The American edition called the new engine for the Su-57 the most powerful

The Russian fifth-generation Su-57 fighter with a second stage "product 30" engine will appear in 2022, and in the same year, the Russian Aerospace Forces will begin to receive an updated fighter. Military Watch writes about it.

The American publication, referring to publications in the Russian "state media", claims that the Su-57 with a second stage engine will begin to enter the troops in 2022. At the same time, it is emphasized that the characteristics of the fighter with the new engine will significantly improve, since the Saturn 30 engine will outperform its predecessor.

The publication notes that the aircraft currently uses the first stage engine, the AL-41F1, which is an upgraded version of the AL-41 engine used in another Russian fighter, the Su-35.

The author of the article, referring again to the Russian press, writes that the new Su-57 engine "will become the most powerful in the world" among the engines ever installed on aircraft of this type.

Currently, he argues, the most powerful engine installed in twin-engine fighters is the F119 of the fifth-generation F-22, and the F135 engine in the F-35 is the most powerful for single-engine fighters. The new Russian Saturn 30 engine for the Su-57 could outperform both American engines.

The publication notes that Soviet aircraft engines in the Cold War era were traditionally more powerful than their American counterparts. Russian engine building is making up for lost time in the 90s of the last century and is creating new models of power plants. It is possible that the new engine for the Su-57 will be used in other projects of Russian aircraft, including the development of a next-generation single-engine Russian fighter.

Comments

[mitroha]

That's right, Russian is the best, you always say so.
And we will try to match.
As they say - you have to do it so that it is good - and the shit will work out by itself

[oleg-gr]

"Russian engine building is making up for lost time in the 90s of the last century and is creating new models of power plants." Once it was necessary to do this. It's good that this time has come.

[Thrifty]

“When the enemy praises us, we are doing something wrong!” In this case, the Yankees are clearly muddying some meanness, and the article is intended to show us off! !!

[Xnumx vis]

Quote: Thrifty

“When the enemy praises us, we are doing something wrong!” In this case, the Yankees are clearly muddying some meanness, and the article is intended to show us off! !!

Yes, when someone else's uncle praises your wife, expect trouble .... Bdi!

[Bar1]

how do they-pin_dos know that 30 will be the most powerful? Nobody knows this, that's just gossip.

[aszzz888]

The new Russian Saturn 30 engine for the Su-57 could outperform both American engines.

I would like to, of course. Not all of the Merikatos will be beaten.

[Crimean partisan 1974]

Military Watch writes about it.
-engine "Saturn 30" will surpass its predecessor ...
-that the new Su-57 engine "will become the most powerful in the world" among the engines ever installed on aircraft of this type ....
-The new Russian Saturn 30 engine for the Su-57 can outperform both American engines ....

Mlyn, not an article, but some kind of set of phrases for the brain of housewives soaked in soap operas ...
Mlyn, on figs to spread this ... maybe you should upload articles from the truly professional publications of our hated partners .. that's from the Janes yearbook, for example .... where there are clearly parameters of products and equipment. on the basis of which the interested person himself will make a conclusion about "excel", "the most powerful", "surpass", etc. ... and so gibberish and not an article

[venik]

Quote: Crimean partisan 1974

maybe you should upload articles from truly professional publications of our hated partners ... here from Janes's yearbook, for example ...

=========
"Not in the eyebrow, but in the eye!" "VO" somehow shredded: focused on all sorts of "National Interest", "Sina" and other "crap"! But there are also more serious and interesting ones, incl. international publications .....

[The leader of the Redskins]

About nothing ...
"American edition, referring to publications in the Russian. state MASS MEDIA..."
Do state mass media have a name? Have public!!!!

[Mavrikiy]

The American edition called the new engine for the Su-57 the most powerful

If so, what has the amerovskoe edition to do with?

Currently, he argues, the most powerful engine installed in twin-engine fighters is the F119 of the fifth-generation F-22, and the F135 engine in the F-35 is the most powerful for single-engine fighters.

Did you write an article for this? Well, well ... Sell, sell rotten fish.

[Vladimir_2U]

The publication notes that Soviet aircraft engines in the "Cold War era" were traditionally more powerful than their American counterparts

Isn't that the American snobby phrase "with powerful engines, aerodynamics are not important"? They always boasted of their dviguns, up to the Su-27 and MiG-29.

[Crimean partisan 1974]

They always boasted of their dviguns, right up to the Su-27 and MiG-29 .... in fairness, it should be noted that this was the case to this day .. judge for yourself ... the main parameter of the engine is the motor resource. ..so at the time of the appearance of the AM-34 (Su-27), the service life barely reached 800 hours -1000 hours for the AM-34F and R-33 for the MiG-29 with a service life of 300 hours, while the striped undercarriage of the F-100 was already 4000 hours of motor life, ... at the moment AM-41 and R-33 have only reached 4000 hours, then F119 and F-135 have already exceeded 6000 hours of motor life ..... as they say, feel the difference

[Vladimir_2U]

It's not about the resource, but about the power, sort of.

[Crimean partisan 1974]

It's not about the resource, but about the power, sort of like ....... not about the resource !!!! ... Teza, .. just the engine resource is the starting point of operation ... the declared engine resource from the manufacturer in the nominal its work, that is, averaged ... but how the operator will use it at the limit is another question, the maximum and afterburner mode eats from 10 to 30 percent of the declared nominal power, reducing the declared motor resource by a second ... so on the scales .. .power or motor resource, ..the designers are looking for the golden mean where the arrow of the scales would end up in the status quo ...

[lucul]

just the engine resource is the starting point of operation ..

In peacetime - everything is so)))
And during the war, everything is different. Well, here's an introduction - your service life is 10 hours, but the plane will make only 000-2 sorties during the war before it is shot down - your actions? ))))

[Crimean partisan 1974]

And during the war, everything is different ........ Vital, ... read the comments carefully .. and you will be happy .... I was just for people like you interpreted -! "And how will the operator use at the limit possibilities is another question, "... prove the opposite

[Local from the Volga]

I often disagree with you, but here it is!

[akarfoxhound]

This is what you "diversified" the names of our engines ... AL-31F and RD-33, no?

[Crimean partisan 1974]

Here you are the names of our engines "diversified" ... AL-31F and RD-33, no? .... name others for the line of Su-27 and MiG-29 ..... I will be interested

[Vitaly161]

and what have the others to do with it, if you simply cannot write models of standing SUs on Su 27 and Mig 29, and you take up something to argue about, they told you everything correctly, there is AL 31 on Su, on Miga RD33, you got AM34 from somewhere and P33, the question is where?

[Crimean partisan 1974]

Where did you get AM34 and P33, the question is where? ... I repent. taken under the impression of the recently discussed topic on AM-34, .... well, and P33 did not notice the difference with the taxiway ... but at least the numbers are correct?

[Vitaly161]

be careful in digital, you are almost not mistaken, AL-31F and RD-33 will be correct

[Crimean partisan 1974]

be careful in digital, you were almost not mistaken, the AL-31F and RD-33 will be correct .... the remark is accepted ... and so on ... and what about the AL-41 engines of the second "course" .. .so whether he will succeed ... sorry from the manufacturer about this there is no information ... and the jurik Janes is expensive ... you can only tell fortunes on the coffee grounds

[akarfoxhound]

So it became interesting to me, turn up your comment, what kind of "masterpiece" is this AM-34F and R-33 from you ?! Since when did the engines of Arkhip Lyulka's design bureau suddenly become not AL, but like those of Mikulin AM, and even 34? In honor of the heroic tank, the numbering? (Even the experienced ancestor of the Su-27go under the symbol T-10-1 and that on the cradle engines rose into the sky, the AL-21 is called (Su-17, 24 for the horizon).
And MiGar 29th suddenly not on the engines of the Klimovsky KB RD-33, but on the main caliber of my own device began to fly, on long-range missiles R-33 (ed. 410)? Not with the second, vigorous set, no?
I’ll listen to you very carefully, they opened a new page of aviation!

[Cyril G ...]

Good day. By the way, what is the assigned resource for the military D-30F6? Otherwise I doubt something about my numbers

Quote: Cyril G ...

F-119 (F-22): power 10500/15800 kgf, assigned resource 5500 hours.
F-135 (F-35): power 12700/19500 kgf, assigned resource 4000 hours.
Al-31FM1 / FP (Su-27SM, Su-34, Su-30SM): power 7800-8000 / 12700-13300 kgf, assigned resource 2000 hours
D-30F-6 (MiG-31): power 9500 kgf / 15500 kgf, assigned resource 3500 hours (not sure though)
Al-41F1S: power 8800/14500 kgf, assigned resource 4000 hours.

I don’t remember where this figure came across, but at least the civilian D-30 seemed to be brought up to 9500 hours of the appointed time ..... A military man with an afterburner was probably two times less

[akarfoxhound]

Good evening! Honestly, I don’t remember exactly, in my head the operational figures remained in fragments (to put it mildly, dohfura), and with this the SDs were tight, somewhere it is, so much time and other hardware has already passed ... eh. There resource limitations and in terms of cycles from the "usual" D-30x differ also in terms of the calendar period of operation. I remember the factory workers who, according to the engines ending in resource, came and after inspection regularly extended them for 100 hours. In 2011, the "Permians" conducted a "survey" in our part, and there they said that according to the "calendar", the extreme engine F6 was supposed to "end" in 2014. At the top they raised the issue of resuming production, the director twirled it, charging an exorbitant amount for "restoration" (so that they would not bother when he organized a "business" on the pumps of oil and gas supplies), in response they "smiled", said that we would give on the slipway, but for every penny, every dvigun and terms you will answer personally. What happened after the age of 14 was not interested, but the materiel, as you can see, flies, 31 are restored at the ARZ, how the pies are baked, now the question is - where to get the crews for them? (optimizer Tolik modestly "has nothing to do with it" )

[Cyril G ...]

Good morning. Yes, as usual. And our attitude to the flight crew is eeeeee strange, although it would seem that crazy money has been paid for the training of each pilot. And the Navy, according to my observations, is generally very fond of initiating criminal cases for damage ... Over there, in the Baltic Sea, the damage of the ancient Su-27 was hanged in full to the lieutenant. And I don’t know from the Air Force - but such cases came across precisely in the fleet ..

[akarfoxhound]

And in the Air Force everything is the same. There is only one district for the fleet and the others, the prosecutor's office, advocating "for cases", is also the same for everyone in the district, they don't care who they start a case against. My countryman in Uglovka was also soldered for the Su-27SM 9 years ago (for damage), filed an appeal - they added more. The rolled-out old people run (they don't even leave, they run), the young come in large batches in parts, but "the quality of the manufactured goods" - I want to cry. In the Krasnodar Bursa - the main thing is a lot, and who will be sorted out in parts, but it, "svezgolotopogonnoe" 6 by 8 minutes 15 in my mind multiplied (on a big one flew - Tu134, in a crew), another creation is the formula of the 5th class V, t ,, S I also recalled at the squadron board with a loud rattle of brains (during my service in OMShAP). And what is typical - for the same 15 minutes, the result was wrong! (15 minutes is not an exaggeration, the stopwatch was turned on at the show). There is also a sea of ​​discouraging examples in 2 of my fighter units, Pinocchio, Mlyn ...

[Cyril G ...]

Yeah. Maybe it is necessary to select people according to their abilities, and then take care of it somehow .... There is no way to rush people .... They run out, those who are smart and healthy.
Yes, and the prosecutor's office should limit the ardor, if by reason. And then everything in the army and others is done through the backside.

[lucul]

Judge for yourself ... the main parameter of the engine is the motor resource.

Well, yes, well, the fools don't know about this in Formula 1)))
But seriously, the main thing in the engine is the power and the motor resource sufficient to complete the task. Won in the Second World War, too, all the time they increased fashion by reducing the motor resource.

[boris epstein]

A large motor resource is good in peacetime. Saves money for the state. In wartime, the winner is the one with the highest other tactical and technical data. What difference does it make for an aircraft of any country, what is its engine resource, if it is due to a loss either in speed, or in maneuverability, or in armament if it is shot down in the first battle with a reserve of 3000 engine hours.

[kit88]

Yes, during the war, our dear Su-27 can be filled with the first available 1 gasoline instead of the TS-76 fuel. What was spelled out in the guidelines.
But if the Penguin splashes such a little petrol, how far will he fly?
I honestly do not know what will happen to him, maybe the truth will fly where, but everything suggests that Western technology is not designed for such "hardships and hardships".

[Blackmokona]

No, this is an Italian phrase and related to the automotive industry

[Vladimir_2U]

Yes indeed! Although at speed, only aerodynamics can press the car to the road.

[Blackmokona]

With a powerful engine, you can also put wheels with increased grip. Yes, and load the ballast.

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: BlackMokona

With a powerful engine, you can also put wheels with increased grip. Yes, and load the ballast.

???? Velcro wheels, or what? Well, a car with ballast, this is something breakthrough!

[Blackmokona]

Long-standing practice

This winter I tried ballast riding for the first time, the feeling is indescribable! Honestly, I did not expect such an effect.
At first, I was skeptical about this, I thought, well, what would they give these 50kg ... that would be a block - that's the case! It seemed to me that the ballast would only interfere due to the centrifugal force in the corners.
But when it came down to it, I was amazed at the results. Starting from the fact that it was no longer some miserable 50 kg, but the evil 90 kg became one piece!)) Of course, it was hard to tinker with this weight, but the game is worth the candle.

https://www.drive2.ru/l/4254631/
Sticky tires have also been used for a long time.

[Vladimir_2U]

You ballast for changing the weight distribution with a load to press the car to the road (for which the wing) is not to be confused.

Quote: BlackMokona

Sticky tires have also been used for a long time.

Are you talking about slicks?

[The popuas]

The wing will start working at what speeds ... on the ice it is no longer up to Velcro and other priblud

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Popuas

The wing at what speeds will it start working

And we will deliver the biplane! )))

[Morozov]

When Amers praise, it is always alarming and yet pleasant ..

[comradChe]

The roof of the "Saturn" leaks. And where are the specialists of the "roofing work" organization? Behind the "swallow's nest" you need an eye and an eye.

[Zaurbek]

They were more powerful, but with less resource and more expense. But now the resource of our turbojet engines, it seems, has been tightened.

[Aleks2000]

Right. Somewhere in the future, Saturn 30 may be the most powerful.
They have been promising this for 2-3 years already.

In the meantime, in other editions of this anonymous article, the first stage engine is named 10-15% weaker than the F22 and F35 engines ...

[Zaurbek]

F22 and 35 have motors of different thrust ...

[Aleks2000]

They write, Different modifications of the same number

[voyaka uh]

Numbers are not shown.
The F135 engine of the F-35 fighter provides 128 kN thrust and 191 kN afterburner
Or in kgf
Link:
Maximum: 13000 kgf
Afterburner: 19500 kgf

[Aleks2000]

Everything is correct. I'll get better. F 119 and f135 - as they say - are considered engines from the same line. One is older, the other is newer.
They wrote on VO - both provide cruising supersonic.
And both, despite their age, are slightly more powerful than the newest engine of the first stage of the SU.

[Sasha from Uralmash]

The engine itself, of all engines, because it is the engine itself ... it is the most, the most!

[Taga]

Very accurately reflected the essence of the article!

[Zaurbek]

Product 30 was promised 18.5 tons of thrust with afterburner, but I don't remember without it. And in an interview, the designer talked about a "record" ratio of thrust to dry weight ..... but not about the record for thrust.

[d4rkmesa]

As usual, the public is teased. But, by the way, there may well be a thrust of the order of 16+ tons, with a reduced weight, with a reduced bypass ratio and a maximum thrust in the region of 11+ tons. It all depends on the TK. And in interviews they say so many things. For example, I once heard that Al-41f1s has a reduced weight, and now in the ROE catalogs Dry weight, kg≤1604 + 2%, i.e. on the contrary, "got heavier".

[Errr]

From the text of the article:

Currently, he argues, the most powerful engine installed in twin-engine fighters is the F119 of the fifth-generation F-22, and the F135 engine in the F-35 is the most powerful for single-engine fighters. The new Russian Saturn 30 engine for the Su-57 could outperform both American engines.

Dithyrambenko
Most likely, the "Product 30" will be close in thrust to the F135, but it is unlikely to surpass it. At the same time, the strong point of the aforementioned newest Russian engine in this comparison with its most powerful American counterpart will undoubtedly be its greater efficiency.

[Cyril G ...]

I came across figures for the product 30 - 10 kgf / 000 kgf on afterburner. It is quite obvious that having caught up, if we caught up with the F-18, otherwise I heard the option that there will be 000 kgf for afterburner on product 119, we have not surpassed the F-15500 at all.

[Errr]

Based on the fact that the thrust-to-weight ratio of the Su-57 with a normal take-off weight (with 100% fuel) of 30,6 tons is assumed to be ~ 1,17, then the thrust on afterburner of each of the two "Products 30" should be about 17,9 tf, and without afterburner of the order of 11,8 tf, i.e. the latter is almost like the "Raptor" Pratt & Whitney F119.
For reference. Afterburner / afterburner thrust:
- Pratt & Whitney F119 - 11,8 tf / 15,9 tf;
- Pratt & Whitney F135 - 12,2 tf / 18,5 tf.

[Cyril G ...]

Let's see what happens.

[Local from the Volga]

It will come out, as usual ... If anything, we will kill everyone with axes! (not irony!)

[APASUS]

The general set of words, no data, characteristics and the material was written strangely

[Crimean partisan 1974]

I wrote the material strangely ... what's strange ... the batch is made ... and we are complementing the material

[BastaKarapuzik And]

Quote: Crimean partisan 1974

.so at the time of the appearance of the AM-34 (Su-27), the service life barely reached 800 hours

Here it is interesting, China also does not yet know how to make engines with a large resource. Russian engines have a greater resource than Chinese clones.
But still I'm interested. Maybe the Americans think this resource differently? It's probably not only about materials and technology, do we have a different method for calculating this parameter?
You come across this all the time. To compare two parameters, you need to use the same calculation method, which obviously is not even close. And with America, in general, in all areas.
That is, in general. There are a million examples. And how they calculate GDP, and how they calculate mortality from influenza, and in general in all areas literally.
Maybe the same story is with this resource of American engines?

[Crimean partisan 1974]

Maybe the same story is with this resource of American engines? ....... it is possible, but doubtful ... the operator needs real data. on this there is a bunch of product acceptance. at the same time. federal and a bunch of other ... it is very difficult to deceive ... you can impose, but not to deceive ...

[Cyril G ...]

Quote: BastaKarapuzikI

Maybe the Americans think this resource differently?

They do not think so for the flight hours of pilots.

[Sergey Averchenkov]

Omitting what they got here ... And what kind of GDP is needed for su57? I'm not just interested. Where can they be based? Which airfields are suitable?

[askort154]

The American edition called the new engine for the Su-57 the most powerful


Silly headline! The same article.

[Cyril G ...]

The article is just about nothing. Not a single number per se ...
In reality, this is not the case.
This is how the situation looks for our and American engines.
F-119 (F-22): power 10500/15800 kgf, assigned resource 5500 hours.
F-135 (F-35): power 12700/19500 kgf, assigned resource 4000 hours.
Al-31FM1 / FP (Su-27SM, Su-34, Su-30SM): power 7800-8000 / 12700-13300 kgf, assigned resource 2000 hours
D-30F-6 (MiG-31): power 9500 kgf / 15500 kgf, assigned resource 3500 hours (not sure about this figure)
Al-41F1S: power 8800/14500 kgf, assigned resource 4000 hours.

[Andrey.AN]

The power of a multi-mode engine is a relative concept. Yes, the American achieves more thrust by spinning a larger turbine longer, the F-22's climb rate is lower than that of the Su-35, the throttle response is not the same, and the thrust gain can also be attributed to power without error, the thrust vector still allows Drying to use its power more fully. And so, you can simply add cargo for the kinetic energy to the plane, it will also accelerate longer and fly faster.

[_Ugene_]

The publication notes that Soviet aircraft engines in the "Cold War era" were traditionally more powerful than their American counterparts.

yes, only the resource and efficiency are noticeably lower

[silverura]

The American edition called the new engine for the Su-57 the most powerful

This is the level, there would be more such news, and the celebration of the New Year will not end! For this I’ll go throw it on!

[Vladislav_2]

do not believe "overseas citizens" ..... this is fse fake