On submarines, nicknamed "black holes" by a potential enemy: a submarine excursion

It is not for nothing that the Russian submarines of Project 636 Varshavyanka, including 636.3, are called “black holes” in the camp of a potential enemy. These are some of the hardest-to-find submarines in the world. With the autonomy of the submarine for 45 days, it is able to cover a 400-mile distance while in a submerged position.

Such submarines, starting with Project 636.1, have inertial navigation systems that provide information transfer to the missile system in a submerged position. This makes it possible to better ensure the secrecy of the submarine of the Russian Naval fleet.

One of these submarines is assigned to the Novorossiysk submarine base of the Russian Black Sea Fleet. This is a multipurpose diesel-electric submarine Veliky Novgorod, which has been in service since 2016.

In the program "Military Acceptance" at the TK "Zvezda" there is an excursion around the submarine "Veliky Novgorod", it tells about the various compartments and specific rooms on board. During the excursion, the question is asked why there is a red box for smoking and incendiary devices on board the submarine, given that not only the Ministry of Health warns about the danger of smoking as such, but also the fact that smoking on board the submarine is strictly prohibited.

The answers to these and other questions regarding the service and life of submariners are in the plot:

Comments

[kapitan92]

With the autonomy of the submarine for 45 days, it is able to cover a 400-mile distance while in a submerged position.

45 days submerged ???
Maybe I didn't understand something?

[kapitan92]

Quote from rudolf

This is taking into account the use of the RDP on the periscope. The diesel engine is running, the storage batteries are being charged, the VVD is knocked out.

Well, the author of the article had to write, and I really thought it was a sinful thing, what a fig for us VNEU, every 45 days we go underwater.

[kapitan92]

Quote from rudolf

Usually "underwater autonomy" is distinguished, i.e. the time the submarine is in a submerged position without surfacing under the RDP.

How many days on this type of boat?

[kapitan92]

Thanks . I expected 3-5 days, depending on the situation.
It is curious to compare with the German p / l, 212 series, after all, somewhere in the early 2000s, they went into service.

[kapitan92]

Yeah! Everything is relative. It's sad!
One thing is good news that something is better than nothing.
Thanks for the consultation .

[dauria]

What is three days versus three weeks for a German woman?

A German or a Swedish woman walks under water for three weeks, what move? Probably still creeping. There are no miracles. Both "styling" and hydrogen cells are only slightly better than lithium batteries in terms of energy capacity. Yes, it's better than the lead ones at Varshavyanka. But in the end, all VNEUs are not worth a damn. The same slow boat, chained to position, capable of a single dash. Moreover, Varshavyanka will be able to charge at least. These are no longer there. It's easier to throw out all the stirlings and others, and give the vacated displacement for lithium batteries. An old proven solution that does not require "exclusive" base equipment, cryogenics or sophisticated expensive chemical components.

[dauria]

You just need to look on the Internet and compare those parameters of lithium batteries with other

It is necessary to compare lithium with the Stirling or with the fuel cells of the 212nd boat. And here a simple thing comes out - you carry with you an oxidizer and fuel in a ratio of 3 to 1 minus the efficiency of the heat engine itself at 30% maximum. You get a win from a gulkin's nose, and hemorrhoids with liquid oxygen or expensive disposable "batteries" (regenerate them later )
Was it in vain that the Japanese spat on this venture and filled the nine-meter additional compartment with lithium batteries, throwing out the VNEU?

[Simple]

Quote from rudolf

... And a German woman will always have 100% ...

Das UBoot - neuter and you attributed them to feminine ... About a hundred forgives - there is no perpetual motion machine. On U212 boats, it is limited by supplies of liquid oxygen and hydrogen (not in liquid form).

[Simple]

I don’t know, spend a finite amount of hydrogen and oxygen while patrolling? It's like a "strategic reserve".

[Simple]

Norway in the north, Greece, Italy, Israel and Turkey in the Mediterranean and the Black Sea. These are all bases for recharging fuel for VNEU installation U212 / 214.
(I don't take South Korea into account)

[Simple]

And then, what does "expensive" fuel cells mean?
If we are talking in the context of VNEU for Russian submarines, then the criterion "expensive" still goes to the third or fourth plan.

The first is Reliability and Safety.
The second is power.
The third is the possibility (for example) of refueling from a ship on the high seas - i.e. ease of delivery, storage and refueling itself.
And only then - the cost.

[timokhin-aa]

Asked to transfer a man with a diesel engine, he is banned on the VO. As far as the truth is, I don’t know:

She will be able to stay under water (without RDP) for a maximum of 3 days, not 5 days. And then in the silence mode, the watchmen in the bunks do not move so as not to emit CO. With the galley stoves turned off, they consume electricity comparable to the economy. On the fourth day, accumulate about 0,8% CO, almost the limit. We have an old chemical regeneration on diesel engines (based on N2H2). As in BOB, it regenerates CO2, produces O2 and water. But CO is not regenerated. There is no oxygen distribution (KDU) installation. Only on nuclear powered ships.

[timokhin-aa]

Answer:

Mixed numbers with CO and CO2

Batteries from nuclear-powered ships were installed on KSF diesel boats. After 3 years of service. Very rarely new. Hydrogen was strongly emitted, afterburning furnaces could not cope. On a diesel engine 641B of project 4 squadron of 69 brigade B-546 (commander Captain 2nd rank Simakov), in 1980 they experimented after being submerged, without the RDP, they held out for 5 days. They turned off the galley stoves, only made tea, and fried alcoholized bread. The compartments were illuminated with only two carriers. The watchmen lay in bunks. But a huge amount of garbage accumulated. every night. First of all, forced ventilation of the compartments.

From myself: For what I bought in this case, I sell for that.

[Undecim]

.On the fourth day, approximately 0,8% CO will accumulate, almost the limit
The maximum permissible concentration of CO is 0,0170%. 0,08% causes suffocation and headache, if exceeded up to 0,32%, paralysis and loss of consciousness are observed. When exposed to this concentration for 25-30 minutes, death is most likely.

[timokhin-aa]

CO2, human confused concentration.

[Undecim]

Oxygen distribution (KDU) installation
Here, it seems, too, confused. Probably it meant "air separation unit". So her DPL will not pull on energy.

[Aag]

Quote: timokhin-aa

Asked to transfer a man with a diesel engine, he is banned on the VO. As far as the truth is, I don’t know:

She will be able to stay under water (without RDP) for a maximum of 3 days, not 5 days. And then in the silence mode, the watchmen in the bunks do not move so as not to emit CO. With the galley stoves turned off, they consume electricity comparable to the economy. On the fourth day, accumulate about 0,8% CO, almost the limit. We have an old chemical regeneration on diesel engines (based on N2H2). As in BOB, it regenerates CO2, produces O2 and water. But CO is not regenerated. There is no oxygen distribution (KDU) installation. Only on nuclear powered ships.

Alexander, is it true that everything is so ... in the paddock in the Navy (submarine in particular)? Or, simply, there were no truth-takers in other troops?
Sincerely, without scruples, I am interested in your opinion. I understand that it is subjective. And it saddens that it is not far from the objective (IMHO) ...
Pleases the abundance of submariners on the site. (Perhaps, there are still plenty of tankers)
Allows you to add a more or less objective picture of the current realities of the Navy, submarine in particular ...
On the other hand, when some authors, many commentators, run into unresolved problems of "their" kind, the kind of the Armed Forces, sooner or later, something sounds like: "Yes, and hell with him, - the Strategic Missile Forces will come, - everyone will judge! will get even ... "
Outraged by this approach.
I can write a lot about the Strategic Missile Forces in the 90s, noughties ... There are judgments about the current ones, he is the division headquarters, you can see from the window ... The children of colleagues serve ... You will go for mushrooms, - to the UBSP (combat training starting positions ) you will come across ... It does not inspire ... (except that you can steal a thorn in the garden))).
To be honest, there was no doubt about the effectiveness of the weapons entrusted to the Strategic Missile Forces. However, there was no real confirmation of the effectiveness. The range, KVO, neither I nor any of my friends measured with roulettes)). EVERYTHING started! During my service 27 "Pioneers" (one with a delay), three "Poplars" ... I did not see any results. They said that it was normal ..
What, exactly, am I?

[Aag]

... The smartphone no longer perceives beeches ...
Yes, that sometimes it is difficult to assess the effectiveness of certain systems, weapons, and even the types and types of the Armed Forces. It seems like there is a General Staff, other structures ... But they operate with the data provided to them on the basis of certain The employees know how the results of inspections are formed ... Byada-ah! ...
In order not to aggravate the gloomy situation, I found some positive in Klimov's article. Alexander, Maxim, I congratulate, it seems, with your labors, the matter has moved forward, the topic has found resonance. Let's hope for the right conclusions and decisions.
Thank you guys !!!

[Aag]

Well, and to defuse the situation (sorry, of course, in another branch it would be necessary):
"... An American military drone flew over a Russian Navy destroyer ... Returned to base (avik) with Yandex, State Services, Besogon TV installed ..."

[timokhin-aa]

We will try

[Aag]

Quote: timokhin-aa

We will try

Thank you!
Good luck!

[Vladimir Mitin_2]

I understand your doubts, which were sown by kapitan 92-rank. Our dll can move under water at full speed for 1 hour, after that it is necessary to surface under the RDP and the diesel engine to charge the battery, while waiting for a nice meeting with Orion, or with its analogue or with anti-submarine forces Read the adventures of our dpl 641 ave during the Cuban missile crisis

[fomin]

There are so many stupid citizens who, like brainless troubadours, whistle about the one that will tell them on TV. Let's finally deal with this "black hole". She makes little noise, hurray, ours won, but let's remember what means of detecting submarines are currently available. passive are those who listen to where it makes noise and what makes noise in the ocean, these can miss Varshavyanka at long distances, active means of detecting these means in figs the boat makes no noise, floats or stands still, so they easily find all the "black holes", Now the boat itself , with a full underwater course, the battery energy will last for 1 hour with an economical course of 2-3 days, and then it needs to swim at least under the RPD to start the diesel engine, and then it is easy to find it by the diesel exhaust and using the radar that sees the RPM at a distance of 15- 20 km, i.e. a potential adversary does not need to chase after our "black hole", it is only necessary to wait a little and it will emerge by itself. A little history, the Varshavyanka project was made for the Warsaw Pact countries, someone remembers what kind of contract it was, and the boats are still riveted against the backdrop of the emergence of a new class of submarines, NNS, which many countries have already acquired. Russia has lagged behind a lot in this matter, and riveting of obsolete rubbish under the joyful cries of the troubadours will backfire in the event of a war.