Military Review

How a brave jackal bit a dead lion

351

First Secretary of the CPSU Central Committee Nikita Khrushchev speaks at the XX Congress of the CPSU in the Kremlin, 1956 © Vasily Egorov / TASS Photo chronicle


"A brave jackal bit a dead lion."

Stalin's legacy


In his quest for unlimited power, Khrushchev first eliminated his main rival, L. Beria (The black myth of the "bloody executioner" Beria; Part 2), who, apparently, was simply killed during his arrest.

He pushed back from management the Chairman of the Council of Ministers of the USSR G. Malenkov, who was considered the heir of Stalin. Then he struck a blow at the deceased leader, starting a de-Stalinization process that was destructive and suicidal for the Soviet country in its consequences. In 1957 he finished off the opposition (the so-called "anti-party group") represented by Molotov, Malenkov and Kaganovich. Then he sent Marshal Zhukov into disgrace, who had previously supported him shortsightedly.

In his struggle for power, Khrushchev relied on the "fifth column", those who to some extent suffered from Stalin's policies. The underdog and hidden Trotskyists, internationalist revolutionaries, nationalists and just people with a philistine, petty-bourgeois psychology, who did not want to "go to the stars", wanted stability and wanted to enjoy power. To do this, it was necessary to destroy the society of knowledge, service and creativity created by Stalin, to form its own analogue of a consumer society and to come to an agreement with the West.

Stalin actually created a new ideology. Formally, Marxism-Leninism remained in the USSR. But de facto it was the Russian idea of ​​creating a society of people of the future.

The project "Light Russia" ("City of Kitezh"), the state of kindness, justice and love for people, was revived. Hence the incredible popularity of the USSR in the world in this era. And the amazing miracles that Soviet people performed in the name of a big idea.

Thus, under Stalin, the Russian people and other indigenous peoples of Russia performed three miracles: - - rebuilt the country after the ruins of the Troubles;
- defeated the "all-European horde" led by Hitler ";
- they restored the state again after the Great Patriotic War and gave such creative energy to the Union that it was a world leader for another thirty years.

Joseph Vissarionovich recreated the Russian Empire. He returned to her many of the lost lands - the Baltics, Vyborg, Western Belarus and Ukraine, Moldova, Bukovina, Southern Sakhalin and the Kuriles. He returned power and greatness to the Russian state.

We have restored a sphere of influence in Eastern and Southeastern Europe, in the Far East (Port Arthur, friendly North Korea and communist China). They created and tempered in a terrible battle the best army in the world.

Formed the world's best system of science, upbringing and education. Stalin launched a Russian (Soviet) project of globalization, an alternative to the Western one.

A powerful industry was built, with the most advanced industries (nuclear, space, rocketry and aircraft construction). The Russians began to build the world on the basis of the brotherhood of peoples and co-prosperity, which dealt a mortal blow to the Western slave-owning society.

Thus, under Stalin, the Russians restored all the best that was in the Russian Empire (classical school and culture, army, navy, etc.). And we went further, building the civilization and society of the future, overtaking the West and the whole world in humanitarian, social and cultural terms - for an era.

"Corn"


During this magnificent and amazing period stories Stalin was judged by the children of "fiery revolutionaries", the heirs of Trotskyism, under the lies and deception of Khrushchev.

Prior to that, Khrushchev was known mainly as one of the "jesters" with the owner. As a completely obedient and unprincipled executor of the will of the sovereign. Of course, with such "authority" he could not hold out on the throne for long. Therefore, the incompetent and narrow-minded, although rather cunning Khrushchev, apparently at the suggestion of his more far-sighted assistants, began to kick the deceased owner, spit on another statesman who had gone into the world.

The “fifth column” (Trotskyists, internationalists, nationalists and cosmopolitans), which was hidden and half-crushed under Stalin, liked it, as did the West.

The special services of the West began to play the "card" of Khrushchev.

And the Khrushchevites have made great strides in the field of de-Stalinization. In essence, this was the course of the ruin of Russia (Betrayal of the USSR. Perestroika Khrushchev; "Khrushchev" as the first restructuring; Part 2).

The Armed Forces, the national economy, and the Russian Church, which under Stalin was undergoing a period of revival, suffered enormous damage. The Russian "unpromising" village was destroyed, the Great Russian central provinces-regions were bled. That laid a powerful "mine" under the demography of the Russian state.

The "thaw" in cultural and social life undermined the Russian "imperial" style, which was formed under the red emperor.

Khrushchev introduced universal egalitarianism, destroying the healthy hierarchy, the new national elite of the Red Empire. Under Stalin, the best people of the country, proving this with their minds and inventions in labor and in battle, became a kind of Soviet aristocracy. University teachers and Stakhanovite workers could receive more Union ministers.

Khrushchev's egalitarianism destroyed all this. Now the low-skilled worker was paid more than an engineer or teacher. Healthy motivation to learn, improve, improve your level and qualifications has been undermined.

The time will come and the monstrous role of Nikita Khrushchev, who dressed up in "Russian" kosovorotki, portrayed the age-old Russian muzhik, but actually destroyed Russia, will be revealed and exposed to the end.

It was during Khrushchev's time that he planted that mental bomb that would destroy Soviet civilization.

Of course, Khrushchev will be neutralized.

The most dangerous "distortions" will be corrected. The Soviet nomenclature was just beginning to decompose at that time. The terrible era of betrayal under Gorbachev was still quite a long way off.

However, Khrushchev's "perestroika" will close the USSR's path to the future. Brezhnev never dares to completely clean up the "Khrushchevs", to return the country to the Stalinist path of development.

Stalin, however, does not need justification and protection.

His deeds speak for him.

He accepted a "killed" country, a demoralized population. And he left - a superpower, a victorious people full of creative energy.

He showed the main path to the salvation of Russia and all mankind - to the stars.

The Stalinist period in the history of Russia was a period of power, greatness and prosperity of our Motherland.

Until now, "perestroika-reformers" of all stripes have been unable to steal Stalin's legacy, the property of the people of this great era.

That is why the social engineers of the West urgently needed then to reformat this popular love and respect for Stalin into a negative "cult".
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Photos used:
https://tass.ru/
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  1. Far B
    Far B 17 February 2021 04: 34
    +12
    Stalin actually created a new ideology. Formally, Marxism-Leninism remained in the USSR. But de facto it was the Russian idea of ​​creating a society of people of the future.
    Actually, it was a Soviet idea. And Stalin did not create any new ideology. He developed the Marxist-Leninist theory, relying on the results of its practical application (theory without practice is dead!). In general, Samsonov is in his repertoire.
    1. Uncle lee
      Uncle lee 17 February 2021 04: 58
      +12
      under Stalin, the Russians restored all the best that was in the Russian Empire (classical school and culture, army, navy, etc.)
      Restored and increased! hi
      1. gsev
        gsev 17 February 2021 08: 49
        +1
        Quote: Uncle Lee
        Restored and increased!

        Best of all, the state of Soviet society was expressed by Tvardovsky, where in his poem Pravda herself is forced to deceive her son, who was innocently sentenced to death. In addition, one should not confuse the true heroes and the Stalinist nomenklatura. For example, because of the protection of former partisans, the nominee of the largest partisan unit was accused of rape by the MGB officers with the approval of the regional committee. Moreover, the prosecutors even ignored the fact that the allegedly "raped" woman, even many years after the alleged crime, remained a girl.
        1. Proxima
          Proxima 17 February 2021 14: 41
          +13
          Churchill had an interesting opinion about Khrushchev. In November 1964, Churchill's 90th birthday was celebrated in the English parliament, and someone proposed a toast to him as to Russia's most ardent enemy. Churchill threw in: “Unfortunately, there is a person who has caused damage to the Land of the Soviets 1000 times more than I did. This is Nikita Khrushchev. Let's clap him!.. drinks And another very interesting phrase:“Khrushchev is the only politician in the history of mankind who has managed to declare war on the dead. But the funniest thing is not even this, but the fact that Khrushchev lost this war. " fool
          1. victor50
            victor50 18 February 2021 08: 08
            +3
            Quote: Proxima
            “Unfortunately, there is a person who has done 1000 times more harm to the Land of the Soviets than I did. This is Nikita Khrushchev. Let's clap him! .. And another very interesting phrase: “Khrushchev is the only politician in the history of mankind who managed to declare war on the dead. But the funniest thing is not even this, but the fact that Khrushchev lost this war. "

            I think this is from the same opera and the same stories as Churchill's words about Stalin. Well, where about the plow and the atomic bomb.
            1. gsev
              gsev 18 February 2021 09: 56
              0
              Quote: victor50
              I think this is from the same opera and the same stories as Churchill's words about Stalin. Well, where about the plow and the atomic bomb.

              I suppose this is the first appearance or birth of such a story. However, it has little chance of taking root, in contrast to the statement about the plow and the atomic bomb. Under Khrushchev, they stopped massively repressing and killing communists, as it happened during Stalin's life, it was under him that science and technology successfully competed with the Americans. And the British and French colonial empires disappeared under Khrushchev. In addition, under Stalin, Soviet nuclear weapons could not be used on US territory due to the lack of reliable carriers. And most importantly: what the descendants of the NKVDs do not pay attention to, but what is ingrained in the genetic memory of the common people, it was under Khrushchev that they stopped dying of hunger in Russia ..
              1. victor50
                victor50 18 February 2021 10: 54
                +1
                Quote: gsev
                I suppose this is the first appearance or birth of such a story. However, it has little chance of taking root, in contrast to the statement about the plow and the atomic bomb. Under Khrushchev, they stopped massively repressing and killing communists, as it happened during Stalin's life, it was under him that science and technology successfully competed with the Americans. And the British and French colonial empires disappeared under Khrushchev.

                I just can't understand why there is such dislike for Khrushchev on VO? Historical facts are completely dismissed. A typical answer to the facts you have cited is that it went on by inertia, and Stalin laid the foundation for this, and his merit. A lot of bad things can be said about the Khrushchev era, but then about Stalin too. But if the achievements of the latter are praised, then the achievements of the period of Khrushchev's rule are attributed to anyone, but not to him and are not associated with him.
                1. gsev
                  gsev 18 February 2021 11: 48
                  +2
                  Quote: victor50
                  I just can't understand why there is such dislike for Khrushchev on VO? Historical facts are completely dismissed.

                  Do not forget that under Khrushchev there were large reductions in the army, and the state security officers lost their former influence and a significant part of the salary increases.
                  There was even such a ditty:
                  "Why are you standing and crying
                  Reserve officer?"
                  - "Waiting for me in the village
                  swineherd position. "
                  Many people pinned their hopes on the beginning of perestroika for the return of the Stalinist order. Even in 1994, in a conversation with me, the serviceman expected the coming of the dictatorship.
              2. Andrey Krasnoyarsky
                Andrey Krasnoyarsky 18 February 2021 12: 52
                0
                Nikolai Aleksandrovich Nekrasov, in his poem "Who Lives Well in Russia", expressed a brilliant idea:
                People of the servile rank are real dogs sometimes. The heavier the punishment, the dearer they are to the Lord. "
                1. gsev
                  gsev 18 February 2021 18: 17
                  -1
                  Quote: Andrey Krasnoyarsky
                  The heavier the punishment, the dearer they are to the Lord. "

                  In a disenfranchised state, obedient people often survive. But this does not mean that if they get a chance, they will not show bestial cruelty to the tormentor.
            2. Proxima
              Proxima 19 February 2021 00: 17
              +1
              Quote: victor50
              I think this is from the same opera and the same stories as Churchill's words about Stalin. Well, where about the plow and the atomic bomb.

              I think from the same opera, you are from the newfangled galaxy of people who, in response to any famous statement of some politician, say that this did not happen. Very simple, effective and most importantly a win-win! good drinks NO AND EVERYTHING IS HERE! And you say, break your forehead, but prove it! And nothing that the statement about "plow and bomb" even entered "Britannica" ?! And nothing that everyone in the English parliament in 1964 simply physically could not hear?
      2. Andrey Krasnoyarsky
        Andrey Krasnoyarsky 18 February 2021 12: 40
        -6
        But they especially increased the repressive apparatus, which no Russian tsar-emperor dreamed of. Compared to the Stalinist GULAG, the tsarist penal servitude was downright a resort. All this multiplication and augmentation was carried out due to the colossal exertion of the forces of the people, as well as colossal losses. To some extent, this was justified, but the lovers of the Stalinist regime elevated to the rank of absolute the measures that were used in extraordinary and extreme conditions of the state's existence. The Stalinist system was effective in extreme conditions, but it was a brake on the normal peaceful development of the country. Khrushchev's flaw is not that he eradicated the Stalinist system, but that he eradicated inconsistently and partially.
        1. Kart
          Kart 18 February 2021 14: 53
          -3
          Quote: Andrey Krasnoyarsky
          But the repressive apparatus, which was never dreamed of by any Russian tsar-emperor, especially increased. Compared to the Stalinist GULAG, the tsarist penal servitude was downright a resort.

          Well, this is in the name of a great goal!
          They don't feel sorry for anyone for her. A person is a cog, a part of society: brigades, for example.
          "The forest is being cut - the chips are flying."
          You have to understand!
          As there: "under the old cart the workers are lying." (by the way - why? why not start with roads and housing, like all normal people?)
          And they whisper - "there will be a garden city".
          These krasnobaev-"historians" would be put under the old cart after 10 hours of pick and shovel. What would they whisper there?
        2. gsev
          gsev 18 February 2021 18: 23
          -2
          Quote: Andrey Krasnoyarsky
          but lovers of the Stalinist regime raised measures that were used in extreme and extreme conditions to the rank of absolute

          Many modern businessmen dream of some features from the Stalin era. Not necessarily repression. But many dream about modern workers working for their employers with the enthusiasm of the Stakhanovites and shock workers. In this respect, there are many more wealthy Stalinists than among ordinary fellow citizens. It seems to them that if propaganda can create the mentality of the people, then people will work for the owners without paying attention to inequality. In principle, even in Ukraine and the Baltic states, Russophobia is designed to distract ordinary citizens from the struggle for their fair wages.
          1. Fat
            Fat 19 February 2021 01: 50
            0
            Vladimir! Are you "blessed"?
            A normal person can plow like a damned one only if the matter is "to their liking" and can wait for rewards without murmuring delays ... if this business and his "personal" business are the same.
            I will not spread ... There is no point in cramming information about the benefits of creativity ...
            But people, who are very good, as it turned out, do not agree to be "simple" mercenaries - artisans.
            Honor them! The little brothers Sorokin, they had a lot of bad things with us, in our company, to endure.
            But they were and remain not mercenaries - friends in honor and in life.
            I keep it in my heart
            For a redneck (Expotator) - a cynic to the venality of Ijeals - a rarity ...
            Craftsmanship is a valuable and unique thing. So it turned out ...
            I have a style, they will find out, And now brotherly things are exchanged. and caught, brag. Heh heh caught? This is because I have the Sorokin originals!
            Morons are mostly athletes.
            But the wizards of China, the company did not even manage to understand!
            yes, let them reproduce the scrap metal as much as they intend.
            Have you seen! wait ...
            In order to fish with artificial bait. Me or My "Chief" have to hold it in my hands, Funny? not! just plain rubbish does not pass the control!
            1. gsev
              gsev 19 February 2021 17: 46
              0
              Quote: Thick
              A normal person can plow like a damned one only if it is to their liking

              I found workers who had passed FZO and FZU in production. The person gets used to the environment. If you make him do a certain thing, he will love him. In many ways, the successes of Soviet industry are due to the fact that collectives were forced to produce certain products, and over time everything worked out. But now practically no one wants to master a profession, the return on which will come in 10 years and will be possible only with a certain industrial structure.
              1. Fat
                Fat 19 February 2021 18: 15
                0
                Cynically, but rightly speaking.
                Probably the trouble of many, not large, entrepreneurs is that assistants are taken from the street .... or by an ad.
                Others, trying to snatch the "shaft" forget about everything. Such people could not get accustomed to our team, nor earn as they should.
    2. Vladimir_2U
      Vladimir_2U 17 February 2021 05: 10
      +10
      Quote: Dalny V
      Actually, it was a Soviet idea. And Stalin did not create any new ideology.
      To recycle, fuse and develop the old is to create the new.
      1. Far B
        Far B 17 February 2021 06: 19
        +6
        In fact, even Engels pointed out that Marxism is not a dogma, but a guide to action. Both Lenin and Stalin approached Marxism precisely as a doctrine that must develop (be processed, absorb something new, be tested by practice, etc.). Like any science, actually. Therefore, it is natural that both under Lenin and under Stalin, Marxism was filled with new content. But it still remained Marxism. The trouble is that since Khrushchev, Marxism began to be perceived precisely as a dogma, ceased to be flexible and to take into account various nuances. Ossified. The ability to adapt was lost, and as a science he began to quickly become obsolete - because without development, science cannot ("Without theory, we die, death!" - JV Stalin, shortly before his own death).
      2. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 17 February 2021 07: 29
        +5
        Quote: Vladimir_2U
        To recycle, fuse and develop the old is to create the new.

        To rethink, fix, change and discard the unnecessary - this is to create something new.
    3. Boris55
      Boris55 17 February 2021 07: 46
      -17%
      Quote: Dalny V
      Stalin did not create any new ideology.

      He built society, taking as a basis the pre-Christian structure thereof.

      Quote: Far In
      He developed the Marxist-Leninist theory

      I advise you to read Stalin's work: "Economic Problems of Socialism in the USSR" 1952, the second section, in which he renounced obscurity: http://www.souz.info/library/stalin/ec_probl.htm

      "I think that our economists should put an end to this discrepancy between the old concepts and the new state of affairs in our socialist country, replacing the old concepts with new ones corresponding to the new situation. We could tolerate this discrepancy until a certain time, but now the time has come when we must finally, eliminate this discrepancy. "

      A new theory never appeared, and the theory of obscurity led us to the collapse of the USSR ...
      1. Far B
        Far B 17 February 2021 07: 55
        +5
        I think that our economists must put an end to this discrepancy between the old concepts and the new state of affairs in our socialist country, replacing the old concepts with new ones, corresponding to the new situation. We could tolerate this discrepancy until a certain time, but now the time has come when we must finally eliminate this discrepancy.
        Where is the rejection of Marxism in the above quotation? What in the above quotation contradicts my words that Stalin developed the Marxist-Leninist theory (changing old concepts to new, appropriate ones)?
        the theory of obscurity led us to the collapse of the USSR
        A theory that has become a dogma ceases to be a theory. So go by.
        1. Boris55
          Boris55 17 February 2021 08: 01
          -14%
          Quote: Dalny V
          Where is the rejection of Marxism in the above quotation?

          Since you don't want to follow the link, here's another quote from that work:

          “Moreover, I think that it is necessary to discard some other concepts taken from Marx's Capital, where Marx analyzed capitalism, and artificially glued to our socialist relations. I mean, by the way, such concepts as“ necessary "and" surplus "labor," necessary "and" surplus "product," necessary "and" surplus "labor time. Marx analyzed capitalism in order to find out the source of exploitation of the working class, surplus value, and give the working class, deprived of the means of production , a spiritual weapon for the overthrow of capitalism.It is clear that Marx uses concepts (categories) that fully correspond to capitalist relations.But it is more than strange to use these concepts now, when the working class is not only not deprived of power and the means of production, but on the contrary, keeps in power and owns the means of production in their hands. ”Now, under our system, the words about labor power as a commodity sound rather absurd,and about the "hiring" of workers: as if the working class, which owns the means of production, hires itself and sells its labor power to itself. It is just as strange now to talk about "necessary" and "surplus" labor: as if the labor in our conditions, given to society for the expansion of production, the development of education, health care, the organization of defense, etc., is not so necessary for the working class , now in power, as well as the labor expended to cover the personal needs of the worker and his family. "

          Quote: Dalny V
          A theory that has become a dogma ceases to be a theory. So go by.

          The theory of obscuration is completely inconsistent with the socialist system. You yourself quoted Stalin from his call to Gorky about the need for a new theory. Not to "polish" ML teaching, but a new, completely new one.

          ps
          The dogmatic teaching in the Bible is not bad enough for more than one millennium.
          1. Far B
            Far B 17 February 2021 08: 15
            +3
            So still "it is necessary to discard some other concepts" or abandon Marxism altogether? And still answer my previous question: How does this contradict my words that Stalin developed the Marxist-Leninist theory (changing old concepts to new, appropriate ones)?
            The theory of obscuration is completely inconsistent with the socialist system
            Where does it not match fully? Partially - yes, because Marx created theory, and Stalin embodied it on practice.
            You yourself quoted Stalin's quote about the need for a new theory
            Where in the quote I have quoted Stalin speaks of the new theory? It is more logical to assume that he is worried about what needs to be moved, to develop the already existing one, on which the country led by him was built.
            The dogmatic teaching in the Bible is not bad enough for more than one millennium
            You so easily rejected the battles of the church fathers, numerous schisms, trends that were declared heretical ... And all this - for two millennia, yeah.
            1. Boris55
              Boris55 17 February 2021 08: 36
              -9
              Quote: Dalny V
              So all the same "it is necessary to discard some other concepts" or in general to abandon Marxism?

              1. If from obscurity to remove everything that is said about "surplus", nothing will remain in it.
              2. If it were possible to develop obscurity, then Stalin would not speak about the need for a new theory, but talked about the development of the theory of obscurity.
              3. The CPSU, based on the theory of obscurity, which describes capitalism, ultimately built capitalism in our country. It is not possible to build a straight house on a crooked foundation.

              Quote: Dalny V
              how it contradicts my words that Stalin developed the Marxist-Leninist theory

              I will answer with a quote from Stalin: "We could tolerate this discrepancy until a certain time, but now the time has come when we must finally liquidate this is a discrepancy. "Not to develop, but to eliminate.

              Quote: Dalny V
              Where in the quote I have quoted Stalin talking about the new theory?

              Re-read your comment above: "The ability to adapt was lost, and as a science, it began to quickly become obsolete - because without development, science cannot ("Without theory, we die, death!"- JV Stalin, shortly before his own death).

              Quote: Dalny V
              You so easily rejected the battles of the church fathers, numerous schisms, trends that were declared heretical ... And all this - for two millennia, yeah.

              Not two, but three. Polishing rot is not a rewarding business, incl. and the Bible, but v. not about that.
              1. Far B
                Far B 17 February 2021 08: 48
                +5
                If it were possible to develop obscurantism, then Stalin would not have talked about the need for a new theory
                Enchanting !!! laughing Where, when, in what place did Stalin speak of the need the new theory?
                I will answer with a quote from Stalin: "We could tolerate this discrepancy until a certain time, but now the time has come when we must finally eliminate this discrepancy."
                AND? What in this quote contradicts my words that Stalin developed the Marxist-Leninist theory? (I'm asking this question for the third time!) Eliminated inconsistencies? Well, this happens when you put theory into practice - inconsistencies are revealed. They are usually eliminated. And they continue to further embody the same theory.
                Re-read your comment above: "The ability to adapt was lost, and as science it began to quickly become obsolete - because without development, science cannot (" Without theory, we die, death! "- I.V. Stalin, shortly before his own death)
                Yes where, where in this quote the words new theory, damn it burnt ?! fool
                Again. Polishing rot is not a rewarding thing in t.i. and the Bible, but v. not about that
                Which one again? For the Bible in the previous post, you yourself started talking, now you decided to transfer this case to me? No, I don’t need someone else's, I have enough of my own.
                1. Boris55
                  Boris55 17 February 2021 08: 49
                  -10%
                  Walking in circles is not fun. Until. hi
                  1. zenion
                    zenion 17 February 2021 17: 33
                    +4
                    Boris55 (Boris). There are two opinions, right and wrong. The right thing is mine! Wrong - everyone else! Young man!
              2. sniperino
                sniperino 17 February 2021 14: 28
                +2
                Quote: Boris55
                the time has come when we must finally eliminate this discrepancy. ”Not develop, but eliminate.
                Eliminate discrepancy... This is required by the dialectical law of negation of negation.
                In dialectics, the category of negation means the transformation of one object into another with the simultaneous transition of the first to the position of a subordinate and transformed element within the second, which is called withdrawal. This opens up room for further development and acts as a moment of connection with the retention of all the positive content of the passed steps. Dialectical denial is generated by the internal laws of the phenomenon, acts as self-denial.
      2. gsev
        gsev 17 February 2021 08: 55
        0
        Quote: Boris55
        A new theory never appeared, and the theory of obscurity led us to the collapse of the USSR ..

        Apparently the theory that Stalin dreamed of introducing would have met with clear rejection in Soviet society. Korean sources indicate that it was Stalin who told Kim Il Sung that monarchy is possible under both socialism and communism.
      3. Was mammoth
        Was mammoth 17 February 2021 09: 08
        +7
        Quote: Boris55
        I advise you to read the work of Stalin: "Economic Problems of Socialism in the USSR" in 1952, the second section, in which he renounced obscurity:

        Cool! MRAXism!
        I advise you to reread the first section: wink
        "Marxism understands the laws of science, whether we are talking about the laws of natural science or the laws of political economy, as a reflection of objective processes occurring independently of the will of people. People can discover these laws, learn them, study them, take them into account in their actions. , use them in the interests of society, but they cannot change or cancel them. Moreover, they cannot form or create new laws of science. "
        If you really want to .... wink
      4. aleksejkabanets
        aleksejkabanets 17 February 2021 09: 25
        +7
        Quote: Boris55
        He built society, taking as a basis the pre-Christian structure thereof.

        Could it be more detailed from this place? What did Stalin take from paganism?
        Quote: Boris55
        I advise you to read Stalin's work: "Economic Problems of Socialism in the USSR" 1952, the second section, in which he renounced obscurity: http://www.souz.info/library/stalin/ec_probl.htm

        There it is, Mihalych! The fact that Stalin proposes to abandon the transfer to the socialist economy of certain categories borrowed from the analysis of the capitalist mode of production, such as "surplus labor", "surplus time", etc. do you think there is a rejection of Marxism? Have you read anything besides this paragraph in your work? Under Stalin, the socialist mode of production had already finally taken shape, it is quite natural that some of the terms created to describe the capitalist mode of production are inapplicable to it. This is what Stalin's work was about.
        Quote: Boris55
        A new theory never appeared, and the theory of obscurity led us to the collapse of the USSR ...

        Can you substantiate your undoubtedly "wise" statement?
        1. sniperino
          sniperino 17 February 2021 15: 06
          0
          Quote: aleksejkabanets
          This is what Stalin's work was about.
          Quote: Boris55
          A new theory never appeared, and the theory of obscurity led us to the collapse of the USSR ...
          Can you substantiate your undoubtedly "wise" statement?
          If you will. Marxism consists of: 1) methodology (the goal is to build a communist society and dialectics - a way of thinking that allows you to understand how and what can be done for this in a specific situation) and 2) theory, which allows you to translate this into social practice. Theory plays here a purely service role. If the theory in the changed conditions begins to hinder the movement towards the set goal, it must be changed, leaving only that which will help further progress, and create a new one. Otherwise, the theory of Marxism inevitably turns into obscurity.
          1. yehat2
            yehat2 18 February 2021 13: 13
            +1
            Quote: sniperino
            dialectics - a way of thinking, allowing you to understand how and what can be done for this in a particular situation

            I'm afraid Hegel, whose dialectics is being studied, did not know about Marxism or the ways to achieve communism. You demonstrate knowledge of some names, but distort their essence.
            I think you do not know that Marx wrote his theory, working on the order of the English capitalist, being at his and neighboring enterprises and the capitalist paid for his work, and was extremely pleased with the result.
            So when your hands itch again to write a pseudo-truthful opus with a bunch of convincing terms, I ask you to think about it, for deception is God's sin ... stop
            1. sniperino
              sniperino 18 February 2021 13: 17
              +1
              Quote: yehat2
              I'm afraid Hegel
              Don't be afraid of him. Give an alternative (correctly) definition of dialectics, business. And you breed snot.
              1. yehat2
                yehat2 18 February 2021 13: 22
                +1
                Hegel's methods simply make it possible to analyze more clearly and clearly, and are studied because the social issues that interest communists are very much related to emotions and other distractions, and what communism is, no one really knows. Only some of its properties are known. And in order to come up with how communism works and not mess up, as well as think over a difficult path to it and distinguish false theories and ideologies from useful ones, Hegel's methods are needed. I'm not a theoretician, I'm just showing WHY they study dialectics.
                there are no ready-made recipes in dialectics, only tools for search and analysis.
                1. sniperino
                  sniperino 18 February 2021 14: 29
                  0
                  Quote: yehat2
                  I am not a theorist, just showing
                  "The moped is not mine ..." I must show where I was mistaken when giving dialectics my definition; because of which Hegel would have had enough Kondraty. Everything else, excuse me, is stringy snot.
                  Quote: yehat2
                  make it possible to more clearly and clearly analyze
                  In order to
                  understand how and what can be done for this in a specific situation
                  for this - to achieve the goal.
                  1. yehat2
                    yehat2 18 February 2021 14: 33
                    0
                    just don't lie. And don't mask it with rhetoric. Is it clear now?
                    If you don’t know what dialectics is, keep silent. Pass for smart.
                    There are questions, for example, how long turtles have tails, where no one cares, how close you are to the truth, and there are cornerstone questions where accuracy and the absence of strange interpretations are extremely important. I wrote in what you were not accurate and it is important not to discredit the established method of teaching people who defend socialist ideals.
                    1. sniperino
                      sniperino 18 February 2021 14: 34
                      -2
                      Quote: yehat2
                      just don't lie

                      Program, leave me alone!
      5. Doccor18
        Doccor18 17 February 2021 11: 03
        +3
        Quote: Boris55
        ... and the theory of obscuration led us to the collapse of the USSR ...

        What is it like? How could the theory of Marxism lead to the collapse of the state?
        Please explain.

        "The only source of wealth is labor" ...
        1. Kart
          Kart 18 February 2021 15: 09
          0
          Any theory, especially intended for use by specific people, is realized precisely by these people themselves.
          And if they understood it and used it in such a way that as a result everything came to collapse, then the theory is wrong.
          Well, it's obvious.
          1. Doccor18
            Doccor18 18 February 2021 15: 23
            0
            Quote: Carte
            Any theory ... is realized precisely and precisely by these people themselves.
            And if they understood it and used it in such a way that as a result everything came to collapse, then the theory is wrong.

            Yes, the theory is not erroneous, but the Leader left early. He failed to appoint his successor, pure in spirit and strong character. This is his main mistake.
            And those who "misunderstood the theory," so they all understood. And the theory has nothing to do with it. Traitors and enemies had to be excluded in time, but he himself did not have time ...
    4. yehat2
      yehat2 17 February 2021 10: 37
      +6
      Quote: Dalny V
      Samsonov in his repertoire

      he's not just in his repertoire. He does exactly the same thing that Khrushchev did
      breeds all kinds of myths and slogans, misinterprets a part and people cease to understand what is happening.
      firstly, Khrushchev relied not on the 5th column, but on the leadership of the party, especially that part of the careerists who replaced the losses of the war, but whose privileges and power Stalin had seriously limited in recent years. And, if you look, Khrushchev has seriously increased their influence. It was they who later made up the decayed elite of the USSR.
      In general, the article seems to be about good, but the way it was submitted makes it even harmful. Talking about Stalin's legacy do not lie. Absolutely everyone was associated with blood - Malenkov, Stalin, Beria and Molotov and Zhukov. And Khrushchev was completely covered in blood. The time was like that. It was necessary to fight with uncompromising and merciless enemies. But what kind of blood was that? Stalin did not practice reprisals for the sake of his power and ambitions. Beria also strove for legality. But with Khrushchev - we know Stalin's telegram "calm down,". So why not tell the truth, and not strange myths and distortions? The truth is stronger, more honest, more effective.
      1. Genry
        Genry 17 February 2021 13: 28
        +3
        Quote: yehat2
        Khrushchev relied not on the 5th column, but on the leadership of the party, especially that part of the careerists who replaced the losses of the war, but whose privileges and power were seriously limited by Stalin in recent years. And, if you look, Khrushchev has seriously increased their influence. It was they who later made up the decayed elite of the USSR.

        That is putting it mildly.
        Inflating the topic of repression, Khrushchev completely abolished control over the "elite" and guaranteed its immunity. This led to the stagnation of this "elite" with nepotism and corruption.
        In video at 12:40
        1. zenion
          zenion 17 February 2021 18: 05
          0
          This is probably about how Lenin planted a bomb under this Russia, and Yeltsin used it. I pulled the strings, thinking that he was going to pee in the toilet. I saw him back in the days when he was the secretary of the Uralmash party organization. During his reign, Fidel Castro came to Sverdlovsk. A healthy strong man and he went on stage in his own way, and next to him was Yeltsin. A tall, handsome man and, as the workers of this plant said, he is always under the influence and annoying like a fly. So he was on this day and all his life. The amazing thing is that he got away with it. If the other were thrown out of the party, this one would be pushed up. It seems that he was curated from America and directed.
          1. victor50
            victor50 18 February 2021 08: 16
            0
            Quote: zenion
            If the other were thrown out of the party, this one would be pushed up.

            And he was not expelled from the Politburo of the CPSU Central Committee ?! And there was no famous: "Boris, you're wrong!" You cannot distort history to please any theory.
      2. Aerodrome
        Aerodrome 17 February 2021 13: 43
        -1
        Quote: yehat2
        But with Khrushchev - we know Stalin's telegram "calm down,"

        ... "calm down, doo.rak!"
        1. yehat2
          yehat2 17 February 2021 13: 44
          0
          the second word did not pass moderation)))
          apparently Stalin would have been banned here am
      3. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 18 February 2021 09: 02
        +2
        Khrushchev relied in many respects on those who rose sharply, first in 1937-1938, and then during the war years. It is enough to study the biographies of most of the party and economic leaders of the Khrushchev and Brezhnev periods. Many had a rapid career takeoff during the Yezhovism. And the condemnation of repression at the 20th Congress of the CPSU did not affect the careers of the overwhelming majority of them.
    5. seacap
      seacap 17 February 2021 11: 33
      -3
      // Actually, it was a Soviet idea. And Stalin did not create any new ideology. ///
      Here you are not entirely right. Under Stalin (this is a collective decision, he never had full power), the strategic concept of the development of society and socialism radically changed, from the Leninist theory of world revolution (globalization) passed to the construction of socialism in a single country (nationalization), the creation and education of a new community " the Soviet people "in a hostile environment. So, if briefly and without going into details.
      1. DNS-a42
        DNS-a42 17 February 2021 13: 28
        0
        Quote: seacap
        So, if briefly and without going into details.

        Let's get in. Then it turns out that:
        1) The idea of ​​the possibility of building socialism in a single country was first put forward by Lenin.
        2) The building of socialism in a single country is part of the world revolution.
        1. seacap
          seacap 17 February 2021 15: 46
          -2
          You are mistaken, read at least one of Stalin's work, for a start. The discussion has no meaning and is not interesting to anyone, I think you can end there, good luck.
          1. victor50
            victor50 18 February 2021 08: 22
            +1
            Quote: seacap
            You are mistaken, read at least one of Stalin's work, for a start. The discussion has no meaning and is not interesting to anyone, I think you can end there, good luck.

            Deftly jumped off! They wrote nonsense, could not refute it, offered to read at least one of Stalin's works ... Which one, I wonder? Have you seen at least one edition of Stalin's speeches and works? How many volumes are there? Which of these do you suggest reading that confirms your theories?
      2. zenion
        zenion 17 February 2021 18: 07
        0
        Stalin also said that the further the class battles will be.
        1. Kart
          Kart 18 February 2021 15: 10
          -1
          How did it end?
          Who won the class battles?
      3. victor50
        victor50 18 February 2021 08: 19
        +1
        Quote: seacap
        Lenin's theory of world revolution (globalization)

        Didn't Lenin allow the possibility of building socialism in a single country, and not the most advanced one? Where did you get what you write about?
        1. Kart
          Kart 18 February 2021 15: 12
          -1
          He allowed it precisely because he understood perfectly well that if a person has a lot of food and 10 pairs of pants, then he will not go to arrange a revolution.
          True, now in the XXI century it became clear that you can promise 10 instead of 20 pairs - and everything is in order, again for the revolution.
      4. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 18 February 2021 09: 07
        0
        Since 1945, socialism has been built in more than one country. The Cominform, CMEA, OVD, etc. were created, joint conferences of the leadership of the USSR and other socialist countries were regularly held.
    6. Bar1
      Bar1 17 February 2021 11: 41
      +3
      1

      Voroshilov and Budyonny -
      Dashing warriors!
      The throne was ceded to Khrushchev
      Without any fight.

      2

      They write a lot about Budyonny:
      Bravely he waved his sword.
      And Khrushchev shouted,
      He became quiet like a lamb.

      3

      -our comrade Beria
      out of trust
      and comrade Malenkov
      kicked him.

      Khrushchev in 1953 was the secretary of the Moscow regional and city party committee, as well as the secretary of the Central Committee of the All-Union Communist Party of Bolsheviks, that is, Khrushchev, together with Malenkov and Bulganin, in terms of power went directly behind the General Secretary and Chairman of the Council of Ministers Stalin, that is, it was Stalin who brought Khrushchev closer and opened his way to power; then it was for what.
      The last years of his life, historians note how the decline of Stalin's political activity and, in fact, since 51, it was these three secretaries Malenkov, Khrushchev and Bulganin who ruled the country.
      Many decisions of that period followed the line of the Council of Ministers. From what considerations did Stalin select his cadres? Stalin was the most informed person in the country and could not but know about the moral and professional qualities of each of the leaders.
      It is clear that one of these three was to become Stalin's successor: Khrushchev, whom historians considered the most hopeless leader-voluntarist, but then how did he turn out to be the person closest to power?
      1. Aerodrome
        Aerodrome 17 February 2021 13: 44
        -2
        Khrushchev, in the same cauldron with Yeltsin and Gorbachev should be cooked.
      2. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 18 February 2021 09: 21
        +1
        By and large, Bulganin was inferior to Khrushchev on many counts. With Malenkov, too, not everything is clear. He was good as a deputy, but not an independent leader. All these three were superior to Zhdanov, but he died several years before Stalin's death, being not an old man. Malenkov, on the other hand, dealt with the Zhdanov nominees rather despicably within the framework of the "Leningrad case." Judging by this "Leningrad case", Malenkov and his supporters even rather successfully misinformed Stalin in the last years of his life. Lucky Kosygin, whom Stalin himself forbade touching. By the way, it was Malenkov, not Khrushchev, who was the first to talk about the need to fight the personality cult almost in the first days after Stalin's death.
        1. Bar1
          Bar1 18 February 2021 09: 37
          0
          Quote: Sergej1972
          Judging by this "Leningrad case", Malenkov and his supporters even quite successfully misinformed Stalin in the last years of his life


          Stalin knew EVERYTHING because he relied not only on his party secretaries, but also had many other sources, according to the same Council of Ministers, through the NKVD, through his own guards. In order to overthrow the Leningrad group it was necessary to organize a UNIVERSAL conspiracy between all these state institutions, and this is probably impossible.
          Therefore, there was something else that Stalin believed and on whose opinion he relied unconditionally. Or to accept the point of view that Stalin was killing everyone who got ahead of him.
          But this is also strange, because Stalin could not but understand that his old man should be bypassed by young leaders, which is exactly what Stalin himself was doing and was raising new cadres.
  2. Destiny
    Destiny 17 February 2021 05: 21
    +16
    The Stalinist period in the history of Russia was a period of power, greatness and prosperity of our Motherland.

    There was no need to write anything else, all the more so to read about the corn-grower, only to spoil the mood in the morning.
    1. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 17 February 2021 09: 04
      +5
      Quote: Destiny
      There was no need to write anything else, all the more so to read about the corn-grower, only to spoil the mood in the morning.

      Delov did the "codpiece Fuhrer", still belching.
      1. zenion
        zenion 17 February 2021 18: 16
        +2
        tihonmarine (Vlad). I lived with this maize and Gorokhovets. I also remember his promise of twenty years and three seven years. But the main expression for him was that corn is the queen of the fields, and peas are the king! Not only did they poke in everywhere and he didn’t want to know that it wouldn’t work. Who said that - anti-party and servants of imperialism. Punished to start planting potatoes in the Arctic. There should be places where it will take root. And the rest - yes, of course. And they began to plant potatoes in the Murmansk region in other places. So it only seemed like three leaves and kaput. But don't you dare report. Such exuberant harvests were filmed in tones from a cubic quadrometer ... As soon as it calmed down, all this was abandoned. It was only a pity for the potatoes that were transferred.
        1. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 17 February 2021 20: 57
          +3
          Quote: zenion
          I lived with this maize and Gorokhovets.

          Seen enough when in 1962 stood from 06.00. to the store for their "500 grams" of black bread. And for corn in the Smolensk region.
          1. Sergej1972
            Sergej1972 18 February 2021 09: 30
            +3
            In the Smolensk region and in neighboring regions, maize for livestock feed was grown on a large scale both under Brezhnev and in a later period. Now, driving along the roads of the Bryansk, Oryol, Kursk regions in the summer, it is hard not to notice that a lot of land is occupied by corn.
            1. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 18 February 2021 10: 10
              +1
              Quote: Sergej1972
              In the Smolensk region and in neighboring regions, corn for livestock feed was grown on a large scale under Brezhnev

              I do not know, but in our Dukhovshchinsky district, the soil is podzol, corn did not grow more than half a meter. Schoolchildren planted seedlings in peat pots.
              Although on the school site, where they put a lot of manure, but constantly spud, it grew up to one and a half meters, but the cobs did not ripen. Clover, lupine, lentils, peas grew well and went well for silage.
              1. nonsense
                nonsense 18 February 2021 13: 27
                0
                even unripe corn goes well into silage - cows are very fond of.
        2. Sergej1972
          Sergej1972 18 February 2021 09: 26
          +1
          The funny thing is that on the territory of the USSR suitable for this, the production of corn and peas continued to grow even after the removal of Khrushchev. Corn is Khrushchev's love. And advice on peas and potatoes was given to him by Trofim Lysenko, a favorite of both Stalin and Khrushchev.
  3. Pessimist22
    Pessimist22 17 February 2021 05: 22
    -10%
    I think now it is possible to carry out the deportation of several nations, well, three or four and repress up to a million people on false denunciations, so that the people feel how good it was then.
    1. Ravik
      Ravik 17 February 2021 06: 07
      +7
      And you do not write false denunciations ... do not write any denunciations at all ...
      You look and you won't have to repress anyone.
      1. Far B
        Far B 17 February 2021 06: 26
        +16
        You look and you won't have to repress anyone
        I am afraid that without any denunciations there are a lot of candidates. You can start with the Russian Forbes list. Well, to bring up the brilliant managers led by Chubys. Very worthy candidates for the Druzhba-2 saw operator.
        1. Destiny
          Destiny 17 February 2021 06: 39
          +17
          Quote: Dalny V
          You can start with the Russian Forbes list.

          It’s a caste of untouchables, but the people, so that they don’t have a bone in the form of some governor (who is no longer needed anymore, because he has stopped sharing), will be thrown to you, they say: We are fighting corruption and theft, we are fighting. work.
          1. Far B
            Far B 17 February 2021 06: 48
            +6
            It is impossible, it is a caste of untouchables
            Damn, well, at least let me dream, or what? sad
        2. Ross xnumx
          Ross xnumx 17 February 2021 07: 33
          +4
          Quote: Dalny V
          Well, to bring up the brilliant managers led by Chubys.

          Then information slipped through that Chubais, while still under EBN, together with Burbulis, stole 3 tons of gold intended for collateral and sent to GB. Send 10 tons - received 3 !!!
          1. Ross xnumx
            Ross xnumx 17 February 2021 07: 48
            +3
            Quote: ROSS 42
            Send 10 tons - received 3 !!!

            Typo. Should be:
            We sent 10 tons, but only 7 arrived at the place !!!
            1. Far B
              Far B 17 February 2021 08: 00
              +5
              Duc, magicians of the highest standard. I remember that of the five (or six?) Lards allocated by the IMF after the default-98, nothing at all got to the final addressee. Chubais also supervised that operation. Coincidence? I don’t think so! (from).
            2. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 18 February 2021 14: 35
              +2
              Quote: ROSS 42
              Typo. Should be:
              We sent 10 tons, but only 7 arrived at the place !!!

              Yes, and we realized with a typo that Chubik and Bubik had stolen three tons.
              1. Kart
                Kart 18 February 2021 15: 13
                0
                Ага.
                "The rich will work and the poor will rest, smoke marijuana and drink beer."
          2. Sergej1972
            Sergej1972 18 February 2021 09: 33
            0
            Why then was Burbulis so poor then, until recently he worked as a petty clerk in the Federation Council until he had a stroke?
            1. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 18 February 2021 14: 36
              0
              Quote: Sergej1972
              Why then was Burbulis so poor then, until recently he worked as a petty clerk in the Federation Council until he had a stroke?

              Chubik has worn out, cheated Bubik.
        3. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 17 February 2021 09: 09
          +3
          Quote: Dalny V
          Well, to bring up the brilliant managers led by Chubys. Very worthy candidates for the Druzhba-2 saw operator.

          Better to let the railway from Murmansk to the Bering Strait be built, it is more needed, and there will be enough space for all the "shanks".
      2. seacap
        seacap 17 February 2021 11: 41
        +1
        Someone wrote all these sleepyheads of thousands of denunciations, and even now they are writing, as it was and is, the whole situation then and now, this is especially well illustrated by our neighbor in the "nezalezhnaya" and "overseas stronghold of democracy", where both husbands and mothers.
        1. zenion
          zenion 17 February 2021 18: 23
          +1
          seacap (Alexey). Before the war, Khrushchev ruled Ukraine. Each regional committee, each district committee was given a distribution order for how many and for whom. They called everyone and said you should write as much, and you should write so much. It was good and quiet in places that border on foreign countries, it was quiet there. There was enough without it. Throughout the Dniester, the borders passed with Bessarabia, and during the winter, when the river froze over, gangs broke through the border. Sometimes in the summer on punt.
    2. Plastmaster
      Plastmaster 17 February 2021 06: 30
      +3
      Quote: Pessimist22
      I think now it is possible to carry out the deportation of several nations, well, three or four and repress up to a million people on false denunciations, so that the people feel how good it was then.

      Ravik answered correctly about the denunciations. There is nothing to add. And as for the peoples ..... Well, there were the same .... Which on the drum who would lead them.
      1. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 17 February 2021 07: 39
        +4
        Quote: Plastmaster
        And as for the peoples ..... Well, there were the same .... Which on the drum who would lead them.

        Let's not close our eyes and hide our tongue in ..., but let's say frankly what if we remove:
        including gratuitous receipts in the amount 74 835 384,1 thousand rubles

        then the questions about who owes whom and who our good southern brothers are will rise by themselves.
  4. savage1976
    savage1976 17 February 2021 06: 11
    +3
    It is not clear only one, why it was necessary to destroy and destroy to the ground what was created millennia before, in order to restore and revive later. To paraphrase an old adage, we can say - spit on history and history will spit on you.
    1. Plastmaster
      Plastmaster 17 February 2021 06: 31
      +3
      Quote: savage1976
      It is not clear only one, why it was necessary to destroy and destroy to the ground what was created millennia before, in order to restore and revive later. To paraphrase an old adage, we can say - spit on history and history will spit on you.

      And the destruction came from the white elite, intervention.
      1. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 18 February 2021 09: 36
        +1
        The industrial center of the country remained under the control of the Bolsheviks throughout the civil war.
    2. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 17 February 2021 07: 42
      +1
      Quote: savage1976
      It is not clear only one, why it was necessary to destroy and destroy to the ground what was created millennia before, in order to restore and revive later.

      The absence of the obligation to obey the laws by everyone and the availability of privileges, natural patience and good feelings of representatives of many peoples allow a bunch of scoundrels to mock the majority, rewriting history like the wrong homework.
      1. savage1976
        savage1976 17 February 2021 11: 59
        0
        And what has changed? Instead of a handful of nobles, a handful of party leaders began to do the same, and after 91, instead of a handful of party leaders, a handful of money bags. So what has changed? Over the 300 years of the Romanovs' reign, the territory of Ingushetia increased 5-6 times, and the population 20 times, for 70 years after the revolution, through the efforts of the revolutionaries, the territory was reduced by a quarter, and the population did not even double. It turns out that the tsarist government did better. Destroy the country for the sake of others to fall to the trough? The tsar exiled to hard labor, Stalin was sent to camps, Brezhnev or Khrushchev were deported from the country with deprivation of citizenship or to mental hospitals, now they are simply issuing fines. It turns out now the most humane government in the country compared to the rest.
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 14: 57
          -3
          Quote: savage1976
          It turns out now the most humane government in the country compared to the rest.

          That the most humane government did not release Raisa Maksimovna's brother from the psychiatric hospital?
        2. Sergej1972
          Sergej1972 18 February 2021 09: 39
          -1
          The greatest explosive growth in territory was under Ivan the Third and Ivan the Fourth. Under the Romanovs, the territory increased significantly, but still not five or six times.
    3. aybolyt678
      aybolyt678 17 February 2021 07: 46
      +5
      Quote: savage1976
      It is not clear only one, why it was necessary to destroy and destroy to the ground what was created millennia before, in order to restore and revive later.

      What was destroyed, I do not understand? The revolution was relatively peaceful. Until March 18, there was practically no civil war. On whose money did the white movement exist? What were the Americans doing in Primorye? What was Kolchak doing in America? a lot of questions to which answers are found only by analogy method according to the present day. The ideology of the white movement was not even based on monarchism, but on an artificially created mess in the then information environment. These idiotic tales about common wives, the theory of a glass of water ... All this is very similar to Perestroika in 85-90. When the deep level of public consciousness broke down.
      The article forgot to tell about Churchill's phrase about the fact that Khrushchev was the only politician who declared war on a dead opponent and, moreover, managed to lose this war
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 17 February 2021 09: 16
        +4
        Quote: aybolyt678
        The article forgot to tell about Churchill's phrase about the fact that Khrushchev was the only politician who declared war on a dead opponent and, moreover, managed to lose this war

        And also Churchill's phrase "An intelligent man Khrushchev, only an intelligent man could leave Russia without bread."
      2. savage1976
        savage1976 17 February 2021 09: 42
        -2
        The revolution took place relatively peacefully only in St. Petersburg (Petrograd), and as a result, as it is now fashionable to say "illegal overthrow of power", anarchy developed in the country and in different regions of the country whoever could take power into their own hands, and it was then that the civil war began ... And seeing all this after the end of WWI, the interventionists pulled up their piece to snatch, and they took part on both sides of the conflict (Latvian riflemen (although they were practically their own), the Czechoslovak corps). so the destruction of the country is a direct consequence of the revolution or the seizure of power by the Bolsheviks.
        1. zenion
          zenion 17 February 2021 18: 28
          0
          savage1976. You should at least read a story about the Czechoslovak Corps, on whose side they fought. You give it out, you learned everything from YouTube.
        2. Sergej1972
          Sergej1972 18 February 2021 09: 46
          +1
          With the exception of the Far East, the invaders were mainly in port cities, and their number was small. And the internal political situation in England, France, and the United States did not contribute to a full-scale foreign intervention. The same Americans in the spring and summer of 1918 made many attempts to establish contact with the Bolsheviks and even provide them with assistance, provided that they would at least keep the front. They even wrote about this in the Soviet era in the History of Diplomacy. If the Bolsheviks announced the continuation of the alliance within the Entente, then the British, Americans and French would have fully cooperated with the Bolsheviks.
    4. Gardamir
      Gardamir 17 February 2021 08: 41
      -1
      destroy to the ground
      If we talk about words, then they were written by a Frenchman. If we talk about action. then we have a later example, when a coup d'etat was carried out in the country by deception in 1991-93. But they continue to destroy to this day.
      1. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 18 February 2021 09: 53
        +2
        Self-organization and initiative were absent among the Soviet people. Most were against the collapse of the USSR, but in no way self-organized, did not participate in protest actions. Where are the massive protests, general strikes in support of the Union in 1991? Everyone hoped for a miracle, for the army, for the KGB, etc. Only at home, in the kitchens and in front of the TV, sat and drunkards. Paternalism, however, is not always good. But the nationalists, separatists, anti-communists were able to organize themselves.
    5. mat-vey
      mat-vey 17 February 2021 09: 00
      +1
      Quote: savage1976
      It is not clear only one thing, why it was to the ground to destroy and destroy what has been created for millennia

      It's not clear where you got this from ..
  5. Squelcher
    Squelcher 17 February 2021 06: 15
    +8
    This is what it turns out Stalin and Beria with the help of communist ideology gathered around themselves some jackals? Communists, do you not understand that pouring dirt on others is stupid and lowers you and the communist idea in the first place?
    1. Flooding
      Flooding 17 February 2021 07: 27
      +4
      Quote: Squelcher
      This is what it turns out Stalin and Beria with the help of communist ideology gathered around themselves some jackals?

      The communist idea has nothing to do with it.
      She, like all mankind, can be accused of the fact that a reliable guaranteed mechanism for separating the grains from the chaff in the power structures has not yet been developed.
      Again, this is a problem for all of us, not just the communists.
      1. Squelcher
        Squelcher 17 February 2021 08: 18
        +2
        Bingo is primarily ourselves, not the political aspect. The most interesting thing about this is that most of the countries that have achieved a high social level of protection for their citizens have done so without bloody revolutions and civil wars. And they are not communists.
        1. Flooding
          Flooding 17 February 2021 08: 56
          +3
          Quote: Squelcher
          The most interesting thing about this is that most of the countries that have achieved a high social level of protection for their citizens have done so without bloody revolutions and civil wars.

          Have not wondered at what cost? Can all other countries of the world pass the same way? Or do the laws of economics rigidly limit the circle of the elite? What is the share of such achievements of His Majesty by chance and coincidence of historical, political circumstances? And most importantly, can this elite club become friendly to Russia, and how should Russia pay for it? How do these wonderful states see Russia, which until recently, for some historical misunderstanding, were colonial predators? Because it is obvious that it is difficult to talk about economic prosperity in the face of tough opposition from the most developed countries of the world.
          1. Squelcher
            Squelcher 17 February 2021 09: 32
            +4
            Now they began to roll by and into the pit of polit idiocy. Are these countries opposing cleanliness in our entrances? These countries probably prevent us from cleaning up poop after a dog or garbage on the beach. Are they forcing the officers to treat the soldiers like filth, or the bosses to their employees? Are these countries forcing our officials to take bribes? Or do our deputies often issue often stupid laws? Perhaps these countries are forcing workers to do their job poorly and carelessly?
            1. Flooding
              Flooding 17 February 2021 09: 35
              +1
              Quote: Squelcher
              Now they began to roll by and into the pit of polit idiocy

              We could stop at this.
              You have shown your objectivity and impartiality to the fullest in just one sentence.
              The rest was overkill.
              It was the apotheosis of your thought.
              All the best.
              1. Squelcher
                Squelcher 17 February 2021 11: 07
                +3
                And all the best to you, looking for external enemies and internal traitors is always easier than changing yourself and society for the better.
        2. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 17 February 2021 09: 22
          0
          Quote: Squelcher
          The most interesting thing about this is that most countries that have achieved a high social level of protection for their citizens have done so without bloody revolutions and civil wars. And they are not communists.

          Bingo, the most interesting thing is that almost all these countries did not become great, but feudal China, with a communist ideology, has become either the second or the first country on the globe. So you need to strive for good, remembering our recent history.
          1. Squelcher
            Squelcher 17 February 2021 11: 02
            +1
            Officially, China has a communist ideology, but in fact? Second, have you been to China? Do you know in what conditions most of them work and live? I have been to China and more than once for work and on vacation, and in Japan and Korea, even in North for work, I have something to compare with. The Russian Empire was also a Great Power like the USSR, but why did the revolution happen and the 90s, from great happiness?
            1. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 17 February 2021 11: 18
              +1
              Quote: Squelcher
              Second, have you been to China? Do you know in what conditions most of them work and live? I have been to China and more than once for work and leisure

              It happened more than once, for the first time in the USSR, the last time 6 years ago, and all the work, I did not feel the desire to rest. There is much more positive than negative.
              1. Squelcher
                Squelcher 17 February 2021 11: 52
                +1
                Now ask yourself, would you like your children to work in the same conditions as most Chinese people? I definitely don't.
                1. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 12: 37
                  -3
                  Quote: Squelcher
                  Perhaps these countries are forcing workers to do their job poorly and carelessly?

                  Quote: Squelcher
                  Now ask yourself, would you like your children to work in the same conditions as most Chinese people? I definitely don't.

                  So, why are you crying now about poor-quality work if you yourself don't want to work with your children?
                  1. Squelcher
                    Squelcher 17 February 2021 14: 10
                    +1
                    Don't worry about the quality of my work, as my poor-quality work can cost the lives of about 200 people. And cry about the increase in the retirement age to the wrong address.
                    But the working conditions of the Chinese, sorry.
                    1. Mordvin 3
                      Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 14: 28
                      -3
                      Quote: Squelcher
                      But the working conditions of the Chinese, sorry.

                      I see that the Chinese are doing their job well. I write from a Chinese laptop, I call from a Chinese smartphone, and as for working conditions, they are hardly worse than ours. Any job can cost someone's life, and there's nothing to brag about. You write here in plain text that neither you nor your children want to work, and at the same time complain about the dirt in your own entrance. At the same time, as I understand it, you yourself do not at all strive to work as a floor polisher, as, for example, my grandmother worked, cleaning 6 nine-story entrances a day for a minimum wage, i.e. 12 thousand rubles.
                      1. Squelcher
                        Squelcher 17 February 2021 16: 37
                        +1
                        It is clean in my entrance, you see, we follow the cleanliness and order, we do not wait for the Fuhrer or Lenin to be clean. And the collapse of the USSR is not whining, unlike the former members of the Communist Party. My grandmother was a collective farmer and in 1961 she was happy about the abolition of serfdom, you see, she received her passport. And I'm sorry to call my own grandmother a grandmother ...
                      2. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 17: 03
                        -2
                        Quote: Squelcher
                        And I'm sorry to call my own grandmother a grandmother ...

                        She was not my own, the seventh water on jelly. And my own maternal grandmother did not work in the field of war at all, they lived on my grandfather's miner's salary.
                        Quote: Squelcher
                        It’s clean in my entrance, you see, we follow the cleanliness and order, we don’t wait for the Fuhrer or Lenin to be clean.

                        Quote: Squelcher
                        Are these countries opposing cleanliness in our entrances?

                        Your words? Yours.
                      3. Squelcher
                        Squelcher 17 February 2021 17: 17
                        +1
                        Yes, my words and I don’t refuse them, they have caught repeatedly, individuals. They probably hooligans and drew on the walls by direct instructions from these countries, and another former nomenklatura worker, too, probably, by direct instructions from these countries, threw bulls out the window, at cars :) ...
            2. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 17 February 2021 13: 12
              -1
              Quote: Squelcher

              -3
              Now ask yourself, would you like your children to work in the same conditions as most Chinese people? I definitely don't.

              This is already opera. Now fashionable - "Would you like to?". And I don’t want anything, what happened is what happened, and with this I have to live without "IF?".
              1. Squelcher
                Squelcher 17 February 2021 14: 16
                +3
                China's success lies in the fact that the communists gave their citizens into slavery to the capitalists. We ourselves could not build, they bought it with cheap labor. But the plus is developing state capitalism under the guise of the Communist Party.
                1. tihonmarine
                  tihonmarine 17 February 2021 14: 55
                  +1
                  Quote: Squelcher
                  We ourselves could not build, they bought it with cheap labor.

                  And I've seen enough of this. Everywhere there is a white side, a black one, but there is also one about which they are silent.
                  1. Squelcher
                    Squelcher 17 February 2021 16: 43
                    +2
                    I absolutely agree with you here.
                2. andrew42
                  andrew42 17 February 2021 20: 14
                  +2
                  There is no socialism in China. Not at all. After the consolidation of national sovereignty, China returned to its natural social order. There is a conditional "emperor" (General Sek), there are higher "dignitaries" (Central Committee of the CPC), there are "dignitaries in the localities", and so on. Conceptually: Zhong Guo, the Middle Empire, is the navel of the Earth, where the "right people" live. Ideologically: formally a “red screen” combined with real Confucianism and deep Taoism at the everyday level. Politically: National Socialism in a mild form, with complete dominance of Han nationality. ... Economically: a symbiont of the economy of the United States and developed countries of the European Union (the main markets for industrial goods and sources of technology), with redundancy in the form of a promising more complete development of the market of the third world countries. There is no pension provision (keeping the elderly as children is a holy Chinese family tradition). Health care is 3% commercial (a fraction of the state, but far from all; a fraction of the employer from under the state "whip"). Education of an acceptable level (including Secondary School) is paid. My friend Young in 80 voiced the figure something like 2011 thousand yuan, which his growing daughter would need to enter and finish a decent Secondary School (the price of a good foreign car in China at that time). The yuan was roughly "160 rubles for 4,90 reimeibin", - Total about 1 thousand rubles of the sample of 800, - so much Yang had to scrape together for 2011 years of study (I can't remember the payment schedule now). In current rubles - about 10 million over 1,6 years. Well, the order of the amount is clear. I don’t think there have been any drastic changes. This data was "from the bottom", from the most that neither is the Chinese everyday life. There is no Socialism there. Not for a long time.
                  1. Sergej1972
                    Sergej1972 18 February 2021 10: 10
                    0
                    There are categories of people who receive a pension. And the pension system differs from province to province depending on its economic success. Well, the dominance of the Han people is quite natural, because they make up over 90% of the population of the PRC. At the same time, there is a lot of talk in the PRC that their country is multinational.
                  2. andrew42
                    andrew42 18 February 2021 13: 00
                    0
                    Of course, there are categories. Do not deny. I meant the "universal pension system" - there is none.
              2. Sergej1972
                Sergej1972 18 February 2021 10: 05
                0
                But the labor force in the PRC is no longer cheap compared to India, Bangladesh and many other Asian countries.
                1. andrew42
                  andrew42 18 February 2021 12: 58
                  0
                  Compared to the payroll, I don't know. On a salary basis - on average, labor in China is more expensive than in Russia, by 35%.
          2. Sergej1972
            Sergej1972 18 February 2021 10: 03
            0
            I would not want us to work like in Japan and South Korea. This damn workaholism also does not lead to good. Countries record suicide, many people have a lot of sexual, psychological, and even mental problems due to excessive overexertion at work. This super-hard work is needed not by ordinary people, but by corporations and states.
  6. ANB
    ANB 17 February 2021 14: 31
    +1
    ... The most interesting thing about this is that most of the countries that have achieved a high social level of protection of their citizens did it without bloody revolutions and civil wars.

    And can, as an example, the names of a couple of such countries?
    1. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 17 February 2021 14: 59
      0
      Quote: ANB
      And can, as an example, the names of a couple of such countries?

      Of course there are, albeit small ones. Switzerland, Luxembourg, and Sweden will do.
      1. ANB
        ANB 17 February 2021 15: 08
        +3
        ... Switzerland, Luxembourg, and Sweden

        For Luxembourg I will not say, but in Switzerland and Sweden enough blood was spilled in due time.
        1. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 17 February 2021 15: 31
          +2
          Quote: ANB
          For Luxembourg I will not say, but in Switzerland and Sweden enough blood was spilled in due time.

          But the last hundred years have not fought, although Luxembourg was twice occupied by the Germans. The rest of Europe was unlucky. And we, as always, were not left alone. These Europeans are greedy.
    2. Squelcher
      Squelcher 17 February 2021 16: 41
      0
      Australia, Canada, Sweden, Finland, Japan.
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 17 February 2021 16: 49
        +1
        Quote: Squelcher
        Australia, Canada, Sweden, Finland, Japan.

        I would agree with the first four, but that's why then Japan demands the return of the Kuril Islands.
        1. Squelcher
          Squelcher 17 February 2021 17: 09
          0
          And what about the standard of living and territory?
          The Japanese do not need islands as such, but 200 miles of economic waters is yes.
  7. zenion
    zenion 17 February 2021 18: 34
    0
    Do you mean America with the civil war, or France, Germany, Italy? Everything there passed through the blood. There is no social level of protection anywhere, it was in the USSR, so it was called a socialist country, which forced the capitalists to take some steps, which are now canceled. It is for this reason that every effort was made to destroy the USSR. Therefore, Europe was set against the USSR. And got hit in the face. Then they began to look for traitors and of course they found them. They even gave you your plus signs for your non-socialist comment.
    1. Squelcher
      Squelcher 18 February 2021 00: 44
      0
      Ignorance is bliss, I also considered the USSR the most technologically advanced country until I went to Japan. What what and propaganda in the USSR well blocked the brain and ears.
  8. Kwas
    Kwas 18 February 2021 09: 25
    0
    And that these wonderful countries organized a couple of world wars, not counting hundreds of smaller ones, apparently does not count? Other actions, such as the overthrow of foreign governments and economic sabotage, of course do not count at all?
    1. Squelcher
      Squelcher 18 February 2021 13: 20
      0
      Didn't the communists do this? Comintern? Finnish government? Amin's palace? Not?
      1. Kwas
        Kwas 18 February 2021 15: 50
        0
        There is a difference. We never did this for the sake of siphoning resources.
        1. Squelcher
          Squelcher 19 February 2021 00: 01
          0
          One rapes a woman for his own satisfaction, the other raped a woman and then gave her money, you have an interesting logic.
          1. Kwas
            Kwas 19 February 2021 17: 06
            0
            If we can draw an analogy with rape, then one raped and sponsored, while the other raped, robbed and lent at interest. But notice that capitalist apologists always use simplistic and flawed analogies.
            1. Squelcher
              Squelcher 19 February 2021 23: 47
              0
              Apologists of socialism, are you ready to kill and rape for the sake of a great goal? You turn on the brain, the goal does not justify the methods?
  • aybolyt678
    aybolyt678 17 February 2021 08: 40
    0
    Quote: Squelcher
    This is what it turns out Stalin and Beria with the help of communist ideology gathered around themselves some jackals?

    With the help of Ideology, they united the country. For technical management, there were enough high-ranking officials, such as Khrushchev as well. Do not remember by the way the historical phrase of Stalin - "calm down" ?? Stalin periodically thinned out those who were in charge. But there was a problem - personnel shortage! many talented, intelligent, promising people died in the civil war and the Second World War. In general, walking up the career ladder is the Bolshoi and Malykh theaters, at the same time the ability to substitute a competitor, walking on bones in general.
    1. Olgovich
      Olgovich 17 February 2021 11: 19
      -1
      Quote: aybolyt678
      But there was trouble - staff shortage! a lot of talented, smart, promising people died in civil and WWII

      belay
      those. tsarism smog to educate "many talented, intelligent, promising" communists, and the Bolsheviks, when its the same sole power ...no belay request lol
      1. aybolyt678
        aybolyt678 17 February 2021 13: 55
        +2
        Quote: Olgovich
        those. The tsar was able to educate "many talented, intelligent, promising" communists, but the Bolsheviks, with their own sole power .... no

        tsarism brought up communists not thanks to itself, but rather in spite of. The Bolsheviks' sole power ended in 1956 when the members of the Central Committee became uncontrollable and not subject to jurisdiction. A flock has formed.
        1. Olgovich
          Olgovich 17 February 2021 15: 47
          -4
          Quote: aybolyt678
          The Bolsheviks have one-man power ended in 1956

          attacked ... by the Martians.?! belay request
          1. aybolyt678
            aybolyt678 17 February 2021 21: 28
            0
            Quote: Olgovich
            attacked ... by the Martians.?!

            Olgovich! you are not a stupid person smile with a lot of information. Imagine there is a group of people sitting like a caste of untouchables, It has the best army in the world, everyone in this group has opportunities as the leader of an average such state, they can do everything, only they lack health and youth. The guarantee of further untouchability and personal power for these people is the belief of those around them in their exclusivity, in the infallibility and inviolability of the Teaching. And osteophytes and calcifications in the joints cause pain with any movement. Naturally, thanks to the sycophants in the service staff, only combed information came to the attention, so that the remnants of health could be protected smile - The country was happy, the fields were growing. And then - Non progredy est regredy (lack of progress is regress.lat) And this is worse than the Martians. If there were Martians, it might even have united all people on Earth. It's Laziness! The word Laziness does not apply to the word Leonid Ilyich or Lenin laughing ... The laziness of the top, namely the top, does not apply to the people either, they are no longer leaders, they are usurpers of Power, the System.
            1. Olgovich
              Olgovich 18 February 2021 08: 40
              0
              Quote: aybolyt678
              people are the Faith of others in their exclusivity, in the infallibility and inviolability of the Teaching.

              I am tormented by the question: WHY the Stalinists, Molotovs, Kaganovichs, Mikoyans, Malenkovs, etc. could not in the slightest degree ... reproduce themselves?

              And at the same time - in IDEAL conditions for this, created by them?

              WHAT did they cultivate in deychtvitelstvo-remind? Tagged, drunkard, yakovlevs and shevardadze with kravchuks and snowfishes. What is it like?! belay
              1. aybolyt678
                aybolyt678 18 February 2021 08: 50
                0
                Quote: Olgovich
                I am tormented by the question: WHY the Stalinists, Molotovs, Kaganovichs, Mikoyans, Malenkovs, etc. could not in the slightest degree ... reproduce themselves?

                drinks fellow good I am also tormented by this very question, what happens to the psyche of a person who has fallen into power ?? The point here is not in the official ideology, not in the political system, but in the biological properties of the human brain and its response to the environment. IMHO of course. Moreover, the more difficult it is for the country, the more progress is made at the exit if the country survived. What system could be created to give the Power a constant tone ???
        2. Sergej1972
          Sergej1972 18 February 2021 10: 19
          0
          Even under Stalin, members of the Central Committee could not be arrested without the permission of the Politburo of the Central Committee and Stalin himself.
          1. aybolyt678
            aybolyt678 18 February 2021 10: 21
            0
            Quote: Sergej1972
            Even under Stalin, members of the Central Committee could not be arrested without the permission of the Politburo of the Central Committee and Stalin himself.

            under Khrushchev, they could not be developed by the special services
  • savage1976
    savage1976 17 February 2021 08: 43
    +1
    Yes, yes, the genius Stalin, who won the war and created a superpower from an agrarian country, did not understand people at all and put all kinds of jesters and clowns who did not know how and did not understand in the highest positions in the state.
    1. aybolyt678
      aybolyt678 17 February 2021 09: 02
      -4
      Quote: savage1976
      Yes, yes, the genius Stalin, who won the war and created a superpower from an agrarian country, did not understand people at all and put all kinds of jesters and clowns who did not know how and did not understand in the highest positions in the state.

      Are you saying that Khrushchev was in his place thanks to Stalin's genius? Or maybe this genius of reincarnation overgenialized Stalin? laughing
      1. savage1976
        savage1976 17 February 2021 09: 29
        +3
        Taking into account the fact that when asked about the main achievements of communism in our country, supporters call free apartments, space exploration, rocketry, pensions for everyone, and these are all the achievements that took place under N. S. Khrushchev, then supporters of communism should not vilify him, and put at least one level with Joseph Vissarionovich. For one head, the country was created by fear, repression, people plowed from dusk to dawn worse than horses, and at the other they finally began to live and feel the achievements of their labor and building communism in their lives.
        1. aybolyt678
          aybolyt678 17 February 2021 12: 55
          +1
          Under Khrushchev, the goal of the main activity of the Communist Party was changed, under him a more complete satisfaction of needs was proclaimed. Under Stalin, the goal was to educate a new person! Satisfaction of needs is already a Capitalist category. In addition, members of the Central Committee and candidate members of the Central Committee were not under the control of any body. And this is a time bomb.
          1. savage1976
            savage1976 17 February 2021 13: 24
            0
            Is it possible to educate a new person without satisfying his needs? Needs are different, need to eat, can you raise a new person without food? And the craving for knowledge for some is also a need, but is it possible to educate a new person by limiting the possibility of obtaining knowledge from other peoples, civilizations of countries? Hardly.
      2. aybolyt678
        aybolyt678 17 February 2021 13: 58
        -1
        Sarcasm is not understandable is it ???
    2. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 17 February 2021 09: 30
      +1
      Quote: savage1976
      Stalin, who won the war and created a superpower from an agrarian country, did not understand people at all and put all kinds of jesters and clowns who did not know how and did not understand to the highest positions in the state.

      Well, not understanding Kurchatov, the same Korolev, and Zhukov and Rokossovsky are also from the same galaxy. Under Stalin, ordinary people from the common people, people from the countryside, which could not have been under the tsars, and in other bourgeois states became famous.
      1. savage1976
        savage1976 17 February 2021 10: 07
        +1
        Let's start with Lomonosov. A simple fisherman could? Smog. World famous for centuries. Sikorsky could? Smog. Popov could? Smog. They are far from noble family. There would be a desire. Mendeleev also did it. It turns out that both before and after the revolution, not everyone could become world famous and it was not the estate that played the main role in fame, but the aspiration of a person.
        1. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 17 February 2021 10: 20
          +3
          Quote: savage1976

          0
          Let's start with Lomonosov. A simple fisherman could? Smog. World famous for centuries. Sikorsky could? Smog. Popov could? Smog. They are far from noble family. There would be a desire. Mendeleev also did it.


          Mikhail Lomonosov was born in the village of Mishaninskaya, Arkhangelsk province. My father owned a small ship, which transported public and private cargo, fished and hunted.
          Igor Sikorsky was born on May 25.05, 1889 in the city of Kiev. He was the son of a famous psychiatrist, a professor at Kiev University.
          Mendeleev was born on January 27.01.1834, XNUMX in Tobolsk into the family of Ivan Pavlovich Mendeleev, who at that time held the position of director of the Tobolsk gymnasium and schools of the Tobolsk district.
          At that time there were ordinary people who achieved heights, but under the USSR, it was massive. Take the story of your grandfathers.
          1. savage1976
            savage1976 17 February 2021 11: 21
            +1
            Maybe this has become widespread because society has developed enough, science and technology have reached high peaks and there is an opportunity to free up forces, time and resources, and not because the party of Lenin, the strength of the people, leads us to the triumphs of communism. These processes took place all over the world, and not exclusively on the ruins of the RI.
            1. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 17 February 2021 11: 25
              +2
              Quote: savage1976
              Maybe it became widespread because society has developed enough, science and technology have reached high peaks

              You are right here, only who created such a state where both science and technology could develop.
              1. savage1976
                savage1976 17 February 2021 11: 44
                +2
                Surprisingly, all developed countries of that time from the USA, England, Germany, etc. to RI.

                "Georgy Zhukov was born in the village of Strelkovka, Maloyaroslavets district, Kaluga province, in the family of a peasant Konstantin Artemyevich Zhukov (1844-1921, Russian [5]).

                After finishing three classes of a parish school in the neighboring village of Velichkovo in the summer of 1908, "his mother arranged for George to study" with her brother Mikhail Pilikhin, a furrier and owner of a small furrier's workshop in Moscow. "

                It turns out that during the tsarist era, peasant children received education in the villages.

                Rokosovsky is from a family of a Polish noble (in Russian noble) family, so not only the peasants and workers created the country. And what would a country be without a revolution, alas, we cannot find out. But for some reason, in the last 35 years of tsarist power in RI, as many people were born as in 70 years of Soviet power. And this is in a backward agrarian country with a poor, illiterate population. And the backward agrarian country turns out to be the first in the world to create an esuadril of bombers, to build a railway from Moscow to Vladivostok with horses and a pickaxe in 25 years, lagged behind the world's first hydroelectric power plant by only 10 years, built its own and at the same time on its own and created its own turbines ... And the vacation pensions and maternity pensions were not invented by the Bolsheviks, but by surprisingly capitalist Germany at the end of the 19th century. For some reason, everyone who develops evolutionarily lives better and does not spit in their history than countries where revolutions are arranged 2 times per century and where each new ruler comes to power as a result of a coup and tries to cheat on his predecessor.
                And all the tsars and Stalin and Khrushchev and Brezhnev and Gorbachev and Yeltsin are our former leaders, someone did better, someone did worse, each gave something of his own good and positive, and one cannot write them exclusively as traitors to the other as creators , all have their pros and cons.
                1. tihonmarine
                  tihonmarine 17 February 2021 13: 08
                  +1
                  Quote: savage1976
                  And the backward agrarian country turns out to be the first in the world to create an esuadril of bombers, to build a railway from Moscow to Vladivostok with horses and a pickaxe in 25 years,

                  The people were so hard-working, and the rulers gave all the oil and coal mining to gold mines, like the famous Lensky mine, mining, and the famous Swede, the creator of dynamite, also had a good family business in Russia. But the people of Russia, who were mostly peasant, were left with a plow, kvass and a crumb of black bread. If the people lived well, they would not have followed the Bolsheviks. History cannot be fooled. Now we all live under capitalism, but I don't see many satisfied people.
                  1. savage1976
                    savage1976 17 February 2021 13: 20
                    +1
                    Yes, only everyone (almost) who now lives under capitalism do not know how to live under it, they are used to living when the party decides for them how and what. Only now there are first-borns born in the 90s and who understand how to live. You can't throw yourself out of the fire and into the fire constantly out of boredom. Nothing good will come of it.
                    1. tihonmarine
                      tihonmarine 17 February 2021 13: 37
                      -1
                      Quote: savage1976
                      You can't throw yourself out of the fire and into the fire constantly out of boredom. Nothing good will come of it.

                      This is also true.
                    2. Fat
                      Fat 17 February 2021 16: 20
                      -1
                      50 on 50 laughing 100 percent of the population of the former USSR knows how to live by deceiving state structures. The 80-ton survivors understood how to survive. This generation is considered lost. However, there are a lot of intelligent people among them. Those born in the late 90s, XNUMXs, are their children ... Very very good growth. yes
                2. Foul skeptic
                  Foul skeptic 17 February 2021 14: 13
                  0
                  But for some reason, in the last 35 years of tsarist power in RI, as many people were born as in 70 years of Soviet power. And this is in a backward agrarian country with a poor, illiterate population.

                  The second sentence is the answer to the first sentence.
                  only 10 years behind the world's first hydroelectric power plant, built its own and at the same time on its own and created its own turbines for it.

                  You are a homemade product with 272 hp. comparing with a 50 hp hydroelectric power plant? Interesting approach. A comparable power plant in Russia appeared only in 000.
                  1. savage1976
                    savage1976 17 February 2021 14: 24
                    +1
                    Edison's first hydroelectric power plant for lighting purposes, Vulcan Street, began operation on September 30, 1882, in Appleton, Wisconsin, USA, and produced about 12,5 kilowatts of power. And that's 50000 liters. FROM.?

                    It is believed that the first hydroelectric power station in Russia was the Berezovskaya (Zyryanovskaya) hydroelectric power station (now the territory of the Republic of Kazakhstan), built in Rudny Altai on the Berezovka river (a tributary of the Bukhtarma river) in 1892. It was a four-turbine, with a total capacity of 200 kW and was intended to provide electricity for mine drainage from the Zyryanovsky mine. [6] The first industrial hydroelectric power station in Russia was the Bely Ugol HPP in Essentuki, built in 1903 (Bely Ugol HPP).

                    The Nygrinskaya HPP, which appeared in the Irkutsk province on the Nygri river (a tributary of the Vachi river) in 1896, also claims the role of the first. The power plant equipment consisted of two turbines with a common horizontal shaft that rotated three dynamos with a power of 100 kW each.

                    So which one is homemade? 12.5 kW or 200?
                    1. Foul skeptic
                      Foul skeptic 17 February 2021 15: 00
                      0
                      Association "Hydropower of Russia"
                      In 1853, Niagara Falls Hydrolic Power and Management Company in the United States received its first license and in 1860 began construction of a canal on the Niagara River. The 35 feet (11 m) wide and 8 feet (2,4 m) deep canal was completed in 1861, and in 1875, the power plant went into operation. However, the hydraulic plant was producing very little power since the beginning of the era of electricity. In 1877, the canal and the company were acquired by Jacob Schoellkopf, a successful businessman who managed to find new customers for the hydraulic unit in several factories. Moreover, in 1882, he adapted an electric generator to one of the water wheels, which powered 16 lighting lamps. It was one of the first truly industrial hydropower plants in the world, with a capacity of 50 thousand liters. with., working at a head of 41,2 m. It was intended for power supply to Buffalo and worked until 1904. Here, a three-phase current system was implemented, and the transmission of electricity was carried out over a distance of 40 km.

                      Edison's first hydropower plant is not the first hydropower plant, it is Edison's first hydropower plant. Is the difference clear?
                    2. Foul skeptic
                      Foul skeptic 17 February 2021 15: 57
                      0
                      The Association "Hydroenergetics of Russia" turns out to be not careful with information. The Schoellkopf HPP on Niagara consisted of several stations. By the indicated year (1882), power station No. 1 had an electric capacity of 1800 hp. By 1898, power station No. 2 with 34 hp was added, in 000, station No. 1914a with 3 hp was added, in 130 - No. 000b with 1918 hp, by 3, No. 112c with 500 thousand hp was added. h.p.
                    3. savage1976
                      savage1976 17 February 2021 16: 30
                      +1
                      When you read, sometimes you need to think about what you have read, otherwise one was sealed and replication began. for 16 lighting lamps 50 liters. C. Or 000 megawatts. Is there a filament a couple of meters thick? It was only later, in 35, that it upset it to a large size and it became truly the first industrial one. So 1892 years after the first 10 kW and in Tsarist Russia were built megawatt.
                    4. Foul skeptic
                      Foul skeptic 17 February 2021 16: 57
                      -1
                      for 16 lighting lamps 50 l

                      This particular piece of text can be easily explained by the fact that 16 lamps are also only 16 lamps, the main load went to the factory needs, lighting is just an experiment, a nice bonus. And how many it went to factories - 50 thousand hp. or 1,8 thousand hp - this needs to be clarified additionally, which I actually did.
              2. savage1976
                savage1976 17 February 2021 14: 28
                +1
                So, modern education in the Russian Federation is much better than in the USSR, is giving birth even less?
                1. Foul skeptic
                  Foul skeptic 17 February 2021 15: 03
                  -1
                  Forgive me for the immodest question, did you get an education in the USSR or the Russian Federation?
                2. savage1976
                  savage1976 17 February 2021 16: 31
                  -1
                  So this reproduction depends on your education, so you can answer the question, did you study, or did you pull the girls by their pigtails.
                3. Foul skeptic
                  Foul skeptic 17 February 2021 16: 58
                  +1
                  So, your reproduction depends on education

                  Not reproduction, but fertility. Yes, fertility depends on the level of education. But this makes it even stronger
                  backward agrarian country

                  It depends
                4. savage1976
                  savage1976 18 February 2021 01: 22
                  0
                  So now education is the best in history and everyone in Russia is getting decent salaries and is happy, the birth rate is the lowest in history. But why is it always about low wages, the decline of education?
                5. Foul skeptic
                  Foul skeptic 18 February 2021 08: 40
                  0
                  Your logic is discouraging.
                  1) why did you suddenly identify the considered pair "birth rate - education level" with salary and happiness?
                  2) why, when considering the issue with the birth rate, do you establish a connection only with the level of education? If fertility also depends on other reasons.
                6. savage1976
                  savage1976 19 February 2021 12: 30
                  +1
                  1. 2. This connection was established by you, I just voiced a question.
                  "But for some reason, in the last 35 years of tsarist power in Ingushetia, as many people were born as in 70 years of Soviet power. And this is in a backward agrarian country with a poor, illiterate population."
                  Your message - "The second sentence is the answer to the first sentence."
                  So this is your logic and the opposite follows from it, now the low birth rate is due to the fact that we have a highly educated and rich population in our country.
      2. Fat
        Fat 17 February 2021 16: 46
        +2
        Higher education is undoubtedly much worse. Now everyone scolds the exam, but in the Kostroma region this method was introduced several years earlier (experiment). The daughter passed ... and even with one "hundredth" ... I will not undertake to judge which is better. Old knowledge control system (Soviet), or new. In any case, a smart young man is never hindered.
        Oh yeah, in fact. Secondary education has gotten better, and "regional higher education" has practically degenerated, you can call yourself a university a thousand times, "but without a decent professorship - all this is fiction. recourse
      3. Aviator_
        Aviator_ 17 February 2021 19: 27
        +2
        Oh yes, in fact. Secondary education got better

        For more than 25 years I have been reading a course in general physics at the Moscow Aviation Institute, and I also teach preparatory courses at the institute. The level of schoolchildren is steadily declining. Now, in the preparatory courses, I have to explain, in addition to physics, actions with fractions. This was not required 20 years ago. Apparently the Soviet teachers died out.
      4. Fat
        Fat 17 February 2021 19: 46
        +3
        No, the teachers are not extinct. The attitude of pupils to basic subjects has died. I tried to teach my "Padawan" for 3 years to solve quadratic equations, remembered everything possible, right down to verses about Vieta's theorem, the result was zero. He rules office equipment much better than many ... But discrimination is beyond his understanding for him. Quack! request
      5. Aviator_
        Aviator_ 17 February 2021 19: 57
        +1
        He drives office equipment much better than many ...

        This is bad. This is also the case with my relatives. "Steering" in a computer is usually limited to knowing a series of instructions for pressing the keyboard without mastering any fundamental system principles. The Unified State Exam is also pressing the keyboard, there are decent tasks only in the "C" point, and even then a little. Now it is impossible to refuse the USE because there is no one to control it in the old way, and the USE allows you to quickly control the correctness of pressing. A student who knows the physics of the Unified State Exam will write excellently, but it is not a fact that the one who has written the Unified State Exam perfectly knows physics.
      6. Fat
        Fat 17 February 2021 20: 10
        +2
        Is not a fact. The attitude of the student to the subject is very important. We were sentenced to 1000 integrals as a "fine." They even learned, no one even took a steam bath on the exam. Basic skills have shifted ... and not always in the right direction ... request
      7. Aviator_
        Aviator_ 17 February 2021 21: 23
        +3
        We were sentenced to 1000 integrals as a "fine".

        An interesting technique. The result is predictable - after such "training" the unfortunate person will solve integrals of these types in 5 -10 seconds, but after a month's break (studying other topics) he will completely forget everything. And of course, this is the main thing about the student's interest. So I tell my boobies that I will recruit employees among them (I teach part-time), and that I don’t need ignoramuses. In short, I try to interest them with my themes. Sometimes it works.
      8. Fat
        Fat 17 February 2021 22: 29
        0
        Try to get on a bicycle, after "20 years of break" - in 3 minutes you will fit into the gate. It's not about knowledge, but about skills, about what is in the subcortex - automatically, which, in theory, the school should give. It is impossible without training. Surprisingly, many smart young people "torture" themselves with training. Seeing the problem, they themselves look for solutions. I saw it, it makes me happy ...
        Of my relatives there is one comrade, he multiplies three-digit numbers, in his mind, and rarely makes mistakes - a skill ... Of course, this is a rarity, but there is.
      9. Aviator_
        Aviator_ 17 February 2021 22: 53
        +1
        Seeing the task, they are looking for solutions themselves.

        This is really a search for a solution, and solving 1000 integrals of the same type is something different, not related to learning.
      10. Fat
        Fat 17 February 2021 23: 25
        +1
        Table, training, generalization, simplification, search for formalization of an example, do not flatter yourself and me. It's complicated. Disciplines and teaches hard work undoubtedly.
        But getting out of the "routine" is really cool!
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 17 February 2021 23: 59
    +3
    To be honest, for the son of a tenth grader I think about MAI. In informatics - prize-winner in the district. In mathematics - stunned.

    I was calmer with the elders.
    And the middle generation chose a technical orientation, in which it is incompetent.
  • Aviator_
    Aviator_ 18 February 2021 07: 54
    +2
    To be honest, for the son of a tenth grader I think about MAI. In informatics - prize-winner in the district. In mathematics - stunned.

    Probably out of luck with the math teacher. But there is still no escape from mathematics at MAI, so let him master it. And physics too.
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 18 February 2021 10: 17
    +3
    Yes. There was a misunderstanding with the classroom - the math teacher. But that doesn't justify him.

    Now the class is math - trying to catch up.
  • Sergej1972
    Sergej1972 18 February 2021 10: 39
    0
    There are a lot of 70-80-year-old professors and associate professors in provincial universities. They already taught 30-40 years ago. Of course, the massive transformation of institutions into universities and a sharp increase in enrollment in these universities were artificial. And the widespread creation of law schools discredited and devalued higher legal education. And so, now it is much easier to enter the majority of both regional and capital universities, even for a budgetary place, than 30-40 years ago. The number of budget-funded places in Russian universities exceeds the number of places for admission to RSFSR universities.
  • Aviator_
    Aviator_ 18 February 2021 18: 31
    0
    The number of budget-funded places in Russian universities exceeds the number of places for admission to RSFSR universities.

    To this, there would also be jobs in the same amount, so it would be quite an idyll.
  • Sergej1972
    Sergej1972 19 February 2021 09: 15
    +1
    This is yes. But, talking with many students in the humanities, you come to the "surprising" conclusion that many initially do not intend to work in the specialty for which they receive their diploma. After the bachelor's degree, they often choose another direction of the master's degree. And many go to study to be philosophers, sociologists, etc., knowing full well that a large number of such specialists are not needed. Obviously, some of them get higher education "for general development". Or because in some structures it is customary to recruit people with a diploma, and it does not matter what specialty. Why was the higher education system inflated in the late 90s and early XNUMXs? So that in conditions of unemployment, young people do not do anything in vain and at least get an education and be under some control. And to some extent, in this way, they also achieved some loyalty from the teaching staff.
  • Aviator_
    Aviator_ 19 February 2021 17: 46
    0
    I believe that the surplus of people with higher education began to do since the 60s. The graduate was sent to work according to distribution, in many cases he worked for 3 years and went somewhere to get a job on his own, not the fact that in his specialty. And the most cleverly done managed to escape almost on the second day. An example is the pop singer Maya Kristallinskaya, who, after graduating from the Moscow Aviation Institute and distribution to Novosibirsk, instantly disappeared from there. But at least this one became a singer.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Foul skeptic
    Foul skeptic 17 February 2021 15: 39
    -1
    created her own turbines for her

    Zyryanovskaya HPP was located in a small wooden building, had 4 turbines with a total capacity of 150 kW, and more precisely, not even turbines - the generators were connected directly to huge, 6 m in diameter, wooden water wheels.

  • Foul skeptic
    Foul skeptic 17 February 2021 15: 48
    0
    over the past 35 years of tsarist power in Ingushetia were born as many people as in 70 years of Soviet power.

    Do you refer to the number of the population or the number of births?
    1. savage1976
      savage1976 17 February 2021 16: 36
      -2
      1880, first census 82 million, 1916 181 million, 1991 293 million. So how many were born in the time interval?
      1. Foul skeptic
        Foul skeptic 17 February 2021 17: 04
        +2
        1880, first census of 82 million

        What kind of secret census is this?
        1916 million

        And have we had the USSR since 1916? And the USSR included Poland and Finland?
        So how many were born in the time interval?

        Unknown because fertility is not equal to natural increase.
      2. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 18 February 2021 10: 57
        0
        RI included a territory where about half of the population of Poland lived. Slightly more than 40% of the territory of the modern Republic of Poland. Don't forget that there were Polish territories in both Germany and Austria-Hungary. The Bukhara Emirate and the Khiva Khanate were vassals of the Republic of Ingushetia, their population was not taken into account when calculating the population. And during the Soviet era, their territories became part of our state, and the population began to be taken into account. Plus, they were not part of the Republic of Ingushetia, but were part of the USSR Eastern Galicia, Northern Bukovina, Transcarpathia, Klaipeda. I do not take into account the territories that became part of the USSR, but whose German and Japanese populations were displaced.
      3. Foul skeptic
        Foul skeptic 18 February 2021 11: 55
        0
        What's the point of all this commentary if it doesn't answer the question asked? Do you understand what you were asked about?
  • Kwas
    Kwas 18 February 2021 09: 37
    0
    Oh well! Take the United States, for example, there seems to be enough resources. But for some reason, the same families run there as they did a hundred years ago. And in other oligarchic countries as well. The possibilities of a social elevator are revealed only if it is bi-directional. And the oligarchy stands on the fact that it protects its power, and does not let outsiders into the narrow circle of rich majors.
  • tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 17 February 2021 10: 28
    +2
    Quote: savage1976
    Popov could?

    Yes, I forgot about Popov, who was the son of a priest, and graduated from the theological seminary with honors.
    1. savage1976
      savage1976 17 February 2021 11: 51
      -2
      It turns out that the priests not only taught to break the forehead in prayers, but also gave education to people and promoted science. Yes, within the framework of that worldview and world order.
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 17 February 2021 13: 09
        +2
        Quote: savage1976
        It turns out that the priests not only taught to break the forehead in prayers, but also gave education to people and promoted science.

        I do not argue that J.V. Stalin is a good example.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • savage1976
    savage1976 17 February 2021 12: 04
    +2
    They will not understand this. They already spat on history, now history spits at them. And they just wonder, "but what for us?"
    1. Squelcher
      Squelcher 17 February 2021 12: 16
      -1
      Neither add nor subtract. Bull's-eye.
    2. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 17 February 2021 13: 38
      +1
      Quote: savage1976
      They will not understand this. They already spat on history, now history spits at them. And they just wonder, "but what for us?"

      I don’t deny that it is.
  • nikvic46
    nikvic46 17 February 2021 06: 15
    +11
    We have poor coverage of the post-war period. Namely, he gave impetus to the development of the country. Literally in the five-year period, the national economy was restored, and this despite the fact that it was necessary to restore Ashgabat after a powerful earthquake. If we talk about a decrease in food prices, then this was not a fraction of a percent. And in 1953 the price for bread was set, which was in the following years, and at the same time the store shelves did not empty. It was only under Khrushchev that huge queues began for bread, sugar, and even for sunflower oil. And at the beginning of the 60s there was an increase in some products. How it happened that before Khrushchev, having no virgin lands, there was a decline in prices, and then there was a shortage ?
    1. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 17 February 2021 07: 45
      +4
      Quote: nikvic46
      We have poor coverage of the post-war period. Namely, he gave impetus to the development of the country.

      Little of. There is a clear contempt for historical figures in the country, whose deeds strengthened the statehood of the country and, on the contrary, lies pouring out of all the cracks about the great merits of Judas, traitors, enemies of the people and the state.
      1. Kwas
        Kwas 18 February 2021 09: 42
        0
        Moreover, the same applies to tsarist time. Monarchists, for example, are thrilled by Nicholas II, unlucky Peter III and Paul. And about Catherine II or Grozny - only nasty things.
    2. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 08: 19
      +1
      Quote: nikvic46
      How did it happen that before Khrushchev, without virgin lands, there was a decline in prices, and then there was a deficit?

      The artels baked a lot of bread.
      1. Gardamir
        Gardamir 17 February 2021 08: 47
        +4
        The artels baked a lot of bread.
        Little is known about the artel now. But once, the production of toys in the country was one hundred percent provided by artels. And there were many toys. In Leningrad, during the blockade, cartridges were produced by artels.
        We forget a lot of the country's history.
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 10: 34
          +2
          Quote: Gardamir
          Little is known about the artel now.

          And when Khrushchev dispersed the artels, the industry simply could not cope with baking bread for the entire population. Stupidly, the capacity was not enough.
          Quote: Gardamir
          But once, the production of toys in the country was one hundred percent provided by artels. And there were many toys.

          And they produced excellent products.
    3. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 17 February 2021 10: 37
      +3
      Quote: nikvic46
      How did it happen that before Khrushchev, without virgin lands, there was a decline in prices, and then there was a deficit?

      "Khrushchev was smart, only a smart man, he could leave Russia without bread." Winston Churchill.
      There was sugar, but in 1962 you had to stand behind bread (rye) from 6 in the morning to get your "ration of 500 grams". He studied in the regional center of the Smolensk region, his mother for 6 days gave 6 pieces of 100 grams of meat, 300 grams of lard, a bucket of potatoes and 1 ruble for sugar and bread. I remember Khrushchev with a "good" word.
  • Plastmaster
    Plastmaster 17 February 2021 06: 40
    +2
    Here is Khrushch himself, an amazing little man. To stand next to the greatest person, organizer, lump. See how it works. And not to see how he himself is a slutty, crafty, authentic Khrushchev. So he took revenge. But I can't understand how Stalin himself trusted him.
    1. oracul
      oracul 17 February 2021 07: 22
      +4
      I think that Stalin did not fully trust him, but used him to solve tactical problems, so he never considered him as a possible successor. The decisions of the Х1Х Congress are evidence of this. Khrushchev was saved by the death of the leader, she interrupted the implementation of his plan.
    2. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 17 February 2021 07: 51
      -4
      Quote: Plastmaster
      But I can't understand how Stalin himself trusted him.

      Quote: oracul
      I think that Stalin did not fully trust him, but used him to solve tactical problems

      You know, sometimes great rulers kept jesters with them so that those around them could notice the difference against the background of these clowns.
    3. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 17 February 2021 10: 40
      +1
      Quote: Plastmaster
      And not to see how he himself is a slutty, crafty, authentic Khrushchev.

      It is always and everywhere like that, all these "shabby" people pretend to be Napoleons. Smart people are their enemies.
  • Olgovich
    Olgovich 17 February 2021 06: 49
    +1
    Chirchev first eliminated his main competitor - L. Beria


    he was removed by ALL the faithful Stalinists Molotov, Malenkrv, Kaganovich, Voroshilov, etc.
    For example, the Voroshilov, Chairman of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR:
    Comrade Malenkov's report, the speeches of the members of the Presidium and the Central Committee quite fully revealed the whole the criminal abomination of the traitor Beria, gave an exhaustive and vivid description of this criminal adventurer. ...

    Beria is a type of an insidious, cunning enemy, a type of a complete adventurer, an intriguer, who knew how to deftly enter into the confidence of the leader, who knew how to hide his vile designs for a long time
    yes
    They later condemned the personality cult at the 20th Congress. Molotov:
    Supported by the whole party, the Central Committee stood firm against the cult of personality, alien to Marxism-Leninism, which played such a negative role in a certain period.


    Then during the night they carried out Stalin's body, and ... nothing. demolished all the monuments, and again .... nothing.

    only the Georgians, who were given heaven on earth (they consumed five times more than they produced) gurgled.

    Joseph Vissarionovich recreated the Russian Empire. He returned many of the lost lands to her - the Baltics, Vyborg, Western Belarus and Ukraine, Moldova, Bukovina, Southern Sakhalin and the Kuriles.


    exactly: were cut off from RUSSIA 4 million km2 by 1940, baking from its territory. like hotcakes. all new sovereigns state -KSSR, KFSSR, etc.

    Precisely chopped into 1917-1940 r border of the 17th century Russia and has today.

    The Russian "unpromising" village was destroyed, the Great Russian central provinces-regions were bled. That laid a powerful "mine" under the demography of the Russian state.

    Yes, to 1953 year, the village lay in complete ruin, tortured by wild taxes and monetary taxes, practically free work, lack of rights and inequality with the city in everything
    recreated the Russian Empire.

    in a sense, yes: just in 40 years after 1913, as a result of many decades of heroic struggle, finally was caught up consumption of food, clothing, housing in cities level 1913
    the main path of Russia and all mankind is to the stars.

    1952, head of the Central Committee Commission on checking the food situation, Secretary of the Central Committee, A. B. Aristov,
    “I was in Ryazan. - What's there? Interruptions? - No, I say, Comrade. Stalin, no interruptions, but for a long time there has been no bread, no butter, no sausage. He stood in line with Larionov at 6-7 am, checked. No bread anywhere.
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 12: 23
      0
      Quote: Olgovich
      He stood in line with Larionov at 6-7 am, checked. There is no bread anywhere.

      Well, Larionov took up agriculture. As a result, he shot himself. It got to the point that trucks with Ryazan plates were not allowed to enter neighboring regions, police cordons were standing. And the Ryazan militia stole cows from the villagers.
  • aars
    aars 17 February 2021 06: 49
    +7
    who, apparently, was simply killed during the arrest.
    I didn't read further!
    The author is generally aware that the trial was ?!
    There are testimonies written by Beria with his own hand, etc. etc.
    What kind of scribbling in general, a fairy tale tunnels?
    1. Aviator_
      Aviator_ 17 February 2021 08: 10
      -1
      the court was ?!
      There are testimonies written by Beria with his own hand, etc. etc.

      From this place in more detail, pzhlst. Court materials, Beria's testimony on it. Brad G.K. Zhukov from "Memories and Reflections" should not be offered.
      1. aars
        aars 17 February 2021 08: 20
        +3
        "Protocol of interrogation of the arrested L. P. Beria dated July 14, 1953" - http://istmat.info/node/22175
        1. Aviator_
          Aviator_ 17 February 2021 08: 36
          0
          Very interesting link. "Source: Politburo and Beria's case. Collection of documents - M.:, 2012. S. 98-106" It is especially amusing how Beria, in the midst of work on the atomic project, (1949) was having fun with the young Drozdova. I would still like to see the scan. Although after the materials published by the prosecutor's office on the Katyn case, where the fate of captured Poles was decided on the letterhead of the CPSU Central Committee (long before the party was renamed) in 1940, belief in the authenticity of such documents, as well as in the super-eroticism of Lavrenty Pavlovich, fades somewhat.
        2. aleksejkabanets
          aleksejkabanets 17 February 2021 10: 00
          +2
          Quote: aars
          "Protocol of interrogation of the arrested L. P. Beria dated July 14, 1953" - http://istmat.info/node/22175

          There are no serious studies on Beria. Everything related to Beria is closed for study today. I do not know of a single, any serious, historian who is working on this topic today. Nor do I know any modern scientific works in this direction. I don’t remember now who said from the historians (Zhukov or Isaev) that the archives on Beria were closed. There is no point in your argument, for the lack of verifiable arguments on both sides. The topic of the arrest and murder of Beria is one of the most closed topics of that period. Today there is no intelligible data about where his remains are, as far as I know.
          1. Kwas
            Kwas 18 February 2021 09: 53
            0
            Don't you think that hiding evidence speaks for itself?
            1. aleksejkabanets
              aleksejkabanets 18 February 2021 10: 02
              0
              Quote: Kwas
              Don't you think that hiding evidence speaks for itself?

              It may be so, but it must be remembered that Beria was in charge, in the main, of extremely closed departments. It is difficult to say after how many years the secrecy label is removed from documents on foreign intelligence, for example, or counterintelligence. Although, of course, according to Beria and the modern authorities, there is something to hide.
        3. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 17 February 2021 13: 55
          0
          Quote: aars
          "Protocol of interrogation of the arrested L. P. Beria dated July 14, 1953" - http://istmat.info/node/22175

          I read it, not the original, the text was written on a computer, not on a typewriter.
          You can believe, you can not believe.
          1. Aviator_
            Aviator_ 17 February 2021 19: 33
            0
            You can believe, you can not believe.

            If a document (scan) is not presented, then there is nothing to talk about. Regarding faith - this is not here, this is to the church.
            1. tihonmarine
              tihonmarine 17 February 2021 21: 04
              +1
              Quote: Aviator_
              If a document (scan) is not presented, then there is nothing to talk about. Regarding faith - this is not here, this is to the church.

              I have not been to the church, but I have not seen a scan of the original on any site.
              1. Aviator_
                Aviator_ 17 February 2021 21: 15
                +2
                Here I am about the same. The terrible demonization of L.P. Beria, and the accusations are unfounded - well, he could not chase women in 1949, he was very seriously busy with the atomic project.
                1. tihonmarine
                  tihonmarine 18 February 2021 08: 52
                  +1
                  Quote: Aviator_
                  Moreover, the accusations are unfounded - well, he could not chase women in 1949, he was very seriously busy with the atomic project.

                  And how many other projects besides the nuclear one he was engaged in. Construction of the Murmansk-Bering Strait railway, the creation of missile weapons, the creation of jet aircraft and much more.
                  1. aleksejkabanets
                    aleksejkabanets 18 February 2021 10: 28
                    +1
                    Quote: tihonmarine
                    And how many other projects besides the nuclear one he was engaged in.

                    This is just the case when you can talk about an "effective manager".)))) I don’t even know how to measure his effectiveness in relation to today's balabols like Rogozin.
                    1. tihonmarine
                      tihonmarine 18 February 2021 11: 09
                      0
                      Quote: aleksejkabanets
                      I don’t even know how to measure its effectiveness, relative to today's balabols like Rogozin.

                      L.P. Beria, the most effective manager of the 20th century, and now only upstarts, from whom only a concussion of the air and the media, and things "the cat cried."
                  2. Aviator_
                    Aviator_ 18 February 2021 18: 34
                    +1
                    And how many other projects besides the nuclear one he was engaged in. Construction of the Murmansk-Bering Strait railway, the creation of missile weapons, the creation of jet aircraft and much more.

                    Everything was built in spite of Stalin and Beria, and they only interfered. Any liberast will confirm this to you.
                    1. tihonmarine
                      tihonmarine 18 February 2021 20: 41
                      +1
                      Quote: Aviator_
                      Everything was built in spite of Stalin and Beria, and they only interfered. Any liberast will confirm this to you.

                      Here you noticed it very subtly.
        4. Kwas
          Kwas 18 February 2021 09: 50
          +1
          Dear, do not you think that
          Quote: aars
          "Protocol of interrogation of the arrested L. P. Beria dated July 14, 1953" - http://istmat.info/node/22175
          , which are easy to forge, and "testimony written by Beria with his own hand" are slightly different concepts?
    2. unaha
      unaha 17 February 2021 08: 36
      +1
      "What kind of scribbling in general, the tale of the tunnels?" - no, fantasy is an alternative history.
    3. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 17 February 2021 10: 45
      +3
      Quote: aars
      The author is generally aware that the trial was ?!
      There are testimonies written by Beria with his own hand, etc. etc.

      Maybe there were testimonies signed by Beria's hand, only there are no such testimonies in the open press and the media, with the conclusions of graphologists experts.
      The dark personality Khrushchev was on the dirty trick.
  • smaug78
    smaug78 17 February 2021 07: 50
    +5
    Another portion of lies and half-truths from Samsonov. Hooray patriots create their myths, the example of the USSR taught them nothing. And then they will be surprised at the new Rezuns, Solonins and others ...
    1. unaha
      unaha 17 February 2021 08: 39
      -1
      "Hooray patriots create their myths, the example of the USSR did not teach them anything" - these are not even hooray patriots, more like a sect of witnesses of Stalinism.
      Well, “the example of the USSR did not teach them anything,” so how many years have passed ... Facts are forgotten, myths come to the fore. And myths, however, cannot in any way correlate with the current reality.
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 17 February 2021 13: 56
        -1
        Quote: unaha
        And myths, however, cannot in any way correlate with the current reality.

        Myth is a forgotten past.
        1. smaug78
          smaug78 17 February 2021 15: 31
          +1
          Quote: tihonmarine
          Quote: unaha
          And myths, however, cannot in any way correlate with the current reality.

          Myth is a forgotten past.
          12 exploits of Hercules, for example laughing
  • rocket757
    rocket757 17 February 2021 07: 52
    +1
    Again, "break spears" on .... an endless topic?
    You can look back, but it NOW will help us little to build OUR future, but to delay the process, smear and quarrel with everyone, it's easy.
    1. aleksejkabanets
      aleksejkabanets 17 February 2021 10: 10
      0
      Quote: rocket757
      But to delay the process, smear and quarrel with everyone, it's easy.

      Do you think we are all united? With whom should I be reconciled? With those who stole my homeland, who shoveled, as a result of criminal privatization, the people's goods in their pockets? With these, what should I unite with? Or with those clowns who are telling tales about the "bloody totalitarian scoop"? I remember that time. I am aware of my class interests. There has never been and never will be any association with them. Unification like Italy, the times of Mussolini or Nazi Germany does not suit me.
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 17 February 2021 11: 59
        -1
        Quote: aleksejkabanets
        Do you think we are all united?

        Including because they pull us to delve into our past and repent, instead of getting down to business and starting to move forward.
        Quote: aleksejkabanets
        With whom should I be reconciled?

        Get busy and go ahead. To whom and how did digging / splitting / burying "graves" help? We sho, everyone in the "criminologists" enroll?
        Do what you think you need to do ... for example, return the people's property to the PEOPLE!
        And all there, it's not me ... fu fu fu.
        We just found a reason NOT TO DO ANYTHING.
        1. aleksejkabanets
          aleksejkabanets 17 February 2021 12: 11
          +1
          Quote: rocket757
          Get down to business, what you think, you need to do ... for example ...

          Yes, I do, of course. I just started my project.))))
          1. rocket757
            rocket757 17 February 2021 12: 19
            +1
            So that's good.
            We will do what we can ... things will get better sooner.
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 17 February 2021 14: 14
        +2
        Quote: aleksejkabanets
        Do you think we are all united?

  • Andrei Nikolaevich
    Andrei Nikolaevich 17 February 2021 08: 14
    +2
    In fact, all the following years after Stalin's death, our elite was engaged only in watering him with mud. Even the Marshal of Victory, Zhukov, could not resist political prostitution, also behaved ambiguously. In war, he was a commander; in politics, he remained a warrant officer of the tsarist army.
    1. bober1982
      bober1982 17 February 2021 08: 22
      +1
      Quote: Andrey Nikolaevich
      and remained the warrant officer of the tsarist army ..

      Zhukov was a non-commissioned officer of the tsarist army, not an ensign.
      1. Andrei Nikolaevich
        Andrei Nikolaevich 17 February 2021 09: 45
        +1
        Okay, sergeant. But I don't see much difference. Obviously not a student of the General Staff Academy
        1. bober1982
          bober1982 17 February 2021 09: 48
          +2
          Quote: Andrey Nikolaevich
          But I don't see much difference

          Not quite so, a warrant officer in the imperial army - an officer's rank, Zhukov was not an officer.
          1. Andrei Nikolaevich
            Andrei Nikolaevich 17 February 2021 10: 25
            +2
            Thanks for the clarification.
    2. Doctor
      Doctor 17 February 2021 09: 43
      +1
      In fact, all the following years after Stalin's death, our elite was engaged only in watering him with mud. Even the Marshal of Victory, Zhukov, could not resist political prostitution, also behaved ambiguously. In war, he was a commander; in politics, he remained a warrant officer of the tsarist army.

      Did the generalissimo even serve in the army?
      Ordinary at least ... wink
      1. Andrei Nikolaevich
        Andrei Nikolaevich 17 February 2021 10: 31
        +3
        The main thing is that the "Generalisimo" was such in politics. To manage the state is not to wave a sword. I have not yet heard about the commanders who have become strong politicians. With all due respect to the army, but "did not serve" is not an indicator in big politics. And the state, as an institution, is a complex and contradictory mechanism. On "equal to attention" - will not work.
        1. mat-vey
          mat-vey 17 February 2021 10: 34
          -1
          Quote: Andrey Nikolaevich
          With all due respect to the army, but "did not serve" is not an indicator in big politics.

          I don’t know how it’s like "I served, I did not serve," but I fought in civilian life.
          1. Andrei Nikolaevich
            Andrei Nikolaevich 17 February 2021 10: 40
            +3
            He fought. Even Tsaritsyn defended or stormed, I don't know for sure. But by and large, Iosif Visarionovich began his "path" in politics with elementary robberies in the spirit of our dashing 90s. And of course, the robbery was exclusively, "by conviction")
            1. mat-vey
              mat-vey 17 February 2021 10: 40
              +1
              Quote: Andrey Nikolaevich
              But by and large, Iosif Visarionovich began his "path" in politics with elementary robberies in the spirit of our dashing 90s.

              and it is possible without fairy tales eaten by moths?
              1. Andrei Nikolaevich
                Andrei Nikolaevich 17 February 2021 10: 46
                +4
                What "fairy tales" can there be? Or do you think that the Bolshevik party existed exclusively on the proceeds from the delivery of empty bottles and scrap metal?)))) Yes, and Ilyich, from Switzerland, did not climb out. And sincerely I spent time there, with Nadezhda Konstantinovna. He was also an esthete ....)))
                1. mat-vey
                  mat-vey 17 February 2021 10: 49
                  +1
                  Quote: Andrey Nikolaevich
                  What "fairy tales" can there be?

                  For example, about the "expropriator Stalin." The tsarist secret police did not find, the provisional government did not find ... Gebels did not find, but Ogonyok found ...
                  1. bober1982
                    bober1982 17 February 2021 11: 30
                    +1
                    Quote: mat-vey
                    For example, about the "expropriator Stalin"

                    At the V Congress of the RSDLP, which took place in London in 1907, "excesses" were legalized.
                    Stalin was a prominent figure in the expropriation of the expropriators, that is, he knew a lot about robberies and raids.
                    1. mat-vey
                      mat-vey 17 February 2021 12: 40
                      +1
                      Quote: bober1982
                      Stalin was a prominent figure in expropriation

                      Did he tell you personally?
                      1. bober1982
                        bober1982 17 February 2021 12: 56
                        -4
                        Quote: mat-vey
                        Did he tell you personally?

                        No, not him.
                        The funds of the bourgeois exploiting class were to be confiscated from them, for the needs of the revolution - that was the meaning of the decision of the London Congress on the resumption of robberies of banks and individual wealthy citizens. Prior to this decision, there was a temporary ban.
                        Lenin, like Stalin, were ardent supporters of such a resolution.
                      2. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 17 February 2021 12: 59
                        +1
                        Quote: bober1982
                        Lenin, like Stalin, were ardent supporters of such a resolution.

                        Well, will there be anything about the exes with Stalin? And that security department did not dig up anything ... maybe you did it ..
                      3. bober1982
                        bober1982 17 February 2021 13: 07
                        -3
                        Quote: mat-vey
                        And that security department didn't dig up anything.

                        The revolutionaries were financially supported, therefore they did not dig.
                      4. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 17 February 2021 13: 11
                        0
                        Quote: bober1982
                        The revolutionaries were financially supported, therefore they did not dig.

                        Yeah, right from 1908 ...
                        Although after that:
                        Quote: bober1982
                        The funds of the bourgeois exploiting class were to be confiscated from them, for the needs of the revolution - that was the meaning of the decision of the London Congress on the resumption of robberies of banks and individual wealthy citizens
      2. andrew42
        andrew42 17 February 2021 19: 33
        0
        The color of the assessment in relation to Stalin's actions in planning exs is not clear. However, not so long ago, a good half of the Perm Territory kept crossed fingers: "Run, Shurman, run" :)
    3. Doctor
      Doctor 17 February 2021 11: 34
      0
      I don’t know how it’s like "I served, I did not serve," but I fought in civilian life.

      Did you go on the attack with Budyonny?
      Or sitting in the RVS looking after Budyonny?

      In the Civil roots of all further Stalin's approach to the army.
      Stretch so far. wink
      1. mat-vey
        mat-vey 17 February 2021 12: 42
        0
        Quote: Arzt
        In the Civil roots of all further Stalin's approach to the army.

        For example?
        1. Doctor
          Doctor 17 February 2021 13: 35
          -1
          For example?

          The Bolsheviks and Stalin in particular, these are underground revolutionaries, and after coming to power, they largely retained a tendency to resolve issues, let's say, in a conspiratorial way.

          Cheka and its methods are organically natural for them, and the military environment looks dangerous.

          Hence the double control (special officers, commissars) over the army, which is getting stronger then weakening still exists.

          Usually the Chekists bankrupt, but after the wars, the army men rise, they can even sentence the People's Commissar of the State Security Service. wink

          During Yeltsin's time, Swans and Rokhlins appeared again, but Serdyukov cleaned them up.
          So it goes on ...
          1. mat-vey
            mat-vey 17 February 2021 13: 42
            0
            Quote: Arzt
            special officers

            Was it that intelligence-counterintelligence was absent in other armies?
            Quote: Arzt
            комиссары

            The regimental priest is the organizer of the spiritual, moral and patriotic education of the military personnel of the Russian army.
            1. Doctor
              Doctor 17 February 2021 13: 48
              0
              The regimental priest is the organizer of the spiritual, moral and patriotic education of the military personnel of the Russian army.

              Maybe. And the commissioner is the "overseer" who tracks loyalty first of all.

              Reread the episodes with Lvov (Mehlis) by Simonov "The Living and the Dead".
              His work is far from spirituality. laughing
              1. mat-vey
                mat-vey 17 February 2021 13: 49
                0
                Quote: Arzt
                Maybe. And the commissioner is the "overseer" who tracks loyalty first of all.

                Do you know when corporal punishment for not showing up for morning was canceled in the Russian army?
                1. Doctor
                  Doctor 17 February 2021 13: 53
                  0
                  Do you know when corporal punishment for not showing up for morning was canceled in the Russian army?

                  RIA has its own cockroaches, I admit it. It was a caste army.
                  But the officers took their word for it.
                2. mat-vey
                  mat-vey 17 February 2021 13: 56
                  -1
                  Quote: Arzt
                  But the officers took their word for it.

                  Then the order number 1 appeared, and although it was for Peter, he quickly fled throughout the army.
            2. Aviator_
              Aviator_ 17 February 2021 19: 42
              0
              Reread the episodes with Lvov (Mehlis) by Simonov "The Living and the Dead".

              Simonov is a good writer, but no more. "The Living and the Dead" is a highly artistic work of the Khrushchev period with all its attributes - the sitting Serpilin, etc. Similarly, Vasiliev's good fiction "The Dawns Here Are Quiet" is a typical adventure fantasy, as a squad of anti-aircraft gunners defeated German saboteurs.
              1. Doctor
                Doctor 17 February 2021 20: 11
                0
                Simonov is a good writer, but no more. "The Living and the Dead" is a highly artistic work of the Khrushchev period with all its attributes - the sitting Serpilin, etc. Similarly, Vasiliev's good fiction "The Dawns Here Are Quiet" is a typical adventure fantasy, as a squad of anti-aircraft gunners defeated German saboteurs.

                Well, did you communicate with the graduates of KVVPAU?
              2. Aviator_
                Aviator_ 17 February 2021 21: 17
                0
                More and more on the technical side, I did not communicate with political instructors with Kurgan, Simferopol, or Lviv. What does this have to do with the original question?
              3. Doctor
                Doctor 17 February 2021 21: 54
                -1
                More and more on the technical side, I did not communicate with political instructors with Kurgan, Simferopol, or Lviv. What does this have to do with the original question?

                Then you would get a personal impression of their working methods. laughing
      2. Doctor
        Doctor 17 February 2021 13: 50
        +1
        Was it that intelligence-counterintelligence was absent in other armies?

        There is everywhere. But there is no such purge.
        Starting to work with military experts (who were really difficult to trust), ours developed their own unique style.
        1. mat-vey
          mat-vey 17 February 2021 13: 54
          -1
          Quote: Arzt
          ours have developed their own unique style.

          What is it that could not do without counterintelligence-intelligence?
          1. Doctor
            Doctor 17 February 2021 14: 04
            0
            What is it that could not do without counterintelligence-intelligence?

            In total distrust.
            But I admit, for this there were (or maybe there are wink) grounds.

            The archers took Peter by the gills, generals Zubov and Benningsen strangled Paul with an officer's scarf, the Life Guards frightened Nicholas I on Senate Square, and General Ruzsky persuaded Nicholas II to abdicate. laughing
          2. mat-vey
            mat-vey 17 February 2021 14: 05
            -2
            Quote: Arzt
            In total distrust.

            And how is this confirmed?
          3. Doctor
            Doctor 17 February 2021 14: 12
            0
            And how is this confirmed?

            The military experts retained the power of the red. They were "thanked" by Kommunarka.
            In 1937 they continued. But when it got hot, many had to be returned to duty.

            I believe here, I don’t believe here ...
          4. mat-vey
            mat-vey 17 February 2021 14: 14
            -1
            Quote: Arzt
            The military experts retained the power of the red. They were "thanked" by Kommunarka.
            In 1937 they continued. But when it got hot, many had to be returned to duty.

            It's clear - again the slogans-myths.
            Soldier Tukhachevsky demanded just one hundred thousand tanks as the most advanced strategist.
            And what is interesting - the "cavalryman" Voroshilov smashed his tank bends (and artillery ones as well), but did not touch the chemical troops ..
          5. Doctor
            Doctor 17 February 2021 14: 21
            +1
            It's clear - again the slogans-myths.

            What is the myth?
            Have you ever studied the command structure of the Red Army of the Civilian era?
            Or do you also think that Army Commander Budyonny and Divisional Commander Chapaev won the Civil War?
            Do you know the commanders?
            You know for sure the Komfrotov of the Second World War, but in the Civil War who was the boss of Semyon Mikhailovich, do you remember? And who is the boss of the chief?

            I wrote a lot here in the comments on this topic with photos and biographies, look through.

            https://topwar.ru/173987-pervye-komandiry-krasnoj-armii-kto-gde-i-kak-obuchal-ih-voennomu-delu.html#comment-id-10677392
          6. mat-vey
            mat-vey 17 February 2021 14: 36
            -1
            Quote: Arzt
            Or do you also think that Army Commander Budyonny and Divisional Commander Chapaev won the Civil War?

            And where did I even hint about it?
            Quote: Arzt
            Have you ever studied the command structure of the Red Army of the Civilian era?

            So you think that it was not necessary to introduce the posts of commissars during the global political reorganization?
            Quote: Arzt
            You know for sure the Komfrotov of the Second World War, but in the Civil War who was the boss of Semyon Mikhailovich, do you remember? And who is the boss of the chief?

            And about Karbyshev and Shaposhnikov, what topic do you want to move on?
          7. Doctor
            Doctor 17 February 2021 14: 44
            0
            And about Karbyshev and Shaposhnikov, what topic do you want to move on?

            Yes, these are the ones who are heard!
            Almost the entire "RED" army is actually WHITE in terms of command structure.
            Officers and peasants fought against each other on both sides.
            But the Reds had a layer of "watching" from the Bolsheviks - the RVS.

            Check out my comments again in this thread
            https://topwar.ru/173987-pervye-komandiry-krasnoj-armii-kto-gde-i-kak-obuchal-ih-voennomu-delu.html#comment-id-10677392
          8. mat-vey
            mat-vey 17 February 2021 14: 48
            0
            Quote: Arzt
            Almost the entire "RED" army is actually WHITE in terms of command structure.

            Oh, how ... do you mean with a submachine gun any officer of the RI army in the "white" record?
            Quote: Arzt
            Officers and peasants fought against each other on both sides.
            But the Reds had a layer of "watching" from the Bolsheviks - the RVS.

            Once again - why shouldn't it be in the civil war? And it means that there was no need to look after the mobilized? And it means that White did not have any counter-intelligence ...
          9. Doctor
            Doctor 17 February 2021 14: 54
            +1
            Oh, how ... do you mean with a submachine gun any officer of the RI army in the "white" record?

            Of course not. Some really believed the Bolsheviks, some were forced, and some just decided to make money.

            But without the RVS whip, there would have been no Civil War.
          10. mat-vey
            mat-vey 17 February 2021 15: 01
            -1
            Quote: Arzt
            But without the RVS whip, there would have been no Civil War.

            What do you think has emerged ahead? Or do you think that the civil war in Russia began in the fall of 1918?
    4. Doctor
      Doctor 17 February 2021 14: 51
      -1
      So you think that it was not necessary to introduce the posts of commissars during the global political reorganization?

      Necessarily needed. Otherwise, there would have been no Civil War! laughing

      The spacecraft commander Kamenev would agree with Denikin, they are classmates, they graduated from one academy - Nikolaevskaya. wink
    5. mat-vey
      mat-vey 17 February 2021 14: 55
      -1
      Quote: Arzt
      Necessarily needed. Otherwise, there would have been no Civil War!

      And, so that's where the dog rummaged ... that's the reason for the civil ...
      Quote: Arzt
      Spacecraft commander Kamenev would agree with Denikin,

      Which one of them told you about it?
    6. Doctor
      Doctor 17 February 2021 15: 06
      +2
      Which one of them told you about it?

      In any case, I doubt that the commander of the Red Southern Front, General RIA Pavel Sytin, would have ordered the body of his Academy classmate Lavr Kornilov to be dug up, dragged and kicked around Krasnodar, and then chopped up with sabers and burned in the slaughterhouse. fool
    7. mat-vey
      mat-vey 17 February 2021 15: 17
      +1
      Quote: Arzt
      Which one of them told you about it?

      In any case, I doubt that the commander of the Red Southern Front, General RIA Pavel Sytin, would have ordered the body of his Academy classmate Lavr Kornilov to be dug up, dragged and kicked around Krasnodar, and then chopped up with sabers and burned in the slaughterhouse. fool

      L.GKornilov .... Date of death March 31 (April 13) 1918 (age 47)
      RVS Created on the basis of a resolution of the All-Russian Central Executive Committee, dated September 2, 1918, on the transformation of the Soviet Republic into a "military camp",
  • mat-vey
    mat-vey 17 February 2021 13: 59
    -1
    Quote: Arzt
    Starting to work with military experts

    On October 9 1942 of the Decree of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR “On the establishment of complete unity of command and the abolition of the institute of military commissars in the Red Army”, the institute of commissars was replaced by the institute of deputy commanders for political affairs (political officers).
    The zampolites did not have commissioner powers, their functions were limited to political work among the personnel. Organizationally, the political commander did not occupy a special position, being considered one of the deputy commanders and fully obeying him. For the most part, after the replacement of posts, the commissars of units and formations automatically became political officers. Those of them who had military ranks of political personnel were awarded general military ranks.
    1. Doctor
      Doctor 17 February 2021 16: 15
      +1
      On October 9 1942 of the Decree of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR “On the establishment of complete unity of command and the abolition of the institute of military commissars in the Red Army”, the institute of commissars was replaced by the institute of deputy commanders for political affairs (political officers).
      The zampolites did not have commissioner powers, their functions were limited to political work among the personnel. Organizationally, the political commander did not occupy a special position, being considered one of the deputy commanders and fully obeying him. For the most part, after the replacement of posts, the commissars of units and formations automatically became political officers. Those of them who had military ranks of political personnel were awarded general military ranks.

      Suvorov-Rezun put it more figuratively:

      But then the Red Army nevertheless reached Berlin! Correctly. Only without commissioners. They were canceled at the beginning of 1943. Politicians were introduced instead. How big is the difference? Great. The zampolit had no right to pry into operational plans. And the commissioner had... Some kind of no coincidence: the commissars were canceled, and after that there was not a single major retreat.

      But the loyalty control function remained. Zampolit is the eye of the party in the army. bully
    2. mat-vey
      mat-vey 17 February 2021 16: 23
      +1
      Quote: Arzt
      ... Some kind of no coincidence: the commissars were canceled, and after that there was not a single major retreat.

      Or maybe due to the fact that the production of "jackal aircraft" was stopped? Or "aggressor tanks" ended?
      Quote: Arzt
      But the loyalty control function remained. Zampolit is the eye of the party in the army.

      And maybe because of this, the Red Army still reached Berlin!
  • Sergej1972
    Sergej1972 18 February 2021 11: 32
    0
    In the 30s, it was often practiced to combine the functions of commander and commissar by one person.
  • mat-vey
    mat-vey 18 February 2021 12: 06
    0
    Quote: Sergej1972
    In the 30s, it was often practiced to combine the functions of commander and commissar by one person.

    And Arzt (Yuri) assures that without a look or how ...
  • Sergej1972
    Sergej1972 18 February 2021 14: 37
    0
    Partly the eye was on the line of political agencies, and on the line of special departments. The special departments were not looking after the commander, they had other functions. The posts of commander and commissar in units in the 30s. were combined if the commander was a party member with at least several years of experience. There have always been commissars under non-party commanders. As far as I know, in 1941-1942. combination was not practiced, regardless of the commander's party affiliation.
  • mat-vey
    mat-vey 18 February 2021 14: 46
    0
    Quote: Sergej1972
    The special departments were not looking after the commander, they had other functions.

    Is that what I said?
  • Sergej1972
    Sergej1972 19 February 2021 09: 02
    +1
    When we write comments, we not only respond to the interlocutor, but we expect other people to read them and receive information. We all have different levels of awareness on different issues. Therefore, sometimes you have to concretize something, chew.) Teaching habit.)
  • mat-vey
    mat-vey 19 February 2021 15: 36
    +1
    Quote: Sergej1972
    Therefore, sometimes you have to concretize something.

    But for that it's just a big .. no thanks a lot ..
  • Sergej1972
    Sergej1972 18 February 2021 11: 23
    +1
    In other armies, military counterintelligence is an integral part of them and is subordinate to the command of the armed forces.
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 18 February 2021 12: 15
      0
      Quote: Sergej1972
      In other armies, military counterintelligence is an integral part of them and is subordinate to the command of the armed forces.

      So in the USSR until the age of 38, the armed forces were territorial-militia ..
      1. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 18 February 2021 14: 19
        +2
        There were also cadre extraterritorial units, and their share was constantly increasing. The point is that, with the exception of the short period of existence of SMERSH NKO and SMERSH NK Navy, our military counterintelligence was not subordinate to the army command, but subordinate to the OGPU-NKVD-MGB-KGB-MBR-FSK-FSB. And its employees were precisely the employees of the special services.
      2. mat-vey
        mat-vey 18 February 2021 14: 20
        0
        Quote: Sergej1972
        ... And its employees were precisely the employees of the special services.

        So I'm talking about the same thing.
      3. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 18 February 2021 14: 29
        +1
        So in the armies of most countries there is no such thing. The army command fully controls the army counterintelligence and itself monitors the reliability of the military.
      4. mat-vey
        mat-vey 18 February 2021 14: 34
        0
        Quote: Sergej1972
        ... The army command fully controls the army counterintelligence and itself monitors the reliability of the military.

        So in RI like gendarmes were attracted?
      5. Doctor
        Doctor 23 February 2021 12: 16
        0

        In other armies, military counterintelligence is an integral part of them and is subordinate to the command of the armed forces.


        There were also cadre extraterritorial units, and their share was constantly increasing. The point is that, with the exception of the short period of existence of SMERSH NKO and SMERSH NK Navy, our military counterintelligence was not subordinate to the army command, but subordinate to the OGPU-NKVD-MGB-KGB-MBR-FSK-FSB. And its employees were precisely the employees of the special services.

        So in the armies of most countries there is no such thing. The army command fully controls the army counterintelligence and itself monitors the reliability of the military.

        Thanks. +++

        THIS IS THE KEY DIFFERENCE!

        I remember that in the 90s, with the reduction of the higher division, their KR department was transferred to our brigade. Instead of one special officer, there were 6!

        On the "registration" the brigade commander asked the question: "Are you yours or not yours?"

        Although there was not a single “blue-blooded” among them (all graduated from ordinary military schools and then moved to the Kyrgyz Republic), we did not receive an answer from “ours”. bully
  • Moskovit
    Moskovit 17 February 2021 08: 31
    +4
    I recognize the dear by ... Samsonov is recognized with his eyes closed. Whatever mistakes Khrushchev made, he appeared for a reason. Soviet society is tired of Stalin's harshness. People wanted to live for themselves.
    1. unaha
      unaha 17 February 2021 08: 42
      +1
      It is useless to explain that a society cannot live forever in a state of mobilization.
      1. mat-vey
        mat-vey 17 February 2021 09: 12
        +1
        Quote: unaha
        It is useless to explain that a society cannot live forever in a state of mobilization.

        Indeed, you cannot forever - "be patient", enter into position "and" tighten your belts "...
    2. Kwas
      Kwas 18 February 2021 10: 06
      +1
      One does not cancel the other.
      Quote: Moskovit
      People wanted to live for themselves.
      but at the same time the rotten part of the elite wanted power and impunity.
  • adler87
    adler87 17 February 2021 08: 40
    +2
    Some nonsense
  • Alexeevich0010
    Alexeevich0010 17 February 2021 09: 02
    +7
    Khrushchev is the only politician in human history who has declared war on the dead. But not only that - he managed to lose it. (C) Churchill
  • kytx
    kytx 17 February 2021 09: 22
    +3
    Become about nothing at all. If you are already voicing things that are obvious to everyone, then at least bother to back them up with some kind of texture, but it's just a set of signs and not an article. The author has spoken.
  • Deniska999
    Deniska999 17 February 2021 09: 28
    +3
    Russia is a counterattack country. A constant desire to go back in time to remake the present. Some are stuck in the tsarist era, others in the Soviet era, and the future is already coming around.
    1. andrew42
      andrew42 17 February 2021 19: 24
      0
      What do you want? Clear the cache and a clean slate? - So, without a thorough audit, it is impossible to build at least some minimally tenacious business plan. It is possible to draw "growth charts" to the public, but the result will be a guaranteed further decline. Therefore, there is an eternal war for rewriting history. - He who does not know the real past does not control the future.
    2. Kwas
      Kwas 18 February 2021 10: 08
      +1
      The point of studying history is precisely to take into account its lessons.
  • Andrey VOV
    Andrey VOV 17 February 2021 10: 13
    +3
    In his struggle for power, Khrushchev relied on the "fifth column", those who to some extent suffered from Stalin's policies. The unfinished and hidden Trotskyists, revolutionaries-internationalists, nationalists and just people with a philistine, petty-bourgeois psychology, the author, to confirm this thesis, well, at least a couple of three names?
    1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
      Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 17 February 2021 18: 03
      -1
      Quote: Andrey VOV
      In his struggle for power, Khrushchev relied on the "fifth column"

      yeah, twenty-fifth. Stop talking nonsense. What does the expression "fifth column" have to do with the internal party opposition?
  • evgen1221
    evgen1221 17 February 2021 10: 33
    +3
    Herr Samsonov. You have nothing more to write? Articles are the same on the same topics in slightly different words. I understand that of course you want to eat, but you also need to turn off the mad printer beforehand. However, it annoys me to read the same thing. Those heaps around, it is much easier to collect the information, but no, we go our own way to everyone who is already tired and dull.
    1. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
      Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 17 February 2021 12: 05
      +3
      Quote: evgen1221
      Articles are the same on the same topics in slightly different words.

      Artel "Samsonov" - this is the father of Zvezdoniy from "Moscow 2042" - "Stovo re-stars" - this is about him laughing
      An example of hypocritical tolerance - it pleases the Stalinists, and the monarchists, and the age-olds, and the companions, and the Vedic schizophrenics, and the Orthodox ascetics, and assorted esotericists for a tip from the VO box office. In a sober person, his dirtyness does not cause anything except disgust. The individual passages are of course just brilliant. laughing
  • Griol
    Griol 17 February 2021 11: 25
    -1
    Ask a psychiatrist of any country and any religion about how to characterize a person who, even with the best intentions, organized the extermination of millions of his citizens, he will answer that he is a maniac .. Ask the same question to the same lawyer, the answer will be expected - this is a criminal .. And as an example of imitation, he will tell you the name of Pol Pot. The peoples of our former country (USSR) went through the hardships of the civil war, which claimed tens of millions of lives, food appropriation, collectivization and famine that swept across the country. The construction of canals, repression, tens of millions of lives given up for the great Victory did not shake our people. In the first post-war years of hunger, even from beggarly salaries, people bought loan bonds, which the majority did not manage to sell .. They survived the "art" of N. Khrushchev, whose only positive step was to allow the issuance of passports to collective farmers on the anniversary of the liberation of peasants from serfdom in 1961, who lived up to that moment in the position of cattle - they were not given passports. This eased the lot of the villagers, but did not solve the problem of food production - not a single year of the existence of Soviet power was the collective farm system able to feed the country to its fill. Only the contracts concluded in 1961 for the purchase of meat and grain from the United States and Europe were able to protect the USSR from hunger in dry years and made it possible for a relative prosperity in Brezhnev's times. The exaggeration and glorification of the "sportsmen's best friend" is a spit on the grave mounds of the camp burials of tens of millions of Soviet people who became victims in a deadly rat internal party struggle for absolute power, for millions of victims in the first months of the Second World War. By 1991, the mediocre, corrupt, stealing party and state elite of the USSR finally destroyed the country, which had a territory equal to 1/6 of the Earth's territory, natural resources that no other country in the world had; destroyed the economy, industry, law enforcement agencies and the army. The most "loyal Leninists" plundered, distributed, sold all the wealth of the state, giving birth to a new class of "communists" - oligarchs .. And when you read about the "Stalinist economy" and the glorification of the one who organized the murder of millions, you begin to understand how far these people are from words "patriotism", "love for the people and pride for them."
    1. Kwas
      Kwas 18 February 2021 11: 08
      0
      Of course, it is useless to convince, but why not ask yourself the question: "Is it true what I truly believe in?" checking as far as possible both the opinion of others and his own.
  • Viktor Sergeev
    Viktor Sergeev 17 February 2021 13: 00
    +1
    Well, you painted a pancake. You should write love letters to stupid girls. Stalin simply made a state strictly controlled vertically, tied to one person, and this is what caused Khrushchev's rise. Stalin made one mistake: he did not shoot Khrushchev, on whose hands there are millions of lives.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • seacap
    seacap 17 February 2021 15: 42
    +1
    Quote: Dalny V
    I am afraid that without any denunciations there are a lot of candidates. You can start with the Russian Forbes list.

    Our staffing system of surrealist society is such that it is impossible to get on this list or take a decent post as an official, and in the upper echelon, and indeed to penetrate the upper nobility, without a decent "hook" for which you can be "hooked." The harder it is, the more you lose, the higher you will be "pulled up", periodically "shaking" so that they do not lose their shores and remember that you have something to lose and to whom you are obliged. Everything is according to the recruitment manual, so everywhere and as old as the world.
  • Vlad world
    Vlad world 17 February 2021 17: 14
    +1
    I read it. Yes. It is desirable for the author to know better the history of the USSR.
    1 Khrushchev, not by personal desire, bled the non-black earth lands, but continued the policy of Lenin, Trotsky-the Party to squeeze the juices out of the Russian people. Back in the 23rd year, a fund was created where part of the funds were deducted only from Russia and only "fraternal" peoples consumed from it. Tens of millions of gold rubles to feed the republics. Subsequently, 30% of Russia's income went only to the republics, not counting the budget of the USSR.
    2 The difference between Stalin and Khrushchev is not very big but fundamental. Stalin was a Technocrat and he didn't mind different colors of cats if they caught mice. Under Stalin there was private ownership of the means of production - except for heavy (large) industry in the form of artels, cooperatives. And this bow helped to achieve great growth. And Khrushchev was a Partocrat. And for him and further leaders, the main thing is the Color of the cat. Even if she doesn't catch mice. And he destroyed this link. And this contributed to the acceleration of the destruction of the USSR. Inevitable as the sunrise
    3 Khrushchev has blood on his hands up to the elbows. Fulfilled and overfulfilled plans for repression. And during the reign he was marked by executions and other things.
    But Stalin also crushed the slightest desire of the Russians for equality in the economic and political field of the USSR. The Leningrad case for 49 years. There was a little desire for equality, so the trial and execution after within an hour.
    4 But there are many monuments to Khrushchev - the Khrushchevs.
    Yes, and Stalin for the destruction of the congress of the winners and bringing the percentage of the leadership of the repressive bodies to the norm, a monument can be erected.
  • Shelest2000
    Shelest2000 17 February 2021 18: 23
    +2
    How a brave jackal bit a dead lion

    Now they bite too. It is enough to recall the statements about galoshes and that Stalin did not work well ...
  • andrew42
    andrew42 17 February 2021 19: 09
    +3
    It is worth recalling that references to memories of the Khrushchev "thaw" were one of the favorite polemical methods of the former communists-shape-shifters of the late 80s and "budding democrats." Even the odious Novodvorskaya (don't remember this devil by nightfall) a couple of times and half-grateful to the address of the "exposer of the bloody regime." Often this was pulled out of context in the style of "even Khrushchev ..." - like the most "positive" of the Communists, etc. So Nikita Sergeich even after his death managed to work for the collapse of the State of the Working People ..
  • andrew42
    andrew42 17 February 2021 19: 16
    +2
    In general, at the end of the 80s, there was a kind of promotion of the "positive role" of Khrushchev in the history of the country. - The second series of attribution of all significant Soviet achievements to Maize. Similarly, today they are trying to "revive" Andropov, who was not actually a Chekist, - he came to the Committee through the party line and immediately to the top (however, the cliché of the "Chekist" spread right up to kitchen conversations), and dragged the Gorbachev-Yakovlev gang, and I cleaned out all the "keepers". Today, from under the carpet, an idea has been launched to solder the Andropov monument on the site of the Dzerzhinsky monument. Times go by, the tricks are still the same.
  • dgonni
    dgonni 17 February 2021 19: 27
    -2
    Laugh or cry? What a damn problem!
    Under the dull Khrushche there was such a baida as raising the productivity of labor by 10% annually! The shooting in Novocherkassk is an example of this!
    Equalization came under the rule of Leonid Illich!
    And if the author does not understand this, then everything written a priori is not true.
    To understand the situation in the industry, it is enough to read Morozov, who was like the first in terms of tanks!
    Everything is described there!
    And he greeted the local type of industrial regional committee with two hands. For production issues were resolved with a crunch faster by 2 weeks than under Stalin.
    The fact that the Moscow elite did not want to change and ruined the union? This is not a crunchy!
    This is to Lena with friends!
    But Samsonov is in illusions, he did not read it, but I stop it!
  • Pushkar
    Pushkar 17 February 2021 20: 32
    -2
    The basis of Russia's current security is the Strategic Missile Forces. And Khrushchev created them. This article is a black and white vision of the world, welcome to the shining expanses of the past. Boring girls.
  • Unknown
    Unknown 17 February 2021 20: 41
    +3
    Judging by the article itself and the comments, the personality of I.V. Stalin gives no one rest. Everything intertwined into a big knot, however, fictions and of course myths launched not only by Khrushchev, but by a number of contemporaries of that time. But Comrade Stalin does not need any accusations or justification, because he was a person who will remain in history forever. The 20th century was rich in world upheavals that periodically shook the entire planet, here and WWII, WWII, VOR, and probably a dozen more local wars and revolutions. There was such a time, such were the leaders of countries, there were no others. Human life, in spite of all the slogans, was not appreciated, as it is now. According to historians at Harvard University, the twentieth century was the bloodiest in human history.

    During the First World War, from 9 to 15 million people died. One of the consequences of the war was the Spanish flu epidemic, which began in 1918.

    It was probably the deadliest pandemic in human history. Nowadays, it is believed that 20-50 million people have died from the "Spanish flu" around the world.

    World War II claimed an estimated 59 million lives.

    In addition, smaller scale military conflicts also carried death. In the 20th century, 16 conflicts were recorded, during which more than 1 million people died, 6 - with the death toll from 0.5 million to 1 million, and another 14, during which from 250 thousand to 0.5 million people died.

    Thus, from 167 million to 200 million people died as a result of organized violence: in fact, wars destroyed one out of every 22 inhabitants of the Earth. So I repeat, the time was hard. European countries. Excluding from the list, the USA, Canada and South American countries on the territory of which there were no hostilities. All of Europe took control of the agricultural market. For example, in that Britain, a farmer could not just slaughter cattle and sell on the market without informing the food control inspection, he was threatened with serious problems, including criminal ones. German prisoners of war worked in mines in Scotland until 1950. So it was in France, Germany and the Benelux countries. There were big problems in the countries of Eastern Europe. It was after the victory in the Second World War that the authority of the USSR rose in the world, and gave impetus to all national liberation movements, in Asia, Africa, and everything was associated with the name of Stalin. Do not touch our memory, do not say, but it is associated with his name.
  • SARANCHA1976
    SARANCHA1976 17 February 2021 23: 47
    +2
    At a reception at the American embassy, ​​the US ambassador boasted that they say they have a sorcerer in Alabama who picks up the dead.
    Present at the reception V.M. Molotov calmly noted that in the USSR there is a wonderful athlete who runs ahead of the plane.
    N.S. Khrushchev, having heard about this fact, called Molotov to him.
    - Why are you talking about it, Mikhalych? But how - they will demand to present a miracle athlete?
    “We will first demand that they present their necromancer.”
    - And if presented?
    - We demand verification, let it raise ... Stalin, for example.
    - Well, how, - will lift it?
    “Then you, Nikita, are not like a plane — you will overtake a rocket!”
  • Sergej1972
    Sergej1972 18 February 2021 08: 46
    0
    How many times can you write the same thing over and over again?
  • Mikhail3
    Mikhail3 18 February 2021 09: 17
    +2
    Then he sent Marshal Zhukov into disgrace, who had previously supported him shortsightedly.
    What a nice definition of Zhukov's actions. Zhukov and Khrushchev carried out a military coup. That is, Zhukov, Marshal of Victory, betrayed his country and his people. That's how it will be right, the author. And he, though not in the proper measure, overtook the fate of all traitors. Khrushchev threw him out like a pissing cat.
    What did he expect? That Khrushchev will rely on a traitor? Nonsense. You cannot lean on a traitor, he will betray again and again. In this regard, the behavior of our traitors is touching. They piously believe that they will be allowed into the countries in whose interests they are betraying, and there they will take a "worthy position." You have to be so stupid ...
  • nonsense
    nonsense 18 February 2021 13: 16
    0
    :) Ay-yya-yay, what a nEkhAroshy little boy this Khrushchev ... He broke and destroyed everything ... But only the entire Soviet people observed the opposite - they began to move from barracks to massively erected houses (apartments). The people (its main part) at least began to "discover" meat in stores - affordable meat (and not like under Stalin). - It's corn, probably, it's to blame ... Khrushchev is certainly not a man of great mind (that a do not blame me, I have a different essence), but it is simply not smart to hang anti-communism on him! A real communist! I especially liked this in this whole stream of consciousness:
    (C)
    "A huge loss was inflicted on the Armed Forces, the national economy, the Russian Church, which under Stalin was experiencing a period of revival. The Russian" unpromising "village was destroyed, the Great Russian central provinces-regions were bled. That laid a powerful" mine "under the demography of the Russian state."

    The "damage" to the armed forces, one must think, consisted in the reduction of an unnecessary huge army (which, anyway, was no longer capable of repeating its campaign to Europe - the conditions had changed), cutting into metal huge cruisers (which simply had nothing to refuel - Samatlor and other fields. not open, there is a fuel shortage in the country), rocketization (that is, giving hitherto unprecedented opportunities to defeat the enemy)? And the "damage" to the church apparently consisted in the fact that Khrushchev forced her to pay taxes on an equal basis with other organizations? (After which the parishes began to close massively). The defeat of the Russian countryside has been going on since the beginning of the 20th century (it began even under the tsar and his Stolypin) - under Khrushchev, this process simply accelerated once again (it was necessary to raise whole new industries - where else to get workers?)
    And you certainly shouldn't present Stalin as such a sinless and unmistakable "leader" - he has a lot of blunders ... Not to mention Stalin, a zealot of Russian culture and the Russian people ... It's funny ... stop repeating agitation.
    1. Kwas
      Kwas 18 February 2021 16: 33
      0
      About the damage to the military. The existing and explored deposits were enough to understand that one cannot deprive oneself of the future ocean-going fleet. Not enough fuel now - preserve it! But he screwed up. General rocketization (still very imperfect missiles) was due to proven barrel artillery systems. Everybody had mistakes, but he had so many of them, and so important that one involuntarily came to conclusions about sabotage. Take the farm. Destruction of MTS, the system of trusts / syndicates, self-financing. Confiscation of the property of industrial cooperatives, the system of economic councils, the ruin of collective farms by debt bondage, forgiveness of debts and encouragement of the worst. Ruin by taxes of individual farmers, artisans. etc...
      1. nonsense
        nonsense 18 February 2021 19: 44
        0
        :) Mothballing means ... Hefty two-hundred-meter ships? The cocoon method? - IMHO, we still do not own such technology (EMNIP is what the States did with their battleships in the 90s), and even more so in the 60s! Moreover, our climate is not American ... Could not have been able to save in general - and this conservation would have eaten big and regular money! IMHO sabotage was to keep these ships in service!
        Oh, what poor "individual farmers-handicraftsmen" - they were strangled with taxes! We did it right! We all know what happened in the 80s and 90s when taxes didn’t suffocate this scum! - Now this criminal bastard rules Russia (they quickly buried the USSR, they managed in five years ...)
        1. Kwas
          Kwas 19 February 2021 17: 22
          0
          Firstly, there are many conservation methods, including quite cheap ones, for the British, consider almost the entire fleet from WWII to WWII. And as for individual farmers - so before that, in the legal field of socialism, they worked and brought benefits, but when they were banned, they began to dream of capitalism, create underground workshops and buy stolen goods from state enterprises.
          1. nonsense
            nonsense 19 February 2021 17: 48
            -1
            EMNIP methods of conservation are only four. But apart from the aforementioned "cocoon", the others do not give a real effect with prolonged (more than a year) conservation. Especially in our climate (with frosts).
            PS: it would be nice to remember WHO gravitated towards the creation of these very underground workshops. - And these are mainly GEORGIANS (and Caucasians in general)! Relatives of the very ones whom Comrade Stalin and his colleagues a) brought into Russian cities from the Caucasus (solving the so-called personnel shortage); b) gave unprecedented freedoms and privileges in Georgia itself. They spawned CUMMONY here - so Khrushchev tried to fight this to the best of his understanding ...
  • yehat2
    yehat2 18 February 2021 13: 17
    +4
    Quote: seacap
    And Stalin did not create any new ideology.

    First, it was Stalin who officially denied Marx's incorrect conclusions about the inevitability of a world revolution. And he was a theoretician no less than Marx, making a significant development in what Marx invested in his "capital". In some places, Stalin had to correct Lenin as well.
  • Vladimir1155
    Vladimir1155 25 February 2021 10: 27
    +2
    I fully support the respected Alexander Samsonov