Military Review

Features of national education

88
Features of national education

Soviet means the best?



Forgive me especially perverse readers, but in this article there will be many references not to my own, but to someone else's experience, mostly practical. But only because I consider my own experience in pedagogy and education to be clearly insufficient.

No, the basic school knowledge, fortunately, has not gone anywhere, and not everything has been forgotten from the Faculty of Journalism of the University. But through the school of the perestroika era and through the modern law faculty of the same Moscow State University, I managed to guide only my own daughter. And seriously I was lucky to teach quite respectable people in journalism courses in two newspaper offices.

However, the changes in recent years with the Unified State Exam, with total dictations, with lyceums and colleges, with almost universal tutoring for those who have money, have long pushed me to take up the pen. The last bell in this regard was the not so long ago self-confident statement of one of our reformers and optimizers, German Gref.


In fact, he made it three years ago, but I came across this reasoning only the other day. When I helped a friend prepare a reportage-presentation about one of the English schools in Moscow, which is comfortably settled in a merchant's mansion on Dostoevsky Street.

German Gref, you see, has no doubt that

"The Soviet education system is completely unacceptable."

Well, in that Russia, which we have people like Mr. Gref, are still trying to build, probably it is.

Their dreams of a free country (so to speak, absolutely), without a unifying idea and already without the last hints of social equality have not yet been realized. But in my homeland, which none of the relatives and friends is going to leave as it is now, as if it is not just the USSR that is in demand, but all the best that was there.

And the best, from the point of view of the overwhelming majority of the population, were just medicine and education. This is not counting tanks and rockets, subways, mass sports and soda.

Optimizer's view


And let the current effective manager, who has become such a zealous owner of the (generally state) Sberbank, continue to insist that

"We are trying to reproduce the old Soviet, absolutely useless educational model."

His right, but it would hardly be worth it to especially replicate such conclusions.

German Gref characterized it, the "Soviet model", as

"Stuffing children with a huge amount of knowledge."

But this is what is actually happening right now, especially with the humanities.

I have an old friend, he is a journalist, a historian, and even an atomic engineer by his first education. And by the way, she is actively tutoring. So he is just shocked by the fact that in recent years he was "crammed" into the exam and even the OGE (the main state exam - based on the results of nine years of study) stories.

But the programs in physics, chemistry and mathematics are changing precisely towards the emasculation of key concepts - both teachers and methodologists are ringing about this, among whom I also have many friends and acquaintances. Only the reformers themselves do not sound the alarm.

But in parallel with this, there is a process of replenishing school textbooks with information that is not in demand in all universities. And it was not by chance that I started talking about the fact that one should not expect any benefit from replicating the maxims of the authoritative reformer Gref about the Soviet education system.

He did not limit himself to his speech three years ago, and in fact continues to use his own official position. They are always ready to provide Gref with a tribune, and a very wide one. Although it is not entirely clear why the banker, in general, talks so much about the general education and higher education in general.

If a banker really needs to train qualified banking personnel, this is nothing more than an excuse to turn seriously to both specialized secondary and higher schools with a corresponding request. They will not be slow to answer, you can believe.

I will note that our outstanding banker German Oskarovich Gref himself received the most that neither is the Soviet education. At least that's what his official biography from Wikipedia says.

Reformer career


For those who are especially curious, let me remind you that German Gref has by no means a financial or even economic, but a legal education, like Kerensky and Lenin. Omsk State University, Faculty of Law. This, of course, is not the elite MGIMO, from where young German was either expelled, or he did not go there at all.

However, Herman Oskarovich's career took off after the Omsk State University. However, for a couple of years even under Brezhnev and even before graduation, he still had to be a legal adviser of the regional agricultural administration of the Irtysh district of the Pavlodar region. This is without higher education ...

At the university in Omsk, our optimizer advanced along the Komsomol line, and completed his postgraduate studies under the leadership of Anatoly Sobchak in St. Petersburg. Continuing, and you can't argue with that, reap the benefits of the Soviet "model of education."

True, he defended his thesis only in 2011. And here (indeed) one can forget about Soviet education. However, it seems to me that it was on him that G. Gref managed to get a job at the Ministry of State Property.

It happened in 1998, when Anatoly Chubais was no longer there, but his spirit, judging by all the signs, still remained there. Privatization then continued with leaps and bounds, although this did not save Russia from default. Although reformers and optimizers promised us something completely different.

Do no harm...


However, it is not worth continuing about Gref, because with his desire to change careers, it will be necessary to write unreasonably much. We are still talking about the education system, and among other things - not only and not so much about educational programs, but about the notorious optimization, from which, perhaps, there is more harm than good.

One widespread association of schools (in conjunction with the association of schools with kindergartens) is worth it. Suffice it to recall, what authority not only the principals of schools, but also the head teachers of the school enjoyed both among teachers and students, and among parents.

Characters such as the "Chief of the Collection" are trying with all their might to resist the generally objective process of growing nostalgia for the USSR. Almost everything good that is said is immediately called a myth. And they are making every effort to refute this myth.


I will write about myths, mythology and myth-makers below. In the meantime, I would like to note that, unlike Russia, the whole world is trying to adopt the Soviet experience in various spheres. Few, for example, paid attention to the fact that even Barack Obama, who has now played out on Trump as his Vice Biden, starting the health care reform, took the Soviet experience as a model.

Yes, along with the experience of other countries, but the social protection system in terms of medicine available to all was built on the Soviet model. Due to a purely American need and the need to commercialize everything and everyone, it turned out in the end something like this and that. But even Trump did not succeed in breaking everything to the end.

In general, here it is simply necessary to digress from the topic, justified by the fact that a teacher, like a doctor, is simply obliged to follow the principle “do no harm”. So, I am absolutely convinced that the coronavirus helped the outgoing president a lot.

Ask what? Yes, in the utterly cynical purge of the ranks of the socially unprotected public in the United States, which was not initiated by him at all. And let someone try to dissuade me of this - I received too much confirmation directly from overseas.

This is not a myth for a long time


The very assertion (by no means indisputable, I agree) that Soviet education was the best in the world has long been recorded in our myths. But why is this a myth, no one has been able to reasonably interpret it yet.

However, most of those who studied in the USSR and have not yet lost their memory are especially offended by the fact that, by debunking such a myth, we are actually forbidden to even be proud. And not only the great Victory, when ordinary ten-year graduates became excellent commanders of platoons and companies, and then of regiments and divisions.

Soviet decade, mind you, which did not hesitate to adopt all the best from the pre-revolutionary education system. And ending with the flight of Gagarin, the bomb and many years of confrontation with the entire Western world, when in the rear we were clearly threatened by the "yellow dragon" of the Celestial Empire.

And yet there were thousands of Soviet scientists and engineers who fled over the hill, who were welcomed by the same West with open arms. Well, the Russians do not want to believe that all these are myths, and that's it.

And if we have already remembered the pre-revolutionary, gymnasium education, then no matter how criticized the Soviet and post-Soviet heirs, it really was so strong that it did not lose its best qualities even now. By the way, more than half of the scientists - participants in the same atomic project - were still graduates of tsarist grammar schools.

Or, for example, today with half a sin it is possible to train schoolchildren on the basics of only two foreign languages. But my friend's grandmother, still a pre-revolutionary graduate of an ordinary gymnasium in the village of Kamenskaya, who later went through a paramedic veterinary and medical school, until the end of her days (at the end of the 80s) conducted active correspondence in three languages ​​at once.

Foreign, besides Russian. As you can imagine, not only with friends and family, or relatives of friends, but also simply with acquaintances whom fate has scattered all over the world.

Not a single test



Of the latest alleged myths, I will focus on only one. Educational reformers are doing their best to defend the system of the OGE and the Unified State Examination. Roughly like reformers from another sphere - raising the retirement age. You might think that it is tests instead of exams that are the worst thing in the optimization and reform of education.

Not at all, much more terrifying (in my opinion) is the rejection of the very essence of education, when in schools and even in universities not so much a set of knowledge is given, as there is education and training in the very ability to learn. That is, to gain knowledge even after school and university.

And it is by no means accidental, for the most part, the "indigestion" from the OGE and the Unified State Exam, already obvious to many, leads to the fact that they slowly, but it seems, very surely mutate towards the old traditional exams. After all, in almost all subjects there are more and more questions with far from unambiguous answers, tasks for consideration or some essays, where the final grade is given not by a robot, but by a person.

So it is not so far before returning to the direct examination. Fortunately, domestic education did not die with the introduction of the USE. Such a statement is indeed a myth. Although the notorious nonsense in test questions and assignments is not getting any less.

But most likely only because the testers are panicky afraid of repetitions and the fact that their charges, the test takers, will learn from their predecessors, and from each other as well. Although it has long been proven that there is often much more benefit from competent cheating than harm.


For what, for what, oh my God?


In conclusion, it remains only to recall what prompted the current head of our "national" Sberbank to the first critical attack on Soviet education.

Now, this was just a regular article in The Economist. Yes, authoritative. Yes, British. Where in the essay about one of the best schools in Great Britain it was told how this top educational institution switched to the Soviet education system:

“For a glimpse into the influence of the Soviet Union on English education, go to sixth grade college in Lambeth, a 20-minute walk from Parliament. This is where King's College London Mathematical School is located. The school is modeled on the Kolmogorov School of Physics and Mathematics in Moscow, which since the mid-1960s has provided Soviet students with the best mathematics education in the country.

Michael Gove, UK Minister of Education from 2010 to 2014, imported the idea, pushing universities to create specialized math colleges. The goal was for any child to receive an "Eaton-level education" in math or physics, recalls Dominic Cummings, a former adviser to Gove.
Author:
Photos used:
from the author's archive, r4.mt.ru, selgazeta.ru, mestniaevesti.ru
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  1. Antonio_Mariarti
    Antonio_Mariarti 1 December 2020 10: 15
    -13%
    Technical education was really one of the best, apart from the persecution of genetics. But the humanitarian was nowhere worse, so they could not release intelligent reformists, especially in terms of the economy, which cost the USSR's dependence on the West at the end of the USSR's existence.
    1. Svarog
      Svarog 1 December 2020 10: 30
      +20
      Now, this was just a regular article in The Economist. Yes, authoritative. Yes, British. Where in the essay about one of the best schools in Great Britain it was told how this top educational institution switched to the Soviet education system:

      I believe that when from the best they go to the side of the worst, then this is purposeful sabotage. Education in the USSR was the best in the world, and many things in the USSR were the best .. But our "reformers" undertake to reform the best .. and they continue to use the worst .. So what is it? Purposeful, knowing killing.
      1. astepanov
        astepanov 1 December 2020 11: 53
        +10
        Quote: Svarog
        this is purposeful sabotage.
        It's not about sabotage, but about the mentality of people like these Grefs, Chubais and other Rogozins and Bulls. Remember how it all began: at first, education was made absolutely poor, and teachers were deprived of their salaries and equated with representatives of the "service sector." Then, believing that the teachers were the same public as the reformers themselves, they announced that they were all bribe-takers and gave marks for bribes. Further, chrenations began: the introduction of a system of standards in which the teacher is separated from the assessment of knowledge, and the procedure itself is formalized and uniform to the limit. It was under the guise of a fight against mythical bribery that this was carried out, although now they are trying to present it in such a way that they sought to improve education. On the way out we got what we got. Further, I suppose, there will be a complete transition to "distance learning" and learning from films instead of live communication with a teacher, learning without practical training - and the result will be something indigestible. However, I have already dealt with graduates of technical universities who are "familiar" with computers, but do not understand the basic foundations of science, or chemists who do not have practical skills in working with matter. Another result is a multiple decline in the prestige of the teaching profession, a drop in competition for teacher training universities. Someone, perhaps, goes there by vocation, but more often - because the path to another university is closed due to greater competition and high passing scores. All this is not just sad - it is the threshold of collapse. What has been broken and disfigured for over twenty years cannot be fixed in decades. Especially when the Grefs and their patrons are in power.
        1. Svarog
          Svarog 1 December 2020 13: 50
          +3
          Quote: astepanov
          All this is not just sad - it is the threshold of collapse.

          I agree with you. But what's the difference under what pretext they kill ..
      2. paul3390
        paul3390 1 December 2020 12: 02
        +10
        Because 30 years ago, the dying enemies of the people and the country came to power .. And since then, nothing has changed. Accordingly, none of their activities, in principle, can be useful and correct. By definition. Only to the detriment.
      3. antivirus
        antivirus 1 December 2020 15: 43
        -1
        I'm like a lousy about a comb ... or a bath?

        the basis of everything is the upbringing of children who will become teachers by vocation. everything was lost 20-30 years ago.
        to work those aunts-teachers for another 10-20 years and do not expect the result.
        they survived in the 90s, earning money, including striptease.
        The level of upbringing and education of tomorrow's geeks was determined in nightclubs in the 90s and 00s
        1. Kisa
          Kisa 1 December 2020 21: 43
          0
          I don’t know about you, but in my class the girls who did not enter the old universe all went to ped as the last choice. and it seems now this is not an enviable profession worse than only a nurse gets.
          Yes, I remember always being proud of the level of higher education, especially in Ukraine - but for some reason they lived so-so without toilet paper ...
      4. Podvodnik
        Podvodnik 3 December 2020 19: 35
        0
        Education in the USSR was the best in the world


        Unfortunately, I cannot compare with the modern one. Not a teacher. This assessment can only be given by professors - they have seen both "this" and "this" education. Maybe this grumble about poor education is just a normal conflict between fathers and children? Like a classic:
        "Yes, there were people in our time,
        Not that the present tribe:
        Bogatyri - not you!
        They got a bad share ... (from)

        According to my observations about "that" secondary education (graduation of 1984): in the class 1-2 excellent students. They cut everything. 4-7 good guys. They can also hack in everything, but they are a little lazy. The rest are C grade. Well, a couple of outright dunce. It's the same in universities. However, the Lomonosovs are not being translated.
        Maybe a whine in vain?
        1. aleksejkabanets
          aleksejkabanets 6 December 2020 10: 24
          0
          Quote: Podvodnik
          Unfortunately, I cannot compare with the modern one. Not a teacher. This assessment can only be given by professors - they have seen both "this" and "this" education. Maybe this grumble about poor education is just a normal conflict between fathers and children?

          Just compare the tutorials. Start with primers, compare modern and Soviet. If you are observant you will find many interesting things, both in terms of education and upbringing. After all, any textbook also carries an educational load.
    2. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 1 December 2020 10: 47
      +21
      Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
      But the humanitarian was nowhere worse, so failed to release intelligent reformists ...

      And reformers? belay
      Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
      which was the cost of the USSR's dependence on the West at the end of the USSR's existence.

      In the final phase of the completion of the destruction of the socialist structure, an important role was played by reformers and simply scoundrels who received an "education" in the very West:

      Do you recognize?
      1. Essex62
        Essex62 1 December 2020 17: 01
        +3
        This is a document for the future criminal case and court. It is worth keeping. The Revolutionary Tribunal uses a photographic fact and a signature to it.
      2. skobars
        skobars 2 December 2020 00: 07
        0
        Here are the nits responsible for the collapse of the USSR. Especially the ginger bastard.
        1. Podvodnik
          Podvodnik 3 December 2020 19: 38
          0
          Here are the nits guilty of the collapse of the USSR


          The USSR did not collapse because of them. The lies are to blame for everything.
          When they say one thing, but before our eyes another.
    3. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
      Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 1 December 2020 11: 00
      +9
      Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
      therefore they could not release sensible reformists, especially in terms of economics,

      Iron logic: to forge cadres of market managers in the spirit of the Western economic model in a country with a state-planned economy laughing
    4. neri73-r
      neri73-r 1 December 2020 11: 07
      +12
      Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
      But the humanitarian was nowhere worse, so they could not release intelligent reformists, especially in terms of the economy, which was the cost of the USSR's dependence on the West at the end of the USSR's existence.

      At least a strange conclusion! Reformists were brought up and imposed on us from the West! Nobody says they were not literate! What does education have to do with it? Self-interest and vanity has never been canceled in any society!
      1. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 1 December 2020 19: 12
        +2
        Quote: neri73-r
        Nobody says they were not literate!

        I, after all, would draw the line between "literacy" and "education". They can be called educated specialists in the field of speculation and psychology. Look at how successfully they "played" their play on the collapse of the USSR using only the simplest human instincts and various forms and methods of "relatively honest" withdrawal of money from citizens and from the state treasury.
        It is incomprehensible to the mind how the values ​​accumulated by all the people were "piled up" at bargain prices for personal gain. And the people pulled themselves up to this redistribution. "Tyrili" and "grabbed" who could. And the peak of the Gaidar-Chubais reforms is a practical transition to natural exchange ...
    5. Aviator_
      Aviator_ 1 December 2020 11: 27
      +3
      failed to release smart reformists, especially in terms of economicsе

      Actually, in this case, one should write "economicsи".
      And further. Reformers without the development of social sciences - this is what grew up under Khrushchev and Brezhnev - continuous worship of the works of the classics of Marxism-Leninism, written at another time and on a different occasion. And Joseph wrote - "without a theory, we will die." And so it happened.
    6. Maxim Aranson
      Maxim Aranson 25 January 2021 17: 31
      0
      Ecoomics is actually never a humanitarian area.
  2. Airdefense
    Airdefense 1 December 2020 10: 21
    +3
    School education and now in Russia at a high level, I can compare Russian and European, higher technical is also quite acceptable, provided that students want to study.

    As for the humanitarian, here I am not strong, but I suspect that the economic is clearly inferior to the Western.
    1. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 1 December 2020 19: 18
      +1
      Quote: Airdefense
      As for the humanitarian, here I am not strong, but I suspect that the economic is clearly inferior to the Western.

      And I do not think that modern Russian education is capable of giving a real personality, a real statesman, under whom "the state is getting rich." Technical education does not give us breakthroughs either in mechanics or in electronics ... And plugging holes by “effective managers” with European salaries does not guarantee European product quality.
      1. Airdefense
        Airdefense 1 December 2020 19: 43
        -1
        Technical education does not give us breakthroughs in either mechanics or electronics ...

        To get such a breakthrough education is only one of the criteria. Russia (and most of the world) loses to the United States in the struggle for talents if a person is included in the top XNUMX in the world in his area of ​​expertise, but he will most effectively open up and apply his knowledge in the United States.
        This is the reality now, the main then "brains" goes to the USA in the USA and most of the breakthroughs take place. Moreover, such a flow could be explained by a purely financial interest or a low standard of living, but after all, people from Europe also go to the United States, although not in such an amount as from Russia, but they do.

        What else, in my opinion, will “save” Russia is that knowledge of English is not the highest in the country on average and is greatly reduced not in the IT industry.
      2. Podvodnik
        Podvodnik 3 December 2020 19: 43
        0
        But I don't think that modern Russian education is capable of giving a real personality


        "There are few real violent, so there are no leaders" (c)
        Capable. Only "PERSONALITY" with a capital letter is a very rare thing. It appears a couple of times every hundred years.
  3. Daniil Konovalenko
    Daniil Konovalenko 1 December 2020 10: 26
    +9
    Yes, there was a normal education. Today's education was spoiled by the Internet. On the one hand, a good thing, there are many sources where you can find the answer. On the other hand, there are a lot of ready-made answers that the student cannot substantiate, relying seemingly on existing knowledge. Learning by the principle of memorized and forgotten.
    1. Skay
      Skay 1 December 2020 10: 30
      +12
      Today's education has been spoiled by the internet.

      Considering the unfolding war with the traditional school, Internet education will do the trick.
    2. Boris55
      Boris55 1 December 2020 10: 55
      -4
      Quote: Daniil Konovalenko
      Learning by memorizing and forgetting.

      All education is built not on the concept of material, but on memorizing it, and the system itself is built in such a way that with the number of ~ 30 students in a class, nothing else is possible. Schools suffer from these shortcomings both in tsarist times and in Soviet times, and even more so in the present.

      Individual members of our society have the ability to memorize a large amount of information, but not understand what they have memorized. It is for them that all education in the World is sharpened, but since they do not understand the essence of what they have learned, they become easily controllable by those who organized such a method of teaching, while at the same time raising in the rational minds a hatred of learning and the cultivation of biorobots who do not understand anything.

      Being smart and reasonable is not the same thing.
      The school is tailored for the smart, but I would like it to be for the smart.

      The clever one built the Titanic, the clever one - Noah's ark.
      The smart one has created a nuclear bomb, the smart one has created a nuclear power plant.
      Smart launched a ballistic missile (FAU-1,2), intelligent launched a man into space.

      The world will not be saved by the smart, but by the reasonable.

      Quote: Skay
      Given the unfolding war with the traditional school, online education will

      It will not finish if the training is organized correctly. All in all, it is necessary that the students ask questions on the proposed topic to the teacher, and the teacher answers them.

      Think nonsense?

      And you will remember how your little children asked you countless questions and how you tried to answer them, and how accurately and correctly you answered them, it depends how your child will grow up. Why should school be different?
      1. Skay
        Skay 1 December 2020 11: 36
        +2
        It will not finish if the training is organized correctly. All in all, it is necessary that the students ask questions on the proposed topic to the teacher, and the teacher answers them.

        Sad thoughts torment me that living teachers in digital education are an endangered species.
      2. pereselenec
        pereselenec 1 December 2020 11: 40
        -1
        Quote: Boris55
        Being smart and reasonable is not the same thing.
        The school is tailored for the smart, but I would like it to be for the smart.

        The clever one built the Titanic, the clever one - Noah's ark.
        The smart one has created a nuclear bomb, the smart one has created a nuclear power plant.
        Smart launched a ballistic missile (FAU-1,2), intelligent launched a man into space.


        Zadornovshchina breathed.
    3. Aag
      Aag 1 December 2020 16: 02
      +2
      "... Learning by the principle of memorized and forgotten ..."
      Probably googled and forgot? Moreover, without delving into the essence.
      1. Daniil Konovalenko
        Daniil Konovalenko 1 December 2020 16: 04
        +2
        Yes exactly.
    4. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 1 December 2020 19: 24
      +1
      Quote: Daniil Konovalenko
      Today's education has been spoiled by the internet.

      The Internet? Yes, if in the 60s I had the opportunity to draw information, as today's generation does.
      Quote: Daniil Konovalenko
      Learning by memorizing and forgetting.

      I'll tell you this. The man (a young man - a graduate of the school) has lost the reference points of his own application. He cannot even determine where he can “stick” with his baggage of knowledge. Yes, in trading networks, knowledge of resistance to materials and higher mathematics is not required. And where in-depth knowledge and high professionalism are needed, such a salary that it is astonishing is how other people work there.
  4. vvvjak
    vvvjak 1 December 2020 10: 35
    -4
    Somehow "everything got mixed up in the Oblonskys' house." And Soviet education, and pre-revolutionary, and current, and the personality of the reformers. And most importantly, what does the author offer in the end? Maybe we need to return to the pre-revolutionary system with an emphasis on studying the "law of God" in parish schools or gymnasiums (in which only a few percent of children from noble families were educated)? Or again "we will destroy the whole world of violence to the ground, and then ........"? Or simply Gref needs to be "abolished", like let the bank "kick", but don't go into education (not a hat for Senka)?
    1. Rostov Papa
      Rostov Papa 1 December 2020 11: 11
      +2
      An article about Gref)))
      1. vvvjak
        vvvjak 1 December 2020 11: 20
        +1
        Quote: Rostov Dad
        An article about Gref)))

        And that Gref has already become a modern Makarenko?
        1. Rostov Papa
          Rostov Papa 1 December 2020 11: 33
          0
          Take higher, Sukhomlinsky
          1. vvvjak
            vvvjak 1 December 2020 11: 40
            +2
            The Russian land is generous with "talents".
  5. vadimN
    vadimN 1 December 2020 10: 35
    +11
    Colleagues! The article, in my opinion, is not so much about education as about the personality of the "banker-reformer-optimizer". Do not find an analogy: B. Gates suddenly transformed from a computer scientist into a great infectious disease specialist. Banker G. Gref suddenly became concerned with education .... Don't you think that some of the characters in the World imagined themselves as celestials and arbiters of other people's destinies? Having sufficient material resources, they decided to translate the conspiracy version of building a global digital concentration camp into reality. This can be seen most clearly in Sberbank's actions.
    1. Aag
      Aag 1 December 2020 16: 50
      0
      Quote: vadimN
      Colleagues! The article, in my opinion, is not so much about education as about the personality of the "banker-reformer-optimizer". Do not find an analogy: B. Gates suddenly transformed from a computer scientist into a great infectious disease specialist. Banker G. Gref suddenly became concerned with education .... Don't you think that some of the characters in the World imagined themselves as celestials and arbiters of other people's destinies? Having sufficient material resources, they decided to translate the conspiracy version of building a global digital concentration camp into reality. This can be seen most clearly in Sberbank's actions.

      Thanks to the author for the article! Despite the controversy (IMHO) of some of the conclusions and statements, I generally agree. And, in my opinion, dear vadimN, the author in the article was puzzled by the question of where, why we are being led on the example of education, as a sphere closer to her Gref appears there only as an ardent representative of the herringbone who sets the direction of movement (movement can be straight and curvilinear, forward, reverse ...))
      Yes, of course, his words about the redundancy of education along with
      others, for example: "There is no money, but you are holding on ...", and many others, shocked compatriots, and no doubt should enter the encyclopedia ... let's come up with a name together.
      ... About conspiracy ... In short: a plan without intent, a fiction. hi
  6. Egoza
    Egoza 1 December 2020 10: 49
    +11
    I can't say "for all education", but when children have changed 4 teachers since the beginning of the school year, or when English is taught by an Armenian (I have nothing against the nationality itself), who speaks bad Russian .... do not expect that knowledge in humanitarian subjects will be at the level of Soviet education
    1. Free wind
      Free wind 1 December 2020 11: 50
      -2
      So maybe she's fluent in English? laughing Earlier, they wrote governors from France, who did not understand Russian belmes, although they were often fencers.
      1. Egoza
        Egoza 1 December 2020 17: 20
        +1
        Quote: Free Wind
        Earlier, they wrote out governors from France, who did not understand Russian belmes,

        So it is necessary to subscribe Eliza Doolittle, at least from England
  7. Cowbra
    Cowbra 1 December 2020 10: 57
    -3
    Tatiana, forgive me, you have to be beaten with a mop stick ... You give an example. well, how is the degeneration of education:
    German Gref, you see, has no doubt that
    "The Soviet education system is completely unacceptable."

    And you - I stress you - do not give reasons why Gref said this. Whether he is right or not is another question, you - YOU just now have arranged a school. pulling out a phrase - and starting to dance over it. Terrible. madam
    Why and what did he say ?! Tatiana. Not really. right
  8. lucul
    lucul 1 December 2020 11: 19
    0
    The very assertion (by no means indisputable, I agree) that Soviet education was the best in the world has long been recorded in our myths. But why is this a myth, no one has been able to reasonably interpret it yet.

    If the author does not understand this, then I will explain.))))
    The Soviet education system was certainly the best in the world ... but the best in the world in training people SUBMITTED, that is, roughly speaking - performers.
    The leaders (leaders) were simply not trained (it is dangerous - there is a possibility of a coup). Nowhere did they teach the art of manipulation and subjugation of people, considering it incompatible with Soviet education and upbringing (this was taught only at the KGB school).
    But excuse me - in the West, the ability to manipulate and subjugate other people to your will is considered one of the key parameters of a manager. That is why schools for the rich are taught this.
    The USSR, on the other hand, went its own way - he diligently nurtured all promising managers (by nature), from a foreman to a plant director and then to a minister and above. The trouble is that leaders (by nature) are born too few to be enough for the whole country. Therefore, the USSR has been chasing the scourge of a shortage of qualified managers for 70 years.
    What, didn't anyone come across unskilled bosses? It seems that he has a higher education, but he does not know how to manage people at all, this is not his, and they did not teach him this.
    1. Wizzzard
      Wizzzard 1 December 2020 14: 17
      +2
      Quote: lucul
      The very assertion (by no means indisputable, I agree) that Soviet education was the best in the world has long been recorded in our myths. But why is this a myth, no one has been able to reasonably interpret it yet.

      If the author does not understand this, then I will explain.))))
      The Soviet education system was certainly the best in the world ... but the best in the world in training people SUBMITTED, that is, roughly speaking - performers.
      The leaders (leaders) were simply not trained (it is dangerous - there is a possibility of a coup). Nowhere did they teach the art of manipulation and subjugation of people, considering it incompatible with Soviet education and upbringing (this was taught only at the KGB school).
      But excuse me - in the West, the ability to manipulate and subjugate other people to your will is considered one of the key parameters of a manager. That is why schools for the rich are taught this.
      The USSR, on the other hand, went its own way - he diligently cultivated all promising managers (by nature), from a foreman to a plant director and then to a minister and above. The trouble is that leaders (by nature) are born too few to be enough for the whole country. Therefore, the USSR has been chasing the scourge of a shortage of qualified managers for 70 years. .

      With the last moment, can you give more details? Are there few leaders (by nature)? I agree. But why do you think that few of them were born in the USSR ??? It is the same in the United States and in Zimbab (adjusted for realities). Next, share from what sources the statement is taken that in the West in schools (!!!) teach the ability to manipulate? Or is this from personal experience? Let me argue. (For there is personal experience.) There is nothing like this either in the schools of North America (USA-Canada) or in Britain. No - from the word at all.
      Ability to discuss - yes, they teach. Ability to include logic - too. And the famous "textbook" of Green's manipulation "48 laws of power", by the way, is prohibited for both prison and school libraries.
      I am not writing all this in defense of Western education. It uniquely worse than the Soviet one. But let's discuss all the same with the facts in hand.
      1. lucul
        lucul 1 December 2020 15: 32
        0
        Further, share, from what sources is the statement taken that in the West in schools (!!!) they teach the ability to manipulate?

        It is written - schools for the RICH, not ordinary schools. Take an interest, for example, about the education of the current British prime minister, and of all the previous prime ministers. See what they all ended up with.
        1. Aag
          Aag 1 December 2020 17: 04
          +1
          Quote: lucul
          Further, share, from what sources is the statement taken that in the West in schools (!!!) they teach the ability to manipulate?

          It is written - schools for the RICH, not ordinary schools. Take an interest, for example, about the education of the current British prime minister, and of all the previous prime ministers. See what they all ended up with.

          Is it really a KGB school ?!)))
    2. Aag
      Aag 1 December 2020 20: 28
      0
      Quote: lucul
      The very statement (by no means indisputable, I agree) that Soviet education was the best in the world has long been recorded in our myths. But why is this a myth, no one has been able to reasonably interpret it yet.

      If the author does not understand this, then I will explain.))))
      The Soviet education system was certainly the best in the world ... but the best in the world in training people SUBMITTED, that is, roughly speaking - performers.
      The leaders (leaders) were simply not trained (it is dangerous - there is a possibility of a coup). Nowhere did they teach the art of manipulation and subjugation of people, considering it incompatible with Soviet education and upbringing (this was taught only at the KGB school).
      But excuse me - in the West, the ability to manipulate and subjugate other people to your will is considered one of the key parameters of a manager. That is why schools for the rich are taught this.
      The USSR, on the other hand, went its own way - he diligently nurtured all promising managers (by nature), from a foreman to a plant director and then to a minister and above. The trouble is that leaders (by nature) are born too few to be enough for the whole country. Therefore, the USSR has been chasing the scourge of a shortage of qualified managers for 70 years.
      What, didn't anyone come across unskilled bosses? It seems that he has a higher education, but he does not know how to manage people at all, this is not his, and they did not teach him this.

      Dear lucul, Often, it seems to me that you are undeservedly minus. In this particular case (comments) I do not agree with you.
      Even the author makes a reservation: "... not indisputable, I agree) that Soviet education was the best in the world ..." And I agree with her, it could have been better. But, in different ways, better than the current one, and more than the proposed, or rather the implanted.
      Well, it's rhetoric.
      Further on your post ... You identify the "SUBJECTS" and performers. IMHO: this is not the same thing. In the USSR, and now, these are different meanings.
      About manipulation ... In the USSR, the word "manipulator" could sound in two contexts - the manipulator of the lunar rover and the manipulator of a deep-sea vehicle!
      "Manipulations" at the level of the chairman of the village council, the director of the plant were easily calculated by the people's spontaneity, wisdom, if you like, and punished. At the same time, "along the party line", there was such a weighty argument ... True, I cannot understand why it has been in recent years The union was still working, apparently by inertia).
      Works by G.Ford, D.Cornegie, etc. came to us later. I suspect, not without outside help. Yes, they are interesting, yes, they are useful, during the period of survival in the 90s. But they destroy our mentality. Some of their students regularly call on behalf of Sberbank. Apparently, from places not so remote.)) Some managers should learn from psychology, skills and abilities! ..
      You write: "submission of people to YOURSELF ..." further in the text ..
      There was no need for this! Tasks. Objectives. If we abstract from the building of communism (which also should not be completely excluded at that time, at least hypothetically, ideologically), then there was always a collective desire to "give a plan three days earlier than planned", and etc. In the current realities, corporate interest. Previously, - "the initiative of the masses" (vulgar, but present). Yes, simply, social competition! It worked! For the time being, brigade in a row .. Sorry, long, tedious ... I will speed up.
      The Union had its own goals and objectives. For a long time, it was quite successfully implementing them and solving them. How was it "leaked"? Was it not without the help of the KGB? Who was taught manipulation (from your statements), and he imagined something about himself? ( with personalities and, of course, it was necessary to teach how to work) I am not saying anything, I am trying to understand.
      Leadership (respect for the collective, -in the Soviet era) was built on other principles. To put it very briefly, “Do as I do!” Such a good army principle ...
      I immediately recall Uncle Vasya, a friend, an older comrade of my father ... Then, my current peer, head of the 9th department of OZGA 85, Riga, veteran of the Great Patriotic War, regimental officer (if I am not mistaken, reconnaissance, three wounds, two contusions , full Knight of the Order of the Red Star, several rows of medals, not jubilee). Do you think he then had a need to "manipulate" anyone? No! And it's not even a matter of the front-line past. In my childhood there were enough of them: I remember columns of "stumps" in the rearguard of demonstrations, parades, the ringing of orders and medals of which was drowned out by the rumble of bearings on wooden shields, there were no ramps or wheelchairs then. ((
      Simply, simply (!) "Managers" "grew" from the machine tool to the bosses sometimes - to the ministers.
      And you mean manipulation ... So you got to "effective management" ..
      I have nothing against being in line with modern realities, but you shouldn't replace efficiency with showiness.
      Well, you yourself, in part, come into conflict with yourself, talking about the innate ability to lead. Even if a person is given knowledge of team management, without skills, abilities, he will not succeed if he lacks certain talents. , people from the army, production teams will agree with me.
      Everything about the "qualifications of managers" - and I finish ... IMHO: we stumbled, just not on the lack of personnel to effectively manage certain industries, but on the fact that the appointees came to manage with their authoritarian quirks, without elementary understanding process Be it education, production, medicine ... And in deputies, consultants, they appointed people not according to prof. suitability, but on the basis of ... kinship, loyalty, devotion, finally ...
      As a result, one more point on which I disagree with your comment ... Sorry, I pulled it out of context: "lack of managers ...," I expressed my opinion about "qualifications". Now, from quality to quantity. There are doubts about trends, ratios; in comparison with the Union? And if you also count in salaries? Well, let's say the salary of a Duma member in ℅ of GDP (I'm talking about the gross product))) in the Russian Federation and the USSR. No, better, more objective: the salary ratio working in the Union (RF), with the salary of a deputy of the USSR (RF). At least, according to open sources. Without delving into the benefits ..
      Sadly all this ... hi
      Sorry for the tediousness ...
      1. lucul
        lucul 1 December 2020 20: 48
        -1
        Everything about the "qualifications of managers" - and I finish ... IMHO: we stumbled not on the lack of personnel to effectively manage these or those industries, but on the fact that the appointees came to manage with their authoritarian quirks, without elementary understanding process

        Read the article, you will be interested.
        https://m.habr.com/ru/post/297678/

        The fact is that without knowing about evil, it is impossible to fight it. To successfully resist manipulation, you need to understand how it works. It's like a wife manipulates her husband - if you don't know the manipulation techniques, it is very difficult to resist them.
        1. Aag
          Aag 1 December 2020 21: 28
          0
          Thank you. Sorry, later.
    3. your1970
      your1970 2 December 2020 08: 16
      0
      The first time I absolutely agree with your opinion !!!!
      Several times they tried to shove me into the bosses - I broke off, because I know that either I will scream wildly or I will do for subordinates their duties - failing to force them ...
      And my superiors, knowing this, still tried to appoint me ...
      And others were appointed ...
  9. BAI
    BAI 1 December 2020 11: 22
    +3
    he defended his dissertation only in 2011. And here (indeed) one can forget about Soviet education.

    Yes, here and the authorship is not a sin to check.
  10. pereselenec
    pereselenec 1 December 2020 11: 35
    -4
    The very assertion (by no means indisputable, I agree) that Soviet education was the best in the world has long been recorded in our myths. But why is this a myth, no one has been able to reasonably interpret it yet.


    1. Ryaruav
      Ryaruav 1 December 2020 20: 22
      0
      and you have horoscopes and you are a monkey, a pig or a rooster in China, it will be worse than our clever
  11. Free wind
    Free wind 1 December 2020 12: 01
    -1
    If the parents hammered a bolt on the kinder, what education can do. And if earlier a good worker could live comfortably and was in demand, now judges, prosecutors, etc. are living well, clans are already being created. Nevertheless, now the Internet offers great opportunities. And you still need to have the ability to languages, I don’t remember anything from English except maze and phase.
  12. Desperado
    Desperado 1 December 2020 12: 15
    0
    That's right, according to official data, the largest number of homework assignments is given in Greece and Russia. As a result, children up to grades 8-9 are deprived of practically free time, and if we add circles here, then the load, primarily psycho-emotional, increases many times over.
    Among the countries leading in terms of education in the world is, oddly enough, Finland. The maximum number of students per class varies from 8 to 20 depending on the school. Students are not given grades until the 6th grade. Teachers do not single out leaders among students, everyone is equal. The main emphasis is on the accessible presentation of knowledge and the logic where this knowledge can be applied.
    The first grades (oddly enough) are generally in kindergartens, where children are calmly prepared for school programs in a comfortable environment. How many children are there in our classes? Classes of 30-35 children are already a rule, especially in large cities. The more children there are in primary school, the lower the level of their assimilation of material in schools.
    What prevents schools from doing more and with a large number of classes? It's simple, the low level of management and the lack of an adequate forecast of the number of seats on the part of government agencies responsible for the standards. And the builders are not interested in building social objects instead of "human beings". First "meters", then schools. They can be understood, according to Federal Law 214, funds for the construction of social infrastructure can only be withdrawn from profit. So it is necessary to change the Federal Law, regardless of who is there "above" what he thinks.
    Excuses like "no money" should not be put at the forefront. If the governor is not able to push through the programs for the development of schools in his region at the federal level, he is worthless, he simply takes the wrong place, or is simply planted there so that another does not take (cross out which is more precise).
    Children are the future of the country and the nation, if we start to economize on education for the sake of other items of expenditure, then we just become like dinosaurs, and they, as you know, finished badly ...
  13. From Tomsk
    From Tomsk 1 December 2020 12: 19
    0
    In reality, the difference between British education and others is that most schools in the UK, even public ones, are boarding schools. That is, students in them not only attend classes, but also live. Therefore, all guesthouses have a large fenced area (in fact, a small campus), which houses educational and residential buildings and, of course, a sports center. If the British primary school places a lot of emphasis on community, the middle school places a premium on education and upbringing. Moreover, the concept of "education" includes not only training, but also the skills of rhetoric, working with text and information, the ability to speak in front of an audience and an understanding of art - both classical and modern.
    This is the difference.
    And the similarity to Soviet education lies in the fact that education in the Soviet Union was closely related to the upbringing and formation of personality traits. The Soviet school was called upon not only to solve general educational problems, teaching students knowledge of the laws of the development of nature, society and thinking, labor skills and abilities, but also to form on this basis the communist views and beliefs of students, to educate students in the spirit of high morality, Soviet patriotism and proletarian internationalism .Now this is not, namely the emphasis on morality and education.
    This is the difference from the Soviet education system.
    About the article in The Economist.
    here is 1 article:
    https://www.economist.com/britain/2017/01/28/why-a-top-unive...
    here is the 2nd:
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/...
    Both articles say only that English universities are adopting the practice of creating colleges in mathematics for gifted children 15 years old. And that's it
    1. Hagen
      Hagen 1 December 2020 18: 27
      0
      Quote: From Tomsk
      The Soviet school was called upon ........ to form on this basis the communist views and convictions of students, to educate students in the spirit of high morality, Soviet patriotism and proletarian internationalism.

      I would like to draw attention to the fact that all the Grefs, Chubais, Russian billionaires, everyone who destroyed the USSR and profited from it, gained "dough" by killing competitors in the 90s - everyone was brought up by the Soviet system of education, which, as you say , not today. But, as you can see, it worked "every other time". In my opinion, the most effective way of education is by example. And no matter how much they talked about patriotism, internationalism, equality and brotherhood, everyone saw perfectly well that the district committee, regional committee, professors, directors, etc. "more equal and more patriotic" than everyone else. And they drew the appropriate conclusions. There is one more difference between the Soviet system, this is a fabulous love for exaggerated beautiful statistics. You can be "wooden" to the top of your head, you will still be "held out" to the certificate. They will suffer themselves, torture the surrounding children from the class, but they will hold out. The question is, why? And for statistics. And I think you don't want to work on yourself, ignore your teachers - get the earned deuces, a certificate and walk with it for all four ... The brain will wake up, if you want to get out of the janitors to become a deputy, you will hire a personal teacher and fill in the gaps, but for your account. And if at the same time, you are also being rude to your teacher, then here the state should look "menacingly" at the elders in this family and make it extremely unprofitable for the student to behave this way. I'm not talking about assault on a teacher - a criminal case and all the ensuing consequences. A teacher from school should go home in a normal mood, with a desire to come there again tomorrow and bring good and eternal things to his students. In our country, from time to time, the situation is radically different, and therefore poor teachers wander to school in the morning, as if to hard labor, and dream of escaping from it at an opportunity. This is probably the first and most important thing to do in education today. Only then can we talk about reforms, the Unified State Exam, programs and biases in schools.
      1. your1970
        your1970 2 December 2020 08: 38
        0
        Quote: Hagen
        earned deuces, a certificate and walk with her for all four ... The brain will wake up, want to get out of the janitors to become a deputy, - you will hire a personal teacher and fill in the gaps, but at your own expense.

        Now they will run and shout, "They are taking away the last social elevator from the poor !!!!!"
        1. Hagen
          Hagen 2 December 2020 11: 21
          -1
          Quote: your1970
          Now they will run and shout, "They are taking away the last social elevator from the poor !!!!!"

          Let them shout. The main thing is to understand that these elevators should be used by those who, by their labor, have proven that they are able to climb. A social elevator is not a place in a disco, there are no extras there.
    2. Aag
      Aag 1 December 2020 20: 56
      0
      Greetings! Let me find out where the information comes from, by links, or are there any familiar relatives? No, not yet from the authorities.)) There is a relative, an emigrant from the former Soviet republic who settled in London ... Together with his wife, they hid the Soviet university education, they study at Harvard for FREE. They do not make contact))).
  14. Ragnarok
    Ragnarok 1 December 2020 12: 19
    +2
    They have already openly admitted that they need only consumers. An atomized and amorphous society without a spiritual core - this is what the enemies need to successfully siphon the vitality from the nation, and such decomposition certainly requires the destruction of the system for maintaining high moral values ​​and the creation of false guidelines that will urge the people to follow the most simple and a seemingly pleasant path - the path of guile, betrayal and appropriation. Evil does not find resistance in the soul, devoid of upbringing and sensory experience, replaced by the pursuit of material, mundane pleasures and cheap emotions, and is affirmed in it, making it its stronghold for the subsequent creeping expansion.
    1. Aag
      Aag 1 December 2020 21: 32
      0
      Quote: Ragnarok
      They have already openly admitted that they need only consumers. An atomized and amorphous society without a spiritual core - this is what the enemies need to successfully siphon the vitality from the nation, and such decomposition certainly requires the destruction of the system for maintaining high moral values ​​and the creation of false guidelines that will urge the people to follow the most simple and a seemingly pleasant path - the path of guile, betrayal and appropriation. Evil does not find resistance in the soul, devoid of upbringing and sensory experience, replaced by the pursuit of material, mundane pleasures and cheap emotions, and is affirmed in it, making it its stronghold for the subsequent creeping expansion.

      In general, I agree.
      But, excuse me, you seem to be one of those who are ready to turn your right cheek ...
      1. Ragnarok
        Ragnarok 1 December 2020 22: 03
        +1
        Confronting evil requires the mobilization of all forces, and rebuffing it by force of arms is one of the sides of resistance to it, moreover, it involves the entire human being, needs absolute selflessness and does not allow any moral concessions. And if we are talking about protecting everything that is dear to us, then reconciliation with evil or rejection of some form of struggle against it is both allowing it to enter into our soul, and conniving it in the destruction of everything that is good and high.
        1. Aag
          Aag 1 December 2020 22: 46
          0
          Quote: Ragnarok
          Confronting evil requires the mobilization of all forces, and rebuffing it by force of arms is one of the sides of resistance to it, moreover, it involves the entire human being, needs absolute selflessness and does not allow any moral concessions. And if we are talking about protecting everything that is dear to us, then reconciliation with evil or rejection of some form of struggle against it is both allowing it to enter into our soul, and conniving it in the destruction of everything that is good and high.

          Are you a sectarian? Without irony, theses are true (IMHO).
          1. Ragnarok
            Ragnarok 1 December 2020 23: 06
            0
            Not at all. Cousin worship is a phenomenon from a different pole.
  15. Aviator_
    Aviator_ 1 December 2020 12: 42
    0
    But my friend's grandmother, still a pre-revolutionary graduate of an ordinary gymnasium in the village of Kamenskaya, who later went through a paramedic veterinary and medical school, until the end of her days (at the end of the 80s) conducted active correspondence in three languages ​​at once.

    Your friend, of course, has a very interesting grandmother. I remember Ilf and Petrov, 12 chairs - "old women were sitting on the porch and scolding Soviet power in French." But my grandmother, a peasant woman in the Voronezh province, (1897-1975) was so unlucky. She somehow learned to read and write only under the bloody Bolsheviks, in the mid-30s. I am tormented by vague doubts that polyglot grandmothers were then negligible.
  16. alstr
    alstr 1 December 2020 13: 17
    +1
    At the moment, the main problem of our school (in addition to training programs) is the position of the teacher.
    Now the teacher has no rights and cannot significantly influence the child.
    The teacher must have leverage both on the child and on the parents. Now, alas, the teacher is to blame for everything, even if he is not at all to blame.
    And in general, taking care of children and their psyche, they began to overdo something. Well, you cannot raise a normal person if you protect him from all problems.
  17. Imobile
    Imobile 1 December 2020 13: 30
    +1
    where is the result of this education? Only self-taught botanists who were recruited in research institutes, but they would have been without school, or rather they read their books at school, and did not study in class. The rest of the ignorant, including the author of the article, which analysis can not be simple. The main disadvantages of the USSR are continuous cramming. As soon as the student finishes the school year - in the head 0. And the methods are backward, in other countries 1-2 years and the child speaks a foreign language fluently, we have a full 0 after 6 grades and college, they can't even introduce themselves. And ours are not mentally retarded, I know a girl who came to a foreign school and became the best student there, despite the other language. Their methods allowed them to fully reveal themselves. This is one of the countries of the European Union. In the United States, according to reviews, education will be worse, but there is a super plus. They are taught to speak freely, defend their thoughts and speak in public. And the best education in Singapore.
    And another thing is the absence of teachers, 90 percent of teachers do not know their subject. I only had a physics teacher who knew her subject - she taught for only 3 years, and a mathematics teacher, she taught only half a year and left.
    The Unified State Exam is the only thing that has been done well for all the time. In the USSR, I remember how excellent students wrote an essay at the exam, and rewrote it 20 times, and they were dictated to each letter. I was not an excellent student, asked to check my essay, and they refused, and pulled the children of party workers. So I made 2 mistakes, and for the first time they made 40 mistakes !!! They wrote there until nightfall, for one student, the teacher's mother wrote (and got 4! Made a mistake :))
  18. Desperado
    Desperado 1 December 2020 13: 38
    0
    Quote: alstr
    At the moment, the main problem of our school (in addition to training programs) is the position of the teacher.
    Now the teacher has no rights and cannot significantly influence the child.
    The teacher must have leverage both on the child and on the parents. Now, alas, the teacher is to blame for everything, even if he is not at all to blame.
    And in general, taking care of children and their psyche, they began to overdo something. Well, you cannot raise a normal person if you protect him from all problems.


    With regard to the powerlessness of teachers, this is a bit different. Read the teacher's rights and responsibilities. If the teacher, due to his internal stoppers or heavy workload or fear of the superior leadership, is not ready to defend his rights, this is another question. Quite a lot depends on the head teacher and the director, if they are adequate leaders, then this is normal support for the teacher in conflict situations. It is necessary to increase the prestige of the teaching profession, to create conditions under which male teachers will start coming to school (for basic disciplines, as class teachers). This will make it possible to "dilute" the female "lobby" in schools, which, due to their dominance, are too exaggerated in everyday life and decision-making.
  19. The Siberian barber
    The Siberian barber 1 December 2020 13: 46
    0

    From Gref's words: "we do not need a creator, we need a competent consumer"
    1. Imobile
      Imobile 1 December 2020 13: 59
      -3
      You won't even get 10 points! Like any other from the USSR. And the anger and rushing. The picture is a complete lie. And who will understand that? ignorant? It's like grandmothers, they are angry that in their youth there were no diapers and come up with stories about harm! Greed and anger are the result of that system!
      1. The Siberian barber
        The Siberian barber 1 December 2020 16: 27
        0
        Malice? )) Rather bitterness, from the fact that with our hands we ruin EVERYTHING that our fathers and grandfathers left us, including good things!
        Kratinka, by the way, fully shows the level of "development" of education at school, unambiguously, albeit exaggerated
        I had the "happiness" to contemplate
        "remote", in the spring ..
        Horror: the system hangs, the children do anything, just not study, the teacher does not care .. the result: knowledge of the material "0"
        And THIS is being pushed by the Grefs / Chubais, without any COVID
        1. Imobile
          Imobile 1 December 2020 22: 17
          0
          At 70 there was no education, at 80 better, 90 even better. And now the Internet, you can learn anything if you want. But we have no methods. And in 70-80 there was not even a single book, only Pushkin and Lermontov in libraries, on the shelves too. They may have been in Moscow, but I did not live there.
      2. Ryaruav
        Ryaruav 1 December 2020 20: 17
        +1
        are you a young stupid person and an ignoramus egovskiy with no answer options?
        1. Aag
          Aag 1 December 2020 21: 27
          0
          Quote: Ryaruav
          are you a young stupid person and an ignoramus egovskiy with no answer options?

          Do not be angry with them. They did not know how it was, how it could be. By the way, it is true, even under the Soviet Union it was not great everywhere (according to the experience of my friends, peers from other regions, I have no reason not to believe).
          However, for the third time in a week, the question of the truth about the USSR arises at VO. It is sad that the detractors are often young people who know about it by hearsay. From the current heralds ...
          IMHO: our business is to tell the truth, to decide, to live by it.
      3. Aag
        Aag 1 December 2020 21: 37
        0
        Quote: Imobile
        You won't even get 10 points! Like any other from the USSR. And the anger and rushing. The picture is a complete lie. And who will understand that? ignorant? It's like grandmothers, they are angry that in their youth there were no diapers and come up with stories about harm! Greed and anger are the result of that system!

        Where does so much aggression come from?
        "If youth knew, if old age could ..."
        Let's be more constructive? You live!
        1. Imobile
          Imobile 1 December 2020 22: 26
          +1
          I am already an old man who has seen a lot in my time. I am against Putin now, but believe me, there may be candidates worse than Putin.Now they are trying to attribute something good, but what was good in the USSR ??? Nothing, just youth. More space. Only one space. Now it is presented as an advanced one, but in the USSR the lag was felt. Very strong, and more and more every year. And when Gagarin flew, it was a miracle, and then it began to subside. Especially when you need to dress a child, but children's clothes did not exist, and poverty is everywhere ...
          1. Aag
            Aag 1 December 2020 23: 11
            0
            Quote: Imobile
            I am already an old man who has seen a lot in my time. I am against Putin now, but believe me, there may be candidates worse than Putin.Now they are trying to attribute something good, but what was good in the USSR ??? Nothing, just youth. More space. Only one space. Now it is presented as an advanced one, but in the USSR the lag was felt. Very strong, and more and more every year. And when Gagarin flew, it was a miracle, and then it began to subside. Especially when you need to dress a child, but children's clothes did not exist, and poverty is everywhere ...

            Almost unexpected ...
            Your "... I am now against Putin ..." I would carefully translate ... into discontent with what is happening under the current President of the Russian Federation ... I confess, before the 15th I was ready to knock a portac on my chest (sorry for bad manners, tattoo, excuse me again, - tattoo: Supreme, Minister of Defense, Minister of Foreign Affairs, as Marx, Engels, Lenin looked like at one time).
            True, if I mock, then, more at myself, I wanted to believe in the best ... And there were reasons!
            ... According to the late Union, I expressed myself more than once. I will repeat. It was different. On the whole, the mountain is better than now. In the very outback of the Union, people could plan their future life, the life of their children, and be sure that it would be better. ? Rather, it did not work out ...
            Now, even in the place of home-grown oligarchs, I would be careful not to reassure the offspring of "confidence in the future" ...
            1. Aag
              Aag 1 December 2020 23: 37
              0
              And, most importantly, what has become better ?!
              Is there any progress?
              The question, as they say, is rhetorical.
              Didn't notice how our foreheads collide? On any basis: national, educational, confessional, professional ... At the VO (!), People who think that military pensioners are parasites have been added. Well, yes, before the World Cup in football, in the sense of before pension reform, no one noticed how the MO "rolled" pennies.
              So, little by little, they will devour us. ((( hi
  20. Desperado
    Desperado 1 December 2020 16: 15
    -2
    Quote: Imobile
    You won't even get 10 points! Like any other from the USSR. And the anger and rushing. The picture is a complete lie. And who will understand that? ignorant? It's like grandmothers, they are angry that in their youth there were no diapers and come up with stories about harm! Greed and anger are the result of that system!


    Unfortunately, such an aspect takes place, I did not understand and do not understand the answers of the older generation - "we suffered and you suffer", it seems that the mentality of the servants is firmly entrenched at the genetic level. We have been "marking time" for a long time already, we must move forward ...
  21. Type 63
    Type 63 1 December 2020 16: 48
    +1
    Who will explain to me why people, who received the best Soviet education in the world, charged water in front of the TV?
    1. Mayan
      Mayan 5 December 2020 10: 29
      0
      ... ".. charged water in front of the TV."
      yes it was something with something (((
      gloomy (
      during the period (early 90s) the outflow of a huge number of intelligentsia abroad (
  22. Ryaruav
    Ryaruav 1 December 2020 20: 13
    -2
    the face of this as he says down shifter causes hatred, he is not smart, he is just in Putin's cage of half-educated
    1. Aag
      Aag 1 December 2020 21: 54
      0
      Quote: Ryaruav
      the face of this as he says down shifter causes hatred, he is not smart, he is just in Putin's cage of half-educated

      It won't bother you, the same thing, but with punctuation marks? Maybe the meaning of the message will become clear and unambiguous.
      No, I intuitively guess about the meaning of your narration. But in the form ... I suspect that if the "mug" read your post, I would greatly appreciate my success in the victory over education.
      True, I did not want to offend anyone, but, you must admit, it is necessary to resist somehow!
  23. evgen1221
    evgen1221 2 December 2020 06: 39
    -1
    It's just that the authorities decided to switch to a corporate elite system globally and technically feudal. This is when quality education for the rich and the rest of the parish schools and vocational schools maximum. I will not be surprised that in a generation, Michael Petrovich and Annabel Ivanovna will be in power and the population will have pubs and shawarma with inapplicable zombie stories.
  24. rocket757
    rocket757 2 December 2020 07: 32
    0
    Soviet means the best?

    Soviet, as it often happens, VERY DIFFERENT !!!
    On the mind, take the best as a basis and modernize to modern realities, requirements !!! only those requirements that are fundamental, which are aimed at the perspective of DEVELOPMENT!
  25. Mayan
    Mayan 5 December 2020 10: 20
    0
    ... the reformers were imposed from the West. then the reformers grew up. reformed, reformed, that they did not reform, then they hang out (transform, reduce, disconnect, unite, optimize, distance, etc.). everything hangs out, everything: enterprises, others, floating payment details, etc., etc. ..
    .
  26. Mayan
    Mayan 5 December 2020 10: 47
    0
    ... learned! parental meetings, the committees did not fight, did not torment, did not kill themselves; vocational departments did not burn out professionally. everything was creatively trying: to study, work, grow. there was always no time to indulge. lived. survived. and now we live, learn, work, live livelier than all living things, we try, we pound, we create. censors, restrictors, prohibitors, optimizers mix (officials are bound by laws, hands, mouth?).
  27. Ruudi 34
    Ruudi 34 11 February 2021 12: 55
    0
    Any diploma for your money ...