Military Review

"The best choice to repel a Russian attack": Sweden offers the Finnish Air Force to purchase Gripen E

169
"The best choice to repel a Russian attack": Sweden offers the Finnish Air Force to purchase Gripen E

Senior Swedish military officials backed Saab's bid for the Finnish Air Force tender, saying the Gripen multi-role fighter is the best choice and will allow the two countries to work together to prevent a Russian attack. Reported by DefenseNews.


Swedish Defense Minister Peter Hultkvist blamed Russia for the deteriorating security situation in the Baltic region and called the expansion of defense cooperation between the Scandinavian countries a prerequisite for resisting "Moscow's aggressive moves." According to him, the organization of air defense is an important part of the confrontation with Russia, and the Gripen fighter is the best choice for Finland.

He echoed Hultkvist and the deputy commander of the Swedish Air Force Anders Persson, who said that Sweden and Finland are potential targets for the invasion of Russia, and in the event of an attack, the Finnish Air Force could retreat to Swedish airfields. In this case, it would be best if both countries were armed with the same Gripen fighters.

By the end of April, the Finnish Air Force must finally decide on the choice of a new fighter that will replace 64 outdated F / A-18 Hornets in the Air Force.

Among the candidates for replacement are American fighters Boeing F / A-18 Super Hornet and Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II, as well as Eurofighter Typhoon, French Dassault Rafale and Saab Gripen made in Sweden. Moreover, the US State Department has already approved the probable delivery of 64 F-35 aircraft, 58 F / A-18 E / F Super Hornet and 14 EA-18G Growler to Finland.

Today there are 30 military airfields in Finland, 11 of them are located on airfield road sections. In peacetime, the Finnish Air Force uses seven main airfields, including those near the Russian borders.
169 comments
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  1. OgnennyiKotik
    OgnennyiKotik 18 February 2021 12: 27
    +1
    For Finland, Gripen E / F is the best option in terms of price / quality ratio. A real competitor to the F-35A. Everything else either falls short of the possibilities or costs a horse's money.
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. Temples
        Temples 18 February 2021 12: 32
        +20
        Quote: OgnennyiKotik
        For Finland Gripen E / F is the best option

        The best option for Finns is to trade with Russia. Create joint ventures.
        General economic activity will be a guarantee of immunity on both sides.

        And the plane will become obsolete after a certain time and you will have to buy more.
        The very fact of the threat will not be removed by the plane.

        In the event of a real conflict with NATO or the mattress, it is better for the finals to stay on the sidelines. There is a chance to survive.
        1. NEOZ
          NEOZ 18 February 2021 13: 29
          -2
          Quote: Temples
          The best option for Finns is to trade with Russia. Create joint ventures.
          General economic activity will be a guarantee of immunity on both sides.

          can you advise the PRC and the USA the same thing? ... or is it different?
          1. dauria
            dauria 18 February 2021 13: 38
            0
            can you advise the PRC and the USA the same thing? ... or is it different?

            This is really different. These two countries are dividing the planet. They are "dividers", all others are "divisible". Alas, Russia too.
            1. DMB_95
              DMB_95 18 February 2021 14: 28
              +6
              Quote: dauria
              can you advise the PRC and the USA the same thing? ... or is it different?

              This is really different. These two countries are dividing the planet. They are "dividers", all others are "divisible". Alas, Russia too.

              Well, as long as Russia has an Army capable of destroying either China or the United States, Russia remains one of the main players in Great Geopolitics. With the economy, it turns out like bee..nice.
              1. dauria
                dauria 18 February 2021 15: 41
                +2
                .... players in Great Geopolitics. With the economy, it turns out like bee..nice.


                Politics is a concentrated expression of economics. And war is a continuation of politics. Said by intelligent people.
                So it is the economy that dictates what to do for politicians and the military.
                She also gives them the opportunity to do something.
                And according to the article - the Swedes have to sell Gripen to foreign markets with nosebleeds. Not a bad car, excellent product, but no one is allowed to cross the F-16 road from the USA just for free.
                If they are allowed, then in exchange for something.
                1. Bad_gr
                  Bad_gr 18 February 2021 15: 50
                  +2
                  Quote: dauria
                  Not a bad car, excellent product, but no one is allowed to cross the F-16 road from the USA just for free.

                  If you bought a Su-35 from us, and the plane is good, and there would be no raznosoritsy with us (who knows how it will turn out in the future, because Finland was once part of the Russian Empire).
                  1. ironic
                    ironic 18 February 2021 16: 52
                    -1
                    I think you yourself can answer why not. History does not repeat itself.
                    1. Bad_gr
                      Bad_gr 18 February 2021 17: 26
                      +1
                      Quote: ironic
                      I think you yourself can answer why not.

                      It was a joke, but it doesn't hurt to remember. How the tsar signed there:
                      this is from the 1914 manifesto
                      Quote: ironic
                      History does not repeat itself.
                      Who argues with this. Now there is a tendency for the collapse of large countries, but in the future there may be a combination of several into one, and no one will predict the composition of new entities in advance.
                      1. ironic
                        ironic 18 February 2021 18: 22
                        -3
                        Remember the classic? It's a pity only to live in this wonderful time ...
        2. ironic
          ironic 18 February 2021 16: 34
          -2
          It does not interfere. Conflicts are different and in general they are not even conflicts, but border control, intelligence and restriction by presence. You always have to replace the old with the new. Airplanes also prevent real conflicts, because they exist.
        3. Pete mitchell
          Pete mitchell 18 February 2021 22: 40
          +1
          Quote: Temples
          the best option is to trade with Russia. Create joint ventures.
          General economic activity will be a guarantee of immunity on both sides

          So God had mercy and the Finns remember this.
          After all, they also need to maintain the reputation of an independent state: they would have fun, the main thing is not to fuss ...
      2. Alien From
        Alien From 18 February 2021 12: 59
        +4
        Alcotourism Finam is better to develop)
    2. yehat2
      yehat2 18 February 2021 12: 40
      +16
      The best option for Finland from the Russian invasion is an open border and trade.
      and the Finns know about it.
      1. ironic
        ironic 18 February 2021 16: 54
        -5
        Otherwise, an invasion?
    3. Dread
      Dread 18 February 2021 12: 48
      0
      Quote: OgnennyiKotik
      ...A real competitor to the F-35A. Everything else either falls short of the possibilities or costs a horse's money.

      And what is it about the F-35 competitor? Certainly not by radar and not by stealth and RVV-BD. Please list with links to the material!
      1. dauria
        dauria 18 February 2021 15: 53
        0
        And what is it about the F-35 competitor?


        Served by one officer with a laptop and four guest workers right on the freeway. Exaggerating, but almost so. This was the main feature when creating. Low cost and simplicity of ground handling, operation based on condition, not resource.
        EPR reduced from the desired angles. And it will be equal to the F-35, if the weapons are hung on both.
        You don't need to poke electronic equipment and rockets - they will be changed three times during the service of both.
        Not all countries need to destroy front-line air defense like Russian - they will buy Gripen. True, as Washington says.
      2. ironic
        ironic 18 February 2021 16: 49
        -1
        The radar actually has almost half the number of modules, but it has the ability to turn. By stealth, it is understandably worse, but it has a non-afterburning super cruise. Meteora carries. GBU too. Moreover, it is simpler and cheaper, it still cannot be taken away from him. A very decent multirole fighter.
    4. Finn
      Finn 18 February 2021 12: 53
      0
      Expensive to match the price / quality. The only plus is that it is not far from maintenance to do. You don't even need to create. Although what to create there. How many planes can Finns buy? four?
      1. ironic
        ironic 18 February 2021 16: 59
        -2
        ... plus 60. And why is the price bad?
    5. Finches
      Finches 18 February 2021 13: 06
      +4
      The Swedes, most likely at the behest of the United States, are working to divert Finland from good-neighborly relations with Russia to the area of ​​confrontation by whipping up anti-Russian sentiments - most likely, the Swedish military was stupidly put on its paws!
      1. Aerodrome
        Aerodrome 18 February 2021 13: 26
        -2
        if without politota, purely from a practical point of view, then "superhornet". firstly, a familiar plane, and secondly, aviation technicians are already used to it and know it. but it's their business where to spend money.
        1. Finches
          Finches 18 February 2021 13: 29
          +2
          If it were not for the politota, it would have used exactly the same arguments as yours, but no argument would have been used - the "aggression" of Russia! hi
          1. Alex777
            Alex777 18 February 2021 19: 30
            0
            We'd better have the Finns choose the Swedes.
            F / A-18 nuclear weapons can carry.
  2. NDR-791
    NDR-791 18 February 2021 12: 33
    +4
    Sweden and Finland are potential targets for a Russian invasion, and in the event of an attack, the Finnish Air Force could retreat to Swedish airfields. In this case, it would be best if both countries were armed with the same Gripen fighters.
    The broader the cranberries and the more colorful the blizzard, the thicker the pocket wassat
    Interestingly, will the Swedish airfields pass this cup?
    1. Mezabralis
      Mezabralis 18 February 2021 13: 15
      -8
      Yes, of course, both Swedes and Americans do not sleep at night and always think about how to harm Russia.
      Maybe calm down. Russia's neighbors need only one thing, do not go to neighbors with tanks.
      1. Finches
        Finches 18 February 2021 13: 28
        +7
        Usually something the other way around happened and is happening! Or is the expansion of NATO towards our borders in the West perceived as a movement of our borders towards NATO? You live in a masterpiece world! laughing
        1. NDR-791
          NDR-791 18 February 2021 13: 36
          +2
          You live in a masterpiece world!
          Nope ... waiting for the holiday !!! So we're already on the way wassat wassat wassat
        2. Mezabralis
          Mezabralis 18 February 2021 13: 38
          -8
          Now, with a neighbor like Russia, not only NATO will join :)
          1. Finches
            Finches 18 February 2021 13: 40
            +7
            And that Russia attacked someone or declares its intentions? Or is he making territorial claims to someone? What is your comment based on?
            1. Mezabralis
              Mezabralis 18 February 2021 13: 47
              .
              1939 Finland
              1939 Poland
              1940 Latvia Lithuania Estonia
              1953 Hungary
              1968 Czechoslovakia
              1980 Afghanistan
              12014 Ukraine
              1. Aerodrome
                Aerodrome 18 February 2021 14: 09
                +5
                Quote: Mezabralis
                1939 Finland
                1939 Poland
                1940 Latvia Lithuania Estonia
                1953 Hungary
                1968 Czechoslovakia
                1980 Afghanistan
                12014 Ukraine

                you're next ... jump out the window ...
                1. Mezabralis
                  Mezabralis 18 February 2021 14: 31
                  -8
                  Why are we in NATO, there is no need to be afraid of any gopniks
                  1. hydrox
                    hydrox 18 February 2021 16: 46
                    +6
                    Well done, limitrophes, that you are not afraid: you will die in peace in your sleep!
                    You should at least read our fresh Doctrine: there is not a word there that we will expect an attack from you.
                    We will only need a massive THREAT on your part (and you are trying hard in this matter!) ... and you are no longer there! laughing
                    1. ironic
                      ironic 18 February 2021 17: 01
                      -3
                      As usual "zhahnut Poplar"? This is no longer exciting. fool
                      1. hydrox
                        hydrox 18 February 2021 17: 15
                        +2
                        Poplar to spend on you !?
                        Are you sick, are you completely crazy !?
                        It's expensive: Poplar to break the old barn! fool
                      2. ironic
                        ironic 18 February 2021 18: 24
                        -4
                        Finally, a business man got caught. Really a couple of thousand from storage. T-80 and for melting under ATGMs? From this you immediately feel the master's vein. lol
                      3. hydrox
                        hydrox 19 February 2021 10: 56
                        0
                        Well, you are dreaming!
                        The T-80 is not an easy thing, it cannot be put anywhere, but it will be enough for the limitrophes and the rat, but be proud!
                        The best Krysid has been stocked for you, British production, L50 - 10 days: you don't even recognize that it has ALREADY been used against YOU and will start to die in a week.
                      4. ironic
                        ironic 19 February 2021 18: 53
                        0
                        Well, first of all, I personally am in a slightly different section of the world map, so "you" in the answers is somewhat inappropriate for me. And so you are even more pleased. Only a true philanthropist and righteous man of the peoples of the world could offer to spray over Europe a substance that is limited to a person's toxicity.
                      5. hydrox
                        hydrox 19 February 2021 19: 16
                        +1
                        It doesn't matter where the hamster is in order to lay out the "treat".
                        And only a complete hamster can afford to think that it will be sprayed on.
                        That's why he is a hamster, so as not to have human brains ... laughing
                      6. The comment was deleted.
                      7. hydrox
                        hydrox 19 February 2021 19: 35
                        0
                        To the doctor.
                        He will prescribe you lithium and a disability.
                        But do not overdo it, otherwise you will end up not on a disability, but in a psychiatric hospital.
                    2. ironic
                      ironic 19 February 2021 19: 33
                      +1
                      Thank you for describing in detail at what level of higher nervous activity you are. I'll take it into account. Is your combat sofa directly connected to the RF Ministry of Defense? Is that how you see it? See if you suddenly find some difference in positions. Otherwise, you have all such quick emotions. You may not be so clean ... lol
          2. Cottodraton
            Cottodraton 19 February 2021 07: 25
            +1
            And the poplar is not for your excitement))), it is for your reassurance, rather even for repose ... And for excitement, use the products of sex shops and pharmacies!)))
          3. ironic
            ironic 19 February 2021 19: 00
            0
            That no, it is for yours, probably, because the sex shop is already useless, otherwise the attraction to Poplar cannot be explained in any way. wink lol
          4. hydrox
            hydrox 19 February 2021 19: 21
            +1
            Now it is clear where the poplar sawdust goes.
            In order to stuff stuffed ironworkers (after all, this is how your chase translates into Russian)! laughing
          5. ironic
            ironic 19 February 2021 19: 38
            +1
            Well, this is the most harmless part of the perverts, their quiet and loud joys are generally not dangerous to anyone. There are other painful manifestations of an unhealthy craving for iron toys, most often causing severe mental damage to adherents of swinging iron and sometimes turning these same adepts into dangerous zombie-devil people around them.
  3. The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. ironic
      ironic 19 February 2021 19: 02
      -1
      People may not be judged, but a long-term attraction to Poplar is not typical of a person. This type of tractorophilia has not yet been observed by scientists. By the way, where did you get the idea that he is from America?
  4. ironic
    ironic 19 February 2021 19: 07
    0
    Sick just. Or the age has come, but the children's complexes have not left.
  • 3danimal
    3danimal 19 February 2021 20: 21
    0
    Stop. This one ALWAYS works both ways.
    And if someone does not become “there”, it is guaranteed that many will not become “here”. Do you understand this when you state so cheerfully?
  • Cottodraton
    Cottodraton 19 February 2021 07: 23
    0
    Well, yes, why be afraid of yourself ...
  • Jacket in stock
    Jacket in stock 18 February 2021 14: 13
    +7
    Quote: Mezabralis
    1939 Finland
    1939 Poland
    1940 Latvia Lithuania Estonia
    1953 Hungary
    1968 Czechoslovakia
    1980 Afghanistan
    12014 Ukraine

    They also forgot Japan in 1945.
    True, all this is about another country. The USSR was called, and there, by the way, the Ukrainians led with the Georgians. So it's not the right place. This is to Kiev and Tiflis.
    But for some reason they are now your allies
    1. Mezabralis
      Mezabralis 18 February 2021 14: 26
      -9
      Russia positions itself as the legal successor of the USSR
      1. Jacket in stock
        Jacket in stock 18 February 2021 14: 40
        +4
        Quote: Mezabralis
        Russia positions itself as the legal successor of the USSR

        Just don't mix everything up.
        Modern Russia is anti-USSR, as has been stated more than once. And everything Soviet has been condemned more than once.
        Exactly the same way you can make claims and the Balts, they were also in the USSR when, according to you, they attacked Hungary and Czechoslovakia. Although, in fact, the Poles and the Germans were the main ringleaders there, but for some reason you have no questions for them.
      2. hydrox
        hydrox 18 February 2021 16: 57
        +4
        Yes, this is so, but that does not mean that, like the USSR, we will allow you to sit on our neck.
        Look: they took the shipment and transshipment from you, we didn't like the pale sprats, we refused to play in a single railway network, the ferry passenger traffic was taken away from you, we blocked the Silk Way, we will take away the electricity in a year - that's what I did to you your bad head and loose tongue, laughing
        1. ironic
          ironic 18 February 2021 17: 03
          -5
          Does everything satisfy you personally? Victory? So why are you so horny?
          1. hydrox
            hydrox 18 February 2021 17: 20
            +5
            You are indifferent and uninteresting to me, like your women ...
            No, and for communication you are also not interesting, as well as a conversation without pleasure, of course, and there is no desire for this either ... negative
          2. ironic
            ironic 18 February 2021 18: 31
            -5
            Those. this is not sexy for you. Got it. Just enlighten this mental or monumental? Without pleasure? Depressive arousal? request
    2. ironic
      ironic 18 February 2021 17: 16
      -4
      However, legally, they are not obliged to take upon themselves the full moral responsibility for all the actions of the USSR.
  • Finches
    Finches 18 February 2021 14: 16
    +8
    If you take history and look at it impartially, and not biasedly, then you can see that the war between the USSR and Finland is more or less suitable, but at the beginning, Suomi, which was Hitler's ally, suggested by diplomatic methods to resolve the issue of territories - for moving the border from Leningrad was given over vast territories in Karelia ... The division of Poland - for its war crimes against Soviet Russia in the early 20s and the aggressive policy of Pilsudski, they still got off easily - the same cannot be called aggression, they were simply divided in half! Further - All three republics of the Baltic states, by the parliaments elected by their peoples, voluntarily adopted Declarations on joining the USSR (for some reason everyone forgets about this). Who else is there - Hungary and Czechoslovakia - the entry of troops at the request of their current Governments, as well as the entry of troops into Afghanistan, and I, for example, do not remember what NATO troops were called there or Yugoslavia asked to bomb itself ... Ukraine - what for nonsense! Even the OSCE representative to the UN said that there are no data on actions on the territory of Ukraine of Russian troops (is it true that you are deaf?). You have forgotten that we "attacked" Georgia - although before that Georgian troops opened fire from multiple launch systems at our peacekeepers and the first dead were Russian soldiers, but this does not count!
    In short, of all your examples, the war between the USSR and Finland remains more or less, but that was a long time ago, and the country was different, but if I now begin to list the real aggression of the United States and its NATO allies, then you will get tired of reading!
    1. Mezabralis
      Mezabralis 18 February 2021 14: 36
      -6
      Voluntarily - after the USSR brought in troops?
      Has no legal force, the parliament that voted for him appointed the USSR.
      1. Jacket in stock
        Jacket in stock 18 February 2021 14: 53
        +8
        Quote: Mezabralis
        Has no legal force, the parliament that voted for him appointed the USSR.

        But as a bum, the very existence of Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia has no legal force, because this is Russian territory, first recaptured in battle, and then also bought by the Russian tsar. And governments and parliaments in 1918 were appointed by the Angian occupation forces.
        1. Mezabralis
          Mezabralis 18 February 2021 15: 22
          -6
          The USSR signed an agreement with Latvia in 1919 stating that it would forever renounce all claims to this territory. You only remember the conventions you want to remember
          1. Jacket in stock
            Jacket in stock 18 February 2021 16: 21
            +7
            Quote: Mezabralis
            The USSR signed an agreement with Latvia in 1919 stating that

            Let's start with the fact that no USSR existed in 1919.
            Yes, and the Soviet government of Russia at that time, no one in the world, except for the very newly-minted Latvia, and of the same kind of Poland and Finland did not recognize.
            Nobody has officially announced the cancellation of the Russian-Swedish agreement, therefore any impartial court recognizes the legal nullity of all later agreements. And you know this very well, therefore, after leaving the USSR and gaining independence, you instantly renounced it, joined the European Union and NATO and invited foreign troops.
          2. ironic
            ironic 18 February 2021 17: 14
            -5
            Seeeee second. They ceased to be legally independent subjects from this? Not. Not acceptable.
    2. Finches
      Finches 18 February 2021 14: 59
      +6
      Of course, this is subjectivity in the interpretation of history - as it is beneficial for us, so we interpret it! But after all, you need to look at history taking into account those realities, the situation of that time - and so all the actions of the USSR were the result of the cause of the policy of the Western powers - this reason is based on the Munich Agreement, but you probably justify it?
  • ironic
    ironic 18 February 2021 17: 08
    -2
    There are no troops, but Russian equipment is there. The annexation of Crimea is also actually a military operation, I understand, they wanted to prevent NATO ships from entering Crimea, but the Russian Federation itself has undertaken not to violate the territorial integrity of Ukraine, and this is a violation of obligations and signed international treaties.
    1. Jacket in stock
      Jacket in stock 18 February 2021 20: 15
      +2
      Quote: ironic
      There are no troops, but Russian equipment is there.

      Your equipment is in Karabakh.
      So what?
      Are you aggressors too?
      Quote: ironic
      ... The annexation of Crimea is also actually a military operation, I understand, they wanted to prevent NATO ships from entering Crimea, but the Russian Federation has undertaken not to violate the territorial integrity of Ukraine itself, and this is a violation of obligations

      Yes, like a bae, the Supreme Soviet of the Crimean Autonomous Republic first separated from Ukraine. He had a right. And only then he asked to be a part of Russia. So there was no violation.
      1. ironic
        ironic 18 February 2021 20: 20
        0
        Firstly, no one hides it. The equipment was sold through export supplies. As well as Turkish by the way. Secondly, we did not participate in the annexation of any part of Karabakh.

        No, he did not have a legal one, since at the time of separation according to Ukrainian legislation, separation is possible only by an all-Ukrainian referendum, and not by a local one.
  • Wolf
    Wolf 18 February 2021 16: 32
    +4
    Have you sometimes read allegedly 1 history book besides Nazi propaganda? Do you know Stoltenberg starts saying that the angry Russians attacked the good Hitler 1941 in Belarus, and then you will write it here as an addition to your quote?
    1939 Finland
    1939 Poland
    1940 Latvia Lithuania Estonia
    1953 Hungary
    1968 Czechoslovakia
    1980 Afghanistan
    12014 Ukraine
    1. ironic
      ironic 18 February 2021 17: 11
      -4
      But Finland was attacked.
      1. Wolf
        Wolf 18 February 2021 17: 42
        +5
        Do you know what kind of Nazi propaganda was in Finland in the 30s and what kind of policy the Fini pursued then? They turned the people into Nazi beasts and repaired many terrible mischiefs! Enough already skrivat TRUE HISTORY OF EUROPE 30 of these years of the 20th century and publish all the "secret" archive about Nazism in Europe! wink
        1. ironic
          ironic 18 February 2021 18: 16
          -4
          As a fact, the USSR carried out an attack on sovereign Finland. This is a legal fact and this is what you need to know about a specific fact. The communists also committed many crimes. But specifically to the question about which we are talking are perfect, both fascists and communists, crimes have no direct relation. So you don't need to look for excuses to edit history. The Japanese also committed multiple atrocities, but the USSR attacked them. wink
          1. Jacket in stock
            Jacket in stock 18 February 2021 18: 49
            +4
            Quote: ironic
            As a fact, the USSR carried out an attack on sovereign Finland. It's a legal fact

            So what?
            These are actions within the framework of the established customs of international relations.
            After 2 years, Finland attacked the USSR. So that's parity.
            But at the same time, the Red Army did not commit any crimes on the territory of Finland. Unlike the Finns in the USSR. And also England, USA, Poland, Japan, Germany, Romania, Hungary ...
            Therefore, if anyone is the "bad guy", then certainly not us.
          2. ironic
            ironic 18 February 2021 19: 08
            -5
            Well, the Finns might have a great opinion about what happened after the attack on their territory. It is hard to imagine that after that they wanted to be an ally of the USSR, although I do not justify their further actions.
  • ironic
    ironic 18 February 2021 20: 37
    -3
    Hitler was not good, and the Russians were not evil, but the 9th Army, which stood against Romania, was clearly not a defensive structure and in general it was not quite an army. wink
    1. Wolf
      Wolf 18 February 2021 22: 08
      +7
      What did you expect when Rumuni were Hitler's allies, what would you do in Stalin's place?
      1. Wolf
        Wolf 18 February 2021 22: 12
        +4
        And not just Rumunia, but Hungary! This was the whole problem of Russia in the Second World War, fought against NAZI EUROPE, as well as against NAPOLEONVE MASONIAN EUROPE, the main problem here is that 1814 Tsar did not destroy them to the root in Europe when everyone was under his grip, this was the main mistake, I hope today nobody's a mistake do not repeat. wink
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. ironic
          ironic 19 February 2021 18: 31
          0
          Those. you thereby confirm that preparation for the throw to the Atlantic was the same task for Stalin as the blitzkrieg was for Hitler? My congratulations. Russian historians cannot in any way fend off this opinion, and you once, twice and all their efforts are in the bud ...
        3. Wolf
          Wolf 19 February 2021 22: 12
          +1
          Yes, but the Brosak to Atlantic was a consequence of the Blitzkrieg plan either DEFANZIVELY or flatteringly. Do you want to say when the Red Army went to Berlin, it was an aggression against Germany?
        4. ironic
          ironic 20 February 2021 20: 33
          -2
          No, it was not. The plan to throw to the Atlantic was very indirectly related to the fight against fascism, well, as much as the opponents were, but no more. Yes, if it were not for June 22 and the beginning of the Second World War, then the strike of the 9th Army through Romania, cutting off the oil fields and the Mediterranean theater, would not be aggression against Germany, take a shallow one, but the occupation of all of Europe, but already by the red Stalinist regime, instead of brown Hitler.
        5. Wolf
          Wolf 20 February 2021 20: 56
          +1
          Do you consider Hitler's Germany for all Europe? In addition, Anglo-Saxons were occupied already in 1918. the weight of BV with oil reserves means that OIL Europe had and is much higher than necessary. Until now, they have been living on the occupation of BV 100 for 1918 years! Otherwise, the main reason for 1 MV was the occupation of the place of birth of OIL in the BV, except for the destruction of the Rus empire.
        6. Wolf
          Wolf 20 February 2021 21: 07
          0
          If you want more, the Austro-Hungarian empire had the task of GERMANIZING THE CATHOLIC SLAVS AND USING THEM AS CANNONBALL MEAT AGAINST RUSSIA. WHEN THE GABSURGS DID NOT COPE WITH THE ASSIGNMENT THEY WERE JUST TAKEN OUT. AND RUSSIA TRIED TO DESTROY BY THE REVOLUTION AND OCCUPATION. BUT THE NUMBER OF THE RUSSIAN PEOPLE SWALLOWED THESE PLANS. wink
        7. ironic
          ironic 20 February 2021 21: 53
          -2
          From the current for the revolution is not necessary. The export of the revolution to Germany was invented by the extremely aggressive and militarist-minded elite of the Russian Tsarist secret police, and the fact that the German intelligence was able to intercept the project and redirect it back to Russia was only partly their own merit, and more a failure and partly an outright betrayal of the French secret service. wink
        8. Wolf
          Wolf 21 February 2021 16: 34
          +1
          Yes Ruski Tsar and his guards financed Mordekhkaia Levia (Karl Marx) and Engels as they took Darwin and his "Evolitsia" away! And then Shif and Baruch, from the protection of the Russian Tsar in New York, prepared Trotsky for a metez in Russia. The tsar decided to commit suicide to Russia and his family, and he planned this through the financial oligarchs of the Rothschilds and their performers in the USA, Baruch and Shif. Is this the interpretation of "history"? smile
        9. Wolf
          Wolf 21 February 2021 16: 45
          +1
          And when they captured Bronshtein in the Khalifakh, Tsarska's guard, through the American president, urged that bi Bronshtin and a couple of hundreds of rebels were immediately released and urgently sent to Russia, and the Tsar personally provided funding in gold for Trotsky and Lenin, or because he spent no gold on them for revolutiu in Germany. smile
        10. ironic
          ironic 21 February 2021 20: 47
          -1
          Only the Tsarist secret police never worked against Germany through America, but worked through France. You heard the ringing but you don't know where it is. wink
      2. ironic
        ironic 21 February 2021 20: 45
        -2
        Rare nonsense. You read less the sites of the failed pogromists, but read more reliable sources about Schiff and whom he supported, about the Rothschild family, about Tesla.
    2. Wolf
      Wolf 21 February 2021 16: 49
      +1
      As for the Franks, they are actually GERMANI, they were called GERMANI, the Germans of GLORY IN MOST OF THE FRIED PEOPLE! LIGHT SAVA 13th century. !!! wink That INTO vi taught in school and read DOES NOT HAVE TRUTH! wink
  • ironic
    ironic 20 February 2021 21: 49
    -3
    Do you even know that the first large oil reserves in the BV were discovered at the end of the 30s? And it also took time to start developing. What the hell is 18th year? The 9th Army cut off from Europe and Romanian deposits and ports of communication with South Africa and the BV. You are not talking nonsense.
  • Wolf
    Wolf 21 February 2021 16: 28
    +1
    FUNNY VI, ALREADY IN THE 20TH CENTURY, THEY KNEW AND PLANNED WHAT THE OIL WILL BE AND WHERE IT WILL, THEREFORE, AND STOPPED NIKOLA TESLA AND HIS PURCHASE OF AN UNLIMITED SOURCE OF ELECTRIC POWER AND WITHOUT WIRED! BASIC REASON FOR THE 1 WORLD WARRIOR TO CAPTURE THE PLACE OF BIRTH OF OIL IN BV! wink
  • ironic
    ironic 21 February 2021 16: 49
    -3
    You're not funny. You are sad. No, they didn’t know, don’t make up fables. Are you also a supporter of conspiracy theories of the world behind the scenes? So they would say. No more questions.
  • Wolf
    Wolf 21 February 2021 19: 04
    +1
    There are no conspiracy theories, there IS A CONSPIRACY! wink
  • ironic
    ironic 21 February 2021 20: 30
    -2
    It's not for me, it's for the doctors. yes
  • Wolf
    Wolf 21 February 2021 19: 09
    +1
    This world is ruled by MONEY, you just need to look at the history of money currents and to whom they go and everything will be clear as day.
  • ironic
    ironic 21 February 2021 20: 32
    -2
    Not 100%, but somewhere 80% it is. But people for the most part do not understand cash flows at all. But they love to talk about money.
  • Wolf
    Wolf 22 February 2021 13: 50
    0
    The history of cash flows from the 10th century to today can be talked about if you have a question and what is not clear, and where is the money or according to Marx Capital. smile
  • ironic
    ironic 22 February 2021 18: 26
    0
    Capital is a big utopian rush, not without some correct conclusions, but nothing more. wink
  • Wolf
    Wolf 21 February 2021 16: 52
    +1
    I just have 1 question, why didn't they kill Nikola Tesla earlier?
  • ironic
    ironic 21 February 2021 20: 38
    -2
    Was he killed? He actually died at the age of 87, taking into account the consequences of the injuries from the accident, from which he suffered for 6 years.
  • Wolf
    Wolf 22 February 2021 13: 46
    0
    I didn’t say that it had decreased, but why didn’t it decrease when he started to work on the project of wireless delivery of electrical energy? Then there was already a DEADLY THREAT TO DOLAR OIL !!! They stopped the project, but it was a transition from the 19th to the 20th century, he could have built the project somewhere else, maybe life in Russia? wink and he has not actually worked for the last 35 years of his life ???????????? They just added it so as not to work !!! wink
  • ironic
    ironic 22 February 2021 18: 21
    -1
    Tesla had many problems with funding and he survived bankruptcy, but his work was recorded in the 11th and 15th and 22nd years. What do you keep coming up with? request
  • Wolf
    Wolf 22 February 2021 13: 55
    0
    You know such a UMU N smile E ADMITTING THAT WOULD WORK WHEN HE IS AT THE TOP OF HIS POSSIBILITY? Isn't that strange to you? Tesla was a MAN THEORETIC AND PRACTICE IN ONE !!! For Anstein's example, I mean HALF of TESLA to know for the future! wink smile
  • ironic
    ironic 22 February 2021 18: 24
    -1
    Tesla was an absolutely brilliant scientist. This is not even a question, but his problems were quite common and associated with the harsh reality of the developing industrial capitalism that characterized that time. Competition issues in the research and funding environment were very acute.
  • ironic
    ironic 19 February 2021 18: 28
    +1
    Yes, it was, but the 9th Army was not going to defend, it was going to attack.
    1. Wolf
      Wolf 19 February 2021 22: 20
      +1
      It was okay that I was going, but how would you get on about Hitler's Nazi Europe? In the place of Stalin, I would have carried out an odmazda for aggression, and even now all Europeans in a country who were companions in the zlochin over the Russian people would have paid tribute. For this reason, they probably scored so quickly that Nazi Europe carried out aggression against the USSR, Serbia and Greece !!! The Germans still owe a huge debt to these countries like Italy. It's time to RETURN a debt !!!
    2. Wolf
      Wolf 19 February 2021 22: 29
      +1
      And France and Norway, etc ...
    3. Wolf
      Wolf 19 February 2021 22: 31
      +1
      And aggression against Poland, Czechoslovakia too
    4. Wolf
      Wolf 19 February 2021 22: 32
      +1
      As well as to Serbia and Greece.
  • ironic
    ironic 20 February 2021 20: 24
    -2
    Those. do you think that the actions of Hitler and Stalin are, in principle, symmetrical, only Hitler was the first to hurry up? Well, in principle, it looks like it was, but again, Russian historians are trying in every possible way to disown what you are writing now. Do you know why? Because then it was not a defense against Hitler, but a counter-scenario of the capture and enslavement of Europe by Stalin's red dictatorship.
  • Wolf
    Wolf 20 February 2021 20: 49
    +1
    If you think defense and aggression are the same, then you are right, but there is no = sign.
  • ironic
    ironic 20 February 2021 21: 58
    -2
    If we call it defense what was not built initially, as defense. Therefore, the questions of signs are more than twofold. The same story repeated itself in 67, but on a smaller scale. It was significant that the Soviet military doctrine did not undergo changes and was used with the same success as the Wehrmacht on June 22nd and even more successfully, because the equipment was no longer the same and the scale was smaller.
  • ironic
    ironic 21 February 2021 16: 56
    -3
    It is normal that they were going to arrange a red blitzkrieg and pulled the rope with a brown blitzkrieg, they say who will be the first and who will be weakened in the accompanying wars? Figase normalalek. Interesting ideas about normality. Germany, like Italy, officially recognized the crime of fascism and responsibility for the crimes it committed. By the way Mussolini was the founder of fascism, but he was not a Nazi.
  • Ugochaves
    Ugochaves 18 February 2021 15: 34
    +2
    Do we have any other military blocs on our planet? Ahh, I got it .... probably the Martians soldier
  • ironic
    ironic 18 February 2021 17: 00
    -4
    You don't need this, you are very big.
  • Cottodraton
    Cottodraton 19 February 2021 07: 21
    0
    Well, the Biden yelling one thing, you are another) ... this is shiz, but with schizos you need to keep your ear on the alert ...
  • iouris
    iouris 18 February 2021 12: 33
    +7
    When, finally, can Russia attack? Everyone is ready.
  • Jacket in stock
    Jacket in stock 18 February 2021 12: 36
    +1
    Let MiGs buy, then there will be no need to retreat to Sweden, you can even, on the contrary, step on Murmansk or St.

    But seriously, replace Hornet with Super Hornet, IMHO the simplest solution.
    1. OgnennyiKotik
      OgnennyiKotik 18 February 2021 12: 42
      +1
      Quote: Jacket in stock
      replace Hornet with Superhornet, IMHO the simplest solution.

      Not really. In fact, these are completely different aircraft. There is a common cockpit and general layout. Engines, avionics, design - everything is different.
    2. Finn
      Finn 18 February 2021 12: 57
      +1
      This is what Finland's pragmatic forces are doing. KamAZ trucks, gases, UAZ trucks are in service. But the planes are American and old. And they don't fly at all.
      1. nks
        nks 19 February 2021 11: 45
        0
        The Finnish Air Force has all the rules with a touch. The planes, it is clear that they are not new, since it is time to change them, but they are not ancient either - the same age as the Su-27. They were collected and maintained by the Finns themselves.
  • bar
    bar 18 February 2021 12: 38
    +4
    "The best choice to repel a Russian attack"

    The best way is to conclude an agreement with Russia. And the cheapest.
    1. iouris
      iouris 19 February 2021 11: 56
      0
      What contract? About the non-aggression of Finnish skiers at our international competitions?
      1. bar
        bar 19 February 2021 13: 20
        +1
        Are there still ours? I'm surprised. Some nameless athletes in nameless T-shirts are running, standing on the podium under someone else's anthem. We, as a country, Russia, what side? Personally, I perceive participation in this show as a personal business of athletes. This is their right, their career, their earnings. They can choose any color of the uniform with any advertisement and win prizes for any music. The honor of the country just does not need to be remembered.
        That's how I personally think, and for centuries who do not agree to minus am
  • rocket757
    rocket757 18 February 2021 12: 40
    +3
    "The best choice to repel a Russian attack": Sweden offers the Finnish Air Force to purchase Gripen E

    Again, the "killer" of something there is offered. Malasy!
    1. ironic
      ironic 19 February 2021 19: 12
      0
      Why a killer? Just a nice plane.
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 19 February 2021 19: 23
        0
        Come on, have you read their advertisements from the responsible general? Killer, killer, that's what it said ...
  • Poetry
    Poetry 18 February 2021 12: 42
    +7
    Scare gullible Finns and propel your planes to them. Nothing personal.
  • Gardamir
    Gardamir 18 February 2021 12: 45
    -2
    To be careful not to make statements about the Russian threat, it is time to end the defeatist ideology of partnership.
  • rotmistr60
    rotmistr60 18 February 2021 12: 46
    +5
    will allow the two countries to cooperate in preventing a Russian attack
    You buy the main thing and then you yourself will see the fright of Russia. Sometimes one gets the impression that the Scandinavians secretly dream of surrendering to Russia. Hence this constant lament that Russia, if not today, then tomorrow, will definitely attack Sweden and Finland after an hour before it captures the Baltic states.
    1. Finn
      Finn 18 February 2021 13: 03
      -3
      No, they don't want to give up. Finland is not Tribalts. The average salary is 2000 euros, pensions are different for everyone, but not 10000 rubles, many retire to Spain and leave and live there well for 1500 euros. There is no point in listing. The main thing is that they don't want to give up.
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 18 February 2021 14: 45
        +4
        Quote: Finn
        many retire to Spain and leave for 1500 euros and live there well.

        They forgot one thing to say that from the moment of leaving Suomi until the moment of arrival, the pension is not charged. We have been sick of this law for 10 years.
    2. Mezabralis
      Mezabralis 18 February 2021 13: 26
      -8
      Yes, of course, Scandinavians dream about it. Live like in Russia under Tsar Putin
    3. ironic
      ironic 19 February 2021 19: 13
      -1
      Why do they need to see the fright of Russia?
  • Ros 56
    Ros 56 18 February 2021 12: 55
    +6
    EU is a big top circus with a lot of clowns trying to stab each other.
  • Elena Akinfieva
    Elena Akinfieva 18 February 2021 13: 16
    +8
    Why do they need planes. Let them continue to sell strawberries.
  • Scharnhorst
    Scharnhorst 18 February 2021 13: 20
    0
    If the Finnish government is committed to a policy of neutrality in fact and not in words, then the choice of the Swedish plane will be justified at least from a political point of view. At one time, after the collapse of the USSR and the eastern bloc, the Finns swung towards the world hegemon and replaced the Soviet MiG-21 with Hornets. Based on the result of the choice, one can read the secret thoughts of top-level politicians in Finland, and if you're lucky, then corruption schemes!
    1. Mezabralis
      Mezabralis 18 February 2021 13: 27
      -8
      Did such an agreement help the Baltics in 1940?
  • fax66
    fax66 18 February 2021 13: 26
    +7
    And why did they decide that the Finns would only retreat to Sweden, and not sink, for example, to France? Then it's better to take Rafali ...
    Or maybe the F-35 right away?
    1. Mezabralis
      Mezabralis 18 February 2021 13: 40
      -8
      The Finns showed you in 1939 and 1940 what kind of men they are
      1. Scharnhorst
        Scharnhorst 18 February 2021 13: 49
        +6
        So after all, in the 41st they decided to continue the "show", so why did they stop in the 44th? If men!
        1. Mezabralis
          Mezabralis 18 February 2021 13: 53
          -6
          5 / 000 = 000/180
      2. Jacket in stock
        Jacket in stock 18 February 2021 14: 47
        +9
        Quote: Mezabralis
        The Finns showed you in 1939 and 1940 what kind of men they are

        And the women?
        And if in truth, the Finnish army of the 1939 model showed the Soviet Army the 1939 model.
        But after 5 years, the Finns showed that they did not want to show anything more against the Soviet Army of the 1944 model, and until 1991 they showed their friendliness very diligently.
        1. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 18 February 2021 17: 32
          +3
          Quote: Jacket in stock
          and until 1991 showed their friendliness very diligently.

          And even now they are not particularly drawn to Russia.
      3. ZEMCH
        ZEMCH 18 February 2021 17: 06
        +2
        Quote: Mezabralis
        The Finns showed you in 1939 and 1940 what kind of men they are

        The task was completed, the border was pushed back for the threatened period)))
        Problems with weapons and uniforms were identified, and by the beginning of the Second World War, the situation began to be corrected)))
    2. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 18 February 2021 17: 34
      +3
      Quote: fax66
      Why did they decide that the Finns would only retreat to Sweden

      Rather, "why did the Swedes decide for the Finns that they would fight Russia."
    3. nks
      nks 19 February 2021 11: 57
      0
      Quote: fax66
      Then it's better to take Rafali ..

      This is the best option anyway :)
  • 2k11
    2k11 18 February 2021 13: 28
    +3
    In fact, the best choice for Finland to defend against Russia is to return to Russia)
    1. ironic
      ironic 18 February 2021 17: 20
      -3
      Well, as if not even a question of what they will choose.
    2. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 18 February 2021 17: 31
      0
      Quote: 2k11
      In fact, the best choice for Finland to defend against Russia is to return to Russia)

      The oligarchs will quickly get their hands on them.
  • nonsense
    nonsense 18 February 2021 13: 31
    +2
    Swedes are simply asking Russia to advertising campaign - check with your Air Force how the Grippens will repel an air strike on Stockholm ...
  • Emil mamedoff
    Emil mamedoff 18 February 2021 13: 47
    0
    The only "not strong" place of Gripen E is the radar, it is like AFAR, but weak.
    "Raven ES-05 detection range 1m2 150 km" - only the detection range is 150 km, and it seems like it can shoot at targets from only 92 km.



    The Chinese radar KLJ-7A, which is also equipped with the JF-17 B3, is even more powerful.
    1. ironic
      ironic 18 February 2021 17: 22
      -3
      It's not just range. They have nothing more. The meteor at its end barely reaches 200 km. And with the engine running ~ 110 km.
      1. Emil mamedoff
        Emil mamedoff 19 February 2021 01: 47
        -2
        So the plane transmits and receives signals from a distance of 90-150 km, aiming at a target from 92 km, what role will the 200 km of this Meteor play there? The meteor there will be effective only at ranges up to 150 km, if there is an external target designator, to reveal the full potential of this missile.
        1. ironic
          ironic 19 February 2021 19: 16
          0
          Maybe even less than 150. Yes. But I mean that they don't need more.
  • tralflot1832
    tralflot1832 18 February 2021 14: 12
    0
    I give 202% finna Gripenn will not buy; mentality is different
  • tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 18 February 2021 14: 41
    +2
    He echoed Hultqvist and Swedish Air Force Deputy Commander Anders Persson, who stated that Sweden and Finland are potential targets for the Russian invasion

    How I want to get something to my neighbor to buy, and Hulyatviust Persson will get a good kickback from Saab. Nobody wants to work, only to receive kickbacks.
    1. ironic
      ironic 18 February 2021 17: 23
      -3
      Why bother? Does he not fly or does he fly badly?
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 18 February 2021 17: 28
        +2
        Quote: ironic
        Why bother? Does he not fly or does he fly badly?

        Who cares, whether it flies badly or well, the main thing is to get it in, and then let them figure it out.
        1. ironic
          ironic 18 February 2021 18: 21
          -3
          So this is the main thing for all sellers to get involved, marketing is called, but there are those who have good goods.
          1. tihonmarine
            tihonmarine 18 February 2021 20: 37
            +1
            Quote: ironic
            So this is the main thing for all sellers to get involved, marketing is called, but there are those who have good goods.

            There is also a good product, and prices are affordable, and some of them use old boats and advertise that they are very good, although they themselves say "Expensive in service."
    2. nks
      nks 19 February 2021 11: 57
      0
      A kickback is a form of bribing an official from a counterparty. In this case, the Swedish Defense Ministry, the Swedish Air Force Castle and the SAAB represent one side. If the duties of these gentlemen include, among other things, the promotion of defense exports, then in this case they are just doing their job and may be able to count on an honest award.
  • Gennady Fomkin
    Gennady Fomkin 18 February 2021 17: 56
    0
    Quote: Alien From
    Alcotourism Finam is better to develop)

    Come on, they nafig these violent laughing
  • Reserve buildbat
    Reserve buildbat 18 February 2021 19: 28
    +3
    Actually, yes. Influenza for dates is ideal. No one will fight them, and the airplane is relatively inexpensive, especially compared to mattress ones.
  • zenion
    zenion 18 February 2021 19: 39
    +1
    What will they do if Russia neglects them and refuses to attack them, they disdain. What will they do with these airplanes, will they really beat them into plowshares?
  • faiver
    faiver 18 February 2021 19: 49
    +1
    "The best choice to repel a Russian attack"
    - if for this, then the Finns do not need anything
  • Maksim_ok
    Maksim_ok 19 February 2021 12: 36
    0
    Gripen is a good car. I wonder what the Finns will choose. After all, they have been using the F-18 Hornet for a long time. can take Super Hornet block3 or F-35 in general as the Poles. if you look at the future, it is better to take the F-35
    1. nks
      nks 19 February 2021 15: 50
      0
      Quote: Maksim_ok
      like poles

      Nooo, Finns are still practical people and in general they have a good state - they will not do like Poles.
      1. Maksim_ok
        Maksim_ok 7 May 2021 16: 49
        0
        What is the impracticality of choosing the F-35? If you want a stealthy, multi-role fighter, there are simply no alternatives. The only question is that the F-35 will be slightly more expensive than the F-18 Super Hornet (now the cost of the F-35A is $ 79 million, the cost of the F-18 Block 3 is in the region of $ 70 million). higher (gradually decreasing)
        1. nks
          nks 11 May 2021 12: 33
          0
          Quote: Maksim_ok
          If you want a stealthy multi-role fighter, there are simply no alternatives.

          Firstly, there are alternatives, and secondly, I talked about practicality. The Finn needs an airplane that can carry out their tasks and perform them as efficiently as possible. Suffice it to say that in the winter 4 F-35s were supposed to arrive in Suomi (LM wanted to show that the efficiency of a link from 4 vehicles increased greatly) 2 flew in with a whole C-17 for maintenance, 1 rather quickly became non-flying, as a result only one showed.
          Well, one can only believe in LM. The Finns are completely unhappy with ALIS in its current form and can only believe that LM will be able to offer some suitable alternative.


          Quote: Maksim_ok
          now the cost of the F-35A is $ 79 million, the cost of the F-18 Block 3 is in the region of $ 70 million

          Your data is incorrect. The cost of flyaway F-18 E / F BIII for USN ~ $ 95m, and F-35A ~ $ 110m for program participants (for Finns it is even higher)

          Quote: Maksim_ok
          the cost of a flight hour for the 35th is also higher (gradually decreasing)

          Yes, it is decreasing, but it is more than 3 times higher and does not threaten to drop to the price of competitors (all 4 in this tender it is lower). Plus it's not just money. The F-35A at the moment cannot make more flights per day, the rafale can do 5. In the event of a sufficiently intense conflict, you will simply have 5 times fewer planes.