Military Review

"I have a kilogram of a sword, please!"

115
"I have a kilogram of a sword, please!"

Knights are very effective at slashing each other with swords. Manuscript "History Julius Caesar ", 1325-1350. Naples, Italy. British Library, London


"... Each took his sword and boldly attacked the city."
(Genesis 34: 25)

History weapons. This material appeared spontaneously. I just met on VO a remark about waving an eight-kilogram sword. Well, I wanted to tell you once again about how much this weapon, which was popular in the Middle Ages (and in ancient times, too) actually weighed. Well, the collection of swords of the Metropolitan Museum in New York will help us in this story. All these swords can be seen in his exposition, and some are kept in storerooms.


Bronze sword of the 73th century BC e. Central Europe. Length: 61 cm; blade length 5,7 cm; blade width 935,5 cm; weight 1 g. That is, less than a kilogram. Of course, you can overlay the handle with wood and wrap it in leather. Then it will just make it up to XNUMX kg.

The first swords appeared very early. And they made them from bronze. It was convenient, although not entirely. Because at first only a blade was cast from metal, and only then a wooden handle was attached to it. Experience has shown that this design does not allow chopping blows. As a result, both the handle and the blade began to be cast as a single unit. Such swords could both chop and stab. Armies armed with such weapons became massive.


Bronze sword. China, V-IV centuries. BC e. The handle is missing a pommel. Dimensions: length 46,7 cm; blade width 5,7 cm; weight 734,3 g.

Kingdoms were built with bronze swords. Moreover, in one, the most famous among us - ancient Egyptian, the army was completely armed with bronze swords and daggers.


New Kingdom Sword, Dynasty 18, early c. 1550-1458 BC e. Upper Egypt, Thebes, Assasif, courtyard CC 41, pit 3, burial D 1, next to or on an inner coffin, excavated in 1915–1916. Material: copper alloy. Dimensions: length 52 cm. Weight not specified, but hardly heavier than Chinese.


Casting and then forging in Europe were the Celts. Their swords in the XNUMXst century. BC e. were often bimetallic. That is, they had an iron blade, but a handle cast from bronze. The collection of the Metropolitan Museum of Art in New York has a very interesting example of such a sword, and together with a scabbard.


Sword and scabbard, approx. 60 BC e. This magnificent anthropomorphic Celtic sword is one of the best preserved. The beautifully modeled head that ends in the hilt is one of the finest surviving depictions of a Celtic warrior. Most likely, such a form of it should have had a talismanic meaning. The face is distinguished by large almond-shaped eyes, and the head has omega-shaped and neatly drawn hair. Although the scabbard has merged with the iron blade, the exquisitely crafted hilt makes it a striking testament to the technical ability of the Celts, the mighty conquerors of ancient Europe. The dimensions of the sword are 49,8 x 6,7 x 2,2 cm. For some reason, the weight is not indicated.

Such swords are of a type associated with the La Tene culture, named after an important Celtic monument on Lake Neuchâtel in present-day Switzerland and eastern France. Other anthropomorphic swords from various finds in France, Ireland and the British Isles show us the widespread distribution of the Celts throughout Europe.

However, already in the VI century BC. e. in Europe, they knew how to process iron and make swords from it. One such sword was found by archaeologists on the island of Cyprus.


Here is this sword. The blade was forged from either iron or possibly steel, but is now almost completely mineralized. Remains of traces of a wooden scabbard, possibly covered with leather. On the handle of the blade, the shank was edged with silver and lined with ivory. The only surviving rivet is bronze with a silver head. Period: Archaic period II. Materials: iron, silver and bronze. Dimensions: length 59,4 cm.


Not all swords in Europe, particularly in Greece and Spain, were straight. Known sword falcata or mahaira, dating back to the V-IV centuries. BC e. Found in Greece. Dimensions: length 54,6 cm, weight 0,7 kg

In the East, the rulers of the Sassanian period (224–651 AD) were almost always depicted with a sword suspended from their belt, the motive of a winner in battle. The swords were made of iron with wooden sheaths, which were covered with metal, and, in particular, among the rulers, they were always gold. Such swords were borrowed by the Sassanids from the Hunnic nomads who roamed Europe and Asia in the sixth and seventh centuries, shortly before the beginning of the Islamic era. They had a long and narrow handle with two finger rests, and the scabbard had a pair of U-shaped protrusions, to which two straps of different lengths were originally attached. The straps held the sword suspended from the warrior's belt in such a way that he could easily pull it out, even while sitting on horseback.


Sword and scabbard, approx. XII century A.D. e. Sassanian Iran. The sword itself is encrusted with grenades and colored glass, and the surface is decorated with a pattern of overlapping feathers. The fact that a similar pattern can be seen on the helmet of the Sassanian warrior led scientists to speculate that it may be a symbol of the Zoroastrian god of victory, Verethragna. Several other swords of this type are known, some of which are mounted in gold trim, some in silver. Stylistically and technically, they are all very similar, although this example is by far the most beautiful. Materials: iron, gold (wood), garnets, glass, gilded bronze. Dimensions: length 100,3 cm


Japanese iron sword with a bronze pommel of the Kofun era, 300-710. Dimensions: length 96,5 cm; blade width 7,3 cm.

In Europe in the VIII century, the empire of Charlemagne was formed and the "Carolingian Renaissance" began. His warriors were dressed in chain mail and in scaly shells - horsemen who terrified their contemporaries with their iron armor and weapons. In addition to the long spear with a winged tip, their weapons were the long "Carolingian swords", which became European weapons for more than a century. They had a relatively small crosshair, a straight blade and a mushroom-shaped flat top.


"Carolingian Sword" from the Metropolitan Museum of Art in New York. The blade is most likely lenticular. Materials: steel, gold, silver. Dimensions: length 93,3 cm, blade length 80,6 cm, blade width 9,2 cm, weight 1048,9 g

The swords of the Vikings, the northern pirates who kept the whole of Europe in fear for more than two centuries, were carefully studied and classified by Jan Petersen, whose classification to this day is perhaps the best basis for their study. For his fundamental scientific work "Norwegian Swords of the Viking Age" (1919), he studied 1772 swords, of which 1240 were typologized. So when, as often happens with us, it comes to the fact that, they say, "all this is fake", it is clear that such an amount of rusty metal is simply impossible to forge, and most importantly - there is absolutely no need, since they are all found on the territory of Norway, although some also ended up in Sweden and Finland.


Viking sword, 95,9th century The sword is distinguished by an ornate hilt and a welded blade, indicating that it was worn by a high-ranking warrior, perhaps a Viking chieftain or a noble franc. The braided copper wires on the pommel give it an elegant look and at the same time indicate a high level of metalworking. The blade was forged from intertwined steel and iron rods. This technology has resulted in a strong yet resilient blade with a characteristic twisted pattern on the surface. Such blades were prized for both their practical and decorative qualities. Dimensions: length 81 cm; blade length 11 cm; blade width 1021 cm; weight XNUMX g.

However, we are now least of all interested in the statements of the Novokhronolozhites, how many are the length and weight of the blades. So, the longest of the found swords (and the only one) has a blade length of 90,7 cm. All other swords are shorter. The heaviest samples weighed about 1,5 kg: 1,443 kg, 1,511 kg, and one just 1,9 kg. But the lightest weighed from 0,727 to 0,976 kg. At the same time, the length of the handle of 435 swords was from 8,5 to 10 cm. And there were those in which it was 8–8,5 cm. That is, the hands of men of that time were smaller than they are now, and the men themselves were also smaller in stature than modern ones. What are their swords in 8 kilograms?


Before us is a classic knightly sword of the early XII-XIII centuries, entirely made of steel. The long crosshair and pommel in the form of a paranus - a southern nut, all this corresponds to another typology of European swords - the typology of Ewart Oakshott, who received the honorary nickname "master of swords" for his research in this area. Sword length 95,9 cm; blade length 81,6 cm; crosshair width 17,1 cm.Weight 1158 g


And this is his handle in close-up.


French sword of the XIII century. Length 91,8 cm; blade length 75,6 cm; crosshair width 13 cm, weight 850,5 g


To lighten the weight of the blade, the valleys on it are wide. Even the mark of the master who made it is visible.


Italian sword of the XIV-XV centuries. Dimensions: length 104,4 cm; blade length 88,3 cm; crosshair width 17,5 cm; weight 1219 g

With the advent of solid forged armor, cutting swords gradually turned into stabbing ones, because it became almost impossible to cut through such armor, but there was hope to pierce. In addition, it was possible to get into the joints between the plates of the armor. Some swords therefore even stopped sharpening. For what? When the injection became their main task!


British sword of 1500 type "one and a half hands". A blade with a rhombic cross-section, designed for stabbing. The crosshair is S-shaped. There are two annular stops on the handle. Materials: steel, silver, leather. Dimensions: length 116,2 cm; blade length 86,5 cm; crosshair width 21,6 cm; weight 1190,7 g

One and a half-handed swords could be used by both infantrymen and horsemen, who usually carried them at the saddle on the left. Their main task in battle was to help the rider fend off the infantrymen, but in a knightly duel it was also an indispensable thing - in fact, it was a universal sword, light enough for them to swordsmanship, but heavy to hit a soldier dressed in armor. They were also called bastard swords ...


"A sword and a half hands" around 1500-1525. Germany. Materials: steel, leather, wood. Dimensions: length 127,6 cm; blade length 96 cm; weight 1814 g


Its hilt ...


But this is a very interesting French sword "with a ring". OK. 1500 g. Dimensions: length 101 cm; blade length 85.1 cm; crosshair width 23.3 cm; weight 1190.7 g. The ring at the crosshair was required in order to protect the finger, which was inserted into it. With such a sword, it was possible to inflict both chopping and stabbing blows, like a rapier. It was from these swords, by the way, that they went ...

But we will tell about this type of cold steel some other time ...
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  1. Catfish
    Catfish April 23 2021 05: 15
    +8
    mortu myrbod with hesVV

    Side as always! )))))))))) (see above)

    All with good morning and new Shpakovsky!
    Enjoy reading and good mood.))
    1. Korsar4
      Korsar4 April 23 2021 06: 27
      +10
      Good morning, Constantine!

      Try it!

      Yet any system has an advantage in presentation over scattered facts and photographs.

      A little more - and I will take a step towards how to present it correctly.
    2. The leader of the Redskins
      The leader of the Redskins April 23 2021 06: 35
      +9
      And good morning to you!
      Vyacheslav Olegovich! Someone has a kilogram of a sword, and we still have a couple of "kilograms" of your interesting articles!)) smile
      1. kalibr
        April 23 2021 10: 09
        +3
        For this, Nazarius, the matter will not be!
        1. Warrior-80
          Warrior-80 April 27 2021 16: 59
          0
          I wonder how little weight, almost a meter long piece of iron, weighs like a bottle of kefir
      2. Aleksandr1971
        Aleksandr1971 April 23 2021 18: 10
        +2
        I liked the article.

        But the Persian sword of the XNUMXth century, Sassanian Iran, is strange, despite the fact that the Arabs finished with the Sassanids in the XNUMXth century.
        1. kalibr
          April 27 2021 18: 31
          0
          I can not say anything. I copied what was there from the "passport". I didn't even think about the content. Just translated!
    3. Olgovich
      Olgovich April 23 2021 09: 44
      +2
      Quote: Sea Cat
      mortu myrbod with hesVV

      Myrdob mortu, Konstantin! hi

      Vyacheslav Olegovich made an interesting emphasis on the weight of swords.

      The heaviest fighting swords, as far as I know, were the Swiss zweichanders, and ceremonial swords are several times heavier than them.
      1. Catfish
        Catfish April 23 2021 09: 51
        +5
        Myrdob mortu, Andrey! smile

        I am the most complete layman in this cold place, I better read what knowledgeable people write. drinks
      2. novel66
        novel66 April 23 2021 13: 07
        +5
        it seems that the executioners were heavy and mercury was poured into them
        1. Gaersul
          Gaersul 7 May 2021 20: 25
          0
          Quote: novel xnumx
          it seems that the executioners were heavy and mercury was poured into them

          Good evenings. It probably looked something like this.
          But seriously, how do you think such a thing can be made?
          1. novel66
            novel66 11 May 2021 08: 00
            +2
            offhand - two or three methods
            1. Daddy pig
              Daddy pig 2 October 2021 07: 06
              0
              Methods in the studio !! Necessarily with photo or video evidence)
              1. novel66
                novel66 4 October 2021 16: 19
                0
                learn to work with your hands
                1. Daddy pig
                  Daddy pig 8 October 2021 00: 11
                  0
                  I prefer the head. And you learn to be responsible for the words, and not to scatter unfounded statements, dear.
                  "Said A, talk to B
                  "The man is responsible for the bazaar
                  ...
                  Well, further down the list))
                  But seriously, what's the problem with throwing off a couple of links "offhand" if you are so familiar with these methods?
                  1. novel66
                    novel66 8 October 2021 08: 07
                    0
                    I made more than 30 different knives with my own hands, the technologies and methods are familiar to me, to do something on camera (especially such a crocus) just to amuse your curiosity in my bastard, to be honest
      3. gsev
        gsev April 27 2021 02: 13
        -1
        Quote: Olgovich
        The heaviest fighting swords

        Heavy swords are caused by the backwardness of metallurgy and the militia level army. Apparently Chiang Kai Shi threw his infantry, often armed with only heavy swords and grenades, to counterattack the Japanese. Apparently these swords were the heaviest.
  2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
    Kote Pan Kokhanka April 23 2021 05: 18
    +11
    Few! Criminally little about iron !!! Who, like in folk tales "drank honey beer down his mustache, it did not get into his mouth" laughing
    I propose to "punish" Vyacheslav Olegovich by continuing the cycle !!!
    Good day everyone, a special thank you for the article, with respect to Kota!
    1. kalibr
      April 23 2021 06: 01
      +11
      Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
      Few! Criminally little about iron !!!

      So after all, there is little information. There is a very detailed book by Petersen - it is boring to retell it, but not interesting to read it. There are Oakeshott in different forms, but there are many personal impressions, and the specifics are mainly his famous typology and its explanation. It is also given in the book by Laible, and ... all this is retold by him quite well, but to collect a photo for each sword is an impossible task. So it's not that simple!
      1. Undecim
        Undecim April 23 2021 08: 35
        +7
        Few! Criminally little about iron !!!

        ...
        So after all, there is little information.

        If we describe swords in terms of typology, then yes, boring, monotonous and uninteresting. And if you go from the side of physics and technology?
        1. kalibr
          April 23 2021 08: 37
          +6
          Quote: Undecim
          And if you go from the side of physics and technology?

          This is the wrong address!
          1. Undecim
            Undecim April 23 2021 08: 49
            +7
            This is the wrong address!

            These are the times! How to create weapons of the future using unique unknown technologies, so at the address. And if the distant past, studied and tested, is not at the right place.
            1. kalibr
              April 23 2021 10: 07
              +5
              That's right, dear Viktor Nikolaevich! You should have noticed that I have all the weapons of the future made of "bricks" that work separately. I am not concerned with the technology of their work. I have one technology - to connect them correctly. And the technology of forging the same sword is the "brick" itself. You need to climb into it ... This requires special knowledge.
              1. Undecim
                Undecim April 23 2021 11: 00
                +4
                Special knowledge is needed in any case. For example, knowledge of the fundamentals of the theory and design of gears allows you to confidently put an end to the use of these as such a "brick" as a barrel.
                1. kalibr
                  April 23 2021 11: 04
                  +4
                  Quote: Undecim
                  as such a "brick" as a trunk.

                  There was a US patent for this, with differences from my system. Our patentee and a very experienced engineer told me that he would "work". And I don't need anything else.
                  1. Undecim
                    Undecim April 23 2021 11: 15
                    +5
                    The presence of a patent does not yet mean operability. And the assurance that "it will work" raises very strong doubts that the engineer studied the above theory.
                    1. kalibr
                      April 23 2021 13: 34
                      +6
                      Quote: Undecim
                      the engineer studied the above theory.

                      Everyone is content with what God has sent him. He sent me the head of the Department of Descriptive Geometry and the author of ... well, a lot of inventions. So in the absence of a stamp, we write in simple! I cannot assess the level of his competence.
          2. mr.ZinGer
            mr.ZinGer April 23 2021 10: 17
            +4
            Vyacheslav Olegovich!
            Subterfuge will not help !!!
            We are waiting, sir !!!
    2. Korsar4
      Korsar4 April 23 2021 06: 28
      +11
      As in a joke about a Russian: I'll drink three, because I don't go without mine.
      1. depressant
        depressant April 23 2021 08: 49
        +5
        And if you describe the history of some famous sword? In "Secrets of the XX century" I happened to read the stories of famous diamonds and emeralds - incredibly interesting! For example, Shah and Hope diamonds.
        1. kalibr
          April 23 2021 10: 04
          +4
          So after all, there are very few of them, such famous swords, dear Lyudmila Yakovlevna. And there is little information on them. Do you think I would not write in "Secrets"? Would have written material ...
          1. depressant
            depressant April 23 2021 10: 19
            +3
            Yes, at least one at a time. They wrote about the Sphinxes - about some, but the people threw how many. Do not hesitate, we will throw in more wassat good )))))
            1. kalibr
              April 23 2021 11: 06
              +5
              It's easy to throw in. Difficult to write!
              1. depressant
                depressant April 23 2021 12: 10
                +4
                For you, master?))) Let me not believe it!
        2. Korsar4
          Korsar4 April 23 2021 10: 43
          +7
          Ivan Tsarevich is urgently wanted for a detailed report on the storage conditions of the sword-kladenets.

          Were the storage conditions observed in the secured safe?

          Reported by Kashchei.
  3. Lech from Android.
    Lech from Android. April 23 2021 06: 35
    +6
    Beautiful blades ... but extremely long, in tight melee, short swords from the era of the Roman Empire are more interesting.
    Apparently, the Europeans loved duel fights more than a fight in a dense crowd.
    1. kalibr
      April 23 2021 06: 37
      +11
      Quote: Lech from Android.
      Apparently the Europeans loved duel fights more than a dense crowd.

      They didn't love. They just weren't trained! Unlike the legionnaires of Rome!
    2. Lynx2000
      Lynx2000 April 23 2021 07: 13
      +12
      Quote: Lech from Android.
      Beautiful blades ... but extremely long, in tight melee, short swords from the era of the Roman Empire are more interesting.
      Apparently, the Europeans loved duel fights more than a fight in a dense crowd.

      There were few people ... You can't build all of them in a phalanx or maniple with a dense formation and discipline.
      In such constructions, you cannot wave a Carolingian sword.
      1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
        Kote Pan Kokhanka April 23 2021 08: 31
        +7
        In such constructions, you cannot wave a Carolingian sword.

        For this, the Greeks of Hellas had mykhra, the Thracians had a fulcata, the Romans had a gladius, and cattle had a Saxon!
        1. Lynx2000
          Lynx2000 April 23 2021 08: 43
          +7
          Roman legionnaires still fought in a dense formation in maniples, and the blows with the sword were stabbing. Is Mahaira like a copy? The hoplites also seemed to have a straight, double-edged sword.
          In the early Middle Ages, all the same, the armies were not numerous, the tactics were: line up in a line in several rows, front to the enemy, running "march-march" towards the enemy, the battle itself rather resembled a dump with fights without the support of "fellow soldiers" on the left and right.

          I'm wondering, in ancient-ancient times, as such, there was no division into hunting and military weapons. Do swords come from knives and daggers? I heard that the ancient Egyptian khopesh traces its origin from Mesopotamia. In Sumer, this form of a sword was a sign of the royal power of the ruler of the city-state, and, supposedly, the ancestor of such a sword was a sickle.
          1. kalibr
            April 23 2021 10: 01
            +5
            I had an article here about ancient swords-rapiers, as well as knives ... But it's hard to search. There was an article in the journal Science and Technology (Ukraine). You can search and see them.
            1. Lynx2000
              Lynx2000 April 23 2021 12: 55
              +2
              Quote: kalibr
              I had an article here about ancient swords-rapiers, as well as knives ... But it's hard to search. There was an article in the journal Science and Technology (Ukraine). You can search and see them.

              Thank you! Was reading. For rapiers and armor of the Achaeans of the Bronze Age I read earlier ...
          2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
            Kote Pan Kokhanka April 23 2021 10: 21
            +8
            Quote: Lynx2000
            In the early Middle Ages, all the same, the armies were not numerous, the tactics were: line up in a line in several rows, front to the enemy, running "march-march" towards the enemy, the battle itself rather resembled a dump with fights without the support of "fellow soldiers" on the left and right.

            The Germanic tribes used the "wall of shields" everywhere. In fact, an ancient Greek phalanx in three rows.
            The Saxons used the formation of the "hedgehog" or "spear hedgehog" against the cavalry. The Normans added "infantry wedge", "pig" to the fighting techniques. These are all dense constructions. So to the long sword and battle ax, the sax (short sword) was a must. In most cases, he was the only weapon of the war, with the exception of the spear.
            1. Lynx2000
              Lynx2000 April 23 2021 13: 30
              +4
              Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka

              The Germanic tribes used the "wall of shields" everywhere. In fact, an ancient Greek phalanx in three rows.
              The Saxons used the formation of the "hedgehog" or "spear hedgehog" against the cavalry. The Normans added "infantry wedge", "pig" to the fighting techniques. These are all dense constructions. So to the long sword and battle ax, the sax (short sword) was a must. In most cases, he was the only weapon of the war, with the exception of the spear.

              Not certainly in that way. Most likely, the tactics of the battle changed. Earlier, at the first meeting of the Romans with the Germanic tribes west of the Rhine, as Tacitus described (probably from the words of Caesar), the Sueb tribes (if I am not mistaken) who received land from the Gauls (the Germanic tribes served as mercenaries for them) used the following tactics:
              They attacked the legionnaires with several wedges "Sinya" as the Germans called it: a boar's head. The most trained (famous) warriors walked (fled) in the forefront.
              The Romans withstood the onslaught, bypassing from the flanks, the maniples of the Romans squeezed the German soldiers into the "cauldron", the Germans began to retreat, trembled, and ran.
              The tactics of the Germanic tribes were based on the initial onslaught, if the enemy wavered as a result of hand-to-hand combat, ran, pursuit developed. Otherwise, the Germans retreated.
              Defensive technique: "wall of shields", most likely was adopted from the Romans. Since Europe of the Early Middle Ages and earlier in the time of Caesar was mainly a forest, the tactics of battle were appropriate, without dense rows of phalanxes, ambushes, rapid onslaught in dense groups, pursuit or retreat. The cavalry was rare and expensive.
              In the era of the Early Middle Ages, in addition to the invasion of the Huns, the main combat unit was still the infantry, and the warriors who owned a war horse and sword (foot) were wealthy, or skillful fighters (heroes), members of the squad (king, duke, rex).
              The main warriors were free tillers, they did not have swords, only shields, spears, darts, battle axes, which the future warrior mastered as a boy in everyday life hunting, preparing firewood and hay.
              Sword skills required different skills.
              Scramasak or Saxon, short sword or long dagger (knife), depending on how you look at it, pessimistic or optimistic ... wink If I were an adult son of a farmer in those days, having a shield, a spear, a pair of darts, an ax at the "gathering" of the leader on a military campaign (raid), I would consider the Saxon a short sword.
              1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
                Kote Pan Kokhanka April 23 2021 13: 37
                +3
                Tacitus is still a late empire, not an early Middle Ages.
                1. Lynx2000
                  Lynx2000 April 23 2021 13: 39
                  +3
                  yes So I wrote "Earlier", in the time of Caesar, in the early Middle Ages.
                  Keyword "Earlier" wink ...
          3. cat Rusich
            cat Rusich April 24 2021 04: 18
            +2
            Quote: Lynx2000

            I'm wondering, in ancient-ancient times, as such, there was no division into hunting and military weapons. Do swords come from knives and daggers? ...
            My opinion.
            The first rapier swords were needed when the "professional attack army" appeared. A long blade was needed to overcome the protection of the "commoners" with knives.
            bronze sword crete

            When the "defense army" with armor and shields appeared, which fought not one by one, but in formation - the sword began to shorten and reached the classical length of the ancient world, and with the advent and spread of iron, swords began to be made of iron, but their length remained the same.
            The Celts who fought in a "crowd", and not in formation, were armed with long iron swords. The Romans who fought in the ranks did not change the length of the blades.
            bronze sword table
            soldier
        2. Lech from Android.
          Lech from Android. April 23 2021 08: 46
          +3
          An interesting topic in general is the relationship between the type and form of weapons and the conditions for their use, a different approach to the conduct of hostilities and the formation of battle formations of the fighting sides. what
          Vyacheslav, could you expand on this topic? hi
          1. kalibr
            April 23 2021 10: 02
            +4
            Quote: Lech from Android.
            could you expand on this topic?

            This should be a separate and very extensive cycle.
    3. Trilobite Master
      Trilobite Master April 23 2021 10: 32
      +8
      Quote: Lech from Android.
      short swords from the era of the Roman Empire.

      The Romans also had long swords - spatas. Used in the cavalry. The Carolingians descended from them.
      In general, you should always remember that the sword is a status weapon, not a mass weapon, especially in the Early Middle Ages. Mass weapons were spears, axes, clubs - they were the ones used to clarify the relationship between groups of armed people - this is both cheaper and more practical.
      1. kalibr
        April 23 2021 11: 07
        +5
        Men are swords, men (little men) are axes!
        1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
          Kote Pan Kokhanka April 23 2021 11: 29
          +4
          Quote: Trilobite Master
          In general, you should always remember that the sword is a status weapon, not a mass weapon, especially in the Early Middle Ages.

          Good day Michael!
          There are exceptions to every rule. For example, francis (throwing axes) francs. And this is in the presence of solid Carolingians.
          An ax, a mace, a club - they beat with a status weapon among many peoples.
          1. Trilobite Master
            Trilobite Master April 23 2021 15: 04
            +4
            Greetings, Vlad.
            Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
            An ax, a mace, a club - they beat with a status weapon among many peoples.

            Yes of course. Remember, at least our voivodship six-man, or first. Ukraine still has a "presidential mace".
            In Japan, for a long time, the bow was generally considered a status weapon of the samurai. I was talking about Europe.
        2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
          Kote Pan Kokhanka April 23 2021 11: 34
          +3

          Valashka, a status weapon of the peoples of the Carpathian region.
        3. Trilobite Master
          Trilobite Master April 23 2021 13: 26
          +8
          I think so.
          The sword is a weapon of a professional warrior, they definitely had to learn to wield it, otherwise it is simply useless. In inept hands, a mace or an ax, as well as a spear, are much more effective.
          In addition, the sword is an expensive and "delicate" weapon. Pounding them on enemy shields is not only useless, but also costly. Doing the same with brodex is both cheaper and much more efficient.
          The sword is effective when used from a horse, or in loose formation, but even here it is inferior in efficiency to a spear.
          Conclusion: the sword was received only by the richest or most skilled warriors and used as a weapon "in the second slot", that is, not the main one, but an auxiliary one. And the main use of the sword is to certify the status of its owner. smile Therefore, swords were also placed in the graves - as an accompanying document to the next world. Passport type. smile
        4. hohol95
          hohol95 April 24 2021 13: 47
          +2
          And also scythes, flails and all sorts of fighting flails ...
          But the katsbalgers of the landsknechts were "gladiuses of the Renaissance"!
          They are just as short, but they weighed from 1300 grams to almost 2 kilograms.
          It turns out that the Landsknechts were larger and stronger than the Roman legionaries ...
      2. Korsar4
        Korsar4 April 23 2021 14: 54
        +4
        Of course, the status. I wonder what it can be compared to from our time?
        1. Trilobite Master
          Trilobite Master April 23 2021 15: 15
          +3
          Quote: Korsar4
          I wonder what it can be compared to from our time?

          If in ancient times the concepts of "military glory", "wealth" (in the literal sense of the word) and "power" were practically synonymous, and the sword symbolized both at the same time, now everything is not so. Each of these concepts needs to be selected as a separate symbol, one cannot do it in any way.
          1. Undecim
            Undecim April 23 2021 15: 23
            +6
            I wonder what it can be compared to from our time?

            "Flasher" of a special signal on the car.
            1. Trilobite Master
              Trilobite Master April 23 2021 15: 49
              +3
              A cruel joke, Victor Nikolaevich. smile
              Formally, no. The "blinker" is an attribute of power, or rather, of belonging to power. I would compare it with the golden paiza of the Mongol khan, which was issued, among other things, to the khan's messengers. smile
              Well, in practice ...
              In general, in a capitalist state, we will always have the supremacy of money. So if we approach the issue as deeply and generalized as possible, then in our states, as in most states of the world, it is the symbols that define their bearer as a rich person that will be the most respected.
              What can be such a symbol? A huge yacht? To be honest, nothing else comes to my mind. Here my imagination fails. smile
              1. Korsar4
                Korsar4 April 23 2021 21: 44
                +4
                Do not offer Ferraris and Jaguars.
              2. Richard
                Richard April 23 2021 23: 40
                +4
                What can be such a symbol? A huge yacht? To be honest, nothing else comes to my mind. Here my imagination fails.

                The symbol of the unlimited power and divine origin of the pharaoh was the image of a small snake, which was called ureus, or ureus. The snake was made of gold, colored enamels, strengthened on the forehead or at the temple on the wig, headdress or beard of the pharaoh.
                modern "ureas" look a little different
                Members of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR - the highest organ of state power in 1938-1989 wore silver, enameled badges

                On August 5, 1996, the President of the Russian Federation Boris Yeltsin issued decree No. 1138 “On the official symbols of presidential power - this is the Standard (flag) of the President of the Russian Federation, a specially made copy of the official text of the Constitution of the Russian Federation, the President's Badge and an enamelled gold lapel pin in the shape of the Russian flag
                a photo President's sign

                a photo gold lapel pin

                Modern presidents of different countries of the world also wear similar badges with the flag of their country.
            2. Korsar4
              Korsar4 April 23 2021 21: 43
              +4
              "Kin-Dza-Dza".
          2. Korsar4
            Korsar4 April 23 2021 17: 20
            +4
            Some of the maesters have remained the same.
    4. abrakadabre
      abrakadabre 8 May 2021 11: 18
      0
      in tight melee, short swords from the era of the Roman Empire are more interesting.
      Which empire is this? If the 4th-5th centuries A.D. then the infantry was without exception armed with spatami - quite long one-handed swords.
      Apparently, the Europeans loved duel fights more than a fight in a dense crowd.
      Europeans were more cavalry - knights. Throughout all the Middle Ages. Working with a short knife from the saddle is an extremely dubious occupation.
      As at the end of the Middle Ages - the beginning of the New Time, sane infantry appeared, so relatively short blades immediately returned to mass use. Truth as an auxiliary weapon. Because with a blade against a halberd and a pike, you can't fight much.
  4. 3x3zsave
    3x3zsave April 23 2021 07: 23
    +10
    I'll add swords from La Tena.

    Thank you, Vyacheslav Olegovich!
  5. 3x3zsave
    3x3zsave April 23 2021 07: 51
    +8
    And this one was found in the Penza region.

    1. kalibr
      April 23 2021 08: 30
      +13
      Drogoy Anton! Once again, by the way, thanks for the photo. And then to the sword from our region ... I have already written about this, but I will repeat myself. In the Regional Museum of Local Lore there was a stand - "the grave of the Mordovians". And there on the "chest" on copper green plates lay an amazing light gray disc with a hole. "Decoration of the Mordovians". Then the stand was dismantled. And I managed to turn this disc in my hands. And it turned out that this is the pommel of a Sarmatian sword. I sketched it, took it to show it to Gorelik. He confirmed: the pommel. That is, someone from the Mordovians, a long, long time ago, breaking the grave of the Sarmatians extracted this disc from it and ... hung it around his woman's neck. A completely random find. And for how many years it would have been considered an adornment, if not for my interest in Sarmatian swords and my acquaintance with Gorelik. How random everything is in this world!
      1. mr.ZinGer
        mr.ZinGer April 23 2021 10: 22
        +2
        An enchanting story, and how many parallels and associations appear at once.
      2. Vlad world
        Vlad world April 23 2021 11: 15
        +1
        Damn, what a wonderful example of a lie, unknown or special, does not matter. And an accidental exposure by a "specialist". Because he was interested in a certain topic. And the specialization is probably different. How interesting in the light of the statements of some about the right of only "specialists" to assert the truth. "
        Well, it's just that - a remark. Not related to the topic of the article, quite interesting.
        1. kalibr
          April 23 2021 11: 22
          +2
          Quote: Vlad-world
          And the specialization is probably different.

          And what does the other mean? Diploma or PhD? Or is it nailed to a person? And if he has been dealing with the topic since 1995 and he has several monographs on it in peer-reviewed publications and articles in the journals of the Higher Attestation Commission. Whereas? Is this a specialization?
          1. Vlad world
            Vlad world April 23 2021 20: 53
            +1
            That you are so horny. If at the moment of inspecting the "decoration" you were a Swords Specialist, that is, you had a Swords Specialization, then you would not have gone to Gorelik. According to your data, you had an Interest at that time. If after some time (at least 5 years) you have dealt with this issue, then you have acquired a specialization in this issue. But other people you refuse to have your opinion because they do not have a specialization in some issues due to the lack of - a diploma, Ph.D. and monographs. Although they have been dealing with these issues for over 10 years. Yes, and in some monographs and books written by candidates and doctors of sciences in history, sometimes such nonsense is written that, as they say, the ears wither.
            Not so long ago, a Ph.D. in an article - in a peer-reviewed journal - wrote such nonsense.
            1. kalibr
              April 23 2021 21: 10
              +1
              Quote: Vlad-world
              Not so long ago, a Ph.D. in an article - in a peer-reviewed journal - wrote such nonsense.

              That is, one wrote, then all are bad? The level of specialization is different, is it really not clear. And why did you decide that I am denying something to someone? Have an opinion, have what you want, you cannot forbid anyone to be interested. It's just that there is no need to blame unfamiliar people from the bay for lying. By the way, about the nonsense of a doctor of sciences ... if nonsense, then you need to refute him, why does he write nonsense? That is why a peer-reviewed journal!
              1. Vlad world
                Vlad world April 23 2021 21: 48
                +1
                Yes, not one wrote, many have written and are writing. But from the bay of the flounder, I do not blame anyone. Before expressing my opinion, I carefully study and ponder this issue. And I ask questions only if I know the answer. With a probability of two nines after the decimal point.
                And he writes nonsense exactly within the framework of the official interpretation of history. One historical character of our history lived and was treated for one disease by the means that were in those days. By the way, this remedy is currently Recommended to alleviate the course of this disease. But alas, he died of this disease. And the author of the article writes that he was poisoned. And so on little things. You see, there is a mention-assumption about poisoning.
                Well, a couple of questions - is it possible to brew tea to the state of Liquid Clay.
                And what is pastry food.
                Of course I know the answers.
                1. kalibr
                  April 25 2021 06: 54
                  0
                  Quote: Vlad-world
                  Well, a couple of questions - is it possible to brew tea to the state of Liquid Clay.
                  And what is pastry food.

                  If the question is to me, then to the wrong address. I have never studied this.
                  1. Vlad world
                    Vlad world April 25 2021 22: 03
                    0
                    Yes, you don't need to do this, just one author (doctor in history), commenting on the message (in his book) that one person in the morning ate food similar to Liquid Clay, wrote that it was brewed tiled tea. There was one in the USSR. And it's just - Kissel, liquid jelly.
                    A-pasty food is just Thick Kissel
                    And a person who is forced to constantly use different consistencies of Kissel is a person suffering from a stomach ulcer. Of varying degrees of severity. Well, what happens when an ulcer perforates, I think you can guess. And they wrote in the article that the person was poisoned.
                    And this is just an example of how two different people carry different Delusions based on one Source.
      3. Korsar4
        Korsar4 April 23 2021 14: 55
        +3
        This is better than he would have fitted the decoration instead of the pommel.

        However, it was always possible to sell.
  6. 3x3zsave
    3x3zsave April 23 2021 08: 02
    +6

    Sword. West Galstadt culture, XNUMXth century BC
    1. kalibr
      April 23 2021 08: 32
      +6
      By the way, this characteristic "crap" at the end of the scabbard is very similar to the "crap" from the scabbard of Assyrian swords, only those have rapier blades. What? After the defeat of Assyria, her masters fled to the West, to the forests? Or is this an accidental similarity?
      1. Catfish
        Catfish April 23 2021 09: 30
        +4
        Good morning, Vyacheslav. smile
        I never found an Assyrian sword with a "rapier blade". request


        1. kalibr
          April 23 2021 09: 56
          +4
          Below is a khopesh - an Egyptian sword. Above is Scythian. And here he is above. The reliefs from Nineveh are clearly visible.
        2. Mihaylov
          Mihaylov April 23 2021 12: 21
          +5
          Quote: Sea Cat
          I never found the Assyrian sword

          There is no Assyrian now, there is a good Acheminid one, will you take it? wassat
          1. Catfish
            Catfish April 24 2021 02: 11
            +3
            For lack of a stamp ... Wrap up! good drinks
      2. Andobor
        Andobor April 23 2021 12: 22
        +2
        Quote: kalibr
        After the defeat of Assyria, her masters fled to the West, to the forests? Or is this an accidental similarity?

        I think the masters are not in the business, but the similarity cannot be accidental, such "baubles" are not accidental. The reason is in the same way of wearing a long cutting sword - the sword dangled freely, but very high, without touching the legs. In order to pull it out, the scabbard had to be fixed by grabbing the wing of the end attachment, or simply by catching it on the elbow, leg or side of the chariot.

        Why at the early European stage the wearing method was so unambiguously not clear, it is necessary to understand, technological reasons, tactical, perhaps it was a chariot method, and the Assyrians and Haldstattans had them, while the earlier and later chariot long swords did not.
      3. 3x3zsave
        3x3zsave April 23 2021 13: 01
        +3
        If I'm not mistaken, this "crap" is called a buterol.
  7. Ua3qhp
    Ua3qhp April 23 2021 09: 21
    +1
    Quote: Lynx2000
    Sumerian sword of this form was a sign of the royal power of the ruler of the city-state, and, supposedly, the ancestor of such a sword was a sickle.

    And a descendant of a kukri?
  8. pytar
    pytar April 23 2021 09: 53
    +8
    Not all swords in Europe, particularly in Greece and Spain, were straight. Known sword falcata or mahaira, dating back to the V-IV centuries. BC e. Found in Greece. Dimensions: length 54,6 cm, weight 0,7 kg


    The sword shown in the photo is not Greek. This is the standard weapon for the Thracians. mahaira... They were armed with him without exception. Thracian name „Skalme" or „Sika“. The primary translation means sacrificial knife... Mention is made of Tukidida, who calls the Thracians the inhabited mountains of the Rhodope massif "Mahayrofori", and also Omir mentions this sword among the Thracians. Hundreds of such swords have been found on the territory of Bulgaria.

    Photo of a Thracian iron makaira from a museum in Sofia.


    The weapon was considered very dangerous, because due to its shape, it received more kinetic energy during a shearing strike.

    Geta makaira.


    The most dangerous variant of the macaira was considered ROMTHE, which the Thracians used in parallel with the macaira. It is an elongated and with a large curvature, sickle-shaped makaira, which was held with 2 hands. There was a rhomfei in the right form. There are also rhomfei with a more pronounced cuckoo shape at the end of the tip.





    Romphei were made of iron. Total length approx. 120 - 140 cm., Handle approx. 40 - 60 cm.
    The Romans noted that in the battles with the Thracians, if they were allowed to pass in close combat, these crawling out with the Romphei hit the Romans in the back area of ​​the shoulders, or pulled the legionnaire out of action like a cook. Therefore, the Romans tried to keep the Thracian fighters at a distance, firing volleys of pilums at them. After meeting with the Thracians, the Romans drew their conclusions and upgraded the armor of the Roman legionary, strengthening the protection of the back of the shoulders and upper back.
    1. kalibr
      April 23 2021 09: 58
      +6
      A very nice addition. Thank you!
      1. pytar
        pytar April 23 2021 10: 15
        +7
        Thank you for the interesting article, dear Vyacheslav! hi
        I would also like to add a few words to my commentary about macaira and rhompheus. These weapons were ideal for the tactics of the Thracians. The Thracians attacked the loose area and tried to defeat the enemy with the first blow. If the enemy held the formation and did not fall apart, the Thracians retreated and waited for a new opportunity to strike. For such a fast-paced battle, the makaira / romfei were ideal, since the fighter did not need to keep a tight formation, he had enough space around him to swing with a less frequent blow and quickly change position, if necessary. The fighting technique of the Thracian fighter was similar to the dance of the eastern martial arts. It was spectacular, which is why the Thracian gladiators were loved by the public in Rome. Example Spartacus. It was an offensive tactic, defensive tactics were not undermined, and if something did not go according to plan, they retreated quickly taking their killed and wounded with them.

        Fresco from a Thracian tomb... It can be seen how the Thracians on foot and on horseback simultaneously attack the enemy. A foot soldier holding a copy in one hand, and rompheus in the other. He doesn't have a bayonet! Stronger fighters could fight simultaneously with one makaira in both hands.
    2. vladcub
      vladcub April 23 2021 14: 14
      +4
      Boyan, thanks for the "rompheya", she reminded me of a peasant sickle. As a child, I still had to work for them.
      It seems to be simple, but with no habit, you don't work a lot and Lego cripple yourself. My great-aunt had 2 fingers missing, once in her youth she waved a sickle and .., and she worked with a sickle since childhood
      1. pytar
        pytar April 23 2021 14: 55
        +2
        Boyan, thanks for the "rompheya", she reminded me of a peasant sickle. As a child, I still had to work for them.

        Hi Svyatoslav! hi Rompheus probably comes from the sickle. The kinetics of movement is similar. Swipe and jerk to yourself.


        It seems to be simple, but with no habit, you don't work a lot and Lego cripple yourself.

        A very difficult weapon! The Thracians and Dacians have trained in ego use since childhood. The teenagers used wooden sticks tied in knots in the shape of a rhomphea. The shock mosht of such a sword is terrible. The disadvantage is that the hands are busy, there is no way to hold the bayonet. Requires freedom of movement, the sacristy is inconvenient to carry.
        In the wars with the Persians, the Thracian allies of Alexander the Great, approaching the horses of the Persian cavalry, cut their sinews.


        As for the mahaira, it is lighter and allows the wearing of a bayonet. With all that, it was made thicker than an ordinary sword, from which a blow with it could split the enemy's helmet, bayonet or sacristy.

  9. Basarev
    Basarev April 23 2021 10: 22
    0
    And what were the swords in Russia? They say a lot about the Europeans, but they are silent about the Russians.
    1. kalibr
      April 23 2021 10: 27
      +8
      Quote: Basarev
      And what were the swords in Russia? They say a lot about the Europeans, but they are silent about the Russians.

      It's a conspiracy! We, the authors, have sworn this secret not to reveal to anyone!
    2. Konnick
      Konnick April 23 2021 13: 59
      +3
      And what were the swords in Russia? They say a lot about the Europeans, but they are silent about the Russians.

      Pampering is for us laughing axes are our everything.
      The respected author is aware of the finds at the Zolotarevskoye settlement near Penza. There were found 26 axes, 2 intact sabers, 17 saber guards, 3 saber blades, 7 spearheads, 2 clubs and 1 flail. This all refers to 1237. And not a single sword. Even in modern medieval combat competitions, axes are very good compared to swords.
      1. Obliterator
        Obliterator April 23 2021 22: 42
        +1
        Quote: Konnick
        Pampering is our all axes for us.

        And heavy spears.
  10. Mihaylov
    Mihaylov April 23 2021 10: 28
    +3
    Triumph of bronze! Archaeological Museum of Athens:




    1. kalibr
      April 23 2021 11: 08
      +6
      Familiar products, but of course!
      1. Mihaylov
        Mihaylov April 23 2021 11: 29
        +4
        Quote: kalibr
        Familiar products, but of course!

        Still: the grave circle of A.
        And they saw this:
      2. paul3390
        paul3390 April 23 2021 13: 14
        +5
        Actually - the Mycenaean bronze rapiers with the characteristic fastening of the handle with rivets - proceed exactly from the same principle as in the late Middle Ages. If you look at what the heroes of the Iliad were actually wearing, we see that such armor is no less difficult to cut through than the much later knightly armor. Hence the corresponding weapon. And the manner of fighting. Stabbing blows with either a spear or a rapier.

  11. Operator
    Operator April 23 2021 11: 19
    +2
    Mahaira with a curved blade is quite an Aryan edged weapon of the 2nd millennium BC, common from the Balkans to India. The Thracians, Scythians and Indians received these weapons from the Balkan Aryans, who were part of their ethnic groups.
  12. Grim Reaper
    Grim Reaper April 23 2021 12: 07
    +3
    Well, in modern fantasy you can also find pood swords. Which "hitants" waved for half a day, leaving a mountain of corpses, on which they stood fighting back.
  13. faterdom
    faterdom April 23 2021 12: 12
    +4
    Quote: pytar
    The sword shown in the photo is not Greek. This is the standard Mahair weapon for the Thracians. They were armed with him without exception. The Thracian name is "skalme" or "sika". The primary translation means the sacrificial knife.

    Thank you, we will know that the mahairod (saber-toothed tiger) was armed with sacrificial knives.
    1. pytar
      pytar April 23 2021 12: 57
      +6
      Thank you, we will know that the mahairod (saber-toothed tiger) was armed with sacrificial knives.

      Thank you, Andrey! So I learned from you where the name of the saber-toothed tiger comes from! I asked the wiki, it really is! good
  14. Avior
    Avior April 23 2021 12: 21
    +5
    It seems that another sword has been missed. Notable albeit of contemporary work

    Total length - 122 cm, blade - 91 cm
    The sword looks smaller in the display case, in the hands it looks different.

    Here it is given as a gift
  15. faterdom
    faterdom April 23 2021 13: 25
    +1
    Quote: Avior
    It seems that another sword has been missed.

    Here, first, the name of the city must be restored, to which this sword was presented by the English king.
    This is the sword of Stalingrad, just like that!
    Or is it another sword? Roosevelt is something.
    1. Avior
      Avior April 23 2021 22: 02
      +1
      Of course, this is it.
  16. vladcub
    vladcub April 23 2021 13: 38
    +2
    "sword and scabbard, about 6o BC" even then adorned the weapon
  17. vladcub
    vladcub April 23 2021 13: 52
    +3
    "British sword 1500" amazing save. I doubt very much that then they knew how to nickel.
    There were probably several reasons that the sword survived this way.
    1. kalibr
      April 23 2021 16: 05
      +2
      Quote: vladcub
      "British sword 1500" amazing save. I doubt very much that then they knew how to nickel.

      They did not know how to nickel. They knew how to store!
  18. 3x3zsave
    3x3zsave April 23 2021 13: 59
    +3
    I just met on VO a remark about waving an eight-kilogram sword.
    For those who like to speculate about swinging an eight-kilogram sword, I suggest you first practice with the following artifact

    Headband weight - 3 kg, handle length - 82 cm.
  19. Free wind
    Free wind April 23 2021 14: 59
    +1
    Hello everyone. Swords of "Ulfberta" were often dug out of the Norwegians and they are dug up. More than a hundred swords were found, according to the dates they were produced for more than 150 years, that is, the case was put on stream, probably, something like a factory.
    1. kalibr
      April 23 2021 16: 06
      +3
      Ulfbert is a well-known brand. They were produced in large quantities and were also forged in large quantities.
  20. Illanatol
    Illanatol April 30 2021 09: 05
    0
    The best blade metal was produced in India. The very words "bulat" (more correctly, "pulat") are of Indian origin.
    And the best blades for individual combat are the Japanese katanas.
    But there is no information about this in the article. Fail.
  21. Molot1979
    Molot1979 19 May 2021 12: 26
    0
    Correct the caption to the photo with the Sassanian sword. Sassanids in the 12th century AD it has not been for many centuries.
  22. Michael
    Michael 12 July 2021 18: 16
    0
    We fought with stools, and then demobilization came running with a crowbar.