Military Review

"From the elite to the outsider." Military Watch explains why Pakistani T-80s will be forgotten

34

The armed forces of Pakistan today are equipped with one of the most powerful tank "Kulaks" in the world. At the same time, the overwhelming number of MBTs is represented by Chinese products, such as Type 59 and Type 69, or platforms jointly developed with the PRC, among which Al Khalid is the most famous.


Tank elite


However, according to the Military Watch (USA), the most privileged position in tank units is occupied by a representative of Soviet engineering:

The T-80 is currently the elite of [Pakistan's] armored units.

As indicated by Military Watch, this vehicle is the most efficient tank of the Cold War period. The T-80 is "a heavier and more deadly analogue of the T-72 and T-90A", although the high requirements for its maintenance and operating costs led to the fact that after the collapse of the USSR, Russia chose to rely on lighter products, namely by choosing for the rearmament of the T-90 army, which remains in production to this day.

Despite the Russian experience, Pakistan acquired about 320 T-80s from Ukraine.

These tanks were noticeably heavier and, in general, much more efficient than the T-72, which made up the bulk of the armored divisions of neighboring India.

- writes Military Watch.



On the way to the "outsiders"


Today, the newest modification of the T-80 is the T-80BVM version [samples of this type are supplied to the RF Armed Forces]. However, Pakistani vehicles did not undergo modernization after their purchase, and therefore are already considered "outsiders" in comparison with the new Indian T-90MS platforms, "which demanded technologies ahead of [the T-80 filling] for several decades ahead."

According to the publication, "Russia is unlikely to want to supply a modernization package for tanks [apparently in connection with the focus on the Indian market], and the less extensive defense sector of Ukraine is ineffective for this task."

The T-80 in service with [Islamabad] will be forgotten in the future, as there are more combat-ready tank designs, such as the VT-4, which Pakistan is currently considering acquiring from China.

- concludes Military Watch.

Recall that at the moment the most advanced modification of the T-80 is the T-80BVM version developed in Russia. At the current stage, vehicles of this type are supplied to the RF Armed Forces in relatively small batches. Initially, it was argued that the T-90BVM tanks, maximally unified with the T-80, were primarily intended for operation in theaters with low temperatures.

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  1. rocket757
    rocket757 11 September 2020 09: 39 New
    +8
    Without upgrading, any vehicle rolls back in its performance characteristics. This is a natural total.
    1. Shurik70
      Shurik70 11 September 2020 09: 54 New
      12
      If Pakistan pays, Russia will modernize its tanks.
      Russia is a supporter of peace. And if possible, it will help keep the peace. And in India there are already very impulsive generals, and if they are sure of the victory of the "little war with Pakistan", they will attack.
      And in Pakistan, Russia's influence must be increased. At least in order to burn out stop functioning of terrorist training camps.
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 11 September 2020 10: 30 New
        +2
        Simple, hard choice ... either politics or business.
        If you mix, the dregs will turn out.
        1. Shurik70
          Shurik70 11 September 2020 10: 43 New
          +2
          Quote: rocket757
          Simple, hard choice ... either politics or business.
          If you mix, the dregs will turn out.

          Any problem must be addressed in a comprehensive manner.
          Politics without a good economy - the country will collapse, the USSR is an example of this, where the people are tired of the eternal deficit and joyfully welcomed the changes, poorly understanding what they will lead to.
          An economy without politics and long-range strategy - such a country will be devoured. Any war is an example of someone's wrong policy.
          1. rocket757
            rocket757 11 September 2020 10: 56 New
            +2
            To get a good mix / cocktail, you need not mutils, but PROFESSIONALS who are responsible for their work!
            At the expense of our "bartender" everything is very different ...
      2. Boris Chernikov
        Boris Chernikov 14 September 2020 20: 22 New
        -1
        hardly .. what to choose: 1 tanks for India or a couple of hundred for Pakistan?
    2. businessv
      businessv 12 September 2020 20: 15 New
      +1
      Quote: rocket757
      Without upgrading, any vehicle rolls back in its performance characteristics.
      But the video was impressive! good
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 12 September 2020 21: 12 New
        0
        The question is not what we cannot do ... WE CAN!
        But this is very serious money and the state is in no hurry or cannot split into such a thing. However, everyone has a financial question and has always become an obstacle to achieving perfection and a sufficient amount of perfect. Alas, alas.
  2. Mavrikiy
    Mavrikiy 11 September 2020 09: 43 New
    +2
    According to the publication, "Russia is unlikely to want to supply a modernization package for tanks [apparently due to its focus on the Indian market], and Ukraine's less extensive defense sector is ineffective for this task."
    fool Without me, they married me. It's just that Pakistan ", which has all its money - a vacuum cleaner .... Will offer to throw out the T-80 and buy" the best Chinese G in the world. "And we are happy to modernize ...
    1. PSih2097
      PSih2097 11 September 2020 09: 58 New
      +2
      Quote: Mavrikiy
      Without me, I got married.

      Well this is "just business, nothing personal", before Pakistan was bought from the states ... about modernization, not only OmskTransMash can participate, Israel itself has experience in modernizing captured Soviet equipment.
    2. Fibrizio
      Fibrizio 11 September 2020 15: 45 New
      -2
      China has long since moved away from the "Chinese consumer goods" stereotype. Yes, maybe somewhere they are lagging behind, but for example, Chinese electronics have been on an equal footing with Europe for a long time. The one that is firm, of course. For example, the xiaomi brand is generally super quality.
      So their tanks are normal.

      And the Pakistanis need modernization in Israel, if they do it of course. There, after all, basically the electronics need to be changed, the sights are the same, the connection. The rest is quite suitable there.
  3. apro
    apro 11 September 2020 09: 52 New
    +6
    Does Pakistan have a T-80? And not t-84 ... accidentally. With a diesel engine instead of a turbine. Delivery is Ukrainian. Yes and assembly too.
    1. venik
      venik 11 September 2020 10: 13 New
      +6
      Quote: apro
      Does Pakistan have a T-80? And not t-84 ... accidentally. With a diesel engine instead of a turbine. Delivery is Ukrainian. Yes and assembly too.

      =======
      No, Oleg is the T-80UD! Only about a dozen T-84s were built! And here is the T-80UD - their Malyshev plant has “riveted” a lot since Soviet times!
      By the way, the Ukrainians delivered to Pakistan not new, but used cars from long-term storage warehouses! They just had a major overhaul, replaced something. New guns were delivered (by the way, they were received from Russia, since they were not produced in Ukraine at that time), sighting systems were updated (also due to import). Moreover, for the tanks of the second batch, new turrets were made (with a slightly improved design). That's all.
      1. apro
        apro 11 September 2020 10: 22 New
        -18
        As in the Russian Federation, the T-72 was renamed to the T-90 during modernization.
        1. venik
          venik 11 September 2020 18: 09 New
          +3
          Quote: apro
          As in the Russian Federation, the T-72 was renamed to the T-90 during modernization.

          ========
          Oleg! "Almost" everything is correct ..... Except for a few "little nuances":
          1) - T-90 has new armor (body is welded from more persistent armor plates; Frontal booking is completely different, much more persistent (to BTS and KS);
          2) - Another engine (in the same block with the gearbox);
          3) - Automated fire control system;
          -------
          Well, and so ... Well, the same T-72 ... Only THREE times more secure and effective ... request
      2. The leader of the Redskins
        The leader of the Redskins 11 September 2020 11: 08 New
        +1
        By the way, the Ukrainian. sites periodically pops up information about deliveries to Pakistan 5TDF (or 6 TD, I do not remember exactly ...). Not in large batches, but still ...
        And I think there are people in the world who want to modernize the FCS. The same China, or Israel ...
      3. tank-master
        tank-master 12 September 2020 20: 19 New
        +2
        50 tanks were delivered to Pakistan from storage bases and the Armed Forces, which underwent a major overhaul with modernization object number 478BE and the rest of 320 .. these are completely new vehicles assembled from scratch .. object number 478BE1
  4. Alekseev
    Alekseev 11 September 2020 10: 03 New
    +5
    An article from general phrases, it is not clear why specifically Pakistani T-80UD (Birches) "tend to be outsiders."
    For me, the reason for this may be the Ukrainian 6TD two-stroke diesel engine, which these tanks are equipped with, and what kind of night sight is there? It is unlikely that it is perfect. Additional armor (grilles, screens), DZ, KURV could also be upgraded over more than 20 years of operation. KAZ could also be, but Pakistani chieftains are unlikely to have a gold reserve for this business.
    Here, our structures could earn extra money, especially since the competitors from Dill have brought themselves to their logical end in tank building and de
    industrialization in general.
    For example, replace the MTO with a diesel version with the T-90 (V-92FS2F), (as they have now begun to do in Uzbekistan with their T-64s), install a modern night light, DZ, curtain, etc.
    Will India scream? Well, to deliver the kits not directly, but through China, for example, through a private contractor.
  5. Pavel57
    Pavel57 11 September 2020 10: 07 New
    +1
    Pakistan purchased about 320 T-80s from Ukraine.

    Real value, but who can modify them? Russia is unlikely, only China. The engine needs to be changed.
  6. Free wind
    Free wind 11 September 2020 10: 12 New
    0
    If we are arming India, and Pakistan and India are not friends at all, then a natural question will arise for Pakistan, and we need such friends. Moreover, China has been selling its tanks for a long time.
  7. beeper
    beeper 11 September 2020 10: 19 New
    +4
    So Pakistan does not have a T-80BV, but a later and more perfect modification of the T-90U (a variant of the T-80UD with a Kharkov two-stroke opposed diesel engine from the 5TDF-6TD line)!
    There even some improvements (they wrote about allegedly "their own development" - also designated T-84, as later the later "Oplot") made the KHKTB named after A.A. Morozov, which in those early post-Soviet years still retained its competencies and personnel !
    And then, that "Pakistani order" -320 "eighties" had to be completed "from pine forest", with the help of Russian gunners and tank builders! With the Thai contract for the supply of 49 MBT "Oplot-T", they barely fizzled out in disgrace!
    And now Kharkiv citizens are no longer tank builders and are unlikely to be able to help the Pakistanis in any way - they can’t do anything sensible for their Ukrainian "smart squads" either!
    So, if Pakistan turns to Russia, the Russians will be able to modernize Pakistani "eighties", but they will no longer be equipped with Kharkov engines.
    1. Alf
      Alf 11 September 2020 10: 43 New
      +7
      Quote: pishchak
      T-90U

      ??
      In fact, the T-80UD is a tank with a 6TD-1 boxer two-stroke. It was not planned to install a two-stroke on the T-90 even in the worst nightmare.
      1. beeper
        beeper 11 September 2020 13: 07 New
        +2
        hi Alf, this is my new smartphone "being clever" (I noticed already when "the editing time has expired" request , but about the fact that we are talking about the T-80UD, you understood correctly ?! ), so I often have to rewrite words and phrases in a new way, it tires me and slows me down a lot, but I still can't get to the deep settings to completely disable this Chinese "artificial intelligence"! smile
        1. Alf
          Alf 11 September 2020 20: 33 New
          +5
          Quote: pishchak
          hi Alf, this is my new smartphone "being clever" (I noticed already when "the editing time has expired" request , but about the fact that we are talking about the T-80UD, you understood correctly ?! ), so I often have to rewrite words and phrases in a new way, it tires me and slows me down a lot, but I still can't get to the deep settings to completely disable this Chinese "artificial intelligence"! smile

          I apologize ! hi
          Finding the courage to admit that you are wrong is worth a lot. It is a pity that there are fewer and fewer of these on VO, as well as those versed in hardware.
          1. beeper
            beeper 11 September 2020 21: 27 New
            +4
            hi So my bobble, Alf, how can you play it! yes
            As for the "hardware", I'm a tanker by military profession. Just before the collapse of the Union, he began retraining for the Kharkov T-64B with its 5TDF, but never completed it ...
            On the tablet, I managed to disable ALL "smart keyboard" - it does not interfere at all! smile
            And on the smartphone, the hands have not yet reached, although I have already searched for on YouTube how to significantly expand my capabilities in the settings, it is very annoying to constantly "parallelize" attention (when typing) to control the "thinking keyboard", which is willful all the time and constantly "ruled" me not in my opinion, in general according to a wild algorithm. winked
            Only by honestly admitting our mistakes, we learn from them! repeat
            IMHO
            1. Alf
              Alf 11 September 2020 21: 29 New
              +1
              Quote: pishchak
              On the tablet, I managed to disable ALL "smart keyboard" - it does not interfere at all!
              And on the smartphone until the hands reach,

              Damn, I had no idea how good it is to work on a laptop. I will never change a laptop for a tablet or, God forbid, Jupiter Optimus Magnus, for a smartphone. laughing
              1. beeper
                beeper 11 September 2020 21: 34 New
                0
                hi Yes, on a laptop with Windows XP and the "seven" I have no such problems with the "smart keyboard" at all - know, knock yourself, as on a typewriter, and everything is authentically printed! yes
                И whole text before your eyes on the screen, and not just a small part like on a smartphone! smile
  8. dgonni
    dgonni 11 September 2020 10: 19 New
    +9
    After reading this one (These tanks were noticeably heavier and, in general, much more combat-ready than the T-72, which made up the bulk of the armored units of neighboring India), it immediately becomes clear that further such an article can not be read.
  9. Boratsagdiev
    Boratsagdiev 11 September 2020 10: 41 New
    +6
    Type 59 and Type 69 showed themselves "in all their glory" during the Iran-Iraq War.
    T-72s burned them in bundles.
    Their presence in the "fist" makes its power doubtful.
  10. Lesorub
    Lesorub 11 September 2020 11: 23 New
    +4
    "From the elite to the outsider." Military Watch explains why Pakistani T-80s will be forgotten

    If Pakistan wanted to modernize its T 80 - then there are no obstacles in this - their money is our modernization. But you need to understand that Pakistan has a very strong lobby for China - where it promotes its military equipment.
  11. svp67
    svp67 11 September 2020 17: 08 New
    0
    Articles are not written by experts ... and this is sad
    The T-80 is "a heavier and more deadly analogue of the T-72 and T-90A"
    Which T-80? There are several of them and they are very different from each other in their fighting qualities.
    The one that Pakistan bought is certainly stronger than all the T-72s of that time, but is similar to the T-90A
    Recall that at the moment the most advanced modification of the T-80 is the T-80BVM version developed in Russia.
    Unfortunately, this tank is still worse than the T-80U ...
  12. lvov_aleksey
    lvov_aleksey 11 September 2020 23: 54 New
    0
    as the Anglo-Saxons tired of me, they themselves do not know how - just sell! We learn - spanks at once (sanctions Russia, China)
    ps for opponents of my thesis, the Anglo-Saxons were good under Yeltsin, and then they were blown away - the stink is more
  13. Incvizitor
    Incvizitor 12 September 2020 00: 23 New
    0
    If I were in their place, I would think about modernizing the t 80, the Russian Federation's tanks are excellent and it would be premature to write them off.
  14. Ratmir_Ryazan
    Ratmir_Ryazan 13 September 2020 08: 47 New
    -1
    Military Watch wrote some nonsense. It seems like a serious publication, but the article is just stupidity.

    The T-80UD is also a Soviet modification of the T-80 tank with a diesel engine, and in nothing it significantly surpasses even the T-72. All the differences are that the chassis is different, the machine gun is controlled remotely and the diesel engine at that time was slightly more powerful than that of the T-72. And the rest is all about the same, the same gun, the same Soviet ammunition, no thermal imager.

    Where is the T-80UD better than the T-72 or the T-90A? Yes, not in any.

    Modern Russian and Indian T-90s are an order of magnitude better, they have thermal imaging sights, which greatly increases the capabilities of tanks at night, for Russian tanks new guns and new ammunition are being developed and already installed on tanks, everything from the engine and dynamic protection is being modernized in Russia tank before the used ammunition, and Pakistan and Ukraine operate tanks and ammunition from the times of the USSR, they became obsolete in the late 80s.