Military Review

Indian Air Force Marshal: The transfer of aircraft engine technology by the French has not yet taken place

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Chief Marshal aviation Rakesh Bhadauria of India confirmed the existence of problems in the creation of engines for Indian fighters. According to him, India has to use foreign-made aircraft engines, which hinders the development of its own engine-building industry.


Recall that at the moment, India is implementing projects for Tejas MK and AMCA fighters. At the same time, AMCA is positioned as a fifth generation fighter. It is planned to be delivered to the troops no earlier than 2032. These plans have been criticized in India itself, claiming that by then geopolitical adversary China will have gone far ahead in the next generation of fighters.

India's problems are also added by the fact that it cannot in any way obtain aircraft engine technology from foreign partners. Such a partner, for example, is the French group of companies SAF (Safran). India previously agreed with Safran on technology transfer, including under a Franco-Indian contract to supply Rafale fighters to the Indian Air Force. But while India continues to buy 4th generation fighters from France for the price of two XNUMXth generation fighters, SAF is in no hurry to share its technological secrets.

Rakesh Bhadauria confirmed the fact that the French have not yet transferred the technological documentation for aircraft engines.

Indian Marshal to reporters:

You asked specifically about Safran, the technology transfer between DRDO and Safran has not yet taken place.

For reference: DRDO is an Indian defense research and development organization.

Marshal Bhadauria also noted that significant problems arose when working on the GTRE GTX-35VS Kaveri bypass turbojet aircraft engine. It was on its development that India and France agreed - for Tejas fighters. France's Safran was supposed to help India upgrade this engine to comply with fifth-generation fighter specifications and for the Ghatak UAV. But the French have not yet fulfilled their obligations, which is what the Indian Air Force command is paying attention to.
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  1. Svarog
    Svarog 7 October 2020 07: 33
    19
    Naive Indian comrades .. all technologies are waiting .. well well ..
    1. marchcat
      marchcat 7 October 2020 07: 41
      +6
      More Rafale - less technology, however ...
      1. Temples
        Temples 7 October 2020 07: 46
        0
        There is no word about money for these technologies.
        Did the Indians pay the money?
        Or then, maybe half.

        Hindus are gypsies.
        And the French are gypsies.
        So, in this dance - who will throw whom and how much.
        Let me remind you about the Mistrals from the French.

        Engines and airplanes are just excuses for dancing.
        1. spech
          spech 7 October 2020 07: 52
          +3
          India continues to buy 4th generation fighters from France at the price of two XNUMXth generation fighters,

          Probably this price also includes technologies, although who saw the contract hi
          1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Pete mitchell
          Pete mitchell 7 October 2020 09: 27
          +5
          Quote: Temples
          Let me remind you about the Mistrals from the French.
          As far as I remember, it is Shafran that supplies the SSJ engine components due to which the aircraft standing by the fence... Shrinks French manufacturer, shrinks
        3. paul3390
          paul3390 7 October 2020 09: 43
          +4
          A deal is considered profitable if both parties are convinced that they have cheated each other. wink
    2. Mountain shooter
      Mountain shooter 7 October 2020 07: 48
      12
      Quote: Svarog
      Naive Indian comrades .. all technologies are waiting .. well well

      Technologies of turbojet engines are the most protected state secrets of the country that knows how to produce them. Everything from such countries ... you can count on one hand. Here are the Chinese comrades ... they are not allowed to be allowed into the "Ufa motors" - they are too curious. With "MotorSich" their KINULI, the Germans did not sell the coating technology on the blades ... And the Indians decided that the French would transfer the technology to them "for free"? Yes, NEVER! The seditious thought crept in that they and we wanted to "fasten" the engine technology to the topic of joint development of the 5th generation fighter. As a result, and (after they were sent to a known address) they abandoned the joint development.
      1. Pereira
        Pereira 7 October 2020 08: 35
        +3
        The mouse documentation has been devoured. There is nothing to transfer.
      2. _Ugene_
        _Ugene_ 7 October 2020 09: 05
        +1
        And the Indians decided that the French would give them the technology "for free"? Yes, NEVER!
        where did you get that for free? Apparently, the transfer of technology by the engine is spelled out in the contract, therefore the price is sky-high
        1. Mountain shooter
          Mountain shooter 7 October 2020 09: 13
          +4
          Quote: _Ugene_
          why do you think so? Apparently the transfer of technology by the engine is spelled out in the contract

          Who told you that there is no way to "throw" a partner, even against the contract? Yes, all the time. On what basis did they stop supplying contracted (and paid) materials and components for MS-21 to Russia? These partners - they are like that ... And the contracts are drawn up in a complex and cunning way ... in this case, I suppose there was a trick for the engines to sign the contract and pay the money ... Nobody was going to fulfill these conditions ...
          1. _Ugene_
            _Ugene_ 7 October 2020 09: 14
            0
            this is all speculation, wait and see
        2. Bobrick
          Bobrick 8 October 2020 20: 33
          0
          Apparently the transfer of technology by the engine is spelled out in the contract

          It is necessary to look at the contract, in fact, it may turn out that the transfer of technology only implies the localization of the production of the inlet device, the low-pressure compressor and individual units of the drive box, maybe low-pressure turbines if they are squeezed.

          With SaM 146, something like that happened, all the most interesting and important things are produced by the French, despite the fact that the Russians are not Indians and are able to master similar technologies (there is experience, although the engines of the previous generation, mostly).
      3. Zoldat_A
        Zoldat_A 7 October 2020 09: 07
        +7
        Quote: Mountain Shooter
        the Indians decided that the French would give them the technology "for free"? Yes, NEVER!

        Why not? Drawings are ready to ship ...
        1. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 7 October 2020 09: 38
          +5
          Quote: Zoldat_A
          Why not? The drawings are already ready to ship.

          They can also convey a more civilized model.
    3. spech
      spech 7 October 2020 07: 50
      +6
      Throw paddling pools, they are not in the first.
    4. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 7 October 2020 09: 34
      +2
      Quote: Svarog
      Naive Indian comrades .. all technologies are waiting .. well well ..

      They think the French are so naive.
    5. TermNachTer
      TermNachTer 7 October 2020 13: 08
      0
      As my ex-wife used to say: "Promising does not mean getting married"))))
  2. The popuas
    The popuas 7 October 2020 07: 34
    +5
    Dance better laughing
  3. Mitroha
    Mitroha 7 October 2020 07: 35
    10
    It would seem that it never happened, and now again. The experience of the Mistrals taught no one. And the Indians decided to get their own, exclusive floral kiddok experience from the French. Well, acha-acha, you can already dance laughing
    1. yehat2
      yehat2 7 October 2020 07: 49
      0
      not to be confused with salty wet.
      The French themselves were not happy with the termination of the Mistral deal.
      And here it is they themselves who dynamite and deceive the Indians.
      In other matters, Indian traders stupidly forgot that they are bargaining with the most greedy nation in Europe.
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 7 October 2020 09: 40
        +1
        Quote: yehat2
        The French themselves were not happy with the termination of the Mistral deal.
        And here it is they themselves who dynamite and deceive the Indians.

        "Down and Out trouble started." So the French got into the taste.
    2. Kuroneko
      Kuroneko 7 October 2020 07: 49
      0
      Quote: Mitroha
      The experience of the Mistrals taught no one.

      You are off topic. Because just from the Mistral we received a sea of ​​documentation for all kinds of units and equipment. Yes, not the ships themselves. But technology - for sure. = 3
      1. yehat2
        yehat2 7 October 2020 08: 20
        +6
        where did you get the idea that I'm not in the subject? If anything, I was on the same Mistral that came to St. Petersburg. I was impressed by only 4 things there - the protective paint, the quality of the speakerphone, the glass entrance, as in an expensive hotel, and the view of St. Petersburg from the flight deck.
        And what technologies did we take?
        How to build a huge barge? So they knew how.
        I'll warn you right away - it's not worth pouring in about modular construction technologies.
        The French did not transfer anything significant, and all NATO equipment on the highways was dismantled.
      2. Piramidon
        Piramidon 7 October 2020 09: 40
        -2
        Quote: Kuroneko
        from the Mistrals we received a sea of ​​documentation for all kinds of units and equipment

        Yeah, for the most advanced. What specific equipment and units can you name? If the "stuffing" has already started to be put on them, and after the Franks threw us, we had to dismantle it. But in order to save face and not look like complete suckers, our signers of the contract in the form of Mr. Serdyukov and others like him, began to hang spaghetti on the ears of the people about supposedly some kind of supertechnologies they received.
  4. ANDREY MIKHAILOV_2
    ANDREY MIKHAILOV_2 7 October 2020 07: 36
    0
    Years so through e current, but for now they were waiting for the technology of dancing.
  5. Mavrikiy
    Mavrikiy 7 October 2020 07: 37
    +3
    They didn’t want to work with us, it’s difficult to dock different systems, a lot of costs ... With the French it’s better, costs, noodles, prospects = 0.
  6. rocket757
    rocket757 7 October 2020 07: 38
    +1
    Their business .... though, so it's FUN.
  7. Mordvin 3
    Mordvin 3 7 October 2020 07: 42
    +2
    I studied with the Indians. I, the eternal troyeshnik, and I was forced to the Indian to calculate the length of the nickel wire and the resistance. Oh, tree winders ...
    1. Zoldat_A
      Zoldat_A 7 October 2020 09: 16
      +8
      Quote: mordvin xnumx
      I studied with the Indians. I, the eternal troyeshnik, and I was forced to the Indian to calculate the length of the nickel wire and the resistance. Oh, tree winders ...

      My father, back in the Soviet Army, used to go on business trips in those parts. He spoke well about the Vietnamese - they want to learn, they try. The only thing they don't understand is that the instructors also need to rest. They pester with questions around the clock.
      But the Indians ... Well, in order not to offend anyone, I will not compare them with anyone. I will only say in the words of my father: "It would be better if I went to the circus - to teach hares to smoke. It's easier ..."
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 7 October 2020 09: 44
        +2
        Quote: Zoldat_A
        But the Indians ... well, so as not to offend anyone

        I worked with Indians, lazy and on their own, but some of them were quite smart.
  8. Shuttle
    Shuttle 7 October 2020 07: 55
    +3
    Actually his name is Rakesh Kumar Singh Bhadauriya. Most likely he is a Sikh from Rajasthan or a Punjabi. And most likely really just a warrior from head to toe. If he were a Bengali or a Gujarati, he might have been more cunning than the French. Well, at least it would seem so.
  9. Pavel57
    Pavel57 7 October 2020 08: 12
    +3
    It was the Indians who had to buy Motor Sich.
  10. Prisoner
    Prisoner 7 October 2020 08: 29
    0
    Dance bye. They'll give you a lift soon. laughing
  11. Tsoy
    Tsoy 7 October 2020 08: 42
    +3
    Everything happens for the first time. And sometimes they sell an inflated horse to gypsies ...
    And the safran office is strange. They threw ours and the Superjet. This is when the engine blades were created with a much lower resource and at the same time they did not begin to refine it.
  12. tralflot1832
    tralflot1832 7 October 2020 09: 13
    +1
    I didn’t understand the French "frogs" lit the Indian dancers? And they said that it is difficult to do business with the Indians?
  13. Galleon
    Galleon 7 October 2020 09: 56
    +7
    Guys, Hindus, you have to think with your own head, only your own. It's safer this way. No amount of money will upgrade your engine to the 5th generation: will the French do something better for you than they do for themselves? This is naivety. Business and politics are ruled by pragmatists.
  14. bar
    bar 7 October 2020 10: 01
    +1
    The transfer of technology on aircraft engines by the French side has not yet materialized

    Did they dream?
    It's time for the Indians to announce a tender for the purchase of a large batch of lip-forming machines.
  15. APASUS
    APASUS 7 October 2020 12: 14
    0
    Indians, first of all traders, are very offended by the French that they were able to "weigh" them!
  16. Wolf
    Wolf 7 October 2020 13: 49
    -2
    Franks and their technology? And selling technology? The famous US tank from WWII M4 soldiers called it and ZIPPO (ZIPPO), because it burned well like a zippo lighter, was French and their technology.
    Russia actually got a lot of technology when it bought the Mistral, the protection of metal is one thing and a trifle, but there are completely digital controlled ships and others, do not forget that "mysteriously" disappeared in the Porto from France the control computers of the ship. In fact, the Mistrals were not good ships for Rusiu and the north, and it is better that they went south to Egypt, but they received precious technologies. For this, Serdyukov earned a good pension and was founded.
    The engine of the 5th generation is the very top of the world technology, today 3 or 4 powers in the world can do it. The "American" engines General Electric and Prat and Whitney are actually a collection of US technology, Japanese on blade blades, British. You can freely say that half of the world worked so that the United States received advanced auto engines.
    Franks on Rafal flew from the head on GE 404 USA then made their own SFs and quickly enough. How is this question?
    Esli Hindusi thought that they would get the technology of production of the 5th generation engine from Franks, then they would look at the naive people. In the best case, they will get a surrogate for flaws that will not be functional.
    Eats the old proverb: "For myself and my horse"
    Neither in 2030 nor in 2040 will Indians be able to independently create an aircraft of the 5th generation, because there is no strategy for the country's technological progress and they have not yet solved the problem of strategic development of technologies, it is better for them to buy ready-made aircraft and faster.
    And the Franks have wonderful helmets for pilots, night viewing devices, aiming devices, etc. , but ochim capricious and delicate electronics are not beneficial for the harsh conditions of the north and frost.
    But how much do I know and the project SU 47 Berkut was FRENCH or am I mistaken? and it's better that he stayed in the laboratory.
    It means "I have my own horse and my own horse" and if something needs to be "bought" according to Serdyukovsky and make your own better.
    And you don't have to judge strictly your aircraft manufacturers, the world was built by Prat and Vitney, and General Elektrik, and Russia (from Ukraine to Kamchatka) was alone! wink
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