Military Review

"I liked the Egyptians": foreign press on the order of the Russian ATGM "Vikhr-1"

63

The Russian company OJSC “Concern Kalashnikov” reported on the early completion of deliveries of guided missiles “Vikhr-1” for the needs of the RF Ministry of Defense. As indicated, the transfer of ATGM to the troops is carried out on the basis of an extended contract, which was signed back in 2014. Since that time, it has been possible not only to develop large-scale production of missiles, but also to replace imported components with domestic ones.


The Vortex laser-guided ATGM was developed by the Tula KBP in the mid-80s of the last century.

Created in 1985, it never went into mass production. In the 2000s, the ATGM was modernized and received the designation "Whirlwind-1", retaining the NATO code designation AT-16 Scallion

- writes the Italian edition Analisi Difesa.

The Russian manufacturer, when deploying a serial production, managed to solve a number of technical problems identified during state tests. The first batch of 9А4172 missiles, designed to destroy armored vehicles, fortifications and low-speed air targets at a distance of up to 8 km, was delivered in 2015.

The Whirlwind-1 rocket was to the liking of the Egyptians [...] Its main carrier is the Ka-52 attack and reconnaissance helicopter. Unsurprisingly, according to numerous industry sources, Cairo became the first foreign customer for a missile designed to arm 46 Egyptian Ka-52 helicopters.

- noted in the specified foreign press.

Earlier, the exact number of such helicopters in the Egyptian armed forces was not reported. How much you can trust the data of the Italian media about the number of Ka-52s in Egypt is an open question.

63 comments
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  1. Victor_B
    Victor_B 23 May 2021 17: 51
    -7
    The Whirlwind-1 rocket was to the liking of the Egyptians [...] Its main carrier is the Ka-52 attack and reconnaissance helicopter. Unsurprisingly, according to numerous industry sources, Cairo became the first foreign customer for a missile designed to arm 46 Egyptian Ka-52 helicopters.
    And what else could the Egyptians attach to the Ka-52 besides the standard armament?
    Spike or Javelin?
    Maybe Hellfire?
    So it's never too late ...
    1. Tusv
      Tusv 23 May 2021 18: 14
      +12
      Quote: Victor_B
      And what else could the Egyptians attach to the Ka-52 besides the standard armament?

      Egypt is an amazing country. They receive a lard of gratuitous (this is according to our Israeli friends) military aid from the United States, while buying our weapons is not sickly. Including advanced air defense systems, in particular Antei - 2500. So, they can quite afford to screw Helfair to the Alligator. The Suez Canal is like that. Mysterious
      1. dauria
        dauria 23 May 2021 18: 30
        +4
        The Suez Canal is like that. Mysterious


        So there is that "Arab spring", then the Arab summer ... and there is also autumn and winter ... They will drive away, then let's be friends. "The power is changing again"
        1. Tusv
          Tusv 23 May 2021 19: 02
          +4
          Well, what can you do here. This is Russo tourist. The face of morality. Lack of onny breaks through both Suez and Bosphorus for departure bully
      2. Viktor Sergeev
        Viktor Sergeev 23 May 2021 20: 57
        +1
        Free American military aid can ruin, it is not for nothing that the Greeks refused it (from the Abrams).
      3. Aleks tv
        Aleks tv 24 May 2021 09: 40
        +3
        I apologize for the flood, although it is agreed:

        This Wednesday (26.05, in the evening), in Yekaterinburg there will be meeting of members of the "Military Review" community.
        Purpose: acquaintance, communication.
        It is planned that a guest from the "Solnechny South" will arrive - Andrey from Chelyabinsk.
        Those wishing to join - write in a personal.

    2. smart ass
      smart ass 23 May 2021 20: 14
      +4
      After how many centuries in the Russian army will the missiles be fired and forgotten ???
  2. Dmitry Izmalkov
    Dmitry Izmalkov 23 May 2021 17: 54
    +3
    And whirlwind 1 and whirlwind-m are different missiles? I saw data on the distance of the vortex m in 10 km, and here there are only 8 for vortex-1
    1. Evil troll
      Evil troll 23 May 2021 18: 28
      +7
      Vikhr-M is the name of the complex itself, with all the electronics, and the rocket itself is called Vikhr-1.
      1. Nikolaevich I
        Nikolaevich I 23 May 2021 23: 11
        +2
        Quote: Angry Troll
        Vikhr-M is the name of the complex itself, with all the electronics, and the rocket itself is called Vikhr-1.

        Well, actually, the rocket is also referred to as the 9M127-1 ...
  3. Jacket in stock
    Jacket in stock 23 May 2021 18: 02
    -3
    Rocket of the last century.
    Hmm.
    Our army is the strongest
    (oh, if only) ...

    And what about the Egyptians, since they got involved with our turntables, like it or not, and they have to take whatever rockets they give.
    1. loki565
      loki565 23 May 2021 18: 11
      +4
      Rocket of the last century.
      Hmm.
      Our army is the strongest
      (oh, if only) ...
      And what about the Egyptians, since they got involved with our turntables, like it or not, and they have to take whatever rockets they give.

      They will also behave well and will receive Hermes, and maybe an anti-ship missile, after all, this is a naval version of helicopters))))
    2. kot423
      kot423 23 May 2021 18: 12
      +4
      You should first read this https://topwar.ru/183266-pressa-ssha-rossijskij-raketonosec-tu-95ms-hot-i-ustarel-prevoshodit-vse-amerikanskie-analogi.html to read where mattresses are crushed, and then here "regret".
      Py.Sy. And yes, if you are so sorry, sell the car, apartment block, dacha, collect all the stash, write a statement at work to transfer your salary to the Tula KBP, and give everything collected there, for R&D and the release of this century's rocket ...
      1. Jacket in stock
        Jacket in stock 23 May 2021 18: 24
        +6
        Quote: kot423
        if you are so sorry, sell the car, apartment, dacha, collect all the stash, write a request at work to transfer your salary to the Tula KBP, and give everything collected there, for R&D and the release of this century's rocket ...

        Thanks for the advice.
        But I’m unlikely to do that.
        Because in the last century I did exactly the opposite.
        He resigned from the research institute, which made many different, good rockets.
        And it was after the dismissal that I got an apartment, a stash, and a salary more often than once every six months. True, if I give it away, there won't be enough ravro for a new rocket. But in our country there are many people who tip in restaurants more than any R&D worth.
        We have capitalism, they are in the first place, and rockets and helicopters only later, and then only because someone can also earn apartments-cars-stash on them.
        1. kot423
          kot423 23 May 2021 18: 31
          +5
          Quote: Jacket in stock
          But in our country there are many people who tip in restaurants more than any R&D worth.
          We have capitalism, they are in the first place, and rockets and helicopters only later, and then only because someone can also earn apartments-cars-stash on them.

          You have only piled up surface "dust". In the last century, you were not the only one who was so "offended", thanks to the stain and the drunk for "friendship" with mattresses. Now - we have what we have, the main thing is that we managed to preserve the achievements (which in their multitude are doing "partners" for many years to come and schools). + we do not have a machine for printing candy wrappers to allow ourselves to start all kinds of projects from scratch. As for the tip - they have already begun to shake them, not as much and quickly as most adequate people would like, but still.
          1. Petro_tut
            Petro_tut 23 May 2021 22: 42
            -4
            As for tips, they have already begun to shake them, not as much and quickly as most adequate people would like, but still.
            Examples, please, by family name ..
          2. Stas157
            Stas157 23 May 2021 22: 47
            -1
            Quote: kot423
            About tip - have already begun to shake them, not as much and quickly as most adequate people would like, but still.

            What? What are you talking about? Whom did it start to shake?
        2. Intruder
          Intruder 23 May 2021 19: 39
          -3
          We have capitalism, they are in the first place, and rockets and helicopters only later, and then only because someone can also earn apartments-cars-stash on them.
          This is while Russian "capitalism", like everything else from that area, lives quietly and makes good money, but if something happened ... and the wave, grandmothers will not be much stopped negative ! And so, they feel comfortable and so far it is smooth, and helicopters and missiles are an additional option, for the protection, first of all, of their business interests in the country and abroad. wink !
    3. Orange bigg
      Orange bigg 23 May 2021 18: 35
      +7
      Quote: Jacket in stock
      Rocket of the last century.
      Hmm.
      Our army is the strongest
      (oh, if only) ...

      And what about the Egyptians, since they got involved with our turntables, like it or not, and they have to take whatever rockets they give.


      There are better rockets.
      To date, all these works have been completed in full, and the first Ka-52M are already undergoing flight tests. It is planned to complete them completely and start delivering new vehicles to the troops in 2022.

      In addition to these improvements, the new "Superaligator" received a radar system with AFAR and the ability to use the latest long-range aircraft missile with a range of more than 25 km, known as "product 305". It has already passed combat tests in Syria, however, it was used from another rotorcraft - the Mi-28NM.

      It is reported that the rocket operates on the "fire and forget" principle and has a combined guidance system with the ability to use an inertial navigation system. At the finishing phase of the missile's flight, its seeker is switched on, and the operator, if necessary, can retarget it at any time.

      In general, the weapon systems, communications and onboard self-defense systems of the Ka-52M were decided to unify as much as possible with the "Night Hunter" to simplify and reduce the cost of servicing the fleet of helicopters entering service with the Aerospace Forces.

      https://m.zen.yandex.ru/media/interesting_technique/rossiiskoe-minoborony-poluchit-novye-superalligatory-modernizirovannye-udarnye-vertolety-ka52m-608a7a4a77941602473b1c4c
    4. KCA
      KCA 23 May 2021 19: 01
      +4
      Rockets of a different class, but tell me which century Harpoon and Tomahawk?
    5. abc_alex
      abc_alex 24 May 2021 01: 04
      0
      The standard weapon of the Ka-52 is the Shturm complex with the Attack missile. Could have ordered them.
    6. yehat2
      yehat2 24 May 2021 11: 35
      0
      Quote: Jacket in stock
      Rocket of the last century.

      if the design is good, what is the problem?
      Look, the Americans will turn into dust from old age, but they are in service
      And the harpoon, of which there are not even hundreds, but thousands in the fleet, is also an old rocket and nothing suits everyone.
      The same goes for the trident.
  4. Thrifty
    Thrifty 23 May 2021 18: 05
    +7
    The launch range is really short, and taking into account the laser guidance, while the helicopter illuminates the target with the rocket, it is an excellent target. The minimum range for a relatively safe launch should be 15 km.
    1. dauria
      dauria 23 May 2021 19: 16
      +1
      The minimum range for a relatively safe launch should be 15 km.

      Well, you went too far. The Jews only recently presented the 11-12 km helicopter racket. And a helicopter at a distance of 8 km still has an average of 4 minutes of life from ground troops (if the infantry is serious, and not anyhow).
      1. And Us Rat
        And Us Rat 23 May 2021 22: 13
        +5
        Quote: dauria
        Jews only recently presented 11-12 km helicopter racket

        This is for export. For their own already adapted to the helicopter launch SPIKE-NLOS. This is the one that hits 25 km from the ground installation. With an air launch, 30+ km are declared.

        1. dauria
          dauria 23 May 2021 22: 21
          +1
          With an air launch, 30+ km are declared.


          And why then did you attach a helicopter to it? He only interferes with her. I would fly to myself, look out. wassat
          1. And Us Rat
            And Us Rat 24 May 2021 10: 46
            0
            Quote: dauria
            And why then did you attach a helicopter to it?

            laughing laughing laughing
            Tactical mobility. hi
            1. dauria
              dauria 24 May 2021 11: 10
              0
              Tactical mobility.

              So give her "cheaper" transport. Call a taxi, let him give you a lift. Or a foam glider with aliexpress. Moreover, you yourself make them well. All the same, for 30 km, the helicopter will be given target designation by infantrymen. They will yell "save, help, then a bunker or tanks jumped out from around the corner." What difference does it make to them who will take the missile to the place. wink
              1. And Us Rat
                And Us Rat 24 May 2021 13: 54
                0
                Quote: dauria
                So give her transportation "cheaper"

                As soon as there is a "transport", with similar AN-64 capabilities and at the same time "cheaper", then I think - developed will not keep you waiting. laughing

                Quote: dauria
                All the same, infantrymen will give target designation to the helicopter for 30 km

                What an anachronism, there are a dozen more ways.

                Quote: dauria
                Will shout

                They will not, for such scenarios they have their own "toys".
        2. OgnennyiKotik
          OgnennyiKotik 23 May 2021 22: 28
          +2
          It's about the LAHAT rocket, it's simpler and cheaper than spikes. Range up to 13 km with an air launch. She showed herself well in Karabakh.
          The USA is supplying the Apache version of SPIKE-NLOS, with a test-proven range of 32 km.
          1. And Us Rat
            And Us Rat 24 May 2021 11: 23
            0
            Quote: OgnennyiKotik
            It's about the LAHAT rocket, it's simpler and cheaper than spikes. Range up to 13 km with an air launch.

            LAHAT has a semi-active laser seeker, which is not the most advanced technology today, and therefore cheaper. It has been modernized since 1992 (year of release), improved performance, but the principle of the GOS has not changed. In addition, the caliber limitation remained at 120mm. This is still a tank ATGM initially.
            But it is also more easily integrated, you can put it on either Western technology or Soviet one.




            Quote: OgnennyiKotik
            USA supply the Apache version of SPIKE-NLOS ...

            Yes, there is such a thing, their own developments of this class have sunk into the bureaucracy. But for objectivity, the Chinese were also helped to establish the production of clones (HJ-10). For balance, so to speak. repeat



            Quote: OgnennyiKotik
            range of 32 km

            There is also NIMROD-3, with a range of up to 50 km, and a dual-mode seeker.
            Its helicopter version has not yet been offered for export. Yes, and it is too heavy for an attack helicopter, as I understand it.

            1. OgnennyiKotik
              OgnennyiKotik 24 May 2021 11: 35
              -1
              Quote: And Us Rat
              Yes, there is such a thing, their own developments of this class were drowned in the bureaucracy.

              They want a wunderwolf. Supersonic speed, higher range than NLOS, with the same dimensions and enhanced capabilities. It makes little sense to make a copy of the spike.
              Quote: And Us Rat
              There is also NIMROD-3, with a range of up to 50 km, and a dual-mode seeker.

              Apache can lift 3 tons of payload. Rather, the question of the need for missiles with such a range and mass for helicopters. It is more effective to drop a bomb from an airplane.
              1. And Us Rat
                And Us Rat 24 May 2021 12: 44
                0
                Quote: OgnennyiKotik
                They want a wunderwolf.

                Let them want to. yes Ambition is a tricky business.
                Israel's ambitions were more modest, and the result speaks for itself.

                Quote: OgnennyiKotik
                Rather, the question of the need for missiles with such a range and mass for helicopters.

                Well, this is so far, apparently the developers assume that in the future the need will appear, with the development of tactical air defense.
        3. yehat2
          yehat2 24 May 2021 11: 38
          0
          Quote: And Us Rat
          With an air launch, 30+ km are declared.

          you try to find a target from a helicopter 30 km away.
          even a tank standing in an open field, it is difficult to come up with anything more contrasting.
          Even from 10 km, only the radar sees the target - this is not quite what is required for good target designation.
          On the radar, that an empty barrel from under the water, that a tank, that the roof of a house, lined with iron - about the same.
          1. And Us Rat
            And Us Rat 24 May 2021 13: 47
            0
            Quote: yehat2
            you try to find a target from a helicopter 30 km away.
            even a tank standing in an open field, it is difficult to come up with anything more contrasting.

            There are tons of options here:
            1. The most obvious thing is external target designation. DRG or UAV, and today it is not required to "highlight the target", it is enough to transmit the coordinates, on approach, the rocket itself will capture the signature that it was told.
            2. DU. The operator can guide the missile to the expected location of the enemy, and when found - to lock the target. Plus - the first missile communicates the rest of the found targets to the operator for capture.
            3. In the mustache of strong electronic warfare countermeasures, you can start, as in paragraph 2, only autonomously. The rocket flies to the search point, searches for familiar signatures, selects the highest priority and aims at it. Feedback in this mode can also be available, but not essential.

            Quote: yehat2
            Even from 10 km, only the radar sees the target

            This was true 40 years ago. Combined systems with significantly higher performance are used today. Recent databases in Karabakh have clearly demonstrated this.

            Quote: yehat2
            this is not quite what is required for good target designation.

            Why is there intelligence, from the field to satellites? In addition, as I said, you can work without target designation at all, not only "good".
            The main thing here is to know the coordinate location of the enemy, in order to know in which direction to shoot.

            Quote: yehat2
            On the radar, that an empty barrel from under the water, that a tank, that the roof of a house, lined with iron - about the same.

            None of the systems I have listed have radar guidance, so it is absolutely not important.
            But for general information - a modern radar with SAR function, perfectly distinguishes a tank from a barrel.
            1. yehat2
              yehat2 24 May 2021 13: 59
              0
              Quote: And Us Rat
              The main thing here is to know the coordinate location of the enemy, in order to know in which direction to shoot.

              Well, there is a tank and 2 houses with an iron-lined roof.
              you gave the coordinates
              and where do you think the rocket will arrive? not true)))
              it generally gets into a tractor Kirovets standing in the way.
              therefore the problem of target designation is much more difficult
              now it is solved in only 4 ways - laser, radio, memorizing the primary radio signal and tele-guidance and IR head.
              the laser is very specific - in fact, it works in line of sight, these are distances of 3-8 km, with 10 it is already very difficult - except in the desert. DRGs can help, but not often and very slowly. Pure active radio guidance and modern IR heads may not require illumination, but they are very easy to deceive with traps.
              There remains a complex system like a spike, but first of all, it is not ideal, it is not always possible to selectively hit a moving target and quickly classify it, and secondly, this rocket is no longer weak and not everyone can produce - there are no components.
              1. And Us Rat
                And Us Rat 24 May 2021 16: 57
                +1
                Quote: yehat2
                a tank and 2 houses with an iron-lined roof.
                you gave the coordinates
                and where do you think the rocket will arrive?

                In what the AI ​​seeker identified as a tank. In the case of the remote control of the rocket by the operator, the question is not at all.

                Quote: yehat2
                therefore the problem of target designation is much more difficult
                now it is solved only in 4 ways ...

                A fundamental delusion is to measure everything with your yardstick. It was more accurate to say "known to me personally it can only be solved in 4 ways. "

                Quote: yehat2
                laser, radio, memorization of the primary radio signal and tele-guidance and IR head.

                But some decided to go beyond this. fellow
                The devil, as always, is in the details. The question is not in the method, but in the level and quality of its application. wink
                Why, other things being equal, are many willing to overpay, but take Israeli? Because in terms of signal processing, software and know-how, Israeli seeker systems are head and shoulders above their counterparts, and as a result, the probability of being hit from the first shot in the most difficult environment is an order of magnitude higher.

                Quote: yehat2
                but they are very easy to fool with traps.

                An archaic statement that is late for 30 years. Modern IR seeker has an ultraviolet channel, HD resolution of the matrix and electronic post-processing of the signal. The same "Python-5" (air-to-air) can not be fooled by a heat trap, in principle, because a thermal candle does not look like an airplane.



                Quote: yehat2
                There remains a complex system like a spike, but first of all, it is not ideal, to hit a moving target ...

                Maybe without straining, even at a certain point of this goal. This has been repeatedly tested in practice in the same Karabakh.
                (see example from 0:33)


                Quote: yehat2
                not everyone can produce - no components.

                Nobody expects that it will be produced by Tribals, for example, or Mongolia. China can, which means that Russia could technically.
                1. yehat2
                  yehat2 24 May 2021 17: 01
                  0
                  Quote: And Us Rat
                  does not look like an airplane.

                  we are talking about terrestrial units, which have very moderate radiation, both infrared and radar.
                  Targets have a much higher contrast in the sky, so please don't confuse warm with soft.
                  1. And Us Rat
                    And Us Rat 24 May 2021 17: 18
                    0
                    Quote: yehat2
                    we are talking about terrestrial units, which have very moderate radiation, both infrared and radar.

                    For modern ICs, the GOS is absolutely unimportant.
                    And the radar reflective surface of the tank is no less than that of the 4th generation fighter.
                    Here's an example of filtering an image.
                2. yehat2
                  yehat2 24 May 2021 17: 03
                  0
                  Quote: And Us Rat
                  which means that Russia could technically

                  it is a very confusing question of what RF can do.
                  Our trillions of investments disappear without a trace.
                  In the United States, they steal and speculate, but they do at least something. And in the Russian Federation they can steal everything and even ask the government for help.
                  1. And Us Rat
                    And Us Rat 24 May 2021 17: 26
                    0
                    Quote: yehat2
                    In the United States, they steal and speculate, but they do at least something. And in the Russian Federation they can steal everything and even ask the government for help.

                    But this is not a technology issue, is it? request
                    1. yehat2
                      yehat2 25 May 2021 08: 09
                      0
                      Quote: And Us Rat
                      But this is not a technology issue, is it?

                      is incorrect, because any breakthrough requires a very serious investment, often not one-time
                      and our state can rarely provide such.
                      a program like Burana is fundamentally impossible for today's state to carry out.
                      What a blizzard, a transport plane to replace Antey, we are simply not able to create today.
                      Even a small transport aircraft IL-112, a completely utilitarian task in modern conditions, is created with overwhelming power and huge shoals.
                      And this directly depends on how investments are spent.
                      The ceiling of today's opportunities - we created an assembly line for the modernized IL-76 once again.
                      1. And Us Rat
                        And Us Rat 25 May 2021 17: 44
                        0
                        Quote: yehat2
                        created an assembly line for the Il-76, which was once again modernized.

                        A very sensible idea, and from the point of view of training personnel, after the "pit" of the 90s. And great cost savings.
                        I have already mentioned in the article about the Il-112 that the Yankees are not shy about modernizing aircraft that are 40-70 years old (F-15, CH-53, C-130) and nothing, they come out with machines that fully meet modern requirements. After all, the same Su-35, in fact, is an old man Su-27, and the difference in capabilities is huge.
                        So you shouldn't neglect the renovation of the Il-76.

                        Quote: yehat2
                        any breakthrough requires a very serious investment, often not one-time
                        and our state can rarely provide such.

                        The numbers indicate that it can. It was able to find money for the restructuring of the whole city for the Olympics, for the emergency construction of a giant bridge, for the ill-fated Skolkovo, for the cosmodrome (triple the amount of the budget).
                        And the fact that they steal is yes, corruption is a scourge worse than war at times, but here I have nothing to say, you have to deal with this, no one will do it for you. request
                        If the 37th year has not eradicated this phenomenon, then I don't even know what it can.
                3. yehat2
                  yehat2 24 May 2021 17: 05
                  0
                  if you think that I have not seen the video, you are wrong
                  I also saw mistakes, which are very difficult to find, although there are also quite a few of them.
                  1. And Us Rat
                    And Us Rat 24 May 2021 17: 24
                    0
                    Quote: yehat2
                    which are very difficult to find, although there are also quite a few of them.

                    Contradictory statement. If not a little, then why is it difficult to find? But I understood what I was talking about - I also saw them, but 100% of them are the operator’s curvature (uncertainty). There you can feel right in your gut how he rushes about in choosing a goal, and as a result - does not have time to turn back at the last moment.
                    This is a banal lack of self-control and discipline. The Arabs also ruined the reputation of Soviet weapons. request
                    1. yehat2
                      yehat2 25 May 2021 08: 10
                      -1
                      Quote: And Us Rat
                      why is it hard to find?

                      because an unsuccessful launch is not an advertisement
                      1. And Us Rat
                        And Us Rat 25 May 2021 17: 50
                        0
                        Quote: yehat2
                        because an unsuccessful launch is not an advertisement

                        I agree. But nevertheless, the fact remains, all the blunders (that I saw) are from the operators' curvature.
                        Still, this is not a shovel, training is required here, and training of a suitable soldier, and not just anyone.
      2. Nikolaevich I
        Nikolaevich I 23 May 2021 23: 31
        +3
        Actually, there are enough "ambiguities" with the Vikhr complex and missiles! Even at the end of the last century, it was known that 9M127 missiles have a supersonic speed and range "up to 10 km" ... I learned about a missile with a range of 8 km relatively recently! And this was after there was information that the development of the "Vikhr-M" complex is the 9M227 rocket with even greater speed than the 9M127, and a range of up to 12-14 km! Moreover ... the 9M227 series included not only missiles with a laser-beam guidance system; but also with GOS (thermal imaging and passive radar ...) And what do we have in real life? request
        1. yehat2
          yehat2 24 May 2021 14: 49
          0
          Quote: Nikolaevich I
          And what do we have in real life?

          well, there is probably a difference between the rated maximum range and the actual range of use, not to mention the difference in the production of experimental and serial products ..
    2. Al_lexx
      Al_lexx 23 May 2021 19: 45
      +3
      Quote: Thrifty
      The launch range is really short, and taking into account the laser guidance, while the helicopter illuminates the target with the rocket, it is an excellent target.

      Anyone can highlight. At least the same drone.
      1. yehat2
        yehat2 24 May 2021 11: 44
        +1
        Quote: Al_lexx
        Anyone can highlight. At least the same drone.

        the very need for backlighting is already a problem.
        The UAV can illuminate, but it still needs to be delivered there and to the height from which the illumination will be effective and fly for some time. In addition, the UAV, which can find a target and fly, illuminating, is already decently worth it. It seems that the backlight is bullshit, you can even use a pointer.
        In reality, this is still the same hemorrhoids. It is only in American films that an infantryman stands 30 meters from the tank and lights up and no one sees him.
        And China, for example, is already actively installing automatic systems for actively countering lasers. Light sensors are installed everywhere, and after the smoke screen is triggered, legs are made.
        1. Al_lexx
          Al_lexx 24 May 2021 12: 59
          0
          Quote: yehat2
          the very need for backlighting is already a problem.

          No one argues. I'm just saying that it is not necessary that the carrier of the weapon would highlight.
          The fact that a drone with the ability to illuminate is very different in price is nonsense. The laser itself costs a penny. Most drones and not necessarily drums have a target tracking system. Even scouts often have a camera, with the option of tracking an object. Pairing a laser with it is like sending two bytes. Of course, such a drone costs a little more, but I repeat, this is a penny, compared to weapons that work on the fire-and-forget principle.
          But, of course, and this is obvious, now almost any serious goal has a means of protection against laser radiation. Both active and passive. You just need to understand that today, laser-guided weapons are (if I may say so) the budget segment of guided missile weapons.
          1. yehat2
            yehat2 24 May 2021 14: 07
            0
            Quote: Al_lexx
            Most drones and not necessarily drums have a target tracking system. Even scouts often have a camera, with the option of tracking an object. Pairing a laser with it is like sending two bytes. Of course, such a drone costs a little more, but I repeat, this is a penny, compared to weapons that work on the fire-and-forget principle.

            one of the most popular reconnaissance drones, without a laser, is a flying machine with Orlan-10 cameras.
            such a "cheap" thing costs about 11 million with a control machine
            Are you sure it's cheap?
            for comparison, a needle costs $ 3-7 million on the black market.
    3. Zaurbek
      Zaurbek 24 May 2021 08: 12
      +1
      And who will give the control center?
      1. Al_lexx
        Al_lexx 24 May 2021 13: 01
        0
        Quote: Zaurbek
        And who will give the control center?

        Those who called for fire support. Sending helicopters on a free hunt is not a very smart decision these days. And where it is appropriate (there are no air defense systems, including MANPADS), it can be illuminated from a helicopter.
    4. yehat2
      yehat2 25 May 2021 08: 15
      0
      Quote: Thrifty
      while the helicopter illuminates the target with the rocket, it is a great target

      That is why we have created and are creating high-speed ATGMs, which do not fly very far, but quickly. Almost twice overtaking American hellfires.
      in addition, now the illumination comes from a turret with a target fixing and the helicopter can maneuver without interfering with guidance. Well, let's not forget that, unlike NATO vehicles, our helicopters are seriously armored. Those. through a crutch, but the issue of survival is generally resolved.
  5. Cat Alexandrovich
    Cat Alexandrovich 23 May 2021 18: 16
    0
    And if the terrestrial version, then the "Merkavu" can do that? One after all figs what exactly to Arabs to sell? drinks
    1. And Us Rat
      And Us Rat 23 May 2021 22: 18
      0
      Quote: Cat Alexandrovich
      And if the terrestrial version, then the "Merkavu" can do that?

      Only without KAZ and not in the forehead.
    2. Nikolaevich I
      Nikolaevich I 23 May 2021 22: 27
      +1
      Quote: Cat Alexandrovich
      And if the terrestrial version, then the "Merkavu" can do that?

      What about the fig? That's what Chrysanthemum is for! By the way, there is also an "air" version of "Chrysanthemum"! ...
    3. Nikolaevich I
      Nikolaevich I 23 May 2021 23: 17
      0
      Quote: Cat Alexandrovich
      And if the terrestrial version, then the "Merkavu" can do that?

      In fact, not only the "ground version" was envisaged, but also the ship version ... but all this remained on "paper" ... in real life, the "air-to-surface" version "went" into production and armament ...
  6. Gennady Fomkin
    Gennady Fomkin 23 May 2021 18: 26
    +1
    Quote: Jacket in stock
    Rocket of the last century.
    Hmm.
    Our army is the strongest
    (oh, if only) ...

    And what about the Egyptians, since they got involved with our turntables, like it or not, and they have to take whatever rockets they give.

    Pinzhak in "stock" that they immediately sell hypersound? laughing
    1. Jacket in stock
      Jacket in stock 23 May 2021 18: 38
      -1
      Quote: Gennady Fomkin
      m that immediately sell hypersound?

      And why not?
      They will ask and sell.
      Maybe they don't ask because there is nothing to offer yet?
  7. Gennady Fomkin
    Gennady Fomkin 23 May 2021 18: 41
    +3
    Quote: Jacket in stock
    Quote: Gennady Fomkin
    m that immediately sell hypersound?

    And why not?
    They will ask and sell.
    Maybe they don't ask because there is nothing to offer yet?

    Come on sell laughing From them, the soldiers are like with ........ a bullet, either they will sell to the Jews or lose laughing Warrior in pajamas