Military Review

Baltic odyssey "Eagle"

228
Baltic odyssey "Eagle"
"Ozhel" became a legend of the Polish naval fleet... Her daring escape from internment was made famous by the Polish war reporter Erik Sopočko.


"Ozhel" (ORP Orzeł, "Oryol") was the only fully operational submarine of the Polish navy in 1939. Her twin "Semp" ("Sip"), after a kind of "escape" from the Dutch shipyard, constantly suffered from defects and breakdowns of ship mechanisms. It was impossible to eliminate these defects in Poland due to the lack of appropriate shipyards and specialists. Therefore, the boat did not pass numerous tests and was recognized as fit for service to a limited extent.

"Bag" for "Eagle"


The crews of both ships lacked the necessary training, especially the psychological resistance to long voyages and the effects of depth charges. In addition, there were no emergency evacuation exercises for submariners. In addition, the Hel naval base did not have a pier or dock where submarines could go through some, even the simplest repair, resupply and rest the crews.

The big mistake of the fleet command was the approval of the plan "Vorek" (The Sack, Plan Worek), which provided for the concentration of submarine forces near the Polish coast.

Thus, Polish submarine operations were limited to patrolling narrow and small sectors where they were easy to track down. Already the first hours of the war showed how disastrous such a tactic was.

Sectors of Polish submarines coincided with the lines of the German blockade. From the very beginning of the war, German aircraft and ships incessantly tracked down and attacked Polish ships and set minefields along their routes. At the same time, Polish submarines were not presented with any opportunity to attack enemy forces.

originally "I'll chew" it fell to patrol the central zone of the Danzig Bay, where the navigation conditions did not at all correspond to its tactical and technical characteristics.

Before the Second World War, the command of the Polish navy insisted on orders for large, ocean-going ships, useless in the shallow waters of the Baltic Sea. But this policy had its own hidden meaning: the more complex and expensive the ordered equipment was, the more kickbacks settled in the pockets of corrupt officials.

The Dutch shipyards, to which orders were placed, built ships of the highest quality for the needs of the escort service on the communications linking Holland with the colonies, especially in the Indian Ocean. In the Baltic Sea, Dutch-built submarines had problems with ballast, in connection with which they could either only walk in a flood position, or go to the bottom. However, after "Ozhela" и "Sempa" the Polish government and command planned to order two more submarines with even larger dimensions.

In the end, on September 4, 1939, the fleet command decided to transfer "Ozhela" in reserve, with an eye to using it in another area, if a favorable situation develops for this.

The command did not yet know that by that time the commander of the submarine, captain of the third rank (in Polish - commander second lieutenant) Henryk Klochkovsky, had voluntarily left the sector allocated to him, without notifying his superiors about it.

The ship headed for Gotland, hoping to give the crew a break and do minor repairs. On the way to "Ozhel" met an enemy convoy with a weak escort, but, despite an advantageous position, Klochkovsky evaded the attack.

Instead, he radioed that a strong enemy escort was attacking his ship with depth charges. In fact, on September 5, German ships attacked another submarine - "Wilk" (Wolf). Most likely on "Ozhele" heard the echo of ruptures. And Klochkovsky used this circumstance to hide his actions.

"Ozhel" reached Gotland on the morning of September 6 and spent two days there away from war, enemy and sea communications.

And on September 8 he radioed that Klochkovsky was ill, possibly with typhus. However, in light of subsequent events, it can be concluded that he was simply feigning illness in order to leave his ship.

However, he handed over the command to his Deputy Lieutenant Commander Jan Grudziński only on September 10. Grudzinsky radioed to Hel about Klochkovsky's "illness" and the need to repair the compressor due to a bursting cylinder.

The fleet commander radioed in response:

“Disembark the captain of the ship in a neutral port and continue under the command of his first deputy, or carefully enter Hel at night to replace the captain.

Please report your decision. "

But Grudziński never received this news, although the Heli radio station broadcasted the dispatch many times over the course of two days.

"Eagle" in Tallinn


Meanwhile the officers "Ozhela" tried to convince their commander to approach Gotland, where he could leave the ship in a boat. Klochkovsky rejected all reasonable arguments and decided to go to Tallinn, where he had acquaintances since his time in the Russian Navy.

This was another insubordination on his part, since the command of the fleet had clearly instructed the Polish submarine commanders to enter (in case of emergency) only in Swedish ports.

Thus, Klochkovsky's dubious decision triggered a chain of events leading to the odyssey "Ozhela".

"Ozhel" went to the roadstead of Tallinn on the night of September 14 and requested permission to disembark a sick crew member and carry out repair work. The Estonian pilot refused to take the patient on board and requested instructions from his superiors.

We had to wait until morning for permission to enter the port. The broken compressor was immediately removed and sent to the port workshop. At the same time, Klochkovsky got off the ship, not forgetting to take with him all his personal belongings, a hunting rifle and a typewriter.

It was quite clear that he had no intention of returning aboard regardless of the diagnosis. Lieutenant Commander Grudziński remained behind him.

Meanwhile, an Estonian gunboat moored next to a Polish submarine "Laine".

Initially, this did not arouse any suspicion among the Poles, especially since the Estonians soon "explained" their actions. Estonian officers who arrived at "Ozhel", told the Poles that their stay in Tallinn would be extended by 24 hours, as the German merchant ship "Thalassa" announced its intention to leave the port the next day.

Thus, the Polish submarine could not leave the port earlier than 24 hours after leaving "Thalassa"... The motivation of the Estonians was fully in line with international rules.

But when the extended stay "Ozhela" expired in Tallinn, the Estonians appeared again and informed Grudzinsky that the Estonian authorities had decided to intern the Polish ship.

This was already a gross violation of international rules.

It is believed that the Estonians did so under German pressure.

But it is now known that the day before Klochkovsky had a long, secret conversation with his Estonian friends. One way or another, the Estonians got down to business very zealously. And already on September 16, Estonian soldiers arrived on the ship and began to unscrew the breeches from its guns, and also confiscated all its maps, logbooks and navigation equipment.

The Polish crew did not intend to succumb to internment and came up with a daring plan to escape from Tallinn. It was realized on the night of September 17-18. Two weeks "Ozhel" wandered around the Baltic Sea with only one homemade map, which Grudziński drew from memory, and with one compass, which one of the sailors hid among his belongings. With an exhausted crew, no ammunition, the ship tried in vain to find a target for the remaining torpedoes.

Meanwhile, Kolochkovsky remained in Estonia. He spent only 3 days in the hospital. From which it follows that no illness was found in him. Then he moved to Tartu, the second largest city in Estonia, where he discharged his family.

It is clear that such a long voyage of a lone submarine with deteriorated navigation and combat qualities, across a sea strewn with minefields, with a constant pursuit of enemy naval and air forces, is a real feat.

But in vain.

On October XNUMX, in view of the surrender of the last pockets of resistance in Poland and the consumption of provisions and fuel, the commander "Ozhela" decided to make his way to Great Britain through the Danish Straits, where he entered the night of 8-9 October.

In the area of ​​the island of Ven "Ozhel" sank under water because of the danger of being tracked down by German or Swedish ships.

The submarine spent the whole day on October 9 at the bottom and continued on its way the next day. She made her way carefully into the Kattegat through the narrow strait separating Elsignor from Helsingborg, full of minefields and German ships.

There the Poles spent two more days trying to hunt German ships between Cape Kullen and Anholt Island, then near Cape Skagen.

Eventually, on 12 October, Grudzinsky sent his ship to the North Sea and on 14 October made contact with the British fleet.

By the end of the day "Ozhel" moored at the naval base in Rosyte. This is the second entry (after "Wilka") the Polish submarine greatly embarrassed the British Admiralty, as the Poles passed unnoticed through sectors patrolled by British aircraft, submarines and light surface forces.

Renovated in Scotland "Ozhel" returned to service on December 1, 1939.

In early 1940, the Poles began to patrol their assigned sectors in the North Sea. There were seven patrols.

During the fifth of them, April 8, "Ozhel" sank German transport "Rio de Janeiro"carrying landing troops to Norway.

Death


From the seventh patrol "Ozhel" did not return. And his fate has not yet been established.

Researchers name different versions - a technical malfunction, a mine explosion, German planes or submarines ...

However, the most likely cause of death "Ozhela" mistaken torpedoing of a Polish submarine by a Dutch "O-13", which on that fateful day had to change "Ozhela" in the designated sector.

Dutch sailors could identify the silhouette "Ozhela" as a homogeneous Dutch submarine. The Dutch already knew that they all fell into the hands of the Germans during the occupation of Holland, but most likely they did not know that two of them were sold to Poland before the war.

Interestingly, two weeks later "O-13" missing. And on the same day the submarine "Wilk" reported on the sinking of a German submarine.

Only after the war did the captured German documents show that the German submarine fleet suffered no losses that day.

If both of these facts are somehow connected, then it is possible that "Wilk" "Avenged" "Ozhela".

Obviously, during the war, such facts were not made public. And after the war история "Ozhela" mired in legends, innuendo and lies.

Just like the story of its first commander.

Adapted from J. Pertek. Wielkie dni małej floty... Wydawnictwo Poznańskie, 1981.
K. Śledziński. Odwaga straceńców... SIW Znak, 2013.

Продолжение следует ...
Author:
Photos used:
From the archives of the Author. Courtesy of the Institute. General Sikorsky in London.
228 comments
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  1. Catfish
    Catfish 27 February 2021 05: 14
    0
    VVVVVartu ogorbod month
    1. Destiny
      Destiny 27 February 2021 05: 40
      +12
      Good morning! It seemed to me that the Pole was still drowned by the Dutchman. Thanks to the author for the article, I would like to read more and more often on "VO" on the marine theme of stories.
      1. Catfish
        Catfish 27 February 2021 05: 42
        +10
        Good morning, colleague. I read from A. Bolnykh that the boat was bombarded with depth charges by British destroyers. hi
    2. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 27 February 2021 08: 30
      +3
      Quote: Sea Cat
      VVVVVartu ogorbod month

      Is this the new fashion - backwards in the morning? wink
      1. Catfish
        Catfish 27 February 2021 08: 41
        +6
        This is not for me, this is for the admins, but if he smiled, then it’s already good. drinks
        1. vladcub
          vladcub 27 February 2021 17: 17
          +2
          Probably the admins are drunk? And that they are people too and nothing is alien to them
      2. aleks neym_2
        aleks neym_2 27 February 2021 11: 34
        +2
        By the way, not only with him - you type in the blind, and then you read ... laughter ..
    3. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar 27 February 2021 09: 40
      +3
      Quote: Sea Cat
      VVVVVartu ogorbod month

      Ogorbod artu, Nitnatsnok! hi
      1. Catfish
        Catfish 27 February 2021 09: 49
        +2
        Mutually, Arkady! laughing drinks
        Although, what the hell it is, good - ice on the paths, half a meter of snow, pouring from the rooftops, from the sky raining incomprehensible rubbish, and even the wind. Brrrrrrrrrrrrrr ...
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 27 February 2021 10: 07
          +3
          Quote: Sea Cat
          Mutually, Arkady! laughing drinks
          Although, what the hell it is, good - ice on the paths, half a meter of snow, pouring from the rooftops, from the sky raining incomprehensible rubbish, and even the wind. Brrrrrrrrrrrrrr ...

          I'm Archibald! drinks Archibald Akakievich! hi
          And we have another temperature difference - from -11 the day before yesterday to +10 today laughing
          Kuban fellow
          1. Catfish
            Catfish 27 February 2021 10: 09
            +3
            A week ago it was -27, and the day before yesterday it was +5 negative Ryazan region. laughing
            1. Krasnodar
              Krasnodar 27 February 2021 11: 14
              +1
              Yes, nefig s ... merry
              1. Catfish
                Catfish 27 February 2021 11: 20
                +4
                "They do what they want!" (from)
                1. Astra wild2
                  Astra wild2 27 February 2021 14: 07
                  +3
                  Konstantin, good afternoon. As always, you have a funny picture.
                  1. Catfish
                    Catfish 27 February 2021 14: 34
                    +1
                    Good afternoon, Vera. love
                    This, unfortunately, is not for me, but for one good artist with an inexhaustible sense of humor. smile
                    1. Astra wild2
                      Astra wild2 27 February 2021 15: 04
                      +1
                      But are you downloading? So thank you
          2. Astra wild2
            Astra wild2 27 February 2021 14: 37
            +2
            I know Akaki Akakievich Bashmachnikov. Gogol's character
            1. Catfish
              Catfish 27 February 2021 16: 05
              0
              Gogol himself is still the same character. wassat
        2. vladcub
          vladcub 27 February 2021 17: 26
          +1
          Good evening, Kostya. Today I have + 11 and there is almost no snow left, but there was a fig. Alik had -11 at night, and at me, in the suburbs, -15, and now 11 heat! It's clear why Greta Thunberg was blown away
          1. Catfish
            Catfish 27 February 2021 17: 43
            0
            Happy young lady, she doesn't need pills. laughing
            1. vladcub
              vladcub 27 February 2021 18: 43
              +1
              Do not say: others need to swallow the "wheels" so that the head is blown off, but she does not need to be stupid
              1. Catfish
                Catfish 27 February 2021 18: 50
                -1
                Colleague of Greta's girl.

          2. Catfish
            Catfish 27 February 2021 17: 45
            0
            Hi, Slava, I am awaiting another cold snap - skating is not my sport. laughing
            1. vladcub
              vladcub 27 February 2021 18: 44
              +1
              And I don't know how to skate at all
              1. Catfish
                Catfish 27 February 2021 18: 46
                -1
                Likewise. It's worth skiing, but I don't like it either.
    4. GTYCBJYTH2021
      GTYCBJYTH2021 27 February 2021 09: 44
      -1
      Quote: Sea Cat
      VVVVVartu ogorbod month

      What to fiddle with the past ... was and passed into history ... ... The present, the living should live ...
      1. Astra wild2
        Astra wild2 27 February 2021 15: 01
        +4
        There is a very good saying: "who does not know the past, does not know either the present or the future."
        1. Catfish
          Catfish 27 February 2021 16: 21
          0
          "A people who do not know their past have no right to the future."
          It seems so.
          1. vladcub
            vladcub 27 February 2021 17: 36
            +3
            Kostya, there are several options and this: "without knowledge of the past, there is no future."
            And your version belongs to Klyuchevsky, and Vika attributes to Lomonosov
          2. Astra wild2
            Astra wild2 27 February 2021 19: 37
            +1
            Konstantin, just looked at Vika: my version is written off to Voltaire, and yours is really attributed to Lomonosov.
            It turns out that Viktor Nikolaevich is right when he scolds the Russian Vika?
            1. Catfish
              Catfish 27 February 2021 19: 55
              0
              Viktor Nikolaevich is always right, that's why his title is Viknik! soldier
        2. Richard
          Richard 27 February 2021 16: 55
          +3
          The Polish crew did not intend to succumb to internment and came up with a daring plan to escape from Tallinn

          At midnight on September 18, the crew seized the boat, tying up the Estonian sentries. "Ozhel" headed towards the exit from the harbor at full speed, but at the exit ran into a breakwater and, having received injuries in the nose, rolled over it and fled from Tallinn. Since there were two Estonian guards on the boat, Estonian and German newspapers accused the Polish crew of killing both. However, the Poles landed sentries near Sweden, gave them food, water and money to return to their homeland, after which they left for England.
          This incident served as a pretext for the Soviet Union's demand to conclude a mutual assistance treaty with Estonia, since Estonia cannot independently cope with the protection of its borders and ensure the safety of navigation in the Gulf of Finland, which is of strategic interest to the USSR.
          On September 24, the Soviet leader Leningrad fired several shots towards the Erus Bay. Three shells exploded in the water, one fell in the forest. Soviet officials called it "shelling of secret Polish submarine bases" in Estonian bays. " On the same day, three Soviet planes flew over the island of Saaremaa for over half an hour.
      2. Catfish
        Catfish 27 February 2021 16: 06
        0
        Andrey, is it for this commentary?
    5. Richard
      Richard 27 February 2021 16: 13
      +3
      I liked the article and the style of the author. It's a pity he doesn't write often.
  2. Catfish
    Catfish 27 February 2021 05: 38
    +12
    Good morning everyone and have a nice day!
    Sayd freaks out with terrible power - that's what he gave above instead of what I wanted to write.
    And I just wanted to say that in 1959 the Poles took off the thin one. the film "Eagle" and I saw it, but the story told in the movie, as usual, is somewhat different from what is written in the article.
    Thanks to the author for an unbiased and interesting story about this event. The crew of the boat died, but he, as best he could, brought the Victory Day closer.
    Gentlemen, administrators, do not catch mice at all, this is not the first day when you write a review on an article first on a thread. Photos cannot be inserted from the word - in general. Emoticons also do not want to be printed Ay-yay-yay.
    1. Catfish
      Catfish 27 February 2021 06: 03
      +12
      Frames from thin. film "Eagle":
      Estonians disarm the boat

      Passage through the straits.

      Photo of the real "Eagle" in Tallinn.

      Its commander is Grudziński.

      Cabin of the boat.

      Finally, I managed to upload a photo.
      1. Richard
        Richard 27 February 2021 16: 45
        +3
        ORP Orzeł (1938)
        real photos




        1. Richard
          Richard 27 February 2021 16: 50
          +4
          ORP Orzeł (1938)

          TTX
          Home port Hel
          Launching on January 15, 1938
          Status Missing
          Ship type large (ocean) submarine
          Project designation type "Ozel"
          Speed ​​(surface) of 19,4 knots
          Speed ​​(Underwater) 9 Knots
          Working immersion depth 80 m
          Ultimate immersion depth 100 m
          Cruising endurance 7000 miles on the surface / 100 miles under water
          60 crew
          dimensions
          Surface displacement 1100 t
          Underwater displacement 1650 t
          The length is the greatest
          (on design waterline) 84 m
          The width of the body naib. 6,7 m
          Average draft
          (on design waterline) 4,2 m
          Power point
          diesel engines: 2 × 4740 hp from.
          electric motors: 2 × 1100 hp from.
          weaponry
          Artillery 1 × 105 mm L / 41 cannon
          Torpedo-mine armament 8 × 1 and 2 × 2 - 550 mm TA (4 bow, 4 stern and 2 twin swivel torpedoes, 20 torpedoes)
          AA defense 1 coaxial 40-mm machine gun, 1 coaxial 13,2-mm machine gun
          1. Richard
            Richard 27 February 2021 16: 51
            +3
            Inside view




            1. Catfish
              Catfish 27 February 2021 16: 56
              +1
              Great selection, thanks, Dima. drinks
              The movie was filming another boat, of course.
              I had a selection of pre-war magazines "Mozhe", there were a lot of photographs of Polish ships, but for three years I pulled the strap, everything disappeared somewhere, I still regret it.
              1. Richard
                Richard 27 February 2021 17: 02
                +2
                I had a selection of pre-war magazines "Moge"

                I envy it because it's such a rarity
                1. Catfish
                  Catfish 27 February 2021 17: 05
                  +3
                  I was visiting my aunt in Vilnius and found magazines in excellent condition in the attic of our house, I was 13 years old, so I just slept with these magazines. Much wasted while I was in the army, not only that.
                2. Former naval person
                  28 February 2021 13: 12
                  +3
                  Archival photographs of "ozhela" in good quality are available in the archive named after General Sikorsky.
              2. Former naval person
                28 February 2021 13: 12
                +4
                in the cinema, his twin "semp" played the role of "ozhela".
    2. Korsar4
      Korsar4 27 February 2021 07: 42
      +4
      Is April approaching and the letters are folding backwards?
      1. Catfish
        Catfish 27 February 2021 07: 50
        +7
        Hello, Sergey. smile

        I wonder what will happen then by the end of May? laughing
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 27 February 2021 08: 37
          +4
          Hello Konstantin! Is it really summer?
          And the snow will finally melt.
          1. Catfish
            Catfish 27 February 2021 08: 42
            +3
            I can’t even believe it - winter is bored, there is half a meter of snow in the garden.
            1. Korsar4
              Korsar4 27 February 2021 08: 59
              +5
              The center of Moscow is already snowless. In the suburbs - ice. I'll go to the train in advance.
              1. GTYCBJYTH2021
                GTYCBJYTH2021 27 February 2021 09: 51
                -4
                Quote: Korsar4
                The center of Moscow is already snowless. In the suburbs - ice. I'll go to the train in advance.

                You have Putin ... And Moscow was filled with snow ... And what about Krasnoyarsk, Norilsk ... Yakutsk ... Muscovites have no shame on the neck of RUSSIANS to live ...
                1. Korsar4
                  Korsar4 27 February 2021 11: 46
                  +6
                  Please tell me, for what act in front of you should I be ashamed?
                  1. 3x3zsave
                    3x3zsave 27 February 2021 13: 25
                    +5
                    Apparently for superior intelligence.
                    1. Catfish
                      Catfish 27 February 2021 16: 33
                      +2
                      That's why they hate. "Moskvich - the tops picked up", and the point is all in smoked sausage, which in his Mukho s r and n s ke had never been seen. But this was in Soviet times, and now what does not give them wiser?
                    2. vladcub
                      vladcub 27 February 2021 17: 46
                      +2
                      Anton, so this is the most important thing: the superiority of intelligence is NOT FORGIVEN!
                  2. Krasnodar
                    Krasnodar 27 February 2021 15: 02
                    +3
                    Quote: Korsar4
                    Please tell me, for what act in front of you should I be ashamed?

                    V.I. is running. Stalin along the corridor of Smolny, late for a meeting of the Revolutionary Military Council. Bronstein steps towards him.
                    Koba falls, the paper is falling from his hands, he looked at the touchy one and said: Krest is on you net, Tavarisch Trotsky.
                    And he was absolutely right! fellow
                    PS And I could have with an ice pick on the head
                    1. vladcub
                      vladcub 27 February 2021 17: 48
                      +1
                      Thank you, I have not heard this yet
                  3. Andrey Shiryaev
                    Andrey Shiryaev 28 February 2021 18: 42
                    0
                    Pecheng, probably, or Khazarin laughing
                2. Catfish
                  Catfish 27 February 2021 16: 31
                  +3
                  You have Putin.


                  And what about you? Grandfather Pikhto and Aunt Martha? And about "sitting on the neck" - you, sick, wash her first, and after that I'll think about whether it's worth sitting on her.
                  Half a century has passed, and you, home-grown people, are still blowing in the same tune - Muscovites are to blame for everything.
                  "They carry water to the water" - have you heard this proverb? So, in this regard, let me ask you, how are you with water?
                3. Astra wild2
                  Astra wild2 27 February 2021 19: 42
                  +2
                  "You have Putin" actually, Putin is already 20 years old, and Moscow has not been swept away like that. So it’s not his fault, but whom.?
            2. 3x3zsave
              3x3zsave 27 February 2021 09: 12
              +3
              Better than ours. All week I drove along the dam to Lomonosov, cursed everything! In a day, some "adventures".
              1. Catfish
                Catfish 27 February 2021 09: 23
                +3
                Hi Anon! drinks

                It's like saying which is better. It's good where we are not. For example, I cannot leave, the quadrik sits on its belly, and this despite the fact that we already cleaned the garden with a tractor at one time. Now you need it again, otherwise it won't melt earlier than in a month.
                1. 3x3zsave
                  3x3zsave 27 February 2021 09: 34
                  +3
                  It's good where we are not
                  Yes, of course.
                  I will not drive for the next two days. Hopefully, during this time it will thaw out so that it will be possible to ride, and not plan.
                  1. Catfish
                    Catfish 27 February 2021 09: 51
                    +3
                    This is correct, take an example from Sergei, he himself calmly gets by train, however, on foot, too, is not sugar.
                    1. 3x3zsave
                      3x3zsave 27 February 2021 09: 57
                      +3
                      Sergei does not need to carry 20-30 kg of tools from object to object.
                      1. Catfish
                        Catfish 27 February 2021 10: 12
                        +3
                        But what about the negroes, what are they good for there? wink

                      2. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 27 February 2021 10: 29
                        +4
                        Simple arithmetic of the cost of public transport proves that it is cheaper and faster by car.
                      3. Catfish
                        Catfish 27 February 2021 10: 32
                        +2
                        Well, you know better, when I worked at Mosproekt, I only came to the construction site to drink port with the foremen.
                      4. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 27 February 2021 11: 50
                        +3
                        But no. They just let me on the train.
                        And in the subway I try to look less often.

                        "The old sea wolf will teach you thrift" (c).
                      5. Catfish
                        Catfish 27 February 2021 12: 17
                        +3
                        And then !!! "We swam - we know" (c)

                      6. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 27 February 2021 12: 56
                        +3
                        “Hold on, Solnyshkin! Bow! " (from).
                2. Korsar4
                  Korsar4 27 February 2021 11: 49
                  +3
                  Here. And there are also Sherpas.
                3. Catfish
                  Catfish 27 February 2021 12: 19
                  +3
                  Sherpas - in the balls! angry
                4. Korsar4
                  Korsar4 27 February 2021 12: 57
                  +3
                  Tenzing Norgay would not approve.
            3. Astra wild2
              Astra wild2 27 February 2021 18: 26
              +1
              And Anton is the overseer?
            4. Catfish
              Catfish 27 February 2021 18: 39
              +1
              Anton is a big white bwana, and his overseers are called brigadiers.
            5. Astra wild2
              Astra wild2 27 February 2021 19: 50
              +2
              And who shot the brick: a black man or a bwana?
            6. Catfish
              Catfish 27 February 2021 19: 52
              +2
              Enemies, interventionists, wreckers of socialist construction! am
            7. Astra wild2
              Astra wild2 28 February 2021 15: 00
              +1
              Look how it is. The main thing is not to be thrown at us
  3. Korsar4
    Korsar4 27 February 2021 11: 48
    +3
    Yes. I put the fountain pen in my pocket. And he went happy.
    True, the backpack has not yet been thrown away. But this is already in the field season.
  4. 3x3zsave
    3x3zsave 27 February 2021 12: 17
    +3
    It never worked that way. Even now, in the presence of a "bucket", I constantly carry in my bag some drills, terminal blocks, jigsaw files ... Professional deformation, apparently.
  5. Korsar4
    Korsar4 27 February 2021 12: 58
    +2
    If you use it, how not to carry it.
    I always stuffed my bag. But now a lot fits into the tablet.
  6. 3x3zsave
    3x3zsave 27 February 2021 13: 36
    +2
    If you use it, how not to carry it.
    Uh-huh. This is karma. About 20 years ago, there was a case. They stopped the PPSniki, I have a long slotted screwdriver in my bag, with a sharpened sting, for working with a small electrician. I had to spend the night in the department.
  7. Catfish
    Catfish 27 February 2021 13: 08
    +2
    It's like cartridges in the third year in the army, you even go to the latrine with them.
  8. 3x3zsave
    3x3zsave 27 February 2021 13: 14
    +2
    But in the army, by the way, my main instrument for the first year was a ballpoint pen.
  • The leader of the Redskins
    The leader of the Redskins 27 February 2021 10: 31
    +2
    I envy ... And we have to go to a neighboring town today for our birthday. With cake, gifts and children (no train). So the spouse will show a master class)))
    1. 3x3zsave
      3x3zsave 27 February 2021 10: 36
      +2
      I, too, today on "day", but on foot, not far, "trawl" + four metro stations.
      1. Catfish
        Catfish 27 February 2021 12: 13
        +3
        And today they will bring vodka to my house, damn how much I haven't drunk, organon asks. smile drinks
      2. 3x3zsave
        3x3zsave 27 February 2021 12: 23
        +3
        Well, they say that there is no service in the provinces! Breshut, envious people of the capital!
      3. Catfish
        Catfish 27 February 2021 13: 13
        +2
        The imperialists slander. am

    2. Liam
      Liam 27 February 2021 12: 25
      +2
      Again the site will be flooded with drunken snot ...
    3. Catfish
      Catfish 27 February 2021 13: 06
      +3
      And you are not asked here. request

      By the way, what about the frozen Italian snot in that memorable winter of 42 to 43? Can you share your experience? tongue
    4. Liam
      Liam 27 February 2021 14: 48
      -1
      At least they threw a snack or out of habit ... with a sleeve ..
    5. Catfish
      Catfish 27 February 2021 14: 57
      +2
      Do not judge people by yourself.
      By the way, you did not answer the question about the frozen snot of your compatriots. Not good, not polite.
    6. Liam
      Liam 27 February 2021 15: 03
      +2
      Leave the story alone, where knowledge is needed to discuss)
      Better let us talk about more familiar and familiar things in the framework of the usual flood for you and your fellow companions in any thread. Type of friendly conversation of Quakers who are not particularly busy with useful things.
      With vodka, what do you prefer besides pickled cucumber?
    7. Catfish
      Catfish 27 February 2021 16: 19
      0
      There knowledge is needed to discuss)


      Knowledge about what, about Italian snot in Russian frost? So this is your story and you know better, that's why I'm asking you.
      With regard to a friendly conversation, you are absolutely right, I have friends here, but you do not seem to have them. You should not be angry and go bile, I am completely indifferent to both you and your opinion about me and my friends, do not waste your nerves and time. smile
      I prefer a lot of tasty things to vodka, but I prefer rum or vintage port to vodka. And in your dreams you can have a snack of vodka with anything, but, I suppose, you still cannot drink it. hi
    8. vladcub
      vladcub 27 February 2021 18: 16
      +2
      Actually, I do not see anything wrong, I do not see anything in friendly communication. And then Kostya is an expert in firearms
    9. Liam
      Liam 27 February 2021 20: 14
      +2
      Quote: vladcub
      I don't see anything bad in friendly communication

      Undoubtedly, especially on dating sites, Odnoklassniki and other similar resources. Here, for years, you litter the thematic branches with a monotonous flood about hangover syndromes after yesterday's drinking, plans about upcoming drinks, touching stories about pets and their adventures, ping pong from dozens of supposedly rhymes, photos in the style of Nu and other similar nonsense from soap operas a la Desperate Housewives. The main goal of this informative and fascinating user for the uninvolved in this performance is to hang each other several dozen plus signs a day and provide clickbait to a couple of "their" authors. to friendly and cultural communication
      It becomes more and more boring and difficult to wade through this jungle of unreadable delirium.
      Quote: vladcub
      Kostya is an expert in firearms

      Uh-huh ... maybe cold. Unmistakably distinguishes a fork from a knife. And it depends on how much they gave the sufferer organone
    10. Korsar4
      Korsar4 27 February 2021 23: 48
      +2
      Change is often more beneficial than lessons. Only if they complement each other.
    11. vladcub
      vladcub 28 February 2021 09: 19
      +1
      If you don't like being friendly. In this case, there is nothing friendly under the Samsonovs, but only hatred. I prefer to talk here than to drown in the saliva of hatred.
      Don't like the pictures? Share the best
    12. Liam
      Liam 28 February 2021 10: 18
      0
      This is a false alternative. The herd instinct in its worst manifestations feels great both there and there. Separation of friend / foe, tolerance for the worst manifestations of behavior and even their support if they come from "friends", lack of critical thinking, aggression against anyone who dares criticize "your" user or author, even if the criticism is justified and the comment of a "friend" or the author's article is frank delirium, streams of praise and touching thanks to very unprofessional and frankly hacky articles, degradation of the level of communication even of those few who have knowledge and skills that For a long time they have not written anything on topics, but only generate this nonsense. So do not flatter yourself. There are no fundamental differences between those branches and these.
    13. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
      Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 28 February 2021 17: 46
      0
      Quote: Liam
      degradation of the level of communication even of those few who have knowledge and skills who have not written anything on topics for a long time, but only generate this nonsense. So do not flatter yourself. There are no fundamental differences between those branches and these.

      I support and agree with each of your comments. With all due respect to the camedenshaft, all this completely irrelevant flood is regrettable and annoying. hi
  • Astra wild2
    Astra wild2 27 February 2021 18: 30
    +2
    In my opinion this is called rudeness
  • Catfish
    Catfish 27 February 2021 20: 00
    -1
    He is alone and no one loves him, hence the malice. And to hell with him.
  • Liam
    Liam 27 February 2021 20: 17
    +1
    You are distinguished by amazing insight for what you need my tinned name +. If I am not mistaken, this is your main interest here
  • Richard
    Richard 27 February 2021 22: 43
    +4
    Liam, what's wrong with you? Why be rude? Wouldn't it be better either to join the conversation, or just write a comment on the topic of the article.
    You are a good and erudite commentator. Absolutely not a stranger in this section.
    Here you made a reproach about the points, but note that neither the Sea Cat, nor how you call him - his "friend-friend", in this article did not give you a single weighty "general minus". Pros - cons - it's all secondary
  • Liam
    Liam 28 February 2021 00: 36
    0
    He who has eyes, let him read.
  • Astra wild2
    Astra wild2 27 February 2021 19: 58
    +2
    I thought you had a myriad of home supplies? I did it for myself, for the first time in my life, and thought that 9 liters would be enough for me until the summer, but 1,5 liters was gone: 0,5 for New Year and Christmas, I took 1 "baby"
  • Richard
    Richard 28 February 2021 00: 22
    0
    0,5 went for New Year and 0,5 for Christmas, but one 0,5 "kid" took

    A liter and a half for New Year, Christmas and Epiphany? Just? repeat
    Then, taking into account your scanty expenses, and based on the proverb "there are no not beautiful women, there is not enough drunk, it turns out that you are a rather beautiful woman and do not add vodka to men for an incentive yes )))))
  • Richard
    Richard 27 February 2021 17: 14
    +3
    Chief of the Redskins (Nazarius): Today we are going to a neighboring town for our birthday. With cake, gifts and children (no train). So the spouse will show a master class)))

    And today, from early morning until lunchtime, I worked as a metro builder - the tractor in the morning drove through the village, cleared the roadway, but completely covered the exits to the houses with a XNUMX-meter layer. And me in the evening to Stavropol. Tortured to clean.
  • vladcub
    vladcub 27 February 2021 18: 06
    +2
    Chief, will the cake itself be in your hands?
    Comrades, remember, from history: did the gopniks take away the car from Lenin? As a child, I read a story: Lenin was going to Krupskaya's and before leaving he handed the guard a spray of milk: "Don't spill it." Now I remembered
    1. Astra wild2
      Astra wild2 27 February 2021 18: 33
      +1
      I also read this story
    2. Phil77
      Phil77 27 February 2021 19: 58
      +1
      Did you designate Yakov Koshelkov as a * gopnik *? Well, well, the deceased would be at least dissatisfied with you, and at the maximum he would criticize you. laughing
    3. Richard
      Richard 27 February 2021 23: 04
      +1
      Well, what a gopnik he is. He is a Muscovite, not a Petersburger.
      By the way, his surname Kuznetsov, Koshelkov - drove. He was a well-known Moscow raider of the late 1910s, who was "in counter" with the Khitrov criminal world and had nothing to do with the gopniks.
      The origin of this word is associated with St. Petersburg. In "tsarist times" there was a system of "public charity orders", such provincial committees, the main purpose of which was to take care of the poor, orphans, cripples, vagrants and other marginal individuals who were kept in nursing homes at the expense of zemstvo institutions. There was a similar establishment at the corner of Ligovsky and Nevsky avenues. It was called the Urban Prize Society (priest - care), that is, abbreviated GOP... The funds for their maintenance, of course, were not enough, and in the conditions of the then realities, like the beginning of the world war, the revolutions that came, even more so. It is clear that the "characters" of these houses of the priest were begging, engaged in petty theft, especially at the nearby Nikolaevsky railway station (now it is Moskovsky)
      After the October Revolution, this house was renamed the State hostel of the proletariat, retaining the abbreviation GOP... They also continued to bring homeless children and adolescents who were engaged in theft and robbery, but in the conditions of the then chaos, their number increased many times. The crime situation in the city has deteriorated sharply due to the large number of juvenile criminals. Peasants who fled from the villages to the city began to settle in these houses, who, under the general influence and atmosphere, poured into these essentially gangs that were engaged in street thefts and robberies (gop-stop). Inhabitants of St. Petersburg began to use the words "gopniks" in conversation, meaning the inhabitants of that same GOP from Ligovka. In the 20-30s. there was even such an expression when ill-mannered people were asked: "Do you live in Ligovka?"
    4. Phil77
      Phil77 28 February 2021 06: 55
      +1
      Good morning Dmitry!
      How does the site * hang *?
      The fact that Yasha- * Elusive * is by no means * a gopnik * I wrote, or rather expressed extreme surprise at the comparison of a seasoned raider with a criminal trifle.
    5. Richard
      Richard 28 February 2021 07: 06
      +1
      So I answered Svyatoslav. yes And the site has moved my comment to yours. Here is such a garbage and turned out request
    6. Phil77
      Phil77 28 February 2021 07: 08
      +2
      This is roughly what I understood. On the next branch again * war on monuments *. Oh, and tired of this topic!
    7. Richard
      Richard 28 February 2021 07: 35
      +1
      And I have sworn to comment on Samson's articles, where he has his own electorate. The tourniquet is not childish. yes Explanatory comments can be counted on the fingers, but the minuses fly in all directions laughing
    8. Phil77
      Phil77 28 February 2021 10: 59
      +1
      No, Dmitry, there Skomorokhov excites the people. Sunday morning. laughing There is no more desire to go there. No one. Not at all. I know.
    9. Richard
      Richard 28 February 2021 11: 18
      0
      And the next branch in this section is Samson's article "Who killed the Russian Empire." I mean her yes
      By the way, I read Skomorokhov, but somehow without emotion and comments. Not hooked. He used to write much more interesting.
    10. Phil77
      Phil77 28 February 2021 12: 11
      +1
      It's just that the topic is frankly * vain *, it is not capable of catching. No, it is capable, but the contingent for it needs ... specific. In general, I think that in our difficult times, and the future looks generally ... vague. We need a kind of moratorium on monuments erected to * political * figures.
    11. Richard
      Richard 28 February 2021 12: 34
      +1
      We need a kind of moratorium on monuments erected to * political * figures.

      A week ago I proposed an option that IMHO would suit everyone
  • vladcub
    vladcub 28 February 2021 11: 56
    +3
    Between them, saying: Roma is not very different from the Samsonovs. If by the evening does not appear, something adequate then ... a day down the drain.
    "Cat", do not be angry that we are directing all dirty tricks to you
  • Richard
    Richard 28 February 2021 12: 28
    +1
    Svyatoslav, I am "doggy" wink
    By the way, in "armament" there is a new article of VOSh
  • vladcub
    vladcub 28 February 2021 12: 30
    +1
    It is very good. Zehr is here.
  • vladcub
    vladcub 28 February 2021 11: 48
    +1
    I read about this 40-45 years ago, and then in-depth study of such topics was not very welcomed.
  • vladcub
    vladcub 28 February 2021 11: 40
    +1
    Thanks for the educational program.
  • Astra wild2
    Astra wild2 27 February 2021 19: 48
    +1
    Konstantin, but the most reliable form of transport is on foot, or as in childhood I heard: "go to number eleven", did you not try?
    1. Catfish
      Catfish 27 February 2021 20: 02
      0
      With "walking", Vera, I'm not very much now, with my legs problems, and earlier it was so easy with pleasure.
  • The leader of the Redskins
    The leader of the Redskins 27 February 2021 08: 49
    +2
    Hmm ... I have never heard of such a movie. It will be necessary to dig and see ... And what two different characters the captains turned out to be!
    1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
      Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 10: 11
      +5
      Quote: Leader of the Redskins
      And what two different characters the captains have!

      Oh, they also composed a love story that, allegedly, Klochkovsky was fond of the wife of the Polish trade representative) When the Soviets came, the trade representative was put in a camp, his wife was kicked in Kazakhstan, but the cap was not touched in a strange way by the NKVD. Something is wrong here laughing
      1. Alex013
        Alex013 27 February 2021 16: 20
        +3
        Exactly! Dark story
        ".... What happened to the hero-lover Henrik Klochkovsky? For some reason, the NKVD did not touch him. The sailor moved to Leningrad (before the revolution he lived and studied there), and with the beginning of the Great Patriotic War he joined the Polish infantry being formed in the USSR division named after Kosciuszko and immediately fell under the Polish military court. He was demoted to sailors, but no jail sentence was appointed. Klochkovsky was hired on an American merchant ship and sailed on it as part of the Northern convoys with Lend-Lease cargo throughout the war. Died in 1950- years into oblivion in America .... "
        1. Astra wild2
          Astra wild2 27 February 2021 20: 04
          +2
          "Immediately fell on the Polish military court" probably, he thought that if Kosciuszko's division then the Poles forgot his act? It looks a lot like dithering in my opinion
  • Comrade
    Comrade 27 February 2021 06: 15
    +9
    The Dutch already knew that they all fell into the hands of the Germans during the occupation of Holland, but most likely they did not know that two of them had been sold to Poland before the war.

    Submarines "Orzeł" and "Sęp" were built by order of Poland at the shipyard Rotterdamsche Droogdok Maatschappij.
    None of the Dutch submarines were sold to the Poles. Even if this kind of negotiations were initiated by one of the parties, everything would have come down to the lack of money from Poland to purchase warships from Holland.
    Even for "Orzeł" and "Sęp" poor Poles, according to the agreement reached, paid not with "real" money, but with beer malt for Dutch breweries. By the way, about ten percent of the components - ropes, electric motors, power cables, etc. - for these two boats were supplied by the Polish side.

    However, the most likely reason for the death of the "Ozhel" is the erroneous torpedoing of the Polish submarine, the Dutch "O-13"

    The version about the sinking of the "Eagle" by a Dutch submarine (May 25, 1940 at about 23:00) was nominated by Feliks Prządak, a member of the Eagle's crew, who did not participate in the last cruise of the boat.
    Testing the hypothesis about the erroneous sinking of the Eagle by the Dutch is difficult due to the fact that after the end of the war the British classified the data on the death of the Eagle for 50 years, and then extended the moratorium on access to this data for another 50 years.

    The most widely discussed is the version of the death of the boat by a mine. The Germans established a defensive minefield Westwall, which included several minefields, numbering a total of 380 anchor mines and 1 defenders. The Eagle's route ran directly or near these fields. In addition, from areas where the Eagle patrolled, other Allied ships reported the presence of many drifting mines.
    Since 2006, 2017, the Poles have repeatedly made unsuccessful attempts to find the remains of the "Eagle". Polish naval officials say the search will continue until the dead boat is found.
    1. Catfish
      Catfish 27 February 2021 06: 59
      +6
      And you do not know what this story with the "escape" is, otherwise in the article they just mentioned it.

      Her twin "Semp" ("Sip"), after a kind of "escape" from the Dutch shipyard ...
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 27 February 2021 07: 31
        +1
        Quote: Sea Cat
        And you do not know what this story with the "escape" is, otherwise in the article they just mentioned it.

        I could tell you more about this "escape, but I'm afraid, as always, I will not be understood as always.
        1. Catfish
          Catfish 27 February 2021 07: 34
          +5
          Good morning Vlad! hi
          ... but I'm afraid, as always, I will not be understood as always.

          And you try, I will honestly try to understand. And if you have any questions, I will. smile
          1. tihonmarine
            tihonmarine 27 February 2021 07: 54
            +1
            Quote: Sea Cat
            And you try, I will honestly try to understand. And if you have any questions, I will.

            Well, I'll try if they believe it.
            When "Eagle" entered TLN, our people realized that it was a provocation. From the SPB left the PH "Communist" (I forgot the last name KM) In the Bornholm region, for some unknown reason, an explosion, the steamer sinks, the Swedes rescued the crew. All the blame is on "Eagle", who allegedly escaped from TLN. And then everything went according to plan .. KM got the "Order of Lenin".
            I worked with this person. "For what I bought. For what I sold." But .... YOU KNOW THE SEAFARERS YOURSELF.
            1. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 27 February 2021 08: 09
              +1
              Quote: tihonmarine
              For what I bought. for that he sold. "But .... YOU KNOW THE SEAFARERS.

              But he had an order.
            2. Catfish
              Catfish 27 February 2021 08: 17
              +2
              Thank you, Vlad. The story is one of the very muddy ones that that time was full of, and not only that.
              I understand that before the "annexation" of Estonia, no one needed a Polish submarine there, but still, it was somehow too difficult - to sink your own steamer, although ... there was a story with the "Maine" in Havana, still haven't really figured out what it was, a sabotage, or an accident, but it hurt just in time.
              1. tihonmarine
                tihonmarine 27 February 2021 08: 22
                +3
                Quote: Sea Cat
                Thank you, Vlad. The story is one of the very muddy ones that that time was full of, and not only that.

                It's even a super dark story. I haven’t learned to tell lies. Just for my sea life and nonsense I heard a lot and truth. And who will understand moreman with 50 years of sea experience.
                1. Catfish
                  Catfish 27 February 2021 08: 26
                  +4
                  You can understand any person, there would be a desire. smile
                  1. tihonmarine
                    tihonmarine 27 February 2021 09: 57
                    +1
                    Quote: Sea Cat
                    You can understand any person, there would be a desire.

                    I forgot, there is a film by Bergman, "Midsummer's Night".
                    Everything is as if in spirit.
                    1. Catfish
                      Catfish 27 February 2021 10: 13
                      +1
                      Unfortunately, I have not seen. request
                      1. tihonmarine
                        tihonmarine 27 February 2021 10: 27
                        +1
                        Quote: Sea Cat
                        Unfortunately, I have not seen. request

                        Was a few years ago, then downloaded it removed, but now you will not find it.
                        Removed.
              2. tihonmarine
                tihonmarine 27 February 2021 09: 29
                0
                Quote: Sea Cat
                I understand that before the "annexation" of Estonia, the Polish submarine was not needed by anyone there, but still, it was somehow too difficult - to sink your own steamer, although

                Estonia accepted the Polish submarine and refueled it, in violation of international rules. The answer is clear - the introduction of Soviet troops into Estonia. Everything is dark, but everything is white. And most importantly, everything is clean.
              3. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
                Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 09: 41
                +5
                Quote: Sea Cat
                somehow it’s painfully difficult - to sink your own steamer,

                Why not? In the 80s, a book by Yukka Myakkel was published, he claims that Osipov carried out the action on Shch-303 with the knowledge and direct order of Zhdanov and Kuznetsov.
                More precisely, it should have been carried out, but missed with two torpedoes from the surface position, and the cargo ship sank the patrol boat Tucha, to which Metallist's team had previously switched.
                1. Catfish
                  Catfish 27 February 2021 09: 59
                  +4
                  Well, this Finnish guy certainly knows what they were talking about over the bottle "for three" Kuznetsov, Zhdanov and Osipov. laughing
                  Very similar to an episode from a famous movie:
                  "... what did Father Varlaam talk about with Grishka the impostor on the Lithuanian border." (S. Captain Zheglov).
                  1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
                    Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 10: 24
                    +6
                    Quote: Sea Cat
                    Well, this Finnish guy probably knows exactly what they were talking about.

                    One thing is clear - the Metalist Eagle did not drown and the Pioneer did not nightmare. The Pole left Tallinn with six torpedoes, came to Britain with six torpedoes. The weapon is out of action. Grudziński drowned Metalist, shouting to him 'Tony, currrva!' from the bridge?)) In the apocrypha with Shch-303, I personally feel more offended for Osipov - damn it, miss it with two torpedoes on a stationary target ...
                    1. Catfish
                      Catfish 27 February 2021 10: 29
                      +1
                      So I'm not saying that "Eagle" drowned some "Metallist", but there is no evidence with regard to Osipov either.
                      1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
                        Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 10: 31
                        +1
                        Quote: Sea Cat
                        but in relation to Osipov, there is no evidence

                        That is why I called Finn's presentation 'apocrypha')
                      2. Catfish
                        Catfish 27 February 2021 10: 32
                        +1
                        Quite fair. smile
              4. tihonmarine
                tihonmarine 27 February 2021 10: 00
                -1
                Quote: Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
                Why not? In the 80s, a book by Yukka Myakkel was published, he claims that Osipov carried out the action on Shch-303 with the knowledge and direct order of Zhdanov and Kuznetsov.

                So he is Finn, but not Russian and not a foreigner, how should he know - a man.
                1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
                  Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 10: 28
                  +2
                  Quote: tihonmarine
                  So he is Finn, but not Russian and not a foreigner, how should he know - a man.

                  And what does nationality have to do with it?
                  1. tihonmarine
                    tihonmarine 27 February 2021 10: 30
                    -3
                    Quote: Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
                    And what does nationality have to do with it?

                    Where you live, write about that. Do not live and do not write.
                    1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
                      Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 10: 33
                      +1
                      Quote: tihonmarine
                      Where you live, write about that. Do not live and do not write.

                      Funny position)
            3. Astra wild2
              Astra wild2 27 February 2021 20: 32
              +1
              "The story with the Maine in Havana" If I'm not mistaken, in the 19th century in Havana, an American battleship sank. Was this the pretext for the Spanish-American War?
              1. Catfish
                Catfish 27 February 2021 20: 50
                -1
                He did not drown, he exploded while standing against the wall, not in battle. There were prepositions before, but that was the reason.
          2. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
            Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 09: 36
            +4
            Quote: tihonmarine
            PH "Kommunist" came out of St. Petersburg

            'Metalist'
            1. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 27 February 2021 10: 37
              +1
              Quote: Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
              'Metalist'

              I didn't even think you heard this story. Wrong, rarely does anyone know.
              1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
                Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 10: 48
                +2
                Quote: tihonmarine
                Wrong, rarely does anyone know.

                I disagree. This is a fairly well-known story.
                1. Astra wild2
                  Astra wild2 27 February 2021 20: 38
                  0
                  But not everyone knows about this story, but for this, do not consider it a work and tell
                  1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
                    Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 21: 37
                    +1
                    Quote: Astra wild2
                    But not everyone knows about this story, but for this, do not consider it a work and tell

                    Read the thread. There is about 'Metalist' and 'Pioneer' in it. I see no reason to repeat hi
        2. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 27 February 2021 07: 58
          +3
          Quote: Sea Cat
          And you try, I will honestly try to understand. And if you have any questions, I will.

          You will understand, and "trawlflot", but ........
        3. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 27 February 2021 08: 07
          +1
          Quote: Sea Cat
          And you try

          I tried it. I worked in St. Petersburg with this guy, on Kamenny Island. Will understand where it is, only Sergei from St. Petersburg and one more.
          1. 3x3zsave
            3x3zsave 27 February 2021 08: 19
            +4
            I worked in St. Petersburg with this guy, on Kamenny Island.
            My regards! hi
            Object "K-4"?
            1. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 27 February 2021 08: 44
              +1
              Quote: 3x3zsave
              Object "K-4"?

              BSMZ
              1. 3x3zsave
                3x3zsave 27 February 2021 08: 53
                +3
                Sorry, maybe I don't know something, but the BSMZ site is located in the Big Turukhtannaya harbor ... recourse
                1. tihonmarine
                  tihonmarine 27 February 2021 08: 56
                  +1
                  Quote: 3x3zsave
                  Sorry, maybe I don't know something, but the BSZM site is located in the Big Turukhtannaya harbor ...

                  Tosno, there was also "cutting", and the office of "Kutuzaki".
                  1. 3x3zsave
                    3x3zsave 27 February 2021 09: 00
                    +1
                    I looked at the official site of the plant, it was also "cut up".
                    1. tihonmarine
                      tihonmarine 27 February 2021 09: 32
                      +2
                      Quote: 3x3zsave
                      I looked at the official site of the plant, it was also "cut up".

                      Then "Barbaretta", where the owner was banged, and so on. but now I don’t know.
                    2. 3x3zsave
                      3x3zsave 27 February 2021 09: 38
                      +2
                      Now the site of the plant is put up for sale for $ 150 million
                    3. tihonmarine
                      tihonmarine 27 February 2021 11: 40
                      +2
                      Quote: 3x3zsave
                      Now the site of the plant is put up for sale for $ 150 million

                      As always "sell - buy - bankrupt"
      2. Catfish
        Catfish 27 February 2021 08: 20
        +3
        I am a Muscovite, but still interesting. Special office?
        1. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 27 February 2021 08: 46
          +1
          Quote: Sea Cat
          I am a Muscovite, but still interesting. Special office?

          Former department of the NKVD.
          1. Catfish
            Catfish 27 February 2021 08: 48
            +3
            For some reason I thought so.
            1. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 27 February 2021 08: 50
              0
              Quote: Sea Cat
              For some reason I thought so.

              Logical.
        2. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 27 February 2021 14: 50
          +1
          Quote: Sea Cat
          I am a Muscovite

          And I thought the Ryazan man was skew-bellied. recourse
          1. Catfish
            Catfish 27 February 2021 14: 53
            +2
            After surgery, the belly is really oblique laughing , and I no longer live in Moscow, but near Ryazan. So I thought right, in all respects.
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 27 February 2021 15: 15
              +1
              Quote: Sea Cat
              So I thought right, in every way

              Well, I’m already getting worried ... winked
              1. Catfish
                Catfish 27 February 2021 16: 04
                0
                The poet's soul is subtle, everyone can offend. wink
                1. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 27 February 2021 16: 07
                  +1
                  Quote: Sea Cat
                  The poet's soul is subtle

                  This is not about me. In poetry, I only have swear words in rhyme, to their mother, to the left.
                2. Catfish
                  Catfish 27 February 2021 16: 09
                  0
                  We are colleagues in this regard, my rhyme is also more and more on the floor of decent words. laughing
  • tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 27 February 2021 08: 12
    +2
    Quote: Sea Cat
    And you try, I will honestly try to understand. And if you have any questions, I will.

    Got it, I don't want to talk further, they will count it as a dabyl.
  • tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 27 February 2021 08: 26
    +1
    Quote: Sea Cat
    And you try, I will honestly try to understand. And if you have any questions, I will.

    Yes, I don’t want to talk about the sea, as everyone has already become obsessed with this Ukraine and the Can!
  • Undecim
    Undecim 27 February 2021 09: 20
    +9
    The question was asked about the "escape" of the second submarine - "Sip", which the Poles simply hijacked before the official acceptance due to the aggravated situation in Europe.
    And you present the version with the escape of "Eagle" from Tallinn.
    You can read about it here -https: //flot.com/history/interesting/orel.htm.
    The author of the article somehow ignored this moment, either out of ignorance, or for "political" reasons.
    1. Former naval person
      28 February 2021 13: 17
      0
      the article is not about the "Semp" and not even about the "Ozel" as such, but about its commander.
    2. volodimer
      volodimer 28 February 2021 13: 36
      0
      Thank you, I had to shovel comments for a long time in the hope of getting this information. In general, I expected so. The Dutch would know what awaits them themselves ..
  • hohol95
    hohol95 27 February 2021 09: 29
    +4
    Based on the material "ORP Sęp (1938) -ORP Sęp (1938) ORP (1938) - https://ru.qaz.wiki/wiki/ORP_S%C4%99p_(1938)"
    The Vulture was built at the Dutch shipyard Rotterdamsche Droogdok Maatschappij, it was laid down in November 1936 and launched on October 17, 1938. At the beginning of 1939, the Polish team leading the construction of the ship noticed a significant slowdown in its construction, which it attributed to the actions of German agents. Due to fears that German pressure on the Netherlands would prevent this country from transferring the ship to Poland, it was decided to deliver the ship to Poland earlier than planned. On April 2, the ship entered deep sea trials in Horten, Norway, with a crew of Polish sailors and Dutch technicians flying the Dutch flag. After completing the tests, the Polish crew took over control of the ship (against the wishes of the Dutch technicians on board), raised the Polish flag and left Horten to meet the Polish destroyer ORP Burza outside the harbor. On the way, the ship ran out of diesel fuel, and the destroyer had to take it in tow. On April 18, the Sep arrived in Gdynia, entering the harbor on its electric motors, and was officially adopted by the Polish fleet. Until Poland itself, two Dutch technicians "remained" on the boat !!! The rest of the Dutch (apparently of no technical interest) were landed ashore in Norway! Upon arrival in Poland, these technicians were released and allowed to return home.

    Such was the "ESCAPE"!
  • Comrade
    Comrade 28 February 2021 04: 58
    +2
    Quote: Sea Cat
    And you do not know what this story with the "escape" is, otherwise in the article they just mentioned it.
    Her twin "Semp" ("Sip"), after a kind of "escape" from the Dutch shipyard


    Dear colleague, I will gladly share what I know.
    The submarine "Sęp" ("Snake") was launched on October 17, 1938, and in the spring of 1939 was tested in Oslofjord (bay in southeastern Norway).
    The Poles, fearing that in the event of a war with Germany, the Dutch government would confiscate the submarine, decided to kidnap it. On April 16, the "Snake" arrived in Norway, where on the roadstead of the Horten base, under threat of force from the Polish destroyer "Burza", it was captured by the Poles and the Polish flag was hoisted on it. All the workers of the Dutch shipyard, except for two taken hostage, were sent ashore. Over the next 12 hours, a Polish crew arrived on the submarine and weapons were loaded.
    Two days later, a submarine in tow of a destroyer (the boat ran out of fuel on the way) arrived in Gdynia, where the last two Dutch officials, the chief engineer and his chief assistant, were released.

    The dispute between the shipyard and the Polish Navy, which arose as a result of this abduction, was considered in court. According to the verdict, the Poles had to pay the last installment for the submarine, pay the transport costs of the shipyard workers, and Rotterdamsche Droogdok Maatschappij will deliver to Poland all the materials and equipment necessary to complete the completion of the "Snake".
    In July 1939, all construction work was completed on the boat, and she entered service.
    In the photo - "Snake" after launching.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 27 February 2021 07: 23
    +3
    The Polish crew did not intend to succumb to internment and came up with a daring plan to escape from Tallinn. It was realized on the night of September 17-18. For two weeks "Ozhel" wandered around the Baltic Sea with only one homemade map, which Grudzinsky drew from memory, and with one compass, which one of the sailors hid among his belongings.

    An interesting statement for someone with a navigational education.
    1. Former naval person
      28 February 2021 13: 20
      +1
      what are you talking about? if about me, then my military specialty is not navigation but radio-electronic warfare. and if about Grudziński, then his map is a historical fact, an exhibit of the museum named after General Sikorsky.
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 1 March 2021 10: 27
        -1
        Quote: Former Naval Person
        and if about Grudziński, then his map is a historical fact, an exhibit of the museum. General Sikorsky.

        Of course about Grudzinsky. The fact may be historical, but it looks more like a fake, like "look what we are Poles!"
    2. volodimer
      volodimer 28 February 2021 13: 53
      +2
      It sounds, of course, like flying through a pack of "Belomor", but this is more of a post-war bike, to glorify the event.
      In addition to the fact that 2 weeks shied around the Baltic, so also:
      On October 8, in view of the surrender of the last centers of resistance in Poland and the consumption of provisions and fuel, the commander of the "Ozhel" decided to make his way to Great Britain through the Danish Straits, where he entered on the night of October 9-XNUMX.
      all on the same map?
      And yet, this paragraph indicates that their radio communication (minimum reception) was in order. Otherwise, how did they know about "surrender of the last foci".
  • Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
    Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 09: 34
    +2
    .with only one homemade map, which Grudziński drew from memory

    A more plausible version is that the map was handed over by the British attaché along with a box of whiskey when he visited the boat on 17 September.
    ... across a sea dotted with minefields, with the constant pursuit of enemy naval and air forces, this is a real feat.

    Come on, author, do not spoil the impression of the article with such passages. The Germans generally reacted indifferently to the incident and only slightly chided the Estonians, who, I must say, scored a lot. And they had no intention of chasing a restless boat across the Baltic. As well as the Red Banner Baltic Fleet, which stupidly established a blockade of the Estonian coast and arranged demonstration flights of Tallinn with naval aviation. And the shelling by Leningrad of the secret bases of Polish submarines is quite ...
    1. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 27 February 2021 11: 54
      +1
      Quote: Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
      A more plausible version is that the map was handed over by the British attaché along with a box of whiskey when he visited the boat on 17 September.

      Yes, everyone who walked the Baltic knows it without a map. And these cards are countless.
      1. Former naval person
        28 February 2021 13: 30
        +1
        Grudziński's map can be seen in the General Sikorski Museum. a British second secretary of the embassy - not an attaché! - did not give the Poles anything except flowers, chocolates and parting words.
    2. Comrade
      Comrade 28 February 2021 05: 19
      +2
      Quote: Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
      A more plausible version is that the map was handed over by the British attaché along with a box of whiskey when he visited the boat on September 17

      The homemade map was indeed compiled from memory by the navigator of the "Eagle" Lieutenant Mokrski (Marian mokrski). Here is a fragment of this map, here is the passage between the island of Zealand and the Swedish coast.
      1. volodimer
        volodimer 28 February 2021 14: 19
        +1
        Well, at least the discrepancy is not Grudzinsky, but Mokrski ... And perhaps a map of maneuvering calculations that the navigator made on the basis of the navigation map.
        As far as I know, the navigator is not "dirty" with paper maps, but such calculations are made on "tracing paper". Otherwise, after several maneuvers in one area, it will not be a map, but a children's coloring.
        So maybe the Polish navigator was very good, but maybe it's still a bike. hi
        I can be wrong in terminology.
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 1 March 2021 10: 30
        0
        Quote: Comrade
        Here is a fragment of this map, there is a passage between the island of Zealand and the Swedish coast

        This is the calculation of the preliminary laying. Each cadet navigator makes such calculations already in the first year.
  • Cowbra
    Cowbra 27 February 2021 10: 50
    -3
    A classic noble story. Everyone is his own master, and whoever is not Sokolsky is Gedeminovich, and all the others are stupid smerds. Everyone has an ambition for a division, and no one has enough brains to cook a strong broth for a bug. Some are sawing on purchases, others are screaming, we are the power here - they are drawing unrealizable plans for peremoga, I'm in charge here, listen to me ... Still others put a bolt on their orders, and in general they are not on the way with dirty plebeians.
    I love pshek, only to show them in the circus
    1. Marine engineer
      Marine engineer 27 February 2021 16: 23
      +6
      ".... only show them in the circus"

      Where do you come from such "flawless"?
      Do not dishonor yourself and us.
      1. Catfish
        Catfish 28 February 2021 19: 41
        0
        Where do you come from such "flawless"?


        They do not "float out".
        A known substance initially possesses positive buoyancy, i.e. does not sink at all. wink
  • Constanty
    Constanty 27 February 2021 11: 16
    +6
    It is worth mentioning another story related to the story of Oryol - Zhdanov's provocation. On September 27, the Soviet press reported that the Soviet ships Metalist and Pioneer were sunk by an unidentified submarine (implicitly ORP Orzeł)
    This was to prove that Estonia was not able to defend its territorial waters, and thus justify the actions of the Soviet navy and aviation in Estonia.
    As a result, the increased diplomatic and military pressure from the USSR on the Estonian government forced the latter to sign a mutual assistance agreement with the USSR on September 28, 1939, according to which the USSR could maintain its own military garrisons on the territory of Estonia. and use the military infrastructure of Estonia.
    To this day, it is unclear whether the Soviet ships were really attacked as part of this action (according to one version, this was supposed to have been done by the ships "Shch-303" or "Shch-322"), or whether they were attacked falsely. reported their "flooding"

    Be that as it may, the USSR used the ORP "Orzeł" escape from Tallinn as an excuse / excuse for the gradual annexation of Estonia - first by setting up its own bases on its territory and taking control of the Estonian army.
    1. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 1 March 2021 10: 38
      0
      Quote: Constanty
      To this day, it is unclear whether the Soviet ships were really attacked as part of this action (according to one version, this was supposed to have been done by the ships "Shch-303" or "Shch-322"), or whether they were attacked falsely. reported their "flooding"

      Now they no longer hide what happened and how.
  • motorized rifle
    motorized rifle 27 February 2021 13: 10
    -3
    Originally "Ozelu" had to patrol

    Somehow wrong. If we use the Polish word and use Russian grammar and spelling, then we should write "Ozhlu", for example: burgundy, donkey-donkey.
  • Astra wild2
    Astra wild2 27 February 2021 14: 42
    +2
    "Grudzinsky never received this news." Why didn't the dispatch reach the addressee?
    1. Former naval person
      28 February 2021 13: 34
      +1
      because, according to the charter, the commander received the dispatch and he made a decision whether to acquaint the deputy with its content or not.
  • Astra wild2
    Astra wild2 27 February 2021 15: 19
    +3
    I once heard about it, but the person who told this story said that it was all FOOTBALL. The Poles began to fight only in 1942-1943. He probably knew about Anders's army.
    It turns out this is a real fact.
    Author, I ask you: tell us something else, otherwise, without AizCh we do not have good reading on marine topics
    1. Former naval person
      28 February 2021 13: 36
      +1
      as a former naval officer interested in history, I can write about naval wars endlessly, especially on self-isolation. define the circle of your interests and maybe I'll pick up some interesting topic.
      1. Astra wild2
        Astra wild2 28 February 2021 14: 53
        +1
        Little-known episodes of Russian-Turkish at sea. About the expeditions of Kruzenshtern, because of which, more precisely, because of whom, the Japanese captured Golovin, they took him for a pirate.
        Sea adventures. About the most distinguished ships, such as: "Mercury" or "Retvizan", "Palada". The ships that passed their "name". In honor of whom they are named: "Moscow," "Pearl". Everything that is fascinating and little known
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 1 March 2021 10: 51
        0
        Quote: Former Naval Person
        define the circle of your interests and maybe I'll pick up some interesting topic.

        Write about the evacuation from Hanko, and about the Moonsund landing, fighting in the Tehumardi area (Syrve peninsula).
        1. Former naval person
          1 March 2021 18: 04
          0
          Isn't that enough light? okay, take note ...
  • TermNachTer
    TermNachTer 27 February 2021 15: 51
    +2
    The Baltic, in the 39th year, was covered with minefields?)))
    1. Former naval person
      28 February 2021 13: 38
      0
      yes, it was. all the Baltic countries have mined their territorial waters since at least August.
      1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
        Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 28 February 2021 14: 21
        0
        Quote: Former Naval Person
        yes, it was. all the Baltic countries have mined their territorial waters since at least August.

        Who exactly from August 39 began mining their terrorists?
        1. Former naval person
          28 February 2021 15: 34
          0
          have you been banned from google? then google in Yandex: "Baltic Sea" and see which countries are out to the Baltic Sea.
          1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
            Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 28 February 2021 15: 52
            0
            Quote: Former Naval Person
            have you been banned from google? then google in Yandex: "Baltic Sea" and see which countries are out to the Baltic Sea.

            I was not asking about this, but about the mine laying of August 1939. You called yourself an interested person in naval history - so answer the question - who mined the Baltic in 1939? You wrote that there was "soup with dumplings" already in 1939.
      2. TermNachTer
        TermNachTer 28 February 2021 17: 32
        +2
        Who is all this? USSR, Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania?)))
        1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
          Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 28 February 2021 19: 47
          0
          Sweden, emnip, began mine laying during the SVF, but not in August 39th. It seems that the Germans made the decision to mine the North Sea (not the Baltic) only in October. The fact that the heroic Poles crawled straight across the Baltic, maneuvering between minefields and the armada of the Kriegsmarine and RKKF destroyers, is a miserable literature.
  • Looking for
    Looking for 27 February 2021 15: 55
    -5
    soon you will all know the enemy's history better than your own. Russian.
    1. Catfish
      Catfish 28 February 2021 19: 43
      +1
      You need to know everything about the enemy, especially his history. Explain why this is required, or will you answer it yourself?
  • bubalik
    bubalik 27 February 2021 17: 25
    +4
    April 8, Ozel sank German transport Rio de Janeiro carrying landing troops to Norway
    ,, be that as it may, but the "Ozhela" team was the first to open an account of the sunk ships during the "Weserubung" operation.

    Of the 380 German soldiers and crew members of the ship, about 200 were killed. Residents of the surrounding towns of Lillesand and Hovog were able to help !!! 183 victims.
  • Kushka
    Kushka 27 February 2021 17: 49
    +6
    Quote: Richard
    Chief of the Redskins (Nazarius):Today we have to go to the neighboring town for our birthday. With cake, gifts and children (no train). So the spouse will show a master class)))

    And today, from early morning until lunchtime, I worked as a metro builder -the tractor drove through the village in the morning [b] [/ b] I cleared the roadway, but the exits to the houses were completely covered with a one and a half meter layer. And me in the evening in Stavropol. Tortured to clean.

    From the diary of a Canadian emigrant August 15th.
    Here we are in Canada !!! I am fascinated by this country! It's amazing here!
    The mountains are so beautiful. I look forward to seeing them covered in snow.
    14 October.
    CANADA! This is the most wonderful place on earth! The leaves on the trees turned yellow and acquired all shades of the spectrum, from red to orange. Yesterday I made a fascinating trip to the countryside, to the countryside. You will not believe! I saw wild deer! In the wild, they are so beautiful and graceful.
    These are truly the most adorable animals on the planet. Well, just cute! No, this is truly heaven!
    November 11th.
    Deer hunting season is opening soon. This is terrible! I can't imagine
    imagine that someone can raise a hand on this cute, harmless creature. Snow is expected from day to day. I like it here!
    2 December.
    Finally! It snowed that night. HURRAH!!! Waking up in the morning, we
    discovered a charming picture outside the window. Everything is covered in snow white,
    fluffy blanket. Looks like an awesome Christmas card!
    I am impressed! My wife and I happily ran out of the house, and having quickly cleared the porch and the parking lot in front of the house, we started throwing snowballs with laughter (I won). Suddenly the snowplow drove past us, covering the entire parking lot with snow. But this did not upset us, and I quickly threw the snow back. How good it is here! I love Canada!
    12 December.
    It snowed again that night. The snow blower repeated his trick and filled up the parking lot.
    19 December.
    It was snowing again that night. I was never able to clear the parking lot and drive away
    to work. It's great here, of course, but I'm already exhausted, constantly
    clearing the parking lot from snow. You idiotic snowplow!
    22 December.
    Again this white abomination fell at night! I got bloody blisters
    on the hands and constant pain in the lower back, from the endless cleaning of the snow.
    It seems that this woodpecker on a snowplow is hiding around the corner and is just waiting for me to throw the snow out of the parking lot. F .... n @ !!!
    25 December.
    MURRY FUCKEN CHRISMAS! Again this grе ..... th snow !!! If only to get
    to the throat of that son of a bitch that's on the snowplow. I swear I would have strangled уp .... d @ !!!
    And then, why don't city services sprinkle salt on icy roads?
    Yesterday I walked and almost killed myself.
    27 December.
    That white shit fell out again at night !!! The third day I sit at home, for
    excluding forays to clear the parking lot after the snow blower.
    I can't get out anywhere. The car disappeared under the mountain of this white rubbish!
    And how brutally cold! The guy from the forecast bureau promises on TV
    another 20 centimeters of white shit tonight. K ..... ate !!! And do you know,
    How many shovels of snow will these 20 centimeters make ???
    28 December.
    That g @ n /// don from the forecast bureau was wrong! Dropped 50 centimeters. Looks like,
    this b ... cue snow will not melt until summer. The snowplow is stuck near
    our house, and this mu // d @ to the driver ran to us with a request to borrow
    shovel. I told him I broke six shovels knocking that white shit away
    with which he filled up our parking lot, and now I will break the seventh on his
    head of lamb.
    4st January.
    Today I finally got out of the house !!! I went to the store to buy food.
    And so, on the way back, this beast flies out onto the road - a deer and
    smashes the entire front end of the car with his hooves. Damage for three thousand dollars !!!
    Why didn't the assholes hunters kill these scum in November?
    These creatures (deer) are everywhere and everywhere. What would tear them apart, kov!
    3rd May.
    I took the car to the workshop. Believe it or not, this tub was in time
    to rust completely, from the salt that koz /// ly from city services poured onto the roads.
    10rd May.
    All! I'm leaving for Florida. I can’t imagine that anyone
    being of sound mind, wishes to live in this city // // oh Canada
  • bubalik
    bubalik 27 February 2021 22: 07
    +4
    and the story of its first commander.
    ,,, if the author continues to tell about the fate of Klochkovsky and Grudzinski, about Marina Kryzhanovskaya and her husband it would be wonderful.


    1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
      Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 22: 16
      +1
      Quote: bubalik
      about Marina Kryzhanovskaya

      This is already a spin-off, as moviegoers say. Or
      'But that's a completely different story ..' ©
      This is for lovers of GULAG strawberries, not naval history))
      1. bubalik
        bubalik 27 February 2021 22: 35
        +2
        hi
        lovers of the GULAG strawberries, not naval history)

        ,,, in any case better than about the mental connection of rats and cats, in today's article on Opinion.
        1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
          Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 27 February 2021 22: 37
          0
          Sorry, I don't read that kind of crap)
    2. Former naval person
      28 February 2021 13: 41
      +2
      yes, the second part will be about Klochkovsky. I did not manage to get to the Grudziński family. but I have collected some interesting materials from the archives of the families of Polish sailors living in Canada.