The formation of the corps of helicopter carriers for the Russian Navy began in Kerch

Russian shipbuilders in Kerch began manufacturing the hulls of two future helicopter carriers. In the course of work on these universal amphibious assault ships (UDC) at the Zaliv plant in Kerch, the experience of creating the French Mistrals is taken into account.

About this news agency TASS said an employee of the military-industrial complex.

The source said that the new landing ships will have a displacement of 30 thousand tons. Each helicopter carrier is capable of carrying 16 helicopters and about a thousand marines on board. In addition, the ship's dock chambers can hold up to four boats for landing marines.

Also, another source in the defense industry, with whom the agency representatives spoke at the international forum "Army-2020", suggested that the UDC would be able to carry not only up to 16 helicopters, but also four S-70 Okhotnik unmanned aerial vehicles. He said that the UAVs will perform strike functions, as well as engage in target designation when striking with Zircon hypersonic missiles launched from other ships.

The ceremony of laying the ground for two universal landing ships, in which Russian President Vladimir Putin took part, took place on July 20 last year. The new ships will be named Ivan Rogov and Mitrofan Moskalenko.

Let us remind you that earlier Russia contracted the construction of two Mistral-class helicopter carriers from France. But as a result, France sold the ships to Egypt, paying compensation to Russia. The decision not to transfer the ships to Russia was made by François Hollande, who decided to support the sanctions.

Comments

[tralflot1832]

With an initiative. Serious work for the Kerch Gulf. There is something to make of iron, it remains to educate and prepare the people. How many ship hulls are left in the Gulf?

[Deck]

About 2017 people have quit since 1700

[Woodman]

Quote: Deck

about 1700 people quit

Can you tell me the source?
July 2020

The plans are to increase up to 5 thousand workers at the Zaliv plant, - said Aksenov

Currently the company employs about 2,2 thousand employees.

[Deck]

Can you tell me the source?

Plant and contractor workers

The plans are to increase up to 5 thousand workers at the Zaliv plant, - said Aksenov

If only they will master cloning))) They have Napoleonic plans since 2014.

[Woodman]

Quote: Deck

Plant and contractor workers

Did they count each other?

[Deck]

Delighted with your wit
Do you have other reliable information, or so, to chat with the language?

[Woodman]

Quote: Deck

You have other reliable information

So I gave you the information from Aksyonov sounded in the media above. And the reliability of your information is at the level of rumors. "Workers of the plant and contractors" can calculate the number of dismissed workers only if the team does not exceed several dozen people and everyone knows each other personally. Your number of 1700 laid-off workers, especially over several years, is not logically calculated from an ordinary workplace. Even Svarog, a fan of conducting polls among his entourage, will confirm this to you.

[tralflot1832]

Sudokopusnik last category salary 115 000 rubles. And this is definitely not an advertisement. The official website of the plant. To run away from such a salary ...

[Deck]

And this is definitely not an advertisement. The official site of the plant.

This is just an advertisement. This time. Two - local cadres have lost over the years of inactivity. The new ones were not trained. These are three. There are no people willing to work on a rotational basis for this money, tk. both Severodvinsk and St. Petersburg shipyards are loaded with orders and are experiencing a shortage of personnel. The experience of SSC Zvezda Rosneft is not applicable due to the lack of such funds. And the last thing - count the number of unfinished ships and vessels at the plant and everything will be clear without "information from Aksyonov announced in the media."
I understand that hurray-patriots do not like information, but eat what you have)))

[tralflot1832]

You are not tired of lying. The official website of the GulfNo shifts. Employment On a permanent basis. If you are a specialist, it is possible to get an apartment. . What else do you need to meet a dignified old age in Kerch.
. 2014 helped me and in Kerch it will work. Unambiguously and without options!

[Deck]

Hasn't worked in 8 years and won't work. Have you ever been there yourself?
Fuck change Peter, or even Severodvinsk, to Kerch and also drag the family there. A dirty, unkempt, provincial town with a dead infrastructure

[tralflot1832]

For information. Going on watch is the lot of Ukrainian shipbuilders. They support the development of the Northern Sea Route by painting the hulls of Russian nuclear icebreakers at any time of the year. Unless, of course, automatic painting has already been introduced.

[bayard]

Quote: Deck

Fuck change Peter, or even Severodvinsk, to Kerch

From the north, yes to the Crimea? Yes, for a good salary?
This is the dream of any northerners. And the fact that Kerch was killed in Ukraine, so now the Crimean bridge is being put in order for this reason - Kerch is the gate of Crimea. But when I drove there in the summer of 2017, the impression was depressing. In other words, then it was decided to "completely rebuild Kerch."
And now "Zaliv" will not be left without orders, so there will be enough work for people.

[ccsr]

Quote: tralflot1832

If you are a specialist, you can get an apartment.

There, a year and a half ago, a new apartment building was handed over, the hostel was completely renovated, and more recently a house was built for the workers of the "Zaliv". The car park in front of the factory is full of cars, it is impossible to find a place. All access roads to the plant are jammed with cars on the side of the road, so we have to look for a place. Many workers from the Crimean bridge settled on the "Zaliv", especially those who decided to settle in Crimea and do not want to return to those areas in which they used to live. The infrastructure around the plant is also being restored little by little, so the plant will grow. I saw all this last summer when I went to the city beach. I learned the information from local residents, and from advertisements in "Bospor" and "Cafe".
2018 year:

Work continues on the construction of a residential area on Seven Winds. Today, at Seven Winds, a solemn event dedicated to the 80th anniversary of the Zaliv shipyard was held - the laying of a second residential building for the company's employees. During the solemn event, representatives of the leadership of the city of Kerch and the shipyard made speeches.

Read Kerch news on RIA KerchINFO: https://kerchinfo.com/14456-v-kerchi-torzhestvenno-zalozhili-vtoroj-zhiloj-dom-dlya-zalivchan-foto-i-video.html

[tralflot1832]

Yes, contracts for shipbuilding for billions and years! The oligarchs have to invest in the working man, and this is commendable. Thanks for the information from Kerch.

[petrol cutter]

"This is just an advertisement. This is one. Two - local personnel have lost over the years of inactivity. New ones have not been trained. This is three. There are no people willing to work on a rotational basis for this money,"
... And the comrade "actually cuts the chip." Don't be offended by him. These are harsh realities, not holiday reports.

[Deck]

Your number of 1700 laid-off workers, especially over several years, is not logically calculated from an ordinary workplace.

And who was talking about "ordinary"?

[Woodman]

Quote: Deck

And who was talking about "ordinary"?

Yes, they did not say anything at all, except about the dismissed.

[Deck]

Duck the rest you yourself did great.

[Woodman]

That is, the figure "1700 dismissed" did not find its confirmation, as I did not get it from you ...

[tralflot1832]

In the age of the Internet it is easy to check. Bay. Kerch and that's it.

[lucul]

About 2017 people have quit since 1700

Do you want to say that so many people worked there during the time of Ukraine? ))))
And after 2014 it may very well be - workers at all Russian shipyards are in great demand, and from Kerch they could rush to other shipyards. Moreover, little was built in Kerch - it was only recently decided to build a UDC there.

[tikhonov66]

"... Since 2017, about 1700 people have left
..."
- So shcha - and come back, pull up ...
There would be work!

[petrol cutter]

Do you really believe that an ordinary CCM collector will completely receive one hundred thousand rubles!?.
We would have abandoned everything in Feodosia, and would have rushed to Kerch.
They won't let you earn that kind of money.
According to the ads and we have a payday of seventy thousand.
And in fact what ?! Moreover, delays of two months raced.
And so, yes. In Feodosia, two and a half brigades forcibly / voluntarily resigned. And there were by no means a hundred / five hundred of them. I have no doubt about a similar picture in Kerch. Because two from there just passed over to us.
The people didn't tell anything good.

[Deck]

Now "specialists", who have not been to a single shipyard, will show you their fucks for the fact that you did not let them ride on a pink pony.

[2 Level Advisor]

Yes, sometimes it's fun on VO, when people who have studied the news according to victorious reports will bypass real workers .. well .. the truth is when it is not hurray, they rarely like it .. thank you guys, so to speak, for the news from the fields ..

[mojohed2012]

Helicopter carriers are good, but the question is: with what forces will these carriers be covered? Do we have a warrant of escort ships capable of covering at least one helicopter carrier from missiles and torpedoes of submarines?

[loki565]

Helicopter carriers are good, but the question is: with what forces will these carriers be covered? Do we have a warrant of escort ships capable of covering at least one helicopter carrier from missiles and torpedoes of submarines?

Even the Mistral was supposed to be re-equipped, and even more so new projects. As for the fight against submarines, the UDC can be based on more anti-submarine helicopters than on any BOD, in this case it is still not clear who will cover whom.

There are places for the installation of additional weapons, in particular, air defense systems to repel air raids, as well as rapid-fire artillery weapons and large-caliber automatic installations to repel attacks from the sea. Strengthening weapons will allow the use of UDC in the open sea with less escort of surface guard ships.

[anclevalico]

I wonder what we have with the means of detecting enemy submarines? The same beacons with a detection radius of 150 m?

[bayard]

Quote: mojohed2012

Helicopter carriers are good, but the question is: with what forces will these carriers be covered?

For this, frigates are being built, which by definition are escort ships. By the time the UDC is delivered, there will be enough of them. And if the BMZ, then there will be enough corvettes.

[petrol cutter]

"With an initiative. Serious work for the Kerch Gulf. There is something to make of iron, it remains to educate and prepare the people. How many ship hulls are left in the Gulf?"
I did not quite understand what it means - the manufacture of cases began, if they began to be made that summer, judging by the article. What sections were shown to the president? ..
The people are doing spectacle-wiping just like ...
Well, the number of ship hulls here does not really make much of the weather, since the steamers are built by the assemblers of the KMS.

[evgen1221]

It is always useful to build ships. But it’s interesting, what do these people, looking at this face, think?

[Woodman]

Quote: evgen1221

But interestingly, what do these people, looking at this physiognomy, think?

You, for a start, show your "physiognomy", and then talk about other people's "physiognomies".

[Ross xnumx]

Quote: Lesovik

You, for a start, show your "physiognomy", and then talk about other people's "physiognomies".

Ah, let's speculate:
Background:
In 2012, the laying of the first Mistral for our fleet, Vladivostok, took place, and the construction of the second, Sevastopol, began a year later. The contract value was 1,2 billion euros. It was planned to send both ships to permanent service in the Pacific Fleet.
In August 2015, dreams were shattered by "Russian gullibility to French partners."
Current affairs:
After this August, yachts were built for the Russian oligarchs for an amount that exceeded the contract value “by a lot” ... A lot.
The oligarch Mordashov's yacht alone is estimated at $ 300 to $ 500 million, depending on the interior decoration. The same one who "earned" $ 2019 billion in 1.
A new yacht is being built for billionaire Roman Abramovich at the Lloyd Werft shipyard in Bremerhaven, Germany, Forbes reports. In the near future the boat will be launched. The yacht is called Solaris and is 145 meters long. The cost of the new 145-meter yacht of the Russian oligarch Abramovich is 450 million euros (40,6 billion rubles). This is more than the budget of 16 regions of Russia or the budget revenues of the Pskov region (36,7 billion rubles).
It remains to find out how long it will take from the formation of the hulls of new helicopter carriers for Russia to their launching and how much it will cost Russian taxpayers ...
... UNDER THE SENSITIVE GUIDANCE OF SOMEONE WHO DOESN'T SHOW ITS PHYZIONOMY IN THE OUTDOOR SINCE THE PAST YEAR ...
I don’t think (yes, what’s there - I’m just sure) that this whole carousel will spin in the right direction. Although, how can I have my own opinion and express it to someone? It is forbidden for us to gather in public places:

 Show / Hide text

[Woodman]

Quote: ROSS 42

We are prohibited from gathering in public places:

And we still have no time.
As for the rest of the above - even if all the yachts are confiscated - helicopter carriers cannot be made of them. Although, of course, if at least some of their owners were sent to places of detention, I would have experienced some moral satisfaction.

[Ross xnumx]

Quote: Lesovik

And we still have no time.

Afraid your wand won't be counted?

Quote: tikhonov66

If there is money somewhere IN THE WORLD, then it is by no means OBLIGED to be spent IN YOUR MIND

Listen here, at your leisure ... And then tell me how to take it all to the other world.

[Woodman]

Quote: ROSS 42

Afraid your wand won't be counted?

No, I'm not afraid. I do not work at a sawmill and, accordingly, do not make sticks. But for you, it seems, not sticking is a sore subject.

Quote: ROSS 42

Listen here at your leisure ...

Do I need it? I have all my leisure time for lunch and dinner, so is it worth spending it on this here? ..

Quote: ROSS 42

And then tell me how to take it all to the other world.

And I don’t think so far at all.

[Nemchinov Vl]

Quote: Lesovik

As for the rest of the above - even if all the yachts are confiscated - helicopter carriers cannot be made of them. Although, of course, if at least some of their owners were sent to places of detention, I would have experienced some moral satisfaction.

then you might like part 7 of this audiobook ... - https://aknigionline.ru/2812-kalashnikov-maksim-kugushev-sergey-pogruzhenie.html

[Woodman]

Quote: Vl Nemchinov

then you might like the part

Once upon a time I liked his books. Especially the "broken sword of the empire" and several subsequent ones. But then he "hit" metaphysics and it became impossible to read him. I will, of course, look at what you advise, but if he continues to write in the same spirit, then I strongly doubt that this book will please me.

[Woodman]

Amendment - "Broken Sword of the Empire"

[lucul]

UNDER THE SENSITIVE GUIDANCE OF SOMETHING WHO DOES NOT SHOW ITS PHYZIONOMY OUTDOOR SINCE THE PAST YEAR ...

And who did Lukashenka meet with? With a double or what? )))

[tikhonov66]

"... After this August, yachts were built for the Russian oligarchs for an amount exceeding the contract value" by much "... A lot.
..."
- so what ?!!!
It is felt that you, dear comrade Sharikov, do not agree with BOTH - that is, - with both Engels and Kautsky. But it would be necessary to "simply" - TO TAKE ... and give to you ...
8-)))
- No need to count the dough IN ANOTHER's pockets.
You would be even more horrified if you knew how many bucks "after this August" the US FRS printed ... Or how much money Russian citizens have in Russian banks (DESTYAKI TRILLION !!!).
- Just UZHYS !! Guard!!! - Steal the loot!
8-))
- You see, sir ... If there is money somewhere IN THE WORLD, then they are by no means OBLIGED to spend IN YOUR MIND !!! If you earn money, then you will DECIDE.
- accept - and so on.

[alekseykabanets]

Quote: tikhonov66

- No need to count the dough IN ANOTHER's pockets.

That is, there is no need to talk about "grandmas" stolen by the oligarchs, let them use them?

[maratkoRuEkb]

After reading your comment, it is immediately clear that you are a narrow-minded person.
Well, they wrote that the billionaires' yachts cost so much, and what? He earned and spends his money as he wants, we have a market economy and democracy, do you remember? And if you have information that he earned dishonestly, write to the prosecutor's office, you will do a good deed and bring the oligarch to the surface.
In general, such statements indicate that you are stupidly jealous, you would also like to be a billionaire and ride a yacht, but you didn’t come out smart, did you? Or am I talking to a billionaire who is sitting on VO and honestly earned his loot ??
And if you say that all oligarchs are thieves, then I will remind you FOR EXAMPLE about Rotenberg: despite the threat of sanctions, he undertook to build the Crimean bridge, he did it, on time and cheaper than over the hill. Honestly earned, coped with the task, so he has the right to buy at least 10 yachts.

[Dart2027]

Quote: mssp

To normal news perfectly

vile comment.

[Paranoid50]

Quote: mssp

is strictly required?

What is, insulted in the best feelings? However, what a vulnerable svezhereg flooded.

[lucul]

Or propaganda filth is strictly required?

Well, for you it is obligatory - since you are carrying it.)))

[Free wind]

Judging by the helmets there are no hard workers at all, naturally they never intended to quit, and they look at no one with delight. They get money and do not care that some 2000 people quit.

[Doccor18]

That's kind of good news - they laid 2 huge ships for the fleet ...
But in fact - two huge floating barracks, which need a serious escort, which does not exist. These ships are very necessary for a power with a large fleet and huge oceanic ambitions ... definitely not about the modern Russian Navy ...

[Ka-52]

much needed for a power with a large fleet and huge oceanic ambitions ...

BDK is not for oceanic ambitions. he has other tasks

[Doccor18]

Quote: Ka-52

much needed for a power with a large fleet and huge oceanic ambitions ...

BDK is not for oceanic ambitions. he has other tasks

And where does the BDK ???
In Kerch, the UDC was laid ...

[tikhonov66]

"... But in fact - two huge floating barracks, which need a serious escort, which is not.
..."
- uh ...
And you, excuse me - WHAT MILITARY MARINE ACADEMY YOU HAVE FINISHED? - Krylova ?! - and when?
And how long have you studied Russia's military planning and defense budgeting plans?
- Aaaaa ... so you are there - "they don't let you on a cannon shot"?
Well-Duc and absolutely CORRECT doing it!
Every cricket - know your six!
8-)))

[Time traveller]

Quote: Doccor18

... But in fact - two huge floating barracks, which need a serious escort, which is not ..

And what about the French, Spanish and Egyptians with an escort?

[Doccor18]

Quote: The Time Traveler

And what about the French, Spanish and Egyptians with an escort?

With the ships of the far sea zone, unfortunately, even better than ours.
Ask, if interested, about the composition of the fleets of these countries.
And the tasks for the fleet of one country are very different from the tasks of another.

[Time traveller]

Quote: Doccor18

Quote: The Time Traveler

And what about the French, Spanish and Egyptians with an escort?

With the ships of the far sea zone, unfortunately, even better than ours.
Ask, if interested, about the composition of the fleets of these countries.
And the tasks for the fleet of one country are very different from the tasks of another.

No, we have, perhaps, better. Because they have ten frigates each, and we have 4 cruisers, 6 BODs, 2 frigates, 2 destroyers, 9 SC, which can be compared with some of their destroyers (this is just what is not being repaired).
And we have more tasks for the UDC than theirs, which became clear even during 08.08.08. If then they could quickly seize Georgian ports, then the American destroyers would have nowhere to moor in order to "provide humanitarian assistance." Well, you need a reinforced marine battalion with 16 turntables - the very thing is to evacuate, if necessary, your diplomats from different Honduras.

[Wedmak]

Great, but ...

suggested that the UDC will be able to carry not only up to 16 helicopters, but also four S-70 Okhotnik unmanned aerial vehicles.

Um .... will there be a springboard on the UDC?

[Ros 56]

Necessarily, and the skis will probably be given out.

[Eldorado]

Yes, like the Japanese helicopter carriers.

[PSih2097]

Quote: El Dorado

Yes, like the Japanese helicopter carriers.

Japs have verticals, but about the S-70 I think not, he has nowhere to sit on the UDC.

[tikhonov66]

"... will there be a springboard on the UDC?
..."
- HOW, you still have not familiarized yourself with the SKETCH PROJECT ?!
- Ay-ay-ay - what is yours, however, not an advanced SOFA ...
8-))
- dig around inside - just find the preliminary design of the BDK.
And all-all quickly TELL US ...
eight-))))

[PSih2097]

Quote: tikhonov66

just discover preliminary design of BDK.

there the UDC is being built, not the sister ship "Gren" of the modernized ...

[Piramidon]

Quote: Wedmak

Great, but ...

suggested that the UDC will be able to carry not only up to 16 helicopters, but also four S-70 Okhotnik unmanned aerial vehicles.

Um .... will there be a springboard on the UDC?

They'll put the Hunter on the floats.

[bayard]

Quote: Wedmak

Um .... will there be a springboard on the UDC?

Take it higher - catapult! From the springboard, the S-70 cannot be started in any way - the thrust is not the same.
These journalists weave sheer intellectual lewdness ... it's not even a shame for the profession of a journalist, but for the human race, for ... degradation ...

[Yuri V.A]

Ten more times it is not known what will be there. Maybe after five years it will become clear that they initially made a fatal mistake - they laid the UTK, a universal transport ship, and all questions about the escort and the goals of the project are automatically removed.

[loki565]

Great news, helicopter carriers were needed yesterday. I wonder what the project will be that will surpass the Mistral?

[paul3390]

I wonder why? Where are we going to land the troops? Only the Kurils come to mind if something happens .. And even then - with the total superiority of the Japanese fleet in hulls, the occupation is, to put it mildly, dumb .. The same is with Norway. What to bring to Syria with them - isn't it expensive? And more - we seem to have nowhere to use them especially .. I am already silent about the necessary support ..

Of course, the ships will not be superfluous, it remains to figure out what to do with them ..

[evgen1221]

This is the main question, what for and what to do with them. Answer, fashion and vanity with the original Mistrals. Well, how to promote it will begin to achieve generally horror.

[Marconi41]

Quote: evgen1221

This is the main question, what for and what to do with them.

And what for do we generally have the marines, if we, in your opinion, do not have naval ambitions?

[paul3390]

We have ambitions. We have no opportunities for implementation. Well, imagine a UDC operation, say, in the Mediterranean Sea. At least - he will have to give a couple of frigates. Least. And we have only three modern ones there !! And - with what will the Black Sea Fleet remain then? How do you order the rest of the tasks to be performed? In the Pacific, everything is no less sad ..

[evgen1221]

And what for in general amers space command when there in space from the power of 3 amers hang out?

[loki565]

And what for in general amers space command when there in space from the power of 3 amers hang out?

And on this occasion there is one funny series "Space Forces")))

[loki565]

I wonder why? Where are we going to land the troops? Only the Kurils come to mind if something happens .. And even then - with the total superiority of the Japanese fleet in hulls, the occupation is, to put it mildly, dumb .. The same is with Norway. What to bring to Syria with them - isn't it expensive? And more - we seem to have nowhere to use them especially .. I am already silent about the necessary support ..

Think narrowly, the UDC is not just a landing ship, it is a whole complex that allows you to conduct reconnaissance, detect submarines, surface ships, and cover ground operations with attack helicopters. RCC for helicopters are now being developed. It can become a command center in local operations, etc.

[paul3390]

You know, it seems to me that a pair of destroyers + a pair of anti-submarine submarines instead of now would be much more preferable for our fleet ... Or let's say a new missile cruiser ...

To use such a fool as a PLO - well, I don’t know .. IMHO - this is somehow far-fetched .. Obviously, it is not sharpened for this .. Cover local ground operations from the sea - and where are you going to turn it around? In Syria, there seems to be enough conventional aviation, remember what happened when Kuzya was brought there? Sheer shame .. Or are you going to say Libya to conquer? So I still won't have enough strength ..

And most importantly - this steamer needs at least two frigates to be escorted. When solving any problems. And even more. Alas, we can count them on one hand. Not China tea ..

[loki565]

You know, it seems to me that a pair of destroyers + a pair of anti-submarine submarines instead of now would be much more preferable for our fleet ... Or let's say a new missile cruiser ...

UDC has a ready-made project and proven technology. Are you serious about a missile cruiser?))) Let me open your eyes, no one will create "Peter the Great" anymore, maximum a destroyer. And this is a global trend.

Obviously, he is not sharpened for this ..

It was as separate command posts that the Mistrals were going to be used, with radar and submarine helicopters.

Cover local ground operations from the sea - and where are you going to do this?

You forget with us "non-brothers" at our side, which are intensively stuffed with armament. Well, the places of the alleged dislocations of the Mistrals.

And most importantly - this steamer needs at least two frigates to be escorted. When solving any problems.

It was supposed to re-equip the Mistral, and new projects even more so

There are places for the installation of additional weapons, in particular, air defense systems to repel air raids, as well as rapid-fire artillery weapons and large-caliber automatic installations to repel attacks from the sea. Strengthening weapons will allow the use of UDC in the open sea with less escort of surface guard ships.

[Grits]

Quote: paul3390

Cover local ground operations from the sea - and where are you going to do this?

Look at the map - from Hokkaido to Kamchatka - such a long chain of islands. Of our islands. But there are those who want to make them not ours. And the troops that can defend them from encroachments - the cat cried. And you can't put a garrison on every island. So such a UDC (or better 2) is an excellent tool for the operational transfer of troops and equipment to protect these islands. This is just one example.
And you shouldn't consider them defenseless. Such ships with a large number of soldiers do not go defenseless.

[Horon]

Think narrowly

They do not think narrowly - their task is to discredit and vulgarize any modern achievements. The only question is: they do it out of their own feeble mind or at someone's instigation!

[paul3390]

There would be achievements ... Otherwise, we can't even build a destroyer, we can't even build a teaspoon of frigates per hour, but we definitely need a UDC ... Somehow it reminds us of the World Cup or the Winter Olympics in Sochi. ...

[Horon]

We build what we can and what we have enough money for, and start building a destroyer, accusations of the absence of anti-submarine ships and ships of technical support will immediately surface. And so on in a vicious circle. During the compulsion of Georgia to peace, remind what were the problems when trying to send an expedition there? Russia does not have enough pennants, there is not enough knowledge and personnel to create different types of ships, and in this case we should be glad that they are trying to do something themselves and something of their own, they train personnel and production for such tasks. Her budget is not rubber, others do not sell, and what they do themselves, albeit more expensive, is already better than listening to arguments about why this should not or should not be done.

[paul3390]

So there are none, PLO ships! It is necessary to build a balanced fleet based on needs and capabilities. In the presence of THREE modern frigates on the Black Sea and FOUR relatively new ones in the Pacific Ocean, it is at least a strange decision to spend funds and forces on UDC .. There is an acute shortage of base ships, there will be nothing to fight back from the Turk, and you will go to Georgia You are going to land a landing .. Compare all this with the fleets of potential enemies - the same Japan or Turkey, and weep ..

[Horon]

I repeat again:

We build what we can and what we have enough money for

Russia lacks pennants, lacks knowledge and personnel to create different types of ships

Budget her not rubber

Who built helicopter carriers, as they are trying to ... as a quick option for patching holes shortage, anti-submarine ships, amphibious ships, aircraft carriers and transport staff

And you tell me:

Compare all this with the fleets of potential adversaries - the same Japan or Turkey, and weep ...

To which I already wrote:

And so on in a vicious circle.

So ask the question:

Than just your brain is clogged ..

your reflection. PSVozmozhno if you were sitting less on the internet, we would have inundated the world superfood destroyers whole world!

[Nemchinov Vl]

Quote: Horon

We build what we can

- the trend is very dangerous !! under this motto, there "Karakurt" laid almost at the same time, in TIMES more - than the possibility of admission for them GEM !!!

Quote: Horon

and what is enough money for

also a dubious statement ... see pr. 20386 and contracting "incapacitated in terms of armament and speed" 20380 ... ? !!

Quote: Horon

start building a destroyer

they don't start like that ... not that EM build, and even a power plant FOR HIM !!!... Only Rahman says that they have solved all the problems of import substitution !!!...
These are not only my thoughts ... For example, if you are interested, - http://cast.ru/news/sudostroenie-v-teni-bespoleznoy-nadstroyki.html .... not devoid of logic look at "corporativeness and its benefits in shipbuilding" ... !!

Quote: Horon

accusations of the absence of anti-submarine ships and technical support ships will immediately surface.

nonsense !! if EM will be like Mishin's project 11560 (then both anti-aircraft defense and anti-aircraft defense and striking power, it is sufficiently balanced) !!

Quote: Horon

Russia does not have enough pennants, there is not enough knowledge and personnel to create different types of ships, and in this case we should be glad that they are trying to do something themselves and something ... and what they are doing themselves

certainly what is NECESSARY !!! , but do (sniff the fleet) something that is expensive and not functional, but can be done by USC, see example 20380 !!!.. It is not right (!). For this amount, the PLO / OVR ship - must be - functional, not toothless with speed 27 knots !!! since, -

Quote: Horon

Budget her not rubber

Quote: paul3390

Build we need a balanced fleet based on the needs and opportunities

but for this, primarily not 20380 to contract, and the amount is five times less than one such (!), give Kolomna (!), then (!), in order to get the finished first power plant out of four in a year "D-500" (12SD-500 8000 hp each) !!!), and two years later (!) the same but out of four 16SD-500 (10000 hp each). !), for the same light frigates like "Thunder" ... !!!
until the moment when the industry will make in a calendar year not only ONE GEM for 22350, but for at least three more types of ships, -

Quote: paul3390

spending money and effort on UDC is at least a strange decision.

!!!

[paul3390]

Yes? Did you not pay attention to the fact that the UDC had a lot of opponents among the military since the time of the Mistrals? What battles were going on then? Because no one in general understands why we need them and how to provide them with everything necessary .. Or, in your opinion, these people were also guided solely by the desire to belittle Russian achievements? Than just your brain is clogged ..

[Horon]

Under the mistral lines, different standards for repair and maintenance were required. The Mistals themselves were needed to obtain NATO standards, with which we were quickly cooled. Helicopter carriers are being built now, as they are trying to justify the purchase of Mistrals not to obtain specific information , plus as a quick option for patching holes in the shortage of anti-submarine ships, landing ships, transport personnel and aircraft carriers. Not everything can be transported on civilian transporters, without the threat of bringing them under sanctions.

Than just your brain is clogged ..

I will answer with a quote:

Everyone imagines himself a strategist seeing the battle from the side! (C)

[paul3390]

Anti-submarine ships, landing ships, transport personnel and aircraft carriers - are you going to urgently close all this with two UDCs ??? And - virtually unaccompanied ??

[Horon]

We only UDC system? "The road will be mastered by the one walking!" How many centuries are you going to build such a fleet? And where, excuse me, are you going to keep it? Oh yes, it is also somewhere, someone has to build, provided that he has both personnel and production capabilities for this. And yet it is worth the money and not small! What will we tear off from? Shall we cancel the pension? Closing the hospitals? Stop paying salaries? Will we quadruple our taxes? So even in this case, even half of it will not be possible to build! Industry will not pull out, but the economy will collapse completely.

[Grits]

Quote: paul3390

Because no one in general understands why we need them and how to provide them with everything they need.

Well, at one time, the dashing cavalrymen did not understand why we need airplanes and how to provide all the necessary tanks.
Everything flows, everything changes. And inertia in thinking, in rejection of something new, leads to disastrous results. Over time, we will understand the significance. Let's learn to use.

[Artyom Karagodin]

There are many things you can do. To begin with, this is a VERY convenient base for anti-submarine operations, since it carries as many as 16 helicopters. And, most likely, even more, judging by the displacement.

Another thing is that by the time they are put into service, we are unlikely to have time to provide these ships with a worthy escort. The mess in shipbuilding is creepy.

[paul3390]

Once again, using the UDC as an anti-submarine is a delusional occupation for us. This should be occupied by specialized PLO ships. Which we are just terribly lacking .. And if you count with the necessary cover - so the operation in general will come out golden .. It is necessary to cover it from the air and from submarines! In fact, there is almost nothing. And what to cover? We count the cases on our fingers.

[Artyom Karagodin]

The whole world uses it if necessary, but for us - a delusional occupation? This time.

What if we have to go back to some Syria to beat another ISIS before they come to us? And at the same time, no one will provide us with an air corridor or Tartus with Khmeimim? Of course, you can't place planes on the UDC, but the headquarters for conducting special operations to seize an airfield or a convenient harbor is quite. It is clear that this is now on the fingers of reasoning, but are they really so unreal? These are two.

Those who are better than me in the topic (there are many of them on VO) will say that this is not all that you can use the UDC for. There are questions about the concept of the ships themselves, yes, but the fact that we need them, the specialists do not deny.

[paul3390]

Exactly - if necessary. For, apart from helicopters, the UDC has nothing to combat submarines. And the operation is not cheap .. A pair of normal PLO frigates will cope much better. And now they are something - we sorely and do not have enough.

And where, if not a secret, do you intend to carry out this special operation? I'm just curious..

UDC is certainly needed. But - after the issue of filling the fleet with the rest of the base ships has been resolved. Frigates, destroyers, corvettes .. For example, China is already possible. Yes, even Korea - she has enough ships for her tasks. We, on the other hand, do not have enough ships in any of the fleets to withstand the probable foe. Alas, this is a fact. And in these conditions, the construction of UDC instead of base ships - it seems to me at least not convincing.

Well, in the Mediterranean. How many frigates do we have there? How many of them will have to be escorted? And - what are we left with for the rest of the tasks? With a bare bottom?

[Artyom Karagodin]

And where, if not a secret, do you intend to carry out this special operation? I'm just curious..

Where the need arises. You never know where it can jerk.

And the fact that we do not have enough ships with purely combat missions is a fact. Perhaps you are right when you say that it is too early for us to have them, but they are needed anyway. God grant that they do not repeat the fate of "Severodvinsk" and "Admiral Gorshkov".

[paul3390]

This is what I am afraid of. Here's how to cover it in the Mediterranean, if we have only THREE modern frigates there ?? Which will have to be sent with him. And what about the Black Sea, then, how to close it off the Turks? And so even their fleet is stronger than ours .. And then there is such a gift .. IMHO - they will just stand at the wall, just to be. It's too early for us to aim at this, it's too early .. For this, ships must be built at a Chinese pace, and not like ours - even frigates are built for 10 years .. Not to mention the destroyers, which are not new, and it looks like they are not expected ..

[New Year day]

Quote: paul3390

It's too early for us to aim at this, too early ..

judging by the "-" we prefer not to think, but "ur-yayaya!" shout
Objectivity is not needed, good news is needed, although it does not correspond to the realities of the day. Drug

[Dart2027]

Quote: paul3390

And what about closing the Black Sea from the Turks? And so even their fleet is stronger than ours.

You mean the World Cup, which is fired through by missiles? In the case of mixing with Turkey, any ship, even ours, even Turkish, which comes out from under the cover of coastal air defense, will live as long as missiles, and a kamikaze UAV, will need to reach it. Its air defense will simply be crushed by the mass.

[Piramidon]

Quote: Artyom Karagodin

it is a VERY convenient base for anti-submarine operations

For these purposes, heels of watchdogs will be much more effective.

[New Year day]

Quote: paul3390

Of course, the ships will not be superfluous, it remains to figure out what to do with them ..

It is more logical to think up first, then build. Judging by the construction process, it doesn't matter with a thought:
1.June 2020 Commander-in-Chief of the Russian Navy Evmenov; “UDC is a completely new project for Russia. The displacement of the ships will be twenty thousand tons, and they will be comparable to French helicopter carriers in their quality characteristics. "
2.December 2020 Deputy Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation Krivoruchko: UDC is already planned with a tonnage of forty thousand tons each.
3. Putin: “Ivan Rogov and Mitrofan Moskalenko in the end they will be slightly changed in comparison with the original project... They can be used for other purposes as well. But this is a secret. "
So while the main thing is to build, and what happens at the end, we'll see. Maybe even an aircraft carrier

[lucul]

Of course, the ships will not be superfluous, it remains to figure out what to do with them ..

Strange question))) Have you ever wondered why we even install helicopters on corvettes, to the detriment of the main armament? After all, as many missiles can fit in the aft cell as in the bow, that is, it would be possible to double the number of missiles, but did you choose helicopters?
Yes, because there were no such helicopter carriers in the fleet. For each order for such a ship, a helicopter carrier and the combat stability of the order will dramatically increase.
But you didn't even know about it - but you sharply criticize everything that is.

[tikhonov66]

"... Of course, the ships will not be superfluous, it remains to figure out what to do with them ..
..."
- here they have thrown a PYCHCHA for you to think about!
Now - go and not even be able to sleep.
And only you will all - think, think and think ...
And wherever you want to "apply" that BDK ...
8-)))
- be careful about the current - otherwise "needles and pins" will come out of your head (from unbearable mental stress) ... Just like the "Wise Scarecrow" from the old fairy tale "The Wizard of the Emerald City"
eight-)))))

[Nemchinov Vl]

Quote: loki565

Great news, helicopter carriers were needed yesterday.

Who ?! USC ?! or PKB ?! ....

[Ros 56]

Nice news and it pleases.

[KrolikZanuda]

It is wonderful. But the fact that the Gulf has not been able to deliver the Sviyaga and Vyatka for the sixth year is just a shame on our shipbuilding industry. And it is not even funny to cover it up with import substitution.

[Rubi0]

So and where are the shipbuilders, the hulls themselves are lowered, there is no equipment for them

[Artyom Karagodin]

The colleague most likely meant not "Zaliv", but the big bag that is going on in our fleet in general.

[New Year day]

“These tankers are not being actively built at the enterprise now,” a source at Zaliv told.

Construction came to a halt due to a number of problems: lack of funding, fleet adjustments to the requirements for ships, problems for the designer and a lack of specialists at the construction plant.

[New Year day]

Would you like to work at the plant yourself? We read the Kerch newspaper
"At the Zaliv plant in Kerch, people are preparing for a strike"
https://kerch.fm/2020/05/29/na-zavode-zaliv-v-kerchi-ljudi-gotovjatsja-k-zabastovke.html

[Rubi0]

It looks like money was given, orders were given, but at the local level everything was stolen and the director built a palace on the seashore

[prior]

The other day there was an article that full-fledged ship-based amphibious helicopters
Russia does not.
How does this fit in with the manufacture of helicopter carriers ?!
Or, as always, "it was smooth on paper, but they forgot about the ravines."

[Wedmak]

But there are brand new drums. Carrying a troop of 10-15 people on a turntable from the UDC to the shore is not a big deal. Except that the reconnaissance group should be thrown, but for now, the Ka series will cope with this.

[Eldorado]

A prototype of the new Lamprey sea helicopter is almost ready.

[CommanderDIVA]

Apparently they are building with an eye on the Mediterranean, the Red Sea (there are already naval mtto points in Syria and Sudan), and our new frigates of project 22350 will probably be as an escort, if I am not mistaken in the numbering, I will not be surprised if new mts of ours will be created Navy in the Indian Ocean, on the east coast of Africa, possibly in Iran, Pakistan or India

[New Year day]

Quote: CommanderDIVA

if new MTO points of our Navy are created in the Indian Ocean, on the east coast of Africa, possibly in Iran, Pakistan or India

there will not be enough ships for all your MTO

[CommanderDIVA]

You don't know Russia well, we harness it for a long time, but we drive fast, Comrade Bismarck also noticed

[Dmitry Potapov]

Thank you French! Otherwise they would have been waiting for your indulgence!

[cniza]

Also, another source in the defense industry, with whom the agency representatives spoke at the international forum "Army-2020", suggested that the UDC would be able to carry not only up to 16 helicopters, but also four S-70 Okhotnik unmanned aerial vehicles.

I think there are a few more "gifts" provided there, but why write about it ...

[Wedmak]

Well, it is unlikely that the CD will be put there. The minimum set of air defense systems, no more. What else is there as a gift? It is a gift in itself.

[cniza]

There must be a sufficient set of air defense equipment, otherwise it is very easy prey ...

[Wedmak]

UDC, especially not guarded, is easy prey by default. The maximum that he can, shoot down a single subsonic CD. If there are 2-3 of them, a big problem in the form of a hole in the case looms. You can't stick a S-400/300/350 there, a maximum of several Marine Shells, maybe Thor, if they get generous.

[ccsr]

Quote: Wedmak

UDC, especially not guarded, is easy prey by default.

And no one will plan him on a solo voyage - the escort ships are in any case obliged to accompany him, this is the alphabet of combat service for such ships.

[Grits]

Quote: Wedmak

What else is there as a gift? It is a gift in itself.

While it is being completed, it is possible that gifts will actually appear in addition to it. In the form of something unmanned. This direction is very much moving forward with us.

[Free wind]

These carriers are carried by 15 helicopters. That is, in one helicopter, which is not there, there may be about 10 people. in one flight, 15 helicopters will transport 150 people over 200 km, which is about 2 hours. 1000 people will be transported in 6-8 hours. All this time, the ship must hang out in the sea in full view of everyone, and is available to all types of anti-ship missiles. 2000 potential deceased. Well, the landing is primarily the seizure of territory, well, we are peaceful people, and what are we going to seize?

[Piramidon]

Quote: Free Wind

These carriers are carried by 15 helicopters. That is, in one helicopter, which is not there, there may be about 10 people. 15 helicopters will carry 150 people in one flight

Do you think that only transport and landing turntables will be based there? Nonsense. And who will support the landing from the air and what are the landing boats for?

[Free wind]

And who or what will support, if not secret. And where are you going to land?

[Runway]

If the ships are built and equipped, they will go to service in the Northern Fleet / Pacific Fleet. Marines are not only aggression (as noted above about "long approaches"). We have a sufficient coastline and islands. Where you can land not only the marines. And some kind of malfunction with air defense / combat missions (RTGR of marines with air defense missile systems / air defense missile systems and brk).
Naturally, DESO will provide all the available fleet (both the Northern Fleet and the Pacific Fleet).
UDC will go as a makeweight to the available means of landing.

[Free wind]

So are we attacking or defending? Decide. Moreover, all these carriers are weapons of attack.

[Runway]

UDC is a delivery vehicle for CCS and their BMT. The doctrine was not rewritten.
For games of neo-colonialism (in the interests of the circle of people), the Russian Federation has no strength.

[Piramidon]

Quote: Free Wind

And who or what will support, if not secret. And where are you going to land?

I answered you only to your calculations. You will decide. Either give calculations for the landing, then sharply dodge and ask yourself questions

[Free wind]

Well, if you are going to capture something, then there is no need to whine that we are so white and fluffy.

[Piramidon]

Quote: Free Wind

Well, if you are going to capture something, then there is no need to whine that we are so white and fluffy.

And when did I whine somewhere? There is no need to rattle about the clave in vain and attribute your fantasies to others. All you can do is jump off the topic and wag. To blurt out something you are a master, but the mind is no longer enough to answer a specific question.

[loki565]

Yes, all peaceful people and the French, Japanese, USA, Australians, etc.))) If the USSR had not collapsed, we would also have, such as project 11780

[amr]

Quote: Deck

Delighted with your wit
Do you have other reliable information, or so, to chat with the language?

Right now you will be showered with hats and shouts of Uraaaaa, and the fact that there are no simple hard workers, I’m not talking about professionals .... who, besides simply not there, are not released anywhere!

[tralflot1832]

I went to the website of the Gulf. The salaries for vacancies are not bad. It all depends on experience and rank.

[Wolf]

I’m on the sidelines and I don’t have any interests, but his face is not a picture of his noble, he is happy and satisfied one hundred workers got a job and an order for many years, every psychologist can confirm this.

In addition, the last 100 years have not had an intelligent sovereign in RUSSIA !!!

YOU CAN CLEARLY SAY "TSAR PUTIN"
Add also Swedes!

[Free wind]

Vovan got a job and a salary, and he is content and happy.

[Freeman]

Quote: CommanderDIVA

Apparently build with an eye on Mediterranean, Red sea (there are already naval equipment points in Syria and Sudan) ... I will not be surprised if new naval equipment points are created in the Indian Ocean, on the east coast of Africa, possibly in Iran, Pakistan or India

More than a likely scenario. Do not forget about the Gulf of Guinea, where these UDCs were needed "yesterday."
https://tass.ru/opinions/9983173

Quote: Free Wind

... well, we are peaceful people, and what are we going to capture?

Many still don’t realize that bourgeois RF, "jumped into imperialism, bypassing capitalism" (as at one time Mongolia from feudalism to socialism, bypassing capitalism ).
The war in Syria and Russian PMCs in the Central African Republic and the DRC are proof of this.

[iouris]

This means that there will be no war. Relieved.

[wow]

And let the guardians gnaw a salted bagel with their troughs.

[Vanyusha]

C70 Is he a one-time hunter? Or already done with vertical take-off and landing.

[xomaNN]

"The man said, the man did!"
When you see DEAL in mega streams of bytes and promises, it pleases me very much! Even if there are delays common in shipbuilding due to project rework, etc. And they are inevitable on the lead ship of a new project for the Russian Federation

[Time traveller]

Quote: evgen1221

This is the main question, what for and what to do with them ...

Well, recently in America, Congress was seized. And if a full-fledged revolution began there? What if the covid decimates the entire Pentagon, the US Navy and the National Guard? What if a civil war breaks out there? Immediately, the tasks of evacuating our diplomats from there and taking control of American nuclear facilities will arise, which will be uncomfortable to solve without heavy equipment and helicopters.
And it doesn't have to start with America. There are still many places where the landing of a reinforced battalion of marines may be urgently required in the absence of real threats to the UDC from a potential enemy.

[nnz226]

Transport and landing helicopters need to be developed. The existing Ka-29s are not suitable ...

[stels_07]

We must call them: Tears of Richelieu and Waterloo

[Consul]

Good news. The main thing is that it does not work out like with the May decrees ...