture existed in the South Ural steppes 4 thousand years ago. The residents of Arkaim were engaged in metallurgy and metalworking, weaving, and pottery. The basis of their economy was cattle breeding. It is very difficult to attribute this historical monument to the ancient Slavs.
                1. +2
                  19 December 2020 14: 15
                  Why is it difficult to correlate the ancient city of Arkaim and the Slavs? Arkaim was founded by Indo-Europeans. Slavs belong to Indo-Europeans.
            2. +5
              3 September 2012 16: 38
              Who really wants to see the evidence base will see it, http://www-sbras.nsc.ru/HBC/2000/n32-33/f13.html, http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sintashta, http : //www.stavropolye.tv/culture/view/11352, http://www.today.kz/ru/news/kazakhstan/2009-08-12/arheolog, there is an Internet, and even this site is in my opinion opinion worthy of the article http://topwar.ru/13258-velikaya-skifiya-i-superetnos-rusov-ch-1.html#comment-id-
              283513. But if it is more convenient for a person not to notice the obvious, then it is useless to prove something to him.
              1. 0
                3 September 2012 16: 45
                Quote: Zhizneslav
                Who really wants to see the evidence base will see it


                Evidence base WHAT?
                That people lived everywhere and everywhere? Well, it never needed evidence.
                That there was an "Aryan community"? So now it is not necessary to prove it, everyone knows!
                But what do the Russians have to do with it?
                1. s1н7т
                  -2
                  3 September 2012 17: 39
                  I can assume that the Russians are those who lived / paid tribute in Russia (a certain adm. Unit). And what, before Russia, no one lived there?
                2. +3
                  3 September 2012 21: 20
                  Not Russian but our ancestors. you don’t get the point, and everyone is trying to discredit this theory, well, you know, if you think at least something in history, you should never say 100% that your opinion is correct, since history is a thing a hundred times slandered, and where the truth is where not, we can only guess. Especially if it concerns ancient times.
                3. 0
                  April 26 2021 21: 47
                  Look at the haplogroups. About 10 thousand people left the Country of Cities. They went to India, China and up to the Amur. The tribes of Slovenes, Rus, Kimari, Khazars and Easter returned from China and reached the Black Sea. and the sixth / raw food / went along the Ob and they met at the lakes of Ilmenya, Ladoga. and in the north of Jutland.
            3. +3
              5 September 2012 01: 07
              Traces of more ancient settlements than the 7-8 century? Arkaim, for example .... Again, the cities in Russia until the 16 century were almost entirely wooden, and it is difficult to look for traces in the style of the Egyptian pyramids, Parthenon and the Coliseum in our country. And without such remains of settlements, finding their location in order to dig out ceramics and something more durable than wood is difficult .... And imported written sources about cities and statehood in Russia mention some kind from the 4-5 century to P .X.
        4. -1
          3 September 2012 18: 57
          Only a plus. I support. History is still a science, not a shelter for storytellers. Both one and the other
        5. +1
          3 September 2012 21: 11
          Sir, what wildness are you talking about? Can you fully assert that the Russian people were wild? On what grounds can you do this? You should know one thing, after the beginning of the period of Christianity in Russia, all that was connected with paganism. with pre-Christian Russia, it was systematically and purposefully destroyed, because little has been preserved to this day. Despite the lack of evidence, you simply do not have any right to state this, you only have the right to either express your opinion or give a hypothesis.
        6. +1
          3 September 2012 22: 09
          The article has the right to life, like many other studies on this topic. But the invasion of seropogonous "agitators" is significant.

          To whom the topic of our ancient history is really interesting, I recommend watching the movie:

          http://www.pravda-tv.ru/2012/08/17/15979
        7. +5
          3 September 2012 23: 25
          Roman 75,
          But if we are talking about "civilization" (I specifically take this word in quotation marks in this case), they have no reliable information about this.


          The father of “political historiography” Niccolo Machiavelli clearly bequeathed to the sovereigns: history is written in order to make it easier for the ruler to manage his subjects: “Whoever owns the past owns the future.” “For a second, imagine that the story that we all went through in schools is partially distorted, and events actually developed a little differently. “So what?” You ask. And the fact that such a distortion can lead to the fact that almost all sciences, it turns out, are built on a false foundation. "

          It is not possible to falsify documents from an entire country. This is the official, or rather, generally accepted, point of view. In general, to falsify is a loose word, of course, it is difficult to copy what happened in the XI century, but if you burned everything that was before, you will begin to write what you need and there will be nothing to compare it with. I thought for a long time what example from Russian history to give, because there is a rather large palette of very different situations, which, in my opinion, shows the illegality of official chronology. The Tatar-Mongol invasion is the clearest example of falsification of our history. And first of all, we need to understand why such falsification was carried out and who needed it.

          At the beginning of the XVIII century, Peter 1 founded the Russian Academy of Sciences. At the historical branch of the Academy of Sciences for 120 years of its existence, there was 33 academic historian. Of these, only three Russians, including M.V. Lomonosov, the rest are Germans. The history of Ancient Russia until the beginning of the XVII century was written by the Germans, and some of them did not even know the Russian language! This fact is well known to professional historians, but they make no effort to carefully review what kind of story the Germans wrote.

          It is known that M.V. Lomonosov wrote the history of Russia and that he had constant disputes with German academics. After the death of Lomonosov, his archives disappeared without a trace! However, his works on the history of Russia were published, but edited by Miller. Meanwhile, it was Miller who harassed M.V. Lomonosov during his lifetime !! The works of Lomonosov on the history of Russia published by Miller are falsification; this was shown by computer analysis. Little is left of Lomonosov in them.


          http://in-gazeta.narod.ru/0/histiry.html
        8. +1
          4 September 2012 01: 01
          Actually, there is no trust in the northern epics (for the same Edda). There is a huge share of the likelihood (normal scientists do not exclude it, and - reasonably. I had the pleasure of talking on this topic with Andrei Valentinov - he is, besides being a great science fiction writer, also an excellent scientist-historian) that all the Edds are a remake created in the 19th century. Just in the wake of the general "ancientization" of their stories, the Scandinavians "suddenly" found the ancient texts of the "Edd" in Iceland. Well, isn't it a trick? So, so ... don't be too strong in referring to the Vikings who described Gardarik ...

          At the same time, I'm not saying that you guys, my friends, Slavs, have no ancient history. She is as old as the human race. It is simply not necessary to cite "muddy" justifications as an example. Look ...
        9. +1
          19 December 2020 14: 22
          Quote: Roman-75
          But if we are talking about "civilization"

          The Novgorod Slavs were completely literate. There are many surviving birch bark "letters".
  2. Skavron
    +1
    3 September 2012 10: 04
    Now it has become fashionable to redraw history and invent a new one, it is a pity that we will never know the truth. for the story of spma is an inaccurate science in the world.
    1. +2
      3 September 2012 11: 36
      Well, why did you yourself answer your question is_TORI_ya (explain what kind of word or so it is clear ??)
      1. Green
        -4
        3 September 2012 11: 53
        Quote: Benzin
        Well, why did you yourself answer your question is_TORI_ya (explain what kind of word or so it is clear ??)


        And please explain to me, what is that word there? laughing
        1. 0
          3 September 2012 18: 05
          And please explain to me, what kind of word is that


          Something related to the Tories - one of the English parties, it seems .. =)
        2. +8
          28 November 2020 18: 10
          laughing An ordinary invention of supporters of the "historians" Fomenkov and Chudinov
    2. +15
      28 November 2020 18: 09
      Quote: Skavron
      it's a pity that we'll never know the truth

      Why then? Archeology and genetics are sufficiently developed today and can already answer many questions of our history.
  3. +2
    3 September 2012 10: 22
    It takes a long time to dig to the truth, but this hypothesis has a right to exist, it remains to find evidence.
    1. 0
      3 September 2012 11: 45
      in our ancestors, the culture (Greek -cultus with a Slovenian ending-ra) was called the Root Zorinesis among the people of the gods in the movement of our families to the truth ... and start looking for evidence from Vasnetsov’s paintings
      1. 0
        3 September 2012 11: 54
        Quote: Benzin
        ... and start looking for evidence from Vasnetsov’s paintings


        Cool!!! good laughing
        Well it had to think of such a thing! The paintings as historical sources are awesome! Nosovsky and Fomenko nibble their elbows with envy laughing
      2. Green
        +2
        3 September 2012 11: 57
        Quote: Benzin
        in our ancestors, the culture (Greek -cultus with a Slovenian ending-ra) was called the Root Zorinesis among the people of the gods in the movement of our families to the truth ... and start looking for evidence from Vasnetsov’s paintings



        What is it ??? This is trend! laughing

        Do you want to write according to your layouts?
        Let's say there is a city of Samara. Who founded it? So, we decompose: CAM - ARA and it turns out that his CAM ARA (Armenian) laughing founded. It is an original Armenian city !!!

        All this is called - linguofriction, pun. A game that has nothing to do with SCIENCE.
        Linguofricate further, learn a lot. laughing
        1. 0
          3 September 2012 12: 08
          Quote: Green
          Let's say there is a city of Samara. Who founded it? So, we decompose: CAM - ARA and it turns out that its CAM ARA (Armenian) founded. It is an original Armenian city !!!


          good good good
          Continue: Belgorod = BELGO-ROD, that is, the Belt of the Belgians-Belgians. It is founded, leaves, immigrants from Belgium. Well, will we turn it back and forth? wink
      3. +15
        28 November 2020 18: 13
        Quote: Benzin
        Greek -culture with Slovenian ending -ra

        Not guys ... So we will never get to the truth ... Do you really believe in all the nonsense of Fomenko, Nosovsky, Chudinov, Khinevich and Asov?
        1. +3
          19 December 2020 14: 29
          The negative position of respected opponents is often explained by gaps in their knowledge required for chronology. Dates are the foundation of history. What are the dates - this is the version of the story. Dates change - everything changes. But dates are numbers. And numbers must be able to calculate. Chronology was and remains a section of applied mathematics. For the first time, global datings were calculated in the 16-17th centuries by Scaliger and Petavius. In the era of the 16-17 centuries, the methods of medieval astronomy and mathematics for calculating dates were still very imperfect. That is why, as it turned out, the first chronologists made big mistakes. For hundreds, and sometimes even thousands of years. The point is that chronological calculations are often quite complex. For example, the calculation of many ancient dates relies on the calculation of Easter dates. But complex algorithms for Easter calculations require serious knowledge and skills.
    2. 0
      3 September 2012 11: 49
      ShturmKGB
      ... the evidence remains to be found.


      Come up with evidence, you wanted to say? wink
      1. +2
        19 December 2020 14: 31
        Ancient dates in documents were often written in the form of three numbers - the circle of the Sun, the circle of the Moon and indict. This means that cyclic counters based on coprime numbers were used. At a minimum, you need to know what three mutually prime numbers are. The dates of many events were calculated by determining the dates of the days of the equinoxes. But an error of just one day leads to an error in the dating of ancient events by about a hundred years. It turns out that there is no need to invent anything. Everything is very simple.
    3. +2
      3 September 2012 11: 53
      Find evidence is not enough. The problem is that the lured official science puts them into circulation. And it is almost impossible.
      Even Arkaim, who accidentally missed in the media, is carefully hushed up, like so many others who do not fit into the official version of the only cradles of human civilization in Egypt and Sumer.
      1. Green
        0
        3 September 2012 12: 06
        Quote: kosopuz
        Even Arkaim, who accidentally missed in the media, is carefully hushed up, like so many others who do not fit into the official version of the only cradles of human civilization in Egypt and Sumer.


        Why is silent? Infa about him is freely available, it is being studied but ... Arkaim and Sumer or Egypt are different, incomparable things. Arkaim does not reach the point that they gave the World TE Civilization. wink
        1. +3
          19 December 2020 14: 49
          What do we know about Arkaim today? Almost nothing. But work is underway to study the city. And I am sure we will have great discoveries.
      2. +1
        3 September 2012 12: 13
        Quote: kosopuz
        Even Arkaim, who accidentally missed in the media, is carefully hushed up, like so many others who do not fit into the official version of the only cradles of human civilization in Egypt and Sumer.


        Here is a discovery ...
        My relatives, who recently traveled to Arkaim, examined the settlement for two days, took a lot of pictures, and all this in the presence of quite official archaeologists, were, it turns out, somewhere in a conspiratorial gathering organized by the patriots, shedding blood in attempts to confront the ominous conspiracy of the World Backstage ?! belay
        1. s1н7т
          0
          3 September 2012 17: 47
          Hm. This morning I went there myself. What tourists are offered for inspection is located one and a half kilometers from the excavation site. There, even the road is not trodden, only with binoculars you can see. I did not find archaeologists there, only those who earn on tourists. Specially tortured them))) I’m not sure that someone is really doing something there. No one is interested and there is no money. If someone tells you otherwise - do not believe it, they are lying. Excavations are far and abandoned.
    4. s1н7т
      0
      3 September 2012 17: 41
      This hypothesis is based on a 16th-century manuscript. Those. sucked from a finger))) Like the story of Rurik, by the way.
  4. Green
    -3
    3 September 2012 10: 40
    And when only on a normal site, and with a military bias, will they stop posting articles not related to the subject of the site ??
    There are many historical sites. This is where it should be placed. There in the topic will be, and explain the popular "xy from xy".
    And then ... the soup starts ...
  5. +12
    3 September 2012 10: 54
    The fact that the Norman theory is bullshit has long been understood by many, except our valiant academics. But they are differently sick, they also defended a bunch of candidate and doctoral degrees.
    1. Green
      -5
      3 September 2012 12: 02
      Quote: baltika-18
      The fact that the Norman theory is bullshit has long been understood by many, except our valiant academics. But they are differently sick, they also defended a bunch of candidate and doctoral degrees.


      Well, you come to the Russian Academy of Sciences, and tell a PROBABLY TRUE story there.
      laughing
      1. Green 413-1685
        +3
        3 September 2012 15: 49
        The failure of Norman theory was proved by Lomonosov. Yes, and later there were many convincing works of her refuting. The same Ilovaisky.
        1. Green
          -1
          3 September 2012 15: 51
          Quote: Green 413-1685
          The failure of Norman theory was proved by Lomonosov.


          Docks in pliz studio.
          And then, I can say that this kind of thread. laughing
          1. Green 413-1685
            +3
            3 September 2012 16: 02
            You still want me to post here the work of Lomonosov on other history or Ilovaisky? So they are in the public domain, do not be lazy to fill in Google, bloody gebna does not hide them. Or maybe you consider yourself smarter and more erudite than Lomonosov lol I don’t know your contribution to world science, to bother to tell with links laughing
            For my part, I demand the docks of Norman theory in the studio. All that was just ordinary fables.
            1. -2
              3 September 2012 16: 59
              Quote: Green 413-1685
              You still want me to post here the work of Lomonosov on other history or Ilovaisky?


              And post, please!
              Something like this:
              Signs of the ancient name of the Slavic appear, firstly, in Ptolemy called stavan. The property of the Greek and Latin languages ​​does not allow them to pronounce the name of the Slavs. For the sake of that, before the stavans, after the Sklavans and the Slavans were called. Amazons, or Alazones, the Slavic people, in Greek mean self-praise; it is clear that this name is a translation, of the Slavs, that is, of the famous, from Slavic to Greek.
              (ANCIENT RUSSIAN HISTORY FROM THE BEGINNING OF THE RUSSIAN PEOPLE TO THE END OF THE GREAT PRINCE YAROSLAV THE FIRST OR BEFORE 1054 STARTED BY MIKHAIL LOMONOSOV, STATIAN COUNSELOR, PROFESSOROMISORES
              Chapter 3
              ON THE FAR ANTIQUITY OF THE SLAVEN PEOPLE
              )
              И it Do you think serious argumentation ?!
              1. Green 413-1685
                +1
                3 September 2012 17: 18
                So what ?
                By the way, we know about the peculiarities of the Greek language, it’s strange that you don’t know about it, and it’s also known how they were careless about the translation and interpretation of local names, self-names and place names. Often twisting in their own way, as they understood it. There are a lot of examples. The same sklavens are well known. And there are plenty of interpretations of the term "Slavs" even now among the Slavic peoples themselves. And no one will tell you which is true. And what have you proved ???
              2. Green
                -2
                3 September 2012 17: 29
                Quote: Roman-75
                And do you think this is a serious argument ?!


                No, Vasnetsov’s paintings are their argument. laughing
                And also a pun with permutation of letters and so on ..
                1. Green 413-1685
                  0
                  3 September 2012 17: 34
                  Yes, I see an ordinary troll. Indicate where in what commentary I gave these arguments. I'm waiting for the proof. Do not indicate, then you are an ordinary balabol.
                  1. Green
                    -1
                    3 September 2012 17: 37
                    Quote: Green 413-1685
                    Yes, I see an ordinary troll. Indicate where in what commentary I gave these arguments. I'm waiting for the proof. Do not indicate, then you are an ordinary balabol.


                    Yes, I’m not talking about you, I’m talking about those who are on the same side with you.
                    These arguments in quotes sounded here.
                    And the answer was not for you.
                    1. Green 413-1685
                      +1
                      3 September 2012 17: 40
                      Well, let's return the line "I'm not me and the house is not mine" laughing
                      And on my side is Academician Lomonosov. You didn’t answer - do you consider yourself smarter than him? lol
                      1. Green
                        -1
                        3 September 2012 18: 05
                        Quote: Green 413-1685
                        And on my side is Academician Lomonosov. You didn’t answer - do you consider yourself smarter than him?


                        The whole RAS is on my side !!! And not only her. wink
                        So I think that this issue can be closed. laughing
                      2. Green 413-1685
                        0
                        3 September 2012 18: 09
                        You will be surprised, but at the RAS, not the majority adheres to the Normanist theory. So do not get on.
                        You are defeated and I trample you with a laugh tongue
                      3. Green
                        -1
                        3 September 2012 18: 17
                        Quote: Green 413-1685
                        You will be surprised, but at the RAS, not the majority adheres to the Normanist theory. So do not get on.
                        You are defeated and I trample you with a laugh


                        Wow, there is such a "majority" that the commission was created to expose pseudoscientific theories. Funny by God.
                        No, not defeated, not at all.
                        All by, all into milk. laughing
                      4. Green 413-1685
                        0
                        3 September 2012 18: 30
                        And where does the pseudo-scientific theory? Today, just the Normanist theory loses in the historical discussion.
                        A downcast (you) lies in the milk, and I stand nearby and laugh wildly over this landscape laughing
                      5. Green
                        -1
                        3 September 2012 18: 32
                        Quote: Green 413-1685
                        and I stand nearby and laugh wildly


                        This is your hysteria from impotence. Call 03, there will help. laughing
                      6. Green 413-1685
                        -1
                        3 September 2012 18: 42
                        And you know the phone ... Looks like a frequent client laughing
                        Your drain is counted laughing
                      7. +1
                        5 September 2012 14: 19
                        Green
                        Ilovaisky is good. There was such a book by S.A. Gedeonov "Varangians and Russia" in 1875, after which the leader of the Normanists A.A. Kunik publicly announced the unreliability of many provisions of their theory. Since then, the theory of Normanism was considered defeated. After the coup in 1917, others came to Russia, who began to throw all the heritage of Russia into a landfill. With Pushkin, Dostoevsky ... failed. But with Gedeonov completely. Soviet historians made it a rule in their writings to intertwine with "Glory to the KPSS" and "Glory to Normanism" in places. I don’t know how young people breathe now, but among the largest and smartest historians who have emerged from those years, for example, R. Skrynnikov, reading this, although he writes about Rurukov's tsarist Russia and the Time of Troubles, causes perplexity.
            2. Green
              0
              3 September 2012 17: 30
              Quote: Green 413-1685
              For my part, I demand the docks of Norman theory in the studio. All that was just ordinary fables.


              Tell me, what exactly are you not comfortable with in the official version?
              I hope not everything at all ...
              1. Green 413-1685
                +2
                3 September 2012 17: 58
                First of all, it does not frustrate me to completely ignore pre-Christian historical sources. Including writing, I’m not even talking about archaeological ones. And also a huge number of inconsistencies and outright juggling of facts. Well, the Norman ethnic groups do not have such a name, Rurik, no, there are similar ones, but this is not. This is the way in your garden stone about embedding letters and far-reaching conclusions from this. There is no account of the geographical facts of the settlement of the Slavs (the same Baltic Slavs, very influential once, with the capital on the island now Rügen, the former Ruyan. ?? Buyan ?? - a proven fact, the German archbishop described in the annals.) By the way, on this topographic name you can see in the example, how strongly the Slavic toponyms are changing. Maybe the same with Rurik? And there is simply no ordinary historical logic in it.
                1. Green
                  0
                  3 September 2012 18: 11
                  Quote: Green 413-1685
                  First of all, it does not frustrate me to completely ignore pre-Christian historical sources. Including writing, I’m not even talking about archaeological ones.


                  How many of them? They are ? Do they relate to us?


                  Quote: Green 413-1685
                  And also a huge number of inconsistencies and outright juggling of facts.


                  More specifically pliz.


                  Quote: Green 413-1685
                  There is no accounting for the geographical facts of the settlement of the Slavs


                  Are there sources for which you can reliably map a settlement map?

                  Quote: Green 413-1685
                  And there is simply no ordinary historical logic in it.


                  Why? With the exception of "white spots", everything is quite logical. wink
                  1. Green 413-1685
                    0
                    3 September 2012 18: 25
                    How many of them? They are ? They are related to us.

                    Perhaps it’s not for you, but for us (Russians) they have it.
                    More specifically pliz.

                    Maiden memory ? Read between Lomonosov and Ilovaysky.
                    And there are sources for which you can reliably map the settlement

                    And this is complete, just do not be lazy and look. Just so in the search engine and enter. Everything is reliable and archaeologically confirmed.
                    Why? With the exception of "white spots" everything is quite logical

                    Well, this is not for me, problems with logical thinking, this is for a psychologist.
                    One call of a stranger to own what is worth. Who would take a stranger. By the way, this is described in detail in Ilovaisky.
                    1. Green
                      -1
                      3 September 2012 18: 30
                      Quote: Green 413-1685
                      Perhaps it’s not for you, but for us (Russians) they have it.


                      Hmm .... And these are words from what there is nothing to say. laughing


                      Quote: Green 413-1685
                      Maiden memory ? Read between Lomonosov and Ilovaysky.


                      Everything is clearly shorter. Woof-woof-woof ... how about business .... into the bushes.

                      Quote: Green 413-1685
                      And this is complete, just do not be lazy and look. Just so in the search engine and enter. Everything is reliable and archaeologically confirmed.


                      Same as above.

                      Quote: Green 413-1685
                      One call of a stranger to own what is worth. Who would take a stranger. By the way, this is described in detail in Ilovaisky.


                      By the way, I do not agree with this. Whether they called, they rather came and not with peaceful intentions.
                      1. Green 413-1685
                        0
                        3 September 2012 18: 40
                        About
                        Woof-woof-woof ... how about business .... into the bushes
                        no, on this I caught you above.
                        It is impossible to prove to anyone who is too lazy to make a couple of queries to the search engine (not to mention a physical trip to the library). You probably believe that the earth is flat? smile
                        By the way, I do not agree with this. Whether they called, rather they themselves came and not with peaceful intentions
                        Your speculation is charming.
                      2. Green
                        -2
                        3 September 2012 18: 43
                        Quote: Green 413-1685
                        Your speculation is charming.


                        Oh, finally understood. You are just a troll banal.
                        Troll further but I won’t feed you.
                        Forward tro-lo-lo ... Forward to "historical discoveries". wassat
                      3. Green 413-1685
                        +3
                        3 September 2012 18: 49
                        He asked how and where to find, I answered him. And he is still "muu, yes muu, nothing will be understood")))) So you don't know how or don't you want to? And here you merge wink
                2. +16
                  28 November 2020 18: 43
                  Quote: Green 413-1685
                  does not obscure a complete disregard for pre-Christian historical sources

                  There are almost none, and those that exist are either falsification or cause distrust.
              2. +2
                19 December 2020 14: 58
                In the official history, the version of the chronology of antiquity adopted today is the creation of chronologists and historians of the XVI-XVII centuries. Basically and more or less finally, it was completed by the famous chronologists Joseph Scaliger (1540-1609) and Dionysius Petavius ​​(1583-1652). Research has shown that this version of the chronology and history of the ancient and medieval world appears to be WRONG. This was understood by many outstanding scientists of the XNUMXth-XNUMXth centuries. But it turned out to be a very difficult task to build a new, consistent concept of history. The accepted today chronology of antiquity is more correctly called SKALIGEROVSKAYA, since it is the creation of several persons, of which Scaliger is best known.
            3. +11
              28 November 2020 18: 40
              Quote: Green 413-1685
              Ilovaisky

              In "Investigations about the beginning of Russia" DI Ilovaisky advocates the southern origin of Russia, completely rejecting the chronicle story about the vocation of the Varangians and everything connected with Rurik. At the same time, Lomonosov in his History defends a different point of view. Lomonosov from Objections to Miller's Dissertation: ... the Varangians and Rurik with their clan, who came to Novgorod, were Slavic tribes, spoke the Slavic language, came from the ancient Russians and were by no means from Scandinavia, but lived on the eastern-southern shores of the Varangian Sea, between the Vistula and Dvina rivers [territory Kaliningrad region, Gdansk, and Lithuania] ... Varangians-Rus lived in the eastern-southern coast of the Varangian Sea, near the river Ruse [now Neman] ... And the very name Prussians or Poruss shows that the Prussians lived along the Russes or alongside the Russes. So which one is right?
        2. +15
          28 November 2020 18: 19
          Quote: Green 413-1685
          The inconsistency of the Norman theory was proved by Lomonosov

          He didn’t prove anything. Have you read the History of Lomonosov yourself?
    2. +9
      28 November 2020 18: 19
      The point is that there is simply very little evidence of non-Norman theory ... The sources are not reliable.
    3. +1
      19 December 2020 14: 52
      And indeed it is. It can be added that those who are trying to open the veil of the secrets of our people and country are ridiculed and their ideas are called nonsense.
  6. +2
    3 September 2012 11: 00
    Of course "HISTORY" is a prostitute who falls under the powers of this world, but I agree with the author that there was Russia before the Rurikovichs, and we did not get out of the swamps. And the task of the state is to educate the younger generation and make more historical films on this topic .Plus article
  7. +2
    3 September 2012 11: 05
    delirium say, untruth ...
    well, well, and so, "mighty ukry"

    1. +1
      3 September 2012 11: 21
      Quote: Stas57
      delirium say, untruth ...
      well, well, and so, "mighty ukry"


      For the sake of justice, it should be noted that nowhere, it seems, does it say directly that "they are our mighty ancestors!" But the Tripillian farmer of the 6th (!!) millennium BC, copied from the Ukrainian of the 19th century, really delivered! laughing
      I admit - I was wrong. P.R.I.D.U.R.K.O.V. enough everywhere. And Ukrainian is no better than ours.
    2. +6
      3 September 2012 11: 35
      It’s funny that ukhistorics separate their history from the Slavs and Slavic states, only in order to alienate their pseudo-national state of Ukraine from any ties with Russia.
      1. shkodnik
        0
        28 September 2012 22: 32
        Is Russia a Slavic state?
        1. +5
          28 November 2020 18: 45
          Are not the majority of the people of Russia Slavs?
  8. loc.bejenari
    +3
    3 September 2012 11: 27
    well, another nonsense on the topic of the great protoucras - the builders of the pyramids and protorusses - the flows of Neanderthals mutated under the influence of cosmic radiation
    well got these constantly published delusional writings
    all that is possible is distorted or far-fetched
    1. +2
      3 September 2012 11: 47
      Got it - do not read. And I got you like, who believe that there are only two points of view: yours and wrong. Are you a historian, archaeologist, or even just interested in history? I love History and I am interested in any points of view.
      1. 0
        3 September 2012 11: 56
        Quote: dimitriy
        I love History and I am interested in any points of view.


        And this is very good.
        I am also interested in a variety of points of view. When they are supported by the alleged evidence.
        Keyword - sane.
        1. +1
          3 September 2012 12: 03
          May I ask - what is "sane" evidence in your understanding?
          1. +2
            3 September 2012 12: 21
            Yes yes dimitriy
            such a comment
            "..Yes, there are only two points of view:
            - Proven.
            и
            - Unsubstantiated, fabulous .. "
            ...
            Here the most valuable thing is ... proven.
            Based on ... fairy tales.
        2. Pinochet000
          0
          3 September 2012 13: 39
          About Arkaim, what do you say? About the Russian language, have something to say?

          Az (a). God living on earth created. But there are other deep images: primordially, the source, the one, the only, the man. The images, it seems, are different, but they have one essence. The image could change if another image, narrating, had a different structural meaning. And for these two images to interact, they had to be coordinated with each other. Therefore, there were images of the vowel, and between them the images are consistent. Now we have just vowels and consonants. But when vowels say, the modern person does not have a question - what do they say? If the letters are consonants, then consonants with what? Coordinations are different, so there are more consonants. And each of them also has its own image. But as in runes, each subsequent image affects the previous one, so the runic word was read in one direction, and the image of its structural meaning was read in the opposite order. So here, the images seem to be different, but the essence is the same. Initially, the source - this also means movement, direction specifically to this image. The point from which the rays went, rays containing deep images. Initially, the source, the one have, as it were, a homogeneous structure, a single form: "that which was above all." Therefore, the numerical value of Az - 1.
          Just one letter ... Explain why the mainland eurasia is divided up along the ural ridge and why do they say a pilot speaker or tank speaker, or speaker of their business? And what is Asia? And why the name is EUR-a-Asia. EUR and AZ in coincidence I do not believe.
          1. 0
            3 September 2012 14: 29
            Quote: Pinochet000
            About Arkaim, what do you say?


            I did not understand the question, to be honest.
            What can I say? Well, there is such an archaeological monument, so what?

            Quote: Pinochet000
            About the Russian language, have something to say?

            Quote: Pinochet000
            Just one letter ... Explain why the mainland eurasia is divided up along the ural ridge and why do they say a pilot speaker or tank speaker, or speaker of their business? And what is Asia? And why the name is EUR-a-Asia. EUR and AZ in coincidence I do not believe.


            Peculiar ...
            Do you really not know where these names came from? The word Asia, as you know, was used by the Assyrians. Pronounced, sort of like an asu or an astsu. And designated the direction in which the sun rises. The Greeks designated the Asians who called the sunrise Asu and named the places of their residence Asia. This is where the term Asia came from.
            By the way, the border between Europe and Asia is drawn quite arbitrarily. Often they consider it the Caucasian, not the Ural ridge.

            Well, the word ace in the meaning that you are talking about came from French, where it means ace. As an ace beats any card, an expert ace outperforms (must surpass) anyone in his field. Simple association, nothing more.
            1. Pinochet000
              +1
              3 September 2012 14: 41
              Quote: Roman-75
              Do you really not know where these names came from? The word Asia, as you know, was used by the Assyrians.
              This is just a hypothesis: The name Asia is mentioned in the "Iliad" of Homer and introduced into the scientific circulation by the authors of the Milesian school Thales, Anaximander, Hecateus. The etymology is widespread, according to which the word Asia is derived from the Phoenician or Assyrian asu "east". However, the application of this version raises questions: if the Assyrians came up with this name, why did they use the word “east” to name the territory lying west of Assyria? And if the name was given to the Greeks, for whom Asia is really in the east, then why did they use a foreign language?
              Quote: Roman-75
              Well, the word ace in the meaning that you are talking about came from French, where it means ace. As an ace beats any card, an expert ace outperforms (must surpass) anyone in his field. Simple association, nothing more.

              Did the Aces live in the mythological Asgard? And what is ACCA in your opinion?
              1. Pinochet000
                +1
                3 September 2012 14: 55
                ,
                Quote: Roman-75
                where it means ace.

                Ace in French ace? That is, the highest card that beats everyone else ...... I already wrote that I do not believe in coincidence ... a word cannot match both in meaning and content, pronunciation.
                Az - Origin, Source, then where did everything come from. You know, you begin to understand the phrase "You are told in Russian."
                1. 0
                  3 September 2012 15: 20
                  Quote: Pinochet000
                  I already wrote that I do not believe in coincidences ... a word cannot coincide both in meaning and content, pronunciation.


                  Yes, it can easily.
                  If survived from some kind of stub of language (languages) that existed in ancient times, in the era of "Aryan unity".
                  After all, I hope you are not surprised by the coincidence of the words water, water, wasser?
                  1. Pinochet000
                    +3
                    3 September 2012 15: 49
                    Quote: Roman-75
                    After all, I hope you are not surprised by the coincidence of the words water, water, wasser?
                    No, of course, like ALa (tyr), where AL is everything, tyry-carry or Al (thai) where is the end, the tielet is the end of summer or for example ALGA by Turki, where AL-EVERYTHING, GA is movement - Verbs (r ) Movement, expiration, direction. When a person speaks, he directs his thought to someone or something, i.e. Information transfer is carried out according to the following scheme: emitter (mouth) - a stream of sound information (speech, verb) - receiver (ears).
                    GA - (summarized): path, movement. But if you read in the images, the GA is “a stream coming from its original origin (source); that which began somewhere, and it flows, if there is no limit to it. ” And the image of the approved source over Tai. Taylet - the month of the end of the Summer (year).
                    Tai + GA - is the "end of the path; the end to the beaten and established flow. ”
                    GA + TH - “beaten, i.e. the created path ", where TB is the hardness of the path, while created" compare and English GOU or ALL, German
                    Alles, only in Russian it is confirmed by images of capital letters, which are absent in European languages.
                    1. Green
                      0
                      3 September 2012 15: 57
                      Quote: Pinochet000
                      Alles ......


                      That's for sure. Full alles kaput. laughing laughing laughing
                      What do we smoke? laughing
                      1. Pinochet000
                        0
                        3 September 2012 16: 09
                        Quote: Green
                        What do we smoke?
                        To say that is what?
                      2. Green
                        0
                        3 September 2012 17: 19
                        Quote: Pinochet000
                        To say that is what?


                        No, I do not smoke and do not smell. Well, maybe a little white for the holiday.
                        So alas, we are on different waves. laughing
                      3. Pinochet000
                        0
                        3 September 2012 17: 31
                        Quote: Pinochet000
                        only in Russian is this confirmed by the images of capital letters, which are absent in European languages.

                        Quote: Green
                        So alas, we are on different waves.

                        You just have nothing to say. Yes
                      4. Green
                        0
                        3 September 2012 17: 39
                        Quote: Pinochet000
                        You just have nothing to say.


                        Why
                        I already told you everything I wanted. And on your experiences with linguofriction, too. You just don’t see what you don’t want to see.
                        However, this is the usual position of all kinds of "new historians". laughing
                      5. Pinochet000
                        +2
                        3 September 2012 17: 50
                        Quote: Green
                        I already told you everything I wanted

                        They said absolutely nothing.

                        Quote: Green
                        You just don’t see what you don’t want to see.

                        It probably concerns you more.
                        Quote: Pinochet000
                        only in Russian is this confirmed by the images of capital letters, which are absent in European languages.

                        That’s what you say, or blah blah blah again
                        Az, Gods, Lead, Verbs, Welcome ....
                      6. Green
                        0
                        3 September 2012 18: 06
                        Quote: Pinochet000
                        That’s what you say, or blah blah blah again
                        Az, Gods, Lead, Verbs, Welcome ....


                        What should I say to that? Letters and no more.
                        So same as Alpha, Betta, Gamma and others. wink
              2. 0
                3 September 2012 15: 06
                Quote: Pinochet000
                This is only a hypothesis: The name Asia is mentioned in Homer's Iliad and introduced into the scientific circulation by the authors of the Milesian school Thales, Anaximander, Hekatey. The etymology is widespread, according to which the word Asia is derived from the Phoenician or Assyrian asu "east". However, the application of this version raises questions: if the Assyrians came up with this name, why did they use the word “east” to name the territory lying west of Assyria? And if the name was given to the Greeks, for whom Asia is really in the east, then why did they use a foreign language?


                And why do Americans use the word borrowed from a foreign, Italian, language in the name of their country? wink
                And by the way, you read inattentively - I never wrote anywhere that the Assyrians called Asu East. Asu, according to the authors, meant sunrise, which for any inhabitants of the Earth happens precisely in the east. Asia from Asu already made the Greeks.

                Quote: Pinochet000
                Did the Aces live in the mythological Asgard?


                And hell knows. That's why it is mythological.
                There is, however, the opinion that aces could mean a distorted ansi, the name mentioned in Chinese chronicles in relation to, apparently, to the Parthians. It seems like the aces / ansi could have been deified by the ancestors of the Scandinavians who created the sagas after many, many centuries.
                But this is also a very speculative version.

                Quote: Pinochet000
                And what is ACCA in your opinion?


                No idea.
                And what is it? Enlighten!
              3. Green
                -1
                3 September 2012 15: 27
                Quote: Pinochet000
                And what is ACCA in your opinion?


                KYNO it was, "ASSA" was called. Probably the sacred meaning is also encrypted in the name. laughing
                And Caucasian - ACCA !!!
                Yes ... laughing
          2. Green
            0
            3 September 2012 15: 25
            Quote: Pinochet000
            Az (a). God living on earth created. .......


            Quote: Pinochet000
            Just one letter ... Explain why the mainland eurasia is divided along the Ural ridge and why they say the pilot-speaker or tank speaker, or speaker of their business?


            It is interesting to play with letters ... Az - As - Us or Uz ..... Uzbek !!! So maybe there, in Uzbekistan, there are traces of the Rus ??? laughing
            No, without jokes they certainly will be found there. Scythians wandered from those lands ...
            But a game of letters can do a lot, but only ... not where you need it. laughing
            1. Pinochet000
              +2
              3 September 2012 17: 28
              Quote: Green
              But the game of letters can do a lot, but only ... not where you need it
              Who needs it? I just think that all the evidence of our true history is in the Russian language, which carries much more information than it seems. It is greatly simplified, distorted, many images (words) and concepts are replaced by the opposite ... at the same time, the spelling is complicated. Pagans from the word language, you just need to remember it.
              1. Green
                +1
                3 September 2012 17: 43
                Quote: Pinochet000
                I just think that all the evidence of our true history is in the Russian language, which carries much more information than it seems. It is greatly simplified, distorted, many images (words) and concepts are replaced by the opposite ... at the same time, the spelling is complicated. Pagans from the word language, you just need to remember it.


                Language is such a thing, transformative. It does not stand still, but develops with society. Sometimes changing beyond recognition, and replacing one concept with another. So do not try to fish out something from the language. I have already given you a joking example with Samara. Once again, linguistic friction can be rewarded with such a thing that we generally become aliens from Alpha Centauri. laughing
                1. Pinochet000
                  0
                  4 September 2012 10: 54
                  Quote: Green
                  Language is such a thing, transformative. He does not stand still, but develops with society

                  Rather degrades with society.
                  Quote: Green
                  As well as Alpha, Betta, Gamma and others

                  Do they carry images? The meaning of the letters do not tell me?
        3. +1
          3 September 2012 14: 43
          Novel-75 (1) Today,
          I am also interested in a variety of points of view. When they are supported by the alleged evidence.
          Keyword - sanity
          --------------------------------------
          Well then, do you think the official Eauki’s point of view is that the pyramids in Egypt built their slaughter with the help of copper chisels, and the 120-ton blocks in Baalbek installed the Romans under their temple.
          1. 0
            3 September 2012 15: 11
            Quote: kosopuz
            Well then, do you think the official Eauki’s point of view is that the pyramids in Egypt built their slaughter with the help of copper chisels, and the 120-ton blocks in Baalbek installed the Romans under their temple.


            The pyramids and stones of Baalbek really exist, in contrast to Slovenska or the city of Russ. You can touch them, photograph them, measure them, take material for analysis, you can try to imagine (with varying degrees of reliability) how they were created.
            Do proponents of the version of fucking ancient Russia have similar arguments?
            1. loc.bejenari
              +1
              3 September 2012 15: 26
              Well, why, beneath Kiev is full of hillforts 2-3 thousand years old + Trypillians and Chernyakhovtsi are even more ancient
              drive in Google the Khodosovsky fortification - a huge structure with a moat and a shaft of five meters height - perfectly preserved - two kilometers across
              though no one can still understand - what purposes did it serve - either a corral for livestock or protection of the city from the wagons - there are absolutely no signs of permanent dwellings, such as in the neighboring Khotovsky
              but so far no one has thought of attributing its construction to the great protoucras
              it would be time laughing
              1. 0
                3 September 2012 15: 41
                Quote: loc.bejenari
                Well, why, beneath Kiev is full of hillforts 2-3 thousand years old + Trypillians and Chernyakhovtsi are even more ancient
                drive in Google the Khodosovsky fortification - a huge structure with a moat and a shaft of five meters height - perfectly preserved - two kilometers across
                though no one can still understand - what purposes did it serve - either a corral for livestock or protection of the city from the wagons - there are absolutely no signs of permanent dwellings, such as in the neighboring Khotovsky
                but so far no one has thought of attributing its construction to the great protoucras


                Yuri, yes, I know about them, of course. About Kruglik the same.
                But no one, thank God, will not seriously talk about them as the oldest cities in Russia ....

                Quote: loc.bejenari
                it would be time


                Yeah. Right
                And the loot from this raise. wink
                1. loc.bejenari
                  0
                  3 September 2012 15: 58
                  I’m talking about something - that there are really existing structures only in ancient Russia, they have nothing to do
                  Kruglik is the Khodosovsky settlement, of which there are 2 — small and large
                  next to them on the mountain is another ancient settlement just of the Old Russian period - serving as an outpost and guarding the road passing there
            2. Bars90
              0
              3 September 2012 22: 05
              What can you say about Arkaim and the Sungir excavation near Vladimir and many other places ... Excavations in Turkey, Bulgaria ... And everywhere there is one culture. The culture of ceramics and clay figures on which approximately the same symbols and runes are displayed. They are also connected by microlithic tools of labor and hunting ... I personally was at excavations of this kind. The solid facts. I can explain this to you, even until the morning ...
            3. +12
              28 November 2020 18: 55
              Quote: Roman-75
              "Slovenska" or "Grada Russa"

              According to some data, the "city of Slovenian" meant Novgorod, and the "city of Russ" Staraya Rusa, but he is not sure.
      2. Green
        0
        3 September 2012 12: 00
        Quote: dimitriy
        there are only two points of view: yours and wrong.


        Yes, there are only two points of view:
        - Proven.
        и
        - Unproven, fabulous.

        Do you like popular fairy tales? Then THIS is for you but don’t say that you love History !!! For THIS is far from History.
        1. +3
          3 September 2012 12: 25
          Proven? Are you kidding me? In the story you are talking about, one thing is proved today, and the opposite will be proved tomorrow. And modern Russia is an example of this. Thirty years ago, official history told us that the revolution made us all happy and brought with it sane and indisputable evidence! In the 90s, textbooks began to be rewritten, introducing the exact opposite. The same applies to WWII. What to believe? And I believe the story of my grandmother (popular stories - in your opinion). Before the revolution, they had a prosperous large family, and by the year 25 out of 11 children there were two. For me, this is a very evidential story.
          1. loc.bejenari
            -3
            3 September 2012 14: 49
            to your question about archeology - yes, I am engaged in military archeology - returning for a worthy burial of our fallen soldiers
            and therefore no local patriot will prove to me that our losses in the Second World War are equal to German - the difference in the number of fighters raised by 41 years with German burials is too great
            and the Germans - I confess honestly - I never found it - even in 43
            but about the fact that I don’t like this pseudoscientific nonsense, look with a sound mind, everything is far-fetched based on linguistics — although the language has changed very much even over the course of 100 years — and here linguistics is thousands of years old
            I’m not sure if any of us would understand what the inhabitants of Kiev in the 9th century say.
            By the way, the Norman version closest to reality - it is fully consistent with what was happening in Europe in the era of the Norman conquest
            I don’t understand. I have my own path. laughing
            but sometimes include common sense and not reading about Scythian and Rus laughing
            1. 0
              3 September 2012 16: 23
              You know, I also had an acquaintance of an archaeologist-digger, but he was interested in something else, he wrapped him full of rings with SS runes, cockades with skulls and badges with the inscription "Gott mit uns". I live in Rostov-on-Don and there is enough of this stuff in the vicinity. But it's not that. And the fact that common sense just prompts to study and analyze all the information. To divide everything into black and white is wrong
            2. +1
              4 September 2012 04: 25
              loc.bejenari,
              Come to Stalingrad (Germans from 1942 to 1943) along the beams and steppes where you can dig through the war - there are many more.
  9. 0
    3 September 2012 14: 52
    Novel-75 (1)
    It seems that you own the question, it seems to be competently reasoning, but for some reason you do not want to answer uncomfortable questions and quickly transfer the conversation to other topics. Not the best method of gaining respect or authority.
    Well, about the AU - in your style - be so kind as to give SPECIFIC evidence of the origin of the word from the French ace. And I beg you, do not repeat the official Western nonsense, namely sane evidence.
    1. 0
      3 September 2012 15: 15
      Quote: Arkt
      Well, about the AU - in your style - be so kind as to give SPECIFIC evidence of the origin of the word from the French ace. And I beg you, do not repeat the official Western nonsense, namely sane evidence.


      Dictionary of the French language. In the absence of such - the English dictionary will come down.
      1. s1н7т
        0
        3 September 2012 17: 58
        By the way, in German the same thing)
        1. Geton
          0
          3 September 2012 18: 56
          The Germans called ases "experts"
    2. Green
      +1
      3 September 2012 15: 29
      Quote: Arkt
      namely, sane evidence.


      Is there any reasonable evidence of what is written in the article? Do they have sane and reinforced concrete evidence for those who dispute official versions?
      No, just speculation.
      So why do you need to take speculation at face value and not believe generally accepted concepts ?? !!
  10. bask
    +3
    3 September 2012 15: 47
    Modern history is a complete lie. Composed by the Memets in the reign of German Catherine 2 To depict Russians ,,, barbarians ,,, capable of being controlled only by ,, civilized ,,, rulers. Evidence of the Indian Vedas. Age over 5 and thousands of years. By the way, the river with the name Ganges is the Arkhangelsk region .. Evidence doh ... !!!
    1. Green
      +1
      3 September 2012 15: 56
      Quote: bask
      Modern history is a telling lie. Composed by the Memets in the reign of German Catherine 2 To portray Russians ,,, barbarians ,,, capable of being controlled only by ,,, civilized ,,, rulers.


      Well, you should not go too far. It is IMPOSSIBLE to distort the whole story.
      That is, it turns out that it was before the XVIII - all lies?
      Stupidity.


      Quote: bask
      Evidence doh ... !!!



      Which ones? Why?
      Doh ... nonsense of pseudoscientific, delirium of feverish and banal raising of grandmas on fictional sensations. This is up to this very .... me.
      1. s1н7т
        0
        3 September 2012 18: 00
        It is IMPOSSIBLE to distort the whole story.
        ___________________________________
        At a time - no, of course, but for 400 years - easy!)))
        1. Green
          0
          3 September 2012 18: 13
          Quote: c1n7
          At a time - no, of course, but for 400 years - easy!)))


          Which is easy?
          What about the remaining historical and cultural monuments around the world? Or are they not there either? Or is it global falsification?
          Easy ... No, not so easy.
    2. 0
      3 September 2012 16: 04
      Quote: bask
      Modern history is a complete lie. Composed by the Memets in the reign of German Catherine 2 To depict Russians ,,, barbarians ,,, capable of being controlled only by ,, civilized ,,, rulers. Evidence of the Indian Vedas. Age over 5 and thousands of years. By the way, the river with the name Ganges is the Arkhangelsk region .. Evidence doh ... !!!


      Oh my God...
      Listen, is it really impossible to understand such a simple thing from one time that names can in no way serve as evidence of anything? Well, there is such a river, and then what? Belarus and Paris are, so is Belarus a department of France? laughing
      1. +3
        3 September 2012 16: 20
        Novel-75 with mates
        And yet, no matter how you criticize such publications, it is often quite right, but you cannot but recognize that the very fact of many publications of this kind is the result of the engagement, deceit and inertness of modern official science, which rewrites a hundred times before our eyes. for the day, even those historical periods that we are living witnesses.
        And what can we say about ancient history?
        1. 0
          3 September 2012 16: 27
          Quote: kosopuz
          And yet, no matter how you criticize such publications, it is often quite right, but you cannot but recognize that the very fact of many publications of this kind is the result of the engagement, deceit and inertness of modern official science, which rewrites a hundred times before our eyes. for the day, even those historical periods that we are living witnesses.
          And what can we say about ancient history?


          All true.
          However, trying to correct the inconsistencies of official science, you do not need to pile up your own nonsense. And this article and the like do not look like a parish parish.
        2. Pinochet000
          +3
          3 September 2012 16: 30
          it is the result of the bias, deceit and inertness of modern official science, which before our eyes rewrites a hundred times a day even those historical periods of which we are living witnesses.
          And what can we say about ancient history?

          Absolutely agree!
        3. Green
          0
          3 September 2012 17: 16
          Quote: kosopuz
          Novel-75 with mates
          And yet, no matter how you criticize such publications, it is often quite right, but you cannot but recognize that the very fact of many publications of this kind is the result of the engagement, deceit and inertness of modern official science, which rewrites a hundred times before our eyes. for the day, even those historical periods that we are living witnesses.
          And what can we say about ancient history?


          Now, most of the "works" on the history of antiquity, any antiquity or history in general, that are printed in thousands of copies, unfortunately, are not a search for truth, these are purely commercial projects and nothing more. And the cooler the author wraps up, the more books will sell out and the more the author will get some money.
          So, draw conclusions about certain conclusions yourself. wink
  11. +3
    3 September 2012 16: 17
    Bileberds and the author and commentators have written a lot!

    I agree with the author on one thing - the topic of pre-Christian Russia is under the tacit ban in culture and in official history. Hence a lot of near-scientific speculation on this subject and a huge number of pseudo-historians.

    In bookstores you can find myths of ancient Greece, Scandinavian sagas, even Tanzanian legends! But editions with the mythology of Ancient Rus - "in the afternoon with fire" can not be found. A growing son often asks - where are the Russian ancient heroes, gods, like among the ancient Greeks or Vikings? What should he answer or give to read, at his seven years old? Maybe Rybakova?
    1. -1
      3 September 2012 16: 30
      Quote: saruman
      In bookstores you can find myths of ancient Greece, Scandinavian sagas, even Tanzanian legends! But editions with the mythology of Ancient Rus - "in the afternoon with fire" can not be found. A growing son often asks - where are the Russian ancient heroes, gods, like among the ancient Greeks or Vikings?


      Namesake, you’re living in Nizhny, is it really so shitty with books in such a large and cultural city ?!
      Strange ... In our remote province, it’s not a problem to get such literature.
      1. 0
        3 September 2012 17: 26
        Quote: Roman-75
        You namesake, do you live in Nizhny Novgorod, is it really so shitty with books in such a large and cultural city?! Strange ... We, in a remote province, have no problem getting such literature.


        "Scientifically" (pseudo-scientific) -popular is full, but to read to children there is nothing. Or you can throw off a link to some publication like "Myths and Legends of the Ancient Slavs" with pictures and with clear (adapted) text for schoolchildren.
    2. Green
      -1
      3 September 2012 17: 17
      Quote: saruman
      But editions with the mythology of Ancient Russia - "in the afternoon with fire" can not be found.


      Yes you ?
      We have these books in any bookstore. For every taste, color and wallet.
    3. saper
      -1
      3 September 2012 17: 29
      Quote: saruman
      What should he answer or give read in his seven years?

      Well, certainly not this nonsense about the Scythians! Scythians are Iranian-speaking people i.e. they are relatives to the Persians and therefore to the Tajiks! this is probably why Tajiks are so drawn to Moscow - damn ancestral homeland laughing
      PS and what Ilya Muromets does not suit you?
    4. s1н7т
      -2
      3 September 2012 18: 02
      Thanks to Orthodoxy for this!
    5. +16
      28 November 2020 19: 11
      Quote: saruman
      What answer or give him to read, at his seven years old? Maybe Rybakova?

      Fishermen are too heavy for a child. I would recommend reading folk tales and epics about Svyatogor, Ilya Muromets. The book by Svetlana Lavrova "Slavic mythology", also look at the literature at the link https://www.rodnovery.ru/spisok-literatury
  12. bask
    +2
    3 September 2012 16: 52
    Roma 75th you put on a Slavic swastika. Which, by the way, is also 5 thousand years old. Facts in the light The golden disk is deciphered Menoan civilization 2.5 thousand years before the era. correspond to it.
    1. Fox 070
      +1
      3 September 2012 19: 38
      Quote: bask
      in the place of the swastikas of the Slavs, fasten a star better. You correspond to it.

      Just in case, I send a picture to the avatar and, well, a password FOR ITS OWNERS.
  13. 0
    3 September 2012 17: 03
    Quote: bask
    Facts into the light Deciphered the golden disk Menoan civilization 2.5 thousand years BC.


    Well, if you also decipher the Phaistos disc, as you express your thoughts in Russian, I'm not surprised. So you can really prove anything.
    1. Green
      0
      3 September 2012 17: 31
      Quote: Roman-75
      Well, if you also decrypt the Phaistos disc


      Is it decrypted?
      1. -1
        3 September 2012 20: 26
        Quote: Green
        Is it decrypted?


        Didn't you know ?!
        Hurray patriots (and not only Russians, Bulgarians and Czechs also noted) long ago read it. laughing Flies and at times. In modern Russian. laughing
    2. Kshatriy
      +1
      3 September 2012 19: 18
      Roman 75,
      In terms of the manner of conducting dialogues, the ability to slip away from all topics that are undesirable for you, you perfectly (just superbly) mastered the format of disputes set forth in your favorite brochure - "Protocols of the Elders of Zion." ........ well, in general - a Jew (for another name of your nation, hidden by me - under the ellipsis - I am mercilessly banned) ... Be so kind as to tell us - to the Russians - to the pig-eaters - to the pagan barbarians, from whom a member you yourself have an "avatar" - something like this. ??? ... Yes, even a field with a hint of heraldic affiliation zabatatsya ....... Don't you think that: "a hat is not on Senka" ????? ??????
      1. -1
        3 September 2012 20: 37
        Quote: Kshatriya
        In terms of the manner of conducting dialogues, the ability to slip away from all topics that are undesirable for you, you perfectly (just superbly) mastered the format of disputes set forth in your favorite brochure - "Protocols of the Elders of Zion." ........ well, in general - a Jew (for another name of your nation, hidden by me - under the ellipsis - they ban me mercilessly) ...


        Kshatriy, thanks!
        Thank you, because "a minute of laughter prolongs life by a year", and I frankly laughed at your post for five minutes. wink Determining nationality by way of dialogue is cool! lol This, let me paraphrase the greats, is "a stronger thing" Mein Kampf "Schicklgruber"! He even looked at his appearance, but you immediately, in absentia, not knowing a single gram of a person, you define his "Jewishness"! laughing
        Well, in order to reassure the nationally preoccupied once and for all, I inform you that I am a purebred Slav. Mom is half Ukrainian, father is half Belarus. The remaining halves, essno, Russian. I managed to trace my kind for about 160 years in depth, so there, besides the Slavs, there are no blood relatives.
        Calm down, gentlemen cheers patriots? wink

        Quote: Kshatriya
        Be so kind as to tell us - to the Russians - to the pig-eaters - to the pagans - to the barbarians, from whom did you make an "avatar" for yourself? does not seem that: "the hat is not according to Senka" ???????????


        Do not you think that this is purely none of your business, what is my profile picture?
        Well, if this question really bothers me - look at my posts, I already somehow explained to one stubborn forum member where I got the picture from.
        1. Kshatriy
          +1
          3 September 2012 20: 49
          Quote: Roman-75
          I am a purebred Slav.

          ........ I also laughed for a long time ....... (there are purebred current dogs) .....
  14. bask
    +3
    3 September 2012 17: 32
    I agree thoughts are jumping. Menoets, Etruscans,, Huns. , Scythians, Slavs. These are the historical names of the Russians. Genetic tests taken from the brahmanas showed 70% similarity with the inhabitants of the Russian North. Roma 75 change suit
  15. s1н7т
    +1
    3 September 2012 18: 07
    The article is about nothing, however. How can the indicated "manuscript" be considered as any primary source? Most of the "artifacts" were written by Christian (Orthodox) scribes of history. The real primary sources that were available were destroyed for the good of the ROC (or whatever it was called then). Today, in my opinion, there are only 2 or 3 pre-Christian texts, according to which history cannot be restored.
  16. serge
    +9
    3 September 2012 18: 14
    And why do not we believe our own chronicles, which quite simply explain the origin of the Russian and Slavic families? We believe in the idiotic nonsense of the Jewish chronicles of the Old Testament about the origin of the Jewish people, who crawled the sea dry land and roamed the desert for 40 years without food and drink. Why on earth do the Hebrew and ancient Greek annals tell the truth, but ours lie? And why do we have to prove something? Written with a pen, you can’t cut it with an ax. This is our story, whether foreigners like it or not.
    1. s1н7т
      0
      3 September 2012 19: 57
      Are you dumb? This "chronicle" of the 16th century. By definition, it has nothing to do with the origin of Russians. Estimate the time difference, if that. Well, if you believe in biblical nonsense, then do not tell your loved ones - they will be sent to a psychiatric hospital)))
    2. -2
      3 September 2012 20: 48
      Quote: serge
      And why do not we believe our own chronicles, which quite simply explain the origin of the Russian and Slavic families? We believe in the idiotic nonsense of the Jewish chronicles of the Old Testament about the origin of the Jewish people, who crawled the sea dry land and roamed the desert for 40 years without food and drink. Why on earth do the Hebrew and ancient Greek annals tell the truth, but ours lie? And why do we have to prove something? Written with a pen, you can’t cut it with an ax. This is our story, whether foreigners like it or not.


      So the fact of the matter is that biblical history is verified by completely scientific methods. Much of what is written in the Bible is confirmed by archaeological excavations, archival research, etc. etc. It goes without saying that among the biblical texts there are full and frank inventions, the authenticity of which is either clearly refuted, doubtful, or unprovable. To believe or not to believe in these tales is a personal matter for everyone. But the main points may well be investigated and confirmed. For example, it would never occur to anyone to refute the existence of Jerusalem - there he has been standing for more than a thousand years, go to Israel and see for yourself if you have a desire and opportunity.
      But cheers-patriotic stories about unrealistically ancient cities in the north-west of Russia, well, nothing, well, nothing is confirmed. How many years they have been digging in that area, but at least kill yourself, they don’t find anything!
      1. Bars90
        +5
        3 September 2012 21: 56
        Jerusalim and the Jordan River or Yardon were the territory of residence of the tribal settlements remaining from Jericho, as well as the Assurians and many other tribes. The Semites came from the south for ready-made food, without weapons and tools. Although the Old Testament says that they had a weapon ... Sheer profanation. The current scientific world, which is based on Jewish foundations, is afraid of new discoveries in biblical archeology ... Otherwise, otherwise everything will have to be rewritten anew. But with what letter and with what word will this "anew" begin ... Let's see.
      2. +1
        3 September 2012 22: 05
        There are a lot of lies in the official history of Russia and this is not disputed! Just because both Germans and Jews put their hands on it and who the hell knows! but the fact that in the end we all bent !!! And we have the largest country and we are the largest European people on the planet! good
        After a hundred years, our eyes will open on what we are not at point blank range! And on our own history and on the history of mankind, we will look differently!
        We do not know the magnitude and consequences of the disasters that occurred thousands of years ago, but one thing is clear that the information that was contained in the stone or giant structures of the Baalbek, the pyramids, etc. could reach us. or in the language of myths and legends!
        For example, if we build something like the sphinx in the north, then after 10000 years, even dust will not stop from it.
        But the fact that we are now inventing for ourselves the story that we want to see is ridiculous.
        And to us Russians (MaloRoss, BeloRussam) that glorious history that our great ancestors left us, even for this 1000 years, would have been enough for a hundred peoples! The main story is still in front of us!
        1. Zmitcer
          -9
          3 September 2012 22: 45
          Quote: concept1
          And we Russian (MaloRoss, BeloRussam) that glorious history that our great ancestors left us
          Our entire glorious history of the Litvinians, or as you call Belarusians, is primarily a struggle against the invaders: Germans and Muscovites.
          1. +2
            3 September 2012 23: 11
            What other Litvinians I mean about Belarusians !!! Soon we will live in one state !!! wink
            1. Zmitcer
              -2
              3 September 2012 23: 45
              Quote: concept1

              What more Litvinov

              ... yes there was such a state before the occupation by the Muscovites, the Grand Duchy of Lithuania, Ruskoe and Zhamoistkoe, and its inhabitants were called Litvin, respectively. You don’t know the elementary, but you are discussing what kind of science fiction, about Vandalov, Slovenian and other nonsense, written by one of the followers of Karamzin, another “historian”. wassat
              1. +1
                4 September 2012 10: 00
                Well, go to your place in Lithuania, what problems!
                1. Zmitcer
                  0
                  4 September 2012 11: 50
                  Quote: concept1
                  Well, you go to your place in Lithuania what problems
                  and you go to Africa. laughing
                  where does Lithuania? I’m not going to be engaged in your education, but still I’ll notice that ON is Belarus.
                  1. Kostya pedestrian
                    -1
                    10 September 2012 17: 39
                    Respected. Lithuania has everything.
                    but what is on ... a fork or something? ah-ah, such a pure apostolic scribe, but you damn it, not in Natoleon style!
                    my roots go deep into Lithuania and Lithuania has always been distinguished by the fact that it added (red), and did not rob it, and even from its own. note that the great Ivan Vasilyevich was on mother Glinsky.

                    I ask as a co-citizen Lithuanian, do not fall for a hook with Western bait.

                    Do not forget Great Russia has both the Kremlin and St. Petersburg, ... oil, gas, gold ... and we have liberators of "Ukrainians" in the 15th century (?) Only pushers and oak groves ...!
                  2. +9
                    28 November 2020 19: 16
                    The territory of modern Belarus was, in modern terms, occupied by the Grand Duchy of Lithuania. So there is no need to equate Belarus and Lithuania.
  17. serge
    +2
    3 September 2012 21: 11
    "Roman-75 (1)". The Russians are called jingoistic patriots. He considers Jewish excavations in the Arab city occupied by Jews to be proof of the existence of Jewish history invented in modern times. The Russian city of Veliky Novgorod (= Slovensk) is considered to have never existed and was not found by anyone during excavations. Avatar - a swastika, a skull in pursuit. SS Division "Death's Head". Judging by the attributes, the "honorary Aryan" of the Reich. Hurray-Jew.
    1. Green
      0
      3 September 2012 21: 46
      Quote: serge
      Russian calls cheers-patriots.


      I think you are bending it.


      Quote: serge
      Evidence of the existence of Jewish history invented in modern times by Jews is considered by Jewish excavations in the Arab city occupied by Jews.


      What does the Jews and Jerusalem have to do with it?
      Read about the civilizations of Mesopotamia, Egypt, the Cretan-Mycenaean culture and others and others around the world.
      Is this what the Jews invented? What does the Jews have to do with it?
      Name or show the traces of any city of Russia, which is more than one and a half thousand years old? And what would it be exactly the Russian city.
    2. Zmitcer
      -1
      3 September 2012 23: 28
      I am sure that many "Rusyns", "Great Russians" in% ratio to the rest, no more Slavic than the ratio of brain to total weight in a pig. laughing Moreover, I do not understand these attacks on Jews. Jews lived in Belarus for a long time, in some cities, they were the majority among the population. So what?! at least they did not kill, did not destroy us, as the Russian "brothers" Slavs did. Tell me it's not. angry Let us recall the Livonian War, the division of the Political Speech, the punitive campaign of Suvorov, the division of Belarus by the Germans and Bolsheviks led by Lenin, the 300 destroyed by Stalin's regime ... this is the price of "friendship" - millions of those killed. And you say ...
      1. +4
        4 September 2012 09: 34
        And I think that closer to the truth is the post of one of the readers of the Eye of the Planet from http://oko-planet.su/first/135719-pochemu-zapadu-nuzhna-rossiya-bl228tter-f252r-
        deutsche-und-internationale-politik-.html
        -------------------------------------------------- -----------------------

        Drop it. In fact, everything is easier. The main motivation of Brzezinski in the zoological (centuries-old) hatred of the Pole for Russian and Russia.

        Almost everyone knows what the Mongol yoke is. But almost no one understands that there was a Polish yoke. And much worse than the Mongolian.

        The point is evident in the silence of this regrettable fact by Soviet historiography.
        And the border of the Polish Empire passed along the very Moscow region. And in the 1610 year, they even captured Moscow. So 90% of the original Russian lands a couple of centuries were in Polish slavery.
        Naturally! And the Mongols were far from the Poles .. on the part of robbery, bloodthirstiness and contempt for the Russian people .. which was called the Poles by their word -

        And a kind of "miserable" ... ragged Moscow principality ... on the outskirts of the oikumene ... Suddenly it began to grow and gain strength. It took away from the Poles "their kresy" .. with all the "cattle" ... And the "cattle" of the gentry did not even have the right to life. Any small ambassador could hang up .. cook, etc. Just walking by ... could chop off a head or an arm, checking the sharpening of a saber.

        And this "ruffled" Moscow principality took the "legitimate" Polish place ... and deprived them of both ambition and a feeding trough.

        Muscovite will not understand. . But I know what I'm saying. And my great-grandmother from Uzhgorod even the Turks remembered ... not that the Austrians. and (Especially !!!) the Poles.

        Of course, you can talk for a long time.

        But! I pay attention at last! Arguing about geopolitics, it is impossible not to take into account the deep mental incentives of certain peoples. Otherwise the constant risk of error. Otherwise, lack of understanding of many things.
        1. Zmitcer
          -2
          4 September 2012 11: 56
          Quote: kosopuz
          The point is evident in the silence of this regrettable fact by Soviet historiography.
          that's it!!! Everyone knows about the Moscow Ulus, about the Commonwealth, about the Mongol yoke and about evil Poles. But why do you forget about the Grand Duchy of Lithuania (modern Belarus)? why do you forget about the Litvin, who, in the battle on the Blue Waters, liberated Ukraine (Kiev, Podolia) from the so-called Tatar-Mongols ?! It was precisely the liberation, and not the internal Horde disassembly that occurred on the Kulikovo field.
          1. +15
            28 November 2020 19: 20
            Quote: Zmitcer
            in the Battle of Blue Waters, liberated Ukraine (Kiev, Podillia)

            When liberated, the liberated territory is given independence. Podillia, after the battle on Blue Waters, became part of the ON. That is, ON just captured Podolia. The inhabitants of Podillya changed one invader to another.
      2. Kshatriy
        0
        4 September 2012 14: 21
        Quote: Zmitcer
        I am sure that many "Rusyns", "Great Russians" in% ratio to the rest, no more Slavic than the ratio of brain to total weight in a pig.

        Quote: Zmitcer
        section of the Commonwealth, the punitive campaign of Suvorov,

        Yes, for such words, such as you are the most dear and in the tolerant Twenty-first century, one should cut off the tongue and fingers so that they do not propagate interethnic discord ... I want to answer with the words of A.S. Pushkin: "Leave the dispute between the Slavs - between you." .... The Novgorod and Pskov spear regiments completely perished in 1410, having taken the blow of the "dogs of the knights" ... She, that under "Grunwald" Russia was defended there ... or their brothers Slavs ???? In what year on the territory of Zhemudia died the last western Dalai-Lama - Kriva ??? - Bother yourself at least reading, Karamzin, so beloved by you !!!
        In the wrong place, you started pushing "dyadzybao" about Rzhech Pospolita .... And one more thing ... if you are so stubbornly promoting your belonging to the gentry --- be so kind as your Shlyakhetsky coat of arms for all to see Expose please !!!
      3. +7
        28 November 2020 19: 22
        There are people like you ... Do you definitely belong to the Slavic people? Something I doubt ...
  18. Bars90
    +1
    3 September 2012 21: 48
    From Sloven came the true Slavs of Russia. However, it is worth saying that the Slavic clan later descended from the Aryan-Scythian branch. And these were the Wends. Wends venerate the Wenda son of Skif. We are direct descendants of the Indo-European, Russ, Indians, Protorusses. Our whole language is inflectional and all other languages, except English, have sprung from it ... And our true faith is Orthodoxy. It is much closer in essence to Russian Orthodoxy than to Judeo-Greek and Byzantine ... So it's time to understand who we are. And do not talk about the invasion of the yoke, if it was not at all. We are distinctive in nature ...
  19. 12Ural12
    -1
    3 September 2012 22: 11
    Is there nothing new?
  20. bask
    +1
    3 September 2012 22: 15
    Mr. Green According to your skeptical reviews of the ancient history of Russia. You have not been given a single counterargument. You probably think that the history of the USA is 2000 years old. And not Russia.
    1. Green
      0
      3 September 2012 22: 24
      Quote: bask

      Mr. Green According to your skeptical reviews of the ancient history of Russia. You have not been given a single counterargument. You probably think that the history of the USA is 2000 years old. And not Russia.


      Mr. Bask, I know how many years of US history. And what does the USA have to do with it?
      I do not have skeptical reviews about the Ancient History of Russia, but only about all the nonsense that they are trying to pass off here as this very History.
      By the way, they also issue ABSOLUTELY NOT ARGUMENTED.
      If you know the Ancient History of Russia so well, then I’ll ask again:
      - Show me evidence that 2000 or more years ago, a powerful Civilization existed here on the territory of Russia, and it was UNCONDABLY ours - Russian civilization. Show me the cities, roads, coins of this Civilization.
      From others: Crito-Mycenaean, Greek, Mesopotamian, Egyptian, Indian, MASSA of monuments remained. And from the ANCIENT RUSSIAN?
      Well, I'm waiting ....
      1. Kshatriy
        +1
        4 September 2012 14: 42
        Quote: Green
        Indian remained a mass of monuments. And from the ANCIENT RUSSIAN?
        Well, I'm waiting ....

        Well, I’m answering ... although I’m tired of ... enlightening not enlightened (by the way, don’t nuk, don’t harness)
        Sanskrit .... 95% - coincidences in the roots of words with the Russian language (All Brahmans, as well as the Dalai Lama of Tibet knowing Sanskrit --- understand the Russian language WITHOUT an TRANSLATOR) ...... In 1700, the Emperor of All Russia Peter - canceled the Vedic Slavic calendar ... well, do not be surprised, but according to that calendar, summer is in the courtyard of 7520th from the Creation of the World in the "Star Temple" .... A hat with a star "Lucifer" squeezes your skull with a steel hoop ?? ? .... live my dear, you - live ......
        1. Zmitcer
          -1
          4 September 2012 19: 34
          Quote: Kshatriya
          .95% - matches in the roots of words with the Russian language
          with which Russian? or do you mean Bulgarian, on the basis of which modern Russian was created? Or who forgot to print your books, besides Litvin? laughing
          although of course about some 95% roots - complete nonsense. wassat
          Quote: Kshatriya
          canceled the Vedic Slavic calendar
          and what? Where are the monuments? - there was a question !! fool
          1. Green
            0
            4 September 2012 19: 48
            Quote: Zmitcer
            and what? Where are the monuments? - there was a question !!


            Yes, they have no answer to these questions. No. Where from ?! wink
        2. Green
          0
          4 September 2012 19: 48
          Quote: Kshatriya
          Well, I’m answering ... although I’m tired of ... enlightening not enlightened (by the way, don’t nuk, don’t harness)
          Sanskrit .... 95% - coincidences in the roots of words with the Russian language (All Brahmans, as well as the Dalai Lama of Tibet knowing Sanskrit --- understand the Russian language WITHOUT an TRANSLATOR) ...... In 1700, the Emperor of All Russia Peter - canceled the Vedic Slavic calendar ... well, do not be surprised, but according to that calendar, summer is in the courtyard of 7520th from the Creation of the World in the "Star Temple" .... A hat with a star "Lucifer" squeezes your skull with a steel hoop ?? ? .... live my dear, you - live ......


          In Turkey, almost everyone understands Russian, so what? laughing
          In general, fly to Tibet or to India, climb into what thread is a monastery or a remote village and try to chat in Russian there. Will they understand? I doubt it ... Sanskrit, you see .... laughing
          The hat is not shaking me. And with a star life was BETTER !!! There were fewer obscurantists, they were kept on a chain. wink
          By the way, I did not see the answer to my question. Which is not surprising, since you, the fomenconoids, have no answer to it.
          Teach the materiel, teach it not too late. And maybe even sooner. Maybe what schoolboy are you? Then yes, then it’s clear. laughing
  21. Horde
    +1
    3 September 2012 22: 50
    "The Legend about Slovenia, Ruse and the city of Slovensk SSRS", which Alexander Samsonov now offers us to analyze, was born in the form of more than 100 LISTS. copies of various kinds in the second half of the 17th century. ORIGINAL, as always, NO and nothing is known about him. The content of the legend is actually a CONFIRMATION of the "Radziwill Chronicle of the RL", although chronologically SSRS is an earlier document than the RL, which raises doubts, I think the SSRS is a document rather from the 18th century than from the 17th century.
    The content of the SSRS is such that with a direct text it is stated that Veliky Novgorod VN was founded by our ancestors on the river. Volkhov. It’s good that they don’t fill in that the Ruriks were Varangians. But VN on Volkhov does not fit in any other Russian annals, nor in any other considerations dictated by common sense.
    From the annals it is known that the VN is the BIGGEST medieval state, very strong and very rich. In fact, the VN on Volkhov does not look large, and therefore strong and rich. In fact, the VN by the length of the fortress wall does not correspond to the largest Russian monasteries, the Yaroslavovo courtyard chronicles, something grandiose in size and sales actually looks like a small platform the size of a village gathering.
    In order to be a large shopping center, you must have GOOD
    trade routes, but this is precisely what VN does not have on Volkhov. The Volkhov River is navigable half the time of the year, but has thresholds inconvenient for shipping.

    Encyclopedic Dictionary F.A. Brockhaus and I.A. Efron
    The Volkhov or Ladoga rapids begin 1 verst below the Gostinopolsky pier, stretch 8 versts 200 fathoms to the village of Mikhail Archangel. V. there are 120 fathoms wide, the banks are rocky, steep, 110 feet high. Thresholds are located by ledges and consist of two parts, separated by a stretch of 3 versts. The upper part is Velitskaya near the village of Velsov; here the so-called Velitsky rub is especially inconvenient for shipping; in ancient times, ships were usually unloaded here and goods were transported by dry means to bypass thresholds. The Peter and Paul part of the rapids consists of 5 rubles and 4 stone braids. The bottom of the Volkhov rapids consists of limestone. Depth in spring is up to 21/2 arshins, in autumn, in shallow water 1 / 2-11 / 2 arshins, as a result of which most vessels are unloaded on special vessels by half and loaded again on the threshold. The fall of water in the Volkhov rapids 29 feet 6 inches, the current is turbulent. Ship escort is allowed only with local pilots; for the safety of navigation, semaphores and a telegraph are arranged on the thresholds.
    1. Horde
      +1
      3 September 2012 22: 52
      Next p. Msta is not navigable at all! threshold of the VN to the role of a powerful, rich, medieval state OPENLY DOESN’T REALLY. Yes, and in general VN is in the swamps neither to live, nor work, nor to trade on a grand scale there, what the hell are our distant ancestors settled there? and how it was possible in these swamps to lure their own and overseas merchants is not clear.
      The meaning of the Soviet Socialist Republic is to create a historical justification of the VN on Volkhov and to close the existence of the real GREAT NOVGOROD-YAROSLAVL on the VOLGA.
      All my data is a study of Fomenko and Nosovsky.

      http://video.yandex.ru/users/istoriya-nauka/view/6
      1. Horde
        0
        4 September 2012 00: 45
        what is the minus in the case to say the gut is thin?
        1. 0
          4 September 2012 13: 26
          Horde, you just forgot ...
          On us
          Today's historians view the HX as producing - hysterical - influence.
          They accuse them first of all of unscience.
          Secondly, in its multifaceted nature,
          thirdly, in attracting the mathematical apparatus (they themselves ... 2x2 do not know),
          ...
          and the MAIN THING is that the books of NX (Nosovsky-Fomenko) are well sold out.
          The main thing is that this is a successful ... business project.
          But not historical and scientific credibility at all.
          Greed, ordinary human envy, greed .... to more successful ones.
          1. Horde
            +1
            4 September 2012 19: 24
            Igarr,
            you know almost all the "refutations" on the mathematical proofs of the Finnish Nuclear Science are not consistent. The "refutals" could not prove the erroneousness of the statistical calculations of the analysis of historical documents, they could not prove the incorrect dating of the astronomical catalog of Ptolemy - a lot of copies were broken. Andreeva A.Yu. "The theory of errors and mistakes of the theory of AT Fomenko" was refuted not once and, moreover, is in some places openly incompetent and fraudulent.
            The linguistic part of the FIN works is the most criticized by the Tradicians, but the authors have always warned that it is this part of the work that is not evidence-based, but serves to recreate the lost picture of the world.
            And what is happening on our site GREEN causes only a feeling of disgust.
  22. -1
    4 September 2012 00: 32
    As for the continents, everything is obvious, the name of all the continents and parts of the world begins on A, only Europe does not fit here, hence the conclusion is Europe later name, introduced for propaganda purposes, Europe is Hebrew Jews, a hundred years later they will declare that they are indigenous to Europe.

    And what prevents the rewriting of the whole story?
    1. Zmitcer
      -1
      4 September 2012 00: 42
      laughing I can upset you. These are all Jewish names, as invented by the Phoenicians, and their language was Hebrew. And I do not advise you to come home late from work. At night, a liquid bear wanders, he is terrified as he does not like people like you. lol
      1. Kshatriy
        0
        4 September 2012 14: 50
        Quote: Zmitcer
        At night, a liquid bear wanders, he is terrified as he does not like people like you.

        I'll see you dear - "Hollywood" after seeing enough ..... eh-aha ... for a long time the Russian Bear has been sleeping ... ".. do not wake up smartly - while it is quiet !!!" ..
  23. MakSim51ru
    +1
    4 September 2012 10: 17
    Green,


    In my opinion, you have slightly deviated from the topic. It’s not because the Varangians came to an empty place. Really both Kiev and Novgorod did not have an internal infrastructure and were absolutely uncontrollable. Most likely Rurik and Truvor and Sineus
    they were invited in much the same way as Alexander Nevsky subsequently because of his squads. To carry out specific tasks, and then apparently something like a coup that brought them to power. Moreover: in order to keep the city in power there are few swords alone. It’s just not possible to do without the support of the local elite (merchants, priests, nobles). It is even more interesting that the Varangians themselves did not have their own state.
    1. Green
      0
      4 September 2012 11: 05
      Quote: MakSim51ru

      Green


      In my opinion, you have slightly deviated from the topic. It’s not because the Varangians came to an empty place. Really both Kiev and Novgorod did not have an internal infrastructure and were absolutely uncontrollable. Most likely Rurik and Truvor and Sineus
      they were invited in much the same way as Alexander Nevsky subsequently because of his squads. To carry out specific tasks, and then apparently something like a coup that brought them to power. Moreover: in order to keep the city in power there are few swords alone. It’s just not possible to do without the support of the local elite (merchants, priests, nobles). It is even more interesting that the Varangians themselves did not have their own state.


      Maxim, where did I deny it?
      I just clearly (for myself) share where normal, viable versions are, and where is fiction.
  24. +3
    4 September 2012 10: 30
    An amazing thing.
    As soon as there are publications dedicated to clarifying the pre-Christian history of the Russian people (about which the official history speaks practically nothing), it’s as if the devil from the boxing always appears solid, disciplined and we must pay tribute to the professionally trained groups of site visitors. It is clearly seen that these visitors act as a single team with a pronounced goal to prove that the Russian people before Rurik did not have any history, and all attempts to find out about her are a made-up whim.
    Meanwhile, an ancient and well-known saying: “Be forewarned is forearmed,” indicates that knowledge is not only power, but also a weapon. And the presence of any, and not only nuclear, chemical or biological, weapons throughout history, various forces sought to take control.
    It is clearly seen that knowledge as a weapon is trying to keep out of control those who own them.
    The question is who? I think no one will give an exact answer. You can only build guesses. For example, Winston Churchill once said (there is no time to look for a footnote - I convey the general meaning) that the real history of mankind is the history of secret societies. Some Illuminati are worth something. Secret society of lovers of knowledge. I wonder why it is secret, instead of openly bringing to people the light of knowledge?
    Maybe it does not produce knowledge, but hides it from people? And, on the contrary, is some kind of specially invented system of myths being imposed on people?
    After all, there are so many obvious incorrect estimates by official science of similar events. For example, everybody is already well-fed Mongol-Tatar yoke. All the great authorities of official science characterize him as a shameful, heavy, draining the soul of the Russian people.
    Why? The horde, as everyone knows, set a tribute at the rate of tithing. That is 10%. But exactly the same tribute all European nations paid to the Pope of Rome, and no one ever called this tribute shameful or extra heavy.
    I see the reason only in the fact that for European science (and it works for us), Europeans were a priori always enlightened, freedom-loving and free nations. And the Russian people for this “science”, also a priori, have always been dark, downtrodden, wild, cruel and further down the list. And, we must honestly admit this to ourselves, it will always remain so for her.
    Therefore, I am always with those who believe that we should write our history ourselves, and not give it to the mercy of a deliberately biased, supposedly social institution that is always supported by the rich (and therefore criminal, since it’s impossible to earn big money with honest work just steal) the powerful.
    1. Green
      0
      4 September 2012 11: 16
      Quote: kosopuz

      An amazing thing.
      As soon as there are publications devoted to elucidating the pre-Christian history of the Russian people (about which the official history says almost nothing), it’s as if the hell out of the snuffbox always come together, disciplined and we must pay tribute to professionally trained groups of site visitors.


      Kosopuz, don't you think that you are looking for a "black cat in a dark room"?
      There are no "close-knit and disciplined groups", but there are just people who understand where the fairy tales are and where are quite acceptable versions of the development of history. These are the people who express their opinion. And thank God there are still such people and not all (far from all) can still think, compare and distinguish delirium from truth.


      Quote: kosopuz
      Therefore, I am always with those who believe that we should write our history ourselves, and not give it to the mercy of a deliberately biased, supposedly social institution that is always supported by the rich (and therefore criminal, since it’s impossible to earn big money with honest work just steal) the powerful.


      If everyone himself begins to write the history of his Country, Motherland, his Ethnos, sometimes without not only proper education but also basic knowledge in these matters, then yes ... we will go far. laughing This can be invented ... mom do not cry. laughing
      Let's really not impose on people unsubstantiated myths that "the pyramids were built by Russians" or "Troy is a Russian city" (and sometimes they write such nonsense laughing ) and everyone will do his own thing. Historians are history, and shoemakers are boots.
      1. +1
        4 September 2012 11: 22
        Green Today,
        Let's ... everyone will do their own thing. Historians - History
        --------------------------------------
        There is one small nuance: “Do not trust history and politics to professionals. They sell their labors for money. ”
        It seems to be A.S. Pushkin
        1. Green
          -1
          4 September 2012 11: 28
          Quote: kosopuz
          There is one small nuance: “Do not trust history and politics to professionals. They sell their labors for money. ”
          It seems to be A.S. Pushkin


          Perhaps, but the cobblers do not trust her writing.
          So that. wink
          By the way, this is true about "selling works for money." An example of this is Fomenko and Co. They sold themselves, their titles and merits for money, organizing a purely commercial project "NH".
          What can you do, troubled times give rise to murky "heroes" and murky theories.
          I repeat once again, I do not agree with all the conclusions of the official history, there are many "blank spots" but in general, almost everything is true there.
          1. Kshatriy
            +3
            4 September 2012 15: 12
            Quote: Green
            By the way, this is true about "selling works for money." An example of this is Fomenko and Co. They sold themselves, their titles and merits for money, organizing a purely commercial project "NH".

            I answer you .., although there is no desire to touch the illiterate abomination of your narrow-minded discussions about the New Chronology - Academician Fomenko ..
            You don’t get the honor that I would bring you his merits in the modern scientific world (oh dear, you will not accidentally be one of the coachmen, otherwise you will introduce yourself before you indiscriminately blame the real member of R.A.N)
            New Chronology is a scientific work lying in the plane of MATHEMATICAL ANALYSIS !!!! NONE of a self-respecting mathematician even tried to refute the calculations of Anatoly Fomenko ... though there were attempts by some modern history strapped to the trough ... however, this cohort of "mathematicians" is at a similar level of education to you --- NONE !!!!!! !!!!!!
          2. +2
            4 September 2012 16: 38
            Green Today
            Perhaps, but the cobblers do not trust her writing.
            ---------------------------------------
            Judging by the way official historians describe the events that I myself witnessed, then definitely any honest shoemaker will write the story more praisier (closer to the truth) than any ostepenenny grantoed.
            1. Green
              0
              4 September 2012 17: 02
              Quote: kosopuz
              Judging by the way official historians describe the events that I myself witnessed, then definitely any honest shoemaker will write the story more praisier (closer to the truth) than any ostepenenny grantoed.


              My dear Kosopuz, and what does it mean that EVERYONE is lying?
              I also know enough lies about certain events, but there is truth. The main thing is to be able to separate "flies from cutlets". So you don't have to dump everything.
              There is historical research, and there is Folk History, and these are two different things.
              And if you rely on "shoemakers", they will tell you this, especially after a glass, that real "spaceships plowing the Bolshoi Theater" will come out. laughing
    2. Kostya pedestrian
      0
      10 September 2012 17: 58
      very well seen. I hope that I am not the first one to rate your statement.

      double standards and lies or lodges with organs-16 or 6 - the history of the West is saturated with secrets ... who wants to show his shaven-headedness and racism.

      that’s PR polzuas tem chto prakicheski (esleb ne Jeep) patriotizm y russkix razgromili.

      tipa slovechka Ypa-patrioty. lchno si govorio Ypa Patriotam!

  25. Green
    0
    4 September 2012 15: 39
    My dear Fomenkoid Kshatriy, or how you are there in real life, who knows .... laughing
    This is for you:

    "Who is Fomenko". ed. Pyotr Obraztsov.

    Academician Fomenko does not exist
    In recent years, many subverters of classical science have emerged. The most famous of them is the mathematical academician Fomenko, in the opinion of my acquaintances mathematicians, who did not differ much on geometric grounds, but published dozens of books on "alternative history". Briefly, his views can be expressed as follows: the chronology of historical events is godlessly distorted, the same character appears under different "surnames" - for example, Alexander Nevsky and Christ are one person, and Russia is generally the center of the universe. Why, there is the center, Russia, and there is almost all the known universe, and there are different France and Germany - only slightly modified western provinces of our immense power. Fomenko decided to change the chronology, guided by vague (and incorrect) calculations of the parameters of the Moon.

    To refute Fomenko and Fomenenko from a scientific point of view is not difficult, but boring. Math books are fascinating, like any nonsense, overflowing with errors, distortions, inaccuracies and just lies. All this has been noticed by professional historians and published - but the truth is dry, boring and not fun. Therefore, unlike Fomenko’s books, professional publications do not diverge in thousands of print runs, and Fomenkoids continue to feel great. And so we thought that to demonstrate the absurdity of Fomenkov’s views, it’s best to try to apply his own method of interpreting history to the alternative. That's what we got.

    Academician Kizhe

    Since the first publication in the popular science journal "Chemistry and Life" of an article with the long title "Precession of the Moon's Orbit as Proof of the Possibility of Building Feudalism in a Single Tartary" the author presented as "Academician Fomenko" has not left the pages of periodicals. Despite the obvious doubtfulness of the statements of this overthrower of classical history (which is, for example, the statement of the "academician" about the absence of the Principality of Conduit and the Duchy of Schwambrania in medieval Europe!), His articles are regularly published in reputable publications such as "Minipolis Express", and the books "Fomenko "are published in one hundred thousand copies. Surprisingly, numerous critics of the theories of this author never bothered to ask the question: who, in fact, is this Fomenko? This chapter is devoted to the answer to this question and a summary of the results of Fomenko's research.
    1. Green
      0
      4 September 2012 15: 48
      So, in the annotations on Fomenko's books it is said that this character is an academician of the Russian Academy of Sciences, a major specialist in logarithmic and integral calculus. The year of birth of Anatoly Trofimovich (1945) and the year of election to academician (1994) are indicated, the main works are listed ("Logarithms on imaginary bases", "Geometry of small forces", etc.). And also an impressive list of academician positions and titles - from a full member of the Central Asian Academy of MMM to the president of the Mutual Debit Society. And only one message is surprising, casting doubt on the entire track record of the academician - it turns out that back in the early 1950s, when our future hero was hardly more than 10 years old, he solved Billboard's 16th problem about topological (and linguistic ) the incoherence of billboards. Well, let's check other information about the alleged academician as well!

      So, the reference book "Russian Academy of Sciences", 1999, "Science". We look at the letter "F" - and, of course, there is no academician Fomenko there at all! However, the critics of the "academician" should not be blamed for their lack of curiosity - the handbook has a DSP stamp, that is, "for official use," and the author of these lines managed to get it solely thanks to special relations with the RAS Secretariat. This is the end of the first myth ... And here is the exposure of the second!
      1. Green
        0
        4 September 2012 15: 49
        The fact is that not only "academician" Fomenko does not exist, but also no Fomenko at all! In the "Dictionary of the Surnames of Slavic Peoples" after "Fomenadze" immediately follows "Fomenyan", and even last year's "Supplement" to this dictionary does not indicate the aforementioned surname. It is quite clear that we are faced with a hoax, similar to the famous second lieutenant Kizhe, Kozma Prutkov and the mathematicians Bourbaki. And this brilliant hoax has recently been exposed - alas, not by domestic, but by German researchers of the "academician". In the last "Annalen Tartaricum" Slavists Munh, Gauz (Haus) and Ann (Ann) convincingly showed that Fomenko's surname is nothing but the Cyrillized "For Man Co", that is, "Company for People". By the way, the researchers note, the English "man" also means "to staff". Who and why is this company "staffed"? Alas, the authors of the publication do not give an answer to the first answer - but the composition of the company "Kozma Prutkov" also remains a deepest secret. But they answer the second question clearly and unequivocally - "Fomenko" pursues the noble goal of establishing historical truth, namely, what is "for people." Despite a number of truly erroneous propositions, the bulk of the works of this author brings a completely new, fresh and absolutely correct in shape to the history of our long-suffering Fatherland and foreign foes. And one cannot but agree with the Germans - let's take a look at the following examples of the innovative Fomenko method.

        In one of the first articles of "Fomenko" it was possible to show that the chronology of the first Russian republic in Novgorod the Great significantly differs from the generally accepted one. Using the radiocarbon method, they established that the wood-shaving letters of the "posad people", found by the expedition of the Russian Academy of Sciences over the past decade, are significantly older than the famous "Vlesovaya kniga" and were written, apparently, in the time of the Nightingale the Robber (identified by the Fomenki with the head of the illegal bandit formations by Stepan Razin).
        1. Green
          0
          4 September 2012 15: 50
          Here's another example. The topographic discoveries of the Fomenko group are striking. One of them was published in the Paradox magazine - this is the discovery of the famous Kulikov field in the Solyanka area in Moscow, and the headquarters of the field commander Mamai - on Taganka (on the site of the future Taganskaya prison, which is very symbolic). But here is a more impressive discovery just presented in the "Papers of the Academy of Sciences, Historical Series." It turns out that the famous Battle of the Ice with the Germans took place not at all on Lake Peipsi, but also in Moscow, in the area of ​​the meat and milk refrigerator on the Khoroshevskoye highway! Field temperature measurements carried out by the group confirmed this to an accuracy of 0,1 degrees Celsius.

          Concluding our small study of the work of the "Academician Fomenko" group, we wish its members continued success in establishing the truth, especially in their most recent endeavors - the study of Western European history. We will look forward to exciting revelations about the decryption of the inscription on the famous Phaistos disc, which has so far defied the best cryptographers in the world. We note in secret that we have already managed to find out the first results on the sidelines of the RAS Presidium. It turns out that "Academician Fomenko" by measuring a large ellipsoidal arc was able to detect clear traces of Slavic influence on the disk, which is kept in the Minoan Museum of Crete. And how else can you interpret the scratched inscription "Tolya was here" on the edge of ancient clay?
          1. Green
            0
            4 September 2012 15: 52
            Kshatriy, for your information, ALL Fomenko's arguments are easily refuted.
            Good luck in studying these "works". laughing
          2. Kshatriy
            0
            4 September 2012 17: 33
            Quote: Green

            Green Today, 15:39 new 0 
            My dear Fomenkoid Kshatriy, or how you are there in real life, who knows ....
            This is for you:

            "Who is Fomenko". ed. Pyotr Obraztsov.

            .................................................. ..............................
            .................................................. ...................
            Peter Obraztsov, Alexey Savin
            The Secret Story of Things
            Paperback (2008)


            Bank cards, bra, vodka, lie detector, dollar, chewing gum, lighter, mirror, playing cards, hookah, Barbie, swimsuit, margarine, soap, wallpaper, condom, toilet ... What do these (and many other) things have in common? Just that they are somehow ...


            216 rubles.
            240 rub 10% discount

            In stock
            The expected date of transfer to the delivery service is September 5
            Weight 320
            Peter Obraztsov, Sasha Bateneva
            AntiHarryPotter
            Second-hand book (2005)
            The authors finally revealed the mystery of millions of children loved books about Harry Potter! In fact, these books were created by an ancient and powerful organization specifically for processing the consciousness of the young generation of earthlings - especially those who speak ...
            Strong "Aftar" ... and his works are so profound that it becomes terrible to become, but I thought you would be smarter ...., or sometimes you take your ass out of the sandbox, but no!
            1. Green
              -1
              4 September 2012 18: 25
              Quote: Kshatriya
              Strong "Aftar" ... and his works are so profound that it becomes terrible to become, but I thought you would be smarter ...., or sometimes you take your ass out of the sandbox, but no!


              Eh ksatriya, ksatriya ... Do you want academics? Well, no problem.
              Since the activities of the Russian Academy of Sciences itself are recognized as anti-scientific by the Russian Academy of Sciences, a commission has been set up at the Russian Academy of Sciences to combat such people as the phenomenon and its ilk. It is headed by academicians Kruglyakov and Zakharov.
              Do not be lazy and look on the net for the conclusions of this commission, at least by last name.
              And yet, somewhere on the network there is also the text of Academician Novikov on the theme of Fomenko and Co. Look, read if you want ACADEMICIANS. By the way, Novikov at one time promoted Fomenko but, after his pusses and the beginning of his activity in the field of pseudoscience and folk history, broke all relations with him.
              Look, read. Can cut through and the brain will fall into place.
              Good luck.
              1. Kshatriy
                +1
                5 September 2012 09: 38
                Quote: Green
                Look, read. Can cut through and the brain will fall into place.
                Good luck.

                My dear, try your "mosch" in place! I spoke about the New Chronology and did not say a word about the "Historical Reconstruction" .. Learn to understand the Russian language. Everything that I have outlined above about people you think ... I would like to add: "you have two classes of education - read the magazine" Murzilka "and sniff in two holes!" .....
        2. Horde
          +2
          4 September 2012 18: 46
          The fact is that not only "academician" Fomenko does not exist, but no Fomenko at all!


          perhaps this is not just drug intoxication and not even a neurosis turning into psychosis, but the schizophrenic delirium of a psycho who escaped from Kashchenko to the first computer with the Internet.
      2. Horde
        0
        4 September 2012 18: 40
        And only one message is surprising, casting doubt on the entire track record of the academician, - it turns out, back in the early 1950s, when our future hero was barely more than 10 years old, he solved Billbort's 16th problem of topological (and linguistic ) incoherence of billboards


        link to the studio let's see what you don't like here.
    2. Horde
      +1
      4 September 2012 18: 31
      Who is Fomenko ". Authors Pyotr Obraztsov.

      Academician Fomenko does not exist





      here is Anatoly Timofeevich Fomenko - GREAT RUSSIAN MATHEMATIC AND HISTORIAN.


      here is Nosovsky Gleb Vladimirovich mathematician, historian, co-author A.T. Fomenko.

      You hear the green is quite real people. All your fabrications about the fact that "Fomenko does not exist" are vile and vile insinuations that are not even worthy of an answer, but I will answer. A lie is open, this is when they say that WHITE IS BLACK, there is a half-truth, when, against the background of a completely clear picture of the world, a black stroke is added causing doubt and distrust, but there is a lie of buffoons-buffoons, i.e. kikush-holy fools, open spitting with saliva on the hated sunlight, which causes no feeling of desire to live i.e. create and create and enjoy the freedom of creativity, but it only causes unbearable burning sensation, headaches and malicious envy of successful and creative people. All your nasty things about Academician Fomenko are just lies of this order.
      1. Green
        0
        4 September 2012 18: 40
        Quote: Horde
        Do you hear green? These are very real people.


        Hear the horde, this material is what I gave it in a playful way. It seems like the Fomenkovsky method of denying the existence of the Fomenki itself.
        Be able to analyze what is written, if it’s already climbed into history to understand. wink
        It is clear that Fomenko and co exist. It is clear that Fomenka is a real academician and that she is a very good mathematician, but ... this is one side, and the other is commercial activity under the HX logo.
        Oh ... horde, horde ... laughing
  26. Horde
    +1
    4 September 2012 19: 01
    It seems like the Fomenkovsky method of denying the existence of the Fomenki itself.
    Be able to analyze what is written, if it’s already got into history to understand


    to joke means please, but the topic for discussion is quite serious “The Legend of Sloven and Rousse and the city of Slovensk” and instead of turning to personalities and insulting respected people, they would have argued for TI if you can of course, but you can’t better not fooling people here.

    and the other is a commercial activity under the NH logo.

    as far as I know Anatoly Fomenko does not even have a car.
    1. Green
      0
      4 September 2012 19: 06
      Quote: Horde
      to joke means please, but the topic for discussion is quite serious “The Legend of Sloven and Rousse and the city of Slovensk” and instead of turning to personalities and insulting respected people, they would have argued for TI if you can of course, but you can’t better not fooling people here.


      I asked for arguments from proponents of the opposite:
      "If you know so well the Ancient History of Russia, then I ask you again:
      - Show me evidence that 2000 or more years ago, a powerful Civilization existed here on the territory of Russia, and it was UNCONDABLY ours - Russian civilization. Show me the cities, roads, coins of this Civilization.
      From others: Cretan-Mycenaean, Greek, Mesopotamian, Egyptian, Indian, there was a MASS of monuments. And from the ANCIENT RUSSIAN? "

      There were no arguments. Do you have arguments, not even arguments, but weighty docks written? No, I think.

      as far as I know Anatoly Fomenko does not even have a car.

      Here, perhaps not. It puts everything at the expense of TAM. laughing
      1. Green
        +2
        4 September 2012 19: 15
        But in general, the Horde and others like him, tired of arguing. You hear only what you want and see too. You demand docks and yourself - feed on unproven tales.
        Feed on, your right. Believe at least in Babu Yaga, at least in Koschei or in "green men from Mars", in parallel to me. Well, you like fairy tales, well ... Your right. Fortunately for them, many fairy tales are being published now. Read, believe, if you haven't matured yet.
        Good luck reading Chippolin. wink
        1. Kshatriy
          +1
          5 September 2012 10: 24
          Quote: Green
          Good luck reading Chippolin.

          And you have a gracious level NO waaaschschshee - no !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
          The New Chronology - is in the plane of mathematical analysis, its evidence base - is applied mathematics (from this point of view, NOBODY even undertakes to argue with Academician Fomenko) All this I have to do for people like you - funny tankers - sitting behind three-layer armor Merkava-4 , repeat again. I am personally not interested in "Historical reconstruction" .... neither as a project, nor as a platform for the extermination of modern historians --- die yourself, where will you go !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !! I don't see any interest in arguing with your kagal anymore (your brain centers are sharpened only for EXTREMISM) ...... Live, you live ....
      2. Horde
        -1
        4 September 2012 19: 55
        There were no arguments. You have arguments, not even arguments, but solid docks written


        for example, an interesting fact, professional cartographer A.Yu. Ryabtsev made a map of the mutual arrangement of European capitals and a curious picture opened

        the Russian city of VLADIMIR was not in vain called the OWNER of the WORLD-this fact is historians 
        not how they do not comment, but what they can say. in the picture is a simplified image, all calculations were made taking into account that the Earth is a ball, and then some people deigned to doubt. During the Empire, Russia-Horde ruled distant provinces by creating strong points at the same distance from the center of VLADIMIR. VLADIMIR is real. CENTER OF THE WORLD. No other city has such a geographical effect. Not Rome, Istanbul, Alexandria or anyone else.




        http://chronologia.org/xpon4/14_14.html
        1. +2
          4 September 2012 22: 43
          for example, an interesting fact, professional cartographer A.Yu. Ryabtsev made a map of the mutual arrangement of European capitals and a curious picture opened


          Gyyyyyy ... *) funny so ... you can take an arbitrary point on the globe, and draw as many such circles as you like. And with the help of this, prove that, for example, the centers of the world were, for example, mmmmmmm ... Uryupinsk or Karaganda ... *) Do you seriously believe in this nonsense, or do you still joke? *)

          Fomenko, this is a figure belonging to the same glorious galaxy of "scientists" as Shcherbakov, who at one time invented a wonderful story by placing Asgard in Turkmenistan, only because, there de, "heavenly apples" grow, which are not really apples, and peaches. And he drew this wondrous conclusion from the fact that in the legends it was written that these trees of paradise had reddish leaves (like, recently sprouted peaches have the same reddish leaves). And it is not clear why Comrade Shcherbakov placed Asgard in Turkmenistan, if botanists suspect that the birthplace of peaches is nevertheless China, more precisely, the vicinity of Beijing. At first glance, it is not clear. But at a second glance, it is very understandable. It's just that when Shcherbakov carried out these "studies", the "immortal" Turkmenbashi was still alive, and he quite so, and robustly could "warm up" these "studies" ... *)

          Well ... your passage about Sanskrit, I'll leave it on your conscience, but I can't resist a bit of malice. Do you know Sanskrit? Considering even that such a single concept as SANSKRIT did not exist. In fact, Sanskrit is the same linguistic community as the current one, for example ... the Romano-Germanic language family. And you can so boldly assert that a native speaker, for example, of the Romanian language, will understand the speaker in Portuguese? *))) And what, for example, Devanagari's attempt to call the Sanskrit alphabet is the same assumption as the fact that a cat is called a close relative of a whale, just because they are mammals, or because in Ukrainian, the word "cat" written - "whale" ... *))) = rolling with laughter =

          Horde, honestly, I received a lot of pleasure reading your comments, and the comments of your friends. This ... this ... You are magnificent in your warlike ignorance! .. * *))) Bravo ... *))))
          1. Green
            -1
            4 September 2012 22: 54
            Quote: de_monSher
            This ... this ... You are magnificent in your warlike ignorance! .. * *))) Bravo ... *))))


            And the Fomenkoids are all like that. Moreover, it is useless to prove anything. They are like a zombie or something, only the program put into their heads by "Fomenko and his comrades" is perceived and that's it. They can no longer think or compare. Alas ... And what is more, all of them militantly defend their "guru", foaming at the mouth of Taldych nonsense. This is on the net, and I talked live with several, so after a few minutes they almost got into a fight. laughing One word is a sect.
            1. -1
              4 September 2012 23: 04
              It’s on the net, and I talked live with several, so after a few minutes they almost got into a fight. laughing One word is a sect.


              I also got this pleasure at one time - to talk with the "Fomenkovites" live ... *)))) gyyyyyy ... *)))) I even tried to give them as an example several phrases in Sanskrit - both verbally and visually. So they, nafikh dismissed my arguments aside, saying that I am "a stupid moron who came up with some gibberish on the go, and I'm trying to zambe people (!!!)" ... *) although the phrases were simple, very ... like - "my cat went for a walk in the garden", "this path leads to the stars" ... and I asked to find common roots of words in Sanskrit with Russian words ... they are, of course ... but so, with a cavalry swoop they are not you will find ... *))) gyyyyyyyy ... *))
              1. Kshatriy
                0
                5 September 2012 09: 46
                Quote: de_monSher
                I also got this pleasure at one time - to talk with the "Fomenkovites" live ... *)))) gyyyyyy ... *)))) I even tried to give them as an example several phrases in Sanskrit - both verbally and visually. So they, nafikh dismissed my arguments aside, saying that I am "a stupid moron who came up with some gibberish on the go, and I'm trying to zambe people (!!!)" ... *) although the phrases were simple, very ... like - "my cat went for a walk in the garden", "this path leads to the stars" ... and I asked to find common roots of words in Sanskrit with Russian words ... they are, of course ... but so, with a cavalry swoop they are not you will find ... *))) gyyyyyyyy ... *))

                I completely agree with the "Fomenkovites" --- you are exactly who you were called!
                1. 0
                  5 September 2012 14: 50
                  I completely agree with the "Fomenkovites" --- you are exactly who you were called!


                  Well ... First of all, man, I did not drink vodka with you (!), And I did not switch to "You". Even such a desire has not yet been, on my part ... *) Do you get it? *)

                  Secondly ... Proving something to the "Fomenkovites" is the same as trying to explain to the "Lysenkoites" the existence of magic amino acids ... *)) With all due respect to Lysenko, and recognition of his merits, in agriculture = take that the minting of cotton, or new methods of potato cultivation =, it is very difficult to call Lysenko, a fundamental researcher ... *)

                  Thirdly ... I very, very much at one time liked the explanations of your colleagues about the same metallurgy. By type - why are there practically no Russian swords in the cultural layers. There are Scandinavian, Germanic, Roman, = you can get acquainted with the studies of the same Shumeiko, or Garting = but the Russians are not. Remember the explanations of the Fomenkovites? By type, it was such a forging technology. Special damask. They, these damask swords, de, "were cool, but short-lived. For 20 years, they served regularly, then crumbled to dust so that the enemy would not get it!" Isn't it funny? *) Here are Indian swords, which are 2000 years old or more, have survived, but these high-tech swords have turned to dust ... *) Damn it ... Anyway, "Fomenkovism" seems to deny "a long history". The conventional radiocarbon dating is completely rejected. That is, what kind of 3-4 millennia of Russian "history according to Fomenko" are you trying to talk about, I still don’t understand ... *)) Like that?

                  Fourth. I really do not like the distortion of historical and, in this context, geopolitical events. It is enough for me that one of the followers of "Fomenkovism" is the newly-minted "VOmpir" - Kasparov. This worries me greatly. Since I am an antagonist of the liberal idea as a whole, I am ready to say even in such a trifle - "everything that pleases my spiritual enemies - liberals, is not to my liking." With this position of mine, is everything clear? .. *)))
          2. Horde
            +1
            4 September 2012 23: 35
            funny so ... you can take an arbitrary point on the globe, and draw as many such circles as you like. And with the help of this, prove that, for example, the centers of the world were, for example, mmmmmmm ... Uryupinsk or Karaganda ... *) Do you seriously believe in this nonsense, or do you still joke? *)


            you must be an ignorant person? You have been told that on the world map there is no longer such a point as the city of Vladimir. Would you like to work on a globe, please, just keep in mind that the Earth is not an ideal ball, so not all globes are suitable for such measurements.
            ARKHANGELSK - 936 km.
            HELSINGFORS - 1.012 km.
            REVEL - 997 km.
            RIGA – 1.004 km.
            VILNA – 969 km.
            MINSK - 856 km.
            KIEV - 912 km.
            TSARITSYN - 864 km.
            UVA - 999 km.
            -------------------------------------------------- ------

            The second ring (6 cities; average distance — 1.343 km.):

            STOCKHOLM - 1.370 km.
            GDANSK - 1.392 km.
            WARSAW - 1.333 km.
            LVOV - 1.299 km.
            CHISINAU - 1.290 km.
            SEVASTOPOL - 1.374 km.
            -------------------------------------------------- ------

            The third ring (18 cities; average distance — 1.830,6 km.):

            TRONDHEIM - 1.847 km.
            OSLO - 1.785 km.
            GOTHENBURG – 1.727 km.
            COPENHAGEN - 1.730 km.
            BERLIN - 1.789 km.
            DRESDEN - 1.840 km.
            LEIPZIG - 1.910 km.
            PRAGUE – 1.852 km.
            Vienna - 1.852 km.
            BRATISLAVA – 1.813 km.
            BUDAPEST - 1.748 km.
            BĢLGRAD - 1.883 km.
            SOFIA – 1.931 km.
            ISTANBUL - 1.877 km.
            ANKARA – 1.887 km.
            YEREVAN – 1.800 km.
            BAKU - 1.885 km.
            SALEKHARD - 1.795 km.
            -------------------------------------------------- ------

            The fourth ring (10 cities; average distance — 2.412,9 km.):

            AMSTERDAM - 2.325 km.
            BRUSSELS - 2.433 km.
            LUXEMBOURG - 2.390 km.
            BERN - 2.474 km.
            ZURICH - 2.379 km.
            MILAN - 2.470 km.
            FLORENCE - 2.475 km.
            ATHENS – 2.370 km.
            NIKOSIA – 2.392 km.
            TEHERAN - 2.421 km.
            -------------------------------------------------- ------

            Fifth ring (8 cities; average distance — 2.614,875 kilometers):

            EDINBURGH - 2.671 km.
            LONDON - 2.677 km.
            PARIS - 2.669 km.
            GENEVA - 2.603 km.
            RIM - 2.554 km.
            DAMASK – 2.535 km.
            BAGHDAD - 2.553 km.
            TASHKENT - 2.657 km.
            -------------------------------------------------- ------

            Sixth ring (5 cities; average distance — 3.482,6 km.):

            REYKJAVIK - 3.421 km.
            MADRID - 3.627 km.
            ALZHIR - 3.520 km.
            TRIPOL – 3.327 km.
            MEDINA – 3.518 km.
            ----------------------------
            1. 0
              4 September 2012 23: 52
              Horde

              you must be an ignorant person? ... that the Earth is not an ideal ball


              = Laugh to tears = ... S ... s ... s-thank you! .. * *))) enlightened ... = wiped away tears = ... So outcast with the concept geoid, this is wise woman ...

              "Colleague" ... Yes, unlike you, I accept my IGNORANCE, even though I have behind me the Faculty of Applied Mathematics, and Analytical Geometry, Lobachevsky Geometry, Topology or Celestial Mechanics - these are not entirely empty sounds for me .. . *))))

              What do you prove by these "average distances" of yours? *))) AND? Explain? Like - in Vladimir there were passionaries who in waves "dispersed" in different directions, and populated, populated, populated ... everyone and everything? *)) So, same ... huh?

              Okay ... take your point of view as the starting point ... *)))

              Well ... would you still look at the map ... just apply the knowledge of geography ... maybe something still got in their way? *))) Mountains for example ... high! Rivers ... deep blue! ... *))) It's somehow lazy, you know, to go strictly along the radii of these your homegrown circles ... *))) gyyyyy ... this is first ...

              Secondly ... Did you take into account the precession and nutation of the axis in your "studies"? Did you ... take into account at least divergence? = Alas, it cannot explain this your spread of parameters =.

              And, by the way, the very fact that the earth is a geoid makes these "circles on the globe" quite a laughing stock of yours ... *)) maybe you yourself think why, eh? *)))
              1. Green
                0
                5 September 2012 00: 08
                Quote: de_monSher
                And, by the way, the very fact that the earth is a geoid makes these "circles on the globe" quite a laughing stock of yours ... *)) maybe you yourself think why, eh? *)))


                No, I’m afraid I won’t understand ... He also has a MAP WITH CIRCLES. laughing

                No, all the same it’s good to go to bed with a good, cheerful mood !!!
                Thank you for this Horde and comrades! wink
                I'll go bye.

                EVERYONE - Calm !! And the Horde, too.
                1. 0
                  5 September 2012 00: 13
                  *))))) To you again ... and more, more ... *))) And in the morning - a great mood ... *))) And we would have had more of such Fomenkovites in life ... *))) otherwise we’ll bend out of boredom ... *)))))
              2. Horde
                -1
                5 September 2012 00: 18
                I laugh to tears = ... S ... s ... s-thank you! .. * *))) enlightened ... = wiped away the tears = ... So from the outcast with the concept of geoid, this is wise ...


                you laughed and smailiki stopped working. If you looked at the article,
                you probably noticed the histograms there, which say something about
                what if you are actually a mathematician, have completed the full course and have not forgotten anything
                since then, maybe you will understand what's what.



                in the table that I brought you the unselected items do not go to exactly the circumference
                , but they have a certain spread - this just says that our ancestors laid the supporting
                points adjusted for uneven terrain.
                1. 0
                  5 September 2012 00: 35
                  Well, thank God, you know how to work with errors ... *)))))

                  And, again, I repeat, how are we different, you know? *)) A very simple thing - I'm not afraid to take your point of view, but you - talk about something that you yourself hammered into your head, and consider it the ultimate truth ... *))) You, understand - I am familiar with these calculations ... And when we got into a dispute with your "colleague" on this very topic, I suggested that he conduct the same "research" with other cities. We took - Samarkand, Athens, Baghdad as obviously ancient cities. Just the same your Lviv, from the list - the city is relatively young ... *) = I'm talking about the rest - I'm silent =. And we got about the same concentric circles ... as for Vladimir ... *))) And what does this prove? *))) AND? *)))

                  And about emoticons - for your information, I do not put them. I have one, branded - "*)". This is such a smile with a squint ... *))) I ask you to love and favor him. And I would not stoop to such trifles ... *))

                  And to build a "notch" line of cities - by your method, it's at least ridiculous. You can recall a new story, when the Nazis simply bypassed Maginot, instead of "honestly, chivalrously", storm it ... *))) In general, so to build a network of fortified points for the "heart of the world, for the city that owns the world" - as minimum, funny ... *))) This is against strategy, tactics, and most importantly, Mother Geography is against it with all the foolishness ... *)))
                  1. Horde
                    +1
                    5 September 2012 00: 35
                    And we got about the same concentric circles ... as for Vladimir ... *))) And what does this prove? *))) AND? *)))


                    Well, nothing to talk ahead if such work has already been done by you, then present it and consider what is there.
                    And it would not have fallen to such trifles ... *))


                    it’s just that your homeric gagging on the entire Internet is very conducive to a serious conversation.
                    1. Horde
                      0
                      5 September 2012 00: 45
                      I can continue the conversation only tomorrow evening in Moscow. all the same, time to sleep.
                      1. 0
                        5 September 2012 00: 53
                        Good night ... *)) and do not be offended ... *) I in no way detract from the achievements of your ancestors - the Slavs. And, in no case do not want to enlighten you or teach you something. Your opinion, this is your opinion. The most important thing is that it be YOURS ... *))) have a good night and a good day in the morning ... *)
                    2. -1
                      5 September 2012 00: 46
                      Get used to it, "colleague" ... get used to it ... *))) another conducts a conversation or an argument with a distorted face, as if an hour ago he had eaten two kilograms of lemons, and I always smile when I have a conversation ... *))) This is Does it bother you a lot? *))) Do I also make a "smart", that is, a twisted face? *)))

                      Well, nothing to talk ahead if such work has already been done by you, then present it and consider what is there.


                      We were sitting in one very cozy cafe in Tashkent. In the same place where Yesenin carved his poems on the boards of benches, when he was there ... they drank baileys and martinis, and drew these diagrams on ancient A4 papers, on which there were the texts of an advertising campaign for UzDeEauto at the back. Even if I want to, I will not show them to you - alas and ah. They were used by my late cat for a long time ... *) Do you really think that I would keep these pseudo-scientific calculations, as a dignified relic? *)))) Any person, if he wants, can easily repeat them ... *)))
                      1. Horde
                        +1
                        5 September 2012 07: 47
                        We were sitting in one very cozy cafe in Tashkent. In the same place where Yesenin carved his poems on the boards of benches, when he was there ... they drank baileys and martinis, and drew these diagrams on ancient A4 papers, on which there were the texts of an advertising campaign for UzDeEauto at the back. Even if I want to, I will not show them to you - alas and ah. They were used by my late cat for a long time ... *) Do you really think that I would keep these pseudo-scientific calculations, as a dignified relic? *)))) Any person, if he wants, can easily repeat them ... *)))


                        what a touching story, but these are just words, only besides words you need to give evidence. So you said that from any place you can draw circles and get the same picture as with Vladimir. You will have a whole day to answer.
                      2. -3
                        5 September 2012 14: 33
                        You will have a whole day to answer.


                        I ... something did not understand - you tell me what. condition? *)) You have an atlas at hand. Find high definition. Take ANY city, and if you WISH, you can build any concentric circles, according to all the rules of "strategy, tactics and geopolitics" ... And with a strong desire, you can make the "center of the world" even San Marino, Veliky Ustyug or Tenerife = not I will understand why these cities are worse than Vladimir? =, declaring at the same time these cities as the centers of sunken Lemuria, *)) I am with you, for now, quite friendly talking, without any "but weak!" etc. More or less like this.... *)
                      3. Horde
                        +2
                        5 September 2012 15: 57
                        Take ANY city, and if you WISH, you can build any concentric circles, according to all the rules of "strategy, tactics and geopolitics" ... And if you want to, you can make "the center of the world


                        not a friend will not do this if you affirm something, or disprove it, be so kind as to prove your words yourself. So far, what about the possibility of holding any circles on the map was voiced by you here and be kind enough to prove your statement, and not to force others to do your work. Otherwise, as we say on the Internet, the drain is counted.

                        I am with you, so far, quite friendly talking, without any there "but weak!" etc. More or less like this.... *)


                        I do not need your friendliness, prove your professionalism.
                      4. +1
                        5 September 2012 16: 54
                        I do not need your friendliness, prove your professionalism


                        Strongly said ... *))))) intriguedly discovered Google map. Since I am in Lviv, he showed me Lviv first thing. Let’s dance from him ... *) And it’s absolutely not important that Lviv was founded by Dannil Galitsky already in the 13th century. It's not important for me. I see what ancient architecture is here, every day. I’m ready to swear by the roots of the hair from my knee, in fact, to Lvov, about 8000 years old = I can see all this with my own eyes! so that's it - the absolute truth! And whoever disagrees with this is a retrograde and a demagogue ... *)))) =. The enemies just diligently dying out all the early references to him ... *)))

                        I will start counting personalities not with Daniel Galitsky, but Yaroslav Vladimirovich Galitsky who lived a little earlier ... *)) therefore, "my - great mathematician, and an expert on everything in the world, the time report "begins from the 11th century ... *)) but in fact, in the 11th century, that famous eclipse of the sun took place ... so in this regard, I will link the name of Yaroslav Vladimirovich, with a name for example ... mmmmmmm ... = thoughtful = ... yes, the same Samson ... *)) Samson had problems with his wife, and Yaroslav - too ... so this is one and that same face - hair roots, all from the same knee I swear! .. *))) gyyyyyy ... *)

                        Cities of the first line - built during troubles with Ivan Berladnik - with the aim of allowing Ivan "Nastasievich" to enter the Galician principality:

                        Przemysl
                        Stryj
                        Ternopol
                        Lutsk


                        Well, a number of other, smaller towns and towns. But they are not important. The main thing is that these 4 cities are located approximately like this, by eye, at the same distance from Lviv that did not exist in the 11th century ... *)))

                        Cities of the second line. Svyatoslav Galitsky began to lay them when he claimed the princely throne of Kiev. And it doesn’t matter to me when these cities were actually laid. That's mine new theory, and I do not care about the opinions of the so-called historians, who for some reason dig in all sorts of mounds and burial grounds, instead of drawing circles on maps and atlases ... *)). So:

                        Lodz
                        Minsk (he, by the way, was always called Mensky. So it seems more correct)
                        Kiev (it was founded by Svyatoslav Galitsky, only to have something to steal)
                        Kishinev

                        Well, a number of smaller cities located at about the same distance from Lviv ... *)) you yourself will find in Google Mape ... *)))
                      5. 0
                        5 September 2012 16: 55
                        Cities of Thirds lines, Svyatoslav laid while sitting under arrest in Hungary. He was a strong man, and could create cities, only with a willp effort ... *)) And so, here they are:

                        Berlin
                        Bucharest
                        Moscow
                        St. Petersburg


                        The latter city is especially interesting, since it can be used to connect Svyatoslav Vladimirovich with Peter Alekseevich, also known as Peter the Great. The conclusion is unequivocal - this is one and the same person. Historians have lied! *)))

                        Is it enough to create a "new chronology and history" or continue? *))))
                      6. -1
                        5 September 2012 17: 18
                        By the way ... there was a discrepancy here. I remembered, all of a sudden ... the insight came directly, it came down that, chronologically, the sun eclipsed in the year 1185 ... so this is the 12th century ... it seems like an embarrassment! .. Fig two ... this is not a glitch but a feature ... *)) in fact, the so-called "historians" did not take into account the error ... *))) they incorrectly count the centuries, according to the programmer - from scratch! *) Since in the time of Christ, there were no programmers, and there were even big disputes about the philosophical concept of the term itself - "zero", the countdown of times should be started from ONE. So everything is correct! 1185th year, this is not the 12th century, but the 11th! Here! And now, try to quibble with my "logic" ... *))))) Please ... = threw up his hands = ... *))))
                      7. Horde
                        0
                        5 September 2012 17: 20
                        Is it enough to create a "new chronology and history" or continue?


                        it doesn’t convince, what kind of mathematician are you if you don’t give figures to confirm it? Please provide the data in kilometers in a table.
                      8. 0
                        5 September 2012 17: 33
                        Sorry. I just don't remember how to measure everything in kilometers in Google Maps. By the way, the concept of a kilometer appeared already in the 18th ... oh, sorry, in the 17th, according to my "new chronology" century! In those centuries, there were no kilometers! And even, I suspect that he is also miles ... *) that's a shame ... Can I measure the distance in elbows of Svyatoslav Vladimirovich? *) This will be more correct - this is the only way to get to the bottom of the sacred essence of all the distances between the "center of the world" - Lviv, and the cities of the zasechnaya line, such as Berlin or Moscow. If these ratios are compared with the aspect ratios of the Cheops pyramid = name, in fact it stands for "Heh! Ops!" - said Svyatoslav, realizing that he would soon die = that Svyatoslav laid down feeling the onset of death, then you can draw very interesting conclusions! It’s just then it will become clear how much strength this man has in building the empire “Great Galician Rus” - he is from Hungary, crawled all the way to St. Petersburg in one night to lay the first stone of the Peter and Paul Fortress ... *)))

                        Oops ... *))) How do you like such nonsense? *)
                      9. Horde
                        0
                        5 September 2012 17: 46
                        Sorry. I just don't remember how to measure everything in kilometers in Google Maps. By the way, the concept of a kilometer appeared already in the 18th ... oh, sorry, in the 17th, according to my "new chronology" century! In those centuries, there were no kilometers!


                        don't play the fool! Do you think the distance between cities changes over time, or what? Give the data even in parrots, but do not forget to measure the parrot in SI. And besides, if you decide to consider Lviv the center of the world, then please not Lutsk, not Stryi, not Ternopol, but Rome, Istanbul, Paris, Moscow and Berlin, i.e. . world capitals. In Ryabtsev’s calculations, there are 37 world cities, so take measurements on them.
                      10. 0
                        5 September 2012 18: 22
                        don't play the fool!


                        In general, you’re right - I’m fooling around, I’m in full swing. But, with a sense of wallowing. Believe me, every word I write is weighted. The game with numbers, which are your favorite followers of Fomenko = whom you are = too, does not operate with ABSOLUTE meanings, but juggle meanings with semantic, relative, sacred and semantic meanings. I don’t understand what annoys you so much when I use the same technique = albeit a little in an ironic manner =? AND?

                        History ... hmm ... Svyatoslav Vladimirovich, Prince Galitsky is a historical person. Bastard Ivan "Nastasievich" Berladnik - too. So I have the right to ... mmmmm ... manipulation, in the style of Fomenko.

                        As for the distances - do not be lazy, and open Google maps yourself and measure them - I DID NOT deceive you with numbers. Plus or minus 100-200 km is also allowed in Fomenko's calculations. How am I, with my "new chronology" worse? What do you dislike, dear? AND?

                        Do you think the distance between cities changes over time, or what?


                        This phrase of yours speaks of your complete ignorance of history in essence. Distances between cities - change over time. For example, in Central Asia, SOME cities roamed along with the changing river beds. So YOUR figures that you gave at the very beginning of our "conversation", at least regarding Tashkent, are fundamentally wrong ... *)
                      11. Horde
                        +1
                        5 September 2012 20: 11
                        Straight line distance
                        Lviv-Moscow ”- 1125 km
                        Lviv - Berlin - 799 km Vladimir - BERLIN —1.789 km.
                        Lviv-Istanbul – 1053 km ISTANBUL – 1.877 km.
                        Lviv-Paris - 1573 km PARIS —2.669 km
                        Lviv-Amsterdam - 1365 km AMSTERDAM — 2.325 km.
                        Lviv-Athens – 1318 km ATHENS – 2.370 km.
                        Lviv-Rome - 1255 km RIM - 2.554 km.
                        Lviv-Belgrade - 621 km BѢLGRAD –1.883 km
                        Lviv-Budapest - 450 km BUDAPEST - 1.748 cells
                        Lviv-Dresden - 742 km DREZDEN —1.840 km.
                        Lviv-Sofia – 796 km SOFIA – 1.931 km.
                        lviv-prague - 689 km PRAGUE - 1.852 km

                        So, four of you I did this work for you. The conclusions in the right column are the difference in the distances between the segments Vladimir - us. point X is comparable with the difference in distances between Lviv and us. paragraph X, but taking into account that the absolute values ​​of Vladimir-X are greater than Lvov-X, the accuracy of the distances is higher by the same amount. This suggests that our distant Russian ancestors, when they built strong points, were much more accurate than the hypothetical rulers of Lviv if they were the center of the world. .
                      12. -2
                        5 September 2012 20: 32
                        You are a good fellow ... *) I said - that I measured the eye by eye ... and in general, according to my theory, not circles have a sacred meaning, but, for example, rhombs. Or is there a sinusoid ... *) Place in the table yourself too? *) Give you addictions, and write off the legends of the appearance of these cities? *) With reference to historical realities? *)

                        Sorry, I’m leaving. The girl has come - and she will not understand me, that instead of paying attention to her, I am sitting at the computer and doing crap ... *))) I’ll come back and try to give you a rationale for choosing the cities that I brought. Get ready for an excursion in the era of Philip the Beautiful, Friedrich Barbarossa and others with them. Maybe we’ll even take a look at the era of Clovis ... *)) And at the same time we’ll look at how Svyatoslav Vladimirovich destroyed the Xi-Xi state in Inner Turkestan, taking the nickname Genghis Khan for this bad business ... *)
                      13. -1
                        5 September 2012 19: 23
                        Lutsk, not Stryi, not Ternopol, but Rome, Istanbul, Paris, Moscow and Berlin i.e. world capitals


                        Hykh ... that's because, and ... *))) you are a funny person. What is Moscow in the 12th century = according to the NORMAL chronology, naturally =? .. *) That is nothing ... it was not even in the ideas. What is Berlin in the 12th century? zero without a shelf - the first mention refers to the year 1244, and even then, only because there was such a city - Cologne. What is Paris in the 12th century? Well ... it just did exist, and it competed with SUCH centers of that time as Bordeaux = or it was Toulouse ... honestly, I don’t remember right away =, the capital of the kingdom of Aquitaine ... *) What is Rome in those days ? A contingent town that had faded at that moment, in connection with which the papal throne was even transferred to Avignon = of course in the 14th century =. What is Istanbul ... sorry, Constantinople in those days? *)) He was preparing to be plundered by the crusaders ... *))

                        What are you talking about here, buddy? *) You operate with the history "frozen", when you need to operate with the history in dynamics ... *)) Do you understand? *))

                        So, la-la, do not ... *)) Lutsk, or Ternopil, the cities are no worse than Rome or Paris ... *)) Your objections, I so far, indignantly dismiss ... Give others your arguments please ... *)
                      14. Horde
                        -1
                        5 September 2012 20: 51
                        So, la-la, do not ... *)) Lutsk, or Ternopil, the cities are no worse than Rome or Paris ... *)) Your objections, I so far, indignantly dismiss ... Give others your arguments please ...


                        you came up with a problem out of the blue, proving that Lviv "the center of the world" began to draw circles around Lviv, which with varying success fell to Lutsk, Ternopil and others. This is not about this, but about the REAL center of the world. If you want to refute Ryabtsev's calculations, Fomenko, then you should carry out work at the LEVEL of what scientists provide: with drawings, tables, histograms. Prove is an honor and praise to you, and you will not prove to be known as a chatterbox, without the right to have your opinion on serious sites.
                      15. 0
                        5 September 2012 22: 55
                        Horde

                        you came up with a problem out of the blue, proving that Lviv is the "center of the world"


                        Why not an equal place, I fantasized about Lviv? Here you are wrong ... The place where I fantasized is very "bumpy" ... *) Shas, right in front of your eyes, I will create an ancient legend "Mista Lviv" ... *)))

                        Based on recent research, mitochondrial Eve lived in Africa. What is Africa? What are the clichés of thinking about this continent connected with? That's right - totemism ... So - a descendant of African Adam and Eve, having reached the middle zone, almost the geometric center of Europe = already a sacred meaning appears, you take a look = retained in the memory and genes faith in totems. And one of the most powerful totems of this man was the "Lion" totem. And so, he hobbled to the Carpathian region, looked around the neighborhood, and said - "here we will lay the city of Lvov." note - the type of city in which Lions LIVE. Then, after a number of minor historical events that have taken place all those millennia, such as - the change of nationalities who inhabited these places, changes in the languages ​​of communication, sometimes - cardinal ... but nevertheless, despite ALL these little things, the city of Lviv, as it was and stayed in Lvov. How do you like the story? Is it okay? By the way, "self-worship" is nothing more than an atavism, a return to totemism. The same "Vedunas" and "Magi", in their mental development, are at the level of a shaman, some thread of an African tribe ...

                        If you say that people migrated here from the shores of the Indus and Brahmaputra, I will just remind you that Lions were found in India, even in historical times. If he says that people came here from "Hyperborea", because of the Riphean mountains - I will remind you about the cave lions, or about that in historical times, as those who believe in Hyperborea claim, there was an almost subtropical climate ...

                        As you can see, I can adapt my story that Lviv is the "center of the world" FOR ANY layout ... *) Here ...
    2. Kshatriy
      0
      5 September 2012 09: 42
      Quote: Horde
      as far as I know Anatoly Fomenko does not even have a car.

      1000 + ..... Pts heard a lot (in a personal conversation) of the feedback of his students ... NEVER more than one disrespectful statement ...
  27. Green
    +1
    4 September 2012 22: 49
    Quote: Horde
    the Russian city of VLADIMIR was not in vain called the OWNER of the WORLD-this fact is historians 
    not how not to comment, but what can they say.


    Yes, your knowledge is amazing! laughing

    Vladimir got his name from the name of its founder - the city of Vladimir - Vladimir Svyatoslavovich, the prince.
    And there is Vladimir Volynsky, doesn’t he want to make calculations? laughing
    "The real center of the world", oh how ...
    Read at your leisure the history of the specific principalities of Russia. Learn a lot.
    1. Horde
      +1
      4 September 2012 23: 52
      Vladimir got his name from the name of its founder - the city of Vladimir - Vladimir Svyatoslavovich, the prince.


      new knowledge doesn’t lie in your head at all, that on the whole world map there is no longer such a point from which points are equally distant — cities — this is the result of calculations, i.e. FACT. The story of the time years from where you pulled your quote has turned pages, it is UNACCEPTABLE in a historical document, on this basis it can be considered that the story about Vladimir Svyatoslavovich along with other stories looks suspicious.
      1. Green
        0
        5 September 2012 00: 05
        Quote: Horde
        new knowledge doesn’t lie in your head at all, that on the whole world map there is no longer such a point from which points are equally distant — cities — this is the result of calculations, i.e. FACT. The story of the time years from where you pulled your quote has turned pages, it is UNACCEPTABLE in a historical document, on this basis it can be considered that the story about Vladimir Svyatoslavovich along with other stories looks suspicious.


        Oh ... What was required to prove. More precisely, it was not required.
        In our, in Russian, this is called:
        - "Even if ssy in the eyes, everything is God's dew."

        laughing laughing laughing

        And by the way, I have never received an answer to my question TWICE above, either from you or from your friends, alas ...
        Dew, dew, dew .... laughing
        1. Kshatriy
          -2
          5 September 2012 10: 01
          Quote: Green
          In our, in Russian, this is called:
          - "Even if ssy in the eyes, everything is God's dew."

          OU .. uuuuu, where is it you dear to move, then decided ???, You have so much Russian in "Lucifer" - holiness !! And I do not advise you to cling to the Great Russian People ... Sit the same and do not be hysterical ...
          1. Green
            0
            5 September 2012 12: 45
            Quote: Kshatriya
            OU .. uuuuu, where is it you dear to move, then decided ???, You have so much Russian in "Lucifer" - holiness !! And I do not advise you to cling to the Great Russian People ... Sit the same and do not be hysterical ...


            Eh ... Kshatriy, Kshatriy ... Calm down, drink some droplets for nerves, climb on a woman or something, and it wasn’t so long ago ... laughing
            Why are you drooling like that, and everything is not the case?
            Tantrum YOU and not mine. I am sitting exactly, you NEVER refute my words. Neither you nor other Femenoids. So do not be nervous, everything is fine, soon the doctor will come, the prick will inject and it will be even better. laughing
            Py.Sy. I didn’t know that in psychiatric hospitals access to the network was allowed ... Although, maybe this is only for kshatriyas? laughing
            PPP. Yes, I’m Russian. And here you are - a question, a kshatriya. The big question. laughing
            1. Zmitcer
              -3
              5 September 2012 13: 00
              Quote: Green
              And here you are - a question, a kshatriya.

              maybe he is a Jew, but for some reason he is embarrassed by this, for some reason unknown to me, and imagined himself a great Russian Atlant, a descendant of aliens. bully all. it was a check in the head .. laughing
              1. Kshatriy
                0
                5 September 2012 16: 24
                Quote: Zmitcer
                this. it was a check in the head ..

                But for such words you are PSYA KRAV - an animal worthy .. even you will sit on my words - according to our tradition, on a COLA and crow - until you die .. Even if I am a Jew ... nothing will save you in this world and witness MY GOD KIND ..... live - you live !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
                1. Green
                  0
                  5 September 2012 16: 41
                  Quote: Kshatriya
                  But for such words you are PSYA KRAV - an animal worthy .. even my words


                  Ohhh ... Yes, here is a megalomania with violent schizophrenia mixed up !!!
                  Moderators should pay attention to this individual? wink
                  1. Kshatriy
                    0
                    5 September 2012 17: 28
                    Quote: Green
                    Moderators should pay attention to this individual?

                    Yes, no more than for you .. the flow of the monkey - according to - Darwin .... live - animal - you live ???
            2. Kshatriy
              -2
              5 September 2012 16: 35
              Quote: Green
              climb on a woman

              Climb is an animal .. I don’t forbid you ... if for people like you a woman is a woman .. your right .. the right is an animal, the right of a Dog, the right of a subhuman ... sit still and don’t let your snot go - read the "murzilka" in the name of your hatred and narrow-minded thoughts ... your consciousness is at the level of your hat with the star "baal-lucifer" ... talking with such people about belonging to the Great Russian Nation is beneath my dignity for ME .. .Chew your drool and flow ...
              Quote: Green
              Yes, I’m Russian. And here you are - a question, a kshatriya. The big question.

              I deeply doubt that among the Russian People there may be ... such a bitterness as your misunderstanding !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
              1. Green
                0
                5 September 2012 16: 55
                Quote: Kshatriya

                I deeply doubt that among the Russian People there may be ... such a bitterness as your misunderstanding !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


                I have seen a lot of Internet zadrot, koi on the network - fighters, and in life - a snotty stink. You seem to be one of those.
                Because no normal, balanced and self-respecting man will behave this way on the net, or communicate in this tone with people who are little or no friends at all.
                So you are either a sick person or a banal Internet-nerd. Although, perhaps both. It happens.
                Okay, "fighter" sit, read fairy tales and believe in your strength. Just look in the real world do not try to tell anyone that, they will knock off the last brains, this is at best.
                Tol-bo-yop is an Internet.
                1. Kshatriy
                  -1
                  5 September 2012 17: 00
                  Quote: Green
                  self-esteem man

                  Guys on the collective farm - plow ....
                  Quote: Green
                  Just look in the real world, do not try to tell anyone like that, the last brains will be knocked off, this is at best.

                  and you really want to meet with me in the real world .... I don’t mind .. I can easily prove - to hell. what the hell !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
                  1. Green
                    +1
                    5 September 2012 17: 07
                    Quote: Kshatriya
                    Guys on the collective farm - plow ....


                    Well, of course, I thought that Iidor and not you man. laughing


                    Quote: Kshatriya
                    and you really want to meet with me in the real world .... I don’t mind .. I can easily prove - to hell. what the hell !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


                    Are you calling for a date? laughing So I'm straight. laughing
                    Prove to your doctor that you are not the devil.
                2. Kshatriy
                  -1
                  5 September 2012 17: 09
                  Quote: Green
                  Okay, "fighter" sit, read fairy tales and believe in your strength.


                  For people like you are younger than me fighters are found ..... anegdot have you heard?: "It's not a royal thing to poke around in pipiske - I will order you ... Iput" ............
                  1. Green
                    +1
                    5 September 2012 17: 13
                    Quote: Kshatriya
                    For people like you are younger than me fighters are found ..... anegdot have you heard?: "It's not a royal thing to poke around in pipiske - I will order you ... Iput" ............


                    Ah ... Well, I thought that because of strangers you can only yelp spin, or online, through the monitor. laughing
                    Everything is clear shorter with you.
                    As I said above .... Idor is banal.
                    1. Kshatriy
                      0
                      5 September 2012 17: 34
                      Quote: Green
                      Ah ... Well, I thought that because of strangers you can only yelp spin, or online, through the monitor.
                      Everything is clear shorter with you.
                      As I said above .... Idor is banal.

                      Yes, noooo ... I can do it myself .. stand up for myself .. just about such an abomination. How do you - hands to dirty - west .... take off your hat --- red-bellied ...... we have a civilian in Russia the war didn’t seem to end .... THE LAMP PILL to you tovarisch !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
                      1. Green
                        0
                        5 September 2012 17: 49
                        Quote: Kshatriya
                        Yes, noooo ... I can do it myself .. stand up for myself .. just about such an abomination. How do you - hands to dirty - west .... take off your hat --- red-bellied ...... we have a civilian in Russia the war didn’t seem to end .... THE LAMP PILL to you tovarisch !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


                        Not far you, Chess word, not far. Stupid. Probably because he’s still young, maybe a schoolboy ... ???
                        Write such nonsense, at first it’s funny to read and then it’s just disgusting to read you. Nasty and no more ....
                        Ugh, some kind of abomination sits at the monitor and disgusts its abominable negativity into the network ... There are such ... Ugh ...
              2. 0
                6 September 2012 02: 35
                You know, you have beguiled the hero of a wonderful film, and simply - a great actor on the profile picture Green, with your deeply launched phobias ... *))

                Just in case, so that you still realize how awful things are for you, I will tell you a deep secret - you have such a small shoulder strap under your avatar, with one gap and two stars of "baal-lucifer" ... *)) = in a whisper = ... You realize that he is of the Soviet model, huh? *) You urgently need to arrange the expulsion of evil from yourself - the ball-lucifer, has already taken possession of you ... *))) gyyyyyy ... *)
  28. +1
    4 September 2012 23: 24
    The logical ending of Fomenkovsky delirium is described in

    http://warrax.net/58/chrono.html



    “And what did this barbarian who did not know hieroglyphs write about me,” Qing Shi Huangdi arrogantly asked.

    “Nothing,” Ivan answered gloatingly. - There was no you. And there was no China.

    - But what happened? - Qing Shi Huangdi dropped the jasper seal.

    - And there was just an ulus of our Russian Horde. Christian. And in general, China is the Russian word!

    “So we never called ourselves China!” - the Emperor protested. - It’s you there, in the West, they call us that!

    - Yea Yea! All the books were collected and burned. You generally come from Russian Cossacks! - connected the little man. - Braids, braids are Cossack forelocks! That's why your comets hurt to fly often! And you weren’t at all!

    - But what is it! I built a wall! Great!

    - And the wall was built only in the 16 century, when you got away from the Horde!

    - And my tomb with a clay army? !!

    - And this is generally under Mao Tse-tung all falsified! But where are you against mathematics?
    1. Green
      +1
      4 September 2012 23: 27
      Quote: Straus_zloy

      “And what did this barbarian who did not know hieroglyphs write about me,” Qing Shi Huangdi arrogantly asked.

      “Nothing,” Ivan answered gloatingly. - There was no you. And there was no China.

      - But what happened? - Qing Shi Huangdi dropped the jasper seal.

      - And there was just an ulus of our Russian Horde. Christian. And in general, China is the Russian word!

      “So we never called ourselves China!” - the Emperor protested. - It’s you there, in the West, they call us that!

      - Yea Yea! All the books were collected and burned. You generally come from Russian Cossacks! - connected the little man. - Braids, braids are Cossack forelocks! That's why your comets hurt to fly often! And you weren’t at all!

      - But what is it! I built a wall! Great!

      - And the wall was built only in the 16 century, when you got away from the Horde!

      - And my tomb with a clay army? !!

      - And this is generally under Mao Tse-tung all falsified! But where are you against mathematics?


      FIVE POINTS !!!! laughing laughing laughing
    2. Horde
      +1
      4 September 2012 23: 59
      The logical ending of Fomenkovsky delirium is described in

      http://warrax.net/58/chrono.html


      Are you stupid libels? Does your pride amuse it? Another she watched the topic, what can you say on the topic?
      1. -2
        5 September 2012 00: 19
        I can say, but I do not want to breed flood. Your energy would be for peaceful purposes.
      2. Kshatriy
        0
        5 September 2012 09: 53
        Quote: Horde
        Are you stupid libels? Does your pride amuse it? Another she watched the topic, what can you say on the topic?

        You entered into an argument with a whole kagal, and they have no reasonable arguments ... their task is different ... Their task is to prove their birthright in ANY way, this comes from their extremist nature ... .I once again became convinced of the justice of the "protocols of the wise men of Zion" .... They are this libel from the cradle, like the dyadzybao hunwenbins, they memorize it!
        1. Green
          +2
          5 September 2012 12: 48
          Quote: Kshatriya
          You entered into a dispute with a whole kagal, and they have no reasonable arguments ....


          From your kagala, kshatriy, AT LEAST ONE reasonable argument sounded ?? !!
          That then !!!!
          So read folk history and suck lollipop. laughing
          Good luck in this difficult matter. laughing
          1. Kshatriy
            -2
            5 September 2012 17: 43
            [quote = Green] and suck "chupa-chups" [/ quot
            Don’t you really be a red-bellied fighter ... insulting something I’ll take a look you’ve got a bit of fun ... but ... I advised those above ... and don’t think that you’re hiding beautifully ... you will have to find and - - we’ll ask ... we’ll ask everyone ... Lamppost - your place !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
            1. Green
              -1
              5 September 2012 18: 04
              Quote: Kshatriya
              Don’t you really be a red-bellied fighter ... insulting something I’ll take a look you’ve got a bit of fun ... but ... I advised those above ... and don’t think that you’re hiding beautifully ... you will have to find and - - we’ll ask ... we’ll ask everyone ... Lamppost - your place !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


              You would be more careful somehow. And then reading your posts, one gets the impression that all the followers of "NH" suffer from megalomania and schizophrenia. Although, perhaps it is ...
              A stupid, worthless little man, with a sore head and huge conceit. Well, do not show you your essence in front of everyone. As they say in Russia: "Keep quiet if you get smart." So I advise you to keep quiet a little. Enough to grind nonsense then. It's not funny already, it's sad.
              1. Kshatriy
                -1
                5 September 2012 18: 45
                Quote: Green
                So I advise you to keep quiet at least a little. Stop grinding stupidity then. Not funny already, sad.

                Note dear, I did not start first .... I wish you exactly the same ...
                Quote: Green
                Stupid, worthless little man, with a sore head and huge conceit.

                I completely agree - it’s great that you described yourself ... I trudge .. a portrait of a red-bellied bosoter in a cap with a star ... no words !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
                1. Green
                  0
                  5 September 2012 18: 54
                  Quote: Kshatriya
                  Note dear, I did not start first .... I wish you exactly the same ...


                  Well and good.


                  Quote: Kshatriya
                  portrait of a red-bellied buzoter in a cap with a star


                  This is a character from a famous film that I like, as the actor himself performed it and the film.
                  You need to know the classics !!!!
                  Yeah ...

                  Okay, I'm tired of arguing with you, and listening to feverish nonsense. Wash with cold water, better sanctified, can feel better.
        2. 0
          5 September 2012 12: 56
          where did you find the kagal, you’re ours sick, just many people don’t like Fomenkovism.

          By the way, you have a lot in common with kagal. THEY declare all who do not like them anti-Semites, and you declare kagalom. The difference is only in terms, not in behavior
        3. +1
          5 September 2012 13: 20
          Quote: Kshatriya
          Once again I was convinced of the justice of the "protocols of the Elders of Zion" ...


          Oh, and you read them, it turns out?
          But do not tell me where to get it? And then I, the Zionist villain, the hereditary Mason, the hatred of all Russia is pathological, I have never even seen this little book in my eyes. wink
          And by the way, if you, in your mono-wisdom of your Slovene-Vandal, were able to determine that I’m still an enemy, I sold Russia for pieces of silver, do not indicate where you can get these pieces of silver? And then I was already waiting! lol
          1. Kshatriy
            0
            5 September 2012 16: 50
            Quote: Roman-75
            And by the way, if you, in your mono-wisdom of your Slovene-Vandal, were able to determine that I’m still an enemy, I sold Russia for pieces of silver, do not indicate where you can get these pieces of silver? And then I was already waiting!

            I'm not going to engage in your "education" ..... but if you insist so .... take the trouble to read A.I. Solzhenitsyn "Two Hundred Years Together" - you will have a lot of new knowledge for you, in particular about the " wise men of Zion "
            Quote: Roman-75
            And then I was already waiting!

            Wow ... so you have something to think about .... wow, how do you surprise me ....
        4. Horde
          +2
          5 September 2012 16: 20
          Quote: Kshatriya
          You entered into a dispute with a whole kagal, and they have no reasonable arguments .... their task is another ... Their task is ANY way to prove their birthright, it comes from their extremist nature.


          there is no dispute, above (it's a pity there are no post numbers on this site) I posted my thoughts on the "Legend of Slovenia, Ruse and the city of Slovensk" all this was completely IGNORED instead from the green, like dirt poured from a garbage can FIN, except for swearing, lying, rudeness, this individual has no constructive thoughts, only obscene lies.
          1. Green
            0
            5 September 2012 16: 37
            Quote: Horde
            no doubt


            Of course not. You go away from direct questions and do not want to see when you are poked with your nose in the stupidity and absurdity of the conclusions given by you and the same "historians" as you are. What kind of argument is there ... You play with one goal.


            Quote: Horde
            instead, from the green, as from a garbage can, dirt poured on the FIN, except for abuse, lies, and rudeness, this individual has no constructive thoughts, only lies.


            Well, don't go too far. By the way, you have not answered my questions. And the questions were direct and I didn’t hear the answer ... Not from you, nor from other folk history lovers.
            And I’m rude only in response to the rudeness of opponents. Although, which of you nafig opponents ... so, undereducated boobies and nothing more. laughing
            1. Kshatriy
              0
              5 September 2012 17: 13
              Quote: Green
              Although, which of you nafig opponents ... so, undereducated boobies and nothing more.

              Sopi in two holes "trained" ... except for deshovy flood, I have not heard a single common thought from your kagal .. !!!!!!!!!!!!!
          2. Kshatriy
            -1
            5 September 2012 17: 23
            Quote: Horde
            there is no dispute, above (it's a pity there are no post numbers on this site) I posted my thoughts on the "Legend of Slovenia, Ruse and the city of Slovensk" all this was completely IGNORED instead from the green, like dirt poured from a garbage can FIN, except for swearing, lying, rudeness, this individual has no constructive thoughts, only obscene lies.
            Reply Citirova

            The point is that this kagal has no arguments ... and they don't know how to argue, and they need to prove their superiority based on the denial of the slave origin of their nation ... .How to do it? ... The answer is to collect a pack .. and bait with a flood ... ignoring any reasonable arguments ... I feel sorry for them - the animals that happened according to the theory of the "Origin of Species" ... Darwin is their God ... so let them believe, that they (animals) - descended from a monkey !!!!! My God is a KIND ... and let someone refute ??????????????????
  29. Kshatriy
    0
    5 September 2012 16: 54
    Quote: Roman-75
    Novel-75 (1)

    By the way, I never heard from you a comprehensible explanation about the origin of SAUVASTIKA on an obscure stamp-field ... ?????
    1. Zmitcer
      0
      5 September 2012 17: 12
      it's all nonsense. where are the monuments? will you answer the question or should I run around the forum after you? wassat Or were they the beards that Peter the First ordered to shave? And there is still some kind of wall calendar ordered to throw in the oven, probably it was without a scanword .. boredom .. and that's it! no beard. no monument! no evidence! laughing
      1. Kshatriy
        -1
        5 September 2012 17: 37
        Quote: Zmitcer
        about the origin of SAUVASTIKA on an obscure stamp field ... ?????

        I asked you this question ... kindly answer ... if you can?
        1. Zmitcer
          0
          5 September 2012 19: 29
          Quote: Kshatriya
          I asked you this question.

          meyayay. and you just like a Jew, answer a question with a question. Are you by any chance from the glorious city of Bobruisk? here you are just splashing saliva and citing some invented nonsense of pseudoscientists about false history. What does it give you? Maybe go out into real life, out of the fantasy world and say something intelligible, meaningful, give concrete facts. And then read cheap fiction about the king-pea and how he fought with mushrooms, do not respect yourself. can you say something essentially? to be honest, it's funny. I imagine it will be a "bomb".
      2. Green
        0
        5 September 2012 17: 53
        Quote: Zmitcer
        it's all nonsense. where are the monuments?



        So, they all run from this question as hell from incense !!!!
        Because they don’t have an answer to it, just as there are no monuments - no.
        They can measure only with a ruler of a card, turn it over to the word, or simply lie and nothing more. laughing
        1. Kshatriy
          -1
          5 September 2012 18: 58
          Quote: Green
          Because they don’t have an answer to it, just as there are no monuments - no.

          How many times should I repeat .. for those sitting in the tank ????
          I'm NOT interested in talking to you about "Historical Reconstruction" ... all this question is not addressed to me ....
          Prove the inconsistency of the Fomenko-Nosovsky hypothesis "New Chronology" in the plane of mathematical analysis ... ... preferably in your own words (you will be given a Nobel Prize .. at least) ... all materials on this issue are freely available ... ... you dear ones - you can't do this --- NEVER ... because there is you - NONE ... and call you ANYWHERE ... cool down, cover yourself with rags and do not shine ... sniff in two nostrils and read comics ... they match your intelligence !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
          Quote: Green
          there are no monuments.

          And the devil will put a monument to you in the hellish worlds ..with a star on the pyramid .......
          1. Green
            +1
            5 September 2012 19: 03
            Quote: Kshatriya
            And the devil will put a monument to you in the hellish worlds ..with a star on the pyramid .......


            Well, you see, well, you can’t, in principle, NORMALLY communicate. YOU CAN NOT !!!
            What can we talk about, to whom and what to prove in this case? No one, you still can’t understand and understand. Alas. Stay dark ignoramus. Amen!
            1. Kshatriy
              0
              5 September 2012 21: 36
              [quote = Kshatriy] How many times should I repeat .. for those sitting in the tank ????
              I'm NOT interested in talking to you about "Historical Reconstruction" ... all this question is not addressed to me ....
              Prove the inconsistency of the Fomenko-Nosovsky hypothesis "New Chronology" in the plane of mathematical analysis ... ... preferably in your own words (you will be given a Nobel Prize .. at least) ... all materials on this issue are freely available ... ... you dear ones - you can't do this --- NEVER ... because there is you - NONE ... and call you ANYWHERE ... cool down, cover yourself with rags and do not shine ... sniff in two nostrils and read comics ... they match your intelligence !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! [

              [quote = Green] Well, you see, well, you can’t, in principle, NORMALLY communicate. YOU CAN NOT !!!
              What can we talk about, to whom and what to prove in this case? No one, you still can’t understand and understand. Alas. Stay dark ignoramus. Amen! [/ Quote]
              To answer a question with a question is all that you can .. tired of ... go read the comics ... do not you learn from me ... Yes, and what? ....
          2. Zmitcer
            0
            5 September 2012 19: 26
            mdyayaya. and you’re just like a Jew, answer a question with a question. Are you by any chance not from the glorious city of Bobruisk? laughing you are just spraying saliva and bring some fictitious nonsense of pseudo-scientists about false history. What does this give you? Maybe go out into the real world, from the world of fantasies and say something intelligible, with meaning, you will see specific facts. And then read cheap fiction about the pea king and how he fought with mushrooms, do not respect yourself. can you essentially say something? honestly funny. laughing I imagine it will be a "bomb".
    2. +2
      5 September 2012 21: 11
      Quote: Kshatriya
      By the way, I never heard from you a comprehensible explanation about the origin of SAUVASTIKA on an obscure stamp-field ... ?????


      And for this to the administrators of the forum, thank you very much. With a rating like mine, you can post a teaspoon per hour. Well, and how the rating is earned on this forum, you, "comrade lieutenant", know better than me ...
      But so be it, I’ll answer - I took this picture a few years ago in LJ one person who is engaged in the historical reconstruction of weapons and military affairs and amateur archeology. According to him, he found this pattern somewhere in Ukraine. Where exactly and under what circumstances - was not specified.

      All right, the lyrics aside.
      I want to ask quite seriously.
      Kshatriya, if you and your like-minded people are so firmly convinced that the Russian state, which occupied a vast territory and was the most powerful power of its time, already existed, God knows in ancient times, I hope it will not be difficult to present such evidence of its reality as:
      1. leftovers for realin large settlements urban type (well, at least something like Athens);
      2. traces of road infrastructure (something like Roman roads, bridges, inns, wells, etc.);
      3. ruins of fortifications (something similar to the remnants of Roman limes);
      4. ruins of production facilities (any mines, mines, quarries, workshops, forges, and the like);
      5. artifacts testifying to the existence of the monetary system of the said state (after all, the state is impossible without finances, right?);
      6. written evidence remaining from this country.
      And all this should be no younger than the turn of the first century AD (and preferably a thousand years older), be located on a really serious territory, have a proven Slavic affiliation.
      Waiting for your arguments.
      1. Kshatriy
        0
        5 September 2012 21: 56
        Quote: Roman-75
        Kshatriya, if you and your like-minded people are so firmly convinced that the Russian state, which occupied a vast territory and was the most powerful power of its time, already existed, God knows in ancient times, I hope it will not be difficult to present such evidence of its reality as:

        Read above .. my comments ... but so be it again ......
        I am not going to prove to anyone the correctness or incorrectness of the "historical reconstruction" .... faith is a matter --- purely personal ... not interesting to me ..... I have no faith ---- I have VEDA ... but this is my personal and for all to see to take out my insides .. I'm not going under any circumstances ...
        Fomenko-Nosovsky's hypothesis "New Chronology" - is in the plane of mathematical analysis .... in this connection, refute it with numbers ... and on the basis of applied mathematics .... if you can't ... then don't flood ... please ..... wikipedia and dropouts are exemplary as a link for me they mean ... the level of the person who gives these links - no .... your thoughts please, as a refutation .... risk putting it on public display and not on this resource and you will become a "Nobel laureate" .... if you can refute ... "New Chronology" from the point of view of modern applied mathematics .....
        1. -1
          5 September 2012 22: 50
          Quote: Kshatriya
          I'm not going to prove to anyone the correctness or incorrectness of the "historical reconstruction"


          Gorgeous ...
          That is, "I will say any nonsense, and you try to refute it when I don't want to know your arguments"?
          Great, everything is clear with you.
          1. Kshatriy
            0
            6 September 2012 09: 34
            Quote: Roman-75
            That is, "I will say any nonsense, and you try to refute it when I don't want to know your arguments"?
            Great, everything is clear with you.


            Where and in what place did I say something about the "historical reconstruction" ?????? Open your eyes !!! I said that this project is not interesting to me and I am not going to discuss it ..., and I did not discuss any nonsense on this issue .... It was your kagal who threw a flood on this topic !!!!
            Quote: Kshatriya
            Fomenko-Nosovsky's hypothesis "New Chronology" - is in the plane of mathematical analysis .... in this connection, refute it with numbers ... and on the basis of applied mathematics .... if you can't ... then don't flood ...you are welcome....

            Here is my answer !!! How do you attach "historical reconstruction" to this ??????
            Quote: Roman-75
            But so be it, I’ll answer - I took this picture a few years ago in LJ one person who is engaged in the historical reconstruction of weapons and military affairs and amateur archeology. According to him, he found this pattern somewhere in Ukraine. Where exactly and under what circumstances - was not specified.

            Amazing answer: "I am not me and the horse is not mine !!!" .... That is, you use a sacred symbol without having the slightest idea of ​​its meaning ...... I wish you good luck in your nonsense .... ....
            1. 0
              6 September 2012 19: 36
              Quote: Kshatriya
              That is, you use a sacred symbol without having the slightest idea of ​​its meaning ..


              Hehe.
              To the bar!
              It is because I understand the meaning that I use this picture on my profile picture.
        2. +17
          28 November 2020 19: 42
          Quote: Kshatriya
          if you can refute ... "New Chronology" from the point of view of modern applied mathematics

          The theoretical construction of NX is largely based on astronomical events reflected in Ptolemy's stellar catalog "Almagest", which, according to Fomenko, was not compiled in the 1000nd century BC. e., as is customary, and in the X century A.D. e. In this regard, the history of the Ancient World in NH was "rejuvenated" by more than XNUMX years.
          According to the modern coordinates of the celestial bodies, it is really possible to calculate at what time the stars occupied the position reflected in the "Almagest" (for this, it is taken into account that the longitude of the stars increases by 72 degree every 1 years). The giant error in Fomenko's calculations, according to astronomers, lies in the fact that he leads them not by the longitudes of the stars, which gives accurate results, but only by latitudes, where the accuracy of the calculations is extremely low.
          According to the professor of astronomy Yuri Efremov, Fomenko, in order to avoid calculations on the longitudes of the stars, went for a direct falsification of Ptolemy's data and said that in the "Almagest" there was no indication of the starting point of longitudes. Whereas it is enough to open the 7th part of book number 11 and make sure that the Alexandrian astronomer already indicates the first zodiac sign of Aries in the coordinate system in longitude.
          It is reported by Rambler. Further: https://weekend.rambler.ru/read/39855500/?utm_content=weekend_media&utm_medium=read_more&utm_source=copylink
  30. 0
    6 September 2012 20: 25
    Yes, guys ... you have leapfrog here ... do not spoil.
    You, that one team, that the opposite - DO NOT HEAR each other.
    Each group talks about its own.
    Alone about the monuments - take them out and lay them down. (Yes, they are under your nose, only you used to call them - Phoenician, Greek, Roman ... Well, so tradition requires.)
    Others say - calculate mathematically .. And will disappear - deep antiquity. Phenicia, Egypt, Greece, Rome will disappear.
    ...
    Allow ???? And what will remain? A shaky, incomprehensible mess ... of pseudo-ancient manuscripts, no APPROVED story? And - the most important thing - where to put MONUMENTS, MONUMENTS, MONUMENTS ... ???
    .. Until now, they have been described like this.
    And .... with NH - how to describe?
    This is not to rewrite ... known.
    It's ... you have to think.
    ...
    And all business.
    Monuments.
    Lenin, Stalin - destroyed. Buddha statues in Afghanistan - shot, blown up. Napoleon from guns planted on the Sphinx.
    Who are the monuments ???? Fly on sale ...
    ..
    ..
    and, another moment .. Since I myself am from Tashkent - I would like to hear the name of the cafe where Yesenin scratched out - Shagane, you are mine, Shagane ... ??
    This is a Monument ...
    1. +1
      6 September 2012 21: 04
      At one time, they are sitting blind-eyed (or even blind) ... peasants. They can write. Or dictating ... well ... to those who write much.
      They are sitting ... in the port, in the tavern. In the inn (monastery, for example).
      And they listen to the tales ... of a passing people. And this is all for selection - mercenaries, dashing little brothers.
      Who are pirate sailors, who are robber guards.
      Tell me ... about life in distant lands? ... For what, or what? ... Well, will we bring a glass of beer? .... So you first bring it-feed-bathe- evaporate in the bathhouse-and then we will agree.
      ..
      Think fiction?
      This is - manuscripts ... Ibn-Fadlan, MavroOrbini, Shletser, Homer, Herodotus. This is the Radziwill fake.
      ..
      They offer and demand us - to believe in this?
      In tales from the third, drunk, mouth. Apart from scribes ... and translators.
      ...
      and, in addition ... they are sitting. And where did they get the money ... for a drink ... talkative shobla?
      Someone, then, instructed ... to sprinkle the material.
      For interest, there.
      For intelligence, let's say.
      Just to read - for a future dream.
      And, all this, talkative, drunken horde will begin ... to lay out the secrets of craft, roads, wells.
      ...
      What's true, brother?
      1. 0
        6 September 2012 21: 16
        Since I myself am from Tashkent - I would like to hear the name of the cafe where Yesenin scratched out - Shagane, you are mine, Shagane ...


        Alas and oh, my friend - this old town cafe = if I remember exactly, it was called "Shoboda" - "Cool" = demolished in 2003. It was very unpleasant to come there and see a pile of construction waste ...

        At one time, they are sitting blind-eyed (or even blind) ... peasants. They know how to write.


        Well, it's understandable that history is usually written by blind-deaf-mute people who only feel how the hammer gripped in the hands of the rulers is biting on the head ... *) But still, you must admit, it is even more idiocy to say - "Alexander the Great in fact - Peter the First! I swear by mathematical analysis and equations of mathematical physics! Look, in this equation of mine, at Planck's constant, this squiggle on top was drawn exactly this way and not otherwise. And it was the hand of providence ... or rather, gesture of my genius subconscious! And it is from this that I conclude that Alexander and Peter are one and the same person! " = of course I'm exaggerating, but not much = ... *)
        1. 0
          6 September 2012 21: 25
          In order to slightly improve the image of Tashkent, in the light of what I have said above, I add - Yesenin's house-museum in Tashkent is carefully preserved. And, it seems, those boards about which I spoke are stored there ...
    2. Green
      +2
      6 September 2012 22: 00
      Quote: Igarr
      (Yes, they are under your nose, only you used to call them - Phoenician, Greek, Roman ... Well, so tradition requires.)


      Igarr, and whose are they? Well, tell me whose?
      So, calmly without emotion.
      Just don’t say that the Parthenon, the Knossos Palace, the Flavian Theater, the temple of Baal Shamin, Leptis Magna or the Pyramids of Egypt and so on and so on were built by the Russians.
      So whose monuments are these?
      1. +1
        7 September 2012 22: 40
        I seem to be very late.
        but I will answer, for the answer ... cleanly.
        Nobody says that there are no monuments.
        Yes, there they are before my eyes.
        Another thing is how we perceive them, these monuments, as we describe.
        ..
        No matter how much I read NH (FIN) - nowhere, something did not mark the words - made by Russians .. This is for such a message - ".. Just do not say that the Parthenon, the Palace of Knossos, the Flavian theater, the temple of Baal Shamin, Leptis Magna or the Pyramids Egypt and stuff and stuff built by Russians. "
        Mzht .. read inattentively.
        Then, I'm sorry .. tell me - I will re-read it again.
        ...
        Parthenon ... then he is the temple of Athena Parthenos (Virgin), then he is the temple - the VirginVirgin-Mothers, then he ..mark ...
        So what ... is he ??
        Further ... all materials admire - Parthenon, creation of the 5th century BC, 447 BC - built according to the proportions of the "GOLDEN SECTION".
        and I, from the school and the institute, have the strong opinion that the Golden Section is the notion of the Italian school of architects and sculptors of the 15 century AD (Michelangelo, Raphael, Leonardo da Vinci).
        What's true, brother?
        The materials are admired - the columns of the Parthenon have a vertical "obstruction" not fixed by the eye ... to create exceptional parallelism ... according to the laws of optical mechanics ???
        It is in the fifth century BC - were developed in detail - the laws of optics?
        And then they were revived only in the 15 century? Huygens, Le Verrier ...?
        And before that, for a thousand years ... they were not known to anyone?
        And suddenly ... in the 15 century .. remembered what happened a thousand years ago?
        it’s not ... seems strange?
        ...
        The thing is ... that these monuments are a double-edged sword.
        They are.
        They were created.
        But who ?????
        Some answer - SO.
        Others are EDAC.
        ..
        What's true, brother?
        1. Green
          +1
          7 September 2012 23: 05
          Quote: Igarr
          No matter how much I read NH (FIN) - nowhere, something did not mark the words - made by Russians .. This is for such a message - ".. Just do not say that the Parthenon, the Palace of Knossos, the Flavian theater, the Temple of Baal Shamin, Leptis Magna or the Pyramids Egypt and so on and so forth built by the Russians. "


          Hmm ... But I've read it, they have such a statement that the same pyramids were built by "Russian princes-atamans". It's almost literal. Well, that's not the point.


          Quote: Igarr
          Parthenon ... then he is the temple of Athena Parthenos (Virgin), then he is the temple - of the Virgin Mother of the Virgin, then he ..mark ...
          So what ... is he ??


          This is the temple of the patroness and founder (according to legend) of Athens - Athena Parthenos.
          Where and by whom is it written that it is "The Temple of the Mother of God" or "Mosque" ??
          Who claims this and what motivates ??


          Quote: Igarr
          Further ... all materials admire - Parthenon, creation of the 5th century BC, 447 BC - built according to the proportions of the "GOLDEN SECTION".
          and I, from the school and the institute, have the strong opinion that the Golden Section is the notion of the Italian school of architects and sculptors of the 15 century AD (Michelangelo, Raphael, Leonardo da Vinci).


          You have the wrong opinion. The ancients knew this principle and used it. Starting from the civilization of Dr. Of Egypt. And dr. Greek architects, builders, sculptors, and used it even more so. And not only during the construction of the Parthenon.

          So where is the truth, brother?
          Yes, and what about the remaining monuments left over from the Civilizations of Mesopotamia, Crete and others?
  31. 0
    6 September 2012 21: 41
    Clear.
    I can’t say anything about the 2003 of the year. The last time I was there was at 1998. But there was a museum on Pushkinskaya. And these boards ........ okay.
    ..
    I'm talking about ... reconstruction of history ... did not say anything.
    About your views ... and the views of your opponents in this topic - too.
    ..
    I will repeat only what I have stated more than once.
    As a result of mastering the material, historical - and its over the past years, oh how much - I had my own ... history of the world.
    I do not impose it on anyone, I do not promote it to anyone. This is my own chip. Non-aggressive.
    But all the rest - I consider, first of all ... ". From my bell tower."
    It can be called - your opinion.
    By the way, you were not against what.
    On this, I take my leave.
  32. 0
    April 26 2021 21: 28
    If we remove all the nonsense with numbers, then the Settlement of Slovensk near Lake Ilmen was formed in 463 BC. e. ...

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