In Russia, the development of a new complex to combat shock drones began

In Russia, the development of the latest complex of long-range radar patrol based on drone helicopter type. It is reported by RIA News with reference to a source in the military-industrial complex.

According to the publication, the enterprises of the Russian defense industry have already begun to develop a new drone designed to aim anti-aircraft systems at enemy attack drones.

Since November, the development of an unmanned helicopter for a long-range radar patrol has been underway, which will track small and low-speed enemy drones at low and extremely low altitudes and ensure the guidance of anti-aircraft missile systems of military air defense at them

- quotes the news agency as saying the interlocutor.

The work on the new project was initiated based on an analysis of the experience of recent local military conflicts, including the war in Nagorno-Karabakh. The work was not started from scratch, the development uses the existing groundwork. The source said the new complex will be created "as soon as possible." Other details of the new development have not yet been given.

Note that the experience of recent military conflicts has shown the increased role of unmanned aviation in all its forms, from reconnaissance to striking.

Comments

[Victor_B]

Life has already clearly demonstrated the danger of drones.
And since a new "cannon" has appeared, then the "armor" must appear, which holds its "shell".
I am all the time touched by the arguments of the liberals that one air defense missile costs ochulion bucks, and it is a luxury to shoot Rolls Royces at a Chinese toy for 1k bucks!
Only one such craft in Khmeimim caused so much trouble that it costs more than a dozen missiles.
The cost of a shot that destroys a drone is almost always no more expensive than the damage it could cause.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Victor_B

then one air defense missile costs oghulion bucks and shooting Rolls Royces at a Chinese toy for 1k bucks is a luxury!

How are you going to deal with the raid of a swarm of drones in the amount of 500-1000 pieces?
And imagine for a moment that this whole armada is exchanging information with each other. And if you fantasize, then you can imagine that the swarm received the command, and performs it independently.

[Victor_B]

Quote: Stroporez

How are you going to deal with the raid of a swarm of drones in the amount of 500-1000 pieces?

Today 05.12.20/XNUMX/XNUMX - no way!
For these "swarms" do not exist in any army.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Victor_B

Today 05.12.20/XNUMX/XNUMX - no way!
For these "swarms" do not exist in any army.

If you do not see the gopher, it does not mean that it is not. First, our anti-ship missiles have an information exchange system. Why not apply this on drones and increase their number? All this is already a matter of the very near future.

[Victor_B]

Quote: Stroporez

If you do not see the gopher, it does not mean that it is not. First, our anti-ship missiles have an information exchange system. Why not apply this on drones and increase their number? All this is already a matter of the very near future.

Dear cutter!
There is no limit to perfection.
There will be "swarms" and means of dealing with them.
They will appear at both "us" and "them". Both. Simultaneously. Nearly.
We made hypersound, believe me - soon there will be means of dealing with it.

[Tatyana]

Note that the experience of recent military conflicts has shown the increased role of unmanned aircraft in all its manifestations, from reconnaissance to delivering strikes.

Lived! Up to this day this is Russia's lag behind the West to create a line of UAVs in the Russian Federation disputed ostensibly as unnecessary.
And it was not possible to take into account the forecasts of experts in the field of the use of shock drones by the West in Russia over the past 30 years?

And who, why and how so recently in the government of the Russian Federation proposed and now to reduce military spending on the Russian Armed Forces? Remind me?

[Lech from Android.]

For these "swarms" do not exist in any army.

In the troops, yes ... but imagine if terrorists master such technologies and use them in large metropolitan areas of the world.
Small drones can be stuffed with anything ... with poisonous substances, poison, grenades, explosives, IEDs, grenade launchers, even shotguns ... and programmed accordingly ... there would be room for such scumbags as Roslyakov, for example.
New technologies are new dangers associated with falling into the wrong hands.

[carstorm 11]

Quite soon, this will have to be put on the level of nuclear weapons, and the danger will definitely be created and all sorts of bodies that will monitor and prohibit this. Otherwise, it will get out of control completely and then you will not drive the gin into the bottle. Especially when, in fact, there is no opposition to such weapons. And it is unlikely to appear in the coming years. The only way is the same drones in huge numbers that will hunt for attackers

[Jacket in stock]

Any weapon in the hands of terrorists is terrible, even a kitchen knife.
Suggest to get confused against knives too?
In this case, there is only one way, to tear off these hands before they take up arms.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Victor_B

For these "swarms" do not exist in any army.

Now we will refresh your memory!

[Captain Pushkin]

Quote: Victor_B

Quote: Stroporez

How are you going to deal with the raid of a swarm of drones in the amount of 500-1000 pieces?

Today 05.12.20/XNUMX/XNUMX - no way!
For these "swarms" do not exist in any army.

The Chinese have already demonstrated their drone launch systems. A dozen installations can launch hundreds of four drones almost simultaneously.

[migsu]

Electronic warfare lowers all life activity to 0.

[purple]

Quote: Stroporez

How are you going to deal with the raid of a swarm of drones in the amount of 500-1000 pieces?
And imagine for a moment that this whole armada is exchanging information with each other. And if you fantasize, then you can imagine that the swarm received the command, and performs it independently.

EMP and the whole swarm falls to the ground

[Sling cutter]

Quote: purple

EMP and the whole swarm falls to the ground

explain.

[purple]

Electromagnetic pulse

[Sling cutter]

Quote: purple

Electromagnetic pulse

will we detonate a nuclear bomb or will we bring a state district power station?

[Alt 22]

There have long been portable EMP generators, the size of a small suitcase.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Alt22

There have long been portable EMP generators, the size of a small suitcase.

Well, then we have nothing to fear, we are completely safe.

[Imobile]

And where do they come from in Russia? Then why air defense?

[Imobile]

even the EMP from an atomic bomb has a small radius and a short impulse, after which the drones will restore communication and fly further, although why? Its manpower will be completely destroyed within the range of the drone from the explosion

[standan]

Quote: Imobile

even the EMP from an atomic bomb has a small radius and a short impulse, after which the drones will restore communication and fly further, although why? Its manpower will be completely destroyed within the range of the drone from the explosion

After which all electronics (except lamps) burn out, from the word completely, and there will be simply no one to restore the connection. Learn materiel.

[Imobile]

Unprotected electronics burns out (simpler Chinese crafts) on an area with a radius of up to 32 km, , that is, for Chinese crafts, it is necessary to blow up again after 32 km. and at the same time, otherwise they can fly over and there will be no effect. Another - in an explosion, all living things will be destroyed, and the task of the drone is completed. That is, you do the task for the drone with your own hands. Let us wear it in Syria, if you blow it up, the consequences will be disastrous in political terms. The actions of artificial EMP and projectiles extend to 3-5 meters, a power plant is required for a distance of 50 meters, we do not even consider this, will you build in Syria?

[standan]

Unprotected electronics (simpler Chinese crafts) burn out on an area with a radius of up to 32 km, that is, for Chinese crafts, it is necessary to blow up again after 32 km. and at the same time, otherwise they can fly over and there will be no effect.

That is, do you think that after EMP the drones will simply hover in the air and then fly further? EMP works on ALL electronics, including engines and batteries.

[standan]

Where did I write about nuclear weapons? There are other ways to get EMP

[Sanichsan]

Quote: Stroporez

will we detonate a nuclear bomb or will we bring a state district power station?

what for? there is "Mercury".

[Imobile]

Chito weapons against our rockets with a radio-controlled fuse. Why spend even a penny on this ?????????????????????????

[Sling cutter]

Quote: purple

EMP and the whole swarm falls to the ground

In principle, I did not ask about the decoding of the abbreviation. And about what front width, at what range and from what kind of space blaster? Or maybe your surname is Garin and you have your own hyperboloid?

[Tiksi-3]

Quote: Stroporez

How are you going to deal with the raid of a swarm of drones in the amount of 500-1000 pieces?

the same as with a swarm of CDs from 100 to 500

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Tiksi-3

the same as with a swarm of CDs from 100 to 500

A drone is not a cruise missile at all! In my humble opinion, a swarm of drones will be able to fight with the same swarm, now the world is on the verge of a great technological breakthrough and we will witness the seemingly most incredible things.

[Tiksi-3]

Quote: Stroporez

and we will witness the seemingly most incredible things.

all the garbage ..... the earth must become one and urgently go into space! ..... only space!

[Vasyan1971]

Quote: Tiksi-3

the earth must become united and urgently go into space! ..... only space!

The Earth, as it is, and so in space ...

[KCA]

An EMP generator for several megajoules and 1000 pieces of drones will fall off like winter crops, unlike electronic warfare and air defense equipment in shielded kungs with grounding

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: KCA

EMP generator for several megajoules and 1000 pieces of drones will fall off like winter crops

Yesaaaa ... "hapkozakidatelstvo" we cannot eradicate! Only now electromagnetic!

[KCA]

Yeah, but the fact that in the event of a massive attack threatening the existence of the state, the Russian Federation will respond with all its forces and means, this is also a hack? 1542 officially ready for use strategic nuclear warheads, and, according to various estimates, from 12 to 16 thousand tactical charges, is that not an EMP generator? Do you doubt the effectiveness of electromagnetic or microwave radiation?

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: KCA

Do you doubt the effectiveness of electromagnetic or microwave radiation?

No ... after the explosion 1542 officially ready for use strategic nuclear warheads, and, according to various estimates, from 12 to 16 thousand tactical charges No doubt !

[KCA]

So there is nothing to argue about, an attack of 500-1000 drones on the Russian Federation will mean the beginning of a war, and who knows, what if a million dollar nuclear warhead from California weighing a couple of kilograms is on the drone? There will be only one answer, about "Dead Hand" I don't think it's a fake, it will take off and deliver

[Bolt cutter]

An apple from California weighing a couple of kilograms?

Will cost at least $ 50 billion.

[My doctor]

Quote: KCA

What if a million dollar YABC from California weighing a couple of kilograms is on a drone?

California-252 (252Cf) weighing 1 gram will cost $ 250000000, but the world stock is only 10 grams.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: KCA

1542 officially ready for use strategic nuclear warheads, and, according to various estimates, from 12 to 16 thousand tactical charges, is that not an EMP generator?

Do you want to explode all this on our territory and immediately, as the bunker lover promises to go to heaven?

[Chizhov Kirill]

there will never be any response from nuclear weapons to a swarm attack from roguly, even if the swarm arrives at the Kremlin. no one will press the button

[Vadim237]

The more densely this swarm flies, the easier it will be to shoot down even 300kami one rocket and parts of the khan's swarm with fragments within a radius of hundreds of meters will knock everything down and yes they will not fly unnoticed to detect them, there are mobile radars Gamma Approach and Casta just for early detection of small slow-moving and low-flying targets.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Nikolaevich I

Yesaaaa ... "hapkozakidatelstvo" we cannot eradicate! Only now electromagnetic!

Colleague, I am also reading about electromagnetic suitcases and it takes me to shock

[figwam]

Quote: Stroporez

How are you going to deal with the raid of a swarm of drones in the amount of 500-1000 pieces?

So there will be a swarm of fighter drones.

[Alex Nevs]

With such a fantasy ... yes, wire exchange. No EMPs are scary.

[KCA]

On unshielded wires, EMP is still induced, it already burns out, pshik and everything, the longer the length, the worse

[qQQQ]

Quote: Stroporez

How are you going to deal with the raid of a swarm of drones in the amount of 500-1000 pieces?

Katz offers to surrender?

[karima]

Quote: qqqq

Katz offers to surrender?

Pashinyan, Pashinyan both offers and gives up.

[Observer2014]

Quote: Stroporez

Quote: Victor_B

then one air defense missile costs oghulion bucks and shooting Rolls Royces at a Chinese toy for 1k bucks is a luxury!

How are you going to deal with the raid of a swarm of drones in the amount of 500-1000 pieces?
And imagine for a moment that this whole armada is exchanging information with each other. And if you fantasize, then you can imagine that the swarm received the command, and performs it independently.

Colleague I’ll tell you so. It would be a task. Clear and clear. You can turn the planet over. And not that this swarm is multiplied to zero. There must be a clear and clear understanding! What we do. What we want. But where are we going in the end. Everything.

[KCA]

Give me a foothold and I will move the Earth, Aristotle, over 300 BC

[Sergej1972]

Only not Aristotle, but Archimedes.

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Sergej1972

Only not Aristotle, but Archimedes.

But tovarischu all the same, give the main thing and that's it

[lucul]

Give me a foothold and I will move the Earth, Aristotle, over 300 BC

Give me target designation and I will destroy any UAVs.)))
To paraphrase it ...

[KCA]

Yes, of course Archimedes, beguiled the Greeks, there is still a drawing from a book in front of my eyes, how Archimedes moves the Earth with his finger, from the point of view of modern science, complete crap, more than once proven, but still

[Sling cutter]

Quote: Observer2014

There must be a clear and clear understanding! What we do. What we want. But where are we going in the end. Everything.

Greetings! This is where the Russian Federation is heading with the current leadership for me is absolutely obvious, along the way powdering the brains of the inhabitants about the constant threat from everyone and everything.
But what to do? first of all, change (without loud words) "course" and stupidly do business in your own country, not paying attention to anyone to solve your own problems and believe me, in 5 years we will not recognize our country in the good sense of the word.

[Observer2014]

Quote: Stroporez

Quote: Observer2014

There must be a clear and clear understanding! What we do. What we want. But where are we going in the end. Everything.

Greetings! This is where the Russian Federation is heading with the current leadership for me is absolutely obvious, along the way powdering the brains of the inhabitants about the constant threat from everyone and everything.
But what to do? first of all, change (without loud words) "course" and stupidly do business in your own country, not paying attention to anyone to solve your own problems and believe me, in 5 years we will not recognize our country in the good sense of the word.

That's it ! That's it!

[lucul]

But what to do? first of all, change (without loud words) "course" and stupidly do business in your own country, not paying attention to anyone to solve your own problems and believe me, in 5 years we will not recognize our country in the good sense of the word.

What do you mean. But I think that in this case, the country will expect a new 5 in 1991 years.
To prevent this from happening again, you first understand the reasons for the collapse of the USSR. Excuses about betrayal do not roll - they betrayed then, they will betray now.
And I didn’t dare to go through the "holy 90s" again.

[Petro_tut]

.
To prevent this from happening again, you first understand the reasons for the collapse of the USSR.

The reasons are well known - the collapse of villages

[Vladimir247]

[First, understand the reasons for the collapse of the USSR]
Well, actually, it is necessary to fight betrayal, this is first of all. And not to transplant them from Rosnano to other chairs.

[Boris Chernikov]

and the cost of each such drone will be very, very expensive, so it's no longer 1 K bucks, but 50-100 k bucks .. About "if there are 500", then this will just allow you to fight them .. in fact the same Derivation are being developed for such a case, and the Rat complex is precisely tailored for this ... you just need to combine them

[lucul]

and the cost of each such drone will be very, very expensive

I don’t know - the maximum use of composites (to lighten the weight) the most advanced fuel-efficient engines, and the most advanced radar. As a result, we get a drone weighing up to 10 tons and a wing spread of 20-30m and an operating time of up to 2 days .... but wait, we already have something like this - it's called Altius. Only he has imported weak screw motors.
And the price, and what the price - at one time the MiG-21 was riveted so much that its cost was comparable to the BMP-2)))

[Boris Chernikov]

taking into account that they were built at the cost of production, and in the West, no one will give up the profit ... and yes, you are confusing kamikaze drones, which predict the "killer of all air defense" and a long-flight reconnaissance drone .. let's just say

[lucul]

and yes, you are confusing kamikaze drones, which predict the "killer of all air defense" and a long-flight reconnaissance drone .. let's just say

I mainly consider drones only in the detection / target designation mode, the drone as a delivery vehicle loses in price to the same MLRS. For example, the Belarusian Polonaise (MLRS) shoots at 300 km. And now, with the removal of the restriction, nothing prevents the development of MLRS with a range of 500 km. Can you imagine the Tornado / Tornado volleys at a distance of 500 km, thanks to drones, with increased accuracy (one target, one missile)?

[Boris Chernikov]

only it will be necessary to make a quasi-ballistic rocket, and shoot with packets in order to hit the target with a guarantee ... so it will be expensive and difficult ... and the kamikaze drones are so good that they are unobtrusive, fly low-low and are cheap .. for understanding our Aileron no more than 3 million rubles apiece .. Suppose that the heavier version will cost 5-6 million rubles, and one hit with a guarantee will disable it .. For understanding, the same Caliber rocket will cost 40-50 million rubles .. So kamikaze drones ... for 10 missiles with a higher probability will be able to penetrate air defense than 1

[lucul]

so it will be expensive and difficult .. And kamikaze drones are so good because they are hardly noticeable, fly low-low and are cheap ..

Where is it cheap ????
A cheap drone is up to a 20km range, no more. Anything further - the price rises in arithms. progression ...

[Boris Chernikov]

um .. who sang about "20 km" to you? the control range via the communication channel is 40 km without a repeater, but if you score a card, then to a dry tank or dead batteries ... in current devices that in a week you can test it under 200 km of range ..

[lucul]

um .. who sang about "20 km" to you? the control range via the communication channel is 40 km without a repeater, but if you score a card, then to a dry tank or dead batteries ... in current devices that in a week you can test it under 200 km of range ..

Well, show me a UAV with a range of 200 km and at a price lower than our MLRS shell? ))))

[Boris Chernikov]

Orlan-10, for example? Recently, Orlan-30 was tested at the exercises .. the price is about 8 million per car .. the difference is that the air defense will detect it when it flies to the target, and the missile will be found immediately after the launch ... and the ballistic missile -typical target for all AA defenses

[Svarog]

Especially with such ..

[venik]

Quote: Stroporez

How are you going to deal with the raid of a swarm of drones in the amount of 500-1000 pieces?
And imagine for a moment that this whole armada is exchanging information with each other.

=========
And that's exactly for this, and there are electronic warfare systems!

[Observer2014]

And that's exactly for this, and there are electronic warfare systems!

Electronic warfare works where there is communication. Communication between the drone, for example, and the control center. Artificial intelligence is on the way. And here is the video that Svarog showed. It will turn into reality.

[venik]

Quote: Observer2014

Electronic warfare works where there is communication. Communication between the drone, for example, and the control center. Artificial intelligence is on the way. wink And here is the video that Svarog showed. It will turn into reality.

========
AND HOW MUCH do you think a "swarm" of 500-1000 drones with "artificial intelligence" will cost ???

[Observer2014]

Quote: venik

Quote: Observer2014

Electronic warfare works where there is communication. Communication between the drone, for example, and the control center. Artificial intelligence is on the way. wink And here is the video that Svarog showed. It will turn into reality.

========
AND HOW MUCH do you think a "swarm" of 500-1000 drones with "artificial intelligence" will cost ???

Are you a production or development question?

[venik]

Quote: Observer2014

Are you a production or development question?

========
On purchasing price!

[lopvlad]

Quote: Stroporez

How are you going to deal with the raid of a swarm of drones in the amount of 500-1000 pieces?

if a swarm means a lot of mini-drones. Mini-drones means an electric motor, an electric motor means a 100% electronic control system, which means the most effective way to fight is to burn out electronics using REB.

[Yura]

Quote: Stroporez

then you can imagine that the swarm has received a command, and is executing it independently.

In addition to what we have and are being developed - once again your quote: "then you can imagine that the swarm received the command, and performs it independently." Why not?

[Bad_gr]

Quote: Stroporez

How are you going to deal with the raid of a swarm of drones in the amount of 500-1000 pieces?

EW should fight this. Modern electronic warfare and satellite communications will score, and will set fake coordinates, and will score communication channels with false information.

[alexmach]

The old Soviet way - an air nuclear explosion :).

[Sanichsan]

Quote: alexmach

aerial nuclear explosion

Good day
Well, why so radically if there is "Mercury"?

[alexmach]

Good evening. Indeed, this is too much for small things.

[Arthur 85]

I don't really use drones, but doesn't an air blast of 1-2 kT solve the problem of "thousands of shock drones", if it came to their use? And then 0,1-1 MT at the place of their launch, and the same amount at the place of "decision-making" ... Let them fly.

[Ilya_Nsk]

Roy of what? "Predators", "Bayraktars"? It's hard to imagine .. The pot-bellied trifle remains. The question is in the concentration of the swarm and the degree of AI of a single apparatus. Solution: it starts as usual - to see, then the paths differ: the promising one is electronic warfare, the sector is covered with a powerful interference (the selection of its parameters is a separate topic) and the swarm ceases to be a swarm, but what can a separate apparatus weighing 3 kg do? But he must carry his own AI, batteries, act autonomously, i.e. on the means of influence remains a little ... Distributed in time, the pecks of these crumbs will probably not reach the goal. If the swarm is sufficiently concentrated, it remains so, then the means are already there - ammunition for a volumetric explosion - several good broads and from the swarm there will be an incapable part. The "Solntsepek" and "Toosochek" will have a new goal. We'll have to modify them a little so that the BOVs arrive and explode in the right place, but this is already easier than making a system from scratch.
These are just sketches, pure impromptu. There are people smarter, more experienced, I hope they will come up with something ... asymmetrical

[Victor_B]

Quote: Victor_B

The cost of a shot that destroys a drone is almost always no more expensive than the damage it could cause.

As an example - the actions of Baytraktorov in Karabakh.
We saved on air defense, were smashed to smithereens and smashed!
And the air defense is not a wonderful magic wand (like I bought the S-400 and all the problems are solved), but the SYSTEM. Layered system. A system that can reliably cover an object and itself, beloved, protect against air attack weapons, and from any MLRS and even "smart" shells.

[KVU-NSVD]

Quote: Victor_B

well, from all sorts of MLRS

Well, here you went too far. I can hardly imagine an object (albeit three times echeloned) air defense system capable of repelling the raid of a battery volley of Gradov, even the most "stupid" unguided RS. And for the numerous swarms it is necessary to start preparing now.

[Lech from Android.]

Israel's iron dome ... not so iron ... is occasionally drilled by the Palestinians with water pipes.

[Maxamud]

Quote: Lech from Android.

Israel's iron dome ... not so iron ... is occasionally drilled by the Palestinians with water pipes.

Quiet Lech !!!! And now they will run in a crowd and trample everyone ... It's better not to mention them out of harm's way ..

[Vitaly gusin]

Quote: Lech from Android.

Israel's iron dome ... not so iron ... is occasionally drilled by the Palestinians with water pipes

What is your goal when you write falsely?
The "Iron Dome" saves the lives of Israelis and, oddly enough, the residents of Gaza. If it were not for the Iron Dome, Israel responded to all these missile launches no weaker than the Aerospace Forces in Syria.
AND NOW STATISTICS.
2019th year. 1.300 rockets 6 killed, more than 70 injured.
2018th year. 941 missiles One dead, over 60 wounded.
2014th year. 3.686 missiles. 14 dead, 169 injured
2012th year. 2.078 missiles - 6 killed, 107 wounded.
8005 missiles
26 dead.
406 wounded.
Without the Iron Dome, with such a dense development, Israel would look like this.

You want them to be pipes, but this is far from the case, the time of pipes is long gone.

Try to write the truth, lies can always be refuted.

[Boris Chernikov]

if ... the main missiles that are launched from the Gaza Strip are local homemade products, half of which fall after flying several kilometers, if the missiles were just factory-made, the result would be different

[Fungus]

What makes you think that your extras don't lie. They also lie. So shove your iron dome stats to hell.

[AML]

Just thinking out loud. So we have Hamas, which has a bunch of weapons, and which simply drills in one place, if they do not launch a couple of rockets towards Israel. What's the catch? If they are so implacable, then most likely they are just mentally retarded.
For example, how difficult is it to load RDX, nitroglycerin or pyroxylin? At the cost of garbage, but one explosion would do much more damage than those 8-plus thousand missiles.
In Russia, at a certain time, hexogen in cubic meters traveled around the country.

Maybe everything is easier? If you cannot defeat crime, then you need to lead it. And there are some pluses. Citizens are constantly in good shape. Funds for the military-industrial complex and the army are easily justified. Well, etc.

[Clear]

Quote: Vitaly Gusin

Quote: Lech from Android.

Israel's iron dome ... not so iron ... is occasionally drilled by the Palestinians with water pipes

What is your goal when you write falsely?
The "Iron Dome" saves the lives of Israelis and, oddly enough, the residents of Gaza. If it were not for the Iron Dome, Israel responded to all these missile launches no weaker than the Aerospace Forces in Syria.
AND NOW STATISTICS.
2019th year. 1.300 rockets 6 killed, more than 70 injured.
2018th year. 941 missiles One dead, over 60 wounded.
2014th year. 3.686 missiles. 14 dead, 169 injured
2012th year. 2.078 missiles - 6 killed, 107 wounded.
8005 missiles
26 dead.
406 wounded.
Without the Iron Dome, with such a dense development, Israel would look like this.

You want them to be pipes, but this is far from the case, the time of pipes is long gone.

Try to write the truth, lies can always be refuted.

If on the roof of the Israelites fell

Quote: Vitaly Gusin

8005 missiles

Isn't it time to think about whether the terrorist policy of the Israeli leadership is correct?

[lopvlad]

Quote: Vitaly Gusin

8005 missiles

Israel is good at lying, and the fact that this is a lie can be understood from this figure of 8005 missiles, coupled with the statement that

Quote: Vitaly Gusin

You want them to be pipes, but this is far from the case, the time of pipes is long gone

intercepted missiles are also "smart".

[Victor_B]

Quote: KVU-NSVD

Well, here you went too far. I can hardly imagine an object (albeit three times echeloned) air defense system capable of repelling the raid of a battery volley of Grad, even the most "dumb" unguided RS.

And you don't need to imagine.
Firstly, depending on what to defend, the infantry in the field fortifications are well protected from the Castle, the Tornado's missiles can be shot down.
Secondly - well, there is no absolute weapon. Especially defense weapons. And it never will.
Thirdly, even if the whole Grad pact is struck against one installation, say Thor, then a maximum of 2-3 shells will hit the installation itself and nearby, because they are sharpened for areal targets. But it is possible to shoot down 2-3 shells.

[My doctor]

Quote: Victor_B

Thirdly, even if the whole Grad pact is struck against one installation, say Thor, then a maximum of 2-3 shells will hit the installation itself and nearby, because they are sharpened for areal targets. But it is possible to shoot down 2-3 shells.

I'm seriously surprised. Thor turns out to be able to shoot down only those 2-3 projectiles that could potentially hit the installation from the entire Grad salvo. Minus is mine.

[Fungus]

We have mercury against MLRS.

[K-36]

Fungus ( We have mercury against MLRS.)

Your Mercury can affect projectiles only with a radio-technical unit inside. But shells, blanks, for example, "Katyusha" times of the Second World War, she is too tough!

[Sanichsan]

Quote: K-36

But shells-blanks, for example, "Katyusha" times of the Second World War, she is too tough!

a swarm of drones of blanks?

[lopvlad]

Quote: KVU-NSVD

an air defense system capable of repelling the raid of a battery salvo of Grad, even the most "stupid" unguided RS.

so the fact of the matter is that in the modern world it is most difficult to counteract an unguided weapon, because no matter how much a REB brick does not affect, all one result will be zero, unlike a swarm of drones.

[Boris Chernikov]

Karabakh is not indicative at all .. because there the Armenians bought old Osa-AK under the guise of Osa-AKM, so even with rotten missiles .. an attempt to enter into battle outdated S-300 without cover immediately backfired .. 1-2 Torah, which lit up there, by Of course, they worked out the Bayraktar, but any quality does not work without the required quantity ..

[Sanichsan]

Quote: Victor_B

As an example - the actions of Baytraktorov in Karabakh.

example of what? PR effect? so the main damage was also caused by artillery.

Quote: Victor_B

A system that can reliably cover the object and itself, beloved, protect against air attack weapons, and from any MLRS and even "smart" shells.

"Mercury"?

[Petro_tut]

Layered system. A system that can reliably cover the object and itself, beloved, protect against air attack weapons, and from any MLRS and even "smart" shells.

In the Beka valley, there was the same deeply echeloned air defense system, but this did not prevent the Israelites from opening it, judging by the comments, conclusions in Russia have not yet been extracted ...

[NDR-791]

The cost of a shot that destroys a drone is almost always no more expensive than the damage it could cause.
Not always more expensive. UAVs shoot down around the Kremlin and see them. In any case, such a weapon has been demonstrated. The main thing is to combine something from, not to break your head from scratch.
... work on the creation of antidrones was carried out by the Kalashnikov concern. His developments REX-1 and REX-2 allowed the introduction of specific "weapons" in the armed forces of the Russian Federation. Mobile portable systems at a distance of up to 2 km provide complete safety of ground units from attack by drones, turning off their radio and satellite navigation.

There is a lot more invented. I am glad that now these detectors will raise higher. And it will be a helicopter or a quadrocopter, no matter what. The detection range will increase, there will be more time for "working hours".

[mitroha]

Just what to do with high-altitude UAVs, you can't reach them with these pukalki. They are more likely for object protection from low-flying, slow-speed drones. And then the Kremlin. But, say, 30 drones will arrive at a position from different sides, and? Not all fighters will have such fart.

[lopvlad]

Quote: Mitroha

But, say, 30 drones will arrive at a position from different sides, and?

the Russian anti-drone complex "Silok" will help you, because it was created just to fight against drones, both single and their swarm.

[donavi49]

These directional drone strikers work only against household drones from Alishka. And not all. For example, dear ones, INS and flight missions laugh in the face of this gun.

Combat drones and loitering ammunition are all almost completely immune. The maximum that is possible is to make it difficult to transmit commands and send a picture (signal). In this case, it is necessary to conduct a drone / ammunition in the sight. However, if the commands were transferred (the target mark was transferred to the teleautomat), then this gun can already be thrown out altogether.

And in the world they are bought mainly in the gendarmerie and the guards. You can constantly see such guns at public events, football, presidential speeches, G7 / 20 congresses, etc.

[Mar.Tirah]

Quote: Victor_B

And since a new "cannon" has appeared, then the "armor" must appear, which holds its "shell".

I agree. I would like to learn more about the performance characteristics of this system? Time of continuous stay in the air, range and detection. Probably this is an addition to powerful systems for detection, tracking and guidance of medium-range air defense systems of military air defense, so as not to include the main radars and eliminate dead zones? And with which air defense system it will be able to integrate. It was already necessary yesterday, but until the third bell rang, our defense engineers will do everything right.

[Victor_B]

Why are you interested in?
Do not close the door, they have already left for you!

[Mar.Tirah]

Quote: Victor_B

Why are you interested in?

From the same one with which this article was published in the open source of the Voennoye Obozreniye mass media Or do you prefer srach sofa specialists "shining" with their knowledge of Wikipedia and the acuteness of words?

[Terenin]

Quote: Mar. Tira

Quote: Victor_B

And since a new "cannon" has appeared, then the "armor" must appear, which holds its "shell".

I agree. I would like to learn more about the performance characteristics of this system? Time of continuous stay in the air, range and detection. Probably this is an addition to powerful systems for detection, tracking and guidance of medium-range air defense systems of military air defense, so as not to include the main radars and eliminate dead zones? And with which air defense system it will be able to integrate. It was already necessary yesterday, but until the third bell rang, our defense engineers will do everything right.

Official information on Russian electronic warfare systems has been minimized. And some directions are classified.
For example, the Samarkand complexes have already been deployed or are being deployed in the Arkhangelsk, Kaliningrad, Moscow, Murmansk, Nizhny Novgorod regions, Krasnodar and Primorsky Territories, the Jewish Autonomous Region, as well as in Belarus.
But secretly contains not only the characteristics of this complex, but also its purpose.

[Mar.Tirah]

Quote: Terenin

Official information on Russian electronic warfare systems has been minimized.

Well, this complex is more related to the air defense system, but your comment is certainly correct. Let's wait until the performance characteristics of this complex become publicly available for discussion. Can you just take note and look for similar foreign installations?

[Terenin]

Quote: Victor_B

The cost of a shot that destroys a drone is almost always no more expensive than the damage it could cause.

An even more useful function of anti-drone systems is the ability to determine the point from which the operator controls the drone and transmit its coordinates to artillerymen or missilemen.

[lopvlad]

Quote: Victor_B

Only one such craft in Khmeimim did so much trouble

the damage in Khmeimim was not from a drone but from mortar shelling at the airfield from the DRG militants.

[meandr51]

So what? One SAM can launch a dozen drones. Here is the ratio of values ​​and will play. The object will still be destroyed. Therefore, it is necessary to achieve cheap and massive anti-drone air defense.

[V1er]

Endless confrontation between shield and sword.

[The leader of the Redskins]

An unexpected decision. Is it too complicated?

[Maxamud]

Work men, this is a very serious matter, judging by the Karabakh and BV .. In Iran, a scientist was killed and nothing can be proved.

[evgen1221]

Well, an uav hunter on a swarm and on a wood-fired traction with self-assembly is an even more tempting idea, and if you screw an underwater start, then generally fire. That's just the concept of guano, but how to cut the rules. A balloon will take a ton of equipment and can chat for a long time in the air, plus it is cheaper at times, but this is not our method - a helicopter.

[siberalt]

So, immediately after violating the area of ​​the closed sky announced by Russia, a couple of "Calibers" can be launched at the manufacturing plants, the launch sites and the concentration of submarines of the intruder country.

[Chizhov Kirill]

pkhhhaaahaaa, who will launch that?

[Vladimir61]

Quote: Leader of the Redskins

An unexpected decision. Is it too complicated?

How to say! Figuratively speaking, before the events in Armenia, many also thought so, until the thunder struck.

[Vadim237]

Armenia in general had a conditional air defense and the air force was completely absent - so there is nothing to compare them with Russia.

[Andrew 40]

Well, at least it was combed. But this is not enough. We have to think about how to deal with the swarm of drones.

[Horon]

For this, there is a REB system, and they transform a controlled swarm into an unmanaged herd of drones. Calm down already pancake bees!

[donavi49]

The Armenians also thought. As a result, their advanced electronic warfare Repellent was destroyed by the UAV.

Well, this is not a wunderwaffe. And in general, very questionable efficiency. In Syria, they ignore it altogether and throw all sorts of patrolling right across Damascus. Many channels. Available protection methods. Dramatic reduction in the required volume. Yes, the video in YouTube will not come out to transfer from the ammunition board, but hang up the target mark completely, and he himself does the rest.

A swarm is not a swarm of insects, it is an application format. There can be kilometers between each UAV. And they will not use intensive exchange among themselves. Group intelligence, a la a neural network in the sky is tempting, but so far they do without it. And they will be able to push the distribution of targets through electronic warfare, or use the simplest nested algorithms.

[Horon]

RAP itself is not a panacea, it does not allow the swarm to organize, then it is necessary to destroy the UAV as an individual object. The same principle as the destruction of a package of guided or non-guided munitions. In a swarm, the main thing is to disrupt the organization. And so yes, if you just break the organization, each UAV will simply go to individual guidance. Without destruction, they are still dangerous. It is about the swarm.

[lucul]

The Armenians also thought. As a result, their advanced electronic warfare Repellent was destroyed by the UAV.

I beg you))) The Armenians had a complete set of camouflage equipment in the army - did they even use it? No . It's the same with this REP, maybe it was ... but it's Armenians ... it's already like a joke))))

[Alexander Seklitsky]

calculate their "womb" and destroy it That is, their control center.

[donavi49]

The control center is a truck. At a distance of 50-150 km. Good luck searching. And if the astro is screwed or there are repeaters in the group, then the control center is even on the other side of the earth. For example, in Afghanistan and Yemen, they often worked from the United States, that is, the operators physically sat at their home base and roasted the babakhs with hellfire using satellite channels.

This feature is already on TV2 even - that is, a light and mass UAV. In addition to Turksat4a, Turksat5 is flying soon.

[prior]

The control center is the building of the Ministry of Defense, the capital of the country.
Why chase every soldier on the battlefield if there is a headquarters?
And all the swarms of drones will land at once, and not only in a particular country ...

[lucul]

The control center is a truck. At a distance of 50-150 km. Good luck searching.

How many operators can a truck fit? )))) By radiation is detected once)))
And if there are autonomous drones, then the means of electronic warfare / electronic warfare)))

[donavi49]

Three TV-3 UAVs are controlled from one truck. Orion 2 UAVs - 3 trucks. There is no direct control. Rather, this is an extreme mode of operation, when you need to do something that is not included in the automatic profile. The operator draws a flight task, takes a picture, analyzes, corrects a flight task, hangs target markers for guiding with a teleautomat, decides to use on-board weapons or transmits and commutes data with other means (for example, a connected battery with adjustable projectiles or non-corrected ones - gives them firing parameters) ...

[lucul]

There is no direct control. Rather, this is an extreme mode of operation, when you need to do something that is not included in the automatic profile. The operator draws a flight task, takes a picture, analyzes, corrects the flight task, hangs target markers for guidance by a teleautomat,

Well, how not? Or do you want to say that the data in the drone's ROM is protected from the manufacturer's factory))) At the moment the data is transferred to the drone, the truck is detected and greetings from the MLRS arrive.

[Guards turn]

On the basis of the Tula "Pantsir-S" will create a new missile system. A new universal anti-aircraft missile system will be created in Russia on the basis of the "Pantsir-S" air defense missile system developed by the Tula Instrument Design Bureau. with ground targets.

ZRPK "Pantsir-S" is one of the first results of this concept. It is capable of effectively fighting not only airplanes, helicopters and unmanned aerial vehicles, but also destroying cruise missiles and guided aerial bombs. The Tula development is capable of hitting targets at an altitude of 15 kilometers and a range of up to 20 kilometers.

[Victor_B]

Quote: Guards turn

ZRPK "Pantsir-S" is one of the first results of this concept. It is capable of effectively fighting not only airplanes, helicopters and unmanned aerial vehicles, but also destroying cruise missiles and guided aerial bombs.

With all due respect, but still Armor is an OBJECT system, and it has nothing to do directly in the front line and on the march.
It will not go where "Maxim will crawl on his belly."
And the device itself, of course, is very worthy.

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: Guards turn

The air defense system will have combined weapons: in addition to air targets, it will be able to effectively deal with ground targets.

Well, such conversations have been "spoken" since the appearance of "Pantsir-S" and the "Hermes" project! And then they "dreamed" from the air defense missile system to shoot at tanks with "Hermes", and from self-propelled ATGM "Hermes" - at the planes .... Whoa, how many years have passed since that time! This is about the "shortest time" ...

[Guards turn]

The Pantsir-SM-SV anti-aircraft missile and cannon systems, or in other words "Super-Pantsiri", will enter the Ground Forces of the RF Armed Forces to protect the S-300V4 air defense systems. This is reported by Izvestia with reference to sources in the country's Defense Ministry.

This type of "Carapace" is the latest modification of the anti-aircraft missile-cannon system, modified specifically for the Ground Forces.

It is expected that the air defense missile systems will be covered by long-range S-300V4s from attacks by cruise missiles, small unmanned aerial vehicles and high-precision weapons. In addition, thanks to double-barreled cannons, they will be able to protect anti-aircraft missile systems in the event of an attack on marching columns and air defense positions of saboteurs.

According to Izvestia, the Russian Defense Ministry ordered the creation of the Pantsir-SM-SV complex in December 2016. The development cost exceeded 1,3 billion rubles.

At present, all the "Pantsiri" developed by the specialists of the Tula Instrument Engineering Design Bureau named after A.G. Shipunov, are supplied to the Aerospace Forces on a KamAZ wheeled chassis. The main difference of the development for the Ground Forces will be the installation of the Pantsir-SM combat module on a tracked chassis.

In addition, the ZRPK received a new radar with an active phased array. For the complex, a hypersonic missile was increased, the maximum interception range increased from 20 to 40 kilometers.

[Jacket in stock]

At least "super shell", at least "hyper shell" will stand on the ground.
This means that the detection range is deliberately limited.
Raising the radar antenna by at least a couple of hundred meters expands the radio horizon radically. And if the missile control station also looks from above, then the capabilities of the same ground missiles also increase.

[lucul]

At least "super shell", at least "hyper shell" will stand on the ground.
This means that the detection range is deliberately limited.
Raising the radar antenna at least a couple of hundred meters expands the radio horizon radically

A balloon-type UAV, powered by a helicopter with electric motors and powered through a cable, at an altitude of 1000m will solve the problem of detection.

[Boris Chernikov]

taking into account the current realities of the SM-SV, although it is a wildly expensive complex, in fact it is the only one who can really fight the entire spectrum of threats ... so the 400 Os that are in service are apparently waiting for the fate to be divided between the Torah and Armor

[K-36]

Guards turn. "installation of the Pantsir-SM combat module on a tracked chassis.

In addition, the ZRPK received a new radar with an active phased array. For the complex, a hypersonic missile was increased, the maximum interception range increased from 20 to 40 kilometers".

Back in 1980, I served as the head of the UVPK crew on the S-125 "Neva". There were as many as 6 of us (officers) in the "U" cockpit. Plus two necessary fighters (manual support operators in azimuth and elevation). Plus there was a flatbed player at the exit of the cockpit. And now all this is "in one bottle", that is, in one case on a caterpillar track. I wouldn't be surprised if they teach shooting on the go.
No, I understand that progress, this and that ... But I frankly admit that it is difficult to fit a tracked C-125 into your head right away in just one (armored, I hope) case. But the fact, as they say, is obvious! I speak from myself many thanks to the men from Tula! And the military glory of their brainchild!

[Petro_tut]

On the basis of the Tula "Pantsir-S" will create

years through tsat? He was needed yesterday ...

[Alexey from Perm]

the shortest time is 10 years?

[Nychego]

Quote: Alexey from Perm

the shortest time is 10 years?

Required is definitely faster. In 10 years, the image intensifier of the UAV will also decrease and the striking distance will increase.
I would not like to see the fighters burning bonfires, as the Armenians tried, when the gifts from Bayraktar tasted.

I will repeat once again: we need a drone fighter-interceptor UAV.

[rocket757]

So we talked about all that stuff .... just wait and see what gets done. This if they share real information ...

[Ros 56]

And this is correct, we must be ready to reflect everything that flies in our direction without permission.

[Alex Nevs]

We should not shout more often "and who did it?" And destroy the sources of decision-making. This is where the unplowed field is.

[svp67]

And Syria and Libya, this is so ... flew past.

[evgen1221]

Helicopter? What? Yes, it is the most energy-consuming and technologically complex in terms of efficiency per kg of carrier mass. Well, for long cuts in thought, go with a bang! Then the truth will be said that the idea was originally a guano and an autonomous tethered aerostat could be loaded at times on a detachable balloon, but by that time, the shock drones could die from waiting for a helicopter-type wunderwafe for constant monitoring in a threatened period and direction.

[Jacket in stock]

the latest complex of long-range radar surveillance based on a helicopter-type drone.

In fact, of the newest here is perhaps the unmanned helicopter.
And so, even in the last century, they hung radars on helicopters, the same Ka-31, for example.
It's just that scientific and technological progress now makes it possible to make the locator much smaller, and accordingly the helicopter is required less. And at the same time, get rid of the crew, which further reduces the required carrying capacity.
In theory, nothing prevents this radar from being attached to a balloon, even an airship, or an unmanned aircraft.

[Land defence]

We must work in a complex manner. Develop cheaper weapons as well.

[O. Bender]

It is necessary for the radar to be able to detect mini drones with a sufficient range to increase the time for starting the issuance of tsu and making a decision.

[Klingon]

it's time to start thinking in the direction of lasers. There are a lot of pluses. For example, a shot turns out to be penny in comparison with missiles. No need to anticipate, and so on. Of course, there are also disadvantages in the form of atmospheric interference; a sufficiently powerful and small source of energy is needed. Moreover, the groundwork was made in the USSR - the "Compression" complex, for example. ..not well, if a monster like "Peresvet" was bungled, is it really impossible to cut something more compact ??

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: Klingon

think towards lasers.

The laser also needs to first detect the target in order to know where to shoot.

[Edvid]

This should have been done ten years ago, when the first to show the capabilities of drones was not the military, but civilian amateurs to design flying models.

[Nikolaevich I]

Information about the development of the UAV-AWACS was accepted with great enthusiasm ... such a news is fully approved! For it has repeatedly "fought" for this very concept of the evolution of air defense! I have repeatedly said that it is time to introduce "flying radars" into the air defense missile systems ... that the radars on the "towers" are only a temporary measure and it is necessary to develop radars (antenna systems) on unmanned platforms! Such unmanned platforms can be autonomous or tethered! But what about the idea of ​​a "tremendous" AFAR, where each active cell element is a mini- (micro) unmanned aerial vehicle? ...

[Alexey G]

The idea is dubious, because a harpy will work on it (a helicopter-type UAV), which is easy to train for it!
It attacks any radar station operating on the ground, I think an airborne and rather slow helicopter will not be a fundamental problem! Catch up and ram in the air! Israel will even make a faster version with less ammo! Or the same, but 2,3 less ammunition!
In addition, apparently, the radar is generally not so effective for small-sized and radio-absorbing products! Here you need to invent something else!

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: Alexey G

The idea is dubious because a harpy will work on it (a helicopter-type UAV),

That's right, the harpy will come anyway.
Only from the air does the locator see much further.

[Alexey G]

For him to see further, you need to hang a large varnish on him, and he cannot fit on the UAV, unless he is like Avax!
This is first! Secondly, it is not obvious that this locator will see harpies, which are small and made of coal sticks! Thirdly, the harpy does not have locators or they are passive, but our UAVs will have them, so what? We are not visible!
And draw your own conclusions!

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: Alexey G

For him to see further, you need to hang a large varnish on him, and he cannot fit on the UAV, unless he is like Avax!

Not necessarily.
For the Earth is round, and the higher the antenna, the further it sees. This is the first
Even plastic drones have metal parts and non-zero RCS, a flying radar can be pushed forward to meet these harpies, and accordingly it is easier to detect and fire them even before they enter the field of view of ground-based radar. This is the second thing.
Again, why is the presence of powerful optics on the same helicopter excluded? Or on the same one flying nearby?

[iouris]

I represent an operator with a Chinese tablet in flying weather at minus 35. And the visibility is miles per miles!

[svoit]

Quote: carstorm 11

The only way is the same drones in huge numbers that will hunt for attackers

It is possible that it is necessary to improve the KAZ, that is, to destroy all objects flying in my direction at a distance of about 50 m, in this case both the radars and the missiles themselves will not be very expensive, since the range of their action (detection) is within 1 km

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: svoit

KAZ needs to be improved,

KAZ is essentially the same air defense system, only very close combat. This is a weapon of last resort.
Nada so that everything that can shoot could shoot into the sky.
Roughly speaking, every armored vehicle should become, if not a "derivation", then at least an "underdog".
By the way, KAZ is easily penetrated by a shock core, for example. And such ammunition has been in service for 40 years.

[DMB84]

I propose to send a swarm of interceptor drones to the drone swarm ... with shotguns ..

[iouris]

"I propose" is an application for a utility model.

[meandr51]

Probably, the locator drone is being lifted on the power cable. Below is a generator, just add diesel fuel ...

[alavrin]

Since November? Belated ... The Karabakh withdrawal is one of them. But better late than ..

[Klingon]

Quote: Jacket in stock

Quote: Klingon

think towards lasers.

The laser also needs to first detect the target in order to know where to shoot.

and missiles of the type do not need to detect the target? not all drones emit enough heat to be captured by the ICGOS and almost all small drones have an RCS comparable to that of a bird. So a powerful radar for illumination and target tracking both in the radio and in the optical part of the spectrum (active track type) is needed in any case

[tank64rus]

We all begin to cross after the thunder, and this is not Russia's main drawback. We learned about drone UAVs and their capabilities in 1995 in Yugoslavia. But we had other problems of "optimization" of everything and everyone in the Army. Well, then everything continued in one form or another. Serdyukov reduced everything, including military science, to zero. And only from the age of 12, they slowly began to restore the collapsed and plundered, and then with varying success. Sometimes you look at the comments of high-profile people and the impression is that they cannot or do not want to understand that war and a war of destruction have been declared on us. But they all have a humpbacked mentality that the West loves and helps us. Therefore, the red-haired Tolyan is settling in a new chair instead of bunks.

[agond]

Quote: tank64rus

We all begin to cross themselves after the thunder, and this is not the main drawback of Russia

Russia is not the only one who does not have effective defense against unmanned aerial vehicles, it simply does not exist in the world today, because UAVs, unlike air defense systems, are an attack weapon, and it has always been easier to attack than to repel an attack.
Alternatively, you can think about creating medium-caliber cluster anti-aircraft projectiles for automatic cannons, anti-aircraft guns and for specialized air defense missiles.

[migsu]

ALREADY. All of you are already under the electronic warfare-missile defense system of the RF Aerospace Forces.