Military Review

Mirages of russian military thought

158
It is necessary to focus the Armed Forces on the reflection of real and not fantastic threats.

The military doctrine of Russia, which is quite natural, remains secret in that part which concerns plans for future wars and probable opponents. But according to individual statements of the Russian Defense Ministry officials, as well as what weapons systems are being developed and are going to be put on combat duty, what kind of exercises are taking place in our country, certain conclusions can be made about who the Russian military planners are supposed to fight with.

I will try to analyze the scenarios of future wars that the Russian Military Doctrine is focused on and show the threats to Russia's military security - now existing and likely in the future.

Expensive but useless toy

Let's start with the most notorious and, perhaps, the most expensive project of recent years - with the purchase of helicopter carriers from France and their subsequent production under license at Russian factories. The price of each ship is about 600 million euros, so this deal is a tasty morsel in all respects. But the logical question arises: what is the combat mission of the acquired Mistral?

Mirages of russian military thoughtAccording to the official classification, these are universal amphibious ships capable of taking on a battalion of marines (450 man), 16 heavy helicopters or 32 light rotary wings and then heading to any point of the World Ocean at a distance of 10 800 kilometers (and at an economical speed - even 19 800 km).

In principle, it is clear why UDC is necessary for the naval forces of the Fifth Republic. If a civil war breaks out in one of the former French colonies (for example, in Gabon or Côte d'Ivoire), a military coup will occur, Paris will be able to quickly transfer a detachment of military personnel to the coast of a troubled country, which, if necessary, will support one of the parties to the conflict and evacuate several hundred citizens.

The aircraft carrier Charles de Gaulle equipped with a nuclear power plant could also perform the same functions. Two such "floating airfields", in all likelihood, would be enough for the French to carry out such overseas missions. But the trouble is that the "Charles de Gaulle" - the largest warship ever built in France, was too expensive. Its value is 2,5 billion euros. Therefore, Paris has so far refrained from replenishing the Navy with the second atomic carrier. A little cheaper is the projected “floating airfield” with a conventional power plant - 1,7 billion dollars. And on the "Mistral" is still the newest management system that allows you to manage the entire 160 crew members (for comparison: its number on the Charles de Gaulle is 1200 people, plus 600 pilots, engineers and technicians of the aircraft carrier group).

However, strictly speaking, for French fleet "Mistral" by and large is just an expensive, but not too necessary toy, somewhat experimental. Indeed, in the event of a serious conflict and confrontation with the enemy, having aviation, air defense and combat-ready coastal defense, in a campaign with the "Mistral" will have to send a large group of ships, including an aircraft carrier. And for the actual evacuation operations, you can use cheaper ships, for example, anti-aircraft or anti-submarine frigate (they are also called destroyers in the old fashion). The Mistral is only suitable for missions from the time of the “big gunboat” diplomacy, when you need to put pressure on some militarily weak state. Such a “big gunboat”, in essence, it is, only the price is impressive.

If you ask the question of which naval theater Mistral will be needed by the Russian fleet, the answer will be unequivocal: only in the Black Sea - in the event of a new armed conflict with Georgia or a war with Ukraine, which has the second-largest army in the CIS. Actually, as a result of the Russian-Georgian confrontation in August 2008, the idea was born to buy French helicopter carriers. Then they tried to land a naval landing in Batumi, but the landing barge, where the marines had plunged, turned out to be faulty. And instead of ordering a new barge or even a landing ship, they decided to become generous with UDC and not even for one (we will keep silent about the possible personal geshefts from this deal).

True, Georgia was defeated, although the matter did without amphibious landings. Similarly, if the Russian-Ukrainian war suddenly breaks out unexpectedly, the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation have every chance to cope with the enemy using only the Ground Forces, aviation and the current ships of the Black Sea Fleet without resorting to engaging the Mistral.

However, these UDCs are supposed to be kept in the Pacific, but what they will do there is known only to Russian military commanders and naval commanders, for whom, even more than their French counterparts, Mistrals will be just an expensive but useless toy.

Sometimes they say: the whole point of the Mistral purchase is that the Russian Navy will receive the most modern control systems. But first, they are only suitable for this purpose, and are suitable for other ships, and for other ships they will have to develop new equipment. Secondly, it will be very difficult for our admirals to prepare officers and sailors for service on the Mistral. For it requires high-class professionals capable of working for six to seven sailors on "ordinary" helicopter carriers and aircraft carriers of the previous generation.

The experience of tragic accidents with domestic atomic submarines does not have to optimism. I am afraid that the safest thing for Mistral in Russia is to always stand at the mooring wall (which most likely will happen). Exit to the open sea and even more so an attempt to conduct combat training and firing will always be fraught with unpredictable and tragic consequences.

Objectively speaking, the Russian Federation in general does not make sense to have a large surface fleet and large surface ships. Since the construction of strike aircraft carriers in our country has always encountered and still faces both the complexity of the design of "floating airfields" and the difficulties in creating deck aircraft and training pilots able to take off from an aircraft carrier and successfully land on it, there is no chance in the foreseeable future what to catch up with the US Navy, and even get a little closer to them in terms of combat power. But except for a hopeless struggle against the US Navy, we no longer need aircraft carriers for any purpose, because Russia does not have a large merchant fleet and significant maritime trade that would have to be protected. The maximum that is worth having the Russian Navy out of surface ships is frigates, anti-submarine and landing ships, guard ships and boats. The main emphasis should be placed on the development of submarines, especially nuclear submarines.

Who can fight the Russian Federation

Let us now turn to the Iskander missile system, which we so frighten Europe with. Its missiles have a range of up to 500 kilometers, can carry tactical nuclear warheads and are designed to defeat combat units in the usual equipment of small and area targets in the depth of the operational construction of enemy troops. When Moscow threatens to deploy Iskanders in the Kaliningrad region, it actually suggests the possibility of some kind of local armed conflict between Russia and Poland or the Baltic countries.

However, it is not difficult to figure out that any missile attack on objects in the territory of the Commonwealth or, for example, Lithuania will not lead to a Russian-Polish or Russian-Lithuanian war, but to a clash between Russia and the entire NATO bloc. And in such a confrontation, with or without Iskander, the Russian Federation, given the size and equipment of the armies of the member states of the North Atlantic Alliance, still has no chance to resist if only conventional weapons are used. Therefore, the war will very quickly grow into an unlimited thermonuclear with disastrous consequences for all mankind. And it is extremely doubtful that then Belarus and other CIS countries will want to come to the aid of Russia.

If, God forbid, a war with the use of conventional weapons will break out in the space of the Commonwealth of Independent States, the use of Iskander complexes by Russia in this case will prove to be excessive.

Take, however, another potential adversary of our country - China. And here again, Russia has no chance of winning the usual large-scale war, given the unlimited human resources of the Middle Kingdom in comparison with the Russian Federation and the potential capacity of China’s industry in large quantities to produce weapon and military equipment. Consequently, any truly serious armed confrontation with China of the Russian Federation will have to end as a thermonuclear war. It has a lot of chances to win in our country, but the damage it will incur will be enormous.

Meanwhile, the Russian military doctrine, as in Soviet times, is focused primarily on the possibility of waging large-scale wars against the North Atlantic bloc and China with conventional weapons, although such a scenario in reality seems absolutely incredible. It is for this purpose that the conscription system of recruiting the army and navy of the Russian Federation remains, although the service of recruits has been reduced to one year.

It is believed that thanks to this, Russia will have a reserve of trained reservists, sufficient to wage the two wars mentioned above. However, for a year of being in the army, military recruits are still not ready to wage a modern war with conventional weapons, and after mobilization they will have to deal with them for at least another year or even one and a half, given that they will have time to forget much of taught earlier. And even 12-month service in the draft army of many young people turns away from concluding a contract with the Ministry of Defense to become a professional warrior.

Most importantly, the preparation of these so-called reservists is completely unnecessary, since it focuses on impossible scenarios of war. First of all, one should focus not on confrontation with NATO, but on a potential alliance with the North Atlantic bloc in the event of a conflict between Russia and Celestial. In addition to this, it is necessary to take into account possible local clashes in the CIS space, the fight against terrorism and the preservation of the potential of nuclear-missile deterrence with the NATO bloc. To solve all these tasks, the large in number ordinary Armed Forces are not required and an army of one million people may be redundant.

It is quite enough to have 600 – 700 thousands of military personnel, especially given the presence in Russia of numerous Internal Troops and paramilitary police units, which are mainly tasked with eliminating terrorists. But all the soldiers of the Ministry of Defense must be professionals.

First of all, it is necessary to develop strategic nuclear forces, air defense and missile defense (capable of repelling an attack by countries with a small nuclear-missile potential), and special-purpose units. That is, troops equipped with models of weapons and military equipment, the effective use of which is on the shoulder only for contract servicemen. The costs of defense products designed to be used in military campaigns of the most fantastic nature divert money and material resources from modernizing those industries of our defense industry that can actually produce products necessary to repel real and potential threats.
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  1. Alex63
    Alex63 9 August 2012 06: 32
    -38
    While the freaks Putin and Medvedev are leading our country, while Serdyukov is leading the defense of our country, there will be a collapse in everything. They need to score aspen stakes in their backs and sprinkle with garlic so that they do not breed. The infection from them should no longer go through the country.
    1. dmitrich
      dmitrich 9 August 2012 06: 46
      +22
      you guy don’t drive the wave, has overwhelmed you.
      1. Alex63
        Alex63 9 August 2012 11: 28
        -1
        Do you know a normal storm, or do you rush in terms like this? At 9 points on the PC went when the head-legs? Hold your tongue. Fenya needs to be able to work too. Unknowingly, you can catch the answer. You must always be able to answer for the bazaar. Or bend under putinoids?
      2. Alex63
        Alex63 12 August 2012 08: 35
        -5
        Me on your minus on ... be! A respected site, but something Putin's snacks dug in there. Not a single sober view of the current state of affairs in our country. There is not a single balanced reasoning for our problems. Continuous "approvals" and "praises" of the current government. There is corruption and theft in the country. Putin and Medvedev have nothing to do with it. The Minister of Defense of the Putin government, Serdyukov ... thwarted the army and navy with his reforms - Putin has nothing to do with it. Putin's lackeys and prostitutes Golikov, Nabiulin, Fursenko, Nurgaliev, Serdyukov, Levitin and others did whatever they wanted in their departments with him, but Putin again had nothing to do with it. So it's white and fluffy! In his shit and in white feathers! And then send to Sagra or to Kushchevka, or Krymsk. There are many such places in Russia.
    2. Vanek
      Vanek 9 August 2012 06: 50
      +17
      Quote: Alex63
      While our country is ruled by the freaks Putin and Medvedev, while the defense of our country is led by Serdyukov, this will be the collapse of everything


      And let's put you in their place.
      1. FREGATENKAPITAN
        FREGATENKAPITAN 9 August 2012 10: 27
        -3
        ..And is it so bad there? That's them already 15 years can not be expelled from there .......
        ... Let's put it, let's ......... I'm ready!
        ..Only close will not let .......
        1. Brother Sarych
          Brother Sarych 9 August 2012 17: 50
          +2
          And I’m ready, I think, only no one will let me go anywhere ...
      2. Alex63
        Alex63 9 August 2012 11: 03
        -14
        Ready. Right now. But only Putin, Medvedev and their lackeys with minions will ice the ice at the North Pole or distribute food to penguins in Antarctica. What, enraged? It really hurts you in the eyes.
        1. Protey
          Protey 9 August 2012 20: 56
          +3
          - We do not seek the truth, but the effect.
          Dr. Joseph Goebbels.
          1. Alex63
            Alex63 12 August 2012 08: 44
            -3
            When there is an effect, there will be truth. Without a severed head, there will be no punishment for the criminal. Only an ax, a gallows or a bullet can stop an impudent villain. Corruption, theft, pedophilia, nepotism, kickbacks, the collapse of the army, navy, aviation, education and industry of our country can only be stopped with the most severe measures, regardless of the rank and class of the criminal. If Putin is a criminal, I say so. If Medvedev is a criminal, I say so. If their sloths, godfathers, brothers, relatives, all those with whom they drink, eat, sleep on the same bed and three ... t one prostitute occupied our power - they must be sent to the most rotten mines and the most half-dumped mines and dilapidated plants . Let them work on the fruits of their labors. Not all the same fat and feast at our expense.
        2. Фокус
          Фокус 9 August 2012 22: 09
          +4
          Of course they will not allow it and they will do it right, if you propose stupid shouting instead of business instead of business.
      3. afire
        afire 9 August 2012 14: 45
        0
        What are you, these ghouls only dream about it!
    3. Concept1
      Concept1 9 August 2012 07: 30
      +10
      While our country is led by the freaks Putin and Medvedev. And you campaign "handsome" yes !!!
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 9 August 2012 09: 30
        +16
        The people, but can I rule the country, you will live in chocolate laughing True, in a couple of months you will overthrow me, but that's another story hi
      2. Alex63
        Alex63 9 August 2012 11: 23
        -19
        The flag is blue. Write to another, "handsome"!
    4. sv-sakh
      sv-sakh 9 August 2012 09: 31
      +8
      boy, are you an addict for an hour? wassat what a cry of the soul?
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 9 August 2012 09: 51
        +1
        Quote: sv-sakh

        guy you're not an addict for an hour

        What do you want to offer a new unique potion belay First, ask Smirnov whether the rules of the site are allowed, whether or not to trade drugs on the site. And then come, sit for a smoke, dream laughing
        1. sv-sakh
          sv-sakh 9 August 2012 10: 04
          +7
          And you, wherever your head doesn’t touch the corner? What trade? fool It was a question for a person who was clearly inadequate .. But I look at you here a whole stash ... you, too, are carrying something wrong
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 9 August 2012 12: 50
            +2
            Quote: sv-sakh
            you, wherever your head doesn’t touch the corner?

            In this case, write to whom the comment refers and do not bull. I found a guy, as at the computer everything is cool, but in fact ............
        2. Alex63
          Alex63 9 August 2012 11: 20
          -9
          What you suggested to me put yourselves in ... Maybe the smoke will go. Putinoids, according to history you have 1 with a minus. Hitler’s rise to power in Germany also began this way. Putin also went along this path. If with the formation of difficulties, no one will help you. Is there anyone normal on this site, not Putin's lackey? And further. Little need to learn Russian. Spelling, punctuation and syntax in the Russian language have not yet been canceled. Before you write a dictionary on the site, read, doodles. You can’t express yourself in Russian, but climb on to general discussion.
          1. Konsdneprovsky
            Konsdneprovsky 9 August 2012 17: 23
            +4
            How so? Stop shaking the air. Tell us about Putin's rise to power along Hitler’s paths. Not personal opinion, but historical facts. You can put your thoughts in one place !!!
    5. drossel81
      drossel81 9 August 2012 09: 46
      +5
      Yes!! And what in the nineties do you think was a wise guy ??
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 9 August 2012 09: 52
        +6
        Quote: drossel81
        And what in the nineties do you think was a wise guy?

        Yes, certainly not smart!
      2. Alex63
        Alex63 9 August 2012 13: 57
        -15
        Arrange the commas correctly, literate! Or maybe the choke with the letters "CH" and "L" is written?
    6. segamegament
      segamegament 9 August 2012 09: 52
      +13
      Lech, 63 R., you are a provocateur
      1. Hans grohman
        Hans grohman 9 August 2012 12: 31
        +10
        Yes, and the article is shitty, with a darling.

        Bullshit, not an article.
        1. starshina78
          starshina78 9 August 2012 19: 55
          +1
          I do not completely agree with you. Yes, the article is a little sly. Regarding the fleet, "Mistrals" the author is right that these "Mistrals" are like a backpack to a cow, but otherwise not. We need not only nuclear submarines, but also a powerful ocean-going fleet. We are already hopelessly behind NATO, but we still need to build ships that can fight both nuclear submarines, surface ships, and aircraft. I mean an Orlan-class cruiser or something similar. It is not necessary, like the Americans and the British, to build strictly specific ships (missile defense cruisers, air defense destroyers). Take any Soviet ship of the first rank, missile cruiser, BOD, you can see how they are self-sufficient. They successfully fought both boats and planes, and could support the landing of troops on the shore. And most importantly, they served in the patrol area of ​​our nuclear missile boats, providing them with peace of mind.
          As for the other weapons, I can not say anything. But about the one with whom Russia is going and the most important thing will be able to fight - this is a question. With such aircraft and the Navy, we can fight, if only in the best case with Georgia or another third-class country. They can’t wage war without specialists, but they bombed our military education, the service will not teach much for one year. And there is a third factor - the venality of politicians and generals. The Americans now have a principle - you can’t win, you can buy (an example of Syria). The current level of the Armed Forces allows you to fight only with terrorists (all exercises are the fight against terrorists, hostage-taking, i.e. police functions), and with an attack by China, the question is whether it will work like in the recent history, when the enemy chopped off half the country in the first days .
          1. Funker1981
            Funker1981 10 August 2012 17: 10
            +1
            Quote: starshina78
            (all exercises are the fight against terrorists, hostage-taking, i.e. police functions)

            Well, now the fashion is just like that, all exercises on land are anti-terrorist, anti-piracy at sea (it's especially funny why aircraft carriers are studying against pirates))). What is not an attack on a country, so "demobilization" and "general humanization")))
        2. Ascetic
          Ascetic 9 August 2012 21: 25
          +8
          Quote: Hans Grohman
          Bullshit, not an article.


          You can’t swear, but similar military ANALtiks are already sick of it.
          Now about the Mistral. We acquire a box and technology for building a large building in a short time - something that we have never had. The stuffing of the ship is a special conversation, but the fact that our ship will not resemble French is for sure. What, what, but we will be able to stuff the box. The theory of the use of ships of this type has set on edge. Helicopter carriers have NOTHING to do either in the Black or Baltic Seas (all targets are within the reach of the coastal infrastructure). The chatter of rodents and Balts, and our "experts", just to attract attention. We have tasks for which ships of this type are simply necessary. Little remains: so that the initiators of this purchase and our leaders understand what they are doing and are guided by the interests of Russia. What tasks do you ask? First of all, in terms of East Kazakhstan region, because they were not disclosed openly.

          The author writes
          First of all, it is necessary to develop strategic nuclear forces, air defense and missile defense (capable of repelling the attack of countries with small nuclear missile capabilities), and special-purpose units.

          And the above substantiates the reason for the uselessness and ineffectiveness of Iskander. A simple question arises: what kind of weapon, besides the Iskander OTRK, can effectively destroy US missile defense objects in Europe (radars and anti-missile bases) without casualties? Personally, I do not see a more effective remedy from the existing ones.
    7. red 015
      red 015 9 August 2012 15: 24
      +4
      someone will always be dissatisfied with the government, no matter what it is, but if we compare the Yeltsin era now, it would be better if Putin would lead the country, even if there is some stability!
    8. Rustam
      Rustam 9 August 2012 19: 15
      +4
      The author of the au with his article was late for 2 years or 2 years ago, it would have passed right now no
    9. Good Ukraine
      Good Ukraine 9 August 2012 22: 56
      +3
      For Alex63;

      Freaks are your masters from Washington.
      And their lackeys are those who harass their homeland for the joy of their masters.
      And where will you and your children live when your master arrives?

      Do you think you will regret it?
      Do not even hope.

      It is unfortunate that having great patriots, Russia also has great traitors.

      I would like to believe that Russia will still have its traitors
  2. itr
    itr 9 August 2012 06: 38
    +12
    Boris Sokolov, you're wrong. One-sided as you think.
    1. John
      John 9 August 2012 06: 45
      +2
      No comment.
    2. Nir
      Nir 9 August 2012 08: 18
      +8
      Quote: itr
      Boris Sokolov, you're wrong. One-sided as you think.

      And why is he wrong? can arguments be? All laid out on shelves especially 12 months. military service and no need to lie to ourselves that this is normal and for 12 months you can learn something and especially how technically and its normal maintenance. And it’s true that when using conventional weapons, it’s impossible to get away either like the PRC or NATO, but you are trying hard to deny it.
      1. itr
        itr 9 August 2012 08: 47
        +11
        NIR well, as I understand from the article. That money must be allocated to nuclear weapons. And the rest is neither here nor there and the amount of army is simply ?????????????????????????? Mistral shit. The author forgot that Russia has been building ships at 2 times less displacement for 5 years. If we let our people build it, they will build it for 12 years if they build it at all. To date, another submarine bookmark has been announced and I don’t know what the score is and the output is still zero. Yes, the USSR also bought warships in the German Democratic Republic, and neither of which
        And if our sailors and builders are called idiots only, they will be so. let them go to the sea and do not stand at the berths and then they will be good. Now they may have accidents and state of emergency, but the author forgot that the Fleet had not gone to sea for 20 years. etc. In short, from the article, I realized the Russian fleet does not need an army to disperse and stumble nuclear weapons across the fields and forests of Russia. If honestly with the latter, I agree. Only when the enemy breaks deep into the territory of Russia. No one in their country will not strike a nuclear strike, but with the Army 600 thousand, nothing can be done
        1. itr
          itr 9 August 2012 08: 56
          +13
          Yes, with a service life of 12 months, I also disagree. And categorically against a fully contracted army, since our country is not able to feed it. Only those countries that print candy wrappers have it.
        2. strannik595
          strannik595 9 August 2012 18: 09
          +3
          No one in their country will not deliver a nuclear strike, but with the Army 600 thousand, nothing can be done .........I fully support ................ but actually there are different missiles, and while someone’s landing will be landing in the Baltic or Amur, let's say he’s already in London, New York or Beijing the package from my grandmother came hot, with heat of heat (with prior notice of course) laughing
      2. igor67
        igor67 9 August 2012 08: 57
        +8
        Quote: Nir
        yes to learn especially how technically and its normal maintenance.

        , I don’t know if there is anything similar to DOSAAF now, but for half a year I knew ZIL 130, like five fingers, disassembling an engine assembly, wheel alignment. I drove as much as km. they refused to drive, stupidly refused, I took their watches, though I traveled around the race track a couple of times, I drove back to the trestle several times further on the national economy, but this is not the main thing, the main thing was they knew the car six months before the army
        1. Protey
          Protey 9 August 2012 21: 07
          +2
          I also studied at DOSAAF to be a driver, half a year in 1970. Then I served in Germany in a Ural 377 with a trailer. They cooked very well, no fools! By the way, the Germans served 15 months, apparently enough, because they were engaged in combat training in full, and not playing the fool.
      3. sv-sakh
        sv-sakh 9 August 2012 09: 00
        +11
        Do you know what is in the Far East?
        Do you know about the existence of islands?
        and how many types of valuable biological resources are extracted in the waters of the Far East?
        and you know what ANNUAL damage to the Russian Federation caused by poachers from neighboring countries?
        And I, as a resident of Yuzhno-Sakhalinsk, can assure you that countless helicopters and boats intercept each month, but marriages have learned to hide and go into neutral waters.
        But at least 4-5 cases of interception per year happen and can not do without the use of weapons.
        Only the protection of the waters of the Far East will pay for the mistral over the coming years from the moment it is put on duty.
        Here is the first application for you, and I think there will still be such examples in the country.
        Z.Y. One of the Mistral will be based in Vladivostok ...
        1. s1н7т
          s1н7т 9 August 2012 12: 31
          -3
          Fight the longboats with the help of the landing ship ?! Original!)
          1. sv-sakh
            sv-sakh 10 August 2012 01: 49
            +1
            using combat helicopters located at a floating airfield.
            landing and capture of the intruder with the help of amphibious assault means.
            I understand that there are big problems with tactics?
    3. red-threat
      red-threat 9 August 2012 08: 47
      +4
      Not one-sided, but liberalistically. Judging by his writings, Sokolov is a reseller.
      1. Nir
        Nir 9 August 2012 08: 49
        -2
        Quote: redthreat
        Not one-sided, but liberalistically. Judging by his writings, Sokolov is a reseller.

        A little that immediately a liberal corrupt Westerner and one-sided ... but that the truth has already been canceled? Or canceled the objective expression of their own opinions?
        1. Simon bolivar
          Simon bolivar 9 August 2012 13: 55
          +4
          The whole article is nonsense of pure water.
          Firstly, you can’t get a lot of war with the fleet of submarines and frigate with corvetics, you need aircraft carriers and heavy cruisers, because the connection of ships headed by an aircraft carrier will lose its power, it will be able to operate anywhere in the world.
          After all, let’s not forget that in the event of a war with NATO, our fleet has a heavy responsibility to take control of the Atlantic and make it impossible to transfer cargo from the United States. Only carrier fleets can do this.
          The submarine alone is not capable of fighting.
          What war with China? Do you think such fools are sitting there? China is not ready to fight for at least thirty years, or even all fifty.
          1. Morgan stanley
            Morgan stanley 9 August 2012 16: 17
            +1
            Quote: SimonBolivar
            What war with China? Do you think such fools are sitting there? China is not ready to fight for at least thirty years, or even all fifty.

            You are mistaken. China can fight, but not yet with the Russian Federation. And according to the article, the author is right, if there is a war with NATO, then the Russian Federation will lose, since NATO has more equipment and weapons than the Russian Federation in the European part. I would show you a graph of how much weapons NATO has and how much Russia is in the European part, but I lost it.
            1. Simon bolivar
              Simon bolivar 9 August 2012 22: 03
              +1
              If the flaws of our fleet succeed in intercepting convoys from the United States, then Europe will not last a month, and the ratio of troops and equipment is far from the most important factor.
  3. Sakhalininsk
    Sakhalininsk 9 August 2012 06: 41
    +14
    I do not agree with the author of the article. It is stated not badly, but in the style of "Let's just now raise our gray and wretched paws to the sky, and let us sink our ass to kiss the one who will teach us how to live correctly"
    1. red-threat
      red-threat 9 August 2012 08: 48
      +5
      Yeah, and merge with ami in ecstasy, crushing Syria, Irna, etc. until you decide to crush us. In FIG, in FIG ....
  4. SergeyN
    SergeyN 9 August 2012 06: 43
    +11
    article - liberal nonsense!
    1. Ustas
      Ustas 9 August 2012 08: 04
      +7
      Quote: SergeyN
      article - liberal nonsense!

      I didn’t even finish reading. The article is a fat minus.
      1. Cadet787
        Cadet787 9 August 2012 15: 09
        +2
        An article with a smell, calling to dance to a famous pipe. Minus.
    2. v53993
      v53993 9 August 2012 12: 24
      +1
      Very softly said
    3. wasjasibirjac
      wasjasibirjac 9 August 2012 19: 02
      +1
      that the nonsense is for sure, but some points are interesting. all the same, why the Mistral in D. Vostok, what are the goals for these ships? Drive pirates and poachers? Frigates and corvettes are really enough for this case. an opportunity to transfer an infantry battalion? but for this, the An-124 heels are better suited, it will be faster and perhaps cheaper. threaten Japan and other countries of the Asia-Pacific region, but does not work, for this Mistral is weak. then why is it needed, they can explain their desire in the Moscow Region, otherwise it’s not clear
      1. Kaa
        Kaa 9 August 2012 21: 48
        +3
        Quote: wasjasibirjac
        the heel of An-124 is better suited,

        Well, we recently discussed the issues of how to transfer helicopters and marines to Syria, everyone agreed that without an air corridor, which no one would give, only by sea and the way. This is where these same "Mistrals" would come in handy. A hypothetical conflict with China - compare the mob potential of a country with one and a half billion people and Russia with 150 million. Doesn't it inspire? I do, yes. Recently, one general in an article (here) was concerned that there were only 2 brigades from the Urals to Vladivostok. Okay, "let's do" 5. What will fundamentally change this, China, if necessary, will set 15, 50, as much as imagination is enough. So, God forbid, in the case of China, unfortunately, there is no fusion. This was understood even in the days of the Invincible and Legendary, and in China smart people are sitting, they realize this. But with Western adversaries, the very thing, you urgently need to remember:STALIN: We have to run this distance in ten years. Either we do it, or we get crushed.We must build our economy so that our country does not turn into an appendage of the world capitalist system, so that it is not included in the general system of capitalist development as its subsidiary enterprise, so that our economy does not develop as a subsidiary enterprise of world capitalism, but as an independent economic unit ".
        Modernization of Russia. And what will comrade Stalin tell us?
        ("On the tasks of business executives" v. 13, p. 39.)
  5. dmitrich
    dmitrich 9 August 2012 06: 45
    +11
    where such scribblers come from, this is the representative of the fifth column.
    1. valokordin
      valokordin 9 August 2012 08: 06
      +5
      Dmitrich You are right, this liberalist is a XNUMX% foreign agent, and his article is an informational throw to check how people will react.
  6. Alexey Prikazchikov
    Alexey Prikazchikov 9 August 2012 07: 36
    +7
    The author you smoked what black-sea TVD belay ? !!! The Black Sea is lying to him drown there fuck and such ships do not go unguarded, the experts divorced the Lord. recourse
    1. wasjasibirjac
      wasjasibirjac 9 August 2012 19: 03
      +1
      + The Black Sea is practically shot through by any missile and the radar shines through where you go on this live
  7. tan0472
    tan0472 9 August 2012 07: 37
    0
    Highways may come in handy to guard the North-Mor. way and shelf.
    1. Armata
      Armata 9 August 2012 08: 08
      +4
      Quote: tan0472

      Highways can come in handy to guard the North-Mor. way and shelf

      They are not adapted to walk in those waters. And what will they protect? Landing and landing on the pack for abortion?
      1. tan0472
        tan0472 9 August 2012 08: 32
        +1
        Of course from the "pirates". laughing And the main thing is to displace "pirate" vessels away from the shelf. And as for unadapted .. There is no such crap in the world that a Russian person will not adapt to another crap. fellow That the death of the French Mistral, the Russian Mistral ... tongue
        1. Armata
          Armata 9 August 2012 08: 39
          +6
          Yes, with his weapons, he will not displace a single pirate ship. He has other goals. This is a platform for support from the air + hovercraft for the landing of equipment and amphibious assault + headquarters for coordination of the squadron. So there is absolutely nothing for him to do there.
    2. wasjasibirjac
      wasjasibirjac 9 August 2012 19: 05
      0
      until the first ice floe, the sides are not strengthened, or we hope for global warming
  8. Armata
    Armata 9 August 2012 07: 49
    +10
    In the article section concerning Mistral, I absolutely agree with the author. We do not need these expensive barges, and not with the best characteristics. But as for the 2 part of this article, the issue is controversial. The author believes that for the sake of Poland, the entire NATO bloc will rise against Russia, since this is not at all the case. Not a single country knowing that Russia possesses nuclear potential will defend a small part, too high a price can be paid for psheks and sprotland. The use of nuclear weapons is the last stage of the war and this is well understood by the Yankees and other countries of the NATO bloc.
    1. tan0472
      tan0472 9 August 2012 08: 34
      +7
      Therefore, the Baltic sphincter and shrinks lol
    2. KA
      KA 9 August 2012 11: 34
      +4
      I agree with you about Misrail, but I would like to clarify about Iskander. The Iskander in Kaliningrad should be seen as a means of destroying the missile defense system, so they are needed.
    3. Eugene
      Eugene 9 August 2012 11: 59
      +2
      The namesake, and then replace the BDK?
      1. Armata
        Armata 9 August 2012 12: 11
        +2
        Quote: KA
        The Iskander in Kaliningrad should be seen as a means of destroying the missile defense system, so they are needed.
        Alexander here, I agree with you.
        Quote: Eugene

        The namesake, and then replace the BDK

        We need the namesake BDK, but we definitely do not need Mistral. He has more problems than advantages, we are not so rich to buy such humus. For me it would be better if they bought the Spaniards.
        1. Eugene
          Eugene 9 August 2012 15: 34
          +4
          The Spaniards would not work ... was interested in this issue. There, most of the equipment is American. The French have all their own. Relations with France historically are better and there is a chance of the option when, by some indication from above, we are left with unfinished troughs without a power plant much lower.
          Quote: Steam Train
          Namesake BDK we need

          Debatable ... the possibilities of the UDC are much wider (like "America" ​​for example, or Tarawa). Aviation support for the landing would not hurt. Mistral as a complex is probably not the best, you are right, but it will take ns about 7 years to develop a similar solution, with the pace of construction of Gren the First UDC will end up with us in the year 2025, when the oldest BDK will be about 45, and the youngest will be over 30. that there is no one to do this - Nevskoe is occupied by an Aircraft carrier, a destroyer is being designed. Because of the collapse of the 90s and microfinance now (promising development of the defense industry, we have allocated something about 130 billion rubles and the US $ 300 billion). And these aircraft carriers should be better than the Chinese ones and not give way to the Nimitz and Ford and have the possibility of modernization and service for about 50 years, that is, remain in service until about 2070-2075 ... Even the USSR could not pull the Aircraft Carriers and UDC at the same time. But you still need a promising destroyer ...
          Quote: Steam Train
          Namesake BDK we need

          Quote: Steam Train
          Namesake BDK we need

          The pace of the construction of Gren speak for themselves ....
          Do not forget the USSR built a noticeable number of ships abroad.
    4. pribolt
      pribolt 9 August 2012 12: 29
      +1
      Quote: Steam Train

      In the article section concerning Mistral, I absolutely agree with the author.

      I also agree with this. The article put a minus in general, but there is something else that the article agrees with, there is definitely the truth that, apart from the nuclear submarines and small boats, we are not building anything for the fleet and it’s stupid to deny it.
      1. Armata
        Armata 9 August 2012 12: 40
        +2
        Quote: pribolt
        there is definitely the truth that apart from the nuclear submarines and small boats, we are not building anything for the fleet and it’s stupid to deny it.

        This is not due to the fact that we do not have factories, technologies, talents. We could all build ourselves, there is one problem in Russia, this is the inertness of the leadership. These people do not perceive anything new. I can give an example based on our design bureau and factory. Once 12-15 years ago, we developed and made a versatile module with remote control. He could work as a sapper, replacing the module, it would be possible to use it as an orderly for the selection and removal of the wounded, and there were still about 5 applications of this machine. But it so happened that after testing and approval by the Moscow Region and the Federal Security Service, everything stopped and they rust in the courtyard of the plant, and we buy foreign narrow-purpose robots, since this industry is supposedly not developed in our country.
        1. wasjasibirjac
          wasjasibirjac 9 August 2012 19: 09
          0
          then the management does not want to share
        2. Protey
          Protey 9 August 2012 21: 15
          -1
          - "We could build everything ourselves" -
          I’ve heard this all my life, but WHY DO WE NOT BUILD IT IF YOU CAN ???
          If something is riveted, then everything is crooked, oblique and breaks. Here again, the satellites horseradish knows where to fly!
      2. lelikas
        lelikas 9 August 2012 13: 05
        +1
        It’s stupid, at least, not to google before writing that the ships are not being built, I won’t do this for you.
        1. pribolt
          pribolt 9 August 2012 13: 21
          +1
          Quote: lelikas
          It’s stupid, at least, not to google before writing that the ships are not being built, I won’t do this for you.


          I'm far from a sailor, but what is being built Admiral Gorshkov and Ivan Gren? or Mistral?
          1. Eugene
            Eugene 9 August 2012 15: 19
            +3
            laid from surface ships from January to May of that year:

            corvette "Thundering" 20385
            frigate "Admiral Golovko" 22350
            frigate "Admiral Makarov" 11356
            corvette "Loud" 20380.

            did not count on trifles.

            launched from previously laid down from January to June:

            MAK "Makhachkala"
            BDK Ivan Gren the notorious
            corvette 20380 "Resistant"

            http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/17673/

            Nakhimov stood up for modernization, and this is a great thing!

            The pace is not Soviet, but this is no longer a nightmare of the 90s of the early 2000s.
  9. lewerlin53rus
    lewerlin53rus 9 August 2012 07: 52
    +10
    The Russian Federation generally does not make sense to have a large surface fleet and large surface ships

    Yes of course. And why do we need Yars with a Mace, the latest submarines. Anyway, why do we need an army? I have not heard a blunt delirium for a long time.
    and the war with Ukraine, which in the CIS has the second army after Russia in terms of number and combat effectiveness.

    He would have come up with a war between the Moscow and Leningrad region.
    The main thing is that the preparation of these so-called reservists is completely unnecessary

    And this is generally insanity. At all times, the country was protected by the whole world
    potential alliance with the alliance

    well, yes, Hitler was also at one time a tender friendship, and how it all ended.
    In short, the author is either stupid or a hire-provocateur.
    1. Ustas
      Ustas 9 August 2012 08: 08
      +6
      Quote: lewerlin53rus
      author or stupid or hire-provocateur

      The author honestly fulfills the Phashington money. ***
    2. Mostovik
      Mostovik 9 August 2012 08: 19
      +6
      It is especially clear that the Mistrals are too complicated for Russian sailors, but not for the French.
      1. lewerlin53rus
        lewerlin53rus 9 August 2012 08: 31
        +5
        Quote: Bridge
        It is especially clear that the Mistrals are too complicated for Russian sailors, but not for the French.

        Afftar, apparently, measures the intelligence of our military in his own way.
      2. tan0472
        tan0472 9 August 2012 08: 44
        0
        Maybe the author meant that Fr. sailors are more experienced, and the Russian do not have time to gain experience?
    3. tan0472
      tan0472 9 August 2012 08: 42
      +8
      Someone asked yesterday: -And where are the trolls? So they were busy. The article was written.
    4. red-threat
      red-threat 9 August 2012 08: 50
      +1
      Rather, a hirelings provocateur.
    5. lds040580
      lds040580 9 August 2012 09: 56
      -1
      It makes no sense for the Russian Federation to have a large surface fleet and large surface ships - I only agree with this point, we really don't need a large surface fleet, the same Hitler became disillusioned with his surface fleet, and if you recall the fate of his "pocket battleships" - it becomes clear why We can't catch the Americans at sea, but we can overtake them under water. I would also like to say that we need to develop aviation - that's where we have a big problem
      1. Eugene
        Eugene 9 August 2012 12: 04
        +1
        And the men didn’t know!
        Hitler worked with the surface fleet, at first they built according to the Washington agreements, and then they stupidly did not have time to build a normal surface fleet. Moreover, the German submarines on the sunken tonnage smoke nervously compared with the sailors of the US Navy submarines, not even talking about how many American aircraft carriers were sent to the bottom of Japanese ships.
  10. genzik161
    genzik161 9 August 2012 08: 13
    +4
    The author is my advice to you to quit smoking it will not bring to good
  11. Irbis9
    Irbis9 9 August 2012 08: 14
    +7
    I do not agree with the article ... In the Far East, we have the Kuril Islands, Sakhalin, Kamchatka. Where it may urgently need to deliver an assault reinforced by alligators)))
  12. Burbur
    Burbur 9 August 2012 08: 28
    +4
    What to discuss?
    Explicitly paid, commissioned, overtly hostile article. I would understand if I could post this article on a geypark or on the Umets ...
    But here ...
    1. tan0472
      tan0472 9 August 2012 08: 49
      +4
      The day before yesterday I was trolling on Echo. Interesting lesson. (News: Flooding in Ecuador. I: - I don’t know how, but Putin is to blame. Putin must resign. Putin must resign himself.) laughing
  13. aksakal
    aksakal 9 August 2012 08: 29
    +6
    Complete nonsense!!!!!!!
    but the landing barge, where the marines plunged, was faulty - I didn’t know such details. But if this is true, then this is tin !!! sad
    "and the clash of Russia with the entire NATO bloc. And in such a confrontation - with or without Iskanders - the Russian Federation, given the size and equipment of the armies of the member states of the North Atlantic Alliance, still has no chance to resist if only conventional weapons are used"- especially in light of the fact that even against Libya, NATO ran out of bombs and they ran, asking each other for a loan. Well, well. The author is simply very incompetent!
    "The costs of military-industrial complex products intended for use in military campaigns of the most fantastic nature divert money and material resources from the modernization of those sectors of our “defense industry” that can really produce the products needed to reflect real and potential threats"- these products" for companies of a fantastic nature "allow to keep the scientific and technical potential of Russia in good shape. The fifth generation fighter is such a fantastic product and it is unlikely that it will ever be used. A worthy enemy is only similar US aircraft, and a war with the United States is not yet visible in the future, and God forbid, it will not arise. And what, not to make a fifth-generation aircraft? The author on soap. As long as Russia is able to design and create such aircraft, it has an aviation industry. As it ceases, there will be no aviation industry. There will be no tanks Armata, there will be no mechanical engineering. And so on in all industries. You have to be a moron so as not to see this !!!!!! It seems that the author looks like one.
    "And even a 12-month service in the draft army of many young people turns away from concluding a contract with the Ministry of Defense to become a professional warrior"- the only place where the author is right. I have a military unit not far from my house. Soldiers are driven out of the territory of the unit for a whole march! And so all day they walk, bawl songs. They bawl very badly - you cannot tell what they are singing. Or" Katyusha "or" A soldier is walking down the street. "They march even worse. And so every day for many hours. And most importantly, no progress even in this matter, which they devote many hours. Why do they not spend the same number of hours at the training ground ? Why don't they, if the cartridges are expensive, not drive paintball at a serious level, with grades and punishments for poor grades instead of this jerkilov, which I see every day? I have a question - who the fuck needs such an army? What is the use of it? This is squalor, not an army!
    Admit it, what idiot put a plus on this article? I want to know the "hero". I'll rub it to death!
    1. prispek
      prispek 9 August 2012 09: 21
      +6
      Quote: aksakal
      Admit it, what idiot put a plus on this article? I want to know the "hero". I'll rub it to death!

      Well, I slapped. What's the problem? The fact that most of the site wants to stay in a sweet and happy state of not knowing and superiority over everything and everything.
      You read komenty and the impression that we will now tear NATO, China, and indeed anyone.
      What is wrong in the article? And the fact that the author does not speak out in the spirit of the jingoistic patriotic hysteria that rages on the forum. Otherwise, almost everything is correct. In the comments, as usual, there are charges of ordering and working off Washington money. Not any arguments, one shout: "How dare he ?! Why did he smoke ?! Complete nonsense !!!! He's not smart at all!" The smart ones have gathered here ...
      I wonder how you are going to train me? Make them march like those soldiers on the parade ground?
      1. lds040580
        lds040580 9 August 2012 09: 59
        -2
        I, too, plus, but only for Mistral and Yao
        1. aksakal
          aksakal 9 August 2012 11: 18
          +3
          Quote: lds040580
          I, too, plus, but only for Mistral and Yao
          - oddly plus. For the overall content of the article and the main message you need to put a mark, and it is in this article below the plinth. Yes, I noted that in some ways I agree with the author about the training of soldiers in one year of service, but because of this I’m not going to put a plus on the whole article
          1. wasjasibirjac
            wasjasibirjac 9 August 2012 19: 24
            0
            if you’re not well prepared for the year, maybe it’s worth changing the ways of preparing and preparing because it really is required and not the stepwork? but this is not a reason to cancel the call. after the army, reservists also need training. because, God forbid, there will be a serious war, there will be significant losses, so the parts will need to be replenished. they hope to win the war only by special forces and nuclear weapons - a myth. as we were told on the commissar - until the soldier’s foot stepped on the ground - this land belongs to the enemy.
      2. aksakal
        aksakal 9 August 2012 11: 15
        +3
        Have you slapped Well done.
        And now the points:
        1.
        Quote: prispek
        The fact that most of the site wants to stay in a sweet and happy state of not knowing and superiority over everything and everything.
        - just because the article is not jingoistic? And we can't live without extremes? Either "everything is fine, percransa marquise", or "everything is so bad that mama do not cry." Didn't you teach me to really and soberly look at things at school and institute (if I graduated from one. But I don't have the impression of having even eight grades of education)?
        2.
        Quote: prispek
        . Otherwise, almost everything is true
        - what exactly is right? what The Russian Federation generally does not make sense to have a large surface fleet and large surface ships? What does not need to develop complex high-tech products? Let the States work out, we don’t need it? You carefully read my post where I wrote why it needs to be developed, even if it may never be needed? Do you absolutely agree that we will lose NATO anyway, so do not oppose them, even if the NATO members are impudent to do something against the interests of Russia? And to concentrate on counteracting weaker opponents, against whom the lim of soldiers is not needed, and almost half less, 600-700 thousand. And therefore, to develop mainly equipment with police functions and for special operations. Do you seriously consider this nonsense right? Do you even know how to read? You know how to read, understand, but understand the meaning of what is written? Can you understand correctly? Did you learn to think somehow?
        I’m not going to train you, I don’t need you. To rub - do you know such a word and what does it mean? Google, look in the dictionary, understand this word. This is the thing I will do with you as soon as I see your post. I warn you right away - it hurts laughing laughing
        1. prispek
          prispek 9 August 2012 14: 26
          -5
          [quote = aksakal] And without extremes we can’t? [/ quote]
          The first phrase in your post [quote = aksakal] Complete nonsense !!!!!!! [/ quote]
          Is this not extreme? Or extreme when not 7 exclamation points. and 27-37 ... [quote = aksakal] And really and soberly look at things at school and institute
          He studied at the Soviet school and really and soberly did not learn to look at things. They taught to be faithful to the cause of building communism.
          The institute did not finish. It was necessary to work. There was no one to support me. [quote = aksakal] But I do not have the impression of owning you even eight classes of education) [/ quote]
          And I have no impression that you are a well-mannered, cultured person. [Quote = aksakal] Do you even know how to read? You know how to read, understand, but understand the meaning of what is written? Can you understand correctly? Did you learn to think somehow? [/ Quote]
          I was taught to think that rudeness is not an argument in a dispute. Correctly understand this understand how are you? [quote = aksakal] I’m not going to train you, I don’t need you. To rub - do you know such a word and what does it mean? [/ quote] Sorry in a hurry, confused and read it incorrectly. I am excusable, I'm not literate.
          [quote = aksakal] I immediately warn you - it hurts [/ quote] Oh, I'm afraid. I'm afraid ...
          1. aksakal
            aksakal 9 August 2012 14: 37
            +4
            Quote: prispek
            He studied at the Soviet school and really and soberly did not learn to look at things. They taught to be faithful to the cause of building communism. The institute did not finish. It was necessary to work. There was no one to support me

            - I see, I changed my mind about treading laughing laughing I realized why you have such pearls, and especially about oil, which amers, if they want to drop, why Russia immediately krants laughing I won’t eat, I’m ashamed of them. I’ll look for a thread more decent. Ok, and I apologize, I just did not think that this was written by people with an education, well, like that, because of circumstances in which they were not to blame. Although if people want to learn, anyone would have learned. In the USSR it was possible, education was free, and they also paid a scholarship. And it was possible to earn extra money. I did so. Now it’s much harder.
            1. prispek
              prispek 9 August 2012 17: 49
              -2
              Quote: aksakal
              - It’s clear, I changed my mind about plying. I understood what pearls are from you, and especially about oil, which amers, if they want to drop, why Russia will immediately have money.

              Well, that's nice that you changed your mind. And then I got scared.
              And pearls about oil are not mine. It is in our government that they are afraid that if the oil falls, they will have to curtail social programs.
              And I think so. They’re not worried about the social sphere; to the bulb they always had a social network. There simply will not be money to pay to the cops and Chechnya, and this is fraught with big problems. Of course, Russia doesn’t have cranks (you came up with it, but I didn’t say it), but the show-offs of the tandem will also decrease.
              Quote: aksakal
              I won’t eat, I’m ashamed of them. I’ll look for a thread more decent.

              Shame has nothing to do with it, for people like you don't have it.
              Look, look, you might find a couple of peanuts ...
      3. dmb
        dmb 9 August 2012 11: 30
        +3
        Isn't the author the same gentleman with the look characteristic of a certain category of citizens like Novodvorskaya? (This is not so much about beliefs, but about mental health.) If he usually writes to the "Military-Industrial Courier" about our losses in the Second World War, then comments are unnecessary. However, the assessment of the Mistrals suggests that sometimes. even people planning to fight separately with Ukraine or Poland have regains of consciousness, and attentive doctors and good care can return them to society.
  14. DIMS
    DIMS 9 August 2012 08: 43
    +6
    However, it is easy to understand that any missile strike on targets in the territory of the Commonwealth or, for example, Lithuania


    Straight eyes hurt. It’s the same thing. When trying to write original, do not forget the story
    1. red-threat
      red-threat 9 August 2012 08: 51
      +2
      The expert is still.
    2. s1н7т
      s1н7т 9 August 2012 12: 37
      +1
      Perhaps the author is a victim of the exam laughing
      I agree only with nuclear weapons, Mistral and annual service. Well, everyone knows that. The rest is nonsense, in my opinion.
  15. volcano
    volcano 9 August 2012 09: 10
    +5
    This is the "expert" who drew.

    Why is it so veiled?
    A large fleet is not needed, a smaller army ...... I would write easier ... We do not need an army and fleet, because we do not care kapets ..... Nerd damn
    It is assumed that the Iskanders are needed to strike at EuroPro, you are our smart.
    It is assumed that the Fleet (including the ocean) is needed just to protect our waters and the coast, as well as to counter the NATO Navy away from our shores, you are our analyst.
    And one million Army is not enough for Russia, you are our expert.
    And we need an alliance with NATO as the fifth wheel of a cart, you are our liberal.
    Would you write (emphasis on the first syllable) somewhere else.
    On some sort of orange forum. There your ideas and thoughts will be greeted by stormy and prolonged applause.
  16. Opertak
    Opertak 9 August 2012 09: 23
    +5
    Unfortunately, the article does not indicate who this B. Sokolov is. If the same one that counted more than 26 million of our soldiers killed in the Second World War (with a total of 27 million), then everything falls into place.
    About the Mistrals. Where and how to use them - I will leave it to the sailors to decide, but let me remind you that France BREAST defended Russia in front of the "world community" 08.08.08. Italy did the same. Is this why we buy Mistrals and Italian armored vehicles?
    As an expert, the author does not inspire confidence:
    - For six months now there has been neither air defense nor missile defense; there are East Kazakhstan Defense Forces.
    - "... the war with Ukraine, which has the second largest army in the CIS after Russia in terms of size and combat capability." - except for a smile, it causes nothing, the Ukrainian army is NOT combat ready and NOT combat ready (SIPRI Yearbook 2011).
    - "... However, it is not difficult to realize that any missile strike on targets on the territory of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth or, for example, Lithuania will lead not to a Russian-Polish or Russian-Lithuanian war, but to a collision between Russia and the entire NATO bloc." - does not correspond to reality. We can afford to roll out any European NATO country without any consequences (with the exception of England). The US doesn't even chirp militarily. According to the Committee of the Chiefs of Staff of the US Armed Forces, it takes a month to transfer 1 (ONE!) Division from America to the European theater of operations. And how many such divisions are needed to start a war with Russia? Or will we, like Yugoslavia, Iraq or Libya, look for a year as the US troops are urging on our borders? It's naive. Who does not believe - remember Poland in 1939. How much did the "strange war" help her?
    - About China. Russia begins with conventional weapons and wins in one day, China is falling apart, ceasing to exist as a single state, its fragments are tearfully asking the world community to help anyone who can Christ, Buddha and Allah for. The Chinese know about their weaknesses, which is why they sit quietly and are engaged in the creeping occupation of the territory of Russia.
    1. lds040580
      lds040580 9 August 2012 10: 03
      +3
      plus you, beyond the Mistral - only the blind don’t see why we bought them, and by the way, we take the armored personnel carriers from the Italians)))
    2. Nir
      Nir 9 August 2012 10: 10
      -1
      Quote: OperTak
      We can afford to roll out any European NATO country without any consequences.

      Dreaming is not harmful, and zigzid is not tossing bags, is it someone you can zakat without consequences? Pryobovat the most deprived member of NATO to touch all of NATO as a united front rolls the aggressor here you have the consequences. And to America it’s not time to transfer their divisions, they are already deployed in Europe. And where does the respected figure of 1 month for the transfer of the division come from? Have you read the plans of the General Staff of the USA? Have you read about quick-response groups?
      Quote: OperTak
      About China. Russia begins with conventional weapons and wins in one day

      And can you learn more about how it wins in a day? Or is it just balabalism and idle talk?
      in a word, it’s not a squeak to rotate dear.
      1. Opertak
        Opertak 9 August 2012 11: 22
        +2
        Quote: Nir
        Dreaming is not harmful, and zigzid is not tossing bags, is it someone you can zakat without consequences?
        - just roll up and that's it.
        1. Have you heard about Poland-1939? Read - everything will be the same.
        2. Tell me, where are the combat-ready American divisions deployed in Europe?
        3. 1 month - read an official document.
        4. Rapid response forces are designed for military conflicts with the popuias, and not for war - study their military composition :))
        5. Would be more prepared, would ask a question about the American nuclear weapons, but I know the answer to it :))
        6. Across China. The task for the freshman of the Academy (subject of the special chapter of higher mathematics): To determine the order of forces and means for the destruction of the dam (dimensions are attached) with a probability of not less than 0,9. Answer: an outfit of 3 KR, an electronic warfare battalion.
        For your information: The largest concrete dam in the world is the Three Gorges Dam in China on the Yangtze River. 360 million Chinese live on the banks of the Yangtze; in its delta, most of the agricultural land is located. Any questions?
        So, Nir, the military business is really for you - do not toss the bags :))
        1. Nir
          Nir 9 August 2012 12: 40
          -3
          Quote: OperTak
          Have you heard about Poland 1939? Read - everything will be the same.

          Well, what historical parallel is it? Well, you know what happened to those who climbed the Poles at 39? Not? I recall good lyuley received, including from the United States and Poland was a bait for a stupid Reich. You are dear with Syrian issues you cannot really decide what, but write like the USA and they won’t dare to blather, it’s your Foreign Ministry that can’t blather out without looking at the Washington Regional Committee. It’s enough for small Qatar and it’s enough even after diplomats counted the ribs. wink
          Quote: OperTak
          Tell me, where are the combat-ready American divisions deployed in Europe?

          And tell me where are your combat ready combat units deployed? Are you going to fight with these conscripts with 12 months old dohliks? Let it be they they can’t even storm the brothel, not like Europe.
          Quote: OperTak
          1 month - read an official document.

          And who gave it to you to read such a document from the US General Staff? Good to lie lol

          Quote: OperTak
          In China. The task for the freshman of the Academy (subject of the special chapter of higher mathematics): To determine the order of forces and means for the destruction of the dam (dimensions are attached) with a probability of not less than 0,9. Answer: an outfit of 3 KR, an electronic warfare battalion.

          As you have everything smoothly, on paper, you dudut the Chinese with cr and the EW battalion to make holes in them ... hold the corman wider strategist you are our site ...
          1. aksakal
            aksakal 9 August 2012 13: 52
            +5
            Quote: Nir
            Are you going to fight with these conscripts with 12 months old dohliks? Let it be they they can’t even storm a brothel, not like Europe

            - These dohliks, as you write, rolled out a bunch of mercenaries in Chechnya and a well-trained Georgian army. By the way, if anything, the Azerbaijani army is also not a question. Doubt it? Start to start aggression against Armenia. And NATO will not scare us - they didn’t crush us and we’ll crush them. We cannot prove this statement until they climb, but we have no reason to be afraid. And we are not going to take Sokolov’s statement on faith that a clash with NATO will immediately lead to the defeat of Russia. Let them try, but we'll see. If they were so weaker, Russia would have been rolled out for Georgia alone in August 2008. They didn’t roll it out, they were afraid. So there is something to be afraid of.
            Quote: Nir
            You are dear with Syrian issues, you cannot really decide what, but write like the United States and they won’t dare to blather, it’s your Foreign Ministry that cannot blather over the Washington Regional Committee

            - Yeah, not even worth the comment. I do not comment on squalor.
            Quote: Nir
            As you have everything smoothly, on paper, you dudut the Chinese with cr and the EW battalion to make holes in them ... hold the corman wider strategist you are our site ...

            - Yes, the Chinese will not climb, and that’s it.
            1. Nir
              Nir 9 August 2012 17: 22
              -1
              Quote: aksakal
              By the way, if anything, the Azerbaijani army is also not a question. Doubt it? Start to start aggression against Armenia.

              Well-educated you are our super duper, why did you drag Azerbaijan here, you like to show off that a super connoisseur can’t easily distinguish flags, but you don’t teach others to live, you’re just a bogeyman wink
              1. Roman Skomorokhov
                Roman Skomorokhov 9 August 2012 23: 48
                +1
                We pose the question differently: what can the army of Uzbekistan boast of?

                And, I warn you, choose expressions. I don't like your boorish tone.
                1. Nir
                  Nir 10 August 2012 08: 16
                  +2
                  Quote: Banshee
                  We pose the question differently: what can the army of Uzbekistan boast of?

                  And who is bragging dear, you found at least one offer with boasting on my part? In addition to the aksakal who boasts of his education and intelligence, no one here brags and simply gives out such a pearl as "malolteka go learn history" sorry, but who allowed him to call another forum participant, though not me personally, or the number of stars on the shoulder straps decides who what can write? Check out his posts above. And he himself has not even studied geography and posts off topic. I do not see anything shameful in putting an oversized snob in place. wink
                  ps
                  Rudeness breeds rudeness. Dear (I write without irony), sometimes I ask you to pay attention not only to those who have a negative rating because some people have a feeling of superiority over other forum participants. And sometimes a different opinion from the contrary gives an objective view of problems and questions.
                  1. prispek
                    prispek 10 August 2012 16: 57
                    +1
                    Nir, thank you for your support. smile
                    1. Roman Skomorokhov
                      Roman Skomorokhov 11 August 2012 00: 41
                      0
                      Quote: Nir
                      Have you found at least one sentence with boasting on my part?


                      No, because, in fact, I turned to you.

                      Quote: Nir
                      or the number of stars on uniform decides who can write what?


                      No, it doesn’t.

                      Quote: Nir
                      sometimes I ask you to pay attention not only to those who have a negative rating


                      I pay. Despite the rank and rating. Prispec will confirm. As well as the multi-star comrades Yarbai (ban), Yoshkin Kot (ban), Odessa and many many others.

                      Believe it or not, I don’t care about the color of your epaulettes, the number of stars and the flag of the country. And with regards to your argument with Aksakal - both are good. Polite, attentive, cultured. I thought for a long time, either to cook, or to wait. I decided to wait.
                      1. prispek
                        prispek 11 August 2012 08: 31
                        0
                        Good morning Roman.
                        Quote: Banshee
                        Prispec will confirm.

                        Sorry, I will not confirm. After that dive with Alessander Romanov, a warning hangs on me. Romanov is pure like an angel. You wrote that he was ogreb from you, and doubly. Please explain what this is expressed.
                        And yet, how do you assess the boorish provocative behavior of Aksakal?
                        Quote: aksakal
                        Admit it, what idiot put a plus on this article? I want to know the "hero". I'll rub it to death!

                        This is not only about me, but about everyone who does not agree with Aksakal. A priori ALL of those he considers idiots. Promises to be dismissive, down. Calls for action against opponents:
                        Quote: aksakal
                        I already know one. Prispec. The rest also need to be dealt with.

                        Then he simply goes on bullying and insulting. You pay attention to Nira, and when he substantiates his position, you declare:
                        Quote: Banshee
                        I thought for a long time, either to cook, or to wait. I decided to wait.
                        What to wait for? When the insult will answer the insult and it will be possible to slap a warning to someone who does not like?
                        Sorry, but your objectivity and impartiality is in great doubt.
                        All the best.
                      2. Roman Skomorokhov
                        Roman Skomorokhov 11 August 2012 14: 09
                        0
                        Quote: prispek
                        Romanov is pure like an angel. You wrote that he was robbed from you, and doubly. Please explain what this is expressed.


                        I gave him a warning at the same time as you. Romanov went to complain to me Smirnov, he took it off. What Romanov happily wrote to me about. Since I gave you warnings at the same time, I considered it fair to remove the warning from you as well.

                        Quote: prispek
                        your objectivity and impartiality is in great doubt.


                        You have full right to contact the administrators. Just forgive me, it's not my fault that you succumb to provocations and begin to insult opponents.
                        And, the most basic. I do not set as my goal to warn everyone. I like everyone here who has brains. And those who do not, they are often funny.

                        Quote: prispek
                        Then he simply goes on bullying and insulting.


                        What are you talking about now? It sounds pointless.
                      3. prispek
                        prispek 11 August 2012 15: 27
                        0
                        Quote: Banshee
                        You have full right to contact the administrators.

                        Well what are you, I'm not Romanov
                        Quote: Banshee
                        Since I gave you warnings at the same time, I considered it fair to remove the warning from you as well.

                        However, Romanov has probably been clean for a couple of days and there were 3 warnings on him, and you removed the shift only today, and even then after my previous post on this discussion.
                        Quote: Banshee
                        It’s not my fault that you succumb to provocations and begin to insult opponents.

                        It was once. I try not to give in, but it’s unpleasant when the moderator is present and does not see the posts of certain comrades.
                        Quote: Banshee
                        What are you talking about now? It sounds pointless.

                        Well I do not know. Maybe for you this is not an insult:
                        Quote: aksakal
                        what an idiot slapped plus this article


                        Quote: prispek
                        Quote: aksakal
                        It looks like a teenage puberty. How old are you, youngster?

                        Quote: prispek
                        Quote: aksakal
                        hear, youngster, you know that twenty years - twenty-five years ago

                        Quote: aksakal
                        ". Didn't they teach you to really and soberly look at things at school and institute (if I graduated from one. But I don't have the impression of having you even eight grades of education)?

                        Although what am I writing to you? After all, one of the posts where these quotes came from is deleted, so you or another moderator read it. So this is not considered an insult. Then a simple trick. Insert your nickname in these calls so that it turns out that they are turning to you and re-read again. Like?
                      4. Alexander Romanov
                        Alexander Romanov 11 August 2012 15: 36
                        +2
                        Quote: prispek

                        Quote: Banshee
                        You have full right to contact the administrators.
                        Well what are you, I'm not Romanov

                        You are not used to defending your innocence, and therefore you can’t connect two phrases to explain the essence of your disagreement. Yes, the level of education among modern youth is lame. You cannot humiliate it evenly.
                      5. spender
                        spender 11 August 2012 15: 41
                        +2
                        Quote: Alexander Romanov
                        Yes, the level of education among modern youth is lame. You cannot humiliate it evenly.

                        Some sort of showdown in the sandbox. She envies that someone defended his innocence by the legal method adopted on this resource and immediately begins to insult, annoying that he himself could not do it.
                        Amazing personalities come across, he himself tries to bring others under the ban to the moderator, posts phrases and calls to the moderator, but he doesn’t criticize himself laughing
                      6. Alexander Romanov
                        Alexander Romanov 11 August 2012 15: 45
                        +2
                        Alexei, yes, this one somehow agreed with me, I still see his grudge. Although I didn’t insult him. Man, he won’t act like that.
                      7. spender
                        spender 11 August 2012 15: 47
                        +2
                        Quote: Alexander Romanov
                        Yes, this one somehow agreed with me, I see that the grudge is still eating. Although I didn’t insult him. Man, he won’t act like that.

                        I don’t know how I’m used to the fact that we got together and fought and broke up, but to live saving up grievances is somehow not in Russian and it’s bad for our health smile
                        It’s amazing how the moderator still accepts loyal appeals to him, but the devil knows the blame for what laughing
                      8. prispek
                        prispek 11 August 2012 16: 37
                        -3
                        Quote: Alexander Romanov
                        Alexander Romanov

                        Quote: spender
                        spender

                        Here they are, handsome! And why are you so few? Your company is well known on the site.
                        Quote: Alexander Romanov
                        Alexei, yes, this one somehow agreed with me, I still see his grudge. Although I didn’t insult him. Man, he won’t act like that.

                        Well, as far as I remember, they agreed. and dispersed. You asked me not to pester you anymore, I promised not to communicate with you. Received warnings and dispersed. So, no, it’s boring for you. At first we ran to the administrator. Man, you have nothing to say. I just don’t overeat, I mentioned Banshee, I answered him. And what do you have to do with it, from which side?
                        Quote: Alexander Romanov
                        You are not used to defending your innocence, and therefore you can’t connect two phrases to explain the essence of your disagreement. Yes, the level of education among modern youth is lame. You cannot humiliate it evenly.

                        Yes, I’m somehow linking it. and not only two words, this is your posts in two - three lines.
                        Thank you for the "youth". How old are you? And by the way, how is it worthy to humiliate? To cheat correctly? Enlighten the ignorant.spender,
                        So you don’t get into someone else’s sandbox. You didn’t stand here and no one called you here
                        Quote: spender
                        She envies that someone defended his innocence by the legal method adopted on this resource and immediately begins to insult, annoying that he himself could not do it.

                        Who am I offending here? Do not you? Oh, excuse me, Aksakala? So is he from yours? Well, so you ask the administrator, in the legal manner adopted on this site, that your digging be entered with an identification mark. So that everyone knows and doesn’t get involved accidentally, otherwise it stinks for a long time and does not lag behind
                        Quote: spender
                        I don’t know how I’m used to the fact that we got together and fought and broke up, but to live saving up grievances is somehow not in Russian and it’s bad for our health

                        Yes, you do not protect your health, you are our Russian. Climb into the old showdown and even not your own. Do not tear yourself ...
                      9. spender
                        spender 11 August 2012 16: 45
                        +5
                        Quote: prispek
                        So you don’t get into someone else’s sandbox. You didn’t stand here and no one called you here

                        Please, sit in your sandbox and make "Easter cakes" winked
                        Quote: prispek
                        Who am I offending here? Do not you? Oh, excuse me, Aksakala? So is he from yours?

                        First of all, you insult yourself with such a boorish syllable. People on "our" and "your" are not used to divide, there are members of the forum who are pleasant to me in communication and there are those who are not pleasant.
                        Quote: prispek
                        Climb into the old showdown and even not your own. Do not tear yourself ...

                        Showdowns lead through PM, and if you post a comment, then be prepared for a collective discussion fool
                      10. Oleg0705
                        Oleg0705 11 August 2012 17: 13
                        -5
                        spender,
                        Quote: spender

                        Alexander Romanov


                        So you are also Yabid? complaining to admins? clearly .. laughing and you teach me decency
                        spender ah what a dizzying career !!!!!! laughing
                      11. prispek
                        prispek 11 August 2012 19: 13
                        0
                        Quote: Oleg0705
                        spender ah what a dizzying career !!!!!!

                        Hello Oleg.
                        Enlighten me, where did he come from? The profile is the first day on the site. According to the content of the comments of the regulars. Yes, and you, apparently, know him more than one day
                      12. Oleg0705
                        Oleg0705 11 August 2012 19: 28
                        +1
                        prispek,
                        Hello Vladimir.
                        I would not like to be like them on this, do not blame me for such an answer; education is different; they did not teach me this; the truth will come out all the same
                        sorry.
                        Regards, Oleg.
                      13. prispek
                        prispek 11 August 2012 20: 08
                        0
                        Quote: Oleg0705
                        truth will come out all the same

                        Is not a fact. And to put a swindler and a boor in that pose with a cathode, he is worthy, that does not mean to be like him. Already you, they are spread rot and will spread rot regardless of decency. So the choice is this; either fight or leave.
                      14. Oleg0705
                        Oleg0705 11 August 2012 20: 15
                        0
                        Quote: prispek
                        So the choice is this; either fight or leave.


                        I will fight with them until the eternal ban, but it is already a success that visitors know about them and will react accordingly it doesn’t matter that I will not be here, this is not the end of my life and my conscience will be clear.
                      15. prispek
                        prispek 11 August 2012 17: 53
                        0
                        Quote: spender
                        Please, sit in your sandbox and make "Easter cakes"

                        Well, that's nice, very grateful.
                        Quote: spender
                        People on "our" and "your" are not used to divide, there are members of the forum who are pleasant to me in communication and there are those who are not pleasant.

                        Well, yes, they’re not used to it ... Otherwise, I’m not able to read the first day on the site.
                        And I don’t remember when we talked swami? But your appearance with Romanov is just a theatrical stage; Two gossips are standing aside and are discussing aloud. One: "Oh, Shur, look at this ignorant" (He envies those who defended their innocence .... Amazing people come across ... etc.)
                        Another: "Yes, I know him - a village, a village, and even a milk sucker" (A man will not behave like that .... Yes, the level of education among modern youth is lame ... etc.)
                        First: "And as soon as you are not ashamed with your pork snout and in our Kalashny row" (It's amazing how else a moderator ...)
                        Well and so on and so forth.
                        Such talents disappear ...
                        Quote: spender
                        Showdowns lead through PM,

                        I’m not doing a showdown, not my profile But I don’t get into someone else’s conversation, like that, like you, from the outside and rude.
                        Read the posts of Aksakal, Nira, Banshee and mine again. Maybe you will understand why all this is not in PM.
                      16. Alexander Romanov
                        Alexander Romanov 11 August 2012 17: 02
                        +3
                        prispek,
                        Quote: prispek
                        So, no, it’s boring for you. At first we ran to the administrator. Man, you have nothing to say. I just don’t overeat, I mentioned Banshee, I answered him

                        Well, and what do you write lies, I didn’t have any complaints to you, I wrote to Smirnov in connection with my disagreement with the Banshee moderator. There were no complaints against you! Not bad, I should have mentioned it, like I don’t go to Raman to write complaints. Well done nothing to say .And why the novels are clean. Responsible in life for yourself and do not drag me into the analysis. There are Sait rules, if you do not agree with them go to another Sait. And I'm 46 years old.
                      17. prispek
                        prispek 11 August 2012 18: 52
                        0
                        Quote: Alexander Romanov
                        Well, and what do you write lies, I didn’t have any complaints to you, I wrote to Smirnov in connection with my disagreement with the Banshee moderator.

                        Where is the lie?
                        Quote: Banshee
                        Prispec will confirm.

                        I was mentioned, and on the wrong side. I answered.
                        Quote: prispek
                        Sorry, I will not confirm. After that dive with Alessander Romanov, a warning hangs on me. Romanov is pure like an angel. You wrote that he was ogreb from you, and doubly. Please explain what this is expressed.

                        Banshee, after our dive, issued me a warning. I answered in a personal and brought your then words and asked if they are an insult, indicating that my post was the answer to yours. Got an affirmative answer and forgot that story. But you, as I see, have not forgotten. Not only did you go to the administrator, you still haven’t said anything about the second side of the conflict, and apparently presented all this as a conflict between you and Banshee.
                        Now you are declared with help. Be rude to me and attribute me insults and lies. At the same time, do not forget to put each other pluses
                        Quote: Alexander Romanov
                        like I’m not a raman to go write complaints. Well done nothing to say

                        And what - am I Romanov? I did not run to the administrator. We had a fight and fled - our business. No, you consider yourself right and I am not, and continue to act on the long-forgotten conflict.
                        I do not touch your posts, although there is something for which and if it were not for the conversation with the modernist in general, your nickname would not have mentioned and the topic had not been raised earlier. But since you point me to "legal ways", why can't I find out where the consequences of our dispute have gone with you, and why they stayed with me? In addition, you had 3 warnings, why did the admin remove everything from you? Explain.
                        Quote: Alexander Romanov
                        Responsible in life for yourself and do not drag me into the analysis. There are Sait rules, if you do not agree with them go to another Sait.
                        Why doesn't this involve you? You then napontovalis (and today too) and want me, like a sucker, to carry on myself "forego", I you walked lightly with a friend and even joke at me?
                        The rules do not say anything about removing warnings. So you went around and you still have the audacity to blame me for being unmarried, lack of education, lying, inability to defend my innocence and inability to connect a few words.
                      18. prispek
                        prispek 11 August 2012 18: 59
                        0
                        I have connected enough words, I hope. I almost forgot. You are younger than me. though not much but younger. So leave your "youth" banter for someone else.
                      19. Oleg0705
                        Oleg0705 11 August 2012 17: 31
                        0
                        Quote: spender
                        he damn modera he blames what


                        but this is not a buzz themselves sorted out, I remembered one quote and lined himself with lard and threw firewood. Stoker Lyaksey laughing
          2. Opertak
            Opertak 9 August 2012 16: 52
            +1
            Quote: Nir
            and you know what happened to those who on the Poles in 39 climbed
            - in the know and proud of it - two of my grandfathers Lyuli threw Germans. And the USA did nothing to the Germans - during the defense of ONE House of Pavlov the Germans we put more than they lost throughout Poland :))))

            Quote: Nir
            And tell me where are your combat ready combat units deployed?
            - "IN. Chirkin noted that at present in the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation a little less than 100 brigades ”are parts of constant combat readiness. Enough? Now you call me at least ONE NATO! :))))) Note to you: The largest foreign military contingent of the USA is in Germany (about 70). But these are purely occupying forces, the US plans provided for in a critical situation (an attempt by Germany to break the Chancellor's Act) to divide it into occupation zones again: American, English, French.

            Quote: Nir
            And who gave it to you to read such a document from the US General Staff?
            - There is no general staff in the US Armed Forces. This is the first. Second: I personally read and thousands of our other people read - designers, technologists, developers, etc. If you think that the designer in the military-industrial complex is sitting and racking his brains: what would be invented for the native Army, then you are extremely naive. Intelligence reports (in terms of) related to all research institutes, design bureaus, etc. Based on their analysis, weapons are being improved in 99 cases out of 100.

            Quote: Nir
            As you are doing smoothly, then on paper, the Chinese people will give you an ear
            And this I hear from the Uzbek ?! No comment, as they say, - YOU AROUND such an adder is explosive, but you are talking about the Chinese threat to me - I’m a pastel! laughing
            1. Nir
              Nir 9 August 2012 17: 18
              -1
              Quote: OperTak
              there is no general staff in the US Armed Forces. This is the first. Second: I personally read and thousands of our other people read - designers, technologists, developers, etc. If you think that the designer in the military-industrial complex is sitting and racking his brains: what would be invented for the native Army, then you are extremely naive. Intelligence reports (in terms of) related to all research institutes, design bureaus, etc. Based on their analysis, weapons are being improved in 99 cases out of 100.

              From what you call the General Staff or otherwise the same military command organ will not change anything, but the fact that you supposedly read something oh how doubtful.
              Quote: OperTak
              The largest foreign military contingent of the United States is located in Germany (about 70). But these are purely occupying forces

              Well, what else do you write that they were eating there and they don’t fit into underpants, they’ll also not take pearls like acupation for me, they’ll not fight in the yard in 2012, 1945 lol
              Quote: OperTak
              And this I hear from the Uzbek ?!

              And it’s not me writing that we’ll drop anyone and the USA won’t even blather, you write only as I wrote figures above who will give you something to do without looking at the Washington Regional Committee. wink
              Quote: OperTak
              You are talking about the Chinese threat

              I didn’t explain you about China, but you got it brave and assured you that you’ll dash off China only when they write to you that it’s good to drive a blizzard and you leave the topic and write about Uzbeks and the viper lol good already idle talk and flaunt it is not clear what. wink
              and about 100 brigades it’s good, of course, just don’t need to la la; we ourselves know what composition there ...
              1. Opertak
                Opertak 9 August 2012 17: 58
                +1
                Quote: Nir
                From what you call the General Staff or otherwise the same military command organ will not change anything
                - Sorry, outright stupidity, and the essence of the work, and its contents are still changing. Or say that in the General Staff and the General Staff they are doing the same thing? lol


                Quote: Nir
                also to me pearls like acupuncture and will not fight
                - they won’t, they are tied to their tasks there. Do you really think that the Americans spend at least $ 1,5 billion a year on their maintenance in order to threaten Russia from there? It is naive, and most importantly, unjustifiably from a military point of view.

                About China. Refute my arguments and deal with the end! :))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) It just won’t work out - because I'm right. And just in case, remember: God doesn’t give horns to a vigorous cow - India is nearby, which sleeps and sees how to strangle it. As soon as China weakens a bit, they will peck it all, including the small but very belligerent Vietnam, where the army always has at hand maps of Beijing - to make it easier to clean up.
    3. prispek
      prispek 9 August 2012 10: 41
      +1
      Quote: OperTak
      We can afford to roll out any European NATO country without any consequences.

      Hello Vladimir.
      Are you serious or joking?
      Quote: OperTak
      The US will not even militarily tweet.

      Yes, the United States will simply bring down the price of oil and you and I will have to urgently move from Moscow to the village, switch to pasture. (it’s easier for me, I’m already out of town) And as soon as we stop paying tribute to Chechnya, we will no longer be up to NATO.
      Quote: OperTak
      About China. Russia begins with conventional weapons and wins in one day,

      Terrible? Yes, one RAP in two hours! And you are busy with some kind of China day wassat
      1. Opertak
        Opertak 9 August 2012 11: 25
        +1
        prishpek, read the comments above - everything is said there.

        PS Comparison of Grozny with China, to put it mildly, is tactless - Grozny is our territory, and China is not (for now :).
        1. prispek
          prispek 9 August 2012 20: 55
          0
          Quote: OperTak
          PS Comparison of Grozny with China, to put it mildly, tactless

          I do not compare China with Grozny, I compared your statement:
          Quote: OperTak
          About China. Russia begins with conventional weapons and wins in one day,

          With the famous saying of the "best minister" of defense.
          Your arguments regarding a possible military conflict between Russia and China do not seem convincing to me. The fact is that the Russian Armed Forces are not the USSR Armed Forces. And it's not even about armament and numbers. The fighting spirit, the mood is not the same as during the conflict on Damansky.
          And I think the Chinese Armed Forces are not the same. Of course, the Chinese are not fighters. In my opinion, I read from Kozhinov that the Chinese chroniclers described military campaigns in this spirit; "in such and such a year, in such and such a place, several tens of thousands of idlers gathered and went to the west (south. east ..), where they were all killed. And on business."
          Nevertheless, defeating China in a day is too much.
          And don't you really think that the dam in "The Three Gorges" can be destroyed by three CDs and an EW battalion? Yes, we have the most powerful orbital constellation of satellites at the bottom of the Pacific Ocean. So this does not mean that we will be allowed to fly up to the firing range and that we will get there. In any case, recently we have been hitting educational goals only conditionally. And missile launches are also "conditionally successful"
          Sincerely ...
          1. Opertak
            Opertak 9 August 2012 21: 52
            0
            Quote: prispek
            In any case, recently we have been hitting educational goals only conditionally. And missile launches are also "conditionally successful"
            Sincerely ...

            With no less respect: Your application is NOT true. Real shooting - real results. If you think that something can be hidden in the army, then this is the deepest error - the security forces in the troops and the military prosecutors eat their bread for nothing, checked it on their own skin :)) They can write something extra (for reporting), but to hide something - does not happen.

            Regarding morale, etc. - In 1941, too, they did not vigorously start, but they finished it great. So it will be now, if that.

            About the Three Gorges. If you think that scientists are paid for philosophizing in the military-industrial complex, then this is not so. Any theory is tested in practice, and if they do not correspond to each other, then shish with oil to such a scientist, and not money - a bare salary and a reprimand in a work book. Each coefficient has been verified many times, confirmed in practice.
            1. prispek
              prispek 9 August 2012 23: 28
              +1
              Quote: OperTak
              If you think that you can hide something in the army, then this is the deepest mistake

              I think you can. and this is not a fallacy. Of course, I have a completely different level, but even at this level it was noticeable how much was hiding in the army. Examples from personal experience;
              1) The performance characteristics and combat characteristics of our equipment and weapons were not published, and curiosity was not welcomed. If the technical characteristics of the equipment of NATO countries and not only could be freely read in the journal "Foreign Military Review", then when I asked about the technical characteristics of the BMP-1, the officers looked at me as if I were a spy and trying to find out a military secret.
              2) Before training firing from MANPADS, the deputy armament sat all night in the kung and tested the materiel. As a result, out of 10 MANPADS, he selected 5 (rejected the rest) Of the 5 missiles, 4 left the containers.
              This is the mid-80s, which will be hard to imagine now.
              Quote: OperTak
              Each coefficient is repeatedly verified, confirmed in practice.

              I also doubt very much. practice often does not confirm theoretical calculations.
              Quote: OperTak
              in 1941, too, they did not vigorously start, but they did a great job.

              Well, it took time, and not a little time.
              Quote: OperTak
              So it will be now, if that.

              Here, as they say; God forbid! But trust in God, but don’t be fooled.
              If I write something contrary to the general opinion, then only so that we would not blunder at the right time.
              Thanks for the calm, consistent answers. All the best.
              1. Opertak
                Opertak 10 August 2012 01: 45
                0
                Quote: prispek
                I think you can. and this is not a fallacy
                - misconception. For the little things - yes, for the big ones - definitely not. I personally had experience when I thought for 4 hours: to lie to Putin for the good of the cause or to tell the truth and fill up my boss. This is an interesting and very visual story. If you want, then in PM I can write how it was (applies to our VZG radar in Armavir).

                Quote: prispek
                The performance characteristics and combat characteristics of our equipment and weapons were not published, and curiosity was not welcomed. If the performance characteristics of the equipment of NATO countries and not only could be freely read in the journal "Foreign Military Review"
                - This is a common practice. The performance characteristics of their weapons and weapons always have a higher security stamp than foreign ones.

                Quote: prispek
                As a result, out of 10 MANPADS, he selected 5 (rejected the rest) Of the 5 missiles, 4 left the containers.
                - Now it’s most likely worse - the lack of military acceptance did not benefit our Army and the military-industrial complex. But the stock of weapons is so great that there is something to compose an outfit of funds for solving any combat mission.

                Quote: prispek
                If I write something contrary to the general opinion
                . You know, I'm tolerant of any opinion, BUT! if only it is justified, and not based on personal convictions and unreasonable thoughts. So if there is something serious - write, I will be happy to take part in the discussion.
                1. prispek
                  prispek 10 August 2012 17: 23
                  0
                  Good afternoon.
                  Quote: OperTak
                  lie to Putin for the good of the case or tell the truth

                  I knew that you are somewhere close to those who make decisions. smile
                  Your words confirm the ability to not only hide, but simply to deceive.
                  Quote: OperTak
                  If you want, then in PM I can write how it was

                  Of course I want. If it does not bother you, I will be very grateful.
                  Quote: OperTak
                  - This is a common practice.

                  I don’t think so. Articles in the "Foreign Military Review" indicating the performance characteristics and combat capabilities of enemy equipment and weapons are translations from publicly available sources. Well, in fact, this is not intelligence information.
                  Quote: OperTak
                  BUT! if only it is justified, and not based on personal convictions and unreasonable thoughts.

                  Here lies a famous catch. Who determines the validity? And unless personal beliefs give the right to their own opinion.
                  You will say that personal opinion should be supported by sources. But where are the guarantees that the sources are trustworthy?
                  Sincerely ...
      2. aksakal
        aksakal 9 August 2012 11: 36
        +1
        Quote: prispek
        Yes, the United States will simply bring down the price of oil and you and I will have to urgently move from Moscow to the village, switch to pasture. (it’s easier for me, I’m already out of town) And as soon as we stop paying tribute to Chechnya, we will no longer be up to NATO.

        - laughing laughing laughing laughing My stomach hurts! That annealed so annealed !!!!! laughing It looks like a teenage puberty. How old are you, youngster?
        Quote: prispek
        Terrible? Yes, one RAP in two hours! And you are busy with some kind of China day
        - you hear, youngster, you know that twenty or twenty-five years ago, China launched a full-scale aggression against a tiny Vietnam and grabbed to the fullest in less than a week. Moreover, from Vietnam, which did not have full-fledged heavy weapons. It is true that before this, the States were raked from Vietnam, but they were not so quickly and not so obvious, the Vietnamese drove them out of the cold more and more tired of dying, and the Vietnamese only got into a rage. It was all the same for them to die, not to die - the main thing was to win.
        And yet - the Chinese in the asset of history do not have a single military victory at all !!!! Militarily in history - China is a rare LUSER. The only exception is the war to help the DPRK in the 50s, but even there, the help of the Soviet comrades could not have done. Learn the story, youngster!
        The danger of China is not militarily. They take it to others, for which it seems like they cannot even declare war. Economic, demographic expansion, etc.
        That's about whom the professor wrote that here on the forum there are absolutely "gifted brains" chelas. True, he exaggerated by writing that there are 95% of them. You are one of those. This is clearly not 95%, but finding you is unpleasant for me - it means that the professor is partly right.
        1. G_sl
          G_sl 9 August 2012 12: 05
          0
          Do not blame people for ignorance of history, your knowledge is also one-sided. Only the USSR supported the version of the victory of the Vietnamese over the Chinese.
          1. aksakal
            aksakal 9 August 2012 14: 00
            +4
            Quote: G_Sl
            Do not blame people for ignorance of history, your knowledge is also one-sided. Only the USSR supported the version of the victory of the Vietnamese over the Chinese.

            - Yes, even then I was in fairly high school and I heard all the news on the news personally. As well as about the situation in the Falklands, about the Iran-Iraq war. And I will tell you this - if the Soviet media lied only when it came to the ideology of the USSR, then I’m not sure. And such news, neutral for the USSR, was covered fairly objectively. Everything that I heard at that time about the Falklands, about the death of Sheffield from the French Exocet rocket, everything was confirmed. So the Soviet media objectively covered the military events of those times. I think this also applied to the Sino-Vietnamese conflict. The Chinese and all business were there. That the aircraft were not used? So the Vietnamese did not apply. Links to the studio about winning China in that war. We will watch.
        2. Opertak
          Opertak 9 August 2012 12: 15
          +2
          Quote: aksakal
          twenty-five ago, China launched a full-scale aggression against a tiny Vietnam and scrambled to the fullest in less than a week


          From myself I will add the following: the Chinese are exceptionally cowardly and Unworkable nation, although very impudent. An example from Damansky. If in the ancient Roman army decimation was carried out - the execution of every tenth warrior of the legion or army as a punishment for fleeing the battlefield, surrendering fortresses, cowardice or failure to comply with the order, then the Chinese performed tremination on the Daman - executed every third - did not help. This is, so to speak, on the lower level. As for the top military-political leadership of China. Intercepted documents of the Central Committee of the CPC were stored in the USSR Ministry of Foreign Affairs after our MLRS covered a peaceful Chinese village instead of troops. A special panic among the leadership of the PRC was caused by the fact that the hospital with the wounded and medical staff was completely burned out. They considered this a sign that the USSR was ready for extreme and most cruel measures. All provocations ceased immediately, although that blow was made by mistake.
        3. FREGATENKAPITAN
          FREGATENKAPITAN 9 August 2012 12: 46
          +2
          ..... In fairness, regarding the Sino-Vietnamese conflict, I’ll add ........ China didn’t practically use aviation (guess why?),
          ..And past the Chinese embassy in Ulan Bator, columns of Soviet tanks and equipment went for days to the Chinese border (I personally saw) ...
          I still remember the provinces of Vietnam where the DB took place ... -Kao-Bang, Lang-Sean .... well done Vietnamese were ...
        4. prispek
          prispek 9 August 2012 14: 01
          -3
          Quote: aksakal
          It looks like a teenage puberty. How old are you, youngster?

          And you? smile Here already one elderly comrade tried to teach me life. True, he later justified himself, saying that I'm old sclerosis and all that ...
          Quote: aksakal
          hear, youngster, you know that twenty years - twenty-five years ago

          Well, yes, in 1979 it was 20-25 years ago. Sclerosis...
          Quote: aksakal
          Learn the story, youngster!

          Thanks for the advice.
          Quote: aksakal
          That's about whom the professor wrote that here on the forum there are absolutely "gifted brains" chelas. True, he exaggerated by writing that there are 95% of them. You are one of those. This is clearly not 95%, but finding you is unpleasant for me - it means that the professor is partly right.

          You misunderstood, This is written about you There are really a lot of people like you. Certainly not 95%, but still too much, and "finding you" (who taught you the Russian language?) Did not come as a surprise to me.
          1. aksakal
            aksakal 9 August 2012 14: 39
            +2
            Thanks for the advice.- use, maybe it’s good.
            And you? Here already one elderly comrade tried to teach me life. True, he later justified himself, saying that I'm old sclerosis and all that ...
            - Come on, try to bring me to this. Especially tell me about oil that the States will drop at once, and we will go to the pasture laughing laughingI already understood your level from this pearl. Malshik pants on the straps! laughing Here is naive, and already in a hurry to put up marks and argue with the big guys. Let's justify your "drop the price", since I took up such a statement, and I'll see if I can eat you this time or somehow later, but before that I laugh heartily. Tell us what instruments the States have for this, what reason for them to drop prices at all, even if there are instruments for dropping, about which you will tell laughing
            About 79 years old - you don't have to remember the dates. I remember listening to the news on our Soviet news and on Radio Liberty - it was not always jammed. So I'm almost an eyewitness, and here someone G-SI proves something to me. The facts in the studio, we will analyze.
            1. prispek
              prispek 9 August 2012 18: 25
              -1
              Quote: aksakal
              Especially tell me about oil that the States will drop at once, and we will go to the pasture

              I already wrote about oil in a post above. I wrote that you have to go to pasture (that is, eat from the garden, and not, as we used to, from the supermarket) and you read or understood GO to pasture. Catch the difference, you educated ours?
              Quote: aksakal
              I already understood your level from this pearl. Malshik pants with straps! Here is naive, and already in a hurry to put up marks and argue with the big guys. Let's justify your "drop the price", since I took up such a statement, and I'll see if I can eat you this time or somehow later, but before that I laugh heartily.
              Such a big uncle, but without an accordion ... There is someone gathered ... Hungry or what?
              Quote: aksakal
              About 79 years old - you don't have to remember the dates. I remember listening to the news on our Soviet news and on Radio Liberty - it was not always jammed.
              Of course, I don’t have to remember, but I didn’t guess on Google? laughing Or advise others - not to strain yourself?
              And Radio Liberty is of course a great authority.
              Quote: aksakal
              So I'm almost an eyewitness
              What an ancient Aksakal you are! No one has survived since those epic times. Only you. Tell us, poor youngsters, what other great revelations Radio Liberty has told you
              And, I almost forgot, so how old are you?
              1. aksakal
                aksakal 9 August 2012 23: 08
                +1
                Quote: prispek
                I wrote that you have to go to pasture (that is, eat from the garden, and not, as we used to, from the supermarket) and you read or understood GO to pasture
                - so you will substantiate how the amers will drop oil, what tools they have for this, and what is the general reason for them to do this? Or cling to words like what's the difference, go to pasture or go to pasture? I do not see any semantic difference here - your statement that the USA will drop prices, as a result of which RUSSIANS WILL BE FORCED TO VERY SIGNIFICANTLY RESTRICT THEMSELVES IN DIET, CONSUMPTION AND LIVING STANDARDS. This is how I understood your statement in your that naive post, this is how the majority of members of the forum will understand my statement about "Grazing." So what you are hooked on is a motherfucker. Your statement that our Russian officials are afraid of this cannot be a substantial basis for such your categorical judgment, which you present as the ultimate truth - officials are afraid of many things, incl. and failure to meet their budgetary plans and social commitments, but their concerns need not be taken seriously. Most often, these statements are made as a safety cushion - what if oil prices actually fall, there will be delays in the payment of pensions, they will start asking me - and here I’m just a newspaper with my statement last quarter that a significant drop in oil prices could lead to significant difficulties in the social sphere, and I warned you, I knew, but what can I do? Be patient, but bribes from me are smooth, no one will accuse me of unprofessionalism now. And if oil prices do not fall, these statements will be forgotten. Hence the conclusion - these statements of officials - of a penny value. In short, substantiate your statement more seriously! I'm waiting.
                1. prispek
                  prispek 10 August 2012 17: 51
                  0
                  Quote: aksakal
                  In short, justify your statement more seriously! I'm waiting.

                  What, emotions subsided? Is it possible to communicate calmly and without insults?
                  Oil prices will wait, there is no where to go. First, to clarify the situation, a few questions.
                  1. So how old are you? Judging by your posts you are born in 1964-1966. Am I not mistaken?
                  2. Which university did you graduate?
                  Z. Did you serve in the armed forces?
                  4. How many children do you have?
                  5. Is Russian your native language? The question is not idle. How I will evaluate the style of your posts depends on your answer.
                  Well, the last question; for yesterday’s rudeness do not want to apologize?
                  Waiting for answers ...
    4. aksakal
      aksakal 9 August 2012 11: 24
      +4
      Quote: OperTak
      About the Mistrals. Where and how to use them - I will leave it to the sailors to decide, but let me remind you that France BREAST defended Russia in front of the "world community" 08.08.08. Italy did the same. Is this why we buy Mistrals and Italian armored vehicles?
      - unfortunately, for such political things it is customary to thank, here you are right.
      For all other positions as soberly. Why minusanuli something? They put the plus below, I put the plus, but in the end - the minus. Does this Sokolov have so many fans? I already know one. Prispec. The rest also need to be dealt with.
      1. Opertak
        Opertak 9 August 2012 11: 37
        +1
        Aksakal, thanks for the support, but these disadvantages are caused not by B. Sokolov’s support, but by personal collisions on the site. Neither intelligence nor knowledge will add these minuses to my opponents, so let them quietly amuse their wounded pride. Because I think that no showdown is necessary. IMHO.
  17. prispek
    prispek 9 August 2012 09: 26
    +1
    Volkan
    Well, finally! Pulled favorite orange bogeyman.
    1. volcano
      volcano 9 August 2012 17: 38
      0
      prispek
      Is this a hit?
      1. prispek
        prispek 9 August 2012 20: 15
        -1
        Quote: volkan
        Is this a hit?

        No, not a collision. After reading the posts above, I realized that without a redhead it will not do.
        I just didn't expect YOU to use the "colored" argument.
  18. IRBIS
    IRBIS 9 August 2012 09: 35
    +2
    1. For the author, the military doctrine is really highly secret and he did not even see its individual positions in his eyes, but he takes up the discussion of the document.
    2. The desire of the author to carry out an analysis "should not be necessary", with a complete lack of understanding of the essence of the issue, leads simply to absurd conclusions.
    3. Wish to the author - write something about love, just before that at least do not drink alcohol and do not smoke any rubbish. Otherwise, pornography will work ....
  19. grizzlir
    grizzlir 9 August 2012 09: 46
    0
    The article is not for this site. Here you need something patriotic. Anyway.
  20. patriot2
    patriot2 9 August 2012 09: 54
    +2
    For the author, by the way about barges: are you aware that ICBMs with nuclear weapons can be launched both from a barge and from a civilian cargo ship converted for this purpose?
    If you don’t know, then study this topic.
    Well, it’s not up to you to judge the use of a helicopter carrier, for this you also need to know the advantages that an AAG or a group of landing ships have with air cover + destruction of a potential enemy’s nuclear submarines by torpedoes and other weapons + detection and identification of targets with the delivery of their coordinates for destruction escort ships.
    And the last: do not scold what has not yet been created.
    1. skiff-xnumx
      skiff-xnumx 9 August 2012 20: 45
      0
      Quote: patriot2
      For the author, by the way about barges: are you aware that ICBMs with nuclear weapons can start from a barge and from a civilian cargo ship

      These are interesting ICBMs that can be launched from a barge. I heard about the KR family "Caliber", there is such an option, but so that ICBM weighing under 40 tons is not technically possible here.
      What about the article even nothing to comment on. Some assumptions (if not an order) of any facts. article -
  21. klimpopov
    klimpopov 9 August 2012 10: 19
    +2
    Then they threw him into a bootleg ... But not about that ...
    I didn’t like the article, firstly the purchase of the Mistral (which name is what) is more for the benefit of poor France and a favor from Russia, the article sounds like crazy ideas about the war with Ukraine, in my opinion the war in the Pacific is much more real, and there are islands Mama do not worry, so the Mistral is very suitable for landing. An infrastructure is also being built under the Mistral (Bey), the Mistral will quickly write off or sell it further and ours will take its place, that’s how I see the situation in a nutshell ...
    1. Armata
      Armata 9 August 2012 10: 32
      +2
      In general, I agree with you, in addition to the convenience of landing. Have you seen how it should be carried out from this ship?
      1. klimpopov
        klimpopov 9 August 2012 11: 02
        +3
        You know, I saw the landing from the Bison - it’s impressive ... But I didn’t see it from the mistral, I think that this is a temporary plugging of holes and nothing more, and they are really needed right now in the Pacific Ocean, by the way I would write about the Bison, it’s very interesting ship.
        1. Armata
          Armata 9 August 2012 11: 45
          +1
          Quote: klimpopov
          But I haven’t seen it from the mistral, I think this is a temporary plugging of holes

          Here you are right. Only these plugs cost us dearly.
          1. lewerlin53rus
            lewerlin53rus 9 August 2012 12: 29
            +4
            Quote: Steam Train
            Only these plugs cost us dearly.

            Yes, a little expensive, of course. But for that quickly. Yes, and developing your own together with production will not be much cheaper.
          2. klimpopov
            klimpopov 9 August 2012 12: 46
            +3
            Well, it’s clear that it’s expensive, but I think that our own capacities are currently occupied or are in a deplorable state, so we decided to buy it, again the Franks come across there, I think there are a lot of interesting things (so to speak, designers need some thought) IMHO While the piers are ready to be built, parking lots will be ready , and there they will arrive in time and these Indians will be shed ... Well, something like that ... In general, everyone understood everything ...
  22. sxn278619
    sxn278619 9 August 2012 10: 37
    0
    A very correct article for the layman. It is intelligible and logical. Due to the fact that Russia cannot wage a large-scale war due to poverty, the threshold for using nuclear weapons is decreasing.
    1. Vyacheslav
      Vyacheslav 9 August 2012 11: 13
      +3
      That's it, another miscarriage designed for the layman. I am not far in this matter and I understand that we need offensive weapons.
  23. Cripple cross
    Cripple cross 9 August 2012 10: 48
    +3
    Author Boris Sokolov

    Comrade Vorobyov got out of the way, you got really strong. The article Anti-Soviet agitation and a traitor to the Motherland cries for you, and the conclusions that come out of here with further rastrel. It’s a pity there are no shots or executions or articles of such kind now. People like you tried to cancel it all so that it would be more convenient for Russia to collapse with such dogmas.
  24. FREGATENKAPITAN
    FREGATENKAPITAN 9 August 2012 11: 05
    +3
    ... I answer briefly, and without any special explanation: -
    _ Russia needs the highways more than ever .... promising TVD-Black Sea Fleet, Caspian, Pacific Fleet (until we ourselves gain the capacity to build ships)
    _NW is and will remain the main deterrent to a potential aggressor, read the USA, NATO ...... and even China ...
    There is usually no big war with the USA or the PRC in haste ..... (I admit border clashes)
  25. aleksej
    aleksej 9 August 2012 11: 12
    +1
    It is quite enough to have 600-700 thousand troops

    Author and what is so much? I would write right away it’s enough to have 50-100 thousand troops, so that in the event of a military conflict, we would transfer the army to the desired region for half a month, forget about the scale of the country? Or have you never gone anywhere further than your city?
    1. Raven1972
      Raven1972 9 August 2012 15: 19
      0
      + To you ... I agree, especially in terms of territory ... For some reason, all these author’s comparisons between the Russian Federation and the USA, although the USA on the land borders can be said that there isn’t, with Mexico if only ... And then, you only need to monitor so that Mexican workers do not climb into America ... lol
  26. Van
    Van 9 August 2012 11: 13
    +1
    People will always be not happy with their lives under any politicians, such a human gut. lol
  27. Num lock U.A.
    Num lock U.A. 9 August 2012 11: 25
    +4
    in the article, logic is not traced
    1, France has colonies, and Russia has innumerable islands and simply remote, inaccessible shores on the Far East - that’s why France needs aircraft carriers and helicopter carriers (although they cost it too much), but Russia does not. By the way, Japan continues to build them. Where is the logic?
    2. Since Lithuania, Poland and comrades are part of the NATO bloc, and this NATO is already scary in its name, Russia doesn’t need the Iskanders and other equipment - all the same, NATO is stronger. Where is the logic? (2)
    3. China is big - you won’t conquer it. It makes no sense to fight with him, so we are exchanging military units for strategic missiles and we will threaten with a fist from behind a hill. Where is the logic? (3)
    well, etc.
    Rave. In the sense of the article minus.
  28. andrey-tse
    andrey-tse 9 August 2012 11: 40
    +3
    Weak article, maybe Siberia and the Far East can give it back, we still cannot master them. Liberoids are bad.
  29. T72B
    T72B 9 August 2012 11: 45
    +3
    "We must focus primarily not on confrontation with NATO, but on a potential alliance with the North Atlantic bloc in the event of a conflict between Russia and the Celestial Empire."

    Oh, how they want to push us with the Chinese. Zae ... this, these trolls of world terry Siomudism have already been tortured.
  30. v53993
    v53993 9 August 2012 12: 33
    +2
    From the point of view of military planning and assessment of military threats - the article is really absolutely unprofessional. It seems that the knowledge of the author of the article does not go beyond the course of the young fighter. Why should such pearls be put up for general discussion? Are there really really professional experts?
    1. Raven1972
      Raven1972 9 August 2012 15: 23
      0
      I would say - beyond the Moscow Ring Road .... laughing This expert does not know about KMB ... lol
  31. Captain
    Captain 9 August 2012 13: 23
    +2
    It is quite enough to have 600-700 thousand troops

    Madness.
    In this situation, in the event of a PLA invasion, the problem for her would not be to defeat the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation, but simply to find them.

    And it is not at all clear how an army of 600 thousand will defend our borders stretching over 60 thousand kilometers.

    It is necessary to focus first of all not on confrontation with NATO, but on a potential alliance with the North Atlantic bloc

    Oh, yes ... The Anglo-Saxons were "remarkable" allies during the Great Patriotic War. Someone wants to give Siberia in exchange for supported American tanks?
  32. Bigriver
    Bigriver 9 August 2012 13: 57
    +3
    What a delight, this Borya Sokolov.

    "... We must focus primarily not on confrontation with NATO, but on a potential alliance with the North Atlantic bloc in the event of a conflict between Russia and the Middle Kingdom. ..."

    The Euro-Atlantic historian does not even try to hide the "ears".
    And it doesn’t look like a scoundrel. Indeed, sincerely thinks so.
    1. v53993
      v53993 9 August 2012 16: 00
      0
      So the author is a sincere scoundrel
  33. Katran
    Katran 9 August 2012 14: 06
    +1
    The whole point of the article is that Russian stupid monkeys who can’t master such high technology as Mistral or Yars, that they say the Russians don’t need a strong army, as the NATO block or the Chinese are so strong that you need to switch to a 100% professional army and so on, like I visited the garbage dump after reading this article, but there is nothing surprising on the site from which this article all publications are of the type that Russians should know the place and all hope for Europe.
  34. Tambov Wolf
    Tambov Wolf 9 August 2012 15: 12
    +2
    Is the author of the article accidentally not from the fifth column? And then having read the article involuntarily you will think about it first of all.
    1. v53993
      v53993 9 August 2012 16: 04
      -1
      If from the fifth, then it even pleases that there are such non-religious professionals.
  35. Oleg Rosskiyy
    Oleg Rosskiyy 9 August 2012 16: 16
    +1
    These are the "advisers" that Gorbachev and Yeltsin had in the early 90s, what did it all lead to? At the expense of reducing the number of military personnel and weapons, it can immediately eliminate the army, because there are only "friends" around - Syria, Libya, Iraq, Iran will soon have, and Russia has them for centuries, therefore, "caring" about our well-being, do not give us a step to take.
  36. darkman70
    darkman70 9 August 2012 16: 54
    +1
    We must focus primarily not on confrontation with NATO, but on a potential alliance with the North Atlantic bloc in the event of a conflict between Russia and the Celestial Empire

    How smart is this expert. Just a genius.) So the experts want Russia to fight with China. And right along with the United States in the same ranks.
    Kukish to him !!!) Let the Americans fight with them, and Russia will help ... morally.
    In general, it seems that the article is designed for the person who spent 20 years in the jungle without the Internet. TV and newspapers.
    Where did he come from this Sokolov? And is he Sokolov?)
    1. Opertak
      Opertak 9 August 2012 18: 05
      0
      Quote: darkman70
      Where did he come from this Sokolov? And is he Sokolov?)
      - if I'm not mistaken, then he really is Sokolov and by education PHILOLOGIST.
  37. Brother Sarych
    Brother Sarych 9 August 2012 17: 48
    +1
    Theorist fucking ...
    I agree only with the fact that the Mistrals are completely unnecessary, I do not agree that they are too complicated for our sailors ...
    The purpose of the article - to try again to push the Russian Federation and China? China, of course, is not a friend, and gunpowder must be kept dry, but to fight China for the thick-assed West - grand merce, uncle!
    I also agree that it is necessary to throw empty jerking off at all kinds of mirages, and to do real things, strengthening the military power of the country!
    It’s high time to soberly assess our capabilities and correct the situation ...
  38. Evgen232
    Evgen232 9 August 2012 18: 18
    0
    Just the word "recruit" you can understand that he is a zaslanets. And the desire to further reduce the size of the army and make it only a contract is the wishes of the enemy. After all, if a man did not serve in the army, then he may want to fight for his Motherland, but not can, due to the inability and ignorance of elementary basic knowledge of military craft. Gad, in general, the author of the article!
  39. PSih2097
    PSih2097 9 August 2012 20: 09
    0
    It is necessary to focus the Armed Forces on the reflection of real and not fantastic threats.

    is the US attack on Japan fantastic? Or is China also a fantasy? Here are the aliens - just a fantasy, and which endures "Missouri".
    In short, reserves up to 60 years rule ...
  40. PiP
    PiP 9 August 2012 20: 14
    0
    In general, the article is similar to unformed nonsense. Although the idea is clear. GSh can not decide who we will fight and what? From a sound point of view, the opponents seem to be clear, but politicians say they are friends. In such a situation, my brains would move. It’s the same as mice running in my kitchen, a bear breaking through the front door, and I have a fishing rod in my hands. wassat
  41. 12Ural12
    12Ural12 9 August 2012 23: 22
    0
    Borya! And you have long arrived from NATO headquarters to us.
    About Mistral is true - this is a bauble to cut the budget.
  42. REPA1963
    REPA1963 9 August 2012 23: 46
    0
    Well, you are talking about the Mistals in vain, a stool will buy an island in a hawk and will be sent there by hackstreeters.