Military Review

MPL pistol "Lynx" on the eve of adoption

99

In the near future, the Rys self-loading MPL pistol will be adopted by the National Guard. Recently, this product has successfully completed state tests and received all the necessary recommendations. In the near future, the development organization plans to start mass production of such weapons... The first MPL will roll off the assembly line this year.


Latest news


On March 9, the Kalashnikov concern announced a meeting of the state commission that monitored the development work on the creation of a promising pistol. The event was attended by representatives of the customer (Rosgvardia), as well as the Ministry of Defense, the Ministry of Internal Affairs and the FSO, who participated in the development program.

It is reported that in February the MPL pistol completed state tests. The product has confirmed the declared characteristics and compliance with the customer's requirements. The State Commission approved the test results and issued a recommendation for the adoption of the pistol by the Russian Guard.

In the near future, the contracting authority will have to carry out all the remaining procedures and adopt a new model for service. An order for serial production is also expected. Concern "Kalashnikov" informs that the series will be adjusted at the Izhevsk Mechanical Plant. The production lines will be created and prepared by the end of this year.

The successful completion of state tests puts an end to the development work that has been going on since 2017. Kalashnikov notes the importance of this event. In addition, the concern hopes for a great future for the new development. The pistol was created according to the requirements of the Russian Guard, but it may be of interest for other structures with similar needs.

Building on existing


The Lebedev modular pistol has been developed since 2017 by order of the Russian Guard. The existing self-loading pistol designed by D. Lebedev was taken as the basis for this product; it should have been finalized taking into account the wishes of the customer and the features of future operation. As far as we know, the main part of the nodes remained the same, and the implemented improvements made it possible to talk about a modular approach.


MPL in basic configuration

The development of the MPL product did not take long. It was presented for the first time at an open event in the spring of 2019, at the same time the main design features and applied modifications became known. In addition, it was announced that after passing the tests and confirming the declared characteristics, the new weapon will go into series and go to units.

The MPL pistol is considered as a modern replacement for the existing PM products. With all its advantages, the Makarov pistol no longer meets the modern requirements of a number of departments and organizations, which is why it needs to be replaced. PL-14/15 and its modular version, in turn, were created in the recent past based on the operating experience of previous samples and taking into account modern requirements and trends.

Modular approach


In design, the new MPL is basically similar to the base pistol. At the same time, some new assemblies and parts are used with the possibility of replacement - this makes a modular system from a simple pistol with the ability to quickly change the configuration. First of all, this will allow you to effectively solve various problems. In addition, improved ergonomics and product performance are provided.

The most visible manifestation of the modular architecture is the interchangeable barrel. Depending on the needs of the shooter, a standard rifled barrel 112 mm long or an elongated piece with a thread for a device to reduce the sound of firing (PSZS) can be used. A pistol with a shorter barrel is considered the standard configuration. The CCD version is called a special purpose configuration.

The design of the MPL allows the use of different types of trigger mechanisms. It was reported about the possibility of installing single and double action trigger and striker type USM. There is also the possibility of introducing an automatic fire mode, which will radically change the firing capabilities of the pistol.


A modular approach is also implemented in the field of "body kit". On the frame of the pistol, in front of the trigger guard, there is a guide for mounting the necessary equipment. In addition, the MPL variant for special tasks receives new equipment to be placed on a fighter's outfit.

At the same time, the Lynx MPL is based on the proven design of D. Lebedev's previous pistols. They all have a traditional architecture with a movable breech cover. Different versions of these weapons used aluminum and plastic frames. Plastic is used in the design of the new MPL. All samples of the series use the 9x19 mm Parabellum cartridge.

Automation is based on the use of the recoil of the bolt, which engages with the barrel. Locking is carried out by engaging the upper part of the breech with the liner ejection window. The base for the PL-14/15 is a double-action trigger type trigger, but later alternative designs appeared. There is a safety catch with flags on both sides of the weapon.

The organization-developer indicates the strengths of D. Lebedev's pistols. It is distinguished by good ergonomics and ease of use by right-handers and left-handers, safe operation, as well as high reliability. So, even with the use of reinforced 7N21 cartridges, the design resource exceeds 10 thousand shots.

Family perspectives


The new pistols of the Kalashnikov concern are being tested and confirm the declared characteristics. In August 2020, it was reported about the successful completion of tests of a compact PLC pistol, performed in the interests of the Ministry of Internal Affairs, and the start of trial operation. Now, with positive results, state tests of modular MPL for the Russian Guard have been carried out. In the near future, other structures may show interest in the new family of pistols, which will lead to the start of the next tests.


"Lynx" in different versions

At least two Russian departments are already showing serious interest in D. Lebedev's pistols and are planning to purchase them. Such contracts will appear in the near future, and Kalashnikov is already planning to launch production. The observed processes are of great interest. The fact is that new pistols are considered as a replacement for the old PM. This is not the first attempt to replace it, but the previous ones have not been fully successful. Perhaps this time the results of rearmament will be more successful.

Recently, the PLC pistol was shown for the first time at a foreign exhibition. The development organization begins to promote such weapons on the international market, and this should lead to the appearance of foreign orders. It is quite possible that other members of the family will enter the market for the PLC, incl. modular MPL.

In general, at the moment, the situation with pistols designed by D. Lebedev looks good enough and encourages optimism. Several new samples were developed at once. They are being tested and prepared for adoption. During the launch of the series and development in operation, certain difficulties are possible, but they should not have a fatal effect on the course of rearmament. It looks like this time the process of replacing the old PM will lead to the desired results.
Author:
Photos used:
Concern "Kalashnikov", Otvaga2004.ru
99 comments
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  1. Vladimir_2U
    Vladimir_2U 11 March 2021 05: 20
    +1
    Personally, I suspect that the MPL is being adopted, because it is made of iron! The guards will pass it on from generation to generation. laughing
    But seriously, that is, the GSh, it is much easier and it is much more comfortable to carry it, despite the fact that the probability of use is low, it is much more comfortable. I do not concern either the reliability or the quality of the workmanship, I judge strictly by weight.
    1. venik
      venik 11 March 2021 11: 30
      +2
      Quote: Vladimir_2U
      But seriously, that is, the GS, it is much easier and it is much more comfortable to carry it, despite the fact that the probability of use is low, it is much more comfortable.

      ======
      GSh-18 machine is very good, but not for field conditions! For the police (PPP there or traffic cops - that's what you need). But for hidden wearing by operatives it is too big (both in length and in width and in height) - it sticks out more than the PM. At least, one friend of the operas, who shot him, said so: "He would have a smaller magazine - 12 rounds, it would be much better!"
      And, as for "Lebedev", the PLC - in terms of weight and dimensions - almost identical PM.
      1. asura
        asura 11 March 2021 17: 50
        +3
        Quote: venik
        As for Lebedev, the PLC - in terms of weight and dimensions - is almost identical to the PM.

        Let's look at the characteristics of the PLC, which were previously laid out in the public domain. And we see there that the PLC is actually much larger than the PM (almost 2,5 cm longer). At the same time, the barrel of the PLC is even shorter than that of the PM - 92 mm !!! (112 is at full size). How such could have been built, I do not understand. On the face of an irrational design. If this has not been fixed in the latest versions of the pistol, then this is just a guard with understandable consequences for muzzle energy. The Glock 19 is one centimeter shorter than the PLC, while its barrel length is 102 mm. So compare.

        Fussing with the trigger only double action is also past the cash register. This type of trigger on pistols never really took off anywhere in the world. The only plus of Lebedev's pistol is its small thickness.
        1. Vladimir_2U
          Vladimir_2U 12 March 2021 03: 07
          +1
          Quote: asura
          Fiddling with a double-acting trigger only

          Seriously only "Moron action" ?!
          1. asura
            asura 12 March 2021 10: 38
            +1
            Quote: Vladimir_2U
            Seriously only "Moron action" ?!

            Yes. This was the main initial version with a hidden trigger, they did it initially, only then the striker version appeared. Lebedev himself said that the trigger "only double action" was taken as a basis under the influence of Kirisenko, the former sportsman-shooter. What option they end up pushing into government agencies, I do not know, but I'm almost sure that the notorious DAO. The single-action version mentioned in the article was developed purely for the sports version.
      2. Barberry25
        Barberry25 18 May 2021 23: 11
        0
        winked and since when did the GSh-18 become a good pistol?
    2. Bad_gr
      Bad_gr 11 March 2021 14: 45
      +3
      Quote: Vladimir_2U
      Personally, I suspect that the MPL is being adopted, because it is made of iron!

      ..... Different versions of these weapons used aluminum and plastic frames. The design of the new MPL uses plastic.
    3. Mister X
      Mister X 11 March 2021 21: 47
      +1
      The design of the MPL allows the use of different types of trigger mechanisms.
      ... it is possible to introduce an automatic fire mode ...
      Author: Kirill Ryabov

      hi
      Then the shoulder rest had to be developed.
      Like Stechkin pistols (APS) and Beretta 93R


      1. 4thParasinok
        4thParasinok 15 March 2021 17: 20
        0
        Have you seen all the possible body kit for a pistol? Where does the infa come from that it does not exist in principle, or is it from the category: "one grandma said"?
        1. Mister X
          Mister X 15 March 2021 20: 50
          0
          Quote: 4-th Paradise
          Have you seen all the possible body kit for a pistol?

          А YOU have you seen a mention of this in the article?
          Quote: 4-th Paradise
          Where does the infa come from that it does not exist in principle, or is it from the category: "one grandmother said"?

          This is my guess.
          After all, most pistols with an automatic firing mode are equipped with a stock for more accurate fire.
          Mauser or Glock.
          Even the RSh-12 revolver.
          Is not it?
          1. 4thParasinok
            4thParasinok 16 March 2021 12: 27
            0
            now I understood, I did not read it correctly, I saw indignation at the lack of a butt.
            I apologize for being indignant repeat
            1. Mister X
              Mister X 16 March 2021 15: 57
              0
              Quote: 4-th Paradise
              now I understood, I did not read it correctly, I saw indignation at the lack of a butt

              As in that fairy tale: you cannot be pardoned to execute.
              Understand as you know;)
              Quote: 4-th Paradise
              I apologize for being indignant

              Received drinks
  2. Strashila
    Strashila 11 March 2021 05: 38
    +7
    "The MPL pistol is seen as a modern replacement for the PM's cash products", another verbal nonsense, for which the PM, and not the PMM, as I remember, lost in an open competition in the 90s.
    This is the one that will be on the "replacement of the PM".
    1. Uncle lee
      Uncle lee 11 March 2021 05: 57
      +2
      Quote: Strashila
      modern replacement

      Would change immediately to Mauser! belay
      1. Abalon
        Abalon 11 March 2021 08: 53
        -4
        Do you think that the Military Review site is a platform for your banter?
        1. Uncle lee
          Uncle lee 11 March 2021 09: 25
          +11
          - I understood what your trouble is. You are too serious. A serious face is not yet a sign of intelligence, gentlemen. All nonsense on Earth is done with this expression. You smile, gentlemen. Smile!
          lol
          1. novel66
            novel66 11 March 2021 17: 36
            -2
            The development of the MPL product did not take long.

            of course, the glock has long been known
            Volodya hi
            1. Uncle lee
              Uncle lee 12 March 2021 01: 10
              0
              Novel hi You haven't been there for a long time ...
          2. 4thParasinok
            4thParasinok 15 March 2021 17: 23
            +1
            Quote: Uncle Lee
            All nonsense on Earth is done with this expression. You smile, gentlemen. Smile!

            and with a smile, most of the meanness ...
            1. Uncle lee
              Uncle lee 16 March 2021 01: 05
              0
              Quote: 4-th Paradise
              most of the meanest ...

              Meanness is worse than stupidity ...
        2. 4thParasinok
          4thParasinok 15 March 2021 17: 22
          +1
          the number of minuses and shows how many windbags have started on the site ...
          1. Uncle lee
            Uncle lee 16 March 2021 01: 06
            0
            Quote: 4-th Paradise
            wind chimes started ...

            More than we imagine! hi
            1. 4thParasinok
              4thParasinok 16 March 2021 12: 29
              +1
              That's why I began to look at the site for a week in six months repeat
    2. venik
      venik 11 March 2021 11: 49
      +1
      Quote: Strashila
      another verbal nonsense, for which the PM, and not the PMM, how many remember he lost in an open competition in the 90s

      ======
      The PMM, like the PM, has the main drawback - a weak cartridge. Even reinforced cartridge 9x19 PMM with a light bullet and reinforced powder charge - not capable of penetrating "armor". Another disadvantage of the reinforced cartridge is that its (out of stupidity) can be shoved into the store of an ordinary MP, which can lead to extremely unpleasant consequences. And so, the PMM did not have any special (fundamental advantages) in comparison with the PM. Therefore, it did not receive wide distribution ...
      1. Strashila
        Strashila 11 March 2021 12: 03
        0
        "not capable of punching" armor ", who said that he does not punch, the question is at what distance.
        1. 4thParasinok
          4thParasinok 15 March 2021 17: 25
          0
          Quote: Strashila
          "not capable of punching" armor ", who said that he does not punch, the question is at what distance.

          you also clarify about the first class ...
      2. Narak-zempo
        Narak-zempo 11 March 2021 14: 36
        +1
        Quote: venik
        not able to penetrate "armor"

        Let them learn headshots.
      3. Intruder
        Intruder 11 March 2021 16: 05
        +3
        9x18 mm. PM, and should not penetrate "armored vehicles", it is for use on the streets, with minimal recocheting factors, for the civilian population on the streets, do you want to raise the collateral damage with armor-piercing during shooting, in alleys and buildings with monolithic walls !?
        Even a reinforced 9x19 PMM cartridge with a light bullet and a reinforced powder charge
        But this, indeed, a surrogate version of the ammunition, for a confident defeat of a bio-target with a NIB at a short distance, has long been 9x21 mm., With a reinforced core, and a short barrel for it!
        1. venik
          venik 11 March 2021 17: 37
          +2
          Quote: Intruder
          9x18 mm. PM, and should not penetrate "armored vehicles", it is for use on the streets, with minimal recocheting factors, for the civilian population on the streets, do you want to raise the collateral damage with armor-piercing during shooting, in alleys and buildings with monolithic walls !?

          ======
          First: PM - so far not only a policeman pistol, for "shooting on the streets and in buildings, but also an army one for use in field conditions !!! (now it is partially replaced, but not everywhere and not always - it is still far from complete replacement ...). But the Army needs the ability to hit targets through the "armor" and at a distance more 50 m.
          Second - I would not say that standard 9x18 bullets are so "ricochet-free". Ricochet and not weak! Simply due to the weak cartridge and the low speed of the bullet after the rebound, the damaging effect is less.
          ------
          Quote: Intruder
          Even a reinforced 9x19 PMM cartridge with a light bullet and a reinforced powder charge
          but this, indeed a surrogate version of the ammunition, for a confident defeat of a bio-target with a NIB at a short distance, has long been 9x21 mm., with a reinforced core

          =======
          Certainly! 9x19 PMM is an insufficient surrogate for the aircraft. The 9x21 cartridge is good. But this is more a special forces weapon: there is a very strong recoil, and the pistols for it ("Gyurza" / "Vector") are too tazhelovat. The "boa constrictor" is really easier, but also more likely a weapon of the special services and special forces! It is just for 9x21 and 9x19 that "ricochet" cartridges have been created, especially for actions in buildings and on the street ...
          drinks
          1. Intruder
            Intruder 11 March 2021 17: 52
            0
            Mutually... drinks Well, with 9x21 recoil, you can fight with proven design solutions, there are no fundamental restrictions with this, and high costs too !? Plus, the ammunition for the police can be their own, expansive with a lower charge of propelling explosives and a ballistic polymer tip on the "head". Even, I think you shouldn't dive into the question, what is it for !? In addition, a corresponding not frail groundwork opens up for compact small arms, and namely, for: the Ministry of Internal Affairs and the National Guard and others, in the region and the PP! winked
            And criminals, now they can simply walk with protection in the form of "light armor" hidden under outerwear, but here 9x18 and 9x19, they can already lose, a little like this ... stopping effect, with a corresponding over-blocking effect on the carcass ...
            1. venik
              venik 12 March 2021 11: 31
              +3
              Greetings, Denis! hi
              -----
              Quote: Intruder
              Well, with 9x21 recoil, you can fight with proven design solutions, there are no fundamental restrictions with this, and high costs as well !?

              =======
              Well, this is a difficult question! For example, the phenomenal reliability of the "Kalash" in the field is due precisely to the fact that all moving parts come to extreme positions on high speed! The pay off for this is the strong recoil and the "shaking" of the weapon. In the M-16, on the contrary, and as a result, the recoil is weak, the weapon is stable when firing, but terribly capricious!
              ---------
              Quote: Intruder
              crime, now it can simply walk with protection in the form of "light armor" hidden under outerwear, but here 9x18 and 9x19, they can already lose, a little

              ========
              A somewhat controversial statement:

              Here is for reference:
              Penetration data for pistol cartridges of various calibers:
              - 9 × 19 mm 7N21 penetrates 4 mm of steel at 55 m (80%);
              - 9 × 19 mm 7N30 penetrates 4 mm of steel at 60 m (80%);
              - 9 × 18 mm 7N25 penetrates 5 mm of steel at 10 m (100%);
              - 9 × 21 mm 7N29 penetrates 5 mm of steel at 40 m (80%);
              - 9 × 19 mm 7N31 penetrates 8 mm of steel at 10 m (100%).
              So, as can be seen from the plate, the armor penetration of 7N21 and 7N30 (9x19 mm) is not very different from 7N29 (9x21 mm) ....
              drinks
              1. Intruder
                Intruder 12 March 2021 13: 55
                +1
                My Respect, Vladimir !!! hi
                Well, look, at 9x21 mm. (7N29) - 5 mm. at 40 m distance, and at 9x19 (7Н31) - 8 mm., at 10 m., and it depends on what kind of armored structures and materials are used in the NIB, the averaged data give large errors, so 100% will never be there, even when shooting "at the boards" !? laughing Plus, the difference in the flight speed of the striking element, especially when "meeting" the soft tissues of the bio-target, with the subsequent hydroshock of these tissues, well, that's it, a little hint ... winked
                By the way, an interesting question is what the shooter will choose, even the "potential" possibility of a confident defeat at 40 meters, or only 10 meters, psychologically and not only .., I say from my experience in the past ... and without sarcasm! Although at real combat distances with the use of a short-barreled and in self-defense - up to 10 m, everything happens in 90% of cases!
                The price to be paid for this is the strong recoil and the "shaking" of the weapon. The M-16 has - on the contrary, and as a result, the recoil is weak, the weapon is stable when firing, but terribly capricious!
                Have you worked with AR-15, or M-16 !? If yes ... then you might have noticed interesting "things" a subtle hint of the barrel and other design differences, which are not in civilian products ... (at least at a shooting range in "room" conditions, with good ammunition ...), M-16, a slightly different militarized version of the basic design of the ARC, and many capriciousness grows from the manufacturer's "terry marketing", in the past, for example:
                The path of the AR-15 / M16 rifles in the armed forces was not easy due to reliability problems. To equip the cartridges supplied to the Armed Forces, they began to use cheap gunpowder, which gave a large amount of carbon deposits that settled in the gas outlet system, the bolt group and the receiver of the weapon. As a result, the soldiers did not receive adequate training in the care of these weapons. All these factors, combined with the humid climate of Vietnam, led to frequent delays in firing in combat conditions and significant losses of the American army in manpower. The situation was corrected by an investigation by a commission under the US Congress.
                So the dogs are buried, only the "tails" stick out, if you do not go into the gloomy technical details, which are also a lot of AKashnykh, especially in real conditions, and not what is shown in test labs!
                1. venik
                  venik 12 March 2021 15: 40
                  +1
                  Quote: Intruder
                  Have you worked with AR-15, or M-16 !?

                  ========
                  Honestly - neither one nor the other! An old friend of mine worked with them, who served in one "tricky" unit ... They "fired" different types of weapons there in conditions "as close as possible to combat". Itself during the "deadline" fired only from the PM, a couple of times APS and TT, well, of course, but AKM and AKMS.
                  -------
                  Quote: Intruder
                  Here are the dogs buried, only the "tails" stick out

                  =======
                  Yes, there seems to be problems not only in gunpowder .... I remember a year and a half or two ago a transmission from Afghanistan passed: there the Yankees checkpoint was besieged by the Mujahideen. The fight lasted 40 minutes .... From an interview with an American fighter: "...After 10 minutes of battle, when they used up 3-4 stores, our M-4s overheated and started jam (!!!). ..." I just ofigel! To AKM "wedge" after shooting 3-4 magazines? And even in 10 minutes? belay
                  1. Intruder
                    Intruder 12 March 2021 17: 08
                    +1
                    From an interview with an American soldier: "... After 10 minutes of battle, when they used up 3-4 stores, our M-4s overheated and began to jam
                    this happens with the M4 and not only with him, by the way ... it even happens when all sorts of fighters disdain to clean it (new ones, especially in the arsenal) from conservation, for which they are very fond of chasing the sergeant staff in our way ... angry
                    And there is a wedge, even from banal particles of sand and finely dispersed dust, for Afghanistan, by the way, normal climatic conditions ...
                    1. Intruder
                      Intruder 12 March 2021 17: 23
                      +1
                      by the way, it was and I have to repent of it request , at the dawn - so to speak, weapon gouging, with a self-loading system, I never thought myself that dust and dirt particles (it was scrapped, with a nagging new barrel ...), with conservation, but when heated during firing (more precisely, when cooling down for short periods of time, they mix well from vibration load and can effectively clog the given gaps, such structural elements that you would not think) give such wonderful "plugs" and all kinds of disturbances in the work of the kinematics of your favorite weapon ...
                    2. venik
                      venik 12 March 2021 17: 55
                      +1
                      Quote: Intruder
                      it even happens here when all sorts of soldiers disdain it (especially new ones in the arsenal) to clean it from conservation, for which they are very fond of chasing the sergeant staff in our way ...

                      =======
                      Yeah! Fighters - they are! Today I read in one of the comments: "...There are not so many "fools" in the Army, but they are somehow so cunningly distributed that it seems as if they are everywhere! .." laughing
                      ---------
                      Quote: Intruder
                      And there is a wedge, even from banal particles of sand and finely dispersed dust, for Afghanistan, by the way, normal climatic conditions ...

                      ========
                      And not only in Afghanistan, not only! Although for AKM, in similar conditions, 5-6 stores in 5-7 minutes is "ugh"!
                      soldier
                      1. Intruder
                        Intruder 12 March 2021 18: 10
                        +1
                        Although for AKM, in similar conditions, 5-6 stores in 5-7 minutes is "ugh"!
                        perhaps, I admit that with its design (I mean exactly the Soviet models, and not the Chinese or Romanian clones, with Iranian "sharpened brick" trunks ...), and with the straight arms of a soldier, with rags wink , it will withstand and not only 5-6 horns from the belly, with a long line ...
                      2. venik
                        venik 12 March 2021 20: 39
                        0
                        Quote: Intruder
                        perhaps, I admit that with its design (I mean exactly the Soviet models, and not the Chinese or Romanian clones, with Iranian "sharpened brick" trunks ...), and with the straight arms of a soldier, with rags

                        ========
                        Ooh! About Romanian and Chinese - I can not say anything: I just heard this is complete bullshit! And the Soviet ones - yes! As they say in Odessa: "You take it in your hands - maesh thing!" good Well, of course, you have to follow, especially when during a storm this damn sand even manages to seep into sealed volumes (it is not clear how!).
                        --------
                        Quote: Intruder
                        it will withstand and not only 5-6 horns from the belly, with a long queue ...

                        ========
                        Honestly - I never tried "from the belly", and I didn't shoot "long" either, it's just an absolutely useless waste of cartridges (usually 2-3, maximum 4 shots - then the "Kalash" still leads to the side), but almost 6 " horns "short and very fast" Kalash "keeps without problems! Checked!
              2. psiho117
                psiho117 13 March 2021 22: 07
                +1
                Quote: Intruder
                an interesting question, what the shooter will choose, even the "potential" possibility of a confident defeat at 40 m, or only at 10 m,

                At a distance of up to 25m (the most popular for a pistol), the 7N31 surpasses all other pistol cartridges available in Russia - thanks to its light, high-speed bullet.
                True, after 25m - it is inferior to 7N21, again, because of a light bullet. However, this is still enough for confident penetration of a class 2a bulletproof vest, at 25 meters.


                According to the results of state tests, it is clear that 7N31 cartridges are most effective when firing at unprotected targets. On protected - at ranges up to 25 meters.

                There is also a rather big problem: the 7N31 is the brainchild of the KBP, and only the Tula GSh-18 and PP-2000 can confidently "feed" on it (But Glock-17 - calmly shoots even the newer 7N31M bully ).
                And then, even in units armed with this weapon, this cartridge is rare (I'm not talking about the new 7N31M).
                And his core is very prone to ricocheting, although on cartridges 7N21 and SP-10 - this has long been fixed request
                So, in fact, we have not even two, but three different, non-interchangeable types of cartridges:
                pr-v TsNIITOCHMASH 9x21mm SP-10 (7N29) and
                9x19mm 7N21, and Tula 9x19mm 7N31.
        2. garri-lin
          garri-lin 11 March 2021 23: 52
          0
          All the salt is available. It is impossible to confidently hit the armor at 50 meters without recoil. The perfect pistol won't work. PMM by the way as an army was not even very bad. 15 -20 meters distance. On the big one you need to shoot from the main weapon.
          1. venik
            venik 12 March 2021 12: 00
            +2
            Quote: garri-lin
            It is impossible to confidently hit the armor at 50 meters without recoil. The perfect pistol won't work.

            ========
            Ideal - does not exist at all!
            ---------
            Quote: garri-lin
            PMM by the way as an army was not even very bad. 15 -20 meters distance.

            ========
            And how, in fact, PMM differs in performance characteristics from PM? Yes, without a cartridge 9x18 PMM - in general, NOTHING! And the same PLC, with the same mass-dimensional characteristics and range, has greater armor penetration, too!
            By the way - with a lightweight cartridge 7N31 and the recoil is small, and at short distances it has an awesome armor penetration! request
            1. garri-lin
              garri-lin 12 March 2021 16: 52
              +1
              Structurally, there are differences in the strength of some elements. And that's all. And I meant for my time. A couple of decades ago.
            2. psiho117
              psiho117 13 March 2021 22: 20
              +1
              Quote: venik
              with a lightweight cartridge 7N31 and recoil has a small

              You are mistaken - the recoil there is not "small" at all, it feels like recoil from it at the level of .45 automatic transmission.
              1. venik
                venik 14 March 2021 11: 04
                +1
                Quote: psiho117
                You are mistaken - the recoil there is not "small" at all, it feels like recoil from it at the level of .45 automatic transmission.

                =======
                So in .45 ACP just recoil and small, due to the low initial speed of the bullet! True and penetrating action: it does not penetrate a thick board, not like a "armor"
    3. hhurik
      hhurik 12 March 2021 11: 36
      +3
      Generally, PMM is produced and purchased up to the present time. Recently, the state procurement site in terms of weapons has been closed from public access.
      In 2015-2016 (when it was opened) there was an order for 800 PMM pistols for the FSIN. Around the same time, at the PMM for the FSO.
  3. Intruder
    Intruder 11 March 2021 16: 01
    0
    This is the one that will be on the "replacement of the PM".
    this is in the area of ​​dimensionless quantities! wink
  4. psiho117
    psiho117 11 March 2021 22: 46
    +1
    PM was replaced by PMM, then PMM was removed (because of the morons shoving the wrong cartridges into PM), then replaced by Yarygin.
    Now they are changing to Lebedev.
    Wangyu, not the last time hi
    1. Alexfly
      Alexfly 17 March 2021 11: 34
      0
      Here, interestingly, all the same .. The Czechs created their own "analogue" of the PM CZ-82, and the cartridges were released for them reinforced, and for some reason, it did not crumble, but the PM from reinforced yes .... Strange as that ..
      1. psiho117
        psiho117 18 March 2021 02: 37
        0
        this did not always happen - nevertheless, PM - PMu strife.
        We have a very different quality of weapons of different years of production, and there were pistols that calmly fired a non-standard cartridge, and there were those that tore off their fingers.
        Since there were no solutions to the first Russian problem, and there is still no - they decided, out of sin, to stop the production of reinforced cartridges.
        And then, some zealous ones also decided to cover up the PMM ...
        What for? Unclear...
  • Vadim Ananyin
    Vadim Ananyin 11 March 2021 06: 39
    +3
    In our country, each department wants its own, the border guards are one thing, the Ministry of Internal Affairs is different, the FSB wants something else.
    Hence such confusion and vacillation on the sides, in types and designs.
    But there are no universal tools either.
    1. Simargl
      Simargl 11 March 2021 07: 53
      0
      Quote: Vadim Ananyin
      In our country, each department wants its own, the border guards are one thing, the Ministry of Internal Affairs is different, the FSB wants something else.
      Well at least there are only two cartridges (well, three, if you take into account 9x18)
      1. Bad_gr
        Bad_gr 11 March 2021 11: 00
        +3
        Quote: Simargl
        Well at least there are only two cartridges (well, three, if you take into account 9x18)

        We still have the vohravtsy armed with a service pistol MP-71 9x17 (in appearance, a copy of the PM). It is chambered for 9x17.
        1. Simargl
          Simargl 11 March 2021 11: 30
          0
          Quote: Bad_gr
          It is chambered for 9x17
          Then let's remember 5,45x18 ... Why?
      2. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 11 March 2021 13: 37
        +1
        Quote: Simargl
        Well at least there are only two cartridges (well, three, if you take into account 9x18)

        Oh?
        ==========
        Quote: Bad_gr
        We still have the vohravtsy armed with a service pistol MP-71 9x17 (in appearance, a copy of the PM). It is chambered for 9x17.

        Add:
        In Russia, the 9x17 cartridge has been produced since 1994 and is known as 9x17 "K" or "Kurz", which means "short" in German. The cartridge is filled with gunpowder for sporting cartridges of the CCN 22 / 4,87 brand - the first letter means the purpose of the gunpowder (C - for small arms), the second - the shape of the powder grain (C - spheroid), the third - the presence of nitroglycerin (H), 22 - thickness of the burning arch (0,22 mm), 4,87 - specific heat of combustion MJ / kg. The bullet consists of a steel clad with tombak and a lead core. After the certification of the 9x17 cartridge in Russia, it was adopted as a service ammunition, and a modification of the PM pistol under the designation IZH-71, service pistols "P-96S", "OTs-21S" ("Kid"), service revolvers "R-92S", "RSA", "RSL" and other models of service weapons. In Russia, cartridges 9x17 "K" are found with copper-clad steel sleeves, brass-plated and with a phosphate-polymer coating. Cartridges are packed in cardboard boxes of 35 or 50 pieces.
        Source: http://www.dogswar.ru/boepripasy/patrony/7869-pistoletnyi-patron-9.html © dogswar.ru

        ==========
        In addition, there is:
        1. Simargl
          Simargl 11 March 2021 14: 14
          +2
          I spoke of two +1 as 9x19, which the world cannot get away from, because the balance, about 9x21, as a promising one, and about 9x18 - it's clear here.
          1. 4thParasinok
            4thParasinok 15 March 2021 17: 45
            +1
            Quote: Simargl
            I spoke as about 9x19, from which the world cannot get away from it, because the balance,

            a controversial statement, especially if you look at what methods are used to increase the power of the cartridge. Even 40 years ago, it was necessary to switch to a sleeve extended by 3-4 mm. Well, and accordingly a redesigned bottom. Bullets leave relatives. As a result, the characteristics will turn out to be something between 9x22 (ZIG) and 9x19.
            Quote: Simargl
            about 9x21, as a promising

            Controversial statement. its only purpose is to make holes in the armor. At the same time, there is too much recoil, about the same as in 9x22.
            1. Simargl
              Simargl 16 March 2021 03: 53
              0
              Quote: 4-th Paradise
              At the same time, too much recoil
              I didn’t shoot much with 9 mm, but it seemed that the PM kicked and carried away more than the Taurus PT 1911 under 9x19, although the mass of the latter was not much greater.
              I would like the COP to be allowed on the hunt as a second barrel, for example. But with a cartridge of type 9x21, but under 1000 J.
              1. 4thParasinok
                4thParasinok 16 March 2021 12: 45
                +1
                Quote: Simargl
                I didn't shoot much with 9mm

                I am not strong either: Margolin, TT, PM, R-38, Izh-71 ... Well, and even so, on the little things repeat
                Quote: Simargl
                I would like the COP to be allowed on the hunt as a second barrel, for example. But with a cartridge of type 9x21, but under 1000 J.

                hunting pistols are a good thing, but the cartridge should be selected based on the future target. What's wrong with the .22 WMR with the .22 Hornet or the .44 Magnum? But in the USA there are hunting pistols and for more powerful cartridges, including rifle cartridges. And here's a link to the description of the .357 Magnum, see the specs yes https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/.357_Magnum
                1. Simargl
                  Simargl 16 March 2021 16: 06
                  0
                  Quote: 4-th Paradise
                  but the cartridge must be selected based on the future target.
                  Bears / wolves / wild boars, etc.
                  A bear went to our country house (this winter) ...
                  Not far from the city, a bear lifted up a woman (in the summer) ...
                  So ... as a weapon of a mushroom picker / fisherman / berry picker / hiker - why not an option? Hence the "excess" power.
                  Quote: 4-th Paradise
                  What's wrong with the .22 WMR with the .22 Hornet or the .44 Magnum?
                  .22 WMR p .22 Hornet - to defend against roe deer? Or Pallas' cat?
                  .44 Magnum - suits everyone, only the barrel is heavy (we assume that it is the second one?) ... to shoot ...

                  Quote: 4-th Paradise
                  in the USA there are hunting pistols and for more powerful cartridges, including rifle cartridges.
                  As far as I know, for rifle cartridges - revolvers and single-shot pistols ... there is even a single-shot one for 7,62x39 ...

                  By the way, .357_Magnum also did not impress in terms of recoil, although it was "threatened" that it almost jumps out of hand. But the gas breakthrough impressed. Of the revolvers I consider suitable - only "fractures" of the MP-412 Rex type, but with large cartridges it is better to have the barrel in front of the lower chamber.
                  You can also make a pistol under .357_Magnum - the cartridge is about 5,7x28 in length, for a single-row magazine for 7-10 rounds - the most that.
                  1. 4thParasinok
                    4thParasinok 16 March 2021 17: 40
                    0
                    Quote: Simargl
                    for rifle cartridges - revolvers and single-shot pistols

                    not true, there are even bolt-ons with magazines of 5-10 rounds. usually made from rifles. They shorten the barrel, cut the butt and put the pistol grip. And everything is direct at the factory., I forgot, the shutter is mirrored in order to reload with the left hand. American cut laughing
                    Quote: Simargl
                    but with large cartridges it is better that the barrel is in front of the lower chamber.

                    duck there is RSh-12 with a cartridge 12,7x55. Any bear ****. Recently I saw a video of a civilian carbine based on this revolver.
                    In the USA, such revolvers and pistols are worn on the chest, across. the weight is on the shoulders and not on the belt.
                    Quote: Simargl
                    Under .357_Magnum, you can make a pistol

                    already has Desert Eagle has a modification. With a light frame it weighs 1,7 kg, and with a steel frame all 2. Capacity - 9 rounds. Watch the shooting video - you don't want to. the easiest way (in terms of weight and size) is a single-barreled fracture. And if for bears, then for Alaska they make special models of revolvers for different cartridges, including those specially designed on the basis of rifle cartridges. One of these Cruz described in "Hops and Klondike", like in book 3.
                    1. Simargl
                      Simargl 16 March 2021 20: 32
                      0
                      Quote: 4-th Paradise
                      American cut
                      It is, nevertheless, a sawn-off shotgun ... although they have everything with a barrel less than 415 mm - a "pistol".
                      Quote: 4-th Paradise
                      duck there is RSh-12 with a cartridge 12,7x55

                      Quote: 4-th Paradise
                      already has Desert Eagle has a modification. With a light frame it weighs 1,7 kg, and with a steel frame all 2. Capacity - 9 rounds.
                      They are heavy, though. Although 12,7x55 is better than 9mm, albeit a re-magnum.
                      Quote: 4-th Paradise
                      And if for bears, then for Alaska they make special models of revolvers for different cartridges, including those specially designed on the basis of rifle cartridges.
                      There is a ma-a-a-scarlet cartridge 10 mm Auto - with all my hands I am FOR it!
                      1. 4thParasinok
                        4thParasinok 16 March 2021 22: 40
                        0
                        Quote: Simargl
                        It is, nevertheless, a sawn-off shotgun ... although they have everything with a barrel less than 415 mm - a "pistol".

                        not a sawn-off shotgun, this is a pistol with a swivel-type bolt on the basis of a rifle, I will even give the bolt a mirror to open it with my left hand, and not with my right, as in bolts. And remember the Reiter pistols. There, the barrel length reached 400 millimeters, but it was precisely a pistol.
                      2. Simargl
                        Simargl 16 March 2021 23: 05
                        0
                        Quote: 4-th Paradise
                        There, the barrel length reached 400 millimeters, but it was precisely a pistol.
                        so up to 400 mm, not 415+ tongue
                        Otherwise, it turns out that a shotgun with a pistol grip is also a pistol.
  • vvnab
    vvnab 11 March 2021 09: 15
    +1
    Why is there 7H21 and not 7H31 everywhere? The latter seems to be more "advanced" ... Or not? Can anyone explain? I just stumbled upon an article somewhere where the cartridges were compared and it seems like the 7N21 and the breakdown action is lower and there are problems with ricocheting.
    1. vvnab
      vvnab 11 March 2021 09: 29
      0
      ... plus "Razvedos" once talked about the PP-2000 and said that the 7N21 did not "digest" well, but how was it back? Is 7N31 suitable for Izhevsk products?
  • Glory1974
    Glory1974 11 March 2021 10: 23
    0
    Now dissatisfied with the regime will pounce on the National Guard and begin to accuse it of trying to buy several types of pistols, instead of raising pensions.
  • gorenina91
    gorenina91 11 March 2021 10: 26
    +2
    - Strange ... - could show a video where they shoot from this pistol ... - and instead, the photo shows a group of people ... - And several photos with the image of the pistol itself ... - Is there enough information to have idea of ​​this weapon ???
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Catfish
    Catfish 11 March 2021 11: 50
    +3
    In general, at the moment, the situation with pistols designed by D. Lebedev looks good enough and encourages optimism.

    This, or something like that, I read a few years ago, but things are still there and still "dispose to optimism." request
    1. psiho117
      psiho117 11 March 2021 22: 52
      +2
      Quote: Sea Cat
      but things are still there and still "dispose to optimism"

      Moreover, the situation with the PJ was also "conducive to optimism."
      And how it came to the series - the marriage went on marriage.
      Only now, after so many years, we have more or less established a high-quality production.
      Chot tells me that the submarine will still walk on this rake ...
  • evgen1221
    evgen1221 11 March 2021 12: 00
    +2
    There is an army, there is a Ministry of Internal Affairs, and the National Guards for me look like a personal pocket army in the system of security officials.
    1. Catfish
      Catfish 11 March 2021 17: 26
      +2
      ... the National Guards for me look like a personal pocket army in the system of security officials.


      Exactly, Praetorians.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • V.I.P.
    V.I.P. 11 March 2021 13: 21
    -2
    we shall have a mi ilse
  • Alexfly
    Alexfly 11 March 2021 17: 23
    0
    A lousy pistol, you can't crack the nuts ... Whether it's an old and faithful PM ...
  • Split
    Split 11 March 2021 18: 26
    -2
    Excellent modularity ... interchangeable barrel drinks this modularity was created 120 years ago with a short barrel stroke, because it is not physically fixed statically on the frame ... put what you want, there would be equipment and rights to manufacture weapons
    In general, nothing new, another replacement of PM (s)
    It makes sense only if it surpasses the PM in reliability, and so it will remain a single one ala GSh-18 ...
    ZY Regarding the General Staff, I planted ... it would be better if they only made aircraft cannons
    1. psiho117
      psiho117 11 March 2021 22: 56
      +2
      Quote: Split
      Regarding the General Staff, I laid ...

      By itself, Gryazev-Shipunov is not bad - but everything is killed by his "super-hot" cartridge - recoil, with such a low weight, is too high. No controllability for you, no smooth transfer of fire.
      And the sleeves for the collar, here they are - infuriate most of all! wassat
      1. Split
        Split 12 March 2021 14: 17
        0
        I agree, the shells are enraged, but the recoil is acceptable, at the level of 1911, but I would not take it and agree with me, or I agree ... I would not take it into battle, this is not the last pistol ... ..... Thank God it did not come to "stacking" then
    2. 4thParasinok
      4thParasinok 15 March 2021 17: 50
      +1
      Quote: Split
      this modularity was created 120 years ago

      you first read it to the end, although ... no, don't, otherwise suddenly you will not only become a writer ...
  • senima56
    senima56 11 March 2021 19: 49
    +1
    For several years in a row I have heard "a pistol to replace the PM"! Since 2003, when the PYa, SPS and GSh-18 were adopted. Last year "Boa constrictor", "Aspid", "Poloz". Now here is the MPL (PLC). "And things are still there" - in the PM Army! Until I see a new pistol in the holsters of active officers, all this is just another chatter!
    1. Avior
      Avior 11 March 2021 22: 48
      +4
      most likely because the other is really simply not needed.
      The PM as a personal weapon is quite suitable, although it is morally outdated, and the combat use of a pistol, when the enemy troops are saturated with automatic weapons, is a very dubious pleasure.
    2. psiho117
      psiho117 11 March 2021 23: 08
      +1
      Quote: senima56
      Since 2003, when the PYa, SPS and GSh-18 were adopted. Last year "Boa constrictor", "Aspid", "Poloz". Now here is the MPL (PLC)

      And also "Swift" really, really wanted to "replace the PM".
      And if you count before 2003, then there were several more pistols ("Varyag", "Bagheera"), some are even in service, and are purchased (P-96M) or purchased, and are available in some units ("Berdysh") .. ...
      1. senima56
        senima56 12 March 2021 17: 49
        -1
        I agree with you. I just didn’t "load" readers with a "full list". I myself have been closely following the topic "Modern Russian small arms" for a long time. As for "Swift" (aka "Strike-one"), this is generally a "sore" topic. I remember how he was praised and "licked" on all channels and programs like "Military Secret" and "Serving the Fatherland". They said that it was "created by order of the special forces, taking into account their wishes." And this pistol suited everyone, and everyone liked it ....., but suddenly, for some reason (??? !!!), it did not pass the State Tests! Yes, the pistol was created jointly by the Italians, but the pistol turned out to be excellent and now it is being successfully sold abroad. I understand perfectly well that the Ministry of Defense wants to have its own, 100% domestic pistol, so as not to depend on sanctions, etc. But why not announce it right away? And how long did it take to create the next "PM replacement" ?! And how much will be spent on rearmament. I am amazed and annoyed by the slowness of the current designers. If at one time Kalashnikov, Korolev and others worked the same way as the current ones, they would still go in the Army with PPSh, and launch Belka with Strelka into space!
        1. Intruder
          Intruder 13 March 2021 22: 51
          -2
          would still go to the Army with PPSh
          Well, this PP is pretty good, and even more so if you make it a modern custom ...! winked
          1. 4thParasinok
            4thParasinok 15 March 2021 17: 57
            +1
            controversial statement. I prefer Vityaz. I had to shoot from both, that's why I say. But custom will not save you, you need to redo the entire structure. Only the thickness of the walls of the frame of a millimeter in 3 is worth (for Bizon-Vityaz-AK it is 1,2 mm), and shooting from the rear sear?
            1. Intruder
              Intruder 15 March 2021 19: 19
              0
              and shooting from the rear sear?
              And what happened to him!?
              This provides protection against overheating and ignition of the cartridge, since the chamber is "ventilated" and cannot heat up intensively in the automatic mode of fire. Such a constructive solution is found in many types of PCBs. The design is simple and inexpensive to perform, especially in mass production, so it is still relevant ... But also, firing from an open bolt has a significant drawback - this is a decrease in hitting accuracy relative to the position with the bolt closed .., by the way, the most "tricky drawback ", but it can be leveled by not very complex constructive additions ...
              1. 4thParasinok
                4thParasinok 16 March 2021 12: 14
                +1
                Quote: Intruder
                This provides protection against overheating and ignition of the cartridge, since the chamber is "ventilated" and cannot heat up intensively, in the automatic mode of fire

                do not confuse with machine guns. In the PPSh, the striker is rigidly fixed to the bolt and there is no trigger. This is what explains the shooting from the rear sear. And the bolt weighing 800 grams is much heavier than the machine gun, and the machine gun itself is heavier than the PPSh. Explain what this means? Press the butt a little weaker and the bullet goes down.
                1. Intruder
                  Intruder 16 March 2021 13: 48
                  0
                  And the bolt weighing 800 grams is much heavier than a machine gun, and the machine gun itself is heavier than the PPSh
                  this is a constructive necessity of this system, because -
                  When firing, the barrel bore was locked with a free bolt mass, which was compressed by a spring (reciprocating combat).
                  1. 4thParasinok
                    4thParasinok 16 March 2021 14: 09
                    +1
                    Quote: Intruder
                    this is a constructive need for this system

                    and what does this have to do with:
                    Protection against overheating and ignition of the cartridge, since the chamber is "ventilated" and cannot heat up intensively during automatic fire mode.

                    No need not to deliberately repeat general words about weapons without thinking about what it has to do with this sample. Shooting from the rear sear is a forced step to simplify the whole structure. And this step reduces the accuracy of shooting for weapons that do not have a machine tool or, in extreme cases, a bipod. Plus it carries a bunch of other disadvantages. And there are only 2 pluses. Low cost of production and the minimum number of machines with professional workers. Yes, this is significant, but during the Second World War, I would have preferred Beretta. It is a pity that we only had them as trophies at 44. Now, if you combine the PPSh AND the Beretta (I don’t remember the model of the 40th year), then it would have turned out to be a really super-duper thing ...
                    1. Intruder
                      Intruder 16 March 2021 15: 19
                      0
                      No need not to deliberately repeat general words about weapons without thinking about what it has to do with this sample
                      it is better not to say what to do and how, to a stranger, and maybe then - you will not receive ... something in return !? request
                      And there are only 2 pluses. Low cost of production and the minimum number of machines with professional workers. Yes, it is essential
                      and answered themselves in their own reasoning ... wink
                      Yes, this is significant, but during the Second World War, I would have preferred Beretta.
                      you, most likely - yes, but these are thoughts in the future, so to speak, a descendant of modern times ... who knows all the mistakes of the past ... and at that time this was not yet, although it is always a good idea to come after, and this is already story... winked
                2. Intruder
                  Intruder 16 March 2021 13: 49
                  0
                  In the PPSh, the striker is rigidly fixed to the bolt and there is no trigger.
                  So what!? Another feature for a PP of the time !? wink
                  1. 4thParasinok
                    4thParasinok 16 March 2021 15: 34
                    +1
                    how hard it is with people who don't even want to think about their own words ...
                    1. Intruder
                      Intruder 16 March 2021 16: 15
                      0
                      how hard it is with people who don't even want to think about their own words ...
                      Completely with you, I agree !!! Especially with those who immediately begin to indicate what to do and how to think ... recourse and further down the list, by the way, I'm probably the only one here who molds pluses for you ... wink laughing
                    2. Alexfly
                      Alexfly 16 March 2021 20: 50
                      0
                      But the chamber really cools down when firing from the sear, it’s empty for some time, as the interlocutor said, it is ventilated ...
            2. Intruder
              Intruder 15 March 2021 19: 21
              0
              Only the thickness of the walls of the frame of a millimeter in 3 is worth
              but here, in more detail than the thickness did not please, when using, plizz !?
              1. 4thParasinok
                4thParasinok 16 March 2021 13: 56
                +1
                what did you not please? yes overweight. The design allows you to reduce the wall thickness to 1,5-1,7 mm. And when using "cheap" steels in production - 2 mm., And not 3,5-4 mm as it was.
                1. Intruder
                  Intruder 16 March 2021 15: 15
                  0
                  The design allows you to reduce the wall thickness to 1,5-1,7 mm. And when using "cheap" steels in production - 2 mm., And not 3,5-4 mm as it was.
                  you lived in that era to claim what has already been done and tested in real combat conditions ..!? If they did so, in wartime already, then there were reasons for this, even if there were "cheap steel alloys" !!!
                  1. 4thParasinok
                    4thParasinok April 14 2021 17: 05
                    0
                    Quote: Intruder
                    you lived in that era to declare what has already been done and tested in real combat conditions ..!?

                    Well, firstly, it was done and passed the test before the beginning of the Second World War. And secondly, did you hold the PPSh in your hands? Personally, I do, and the first time it was back in the 70s ...
                    Oh, and yes, measure the thickness of the walls of the PPS and AK frames, be surprised.
  • puskarinkis
    puskarinkis 5 May 2021 21: 10
    0
    "With all its advantages, the Makarov pistol no longer meets the modern requirements of a number of departments and organizations, which is why it needs to be replaced." A pistol for the military is an auxiliary weapon, and I wonder what special requirements effective managers from the army have come up with and what place, the desired characteristics of the pistol, will it take in modern combat? PM was created as a "police" weapon and in this form, it fully meets the requirements so far. To change weapons for the sake of the very fact of replacement and profit from this, it is to change an awl for soap of unknown quality. A pistol is needed for the needs of the military, but it must be Simple, reliable, relatively light and a magazine with a capacity of 12-18 rounds, with the corresponding penetrating action of the cartridge. And this is not a replacement for PM, but a product for the military! But the resource of 10 shots ... is rather weak.
  • Vladimir Khlestakov
    Vladimir Khlestakov 7 May 2021 20: 05
    0
    I really hope that the pistol will be successful. Still, the PM is already a bit old and needs a replacement.
  • Irbiz123
    Irbiz123 20 May 2021 10: 04
    0
    od Luger guano?
    П