Military Review

How many An-2 planes were shot down: Azerbaijani losses are calculated in the West

82

The officially announced statistics that characterize the last stage of the escalation in Nagorno-Karabakh can hardly be called objective, if only for the reason that they are not confirmed by photo and video materials. However, there are other ways to analyze losses.


The Spanish media resource Charly015 tried to independently understand this issue regarding the downed Azerbaijani An-2 aircraft. Were studied two satellite images, which captured the location of this type of machine at the military airfield in Yevlakh.

Even before the new round of confrontation in Karabakh, there were from 59 to 61 aircraft on a permanent basis. So, as of August 26, 61 cars can be counted. However, already on October 3, after a few days of fighting, the number of An-2 decreased to 26 units, that is, decreased by 35 aircraft.

What happened to them? It was October 3, how many are there today?

- ask a question on the resource.

Allegedly, the An-2 was actively used by the Azerbaijani military for reconnaissance purposes - to reveal the combat positions of the troops, first of all, the locations of the air defense systems. According to them, these aircraft, being converted into UAVs, were sacrificed to "clear the way" for much more expensive drones. If we follow this logic, then almost all An-2 of the Azerbaijani troops were shot down by Armenian air defense crews, and today they practically should not have remained. True, there are nuances. The Armenian side previously announced the downed enemy Su-25 attack aircraft, while demonstrating the fall of the An-2 in the frames.

Western experts, analyzing visual data from the South Caucasus, believe that Azerbaijan could objectively lose up to half of the An-2 aircraft that were present at the beginning of a new round of conflict.



Photos used:
https://twitter.com/charly0153
82 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must to register.

I have an account? Sign in

  1. Asad
    Asad 21 October 2020 15: 28
    14
    In war, all means are good, so the corn-workers are good!
    1. Hunter 2
      Hunter 2 21 October 2020 15: 33
      18
      Well, it means that not all statements of the Armenian side are "disinformation" as the Azerbaijani forum users told us. So it turned out that the truth is somewhere in between.
      Really, it's not entirely clear to me how a corn-grower can be confused with a Rook? Since the number of shot down SU-25 is clearly more than their nominal number.
      1. credo
        credo 21 October 2020 16: 12
        +8
        Quote: Hunter 2
        Well, it means that not all statements of the Armenian side are "disinformation" as the Azerbaijani forum users told us. So it turned out that the truth is somewhere in between.
        Really, it's not entirely clear to me how a corn-grower can be confused with a Rook? Since the number of shot down SU-25 is clearly more than their nominal number.

        It seems like a waste of time to calculate the losses of both sides, because none of them wants to voice the truth, so as not to cause anger and indignation of the population of the rear.
        The only success or failure of the current war will be the results of the advance and retreat of the parties to the theater of operations.
        This is what you need to pay attention to.
        1. Hunter 2
          Hunter 2 21 October 2020 16: 17
          +4
          I agree, just to draw conclusions "locally" on the basis of the constantly changing tactical situation is also not a rewarding business!
          When it’s over, we’ll take it all apart! hi
          1. credo
            credo 21 October 2020 16: 36
            +5
            Quote: Hunter 2
            I agree, just to draw conclusions "locally" on the basis of the constantly changing tactical situation is also not a rewarding business!
            When it’s over, we’ll take it all apart! hi

            Totally agree with you.
            We, as people who do not have any reliable information, can only guess on the coffee grounds and make assumptions about who is who and when.
            One thing is clear, there is big politics going on in the South Caucasus, and war is a tool for achieving results from the interested party.
            I hope that our political and military leadership is also not sitting idly by and is taking action to prevent this war from spreading to our territory.
      2. faiver
        faiver 21 October 2020 16: 25
        +3
        Quote: Hunter 2
        Truth to me it is not entirely clear how the maize with the Rook can be confused?

        - fear has big eyes
      3. Fregate
        Fregate 21 October 2020 16: 32
        +6
        Quote: Hunter 2
        Truth to me it is not entirely clear how the maize with the Rook can be confused?

        Maybe Azerbaijanis write on their board in large type SU-25? winked
        1. uranium
          uranium 25 October 2020 19: 20
          0
          Better write an F-35. And the headlines will say Azerbaijan lost the F-35 in Karabakh. Or the Armenian air defense forces destroyed the F-35. Yankees will scratch their turnips from where Azerbaijan got F35 and how Armenia was able to bring it down
      4. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar 21 October 2020 18: 04
        +3
        Quote: Hunter 2
        Well, it means that not all statements of the Armenian side are "disinformation" as the Azerbaijani forum users told us. So it turned out that the truth is somewhere in between.
        Really, it's not entirely clear to me how a corn-grower can be confused with a Rook? Since the number of shot down SU-25 is clearly more than their nominal number.

        They are artists, they see so fellow
      5. The comment was deleted.
        1. CSKA
          CSKA 22 October 2020 11: 26
          +2
          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
          How many tanks we have lost with the crew, and still KAZ is not worth on tanks

          How many? Let's voice the numbers. That's how weird we are. Until now, KAZ has not been delivered. Here are the rest of the strange Germans, British, French, Americans, Japanese. Also, KAZ was not delivered.
          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
          But KAZ can be made with protection in the upper hemisphere and then no drones will be able to hit the tank.

          You have opened the eyes of all military personnel and specialists around the world.
          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
          The high command of the armed forces of Russia is either mediocre, or simply everything is rotten to the bone, everyone thinks only how to fill their pocket and spat on the army.

          It's already good to carry nonsense. The army is actively re-equipping and changes are visible to everyone except you. All over the world, the ability of the RF Armed Forces was appreciated, but all the same in the RF itself there are whiners who imagine themselves to be specialists in everything and everyone.
          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
          Otherwise, I cannot understand why we have no drone UAVs

          They have already been developed and are being tested.
          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
          no KAZ on tanks

          They are not present on most tanks of countries around the world. And it is already possible that the T-72B3 and T-90 are being modernized.
          https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3839517.html
          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
          not many other necessary things.

          What are you? For example what?
      6. nemez
        nemez 23 October 2020 04: 56
        0
        Absolutely all Caucasians love to embellish their exploits and hide defeats, whether in sex or in war.
    2. RealPilot
      RealPilot 21 October 2020 16: 18
      +5
      Cheap, angry.

      But, unfortunately, these are still losses in the civilian sphere. These An-2 flew and were useful. They transported passengers, pollinated fields ... For a poor state, these remnants of the Soviet legacy are clearly not superfluous. And the economic negative effect will manifest itself.

      At the same time, from a military point of view, the maneuver is interesting. We've been talking for a long time about converting obsolete fighters and bombers into attack drones. In order not only to spend additional heavy enemy air defense missiles, but also to cause damage by means of air attack ...
      And here is the first swallow! Concept confirmed. Cheap, angry, but revealing ...

      And if we compare the S-300 missile and the old An-2 at the price ... then, in general, it is successful.
      1. Alexey Bobrin
        Alexey Bobrin 23 October 2020 10: 56
        -1
        AH2s were used as aerial trap targets for aiming Israeli kamikaze drones! Thanks to this, Azerbaijan managed to destroy the C300. This, of course, is an indicator of the inexperience of the calculation, and of its command.
  2. Thrifty
    Thrifty 21 October 2020 15: 32
    +5
    Well, "Annushki" have fulfilled their goal, showing the complete absence of a MODERN AND EFFECTIVE air defense in Karabakh! So, this is the case when the loss is not a burden!
    1. Pereira
      Pereira 21 October 2020 16: 19
      11
      I would call their use an ingenious solution. Spectacular and proven.
  3. Evil 55
    Evil 55 21 October 2020 15: 34
    +7
    They did not think ... Why would they spray grapes in the spring?
    1. Oquzyurd
      Oquzyurd 21 October 2020 15: 48
      +3
      Airplanes for spraying gardens and fields have not been used in Azerbaijan for a long time. Everything is done by tractors, as it is more environmentally friendly and safer for the population, who live close to each other in settlements with these gardens and vineyards.
      1. Evil 55
        Evil 55 21 October 2020 15: 57
        +4
        There will be time - read the specialized literature, you will find out what overcompaction by running systems is and how it affects the yield ... hi
        1. Oquzyurd
          Oquzyurd 21 October 2020 16: 09
          +5
          Azerbaijan is a densely populated country. Sometimes settlements are at the beginning of the field and at the end, or very close to the left or right side of the field. The plane flies at a certain height, sometimes you have to fly higher than it should be, since in the middle of the field there are poles with power lines The wind blows and all the charm of the sprayed substance goes to the heads of people and children in the yard playing. There is nowhere for the plane to deploy; there are rare places and fields where the airplane can still be used. Under the union, with developed cotton growing in Azerbaijan, the population suffered greatly (disease) from pesticides, with which the An-2 sprayed the fields in one village.
          1. Trojan_wolf
            Trojan_wolf 21 October 2020 18: 13
            -2
            The fruits of the spraying are now visible.
      2. faiver
        faiver 21 October 2020 16: 27
        +1
        simply say - it's cheaper
      3. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar 21 October 2020 18: 09
        0
        Quote: Oquzyurd
        Airplanes for spraying gardens and fields have not been used in Azerbaijan for a long time. Everything is done by tractors, as it is more environmentally friendly and safer for the population, who live close to each other in settlements with these gardens and vineyards.

        And rightly so - at the same time more economical and more accurate.
    2. APASUS
      APASUS 21 October 2020 16: 47
      +8
      Quote: Angry 55
      They did not think ... Why would they spray grapes in the spring?

      This survey has long been decided

    3. Mini Mokik
      Mini Mokik 21 October 2020 17: 07
      +4
      So maybe there will be no vineyards in the spring request
  4. Homeland
    Homeland 21 October 2020 15: 34
    +2
    Maize scout kamikaze smile
    Three in one smile
    1. EnGenius
      EnGenius 21 October 2020 16: 42
      +5
      Just yesterday I was looking at pictures from another piled-up An-2, where it is clearly visible in the wreckage that there is a very solid unexploded bomb of 250-500kg. This means that the devices are rather unmanned drones or kamikaze drones for seriously fortified facilities. For a scout, they are too large, vulnerable to air defense and can be in the air for a short time.
    2. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar 21 October 2020 18: 13
      -1
      Quote: Homeland
      Maize scout kamikaze smile
      Three in one smile

      Peaceful plowing tractor with vertical takeoff
      1. Pike
        Pike 22 October 2020 07: 52
        +1
        Judging by the illustration to the article, rather with a vertical fit)
  5. Oquzyurd
    Oquzyurd 21 October 2020 15: 38
    +1
    "Western experts, analyzing visual data from the South Caucasus, believe that Azerbaijan could objectively lose up to half of the An-2 aircraft that were present at the beginning of a new round of the conflict." These "experts" cannot guess that some of these An-2 could have been transferred to another airport ?) According to local estimates, about 2 of these An-10s were used.
    1. Bashkirkhan
      Bashkirkhan 21 October 2020 15: 44
      19
      "Experts" they are now
      1. MTN
        MTN 21 October 2020 16: 01
        -1
        Quote: Bashkirkhan
        "Experts" they are now

        good support
      2. Pereira
        Pereira 21 October 2020 16: 20
        18
        Where did you get my photo?
        1. LiSiCyn
          LiSiCyn 21 October 2020 16: 42
          10
          Quote: Pereira
          Where did you get my photo?

          laughing good
          At least one comrade, I will know by sight. wink
          1. tihonmarine
            tihonmarine 21 October 2020 17: 48
            -6
            Quote: LiSiCyn
            At least one comrade, I will know by sight.

            And you also know this comrade.
            1. LiSiCyn
              LiSiCyn 21 October 2020 18: 34
              +5
              Quote: tihonmarine
              At least one comrade, I will know by sight.

              And you also know this comrade.

              Anatoly, is that you ??? belay
              Damn, I had a suspicion that the site is not only retirees, but simple hard workers ... But what would such People? !!
              How are things at the UAC? What about the 6th generation? If a military secret, at least Hint ... wink
              1. tihonmarine
                tihonmarine 21 October 2020 19: 17
                -2
                Quote: LiSiCyn
                Anatoly, is that you ???

                What didn't you recognize? It's me, look what a handsome man.
                1. LiSiCyn
                  LiSiCyn 21 October 2020 19: 28
                  +4
                  Quote: tihonmarine
                  What didn't you recognize?

                  Of course I didn't ... How do I know. You, under a penny mowed, from the near abroad. Although, now I'm not surprised. In Komersant or RBK, something about your real estate in Latvia slipped. Now, everything came together. yes
                  Quote: tihonmarine
                  It's me, look what a handsome man.

                  Well, here, I can argue with you ... As they say, the taste and color ... wink
                  Anyway, I am more of female beauty. stop
                  1. tihonmarine
                    tihonmarine 22 October 2020 08: 39
                    0
                    Quote: LiSiCyn
                    In Komersant or RBC, something about your real estate in Latvia slipped.

                    That is exactly "slipped", and how much it took even we do not know, but we know much more than you do.
    2. paco.soto
      paco.soto 21 October 2020 16: 16
      +4
      These "experts" cannot guess that some of these An-2s could have been transferred to another airport?) ©
      There is only one comment on Twitter under this post and is similar to yours: it literally translates as "maybe they were sent to some workshop to be turned into drones."
      The blog spot of these Spaniards is much more interesting than their Twitter, there is a lot of interesting information and comments from professionals as in the "good old VO".
      1. Oquzyurd
        Oquzyurd 21 October 2020 16: 21
        +4
        Unfortunately, or fortunately, I do not use tweeter, from the word-at all)
      2. paco.soto
        paco.soto 21 October 2020 23: 25
        +1
        http://charly015.blogspot.com/?m=1
        Análisis Militares
        Those who do not speak "Latin languages" can be translated by the built-in translators. A lot of interesting information about Russia, I didn't even expect from the Spaniards.
  6. OgnennyiKotik
    OgnennyiKotik 21 October 2020 15: 42
    +7
    The Chinese seem to have tried, relatively recently made an unmanned FH-98, a copy of the An-2

    Who needs it right now they are selling from 1,5 to 3,5 million rubles.
    https://www.avito.ru/edissiya/gruzoviki_i_spetstehnika/samolet_an-2_1967049484?utm_campaign=native&utm_medium=item_page_ios&utm_source=soc_sharing
    https://www.avito.ru/magnitogorsk/sport_i_otdyh/samolet_an-2_1879387286?utm_campaign=native&utm_medium=item_page_ios&utm_source=soc_sharing
  7. Babayka babaykin
    Babayka babaykin 21 October 2020 15: 45
    -4
    Azerbaijanis forward
    1. Livonetc
      Livonetc 21 October 2020 17: 26
      10
      Quote: Babayka Babaykin
      Azerbaijanis forward

      Why do you hate Azerbaijanis so much?
      Think about Azerbaijanis and Armenians.
      Share the land and keep your children alive.
  8. KAVBER
    KAVBER 21 October 2020 15: 48
    +7
    What's the point of counting corn workers? They were originally consumables, but they have fulfilled their function, they will run out, something else will fly, without aerial reconnaissance and adjustments today you still can't fight much. Even if they were all shot down, the war would not end.
  9. Victorm
    Victorm 21 October 2020 15: 50
    +6
    Quote: Evil 55
    They did not think ... Why would they spray grapes in the spring?

    An-2 has long been outdated, it was easier to open the air defense of the Armenian Armed Forces with this non-ferrous metal. And more economical aircraft can always be bought, or even better, to establish production at home, fortunately, due to this, your aircraft repair plant will be supported and developed, where, by the way, the An-2 was converted into a UAV.
    1. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 21 October 2020 17: 50
      0
      Quote: VictorM
      An-2 has long been outdated, it was easier to open the air defense of the Armenian Armed Forces with this non-ferrous metal.

      It is probably easier to organize the production of outdated, but cheap software-2.
  10. ism_ek
    ism_ek 21 October 2020 15: 57
    +8
    An-2, if not disturbed, can fly independently. The pilot lifted the plane into the air, chose the desired course and jumped out with a parachute, and the plane flew in a straight line to Karabakh. Early warning systems on the territory of Armenia recorded it, gave a signal to the Osa Karabakh air defense system to switch on. Those included, unmasking themselves. Then a swarm of Israeli komikadze was already on the move.
    1. MTN
      MTN 21 October 2020 16: 03
      +2
      Quote: ism_ek
      An-2, if not disturbed, can fly independently. The pilot lifted the plane into the air, chose the desired course and jumped out with a parachute, and the plane flew in a straight line to Karabakh. Early warning systems on the territory of Armenia recorded it, gave a signal to the Osa Karabakh air defense system to switch on. Those included, unmasking themselves. Then a swarm of Israeli komikadze was already on the move.

      That's all right. And so it happened. A very clever tactic. Whose idea is this, I wonder? Has anyone already done this?
      1. Pereira
        Pereira 21 October 2020 16: 22
        +1
        Hardly anyone did. If only because no one has such a stock of maize workers. But now the idea has gone to the masses.
      2. Eugene-Eugene
        21 October 2020 16: 26
        +9
        Whose idea is this, I wonder? Has anyone already done this?

        Baron Munchausen did so lol
      3. bobwings
        bobwings 22 October 2020 06: 19
        0
        It seems to me that it was not without Israeli specialists.
  11. Nasdaq
    Nasdaq 21 October 2020 16: 25
    12
    There is a video of the fall of such an-2 on YouTube. It seems that the passenger seats have been removed and the containers with napalm have been fixed.
    Here is the link https://youtu.be/J3aY_JPX8H8
    It looks like they are using the AN 2 as a kamikaze drone. And unlike the Israeli, the payload is measured in hundreds of kilos, or even more than a ton. The affected area is amazing.
    Imagine that such a "thing" collapses in position
    .
    1. Oquzyurd
      Oquzyurd 21 October 2020 16: 40
      +6
      The tanks are filled to the dump with 1240 liters of fuel. Until it reaches the task, it will probably consume 200-300 liters, which means 1000 liters of fuel in an explosion. Even the carrying capacity is up to 1500 kg. If the cabin was loaded in barrels, then the total explosion is 2000-2500 liters of fuel.
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 21 October 2020 18: 53
        0
        Quote: Oquzyurd
        that means 1000 liters of fuel in an explosion.

        And if it is explosive, then it boils.
      2. Kamchatsky
        Kamchatsky 22 October 2020 06: 10
        +1
        As far as I remember the Airplane Flight Manual An-2, with a full refueling the maximum load is about 400 kg. Although who will comply with the Airplane Flight Manual for a one-way flight?
    2. LiSiCyn
      LiSiCyn 21 October 2020 16: 46
      +6
      Quote: Nasdaq
      It seems that the passenger seats have been removed and the containers with napalm have been fixed.

      They wrote that they were suspending 250 kg of bombs. And they use them as unmanned bombers.
      1. Nasdaq
        Nasdaq 21 October 2020 17: 07
        +7
        Unlike FAB 250, I think there is only fuel. FAB would throw everything in all directions. And as if the liquid "splashed" on the ground
        In addition, they showed burnt debris. And the wreckage as a whole is not very tattered.
        1. LiSiCyn
          LiSiCyn 21 October 2020 18: 24
          +5
          I am not saying that "this is" a consequence of the explosion of the FAB 250. I am saying that Azerbaijan used the An-2, not only to detect air defense, but also as bombers. hi
  12. faiver
    faiver 21 October 2020 16: 34
    +5
    The plane is more than 70 years old, and it is still at war ... this is the technique that was made in the Great Power
    1. paco.soto
      paco.soto 21 October 2020 23: 39
      +2
      The plane is more than 70 years old, and it is still fighting ... this is the technique that was made in the Great Power ©

      I apologize for being offtopic. In this very old military video, the AN-2 is used in the video sequence by an American.

  13. Nasdaq
    Nasdaq 21 October 2020 16: 42
    +3
    If they really load them with napalm / gasoline / kerasin, and they are ready for war and fueled, then 1 Iskander can arrange such a fire show. After all, they are in such a dense formation. 1 Iskander could undermine a few at once, and then a chain reaction. You can put out such a fire of figs.
    Plus, the missiles for air defense would have been preserved, they would not have been opened again.
    1. AllBiBek
      AllBiBek 21 October 2020 17: 03
      +3
      Well, now calculate the cost of such an AN-2 with all the stuffing, and the cost of ammunition for Iskander.
      It's like shooting a FAU-2 across London, the same price / performance ratio.
      1. Nasdaq
        Nasdaq 21 October 2020 17: 09
        +6
        Well, if you count how much anti-aircraft missiles cost to shoot down these corn, plus the saved lives (it's not a fact that everyone is shot down), then I think the game is worth the candle.
        1. AllBiBek
          AllBiBek 21 October 2020 18: 13
          +1
          In principle, a loaded AN-2 Shilka will not reach the maximum height, but Tunguska is quite.
          So it's not a fact that everyone was shot down by missiles.
          1. Nasdaq
            Nasdaq 21 October 2020 18: 20
            +2
            The one on the YouTube video seemed to say that they shot down with small arms, he was on fire until he fell. Looks like the "filling" caught fire. On the contrary, they are not raised high, wasps are everywhere. They try to let them go lower. There are more chances to fly.
            But if such an-2 plops onto the held trenches and dugouts, then this is a complete paragraph.
      2. Maxwrx
        Maxwrx 22 October 2020 01: 17
        0
        The funny thing is, the missiles brought more casualties and permits than the entire Luftwaffe, not to mention that the British had to spend a lot on missile defense
      3. Konnick
        Konnick 22 October 2020 06: 29
        0
        And how much does the ammunition for Iskander cost?
  14. certero
    certero 21 October 2020 17: 09
    +3
    Yes, they are not all shot down, just "autopilot" is a brick on gas :)
  15. iouris
    iouris 21 October 2020 20: 39
    -1
    All this is barbarism.
    1. AllBiBek
      AllBiBek 21 October 2020 20: 56
      +1
      Well, nothing more humane than a tactical nuclear one for the congregations of those wishing to fight has been invented, but, alas, no way.
      So - in the old fashioned way, barbaric.
      1. iouris
        iouris 21 October 2020 22: 45
        +1
        It can be fixed. Nuclear, so nuclear.
        1. AllBiBek
          AllBiBek 22 October 2020 09: 46
          0
          Why so rude?
          Any US embassy will have enough land mine in a ton. For eyes.
          Besides that in Yerevan. It is the largest American embassy in the world, with the largest staff.
          There - yes, only tactical.
  16. jovanni
    jovanni 22 October 2020 00: 49
    +2
    Oh, sorry for the old man! For a year now, we have not made a replacement for a hard worker, but these are sent to slaughter ...
    1. Victorio
      Victorio 22 October 2020 08: 53
      0
      Quote: Jovanni
      Oh, sorry for the old man! For a year now, we have not made a replacement for a hard worker, but these are sent to slaughter ...

      ===
      exactly, it's a pity.
  17. Object.F7
    Object.F7 22 October 2020 01: 52
    0
    I came across the funeral of an Azerbaijani pilot on YouTube. What did he control: an "unmanned" an-2 or a su-25?
    1. Otshelnik
      Otshelnik 22 October 2020 15: 23
      -1
      Throw off, let's see ...
  18. Konnick
    Konnick 22 October 2020 06: 26
    +1
    Quote: Hunter 2
    Really, it's not entirely clear to me how a corn-grower can be confused with a Rook? Since the number of shot down SU-25 is clearly more than their nominal number.

    Anti-aircraft gunners don't look through binoculars, and you can't praise yourself either ...
  19. The comment was deleted.
  20. meandr51
    meandr51 22 October 2020 10: 39
    +1
    The North Koreans turned the An-2 into manned attack aircraft. And this is not funny, because they crawl along gorges and ravines, jump out at the target suddenly, hit exactly.
    In general, of course, if in the 80s who had said about this war, no one would have believed it ... This is a "divide and rule" strategy in action ...
  21. AIR-ZNAK
    AIR-ZNAK 22 October 2020 14: 45
    +1
    In the case of an uncontrolled flight, the An-2 leads to the left. Znazza needs to be set on the autopilot. And this is not a small amount of money.
  22. aiden
    aiden 23 October 2020 02: 06
    0
    Somewhere I have already seen this
  23. Alexey Bobrin
    Alexey Bobrin 23 October 2020 10: 53
    0
    Thanks to AH2, the C300 was destroyed! The old man is still alive.