The timing of the start of state tests of the ACS 2S43 "Malva"

The newest self-propelled artillery gun (SAO) 2S43 "Malva" will enter the state testing stage next year, 2022. Reported by "RIA News"with reference to a source in the military-industrial complex.

According to the source, in 2021, the prototype of the CAO will undergo acceptance tests, during which the compliance of the weapon with the requirements of the technical task will be confirmed. State tests are scheduled for 2022.

Acceptance tests will take place in 2021 (...) in case of a positive result, the CAO will be admitted to state tests, the beginning of which is tentatively scheduled for the first quarter of 2022

- said the source.

As part of acceptance tests, which will begin in the spring or summer of this year, "Malva" must shoot a certain number of shells, as well as undergo tests of the chassis on various soils. Factory tests of the CAO were completed at the end of 2020.

SAO 2S43 "Malva" is being developed by the Central Research Institute "Burevestnik" within the framework of the ROC "Sketch". For the first time, the howitzer was presented in 2019 behind closed doors, details of the development are not provided.

It is known that the 152-mm 2A64 cannon used in the Msta-S self-propelled guns is used as a firing component at Malva. It is possible to install an upgraded version of this gun, but the data is missing due to the secrecy of the development. The transportable ammunition load of the howitzer is 30 rounds, the weight of the CAO is 32 tons. The chassis of the "Malva" is the BAZ-6010-027 all-terrain vehicle with an 8x8 wheel arrangement manufactured by the Bryansk Automobile Plant.

As previously reported, in the framework of the R&D project “Sketch” a whole flower garden is being developed, which, in addition to “Mallow”, includes 120-mm Flook SAO on the Ural-VV chassis, 120 mm Arctic Magnolia self-propelled guns on the chassis of a two-link tractor DT-30MP and 82-mm mortar "Drok" on the chassis "Typhoon-VDV".

Comments

[Vladimir_2U]

"Hyacinth" had the nickname "Genocide", a nickname competition for "Malva" is announced!

[Lelik76]

Served in PSABr on 2S5 Hyacinth, honestly for the first time I hear such a nickname

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Lelik76

honestly the first time I hear such a nickname

No less honest, I didn't invent it myself!

[Lelik76]

Honestly, I only served on it for 2 years at the end of the 90s, and after that in the aircraft industry as an engineer, I know more nicknames, all sorts of words in this area

[Vladimir_2U]

Specified in the search, in Afghanistan they gave a nickname.

[Lelik76]

In the brigade, we had only a couple of officers who took part in the hostilities and it happened in Chechnya and they were not verbose, and so yes, interesting information

[TermNachTer]

A well-known nickname, it is strange that you, having the most direct relation to these weapons, did not know this.

[Reviews]

Local nicknames do not always permeate the "neighbors". For example, the An-24 has at least 3 nicknames and some of them have a strictly local distribution.

[TermNachTer]

I agree that in different places, they call it differently. But comrade, he served on the "Hyacinths".

[carstorm 11]

Figs knows) we called them their shoes)))) I will remember all my life when we were chasing one battery in two companies) they had cunning officers)))) I had such a flight for the first time))))

[tralflot1832]

Whoever offends Malva (Malvina) will have to deal with her evil friend "Buratina".

[tralflot1832]

And Malva fell in love with the evil Buratina. And after nine months they had a son. Affectionate to those who shoot from him, hateful to those who throw sand at his friends. His parents called him Buratinoid. That's the end of the fairy tale, who read to the end the fellow.

[Flooding]

Quote: Vladimir_2U

a nickname competition for "Malva" is announced

little thing?

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Flood

little thing?

No, well, something with black humor is desirable, it seems to me.

[Flooding]

much blacker than thug jargon.
have you thought about the little one? not
Malyava, citizen chief

[Orange bigg]

Quote: Vladimir_2U

"Hyacinth" had the nickname "Genocide", a nickname competition for "Malva" is announced!

"Plea" (for mercy) I think will do. Naturally for those for whom the weapon will be used.

[KONST.RU]

Malva will be Malya in the ranks. It's simple.

[Grits]

Quote: Vladimir_2U

"Hyacinth" had the nickname "Genocide", a nickname competition for "Malva" announced

I just want to say - "Vulva" ....

[Flashpoint]

Quote: Vladimir_2U

"Hyacinth" had the nickname "Genocide", it is announced nickname competition for "Malva"!

Wetted, or Washcloth.

[ShturmKGB]

Ochevino - malyava! And let's purely poison the miaław with the fraers!

[g1v2]

Malyava. Such a remote hello.

[LTMax]

"Vulva" - okay?

[The leader of the Redskins]

I think there is a place to be, but the dimensions are alarming. Visually - more than all foreign counterparts.

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Leader of the Redskins

I think there is a place to be, but the dimensions are alarming.

Yes, the barrel is long, but they could not place it above the cockpit. It can be seen that the gun was placed as low as possible, apparently they considered that it was cheaper to make a long base than the higher the gun was placed.

[spech]

Height may not fit into the dimensions (railway, bridges, etc.,)

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: spech

Height may not fit into the dimensions (railway, bridges, etc.,)

Yes, it is unlikely that a maximum of half a meter will not be a plus to fit into the overall dimensions, to the eye the ACS will be lower than the "Thor".

[svp67]

Quote: Vladimir_2U

Yes, the barrel is long, but they could not place it above the cockpit.

Didn't you think that they left a place for a longer barrel?

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: svp67

Didn't you think that they left a place for a longer barrel?

By the way, yes!

[Bad_gr]

Quote: svp67

Didn't you think that they left a place for a longer barrel?

Quote: Vladimir_2U

By the way, yes!

The picture shows the "Malva" with the 2A64 cannon, which differs from the 2A65 only in the presence of an ejector (information from Vicki). But she does not need an ejector in this configuration, and it is possible that it will go into the series with the 2A65 barrel, and at the moment it is being made 53 caliber long, in contrast to the MSTA-S barrel, which is 47 calibers long.
PS
I came across information that when upgrading to the ACS "MSTA-S" they began to put the same on 53 caliber.

[Grits]

Quote: svp67

Didn't you think that they left a place for a longer barrel?

Isn't it possible to place a long barrel above the cockpit? Or is it necessary to lengthen the base?

[loki565]

Yes, the barrel is long, but they could not place it above the cockpit. It can be seen that the gun was placed as low as possible, apparently they considered that it was cheaper to make a long base than the higher the gun was placed.

The thing is not in height, but in the maximum displacement to the outriggers, so that during the shots there is no load on the chassis, and there is no problem to make stamping in the cockpit.

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: loki565

It's not about the height, but about the maximum offset to the outriggers.

Only this on Malva for some reason is not. And in the photo in your comment, the gun is too high, and the supports are much more powerful and longer, which means more expensive, and the firing sector will obviously be smaller. Mallow looks more optimal.

[loki565]

Only this on Malva for some reason is not. And in the photo in your comment, the gun is too high, and the supports are much more powerful and longer, which means more expensive, and the firing sector will obviously be smaller. Mallow looks more optimal.

They are all plus or minus the same, the nuances in the loading system, what it is in the mallow, is not yet clear

[Zaurbek]

This, apparently, hit the barrel of the "Coalition" ..... And the loading system there is usual, with the supply of a projectile and charge. Otherwise, the tower would have been erected, like on a KAMAZ ... but here everything is in the open air.

[Bogalex]

Perhaps, in order not to increase the dimensions in height due to the requirements for transportability by rail and air.

[Barberry25]

why remodel the cabin?

[strannik1985]

Dimensions are secondary, its protection is the ability to work in the mode: short fire raid (literally 5-6 shots) - movement - short fire raid ...

[Flooding]

Quote: Leader of the Redskins

the dimensions are alarming. Visually - more than all foreign counterparts.

hardly longer than Archer

[Kaw]

Archer has a 52 caliber gun, self-loading, with an uninhabited tower behind. Malva, this is an outdated 42 caliber gun, without any mechanization of the loading process, but in size (and probably weight) they are really similar. Archer's chassis is a two-link vehicle that is much more maneuverable.
Malva is rather an analogue of the French Caesar self-propelled gun, but it is much more compact and its cannon is 52 hummingbirds.

Mallow is the perfect example of how you don't need to design cars. IMHO

[Flooding]

Quote: Kaw

Mallow is the perfect example of how you don't need to design cars. IMHO

I think this is not the final look of the installation
and, of course, it is very doubtful the statement about the use of an obsolete weapon in a new developed sample

[Bogalex]

Well, the article specifically states - 2A64. In appearance, the photograph looks very much like it is. There will be new information - it will be possible to agree with you, but not yet.

[garri-lin]

The weapon is old. But!! Old, Proven. And not at all outdated. And it has not exhausted its modernization potential.

[Grits]

Quote: garri-lin

The weapon is old. But!! Old, Proven. And not at all outdated. And it has not exhausted its modernization potential.

Artillery is very conservative. And the old proven weapons are still relevant now, they have been working perfectly for many decades - maybe more than planes, tanks and ships. Therefore, putting an old cannon on a new chassis is not a sin at all, but new capabilities of the artillery system.

[scoutbat]

Hmm? Since the transition of NATO to the standard "155/52 caliber / 23 liters of volume of the charging chamber", the caliber (still imperial) in 6 "(152,4 mm) has turned into a pumpkin. Even during the design of Msta, voices sounded in the normalization of the caliber to 155-160 mm and a departure from the only remaining inch, but ran into stocks of shells / charges, saved. When designing the Coalition stepped on the same rake, unifying with old charges, clowns in uniform. As a result, the export potential is zero, systems even with a barrel length of 52 caliber inferior to the same in the firing range of 20% on average (firing range of a standard HE without a bottom gas generator is 24,5 km Msta and 30 km of the NATO art / standard

P.S. the situation is one-on-one with the Grabinsky gun f-22, when, at the request of the GRAU, it was supposed to shoot at the planes, and work from closed positions, and be anti-tank, and all this with the old shell for the regimental gun of 1902. As a result, the Germans used the trophy with a bored charging chamber, a modernized gun carriage and rejoiced, we were on the mountain.

[garri-lin]

How does this relate to the caliber? This is even related to the size of the charge.

[scoutbat]

I will quote

From a scientific and technical point of view, the replacement of the 152,4 mm caliber with the 155 mm caliber reflects the widespread trend of the transition of weapons from outdated inch to metric with a corresponding change in tolerances and measuring instrument systems. In the domestic artillery, this tendency was clearly traced both during the Great Patriotic War and in the post-war period. All the newly introduced calibers of field and tank artillery, as well as mortars, were metric - 45, 85, 100, 115, 120, 125, 130, 140, 160, 180 and 240 mm.

The trend is to streamline the sizes of equipment objects by bringing them to normal series of linear sizes, whose members represent a geometric progression. The main calibers of domestic artillery 82, 100, 122, 125, 130, 203 and 240 mm are grouped around members of the normal Ra10 series according to GOST 6636-69 (the denominator of the progression is 1,2589) with a deviation not exceeding 4%. Caliber 152,4 mm is the only exception (5% deviation). When switching to 155 mm caliber, the deviation from the corresponding member of the row (160 mm) decreases to 3,5%, i.e. the general pattern is restored.
The transition to 155 mm caliber with a fixed value of the relative mass of the projectile gives it an increase of 6%, i.e. 2,5 kg. According to calculations, this additive, with its rational distribution between the projectile body and the explosive charge, will increase the effectiveness of the fragmentation action of the projectile by about 10%.

[garri-lin]

Do you understand what kind of nonsense you quoted? Are you aware that the actual geometrical dimension, the diameter of the Russian 152 mm caliber projectile is greater than the NATO standard 155 mm projectile diameter?

[scoutbat]

That is, the 152,4 caliber is larger than the 155 mm caliber measured using the same system? You are healthy? Is there even a word in the quote about NATO 155? There is only a justification for switching to a larger caliber that fits into a series of numbers. You have invented the word NATO for yourself, dear.

[garri-lin]

2,6 mm? Tobish, are you proposing to invest billions in rearmament for the sake of 2,6 mm? And at the same time not even unify a potential enemy with ammunition? 477 mm in circumference by 2,6 mm in length, I honestly don’t remember, but about 700 mm is that much?

[scoutbat]

Whether you like it or not, you will have to upgrade for the main reason: the small volume of the charging chamber in 2c19 and others like them is 152,4. Let me remind you that the range of any NATO 52-caliber howitzer is 30% higher than the range of MSTA with an active-rocket projectile (40 km versus 30 km). Well, reduction to a normal series of numbers will give an additional, according to calculations, an increase in power of 10%. Another bonus of modernization is the introduction of combustible casings, which was tested on the export MSTE 155 NATO. This will increase the transportable ammo, increase the rate of fire, and facilitate promising AZ / MZ.

[garri-lin]

I agree with the range and energy of the shot. Need to work. For example, how they worked when creating the Coalition. The 10 percent increase in power from the extra 2,6mm diameter won't work. You shouldn't have thought of this for yourself. A combustible sleeve has both pros and cons. So this point needs to be thought over soberly.

[scoutbat]

"The transition to 155 mm caliber with a fixed value of the relative mass of the projectile gives it an increase of 6%, ie 2,5 kg. According to calculations, this additive, with its rational distribution between the projectile body and the explosive charge, will increase the effectiveness of the fragmentation action of the projectile by about 10%. At the same time, an increase in the volume of the charging chamber to the NATO standard makes it possible to significantly increase the mass of the charge and, as a consequence, increase the firing range. "

It was not I who considered it, but the specialists https://warspot.ru/15099-natovskiy-kalibr-dlya-rossiyskoy-gaubitsy

[garri-lin]

My friend, these specialists are as ignorant as you are. I would even say the losers of the school curriculum. 47.7 circumferences by 0.013 thick by about 70 centimeters long. By some simple calculations, we teach a lesson 47.7 by 0.013 by 70 for a total of 44 cubic centimeters that will be added to the projectile. We multiply by the specific gravity of steel in the amount of 7,8 grams per cubic centimeter. Total 338 grams. How your brilliant experts were able to stretch them up to 2,5 kg, I think the story is silent. I congratulate you, citizen of the lie. Sat down in a puddle.

[scoutbat]

Oh ... I swore to deal with ignoramuses who do not know beyond the school course ...
Let it be known to you that the weight of the projectile grows approximately in cubic dependence on the caliber, that is, with an increase in caliber by 1,5 times, the projectile becomes heavier by almost four times, and with a doubling - eight times. That is, an increase in caliber by 2,6 mm, or 1,706%, gives an increase in projectile mass by 4,965%, and this is a rough formula on the fingers, so 6% is more than a realistic option. Well, since you showed your inability to communicate, coupled with your lack of knowledge about the ballistics of barrel artillery and related calculations, I see no more reason with you to continue the dialogue. All the best, improve your level of knowledge, arithmetic is good, but not enough

[garri-lin]

Merged yes, okay. I gave a mathematical calculation of the change in weight due to a change in volume. You gave an unfounded statement based on the words of certain persons.

[svp67]

Quote: Kaw

Malva, this is an obsolete 42 caliber gun, without any mechanization of the loading process,

Don't say nonsense, everything is there.

[Sidor Amenpodestovich]

Quote: Kaw

Mallow is the perfect example of how you don't need to design cars. IMHO

And you, my dear, are an ideal example of a "sofa expert".
Are you an artilleryman? Military equipment designer? In general, is there anything to do with the army besides the fact that they are registered on the VO?
You only know about Archer and Malva what they are called.
Pompous amateurism is the stupidest and most absurd. What do you ideally confirm.

[strannik1985]

Mallow is the perfect example of how you don't need to design cars.

Yeah, that's why Norway and Finland (originally taking part in the development) refused from Archer, Denmark ordered Caesars instead of Archers (although they were initially interested), and Sweden itself sat for several years without artillery at all (FH-77B was removed from service, the last were withdrawn in 2011, the first "Archers" appeared in 2014).
Microscopic b / c without the ability to shoot from the ground.

[donavi49]

Like 2000 atmosphere.

[venik]

Quote: Leader of the Redskins

I think there is a place to be, but the dimensions are alarming. Visually - more than all foreign counterparts.

=======
Evil tongues assert that once, being in irritation, Napoleon remarked to Murata: above - you LONGER! But this is a flaw that is never too late to fix!
The long chassis is not the biggest drawback of the gun mount! But it is clearly resistant to rollover!

[Grits]

Quote: Leader of the Redskins

I think there is a place to be, but the dimensions are alarming. Visually - more than all foreign counterparts.

It also seems to me that all the bourgeois ones will be shorter. And by design, I like Dana and Archer the most. "Dana" by the fact that everything in it is thought out precisely for the gun mount and the chassis itself was made on it, and did not take a basic sample and thought about how to mount the gun there. And the "Archer" is very
brutal and original car itself.

[TerraSandera]

Is it like a reduction in the cost of Msta and the Coalition? How do you change from a motorcycle to a moped? It looks very big and there are problems with mobility.

[Lara Croft]

Quote: TerraSandera

Is it like a reduction in the cost of Msta and the Coalition?

No, this is an SPG on a wheeled chassis. Or are you against such self-propelled guns, which the empirialists have for a long time, the RF Armed Forces do not deserve this in your opinion?

[paul3390]

It depends on where such a device is used .. If, say, in the sands of the Iraqi region, it will do quite well, but if in the fall in our zone ... There are places where tanks get stuck, let alone the wheels ..

[Lara Croft]

Quote: paul3390

It depends on where such a device is used .. If, say, in the sands of the Iraqi region, it will be fine,

Yes, the export potential is great, especially in the vastness of the CIS countries and other countries where the towed MSTA-B SG is in service ....

if in the fall in our strip ... There are places where tanks get stuck, not like the wheels ..

Well, we have a big country with different climatic conditions, somewhere there is a place for it in the same KOR ....., Crimea ...

[scoutbat]

Yes, the export potential is great, especially in the vastness of the CIS countries and other countries where the towed MSTA-B SG is in service ..

Yeah, so big that 152,4 caliber could not be sold to anyone after 91))))

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Scoutbat

Yeah, so big that 152,4 caliber could not be sold to anyone after 91))))

For fear of God, the young man SG Msta-S only in 1989 was adopted by the SA.

В 1989 year the new self-propelled gun was adopted by the artillery regiments of motorized rifle and tank divisions of the Soviet army

https://topwar.ru/4127-152-mm-samoxodnaya-gaubica-2s19-msta-s.html
VIKI: SG operators - outside the CIS: Venezuela, Morocco, Ethiopia.
In the CIS countries, few were able to get it, and then most likely after the collapse of the Union - RB, RAz, Ukraine, Georgia.
In total, 720 units were produced.
The Msta-S SG was created to replace the Akatsiya SG, however, due to the collapse of the Union, it was not possible, what large-scale supplies abroad can we talk about if the main 152-mm SG in the RF Armed Forces is the Akatsiya SG with a gun times of the Second World War.
BG Msta-B was put into service in 1986.

Serial production of the towed version began in 1987... Currently, the 152-mm Msta-B howitzer is in service with the Russian army, as well as a number of post-Soviet countries - Belarus, Kazakhstan, Georgia and Ukraine. Howitzers managed to fight during the second Chechen war, as well as the armed conflict in eastern Ukraine in the territory of Donbass. Also, artillery systems are used in Iraq, were purchased from Russia by the government of the country to combat ISIS and in Syria.

https://topwar.ru/101092-152-mm-buksiruemaya-gaubica-msta-b-2a65.html
In total, 1 units were produced.
There are also few of them in the CIS countries, the largest operator after the RF - 222 units. The Republic of Belarus and the Armed Forces of Ukraine - 130 units, it is not a fact of course that the Republic of Belarus and Ukraine could have drunk some part of them ...
But all the same, it is clear that both the SG and BG managed to do relatively little and their small number in the CIS countries, the SGs in service with the CIS countries (except for the Russian Federation) are generally dozens ...

[scoutbat]

I remember the MSTU was offered every year at exhibitions, in Abu Dhabi they even staged a whole circus, with the defeat of tanks by direct fire, but no one bought it precisely because of the caliber.

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Scoutbat

I remember the MSTU was offered every year at exhibitions, in Abu Dhabi they even staged a whole circus, with the defeat of tanks by direct fire, but no one bought it precisely because of the caliber.

I think she is not a competitor to the German and Korean SG. She belatedly appeared in the SA, and the best quality SG "Coalition" is expensive.
I think the line of existing SG and BG in the RF Armed Forces will remain the same. There will be an SG on a wheelbase (because the Empireists have them) with worse performance characteristics than Western countries.
Ampirialists re-equip with 155-mm BG, leaving BG 105-mm only in light infantry units, and we simply sent all the BG 122-mm D-30 for storage, neither creating a replacement for it and not adopting the new BG 155-mm. ...
We are probably waiting for the Armed Forces of Ukraine to have "new" PA guns that are being written off soon in NATO countries - for example, the Palladin SG M109 and the SG AS90 ...., in addition to them, the Americans will put new radar serifs art. fire, ACS, and Israeli Jews drums UAVs ...

[scoutbat]

So yes, it is expensive to conduct R&D, and in the capitalist formation the country does not have the money for this.

[tralflot1832]

And in the state of taxi drivers in Texas, not an option?

[KCA]

ACS A-222 "Coast" feels good in the Kaliningrad region, if ordered on wheels, then there is where to apply

[Grits]

Quote: KCA

ACS A-222 "Coast" feels good in the Kaliningrad region, if ordered on wheels, then there is where to apply

Is it really there too? I thought they were only on the Black Sea coast.

[donavi49]

Well, the palm superpower with 100050000 islands and plans to take away (return to its home harbor) the lands of the neighboring palm superpower chose Caesar's chariots, although if ROE had an option then, it might have been possible to sell.

Again Africa, otherwise they buy all sorts of Atmos.

And also the factor of China, they have a large-scale 155 mm system, which they will very soon be exporting. For example, a 122 mm wheel-type system is quite actively being sold to itself (Myanmar, Pakistan, Nigeria).

[Grits]

Quote: paul3390

It depends on where such a device is used .. If, say, in the sands of the Iraqi region, it will be fine, but if in the fall in our strip ... There are places where tanks get stuck, not like the wheels

And in the fall, roads disappear completely in our lane? I live in the Far East, and even we have a sufficiently extensive road network, sufficient to drive quickly along it and strike. What can we say about the western part of the country. Tracked vehicles, even if they go straight through fields and forests, will still arrive later.

[TerraSandera]

I wrote that against? I just asked what its purpose is, is it to reduce the cost of the ACS? Where have I ever mentioned that this is good or bad? Just like a pack of sentries. Yes, sculpt, if there is nothing to answer, it's not a pity

[svp67]

Quote: TerraSandera

Is it like a reduction in the cost of Msta and the Coalition?

It depends on what "MSTA". ACS "MSTA" - no, these systems will replace the towed MSTA-B

[TerraSandera]

Sorry, probably everyone who is in the subject, understood what Msta is, if it is written about the ACS, and not about the tug. I do not want to take an example from Damantsev, with dozens of alphanumeric designations

[TerraSandera]

Ps, thanks. I just didn't think it was logical, because Msta B is towed by much lighter "tractors" and here it is almost a rocket platform.

[svp67]

Quote: TerraSandera

I just didn't think it was logical, because Msta B is towed by much lighter "tractors" and here it is almost a rocket platform.

Unfortunately, the time of towed artillery systems has already passed, the time of their life on the battlefield has dropped sharply. and such a system somehow allows you to survive

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

Take your time to bury them. A large self-propelled gun cannot be thrown by a helicopter, and towed D-30 howitzers are quite possible and a tractor separately by a larger helicopter.

[svp67]

Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich

Take your time to bury them.

Of course, some niche in the weapons system will remain for them, but not so big.

[Grits]

Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich

and the towed D-30 howitzers are quite possible and the tractor is separate

In addition, no specific tractor is required. If necessary, you can use any more powerful car or any tracked equipment. Any tractor can be used.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

It is hardly possible to speak of light tractors with the weight of the MSTA-B towed howitzer at 7 tons.

[Grits]

Quote: svp67

It depends on what "MSTA". ACS "MSTA" - no, these systems will replace the towed MSTA-B

I wonder if towed artillery will be given any role in the future, or will it disappear as a class? It seems that it is squeezed everywhere by more practical, but more complicated and expensive ones. Sorry.
By the way, earlier in Soviet times, towed artillery was shown at parades. Now for many years it has not been rolled on Red Square.

[Bad_gr]

Quote: TerraSandera

Is it like a reduction in the cost of Msta and the Coalition?

This is the development of towed artillery.

[svp67]

This is where and when we would like to ACCELERATE. The situation is painfully complicated and these artillery systems may be needed ...

[Catfish]

Sergei , I always believed that the self-propelled artillery mount is designed to fire immediately or from a short stop, unless this "flower" can fire right away. It is a self-propelled rather than self-propelled unit. Or did I just miss the moment when the abbreviation ACS took on a different meaning?

[svp67]

Konstantin

Quote: Sea Cat

Or did I just miss the moment when the abbreviation ACS acquired a different meaning?

I think that a new designation will be introduced to distinguish it.

[Bad_gr]

Quote: Sea Cat

I always believed that the self-propelled gun is a self-propelled gun mount designed for firing immediately or from a short stop,

Tanks shoot on the move or from a short stop. Self-propelled guns only from the spot (I have not seen any other information). After stopping, most often, he puts out additional stops (who have paws, who have a bucket), preliminary preparation, and only after that they shoot.

[Catfish]

You haven’t come across such information, but I saw it during my service.

After stopping, most often, he puts out additional stops (who have paws, who have a bucket), preliminary preparation, and only after that they shoot.

Look at the military chronicle, or at least a photo of the SU-100, Su-85, ISU-152. "Where are the buckets and paws?"

[Bad_gr]

Quote: Sea Cat

Look at the military chronicle, or at least a photo of the SU-100, Su-85, ISU-152. "Where are the buckets and paws?"

This is all an old technique and was done according to a different TK. Their tasks were on the front line (hence the defense like a tank), where they fought against enemy armored vehicles, pillboxes, etc. direct fire. Now these tasks are being solved by tanks. Modern self-propelled guns have light armor and, as a rule, a howitzer cannon. Basically, they shoot from afar, from a canopy, and shooting outright does not make sense, since you will not get anywhere.
Where am I going wrong?

[Catfish]

With regard to modern self-propelled guns, you are not mistaken anywhere. I meant precisely the designation of the self-propelled gun, as a self-propelled installation, with the possibility of immediate opening of fire without preliminary preparation, the designation was preserved, but the tasks changed, this is what we are talking about.
Here SD-57 was designated quite correctly - self-propelled.

[Bad_gr]

Quote: Sea Cat

Here SD-57 was designated quite correctly - self-propelled.

I think the name ACS only implies the way the gun mounts move. If it can independently move along with the columns of other troops, without yielding to them in speed, independently get to its positions from which it will perform its tasks, then this is an ACS.

[Bad_gr]

Quote: Bad_gr

then this is a self-propelled gun

It turns out that there are nuances here:
looked at different sites, on some "Malva" is called ACS (U-installation), on others CAO (O-gun), and some on the same page this or that.
The manufacturer assigns it to the CAO.

The description indicates the ammunition load (30 pieces), weight - 32 tons, that is, this plate refers to the entire complex (gun + vehicle).
And in the English version of the description it is already "SYSTEM" - how to understand?

[Catfish]

That's what I'm talking about, it's all about terminology.

[Zaurbek]

Exhibited in 100% of cases .... ISU 152 - hastily home-made, for fighting heavy tanks and an assault gun ... Not a howitzer like Carnations and so on. And there is a certain ratio between the weight of the tracked vehicle and the power of the artillery system. Not on Akatsia, on Malka ... But wheeled vehicles will not be able to shoot like that.

[svp67]

Quote: Sea Cat

Or did I just miss the moment when the abbreviation ACS acquired a different meaning?

As expected, already in official documents "Malva" is designated as CAO (self-propelled artillery gun)

[Catfish]

This is true. Thanks for the information, Sergey.

[Azimuth]

Quote: Leader of the Redskins

I think there is a place to be, but the dimensions are alarming. Visually - more than all foreign counterparts.

Quote: TerraSandera

... It looks very big and there are problems with mobility.

I agree with you. At Floks-e, taking into account our realities, it was necessary to round off, or create a CAO similar to the French or Israeli.
They spent money on development, factory testing of the devil, then start whining that the company or the budget has no money.

They had to set a task so that two CAOs would fit into a transport plane with a "jack". And then the root crop knows that they have nailed it

[Ros 56]

Within the framework of acceptance tests, which will begin in the spring or summer of this year,

What kind of frivolity is this, specific dates for each stage of work must be indicated. If you tried so to speak during Stalin's time, the little head would quickly be unscrewed. And to be honest, they would be right.

[bald]

Here, there may be a mistake, no, I'm not talking about the ACS, of course, the range (concealment, withdrawal from other people's fixations) control over the target, and the quality of defeat, too many of which offer, this is both dismantling and braking for many reasons.

[UltraTotenkopF]

Quote: TerraSandera

I wrote that against? I just asked what its purpose is, is it to reduce the cost of the ACS? Where have I ever mentioned that this is good or bad? Just like a pack of sentries. Yes, sculpt, if there is nothing to answer, it's not a pity

The Malva self-propelled guns have only one purpose, to replace the Msta B towed howitzer!

[cost 75]

What is its advantage over the towed one? Price, mobility, range, accuracy, more bq ???

[Zaurbek]

Have you pulled the cannon? There are certain standards for deployment and collapse. At the training camp we pulled 100mm MT-12 Rapier. 3 tons of weight and 6 people calculation. And here - a 152mm long-barreled howitzer .... loading is completely manual .....

[Letnab]

I think that at the initial stage of any major conflict, self-propelled guns will take on the bulk of the load, and there, as the conflict (war) develops, one way or another, the use of towed guns will be required ...

[Zaurbek]

Quite right ..... the trunks are in reserve ..... there is also M-30 152mm there. with a short barrel from the Second World War

[DMi]

The standard, mastered by production, the gun was put on the standard, mastered by the production of the chassis. As quickly and cheaply as possible. What are you dissatisfied with in the comments?

[113262a]

All! Obviously, the generation of millennials designed!))) Instead of Msta-b, but cheaper than the Coalition and Msta-s! With the excuses of this action sucked from what organs are unknown. Whoever was present at the positions of the arts at the time when the first response arrives, he will understand! And now she arrives literally right away! And the hell is there where you hide, even from large fragments. By analogy, we are waiting for the continuation, an intermediate option between the Su-57 and An-2, between the Armata and the UAZ, etc. ))) And so-the babakh will go, but they themselves are riveting SUCH.

[Sukhoi]

Coalition-SV-KSH is an expensive, heavy artillery unit on a cheap chassis with a narrow base and a high center of mass.
Malva is a cheap, light artillery unit on an expensive wide chassis.
Sometimes I can’t understand at all what is going on in the heads of designers.

[Grits]

Quote: Sukhoi

Coalition-SV-KSH is an expensive, heavy artillery unit on a cheap chassis with a narrow base and a high center of mass.
Malva is a cheap, light artillery unit on an expensive wide chassis.
Sometimes I can’t understand at all what is going on in the heads of designers.

I am also at a loss and thought that it should be just the opposite.

[Zaurbek]

I don’t understand at all why to fence such a system with a tower and automatic equipment on KAMAZ ...?! And here - it is necessary to immediately put the "long" trunk of the Coalition on the BAZ

[Maxim Davydov]

There is still a question on the bases. If I am not mistaken, there is nothing in the division at the BAZ base. And there are many KAMAZ trucks. And now the Coalition is at KAMAZ, and Msta is at the BAZ. A strange conclusion suggests itself: Koala with its 80km - for division artillery regiments, Msta with its <30km - for army artillery brigades? .. Or is it not so ???

[Zaurbek]

Why is Msta less than 30 km?

[Maxim Davydov]

I have no data that Msta is more than 29 km.

[garri-lin]

For a long time, the site has not seen the respected Lopatov. To our great regret. Here is his opinion of a specialist I would like to hear about this sample.

[Grits]

Quote: garri-lin

For a long time, the site has not seen the respected Lopato

Almost a year he has not been seen. On the part of artillery, he said very sensible things here. It was evident that he was a professional.
Lopatov - RESPOND!

[garri-lin]

Now I looked. He left his last message in November. I hope I'm alive and well.

[Constanty]

The chassis, like that of Malva, would be better suited for the Pantsir than the Kamaz.
Much lower center of gravity.

[Scorpion85]

ACS "Malva" on the chassis under the OTRK looks cumbersome, I prefer the Ukrainian 2S22 "Bogdana" with 155 mm cannon. More compact and superior in caliber.

[Kote Pan Kokhanka]

Quote: Scorpion85

ACS "Malva" on the chassis under the OTRK looks cumbersome, I prefer the Ukrainian 2S22 "Bogdana" with 155 mm cannon. More compact and superior in caliber.

6 by 6 is definitely worse than 8 by 8.
NATO 155mm, no matter how smaller the domestic 152mm will be. In terms of the volume of the chamber, my grandmother told me for two what trunk would weigh on Malva. If from the coalition, then Bogdana is crying on the sidelines.

[Zaurbek]

There is a Caesar on both 6x6 and 8x8 ... but the cross-country ability is different for the chassis ... 155 and 152 are equal calibers ... and the weight of the gun depends on the length of the barrel and the size of the breech, the range and accuracy of the gun depend on this. And so, you can put the M30 152mm. It is even more compact and KRAZ 4x4 will do.

[Grits]

Quote: Scorpion85

ACS "Malva" on the chassis under the OTRK looks cumbersome, I prefer the Ukrainian 2S22 "Bogdana" with 155 mm cannon. More compact and superior in caliber

"KrAZ" - "lapotnik", of course, is good. Not like our "KamAZ". And "Kaolitsiya" on "KamAZ" looks like a saddle on a cow.

[Zaurbek]

There are no such differences anymore. KAMAZ has occupied all niches and 4x4 and 6x6 and 8x8 ... and now all this appears with a new cab and its diesel engine from 400 to 750 hp and is already advertising a 5-axle quarry car.

[Bad_gr]

Quote: Scorpion85

ACS "Malva" on the chassis under the OTRK looks cumbersome, I prefer the Ukrainian 2S22 "Bogdana" with 155 mm cannon. More compact and superior in caliber.

This weapon is located too high. And judging by the fact that he has only a bucket from the back of the supports, he can only shoot in a small sector of angles relative to the longitudinal axis of the machine.
In Malka, the legs move apart, its track width is greater than that of Kraz, and the length of the car is a plus in this case. That is, it has much larger guidance angles along the horizon.

[Zaurbek]

Such weapons:
1. Easier to deploy and move.
2. Western trends - long barrel, increased range and corr shells with GPS guidance (relatively cheap)

[cat Rusich]

Mallow is a flower.

Hyacinth is a flower.

Phlox is a flower.

Gorse is a flower.

Silk acacia is a flower.
Just admire ...

[cat Rusich]

Sand carnation - flower.

Variegated tulip.

[Vlad Vlad (Shimas)]

everything is rearranged on the wheels. in any way gathered in Europe?

[JD1979]

Why is it needed ... From what can be seen in the photo
1. No AZ
2. No place for BC ...
3. Shed, I sympathize with those who will prepare it for transportation by piece of iron
4. Apparently, the controls are extremely primitive, you can not even dream about control and guidance from the cockpit.

There is no way to spy on the Czechs, they have already eaten a dog on such self-propelled guns.

[Irbiz123]

And the Swedes have an Archer!

[Irbiz123]

I suggest "Murka"

[Ilya_Nsk]

I don’t like it. Huge overhangs, somehow unbalanced. This

it seems to me more perfect.