Does Armenia have a chance to maintain its positions in Karabakh: current alignment and likely prospects

The armed conflict in Transcaucasia continues for over a month. At the moment, the Azerbaijani army has seriously advanced in the conflict zone. Does Armenia have a chance to retain its positions in Karabakh, or will it be taken by Azerbaijani troops?

By itself, the success of the Azerbaijani army, which was achieved not without direct military assistance to Turkey, is not yet a XNUMX% guarantee of a change in the real situation in Nagorno-Karabakh.

But the chances of the Armenian army to defend the region are rapidly decreasing. This is the situation today. The Azerbaijanis reached the strategically important city of Shusha (Shushi), the capture of which could mark the complete defeat of the Armenian troops. At least, this version is expressed by the former Minister of Defense of the Donetsk People's Republic Igor Strelkov (Girkin).

To date, the Armenian troops have lost dozens of settlements in the territories adjacent to the unrecognized Nagorno-Karabakh Republic. This and several cities, including Zangilan, Fizuli, Gubadli.

What about the prospects?

The offensive of the Azerbaijani army on the Lachin-Shusha highway will lead to the impossibility of supplying the belligerent units, and therefore to the retreat of the Armenian troops from Karabakh or their destruction by the advancing Azerbaijani troops. There is no doubt that the Armenians will fight to the last, but the forces are too unequal, and this is recognized by many military experts.

Now Armenia has two chances to get out of the conflict without losing Karabakh with a subsequent humanitarian disaster. The first chance is if a "miracle" happens, and Moscow nevertheless decides to openly intervene in the conflict in Transcaucasia, providing if not military support to Armenia, then at least sending a peacekeeping contingent to Karabakh. However, so far the Russian authorities have not made such a decision. Moreover, Vladimir Putin spoke about a compromise option and the possible transfer of 7 regions to Azerbaijan as a way to end the conflict, which is in line with the previously signed agreements between Yerevan and Baku.

The second chance is for Armenia to start an all-out war against Azerbaijan, including, among other things, strikes on the republic's oil facilities. But Armenia is unlikely to dare to such a scenario, and Nikol Pashinyan is not the leader who would make such decisions. In addition, Russia will in every possible way prevent the start of an even larger-scale war between Armenia and Azerbaijan and its exit from the borders of Karabakh. After all, the Armenian-Azerbaijani war outside of Karabakh is a guaranteed intervention by Turkey, the invasion of the troops of the Turkish-Azerbaijani coalition into Armenia itself, and then Russia will have to provide assistance to Yerevan as an ally in the CSTO.

No matter how high the fighting spirit of the Armenian people is, no matter how many recruits and volunteers are sent to the Karabakh front, the advantages in manpower and equipment are on the side of Azerbaijan. After all, now it is the Azerbaijani aviation dominates the airspace, and Drones "Bayraktar" of Turkish production destroyed a significant part of the Armenian military equipment.

The most impressive losses of the Armenian side in armored vehicles - destroyed, apparently, half of all Armenian tanks, half of self-propelled artillery installations, 67 multiple launch rocket systems. The losses of the Azerbaijani army in equipment and personnel are also very large, but inferior to the Armenian losses due to the dominance of Azerbaijan in the air.

If Azerbaijan seizes Karabakh, the existing balance of power in the region will seriously change. The role of Turkey in the Transcaucasian politics will become more significant, and at times, and the positions of Russia will weaken. But the saddest thing is what awaits the Armenian population of the region. It is unlikely that most of the Karabakh Armenians will want to live as part of Azerbaijan, and this only means that a guerrilla war, ethnic cleansing, an exodus of refugees will become inevitable - with the ensuing humanitarian problems for Yerevan and a desire for revenge.

Comments

[NTD]

Without military assistance from outside, without additional equipment ranging from air defense to MLRS, without additional people, it will be problematic to keep it.

[Vadim237]

And it will definitely not be.

[passerby]

If Armenia becomes an aggressor and strikes, for example, on the Azerbaijani oil infrastructure, Russia will not be obliged to help Armenia, because within the framework of the CSTO assistance is provided to victims of aggression, and not to the aggressors, who in this case will be Armenia. In any case, I am opposed to Russia fighting for Armenia, let them deal with Azerbaijan themselves, especially since the dispute is over territories that Armenia itself does not recognize as its land.

[NTD]

Quote: bystander

If Armenia is the aggressor and hits, for example, the Azerbaijani oil infrastructure

Igor, you are well aware of the role of oil corporations and their influence on the political arena of the countries of the world. If the Armenians do such a stupid thing, which means flattery in the pockets of the oil companies and, most importantly, on BP, we will just have to sit and watch the show what Britain will do to the Armenians.

Quote: bystander

let them deal with Azerbaijan themselves, especially since the dispute is over territories that Armenia itself does not recognize as its land.

That's it.
Thank you for your attention

[New Year day]

Quote: bystander

If Armenia becomes an aggressor and hits, for example, the Azerbaijani oil infrastructure, Russia will not be obliged to help Armenia, because within the framework of the CSTO, assistance is provided to victims of aggression, and not to the aggressors, who in this case will be Armenia.

That's right - donut hole

[major147]

Quote: bystander

within the framework of the CSTO, assistance is provided to victims of aggression

The decision will be made not by Russia, but by the CSTO Council.

[bayard]

Quote: major147

The decision will be made not by Russia, but by the CSTO Council.

Exactly .
And the CSTO members from Central Asia will definitely not fit in for Armenia.
And they know this in Armenia.
And they know HOW they don't like Armenia for its blocking of Azerbaijan's entry into the CSTO members.

Armenia was covered by Karma.

[Lara Croft]

Quote: major147

The decision will be made not by Russia, but by the CSTO Council.

What are you talking about! There is an agreement between the Russian Federation and Armenia on mutual military assistance until 2044, so that the CSTO did not surrender to the Armenians for nothing (you cannot take anything from it except for analyzes), Armenia will seek military assistance directly from the Russian Federation, within the framework of bilateral agreements .. ..

[major147]

Quote: Lara Croft

What are you saying?

Please, not so emotionally. I looked through a bunch of international treaties and agreements on this topic, and did not find a clear promise to join the war. Can you explain, please, what kind of "agreement on mutual military assistance until 2044" Do you mean?

[Lara Croft]

Quote: major147

Please, not so emotionally.

Why did he say so boldly?

I looked through a bunch of international treaties and agreements on this topic

Happy for you...

and did not find an unequivocal promise to enter the war.

what a hell ...

Can you explain, please, what kind of "agreement on mutual military assistance until 2044" Do you mean?

Probably this ...

The Treaty of Friendship, Cooperation and Mutual Assistance between Russia and Armenia "was signed in 1997 by the presidents of Armenia and Russia - Levon Ter-Petrosyan and Boris Yeltsin, it consists of 23 points.
Article 3. High Contracting The parties will jointly take all measures available to them to eliminate the threat to the peace, the violation of the peace or to resist acts of aggression against them by any state or group of states and provide each other with the necessary assistance, including military, in order to exercise the right to collective self-defense in accordance with Article 51 of the UN Charter.

https://zen.yandex.ru/media/id/5f34f13dd29b7820ca85918d/5f9db3623910530e0d5d4524

The parties will carry out close cooperation in these areas and will determine the forms of interaction based on this Treaty, bilateral Treaty on the Russian military base on the territory of the Republic of Armenia dated March 16, 1995as well as other relevant agreements.

there ...
Arrival of the 102nd WB extended until 2044
Look for both Agreements in the Consultant +

[major147]

Quote: Lara Croft

Why did he say so boldly?

Quote: Lara Croft

Happy for you...

Quote: Lara Croft

what a hell ...

Are you rude? Not necessary. Raises doubts about your adequacy, especially if you are Lara for me

Quote: Lara Croft

Rad

Quote: Lara Croft

Probably this ...

Quote: Lara Croft

The parties will jointly take all measures available to them

The concept is very broad. Very ambiguous, even including "including the military". This is what I spoke about last time.

Quote: Lara Croft

Look for both Agreements yourself

Do not hesitate, before writing my previous post, read:
Treaty of Friendship, Cooperation and Mutual Security between the Russian Federation and the Republic of Armenia (December 29, 1991, Moscow)
Treaty of Friendship, Cooperation and Mutual Security between the Russian Federation and the Republic of Armenia (December 29, 1991, Moscow)
Agreement between Ra and the Russian Federation on the principles of mutual technical and material support of their armed forces (August 21, 1992, Moscow)
Agreement between the RA and the RF on the status of the RF Border Troops located on the territory of the RA, and the conditions of their functioning (September 30, 1992, Yerevan)
Agreement between the RA Ministry of Defense and the RF Ministry of Defense on cooperation in the field of air defense (November 3, 1994, Moscow)
Agreement between the RF and the RA on a Russian military base on the territory of the Republic of Armenia (March 16, 1995, Moscow)
Agreement on friendship, cooperation and mutual assistance between the RA and the Russian Federation (August 29, 1997, Moscow)
Agreement between the Republic of Armenia and the Russian Federation on joint planning of the use of troops (forces) in the interests of ensuring joint security (September 27, 2000, Sochi)
Also, the following agreements were adopted between the RF and the RA:

Agreement between the Government of the Republic of Armenia and the Government of the Russian Federation on industrial and scientific-technical cooperation of enterprises of the defense industries (March 30, 1994, Moscow).
Agreement between the RA government and the RF government on cooperation in the field of military intelligence (December 16, 1994, Moscow).
Agreement between the RA Defense Ministry and the RF Defense Ministry on cooperation in the field of military medicine (May 24, 2001, Yerevan).
Agreement between the RA government and the RF government on information exchange in the military field (October 1, 2002, Moscow).
Agreement between the government of the Republic of Armenia and the government of the Russian Federation on military-technical cooperation (January 17, 2003, Moscow).
Agreement between the Government of the Republic of Armenia and the Government of the Russian Federation on Cooperation in the Export of Military Products to Third Countries (December 16, 2009, Yerevan).
Agreement between the Republic of Armenia and the Russian Federation on the development of military-technical cooperation (June 25, 2013, Yerevan).

[Lara Croft]

major147

Quote: Lara Croft
The parties will jointly take all measures available to them

The concept is very broad. Very ambiguous, even including "including the military". This is what I spoke about last time.

Yes, it seems like I highlighted it in bold for the sane, apparently in vain ...

и provide each other with the necessary assistance, including military

Which country will prescribe the declaration of war in the Treaty?
The Russian Federation will simply destroy the military threat posed by third countries (groups of countries) against the territory of Armenia ...
In addition, the war on 08.08.08/XNUMX/XNUMX showed that the Russian Federation can send troops into the territory of an independent state if the actions of this country threaten the security of the Russian Federation ... the Americans have even more such examples ...
So

Please, not so emotionally.

Raises doubts about your adequacy

[major147]

[quote =

Lara 

Croft] for the sane

singled out

[/ Quote]
Arguing with a non-sane person, I'm afraid to sink to your level. Don't get sick "Lara" ....

[Lara Croft]

Quote: major147

Arguing with a non-sane person

Nice to meet you, but you didn't have to admit it ....

I'm afraid to go down

too late...

to your level

don't even try ....

Don't get sick "Lara" ....

without reciprocity, already ill ...

[major147]

Quote: Lara Croft

to your level

don't even try ....

I decided on my gender identity from birth, which cannot be said about you ..... So I will not try.

[Simfy]

especially with this attitude (image from the endless expanses of the worldwide network)) ...

[Hypertension]

Quote: Vadim237

And it will definitely not be.

Vladimir Vladimirovich, is that you ..?
The picture for the article seems to hint: only old people are going into battle. Young people are "at war" on the Internet.

[Stas157]

... It is unlikely that most of the Karabakh Armenians will want to live within Azerbaijan, which means

This means that the non-rubber will become even more rubbery. And Sochi too.

[NTD]

Quote: Stas157

This means that the non-rubber will become even more rubbery.

those Armenians who have nowhere to go will live in Karabakh. Others will leave.

[Grits]

Quote: MTN

those Armenians who have nowhere to go will live in Karabakh

Do not indulge yourself with illusions. You yourself know very well that your fellow tribesmen on the very first day will go with rapture to cut off the heads of those who remain. And the old people will remain. We have already seen what you do with the old people of Karabakh in the famous video.
In any case, if someone's hand trembles, the barmaley brought by Erdogan from Idlib will very quickly teach you this.

[Rubina]

Let's turn on the logic. Azerbaijani soldiers found two old men abandoned without food. Could finish off on the spot and ends in water. Who would prove what? But we are not barbarians, the soldiers dragged them on our backs to the car and handed them over to the Red Cross, which the grandmother handed over to the Armenians. The old man was not transportable and died in the hands of the Red Cross. Ask them. The poor Armenians pressed the old woman, so she is lying.
It's funny, by God, any Armenian lie is taken on faith; Azerbaijanis have to prove all the time. But thanks for the science anyway,

[georgigennadievitch]

Now all attention is paid to military operations, but when they are over, what will a possible victory for Azerbaijan give? Nothing but problems. Destroyed villages, cities, infrastructure. Armenians will not accept the loss and will prepare for revenge. And who in these conditions in their right mind wants settle among the ruins and graves? It will be an empty space, which also needs to be protected.

[Ganja]

Do you yourself believe what you said? During the first shelling of Ganja, one of the wounded was Karina Grigoryan in the city of Ganja. Please tell me where did this woman come from in Ganja after so many years of confrontation? Yes, she just lived here and everything and no one touches her (and not only her and many others, but there are several thousand of them). How many Armenians from Armenia live and work in Turkey? God knows. Tens of thousands

[bayard]

Quote: Stas157

... It is unlikely that most of the Karabakh Armenians will want to live within Azerbaijan, which means

And this means that just as in their time under the kings they came there as refugees, so now they will leave as refugees.
Once they did not want to live peacefully.
When they declared Karabakh the territory of the Armenian SSR in 1989, expelled all Azerbaijanis from Armenia and began to form militant detachments, seizing weapons from militiamen, from DOSAF warehouses and attacking military units ... they proudly declared that the entire Armenian diaspora would support them, listed how many millionaires and billionaires Armenians live in the United States and France, counting on their help.
Where is this help?
When, back in 1985, in the squares of Yerevan, they publicly burned Soviet passports and were the first, together with the Baltic states, to shake the Union into disintegration ... When recently they came out with posters "Russian invaders get out of Armenia" ... They were so proud and self-confident. ..
If they are so confident in themselves, if their diaspora is so rich and influential, if between peace and war they always choose war - Fight!
It's your right .
... When in January 1990 the rebellion in Azerbaijan was suppressed (caused by the expulsion of Azerbaijanis from Armenia and the declared annexation of Karabakh), but at the same time Gorbachev with his camarilla did not touch his finger to pacify the enraged Armenia ... we are Soviet officers those serving in Azerbaijan were very much surprised at such selectivity ... After all, attacks on weapons depots, police departments and military units (usually separate small units) in Armenia began earlier than the mutiny with an attempted coup in Azerbaijan.
As it turned out, Gracheva was simply bought.
Those same Armenians from the Diaspora.
And how decisively and quickly the rebellion was suppressed in Azerbaijan, just as decisively the Gorbachev government forgave ALL the antics of the enraged Dashnaks of Armenia.

I hope this time the Karabakh issue will be closed.
And finally closed.
Just for the sake of historical justice.

[phair]

On my street, within a radius of 300 meters, there are shops of Armenian, Azeri and Russian. Russian is better (observations-25 years). Uzbek Tajiks work for everyone. BUT-do not conflict. Because Ivan Ivanych, the district police officer, will come and give ALL of them. Tactically so ....

[TermNachTer]

For five weeks, not even the army, but the "advanced" militia, is holding the army, which was taught by instructors from NATO, the operation was planned by Turkish generals, and supplied with quite modern and effective weapons and military equipment. And Aliyev's today's appeal to Russia means that the cost of this war has already exceeded all reasonable limits for Azerbaijan, and the end of the war is still far away.

[Vadim237]

"And so the" advanced "militia keeps the army" From the beginning it was the NKR Armed Forces, but in 30 days they dropped to the "advanced militia" every day more and more this "advanced militia" turns into minced meat for another 30 days they will keep the rank " Whisper of the Karabakh mountains "

[TermNachTer]

The militia can be called an army, it can be the personal guard of the Ikhtamnetov emperor, you can do whatever you like)))) from this they will not become an army. At the expense of turning into minced meat))) let's see. By the end of the week, they promise "0" and even "-1" in Karabakh. Probably will have to issue medals "frozen meat")))

[Grits]

Quote: TermNachTER

By the end of the week, they promise "0" and even "-1" in Karabakh. Probably will have to issue medals "frozen meat

Moreover, on both sides.

[TermNachTer]

It is a little easier for the Armenians, they sit in cities and villages that have not yet been severely beaten by the war, but Azerbaijanis on bare rocks are sad.

[Vadim237]

And at the same time, the guys will have to make a fire, which the drones will be very noticeable especially at night as the heat of bodies and the heat from the running or running engines - the drones will simply lower it lower or, for the most part, ordinary mini reconnaissance officers will start using the Harop type, it can be in the air for 6 hours and it is very problematic to shoot it down, just as they will notice, they will simply direct and process artillery at the detected positions and process square by square - for this, Azerbaijanis do not need to sit on bare rocks.

[TermNachTer]

The thermal imager that sees through the walls?)))) Something has not been observed recently for Jewish (Turkish) UAVs. So let's see - not long left

[Artavazdych]

the advanced militia "turns to mince

The analyte brains turn into minced meat. No, not yours. And like Yurassuma or Podolyaki - these are Russian-patriotic ones. They broadcast about the capture of the Red Bazaar and Kubatly 10 days ago. But Krasny Bazar and Kubatly quietly fought back. And - silence.
You can even look at Azerbot cards.

[Otshelnik]

Did they beat it off?))) Proofs yes let's

[Vadim237]

The fact that Azerbaijan Red Bazaar Shusha Stepanakert and all towns and villages as well as the whole of Karabakh will take over sooner or later, in the current situation, does not cause any doubts, and those who defend it will become the very minced meat that artillery and aviation will make of them - in view of imminent exhaustion all equipment from the Armenians. And at the expense of the recaptured Kubatls, you’re completely hungry, since the Armenians have nothing to beat back in fact today in a tank attack that was a pure suicide, tanks drones gouged and all this offensive was covered with a copper basin and such attacks in Karabakh will all end in the same way.

[Artavazdych]

Well, well ... let's go to the tank? on which of the ridges?
My dear, there are mountains, mountains. There are no plains at all. The plains ended 3 weeks ago. Have you been to the zoo? Did you see the camel?

[Artavazdych]

Well, if you really look at the Azerb messages. side (I hope you understand everything about the blooper with the tanks), then I would pay attention to the message about the neutralization of the Armenian DRG in the Zangilan region. What does this mean? That it is deep (~ 45 km) rear. Which was cleaned up a long time ago.

[georgigennadievitch]

If Azerbaijan wins a military victory over the militia, it will be a "Pyrrhic victory". The war will not end, it will pass into other forms. But why would Azerbaijan need a piece of land with destroyed villages, cities and infrastructure? Nobody wants to live there anyway.

[evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru]

There is not a militia, but the NKR army, which is more than a quarter （!） Century. And the army of Armenia. Two armies of two states.
... When the Red Army was of this age, she beat the army of the Third Reich in the tail and in the mane. But then the Union would be a sensible PROLETARIAN state of the Russian （and other indigenous peoples, but without Russians - nowhere, they are a STATE FORMING nation ...） of the people, the state of the ,, red emperor ,, Stalin.
Frivolous states cannot have a serious army! This is what the next war in the post-Soviet space is about once again, to r and h and t. ,, Soap bubbles ,,, ,, balloons ,,, not the state ... All these ,, PMRs ,,, ,, LDNRs ,, ,, ,, NKR ,, ... How can you be responsible for the state building of all, for example 5 years old? ONLY five years. What is this satanic nonsense? Who needs a family head FOR FIVE YEARS? Is it possible to steer the state for just five years? This nonsense is imposed on people by Satanists - ,, ordinary inhumans ,, （convenient and sensible in meaning - ,, ufo ,,）. They don't care about the flag under which they are performing. They can be “red”, and “brown”, and “blue”, and “democrats”, and “conservatives” .. Servants of not mythical Darkness at all. Dreamers of world domination. Mediocre and dull, but cunning and aggressive.
Armenia and Artsakh need a tsar, a real one, Khrist, and not a temporary worker - a "democrat", for an Armenian he should.
“A large diaspora,” could seriously attend to this. Or else, let's play with life? Little did you sleep, little defeats, little nibble on the crown of the roast cock?
If Russia, too, while ,, sleeps on the move ,, （there are such periods in its history, what can you do ...）, then you need to move yourself, - to build your PRESENT state. Who will have a REAL army. There is no need to look back at the stupid West or the stupid East. Not for them (for now), but for you to look into the eyes of refugees, not for them, but for you to burn in tanks, not for them, but for you to hide in basements and dugouts

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Vadim237

From the beginning it was the NKR Armed Forces, but in 30 days they dropped to the "advanced militia" every day more and more this "advanced militia" turns into minced meat for another 30 days they will keep the title "Whisper of the Karabakh mountains"

Not everything is lost....

In general, the representative of the Ministry of Defense of Armenia stated that at the moment the first female company is ready to undergo training. Whose goal after training is to go to Nagorno-Karabakh and fight against Azerbaijani militants.

https://zen.yandex.ru/media/id/5f3ed485a5159344c3b1b807/i-jensciny-vziali-v-ruki-orujie-jenskaia-rota-voorujennyh-sil-v-nagornom-karabahe-5f9c4cb79ac0705ae4610887

[Megatron]

If Armenia starts aggression against Azerbaijani targets, Russia will not need to intervene.

[Rubina]

Indeed, it is not necessary. For this there is Turkey behind Azerbaijan

[Clear]

Quote: MTN

Does Armenia have a chance to maintain its position in Karabakh

Quote: MTN

Without military assistance from outside, without additional equipment ranging from air defense to MLRS, without additional people, it will be problematic to keep it.

Now what are they doing? Aren't they held back?

[Arthur]

You, too, without military assistance from outside the kaput !!! And for the Armenians, everything they need is delivered in the right quantities. You loved to upload videos, look what happened to the "valiant" warriors. https://youtu.be/2FJgMxkADEE

[Don karleone]

Will Soros help? Or americos

[Rudkovsky]

In the 90s, under the "weak" Yeltsin, Russia was ready to defend its interests in Yugoslavia, and in 2020, after 20 years of getting up from its knees and under the "strong leader" Putin, it sluggishly mumbles excuses when one of its last allies is hammered.

Here's the alignment. There is something to think about.

[NTD]

Quote: Rudkovsky

"Putin - languidly mumbles excuses when one of the last allies is hammered.

that is, you are insulted, the president of Russia is insulted, Russia is considered an occupier, the people, it is the people who choose the anti-Russian candidate, and in spite of this you want a new enemy in the person of Azerbaijan, but to defend them?

[Rudkovsky]

I don’t want anything, I’m just stating a fact. Armenians may not be angels, but we simply have no other "friends" left.

[Egor53]

Since when did the Armenians become our friends?

[New Year day]

Quote: Egor53

Since when did the Armenians become our friends?

Obviously from these

[Arlen]

Quote: Silvestr

Quote: Egor53

Since when did the Armenians become our friends?

Obviously from these

There are enough bad guys, pro-Western protesters and various Russophobes everywhere, even in Russia there are such individuals.

[Grits]

Interestingly, where is this pretty Armenian girl with a poster now? She sews uniforms for the fighters of Karabakh or dumped them to Moscow to earn money?

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Gritsa

Interestingly, where is this pretty Armenian girl with a poster now?

Where did you see the pretty Armenian girl there?

[Grits]

Quote: Lara Croft

Where did you see the pretty Armenian girl there?

We are probably looking at different ones.

[major147]

Quote: Egor53

Since when did the Armenians become our friends?

And not only Armenians ... All this reminds me of the "friendship" of a horse and a rider. They seem to be friends, but at the same time one drives the other all the time.

[leks]

Armenians are not our friends for a long time!
The fact that they are allies in the CSTO is yes, but this does not mean that the Russian Federation should fight for the Armenians on foreign territory.
For reference, Nagorno-Karabakh is not the territory of Armenia. Nagorno-Karabakh is not a recognized republic, even the Armenians did not recognize it.
Nagorno-Karabakh is the territory of Azerbaijan.
Apart from its army and navy, Russia has no friends, only partners.

[Hypertension]

Quote: leks

The fact that they are allies in the CSTO is yes, but this does not mean that the Russian Federation should fight for the Armenians on foreign territory.

In general, the CSTO is much more needed by other countries. In the event of a big war, there will be no sense from the Kazakhs and Armenians with the Tajiks. But Russia is behind the back - a huge help for the same Kazakhs, Armenians and Tajiks. Is that Belarus is a real "partner", but when will the kipish still settle there ...

[NTD]

Quote: Rudkovsky

Armenians may not be angels, but we simply have no other "friends" left.

Dear Oleg, if my mistress starts looking for another guy, despite the fact that I bought her an apartment, gave her money, protect and protect, and in return treason, then what a fig for me is such a mistress. Keep her faithful with a whip? I need it? This is a figurative example. I hope you understand.

Quote: Rudkovsky

but we simply have no other "friends" left.

You know how Omar Khayyam said, it's better to be alone than with just anyone, especially since there is a saying in Russia that Russia's best ally is its army and navy.

[Grits]

Quote: MTN

This is a figurative example. I hope you understand.

Good analogy

[bar]

With such friends, no enemies are needed

[New Year day]

Quote: Rudkovsky

but we simply have no other "friends" left.

This is not friendship! This is prostitution, sweetheart. Friendship is disinterested

[210ox]

Why do we need such "friends"? Pashinyan & Co. By the way, in the Kuban, from those Armenian families that I know, they did not lift a finger about Artsakh

[Nastia makarova]

we don't need friends in quotes

[Igor Semenov]

I don’t know if this will console you, but the attitude of Azerbaijanis towards Russia is also trifling.

[Overlock]

Quote: Igor Semenov

but on the part of Azerbaijanis, the attitude towards Russia is also trifling

It happened so. And what about this in the Baltics and Ukraine? And in Europe?

[210ox]

By the way, unlike Armenia (a mono-ethnic state, by the way) - Azerbaijan is much national. And several hundred thousand Russians live there

[Petro_tut]

And several hundred thousand Russians live there

Correction, left from almost 400 thousand less than 150 thousand

[210ox]

To be honest, I thought that almost everyone had left. There were many military, petrochemical specialists. Thanks for the amendment.

[Alex777]

I don’t know if this will console you, but the attitude of Azerbaijanis towards Russia is also trifling.

Talking about our family!

[Arlen]

Quote: MTN

Despite this, you want a new enemy in the person of Azerbaijan and protect them?

Since when did the pro-Turkish states become friends to us?

[Cetron]

It is better to have a Turk as an adversary than an Armenian as an ally.

[Jünger]

We have been allies with them for centuries, if you look the truth in the eye. And everything was fine

[Alex777]

Then there was no diaspora in America and France.
Then - yes, it was normal.

[Artavazdych]

And nothing that the Armenians alone are now putting dozens and hundreds of barmaley people from all over the world a day? 150 km from the border with Russia, I note. You don't need it, I understand.

[lelik613]

Announce the entire list, please ...

[Goffman]

The Armenians are the same barmaley, just a different sort.

[Artavazdych]

Well, let them be barmaley for you. Only they, unlike you, wear crosses around their necks. And also on the uniform and on the helmets.

[Artavazdych]

This photo says: a) This is the Jordan River
b) you don’t wear a cross

[Goffman]

No, these photos confirm:
Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, that you are likened to colored tombs that seem beautiful on the outside, and inside are full of dead bones and all impurities; in appearance you seem righteous to people, but inside you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness
You don't wear a cross.

[melkonster1974]

This is a Pharisee about you. Didn't you send Jesus Christ to Calvary?

[Artavazdych]

Hm strange. After I answered you edited your comment.
Where do these opportunities come from?

[Cetron]

The Nazis had crosses everywhere: on uniforms, tanks, airplanes. The inscription on the buckle: "God is with us." Are the Nazis good barmaley?

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Artavazdych

they, unlike you, wear crosses around their necks. And also on the uniform and on the helmets.

Does it help? Now, if they would have dug some kind of sea ... you could talk about anything ...

[melkonster1974]

And the Jews are the same Judas - just a different kind

[Artavazdych]

"About 2000 mercenaries from the Middle East take part in the conflict in Karabakh"
S. Lavrov, interview to Kommersant
There is a video of the interrogation of two Syrians. Don't be lazy, everything is on the net.

Here these guys say - from what they shout, except for "Allah akbar" we do not understand anything

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Artavazdych

Is it okay that the Armenians alone are now putting dozens and hundreds of barmalers from all over the world a day?

They would not have coveted foreign lands and there would be no barmale ...

[210ox]

Since when they got off with tomatoes for the death of our pilot.

[Daniil Konovalenko]

The policy is not so unambiguous under EBN. Yes, it was possible to bring peacekeepers to Abkhazia and South Ossetia. They supported the elder Aliyev when he overthrew the nationalists, but they did not go further, they were not particularly friendly. Azerbaijan kept Russia at a distance. Supported Shevardnadze, and he then The fig showed. Armenia, extorted funds for a military base in Armenia. They believed and still believe that Armenia is very necessary to Russia. Yes, what can I say. The Caucasus, wasted back in the 90s, but what is happening now. the consequences of those years that cannot be corrected. You cannot make a genius out of mediocrity.

[Rudkovsky]

Nevertheless, the bottom line is that there will be no peace-gum now either with Armenia, or with Azerbaijan, or with Georgia. The entire Caucasus goes to the other side.

And ignoring the current situation only reinforces Russia as a weak side that does not solve anything, and contracts with it are dirty paper. Zugzwang.

[New Year day]

Quote: Rudkovsky

The entire Caucasus goes to the other side.

This is the second question.
It is systemic and there is no real opportunity to resist it.
Jumping into the last car of a departing train, you can stumble. Landing is done well in advance

[210ox]

Well, the rulers are like that. In May 2014, in Odessa, for the sake of their own Russians, they didn't lift a finger.

[NTD]

Quote: Daniil Konovalenko

Azerbaijan kept Russia at a distance.

Danil, what should Azerbaijan do? Even here in the virtual world you support the Armenians, and should we hug and kiss you for this? But despite all this, Azerbaijan did nothing against Russia. We did not collect the staff of the US Embassy in the amount of one Armenian village, and it was not us who opened the biological laboratory, but the Armenians. It is not Aliyev who shouts against Putin, but Pashinyan. Not Azerbaijanis with placards are against Russia, but Armenians.

[paul3390]

Even here in the virtual world you support the Armenians, and should we hug and kiss you for this?

Maybe - at least for the fact that we do not understand why we are keeping millions of your compatriots with us? Also no?

[Rubina]

I will answer this question. In Russia, the birth rate is lower than the death rate, which means that you need migrant workers. We will end - the former republics, which you taught your language and culture for 200 years, there will be either a catastrophic shortage of workers, or the Chinese. The Russian government is well aware of this. When the outflow of migrants began with the pandemic, the Russian government announced the issuance of 1 million passports to migrants. This is a mutually beneficial process.

[paul3390]

Come on. We have half the country of healthy men working as security guards .. We do not need working hands - but a sane government. For the stump is clear - no one will work hard for a pack of do-shirak. But if you put things in order with wages - and you don't really need it. And there is nothing profitable in the mass settlement of Russia with characters completely alien to us.
And why do we need another batch of sellers of tomatoes and shawarma? There are already more traders than guards.

[leks]

Azerbaijan, at least, did not pretend to be a friend and ally, did not hang noodles on the ears of the Russian Federation, but built a balanced policy towards the Russian Federation, and they certainly do not consider us enemies.
At least YET!
State radio in Azerbaijan broadcasts 20 minutes a week in Talysh, Kurdish and Lezgin, about 40 minutes in Georgian and Armenian, and 15 hours a month in Russian.
Teaching in Russian is conducted in 325 primary and secondary schools in the country, while the number of children studying Russian has increased by 2011% since 16, to 104. Another 288 university students study in Russian-language faculties. Teaching in the Georgian language is conducted in ten schools, although in 17 there were 000 such schools.
Armenia can only boast of a ban on the Russian language wherever possible and posters of Russian invaders out of Armenia.

[musketon64]

I agree with you. Azerbaijan is pursuing quite an adequate policy towards Russia, in contrast to the Armenian leadership. I disagree on another point in another. The majority of Russians do not sympathize with Armenians. Especially after the next high-profile murder of a single father in Volgograd with an excessively hot hach_ik, who got mad at the instigation of his sister and wife, who were de-insulted in the parental chat. The correspondence is also published. Here is the most eloquent response to the publication: “The Armenians, if I were you, would have executed him themselves, you do not understand that after the incident when a special forces soldier (who fought, unlike you, who was fattening in Moscow) with ISIS in Syria, now it is-- and this is at the time when ISIS came to your land - do you think the Russians are now eager to defend Armenia and Karabakh? " I subscribe to every word.
https://vz.ru/news/2020/11/2/1068507.html
https://vz.ru/news/2020/11/2/1068467.html

[parusnik]

Sorry to interfere. And who are you? Reading the comments, many are neither for those nor for others. I would say who you are, both Armenians and Azerbaijanis, in the words of Lavrov, will be banned. And in his words, it’s true. For 30 years your bourgeois governments have not agreed, nooo, not at the expense of Karabakh, but how to live together. Amicably, without wars. You are ready, each other, to gnaw each other's throats. Moreover, neither the Armenian and Azerbaijani billionaires and millionaires, but ordinary people on both sides. Billionaires will always agree and will support that ordinary people cut each other. The worst thing is that all ordinary people living on the territory of, unfortunately, the former USSR are ready to cut a friend, friend. And those who are pulling the last veins from the peoples, rubbing their hands and rejoicing. They incite interreligious and interethnic strife.

[Peter rybak]

Don't say that our Russian society is perfect. We have enough of our own here.

[Sanichsan]

Quote: Peter Rybak

Don't say that our Russian society is perfect.

and since when has Russian society become "ours" for Azerbaijani bots?

[Peter rybak]

restless. I am a citizen of the Russian Federation, I live in Ufa, in Dyoma, and Russia is my Motherland. But what does Russia mean to you, for a simple trader from the market?

[Sanichsan]

Quote: Peter Rybak

I am a citizen of the Russian Federation, I live in Ufa, in Dyoma, and Russia is my Motherland.

Yes Yes. exactly. that's just boiling at you, and not blood at all, as soon as someone doubts the victories of your native Azerbaijani army

Quote: Peter Rybak

But what does Russia mean to you, for a simple trader from the market?

was it a philosophical monologue in front of a mirror? Bravo!

[Reptiloid]

Quote: parusnik

......... And they will cut, neither the Armenian and Azerbaijani billionaires and millionaires, but ordinary people on both sides. Billionaires will always agree and will support that ordinary people cut each other. The worst thing is that they cut each other. friend, all ordinary people living on the territory, unfortunately, of the former USSR are ready. And those who are pulling the last veins from the peoples, rubbing their hands and rejoicing. They incite interreligious and interethnic strife.

I also want to add that all these actions, these processes are the continuation of the destruction of the USSR. Everything negative that happens on the territory of the destroyed USSR, from a decrease in the social sphere, deterioration of conditions and anti-Sovietism, to armed conflicts is all destruction THE USSR.
The union built, did so much that it could not be destroyed instantly. As further destruction in various industries, the life of the population will deteriorate more.

[Grits]

Quote: MTN

Danil, what should Azerbaijan do? Even here in the virtual world you support the Armenians, and should we hug and kiss you for this? But despite all this, Azerbaijan did nothing against Russia. We did not collect the staff of the US Embassy in the amount of one Armenian village, and it was not us who opened the biological laboratory, but the Armenians. It is not Aliyev who shouts against Putin, but Pashinyan. Not Azerbaijanis with placards are against Russia, but Armenians.

Speak all right. Here all the buns are only in the basket of Azerbaijan. The overwhelming majority of Russians would side with Azerbaijan. If not for one BUT ... Turkey. You have chosen our historical enemy as your ally. And it crosses out everything else with a bold line.

[Rubina]

This is a key turning point in the history of both countries, which many have not yet realized. Russia and Turkey were historical enemies, but both countries have their own interests in the first place. And history should not be allowed to overshadow current interests. Bulgaria was a historical friend of Russia and how did it end? She fled at the first opportunity to Europe. And these interests dictate today the need to unite Turkey and Russia against the West. It is enough to listen to the speech of Mr. Putin at the meeting of the Valdai Club. And small Azerbaijan is a bridge in this union.

[melkonster1974]

Don't beat Clara Tselkin out of yourself. It is in your textbooks that the Russians are called aggressors.

[would]

Even here in the virtual world you support the Armenians, and should we hug and kiss you for this?

Most do not care, we have a long-standing interethnic conflict between Armenians and Azerbaijanis and we Russians simply do not want to participate in it. And there are many reasons for this. The most frequent proposal in the virtual world is to send all Armenians and Azerbaijanis to Karabakh.

So you don’t need to hug or kiss us, you and the Armenians arranged this with the collapse of the USSR for you and only for you to disentangle it.

[donavi49]

Well, how did you protect it? And in Serbia they believed in brothers - they waited and hoped.

In Yerevan, they actively pedaled the base (or a divorce to increase payments or an attempt to knock it off) + rallies were constantly going on all two years.

This is what they wanted - for Putin to leave Armenia, and now they are demonstrating. So to speak, or with Soros and Makrn to Baku.

[Rudkovsky]

It turns out that Soros has outplayed the whole of Russia. So we will write it down. Brilliant old man.

[New Year day]

Quote: Rudkovsky

Brilliant old man.

Do you have doubts? We must respect the enemy, and not rest on the laurels of past deeds ... like Armenia, for example

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: Rudkovsky

It turns out that Soros outplayed the whole of Russia

Is it Russia ... or is its leadership insufficiently smart and far-sighted?

[New Year day]

Quote: Rudkovsky

There is something to think about.

Exactly! Russian Ivan has to create a paradise for someone with his tax deductions and life?
As Putin used to say, "you yourself."

[Arlen]

Quote: Rudkovsky

In the 90s, under the "weak" Yeltsin, Russia was ready to defend its interests in Yugoslavia

And how did Russia defend its interests in Yugoslavia? Helped stop genocide?

[qQQQ]

Quote: Rudkovsky

when one of the last allies is pounded

And when did the Armenians help us as allies? Maybe Crimea was recognized? As far as I see, it all comes down to one thing, when Armenia needs it, then Russia should, and that was the end of all the allied obligations on the part of Armenia.

[lelik613]

"one - a bagel,
the other - a donut hole.
This is a democratic republic "(c) Classic

[bayard]

Quote: Rudkovsky

and in 2020, after 20 years of getting up from his knees and under the "strong leader" Putin, he sluggishly mumbles excuses when one of the last allies is hammered.

This is the first time I hear that the self-proclaimed and (!) Unrecognized territory of Karabakh is Russia's allies.
According to all international standards, this is the territory of Azerbaijan.
The Armenians of Karabakh and the Armenians of Armenia unleashed a war and seized these territories. These territories are now being returned to their legal jurisdiction by force of arms.
Why by force of arms?
Because 30 years of negotiations and admonitions did not help, and now armed impostors and guest performers from Armenia are asked to leave.
Weapons.
Armenia wanted a foreign land ... and now her sons are interfered with with this very land.
Hang your Pashinyan on the first bitch and enter into negotiations urgently. Cultural autonomy is enough for your compatriots.
Of course, with full demilitarization and the possible entry of peacekeepers from the CSTO to oversee compliance with the agreements signed.
You will soon translate your entire male sex with your foolishness.
And do not call the Russians for help in a war that is not right for you, you are too dear for Russia. Literally!
And do not dare to call yourself "the only one of the few ally", an ally of you ... enemies with such is not necessary.
Drive your dashnaks and become normal people.

And just don't need me about the war, I've been living on it for the seventh year - in Donetsk.

[Rudkovsky]

Donetsk people were afraid of the appearance of competitors? By all international standards, you are residents of Ukraine, so why are you jerking for 7 years? You still have no prospects, Russia has turned away, Ukraine has been ill and cooled down. And you are still fighting and fighting against common sense, but why do you forbid others to do the same.

[bayard]

Quote: Rudkovsky

By all international standards, you are residents of Ukraine,

By all international standards, we are citizens of the Soviet Union, which to this day is the founder (co-founder) of the UN. Ukraine has NOT DEMORCED ITS BORDERS, it is generally de jure a state without borders, which means this is the territory of Russia - as the legal successor of the Soviet Union and RI. Historically, no Ukraine existed. Donetsk and Lugansk regions are generally the historical lands of the Great Don Army. The entire Southeast of the so-called. Ukraine is the historical Novorossia, we have all Russian toponyms - Novomoskovsk, Old Rus, Yekaterinoslav (Dnepropetrovsk), Pavlograd (not at all in honor of the "Cossack PavlA"). And these lands are inhabited almost without exception by immigrants from central Russia - from near Kursk, Orel, Moscow, inhabited empty lands after the annexation. And they never spoke Ukrainian here, except that surzhik and that for charm, in the Kuban, for example, in general, surzhik is scratched - it's just a South Russian dialect.
And certainly not any jealousy of Karabakh.
I served in Azerbaijan in my last officer's life - in 1988 - 1991. , so I just caught the beginning of this conflict and remember everything VERY well. Who started, who expelled Azerbaijanis from Armenia - 150 thousand were expelled by the end of 1989, although they mentioned the figure and 200 thousand, but I knew about 150 thousand refugees, the last in winter, through the mountain passes. Many died. Then, at the end of 1989, Armenia announced that henceforth Nagorno-Karabakh was the territory of Armenia and included it in the economic development plan for 1990.
At the same time, the formation of armed detachments of the Dashnaks began, the seizure of weapons, attacks on military units ... and the Kremlin with Gorbachev at its head did not react to this in any way, on the contrary, it condoned in every possible way.
And then Azerbaijan exploded. A mutiny began, the first secretary fled to Moscow, on January 11, the rebels seized power in Astara (a city on the border with Iran), on January 13, Baku was captured by the rebels, pogroms of Armenians began, with murders, sometimes just brutal - the crowd is terrible when it goes berserk. This continued until January 20, 1990.
And at dawn on January 20, an operation to restore constitutional order began. It was headed by Yazov personally. On the same day, Baku was liberated and the establishment of order in the republic began. Tough, well-coordinated, promptly.
Yes, since January 13, martial law has been declared in Azerbaijan.
Order was put in place by several airborne divisions, formations of internal troops and even a number of urgently called up reservists. For their operational transfer across Azerbaijan, as well as for organizing the evacuation of the families of military personnel and the Armenian population, 17 (!) Helicopter regiments (42 - 46 helicopters in each) were transferred to Azerbaijan, I personally accompanied these 17 regiments.
Yes, I served at the RIC (intelligence and information center) of the air defense unit, so I was very well informed about the events that took place.
And one of my friends for preventing the seizure of weapons in one of our units (a separate radar company in Karabakh - Gindarkh), shown courage, heroism and resourcefulness, was awarded the Order of Courage at number 5.
I have enough claims to Azerbaijanis for those events. We sheltered Armenian families in our military camps and organized their subsequent evacuation, we slept dressed and with weapons for almost two months, dispersed crowds with anti-aircraft searchlights, incited by provocateurs to seize the weapons depots of the mob-reserve ... I almost took prisoner "the Minister of Defense of the Popular Front of Azerbaijan "and they flew away from us as if with full pants ... under the aim of anti-aircraft searchlights ... my soldiers will not forget this ... We took under the protection of the homes and families of the Russians who lived in Azerbaijan, in order to prevent something bad and their address ...
There is a lot to remember ...
And order was restored in the republic.
And the locals thanked for this, because they themselves had endured a mess ...
But at the same time, seizure of weapons, arming militants continued in Armenia, they also acquired foreign weapons - Uzi machine guns, plastids, foreign detonators, equipment (they were transferred the day before under the guise of humanitarian aid after the earthquake in Spitak) ... armed gangs appeared and in Karabakh (this is why the Azerbaijanis rushed to arm themselves, at least with hunting rifles) ... And there was no reaction from Moscow, the Ministry of Internal Affairs, the KGB ... The Armenians were given complete carte blanche. After putting things in order in Azerbaijan, we intercepted a sabotage group of terrorists who were trying to blow up the oil and gas pipeline going from Azerbaijan to Armenia. Undoubtedly for provocative purposes for further incitement. And this happened already in March.
And this group of diversionists flew in from Armenia (!) On two Mi-8 helicopters (!!!), which we intercepted with our two Mi-24 duty officers. The detonation was disrupted (they managed to tie the pipes with explosives, but did not manage to connect the detonators, a backpack with detonators was lying around), but the saboteurs managed to retreat to Stepanakert, sat down on the square and fled. It was on my watch and I took part in it.
And a day later we were ordered ... to forget about this incident ...
This is how the frenzy of Armenian separatism was nurtured and fed.
Gorbachev and his camarilla.
In raging Armenia, no one put things in order.
... And in 1994, these Dashnaks captured 7 more districts in addition to the N. Karabakh region ... And they were very proud of their victories ...
True, Armenia itself after that fell into a blockade from its neighbors, subsidies from the Center stopped long ago, poverty, hunger and cold ... and the Armenians began to scatter rapidly in all directions.
I know families of such refugees in Donetsk.
After victories, life was uncomfortable for them at home ...

And we have a war of a completely different nature.

[Rudkovsky]

Yes, yes, you are good and are fighting for the right cause and in general God is with you, and the rest are bad, fighting for the wrong cause and God frowns at their deeds. Classic.

But in fact you are an ordinary Ukrainian - a separatist who sold his homeland for a sweet pie, but the provocateurs did not give you a pie, but only 7 years of war.

[bayard]

Quote: Rudkovsky

But in fact you are an ordinary Ukrainian - a separatist who sold his homeland

For such words, I would have twisted my soul out of you.
And tied it in a knot.
I am Russian, from Russian parents, I was born in Russia (RSFSR) in the South Urals.
Graduated from school in Ukraine.
He studied at a military university in the Baltic States, and took an internship there.
He served in the Transcaucasus.
He worked in Moscow.
My homeland is the Soviet Union.
And nobody beckoned me with a pie, but we got up to fight when armed criminals seized power, began to kill police officers and anti-Maidan activists.
Especially when they burned people in Odessa and shot the city police department in Mariupol with policemen inside - from BMP-2 cannons and grenade launchers! There, on the first floor alone, no less than 50 corpses were counted.
And before the war I lived quite well, had my own business and did not live in poverty at all.

[Grits]

Quote: bayard

I served in Azerbaijan in my last officer's life - in 1988 - 1991. , so I just caught the beginning of this conflict and I remember everything VERY well

I beat you cool ...

[bayard]

Quote: Gritsa

I beat you cool ...

Yes, in his youth, everything was in drive and adrenaline, people were beaten there, Russians followed the Armenians from Azerbaijan, left en masse but on their own, it became too alarming for a normal life.
... I will not forget Yazov's report to Gorbachev in the morning of January 20, 1990 (the call was through our communication center and, as everything was recorded) about the "restoration of Soviet Power in Baku) ... and the next day this Judas told reporters from the screen that he "was not even aware of what the Army had done there, I say, I did not give an order and generally was on a trip abroad ..." ... We were just furious with such a hypercynical lie, especially after he had already done a similar thing after the Tbilisi events, blaming everything on General Rodionov ... The record immediately after Yazov's report was ordered to be destroyed, but the person on duty before that had time to play it for us several times.

So the traitors kindled ethnic conflicts throughout the country, adding kerosene wherever they did. And the Armenians in that process were one of their main instruments, on a par with, and even ahead of the Balts.

[Rubina]

I'm just shocked at your honesty. You're right. It was all that way. I can only add that many Azerbaijanis also hid and took Armenians to the airport. My husband took the neighbors to the airport, and my neighbor bought the Armenian neighbors' apartment and brought it in full in cash to Moscow.

[bayard]

Yes, there were such cases, and they were by no means isolated, I also know about many similar things.

[icant007]

All hands for! In 1988-91 they lived and served in Baku.

Unfortunately, the majority on the forum simply do not know the picture of those years and do not try to find out, therefore they are deeply mistaken and do not understand the position of Azerbaijan.

[bayard]

Yes, those events were hardly covered in the press, the television was silent. I was worried that my parents would be worried after learning about our events ... and upon arriving on vacation I found out that they did not even suspect what was happening with us ... Despite the fact that my mother was visiting me since 1 until January 5, 1990 and saw the newly burnt Armenian church on Azneft ... In the information space of the Union, there was a complete blockade of all events from the Transcaucasus ... Therefore, people did not remember it.

[icant007]

And my father and I (was the head of the air defense division in the Salyan barracks) on January 14 went to the cinema in the city center. Near the Baksovet we met a lone explosive patrol in helmets, bulletproof vests and with batons. No weapons. And at home they learned from TV that there were pogroms in the city. Although in the center where we were, nothing said about it.
It seems to me that the church was set on fire at the end of December 1989, because that day my classmates and I went to the center, we had a Criminal Procedure Code nearby.
A large crowd surrounded the church. But there was no open fire to be seen. Some smoke poured from the broken windows. The temple itself was outwardly intact.
On the night of January 19-20, watching the shooting in the Krasny Vostok area, I saw the reflections of searchlights, maybe this is what you were talking about.

[bayard]

My mother flew to me on January 1 and I decided to show her the city right away, went along Azneft, reached the church, it seemed whole, but went in ... everything was burnt inside, frescoes with black scales, in the middle of the haram (right under the chandelier) a lot of human feces and flocks of Azerbaijani children are scurrying inside ... and a few adults - also to see. We were taken aback then - it looks like everything is whole, and the gate too ...
In general, I showed my mother Baku.
And the case with anti-aircraft searchlights was in a different place - 90 km. to the south, there provocateurs led by the "Minister of Defense of the Popular Front of Azerbaijan" came to "negotiate" the transfer of weapons to them from the warehouses of artillery equipment of the mob-reserve ... but the negotiations did not go well and then they drove the entire population of the village with the aim of throwing it into an assault ...
At our unit there was an airfield of "school aviation" from the Armavir School, to ensure night flights there were anti-aircraft searchlights to illuminate the strip ... It was with these projectors that we dispersed that crowd, in a minute the square was empty, and of course "everyone in rifle "... The provocateurs in five cars rushed to run ... but there the steppe is as flat as a table ... So they took them into the" cross "with two searchlights and led them for five kilometers. The power of the searchlights is brutal, I myself almost went blind - I didn't have time to turn away, but in the dark ... for 10-15 minutes I didn't see anything at all, I thought I was blind, but nothing let go.
It was then that I almost took this "Minister of Defense" prisoner. When they arrived, I was at the checkpoint and was the first to negotiate with them, well, and then I sent them to the command for negotiations ... But I gave special instructions to the fighters sent with them to escort ... And when they moved away from the checkpoint to 100 meters, behind them the bolt suddenly snapped reliably and the voice of the escorts became harsh and imperious, like a convoy before being shot. And they were delivered to the headquarters in a prepared, psychologically, form ... Well, and only then, when they were sent to the headquarters, they moved to start the crowd.
And while they were being taken to the headquarters, I was near his armed retinue to control the situation ...
Fear then my soldiers caught up with the "minister" and his partner ... I specially sent two of the most arrogant ... to bring down arrogance.
The fighters then, from their reaction to the clang of the shutter, rolled with laughter (but not with them - discipline).

And the fact that you saw the reflections of the searchlights is most likely the searchlights, or the searchlights on the armored personnel carrier, because the "assault on the city" at dawn began.
... Our searchlights WHERE were more powerful.

[bayard]

Quote: icant007

my father and I (was the head of the air defense division in the Salyan barracks)

Near the Salyan barracks, a friend of mine lived - Lieutenant Colonel Amons Vitaly Eduardovich, he served at the RIC Headquarters of the Southern Group of Forces, maybe you knew each other? Since your father served in the air defense?

[icant007]

Can. Father (Lysenko Nikolai Fedorovich) from the summer of 88, first in the High Command also served in the air defense line, his chief was like Lieutenant General Fields, and then in the summer of 89 he was transferred to the beginning. Air defense of the local division. But he spent the January events in Guzdek, where an anti-aircraft missile regiment was stationed. And my mother and I stayed in Baku. And we were taken out of the city with the assistance of Colonel Nevolko. He was either the chief (or the chief of staff) of the Air Defense of the 4th Army.

[mmaxx]

Are you going to "throw to Stepanakert"?

[NTD]

Author Ilya Polonsky. You write

The success of the Azerbaijani army itself, which was achieved not without direct military assistance to Turkey

Why do you repeat yourself as Armenians, once you write, write the entire list. Thanks not only to Turkish drones, but also to Israeli technology. Also, the Russian MSTA and tanks and Sushki and MLRS Smerch, as well as Iranian shells that Azerbaijan buys. It's not worth adding everything for the good of Turkey.
Next

Second chance for Armenia to start an all-out war against Azerbaijan

Than? By whom? How? For slaughter?

The role of Turkey in the Transcaucasian politics will become more significant, and at times, and the positions of Russia will weaken.

The author, in my opinion, does not vkurse that Erdogan is constantly in contact with Putin. The author, if you don't know, even Iran has merged Armenia.

The Armenians are doing very badly.

[air defense]

The Armenians are doing very badly.

So the USSR at 41, too, was not doing very well, and in the first war at the beginning Armenia was losing. I honestly do not know how really important Karabakh is for an ordinary Armenian, if they are all ready to die for it, then there will inevitably be a revenge and retreat of Azerbaijan. Even now, Azerbaijan, with all its weapons and superiority, has lost at least a thousand people, plus the barmaley imported from Syria. The Turkish lira is now making the same steep dive as the ruble and Erdagan's problems are not excluded, and without his support, the situation will be completely different in Karabakh. In terms of moral and strong-willed qualities, the Armenians look stronger than the Azerbaijanis.

Plus, here Aliyev not so long ago stated that Yerevan is the historical territory of Azerbaijanis and his goal is to take it back, so the little Fuhrer may go too far, according to the good old tradition, to arrange ethnic cleansing.

[NTD]

Galimov propaganda carry.

[air defense]

And what is the propaganda, let me ask you? Aliyev made no statements on Yerevan? Erdogan does not support Azerbaijan? The Syrian barmaley have already been identified and there is a statement from the heads of the intelligence services of Russia, the United States and a number of European countries.
Ethnic cleansing, so recently there were Armenian pogroms in Baku and perhaps even those who took part in them or even now participate in hostilities are still alive. But by the way, I think that Karabakh is your Azerbaijani territory, but the reality is that Armenia also considers it its own.
The fact that the Armenians are stronger as a war is obvious, by the way they still hold on, remove the support of Turkey and Azerbaijan will be forced to retreat.

[Nagaibak]

MTN "You are carrying galley propaganda."
I noticed too. One to one like yours.)))

[NTD]

Quote: Airdefense

So the USSR at 41, too, was not doing very well, and in the first war at the beginning Armenia was losing.

You are comparing the USSR and Armenia, do you think this is normal?

Quote: Airdefense

lost plus barmaley imported from Syria.

And the barmaley in the faces of the PKK Kurds. Lebanese and so on, is that okay? That's right and we do it!

Quote: Airdefense

Plus, here Aliyev not so long ago stated that Yerevan is the historical territory of Azerbaijanis and his goal is to take it back

Is it a secret or news for you about what Aliyev said Yerevan is a historical territory of Azerbaijan? Or are only Armenians allowed to remember historical lands?

And about what he wants to target, this is your blatant lie.

[air defense]

And the barmaley in the faces of the PKK Kurds. Lebanese and so on, is that okay? That's right and we do it!

Of course not, especially if it is a lie, the Armenians cannot get volunteers because of transport problems. But as I understand it, you indirectly confirm the presence of the Syrian barmaley, which the heads of the intelligence services of Russia and the United States announced again.

Is it a secret or news for you about what Aliyev said Yerevan is a historical territory of Azerbaijan? Or are only Armenians allowed to remember historical lands?

Only your Fuehrer said that his goal return Yerevan.

[Peter rybak]

Vyacheslav, don't go broke. You should not insult the head of state, being confident in your impunity. The Internet forgives everything.
There is propaganda from both sides. But the fact remains - for another couple of weeks and we will discuss other topics here. Not related to Karabakh.

[air defense]

And how to call Aliyev a dictator-usurper who, at the suggestion of Erdogan, is waging a war in Karabakh using barmalev from Syria, I have no sympathy for him. By the way, I do not feel any warm feelings for the Armenian side either, the guys were engaged in a Russophobic policy. But if it were a showdown between Armenia and Azerbaijan, then everything would be fine for me in general, but realizing that Erdogan is behind Aliyev's back, I do not exclude further provocations on the Armenian border, strengthening of fundamentalism in Azerbaijan itself, and as a result it will be possible to get a gadyushnik like Idlib, but already close to Russia.

[Peter rybak]

Treat how you want. But insulting a person on the Internet, taking advantage of impunity, is the last thing. And this applies not only to presidents.

[72jora72]

Is it a secret or news for you about what Aliyev said Yerevan is a historical territory of Azerbaijan? Or are only Armenians allowed to remember historical lands?

Yesterday Iran also hinted that the territory of modern Azerbaijan is the former lands of Persia ...

[Sanichsan]

Quote: MTN

Galimov propaganda carry.

self-critical ...

[paul3390]

how really important is Karabakh for an ordinary Armenian

Something I do not see in Russia huge crowds of Armenians who want to fight for the Ridna Karabakh region .. But we will have more of them than in Armenia .. Unfortunately ..
However, the Azerbaijanis somehow did not show any special patriotism either.

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: Airdefense

So the USSR at 41, too, was not doing very well

The comparison is not correct ... Armenia does not have the necessary human and material resources, unlike the USSR ...

Quote: Airdefense

in the first war, Armenia was losing at first.

Then Azerbaijan did not have an Army, it was ... like a militia ...

[air defense]

Armenia does not have the necessary human and material resources, unlike the USSR ...

What are the missing resources? If Azerbaijan takes Karabakh, then in Armenia there will most likely be a change of power, politicians will come, who declare their goal to return Karabakh, they will also invest in the army, modernization, brainwashing of young people about the historicity of Karabakh. This is an endless swing until someone cuts someone to zero or an external force resolves this conflict.
Even now, the Armenians are holding on despite all the victorious reports of Azerbaijan.

[NTD]

Quote: Airdefense

then in Armenia there will most likely be a change of power

Because of the change in power there, Armenia will not belong to the Armenians. Dejure maybe.

[Peter rybak]

And in a wonderful future, Armenia will declare war on Azerbaijan? Not sure. I will tell you what will happen to Armenia in the coming years. After the lost war, when refugees rush through them in transit to Russia, the attitude towards Armenians in Russia will worsen even more. The fact that their propaganda programs on Russian TV are already annoying is a fact.
Armenia is one of the poorest countries in the post-Soviet space. And most of its "modern" weapons were received from Russia either on credit, or for beautiful eyes.
I don’t think that Armenia will ever rise from its knees, unless, of course, it opens wide the doors of the United States or Russia. But Pashinyan's policy of surrendering Karabakh is precisely designed to make Russia even more hated inside Armenia and the country would have an open road to the EU. For God's sake. Who believes that Russia will lose from this? Russia does not even have common borders with Armenia. The 102nd military unit can be moved to Dagestan.
But who will lose is Armenia itself. As soon as the last Russian soldier crosses its border in the opposite direction, Armenia will simply be devoured by Turkey, or driven to extreme poverty. And the West will not help anything. As I understand it, Erdogan does not care at all about someone else's opinion.
And we will somehow live here without a base in Armenia.
I want to say that there are enough Armenians here in Ufa too. They are not only in Sochi or Krasnodar. As far as I know, there are three times less Azerbaijanis in Bashkortostan. In the South Market near my house, mostly Armenians, by the way, of military age, trade.

[Grits]

Quote: Peter Rybak

And we will somehow live here without a base in Armenia.

Let experienced knowledgeable officers tell us - what is the significance of our base in Armenia? What are its tasks, what covers, what is the stability? And in general - is it needed? After all, we will not intimidate Turkey with one single base. And in the event of a mess with the Turks, the fighters from it will not capture half of Turkey. It seems that we need it not so much for us as for the Armenians themselves, so that the Turks do not come and finally cut out the Armenians, not wanting to butt with Russia. And taking into account the fact that after the war in Karabakh (I think who will be the winner there is already obvious), the power and influence of Turkey in Transcaucasia will be undeniable. In any case, much more powerful than Russian influence.
This is where the question arises - if we are no longer able to keep Transcaucasia in the sphere of our orbit, then is there any point in holding on to this base. Maybe, indeed, transfer it to the territory of the Russian Federation. Moreover, the Armenians want it so much. And let them then themselves there with the Turks and Azerbaijanis ramming until they lose their pulse.

[andrew42]

That's a very good question. It is obvious that the base in Gyumri DOES NOT PROTECT anything, but itself is an object that requires protection, which is extremely problematic for Russia to provide. The Caucasus was lost for Russia in the 1990s, and there is no need to pass off wishful thinking. In other words, decisions about "leveling the front" were also made in less tragic situations. The meaning is bases - just to shine in front of the Turks. In military terms, this is a weak and far advanced outpost, doomed to be cut out with serious intentions of the enemy. In addition, the Armenians themselves dragged the slogans "go home".

[Grits]

Quote: Nikolaevich I

Then Azerbaijan did not have an Army, it was ... like a militia ...

Then Azerbaijan did not have Turkey

[Nikolaevich I]

Now, I don’t remember something about "Turkey and Turkish officers"! But I remember that in the ranks of both sides there were "former Soviet" officers ... and simply, "technical specialists" (anti-aircraft gunners, artillerymen, tankmen, pilots, anti-tankmen ...) ... often, with Russian surnames!

[16329]

Actually, then in the Azerbaijan Army there were the same Turkish officers (who replaced the Russian ones)

[Rubina]

Aliyev said this in response to constant claims to Nakhichevan, Ganja, Turkish and Georgian lands. He said no more. But the map in the Yerevan metro, is it okay that Russian lands are also included on it?

[New Year day]

Quote: MTN

Also, the Russian MSTA and tanks and Sushki and MLRS Smerch, as well as Iranian shells that Azerbaijan buys.

Essential and undeniable

[Daniil Konovalenko]

Let's see what will happen, although what to watch. Russia's mediocre policy in the Caucasus has led to what is happening now.

[NTD]

Quote: Daniil Konovalenko

Let's see what will happen, although what to watch. Russia's mediocre policy in the Caucasus has led to what is happening now.

So you think that you are smarter than military analysts and Putin's advisers?

[Overlock]

Quote: MTN

do you think that you are smarter than military analysts and Putin's advisers?

And there are the gods?
Mistakes with Ukraine and Belarus are not considered?

[andrew42]

Transcaucasia generally does not deserve any mediocre or any particularly gifted "Russian policy". The policy should be cold, calculating, and only in the interests of Russia. All the republics of Transcaucasia happily ran out of the USSR, which means that they did not want to have anything to do with Russia, as the basis of the Soviet Union (the fact that the basis for the creation of the union was the RSFSR, I hope, there is no need to remind). Azerbaijan found itself a "Turkish husband", Armenia - an "American boyfriend". Everybody's Free! Cooperation, mutually beneficial - yes. But no more gingerbreads at the expense of the dead Russian non-black earth, as in the union. Basta. Business relationship only.

[fa2998]

Quote: MTN

without additional people, retaining will be problematic.

In Rostov-not-Don, we can easily form 20 divisions of Armenians, and the reserves will remain!

[leks]

If only with the help of the National Guard to form in a voluntary compulsory manner.
I doubt very much that there will be so many volunteers among the Armenians in the Russian Federation ready to go to slaughter.

[NTD]

Quote: leks

Armenians in Russia are ready to go to slaughter.

Video clips from the Azerbaijani side were released with this intention. IMHO.

[New Year day]

Quote: fa2998

In Rostov-not-Don, we can easily form ave. 20 Armenian divisions,

Do Armenians agree? Diaspora in Sochi is 20%. What are the problems? Simonyan and Keosayan are ready?

[Scorpio05]

There was no local population left there, and so before the war there lived only 50 thousand people, the population of a small microdistrict in the Russian Federation, and now, in general, everyone has left, there are soldiers from Armenia itself from abroad (Lebanon, Syria, etc.).

[nobody75]

Having received guarantees from Russia to defend their own territory, the Armenians concentrated two army corps in the composition of 4 divisions. It is their artillery units that are shelling the corps, which is searching in the direction of Berdzor. The double task of covering the border with Armenia and searching for Berdzor does not allow this corps group to organize a full-fledged offensive. Therefore, she is constantly being derailed to strengthen the military group operating against Shushi. After the capture of Gadrut and Fizuli, the second corps of the Azerbaijani Armed Forces launched actions against Martuni and Shushi. Will this "hodgepodge" team take Shusha? Not sure.
In the north, the 10th Guards Rifle Division of the NKR is successfully defending - a normal, full-blooded division. As I said, Azebaydjan's lack of Guderians and Ribentropov did not allow to develop an offensive along the border, and the loss of tempo and striking force of the corps in aimless strikes in diverging directions does not allow strikes to be delivered to the required operational depth.
Taking into account that the Armenians continue to strike at the rear of the Azerbaijani group, I expect a crisis in the offensive operation of the Azerbaijani Armed Forces within the next 10 days. If they fail to take Shusha, then after the expiry of the above-mentioned period, the parties will switch to positional battles. After that, the Armenians tried to perform the maneuver with two corps.
Sincerely

[NTD]

Quote: nobody75

Armenians concentrated two army corps in the structure of 4 divisions.

Azerbaijani drones groaning, do you know? Moreover, yesterday the military motorcade was destroyed. The forward command post of the 18th motorized rifle division was destroyed, and the chief of staff of the division, Colonel Sergei Shakaryan, who was recently awarded the highest rank of "Hero of Partsakh", was also destroyed + Deputy Defense Minister of the puppet regime of Karabakh Artur Sargsyan was destroyed. To all this, add the new names of the victims ... The Armenians have updated the list.

Quote: nobody75

After that, the Armenians try to perform the maneuver with two corps.
Sincerely

drones are waiting.

[nobody75]

Azerbaijani drones groaning, do you know?

About Azerbaijan:

This nation has already passed. Him - what he did. And to you - what you have done. And you will not be asked about his affairs.

Azerbaijani drones groaning, do you know?

Allah will do everything. For "Allah alone conquers."
Sincerely

[NTD]

Quote: nobody75

Allah will do everything. For "Allah alone conquers."
Sincerely

I really don't doubt it.

[Nagaibak]

nobody75 "If you do not succeed in taking Shusha, then after the expiry of the above-mentioned period, the parties will switch to positional battles."
What are you talking about?))) They have taken Shusha a long time ago and are marching victoriously to Stepanakert.))) Hope for drones.)))

[sevtrash]

Quote: nobody75

If it is not possible to take Shusha, then after the expiry of the above-mentioned period, the parties will switch to positional battles. After that, the Armenians tried to perform the maneuver with two corps.
Sincerely

It is not clear what are the prospects of the Armenians in the defense of Karabakh. So far, the domination of drones has not gone anywhere, on the contrary, more and more examples of the defeat of Armenian equipment and manpower. They seem to have 2 outputs left. The first is to accept the loss of Karabakh. The second is to strike at the dam, oil and gas fields and their structure. This option will lead to an escalation of the conflict with many casualties, but with at least some prospect of more energetic intervention by the United States or Russia. But it can also lead to the capture of Yerevan by Turkish-Azerbaijani troops. I have no doubt that they will choose the first option. Life is more precious. And the blame for the loss of honor can be attributed to others. Russia is the only candidate.
And a serious puncture in Russia. After Ukraine, Belarus, etc., etc. Modavia, Kyrgyzstan is next in line. Or what is left there may already be nothing.

[nobody75]

What does the word "puncture" mean? Are you ready to fight for all of the above republics? Maintain them from the Russian budget? Ukraine dumped off to Europe and ... it is easier for us, but today there are no NATO bases there. I can write a novel in verse about Ukraine, Gazprom, Ala Gora, Enron and Hunter Biden. Only laziness ...
In Kyrgyzstan, the Maidan is already a national sport. Games between local clans. And our base is there ...
About Belarus - "Goblin Reserve" ... The experiment failed - the fakir was drunk, and the negative result of returning to the scoop was the same result.
Previously, Russia had only two allies - the army and the navy. And now a third has appeared - VKS!
Sincerely

[Sanichsan]

Quote: nobody75

Previously, Russia had only two allies - the army and the navy. And now a third has appeared - VKS!

forgot the fourth ally, the Strategic Missile Forces! so then the limits in the main military temple 4

[sevtrash]

Quote: nobody75

Dumped Ukraine to Europe and ... it's easier for us

There was a friendly state, it became hostile ... Is it easier?

Quote: nobody75

In Kyrgyzstan, the Maidan is already a national sport. Games between local clans. And our base is there ...

There is also a base in Armenia. For now. There is no doubt that the Armenians will accuse Russia of their defeat and all other sins?

Quote: nobody75

About Belarus - "Goblin Reserve" ... The experiment failed - the fakir was drunk, and the negative result of returning to the scoop was the same result.

With such an attitude, you can ask for everything and everyone. And then the rest.
The effectiveness of the policy is below the floor.

[nobody75]

There was a friendly state, it became hostile ... Is it easier?

Are you talking about a friendship agreement? So he was only on paper. In fact, the whole "friendship" was only in the pipe. In the murky schemes of Chernomyrdin and Kuchma, who entered the European gas market liberalized by Enron. As soon as Enron went bankrupt (2001), Gazprom immediately started having problems with the Ukrainian transit problems, which resulted in the proposal of Naftogaz (March 2005) to abandon the soviet barter schemes and switch to direct cash settlements. Viktor Andreevich did not know about the Cactus III scheme, which made it possible to make money on the resale of Russian gas, as Enron did in the States, and then in Europe ... But this is a separate story ... and not even about Yulia .. ...

There is no doubt that the Armenians will accuse Russia of their defeat and all other sins?

Calls. I posted pictures - the Russian diaspora is already collecting all the money for the war.

With such an attitude, you can ask for everything and everyone.

Everyone, who is this?

Russia should give Belarus some of the money it is now spending on defense. This was stated in an interview with the youtube-channel PolitWera by a former member of the election headquarters of Viktor Babariko, who is now in jail, Yuri Voskresnsky, who is now actively cooperating with the authorities.

He named the approximate amount of 4 - 5 billion dollars ...
Do you still need such "friends"?
Sincerely

[sevtrash]

Quote: nobody75

Are you talking about a friendship agreement?

And what has to do with the contract. Why don't you see any trends? The inner circle of Russia is turning from friendly countries into hostile ones. One by one. Do you think it is easier for Russia to break with them? And the sales markets? And with Ukraine - engines for ships, planes, helicopters? And this is all money, economics. The blind can see.
It is not clear where is going and who is the conductor? And you have to work with a conductor, not a dog. Because he is a conductor.

[nobody75]

The inner circle of Russia is turning from friendly countries into hostile ones.

We have to pay too much for their "friendship".

Do you think it is easier for Russia to break with them?

Yes, I think you were not so worried about the collapse of the CMEA ... Why?

And the sales markets?

Gabon, as a sales market, is larger and more interesting than Ukraine. Are you offering to help them pay off the debts that Yatsynyuk had already collected? Then Jareska will be glad!

And with Ukraine - engines for ships, planes, helicopters?

For ships and helicopters, the import has already been replaced by engines and gearboxes. "Zorya" was breathing hard.

And this is all money, economics.

Exactly, but they love money. There is nothing to squander them on "friends". Yes, such a friend from Ukraine ... Where and when has Ukraine supported Russia militarily since the 90s?

And you have to work with a conductor, not a dog. Because he is a conductor.

Did Poroshenko work well with the "conductor"? Liked? I put it on the wrong "conductor".
Sincerely

[andrew42]

Is it okay that the Azerbaijanis are obviously conducting military operations with the condition of squeezing the Armenians out of the occupied territories? “They simply don’t need Armenians there, none of them. This is not about a hasty seizure with the receipt of an occupied population. It's about stripping, albeit by such methods. Therefore, Aliyev does not need any "breakthroughs". Will grind NCR into flour, slowly and surely. And not Guderians in the mountains are required. Essentially, a driven hunt.

[nobody75]

And what is happening at Berdzor - Lachin now? Wasn't it a breakthrough in the south? Compare, please, with the actions of "Swift Heinz" in the Polish company. One to one. Only there Guderian's tanks broke through to the Soviet - Polish border. And with the USSR, Germany had a non-aggression pact - the Ribentrop-Molotov Pact. That is why I write that Azerbaijan does not have its own Guderians and Ribentrop.
An attempt to block communications in the north (Murovdag) and in the south (Berdzor) suggests that an encirclement operation was envisaged, and not squeezing out the population into Armenia.
Sincerely

[New Year day]

... The second chance is for Armenia to start an all-out war against Azerbaijan, including, inter alia, strikes on the republic's oil facilities

и

... .. then Russia will have to render assistance to Yerevan as an ally in the CSTO.

What is it like? Armenia attacks Azerbaijan with blows on oil pipelines and oil wells, and Russia should intervene in response to Armenia's surrender? Stunned!

[Achilles]

Quote: Silvestr

What is it like? Armenia attacks Azerbaijan with blows on oil pipelines and oil wells, and Russia should intervene in response to Armenia's surrender? Stunned!

It is not Armenia that needs to strike at oil pipelines and oil wells and an oil pipe, but Karabakh itself, if Nagorno-Karabakh wants to survive and defend its historical land (not these 7 regions that belong to Azerbaijan), namely the historical part of Karabakh, then you need Strike Karabakh on everything that brings profit to Azerbaijan

[New Year day]

Quote: Achilles

Strike Karabakh on everything that brings profit to Azerbaijan

Forgot about Turkey, it is also in the share of business and in no small part.
Then Karabakh gets it

[xomaNN]

losses of the Armenian side in armored vehicles - apparently destroyed half of all Armenian tanks, half of self-propelled artillery installations, 67 multiple launch rocket systems

And the worst thing for Russia is that in addition to the remnants of the Soviet, "fresh" equipment from the Russian Federation has not actually been paid for, but taken either for our irrevocable loans or practically donated. this is the loss of the Russian Federation ...

[GTYCBJYTH2021]

Quote: xomaNN

losses of the Armenian side in armored vehicles - apparently destroyed half of all Armenian tanks, half of self-propelled artillery installations, 67 multiple launch rocket systems

And the worst thing for Russia is that in addition to the remnants of the Soviet, "fresh" equipment from the Russian Federation has not actually been paid for, but taken either for our irrevocable loans or practically donated. this is the loss of the Russian Federation ...

We lost more, but we are alive ... we tolerate ... we believe in a bright, satisfying and sufficient life ...

[GTYCBJYTH2021]

[quote = MTN] [quote = random passer-by] If Armenia becomes an aggressor and hits, for example, the Azerbaijani oil infrastructure [/ quote]
Igor, you are well aware of the role of oil corporations and their influence on the political arena of the countries of the world. If the Armenians do such a stupid thing, which means flattery in the pockets of the oil companies and, most importantly, on BP, we will just have to sit and watch the show what Britain will do to the Armenians.
And what will the British do with the Armenians, they will bomb, launch missiles ... the aircraft carriers cannot be driven there ... need ..... like Europe and America.

[NTD]

Quote: GTYCBJYTH2021

And what will the British do with the Armenians, they will bomb, launch rockets ...

they will destroy them in the political arena.

[Sanichsan]

Quote: MTN

they will destroy them in the political arena.

Who? British??? they themselves would not have thrown back their hooves with Brexet and Lockdown from the second wave of Covidla

[Cottager452]

Large human losses among Armenians will lead to a point of no return in relations with countries that have allowed it.

[paul3390]

Large human losses among Armenians will lead to a point of no return in relations with countries that have allowed it.

In the sense of? Will Armenians quarrel with Armenia? For who else is the main culprit of the military defeat if not Armenia itself? It was necessary to prepare for war, and not to throw a show-off jumping on the Maidans ..

[Sanichsan]

Quote: paul3390

Will Armenians quarrel with Armenia?

exactly! will quarrel and come out of it! in the sense of Armenia. damn ... they will come out to us

[flicker]

The first chance is if a "miracle" happens and Moscow decides to openly intervene in the conflict in the Transcaucasus

This will not be a "miracle" but stupidity.
---
It is more than obvious that the Anglo-Saxons and Israeli propagandists long for direct Russian participation in this conflict against Azerbaijan (wider Turkey, and then with the Turks and Muslims).
That's just them broke off.
---
Unfortunately, in this conflict, one of the parties will be the one to play. The difficulty for us is that both peoples are not strangers to us and we would very much like this conflict to be resolved peacefully.
---
But ...

[parusnik]

About the "miracle". Stirlitz fell from the balcony, and miraculously caught on the cornice on the floor below. The next day, the miracle was swollen and made it difficult to walk.

[paul3390]

Quote: nobody75

Allah will do everything.

Trust in Allah - and tie the donkey ..

[Old tanker]

Why is everyone so worried about the Armenian population of Karabakh? Why don't they remember the ethnic cleansing of Azerbaijanis in Karabakh in the 90s, hundreds of thousands of Azerbaijani refugees from Karabakh? Now Azeri tears are pouring out to Armenians.

[Angivin]

Quote: Airdefense

In terms of moral and strong-willed qualities, the Armenians look stronger than the Azerbaijanis.

Is there a scale for measuring moral and volitional? Share your conclusions, if it is not difficult.

[parusnik]

It is immediately evident that Polonsky wrote the article, if Damantsev wrote, everything would be clear there.

[Grits]

Quote: parusnik

It is immediately evident that Polonsky wrote the article, if Damantsev wrote, everything would be clear there

In in. And I would even cite as an example the very scale of moral and volitional qualities. With the name and brand, date of modernization and quantitative and qualitative characteristics in absolute numbers.

[Smirnoff]

I do not know what the outcome of the confrontation will be, but the leadership of Armenia will face difficult times.

[Peter rybak]

This photo shows my peers. I'm sorry for the generation. When we were young, we were tested by the Afghan, when we were young, the Union collapsed and we were doomed to survive; in the early shaggy nineties, with grief, they supported their families in half. I still remember the salaries with chickens and bricks. When we became mature, the Chechen wars broke out, which did not pass by my generation either. In anticipation of an economic miracle, we lived for several more years and waited for our pensions to be postponed for another five years. And it seems like the sixth decade, you can quietly sit at home and babysit your grandchildren - but no, pandemic, damn it.
And these are my peers with weapons. They have more dignity than young people who by hook or by crook hide from the call, or proclaim: this is not my war.
Whoever they are, Armenians or Azerbadzians, but still I am proud of my generation. I don’t know why.

[t-12]

but still I'm proud of my generation

We should rather be proud of those who brought up this generation. And today's young people are brought up on bubble and clown "post-Soviet" culture.

[Scorpio05]

Quote: nobody75

Having received guarantees from Russia to defend their own territory, the Armenians concentrated two army corps in the composition of 4 divisions. It is their artillery units that are shelling the corps, which is searching in the direction of Berdzor. The double task of covering the border with Armenia and searching for Berdzor does not allow this corps group to organize a full-fledged offensive. Therefore, she is constantly being derailed to strengthen the military group operating against Shushi. After the capture of Gadrut and Fizuli, the second corps of the Azerbaijani Armed Forces launched actions against Martuni and Shushi. Will this "hodgepodge" team take Shusha? Not sure.
In the north, the 10th Guards Rifle Division of the NKR is successfully defending - a normal, full-blooded division. As I said, Azebaydjan's lack of Guderians and Ribentropov did not allow to develop an offensive along the border, and the loss of tempo and striking force of the corps in aimless strikes in diverging directions does not allow strikes to be delivered to the required operational depth.
Taking into account that the Armenians continue to strike at the rear of the Azerbaijani group, I expect a crisis in the offensive operation of the Azerbaijani Armed Forces within the next 10 days. If they fail to take Shusha, then after the expiry of the above-mentioned period, the parties will switch to positional battles. After that, the Armenians tried to perform the maneuver with two corps.
Sincerely

Well, actually, Ribbentrop was a diplomat, Foreign Minister) Well, Heinz Guderian was a tank genius, a master of lightning-fast flank raids, one of the authors and a brilliant performer of the German blitzkrieg. He was called "Fast Heinz") True, only at the end of the war did he become chief of the general staff of the ground forces, in a defensive war his genius remained unclaimed, and it was too late. Germany did not have enough resources even for a full-fledged defense.
What are the fast flanking raids on the Karabakh theater of operations? The Azerbaijani Armed Forces, under constant fire from the territory of Armenia, have to break through to the Lachin corridor along the entire Armenian border. To be honest, the actions are usually regarded as unfeasible due to the impossibility of retaliatory fire (the CSTO factor) to neutralize the firing points of the Armenian Armed Forces located on the territory of Armenia proper. The Azerbaijani Armed Forces are breaking through to Lachin under the hurricane fire of Armenians from the territory of Armenia in an extremely difficult situation, the Armenians can as much as they want, as they want, from where they want to attack the Azerbaijani troops from the territory of Armenia, strike them with art, MLRS and aviation, make raid passes to the territory of Azerbaijan from any point of the border. Or in general, to attack with large forces from its territory possible gaps in the Azerbaijani defense, starting from Zangelan. The Azerbaijani Armed Forces are even theoretically deprived of this opportunity, since they immediately see the Russian flags appearing from nowhere in front of them. This is some kind of duel between two boxers, where one of them is forced to box with one hand, forcing the other hand to be held behind his back. Armenia's behavior is a blatant abuse of membership in the CSTO and Russia's military umbrella. And you say Guderian or Ribbentrop ...

[nobody75]

Excuse me, you didn't know about this when planning the operation? And I didn't write to you about this in September? Now I can give more details - they won't consider it a disclosure. The Armenians had 2 divisions in Karabakh. One 10th mountain rifle, which is now defended in the north, and the 18th motorized rifle - "cropped", of which the 9th MRR was more or less efficient. All the equipment, which was leaning, was withdrawn to Armenia. Otherwise, Pashinyan would not have sat in Yerevan. All your success in the south is due to the fact that 1 division and 1 regiment have dropped against you! The columns destroyed by your UAVs are an attempt to replenish the 18th Mechanized Infantry Division. And an unsuccessful attack by a tank battalion - the introduction of units into battle ... Therefore, there is no camouflage in the 18th, no normal platoon and company commanders, since no one was involved in training and coordination!
Therefore, I do not really believe in your cartoons, because I know that the equipment of the 18th mechanized infantry division is not there.
Sincerely

[Scorpio05]

Quote: Angivin

Quote: Airdefense

In terms of moral and strong-willed qualities, the Armenians look stronger than the Azerbaijanis.

Is there a scale for measuring moral and volitional? Share your conclusions, if it is not difficult.

He means how the Armenians in a highly moral manner in a strong-willed style faded, their heels sparkled, leaving 54 units of Armenian tanks on the move for the Azerbaijani Armed Forces. The Armenians were in such a hurry that they did not even blow up (mined) the ammunition depots (there were Cornets and everything else).

[Li17]

It's good that at least the equipment and weapons were not sold, this is already positive!

[Scorpio05]

Quote: nobody75

Excuse me, you didn't know about this when planning the operation? And I didn't write to you about this in September? Now I can give more details - they won't consider it a disclosure. The Armenians had 2 divisions in Karabakh. One 10th mountain rifle, which is now defended in the north, and the 18th motorized rifle - "cropped", of which the 9th MRR was more or less efficient. All the equipment, which was leaning, was withdrawn to Armenia. Otherwise, Pashinyan would not have sat in Yerevan. All your success in the south is due to the fact that 1 division and 1 regiment have dropped against you! The columns destroyed by your UAVs are an attempt to replenish the 18th Mechanized Infantry Division. And an unsuccessful attack by a tank battalion - the introduction of units into battle ... Therefore, there is no camouflage in the 18th, no normal platoon and company commanders, since no one was involved in training and coordination!
Therefore, I do not really believe in your cartoons, because I know that the equipment of the 18th mechanized infantry division is not there.
Sincerely

I do not plan operations) Operations are planned by the Azerbaijani General Staff perfectly, everything possible is being done to achieve tangible results even in such seemingly unbearable conditions. We have to fight in conditions that are not dependent on the Azerbaijani Armed Forces. This reality, there is simply nothing else to do. Greenhouse conditions are created for Armenians by their guardians. The task of the Az.VS is to liberate the territories from the occupiers, which they carry out, even despite unequal conditions and all the advantages of the relief, echeloned fortifications created for years, and free weapons. What is also important are the opportunities that the Armenians received using the help of their allies to close the border with Azerbaijan to release all forces from the borders and redirect them to the combat zone in Karabakh, as well as along the entire border from Lachin to Zangelan.

[icant007]

Quote: bayard

And they know HOW they don't like Armenia for its blocking of Azerbaijan's entry into the CSTO members.

And when was that? I have not heard of such a fact.

[Peter rybak]

Quote: icant007

Quote: bayard

And they know HOW they don't like Armenia for its blocking of Azerbaijan's entry into the CSTO members.

And when was that? I have not heard of such a fact.

bayard confused. Azerbaijan voluntarily left the CSTO on the same day as Georgia. The point is that Armenia blocked from 2015 to 2017. Azerbaijan's entry into EurAsEC, in economic cooperation.

[icant007]

Got it, thanks for the clarification)

[Operator]

Armenians have zero chances to keep Karabakh:
- total technical superiority of the enemy;
- complete domination of the enemy in the air;
- shooting, as in a shooting range, of any types of ground targets of Armenians;
- the reluctance of Armenians to start producing air defense systems, KAZ, UAVs and BBs with a video guidance channel themselves.

[t-12]

If the Armenians stop crowding and organize a camouflage, then there will be no "shooting like in a shooting gallery", losses will decrease significantly.

[Alexander Kopychev]

The first chance is if a "miracle" happens, and Moscow nevertheless decides to openly intervene in the conflict in Transcaucasia, providing if not military support to Armenia, then at least sending a peacekeeping contingent to Karabakh.

I propose to send not a peacekeeping contingent to Karabakh, but Girkin himself. The knight's move from Shushi will be ensured and the end of the war.

[megavolt823]

The question is not about the peoples. The question is who is the owner of these lands? We can say that these are the peoples who live there. And according to (humanly) it can and will be (right). But you need to know the history. And there will be the answer. 40 Turkish schools in Georgia. Turkish business arrives. There is no point in writing about Baku. Here comes another owner. If the old one did not suit. And everything else is a shake of the air. Not many people know about the Turkish views in the Caucasian republics. There is a slow pace of policy implementation. Young people are invited to work and study. This is not a question of Karabakh or even Armenia. These are far-reaching plans.

[Petro_tut]

The old master of these lands for a minute, Iran

[megavolt823]

Turkey. Part of the population is Persia. But Iran is not there.

[saygon66]

- And this is how it goes ... In the early 90s, the same "roll" of all Turkish took place in Uzbekistan!
- Turkish TV channels, Turkish shops, Turkish alphabet, Turkish cars ... Only here the Uzbeks managed to somehow wriggle out of the tender Turkish embrace ... Even with a profit for themselves ...

[Old26]

Quote: Rudkovsky

In the 90s, under the "weak" Yeltsin, Russia was ready to defend its interests in Yugoslavia, and in 2020, after 20 years of getting up from its knees and under the "strong leader" Putin, it sluggishly mumbles excuses when one of its last allies is hammered.

Here's the alignment. There is something to think about.

In the 90s we were "plugged into every hole." Imperial thinking was still beating over the edge. Now smarter. Now it is already clear that when someone is squeezed, they immediately remember brotherly friendship, good neighborliness and so on. But when they, in their opinion, feel good, they are rushing to Russophobia and such individuals appear as in the photographs with posters "Russia is an occupier, out of (hereinafter is the name of the state)
Therefore, now we first of all "knock out" the grandmother, how and who treats us, and only then we begin to help ...
Armenia is such an "ally". that with such an ally and enemies are not necessary (I'm not talking about ordinary people, but about those who make decisions)

Quote: Arlen

And how did Russia defend its interests in Yugoslavia? Helped stop genocide

And what are our interests in Yugoslavia? More brothers? Bulgaria was considered almost a union republic all the time, but now it is sometimes heard that instead of freedom we brought them almost slavery and that monuments to our dead soldiers sometimes become monuments to the invaders?
What has Russia forgotten in Serbia?

[Li17]

Quote: MTN

those Armenians who have nowhere to go will live in Karabakh. Others will leave.

Yeah, in the Rostov region I know a bunch of Armenians who just left the NKR at the beginning of the events! Considering that they work very well here and make money .... and they are very friendly! So there is just where to go.

[Woland]

chances are always there. But with the possibilities, the matter is more complicated. But if they fight as for their native land, and ALL Armenians, then, kagritsa, options are possible

[Azimuth]

By itself, the success of the Azerbaijani army, which was achieved not without direct military assistance to Turkey, is not yet a XNUMX% guarantee of a change in the real situation in Nagorno-Karabakh.

DIRECT MILITARY ASSISTANCE would mean the participation of the Turkish army in battles on the side of Azerbaijan and in Karabakh, which is not.
I read a lot of pro-Azeobaydzhan and pro-Armenian posts, each had different arguments, a lot of information. In fact, neither we, nor Turkey, nor Israel, nor even more so Ukraine and Belarus, and these are the main suppliers of weapons did not give them to Azerbaijan, for everything really paid with hard currency. We, Russia, have delivered more weapons and for large sums than anyone else, the Turks, Turkey, are not even in second place.
From here:

The role of Turkey in the Transcaucasian politics will become more significant, and at times, and the positions of Russia will weaken.

The role of Turkey will not become more significant than it already is in Georgia, and will not become more significant in Azerbaijan than it already is today or yesterday. Our positions will be strengthened if the war in Karabakh leads to a change of power in Armenia and the departure of pro-Western liberals and nationalists from the power structures.
We also have the opportunity to further improve and strengthen relations with Azerbaijan, if we can still win tenders for the supply of arms after the war. First of all, this concerns the renewal of the Azerbaijani Air Force fleet, the modernization and restoration of some of the equipment.

But the saddest thing is what awaits the Armenian population of the region. It is unlikely that most of the Karabakh Armenians will want to live as part of Azerbaijan, which only means that a guerrilla war, ethnic cleansing, and an exodus of refugees will become inevitable - with the ensuing humanitarian problems for Yerevan and a desire for revenge.

There is no and there cannot be any sorrow about this. Let them disperse, the Azerbaijanis left Armenia in due time and not of their own free will, it would be better if the Armenians also leave Azerbaijan for now. So they will sooner eventually come to terms and begin to learn to live together anew, to build business and human relations, and in this for them, one of the help will be the relationship between them in us, in Russia.

There is no ground for a guerrilla war, even if a part of the Armenian population of Karabakh remains to live in the territory of Azerbaijan.

The problem of refugees from Karabakh for Yerevan is incomparably smaller in scale than the problem of Baku with refugees from Armenia, Karabakh and the occupied regions around it.

For revenge, Armenia will simply not have resources, either material or human, for the next quarter of a century. The end of the war will be accompanied by a crisis and an additional outflow of the population, plus losses in the war, and they are already very significant, so Armenia will not have time for revenge in the near future, and it will be better if, including with our participation and support, they demarcate borders with Azerbaijan and will gradually begin to be involved in joint projects, including by us.

The end of hostilities in Karabakh will not lead to a decrease in tension along the Azerbaijani-Armenian borders, which Azerbaijan can still somehow overcome, but for Armenia this is simply unaffordable and threatens with even greater risks and aggravation of the post-war crisis. you just need to understand the axiom, even if the impossible happens, and Armenia, having changed the course of the war, will again regain all its positions, for example, in 2016 SHE LOST, Armenia has no victory in any outcome. Here we have a huge trump card and leverage. Let me explain.
At the moment, our border troops are guarding the Armenian-Turkish and Armenian-Iranian borders. We can also take under protection the Azerbaijani-Armenian border with both main Azerbaijan and its exclave Nakhichevan. At the same time, having put pressure on both Azerbaijan and Armenia in order to demarcate the borders, how will the war between these states finally end, but on condition that Azerbaijan opens the transit of goods to Armenia in both directions, first of all, we are talking about railway transport, opening of transit by Armenia cargoes to Nakhichevan also by rail and possibly we will attract Turkey, to open borders with Armenia also from its side. thus, Armenia will be able to receive goods from the Black Sea through Georgia, and from Russia and Central Asia through the territory of Azerbaijan.
Only the solution of the issue of isolation of Armenia will allow it to get out of the crisis much faster, as well as allow the states, Azerbaijan and Armenia, to start everything by and large from scratch, step by step.

That is, we have more options than anyone else in the region, and neither Turkey, nor the US, nor the EU have our capabilities. But this is all possible only with a change of power in Armenia and the arrival of constructive forces, otherwise, the maximum of our support is to ensure protection from external aggression.

Well, in case of pressure on us by non-constructive forces about, for example, the withdrawal of our base, in the absence of border demarcation and constant skirmishes along them, we can agree with Azerbaijan so that our base remains on its territory, as before in the city of Gyumri, to the base. in Armenian Los Armenias, sorry in Los Angeles, we do not pretend. A joke, but there is a hint in it.

[nobody75]

and Armenia, having changed the course of the war, will again regain all positions for example in 2016 SHE LOST

Again twenty-five ...
Please do not interfere with playing in the Karabakh sandbox!
I don’t take your keyboard away so that you “analytic” comments cannot write ...
Even if you write all the comments in capital letters - this will not change the position at the front.
Sincerely

[Azimuth]

Quote: nobody75

and Armenia, having changed the course of the war, will again regain all positions for example in 2016 SHE LOST

Again twenty-five ...
Please do not interfere with playing in the Karabakh sandbox!
I don’t take your keyboard away so that you “analytic” comments cannot write ...
Even if you write all the comments in capital letters - this will not change the position at the front.
Sincerely

To spit on the front and the situation on it, without solving the blockade issue, almost the entire population will scatter from Armenia, regardless of the outcome of the war, he meant it. So the loss is somewhere in the hands of the Armenians, if the authorities think more pragmatically.

And about the sandbox - chur-chur me, in no case wanted

[nobody75]

Thank you, otherwise it's boring without a box of sand. And with him I feel forever young - forever drunk ...
Sincerely

[t-12]

without solving the blockade issue

What blockade? The railway line to Poti and Batumi, as it worked before the war, is still working.

[Comrade Kim]

Quote: MTN

what Britain will do to the Armenians.

Britain will arrange genocide more abruptly than the Turks. In terms of cruelty, only the Israelis can compare with the British.
Armenians, Azerbaijanis need to stop looking back at the opinion of international institutions. Strikes on the capitals, Yerevan and Baku, will turn the tide of the war.
If thousands of civilians die, the regimes of these countries will have no problems. The main thing is that oil is produced without interruption.
But apparently both of them have a "guts" to wage total war.
In any case, one of these weaklings will end his career behind a high fence, on the Rublevo-Uspenskoe highway, like Yanukovych, who refused, on the advice of his older brother, to drown the Maydaun rebels in blood.

[Misha Smirnov_2]

Russia diligently systematically disarmed the Caucasus.
Arming properly again, accepting refugees, they will then have to whip the floor of Turkey ...
Strong friendly youth, I am sure the Turks are guaranteed to wear themselves out in the Caucasus for a long time.

[Konnick]

Quote: Misha Smirnov_2

Russia diligently systematically disarmed the Caucasus.
Arming properly again, accepting refugees, they will then have to whip the floor of Turkey ...
Strong friendly youth, I am sure the Turks are guaranteed to wear themselves out in the Caucasus for a long time.

What language is it written in?
An Armenian accent is heard

[Vasya Zhulbin]

Time will tell. But it is interesting, in 43, did Germany and Japan still have a chance to hold the occupied territories? Although it is better to think about saving the country and the people itself than territories that no one in the world recognizes.

[saygon66]

- It is worth considering whether the retention of Karabakh by Armenia will lead to a final solution to the problem, or will it generate new ones?
- And if the decision has not happened in the past, it will not be in the future ...
- There are many such conflicts ... Turks and Kurds, Indian-Pakistani-Chinese, Indians and Tamils ​​- nowhere and no one came to peace ... In spite of everything!
- Whichever side wins, the hot spot remains!
- And it is also good if one of the parties to the conflict wins, and not the third, but extremely interested, and does not turn Karabakh into an eastern likeness of the former Yugoslavia ...

[Michael HORNET]

Convenient moment for the Russian Federation to pick up the NK
But for the current RF it is impossible.

[The eye of the crying]

Quote: Michael HORNET

Convenient moment for the Russian Federation to pick up the NK

Why does Russia need NK?

[yfast]

Quote: Simfy

especially with this attitude (image from the endless expanses of the worldwide network)) ...

They are probably at the front now. 2 nurses and a half-unit of fighters.