Systemic crisis of the post-Soviet space. What to do?

Every year the former republics are slowly but surely moving away from Russia and losing political and economic ties with it. It is especially unpleasant to see how Ukraine and Belarus, two branches of the triune Russian people, are leaving. They leave their historical bosom and thereby weaken Russian civilization. Part of the Russian elite and some jingoistic patriots clap their hands with joy and believe that having thrown off the freeloaders and surrendering the post-Soviet space, the well-fed and protected will sit out "behind the fence." Recent experience shows that this will not work, this territory will inevitably be occupied by a geopolitical adversary in order to increase pressure on Russia. The situation will worsen even more.

Different socio-economic and political models

What is the basis of the drift of the former republics, especially the Slavic ones? What makes them distance themselves from Russia and forget their roots?

Over the years, different socio-economic and political models of state and social structure have developed in the new countries, which are largely incompatible. Moreover, in any state it is not the people who decide. Decisions are made by the current elites, who form the ruling class and direct the state's policy in the direction they need. Therefore, interaction between states is determined by the desire of the ruling class to realize the interests of the elite, which sets the vector for the development of the state.

This is clearly seen in the actions of the elites of Russia, Belarus and Ukraine, whose interests largely diverge, and in some aspects are antagonistic in nature. The Ukrainian and Belarusian elites are afraid of a strong Russia, they are afraid of absorption and curtailment of opportunities for realizing their interests. What matters here is often not the state, but the clan and corporate interests of representatives of the elites. The contradictions between the elites are mainly due to the peculiarities of the formation of statehood in the fragments of the former Soviet Union and the different views of the elites on the future of their states.

In the 1990s, the interests of the elites of Russia and Ukraine, as well as of many other former republics, largely coincided. For example, in Russia the "seven-bankers" ball ruled, and in Ukraine - the oligarchic republic created under Kuchma's wing. Under the conditions of thieves' capitalism, brothers in the class, having created clan-oligarchic groups, robbed their states with impunity and with passion and were united in an unrestrained striving for the West, where they hid their capital. Ukrainian marauders turned out to be so cunning that they found a way to profit from cheap Russian energy resources, giving part of the rent to their Russian "colleagues".

The Russian elite was absolutely not interested in state interests and integration issues, it sought to alienate the former republics from itself and invested resources not in integration processes and the creation of pro-Russian non-governmental organizations and movements, but in bribery of local elites and joint robbery of the Soviet legacy. Using the cover of their Russian "colleagues", the Ukrainian elite was building an independent nationalist state, seeking to integrate into the West.

With the coming to power of Putin and the "statesmen" this shop was largely closed, but not completely. In Russia, the clan-oligarchic political system was transformed into a state-liberal one, under which two wings were formed in the government: "statists" and liberals, and the president became an arbiter between rival groups. The main emphasis was placed on the formation of a powerful state, upholding state interests, reviving Russian civilization and strengthening the role of Russia in the international arena. At the same time, the positions of the liberals in the economic policy of the state remained unshakable. This duality allowed them to freely increase their capital on the "lawful" robbery of the state and to put a spoke in the wheels of the "statists".

In the new conditions, taking into account that the clan-oligarchic system has survived in Ukraine, the interests of the Russian "statists" and the Ukrainian elite began to diverge and collide. The Ukrainian oligarchic republic took full control of the political power in the state and, under the supervision of the Americans, turned Ukraine into an anti-Russian bridgehead. The oligarchs determined the policy of the state in American and their own interests, decided by oligarchic consensus who would be the president of the country, and then legitimized his power through popular elections.

In Belarus, the political system developed differently, with the coming to power of Lukashenko, supported by the post-Soviet elite and the majority of the population, the oligarchs were not allowed to power and began to build a state with a different socio-political system that preserved the economic foundations of Soviet state capitalism, the predominance of state property, elements of social protection population and a rigid vertical of power headed by the president.

Over time, Lukashenka's dictatorship was established. Using the unconditional support of the population, he permanently led the state, determined the political and economic course, formed the elite and the state vertical for himself. Having concluded an alliance agreement with Russia, Lukashenka skillfully used his position. Due to cheap Russian energy resources and other preferences, he kept the economy afloat and a decent standard of living of the population, creating the appearance of a successful state leader, without particularly bothering himself with obligations under the union agreement and closer integration.

All this led to the formation of a degrading political system, which became a brake on the development of the state. A significant part of the population began to show dissatisfaction, tendencies began to mature in society with the requirements for changes in the state structure. Contradictions with the Russian leadership over the future union were growing, Lukashenko, in order to strengthen his power, purposefully began to plant Belarusian nationalism in society and, as a result, lost many Russian preferences. In response, he began to flirt with the West, which further complicated the situation.

Ideological differences

Ideologically, Ukraine and Belarus were also fundamentally different. In Ukraine, from the middle of the XNUMXth century, the Poles cultivated the national idea of ​​building an independent Ukrainian state, which was based on local Galician nationalism, which did not recognize the Russian roots of the Ukrainian population and harbored a fierce hatred of everything Russian. This ideology, which originated in Galicia, became the state one, was strenuously imposed by the elites on the entire population of the country and gradually encompassed a significant part of it. Considering that the ideology of Galician nationalism is in principle incompatible with the idea of ​​Russian unity, it excluded any integration of Ukraine and Russia.

In Belarus at the time of the collapse of the Union there was no national idea of ​​an independent Belarusian people, almost the entire population considered itself one of the branches of the single Russian people, and nationalist ideas were the lot of the marginalized. It was on this wave that Lukashenka came to power. To strengthen and maintain the sole power, Lukashenko began to artificially form and, through the state propaganda machine, impose on the population the national idea of ​​“Lithuanianism” - an independent Belarusian people with its own history, language and ancestry from the Grand Duchy of Lithuania. Gradually, this idea took possession of part of the Western-oriented intelligentsia, as well as young people, and the president's entourage, striving to convert their power into capital and preserve it in the West, successfully promoted the idea to the masses.

With the aim of establishing "national identity", the state apparatus imposed the Belarusian language in all spheres, despite the fact that only 5-7% spoke it, and only 2-3% of the population used it. Belarusian speech can be heard only in the outback in the west of Belarus.

Under such pressure from the authorities and the support of the West, the Belarusian society gradually matured to accept the imposed "Lithuanian" identity; this ideology took possession of the masses and changed the outlook and self-consciousness of a significant part of the Belarusian people.

In Russia, with the beginning of the revival of the Russian state in the 2000s, the national idea and the image of the future were never formulated, the liberal idea from the 1990s continued to dominate in the country, and the old wording remained in Article 13 of the Constitution of the Russian Federation: “No ideology can be established as a state or mandatory ”. That is, the Basic Law of the state did not determine the goals of its development and did not set tasks for the ruling class that it had to implement.

Without a national idea and image of the future, Russia could not be attractive for its population and outskirts. Thieves' capitalism under construction in Russia attracted few people, especially in Belarus, which feared liberal reforms and predatory privatization. The current situation suited the oligarchs from the outskirts, who took full advantage of this situation in the 1990s. Like crows, the oligarchs flocked to Moscow to agree on plans for the joint plunder of the Soviet legacy and assert their power in the newly formed “principalities”.

The absence of a state ideology and an image of the future in Russia has largely held back and continues to hold back the development of the state and integration processes in the post-Soviet space. The peoples of the borderlands do not yet see clear advantages for themselves from integration with Russia, while the elites are quite satisfied with the current situation and continue to intensify disintegration processes.

Elites and peripheral peoples have no interest in integration

For various reasons, Ukrainian and Belarusian elites tried to distance themselves from Russia. Their main goal is the creation of independent states and undivided domination in them. The Ukrainian elite feared a takeover by a stronger competitor, while the Belarusian one feared the privatization of state property on the Russian model and the elimination of the built-up socio-economic model of the state on which its power was held. The loss of the economic base of the elite inevitably led to the loss and collapse of political power.

All this suggests that the population and elites of Ukraine and Belarus were not interested in the integration of their states with Russia. The main goal of the Ukrainian and Belarusian elites all these years has been the desire to strengthen their statehood through preferences and cheap energy resources from Russia. In Ukraine, they were successfully plundered, and in Belarus they went to support an ineffective socio-economic system.

The evolution of the post-Soviet space on the example of Belarus and Ukraine led to the creation of three states with fundamentally different, incompatible socio-political and economic development models. In Russia, a strong state was formed without a national image of the future and a liberal economic basis, in Belarus - the dictatorship of the president based on state capitalism and social protection of the population, and in Ukraine - a neo-Nazi oligarchic republic under external control. At the same time, the Russian elite did not set itself the goal of integrating the post-Soviet space, but was looking for ways to satisfy its purely commercial interests, far from state ones.

Incentives for Post-Soviet Integration

For the revival of Russia and Russian civilization, the integration of the post-Soviet space in one form or another is necessary, but appropriate conditions must be created for this. The Ukrainian and Belarusian elites will have to realize that their states are limitrophes at the junction of two civilizations and cannot exist independently, they will always be under the control of either Russia or the West. They will have to rethink their status, moderate their ambitions and learn that no one except Russia will help them.

In the interests of integrating the three branches of the Russian people in Ukraine and Belarus, it is necessary to revive the Russian self-identification of the population with Ukrainian and Belarusian specifics and to form a pro-Russian counter-elite. We also need a state ideology of Russia's future that is attractive to all, emphasizing who we are and what we strive for.

The majority of the population of Belarus still has Russian identity, and the counter-elite, which can be formed on the basis of the remnants of the post-Soviet elite, will not be so difficult to convince them of the need for integration with Russia.

In Ukraine, the counter-elite, in principle, have nowhere to come from, everything is cleaned up there. It can be formed only on the territory of the Donbass republics and then integrate into Ukraine. Ukrainian society is not Belarusian, to a large extent it is infected with nationalism, there is a lot to be done there to return Russian identity. This is unlikely to be achieved without creating an attractive image of Russia's future.

The situation with the elite in Russia is not so simple, the population also expects from the authorities not empty promises, but concrete changes. The conserved liberal model, stretching back from the 90s, is a brake on development; without breaking it, it is impossible to reach a compromise and mutual understanding in society and with the outskirts. The Russian elite must acquire a different quality, without cleansing it of liberals who continue to parasitize on the body of the state, it is impossible to create an attractive image of Russia.

Instead of the purely financial sense of the development of society imposed by the liberals, aimed at integrating financial and bureaucratic structures, we need social and political ideas and meanings aimed at integrating countries and peoples. Only the advancement and implementation of new socio-political and economic models of the development of society, aimed at strengthening the state and increasing the well-being of the population, can stop the disintegration and degradation of the post-Soviet space.

Comments

[Svarog]

With the coming to power of Putin and the "statesmen" this shop was largely closed, but not completely.

The statesmen in quotation marks are correct.
Nothing was covered up, the system, unfortunately, did not change with the arrival of Putin. The relationship between the Slavic states continued and continues to degrade.
The capitalist model does not carry the idea of ​​unification .. here money and personal or private are at the head. But even in this case, Russia had a chance to integrate the economies of Belarus and Ukraine, as well as the elite of these countries ... but this was not done either. There are no even pro-Russian parties in the former CIS countries, and therefore no politics.
In general, the actions of our leadership in all areas have failed .. and are focused on tactical victories, but strategic defeats.

[Lexus]

The statesmen in quotation marks are correct.

"Little khataskrayniks" and other "troubadour-compradors" a priori cannot be statesmen. It's like a rat dragging stolen grain back to the warehouse from a hole.

[Tatyana]

For the elites and the peoples of the outskirts no interest in integration

And why should this interest be now among the elites and the peoples of the national borderlands, if so many years have passed since 1917 without changing the original national policy of the Bolsheviks in the USSR ?!
After all, the Bolsheviks and other followers of the classics of Marxism-Leninism during the Great Patriotic War. Oct socialist. revolution and civil war in Russia, having come to power to build socialism and with the formation of the USSR - the world's first socialist state - in practice, they actually departed from the observance of the essence of "proletarian internationalism" in relation to the Russian people, which they previously and then still promoted. Namely.

In practice, it turned out that the slogan of "proletarian imperialism" Karl Marx was turned by Lenin and Trotsky in Russia on a bourgeois seamy side:
1) the state forming the Russian people was Russophobic everywhere Lenin removed from all bodies of Soviet power [V.I. On the question of nationalities or "Autonomization". Full collection cit., edition 5, v. 45, pp. 356 - 362],
2) the territory of Russia was administratively divided according to the principle of the so-called. "Titular" nationalities,
3) power in the titular nat. Soviet republics In the absence of its own national PROLETARIAT there, it was transferred by the Bolsheviks to the representatives of the petty national BOURGEOIS and the former FEDALS.
Hence the annexation by the Bolsheviks of the primordially Russian lands to the so-called. titular national SSRs.
T.O., Conducted. Oct socialist. the revolution was not only a change in the social system, but also a geopolitical nationalist state. coup. Russia from a state of historically primordial Russian people, who took peoples of other nationalities under its protection and guardianship, turned into a "Russophobic" state of national minorities.
In other words. In Russia, during the formation of the USSR, a geopolitical national isomerism occurred in society with the administrative-territorial division of the population, the peoples of the country. Namely.
Nat. outskirts of RI to the Council. Russia turned in relation to the Russians into the titular national metropolises, the central power ended up in the hands of Jewish globalists - agents of British and American intelligence with Rothschild's money. Industry in the national republics was already being built by the hands of the Russian and Russian-speaking peoples.
Thus, bourgeois deformations for the collapse of the USSR in 1991 were laid in Russia by the Bolsheviks-Trotskyists from the very beginning of Soviet power.

[Kronos]

Big-headed delirium

[Tatyana]

In the interests of integrating the three branches of the Russian people in Ukraine and Belarus, it is necessary to revive the Russian self-identification of the population with Ukrainian and Belarusian specifics and to form a pro-Russian counter-elite. We also need a state ideology of Russia's future that is attractive to all, emphasizing who we are and what we strive for.

To understand what is happening in Ukraine and the same Republic of Belarus now, you need to understand the cause-and-effect relationships of what happened wrong in the national policy in the USSR. Namely.

The development of Soviet Russia - the first socialist in the world. State was twofold - CONFLICT - character.
On the one hand, Russian people, who believed in the communist. the idea of ​​the Bolshevik-Leninists, and. being the bearer of a DOMINANT, not a small-town-outskirts national mentality of the minority in the country, on all fronts of the public. construction really created socialism within the entire country as its entire multinational. Homeland. In principle, he had nothing left to do.
But at the same time, on the other hand, in the former tsarist national outskirts, where feudal relations and their own nat. the proletariat was absent (there were no carriers of the proletarian mentality), power from the Bolshevik-Leninists and under their control received the petty national bourgeoisie and former local feudal lords.
National industry was built by the hands of Russian and Russian-speaking peoples.
At the same time, everything that was created was truly a national council over the years. power in the once backward tsarist nat. in the outskirts - it is only the local national party and Soviet bureaucracy, as well as the national creative intelligentsia that serves it (social scientists, writers, artists, etc.).
This nat. The party and Soviet bureaucracy and the intelligentsia objectively retained the national bourgeois-feudal mentality not only in relation to their own working people, but also in relation to those who, in their opinion, came to “hunch the Russians” up to the time of the so-called Gorbachev “new thinking”.

TOTAL national problems in the USSR were not only from the very beginning of Soviet power, but also had a national-bourgeois class character in relation to the Russian people. BUT The counter-bourgeois coup of 1991 in the USSR as a whole only raised from the bottom to the surface the already existing national-bourgeois deformations during the construction of socialism in Russia, which the Soviet leadership tried not to publicize.

As for what is happening now in Belarus, the Russian people, divided by the Bolsheviks into Great Russians, Belarusians and Little Russians, in a certain respect, were very lucky with President Lukashenko, otherwise it would now be like the genocide of Kiev against the Russians in Ukraine.
But this is exactly what the Polish-Lithuanian national opposition in Belarus, headed by Tikhanovskaya and her Consultative Council, with the support of their West, is striving for.

[military_cat]

Only the promotion and implementation of new socio-political and economic models of the development of society, aimed at strengthening the state and increasing the well-being of the population, can stop the disintegration and degradation of the post-Soviet space.

A very fresh idea, and now let's think about how we will achieve this. Let me remind you that a couple of months ago we publicly presented the chief architect of the current system, who had been building it for 20 years and never once showed a desire to build something else, the opportunity to stay in power forever. What are the suggestions?

[Squelcher]

Tatiana is the voice of one crying in the desert, unfortunately the adepts do not read either Capital or Collected Works, and they do not want to know the history either.

[KMS]

Quote: Squelcher

Tatiana is the voice of one crying in the desert, unfortunately the adepts do not read either Capital or Collected Works, and they do not want to know the history either.

Alas so .. Only howl and noah Maxim .. And Tatiana is our clever, she says such things that not everyone here dares to write from men ..

[Svarog]

Quote: Tatiana

Thus, bourgeois deformations for the collapse of the USSR in 1991 were laid in Russia by the Bolsheviks-Trotskyists from the very beginning of Soviet power.

Tatyana, the easiest way is to refer to the blunders of a dead lion .. This is what the liberals are doing now, they say that the USSR and other nonsense are to blame for today's demography .. Let's remember that 30 years have passed since there is no USSR, a whole generation has changed, for 30 years the state has been living with capitalism, and even if you accept your point of view, the question arises, what prevented the "statesmen" from correcting this situation ..
Now about

the central power was in the hands of Jewish globalists - agents of British and American intelligence with Rothschild's money.

https://jeteraconte.livejournal.com/383373.html
Here nationalities are indicated .. but even this fact is not worth discussing .. Jews can be found in any state close to the government, and there are many in the United States and in today's Russia there are enough ..
In my opinion, nationality is not important, the result is important .. the USSR had a result, and what kind of it .. now it is not. More precisely, now it is negative ..
Now about

the territory of Russia was administratively divided according to the principle of the so-called. "Titular" nationalities,

This was not done at all in order to lay a mine. Thus, the Soviets wanted to buy the elite and integrate into the USSR. And this action was correct, considering again the result. The USSR became an empire and in what conditions ... in the most severe. Of course, at that time it did not even occur that the USSR would collapse and the central government would weaken.

[Vadim237]

Russia, except with Belarus, in fact, has no one to integrate with - everyone else is on their own and they like it.

[Tatyana]

Quote: Svarog

Tatyana, the easiest way is to refer to the blunders of a dead lion .. This is what the liberals are doing now, they say that the USSR and other nonsense are to blame for today's demography .. Let's remember that 30 years have passed since there is no USSR, a whole generation has changed, for 30 years the state has been living with capitalism, and even if you accept your point of view, the question arises, what prevented the "statesmen" from correcting this situation ..

And how many "statists" were in the power of the Russian Federation over these 30 years? How many of them were allowed into power after the collapse of the USSR - especially since the USSR lost the Cold War to the USA?
What are you talking about and what are you asking about? Get down to the ground!

There is no Russian elite in Russia. Yuri Polyakov. Human Upgrade • Feb 20. 2017


Even people from abroad understand this! And you metaphysically 9 not dialectically-materialistically) you are not asking me systemic questions in history, but just fragmentary, fragmentary-limited questions!
For example. Politician Yakov Kedmi, who participates in various political talk shows in Russia, said: the main problem of Russia is today's anti-national elite.

Russia's main enemy is the country's elite, says Yakov Kedmi. Dec 5

[Svarog]

Politician Yakov Kedmi, who participates in various political talk shows in Russia, said: the main problem of Russia is today's anti-national elite.

Kedmi is the same Jew You refer to their occupation of power in the USSR and Russia, but you also cite them as an argument. I agree with you that our elites are anti-national, but I do not agree that they are anti-national. The national question is raised when they want to steal or deceive something.

And how many "statists" were in the power of the Russian Federation over these 30 years? How many of them were allowed into power after the collapse of the USSR - especially since the USSR lost the Cold War to the USA?

About that and speech, they were not and now are not. Perhaps only Primakov was a statist.
It seems to me that it’s not a matter of nationality, I’m not a supporter of nationalism, I consider it evil. Although he is Russian himself. Since the time of Russia, Russia has always been tolerant and respectful of other nationalities, from which our territories multiplied and the peoples that were part of Russia remained with us for centuries. In any nation there are scum and good people, but they are judged not by their nationality, but by their deeds.

[Tatyana]

Quote: Svarog

Kedmi is also a Jew

And what of it? If Kedmi says correct - i.e. internally logically not contradictory - and useful things for us!

[Tatyana]

Quote: Svarog

In my opinion, nationality is not important, the result is important ..

You are deeply mistaken! At one time you were dogmatically hammered into your head with the abstract "PROLETARIAN INTERNATIONALISM", and how legitimate this abstractness is in real life you cannot imagine, because you do not know the dialectical-materialistic method and cannot apply it in practice.

For example. If we say that Ch. the question of building any state is the question of power, then Ch. the national question of building every multinational. of the state the question is - “What nationality people are headed by this multinational state? Or representatives of what nationality dominate the power and management state. structures? "
The very desire for power is motivated by the desire of people to personally order, distribute and protect property.
The concept of property (proceeding from a materialistic solution to the main question of philosophy in diamatics) does not exist by itself - without its material carrier. And the material carrier of the concept of property is people with their natural biological and social needs, with their national, religious and class mentality. If there are no people, then there is no concept of property. Those. "Property" is an ideological concept. It is designed to shape - educate - the consciousness of people in such a way that it corresponds to the dominant type of historically achieved PO in society and the nature of folk traditions (in everyday life, in the family). Since the concept of property is an ideological concept, the concept of "property ownership" derived from it can sometimes be purely illusory. This means that people can be easily deceived in matters of property (voucher scam, MMM "pyramids", etc.)
But the subject of "property" is always real things - 1) material (natural and production) values ​​and 2) spiritual and cultural values, with the help of a cat. people, a nation can not only survive, but also develop, prosper, enjoy life.
When building a multinational states need to know that each people and nation in the process of its historical formation and development, starting from tribal tribes, have created their own ideological system of the concept of property, expressed, first of all, in the system of its own nat. religious beliefs. And the more the religion of the people, the nation in the historical plan retained the original tribal selfish interests, the more aggressive the attitude of this people and nation towards other peoples and nations with regard to recognizing the right of these other peoples and nations to their share of property in the multinationals. the state; and the less capable representatives of the elites of a given nationality, committed to their religion, to build a multinational. a socially just state and do not even strive for this. If they are put in power, then, in the end, they will ruin and destroy their multinationals. Fatherland, having destroyed a lot of people.

[Svarog]

If they are put in power, then, in the end, they will ruin and destroy their multinationals. Fatherland, having destroyed a lot of people.

In other words, do you think that if we had all Russians in our leadership and all the elite were Russians, we would live better and neighboring countries would be drawn to us?
Let's look at the situation from the other side. Let's assume your idea is correct ..
So what?
Nevertheless, I am convinced ... that it is not a matter of nationality. Nobody drove me proletarian internationalism, the street gave me the ideas that I have .. I have friends of very different nationalities and we still get along very well .. different life experience .. I worked with different bosses .. both with Jews and with Ukrainians and Russians and Tatars .. So we can definitely say that it is not a matter of nationality, but of a person ..
I agree with almost everything that you write, but no on this issue ..

[Tatyana]

Quote: Svarog

I have friends of very different nationalities and we still get along very well .. my life experience is different .. I worked with different bosses .. both with Jews and with Ukrainians and Russians and Tatars .. So you can definitely say that it's not about nationality, but in a person ..

First, what you think doesn't mean that they think so. And even more so whole nations.
I was convinced of this more than once in working with foreign "labor" migrants from the near abroad. They still believe that Russia and the Russians nationally still owe them economically since 1917.
And secondly, if everything were as you say, there would be no war in today's Ukraine, in today's Republic of Belarus, in the former Soviet republics, etc., etc.
I'm talking about patterns in national psychosociology. And nobody canceled these laws, except for the Marxist-idealists.

[Svarog]

First, what you think doesn't mean that they think so. And even more so whole nations.

The people are a simple layman who does not need so much in life, a peaceful sky, work, and a roof over their heads .. But those who are at the head of the people, they manipulate the national idea and the fact that someone owes someone to someone .. It is the elite, the so-called, motivates citizens to stay in power and rob the layman, along the way blaming people of other nationalities for their own troubles .. They say, if it were not for the Russians, Tatars, Mongols ... and so on .. then we would live better..This song drags on for centuries, but the reason is always in specific individuals who straddled the power and saw money to nationalist music .. The same happens in Ukraine, it happened in Tatarstan in the 90s .. the same was in all post-Soviet countries .. the exception of the Republic of Belarus, there Lukashenka did not allow ..

I was convinced of this more than once in working with foreign "labor" migrants from the near abroad. They still believe that Russia and the Russians nationally still owe them economically since 1917.

This was hammered into them by their nationalist elite, in order to manipulate .. But in Kyrgyzstan, discussions are already underway to join Russia ..
It all depends on propaganda and ideology. This is what I want to say. If the ideology is socialist and its essence is aimed at meeting the needs of the whole society (well, or the overwhelming number, and not a separate handful of people, then there can be no nationalism, and if it manifests itself somewhere, it means that someone is behind it and wants to use it in their own selfish interests ..

I'm talking about patterns in national psychosociology. And nobody canceled these laws, except for the Marxist-idealists.

I have doubts that there is a national psychology .. rather there is just psychology and a national mentality .. Which, of course, due to cultural historical development is very different .. But all people are trained, which is why education is important, the better and more accessible it will be, the less nationalism and differences in the perception of the essence will be, and the funnier will be the leaders who advocate the superiority of their people over others ..
For this reason, the quality of education in our country is decreasing because it is easier for an uneducated person to control and it is easier to arouse an animal instinct in him .. while suppressing the ability to think independently ..

except for the Marxist idealists.

When I was 17 years old, I got a job as a geodesy worker .. I dragged a rail)) In my free time I read "Capital" .. it was difficult .. twice I had to re-read the page to understand the essence .. But the book turned out to be very exciting and I mastered several volumes .. I think I still need to reread to be savvy, so to speak)) But this book finds confirmation of its correctness to this day with me ..

[your1970]

Quote: Svarog

the better and more accessible it is, the less nationalism and differences in the perception of the essence will be and the funnier the leaders will look

Citizens who attended rallies with the slogans "Get the CPSU !!!" and "Ridna nanny" in the 90s - learned in Soviet schools no later than the 70s ...
If we argue according to you, in the USSR in the 60-70s there was NOT quality and NOT affordable education? ?? !!!!

[Alex Nevs]

Only "Man" must be "created" by these intelligent society. No other way.

[immobile2008]

Since Lukashenko's support, Belarus can be considered a hostile state

[Max otto]

True, and also:

The Ukrainian and Belarusian elites will have to realize that their states are limitrophes at the junction of two civilizations and cannot exist independently, they will always be under the control of either Russia or the West. They will have to rethink their status, moderate their ambitions and learn that no one except Russia will help them.

As usual, everyone owes everything to the Russians, and only the Russians can relax, Putin has decided everything for them and is already doing it.

[nikvic46]

Tatyana. Today. You have not even thought about what attracted the peoples who entered the USSR. No one forced them into the Union.

[Tatyana]

Quote: nikvic46

You have not even thought about what attracted the peoples who entered the USSR. No one forced them into the Union.

Study the history of the beginning of Soviet power and the formation of the USSR!
And why was it that the local feudal lords and the petty bourgeoisie and other local national chauvinists on the outskirts of the Republic of Ingushetia could not be included in Soviet Russia? If the Bolshevik-Trotskyists gave them statehood, added primordially Russian lands to them, lowered the Russian people to the position of second-class people, allowed Russians by nationality to plunder with impunity, take away property and in every possible way squeeze them out of their homes - and this with subsidies from the Center of the Soviet country and the world workers' International in regarding the policy of local national chauvinists!

[nikvic46]

Tatyana. Have you traveled to other republics? Not Western. I drove and I wouldn't say that they ate us.

[your1970]

Quote: nikvic46

I would say that they ate us.

There were books, furniture and clocks that were in short supply here, which nobody needed ...

Well, in 1990 I sent my aunt from the army (!!!!) a package of sweets, condensed milk, washing powder and soap to Moscow !!!

[Alex Nevs]

Oh and stupidity you dashed off here.

[DNS-a42]

Quote: Tatiana

Russia from a state of historically primordial Russian people, who took peoples of other nationalities under its protection and guardianship, turned into a "Russophobic" state of national minorities.

"Trotskyist-Bolshevik" Stalin I do not agree with you.

Tsarism killed all activity of the popular masses of the outskirts. By all this, tsarism generated among the local national masses the deepest mistrust, sometimes turning into hostile relations, towards everything Russian. To strengthen the alliance between central Russia and the border regions, an atmosphere of mutual understanding and fraternal trust must be created. But in order to eliminate mistrust, it is necessary, first of all, to help the popular masses of the outskirts to free themselves from the remnants of the feudal-patriarchal yoke, it is necessary to abolish - to abolish in deeds, and not only in words - all and every privilege of the colonial elements, it is necessary to give the masses of the people a taste of from the material benefits of the revolution.

I don't even want to comment on the rest of the nonsense.

[Tatyana]

Quote: DNS-a42

"Trotskyist-Bolshevik" Stalin

First, Stalin was never a Trotskyist. Rather, Lenin can be called a Trtskyite than Stalin.
Trotsky and Lenin were for the world revolution and were ready to be Russophobic for the sake of the world revolution to burn in its fire even the entire state forming the Russian people of Russia. In principle, these ideologically obsessive gentlemen did not feel sorry for the Russian people and the country.
Stalin, on the contrary, advocated the building of socialism in a single country - in Soviet Russia - and was not going to sacrifice the Russian people and population for the sake of the world revolution.

Quote: DNS-a42

Tsarism killed all activity of the popular masses of the outskirts. By all this, tsarism generated among the local national masses the deepest mistrust, sometimes turning into hostile relations, towards everything Russian. To strengthen the alliance between central Russia and the border regions, an atmosphere of mutual understanding and fraternal trust must be created. But in order to eliminate mistrust, it is necessary, first of all, to help the popular masses of the outskirts to free themselves from the remnants of the feudal-patriarchal yoke, it is necessary to abolish - to abolish in deeds, and not only in words - all and every privilege of the colonial elements, it is necessary to give the masses of the people a taste of from the material benefits of the revolution.

This is a quote from Lenin's works, repeated by Stalin. And its content does not at all mean that in this regard, in the nationalist policy in the Soviet socialist state, the nationalist should have been an overload in the direction of chauvinism of national minorities for the rest of their lives.
More than 100 years have passed, and the Leninist-Trotskyist delirium is still in the chauvinistic swamp of national minorities 100 years ago.

You can not comment on what I said - you will not say anything worthwhile!

[Malyuta]

Quote: Tatiana

Rather, Lenin can be called a Trtskyite than Stalin.

I am very sorry, but your creative experiences have gone too far.
Do not, under the guise of patriotism, mock Goebbels' propaganda bogey, picked up by the Anglo-Saxons and Judas Yakovlev that Stalin was not a true Leninist!
The first task for the collapse of the USSR was to discredit the name of Stalin, the second, to knock out the foundation created by Lenin, and only then discredit socialism and Bolshevik ideology.
Remember for yourself, if it were not for Lenin, then Stalin would not have taken place as a leader, and Stalinism became the material embodiment and further development of the Marxist-Leninist theory.

[Tatyana]

Quote: Malyuta

It is not necessary, under the guise of patriotism, to repeat Goebbels' propaganda bogey, picked up by the Anglo-Saxons and Judas Yakovlev, that Stalin was not a true Leninist!

There is no need to misrepresent and interpret my words! I said everything absolutely correctly. On the question of the world revolution, Stalin parted with Lenin. And this is a historical fact!

Quote: Malyuta

if it were not for Lenin, then Stalin would not have taken place as a leader, and Stalinism became the material embodiment and further development of Marxist-Leninist theory.

Yes, that's right - Stalin, from the standpoint of the dialectical-materialist method, creatively and competently corrected this mistake of Marxism-Leninism in practice. And he did the right thing!

Do not go too far in your opposition and do not engage in eclecticism, everything and everyone is indiscriminately biased and biased and mistakenly mixing into one heap!

[Malyuta]

Quote: Tatiana

There is no need to misinterpret my words and interpret them in your own way! I absolutely said everything correctly. Stalin parted with Lenin on the question of the world revolution. And this is a historical fact1

It's a strange thing ... you are misleading yourself and I have absolutely nothing to do with it
Remember who was the first to declare "the possibility of the victory of the social. Revolution in a single country"?
I also ask you to remember that it was not under Stalin that a socialist camp and half the world of socialist countries appeared.
And now the question is, without Stalin's support, countries such as China, North Korea, Eastern European countries, would have become socialist?
And what is this if not the path to world revolution?

[Tatyana]

Quote: Malyuta

I also ask you to remember that it was not under Stalin that a socialist camp and half the world of socialist countries appeared.

This was not in 1917, but at a different time - in 1945 after the victory of the USSR in WWII and WWII - after the Red Army finished off the German Nazis as its enemy and world invader in its lair - in Berlin.

Quote: Malyuta

And now the question is, without Stalin's support, countries such as China, North Korea, Eastern European countries, would have become socialist?

Wouldn't. But again, it was not Soviet Russia that attacked these countries with the aim of accomplishing a socialist revolution there, as Lenin and Trotsky planned to do simultaneously - consistently without stopping - to do this in 1917, one after another in all countries.
The task of Stalin / SSR was to finish off the invader and stop the enemy-aggressor.
And the people in the countries liberated from Hitler's fascism themselves adopted in 1945 the socio-political system that they considered necessary.
Stalin did not have this EXPORT of the socialist revolution in the classical sense of the word, as Lenin and Trotsky intended to do. These are two different things.

[DNS-a42]

Quote: Tatiana

On the question of the world revolution, Stalin parted with Lenin.

Oh, by again! Lenin in 1915 year:

The unevenness of economic and political development is the unconditional law of capitalism. From this it follows that the victory of socialism is possible initially in a few, or even in one, a separate, capitalist country. The victorious proletariat of this country, expropriating the capitalists and organizing socialist production at home, would stand up against the rest, the capitalist world, attract the oppressed classes of other countries, raise an uprising in them against the capitalists, and, if necessary, even with military force against the exploiting classes and their states.

[Tatyana]

Please, give a link to the above quotation of Lenin from Lenin's sources!
And explain to me why Lenin's words diverged from deeds - and even in that very Russia, on its non-proletarian outskirts!

[DNS-a42]

"On the slogan United States of Europe"
https://www.marxists.org/russkij/lenin/1915/08/10a.htm

It didn’t come out. What he called for, he began to implement, and Stalin continued.

[Tatyana]

Quote: Tatiana

And explain to me why Lenin's words diverged from deeds - and even in the same Russia on its NON-PROLETARIAN outskirts!

You did not answer this question to me.

[DNS-a42]

Once again, deeds and words did not diverge. The Bolsheviks consistently defended the right of nations to self-determination and the principle of equality of nations, which made it possible to preserve the country and create the USSR.

[Tatyana]

Quote: DNS-a42

principle of equality of nations

In addition to the equality of Russians with other peoples !!!
And now we slurp this Russophobia in the country and in the near abroad from national minorities with shovels! What the Bolsheviks laid down in Soviet Russia, we got it!

[Malyuta]

Quote: Tatiana

In addition to the equality of Russians with other peoples !!!
And now we slurp this Russophobia in the country and in the near abroad from national minorities with shovels! What the Bolsheviks laid down in Soviet Russia, we got it!

I am very sorry Madame, but Putinism has dislocated your consciousness, determined by being!
What the hell are you talking about ???? !!!
Centrifugal nationalist movements on the outskirts began even before February 17th, and temporary workers gave them a hundredfold acceleration.
These are the Caucasus and Zkavkazie, Middle Asia, the Baltic States, Ukraine, Don and Tsetra and Tsetera.
But the BOLSHEVIKS recreated the country as an empire and finally approved it in 1945.
By the way, the Central Asian Basmachi were worn out only in the early 30s.
So learn history, and do not drive the "blizzard"))) it is never too late to learn

[DNS-a42]

Quote: Tatiana

First, Stalin was never a Trotskyist. Rather, Lenin can be called a Trtskyite than Stalin.

Quotes, as it were.

Quote: Tatiana

Trotsky and Lenin were for the world revolution and were ready to be Russophobic for the sake of the world revolution to burn in its fire even the entire state forming the Russian people of Russia.

Oh! Stalin in 1925:

Disbelief in the international proletarian revolution; disbelief in her victory; skepticism towards the national liberation movement in colonies and dependent countries; failure to understand that without the support of the revolutionary movement of other countries, our country could not stand against world imperialism; failure to understand that the victory of socialism in one country cannot be final, because it cannot be guaranteed against intervention until the revolution is victorious in at least a number of countries; lack of understanding of that elementary requirement of internationalism, by virtue of which the victory of socialism in one country is not an end in itself, but a means for the development and support of the revolution in other countries.

[Tatyana]

Quote: DNS-a42

the dinner of socialism in one country cannot be final, because it cannot be guaranteed against intervention until the revolution is victorious in at least a number of countries;

And what's wrong with that? What are we arguing about?
Also give, please, a link to the source! A phrase taken out of context and detached from the reason for its writing leaves many questions behind it.
Do not forget about the existence at that time of such an international organization as the "Communist International"! At the same time, talking shop in the stands is one thing, and a completely different thing is the direct military intervention of one country in another for the sake of exporting a socialist revolution there! These are two different things!

[DNS-a42]

"Stalin's speech at the Sverdlovsk University"
https://marxists.architexturez.net/russkij/stalin/t7/questions_answers.htm

The Bolsheviks always acted according to the situation. Today it is possible to support the foreign proletariat with words, tomorrow - economically, and the day after tomorrow - by force of arms. This is a matter of tactics.

[Tatyana]

Quote: DNS-a42

The Bolsheviks always acted according to the situation. Today it is possible to support the foreign proletariat with words, tomorrow - economically, and the day after tomorrow - by force of arms. This is a matter of tactics.

I agree that this is a matter of tactics!
Why, then, under Stalin, Trotsky was forced to emigrate from the country, and then even killed on instructions from the USSR in Mexico?
Why was the attitude of Stalin and Lenin towards the Russians different?
Why did the Trotskyists "kill" and then "clean up" Stalin's image as a leader? After all, the party had 2 Bolshevik political wings: the Trotskyists and the Stalinists.

[DNS-a42]

Quote: Tatiana

Why, then, under Stalin, Trotsky was forced to emigrate from the country

What else was there for him? He lost the struggle for power, and in the conditions of the country's preparation for the coming world war, he would not have been spared.

Quote: Tatiana

then even killed on assignment from the USSR in Mexico?

There is no reliable evidence that the USSR was behind this.

Quote: Tatiana

Why was the attitude of Stalin and Lenin towards the Russians different?

Did not have.

Quote: Tatiana

Why did the Trotskyists "kill" and then "clean up" Stalin's image as a leader?

Trotskyism has nothing to do with it.
Stalin asked sternly from the party nomenklatura. When the party members got the opportunity to “live for themselves,” many took advantage of it. Slandering Stalin is only an ideological way of defending against his methods of influencing the party.

[Tatyana]

Quote: DNS-a42

Quote: Tatiana
then even killed on assignment from the USSR in Mexico?

There is no reliable evidence that the USSR was behind this.

Trotsky's killer, after serving 20 years in a Mexican prison for his murder, immediately emigrated to the USSR and received a high Soviet award there.

Quote: DNS-a42

Quote: Tatiana
Why was the attitude of Stalin and Lenin towards the Russians different?

Did not have.

Exactly what happened! And you find and read the Russophobic articles of Lenin in the last years of his life! Haven't you read it? When I read them, my hair just stood on end!
Have you heard Stalin's drinking speech about the Russian people after the victory in the Second World War?
What nationality do you yourself wake up, otherwise it may be pointless for us to argue on the national question in view of your anti-Russian-international bias?

Quote: DNS-a42

Quote: Tatiana
Why did the Trotskyists "kill" and then "clean up" Stalin's image as a leader?

Trotskyism has nothing to do with it.

Very much even with it! And we again run into what we started to argue with: who, why and why carried out the so-called "Great October. Socialist Revolution" with a geopolitical national coup in the country.

[DNS-a42]

Quote: Tatiana

Trotsky's killer, after serving 20 years in a Mexican prison for his murder, immediately emigrated to the USSR and received a high Soviet award there.

AND? Does this somehow prove that the USSR ordered him to kill Trotsky?

Quote: Tatiana

Exactly what happened! And you find and read the Russophobic articles of Lenin in the last years of his life! Haven't you read it? When I read them, my hair just stood on end!

I read and continue to read, I have not found anything Russophobic.

Quote: Tatiana

Have you heard Stalin's drinking speech about the Russian people after the victory in the Second World War?

I read it and liked it. But where is the connection with Lenin here?

Quote: Tatiana

Very much even with it! And we again run into what we started to argue with: who, why and why carried out the so-called "Great October. Socialist Revolution" with a geopolitical national coup in the country.

It is known who is the proletariat. It is known why - the contradictions of capitalism ripened in RI most clearly. The so-called it is only for anti-Soviet.

Quote: Tatiana

What nationality will you be?

State-forming.

[Tatyana]

Quote: DNS-a42

Quote: Tatiana
What nationality will you be?

State-forming.

All peoples of national minorities in Russia now consider themselves to be forming the state.
After all, they have their own territorial-administrative national "apartments" from which Russians with their "foreign" Russian language are squeezed away to other regions so that the ethnic Russians there, after leaving, are no longer able to study in universities and other educational institutions of the country after school in the native Russian language. According to the Unified State Exam, they get to the university, but they do not understand anything, what the teacher says to them in Russian at the lecture and they fly out after the first session. In other words, they only take away a place from Russian-speaking applicants.

So I believe that you have not answered my question directly.
Otherwise, everything is clear to me with you. It is useless to explain something to you.

Quote: DNS-a42

Quote: Tatiana
Quote: Tatiana
First, Stalin was never a Trotskyist. Rather, Lenin can be called a Trotskyist than Stalin.
Why did the Trotskyists "kill" and then "clean up" Stalin's image as a leader?

Trotskyism has nothing to do with it.

People who challenged Stalin. Andrey Fursov. • 22 Mar Dec 2019

[Malyuta]

Quote: Tatiana

People who challenged Stalin. Andrey Fursov. • 22 Mar Dec 2019

This is all absolutely clear with you, if you manage to expose the poop of obscurantist Fursov for authority. It would be funny if ...

[Tatyana]

You are a bad communist, and, apparently, the person is not Russian. I'm even sure of that. Russian won't speak like that.
We have lost the USSR, but you don't care about it! You do not want to understand the reasons and roots of what is happening. You call Fursov an obscurantist. Yes, you, as a historian in knowledge, reach out and reach for him!
What's the use of such communists as you, if you do not understand the theory of oil and gas! You do not know the dialectical-materialistic method! Who will follow you for such if you yourself do not understand anything? You are a communist dogmatist and no one else! Like a pop in church!
That's right about you - the communists - Putin said that you are just a kind of religious believers!

[Malyuta]

Quote: Tatiana

Putin correctly said about you that you are just a kind of religious believer!

Honestly, I don't give a damn about his words and rub, I don't even want to talk about him.
By the way, in the country we lost, there is also his fault.

[Malyuta]

Quote: DNS-a42

Trotskyism has nothing to do with it.
Stalin asked sternly from the party nomenklatura. When the party members got the opportunity to “live for themselves,” many took advantage of it. Slandering Stalin is only an ideological way of defending against his methods of influencing the party.

Bravo, Comrade !!!
An exceptionally sound assessment.
PySy. Your opponent is a covertly-Putin propagandist
she and others like them easily equate Stalin and the head club. Here, willy-nilly, you want to cry ...

[naidas]

Quote: Tatiana

1) the state forming the Russian people was Russophobic everywhere Lenin removed from all bodies of Soviet power [V.I. On the question of nationalities or "Autonomization". Full collection cit., edition 5, v. 45, pp. 356 - 362],

And here's what Lenin actually has:
Under such conditions, it is very natural that the “freedom to leave the union”, which we justify ourselves, will turn out to be an empty piece of paper, unable to protect Russian foreigners from the invasion of that truly Russian man, a Great Russian chauvinist, in essence, a scoundrel and a rapist, which is a typical Russian bureaucrat . There is no doubt that an insignificant percentage of Soviet and Soviet workers will sink in this sea of ​​chauvinistic Great Russian trash, like a fly in milk.

Do you have Tatiana Russian bureaucrats without exception? Do not agree that then, and even now it is necessary to protect an ordinary person from a bureaucrat?
Lenin:
... almost always in historical practice, we, the nationals of a large nation, find ourselves guilty of an endless amount of violence, and even more than that - we imperceptibly commit an endless amount of violence and insults - one has only to recall my Volga memories of how we are being bullied foreigners, as a Pole, are not called anything other than a "Polish", as a Tatar is not ridiculed otherwise than a "prince", a Ukrainian other than a "Ukrainian", a Georgian and other Caucasian aliens - as a "Kapkaz man."
Are you Tatyana for not agreeing with Lenin here, are you for the "Polish", the Ukrainians, the "Kapkaz man", etc.? Or do you agree with Lenin?
Lenin:
This requires more than formal equality. For this, it is necessary to compensate in one way or another with your conversion or your concessions towards a foreigner that mistrust, that suspicion, those insults that were inflicted on him in the historical past by the government of the "great-power" nation.

How do you think it is necessary to attract foreigners with something, or among the Russians “No ideology can be established as a state or obligatory one.” Or how?

It would be an unforgivable opportunism if, on the eve of this uprising of the East and at the beginning of its awakening, we undermined our authority among it with the slightest rudeness and injustice towards our own foreigners.

[Tatyana]

Quote: naidas

How, in your opinion, it is necessary to somehow attract foreigners, or among the Russians "No ideology can be established as a state or mandatory." Or how?

No state exists without the dominant ideology of the ruling class. This is the first thing.

Second. I recommend that you familiarize yourself with the work (otherwise we can throw as many quotes as we like and all without results - without mutual understanding and benefit):

Zueva, Tatiana Fedorovna. Russian question. National crisis and democracy: the administrative-territorial structure of Russia / T. F. Zueva; International Slavic Academy of Sciences, Education, Arts and Culture. St. Petersburg branch; [introductory speech by academician of ISA and PAN Yu. K. Begunov]. - St. Petersburg: A.S.Suvorin Publishing House of the Writers' Union of Russia, 1995... - 30, [2] p .. - (Series "History of Russia"; No. 2)

To read this work, type on the Internet: "Russian question. Zueva T.F."Sites with this work will open.
Open this work on the Internet on the website of the NEL (National Electronic Library)
Russian question, national crisis and democracy:
rusneb.ru ›catalog / 000200_000018_EN_NLR_BIBL_A ...
Zueva T.F. ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ “The Russian question, national crisis and democracy: the administrative-territorial structure of Ross” (5-87462-010-9) - Zueva T.F., 30, 2 p .. Published: (1995).
The cover looks like this.

[naidas]

You are not writing Lenin from the PSS, but Zueva T.F. Lenin's opinion is taken from his work by your link, you deliberately distorted Lenin's words. Read Lenin's work by your own link, not T.F. Zuev.

[Tatyana]

Quote: naidas

You are not writing Lenin from the PSS, but Zueva T.F.

You are simply moving away from polemics and the essence of the national question in Russia.
How familiar is it from the persons of NERUS nationality with their petty-bourgeois and consumer national chauvinism!
If you don't want to - don't read! It would be suggested. That's all.

[KMS]

Quote: Tatiana

Quote: naidas

You are not writing Lenin from the PSS, but Zueva T.F.

You are simply moving away from polemics and the essence of the national question in Russia.
How familiar is it from the persons of NERUS nationality with their petty-bourgeois and consumer national chauvinism!
If you don't want to - don't read! It would be suggested. That's all.

Write to Tatyana and do not pay attention to the "bites" .. Many people read you here and support you ..

[naidas]

I'm not going to argue and prove, but I consider it unworthy to post fakes on such a serious site. If you refer to the source, then separate your opinion from it.

[Tatyana]

I have no fakes. You do not notice that the Russophobe Lenin and the Bolsheviks have DOUBLE standards! Besides, you don't know much about history. Yes, and you are not quite a fair person, and therefore you hide your non-Russian nationality.

This requires more than formal equality. For this, it is necessary to compensate in one way or another with your conversion or your concessions towards a foreigner that mistrust, that suspicion, those insults that were inflicted on him in the historical past by the government of the "great-power" nation.

Rave! This is a complete pro-Western nonsense, intended for the pro-Western fragmentation of the Republic of Ingushetia on a national-territorial basis! And this policy continues. Ichkeria alone cost Russia!

With such a legacy of the Bolsheviks, our country, Russia, will continue to fall apart.

And how long do you think this "REPENSE" of the Great Russian people in front of the national minorities should continue ?! 100 years? 200 years old? Or FOREVER ?!

Why are you fooling me with your petty-bourgeois pro-Western consumer chauvinism of national minorities ?! Where is your "PROLETARIAN" internationalism? For a long time - from the very beginning of Soviet power - the Bolsheviks (and in your head) were drained into the toilet by them and has long since sunk into oblivion! Therefore, the country fell apart.

[Kart]

Quote: Svarog

Nothing was covered up; unfortunately, the system did not change with the coming of Putin.

Well, that is, everything that happened in the 90s - is everything the same? And the famine of the population, and the bandits on every corner?
I understand correctly?

[Lexus]

The crooks from "raspberries" have moved to comfortable office chairs, as well as palaces and estates. We changed the paddy wagons to limousines, yachts, planes. Now their "gatherings" are pathetically called Olympiads, forums, games and other "meetings". Instead of tattoos, "family coats of arms" are stuffed. Only the "smell" remained the same. No masks and botox can hide it.

[Daniil Konovalenko]

And the famine of the population, and the bandits on every corner?

.... bandits, now called collectors. Officially. Hunger? No, low-quality products, a simple example: Navalny, ate, ate and poisoned ..

[kamarada]

Now thugs are power

[Vadim237]

"Now the bandits are the power." If this were actually so, then Russia still in the 90s remained in everything, and you would walk like Moldavian, and now Ukrainian Gaster, with an outstretched hand around the world.

[Overlock]

Quote: Carte

And the famine of the population, and the bandits on every corner?

before there were bandits, but now there are security officials of all stripes, and there is no difference between them. What difference does it make to the layman who is robbing you, with or without shoulder straps.
As for hunger: look in the Federal State Statistics Service, how much is undernourished in the country.

[Civil]

What is the basis of the drift of the former republics, especially the Slavic ones? What makes them distance themselves from Russia and forget their roots?

1. Socio-economic situation in the Russian Federation, optimization (reduction) of social functions and inequitable distribution of income.
2. Social and political situation in the Russian Federation. Elimination of social elevators, over-centralization of management.
3. Elites in personal consumption, like the elites in the former republics of the USSR, are oriented towards the West.
4. The impoverishment of the regions at the expense of Moscow.

[Vadim237]

"The socio-economic situation in the Russian Federation, the optimization (reduction) of social functions and the unfair distribution of income" - For that, spending on social services is growing this year by more than 7 trillion rubles. "Inequitable distribution of income". Whoever earns as much as he can - for everyone, the amount for a decent life can differ several times, since all people are different.
"The impoverishment of the regions at the expense of Moscow". This is how Moscow and the region have a GDP of more than 28 trillion rubles for a year, of course, the more people are concentrated in one place, the more money and sales market, respectively, and industries with the service sector - that's why everyone comes here to work. And do not confuse Moscow and the Russian budget - they don’t spend anything from the budget for Moscow; it has its own budget.

[Civil]

Quote: Vadim237

"The socio-economic situation in the Russian Federation, the optimization (reduction) of social functions and the unfair distribution of income" - For that, spending on social services is growing this year by more than 7 trillion rubles. "Inequitable distribution of income". Whoever earns as much as he can - for everyone, the amount for a decent life can differ several times, since all people are different.
"The impoverishment of the regions at the expense of Moscow". This is how Moscow and the region have a GDP of more than 28 trillion rubles for a year, of course, the more people are concentrated in one place, the more money and sales market, respectively, and industries with the service sector - that's why everyone comes here to work. And do not confuse Moscow and the Russian budget - they don’t spend anything from the budget for Moscow; it has its own budget.

How does it work? Did it help?
So it is the regions themselves that are to blame for not having enough money for anything?

[your1970]

Quote: Civil

So it is the regions themselves that are to blame for not having enough money for anything?

Including ... Land tax goes to the local budget, municipal land inspectors must identify violators, draw up acts, issue orders, send documents to Rosreestr to fine violators ...
Over the past year in our area there are -1 such cases, in the region (not small !!! 40 areas !!) -126 ....
Do they want to replenish the budget of their area (5000 fine to the local budget + tax / rent / ransom) ???
Yeah, right now

[Alex Nevs]

Smoothly ... on paper ... but they forgot about the ravines ... But I will not describe your mistakes to you. You pick up this Paper and be horrified.

[Hlavaty]

Quote: Svarog

procurators in quotes - that's right

It would still be correct to quote "elite" when it comes to:

the Russian elite did not set itself the goal of integrating the post-Soviet space, but was looking for ways to satisfy its purely commercial interests, far from state

What kind of "elite" is this in a state for which state interests are far away?
Elite (English French élite from Latin eligo "chosen; best"). The best people in the state cannot but worry about the problems of the state. Otherwise, they are not the best, but the most cunning and unprincipled marauders.

On the national question, the author seems to be afraid to step on the calluses of the nationalists:

it is necessary to revive the Russian self-identification of the population with Ukrainian and Belarusian specifics and to form a pro-Russian counter-elite.

Some kind of nationalism inside out. A modern empire needs internationalism. Otherwise, never get rid of nationalism, and it will always be the back porch for hostile influence.

In Ukraine, the counter-elite, in principle, have nowhere to come from, everything is cleaned up there. It can be formed only on the territory of the Donbass republics and then integrate into Ukraine.

Well, don't be so unequivocal. If over the decades of pressure in Ukraine, pro-Russian sentiments still persist among the people, this indicates that there is great potential for work. But this work should be carried out by specialists who have good financial and political support from outside. As it was with the nationalists, it is no longer a secret for anyone that the West prepared, provided and supported them at the state level, plus a bunch of non-governmental organizations.
But if the pro-Russian forces did not and do not have such support, then it turns out that "In Ukraine, the counter-elite, in principle, has nowhere to come from." And not because "everything is cleaned up there", but because no one is doing this.

[9 Shaft]

Moreover, the longer it takes, the more difficult it is to start the process. Because the screws are tightening (educational, language laws are being adopted, the Orthodox Church oriented towards the MP is loosening ...), and young people are growing, the workforce is still leaving and leaving to work in the west, they can also enter visas when crossing the state border with the Russian Federation. ..

[Kronos]

Yes, it's too late, after looking at the suffering of the inhabitants of the LPR, there are few who want for Russia.

[Alex Nevs]

Don't. Everything is complicated here. But more than 500 thousand Russian passports have already been issued ... well, etc.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Hlavaty

A modern empire needs internationalism.

do you need an empire? ready to pay for the revival of Ukraine? and they will be reborn at our expense and decide that they do not need us ...

[Hlavaty]

Quote: DrEng527

ready to pay for the revival of Ukraine?

Well, if you are really so "accounting", then consider what will be cheaper of the two options:
Option 1. Expenditures on the creation of pro-Russian forces in Ukraine, special operations to change the anti-Russian leadership to a more moderate and gradual (relatively bloodless) pulling of Ukraine into the sphere of influence of the Russian Federation.
Option 2. Expenses for the maintenance of Donbass, then for the war with Ukraine, and then its restoration after the war, denazification, creation of a control system, and then either incorporation into the Russian Federation, or all again according to paragraph 1.

Are you still hoping that what is happening in Ukraine will not affect your life in Russia?
Wake up. It already influences and will influence even more. And if you think that the Russian Federation just needs to leave Ukraine alone to solve the problem, then you are deeply mistaken. Ukraine is a springboard for an attack on the Russian Federation. Leaving a foothold to the enemy is simply to provoke him to attack, creating favorable conditions for him.

Whose side are you on?

[DrEng527]

Quote: Hlavaty

Well, if you are so "accounting",

money loves the bill ...

Quote: Hlavaty

Donbass maintenance costs,

the problem is solved simply - we must recognize them as Abkhazia ...

Quote: Hlavaty

and then its restoration after the war, denazification, creation of a control system, and then either inclusion in the Russian Federation, or all again according to paragraph 1.

WHAT FOR? You asked them - do they want to go to Russia? As far as I understand, most do not want ... do you want to break them? Even the USSR did it for 10 years in Western Ukraine after the war ... rabbi of what?

Quote: Hlavaty

will not affect your life in Russia in any way?

positively! We stopped subsidizing them and are developing ourselves in the form of import substitution ... the same turbines for ships, a control system for the Unions, etc.

Quote: Hlavaty

Ukraine is a springboard for an attack on the Russian Federation.

Earlier they told us about the FRG ...

Quote: Hlavaty

Whose side are you on?

on my own, my Motherland is Russia! And the metro in Ekb is more important to me than the lies of false patriots in the CIS ...

[Nastia makarova]

that there are too many footholds for the enemies

[Overlock]

Quote: Hlavaty

that the Russian Federation just needs to leave Ukraine alone to solve the problem

your suggestions....

Quote: Hlavaty

Ukraine is a springboard for an attack on the Russian Federation. Leaving a foothold to the enemy is simply to provoke him to attack, creating favorable conditions for him.

what ass did 20 years think? Now "grab your bags the station is leaving"?
Previously, you had to think about it, but now, move over. More than one generation has grown up free from such thoughts. Our leaders did not want and do not want to talk to their own people, but you want to talk to a stranger. What can you offer Ukraine - zeroing power, our thieves, economic development at the "0" level? Do not tell my slippers, as they said in Odessa.
Forget and live in peace.

Quote: Hlavaty

Whose side are you on?

you ask the authorities

[Vadim237]

Ukraine is a country slowly but surely repeating the path of present-day Moldova, and Russia will never again be dumping into bankruptcy at its own expense.

[Hlavaty]

Quote: Overlock

your suggestions....

Are you from the SBU by any chance? Otherwise, a request to outline a plan to overthrow the existing government in Ukraine looks quite provocative ...
In general, this site is not the place to discuss tactics and strategy of special operations. Let the specialists do it. Here we can only strengthen the friendship of peoples and maintain a dialogue with those in the CIS who have not yet lost interest in communication.
Because when the dialogue ends, the weapon will speak. And before that, somehow I really do not want to bring.

[military_cat]

Quote: Hlavaty

Ukraine is a springboard for an attack on the Russian Federation.

How do you envision this offensive?

[Fan-fan]

Like this: Ukraine is a NATO member and 450 km to Moscow, this is enough for the simplest missiles - short-range missiles.

[Hlavaty]

The Tomahawk will fly in less than half an hour. The standard for the collection of district headquarters officers is 40 minutes (if nothing has changed). The headquarters won't even have time to get together. In general, from the Kharkov region, only Tomahawks cover most of the military-industrial complex of the Russian Federation (Nizhny, Samara, Voronezh, etc.)

And if only that. From the territory of Ukraine, biological weapons can be used at a safe distance from Western Europe, which creates unnecessary illusions among the Europeans.

How many saboteurs can be recruited in today's Ukraine? For a penny. And those who do not need to prepare for implementation for a long time - they may well impersonate Russians.

Well, and the ideological poison is pouring just immeasurably. What did Russian nationalists learn on the Maidan in 2014? Why did they learn this?

Those who understand what a beachhead is, there is no need to explain its meaning. Those who do not understand, look at the military history - pay attention to how fiercely they fought for bridgeheads. Not for the sake of sport, but because they knew how it could be used.

[military_cat]

Let's admit. And what will the “decision centers” do with a massive ICBM retaliatory strike?

[Hlavaty]

Are you sure he will be?
Several decades of betrayal may surprise you in the form of an inactive "dead hand".
And do not forget how brightly the Americans demonstrated their style of warfare in Iraq: a combination of massive missile strikes with massive bribery of generals. Are you sure of the integrity of the generals of the Russian Federation?
And in the incorruptibility of government officials of ALL levels? Especially considering that their families have already been relocated abroad and live mainly in NATO countries.

To what extent is the "RF state" generally ready for a real hot war? I do not mean the army, but the state machine. Maybe that is why Putin is so "delicate" in relations with Western "partners"?

[military_cat]

I think it is strange to say that national elites oppose the emergence of a NATO foothold in Ukraine and at the same time undermine the "dead hand" to please NATO. If these are different people, then what prevents those who oppose the emergence of a foothold to improve their "dead hand"?

[Hlavaty]

Quote: military_cat

it is strange to say that national elites oppose the emergence of a NATO foothold

This is really strange to say. Because there is no visible opposition to the emergence of a bridgehead. When there was a threat to the naval base in Sevastopol, then they fussed in advance and recaptured the Crimea. But Donbass was not lucky - they did not have any Russian base. Therefore, they were "suspended" in uncertainty. And you can't give up - the last allies will turn away, and they don't want to make it part of the Russian Federation - the Western "partners" will be completely offended.
I would not talk about any real confrontation in Ukraine. There is a cruel bargaining on the financial interests of various oligarchs on the part of the Russian Federation, and a systematic powerful offensive from the West, which is drawing Ukraine into its sphere of influence.
I live in Ukraine and I see only the constant squeezing out of everything Russian from all spheres of life, against the background of some alien diplomatic passions "for Minsk", which have long ceased to interest the people of Ukraine - there is too much nonsense around this.

And most importantly - who do you mean by "national elites"? Who are these people? Do they really care about state interests? Or is it the capitalists for whose homeland is where their loot is?
As I wrote above: Elite (English French élite from Latin eligo “chosen; best”). The best people in the state cannot but worry about the problems of the state. Otherwise, they are not the best, but the most cunning and unprincipled marauders.

[military_cat]

Ok, the position is clear. Therefore, in any case, an update of the nomenclature responsible for the implementation of national security policy is required, otherwise there will be no security in any form. The question is - if such a nomenclature appears, what will it care about the bridgeheads, when it is possible to restore the "dead hand", and in this case it ceases to have any meaning, where and how many bridgeheads are located, because it is still impossible to use them for an attack?

[Hlavaty]

Do you consider the "dead hand" a panacea for all ills?
It only keeps the Western "partners" from direct armed attack. And then, only for the time being.
But it does not at all keep from the cold war - sabotage, bribery, sabotage, decomposition of management personnel, corruption of the younger generation, etc. But here all the bridgeheads matter. They work out the dismemberment of the Russian Federation, which the "partners" are planning.
After the collapse of the USSR, the main task of the "partners" was and is: to prevent the possibility of the unification of the former parts of the USSR into a new state.
The same task will face the "partners" after the dismemberment of the Russian Federation. And now, on the bridgeheads, technologies are being developed to maximize the separation of peoples and people who once lived in the same country. Military conflicts, such as the one in the Donbass, can be viewed as one such technology.

"Partners" are gradually bringing the zone of military conflicts closer to Moscow, while remaining in the shadows. Today, this is a conflict between Ukraine and the Russian Federation, tomorrow, for example, the Smolensk region will remember that it was a part of the Grand Duchy of Lithuania and will begin a struggle for independence. With the full support of the West. A new foothold will appear. And now the war has moved even closer to Moscow, and there seems to be no reason to bomb the USA or Europe. The war is in fact going on, and the "dead hand" is resting as unnecessary.

That is, the "dead hand" does not in any way affect the ability of the "partners" to conduct the entire spectrum of special operations.
The USSR collapsed without any "hot" war.

[Hlavaty]

By the way, more about the bridgeheads. Fresh and clear information:

Recently, American strategic bombers flew to Ukraine and came close to the Crimea. Here's an article about it:
"" They are studying the future theater of military operations ": the Ministry of Defense notes the activation of American strategists"
https://topwar.ru/175227-izuchajut-buduschij-teatr-voennyh-dejstvij-v-minoborony-otmechajut-aktivizaciju-amerikanskih-strategov.html
They do not fly over Belarus yet. Because there is a zone of influence of the Russian Federation. And they fly over Ukraine, because there is no longer a zone of influence of the Russian Federation.

[2 Level Advisor]

the difference of 100 km with Latvia is enough without Ukraine ... so I don't see a super need for it as a springboard for missiles

[Svarog]

Quote: 2 level advisor

the difference of 100 km with Latvia is enough without Ukraine ... so I don't see a super need for it as a springboard for missiles

By the hands of the Balts, Poles and Ukrainians, the West, led by the United States, will fight ... it's obvious, and Brzezinski and Albright spoke about this in plain text ... everything is moving according to their precepts ..

[DrEng527]

Quote: Svarog

The West, led by the United States, will fight with the hands of the Balts, Poles and Ukrainians.

they should figure it out at home ...

[Hlavaty]

And who will give them? They are exactly what we need - unsettled, dilapidated, and therefore embittered. And if you do not let the anger out in your countries, then you can direct this energy outward. Towards the RF.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Hlavaty

you can direct this energy outward. Towards the RF.

do not consider Poles idiots

[Hlavaty]

I don’t think so.
But I don’t forget that this is the only country in Europe that was liquidated three times.
This is how it was necessary to get the neighbors!

[DrEng527]

Quote: Hlavaty

which was liquidated three times.

1) 3 sections were in the 18-19th century, and even in the 20th ... so only 4 ...
2) once it is reborn, it means that the people have strength ...

[Hlavaty]

You are so selectively worried only about the Poles that the question arises:
Pan Pole?

[DrEng527]

Quote: Hlavaty

You are so selectively worried only about the Poles that the question arises:
Pan Pole?

1) I'm not worried, I'm just pretty well educated ...
2) I am Russian, even more - I am a Siberian! But your question makes you think about you - are you a natik?

[Hlavaty]

You don't have to twist about me
I am an internationalist.
They just talked about Ukrainians, Poles and Balts. But for some reason you started to intercede only for the Poles.

Quote: DrEng527

do not consider Poles idiots

So it is completely obvious to you that the Ukrainians and the Balts?
And the fact that you are a Siberian does not guarantee the absence of Polish blood in you. After the uprising of 1863, the population of Siberia was noticeably replenished with exiled Poles.
Yes, and I do not remember such a nationality - a Siberian.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Hlavaty

So it is completely obvious to you that the Ukrainians and the Balts?

in general - yes! The Poles received 200 yards for development in the form of grants and cheap loans from the EU, significantly strengthened their economy, including the real one. The Ukrainians and the Balts have practically liquidated their industries and are on the path of finishing off the remnants ... There are differences, but not fundamental.

Quote: Hlavaty

I am an internationalist.

it happens... there are also more stupid slogans ... I recommend rereading the VIL "On the national pride of the Great Russians"

Quote: Hlavaty

But you intercede

do you think they need my help?

Quote: Hlavaty

Yes, and I do not remember such a nationality - a Siberian.

it's your problem... I strongly recommend reading books and understanding some of the features of the Russian mentality - why there are Pomors, Siberians, Urals ...

[your1970]

Quote: Hlavaty

with good financial and outside political support.

- and tomorrow at the rallies they will shout - HE again, all the money of the country is going somewhere ...
And the entire population will not be bothered that this money for the creation of a pro-Russian elite in Ukraine ...

[Hlavaty]

Are special operations discussed at rallies?

Quote: your1970

HE again, all the money of the country is going somewhere ...

Well, they are shouting now. And they will shout for any reason, regardless of the real state of affairs.

Quote: your1970

And the entire population will not be bothered that this money for the creation of a pro-Russian elite in Ukraine ...

If they cannot agree with their own population, then how are they going to come to terms with the population of another country?

If we are talking about confronting a powerful adversary who has invaded your zone of interests, then the answer should be at least adequate. And this is not cheap now. Because you missed the time. Twenty to thirty years ago it would have been much cheaper and easier.

[Daniil Konovalenko]

There are no even pro-Russian parties in the former CIS countries

... But they will not exist, for example, what should be promoted by a pro-Russian party in Kazakhstan, first of all, friendship between the Russian and Kazakh peoples, in other words, internationalism, and this is almost a socialist or communist party and why such a party should be supported by the Russian leadership. to offer a pro-Russian bourgeois party, absolutely nothing.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Daniil Konovalenko

And what the pro-Russian bourgeois party can offer is absolutely nothing.

from what? for example, protecting the interests of Russians by forming a diaspora and factions in parliament and regions ...

[Fan-fan]

In Russia itself, the people are not particularly protected, and you suggest the oligarchs take care of the Russians in Kazakhstan or in Ukraine? The oligarchs do not care about their people, and even less about others. The Kremlin cannot offer its people a decent life either, but the peoples of neighboring countries see it, especially since they get news not only from the first channel of TV.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Fan-Fan

In Russia itself, the people are not particularly protected, and you suggest the oligarchs take care of the Russians in Kazakhstan or in Ukraine?

why are you asking either / or? must be protected both at home and abroad ...

Quote: Fan-Fan

Oligarchs do not care about their people, and even less about others

besides the oligarchs, there are also just entrepreneurs who live at home!

Quote: Fan-Fan

The Kremlin cannot offer its people a decent life either

1) what are you all about the Kremlin then? we ourselves can’t do anything?
2) In general, the people in Russia now live well, compared with other stages of history ... I agree that I would like it better. but swelling is one thing ...

[Alekseev]

"The system has not changed"
Has not changed .... but a good system.
Everyone says that they need a system, and a good tsar and the masses of the factory, though the masses themselves do not really want the land. Bread and circuses ..
Well, that's what needs to be done to make everyone feel good, they are silent, they don't give an answer.
As for the post-Soviet republics, some of them don't need the Russian Federation as a suitcase without a handle. On a fig to bring closer to you and feed, by the way, also a dozen and a half Banderlog?
Or like them?
Pragmatic relations, and there is one way to instill inspiration - order in the country and well-being should be better than those of the "come in large numbers". This, of course, is not enough. For example, migrants don't like Geyrop all the same. But being a leader in development in all directions is the main condition for people to strive for us, and not at all the creation of pro-Russian parties, propaganda in the media, etc. are also necessary, but secondary matters.

[Overlock]

Quote: Svarog

In general, the actions of our leadership in all areas have failed .. and are focused on tactical victories, but strategic defeats.

but with thin little hands it, the leadership, clings to Belarus, not realizing that it's too late ... it's all too late. Two "zeroed" ones have zeroed everything that is possible.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Svarog

The capitalist model does not carry the idea of ​​unification .. here money and personal or private are at the head.

Any capitalist elite needs its own field of activity, its own separate fiefdom, where it can rule even to the detriment of the state. And even tiny states want to be separate, in some kind of union, but not as part of any state. Unification, be it with Russia, be it with Germany, or even with Poland, will be death for the local elite. The West understands this and does not try to unite them, all these small, not independent limitrophes are beneficial to it.

[antivirus]

They leave their historical fold and thereby weaken Russian civilization

EVERYONE COMES OUT OF THE BONE AND CAN'T LIVE THERE
after the default of 98g Kohly - RUSSIANS left for a long dollar in other countries. in the "bosom" did not remain.
a cradle is only a cradle; not peace (Russian) or a unifying system of values

[Alex Nevs]

Ideology! Not. No and nothing will happen. Simple pouring water with a colander (not entirely simple, of course), but the result is simple. Loot all ideology. Further according to Marx.

[pereselenec]

Quote: Svarog

the pro-members in quotation marks is correct.
Nothing was covered up, the system, unfortunately, did not change with the arrival of Putin. The relationship between the Slavic states continued and continues to degrade.

Nothing - Putin has voted a new constitution for himself, and now he will finally gain sovereignty and will be able to act in spite of the machinations of the State Department, which for 20 years prevented him from pursuing a smart policy towards the post-Soviet space.
So, at least, one friend from the NOD explained to me.

[Lexus]

Systemic crisis of the post-Soviet space. What to do?

What to do? What to do? Restore the Great Soviet Union!

[Svarog]

Quote: lexus

Systemic crisis of the post-Soviet space. What to do?

What to do? What to do? Restore the Great Soviet Union!

But first, restore the power of the people in their own country. It is necessary, taking into account the mistakes of the past, to return to socialism. Without this we are doomed ...

[Kart]

You are, indeed, doomed without it.
Russia will live.

[Svarog]

Quote: Carte

You are, indeed, doomed without it.
Russia will live.

What is Russia to you? Russia is a territory where Russians and other nationalities have lived for centuries. Will Russia be Russia if people die out? No, it will be just a territory .. So the population of our country is decreasing every year, a whole city dies out every year .. So, we are doomed, just ... citizens of Russia .. and you, who broadcast from the west, you will live of course .. but your descendants, there in the west will not find happiness ..

[DrEng527]

Quote: Svarog

Will Russia be Russia if people die out?

if the Russians die out, then it is not Russia ... I will note - the development of Russians in the USSR was not set as a task ...

[Svarog]

Quote: DrEng527

Quote: Svarog

Will Russia be Russia if people die out?

if the Russians die out, then it is not Russia ... I will note - the development of Russians in the USSR was not set as a task ...

However, under the USSR, the number of Russians only increased.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Svarog

However, under the USSR, the number of Russians only increased.

Where is your data from? you misinterpret them - demography has a lag - the processes of the extinction of Russians were launched under the USSR, the growth in the IVS is a consequence of the RI, but under Khrushchev, GW, collectivization and hunger, as well as the demographic transition during urbanization have already affected ...

[Svarog]

Quote: DrEng527

Quote: Svarog

However, under the USSR, the number of Russians only increased.

Where is your data from? you misinterpret them - demography has a lag - the processes of the extinction of Russians were launched under the USSR, the growth in the IVS is a consequence of the RI, but under Khrushchev, GW, collectivization and hunger, as well as the demographic transition during urbanization have already affected ...

You can check them, in the USSR everything was clearly taken into account ..
Where did your data come from? Growth under Stalin is a consequence of RI .. What can be the consequence of RI, a person born in RI, under Stalin was 40 years old, at 40 years old, at that time, children no longer gave birth .. collectivization, hunger .. -liberal mantras .. And why have you forgotten about the Second World War? The Second World War carried away over 26 mil. people .. Despite this, the population of Russia only increased .. Do you know why? Because medicine has become available to everyone, educated people have become 100% (with RI, there were 14% educated). Infant mortality has sharply decreased .. People are confident in the future. So they began to give birth.
Of course, demography has a lag, but not by 40 years, but 20-25 ..

[DrEng527]

Quote: Svarog

in the USSR everything was clearly taken into account ..

not even funny ...

Quote: Svarog

a person born in Ingushetia, under Stalin was 40 years old,

those. born in 1915 was a man 1940 years old by 40?

Quote: Svarog

at the age of 40, at that time, children no longer gave birth ..

my grandmother (1904) gave birth to T. Tom (6 children) in 1946 ... how are you superficial

Quote: Svarog

collectivization, hunger .. -liberal mantras.

you have a Russophobe in your head, no more only in 1930, 4,5 million were dispossessed, 2 million were exiled ... "According to the estimates of the historian and researcher of repression V. N. Zemskov, about 1930 thousand people died and committed suicide in kulak exile for the period from 1933-600. hunger was not the main cause of death ["
Holodomor, according to the statement, the State Duma of 2008 is 7 million victims, but you know better ...

Quote: Svarog

So they began to give birth.

My maternal grandfather has 6 children, my father has 1 ...

Quote: Svarog

, but not for 40 years, but 20-25 ..

see your chart - rapid growth BEFORE the war ... then stagnation ...

Quote: Svarog

The Second World War carried away over 26 mil. person

thanks to the brilliant leadership of the VKPB and the IVS ...

[your1970]

This was fashion, especially in Kazakhstan in the 50-60s - to take Russian names - patronymics, but there were no problems with nationality at all - what kind of passport officer you can tell and they will write ...

[tihonmarine]

Quote: DrEng527

if the Russians die out - it is not Russia ... I will note - the development of Russians in the USSR was not set as a task.

When Russia dies out, by that time not a single white person will remain on the globe.

[DrEng527]

Quote: tihonmarine

When Russia dies out, by that time not a single white person will remain on the globe.

who knows ... but the white race is dying out and faster ...

[Ingvar 72]

Quote: Carte

Russia will live

Only who will inhabit it, and within what boundaries? Didn't you think about it?

[Overlock]

Quote: Ingvar 72

Only who will inhabit it, and within what boundaries? Didn't you think about it?

asians, blacks

[Svarog]

Quote: Overlock

Quote: Ingvar 72

Only who will inhabit it, and within what boundaries? Didn't you think about it?

asians, blacks

Also the Chinese .. they will definitely settle in Siberia and the Far East ..

[Vadim237]

The Chinese will populate Australia faster than our Siberia and the Far East - because people go to live where it is warm and not to mosquito paradise and permafrost with temperature drops from minus 40 to plus 40.

[Ingvar 72]

Quote: Vadim237

because people go to live where it is warm and not to mosquito paradise and permafrost

Think small Vadik. People go where they are provided with conditions for life and work. And the wealth of Siberia is worth creating such conditions.

[your1970]

Quote: Ingvar 72

People go where they are provided with conditions for life and work. And the wealth of Siberia is worth creating such conditions.

The USSR could not - people left the North even under the USSR, and quite a lot

[Ingvar 72]

You are somehow confusing - under the Soviet Union, many cities in the North were built from scratch. The security was Moscow, and the salaries were higher. People were going there, not leaving. Only in the late 80s did the outflow begin.

[your1970]

Massive outflow - when cities began to leave, yes, in the 80s and 90s ..
But they left a lot before. My two relatives left Yamal after working there for 10 years in the 70s, and my aunt from Sakhalin after working for 7 years and earning money for a cooperative went to Saratov. They said that the bulk of them, having earned money (including for a cooperative), left there. And this 70s was

[Ingvar 72]

Nevertheless, the population of northern cities grew in the 70s, an undeniable fact.
And in Siberia, the population in the cities was mainly indigenous, and not newcomers.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Ingvar 72

Only who will inhabit it, and within what boundaries? Didn't you think about it?

Chinese.

[9 Shaft]

Communist socialism is also semi-spiritual. It is necessary to build a socially oriented state, as under socialism, to nationalize the subsoil and leading industries, about ideology, one must think, the Russian Federation is a multinational federation of peoples with different religions (from the main directions-Orthodox, Muslim ... to paganism).

[tihonmarine]

Quote: 9 Shaft

It is necessary to build a socially oriented state, as under socialism, to nationalize the subsoil and leading industries, about ideology we must think that the Russian Federation is a multinational federation of peoples with different religions

Well, you are just like Herbert Wales.

[kamarada]

Great Soviet little real. But Great Russia is real. But for this it is necessary to change the system, ideology, power, education. If you measure everything with dough, nothing will work. Loot is like a yardstick. Moreover, this system is designed to suck money out of the Russian economy.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Kamarada

If you measure everything with dough, nothing will work

But even without the dough, you can't build a new system either.

[kamarada]

I agree you need the loot But loot won't be an icon for long. It's like a trowel for a builder. It is a tool that helps build a building. And if you pray and accumulate trowels, you won't build anything.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Kamarada

It's like a trowel for a builder. It is a tool that helps build a building.

But even Vladimir Ilyich Lenin and his comrades could not pick up the power, which was "lying around" after Kerensky without dough.

[kamarada]

So it seems that there is money. In the egg-box + nationalization + natural resources. Trillions steal every year. That is, there is money if it is stolen.

[your1970]

Quote: Kamarada

So it seems that there is money. In the egg-box + nationalization + natural resources. Trillions steal every year. That is, there is money if it is stolen.

And automatically 1918 + War Communism will come ...

[Alex Nevs]

There is no fundamental foundation. Only after a small dismemberment of "internal ties" will they return to the question of ideology. There is no escape from it.

[Kronos]

The main emphasis was placed on the formation of a powerful state, upholding state interests, the revival of Russian civilization and the strengthening of the role of Russia in the international arena - There is no such emphasis as the course was, the sale of natural resources has remained.

[Grandfather]

Systemic crisis of the post-Soviet space. What to do?

an ant to attach a bolt ... what can you do ... just shoot from the "Aurora".

[kamarada]

Sell ​​EVERYTHING. And to withdraw the money there, but buy there. After all, babies and suckers are there. And let Vanya and Fedya burn firewood and eat vodka.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Kronos

There is no such emphasis as the course was, the sale of natural resources has remained.

But so far the opposite has not happened, and there is not even a hint.

[Vadim237]

"There is no such emphasis as the course was, the sale of natural resources has remained." Over the past year, Russia exported non-primary products worth 210 billion, along with weapons, and it will grow further

[gridasov]

The union can be restored in only one way - by creating in Russia the most favorable conditions for the development of the middle class.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: gridasov

The union can be restored in only one way - by creating in Russia the most favorable conditions for the development of the middle class.

Erast Garin, in the film Cain XVIII, where he played Karol, has the following words: "Everyone will be rich, except the poor."

[gridasov]

All orientate their activities in relation to the middle class!

[tihonmarine]

Quote: gridasov

All orientate their activities in relation to the middle class!

And what to do with the poor, they will still be half of the population.

[gridasov]

Poverty is not a pathology; the poor need to create conditions for productive and creative work. And the reference point for them is precisely the middle class, not the clamorous oligarchs. And of course, those who are not able to work should be supported, at least, so as not to create confrontation between people. I'm not actually saying anything new. A healthy community is built on certain principles.

[your1970]

- "- congratulations! You are admitted to the Republican Party (s)"
You just told an American anecdote about their games almost literally

[Alex Nevs]

One hundred pounds is not so.

[Uncle lee]

a state without a national image of the future

Therefore, Russia is not attractive for the outskirts. And as long as the oligarchs are in power, there will be no integration.

[9 Shaft]

Yes, it's just that everything was conceived and everything that happens was invested in one concept - the collapse of the USSR. Apparently the situation is not ripe when everyone wants!

[gridasov]

It is worth adding - an illiterate and openly anti-Russian oligarchic mass. A real oligarch first thinks about how to organize or stimulate the development and creativity of the middle class.

[nnm]

All this suggests that the population and elites of Ukraine and Belarus were not interested in the integration of their states with Russia.

And I would look at the question from the other side - how can modern Russia interest them, what can we offer instead of Western models?
- the economy? no - we are losing to the West in it;
- the system of power in the country? Yes, they are the same!
- to replace their oligarchs with our own? What's the point?
- do we have a high level of social protection of citizens, exceeding Western standards? Again, no!
- what are the unthinkable technologies? Yes Chubais from the penthouse of the Rusnano Palace laughs wildly at this ..

what then? social justice? prevalence of a man of labor over an oligarch who received wealth at a loans-for-shares auction? education worthy of our country, medicine? Well, at least something !!!
Or have we invested in relations with these countries, developed culture, joint education of students, raised and made joint their innovative enterprises? We didn’t do anything to make them want to be with us. For we ourselves, socially, economically, politically, are a weak copy of Western models, which offer our neighbors stronger originals.

[Rubi0]

So not for social justice they rush there, but for the money, for which you can buy a house in Manhattan and education and medicine. Successful people and, accordingly, the elite most of all in Russia are frightened by the fact that they can take away what they have acquired by back-breaking labor, well, or simply loot. Case law in court and tax collection is what is lacking, although the tax office with Mishustin at the head has made good progress.

[DrEng527]

Quote: nnm

And I would look at the question from the other side - how can modern Russia interest them, what can we offer instead of Western models?

a strange statement of the question - do we need integration more than they do? From what? It seems that we live no worse than in Ukraine / Belarus ...

[nnm]

That is, about the same .... then what can become an integration driver? Here you work in your place ... next to another company and the leaders are the same, and the team, and salary, and responsibilities, and so on ... but why don't you go there to work ?!
Because there is no motivation to do it. And why, for example, Ukraine or Belarus, other things being equal, should want this? I mean before the Maidan period ...

[DrEng527]

Quote: nnm

Because there is no motivation to do it.

motivation should be internal, not economic - freebie

[your1970]

,
[quote = nnm] Now you work in your place ... next to another company and the leaders are the same, and the team, and the salary, and responsibilities, and so on ... but why don't you go there to work?! [/ quote ]
[quote = DrEng527] motivation should be internal, not economic - freebie [/ quote]
Go to a neighboring organization to work as a turner just because there is a beautiful flag over the office ????

[DrEng527]

Quote: your1970

Go to a neighboring organization to work as a turner just because there is a beautiful flag over the office ???

if the concept of Homeland is not available to you - I see no reason to explain something to you - it looks like you are from Ukraine - where is the goal in itself to leave the country ...

[your1970]

Quote: DrEng527

Quote: your1970

Go to a neighboring organization to work as a turner just because there is a beautiful flag over the office ???

if the concept of Homeland is not available to you - I see no reason to explain something to you - it looks like you are from Ukraine - where is the goal in itself to leave the country ...

That is from intrinsic motivation- should all Ukrainians seek to leave the Russian Federation for Ukraine ?? Vaughn what ...
And blacks - to Africa, to their homeland ???
Strong.....
Intrinsic motivation only works when 1) it's too bad here, 2) it's good there ...
In the USSR, there were people traveling "for the fog and the smell of the taiga" - but even for them the state was forced to pay northern allowances. Otherwise, the people scattered ...

Z. Y. No, I am not from Ukraine, and I will not go anywhere else from the country.

[9 Shaft]

Russia eats up the legacy of the Union for the longest time and, having the resources, keeps afloat and a more or less "sane" president and probably not the proximity of borders with Western Europe still keep people from decent labor migration and degradation, as happened in Ukraine.

[DrEng527]

Quote: 9 Shaft

Russia eats up the legacy of the Union the longest

More asphalt roads have already been built than in the RSFSR, update the manual ...

[Overlock]

Quote: DrEng527

more asphalt roads have already been built than in the RSFSR,

and in schools and hospitals, kindergartens?

Quote: DrEng527

update the manual ..

[DrEng527]

Quote: Overlock

and in schools and hospitals, kindergartens?

prove the opposite

[Alex Nevs]

Simple. Amount? and that and people. And? Parry.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Alex Nevs

Simple. Amount? and that and people. And? Parry.

1) I did not see the tsifir ...
2) I look around - schools are being built in Ekb, hospitals (for example, a new building for IMM in Academicheskiy) and kindergartens too ... Go to "Made by us" - they constantly write about d / s and schools, including in the countryside ... so everything is not perfect, what to move ...

[Vadim237]

On September 240, more than 300 new schools across Russia opened from 2000 places to XNUMX places.

[Alex Nevs]

Why is the average temperature in the hospital? The number of closed school places in the 90s has not yet caught up and will not catch up in the near future.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Alex Nevs

Why is the average temperature in the hospital? TO

I am waiting for a number from you again - will it be? Or just a sketch?

[Alex Nevs]

Numbers will not help you, because you do not see the elementary things ... under your feet.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Alex Nevs

The numbers won't help you, because you don't see the elementary ... under your feet.

those. You don't have a number - which is what you had to prove ...

Quote: Alex Nevs

And you need to know the numbers, to be able to count them. This is done in schools.

I will say this - against my background, you are an illiterate schoolboy ...

[2 Level Advisor]

But let's suppose, tomorrow they introduced visa-free travel with the USA and the EU with the right to work, how long do you think it will take 30 percent of the Russian population abroad to work? and why? Is everything so cool with us? That is why the neighbors are looking towards Europe ..

[your1970]

Quote: 2 level advisor

But let's suppose, tomorrow they introduced visa-free travel with the USA and the EU with the right to work, how long do you think it will take 30 percent of the Russian population abroad to work? and why? Is everything so cool with us? That is why the neighbors are looking towards Europe ..

I bet that in a month, not 30% will come back, but 40% ....... from the surplus of those who have come in large numbers ...

[Vadim237]

Eats up the legacy of the Union "- All this legacy was taken away and sold back in the 90s, and now what is left is being actively changed for new in all spheres.

[darkesstcat]

But what about the great hatred of the communists? They would teach how to hang the mausoleum correctly at parades.

[rocket757]

The great country was destroyed ... figures were found.
But to collect now SOMEONE.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: rocket757

+5
The great country was destroyed ... figures were found.

Well, these "enemy figures" were helped by the whole West with comrades from overseas. And how much dough they shoved into this business, while there is not even a hint. Well, judging how much of the Union was removed, it is not enough.

[rocket757]

The topic is complex, long, and has been discussed more than once ...
One, the main reason, still cannot be singled out. It was a whole complex of internal / external, economic, political reasons!

[Alex Nevs]

All this number of reasons is united by one word - IDEOLOGY.

[rocket757]

Ideology of WHAT, WHERE, HOW?
You also can't answer that easily, and you won't be able to figure it out at once.
This topic has also been discussed more than once! The confusion is such that uh x x.

[rocket757]

Not so simple!
The fifth column is WHO?
They bite me from all sides, because I have hard questions for everyone!
To the monarchists, to the Bolsheviks, to the communists, to the liberals, to the Westernizers, to the false patriots, to the current authorities, there are so many questions to be considered !!!
What column will they add me to, as a result ??? If I'm NOT YOUR OWN for everything! as they think.
I am just a SOVIET and I NEVER BETRAYED OUR HOMELAND, I served her and our people with faith and truth, worked for her good.
I will defend anyone, if they will be erected in vain, I will praise anyone if their actions are for the good of our country and the PEOPLE!
I will not defend anyone if they do not deserve it and from them harm, trouble, our country!
Here is such a simple philosophy of life!
Now it is required to defend the Great History of the Great Country, from all who carry deceit and vain against it! This is the business of every decent person in the country.

[rocket757]

Those who are BETWEEN always get more from everyone and everything!
Eh, where ours did not disappear .... I DID NOT GONE ANYWHERE! Because behind us is the TRUTH!

[Proxodnoi]

Quote: rocket757

Those who are BETWEEN always get more from everyone and everything!
Eh, where ours did not disappear .... I DID NOT GONE ANYWHERE! Because behind us is the TRUTH!

The TRUTH is with us and God is for Russia (although he punishes us Russians often)
Such is our lot to be beaten from both sides ..
AND WE ARE FOR RUSSIA -MOTHER, we are ready to accept everything and from everyone .. That is how she lives the long-suffering Russia!

Chaliapin knew the Russian soul ..
But if you get angry, the whole world will shake ..

[Alex Nevs]

Confusion of opinions is for sure. But you can see it with the naked eye. There are TWO ideologies ... basic. The pros of one are the cons of the other. And humanity (in the sense of "Homo sapiens") only in one. In the other, there is a real "joke and parody" about humanity and, in a stupid, concrete "noodle on the fish soup" about humanity. A win in one, very important and a big loss in another. In general, this classic has long been described by the Greats.

[rocket757]

It is unlikely that many will agree with you that the ideologies are a couple and no more. They have produced enough of them and they have their supporters, opponents ...
It’s just easier for me to accept that the main thing in the world is only two definitions, but even to call them ideologies, it’s not important !!!
There is CREATION and there is DESTROY, and the rest is all particulars, only confusing the most important thing.

[Petrik66]

Sadly, again it is necessary to unite for some reason. Will the outskirts have to be raised again? WHAT FOR? The author did not say anything new, a sad statement of what everyone knows and the mossy slogan of revival through unification. You haven’t written about the Slavic brotherhood yet — a sure thing.

[Alex Nevs]

There will be a unification .. But not soon. Only passing through the complete ..oppa of everyone and everything will cause this chain reaction.

[Alex66]

We are talking about the integration of three branches of the Russian people, but we forget about the position of Russians in Russia, maybe this scares the other two branches. If they tell me that the national question in Russia has been resolved and the Russians are doing well, I will not believe, there is no smoke without fire.

[Pashhenko Nikolay]

You are right. The struggle against Great Russian chauvinism has not been canceled and it has been going on for a hundred years. It was necessary to declare war on the people, the titular nation, whose aspirations created our state. As a result, the cherished national outskirts were the first to flee in different directions. after a time of relative stability, everything will continue in the same spirit. Unless the world outlook is fundamentally changed at the top, the country's disintegration will continue.

[tatra]

The enemies of the communists who seized the republics of the USSR hate both the communists and their supporters, as well as each other, and just as they unleashed "hot" and information wars against the communists and their supporters for 70 years under Soviet power, they did 30 years after their seizure of the republics of the USSR unleash "hot" and information wars against each other, and they and their adored anti-Soviet West after the destruction of the USSR proved that anti-Sovietism is always equal to Russophobia, they hate any Russia, with any government, and any social system.

[Alexey Sommer]

ca
what do you suggest?

[Tank hard]

Quote: Alexey Sommer

what do you suggest?

Yes, the Tatra cannot offer anything, except for slogans and chants about the enemies of the communists, once they shouted (Xia ??) to the point that the Russians are also enemies of the communists. Don't take it seriously.

[Alexey Sommer]

This is some kind of holiday today. Article by article straight to the point.
1. What is "Elite"? Elite (English fr. Élite from Lat. Eligo "chosen; best") in sociology and political science - a set of people holding high leadership positions in the government, the union of states.
I disagree. Well, our rulers, who keep money in the West, bring up their children there, are not like our elite. This is "THEIR" elite.
A more correct question is whose is this elite?) The answer is already there, above.
A more correct definition of the Elite is a part of society capable of creating new values ​​.. Not material in the first place ..
What values ​​can they create? .. This is a rhetorical question.
Further. As they say in the second ..
And what can we, the state of Russia, offer Ukraine and Belarus, besides Ur of patriotism and the cult of theft on a national scale? ..
Maybe we offer them a flight to Mars? Or offer a 50-year pension? Or free and high-quality medicine?
What can we "the state of Russia" offer as a platform for unification?
Tell someone !?

[Alex Nevs]

What platform? There is no foundation. But. He will. Not soon the truth.

[Daniil Konovalenko]

In all the above-mentioned republics, including Russia, consumer societies have been created ... Dunno on the Moon, everyone has read it, but no one has drawn any conclusions.

we need social and political ideas and meanings aimed at the integration of countries and peoples.

.... Yes, they were already in October 1917, they have not lost their relevance today. But they were so discredited that in the near future it is not possible to return to them. Yes, nationalism, in every place, is in full swing, on the territory of the former USSR.

[iouris]

Don't worry: someone is mastering the space. What else can you do with "space"? It is strange that this someone is invisible to the analyst's eye armed with special tools.

[7,62x54]

It has been a long time since Swan Lake has been on TV.

[Knell wardenheart]

In my opinion, you have too much theorists and delving into history. The issue of integration and return is simple.
There are two ways - political and economic. Political - we are again returning to the mistakes of the "Warsaw Pact" - we gather around ourselves at the expense of our resources a bunch of hangers-on of varying degrees of utility, tearing them away from our own development and interests of our citizens, without investing these funds in improving welfare, modernization, science, education, medicine etc. The result is also known - the hangers-on will be with us as long as we have these very resources to maintain a certain economic, political and propaganda concept that keeps the natural and unnatural turbulence and desires of the elites of these states from securing benefits for such countries that are contrary to bloc interests. This construct is beautiful (from the point of view of a megalomaniac) and just as vicious - its usefulness is relative, its medium-long-term results are destructive.

In contrast to this concept, there is the phenomenon of economic integration - we hammer the bolt on all these "allies", on the ostentatious loyalty of their elites - and are engaged in the development of our own country and the potential of neighboring regions. Organization, organization and more organization. If we do everything right, we will gradually become that vacuum cleaner, which naturally attracts all the best and most useful that is in these states - minds, resources, we become a cultural and economic beacon. They themselves will be FORCED to come to us and talk to us on our terms, they will be forced to fit into unions according to our patterns. To do this, we need to end this feeding with cheap resources - our neighbors are our competitors. Their industry is a competitor to our industry. Their guest workers and citizens of Zrobitch are those who bring down the price of the cost of wages in our country.
If we really want a strong and organic union with our neighbors, we must stop creating favorable conditions for them and start competing with them. To put them before a choice - either the elites of these states are preparing to surrender unconditionally and integrate into our new system - or their state will become impoverished, the loss of social stability and the emigration of the best minds to us.

It may sound rather cruel, but the whole world existing outside the former Soviet cage is built on the element of competition and profit. However, in order to do all this, we need to deal with our own country for 20 years - laws, small and medium-sized businesses, long-term programs and economic reform.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Knell Wardenheart

We hammer the bolt on all these "allies", on the ostentatious loyalty of their elites - and we are engaged in the development of our own country and the potential of neighboring regions. ABOUT

exactly! and rob them like the USA does! for this, the United States is respected ...

[Knell wardenheart]

Any construction of any state is based on Robbery and / or Deception and / or Violence. In certain, verified proportions and to a certain extent, depending on the degree of tolerance of the population (in turn, depending on faith, traditions, culture), the size of the state and its cultural and national fragmentation.

The only difference is in changing the slider of these proportions and the question of whether the state is robbed and exploited by its own people or others (by similar methods) - a kind of dilemma-sadist or masochist :-)

Our state has historically preferred a masochistic bias of activity, within which preference was given (until the 20th century), as a rule, to the instruments of Violence and Deception. During the 20th century, we accelerated our successes, to a heap, also by Robbery (of our own population) - as well as some growth in expansionist tendencies - which caused many of our successes.

What is now commonly called the "Collective West" - focused more on the tools of Robbery and Violence oriented outward - over time, slightly reducing the pressure with Violence and slightly increasing the Deception slider (and at the moment this is their main lever). And he oriented such activities primarily outside - preferring to plunder distant territories.

With the collapse of the system of colonialism (de jure), it thus became clear that its own population is rich and educated enough to use only one instrument of Deception to support the state structure of Western countries.
In our case, there is not enough internal resources (already for quite a long time and systematically plundered) for such a counter - this is why at the moment our scheme is experiencing the need for additional use of the levers of Violence and Robbery to maintain its own stability.

A more competent distribution of these proportions and directions in the formation of foreign policy is a matter of the survival and development of our own state. You have to understand that resources NEVER come from nowhere. Always someone takes them away from someone. This is the law of conservation of matter.

[Alex Nevs]

Way One. Economy cannot be separated from politics. No way.

[Knell wardenheart]

Here, it's funny, but in our case, we also need to clarify that this POLITICS comes from the interests of the economy, and not the economy, from the interests of politics. Otherwise, we will again try to make someone happy somewhere, far away ..

[Alex Nevs]

Politics and Economics are ONE. Each depends on the other. Only dependence and fluctuates more in one direction or the other. And as soon as the scales begin to tilt strongly - crisis = imbalance (revolution, inflation). And now they are trying to "balance", but it is going hard and ... bad in one and good in another ..

[Terrible GMO]

Systemic crisis of the post-Soviet space. What to do?

Stop supporting the kings who are crazy about power.
Stop considering all the surrounding countries as their fiefdom and lost souls that need to be returned back. Tanks if necessary.
Establish order in your own country.

But nobody will go for it. So that It remains only to talk about the ubiquitous hand of Washington, Berlin and Warsaw and their intrigues.

[Gloomy skeptic]

Ever since people invented the army - all the lost lands can always be returned with its help - everything else is an empty shaking of air !!!

[Overlock]

Quote: Grim Skeptic

Ever since people invented the army, all lost lands can always be returned with its help.

Hitler also thought there, capturing the Sudetenland and Austria. Are you a fan?

[Gloomy skeptic]

I don't care what your friend was thinking, but not a single territory of the Russian state fell from the sky like manna from heaven. All newly acquired parts were conquered in one way or another. Although tolerators think differently, this is their right.

[apro]

The crisis? I don’t think. It’s just that everyone returned to their original state. By February 1917. And today national and financial interests are more important than integration ones. Besides, Russia today is not any leader. And it is also dependent. And there is no sense in any kind of unification.

[Nevolnik]

I saw the map of the USSR and straight nostalgia .. We did not grieve and were proud of the country!
It was both shallow and good, but the common people lived socially protected and felt calm in their souls, even with children for their future ..
Now we live one day and fear for the future .. Even those who have money, but there are very few of them left ... Capitalism and freedom, damn it all took away and returned to us the unbreakable Union
It's time to unite again differently ..

[Ronald Reagan]

Serfs need a landlord?

[solzh]

Quote: Ronald Reagan

Serfs need a landlord?

Will you be Russophobes?

[Ronald Reagan]

No, I will not. Learn to digest the meaning of what you read.

[Vadim237]

"Now we live in one day" - Only fools live in one day.

[solzh]

Quote: Nevolnik

It's time to unite

It's time. But the common people understand and want this. Politicians think differently and will not allow unification, because they are afraid to lose their power and privileges.

[Ronald Reagan]

What kind of "common people" in your understanding? What unites them?

[nnm]

Quote: Rubi0

Case law in court and tax collection is what's missing

Are you sure that now we would have formed the correct precedents? And one should not forget that there is a principle of unity of judicial practice, which is essentially the same thing. And in countries with case law, there are procedures to change them.

[DrEng527]

Common words and good wishes I am glad that the author no longer wants integration with Central Asia ...
Or maybe leave them - let them drink their cup?
"a revival of Russian self-identification is necessary in Ukraine and Belarus"
this is not done properly in Russia either ...
"This will hardly be achieved without creating an attractive image of Russia's future."
in translation - hang a carrot? And again to finance their existence? Or maybe they will spit and develop Russia for themselves? So they gave Yanukovych 3 yards, now Old Man is 1.5 ... 600 yards in ZV reserves, but there is no money for the construction of a metro in Ekb ... and the people are in traffic jams ...
"we need social and political ideas and meanings aimed at integrating countries and peoples."
read out the list ...

[Herman 4223]

Do you want social ideas? In our country, ideas for the state are prohibited by the main law, and the ZV reserve is managed by the central bank, which is not subordinate to the government of the Russian Federation or anyone else on the territory of the Russian Federation.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Herman 4223

We have ideas for the state prohibited by the basic law,

"Article 7
1. The Russian Federation is a social state, the policy of which is aimed at creating conditions that ensure a decent life and free human development. "
enlighten yourself, if this is not an idea, then what?

[Herman 4223]

This is the structure of the state, the device.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Herman 4223

social ideas?

Quote: DrEng527

welfare state, whose policy is aimed at creating conditions ensuring a decent life and free development of man

do you understand the written badly?

[Herman 4223]

An idea is your ideas for the future, something that sets development goals. And what you write about this device description, it essentially means that the state has social obligations.

[DrEng527]

Quote: Herman 4223

your ideas for the future, something that sets development goals. AND

Quote: Herman 4223

states have social obligations.

this is the idea and the goal ... another is not necessary ...

[g1washntwn]

The state is WE, and liberalism is I. Therefore, I agree, to drive us to an uninhabited American island. Democracy is the same propaganda cliché as the rule of the people. We are on a ship from which there is no escape (until interstellar flights are implemented). So it is with the Motherland. No Motherland - all 4 sides are available. But if you came on board, then if you please row where and that's all. In this case, the captain at the helm must be alone. But he must steer so that the team does not die of hunger and scurvy, otherwise - there, overboard. If the cook steals - the core to the feet or on the yard. A rigid hierarchy and verticals of power are the basis of the entire nature management, everything else is the Brownian motion of molecules. Ideology is that magnetic field that orders the movement of electrons in the head. Therefore, I agree here too - without a clear position and vision of the future, swinging the oars on the gallery is somehow unpleasant. Perhaps the time has not yet come, but as the saying goes, "You can't see communism from here," but you want to see at least a candle at the end of the tunnel.
As for the neighbors, the economy and welfare are the result of social state ideology, so the soul is primary, food for the body is after. Accession is not an end in itself, it should also be a result. Therefore, the third plus.

[Country Councils]

Strange ... The author does not seem to know that in 1991 a coup d'etat and Gorbachev's betrayal took place and the country has been ruled by the Zhidosaks since then https://mmanificarum.blogspot.com/p/blog-page_85.html. But the point is that the decisions of this creature will be canceled with all the consequences https://mmanificarum.blogspot.com/2020/09/blog-post_11.html

[Herman 4223]

Illegal decisions can always be reversed by law

[kamarada]

Only not controlled but plundered

[GREG68]

I think that over time, and especially in the event of a major military mess (God forbid, of course), many of our former Soviet republics will be asked to return under our wing. They will not be able to resist and survive alone. IMHO.

[avia12005]

After they put an end to the final separation of the former Soviet republics from the Russian Federation, they will take on it itself. Whoever does not understand this is either a traitor.

[Pravodel]

Good article. Correct raises questions. Some continuation.
1. The need for state ideology
Hegel said: the idea rules the world ... The idea of ​​communism, then socialism, perfectly coped with the economic line of building a strong independent state until 1953, before Stalin's death. After the death of the leader of the peoples, a struggle for power began, which ended in the victory of Khrushchev, who needed a political rationale to strengthen his own power. As a result, criticism of the personality cult of Stalin began with the subsequent destruction of the idea that was at the foundation of the state. In the wake of the destruction of the idea of ​​the state, the decay of the elites began, predetermining the final collapse of the state, the collapse and disintegration of the USSR.
Hence, no strong state can exist without an idea, which, in turn, forms an ideology - a system of views on the state, society, and personality. In this sense, ideology is the core that holds the state itself together. A strong, affirming idea, ideology, contribute to the flourishing of the state, a weak idea, ideology - decay and subsequent disintegration.
Our enemies, enemies of Russia, its people are directing all efforts to ensure that Russia does not have, does not exist, any idea, ideology, does not exist that holds the Russian people into a single whole, allows it to exist as a monolithic force that defends itself, own state, Fatherland from internal and external enemies.
In this sense, "People-State-Fatherland" is the idea and slogan of every patriot of Russia: a strong state, a united people, a prosperous Fatherland for centuries, which cannot be broken by internal and external enemies.
2. Management by state elites
The second main danger of any state is the betrayal of the elites. Russia never at any time could be overcome by external and internal enemies, if the people of Russia and the elites of Russia were united and united by a single goal: the prosperity of Russia. And every time, as soon as the elites of Russia separated from Russia and the people of Russia, from its goals and objectives of Russia, betrayed its interests, Russia disintegrated. So it was in the 1917th century, when Russia, torn apart by the struggle of the appanage princes, fell under the onslaught of the Mongols; in the 90th century, when the betrayal of the boyars and the principality led to unrest, and Russia, Russia almost ceased to exist as a result of the Polish invasion; twice in the XX century: in XNUMX and the XNUMXs, when the collapse of the Russian Empire, and then the USSR was caused by the decomposition and betrayal of the elites, in the first case by Freemasonry, Westernism, deeply crawling into the upper floors of state power, in the second - decomposition and corruption of the party-bureaucratic apparatus of the USSR.
The belonging of the elite of Russia to Russia itself is the most fundamental for Russia: either the elite is nationally oriented and works for Russia, for its people, contributes to the prosperity of Russia and the Fatherland, or the comprador elite is an element alien to Russia that controls Russia in the interests of foreign capital, in the interests of the West. Most importantly, is the elite working for Russia or against it !?
Elite identity is closely linked to corruption. If before the XIX century. this question was not so acute, then from the XNUMXth century. and in the present, the issue of combating corruption is of fundamental importance for Russia, since thieves hide from the state with the people of Russia in the west, from where, relying on the loot, they throw mud at Russia and wage an open struggle against Russia. In this sense, theft and bribery are extremely beneficial to the West, because on the one hand, they contribute to the robbery of Russia, the withdrawal of capital and national wealth, and on the other hand, inside Russia they create a breeding ground for the formation of a fifth column capable of rushing to tear Russia to pieces at the slightest opportunity. Hence, the task of Russia and the state is the maximum purge of the Russian elite from bribe-takers, embezzlers, from all those for whom Russia is only a feeding trough, ensuring their rotten existence. And there has already been an example in Russia. I. Grozny, relying on the oprichin, cleansed Russia of parochialism. Stalin, before the war, cleared the top of the fifth column, which made it possible to win the war and not surrender, not put the country under the Nazis.
Of course, now such drastic measures as under I. Grozny or under Stalin are not applicable, but the state must, at all levels, clean out the embezzlers and bribe-takers with a hot iron with a hot iron - a potential fifth column, an internal enemy working for our external enemies.
3. Education of the people
The upbringing of the people is the most difficult, but at the same time the most rewarding task of the state. Look at Ukraine, where for some 25 years they were able to raise an anti-Russian person. In this regard, Russia, having developed its own idea, ideology and relying on them, can also successfully form a person-citizen for whom Russia is not a feeding trough, but a mother, Fatherland, which he protects and promotes his prosperity with all his might.

[Campanella]

The key question is who will solve all these problems in Russia and when?

[Herman 4223]

Everything is true and that is why ideology for our state is prohibited by the basic law. And then what else we will begin to develop.

[kamarada]

Russians were abandoned and betrayed everywhere. Moreover, Russian even in Russia did not create conditions for prosperity. Russian youth dreams of going anywhere.

[U-58]

So, the author has once again confirmed that the world is ruled by money.
Lust for money. Thirst for profit. The aspirations of all the elites listed, in a simple way, are to cut the dough. As much as possible and as lightly as possible.
Loot gives power, and power makes it possible to get even more loot.
What to do?
The answer is essentially one.
Develop the economy.
But not the economy of selling resources and cutting coupons from "second oil" - the people. To develop the entire economic complex - resources, machine tool building, the entire range of machine building.
And to realize this, science, education.
Being strong isn't easy.
Yes, you have to teach well. And it's free. Yes, talented youth must be paid for.
Yes, it is categorically necessary to invest in the development of industries, but not to put money in a box, especially foreign money.
But ... there are no such ideas. More precisely, ideas are and are being broadcast by the guarantor and his inner circle with enviable regularity.
But that's all ...
And no matter how much you say "halva", your mouth will not become sweeter.
And yet, if instead of declarations to go this way, Russia will become strong.
The weak always strives to lean against the strong. Be it Uzbekistan, be it Bulgaria.
How many satellites the States have! Because the strong ..
And further. The dominant idea of ​​getting rich in any way, even criminal, must be suppressed at all levels. Just ban it.
Enough, we ate the ideas of Western freedom, prosperity at the expense of our neighbor.
You should love your neighbor, but you should not ruffle him at every step, not rip him off like a sticky one.

[Tank hard]

Simple question. Why are they to Russia? Donating billions? But is it probably better to just distribute it to your citizens? They gave 3 billion to Ukraine, so what? They are still suing. The banks are not visible. They charged Luka with 1.5 billion, so what? And Luka signed a document that Belarus is now part of the Russian Federation. those. a real union state and not a declaration on this score? I have not heard or seen this, the money will already go away. How will Tikhanovskaya or some other "leader" take the helm of the Republic of Belarus? Will they return the money? Tikhanovskaya answered unequivocally that no. Citizens of the former republics of the USSR have already filled the territory of the Russian Federation. Take Kyrgyzstan for example, it feels like most of the citizens outside the republic, especially in the Russian Federation. Do you really need Georgia and Lithuania as part of the Russian Federation? Aren't you masochists by any chance?

[Asad]

And why did they miss Kazakhstan? Also interesting things are happening.

[Herman 4223]

The answer is simple, the exit is the same as the entrance. Cancellation of illegal decisions of 1991, restoration of public authorities and legal borders of our country.

[solzh]

If everything was so simple ...

[Maks1995]

There are many words, the meaning is not the same.
Remember what consciousness determines?

No real economic growth in Russia, no trade - no integration !!
(For some reason, China in the sense of integration, rushing leisurely forward, and rushing)
Nobody will share Gazprom's shares with Belarusians, not enough.

But for many in interviews it slips that many, including from the Russian oligarchs, are feeding the nationalists. To protect interests.

What kind of integration is there ...

[Tank hard]

Quote: Max1995

For some reason, China in the sense of integration, rushing leisurely forward, and rushing

And who is integrating with China?

[evgen1221]

Central Asia is not at all averse, so details on capital will be lost and rushed to where the food is closer and sweeter.

[Tank hard]

Quote: evgen1221

Central Asia is very not averse, so details on capital will be lost and rushed to where the food is closer and sweeter

Where does this information come from? I was born there (Central Asia, Kyrgyz SSR) and in my memory none of the Kyrgyz and Kazakhs was eager to integrate into China. But people like you always know better.

[evgen1221]

Do you speak for yourself or for local business and political elites?

[Tank hard]

You know absolutely nothing either about China or about Central Asia, but you are trying to tell something about their relationship. Dialogue with you is meaningless.

[Maks1995]

Hong Kong, Taiwan, if you don't take Central Asian ones.
Taiwan is, like, an adversary, but people go back and forth, laws, they wrote, they slowly adjust, there are agreements on investigations and extradition of criminals.
And trade with the economy ...

[Captivity]

[quote] Ideologically, Ukraine and Belarus were also fundamentally different. In Ukraine, since the middle of the XNUMXth century, the Poles have cultivated the national idea of ​​building an independent Ukrainian state, based on local Galician nationalism, which does not recognize the Russian roots of the population of Ukraine / quote

The author is not aware that there was no Poland in the 19th century. Was Galicia a part of Austria-Hungary?

[evgen1221]

And in practice, the country 404 has always been viewed by the Poles and Europe as a nearby food base of the colony, with all actions aimed at achieving this. In the modern world, 404 is more needed by the states as an irritant and a platform for deployment, and Europe as a supplier of slaves free by their standards.

[nikvic46]

Recently listened to the comments of a 12 year old boy. “Now all the houses are decorated. And all the old houses are gray.” Forgive the fact that a boy at this age thinks so primitively. In our country, adults do not give out that. We will make colorful houses, shiny shop windows, and we think that we have become attractive. We admired the natural beauty even at a younger age. And boys are taught to showcase. I read, "Soon there will be sculptures on all the streets ..." An empty wall was painted in front of my house At home. It's very bad. And the sculptures will be of the same quality. And the greenery in the city is slowly being removed. Something is cut out, something is simply broken.

[Trilobite Master]

The author has piled up all sorts of different things ... Azhno the jug is bursting.
But in fact, everything is simple.
Under capitalism, integration, that is, merging, is possible only through absorption, when some capitalists devour others. The result is always the same - a change of owners. Need to explain why?
Those who do not have the ability to devour others can only choose who to be devoured.
The capitalist world, with the exception of Russia, by and large agreed that it was the United States that would eat them, and not someone else. For a quarter of a century, Belarus, through the efforts of Batka (honor and praise for this), twisted its backwards, managing not to decide on the question of who would eat them - Russian capitalists or American. Now, apparently, the time has come to be determined, Old Man passed, there is no replacement.
With nationalism, the Ukrainians and Belarusians tried to hide behind, first of all, from the Russian capitalists, who climbed to them with their money. The example of Ukraine shows what this leads to - nationalist ideology, like any ideology in general, is just a handful of rose petals, which are necessary only when it is necessary to cover up the stinking rot in the house, and not some kind of protection from anything.
Russia and the United States differ from each other only in the size of the mouth and the length of the teeth in it, and nothing more. And why the author thinks that the gastric juice of the Russian capital will be more pleasant for Belarusians than the American one is not clear to me.

[evgen1221]

Quite rightly they said: Whoever offers sweeter food, everyone, without exception, falls under that, and we partly also rush between the Chinese west and our ambitions (which are no longer strong enough to realize) .In my opinion, they will not take up the moral education of society seriously, and its population, the country, little good shines.

[Tank hard]

Quote: evgen1221

we partly also rush between the Chinese west and our ambitions

Let's speak not for everyone, but for ourselves. If you are rushing about, then I am not. Don't assign your desires to others.

[Trilobite Master]

Quote: evgen1221

until they engage in moral education of society

Moral principles are formed by the necessity of this or that behavior in certain economic conditions. Roughly speaking, "to live with wolves - howl like a wolf." Education won't help. If you want to change people, change the system of economic relations between them. Then people will change themselves. There is no other way.

[Azis]

It is the "Russian" capital that scares them - many people still remember the redistribution of property from the 90s. And the current "Russian" capitalists, in addition to the criminal, also have an administrative and political lobby at a fairly high level.

[Tank hard]

Quote: Azis

It is the "Russian" capital that scares them - many people still remember the redistribution of property from the 90s. And the current "Russian" capitalists, in addition to the criminal, also have an administrative and political lobby at a fairly high level.

As if in Kazakhstan, Azerbaijan, Kyrgyzstan and others, capital somehow differs from Russian, well, with the exception of some national characteristics. In general, I am amused by the assessment of "Russian" capital from a user named Aziz.

[evgen1221]

A systemic crisis in the capacity of leadership in the republics and in our country too. The rest are consequences. In Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan, Azerbaijan has arranged their life well and the population has and multiplied what got the fervor. In all other outskirts, the deriban prevailed, and partly because of us Russians as setting an example and trend of the season, as well as where our influence and numbers were great. So I suggest that you first of all take care of yourself, the outskirts will reach for the strong and rich. You have to get used to living for your country and not to satisfy the great-power ambitions and all sorts of petty czars, one figs all these flirting ended with the introduction of our soldiers and the disbandment of the countries of mistakes. We always obey Europe, we feed the Papuans and our people and territory are in eternal desolation. ENOUGH !!!!

[Tank hard]

Quote: evgen1221

In Uzbekistan and Of Turkmenistan Azerbaijanis have arranged their life well and the population has and multiplied what they got the fervor.

This post speaks of your complete ignorance of the situation. But you keep talking nonsense with a smart look.

[Azis]

It is necessary to beat the enemy with his own weapon - apply for joining NATO, EU, other excrement (although there is already the Russian Federation - Sb UN, IMF, IK, WTO, OIS, MOM, G-20, Ce, Pase, OSCE ... ). Break their strategy. And then bother them for years and destroy them from the inside. Rogozin went there, he did not have time for three years, 2008-2010. It's bad that you have to pay the fees ...

[Tank hard]

Quote: Azis

apply to join nato

Already asked, refused. You are poorly informed.

[demo]

Pleased with the presentation of the material.
The topic is not simple.
But the author chewed like little children.
And put it on the shelves.
The Bible is straightforward, for elementary grades.

I was especially pleased with the definition of the place and role of GDP.
Arbitrator.
The head of state cannot be an arbiter. It's not teams playing football here.
Here is the state.
And if in a state two, three, four or more teams with very great capabilities fight among themselves from year to year, then such a state will eventually perish.
And an arbitrator, by definition, is an independent and unbiased judge.
Who got money for his work and went home.
He does not need to develop football or hockey.
He needs to monitor compliance with the laws of the game.
If the author sees this as the purpose of the VVP's stay in power, then one can only sympathize with our fate.

It is precisely that Russia does not have a life-affirming goal, because it does not have any ideology, because such a policy is carried out by the "arbiter" and his pocket party, and there is a spiritual rejection from the fraternal republics.
Brothers are not so bad and selfish.
How we got in the wrong place.
And neither those "judge" us.
The author is you hokmach!

[APASUS]

Our oligarchs are flesh of flesh Western scammers (remember the American aid to Russia, how we were stripped in the 90s, under the pretext of building democracy) That is why the fear of integration among the former republics is fully justified, OUR CANNOT OFFER AN IDEAL MODEL! And the West offers, let it not keep its promises, but promises to everyone, to the left and to the right!

[hermit]

The Soviet Union was not destroyed in order to create something better in its place. So everything that happens is natural.

[KMS]

Quote: hermit

The Soviet Union was not destroyed in order to create something better in its place. So everything that happens is natural.

Well, don't tell me who was breaking up the USSR, basically they already sit out and shake abroad, no matter how they are attracted ...
Russia has such a property, first to plunge into the abyss of turmoil and devastation and then revive, even stronger and more powerful .. Now we seem to be observing such a process and it does not matter who is in power. This is just a historical pattern
We are still far from the USSR and the Russian Empire, but there are already some revival trends.

[hermit]

Blessed is he who believes, warmth in the world.

[pereselenec]

Only the promotion and implementation of new socio-political and economic models of the development of society, aimed at strengthening the state and increasing the well-being of the population, can stop the disintegration and degradation of the post-Soviet space.

This is an article of the Criminal Code about calls for a change in the constitutional order.

[Old Orc]

no requirements for violent change means everything is fine.

[Old Orc]

the reason for the run is simple. local wolves-oligarchs who themselves shear their rams- people see how the wolves of a neighboring country, after the division of their rams, begin to pay attention to their rams. Neighborly wolves of mothers and rams they have more and oil and gas are. so the wolves decide to go under other neighbors. they also want their rams, but they are far away, and suddenly something will fall on them, because after the arrival of nearby wolves, even the local wolves will only have wool. they know it for sure because they are from the same litter they are the same.

[immobile2008]

Quote: your1970

Quote: nikvic46

I would say that they ate us.

There were books, furniture and clocks that were in short supply here, which nobody needed ...

Well, in 1990 I sent my aunt from the army (!!!!) a package of sweets, condensed milk, washing powder and soap to Moscow !!!

True truth! It was not even worse in Moscow

[Jaromir]

Quote: imobile2008

in fact, Comrade Stalin with this speech "took away" the Russian language and paved the way for nationalism in the republics.

Based on what do you make this conclusion?

[Valery Nikolayevich]

How to stop the removal of republics from Russia? It's very simple: to change the power and system in the Russian Federation, i.e. those obstacles that resulted in the destruction of the state. It is not the republics that are leaving Russia, but Russia, thanks to the existing regime, is leaving them!

[frolsa]

Cool analysis. Without considering the real and promising socio-economic systems of states. Boldly, new.

[Alexander Ivanov_8]

Belarus is not moving away by itself. She is repulsed. What normal ruler wants for his people a life like in Russia

[Sychev Vitalii]

change the national leader, because the only problem is in him ...

[79532401087]

In Russia there is capitalism, and not an attractive one. Capitalism has one goal - to rob. All former republics see perfectly well how Russian capitalism robs its people. Russian capitalism is special. He doesn't just rob, he slowly kills his people. All former republics do not want to become sheep, which the current
Russia will "cut" and "skin"