Military Review

The decision of the Ministry of Defense on RTOs of the Karakurt project put Vostochnaya Verf in a difficult position

112

It is reported about a forced measure to introduce a four-day working week at the Vostochnaya Verf enterprise. This measure was taken in connection with the intention of the main defense department to terminate the contract for the construction of two MRK (small missile ships) of project 22800 "Karakurt".


Taking into account the fact that initially the contract accounted for half of all orders of Vostochnaya Verf for the next five years, the decision of the Ministry of Defense, of course, could not but affect the work process of the enterprise.

The press service of Vostochnaya Verf reports that if the four-day period were not introduced, the management would have to make significant reductions. So, the number of 500 employees who could lose their jobs in connection with the termination of the contract for "Karakurt" is called.

At the same time, it is noted that the days "dropped out" from the working schedule, unfortunately, cannot but affect the salary. It will decrease.

In addition, the negative is added by the fact that the refusal of the contract for the aforementioned RTOs from the Ministry of Defense will affect the processes of modernization of the enterprise. As noted in the release of Vostochnaya Verf, in fact, the modernization processes will have to be suspended.

For reference: "Vostochnaya Verf" has been operating since 1952, building warships, supply vessels and berths. The customers of the enterprise are the RF Ministry of Defense and the RF FSB. Over the years, over 500 ships and vessels of various classes have left the stocks of the enterprise. It is noteworthy that since 2020 Vostochnaya Verf has remained the only defense industry enterprise in the Far East - a resident of the Free Port of Vladivostok.
Photos used:
East Shipyard
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  1. Livonetc
    Livonetc 16 September 2020 14: 27
    12
    But what about the Far East development program?
    If people also start to put on the street ...
    Let's hope that the enterprise will not be allowed to disappear and will be provided with other orders.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 16 September 2020 15: 31
      32
      Quote: Livonetc
      development of the Far East?
      Yes, there is no development in the Far East. Gradual degradation of infrastructure, permanent corruption scandals, rising prices and, as a result, permanent population decline.
      1. Lexus
        Lexus 16 September 2020 15: 43
        +2
        The decision of the Ministry of Defense ... put ... in a difficult position

        Yes, there is no development in the Far East. Gradual degradation ...

        hi Not even thirty years of "ordeals" have passed ... and the "difficult childbirth" (C) still will not end.


        Fragment from the movie "72 meters." (2004)
        1. Temples
          Temples 17 September 2020 12: 21
          +1
          When all the schedules were lost, the leaders of this enterprise were thinking about people?

          There were orders, there was money.

          Shoigu personally asked questions in the summer.

          But patience has run out.

          And rightly so.
          1. Niko
            Niko 18 September 2020 16: 16
            -1
            Yes ... my heart breaks as I feel sorry for Shoigu. Will such a disorder survive?
    2. avg
      avg 16 September 2020 19: 14
      13
      Quote: Livonetc
      But what about the Far East development program?
      If people also start to put on the street ...

      This is not an MO program. Everyone must do their job. The Ministry of Defense is already building hospitals and will soon start harvesting crops. And the prosecutor's office needs to deal with the shipyard. With a leadership that successfully "harnesses the money" by demanding more and more and skipping deadlines.
      1. Ros 56
        Ros 56 17 September 2020 19: 03
        0
        It's time to return the troikas for these thieves.
    3. Fitter65
      Fitter65 17 September 2020 02: 19
      +7
      Quote: Livonetc
      But what about the Far East development program?

      Have you seen Komsomolsk-on-Amur? And this is the city of "presidential attention" !!! And if the president had not "listened" to our city, the kerdyk would probably have arrived at all ...
      1. Temples
        Temples 17 September 2020 12: 18
        +4
        Quote: Fitter65
        Have you seen Komsomolsk-on-Amur?

        The cities in which there is real development are Moscow, St. Petersburg and Kazan.

        Well, be more mature.
        What cities when SP2 is not allowed to build.
        The Chinese need to pump gas urgently.
        The Turks have a nuclear power plant.
        Push the oil over the hill.
        Forest, fish ...
        Yes, Russia is full of natural bounty.
        All this needs to be delivered to partners.

        Not to the cities.
        And our people are tenacious.
        They don't bomb and that's good. wassat
    4. Grits
      Grits 17 September 2020 13: 13
      +2
      Quote: Livonetc
      But what about the Far East development program?

      Which programm? belay I don't see anything developing here.
  2. The comment was deleted.
  3. Sofa
    Sofa 16 September 2020 14: 32
    +9
    MRK remain unchallenged after the US withdraws from the DMSD, therefore, a refusal is expected at least frigates and corvettes should be done.
  4. rocket757
    rocket757 16 September 2020 14: 33
    +2
    What is the reason? What will happen next?
    1. Proxodnoi
      Proxodnoi 16 September 2020 14: 36
      +3
      Quote: rocket757
      What is the reason? What will happen next?

      Well, I don’t believe it will be closed .. Something else is clearly conceived!
    2. g1v2
      g1v2 16 September 2020 14: 38
      10
      There is a suspicion that the Amur residents will be given back, which are already building 4 pieces. Again, there are not enough engines yet - there is a queue for a long time.
    3. kapitan92
      kapitan92 16 September 2020 22: 07
      +2
      Quote: rocket757
      What is the reason? What will happen next?

      hi
      In the draft budget for 2021 -2023. , 5% sequestration of the State Armament Program is laid. Perhaps from there "legs grow".
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 16 September 2020 22: 18
        +1
        I dare to assume that the enterprises did not spend money on preparatory work for the canceled order.
        And yes, the owner is a master, although he also depends on the allocated finances.
        In principle, one should always think about this, plan ways of maneuver! on budget orders do not sit forever.
  5. TAMBU
    TAMBU 16 September 2020 14: 34
    +6
    It was not difficult to put Vostochnaya Verf in a difficult position ...
    1. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 17 September 2020 07: 43
      +1
      Quote: TAMBU
      not difficult it turned out to put Vostochnaya Verf in a difficult position ...

      That's right, just like that! No wonder there is a saying: "Simplicity is worse than theft" ...
  6. g1washntwn
    g1washntwn 16 September 2020 14: 38
    -11 qualifying.
    Personnel on a business trip to Zvezda, let the new floating dock be brewed instead of the sunken one.
    Will they agree somehow among themselves that hands with experience are not needed there? Or can't you take these hands off your skirt?
    1. Sergey Sfiedu
      Sergey Sfiedu 16 September 2020 14: 42
      14
      Here you are on a business trip to the Far East for a year, with a Far Eastern salary, with housing and food at your own expense - will you go?
      1. g1washntwn
        g1washntwn 16 September 2020 14: 52
        -2
        We went on watch - we know. And if you can no longer work without a shower stall and a diaper, admit that it is much more comfortable to scribble from offices.
        1. The leader of the Redskins
          The leader of the Redskins 16 September 2020 15: 02
          +8
          My life is on business trips. Moreover, in an open field, where not only showers - sometimes there was no river nearby, or the Karakum canal, at best. But the longest is five and a half weeks.
          He was young, chasing a long ruble. But just like that, on enthusiasm, on a stupid whim of someone - I won't wish it on anyone. And I advise you not to wish it.
        2. Ross xnumx
          Ross xnumx 17 September 2020 07: 52
          +8
          Quote: g1washntwn
          And if you can no longer work without a shower stall and a diaper, admit that it is much more comfortable to scribble from offices.

          And you here do not scatter reproaches. You can sacrifice the conveniences, benefits of civilization for the sake of great goals, for the implementation of tasks of national importance. For what do you propose to "give up everything": family, home, old parents? So that they gaze at well-fed, flabby back-headed talking heads? Thank you in the hat!
          We also went on different business trips and had to live in dugouts - nothing, we could ... For what? To be reproached for the years of my life in the USSR?
          1. Jager
            Jager 17 September 2020 11: 34
            +4
            And for what? All "great ideas" are in the past. Capitalism, my friend. Previously, workers were given apartments, work was 100% everywhere. At the moment, one boat has been removed from the shipyard and that's it, the difficult situation, please go outside.
            I myself am sitting on a 3-day stay at the Research Institute of Russian Railways, now I have been transferred to a 4-day day. We have a crisis, you see. Only from the administration, not a single one left for sokreschenka. And the director was hired the 4th (sic) secretary. Everything is broadcasting from the stands about "a little more and we will overcome everything together." Only to overcome with salary 160 and salary 28 - there is a difference.
      2. alexmach
        alexmach 16 September 2020 15: 29
        +1
        So they seem to be already in the Far East.
      3. Alexey RA
        Alexey RA 16 September 2020 15: 36
        13
        Quote: Sergey Sfyedu
        Here you are on a business trip to the Far East for a year, with a Far Eastern salary, with housing and food at your own expense - will you go?

        Hmm ... actually, the one mentioned in the article "Vostochnaya Verf" is the Far East.
        Vostochnaya Verf is located in Vladivostok. "Zvezda" - in Bolshoy Kamen, on the other side of the Ussuri Bay. In a straight line - 30 kilometers.
        1. Shopping Mall
          Shopping Mall 17 September 2020 13: 45
          0
          Quote: Alexey RA
          Quote: Sergey Sfyedu
          Here you are on a business trip to the Far East for a year, with a Far Eastern salary, with housing and food at your own expense - will you go?

          Hmm ... actually, the one mentioned in the article "Vostochnaya Verf" is the Far East.
          Vostochnaya Verf is located in Vladivostok. "Zvezda" - in Bolshoy Kamen, on the other side of the Ussuri Bay. In a straight line - 30 kilometers.


          There, in the context of the conversation, it was about the transfer of workers from the Eastern shipyard, from the Far East to Zvezda, to the north.
          1. Alexey RA
            Alexey RA 17 September 2020 14: 26
            +1
            Quote: AVM
            There, in the context of the conversation, it was about the transfer of workers from the Eastern shipyard, from the Far East to Zvezda, to the north.

            We have two "stars" connected with the fleet. St. Petersburg, which has grown fond of the production of diesel engines for the fleet. And the Far East, which is a shipyard.
            In the North there is "Zvezdochka", but it is a ship repair, built for the repair and modernization of ships.
    2. Greenwood
      Greenwood 16 September 2020 15: 31
      -1
      Quote: g1washntwn
      Personnel on a business trip to Zvezda, let the new floating dock be brewed instead of the sunken one.
      The Chinese work at the Star. The locals are not accepted.
      1. Grits
        Grits 17 September 2020 13: 21
        +1
        Quote: Greenwood
        The Chinese work at the Star. The locals are not accepted.

        Recently, an uncle from Bolshoi Kamen visited me. She says there are not only Chinese people there. And all of Asia. As in Babylon. Russians are really almost never taken
        1. Greenwood
          Greenwood 17 September 2020 15: 23
          +3
          The most offensive thing is that Chinese (and other foreign) workers and engineers there receive salaries of over 100 rubles. Residents of Bolshoi Kamen can only sometimes dream of such a salary, as, in principle, the majority of the population of Vladivostok, I am already silent about small towns.
          1. Grits
            Grits 17 September 2020 16: 15
            +1
            Quote: Greenwood
            Residents of Bolshoi Kamen can only sometimes dream of such a salary, as, in principle, the majority of the population of Vladivostok, I am already silent about small towns.

            So I am ashamed to talk about my salary as an ordinary municipal official in Primorye
            1. Greenwood
              Greenwood 20 September 2020 08: 12
              0
              I had the same situation. For several years he was a civil servant in a seemingly not the worst position in the management of one of the state structures. As a result, he spat and quit, moved to a branch of an international bank. “I don’t regret anything!” (C) Work and hassle is 3 times less, and the salary is the same amount of time.
              1. Grits
                Grits 20 September 2020 09: 53
                +1
                Quote: Greenwood
                As a result, he spat and quit, moved to a branch of an international bank. “I don’t regret anything!” (C) Work and hassle is 3 times less, and the salary is the same amount of time.

                If I lived in Vladik, I would probably do the same. But, unfortunately, our job is tight. To be honest, all municipal employees are just waiting for the opportunity to dump as soon as work turns up. The hassle is over the top, and the salary is ridiculous. These are we, officials ...
  7. stalki
    stalki 16 September 2020 14: 38
    +7
    It has not been terminated yet. Already 100% aware of the future termination? I would like more reliable information.
  8. Name Surname
    Name Surname 16 September 2020 14: 39
    -11 qualifying.
    a couple of large communication boats made by "Lux" will be ordered and norms)
    more useful than MRK))
  9. Alexey-74
    Alexey-74 16 September 2020 14: 40
    0
    The news is not ice of course .....
    1. strannik1985
      strannik1985 16 September 2020 15: 10
      +6
      Not ice, but it should be - the military-industrial complex for the army, and not vice versa. Unfortunately, in the current situation, these RTOs are not relevant.
      1. Nemchinov Vl
        Nemchinov Vl 17 September 2020 14: 13
        -1
        Quote: strannik1985
        this is how it should be - the military-industrial complex for the army, and not vice versa. Unfortunately, in the current situation, these RTOs are not relevant.
        Even when they were contracting 18 (eighteen !! Charles) "Karakurt", that the speed of creation for them of the GEM "Star", is not feasible, could not know (!)... But it was important to lobby, and lobbied (!)... And no one is to blame for this ?!.
        Now for the Pacific Fleet, the army contracted again "incapacitated for PLO / OVR", corvettes 20380 (?!)who have nothing to effectively fight with the SP ... (?!).... It's nobody's fault (!), but money will be allocated (!)... Why there, instead "Karakurt" for which contracts are canceled, do not lay for PLO / OVR, 2-3 corvettes 11664 (with UKSK and at the power plant as in 20380 /DDA-12000/ ... ?!), and retain staff and competencies, providing people with jobs ?! .
  10. askort154
    askort154 16 September 2020 14: 41
    +4
    I wonder what is the reason for the Defense Ministry's refusal from the contract for "Karakurt"?
    Who will cover the topic? And then the author of the article said only "A".
    1. strannik1985
      strannik1985 16 September 2020 14: 46
      +2
      Interestingly

      Most likely because of the US withdrawal from the INF Treaty, while the missile boat with the Caliber was in operation, it is now possible to deploy missile brigades with the same missile launchers with the same money.
      1. g1washntwn
        g1washntwn 16 September 2020 14: 58
        -1
        Quote: strannik1985
        you can deploy missile brigades for the same money

        If only the tractors are on your floating platform. Rather in projects bоThe funding is being thrown over more tonnage, the Americans have announced that oil will again drop below the 40 that has risen, and the Ministry of Defense does not print its budget on the press. Or maybe we don’t know something, and Poseidons with different Petrels really need to be stamped as quickly as possible.
        1. strannik1985
          strannik1985 16 September 2020 15: 30
          +3
          If only the tractors are on your floating platform.

          The depth of the ford MZKT-7930 is 1,4 meters.
          One RBR - 24 missiles in a salvo, 24 on TPM. 2xMRK pr.22800 16 missiles in a salvo.
          With a firing range of 2,5 ~ 3 thousand km, the platform floats or not is absolutely irrelevant.
        2. Piramidon
          Piramidon 16 September 2020 22: 08
          -1
          Quote: g1washntwn
          If only the tractors are on your floating platform.

          And what, "Calibers" can only be launched from water?
          1. ism_ek
            ism_ek 17 September 2020 08: 44
            -1
            Quote: Piramidon
            And what, "Calibers" can only be launched from water?

            Under the DRMSD agreement - YES, only from water
            1. Piramidon
              Piramidon 17 September 2020 08: 49
              +1
              Quote: ism_ek
              Under the DRMSD agreement - YES, only from water

              And where is he that DRMSD?
        3. Sofa
          Sofa 17 September 2020 09: 35
          0
          Already dropped oil is not beneficial to anyone, neither the United States nor the Saudis, where they drop it and raise it, especially in the United States, the elections are on the nose, the loss of votes is another thing. . and as for the people, so "there is no money, but you hold on." The army also suffers from surges in oil prices, where something has to be cut, such as with rebar or su 15.
    2. Shadow041
      Shadow041 16 September 2020 14: 57
      +9
      The construction of these RTOs under the contract was supposed to start this year, and Vostochnaya Verf did not even bother to start it, so all questions are for the management of the enterprise, which is sweet and sweet asleep, but does not want to work. Chubais's supposedly effective managers have shown their complete failure. The reason for the refusal of the Ministry of Defense from the contract with the Eastern Shipyard is an outright breakdown of the contract for the construction of ships at the initial stage, there was simply no point in waiting for the weather by the sea further. The order will most likely be transferred to the Amur shipyard, which, if not ideal, is still tolerant.
      1. pmkemcity
        pmkemcity 17 September 2020 05: 11
        +2
        Quote: Shadow041
        effective managers of Chubais

        Lysenko is a professional liquidator:
        Leader:
        JSC "VOSTOCHNAYA VERF"
        JOINT STOCK COMPANY "VOSTOCHNAYA VERF" Operating 2537009643 Lysenko Alexander Borisovich 08.06.1994/690017/1 XNUMX, Primorsky kr, Vladivostok, Heroes Tikhookeantsev street, building XNUMX
        CJSC "ETUAL"
        CLOSED JOINT STOCK COMPANY "ETUAL" Liquidated 2536196158 Lysenko Alexander Borisovich 13.12.2007/690091/3 XNUMX, Primorsky kr, Vladivostok, Fontannaya street, XNUMX
        LLC "UK BAMR"
        LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY "MANAGING COMPANY BAMR" Liquidated 2536160384 Lysenko Alexander Borisovich 14.09.2005/690014/50 XNUMX, Primorsky kr, Vladivostok, Nekrasovskaya street, XNUMX A
        1. Bear040
          Bear040 18 September 2020 01: 15
          +1
          It is not excluded that Mr. Lysenko is acting on the orders of his Kiev masters. It's about time this liquidator of the FSB of the Russian Federation should be properly dealt with and liquidate the Bandera fighter entrenched in the Russian Federation
  11. Cyril G ...
    Cyril G ... 16 September 2020 14: 54
    +4
    What a bullshit. Komsomolsk is building 4 ships on Project 22800 for the Pacific Fleet. A contract was signed with Vostochny Verf this year for 2 RTOs, they didn't even seem to be mortgaged ...
    And that the FSB does not need ships? Project 22460 was built at the shipyard. It is clear that now they have decided to abandon them. Well, for sure there will be some kind of decision to resume construction of project 10410 on the Far East
  12. The comment was deleted.
  13. Nestor
    Nestor 16 September 2020 14: 57
    -16 qualifying.
    So in the Far East there is no one to defend against, KTOF has the most modern ships and submarines, Americans with Japs do not walk side by side, until the Moscow district is far away, little people live richly
  14. 210ox
    210ox 16 September 2020 15: 05
    +5
    And how to understand the assurances of our management that the shipyards are loaded to capacity?
    1. frog
      frog 16 September 2020 15: 09
      +5
      Yes, that's how to understand ... As usual repeat
    2. Interlocutor
      Interlocutor 16 September 2020 15: 15
      0
      And how to understand the assurances of our management that the shipyards are loaded to capacity?


      The feeling that this article has big ears and it is pulled for them ...
      Such an article "with a double bottom".
    3. hydrox
      hydrox 16 September 2020 19: 15
      0
      You see, earlier our leadership was going to build both a nuclear super-destroyer and aircraft carriers, now they have laid two stupid landing docks, which are not needed by either the army or the navy, but there were no border patrol ships in the economic zone, and there will never be - that's it. our seafood and fish will continue to be felt by the Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese, Koreans at the root of their language, and the rest of the world will also be able to process them ... sad
      1. Vladimir1155
        Vladimir1155 17 September 2020 20: 39
        +1
        I support, instead of the necessary ships they order super-expensive and useless udcs
        1. hydrox
          hydrox 18 September 2020 07: 25
          +1
          But with what pleasure these so-called. "naval commanders" will be able to boast of worthless, but expensive tsatski :: this is the same as cutting circles around the Arbat VO on a camouflaged Hummer with a dozen antennas ... !!! laughing yes good
  15. mole
    mole 16 September 2020 15: 17
    +3
    Engines are the main problem. More precisely, their absence.
    1. Nestor
      Nestor 16 September 2020 20: 15
      +1
      Is everything so sad?
  16. Ryaruav
    Ryaruav 16 September 2020 15: 26
    +1
    before terminating the contract with a defense enterprise, you need to think about replacing it with another order, because this is an operating enterprise with ready personnel, they can not only produce RTOs
    1. Vladimir1155
      Vladimir1155 17 September 2020 20: 38
      0
      order them minesweepers
  17. voyaka uh
    voyaka uh 16 September 2020 15: 28
    -5
    The problem is that all new ships: frigates, corvettes, MRKs, submarines
    under construction for cruise missiles Caliber.
    But the Russian industry does not produce even half the number of these missiles.
    for all new ships. To have at least one set per ship.
    If you load the KR Caliber completely frigates, then there will not be enough for
    RTOs and corvettes. Why release them then?
    1. Cyril G ...
      Cyril G ... 16 September 2020 15: 34
      +4
      Quote: voyaka uh
      But the Russian industry does not produce even half the number of these missiles.
      for all new ships. To have at least one set per ship.
      If you load the KR Caliber completely frigates, then there will not be enough for
      RTOs and corvettes. Why release them then?



      To go nuts, a specialist was found for the release of CD in Russia. In general, there are calculated ammunition sets for anti-ship missiles, for everything that is in service and the CD, the required amount has been piled, and it is also enough to periodically fire inadequate fire on different ones ...
      1. 3danimal
        3danimal 16 September 2020 18: 57
        -1
        periodically enough to shoot at different inadequacies ...

        Based on this fact, do you think that there are more than enough missiles?
        1. Cyril G ...
          Cyril G ... 16 September 2020 19: 53
          +2
          And this, too, but this is not at all the main thing. I am slightly aware of how things are going in our fleet. And where we have a complete a-n-y-s I, and he is then I say so. The production of CD and anti-ship missiles does not belong to this. And the mister of the warrior is talking nonsense with or without reason.
          1. 3danimal
            3danimal 17 September 2020 05: 55
            0
            The production of CD and anti-ship missiles does not belong to this.

            Is there a stock of 5000-10000 missiles?

            https://m.tvzvezda.ru/news/opk/content/20194121232-ebxdY.html/amp/
            It can be assumed that 100-150 of them are produced per year.
            Then the number of 5000 will be reached in 33-50 years.
            1. Volder
              Volder 18 September 2020 12: 28
              -1
              Quote: 3danimal
              Is there a stock of 5000-10000 missiles?
              Why so much? The number of warships in the World is several times less. Even the United States doesn't have that many CDs.
              1. 3danimal
                3danimal 19 September 2020 08: 09
                0
                The total number of Tomahawk-type missiles in the US military ranges from 5500 to 7500.

                https://zvezdaweekly.ru/news/t/20182261034-3UiyN.html
                Only one salvo from sea carriers needs more than 500. And the stock should be more.
                1. Volder
                  Volder 22 September 2020 14: 07
                  0
                  Quote: 3danimal
                  The total number of Tomahawk-type missiles in the US military ranges from 5500 to 7500.
                  It's on paper. In fact, of course, less. In addition, you need to understand that the United States will not be able to throw on Russia the entire list of carriers of the CD (ships, submarines, aircraft), exposing other directions and bases in the world. And of course, Russia will not calmly watch how missiles are fired at its territory - some of the enemy ships will be sunk by our anti-ship missiles, and the bombers will be shot down by our interceptors. The remaining 1000 CD will be successfully reflected by our echeloned air defense system and electronic warfare systems.
                  1. 3danimal
                    3danimal 22 September 2020 21: 56
                    0
                    It's on paper. In fact, of course, less.

                    What are the grounds for such statements? Because we have less CD? request
                    The United States will not be able to throw on Russia the entire list of carriers of the CD (ships, submarines, aircraft), exposing other directions and bases in the world.

                    There are 4-6 converted Ohio, 154 Tomahawks each. Nothing will stop them, and the cover of these nuclear submarines will be very strong.
                    some of the enemy ships will be surely sunk by our anti-ship missiles,

                    IMHO, the main striking force will be Ohio with the CD. And a considerable part of the anti-ship missile carriers will also be sunk / shot down. War is the case.
                    The remaining 1000 CD will be successfully reflected by our echeloned air defense system and electronic warfare systems.

                    What is the problem with the RC: they fly at an altitude of 20-50m. And the curvature of the Earth interferes with their detection at distances over 15-30 km (depending on the relief). In addition, the trajectory of their flight is by no means a straight line on which you can direct the short-range air defense system.
                    The way out can be AWACS aircraft and fighters directed by them. And all the same, when 1000 missiles are launched, more than half of them will be able to reach (Perhaps some of them will be shot down by air defense systems near important targets).
                    So, to argue in the spirit of "the remaining 1000 will be shot down" is very presumptuous.
                    I am glad that the likelihood of such a development of events (launches on the territory of Russia) is vanishingly small drinks
                    1. Volder
                      Volder 23 September 2020 12: 50
                      0
                      Quote: 3danimal
                      What are the grounds for such statements?
                      Remind you how many tomahawks each destroyer fired at Syrian airfields in 2017?
                      There are 4-6 converted Ohio, 154 Tomahawks each. Nothing will stop them, and the cover of these nuclear submarines will be very strong.
                      Our nuclear submarines, diesel-electric submarines, anti-submarine aircraft and surface ships with anti-submarine properties will interfere with them. Starting to release tomahawks, submarines inevitably unmask themselves. The submarine crew is suicide bombers.
                      the main striking force will be Ohio with the CD.
                      These tomahawks are successfully neutralized by Russian air defenses. Only half of the tomahawks flew to Syrian airfields in 2017, and the remaining half were allowed to fly. But even those who arrived did NOT fulfill the assigned task (the airfields continued to function the next day).
                      1. 3danimal
                        3danimal 23 September 2020 13: 03
                        0
                        Our nuclear submarines, diesel-electric submarines, anti-submarine aircraft and surface ships with anti-submarine properties will interfere with them.

                        Ask about the number of nuclear submarines (by fleets and total) with us, then compare with the number of nuclear submarines in the United States, as well as the percentage of new boats.
                        These tomahawks are successfully neutralized by Russian air defenses. Only half of the tomahawks flew to Syrian airfields in 2017, and the remaining half were allowed to fly. But even those who arrived did NOT fulfill the assigned task (the airfields continued to function the next day).

                        If you believe everything that is said on TV and related online media smile (and do not bother yourself with the intrigues of information, note).
                        Pro was allowed to fly: after graduation, a young man from an adjacent class asked for a fight. I missed a blow (I was boxing at one time), fell down, probably lay for half a minute. But after all, he said that he didn’t care and he could easily continue .. (although it was clear that he would have continued in the hospital). Analogy smile
                      2. Volder
                        Volder 23 September 2020 13: 36
                        0
                        Quote: 3danimal
                        Ask about the number of nuclear submarines (by fleets and total) with us, then compare with the number of nuclear submarines in the United States, as well as the percentage of new boats.
                        You said that the western nuclear submarines are not in danger and they can operate freely without fear of anything. As if Russia has nothing to resist. And now you admit that Russia still has something, albeit in a smaller amount than the West. We will assume that you accidentally made a reservation. I will repeat to you once again: the United States will not send all its submarines to the shores of the Russian Federation, tk. exposing other directions in different parts of the world is a strategic and tactical mistake.

                        If you believe everything that is said on TV and related online media (and do not bother looking for information, note).
                        The Ministry of Defense publicly presented material evidence to the public - tomahawks that did not fly and collapsed in the field. And the Syrian planes began to take off from the airfields the next day, because most of the strips and hangars were not damaged. There are videos of journalists from the ground, drone photos and satellite images. While the Americans unfoundedly claimed that all the missiles had flown and hit the target. You probably trust the Americans more, this is your right.
                        Pro was allowed to fly: after graduation, a young man from an adjacent class asked for a fight ... Analogy
                        This is not an analogy. It is foolish to perceive the events taking place in the world through the prism of your narrow life experience. You are biased.
                      3. 3danimal
                        3danimal 23 September 2020 15: 49
                        0
                        You said that the Western nuclear submarines are not in danger and they can operate freely, without fear of anything.

                        I never said it. BUT: boats (and in fact, even destroyers) are able to secretly advance to the desired area.
                        This is not an analogy. It is foolish to perceive the events taking place in the world through the prism of your narrow life experience.

                        On the contrary, there are many examples where the party that has suffered losses belittles the damage.
                      4. Volder
                        Volder 24 September 2020 09: 29
                        0
                        Quote: 3danimal
                        I never said it.
                        Watch your own speech! Your words from September 22nd:
                        There are 4-6 converted Ohio, 154 Tomahawks each. Nothing will stop them

                        On the contrary, there are many examples where the party that has suffered losses belittles the damage.
                        Examples are not analogies. There is no need to perceive the situation and events in the world through the subjective prism of some everyday events from life. The neutralization of missiles is NOT connected in ANY way and cannot be connected with what happened to you personally in your youth. In this case, there is no belittling of damage, since all the damage, I repeat to you, is easily checked (there are videos and photos, as well as artifacts).
                      5. 3danimal
                        3danimal 25 September 2020 10: 04
                        +1
                        Watch your own speech! Your words from September 22nd:
                        There are 4-6 converted Ohio, 154 Tomahawks each. Nothing will stop them

                        Let me clarify: aviation and surface ships will not interfere, because nuclear submarines are capable of SECRETLY moving forward into an area free from them. And the insufficient number of ships and the huge length of the coast will not allow closing all directions.
                        An important point: instead of focusing on the production of anti-submarine corvettes 20380, non-interchangeable and not very useful ships (artillery and others) are being built. Useless against submarines and extremely vulnerable to aircraft. Although it would be better to increase the series exactly 20380 (at the same time reduce the price of each corvette).
                        In this case, there is no belittling of damage, since all the damage, I repeat to you, is easily checked (there are videos and photos, as well as artifacts).

                        IMHO, you did not set out to search for details, but were content with ready-made information from patriotic resources.
                      6. Volder
                        Volder 15 October 2020 12: 42
                        0
                        Quote: 3danimal
                        IMHO, you did not set out to search for details, but were content with ready-made information from patriotic resources.
                        I was just interested in the details, so I know about the existence of evidence (videos and photos, as well as artifacts). You do not bother to look for information, so you carry some kind of nonsense.
                      7. 3danimal
                        3danimal 16 October 2020 02: 17
                        0
                        It was very easy to find evidence of your version, because it coincides with the broadcast on "First" and "Russia 24" smile
                        What's the secret: during one of the strikes, about 30 CDs were launched (Yankees declared). Assad said that there were 60-70 missiles, and more than half of his valiant (and "perfectly prepared") air defense successfully shot down. The damage was received, but a certain media profit was also received.
                        This is how it works.
                      8. Volder
                        Volder 16 October 2020 09: 23
                        0
                        Quote: 3danimal
                        It was very easy to find evidence of your version, because it coincides with the broadcast on "First" and "Russia 24"
                        The media is just a conduit for the release of facts and evidence. It is clear that the anti-Russian media are trying to either conceal or distort inconvenient information. After all, Russia's successes are always inconvenient, they need to discredit and slander any success, passing off wishful thinking. I strongly recommend that you evaluate the veracity of information on the basis of arguments, facts, evidence and logic, and not on the name of the media. In addition, you should always read / look at several sources to form an objective picture.
                        during one of the strikes, about 30 CRs were launched (Yankee claimed). Assad said that there were 60-70 missiles, and more than half of his valiant air defense successfully shot down.
                        There were 2 consecutive attacks from destroyers, an average of 35 missiles per salvo. All missiles from the first destroyer did not reach, or did not hit their targets (there is a version that they were taken away by the Russian electronic warfare system). When the Yankees realized that there was no effect, they launched rockets from the second destroyer. The second strike was repelled by the Syrian air defense, and by world standards, it was quite effective. Assad correctly said that more than half of all missiles were neutralized over Syrian territory, and our Ministry of Defense has confirmed this. On the other hand, the Americans were completely lying: they said without support that all the missiles had flown and hit the target.
        2. 3danimal
          3danimal 23 September 2020 13: 28
          +1
          We have few MAPLs, only 1-2 4 generations (and about 20 - 3rd), they have 20 (Seawulf and Virginia), plus 32 boats of the 3rd generation. In fact, the difference in the strength of the fleets is generally significant.
          (I specially take MAPL, it is possible to use "strategists" for hunting only in a desperate situation)
        3. Volder
          Volder 23 September 2020 13: 52
          -1
          Quote: 3danimal
          We have few MAPLs, only 1-2 4 generations (and about 20 - 3rd), they have 20 (Seawulf and Virginia), plus 32 boats of the 3rd generation.
          1) What makes you think that the entire list of enemy submarines is in combat readiness? About repairs, waiting for repairs in the sludge and regular maintenance. service you certainly haven't heard anything. For example, at the moment the United States has only 3 combat-ready aircraft carriers capable of going out into the ocean, out of 11 in the list.
          2) The United States will not send all its submarines to the shores of the Russian Federation, tk. exposing other directions in different parts of the world is a strategic and tactical mistake.
          3) Do not forget about our diesel-electric submarines, whose function is to wait for enemy submarines in ambush.
        4. 3danimal
          3danimal 23 September 2020 15: 45
          +1
          1) What makes you think that the entire list of enemy submarines is in combat readiness? About repairs, waiting for repairs in the sludge and regular maintenance. service you certainly haven't heard anything. For example, at the moment the United States has only 3 combat-ready aircraft carriers capable of going out into the ocean, out of 11 in the list.

          On the contrary: you do not think that the entire list of our submarines is combat-ready, do you? It is known for sure that some of them are undergoing repairs or upgrades, and let's not forget that we have many fleets and they are physically separated. And throwing all combat-ready boats in one direction will also fail.
          Therefore, let's assume that both sides will be able to send only a third of all multipurpose submarines. As a result, it turns out that on our side there is one boat of the fourth generation, on their side there are 6-7. We have six boats of the third generation, they have 11. The ratios are not very favorable request Moreover, the quality composition is also very different.
          Acting even only with nuclear submarines, you can covertly advance into one of the areas and make launches. And then leave at full speed (25-30 knots) under the cover of a superior number of submarines. But there is still the largest (which is important, and in terms of the number of ships of the 1st rank) surface fleet.
          It's good to be rich and have the capacity and infrastructure to build and maintain all of this ..
          I repeat, all these are assumptions, there are no real grounds for such an adventure.
          3) Do not forget about our diesel-electric submarines, whose function is to wait for enemy submarines in ambush.

          Diesel boats are very limited in their actions - they are not able to move at high speed under water, they are not able to stay under water for a long time. And surfacing is definitely unmasking.
          Also, they are not able to quickly move to the area from where the CD was shot.
        5. Volder
          Volder 24 September 2020 09: 07
          -1
          Quote: 3danimal
          As a result, it turns out that on our side there is one boat of the fourth generation, on their side there are 6-7. We have six boats of the third generation, they have 11. The ratio is not very favorable
          It should be noted here that American submarines are sharpened to strike the ground (coast). Our submarines are sharpened for underwater combat - fighting submarines.
          Diesel boats are not capable of moving at high speed under water,
          High speed is not required to ambush.
          not able to stay under water for a long time.
          2-3 days is enough to watch the enemy.
          And surfacing is definitely unmasking.
          Unmasking for anti-submarine aircraft and surface ships, but not for submarines.
          Also, they are not able to quickly move to the area from where the CD was shot.
          This is yes. However, after the diesel-electric submarine spotted the submarine from an ambush, it will lead it, keep it at gunpoint. It is convenient to arrange ambushes near narrow sea openings (which must be avoided in order to get closer to the coast of the Russian Federation).
        6. 3danimal
          3danimal 25 September 2020 09: 54
          +1
          It should be noted here that American submarines are sharpened to strike the ground (coast). Our submarines are sharpened for underwater combat - fighting submarines.

          The grounds for such statements ??
          Is Seawulf then (not even having rocket silos) sharpened for strikes on the shore? smile
          By your analogy, "Severodvinsk" is also "imprisoned" against the coast? (He's got more rockets than Virginia)
          Untenable.
          High speed is not required to ambush.

          How to enter a battle? It turns out that this is a suicide boat when it collides with a strong enemy ..
          2-3 days is enough to watch the enemy.

          Who will tell you in advance when and where it will appear smile
          Unmasking for anti-submarine aircraft and surface ships, but not for submarines.

          And for the acoustics of the nuclear submarine hunters.
          This is yes. However, after the diesel-electric submarine spotted the submarine from an ambush, it will lead it, keep it at gunpoint. It is convenient to arrange ambushes near narrow sea openings (which must be avoided in order to get closer to the coast of the Russian Federation).

          It was smooth on paper .. How will the diesel-electric submarine "lead" the nuclear submarine running at 20 knots? (Quiet running for modern MAPLs) Batteries will run out quickly ..
          It's great that you have chosen a convenient place for ambushes, but the coast of the Russian Federation does not consist of fjords ("bottlenecks"). And the opponent is also not stupid and does not seek to get into an ambush.
        7. Volder
          Volder 15 October 2020 13: 02
          0
          Quote: 3danimal
          And how to fight? It turns out that this is a suicide boat when it collides with a strong enemy.
          In the event of an enemy being hit, our submarine is no longer a suicide bomber.
          Quote: Volder
          2-3 days is enough to watch the enemy.
          Quote: 3danimal
          Who will tell you in advance when and where it will appear
          In the threatened war period, when NATO decides to attack Russia, in addition to submarines, the AUG will certainly be involved. It is common knowledge that any AUG includes submarines. Tracking the movement of the AUG can be thousands of kilometers from the coast (from the same satellites from space). Therefore, Russian submarines will advance to the positioning area in advance and will wait for the AUG submarines. Alone, enemy submarines (and ours too) go on alert only in peacetime.
          It's great that you have chosen a convenient place for ambushes, but the coast of the Russian Federation does not consist of fjords ("bottlenecks").
          You haven't looked at a geographic map for a long time. Look!
        8. 3danimal
          3danimal 16 October 2020 02: 28
          0
          In the event of an enemy being hit, our submarine is no longer a suicide bomber.

          The very first torpedo good Coyuche here is "in case". On boats of the 4th generation there is a more advanced SAC than on diesel-electric submarines.
          He cannot lead a counter battle while avoiding attacks; he cannot leave the battle.
          Therefore, Russian submarines will advance to the positioning area in advance and will wait for the AUG submarines.

          In the hypothetical scenario I am describing, this is precisely a special operation by the forces of only nuclear submarines. (As secretive as possible)
          Tracking the movement of the AUG can be thousands of kilometers from the coast (from the same satellites from space).

          You also say 24/7 anywhere in the world smile
          Not enough resources. The military budget is not the same and the size of the constellation of satellites.
        9. Volder
          Volder 16 October 2020 10: 28
          0
          Quote: 3danimal
          On boats of the 4th generation there is a more advanced SAC than on diesel-electric submarines.
          It is no coincidence that the Russian diesel-electric submarine was nicknamed the "Black Hole" in the West. When the diesel-electric submarine moves at a speed of 2-4 knots on electric motors, it remains invisible to any GAC. Diesel-electric submarines are much quieter than nuclear submarines. Therefore, the Russian "Halibuts" and "Varshavyanka" can get very close to NATO nuclear submarines and strike first, emerging from an ambush.
          In the hypothetical scenario I am describing, this is precisely a special operation by the forces of only nuclear submarines.
          Well, in what cases is your scenario possible without unleashing a nuclear war? This scenario does not work for Russia. Even against small North Korea, the United States drove an aircraft carrier with destroyers, and against Russia, they are guaranteed NOT to manage with submarines alone.
          Not enough resources. The military budget is not the same and the size of the constellation of satellites.
          To monitor the coast of Russia and the area around at a distance of 2000 km, satellites are quite enough. In addition, the media regularly monitors the movements of aircraft carriers (remember the recent conflict with North Korea, for example), and the media of those countries that the aircraft carriers pass by are even more tracking. In the XNUMXst century, it is very difficult to hide something, especially when it comes to such a large armada as the AUG. At the same time, AUG is a big target, like a bright star on a Christmas tree.
  • Grits
    Grits 17 September 2020 13: 27
    -1
    Quote: voyaka uh
    If you load the KR Caliber completely frigates, then there will not be enough for
    RTOs and corvettes. Why release them then?

    Are you sure that building 8 cruise missiles is more difficult than building 1 ship?
  • Connor MacLeod
    Connor MacLeod 16 September 2020 15: 43
    0
    Well, rightly so, it's better to blacken the normal building! Diesel-electric submarine or 20380 ...
    1. Cyril G ...
      Cyril G ... 16 September 2020 17: 07
      +1
      The eastern shipyard was built by the border Hunters. After the known events, it was decided to abandon the Hunters and again resume the construction of Project 10410 ....
      Two ships of Project 10410 are to be completed by the end of the year. But there seem to be no more orders.
      1. 3danimal
        3danimal 22 September 2020 21: 58
        0
        There were a number of articles here, where the author quite convincingly questioned the advisability of striving to produce many different projects of ships in service.
  • ved_med12
    ved_med12 16 September 2020 16: 54
    +1
    Is the Green Valley next in line?
  • jeka424
    jeka424 16 September 2020 20: 55
    -2
    VSMPO also reduced wages, working days, and people are dispersed
    1. Volder
      Volder 18 September 2020 12: 34
      0
      Quote: jeka424
      VSMPO also reduced wages, working days, and people are dispersed
      The management of the VSMPO-Avisma corporation plans to restore the previous work schedule for the employees by the beginning of winter, the Novator corporate newspaper reports. According to the head of the corporation Sergei Stepanov, most of the workers in the production shops will return to the five-day schedule in September. They are planning to provide them with other work.
  • Petrol cutter
    Petrol cutter 16 September 2020 21: 37
    +2
    Here's your grandmother and St. George's Day ...
    But why be surprised? Similar murky stories take place in our production.
    In theory, employees of the first category have no right to dismiss.
    But, not a fact.
    The reduction is obliged to affect first of all - heaps of accountants, all kinds of aunts Val and Uncles Pet - who do not understand what they are doing at all, they do not solve any production issues at all. But they go to work and get paid for something ...
    Plus they constantly smoke in the smoking room. Designed for production workers. They almost bring a samovar with them, and they have a bivouac here ...
    1. Cyril G ...
      Cyril G ... 16 September 2020 21: 43
      +1
      Quote: Benzorez
      The reduction is obliged to affect first of all - heaps of accountants, all kinds of aunts Val and Uncles Pet - who do not understand what they are doing at all, they do not solve any production issues at all. But they go to work and get paid for something ...


      They forgot the secretaries. Direct blast disruption of production ..
      1. Petrol cutter
        Petrol cutter 16 September 2020 22: 14
        +1
        Was it a humor joke or where?
        All people receiving salaries and not related to production, for me personally, is ballast. Which I feed with my salary.
        I personally earn money. Building an order.
        If I don't build it with my crooked little hands, the girls with all their beauty will die of hunger. Since they will turn out to be useless and meaningless. What else needs to be explained here? ...
        1. Cyril G ...
          Cyril G ... 16 September 2020 22: 26
          +3
          I wasn’t joking. Our management pyramid traditionally tends to turn the ship of production. At the same time, effective managers with their lackeys do not hesitate with salaries for their beloved ...
          1. 3danimal
            3danimal 22 September 2020 22: 01
            0
            This is yes. Our management remuneration is usually 100 or more times the average salary for the company. For the Japanese, for comparison, about 10 times.
        2. Rzzz
          Rzzz 17 September 2020 08: 44
          +3
          Quote: Benzorez
          If I don't build it with my crooked little hands, the girls with all their beauty will die of hunger.

          And you can't build it without these girls. You only know how to swing a conventional sledgehammer.
          And you need to hire you, draw up a bunch of documents just for you. So that your seniority and pension are considered. You need to buy you your sledgehammer and make it work. You need to purchase materials and equipment from which you will build - and this is just an unthinkable amount of contractual work with hundreds of suppliers. And each contract must be verified so that everything is delivered on time and quality is needed, and not in ####. You have to pay for everything, in rubles and foreign currency. You have to pay all taxes and get all the deductions, and given the extremely complex tax system in the Russian Federation, this is a separate quest. Finally, if there is money left, you also need to pay your salary, otherwise you will write a letter to Putin laughing
          If an enterprise works under a government contract, the volume of gimoroj is tripled. For each sneeze, you need to announce a tender through the public procurement portal, keep a bunch of reports for different departments.
          And this is all done by people about whom you think that they have nothing to do with the construction of the ship.
          1. Petrol cutter
            Petrol cutter 17 September 2020 20: 44
            +1
            "And you can't build it without these girls. You only know how to swing a conventional sledgehammer."
            All this is wonderful. But at the time of "Pella" at our plant, ten people were coping with all these activities. And the 22800 was a much more serious ship than those motorboats that the plant is sculpting today. Apart from SDS and Comets.
            Now these events are engaged in fifty people.
            And when I came to the accounting department to hand over the unfortunate piece of paper, three aunts sitting there told me: Come back later. We have no time right now ...
            That is, but I have when to run to you through the entire plant! ..
            And then the head of production (one of ...) will meet me and ask the question - why are you hanging around here, and not waving a conventional sledgehammer at your workplace. Why did you bring her from home ?!
            1. Rzzz
              Rzzz 18 September 2020 09: 00
              +1
              Quote: Benzorez
              But at the time of "Pella" at our plant, ten people were coping with all these activities

              You can't even imagine how the volume of bureaucratic work has grown in comparison with the USSR. There are more officials, different departments. And each one needs attention.
              I see how these "useless" accountants sometimes sit until 10 pm, collecting their numbers. I leave work at 18:05 pm to catch the train, and nirazu the accounting door I walk past has not been closed.
              Believe me, not a single normal director will take on a person who is not needed. It will rather overload the existing ones.
              1. Petrol cutter
                Petrol cutter 18 September 2020 20: 49
                0
                "You can't even imagine how, in comparison with the USSR, the volume of bureaucratic work has grown. There are more officials, different departments. And each one requires attention."
                I don't even want to present. Everyone should perform their duties as productively as possible. This is my harsh opinion. And nothing will change it.
                I have been assigned specific deadlines for the execution of work on the manufacture of a section of the ship. At the same time, nobody is interested in how / what / with whom I will do it. Although the employment contract says, I will be provided with EVERYTHING necessary. All the same, we have a little different understanding of the NECESSITY with the council and other "girls".
                1. Rzzz
                  Rzzz 18 September 2020 22: 14
                  0
                  Quote: Benzorez
                  I will be provided with EVERYTHING

                  That is why you wave a sledgehammer in the cold, and the girls drink tea in the warmth.
                  You see only your work, and you don’t want to see more than that, this is typical for an ordinary performer. They sit on a higher level, they see not only their work, but also the work of a significant part of the enterprise. And much more depends on them than on an ordinary worker.
    2. pmkemcity
      pmkemcity 17 September 2020 05: 15
      +1
      Quote: Benzorez
      aunt Val and uncle Petya - who do not understand what they are doing at all

      Yes Yes! And they tied the dock on a bow!
  • kig
    kig 17 September 2020 14: 52
    0
    it looks like there is a lot of time stretching. Last year, some, even central, publications announced the "launching of the small tanker Mikhail Barskov", which was started in 2015 (!!!!). This was announced as a huge victory for the domestic shipbuilding industry. Here is a quote from Vzglyad:
    This event is of great importance not only for the development of the domestic shipbuilding industry and the development of the Northern Sea Route. It shows Russia's technological superiority in this area.
    ... At the same time, the deadweight of the tanker is only 1600 tons - in Korea, such a boat will be made for you in less than a year, and on a turnkey basis. And "launching" means only the launching of the ship's hull. In the press there were many photographs taken from the bow angle, when the bow bulb and part of the body are clearly visible. What's next is not clear. The tanker should be like this:



    And at the time of launching, he looked like this:



    It looks like the add-on isn't there yet. It is quite possible that there are no basic mechanisms either, that is, the transfer of the vessel to the customer is not yet discussed. And almost 5 years have passed since the laying. And this is a tanker, not a warship. So it is quite understandable if the Ministry of Defense refused the services of such a builder.
  • Sedoy
    Sedoy 17 September 2020 19: 53
    0
    and how Putin promised them work for many years ... :)
  • Vladimir1155
    Vladimir1155 17 September 2020 20: 37
    +1
    let the minesweepers do, there are not enough minesweepers
  • Zomanus
    Zomanus 19 September 2020 01: 12
    0
    So what? "Radiozavod" was let in one place. In words, they added something to Dubnensky, but in fact the people on the street, workshops on the castle. Now the Vostochnaya Verf shipyard is being opened at the same address. By the way, this is also about the importance of working professions ... Who will need these workers now and where? And then they are surprised. why don't young people go to factories ...
  • silver_roman
    silver_roman 19 September 2020 01: 42
    0
    And they talk about the outflow of young brains from the industry. That's just ridiculous. Who will go to work at the plant for a penny so also with an absolutely incomprehensible prospect, when you can lose 20% salary due to the fact that 2 unfortunate RTOs were canceled. How can you plan your life in general, working in such an enterprise?
    Until such tasks are solved, there will be no case. But sitting in the office, leafing through pictures of cats, going out for smoke breaks and lunches, occasionally doing something, they get 80-100 kopecks in the capitals. Or someone expects that a person is worried about the Motherland and will leave such an office and go to the bottom of the world for a penny to undermine his health, so that he will suddenly lose his salary due to a change in the order. Disgusting, comrades
  • 3danimal
    3danimal 25 September 2020 15: 40
    +1
    Another highly specialized project.
    Instead of focusing on the successful versatile 20380 series of corvettes, this is being built ..
    Minimum protection: air defense AK-630 and .. "Igla" crying (sailors with MANPADS on deck?), and there is no PLO at all (despite the fact that there are not enough ships with these functions).
    With a high probability, the first anti-ship missile system issued on it will be the last. And he doesn't even know that he is going to be attacked by the PL.
    A vulnerable oversized missile boat ...