Military Review

"Iron Dome" in Operation Wall Guardian

168

On the evening of May 10, local time, Palestinian armed formations once again began shelling Israeli territory with the use of unguided rockets of various types, handicraft and factory made. To protect its cities, infrastructure and population, the Israel Defense Forces launched Operation Wall Guard, during which it uses all available tactical missile defense systems, including the most famous Kipat Barzel (Iron Dome). And again there is an opportunity to assess the real capabilities of such an ABM.


Combat indicators


Over the past several weeks, there has been a steady rise in tensions in the disputed areas, and Israel and its opponents have exchanged aggressive actions. In particular, Palestinian formations have repeatedly used mortar and unguided missiles. However, the shelling has so far been sporadic, and the IDF, when necessary, has successfully shot down incoming ammunition.


Missiles and anti-missiles in the sky

The massive use of missile weapons began on May 10 in the evening. After 18:00 the first salvo of 7 rockets took place in the area of ​​Jerusalem. Soon thereafter, attacks began on territories near the Gaza Strip and southern Israel. The IDF reports that the enemy had fired over 160 missiles by midnight. Dozens of such threats (the exact number has not been named) have been successfully intercepted by the Kipat Barzel complexes. A number of rockets fell at a safe distance from settlements and people.

Some of the missiles broke through the missile defense system. According to Israeli data, 10 buildings were damaged on May 4. No one was killed, but several people were injured, mostly from fragments of damaged buildings.

During the night of May 10-11, shelling did not stop. During the night, morning and day, the Palestinians attacked the same range of targets. In the evening, the first strikes began on the Tel Aviv area. By 8 o'clock in the morning, the IDF announced the use of at least 200 missiles, of which 90 were intercepted by missile defense. By the evening report (after 19:30 local time) the number of missiles fired increased to 480. Approx. 200 pcs.


Tamir anti-missile launch

During May 11, there were reports of two dozen rockets hitting houses, office buildings and social facilities in different settlements; also damage to vehicles and infrastructure. At 18:24, a rocket set fire to an oil storage facility near the city of Ashkelon. In several cities attacked, a total of more than a hundred people were hospitalized. It became known about the first victims and those who died from wounds.

The attacks continued throughout May 12. According to the IDF, by morning the number of missiles used had reached 850 units. Hamas has announced the use of a variety of types of ammunition, including those received from Iran. Also appeared news on the interception of Palestinian UAVs intended to attack Israeli targets. From morning to evening, approx. 180 missile launches. According to the IDF, about 40 fell in Gaza, and several dozen more were hit by the Kipat Barzel system.

Again, it was reported about missiles that broke through the missile defense system and fell on the territory of populated areas. In Ashkelon alone, at least 110 people applied for help, of which more than 10 were hospitalized. Seriously injured and casualties reappeared.


Thus, by midnight on May 13, Palestinian formations were using more than 1000 missiles of various types with different characteristics. OK. 850 of these products were able to enter the desired trajectory and enter Israeli airspace. News from the IDF mentions the successful interception of a large number of missiles, but the exact number has not yet been announced. At the same time, officials point to the ABM's ability to intercept up to 90% of dangerous objects flying in the direction of residential areas.

Some of the missiles were able to overcome the missile defense and hit targets in the protected area. As a result, five people died, hundreds were injured and asked for help, and the total damage is already estimated at tens of millions of shekels. If the shelling continues, all these negative indicators will grow.

The main thing


The IDF is armed with several anti-missile systems with different characteristics and capabilities. At the same time, the main combat work falls on the Kipat Barzel systems developed by Rafael and IAI. The first complexes of this type were put on duty in March 2011. Subsequently, the army received new battery kits, which were deployed in all dangerous directions. In the recent past, upgrades have been carried out aimed at improving performance.


The Iron Dome battery includes an EL / M-2084 multipurpose radar, a command post and three launchers with 20 Tamir interceptor missiles. The complex operates in automatic mode and monitors the air situation. When a dangerous object is detected, an anti-missile is launched.

The reaction time, from target detection to missile launch, is a few seconds. "Kipat Barzel" is capable of fighting unguided missiles with a firing range of 4 to 70 km. There is information about the ability of the complex to intercept aircraft and UAVs.

The developers and operators claim that the missile defense system is highly reliable and efficient. In particular, automation is able to determine the danger of a detected target for settlements. Ammunition heading into a deserted area is ignored; only those that threaten populated areas are intercepted. This makes it possible to obtain a high probability of repelling an attack while reducing the consumption of anti-missiles and certain savings.

"Iron Dome" in Operation Wall Guardian

Missile crash sites May 10-12

Anti-missile mathematics


From 10 to 12 May, Palestinian militias used more than 1000 unguided rockets. At least 150-200 products failed to reach the calculated trajectories and fell in the Gaza Strip. Several hundred missiles did not threaten populated areas and were allowed to land in safe areas. Hundreds more missiles heading for cities were successfully intercepted by the Iron Domes. At the same time, about 30-35 missiles were able to break through the missile defense system and fell on settlements, which led to destruction, injury and casualties.

Unfortunately, more accurate data are not yet available, which makes it difficult to assess the situation. However, the available information also shows that the missile defense systems have shown a fairly high efficiency. They were able to distinguish missiles dangerous for cities from "safe" and hit most of them.

At the same time, some of the ammunition went through the defenses. Its OK. 3-4 percent of the total number of missiles used. The share of these items in the total number of dangerous objects subject to interception should be higher - it can be estimated at the level of 10-15 percent. or more.


It is known that over 10 years of combat duty, the Kipat Barzel complexes intercepted a total of several thousand enemy missiles. They successfully coped with the protection of cities from single threats or small volleys. On several occasions, the batteries withstood large and prolonged attacks. In these cases, the efficiency reached 85-90 percent, and a significant number of missiles fell on cities, causing damage.

The available information shows that the proportions of intercepted and missed missiles generally remain at the same level. Accordingly, the observed increase in the absolute number of unaffected targets is mainly related to the intensity of shelling. The enemy launches hundreds of missiles, the IDF intercepts most of them, but it is not possible to hit dozens of products.

Risk percentages


Thus, the IDF has numerous and effective means of protecting populated areas from enemy unguided missiles. Such protection is not one hundred percent, and errors are possible, incl. with tragic consequences. However, even 10-15 percent. missiles missed is better than no protection at all.


The result of a rocket hitting a residential building in the city of Sderot. A child died, his mother was seriously injured

Apparently, the enemy understands this, and therefore organizes long and massive shelling. With their help, a high density of fire is created, which makes it possible to increase the number of successful launches, if not relative, then absolute. Accordingly, within a limited period of time, the maximum possible damage in such a situation is achieved, which should negatively affect the morale of the Israeli side.

It is obvious that new destruction and casualties can be prevented through the peace process and the settlement of the situation in the region - but, for a number of reasons, such a scenario is excluded. Therefore, Israel seeks to improve the complexes of protection. The Iron Dome has undergone an upgrade in the recent past, and more updates are expected in the future. All of them will be aimed at increasing the efficiency of interception and achieving one hundred percent probability of hitting the intended targets.
Author:
Photos used:
Israeli Ministry of Defense
168 comments
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  1. Lech from Android.
    Lech from Android. 14 May 2021 04: 55
    +4
    The article does not disclose the classification of missiles fired by the Palestinians, their performance characteristics, methods and methods of launching, how they were delivered to the launch site, how they were guided, a portrait of the combat crews of missiles, their level of training and many other issues.
    What is the time of the retaliatory strike by the IDF on the positions of the Palestinian missile positions?
    And what is the approximate potential of the Palestinians in building up missile strikes, what is the stock of missiles for the next strike, what are the possibilities for replenishment?
    Why did the Jews decide on an earthly operation in the Gaza Strip?
    How long will it last?
    Etc.
    1. AC130 Ganship
      AC130 Ganship 14 May 2021 05: 11
      +13
      What "combat crews", colleague. The rockets are launched according to the novice Korolev method. A teenager ran out, put a guide. The second brought a rocket from the barn. And - ignition ...
      1. Lech from Android.
        Lech from Android. 14 May 2021 05: 15
        +12
        Come on smile..there are a dime a dozen of such Korolevs, and there are certainly Iranian Queens ... you must have at least some idea of ​​where you are launching the missiles.
        All the same, more than a thousand starts is no longer a joke.
        1. your1970
          your1970 14 May 2021 06: 06
          +9
          They shoot at residential areas - the target is not mobile and large. Any smartphone will give you a direction, an angle by eye - where the rocket will hit anyway
          1. For example
            For example 14 May 2021 14: 41
            +3
            Quote: Lech from Android.
            Not disclosed in the article ...

            And why should the author be afraid to write what you, sir, want to read?

            Didn't find what you wanted and present it to the author. laughing

            Funny.

            The author wrote what he wanted to write.

            And these are your problems that you wanted to read about ballet in a note about hockey. wink laughing
    2. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar 14 May 2021 05: 58
      +20
      Quote: Lech from Android.

      Why did the Jews decide on an earthly operation in the Gaza Strip?
      How long will it last?
      Etc.

      Here about the effectiveness of countering LCD missiles. They are of different types - already quite decent "homemade products", Katyushas, ​​grads, their Iranian and Syrian serial modifications (the engine is more powerful, like warheads, the most long-range ones fly 220 km)
      How long it will last is unclear. The day before yesterday, Hamas began to move towards a truce, yesterday Egyptian delegations arrived in Tel Aviv and Gaza to mediate a ceasefire. It is beneficial for them - they showed a massive attack with a reset of the Jewish air defense, around and for all handsome men, supported their own in the struggle for Jerusalem Mosques.
      The Jews do not need this - they need to show who is the boss in the "house" and return the fear of the IDF to the Arabs so that they play by Israeli rules.
      And most of all this is not necessary Bibi - he holds on to power with both hands, he failed to create a coalition and a small victorious war (or better a big one, which will give the country peace of mind for ten years) will give a big plus to his image in the next, fifth in two years, elections ...
      Otherwise it will sit down. laughing
      Therefore, it is difficult to determine by timing.
      A ground operation - if Hamas is punished only from the air or by artillery - the problems cannot be solved (there are disguised mines right among the cities of the sector, from where missiles are taken out of underground tunnels for firing), besides, there is very dense, one of the highest buildings in the world, every shell and bomb will result in the death of a civilian, which is beneficial to Hamas, because will hit the image of Israel. It is already quite low in the West for two reasons:
      a) A country that has overtaken Japan and France in terms of living standards (2019) tramples the poor people in the blockade in the shit
      b) The Muslim diasporas of Western Europe, united with the liberal leftists, are conducting systematic propaganda against Israel.
      Therefore, to do maximum harm to Hamas, you need to go inside Gaza in the literal and figurative sense of the word laughing Fighting / blowing up the "metro" under Palestinian cities, drenching as many militants as possible in battles, etc., thus minimizes losses among Palestinian civilians.
      1. Lech from Android.
        Lech from Android. 14 May 2021 06: 08
        +1
        Surely, the battles inside Gaza will unfold according to the old scheme ... after all, this is not the first and not the last offensive of the IDF in the area. what
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 14 May 2021 07: 45
          0
          I do not know what exactly the IDF will do, how the Palestinians will respond, nothing is known request
        2. And Us Rat
          And Us Rat 14 May 2021 19: 15
          0
          Quote: Lech from Android.
          Surely, the battles inside Gaza will unfold according to the old scheme ... after all, this is not the first and not the last offensive of the IDF in the area. what

          Yesterday Israel announced a ground operation in the media, Hamas took up defensive positions - tunnels, mines, pillboxes and prepared to meet Israeli tanks, and instead bombs fell, burying a bunch of militants alive. Hamas has not yet announced the number of casualties.
          1. Pilat2009
            Pilat2009 15 May 2021 13: 37
            +3
            Quote: And Us Rat
            instead, bombs fell, burying a bunch of militants alive

            And the civilian population
            1. And Us Rat
              And Us Rat 15 May 2021 13: 45
              -1
              Quote: Pilat2009
              And the civilian population

              In the border tunnels and pillboxes dug outside the city? How did they get there? request
              Can we count how many civilians were killed in the bombing of Aleppo?
          2. Baron pardus
            Baron pardus 20 May 2021 17: 39
            +2
            There are no civilians there. There are only terrorists and their accomplices. You remember the story. Have the Palestinians been kicked out of all Arab countries by their own "Arab brothers" with a bang? Why? And because wherever they went, they were doing the same thing as now: terrorism and attempts to seize power. Suffice it to recall the assassination of Sadat and the attempts to seize power in Lebanon. Therefore, they were kicked out of all Arab countries - no one needs such problems in their own country. So there are no "civilians" there. Only terrorists and their accomplices.

            And the way Israel skillfully forced the Hamasites to set themselves up for an airstrike - my compliments. Why. Unfortunately, in order to destroy Hamas, in particular, and Islamic terrorism in general, it is necessary to invade not the Gaza Strip, but Europe and Great Britain - the whole of Hamas, along with Al Qaeda, is already there.

            The Europeans and the British are just beginning to understand what kind of monster they are sheltering. The number of rapes in Britain, especially youngsters, is simply off scale.
            1. Konnick
              Konnick 20 May 2021 18: 09
              +1
              There are no civilians there. There are only terrorists and their accomplices. You remember the story. Have the Palestinians been kicked out of all Arab countries by their own "Arab brothers" with a bang? Why? And because wherever they went, they were doing the same thing as now: terrorism and attempts to seize power. Suffice it to recall the assassination of Sadat and the attempts to seize power in Lebanon. Therefore, they were kicked out of all Arab countries - no one needs such problems in their own country. So there are no "civilians" there. Only terrorists and their accomplices.

              I agree with you, that is why the Arabs do not support them, but the Turks and Persians support them.
      2. Ka-52
        Ka-52 14 May 2021 06: 20
        +14
        Fighting / blowing up the "metro" under Palestinian cities, drenching as many militants as possible in battles, etc., thus minimizes losses among Palestinian civilians.

        fighting in the city and minimizing civilian casualties are two diametrically opposed concepts. Well, only if this is not a military operation against the natives with sticks and stones. With more or less serious armed resistance, the infantry will not break through and will request support from artillery and aviation. And the usual principle of battles in the city will follow - they shoot from the house, which means that the house needs to be folded. And who is there from the peaceful does not matter anymore.
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 14 May 2021 07: 47
          0
          Losses will be less than from waging war solely from the air and artillery. That they will surely
          1. Ka-52
            Ka-52 14 May 2021 08: 47
            +3
            Losses will be less than from waging war solely from the air and artillery. That they will surely

            here the yardstick is different. With an exceptionally distant war, it is generally not realistic to achieve a result. For a ground operation, the result is predicted with certain assumptions. And the loss of the civilian population is an inevitability that cannot be prevented. You can, of course, block the city and leave corridors for the exit of civilians. But the militants will simply come out with them and after the cleansing they will return to their homes.
            1. Krasnodar
              Krasnodar 14 May 2021 08: 58
              0
              Certainly so. Another question. How large will be the loss of the civilian during a ground operation, rather than with, let's say, applying the formula "where the rocket flew from, the projectile flies there." Or a bomb. Figurat - they are across Israel directly from urban development.
              1. dauria
                dauria 14 May 2021 09: 41
                +3
                Figurat - they are across Israel directly from urban development.


                Since the task is to set - to solve the problem once and for all, to solve it for a while, not to solve it at all. You kind of choose the middle. "Do not give impudence, and then it will resolve itself."
                And to send infantry without artillery and aviation training and support for the attack is a crime. Just bombing is what they expect from the Jews. "Resonance". For this, the Gaza Strip is fed.
                Pat. Can you play Hamas against someone? Power is needed by many, let them fight.
                1. Krasnodar
                  Krasnodar 14 May 2021 09: 45
                  +5
                  The task is to leave the weakened Hamas in power as much as possible. Artillery and aviation support to ground forces can be provided with point and very accurate fire, on a tip from infantry / accompanying ground forces of the air force officers. To play off Hamas with someone? Is that the IG, and this is still that shit, and worse
                  1. dauria
                    dauria 14 May 2021 10: 34
                    +4
                    The task is to leave the weakened Hamas in power as much as possible.

                    Hmm ... You do not need a weakened one, but your own Hamas. Pursuing the policy you want. Since there is no point in conquering, at least the top must be done manually. Okay. not from our hummock. But do you have a state. intelligence, the structure, funding channels, and internal "graters" are probably known.
                    Apparently, these guys didn't get you much, since you hit with your palm, and not with a shovel in the face.
                    1. Krasnodar
                      Krasnodar 14 May 2021 10: 48
                      +1
                      It will not become its own, with Qatari (and not only) funding laughing got it, just who instead of them to fill the vacuum of power - firstly, these cannot be tamed, tk. they will quickly throw off their own, secondly, thirdly, Hamas is a branch of the Muslim Brotherhood - such games do not work with them
              2. And Us Rat
                And Us Rat 14 May 2021 19: 23
                0
                Quote: Krasnodar
                formulas "where the rocket flew from, the projectile flies there"

                This formula has proven to be useless. There is no one from where the rocket flew out, except for a human shield made of peace and a disposable guide, welded in 15 minutes from a pair of iron profiles for 3 bucks. And if we hit as a punitive action, then napalm in the neighborhoods would be far more effective, but Israel will not agree to such a thing.
        2. Konnick
          Konnick 20 May 2021 18: 13
          +1
          And the usual principle of fighting in the city will follow - they shoot from the house, which means you need to fold the house. And who is there from the peaceful does not matter anymore

          Well, why waste shells and rockets, Jews have this
      3. NDR-791
        NDR-791 14 May 2021 06: 42
        -2
        Quote: Krasnodar
        you need to go inside Gaza in the literal and figurative sense of the word Fight / blow up the "metro" under Palestinian cities, kill as many militants as possible in battles, etc:

        This is exactly what Israel will not take out. It's not about driving Barmaley tanks across the desert. They live too well for such assault losses. So I think they will use their weapons and still come to an agreement. If there is an assault and losses, then Ben will definitely not sit out. Or already straight to Rostov ...?
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 14 May 2021 07: 53
          +4
          In 2014, there was an attack and losses. Building fighting is one of the Israelis' specialties. A lot of tools and techniques for attacking the built-up area. Yes, and the barmaleevs in the desert - it never happened, there were battles with tanks on the Sinai and before the retreat of the Egyptians.
        2. nemez
          nemez 14 May 2021 10: 44
          0
          After the death of our plane to Rostov? Do we need it?
      4. vadim dok
        vadim dok 14 May 2021 16: 03
        +2
        There will be no ground operation! Israel launched misinformation and Hamas got into the tunnels / sabotage /, And Israel hit these tunnels with special bombs, 160 tons were dropped. Many stayed forever in this "Metro". Now the IDF has announced what houses of senior Hamas officers and WHEN will be destroyed!
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 14 May 2021 22: 27
          -1
          Quote: vadim dok
          There will be no ground operation! Israel launched misinformation and Hamas got into the tunnels / sabotage /, And Israel hit these tunnels with special bombs, 160 tons were dropped. Many stayed forever in this "Metro". Now the IDF has announced what houses of senior Hamas officers and WHEN will be destroyed!

          We will follow the further development of events hi
      5. Cossack 471
        Cossack 471 14 May 2021 22: 22
        0
        Greetings ! If you know the answer. write how it was possible to secretly deliver and hide 2 missiles in such a small territory? Is intelligence in Israel stopped working?
    3. Roman1970_1
      Roman1970_1 14 May 2021 06: 09
      0
      No ground operation, this is bullshit
    4. Nikolaevich I
      Nikolaevich I 14 May 2021 08: 52
      +9
      Quote: Lech from Android.
      Not disclosed in the article ... etc, etc. ....

      As always said one regular "visitor" Yandex Zen "...:" The topic of boobs has not been disclosed again! " the necessary (objective) data! What do we hear? The Arabs launched "so many" missiles ... most of them were shot down ... the effectiveness of the "dome" is 100% ... And if the slingers had acted? efficiency of 95% "? Not having the full volume, measure of real objective data, it is difficult to tell the citizens of the Jews, joyfully amazing sidelocks and, as it is sung in one song," and something else and something else ... they say what they don't teach at school ... what they don't talk about, what they can't look at! "Well, you guys are pouring in, without blushing! But strongly (about) the Jewish lobby! And now Lyokha did not have time to press the key five times, as he was fed up with" cons!
      What does VO “turn into?” Maybe B does not mean “military” at all?
      1. max702
        max702 14 May 2021 09: 16
        +4
        Quote: Nikolaevich I
        What do we hear? The Arabs launched "so many" missiles ... most of them were shot down ... the effectiveness of the "dome" is 95% ... And if the slingers were acting? Jews would just as happily report "95% efficiency

        And an article with different ratings HERE will not pass moderation ..
    5. yehat2
      yehat2 14 May 2021 14: 32
      +1
      Quote: Lech from Android.
      Why did the Jews decide on an earthly operation in the Gaza Strip?

      they have not yet made up their minds - they are only gathering strength, but they must soon begin
    6. Viktor Sergeev
      Viktor Sergeev 14 May 2021 17: 27
      +3
      What is the classification there? A pipe is taken, stuffed with fuel, the warhead is inserted and forward, the calculation has already been washed out in a few minutes. The launch is the simplest, the price is low, although the missiles are flying, hell knows where, but here there is an attempt to get a moral effect than a material one. And about the reaction and the ground operation, this is a useless waste of money with no visible effect, there is an anecdote about this: two friends are walking down the street, then a bird shit on one of his heads. The nasty one turns and asks a friend: do you have toilet paper? Answer: why paper, the ass has already flown away.
      But the shelling has a positive result even for Israel: people are frightened, people are in good shape, the army is receiving funding.
    7. TermNachTer
      TermNachTer 14 May 2021 17: 54
      +3
      In addition to the above. I would like to hear the cost of the Jewish and Arab missiles. If several dozen missiles nevertheless broke through, it means that very dangerous objects may also be damaged - factories for the production of explosives or chemical ones, or a factory in the Negev desert. How then will we calculate the percentages?)))
      1. Baron pardus
        Baron pardus 20 May 2021 18: 49
        +1
        And now the most interesting thing. This battle Israel has LOST. How so, you ask? After all, most of the missiles were intercepted, and a bunch of other missiles fell where. But I'll explain to you. How much does an anti-missile missile cost? How much does NURS cost? This time. And now attention. Israel spends its money on anti-missiles. But Hamas spends someone else's money on its NURS. This is exactly what is called an asymmetric strike. It's like putting a cloud of nails into orbit so that they knock down all US and NATO detection satellites, GPS and missile defense, (in general, to take everything out of orbit) will be cheaper than launching your satellites or shooting down each satellite with a super rocket. So it is here. How much does NURS cost? Even if it is a factory-made GRAD? How much does it cost to simply, with the help of the simplest tables, put the core at the desired elevation angle, directing it somewhere in the direction of the city? And how much does a system for detecting such NURSOV cost? And the system of protection against such NURSs. So having lost a dozen people, Israel specifically lost on the dough.
        I already wrote that in a foreign military review somewhere in the 80s there was an article about a British project to protect ships from anti-ship missiles, using not missiles, not super rapid-firing guns such as phalanxes, but a banal package of high-speed 114-127mm caliber weapons equipped with a warhead with a remote fuse. And that even a volley of 16-20 Nurs will be CHEAPER than one SAM or one RCC ... And even 4-6 Nurs will create such a cloud of fragments and a blast wave that not a single RCC will fly through it unharmed, as a maximum it will be shot down, at least it will be demolished by guidance and control systems.
        And here it is exactly the opposite. Do not shoot down 1 anti-ship missile with 20 nurs, but shoot down NURS with SAMs. And clearly not with 100% accuracy.
        Moreover, the US will provide much less assistance to Israel. I can't say that it worries me. Israel was one of the first who ran to lick Biden's wrinkled glutteus maximus congratulating him on "Victory in the elections" exactly second after Ukraine, EMNIP. So when Biden throws them, they will get exactly what they deserve.
        But Hamas is exactly the opposite. Not only Hamas is fed by all sorts of Saudis, Yemenis and others like them, money is being raised for Hamas ... BLM, Antifa, Arab diasporas in the United States (90 percent of those sitting on the welfare, that is, parasitizing on working Americans), but also the equivalents of these "organizations "and the gathering in Europe, where there are far more of them than the US. The social cancer called liberalism (not to be confused with Socialism, Communism and Stalinism, these are completely different things), struck Europe much more than the United States, and I sincerely wish all the victories and LePen and the Alternative for Germany. Otherwise, the European Caliphate (with all its charms) is not far off; Arafat (The best weapon of Islam is the womb of an Arab woman) spoke quite openly about these plans. So all these groups, plus the gayropean tolerant leftists, willingly boycott Israeli goods and give money to the "poor Palestine".

        Once again I will repeat the words of Roke Alva "We must fight not with mosquitoes, but with a swamp." And Israel has only one way out = to bomb "Palestine" in the Stone Age, to raze everything there, to seize the territory, to knock out all the "poor Palestinians" from there with a bang, let them go to all 4 directions, but let the "poor refugees" are taken by those who love them so: Iran, Saudis, Yemenis, and further on the list. There is no other way out. Concessions do not work, in the east any concession is perceived as weakness and begins to press even more .... "Like the infidels are weak, praise be to Allah, forward to complete victory" ... As long as there are Palestinians nearby and in Israel itself, until then there are war and terrorist attacks will continue. Read the Koran, it says everything very clearly about the Jews. It's a pity, of course, that there is no huge lake "Barsovy Ochi" over the Gaza Strip, but I think Israel has something to "fight with the swamp".

        Israel, by and large, has nothing to lose in the first place, they will still be hated. Nobody can do anything to them anyway, purely due to the fact that most of the large financial structures in Europe belong to ..... well, you understand, right? And money, in our post-industrial world - tax everything in the minus. So whatever Israel does, so far both the United States and Europe "express concern and indignation," but no more. And even if they do something more, then nothing prevents other Israeli technologies from repeating the path of the Lavi fighter. Both Europe and the United States understand this. They angered Israel and China will have new military technologies, like last time. China is far from Israel, but much closer to the United States and the US Pacific vassals.
  2. Uncle lee
    Uncle lee 14 May 2021 05: 07
    -5
    10-15 percent missiles missed is better than no protection at all.
    And what are they itching to ?!
  3. Avior
    Avior 14 May 2021 05: 38
    +8
    From 10 to 12 May, Palestinian militias used more than 1000 unguided rockets.

    Specific area. In any other case, a strike with a thousand missiles would mark the beginning of a full-scale war, in which the sides would use means of destruction without bothering with their possible damage to the population.
    1. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar 14 May 2021 06: 04
      +3
      Palestinian Lives Matter request
    2. Mountain shooter
      Mountain shooter 14 May 2021 07: 23
      +16
      Quote: Avior
      Specific area

      I am amazed at the number of missiles accumulated "of all types". And homemade, and not homemade. How they brought in, how and from what they were made, where they stored them ... How did they manage to do it secretly. These are wagons and wagons. Where did the intelligence and agents look? Having accumulated such a potential, the Palestinians were simply looking for an excuse to use this entire arsenal. And they applied. We "overloaded" the air defense system by "massing" the attack. It is not clear what they have achieved. But the people were strained. My friends from Ashkelon sent their children to Eilat. It does not reach there. However, not everyone can do this.
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar 14 May 2021 07: 54
        +2
        Sent through Sinai by ships.
      2. vladcub
        vladcub 14 May 2021 09: 15
        +2
        The question is very reasonable: where was the MOSAD looking? After all, a thousand missiles in one day will not be delivered. Wasn't it easier to prevent this shelling? After all, they should know that a field commander, for example Hamid, is stockpiling ammunition or can. Take this Hamid too ... cut down. In my opinion it would be cheaper
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 14 May 2021 10: 21
          +1
          Everything is more complicated there. After the reduction of the next Hamid, another two-week busty begins with mutual shelling, and in place of each Hamid there is a queue of a couple of dozen Salims.
          1. vladcub
            vladcub 14 May 2021 11: 24
            +3
            And what is the way out? After all, it will not be possible to install an armored dome over all of Israel to protect against missiles
            1. Krasnodar
              Krasnodar 14 May 2021 11: 54
              +1
              Output? And it is good to embed in Hamas, as in Hezbollah in 2006 - 10 years of silence will provide
              1. Astra wild2
                Astra wild2 14 May 2021 14: 42
                +6
                And you do not admit the thought that Hamas will have even more members and that everyone has a thought in their heads: death to Israel.
                1. Krasnodar
                  Krasnodar 14 May 2021 14: 52
                  0
                  Not what I admit, most likely it will be so. ))
                  1. Astra wild2
                    Astra wild2 14 May 2021 16: 35
                    +1
                    The best option is peace negotiations
                    1. Krasnodar
                      Krasnodar 14 May 2021 17: 19
                      +1
                      I agree. Please tell that to Hamas. laughing
                    2. And Us Rat
                      And Us Rat 14 May 2021 19: 37
                      +1
                      Quote: Astra wild2
                      The best option is peace negotiations

                      There is one snag, Hamas is loyal to the Khartoum resolution, the "Three Nos" policy.
                      - no to the world with Israel,
                      - no recognition of Israel,
                      - no negotiations with Israel.

                      All contacts are conducted exclusively through a third party.
                      There is no one to talk to. request
                2. TermNachTer
                  TermNachTer 14 May 2021 17: 57
                  +5
                  the third generation has already grown up, in which someone died at the hands of the Jews. Those wishing to look at the color of Jewish hemoglobin are waiting for many kilometers. So, you can't shoot everyone.
                  1. Krasnodar
                    Krasnodar 14 May 2021 19: 35
                    0
                    Quote: TermNachTER
                    the third generation has already grown up, in which someone died at the hands of the Jews. Those wishing to look at the color of Jewish hemoglobin are waiting for many kilometers. So, you can't shoot everyone.

                    Physically possible. Practically disgusting.
                    1. TermNachTer
                      TermNachTer 14 May 2021 20: 25
                      0
                      And you, explain it to them. They grew up on this, not to mention the fact that religious fanaticism is a very difficult thing.
                      1. Krasnodar
                        Krasnodar 14 May 2021 20: 31
                        0
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        And you, explain it to them. They grew up on this, not to mention the fact that religious fanaticism is a very difficult thing.

                        Why explain something? They themselves know everything very well
                      2. TermNachTer
                        TermNachTer 14 May 2021 20: 34
                        +2
                        That is just it, that "the circle is closed" and no one is going to give in.
                      3. Krasnodar
                        Krasnodar 14 May 2021 20: 42
                        0
                        but where else to concede to them? Gas was left to them as is, that is, all farms, greenhouses, irrigation systems, a hospital, agricultural infrastructure, etc. In gratitude for 16 years, except for the 200s and one prisoner, no one gets a fig. Etc. etc.
                        that's how they want to live, that's how they are interested
              2. Baron pardus
                Baron pardus 20 May 2021 19: 53
                +2
                First, it is quite possible to shoot. Ammunition is inexpensive. And secondly, there are such things as napalm, white phosphorus, ammunition of a volumetric explosion, and a banal economic blockade, destruction of infrastructure. "Palestine" is not Israel where tangerines and everything else grow, there is no grub. And the destruction of what is + economic blockade. And you will be successful. There is no need to destroy all of the Palistins. Enough to make them go ... somewhere far away. To Iran, Yemen, OAU, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan ,. But the problem is that THERE is that the "poor and unfortunate" Palestinians are already well known, they remember very well the attempts of the Palestinians to seize power in Libya, the assassination of Sadat, and all the other joys that the presence of Palestinians brings with it on your land.
                If there is a DECISION to defend their interests and send the "progressive world community" to the negro in .... well, under the arm, then success will be. But if there is no determination and Will, then all this mumbled and indistinct humming will not bring results, and the attacks and shelling will continue.
                By the way, if the Jews were even a little more sane, they would not hire the Palestinians wanting to save money on salaries. Anyone, any Palestinian, is potentially, if not a terrorist, then an art spotter. It costs him nothing to install a small radio beacon.
                On "ships with food" to the "poor starving Palestinians" are brought both NURSs and ATGMs, and MANPADS and many other things. Therefore, a naval blockade is necessary. Each ship must be inspected from keel to klotik, I am sure that they will find a lot of interesting things (in every person you can find something good if you search it properly). each such ship is CONFISCOVED, and the crew is on trial. I am sure that those who want to engage in smuggling will decrease very quickly.

                The attacks will continue until Palestinian parents love their children more than they hate Israel. No, I understand that only parents are irreplaceable, everyone else can be replaced, but still.
      3. And Us Rat
        And Us Rat 14 May 2021 19: 32
        0
        Quote: Krasnodar
        and in place of each Hamid there is a queue of a couple of dozen Salims.

        THE ENTIRE Hamas is being renewed by the Israeli weeding every few years, only Khaled Mashal is still alive from the old guard. The average age of warlords is 23. laughing
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 14 May 2021 19: 36
          +1
          Quote: And Us Rat
          Quote: Krasnodar
          and in place of each Hamid there is a queue of a couple of dozen Salims.

          THE ENTIRE Hamas is being renewed by the Israeli weeding every few years, only Khaled Mashal is still alive from the old guard. The average age of warlords is 23. laughing

          Muhammad Def is also the most alive of all living beings. And loves children repeat
    3. Astra wild2
      Astra wild2 14 May 2021 14: 45
      +2
      "Where did the Mossad look, and where do men mostly look?"
  4. sivuch
    sivuch 14 May 2021 09: 44
    0
    We flew there too. Of course, not like in the Ashdod region.
    By the way, the very concept of an open area is rather arbitrary. Here you are standing on the quishe between Ashdod and Ashkelon and you know that no one will shoot down a rocket here.
  5. Do not care
    Do not care 14 May 2021 15: 56
    +3
    They are produced in Gaza from Iranian components.
  6. bobba94
    bobba94 14 May 2021 18: 38
    0
    The same questions. Israeli UAVs were originally an example for everyone ... for Americans, Russians, Chinese ... The territory of this viper is 10x40 km, launch reconnaissance drones and let them hang over Gaza for days and monitor the situation. On American spy satellites, only Israeli photographic equipment is installed, the best in the world .. So, please, on American satellites, is the toad pressing on its defense? ...
    1. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar 14 May 2021 20: 30
      +1
      This is why Palestinians are digging tunnels, in most cases starting construction in one of the buildings. hi
      1. Kerensky
        Kerensky 17 May 2021 23: 27
        0
        This is why Palestinians are digging tunnels, in most cases starting construction in one of the buildings hi

        Is the soil taken out at night in baby carriages? Very hardworking Palestinians there ... or well paid. Knowing those soils, I would have broken pretty much for a cube. Unfastening, ventilation .... lighting again. And how long will the link pass per shift?
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 18 May 2021 05: 16
          0
          No, depicts renovations or adjustments to an additional floor. 300 meters of tunnel from Sinai to Rafiyah at the beginning of 2010 cost about half a million dollars hi
  • fuffi
    fuffi 14 May 2021 08: 53
    +6
    Quote: Avior
    district. In any other case, a strike with a thousand missiles would mark the beginning of a full-scale war, in which the sides would use means of destruction without bothering with their possible damage to the population.
    It can be seen that the Israeli leadership does not need it. Extra expenses. Benya has already achieved his goal: he unleashed a small war, trained the military once again, poked the Palestinians with a stick, mobilized the population in front of the image of an external enemy. You can go to the polls and all that.
    1. Avior
      Avior 14 May 2021 09: 19
      +1
      I think it would be ideal for Israel - a fast and victorious war.
      But Israel is forced to reckon with international pressure on this score.
      I don't think Israel has a problem with finding an external enemy.
  • Aaron Zawi
    Aaron Zawi 14 May 2021 05: 59
    +7
    There is no 100% protection. This son repeats to us continuously, but he still served on the LCD. wink Today NURS got to the house of a comrade in Ashkelon. request One of his neighbors was wounded by a shrapnel in the stomach and the destruction was obviously much greater than the cost of "Tamir". So once again I recommend all Israelis to follow the instructions of the "Logistics Service".
    1. vladcub
      vladcub 14 May 2021 07: 45
      +8
      We are somehow far from your loudspeakers, and therefore we do not know the recommendations: "rear services".
      1. fuffi
        fuffi 14 May 2021 09: 09
        -6
        Quote: vladcub
        We are somehow far from your loudspeakers, and therefore we do not know the recommendations: "rear services".

        Interestingly, the Home Front Service recommends leaving the occupied territories?
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 14 May 2021 10: 26
          +6
          All Arabs back to Jazeera? Not humanely like that, and the Saudis will not accept them. It has been 1300 years since they conquered the Jewish land.
        2. yehat2
          yehat2 14 May 2021 14: 46
          +1
          Quote: fuffi
          leave the occupied territories

          Yes, there is already the devil's leg break someone who occupied what.
    2. sivuch
      sivuch 14 May 2021 09: 47
      +1
      Who would argue. In our area, the alarm was 6 or 7 times a night.
    3. yehat2
      yehat2 14 May 2021 14: 37
      +3
      if my memory serves me, the probability of intercepting a simple subsonic unguided missile is about 40% (it was - now it can be improved). Often they make paired launches, which brings the average probability of 1 salvo to intercept up to 80%, but it may well happen that 2 volleys will miss in a row, so the LCD is far from ideal. On the group goal, the confusion is further intensified.
      It seems to me that the declared 3-4% of the missiles that pass is a very optimistic statement.
      So yes, cramming civil defense and stocking up extinguishing agents is worth it.
      1. And Us Rat
        And Us Rat 14 May 2021 19: 42
        -2
        Quote: yehat2
        if my memory serves me right

        Changes yes
        And memory and knowledge, and often common sense.
    4. OgnennyiKotik
      OgnennyiKotik 14 May 2021 15: 16
      +4
      Expect new contracts from the United States for the supply of air defense systems and components. After such advertising, they are inevitable. Great system. Work on massive shelling, 1 missile 1 target, ~ 5% of missiles missed, below the minimum system failure. There are no questions at all. My respect for the creators of the system hi
      1. Sanichsan
        Sanichsan 14 May 2021 22: 12
        0
        Quote: OgnennyiKotik
        Work on massive shelling, 1 missile 1 target, ~ 5% of missiles missed, below the minimum system failure. There are no questions at all.

        well, we have already seen it. the same was written about the American patriots after the Iran-Iraq war. there, too, 80% of the efficiency was drawn, although later it turned out that in reality about 20 wink
  • Pessimist22
    Pessimist22 14 May 2021 06: 41
    -1
    Yesterday I watched a video of how the LCD package lost control and crashed into and exploded in a building, no casualties and destruction were reported. I wonder what percentage of these missiles.
    1. Aaron Zawi
      Aaron Zawi 14 May 2021 06: 44
      -3
      Quote: Pessimist22
      Yesterday I watched a video of how the LCD package lost control and crashed into and exploded in a building, no casualties and destruction were reported. I wonder what percentage of these missiles.

      Brad.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. yehat2
        yehat2 14 May 2021 14: 48
        +1
        just let's go without hurray propaganda. What makes you think that nonsense?
        LCDs are launched in hundreds and not a single rocket has ever malfunctioned?
        1. Aaron Zawi
          Aaron Zawi 14 May 2021 14: 50
          -1
          Quote: yehat2
          just let's go without hurray propaganda. What makes you think that nonsense?
          LCDs are launched in hundreds and not a single rocket has ever malfunctioned?

          Of course she did. And the radars were out of order. But the LCD does not fire packets.
          1. yehat2
            yehat2 14 May 2021 14: 52
            +2
            Quote: Aron Zaavi
            But the LCD does not shoot packets.

            so speech about the fact that one missile lost control.
            What's the difference - let it go in a bag or a string bag?
            1. Aaron Zawi
              Aaron Zawi 14 May 2021 14: 57
              +1
              Quote: yehat2
              Quote: Aron Zaavi
              But the LCD does not shoot packets.

              so speech about the fact that one missile lost control.
              What's the difference - let it go in a bag or a string bag?

              Nobody talked about it here, but believe me, there would be a cry ...
              1. yehat2
                yehat2 14 May 2021 14: 59
                +1
                Quote: Aron Zaavi
                Nobody talked about it with us

                Well, now there is no time for that, then they will begin to sum up the results.
            2. And Us Rat
              And Us Rat 14 May 2021 19: 50
              0
              Quote: yehat2
              so it's about

              I watched the video yesterday, but I forgot to attach to the comment, what a convenient coincidence. fellow
              And readers of the naive Chukchi lovers should take everything on faith. wassat
              Critical thinking is probably not familiar to readers? wassat
              1. yehat2
                yehat2 17 May 2021 08: 22
                +1
                it's about rumors, not lies.
                moreover, it would be naive to think that after launching hundreds of rockets of the iron dome,
                100% of the launches turned out to be without problems and nothing fell anywhere.
                Nobody took anything on faith, except maybe you, it's about trying to figure out - it was or was not and if it was, then how.
                but the attempt to understand is drowned in strange spam from outright Jews and people like you.
                1. And Us Rat
                  And Us Rat 17 May 2021 10: 47
                  -2
                  Quote: yehat2
                  but trying to figure it out is drowning in strange spam

                  Oh, how he turned it out, took it and accused him of what he was doing! fellow
                  On the blue eye. laughing Demagogue.
                  1. yehat2
                    yehat2 17 May 2021 10: 49
                    -1
                    Quote: And Us Rat
                    does it himself

                    Quote: And Us Rat
                    Demagogue

                    Quote: And Us Rat
                    twisted

                    Quote: And Us Rat
                    took

                    you are so helpful and informative that you honestly deserve a minus. I disdain to answer.
                    1. And Us Rat
                      And Us Rat 17 May 2021 10: 52
                      -1
                      Quote: yehat2
                      you are so helpful and informative

                      Who would say, Black Hundreds.

                      Quote: yehat2
                      I disdain to answer.

                      Because there is nothing, the drain is counted. laughing
    2. Avior
      Avior 14 May 2021 07: 35
      0
      Can you give a link to this video?
      1. Pessimist22
        Pessimist22 14 May 2021 08: 08
        +3
        Posted on Instagram on Militarycolumnist 15 hours ago https://www.instagram.com/p/CO0MOMklgWO/? Igshid = 1lhnna1b27d4j
        1. Avior
          Avior 14 May 2021 08: 24
          0
          Thank you. Only it is not clear, is it exactly the Iron Dome?
          There, all the missiles, the trajectories of which remained on the video, have strange chaotically broken trajectories.
          It looks strange. Looks like cheap Chinese firecrackers were fired.
          Moreover, there is no sound from hitting the ground, and the trajectories of all the missiles in the frame are cut off by no explosion, no continuation further, as if they had disappeared into the air.
          1. Sergey_G_M
            Sergey_G_M 14 May 2021 10: 53
            +1
            Quote: Avior
            There, all the missiles, the trajectories of which remained on the video, have strange chaotically broken trajectories.

            The trajectories "break" after the development and separation of the first stage of the rocket.
            Quote: Avior
            the trajectories of all the missiles in the frame are cut off by no explosion, no continuation further, as if they had dissolved in the air.

            After working out the second stage, there will be no smoke from the engine operation and you simply will not see the rocket (at such a distance it is small in size and moves quickly, to see you need special equipment and not a smartphone camera)
            1. Avior
              Avior 14 May 2021 11: 17
              +2
              actually looks different

              it is not visible that the rocket in that video hit somewhere or exploded
              1. Sergey_G_M
                Sergey_G_M 14 May 2021 12: 32
                +1
                Obviously, the two videos are different missiles.
                On your video, the targets are hit very close and you can see the operation of the warhead of the missile defense system - by the way, this is not very good, you can see that the defeat is taking place over the city and the debris will fall on the city, and if the warhead is not hit, then it can explode in the city.
                In the first video, it is possible that the interception was carried out much further and therefore the operation of the warhead of the missile defense is invisible.
                1. Avior
                  Avior 14 May 2021 13: 14
                  0
                  the smoke trail is visible until the very moment the warhead detonates. and it has no broken paths many times.
                  After working out the second stage, there will be no smoke from the engine and you simply will not see the rocket

                  the width of the smoke trail and the sound level from the flight of the rocket in the first case show that the rockets were closer to the observer than in the above video. But the gap in the first case is not audible and not visible, and in the second, it is visible and audible.
                  Shl by the way, is there actually a two-stage rocket? I did not see this either in the photo or in the video.
                  1. yehat2
                    yehat2 14 May 2021 14: 40
                    0
                    I saw in the video of Tel Aviv at night the characteristic explosions during the interception.
                    Their tracks hang in the air for a long time.
                    but you need to understand that the LCD is not the only air defense complex.
                    Everything that is involved is involved.
                    Installations like TOP would be useful there.
                    I criticized Israel a lot in connection with this incident, but such attacks are unacceptable from any side. Mirnyak should not be a bargaining chip in politics.
                    1. Avior
                      Avior 14 May 2021 14: 49
                      0
                      we are talking about a specific video from the link above
                      1. yehat2
                        yehat2 14 May 2021 14: 50
                        0
                        it’s difficult to tell what’s going on.
                  2. And Us Rat
                    And Us Rat 14 May 2021 20: 01
                    -2
                    Quote: Avior
                    and the rocket is actually two-stage?

                    Not. Single stage.
        2. And Us Rat
          And Us Rat 14 May 2021 19: 56
          0
          Quote: Pessimist22
          Posted on Instagram on Militarycolumnist 15 hours ago https://www.instagram.com/p/CO0MOMklgWO/? Igshid = 1lhnna1b27d4j

          What should have been proved, lies and distortion of facts.
          In the video there is NO "hitting the building", there is a maneuver when changing the target and going to a lower trajectory of interception, the rocket makes a loop and pursues a new target along a flat trajectory, in this video it breaks off. fellow
      2. The comment was deleted.
    3. The comment was deleted.
  • sergo1914
    sergo1914 14 May 2021 07: 15
    +4
    Ammunition heading into a deserted area is ignored; only those that threaten populated areas are intercepted.


    IMHO. They beat everything in a row. In addition to the downed ones, the self-fallen and under-flown ones are added. On such a volume of even ballistic cobblestones, the system sagged. Downed ones are declared threatening, those not downed - ignored. And what if the Arab queen will do the simplest maneuvering on the trajectory? Again, IMHO. Against the rocket collective farm - packages of small-caliber barrels. And a curtain of shells or submunitions in threatening areas. Many times cheaper and more efficient.
    1. vladcub
      vladcub 14 May 2021 07: 47
      +5
      Offer it to the IDF, but no matter how Hamas gets angry at you
      1. sergo1914
        sergo1914 14 May 2021 07: 58
        +8
        Quote: vladcub
        Offer it to the IDF, but no matter how Hamas gets angry at you


        I did this in the early 90s for the Russian Navy. I was even given a prize. RUB 70 The installation did not want to get anywhere. We decided to make additional supports for the packages. They began to do at the muzzle cuts, and I suggested at the point of maximum deformation of the package. Made. We got it. Senior comrades were given normal bonuses. And I'm 70. I, when I was young, got a little swollen. They gave the second category and made him responsible for the kettle in the department. In general, the bloody red-haired and found his victim here.
        PS Why should someone offer something? They themselves will figure it out.
        PPS A line of two six-barrel screw-fed packages looks very exciting up close.
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 14 May 2021 09: 02
          -2
          Swelled m swelled laughing
          1. sergo1914
            sergo1914 14 May 2021 09: 52
            +6
            Quote: Krasnodar
            Swelled m swelled laughing


            I wanted 500, not 70. They said it's too small.
            1. Krasnodar
              Krasnodar 14 May 2021 10: 13
              +1
              Wasn't it an option to agree on 70/30 in their favor? ))
              1. sergo1914
                sergo1914 14 May 2021 10: 16
                +5
                Quote: Krasnodar
                Wasn't it an option to agree on 70/30 in their favor? ))


                A young specialist who has just received the third category? They said that I was still ahead. But there is a labor record about 70 rubles. The personnel officers laugh.
                1. Krasnodar
                  Krasnodar 14 May 2021 10: 27
                  0
                  Aren't the people giving out the prizes? laughing 150 for you, 350 for them after receiving cash and everyone is happy fellow
                  1. sergo1914
                    sergo1914 14 May 2021 10: 48
                    +3
                    Quote: Krasnodar
                    Aren't the people giving out the prizes? laughing 150 for you, 350 for them after receiving cash and everyone is happy fellow


                    Komsomol members did not act like that !!!)))
    2. qQQQ
      qQQQ 14 May 2021 08: 48
      +7
      Quote: sergo1914
      Against the rocket collective farm - packages of small-caliber barrels. And a curtain of shells or submunitions in threatening areas. Much cheaper and more efficient.

      If you had ever fired at the VC from even the fastest-firing ZA, you would have realized that the probability of hitting is very small. In general, it will turn out to be much more expensive and less effective.
      1. Gust
        Gust 14 May 2021 09: 02
        +3
        He spoke about the striking elements, which means detonating the projectile on the trajectory. Another question is that the power of a 30 mm projectile from a package or a single cannon is not enough, a minimum of 57 mm is needed for heavy fragments.
      2. sergo1914
        sergo1914 14 May 2021 09: 55
        +7
        Quote: qqqq
        Quote: sergo1914
        Against the rocket collective farm - packages of small-caliber barrels. And a curtain of shells or submunitions in threatening areas. Much cheaper and more efficient.

        If you had ever fired at the VC from even the fastest-firing ZA, you would have realized that the probability of hitting is very small. In general, it will turn out to be much more expensive and less effective.


        Shot and repeatedly. Advise in areas that you really understand. Well, there, how to milk a goat. Air defense is not yours.
        1. qQQQ
          qQQQ 14 May 2021 10: 21
          +1
          Quote: sergo1914
          Shot and repeatedly. Advise in areas that you really understand. Well, there, how to milk a goat. Air defense is not yours.

          So I just fired, and they fired nearby and others and a lot, while not a single direct hit, the flight of shells near the target (Shilka) was assessed, and at what real distance from the target they passed, who knows, from the ground everything looked like nice. If we take SPP, then given their number in a salvo and also not a small cost, the process will not be cheap.
          1. sergo1914
            sergo1914 14 May 2021 10: 46
            +1
            Quote: qqqq
            Quote: sergo1914
            Shot and repeatedly. Advise in areas that you really understand. Well, there, how to milk a goat. Air defense is not yours.

            So I just fired, and they fired nearby and others and a lot, while not a single direct hit, the flight of shells near the target (Shilka) was assessed, and at what real distance from the target they passed, who knows, from the ground everything looked like nice. If we take SPP, then given their number in a salvo and also not a small cost, the process will not be cheap.


            The task is not to hit the target. The task is to hang a curtain of submunitions on the target's trajectory. Everything worked with the RCC. Into the dust with sub-caliber arrows. Shilka is different. Although it is also possible to skolkhoz the curtain. It is necessary to work not according to the goal, but according to the area of ​​its probable appearance. Well, on homemade missiles, the warhead is not armored. There is enough ball from the bearing. Moreover, a group ballistic target.

            PS Well, nobody canceled the netting. Cover the city with a dome. The entire collective farm on the dome will explode. They will never hit the same point with their missiles. After the shelling, I changed the net. Iron Dome - 2.
            1. qQQQ
              qQQQ 14 May 2021 14: 20
              +1
              Quote: sergo1914
              Everything worked with the RCC. Into the dust with sub-caliber shooters.

              The anti-ship missiles are large enough in size, there were enough cases that they had, that we had, when the ZAK missed targets. A sufficient curtain, it is very expensive, for airplanes to make a curtain, look how much c60 is involved in a salvo and then the probability of hitting is scanty in comparison with missiles. It was not from a good life that they switched from cheap artillery to expensive missiles.
            2. qQQQ
              qQQQ 14 May 2021 15: 17
              0
              Quote: sergo1914
              PS Well, nobody canceled the netting. Cover the city with a dome. The entire collective farm on the dome will explode. They will never hit the same point with their missiles. After the shelling, I changed the net. Iron Dome - 2.

              I don't understand, is this from the humor section?
              1. sergo1914
                sergo1914 14 May 2021 15: 27
                +1
                Quote: qqqq
                Quote: sergo1914
                PS Well, nobody canceled the netting. Cover the city with a dome. The entire collective farm on the dome will explode. They will never hit the same point with their missiles. After the shelling, I changed the net. Iron Dome - 2.

                I don't understand, is this from the humor section?


                Not. This is a business plan.
                1. qQQQ
                  qQQQ 14 May 2021 15: 32
                  +2
                  Quote: sergo1914
                  Not. This is a business plan.

                  It's great, but if it's also at MO prices, then it's just a bonanza. And if you take a thicker mesh, then you can declare protection against ICBMs.
                  1. sergo1914
                    sergo1914 14 May 2021 15: 41
                    0
                    Quote: qqqq
                    Quote: sergo1914
                    Not. This is a business plan.

                    It's great, but if it's also at MO prices, then it's just a bonanza. And if you take a thicker mesh, then you can declare protection against ICBMs.


                    Quiet. There is no need to burn a promising startup.
                    1. qQQQ
                      qQQQ 14 May 2021 15: 55
                      +2
                      Quote: sergo1914
                      Quiet. There is no need to burn a promising startup.

                      Silently I envy that I didn’t come up with it myself.
      3. yehat2
        yehat2 14 May 2021 14: 56
        +1
        Quote: qqqq
        In general, it will turn out to be much more expensive and less effective.

        there is ww2 statistics. For 1 downed aircraft, 40000 shells are fired.
        This approach can hardly be called effective.
        1. qQQQ
          qQQQ 14 May 2021 15: 18
          +2
          Quote: yehat2
          there is ww2 statistics. For 1 downed aircraft, 40000 shells are fired.
          This approach can hardly be called effective.

          I'm talking about the same thing that artillery, if you reach a target hit rate comparable to missiles, is unlikely to be cheaper.
          1. SKS_PRO
            SKS_PRO 14 May 2021 19: 25
            0
            Well, perhaps the average temperature in the hospital should not be passed off as the effectiveness of anti-aircraft artillery with radio fuses at the end of the war. Look at the results of the Americans at the final stage of chtoli.
  • vladcub
    vladcub 14 May 2021 09: 04
    +3
    "can be prevented through the peace process" the chance of a peace process is slim. To sort out who is right and who is not, when it was necessary and so on, is long and debatable.
    Even if a miracle happens: Natanyahu and Hamas will say today: peace for eternity. Among Hamas there will always be demagogues who will call for sacred revenge, and there only light a match and fire
    1. sivuch
      sivuch 14 May 2021 09: 51
      0
      And besides Hamas, there is still an Islamic jihad, and Fatah has not disappeared either.
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar 14 May 2021 10: 16
        +3
        Quote: sivuch
        And besides Hamas, there is still an Islamic jihad, and Fatah has not disappeared either.

        Islamic Jihad - Mal
        Fatah - not popular (corrupt)
        Hamas can be replaced only by completely frostbitten pseudo-Islamists, others have no chance
  • Normal ok
    Normal ok 14 May 2021 09: 28
    +2
    There is simply no 100% protection. We can only talk about the degree of efficiency.
  • iouris
    iouris 14 May 2021 09: 46
    -2
    That's why you need to get out of limitation treaties.
  • Alexander X
    Alexander X 14 May 2021 09: 55
    -1
    What he noted for himself after reading the article: if the Jewish Dome could not intercept some of the most primitive missiles of the Arabs in the absence of interference, then how much will it miss in the conditions of electronic warfare in the presence of intelligently created interference? And what if false goals and other tricks are added to this? A bleak picture emerges ... IMHO ...
    1. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar 14 May 2021 10: 18
      +5
      To intercept missiles more difficult than Katyusha, Grad and their Syrian / Iranian modifications (i.e. what Hamas mainly uses) there are other air defense systems - not a dome.
    2. And Us Rat
      And Us Rat 14 May 2021 20: 35
      -2
      Quote: Alexander X
      A bleak picture looms ...

      In the eyes of an amateur, I do not argue. yes
      But those who want to "play for an adult" and will be answered "for an adult. And now there is, one might say, a police action.
  • fuffi
    fuffi 14 May 2021 10: 12
    +3
    Quote: Avior
    for Israel it would be ideal - a fast and victorious war.

    It depends on how you look at it. A quick war is an invasion, hostilities, the death of a civilian, the revitalization of the Arab world, etc. Again, Europe will condemn. Of course, they will not say about annexation and will not be called occupiers, but unnecessary tension. It is much more profitable to maintain a smoldering conflict, which can be periodically stirred up at the right time (for the same elections, for example), rally the people, then "negotiate" with the Palestinians, look like a "peacemaker" in the eyes of the electorate, etc. In the meantime, there is such a mess, then you look and the Israelis will not have time to hide Benya in prison. The war is the same. Not before.
  • Alexfly
    Alexfly 14 May 2021 13: 02
    0
    Well done Israelis! 4% is a good result! It is interesting simply, and at what level is the Shell?
  • Astra wild2
    Astra wild2 14 May 2021 14: 32
    0
    "which should negatively affect the morale of the Israeli side" if the air defense siren howls day and night, everyone's nerves will be strained. No matter how perfect the "iron dome" system is, but realize that 10-15% can break through and get into your house. There is little pleasure. I could not live like this, and ten times I looked for where it is safer
    1. Ratmir_Ryazan
      Ratmir_Ryazan 22 May 2021 09: 59
      0
      And if you knew that for the destroyed house you will receive multiple compensation for its value and there is a normal bomb shelter nearby, and you will be warned in advance of a missile attack?
      1. Astra wild2
        Astra wild2 22 May 2021 10: 16
        +1
        Persuaded: I'll live for now, but still little pleasure
        1. Ratmir_Ryazan
          Ratmir_Ryazan 22 May 2021 13: 56
          -1
          Jews are paid, so they live there.
  • Aleksandr97
    Aleksandr97 14 May 2021 14: 44
    +2
    Evaluation of the real result of the work of scientists and engineers, who created in this case, the "Iron Dome" system, its combat work! The topic is very interesting, I would still like a professional "debriefing"!
  • Kostadinov
    Kostadinov 14 May 2021 15: 29
    -4
    At the same time, about 30-35 missiles were able to break through the missile defense system and fell on populated areas, which led to destruction, injury and casualties.

    It is only the rockets that cannot be beaten fall silent as they led to great destruction. Since the warhead of Palestinian missiles is small, such missiles are less than 10% of all that hit the cities.
    So at least 350-400 missiles broke through the missile defense system and hit their targets. Another 350-400 missiles did not hit for various other reasons not related to missile defense.
    Effectiveness w. domes somewhere from 0 to 10%.
    Professor T. Postol of the Masachusetts Institute investigated the effectiveness of g. domes and claims that in 80-90% of the so-called "interceptions" the railway dome does not even come close to Palestinian missiles.
    1. Shimshon
      Shimshon 14 May 2021 21: 32
      +2
      It remains only to show the photo "destroyed by Tel Aviv by 350 bursting Hamas missiles." Isn't it a joke 350 missiles with a range of over 40 km should turn the city into dust.
      Confirm your theory with a photo.
  • Gennady Fomkin
    Gennady Fomkin 14 May 2021 18: 09
    0
    Oh, statistically, they have an interception of 1 out of 10 ... belay
  • Klingon
    Klingon 14 May 2021 18: 20
    +2
    As I understand it, the Jews do not have echeloned air defense? ZhK is a tactical air defense system with a medium radius of 4-70 km. and there is nothing to finish off the bursting ammunition type. This is where something like the Pantsir or an art system such as Russian ship daggers, Duets, or the type of German air defense object art Mantis could come in handy. Oh yeah ... so where are their vaunted lasers?
    1. Sanichsan
      Sanichsan 14 May 2021 22: 39
      0
      Quote: Klingon
      This is where something like Pantsir or an art system like Russian ship's Daggers, Duets, or a type of German air defense object art Mantis might come in handy.

      to shoot at cannon air defense missiles over the city? IMHO the idea is not very good. yes, a cloud of striking elements in the form of shells will of course give a shell, and most likely it will shoot down a rocket, but ... creepy physics! this ammunition will fall after 4 kilometers, which is typical of someone's house or a gas station. A 30mm projectile is not a very sour thing, and here it is already a question of what will cause more destruction, from water pipes with explosives or from such an anti-missile defense system.
  • Synoid
    Synoid 15 May 2021 16: 37
    +1
    Quote: Lech from Android.
    The article does not disclose the classification of missiles fired by the Palestinians, their performance characteristics, methods and methods of launching, how they were delivered to the launch site, how they were guided, a portrait of the combat crews of missiles, their level of training and many other issues.
    What is the time of the retaliatory strike by the IDF on the positions of the Palestinian missile positions?
    And what is the approximate potential of the Palestinians in building up missile strikes, what is the stock of missiles for the next strike, what are the possibilities for replenishment?
    Why did the Jews decide on an earthly operation in the Gaza Strip?
    How long will it last?
    Etc.

    Alexey, the article is not for broadening the horizons of readers, but also an advertising booklet.
    Iron kaput, the error is only 15%. Of course, in ideal conditions. In fact, everyone can see its effectiveness, but the Jews are trying to put a good face on a bad game.
    Of course, + that Israel has its own missile defense system, but nothing breakthrough.
  • Mikhail Ya2
    Mikhail Ya2 15 May 2021 19: 40
    +1
    I wish Russia could offer Israel its systems to show how much more effective they are in real combat. Isn't it advertising? True only if it is more effective
    1. Maki Avellevich
      Maki Avellevich 15 May 2021 20: 42
      -3
      Quote: Mikhail Ya2
      I wish Russia could offer Israel its systems to show how much more effective they are in real combat.

      we have already seen videos showing their effectiveness.
      while we ourselves will interrupt, but thanks for the offer.
    2. Ratmir_Ryazan
      Ratmir_Ryazan 22 May 2021 09: 56
      -1
      I wish Russia could offer Israel its systems to show how much more effective they are in real combat.


      If only Russia would buy the Iron Dome air defense system, to see how air defense can intercept a massive missile attack, and not 1-2 missiles.

      Our systems and half would not have been shot down by the missiles that the Palestinians launched at Israel.
  • Shahno
    Shahno 15 May 2021 19: 57
    -2
    Quote: Michael Ya2
    I wish Russia could offer Israel its systems to show how much more effective they are in real combat. Isn't it advertising? True only if it is more effective

    Why do we need an air defense system with export restrictions and about the same technical. level ...
  • Nord11
    Nord11 15 May 2021 21: 48
    0
    Well, if you consider that the overwhelming majority of Palestinian missiles of the Ivashka level are from the Palace of Pioneers, then it is quite a budgetary hassle for Israel, plus unequal costs for the cost of launching and intercepting ..
    1. Mikhail Ya2
      Mikhail Ya2 15 May 2021 22: 56
      +1
      Fundamentally wrong approach. We must look at what damage this missile defense can prevent.
    2. Ratmir_Ryazan
      Ratmir_Ryazan 22 May 2021 09: 53
      0
      unequal cost of launch and interception ..


      Consider not the cost of the intercepted missile, but the cost of damage prevented.
    3. TatarinSSSR
      TatarinSSSR 22 May 2021 10: 45
      +1
      The main criterion is the possible damage from a non-intercepted projectile. And it's very high. And the second criterion is the highly effective advertising of the Israeli missile defense "Iron Dome" on the world arms market. Its demand after such events and the indicator of efficiency will grow significantly. And this is a lot of money for the Israeli budget.
  • Alexander Myasnikov
    Alexander Myasnikov 15 May 2021 23: 03
    +1
    Israel will win, in sha Allah.
  • Comrade Kim
    Comrade Kim 16 May 2021 02: 28
    -1
    Quote: Krasnodar
    will hit the image of Israel. He's pretty low already

    Yes, they wanted to sneeze at it.
    Netanyahu is shaking at his naughty woman, this is the main reason for the mess. It is possible that the Hamas "Star raid" was coordinated with Beneya.
    The earth has been burning under his feet for a long time. I agreed with Hamas: "Hit Israel, otherwise I won't win the elections."
    Benya did not send his homosexual son under the blows, but drives Russian Jews like cattle to slaughter: "Every family who comes from the Russian Federation will have an apartment in the apartment when we will evict the Palestinians."

    https://t.me/parstodayrussian/72082?single
    1. Maki Avellevich
      Maki Avellevich 16 May 2021 09: 44
      -2
      Quote: Comrade Kim
      Yes, they wanted to sneeze at it.
      Netanyahu is shaking at his naughty woman, this is the main reason for the mess. It is possible that the Hamas "Star raid" was coordinated with Beneya.
      The earth has been burning under his feet for a long time. I agreed with Hamas: "Hit Israel, otherwise I won't win the elections."
      Benya did not send his homosexual son under the blows, but drives Russian Jews like cattle to slaughter: "Every family who comes from the Russian Federation will have an apartment in the apartment when we will evict the Palestinians."

      young man, it didn't hurt to wash your mouth with soap.
      pollute the forum.
  • tarakan
    tarakan 16 May 2021 11: 35
    0
    Damn, such metro builders disappear.
  • Shahno
    Shahno 16 May 2021 11: 42
    0
    Quote: tarakan
    Damn, such metro builders disappear.

    It's a shame, but here in TA .. I have already forgotten how many years they have been suffering from the metro.
  • Kostadinov
    Kostadinov 17 May 2021 14: 43
    +2
    there is ww2 statistics. For 1 downed aircraft, 40000 shells are fired.
    This approach can hardly be called effective.

    Where did you get these statistics? The United States lost at least 8 thousand aircraft and at least 3 thousand British bombs from German anti-aircraft artillery. command. More than a thousand aircraft from anti-aircraft gunners were lost by France, Poland and so on.
    12 thousand aircraft, 40 thousand shells each, is 480 million anti-aircraft artillery shells only in the West and even so much in the East - means a billion only fired shells without other losses.
    This is more than an order of magnitude higher than all German production of such shells.
    4 thousand shells for shooting down an aircraft is closer to the truth, but this is also hovered at least 2 times.
  • Kostadinov
    Kostadinov 17 May 2021 14: 54
    +1
    It remains only to show the photo "destroyed by Tel Aviv by 350 bursting Hamas missiles." Isn't it a joke 350 missiles with a range of over 40 km should turn the city into dust.
    Confirm your theory with a photo.

    At least 350 missiles passed the air defense system, but hit not only Tel Aviv, but several other cities.
    But also 350 missiles of 10 kg. vzryvchatka is not more than 3,5 tons.
    It will turn a million-city like Tel Aviv into dust with 1-2 tones of common vzryvchatka this is a joke for you. In your opinion, a hundred missiles of no more than 100-155 mm artillery shells should turn a big city into dust?
  • foxhound
    foxhound 18 May 2021 06: 55
    0
    Hmmm. And why does Hamas not fire false targets simultaneously with military missiles? The same missiles, but instead of a warhead, a cast-iron blank or concrete. It is almost impossible to knock down this one (if the engine has time to work). After being hit by an anti-missile, such a blank will continue its flight, the iron dome will decide that the target is not hit and will fire at it again and again. Thus, the blank will divert the anti-missile onto itself, giving a chance to the present. Plus the overspending of missile defense ammunition and the savings of explosives at Hamas.
  • Kostadinov
    Kostadinov 18 May 2021 12: 19
    0
    Quote: foxhound
    Hmmm. And why does Hamas not fire false targets simultaneously with military missiles? The same missiles, but instead of a warhead, a cast-iron blank or concrete. It is almost impossible to knock down this one (if the engine has time to work). After being hit by an anti-missile, such a blank will continue its flight, the iron dome will decide that the target is not hit and will fire at it again and again. Thus, the blank will divert the anti-missile onto itself, giving a chance to the present. Plus the overspending of missile defense ammunition and the savings of explosives at Hamas.

    Hamas is already using this tactic. But cutting the normal HE of the missile warhead with anti-missile fragments is also not an easy task, and if independent experts believe 80-90% of interceptions, this does not happen.
    Another threat is that anti-missile stripping will occur over the protected city and fragments of missiles and anti-missile missiles will fall on the residents' heads, which is also unsafe.
    The main missile defense system of Israel is ukritiya and strengthening of houses. This very effectively protects people's lives from small warheads of missiles and from shrapnel. Only cars and people outside Ukraine are affected.
  • Shahno
    Shahno 20 May 2021 18: 20
    +2
    Quote: Konnick
    There are no civilians there. There are only terrorists and their accomplices. You remember the story. Have the Palestinians been kicked out of all Arab countries by their own "Arab brothers" with a bang? Why? And because wherever they went, they were doing the same thing as now: terrorism and attempts to seize power. Suffice it to recall the assassination of Sadat and the attempts to seize power in Lebanon. Therefore, they were kicked out of all Arab countries - no one needs such problems in their own country. So there are no "civilians" there. Only terrorists and their accomplices.

    I agree with you, that is why the Arabs do not support them, but the Turks and Persians support them.

    Turks and Persians .. THEM have an idea to be in the lead in the Muslim world. Israel is here for them 'litmus paper'.
  • Ratmir_Ryazan
    Ratmir_Ryazan 22 May 2021 09: 50
    +1
    I wonder how the Iron Dome missiles distribute targets during a massive attack so that each anti-missile missile hits its own target and there is no such thing that several anti-missiles attack one missile?

    I don’t remember that at one time Russian air defense systems, land or sea, conducted exercises to repel a massive missile attack.

    Are we in our army or navy capable of repelling a missile attack similar to the one the Palestinians staged against the Israelis?

    And they will attack us in about the same way, only more missiles will be high-precision.

    The iron dome is an ideal air defense against cruise missiles and UAVs both for the front line of defense and as object air defense, launcher separately, radar separately, command post separately, large b / k.

    I think this system has the ability to connect several radars to one battery, so that in case of defeat of one, the other continues to ensure the incomparableness of the air defense system.

    In general, Russia should take this experience into account and create a similar system.

    Carapace with 12 missiles in B / K and without AGSN, nervously smokes on the sidelines.

    We are very lucky that ISIS did not think of such a massive one against our base in Khmeimim.
    1. TatarinSSSR
      TatarinSSSR 22 May 2021 10: 32
      +1
      Also asked the main question - what if suddenly a massive missile attack on Russian targets? We need the same missile defense system as the IDF with a large number of ammunition complexes, because the ammunition of the Pantsyr and Thor missiles ... In general, everything is sad there.
  • Shahno
    Shahno 22 May 2021 09: 58
    0
    Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
    I wonder how the Iron Dome missiles distribute targets during a massive attack so that each anti-missile missile hits its own target and there is no such thing that several anti-missiles attack one missile?

    I don’t remember that at one time Russian air defense systems, land or sea, conducted exercises to repel a massive missile attack.

    Are we in our army or navy capable of repelling a missile attack similar to the one the Palestinians staged against the Israelis?

    And they will attack us in about the same way, only more missiles will be high-precision.

    The iron dome is an ideal air defense against cruise missiles and UAVs both for the front line of defense and as object air defense, launcher separately, radar separately, command post separately, large b / k.

    I think this system has the ability to connect several radars to one battery, so that in case of defeat of one, the other continues to ensure the incomparableness of the air defense system.

    In general, Russia should take this experience into account and create a similar system.

    Carapace with 12 missiles in B / K and without AGSN, nervously smokes on the sidelines.

    We are very lucky that ISIS did not think of such a massive one against our base in Khmeimim.

    They would have guessed, such sponsors were not easy.
    About
    # so that each interceptor missile hits its target and there is no such thing that several interceptor missiles attack one missile? #, the whole point is this:
    Battle Management & Weapon Control (BMC) from imPrest Systems.
  • TatarinSSSR
    TatarinSSSR 22 May 2021 10: 27
    0
    A wildly stretched article, a lot of repetitions of the same thing, only with rearranged words in a sentence. No specifics on the weapons themselves, many contradictory conclusions of the author. It was like a 5th grade schoolboy wrote an article - a short essay on the Palestinian-Israeli conflict and the role of the IDF missile defense system in it ...