Military Review

Russia has created a composite wing box for a promising small aircraft

79
Russia has created a composite wing box for a promising small aircraft

It became known about the creation in Russia of a polymer demonstrator of the wing load-bearing structure for a 9-seater small aircraft aviation.


The design and creation of such a demonstrator for a promising aviation facility was carried out by TsAGI (Central Aerohydrodynamic Institute) specialists under a state contract with the Ministry of Industry and Trade of the Russian Federation. It was noted that the Chaplygin Aviation Research Institute was a co-executor.

The work was carried out within the framework of the program, which is designated by the code "MA 19-20". One of the main tasks during the work was the task of assessing the possibility of import substitution of materials necessary for the successful implementation of the project.

The press service of TsAGI reported that for these purposes more than 400 different samples (including structurally similar ones) were manufactured to obtain operational information about the strength characteristics. As noted, in the end, we came to the conclusion that the materials produced in Russia are not inferior to imported materials in their main parameters.

TsAGI adds that the obtained data on the strength of the samples formed the basis for the development of the structure, which includes spars, ribs and three-layer sheathing panels.

As a result, the spars were manufactured on the basis of the Siberian NIIA in autoclave molding, and the steel structural elements were manufactured directly at TsAGI using vacuum molding technology.

According to the head of the design and production department, Yuri Evdokimov, in the manufacture of a demonstrator of the strength structure of the wing of a small aircraft from domestic composite materials, such new solutions were applied as the use of the vacuum infusion method in the manufacture of the caisson panel (its span is about 5 m, the chord is about 1 m). This panel is an integral three-layer skin.

This year, the manufactured wing structure will undergo strength tests, so that, as a result, the correctness of the technological solutions used is confirmed.
Photos used:
TsAGI
79 comments
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  1. Aerodrome
    Aerodrome 3 February 2021 07: 06
    -8
    beautiful, what to say ... first revive the sea, PLO aircraft are needed as air.
    1. bar
      bar 3 February 2021 09: 41
      +5
      Give it all up and wait for PLO? Working in parallel is not an option at all? Maybe try it all the same? what
      1. novel66
        novel66 3 February 2021 09: 58
        +1
        analogues of An-2 are more important
  2. SAG
    SAG 3 February 2021 07: 06
    +11
    +1 positive news, for a good day good
    1. yehat2
      yehat2 3 February 2021 09: 40
      +14
      Quote: SAG
      +1 positive news, for a good day

      small aircraft need not a wing - this is the 10th case, but an inexpensive economical engine is needed.
      while it is not - even if you do miracles with wings, there will be no aviation.
      The second point is imported avionics. It also significantly increases the cost of the car.
      And the last point - fuel prices and incentives for small aircraft. Nowadays, small aviation is the most unprofitable type of transport aviation in terms of financial conditions. Check out how much it costs to just get to the airport and how you can recoup it.
      Next, departure clearance. You are never sure if you will receive it on time.
      And these are not all problems, so the positive news from the news is purely nominal.
      1. Souchastnik
        Souchastnik 3 February 2021 10: 12
        +3
        so the positive from the news is purely nominal

        Let me disagree. Figuratively, the lack of money for black caviar does not mean that one should give up black bread.
        But in essence: research is a necessary condition for the development of aviation, and for any field of activity. The lighter design will allow the use of less efficient engines available.
        1. yehat2
          yehat2 3 February 2021 10: 24
          +10
          new small-scale technologies are always expensive
          and our small aircraft already suffers from very high costs
          and I do not agree with you that small aircraft is for oligarchs.
          There are a bunch of other countries where the plane is at the level of a campervan. Also available.
      2. Intruder
        Intruder 3 February 2021 12: 23
        +4
        small aircraft need not a wing - this is the 10th case, but an inexpensive economical engine is needed.
        that's the truth, while this is tight and somehow suspiciously dull, as well as for a UAV, however !? recourse
        The second point is imported avionics.
        but here is generally an ambush, especially in the field of microelectronic components, when they are easy to define (if desired) as dual-use products and cut off supplies "because of the column" ...
        And the last point - fuel prices and incentives for small aircraft.
        better than private aviation, but with this there is a "plug" in the regulatory and legislative sphere, and the cost of aviation fuel types, in the absence of a sales market in private aviation, will always be monopoly high!
        Alas and ah ... No.
  3. Vladimir_2U
    Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 07: 14
    +1
    How expensive is such a wing than an aluminum one? Found the price of aluminum at $ 3. per kg, and the composite for Boeing-787 at 400 per kg. Especially aerodynamic and other characteristics are unimportant, the approximate pricing is just interesting.
    1. Jacket in stock
      Jacket in stock 3 February 2021 07: 31
      +16
      Quote: Vladimir_2U
      How expensive is such a wing than an aluminum one?

      It is correct to calculate the cost of the entire cycle.
      Not only manufacturing, but also exploitation.
      1. SovAr238A
        SovAr238A 3 February 2021 18: 20
        -1
        Quote: Jacket in stock
        Quote: Vladimir_2U
        How expensive is such a wing than an aluminum one?

        It is correct to calculate the cost of the entire cycle.
        Not only manufacturing, but also exploitation.


        And look also at the difference in the quality of operation and maintenance.
        If a modern airbus is a top-end newest bus, then a scanty plane is a cart.
        And he must be a cart.
        What would be in any kuruman - Uncle Fedor could fix it.
        And Grandpa Mazai, he could hang a patch for him.

        You just need to stupidly repeat the experience of Cessna, Beechcraft.
        Those who have hundreds of thousands of planes flying across Alaska, Canada, the States, South and Middle America.
        With a comparable level of service and maintainability.

        How will this composite wing be repaired when a Christmas tree with knots falls on a plane?
        And so in everything.
    2. nsm1
      nsm1 3 February 2021 07: 45
      +8
      At one time, an imported chisel was 10 times more expensive than ours, with a resistance of 1,5 times.
      But by reducing the number of trips and hoisting operations, the result was significant savings.

      And to calculate the price of a structure based only on the cost of the material is actually a strange idea.
      1. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 08: 11
        -1
        Quote: nsm1
        And to calculate the price of a structure based only on the cost of the material is actually a strange idea.
        The cost / efficiency parameter was not invented out of boredom. It is the price that interests me.
        1. Hagen
          Hagen 3 February 2021 08: 59
          +3
          Quote: Vladimir_2U
          It is the price that interests me.

          Price is a live function. What today can be prohibitively expensive, tomorrow, after the testing of the corresponding related technologies, can become several times cheaper and become a completely competitive and integral part of the design, and not only in aviation.
        2. Souchastnik
          Souchastnik 3 February 2021 10: 26
          +4
          It is the price that interests me.

          You have already been told above that the cost per kg of aluminum does not show the whole picture. Much depends on the technologies for making the sample: casting, milling, etc. In addition, it is important - you make one part in a single copy (using a file and sandpaper), or 10 parts (on a robotic conveyor).
          1. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 10: 33
            -1
            Quote: Souchastnik
            You have already been told above that the cost per kg of aluminum does not show the whole picture.
            I'll tell you more, even without any operations, a sheet, corner or plate of the same material at a price per kg. will be different. Is there anything to say about the composite?
      2. Hagen
        Hagen 3 February 2021 09: 13
        -1
        Quote: nsm1
        But by reducing the number of trips and hoisting operations, the result was significant savings.

        If it's not a secret, what deposit are you picking?
    3. Ka-52
      Ka-52 3 February 2021 08: 05
      +4
      How expensive is such a wing than an aluminum one?

      what does the price have to do with it? The main purpose of using the composite is to reduce the specific weight of the structure. Weight is the most serious sword of Damocles of designers since the days of the planes. Weight is a limitation on operational characteristics that have to be countered by the power of the power plant, an increase in the volume of fuel tanks, the dimension of the planes, etc.
      1. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 08: 09
        -5
        Quote: Ka-52
        what does the price have to do with it? The main purpose of using the composite is to reduce the specific weight of the structure.
        There is no need for common truths about weight, I am interested in the price per kg of composite.
        1. bar
          bar 3 February 2021 09: 45
          +4
          There is no need for common truths about weight, I am interested in the price per kg of composite.

          Interested in the price at the research stage? And exactly in foreign currency? Is it not an option to wait until at least small-scale production and from domestic components in rubles?
          1. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 10: 02
            -3
            Quote: bar
            Interested in the price at the research stage? And exactly in foreign currency? Is it not an option to wait until at least small-scale production and from domestic components in rubles?

            If you are so all smart, then give the cost of the black wing of ANY production aircraft, indicating the weight.
            1. bar
              bar 3 February 2021 10: 10
              +3
              At least I'm not trying to pretend to be smart. And I definitely cannot quote the cost of a composite wing of a serial Russian aircraft due to the lack of such. I also propose not to be clever and not to run in front of the locomotive, but at least to wait for the MC-21 to enter the series. And we'll see. In any case, R&D must continue. And to calculate the cost of samples in rubles / kg, produced within its framework, is simply stupid. There the main costs are in the brain, not in kilograms.
              1. Vladimir_2U
                Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 10: 17
                -4
                Quote: bar
                At least I'm not trying to pretend to be smart.
                I asked, and instead of answering you started to be clever.
                Quote: bar
                Interested in the price at the research stage? And exactly in foreign currency? Is it not an option to wait until at least small-scale production and from domestic components in rubles?
                And we are talking about ANY aircraft, not necessarily domestic. Once again, personally for you, 400 yusd per kg indicated a certain composite for 787.
                1. bar
                  bar 3 February 2021 10: 25
                  +1
                  Quote: Vladimir_2U
                  Once again, personally for you, 400 yusd per kg indicated a certain composite for 787.

                  Thanks a lot, but there was no need to worry. I don't need this figure at all, and it doesn't mean anything, absolutely. Boeing does not sell these wings or make them to order. Perhaps these are its internal prices, according to its internal accounting, which do not make any market sense.
        2. Ros 56
          Ros 56 3 February 2021 10: 01
          +4
          Actually, there are different composites. Your question is more like - how much is a kg. food.
          1. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 10: 05
            -4
            Quote: Ros 56
            Actually, there are different composites. Your question is more like - how much is a kg. food.
            We are talking about the composite for the wing, so more specifically? Do you have anything to say specifically, or are you being clever out of love for art?
            1. Ros 56
              Ros 56 3 February 2021 10: 10
              +6
              They also use different combinations of materials, and carbon fiber, and fiberglass, and Kevlar, and boletus, as on the same blades of helicopters. hi
              1. Vladimir_2U
                Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 10: 13
                -4
                Quote: Ros 56
                They also use different combinations of materials, and carbon fiber, and fiberglass, and Kevlar, and boletus, as on the same blades of helicopters
                Well then, give the average price, for 787 the price of a certain composite is indicated, it is possible that the average price is.
                1. Ros 56
                  Ros 56 3 February 2021 10: 22
                  +3
                  And how do I know, we worked with these materials back in the last century in the 80s. I don’t understand at all why they are presented as new items. They just didn't use it so widely, yes. Even ship modelers used fiberglass for ship hulls back in the 70s.
            2. Roman 57 rus
              Roman 57 rus 3 February 2021 11: 44
              +3
              Carbon fiber + compound 6000 r per kg.
              1. Vladimir_2U
                Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 11: 46
                +1
                Quote: Roman 57 rus
                Carbon fiber + compound 6000 r per kg.

                The only concrete comment so far. Thanks.
              2. Intruder
                Intruder 3 February 2021 12: 30
                +3
                multilayer plywood and percale, lacquered pure "green" organic matter (up to a heap and cheap epoxy can be used for repairs ..., by the way, on IL-2, so the tail unit was glued ...) and the composite is cheaper than carbon fiber !? Ancestors flew across the Atlantic on similar materials in Africa, too, by the way, two world ones passed ... sad
              3. minus
                minus 3 February 2021 19: 41
                0
                Now I specifically looked at a bunch of sites. Carbon fabric for repair purposes on average sells from 1500 to 2500 rubles per square meter. Binder consumption 2 kg per square meter. The average cost of epoxy is 500 rubles. We get 2500-3500 for about 2,2 kg of the product, excluding the cost of work. The materials are of course for domestic use, but obviously they do not stretch by 6000 per kg. And also these are the prices of small wholesale traders .... The cost of the finished product in any case will be determined differently. And the greed of the manufacturer is not the least important. I have already written about equipment and spare parts included, for example, in the maritime register. In the register, the cost can be ten times more expensive. I will not give examples now. Or, for example, various sensors in cars. The same company produces the same sensors. Absolutely identical. But for example, Mitsubishi glued their sticker to the sensor. The price for this spare part has doubled on average. Rather, they didn't even stick it on themselves, but the manufacturer.
                1. Vladimir_2U
                  Vladimir_2U 5 February 2021 04: 25
                  0
                  Quote: Minus
                  Carbon fabric for repair purposes sells on average from 1500 to 2500 rubles per square meter. Binder consumption 2 kg per square meter. The average cost of epoxy is 500 rubles.
                  You looked badly, epoxy from 1500 without hardener was declared, and you thought badly, because the price is given per square, not per kilo.
                  A kilo of carbon fiber at least 4000 r. so the least of 2 r. goes beyond 5500 kg. only epoxy and fabric, and in fact there is a whole breakthrough of auxiliary compounds, films and fabrics that can cost many times more expensive than the fabric itself.
                  1. minus
                    minus 7 February 2021 12: 35
                    0
                    I looked right. Wholesale prices are even cheaper! Targets for 2,2 kg of composite and will consist of 200 grams of carbon fiber (on average a square meter weighs so much less) and 2 kg of epoxy. Last year I myself bought 450 rubles per kg from a large supplier. Just 2 kg per square meter of fabric. I don’t consider the hardener, it leaves little) the price does not increase significantly! 1500 without hardener ???? Well, yes, there are also more expensive ... When packing in small containers, with a beautiful sticker!)))) And I'm talking about bottling from industrial containers! Here, with the ratio of fabric to resin 1k10, as is usually the case in practice and the purchase of raw materials in firms that sell industrial chemistry, the price will correspond to me indicated. For the industry, prices will be lower ... Direct contacts with manufacturers, wholesale prices, and so on ....
                    1. Vladimir_2U
                      Vladimir_2U 7 February 2021 15: 00
                      0
                      I am amazed at you! Judging by your calculations of the consumption, you paste over the hoods with carbon fiber and I do not see anything reprehensible in this, it is reprehensible that you transfer the methods and proportions of this process to the formation loaded details! The fact that it goes with a bang for decorative purposes for a serious product is not suitable at all, even if the part is formed by several layers of EQUAL STRONG carbon fabric and is not coated with three layers of epoxy on top, but is impregnated in a ratio of 1 to 1,5 maximum, this time, and epoxy not just any horrible but UV and temperature resistant apply these two. And the price of epoxy does not determine whether it is carbon fiber or carbon fiber.
                      What is suitable for show-off is not applicable for the most important detail.
                      1. Vladimir_2U
                        Vladimir_2U 7 February 2021 15: 17
                        0
                        2,5 kg of resin per kg of fabric, not a meter but a kg!
                  2. minus
                    minus 7 February 2021 12: 50
                    0
                    Example: Epoxy resin ED-16
                    The price is indicated per kilogram with VAT and packaging and varies by volume:
                    From 5 kg the price is 420 rubles / kg
                    From 55 kg (Metal drum) price 250 rubles / kg

                    It is possible to purchase separately:
                    - PEPA hardener (Packing of 1 kg at a price of RUB 500 / kg)
                    - Thinner-plasticizer DEG-1 (Packing of 1 kg at a price of 1900 rubles / kg
                    Ed 20 they have 450 rubles each.
                    In many catalogs, dag-1 goes, for example, as epoxy resin .... Although it is in reality, as stated above, a thinner - a plasticizer .... And its consumption is a few percent .... The examples I have given are the simplest of course. But these are prices from outbid speculators, not from the manufacturer! More expensive and high quality formulations are not much more expensive. I have already said about expensive additives - their contribution is one and tenths of a percent ...
                    1. Vladimir_2U
                      Vladimir_2U 7 February 2021 15: 36
                      0
                      materials used:
                      - Sicomin SR8500 resin + prepreg hardener KTA315
                      -gel SG715 white
                      - resin for matrix YD-128 + TETA 12% with post-curing.
                      -Zyvax compositeshield separator + SealerGP filler
                      - outer layer carbon 3k 2/2 twill 240 grams
                      -two inner layers of canvas 12k 300gram
                      -sacrifice diatex PA80
                      -perf film ELA20 P1
                      -drainage PES150
                      -vacuum film PO180

                      All this is just three layers of fabric.
                      1. minus
                        minus 7 February 2021 16: 00
                        0
                        Did you give an example of import substitution? What and where from? Once again, quote the manufacturer's price of epoxy resins. Russian. Not from speculators, but from manufacturers!)
                      2. Vladimir_2U
                        Vladimir_2U 7 February 2021 16: 18
                        0
                        Quote: Minus
                        Did you give an example of import substitution? What and where from?
                        This is an example of components for a protective pad for a motorized tank. What's unclear?
                        Quote: Minus
                        Once again, quote the manufacturer's price of epoxy resins. Russian.
                        Prices are really low, even below 500 rubles. Only you did not bring what materials and how much are used for the "black" wing, and no one did, except for 6000 per kg, so restrain your requirements.
              4. Roman 57 rus
                Roman 57 rus 8 February 2021 08: 18
                0
                Manufacturers announced the price for me at MAKS 2013
    4. Alexander Seklitsky
      Alexander Seklitsky 3 February 2021 08: 17
      +3
      Quote: Ka-52
      The main purpose of using the composite is to reduce the specific weight of the structure.
      Again, how much it will be justified for a small aircraft. Vaughn TVS 2DTS was not in demand due to the high price.
      1. Ka-52
        Ka-52 3 February 2021 08: 27
        +1
        Again, how much it will be justified for a small aircraft.

        is not a fact. For big feet and for military aircraft, completely different requirements and restrictions are imposed on the wing. For example, according to elastic characteristics. What ultimately affects the technology and even more so the price of GI
  4. Mechanic
    Mechanic 3 February 2021 08: 10
    +2
    composite is lighter, savings will be on fuel during operation
  5. NDR-791
    NDR-791 3 February 2021 08: 18
    +3
    Found the price of aluminum at $ 3. per kg, and the composite for Boeing-787 at 400 per kg.
    So that's for Boeing !!! wassat For the F-35, they probably sell for 4000 tongue
    And so far more expensive than luminaire, but the more the cheaper. And this is exactly about the design. Our material itself has been releasing for a long time.
    1. Vladimir_2U
      Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 08: 19
      -5
      Quote: NDR-791
      And so far more expensive than luminaire, but the more the cheaper. And this is exactly about the design. Our material itself has been releasing for a long time.
      So I'll write in the article! laughing
      1. NDR-791
        NDR-791 3 February 2021 08: 21
        +3
        So I'll write in the article!
        Do not forget to highlight that the high price is not about the material, namely about the design
  6. APASUS
    APASUS 3 February 2021 08: 58
    +3
    Quote: Vladimir_2U
    How expensive is such a wing than an aluminum one? Found the price of aluminum at $ 3. per kg, and composite for Boeing-787 at 400 per kg.

    The wing for the Boeing-787 is a very complex mechanism, the price rather shows the total cost per kg of the finished product.
    1. Vladimir_2U
      Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 09: 09
      -4
      Quote: APASUS
      The wing for the Boeing-787 is a very complex mechanism, the price rather shows the total cost per kg of the finished product.
      Those. if the wing were purely aluminum would it cost 3 days per kg? I saw these prices in one sentence without any "price per kilogram of wing".
  7. Sergey Valov
    Sergey Valov 3 February 2021 09: 08
    +3
    "How much is such a wing more expensive than an aluminum one?" - there is no definite answer to this question, in principle, it depends on the series, and the price may differ significantly.
    1. Vladimir_2U
      Vladimir_2U 3 February 2021 10: 07
      -4
      Quote: Sergey Valov
      In principle, there is no definite answer to this question, it depends on the series, and the price may differ significantly.
      And I need a rough answer, at least. The approximate cost, other things being equal.
  • nsm1
    nsm1 3 February 2021 07: 46
    -1
    Details are few, superficially described.
    1. krot
      krot 3 February 2021 08: 36
      -6
      Quote: nsm1
      Details are few, superficially described.

      What climbed here? This thread is not for the Sumerians) Little has been written to him. The rest is not for people like you. You said our country is not doing anything new ..))) And everything is gone, the sanctions are bothering you .. Like a bad dancer laughing
      Whose words were about the sanctions?
      Nooo - watch TV better!
      They don't work at all!
      They do not in the least prevent Russia from achieving new victories.
      1. nsm1
        nsm1 3 February 2021 09: 11
        -1
        Essentially there is something?
        And everything is correct about the sanctions, they are still point-like and affect significantly in narrow areas, therefore your excuses do not roll.
        But here it is off topic.
        1. krot
          krot 3 February 2021 09: 15
          -4
          they are still point and affect significantly in narrow areas

          Will you be happy if the sanctions are not targeted? laughing
          To make everyone feel bad in Russia, do you support it?
          1. nsm1
            nsm1 3 February 2021 09: 19
            0
            No, why are they happy with me?
            Here you and your fellow dill tribesmen will definitely please!
            1. krot
              krot 3 February 2021 09: 21
              -5
              Quote: nsm1
              No, why are they happy with me?
              Here you and your fellow dill tribesmen will definitely please!

              I think from your comments it is clear whose tribesmen are dill laughing
              And you are always happy, as can be seen from your comments, wherever there is a bad word about our country ..
              And your sanctions are welcome, they don't touch me personally, I think like most Russians.
              1. nsm1
                nsm1 3 February 2021 09: 23
                -1
                It's hard not to understand, everyone knows who is shouting loudest, hold the Sumerian and there is the Sumerian!
                1. krot
                  krot 3 February 2021 09: 31
                  -5
                  Quote: nsm1
                  It's hard not to understand, everyone knows who is shouting loudest, hold the Sumerian and there is the Sumerian!

                  Old button accordion .. laughing And logic is also from kindergarten. Can't you think of anything new? laughing
                  And by the way, "the loudest" is you, because there is no sound here, unfortunately. But for that you can see a lot))))
                  1. nsm1
                    nsm1 3 February 2021 09: 37
                    -1
                    The old truth has not ceased to be just as true as before!
                    1. The comment was deleted.
                      1. nsm1
                        nsm1 3 February 2021 09: 46
                        -2
                        So not yet sent from Sumerostan!
                        Where to get?
                        Could you borrow yours?
  • Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 3 February 2021 08: 25
    +6
    The direction of work suggests that a shortage of carbon fiber is not expected. The sanctions have pushed Russian production. Carbon fiber. Well, prepregs based on it.
  • Gardamir
    Gardamir 3 February 2021 08: 38
    +4
    Urrya, of course, but really in Russia there is still small aircraft. Of course, there are airplanes for those who have no money for us, so this is light aviation.
    I remember how we, students from Sochi, traveled to Krasnaya Polyana by helicopter. Now who is this news for?
    1. Ka-52
      Ka-52 3 February 2021 12: 05
      +1
      Of course, there are airplanes for those who have no money for us, so this is light aviation.

      and how is "light" different from "small" in your alternate universe?
  • evgen1221
    evgen1221 3 February 2021 08: 44
    +1
    In short, they reported about the introduction of a new (rather purchased line) finally into operation, now how much. And that small aircraft will appear?, I doubt. In single samples for parades and a tick, yes, Massively, the system does not exist for this. Now, if the teleport was invented by instantly pumping the extracted resources abroad, then yes, it would be massively implemented. We can talk about small aircraft only when it is massive, and a single one is just ridiculous. Do we have conditions for mass aviation?, Rather than yes. Well, everything for sale is ours, of course.
    1. nsm1
      nsm1 3 February 2021 09: 12
      -1
      As with the Chinese, not exactly: "The path of a thousand li begins with the first step"
      1. evgen1221
        evgen1221 3 February 2021 09: 24
        -2
        How did you steal a bullet from the Chinese? Will we have more questions about the bright tomorrow?
    2. Strannik96
      Strannik96 3 February 2021 12: 16
      -2
      Read carefully - it is said in general about the program and the specific task. How did it become known about the conditions for mass aviation? Nourish yourself with unnecessary information less, be healthy
      1. evgen1221
        evgen1221 3 February 2021 13: 32
        +1
        Well, if this is not done for mass aviation according to you, and therefore for a single one (then where I am wrong then according to you), and then what for is a plant for units of equipment (it's easier to buy a ready-made sesna.
        1. Strannik96
          Strannik96 3 February 2021 14: 22
          -1
          It's easier and healthier to walk
  • Alex013
    Alex013 3 February 2021 08: 49
    0
    Good news, the main thing is to bring everything to its logical conclusion. Before the production of technology.
  • prior
    prior 3 February 2021 09: 52
    +1
    Dreaming is certainly great.
    As for me, it's better to change your Zhiguli in three years than dreaming of a Rolls-Royce all your life.
    Well, we made one SU-57, but if something happened, the SU-27 and its modernized versions will have to fight.
  • Ros 56
    Ros 56 3 February 2021 09: 54
    +3
    The thing is certainly good, strong and light, but expensive and not repairable. So it is necessary to count both the number of aircraft and their load. Let's wait and see how it turns out.
  • yehat2
    yehat2 3 February 2021 10: 31
    +2
    Quote: Vladimir_2U
    the approximate pricing is just interesting.

    composites are usually not associated with expensive raw materials and are less energy intensive than metals.
    often a significant portion of the wing is generally made of carbon and similar elements, which are everywhere in abundance, so the cost potential of resources is generally excellent.
    The only question is the cost of equipment, research, personnel and the manufacturing itself, and sometimes very expensive components, which in theory can be replaced, but this did not happen.
    Another point is narrow specialization. Composites cannot be remelted into something else, they are usually created irreversibly and, when discarded, simply turn into garbage.
  • three
    three 3 February 2021 11: 57
    +4
    All this is good and fun, but if we seriously intend to raise small aircraft, there is one and the main question - the ENGINE. And not just an engine, but a modular complex (as an approach to the manufacture of PD-14). Gliders in Russia are always not a problem and always (not only in aviation, but in all industries) we are categorically lagging behind in engines (as one professor at the AD department once told us - "300-400 kelvin"). The exception is rocket engines ...
  • Maxwrx
    Maxwrx 3 February 2021 13: 17
    +2
    In general, I read that the black wing was abandoned all over the world in small and even medium (superjet dimension) because it is very expensive to manufacture, and the weight that saves (including fuel savings) does not cover all costs. And for large aircraft (MS-21 level and above) such a wing is required.
    Therefore, either a breakthrough in technology / dramatic cost reduction for any of a variety of reasons, or for heavy drones for the military under the myth of civil aviation development (to supply equipment, material, etc.)
  • Dmitry V.
    Dmitry V. 4 February 2021 12: 54
    0
    The main problem of composite elements is life testing.
    Composite issues, not in alternating loads, but in changing the properties of the composite with time and temperature fluctuations from +50 degrees on the ground to -50 degrees at an altitude, which leads to degradation of the binder and its delamination, loss of strength properties of the structure.
    Designing and making a prototype is hardly 50% of the solution to the problem.
  • zenion
    zenion 4 February 2021 16: 31
    0
    Assume? Man proposes and God disposes.