"Plus or minus a kilometer": Ex-General of the Armed Forces of Ukraine named those responsible for the missiles of the artillerymen of the Armed Forces of Ukraine in Donbass

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The leadership of the Ukrainian General Staff during the presidency of Viktor Yanukovych is guilty of the fact that during the first years of the war in Donbas, Ukrainian artillerymen fired with an accuracy of "plus or minus a kilometer" and did not hit where they were aiming. This was stated by the former Deputy Secretary of the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine, General of the Armed Forces of Ukraine Serhiy Krivonos.

The general, speaking at a round table in Lvov, said that at the beginning of hostilities, when Ukrainian artillerymen fired, half of the shells flew "anywhere", but not at the target. The reason for this, he stressed, is not the "squint" of the gunners and the inability to shoot, but the "wear of the barrels" of the guns and howitzers inherited from the previous government.



According to Krivonos, the former leadership of the Ukrainian Ministry of Defense under Yanukovych carried out a "quiet sabotage" aimed at the collapse of the Ukrainian army. This was done, no one has any doubts, by order of Russia, which is trying to nullify the superiority of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

It was such a gorgeous sabotage, because when our shells hit the front plus or minus a kilometer (...) there was no reason for the poor training of the gunners. This was the reason - the erased barrel channels

- declared the general.

Thus, following the logic of Krivonos, the Ukrainian Armed Forces did not fire at the settlements of the Donetsk and Lugansk republics. It is not the artillerymen of the Armed Forces of Ukraine and their commanders who gave the order to shoot, but the former leaders of the Ukrainian military department, who "erased" the barrels of the guns, are to blame for the hits of shells in houses and the murder of civilians. Iron logic.
  • Ministry of Defense of Ukraine
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  1. +8
    5 2021 June
    Tell the sovereign that the English don't clean their guns with bricks

    And here Russia is to blame, well, these infallible Ukrainians ...
    1. +10
      5 2021 June
      following the logic of Krivonos, the Ukrainian Armed Forces did not fire at the settlements of the Donetsk and Lugansk republics. It is not the artillerymen of the Armed Forces of Ukraine and their commanders who gave the order to shoot, but the former leaders of the Ukrainian military department, who "erased" the barrels of the guns, are to blame for the hits of shells in houses and the murder of civilians.

      The former deputy secretary of the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine, General of the Ukrainian Armed Forces Serhiy Krivonos, is simply trying to ward off the military crimes of the Armed Forces of Ukraine and the Bandera-Nazi authorities in Kiev, which came to power in 2014 as a result of the Illegal State Revolution of the Bandera-Nazis on the Maidan in Ukraine, genocide against the Russian people and the prohibition of the Russian language throughout the country and the declaration of the Russian civil war in the southeast of the country.

    2. +2
      5 2021 June
      To confer the title of Doctor of Military Sciences without protection.
      NOT! Not depleted in "talents" ... APU
      1. -1
        6 2021 June
        Quote: knn54
        To confer the title of Doctor of Military Sciences without protection.

        Sometimes such a title is for the most part Civil famous universities is awarded as an honorary one for contributions to science and education ...
        GDP has a couple of these ...
        While assigning honorary title Doctor of Military Sciences for a certain contribution to the development of military science, it seems to me wrong ...
    3. +5
      5 2021 June
      They are already laughing openly over the clown.

      Who sings in a pirate language here ?? !!)) - Otpad))
  2. +5
    5 2021 June
    How? Again Petrov and Boshirov? Are they washing cannon barrels now?
    1. 0
      5 2021 June
      Here is the insidious hand of the Kremlin. What was it rubbed with? Probably with rasps on quiet Ukrainian nights :))) And the fact that Ukraine was actively selling weapons after the acquisition of "independence", the grief of the military, inherited from the USSR, does not want to remember. , if she was at all in the army selling weapons? And how were the weapons stored? But Moscow and Yanukovych type are again to blame for Svidomo :))) Previous presidents have nothing to do with it, as well as such Svidomo generals :)))
    2. 0
      6 2021 June
      No, this specimen, obviously, is one of those inhibited personalities who cannot get off the topic of "poperedniki" in any way.
      He will remember Petrov and Boshirov in the year 30, if by that time they had not yet buried him.
  3. +17
    5 2021 June
    How can KRIVONOS talk about accuracy ??? wassat
  4. +7
    5 2021 June
    Bravo))) 404 in all its glory. Anyone is to blame but not them))) Lord ... they are repulsed. Give them some brains.
    1. +8
      5 2021 June
      Quote: carstorm 11
      Bravo))) 404 in all its glory. Anyone is to blame but not them)))

      And it was not they who unleashed the terror and the war against the peaceful Donbass, but Russia ...

      Quote: carstorm 11
      Lord ... they are repulsed. Give them some brains.


      This is unlikely ... The Lord left Ukraine.

      1. 0
        5 2021 June
        It was not in vain that people around Gutroshenko fainted, even his offspring fell down. One can believe, one may not believe, but too often it happened that way.
  5. +9
    5 2021 June
    The Minsk agreements were born for both the Illovaysky and Debaltsevsky boilers.
    If for each arrival of Ukrainian ammunition across the territory of Donbass to Kiev, specifically to Kiev, a response arrives, Minsk -3 will be "born" instantly.
    And a deviation of a kilometer or two will not play any role.
    It's time to help the defenders of Donbass with appropriate weapons, and then the world is not far off.
    1. +5
      5 2021 June
      Quote: prior
      If for each arrival of Ukrainian ammunition across the territory of Donbass to Kiev, specifically to Kiev, a response arrives, Minsk -3 will be "born" instantly.

      The moment when I agree with you by 146%.
      Py.Sy. Only to lay ammunition at significant points, and then write off, like Krivonos, "for wear and tear of the barrels" at the LPNR, they say, "we were the points that were firing at us, suppressed."
      1. +1
        5 2021 June
        Quote: prior
        If for each arrival of Ukrainian ammunition through the territory of Donbass to Kiev, specifically to Kiev, a response will arrive

        Garn idea. But does the LPNR have the technical ability to finish off Kuev, and even put the projectile at the desired point? It is the Ukronazis who shoot at residential areas "with every right", but Hamas can shoot with impunity wherever Allah sends, and if the LPNR accidentally gets in the wrong place, Bidet will immediately gurgle about war crimes, and the whole of Geyropa will sing along.
  6. +5
    5 2021 June
    The general, speaking at a round table in Lvov, said that at the beginning of hostilities, when Ukrainian artillerymen fired, half of the shells flew "anywhere", but not at the target. The reason for this, he stressed, is not the "squint" of the gunners and the inability to shoot, but the "wear of the barrels" of the guns and howitzers inherited from the previous government.

    Just like in the movies:

    But it seems to me that the Ukrainian artillerymen simply forgot when they conducted the exercises. And the binding of the firing positions was done by the ringing of the dog's chain.
    1. +7
      5 2021 June
      Quote: ROSS 42

      Just like in the movies:

      Well, it has long been known that "Wedding in Malinovka" is a documentary film. From the first frame to the last.
    2. 0
      5 2021 June
      Inspired by ....
      At the training ground, self-propelled guns ....
      Shot, spotter .... 300 m undershot
      Commander ... "Mekhvod, (hereinafter language No. 3) 300 meters ahead ...
  7. +10
    5 2021 June
    It is impossible for stupid farmers to have their own state. A.I.Denikin was right. Stupid, limited, lazy, envious, thieving and sneaky. Strongly reluctant to look in the mirror.
  8. +12
    5 2021 June
    Are there generally adequate generals and ministers? This is how much you need to drink to freeze this. Yes, there is wear and tear. But where is the replacement money? And who gave the command to fire with such a spread? In general, this is nonsense. As a DPR fighter, I will say so - when adjusting from a UAV, they shoot not badly, unfortunately. To put two mines with a spread of 1 meter is not bad. Exactly a month ago, near Dokuchaevsk, we have 3 two hundredths. But they threw in a lot. At first, they worked on the area. I had a newbie. I asked what to do. I say - stand on the loophole, and there it is like in a lottery. Will not arrive ... We were lucky then.
    1. +2
      5 2021 June
      Oleg, the person who asks "what to do" is not a fighter. I, who did not serve, would first of all ask to show me the firing sector.
      P.S. Oleg, excuse me, only on the second reading understood that it was about mines. Yes, you filthy thing ...
      1. +1
        5 2021 June
        Oleg, the person who asks "what to do" is not a fighter.

        So I say - a beginner. Well, about the shelling sector .... We were even forbidden to shoot at pheasants. God forbid we provoke! Although, if the reconnaissance shoots, then the task is failed. Our business is to observe.
        1. 0
          5 2021 June
          Quote: URAL72
          So I say - a beginner.

          It will be cleaned, it will be maintained. Under fire, "mom's pies" come out quickly Yes
      2. +1
        5 2021 June
        Quote: sabakina
        Oleg, the person who asks "what to do" is not a fighter. I, who did not serve, would first of all ask to show me the firing sector.

        Proceeding from the fact that you are not "fired upon", and even did not serve, you have such ideas.
        That is why you decided that the fighter was not shown the "fire card" in advance, and he does not know his sector of fire?

        And how would YOU behave in a similar situation when "it happened for the first time" and a massive artillery bombardment began? Would you aimlessly shoot from an embrasure into invisible mortars (cannons) or ask an experienced comrade how to behave under fire?
        1. +2
          5 2021 June
          PiK yes, not served. But he spent his entire childhood in the 331st Airborne Troops Regiment, from the obstacle course (well, I liked it), to the regiment headquarters. I just do not understand why they sometimes frighten me? request
          1. 0
            5 2021 June
            Quote: sabakina
            I don’t understand why they sometimes frighten me?

            Who belay ?

            Quote: sabakina
            spent his entire childhood in the 331st Airborne Troops Regiment, from the obstacle course (well, I liked it), to the regiment headquarters.


            A child's look from the outside and the stress of the first more or less significant shelling, when the consciousness creeps into - " A little more - and the END ", this is somewhat different ...
  9. +3
    5 2021 June
    to the order of Russia, which is trying to wipe out the superiority of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

    uhry even talk about superiority--
  10. +6
    5 2021 June
    It was such a gorgeous sabotage, because when our shells at the front, plus or minus a kilometer, hit (...)
    Well, they found the culprit for their defeats in the years 14-15. Sabotage, General, you have confusion and confidence in impunity. And it causes irreparable harm to your second generation. You have complete wear not of the trunks, but of the brain as a result of its aggressive exploitation for other purposes.
  11. +4
    5 2021 June
    Dad "missed" them ... didn’t drip ... Mom didn’t bring them ... iodine wasn’t enough ...
    And so - garni lads !!!
    1. 0
      5 2021 June
      Quote: usr01
      Dad "missed" them ... didn’t drip ... Mom didn’t bring them ...

      Dad, just dug - sivukhs, before... And their maman is the same, an alcoholic ...

      In general, they were made a bit ...
      1. 0
        5 2021 June
        And again the Kremlin's hand is to blame :))) They are incorrigible!
  12. +3
    5 2021 June
    Maybe a scatter in the brains? I remembered Yanukovych ... Under the USSR, I would not have gone further than a major, but now the bet is on the "devoted", that's the whole trouble of the current government: whoever shouts loudly and beats himself in the chest is glory, and intelligence is a secondary matter ... gyrus from the cap, al two, side ...
  13. +6
    5 2021 June
    From the D-30? Miss a kilometer? Which place should you aim for?
    1. +5
      5 2021 June
      Quote: sergo1914
      From the D-30? Miss a kilometer? Which place should you aim for?

      Well, if you use the tables from the mortar, keep them upside down, aim at the boot in a drunk state, then you can miss 10 km. But, after all, all these are excuses ... These creatures deliberately hit the peaceful.
    2. +5
      5 2021 June
      when you see double or triple in your eyes from what you drink, it's easy :)
      1. +1
        5 2021 June
        Quote: Shkworen
        when you see double or triple in your eyes from what you drink, it's easy :)


        Well, we somehow, in practice, at the institute, drunk bullets from it. But they got there. In the sense of the right place.
        PS Nobody was hurt. It was in the Urals. There were no normal people in the area. Polygonists only.
    3. +2
      5 2021 June
      Quote: sergo1914
      From the D-30? Miss a kilometer? Which place should you aim for?

      If, with a hangover, your hands do not hold a glass, and you are still asking about the sight.
      1. 0
        5 2021 June
        So that's a glass. The sight is bolted to the fluff tightly. You can't drop it.
        1. 0
          5 2021 June
          Quote: sergo1914
          The sight is bolted to the fluff tightly. You won't drop it.

          But you definitely can't point it ...
  14. +6
    5 2021 June
    Apparently, for the artillerymen of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, the Gauss-Kruger firing table is just an empty phrase ... as well as for their command.
    1. +4
      5 2021 June
      Quote: Angry 55
      for artillerymen of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, the Gauss-Kruger firing table is just an empty phrase

      You have written words that are terrible and incomprehensible for the artillerymen of the Armed Forces of Ukraine Yes
      1. +3
        5 2021 June
        Quote: PiK
        You have written words that are terrible and incomprehensible for the artillerymen of the Armed Forces of Ukraine

        Why tables, ragul looked at the barrel, drove the shell and fired. Somewhere and will get.
        1. +3
          5 2021 June
          Quote: tihonmarine
          Why tables, ragul looked at the barrel, drove the shell and fired. Somewhere and will get.

          Will get Yes , will get Yes (pulled the "shmogalka" too hard).

      2. 0
        5 2021 June
        Well ... to be fair, they shoot just fine now. We are plowing our positions so hard that mom don’t cry! And in our landfills, artists fill out the magazines and build the landfill. So that...
  15. +7
    5 2021 June
    Something Krivonos is not that crooked. In the first years of shooting, they smeared because of worn-out barrels, and in subsequent years, why was they smeared? Now how are the trunks not worn out anymore? Or did they begin to make a correction for the barrel? It smells a bit of a sigh, Pan Krivonos. It turns out that in the strongest army on the continent, artillerymen are shooting by, and every year everything is less and less. Eh, General, I didn't have enough sense to say that under Ze, an American tap was cut on a new barrels, maybe the field marshal would have been given.
    1. +1
      5 2021 June
      Quote: Angry Troll
      It smells a bit of a sigh, Pan Krivonos.

      Eh, Krivonos! Such a name is a disgrace! There was Maxim Krivonos - the first colonel and loyal ally of Bohdan Khmelnitsky! And this one ... It can be seen that nature is resting on its descendants.
  16. +3
    5 2021 June
    Everyone around is to blame, are only Svidomo lads innocent.
  17. +1
    5 2021 June
    So there is not only Krivonos, but also a crooked-eyed and a crooked brain, from there all the troubles of the Ukrainians.
  18. +1
    5 2021 June
    The opinion of this haneral is of particular value - since he served the entire service in the SBU and saw guns only on TV and in books (although he hardly read books).
  19. 0
    5 2021 June
    Here you are all laughing at their skills, but there was also a Soviet school of artillery there. There, officers from the USSR taught at universities. They can do anything. I do not know. There are specialists who can really pile on the art of the entire group in the Crimea. Only not for long. A question for experts, what will 150-200 tanks do from the side of the Armed Forces of Ukraine on the border with Crimea in the event of an offensive?
    1. +1
      5 2021 June
      Burn within three to five days.
      1. 0
        6 2021 June
        For a long time you are going to fight.
        1. 0
          6 2021 June
          I'm not going to fight at all. On the
          The same people live in that territory, the brains have been made to them, but the people are the same. I hope it won't come to war.
    2. +2
      5 2021 June
      At Perekop, the last, then the first tank is destroyed ... well, according to the classics.
  20. 0
    5 2021 June
    And now they are not erased?
    Where do they get new trunks?
  21. +1
    5 2021 June
    Does he regret the injured civilians, wasted in empty squadrons or missed the militia? Dont clear...
  22. 0
    5 2021 June
    I thought that the military was responsible for the weapons, but no, the supporters were to blame for everything, and always.
  23. -1
    6 2021 June
    Um, am I missing something? If we follow the logic of this "genius", it turns out that at the beginning of the war, the wear of the barrels was at a level leading to an increase in the dispersion radius up to a kilometer, and then decreased? How is it in general?
  24. 0
    6 2021 June
    Quote: Victor Sergeev
    I thought that the military was responsible for the weapons, but no, the supporters were to blame for everything, and always.
  25. 0
    6 2021 June
    well, yes, remember .... barrel bending recourse
  26. 0
    6 2021 June
    According to Krivonos, the former leadership of the Ukrainian Ministry of Defense under Yanukovych carried out a "quiet sabotage" aimed at the collapse of the Ukrainian army. This was done, no one has any doubts, by order of Russia, which is trying to nullify the superiority of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

    Has Yanukovych Been President Since Ukraine's Independence?
    Similarly, things are developing in the Ukrainian artillery units. From the storage bases, perhaps, everything that could shoot and of various calibers was pulled out. There was also room for 2030mm B-4 and 850mm D-48 howitzers. In fact, with the beginning of the war, all artillery pieces, MLRS and self-propelled guns that were inherited from the USSR went to the artillery units. One of the attempts to create their own artillery ended in tragic consequences. The 120-mm Molot mortars created in Ukraine became the real killers of their own crews and were discontinued due to high-profile scandals.
    Perhaps, Now the most valuable artillery novelty, which has already begun to enter the troops, is the mobile 120-mm mortars "Bars-8MMK". Manufactured under license purchased in Spain these mortars are able to quickly turn around in position, make an artillery raid and leave the position just as swiftly. Currently in the Armed Forces of Ukraine six mobile mortars delivered Bars-8MMK.
    In the development of the artillery forces of Ukraine support from abroad was also important. So, the Americans supplied several dozen radar stations for the Ukrainian army for counter artillery combat.... As a result, the artillery brigades of the Armed Forces of Ukraine were able to conduct more effective fire on the positions of the people's militia. Truth, one such complex was captured by the militia during the battle for Debaltseve.

    https://anna-news.info/evolyutsiya-vsu-za-pyat-let-vojny-na-donbasse/
    According to Wiki:
    With the collapse of the USSR, Ukraine got:
    In total, 8700 tanks, 11 infantry fighting vehicles and armored personnel carriers went to Ukraine, 18 units of rocket and cannon artillery and 2800 aircraft
    In 2016: the artillery of the Ground Forces by 2016 was in service with up to 40 152-mm self-propelled guns "Msta-S", 456 152-mm self-propelled guns "Akatsia", 74 "Nona" systems, 24 "Hyacinths", 279 MLRS BM- 21 Grad, 20 Grad-1, 137 Uragan MLRS and 80 Smerch MLRS. In addition to them in storage - 92 "Pion" mortars and 542 122-mm self-propelled guns "Carnation"

    Specifically, how many PA, PTA guns were drunk, you can find out if you analyze the number of weapons for each of the three military units deployed in Ukraine in 19990, maybe someone will write an article about this and not only about Ukraine ...
    Armed Forces of Ukraine. Status for 2019

    https://proza.ru/2019/01/30/580
    An interesting article about the page of the Artillery of the Armed Forces of Ukraine ....
  27. 0
    6 2021 June
    The dope of generals is close to the maximum!
  28. 0
    6 2021 June
    I would say that it was Yanukovych who ordered to shoot at the Donbass, they continue to shoot with the same accuracy, even with new barrels.
  29. 0
    7 2021 June
    When preparing data for firing, a correction is always made for the wear of the gun barrel. In normal firing modes, the barrel will be worn out if the initial flight speed of the projectile has decreased by 5-10%. And since there have been little exercises and live firing in Ukraine since the 90s, when they managed to bring artillery systems to the state of firing "into that steppe", that even the amendments introduced do not affect the accuracy of the shooting ?!

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