Military Review

Patriotic religion and camouflage candles

274
Patriotic religion and camouflage candles

Well, we can congratulate ourselves. At the forum, where new items of the military-industrial complex were previously demonstrated, now ... yes, they also demonstrate new items, but somehow they smell strangely, to be honest.


When on "Army-20 ..." Tanks, which even if they appear in the troops, it is clearly not during our lifetime, the technology of tomorrow, about which the same can be said, you know, it was normal. What will happen tomorrow or the day after tomorrow - why not show it today?

Even if it never will. Kind of like the mock-ups of nuclear destroyers and aircraft carriers with a displacement of 100 tons. Why not tell a beautiful fairy tale for the layman? We have many such believers ...

By the way, about the believers.

Here is tomorrow that is shown today. This is already being discussed by specialized publications in the world, commenting on who in what way.

Cassocks in the "pixel" and green candles. Military wax.



In general, of course, the penetration of the ROC into the army evokes different emotions in everyone. I am already silent about representatives of other religions. In our army, everything is the same: if you want to send spiritual needs, get baptized. If you are a Muslim, a Catholic, a Buddhist, a Jew, or anyone else, these are your problems.

But, in general, it has always been like this in our army. That is not according to the charter, all your problems. And though Orthodoxy is not included in the charter (yet), it is blessed by the commander-in-chief. That is why billions are flown from the budget to the chief military church, therefore they sprinkle holy water on everything, from cartridges to ICBMs.

Well, now, the robes and candles of the appropriate color. To be honest, I do not quite understand how the “civilian” candle differs from the “military” one, and therefore I cannot explain it with anything other than another way to make money.

As for the military field robes, then there is no surprise.






Regimental priests of the First World War must be treated with respect and awe. Excuse me, there were no political commissars and deputies for the fight against personnel then, so all the encouragement and parting words of the Russian soldier lay on the shoulders of these people.

I respect

However, all this was more than a hundred years ago. It is understandable: "It's safer to live with God, it's easy to die with God" (as one famous performer sang), but nevertheless the world has changed somewhat over the past century.

Putin's current stakes on the ROC as a substitute for the institution of political workers and army psychologists looks twofold.

On the one hand, this is sheer powerlessness. Refusing to train political workers, closing all political schools at the end of the last century, the army leadership, together with the country's leadership, simply removed those whose duty was to prepare the heads of conscripts (especially) for combat training and work.

Experiments with psychologists and deputies for work (wrestling, as they called it in the army) with personnel also failed.

And now - the priests.

Today, yes, the clergy are more than actively involved in the affairs of the army. They baptize those who wish, conduct services, sprinkle holy water on a variety of military equipment, from ballistic missiles to submarines.


It is difficult to say how much all this will help the technology to work properly (the experiment with the Proton showed that it does not help), but everything looks peculiar in the 21st century.

Especially in the light of the statements of some people from the Russian Orthodox Church about how to bless weapon mass destruction is not according to the commandments of God. It is one thing to bless a soldier who will defend his land, and another thing to bless an intercontinental missile that will blow tens of thousands of the same ... slaves of God into steam.

Somehow it's not according to the commandments.

As for the green candles and pixel cassocks - well, it doesn't look very surprising. We cannot build an engine for a destroyer, a spaceship is difficult. Booster rocket. The only thing left is to rely on God.

It seems like God is with us ...

In fact, endlessly respecting the priests of the First World War and their work, I would have preferred an extra carriage of shells to a good liturgy. I am sure that everyone at the front at that time would also have preferred it. It is clear that there are no atheists in trenches under fire, and the word of the shepherd, parting words - it is not superfluous. But in conjunction with a good portion of porridge with meat, a couple of extra pomegranates and hundreds of rounds. Then - the case.

But I don't really want to remember how things were in the Russian army during that war. And what was the result, and even more so. So we won't, that's not the point.

The point is that a camouflage cassock with an indication of the clergy and green candles - this, of course, looks funny, but is it so important today? Is it really more important than a new technique, the terms for which are constantly "shifted to the right" ad infinitum?

Of course, if the president of a seemingly secular country and the commander-in-chief of the army decided so ...

But then it is really worth remembering that we have a multi-confessional country and every citizen, according to Article 28 of the Constitution of the Russian Federation, has the right to religion in accordance with the way it is spelled out in the article. And here we have the oppression from the ROC of all other confessions.

In theory, then a mosque, a church, a prayer house, and so on should stand next to the church, which is in each part. Because, according to the Constitution, we all have the same rights. And Muslims, and Jews, and Orthodox. All.

True, the army will then finally turn into a religious mess, but then everything will be according to the Constitution.

But this is the army. Where almost formed personalities come today, who themselves can decide where to go and why.

And what is the level below?

A level below the school. In which there seems to be some kind of amorphous patriotic education. Not to reproach, by the way, Putin, but from time to time he tried to portray something like that in terms of school patriotic education of children. Another question is that it all turned out so-so, because the performance ...

But this was exactly how it was with us in life. Somehow, but from the heart.

And in May of this year (on the 22nd), Putin introduced a number of amendments to the law on education to the State Duma. It was proposed to add such things as a parenting program, an educational work plan and attestation to the educational program.

Certification in educational work - it smelled like the Soviet Union from the heart.

What should be included in the educational plan for Putin? And everything is the same. A sense of patriotism and civic consciousness, respect for the memory of the defenders of the Fatherland, their exploits, law and order.

Good? Yes, the words and terms are good. But in schools today there are some educational programs. How they are implemented is another matter. But it is unlikely that Putin's new ideas will be properly implemented, because they will be carried out by those who today can not do anything with the education of young people.

Not so long ago, being "in business" myself, I attended parent-teacher meetings, where I heard the same thing: we teach, you educate. The school is not obliged to engage in education and stuff like that.

The time of teachers remained there, in the USSR, today everyone wants to be purely teachers. Deservedly.

The fact that children are now, according to the Constitution, an important part of state policy, on the one hand, is good, on the other, not very good. This means that upbringing, more precisely, drawing up plans for educational work and methodological recommendations, will be dealt with by those who today cannot do anything from the word “absolutely”. That is, those who are trying to steer an old and rusty barge called "Russian education."

Long ago, somewhere in 2002-2003, Putin said that the basis of education should be all-Russian patriotism. So no one understood for almost twenty years what kind of thing it was. And today he does not understand.

And what will be able to instill and what to teach people who do not understand anything about the issue? Yes, everything will remain at the level of empty, but loud words.

And from schools will continue to release "otegassed" children who do not know anything about stories country, because they taught it from textbooks written by ignoramuses. And who are unlikely to be patriots of the level that Putin would like to see them. Simply because they will not be taught by patriots.

And what is the result? In the end, everything is simple: if a cultural worker does not work, a cult worker takes his place. And here pixel robes and camouflage candles come in handy.


Because the state cannot offer anything more to a young man. But the church is easy. Good or bad in the 21st century, I don't know. It seems like nothing bad, but good in such a replacement is not enough.

But, as practice has shown, we are already being prepared for this.
Author:
274 comments
Ad

The editorial board of Voenniy Obozreniye urgently needs a proofreader. Requirements: impeccable knowledge of the Russian language, diligence, discipline. Contact: [email protected]

Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must to register.

I have an account? Sign in

  1. Pessimist22
    Pessimist22 30 August 2020 05: 18 New
    64
    Religious cult is shoved everywhere, but in the courtyard of the 21st century, as it says "servants of God", the more obedient slaves the better. And the communists rested on education, and in the army they taught the political situation in the world. they want, about no modesty, humility and fasting, on luxury cars, with belly and glossy mugs
    1. Stas157
      Stas157 30 August 2020 05: 34 New
      58
      The church, being the backbone of the authorities, was the fetters for the people until the communists changed the course of events. For millennia, she taught restraint and humility to the common people.

      And now, when the USSR is gone, the new masters of life did not find anything better than to return everything to the old tracks. After all, the top can offer nothing good, not any positive development scenario to the future of Russia. There remains only "patriotism", in the form of the last refuge for villains, and the church, broadcasting that a better life will come only in the afterlife.
      1. Pessimist22
        Pessimist22 30 August 2020 05: 45 New
        59
        The main task of all the churches was one and the same: to impress the poor serfs that for them there is no happiness on earth, it is destined for them in heaven, and that hard labor for someone else's uncle is a charitable thing.
        Maksim Gorky.
        1. Tatyana
          Tatyana 30 August 2020 06: 02 New
          38
          Have sunk! The priests are happy - they have achieved their goal. The church has grown together with the power apparatus of the state. Sat the church on the neck of the people. The Church does not have its own army, so the police and the army will defend its interests.
          Soon, all servicemen, including atheists, will be forced into the church! And, for sure, they are already being driven. Try to refuse from the commander - it will be more expensive for yourself!
          1. Tatyana
            Tatyana 30 August 2020 06: 07 New
            37
            Today, yes, the clergy are more than actively involved in the affairs of the army. They baptize those who wish conduct services, sprinkle holy water on a variety of military equipment, from ballistic missiles to submarines.

            Church business is in full swing! Government orders are the most profitable for the "manufacturer" of mythical services!
          2. Reptiloid
            Reptiloid 30 August 2020 07: 09 New
            12
            Good morning, Tatiana! hi Once I read the expression that under socialism everyone was forcibly driven into different organizations. He asked. Lies! Nobody drove anyone anywhere!
            1. Oleg133
              Oleg133 30 August 2020 07: 26 New
              -8
              They asked so much that it was impossible to refuse
              1. Reptiloid
                Reptiloid 30 August 2020 07: 36 New
                21
                Quote: Oleg133
                They asked so much that it was impossible to refuse

                Come on! The children themselves wanted to become pioneers-october. Both me and my classmates ---- all wanted, but it was no longer ... Yes, and older ---- too, as they decided for themselves.
                1. Oleg133
                  Oleg133 30 August 2020 08: 11 New
                  -42
                  Quote: Reptiloid
                  Both me and my classmates ---- all wanted, but it was no longer ...

                  You just don't understand how lucky you are)
                  I was there.
                  There, the entrance is a ruble, and the exit is two
                  You MUST do what THEY said
                  THEY know better what you need ...)
                  And most often it all came down to pieces of paper and reports, from childhood they were taught to profanity and fraud
                  There is no question of any free will or even just freedom there
                  1. bayard
                    bayard 30 August 2020 09: 17 New
                    46
                    Quote: Oleg133
                    You just don't understand how lucky you are)
                    I was there.
                    There, the entrance is a ruble, and the exit is two

                    Don't talk nonsense. Those who really didn’t want to join - didn’t join, and I knew such people, but they were very few. Moreover, I myself left the Komsomol when I was already in the officer rank and in operational work. And it was in the spring of 1989.
                    And nothing .
                    Nobody even noticed.
                    Noticed a year and a half later. lol
                    They were surprised (the fathers of the commanders), but threw up their hands - we now have perestroika ...
                    And the reason for leaving was by no means ideological - I owed my contributions for 9 or 10 months, and decided that 30 rubles, this is serious money ... and gave the Komsomol organizer (by the way, the ensign) my Komsomol card. Although by age he could remain in the ranks for several more years.
                    But even then - at the end of the Soviet era, the entire communist ideology fell on the mentality of young people very harmoniously. Everything was CLEAR, CLEAR and WITHOUT LIES.
                    And almost three decades under capitalism only strengthened the confidence in the correctness of the socialist ideology.
                    And about capitalism and its laws and rules, we were definitely not lied to.
                    In Russia today it is not even capitalism that is being built, but "aristocratic" feudalism. We have fallen not even one, but two steps in the development of social society.
                    This is DEGRADATION.
                    In everything.
                    In the social structure of society.
                    In science .
                    Culture.
                    The education system.
                    Health care.
                    Pension security.
                    The POWER was simply MONSTALLY degraded.
                    And this degradation, like entropy, will only grow - like a snowball rolling down a slope.
                    This is a fatal disease of society.
                    States.
                    And the People.
                    And obscurantism at the state level is only evidence of that.

                    When the Bolsheviks began their struggle against illiteracy, they wrote in large letters on the blackboard:
                    WE ARE NOT SLAVES
                    SLAVES ARE NOT US!
                    And now, again, grace is given out as humility with the knowledge that we are all slaves.
                    As in the dark times of medieval obscurantism.
                    An intermediary is not needed to communicate with God.
                    Imposing the feeling of "original sin" is a DEADLY SIN.
                    Worship and complicity in the ancient Jewish cult is a terrible sin before the memory of ancestors.
                    But for the POWER the people are a herd.
                    And to inspire people that this should be so, the most convenient way is through a cult alien to this People - "All of you are rams (and sheep are their wives and daughters) of God."
                    And God DOES NOT NEED slaves.
                    He Himself is free and His Children are free.
                    ... Slaves are needed ... conquerors, enslavers, who do not have power by right.
                    Such authorities also need SUCH church.
                    1. aybolyt678
                      aybolyt678 30 August 2020 18: 47 New
                      -6
                      Quote: bayard
                      ... Everything was CLEAR, CLEAR and WITHOUT LIES.

                      you do not remember the political information, the Komsomol meetings that resembled a church service in the health of the leading and directing ??? I remember. It was Dogmatism that destroyed the Great Country
                      1. bayard
                        bayard 31 August 2020 00: 16 New
                        19
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        It was Dogmatism that destroyed the Great Country

                        Oh really ?
                        Isn't it a deviation from those very "dogmas", isn't it the disintegration of the ruling elite of the party and the state apparatus? Is it not the desire of the new generation of party bosses to become bourgeois themselves and to privatize public property? Isn't it a desire to monetize your social position? bully
                        And THIS is - RETREATING from the very "dogmas" of the State of social justice, public ownership of the means of production, the prohibition of the exploitation of man by man. yes
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        you don't remember political information, Komsomol meetings that resembled a church service

                        Did the personnel stand on political information and bow down to the "idols of communism"?
                        No, the l / s was sitting in the classrooms and the duty officer (from among the cadets, in the order of the queue), the political informalor covered the political situation in the country and the world. smile Like an International Panorama or a news release. In this way, oratory skills, the ability to speak in front of an audience were perfected, the horizons and skills of working with personnel expanded. It was practically a roundup of news.
                        And there was no lie in these political information.
                        Yes, it was a common place to mention the leading role of the Communist Party ... Well, it really led our society.
                        Yes, each company had its own "Lenin room", where there were newspaper filings, books of the classics of Marxism-Leninism on the shelf, tables and table lamps for the convenience of preparing for classes, preparing cadets for political information (sketch out a synopsis of newspaper publications), just write a letter home or read a book in silence ... get ready for class ... work on your essay.
                        We were given a much deeper education than now, we had a broad outlook, participated in the military-scientific society, our best works were sent to republican and all-Union competitions. Having received such an education, we could freely and without any complexes communicate with scientists and thinkers of completely different fields of science and knowledge, knew how to own an audience and manage a military collective, train personnel and service the most complex military equipment.
                        And even in our thoughts we could not move, christen ourselves a "slave". No.
                        We were free.
                        And even treating the communist ideology with a certain amount of irony (all young rebels), we remained integral individuals and patriots of our Great Motherland.
                        And the death of my Country is not our fault, but the betrayal of its leadership, which matured for a long time, purposefully, leading its people to all echelons of power. Ideological work has recently been more profaned, through the "progressive press" ("Ogonyok", "Komsomolskaya Pravda", etc.), television ("Vzglyad", etc.) and cinematography, there was disintegration, disorientation and preparation of society for acceptance by society. , CHANGE OF POWER, as "blessings" ...
                        If you found yourself at the very end of the Soviet era under the "torment of political information" ... and what torment because of a 15-minute lecture on the current situation? ... Then I can only sympathize - you have a very vulnerable psyche ... request
                        But the political information lasted ONLY 15 minutes!
                        Sitting in the audience. smile
                        And the liturgy:
                        - shortened - 2,5 hours. yes
                        - full for laymen - 4 hours. yes
                        - full according to the monastery charter - 5 - 5,5 hours.
                        For military personnel, the service is probably no more than 2,5 hours ...
                        But STANDING.
                        And with bows.

                        If you think that someone who calls himself a slave and is called a clergyman is a ram (a sheep, if feminine), and a community like him is a herd ... more free is the one who, after listening to a 15-minute lecture, went to the service or on my own business ... I did not bow to someone else's god ... ... I am sincerely sorry for you.
                        He who calls himself a SLAVE cannot be free.
                        Knowledge is power .
                        Knowledge is given by the education system.
                        Strength by training.
                        Including your Mind.
                        And then no obscurantism will stick.
                      2. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 31 August 2020 10: 52 New
                        -1
                        Quote: bayard
                        Isn't it a deviation from those very "dogmas", isn't it the disintegration of the ruling elite of the party and the state apparatus?

                        In proportion to the decomposition of the top, the Teaching more and more turned into Dogma.
                        although Comrade Stalin said that Marxism is not a dogma but a guide to action. smile
                        Quote: bayard
                        And THIS is - RETREATING from the very "dogmas" of the State of social justice, public ownership of the means of production, the prohibition of the exploitation of man by man.

                        Lenin with the NEP deviated from dogmas, Stalin with the mobilization system too ... But they had a goal! that same social justice. The ruling elite of the Party had access to the distribution of material wealth, they had little. However, Perestroika proceeded under the slogans of moving forward towards a fair market. The people were tired of dogmatic mantras and the people accepted Perestroika with a bang.
                        Quote: bayard
                        No, the l / s was sitting in the classrooms and the duty officer (from among the cadets, in turn), the political informalor covered the political situation in the country and the world

                        Yeah, mumbled in a monotonous voice about the machinations of Imperialism wassat I remember ...
                        Quote: bayard
                        each company had its own "Lenin room", where there were newspaper files, books of the classics of Marxism-Leninism on the shelf

                        I have never seen anyone who studied Marx or Lenin for their own development. I only understood Marx at the institute.
                        Quote: bayard
                        Like an International Panorama or a news release.

                        The international panorama had an interesting presenter .. Alexander Bovin is one of a kind
                        Quote: bayard
                        Ideological work has been more profane lately,

                        laughing you see, you agree with me, but just think about the fact that since 1969 elements of capitalism have been introduced into the economy: cost accounting, brigade contracts, etc. ... thereby undermining the planned economy, creating wild distortions, infecting people with a thirst for profit sad And at the same time, social justice and the desire for communism were declared.
                        The teachings of Lenin and Marx were declared as purely materialistic, although in practice Capitalism is materialistic, while Socialism must be ideological. It is impossible to build a socially oriented society without an Idea.
                      3. bayard
                        bayard 31 August 2020 16: 34 New
                        +4
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        Lenin with the NEP deviated from dogmas,

                        With his "New Economic Policy" Lenin saved the country's economy and its population from collapse and hunger - the consequences of the post-war devastation (WWI and GW) and social cleansing. Indeed, in the shortest possible time the food problem was solved and the economy began to recover.
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        Stalin with a mobilization system too ..

                        And then by - Stalin with his Collectivization and Industrialization in the shortest possible time created a powerful economy without Western loans. Relying solely on OWN POWER. That fundamentally contradicted the capitalist model of development, where everything was built on the basis of bank loans at interest and, as a result, led to a cyclical development of the economy (crises wink ).
                        All this was not a deviation from the "dogmas", for the dogmas themselves did not exist yet. There was a lively process of social experimentation in building a classless society and a society of social justice.
                        And the result of these experiments was BRILLIANT!
                        For some 10 years, backward Russia / USSR has turned into a developed industrial-industrial power with a self-sufficient economy, with its own machinery and machine-tool industry, agriculture adapted to local climatic conditions, a strong army and a healthy population. And the population - the People, ACCEPT this State - as OWN. And that is why our grandfathers fought SO for his independence ... as they did not fight either in WWI or in other wars before.
                        They fought for their State, the state that gave them everything they could take from life - all social lifts and access to professions were open.
                        Maybe that's why there were so many academicians, doctors of sciences, engineers, designers and art workers with peasant and workers' roots in the USSR? smile
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        Quote: bayard
                        No, the l / s was sitting in the classrooms and the duty officer (from among the cadets, in turn), the political informalor covered the political situation in the country and the world

                        Yeah, in a monotonous voice I mumbled about the intrigues of Imperialism, I remember ...

                        I don’t know where you listened to your political information, but in the end, a 15-minute lecture, not an entertainment show ... But you apparently think that there were no "intrigues of Imperialism" either then or today ...?
                        Then this is either schizophrenia, or a political position, in any case, an objective perception of reality in your case should not be expected. request
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        I have never seen anyone who studied Marx or Lenin for their own development. I only understood Marx at the institute.

                        Yes, it was not a common hobby, but in the end, these books were not only for self-development, but also for practical purposes - we, cadets of military universities needed to have easy access to them to prepare for classes in:
                        - History of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union (1st year);
                        - Marxist-Leninist Philosophy (2nd year);
                        - Political Economy (3rd year);
                        - Scientific Communism (4th year) ... etc.
                        In order not to go to the library every time, but simply go to your barracks in Lenin's room and take a volume of Marx's Capital, prepare for the lesson. yes
                        Everything is convenient, everything is at hand.
                        Quote: aybolyt678

                        The international panorama had an interesting presenter .. Alexander Bovin is one of a kind

                        Why only Bovin?
                        And Zorin?
                        In the end, everything depended on the speaker / political informer. For example, my comrades did not sleep on my political information, but my case is special - for the last year and a half of my studies, at their request, I read these political information almost every day. lol - and they feel good (they don't need to prepare), and my practice is not at all strained ... and the teachers did not notice, because every day the first lesson was with different teachers ... But why did I not scratch there? lol And on military-political, and on military-technical, and on historical topics ... Once, for the sake of experiment and to check the reaction of the next teacher, I in general rolled political information on the topic of Atlantis - based on the materials of the study of the top of the Ampere seamount by our military hydrographic vessel " Sokol "... The teacher's eyes, of course, widened, but ... the ritual was observed, about the growth of the imperialist threat, the leading role of the Party and the need to learn military affairs in a real way, it was mentioned ... And the chosen topic was justified by the fact that in our Every year more and more literate and educated soldiers are called up to the Soviet Army, and a Soviet officer must have not only specialized knowledge and skills, but also a developed general erudition. yes
                        Each such political information turned into a kind of show with verbal equilibristics and oratorical experiments (the audience must be kept in suspense by taking certain techniques for this ...). The teachers were just delighted and set an example lol , and the comrades quietly whinnied into fists and under the palm of their hand, because only they knew what such a performance we have every day ... and only the teachers do not know about it. bully
                        So it really depends on ... the speaker. yes
                        And you seem to be out of luck with those. request
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        but also think about the fact that since 1969 elements of capitalism have been introduced into the economy: cost accounting, brigade contracts, etc. ... thereby undermining the planned economy, creating wild distortions, infecting people with a thirst for profit

                        Ltd , lol And exactly since 1969?
                        Or practically with NEP?
                        What do you know about the Stalinist Model of Socialism?
                        No, you could not live with her, and I didn’t have a chance, but you can also ask. smile
                        All of the above was introduced into general use precisely under Stalin. yes Moreover, under the Father of Nations, individual and collective labor and creative initiative was very widespread. As soon as a specialist in production reached a certain level of skill, he was usually offered a BASKET organization of his labor (Stalin's direct recommendation), in the country there were a huge number of individual entrepreneurs (the word "private" was not used) and cooperatives (collective property) that worked on FULL cost accounting.
                        These were shoe workshops and cooperatives \ private traders for sewing clothes, producing furniture, building, apartment and house repairs, some doctors had their own - paid practice (under a patent) ... Cooperatives produced: radio receivers, gramophones and radios, TVs (!) , all types of furniture and decorative finishes, there were a lot of them in the food industry, household services (hairdressers, beauty salons) ... There were even design bureaus, our magnificent Mil and Kamov design bureaus, started exactly as COOPERATIVES on a government contract. They rented the premises of a former furniture factory and on its territory (dividing the workshop in half with a partition) created their first helicopters - Mi-1 and Ka-1. Then we received a firm government order and funding. And we continued to work.
                        Only during Khrushchev's savage reforms were these cooperatives and most others (in all spheres of the economy) nationalized and turned into state-owned enterprises.
                        And what else could one expect from the rabid Trotskyist who had grasped power?
                      4. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 31 August 2020 18: 26 New
                        +1
                        Thank you! smile I agree with almost everything ... only I do not agree with the fact that self-sufficiency, cost accounting and brigade contracts were under Stalin in the form in which they appeared in the seventies ... Imagine that the workshop has switched to self-sufficiency, in a planned economy with fixed prices, he began to rivet something that made a profit, but he was deep in the plan ... My dad was the director of the DOK (woodworking plant), and coming from the party meeting for a very long time he swore about this. Before my eyes, a hidden bourgeoisie was born, our neighbors were the head of the district party committee, the chairman of the district trade union committee, etc ... They sat on the distribution of benefits ... and clever foremen on contracts ... It was not accepted then to advertise strongly, the financial inspection worked , but those responsible for the Ideological side of the life of the Soviet people betrayed them. And here are the questions - Where to go now? where is the Idea that will unite people? can't find an answer
                      5. bayard
                        bayard 1 September 2020 00: 28 New
                        +2
                        hi Goodnight .
                        Everything that you described is the result of Khrushchev's idiotic experiments with his collapse of the Stalinist Model of Socialism and Brezhnev's half-hearted measures to eliminate Khrushchev's legacy. You just remember what kind of purges - personnel purges of the state and party apparatus were organized by that ghoul ... He even abolished the government of the USSR!
                        And he subordinated the entire national economy of the country ... to the Economic Councils - local party structures. fool angry by abolishing ALL ministries. How did our entire economy not collapse then ?! All cooperation ties were broken - before, all issues were resolved through the ministry ... and under Khrushchev - through a local party organization - the Economic Council of such an area, then agreements went horizontally - through the Economic Council, where the enterprise was located, the contractor who set the task for the enterprise on its territory .. and if someone resisted - through the Central Committee. fool
                        And THIS was done with the state built by Stalin, with its people's commissars, with our amazing State Planning Committee !!! ...
                        But another miracle happened - the country survived.
                        And it even maintained the highest rates of economic growth, albeit somewhat slower than before - the gigantic INERTIA of the People's creative impulse affected ... Therefore, Sputnik, and Gagarin and the icebreaker "Lenin" ...
                        But!
                        Under Khrushchev, the standard of living dropped sharply - thanks to the monetary reform, revision of tariffs, salaries, PENSIONS (!!!). Therefore, the "uprising" in Novocherkassk with the execution of demonstrations of Soviet Citizens, marching under red banners and portraits of Lenin ...
                        Trotskyist. request
                        Yes, not just a fool @ k, tyrant and ideological pervert, but also ... a direct agent of British intelligence. This was exactly the "mole" that Stalin was SO looking for before his death - our intelligence - agents in MI6, reported that the British had a VERY valuable agent and informant in the Central Committee. But they could not find out the names - they very much protected him from failure ...
                        Stalin did not get to the truth then - he did not have time, but his counterintelligence came very close ... And then Khrushch organized a conspiracy and killed Stalin.
                        And just by this moment it became known (to those who were doing this) who this mole was and through what he was recruited.
                        Khrushchev hid his true origin. Namely, his biological father. And his father was a large land tycoon, a Polish aristocrat ... who later emigrated from Poland to England (with the outbreak of war). And in England they took him into circulation, through their agents and military representatives (during the war we had enough such representatives from the allies) they went to Khrushch ... and threatened to expose his family ties.
                        And Khrushch then was generally under suspicion, after the betrayal of his son and shooting him in front of the formation ...
                        But it's better to look for more details yourself, and I already have comments for lengthy comments ...
                        So what we remember as Socialism is an invalid, truncated, perverted and crippled copy of the truly Stalinist Model of Socialism. That's why it was with us the way it was. As we remember. The destruction of the Soviet Union and the elimination of Socialism, as a socio-economic model of the state, were laid down by Khrushchev ... And under Brezhnev, they simply waited for a generational change, so that everything would turn out smoothly.
                        And they did it.
                        Smoothly.
                        And disgusting.
                      6. bayard
                        bayard 1 September 2020 01: 00 New
                        +1
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        Thank! I agree with almost everything ... only I do not agree with the fact that self-sufficiency, cost accounting and brigade contracts were under Stalin in the form in which they appeared in the seventies.

                        You know, under Stalin, almost the entire economy was self-supporting. The state was the owner, but the budget of the enterprises was formed from their own profits, and the state issued a loan and provided with an order. Yes, the prices were state-owned, but they were economically justified and were never unprofitable for the enterprise. At state prices, a person could take out a loan to build a house, buy all the necessary materials and build himself, or hire builders. This was encouraged by the State.
                        And the central / fiscal distribution system appeared later - under Khrushchev, and later only worsened when this perversion became a "dogma" ...
                        Under Stalin, it didn't smell like that.
                        On the contrary, the economic initiative was encouraged as much as possible. One of the brightest examples of such an initiative, I cited above - the history of cooperative KB Mil and Kamov. But there were a LOT of such enterprises.
                        Yes, you just read the last works of Stalin - his thoughts on the future of the country and the Society ... there will be answers to your questions.
                        hi
                      7. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 1 September 2020 08: 19 New
                        0
                        Quote: bayard
                        Yes, you just read the last works of Stalin - his thoughts on the future of the country and the Society ... there will be answers to your questions.

                        from Stalin's works I mastered only "about some problems ..." The rest is unreadable in the sense of being tied to the situation of today for in our country
                        Did you mean those last questions of mine ???
                      8. bayard
                        bayard 1 September 2020 17: 54 New
                        +2
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        Did you mean those last questions of mine ???

                        Yes, exactly them. You need to understand that a state like the Soviet Union was so much ahead of its time, like the phenomenon of an intergalactic starship in the 16th century. Such a society can only be created by people with a perfect worldview. And such a state was built and almost took place. But such a society also requires the purity of the ranks, for history itself has shown how the degenerates who broke into power have perverted the very essence of the state of social justice. In fact, the entire phenomenon of the USSR took place thanks to the personality of Stalin and those of his comrades-in-arms whom he was able to attract, direct, and inspire. But such a society requires a completely different human material - a person of a new type, a person of a creator, a person of ideas ... such people had to be educated ... and they were brought up ... a lot ... a lot ... But in the body of a young state organism there were and parasites, opportunists with a perverted psyche.
                        They ruined the greatest social experiment in known history.

                        But an EXAMPLE was GIVEN to us. Not theory (not only theory), but the PRACTICE itself of building a perfect society, a perfect economy, a perfect education system and a perfect person.
                        This example, this tool and method only needs to be used.
                      9. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 1 September 2020 23: 58 New
                        +2
                        Quote: bayard
                        This example, this tool and method only needs to be used.

                        Unfortunately Putin does not like Stalin sad Modifying the question: How to use the public demand for social justice to turn the brains drenched in consumerist ideology to socialism. without war???
                      10. bayard
                        bayard 2 September 2020 04: 36 New
                        +1
                        If it is impossible without war, then there will be war ... Yes, it is almost inevitable.
                        And this is not even our choice.
                        ... And here, in Donbass, it has been in its seventh year ...
                        ... And Putin looks like ... not very ... Putin.
  2. nickname7
    nickname7 30 August 2020 10: 05 New
    +9
    You MUST do what THEY said

    In complex societies, such things are mandatory, in particular in the West, in order to make a career in the civil service or corporations, you need to collect a personal portfolio, you need to do what is proper and should be a gentleman. Unless it's a voluntary business there, if you want to work at a gas station it's your business, if you want to become an engineer at the Boeing concern, learn to walk in formation.

    1. Deck
      Deck 4 September 2020 13: 15 New
      +1
      The participants and guests of the Army-2020 forum were urgently evacuated due to heavy smoke. The cause of the incident was the latest combat censer presented by the Sergiev Posad Research Institute of Applied Chemistry.

      The censer is intended for services in open areas, right up to the battlefield. Therefore, its power is significantly increased.
  3. Mordvin 3
    Mordvin 3 30 August 2020 11: 26 New
    14
    Quote: Oleg133
    And most often it all came down to pieces of paper and reports, from childhood they were taught to profanity and fraud

    What other reports and pieces of paper do the pioneers have? fool
    1. BAI
      BAI 30 August 2020 14: 00 New
      +7
      The ordinary pioneer did not. And the school's squad board is full of plans and reports on the work done.
    2. Simargl
      Simargl 31 August 2020 04: 42 New
      0
      Quote: Mordvin 3
      What other reports and pieces of paper do the pioneers have?
      At the link - everything is oral. And everything above is pieces of paper.
  4. blackice
    blackice 2 September 2020 09: 28 New
    0
    you just don’t understand how lucky you are)
    I was there.
    There, the entrance is a ruble, and the exit is two
    You MUST do what THEY said
    THEY know better what you need ...)
    And most often it all came down to pieces of paper and reports, from childhood they were taught to profanity and fraud
    There is no question of any free will or even just freedom there

    Lying.
    An impudent, stupid, stinking lie.
  • Simargl
    Simargl 31 August 2020 04: 44 New
    -6
    Quote: Reptiloid
    The children themselves wanted to become pioneers-october.
    They themselves want to vote for Putin, and for amendments to the constitution. Watch the movie "Wave" - ​​maybe you will see.
  • victor50
    victor50 30 August 2020 18: 20 New
    +8
    Quote: Oleg133
    They asked so much that it was impossible to refuse

    Sure? Can you prove it? Did you live yourself then? Or has it been explained now? Don't lie! Below you claim that you have lived. I refused to join the party since my military service. And he was successfully promoted.
    1. Simargl
      Simargl 31 August 2020 04: 45 New
      -1
      Quote: victor50
      I refused to join the party since my military service.
      The 80s, and especially their end, are not at all earlier times.
  • Tatyana
    Tatyana 30 August 2020 07: 56 New
    10
    Quote: Reptiloid
    Good morning, Tatiana! hi Once I read the expression that under socialism everyone was forcibly driven into different organizations. He asked. Lies! Nobody drove anyone anywhere!
    Good morning, Dmitry!

    Yes, indeed, under socialism no one forced anyone into the party. It was even sometimes quite the opposite.
    There was a party directive in the Communist Party of the Soviet Union - to accept only one ITR worker at the factories (production facilities) in the party for the three workers admitted to the party, to whom, by the way, were the foremen of the shops at the factories. And such engineers and technicians waited for their turn for years until three workers joined the party to become a member of the CPSU.
    And the workers already felt at ease at work and in terms of wages - and did not really want to pay party dues - and they sent party organizers away from themselves somewhere far away.
    So it was like that.
    1. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 30 August 2020 08: 42 New
      +4
      Thanks for the clarification, Tatyanv good ! This is approximately what my grandmother told me, and she was a party worker in the Party committee of a large enterprise. Only now it was impossible for me to retell, I did not understand then. But --- I remember that it was connected with the press. There were authors of technical books. They wanted to, were in a hurry to join ...... It was easier with a book if I joined the Communist Party. I didn’t understand the reason before. It turns out that then any anti-Sovietism tried to get through. I even climbed through, but subjected
      But now anti-Sovietism, lies, Russophobia, in the most unexpected circumstances can be found.
    2. BAI
      BAI 30 August 2020 14: 01 New
      +1
      indeed, under socialism no one forced anyone into the party. It was even sometimes quite the opposite.

      Membership of officers in the party was compulsory (except 1989-90).
      1. Old Michael
        Old Michael 30 August 2020 15: 35 New
        +3
        BAI: Membership of officers in the party was compulsory (except 1989-90).

        I cannot agree with you, dear BAI!
        In my oldleigh years, a non-partisan captain headed the headquarters of a missile regiment (!), Becoming, however, a major (ahead of schedule, the staff category of NSh is colonel). And by the time of his next career, a catastrophe was already flaring up, and the question of partisanship was no longer raised.
        PS Imyarek is still in service, in a very high orbit. Because he always knew what to do and how, knew how to prioritize and organize the most effective implementation of tasks. The subordinates were carried away with him into a completely crazy rhythm of the service, not by loud calls, but by personal example.
        And where does the partisanship have to do with it?
        PPS I remember an anecdote about the incompatibility of three qualities in one organism (intelligence, honesty, and partisanship).
        1. BAI
          BAI 30 August 2020 18: 01 New
          +3
          This is the exception that proves the rule. If a specialist was really irreplaceable, they turned a blind eye to non-partisanship, but they constantly recommended to join.
    3. polar fox
      polar fox 31 August 2020 07: 40 New
      +1
      Quote: Tatiana
      And the workers already felt at ease at work and in terms of wages - and did not really want to pay party dues - and they sent party organizers away from themselves somewhere far away.
      So it was like that.

      word for word about my uncle ... and he lived, he was not sad!
  • Hagen
    Hagen 30 August 2020 08: 41 New
    0
    Quote: Reptiloid
    He asked. Lies! Nobody drove anyone anywhere!

    Of course they didn't. Who will drive a lifelong janitor to the CPSU? But if you want to become a foreman of janitors, then without membership in the Komsomol it will be "very difficult". And a company / battalion commander without membership in the CPSU is not possible. So it all depends on who you asked. Ask the plant manager or shop manager - one answer; ask the turner - another. Sociology is a science ... you have to learn it. laughing (of course, if you are interested in the truth).
    1. dauria
      dauria 30 August 2020 13: 21 New
      +8
      And a company / battalion commander without membership in the CPSU is not possible.


      Yes, without a ticket from the district committee of the Komsomol in a military school and you will not enter. Obligatory document like a certificate, passport and birth certificate. laughing I myself followed him to the district committee, a red postcard with a pretentious text. You listen to a touching speech and is free. Without membership in the CPSU, no GSVG at once, go to the ZabVO for a start, think about the role of the party. Higher than the captain and do not dream.
      The funny thing is the confusion of the real ideological at the turning point and against the background of a huge number of scoundrels of communists.
      A surprisingly effective system of selection for the power of opportunists.
      So the priests in the army are funny and unpleasant, but the Communist Party in the army is not funny and scary.
      1. Hagen
        Hagen 30 August 2020 13: 49 New
        +3
        Quote: dauria
        So the priests in the army are funny and unpleasant

        In the late 80s, I had a soldier who was a real believer. On leave, he always attended a church service (he saw him a couple of times in the courtyard of the church). A more diligent soldier was hard to find. And not in the sense of subservience to the leadership, but precisely such a calm diligence. And no matter what happened, he was always in a good mood. Faith helped him or something else - I don’t say, but as a fact ... From the training all the "microdembels" left for the ZGV (team 20B), his non-Komsomol member was not taken. Through the commander, I left him in the company as a sergeant and did not know grief. So the priests in the army do not "hurt" me personally, as long as they do their job. And if he manages to find human contact with a soldier or sergeant, called up from far away and homesick, then this is any better than a crossbow on guard because of the "departed" girl. And in black or "the color of the terrain", what's the difference? Though in shorts and a vest ... laughing
        1. Simargl
          Simargl 31 August 2020 04: 57 New
          +3
          Quote: Hagen
          So the priests in the army do not "hurt" me personally, as long as they do their job.
          Do not worry. And the next believer will go to civilian life, who will need science only in a smartphone and TV. And children are unlikely to jump higher. And he will pull those around him into faith. And most importantly, he will continue to carry bablishko to church.
          And what is the difference between hazing and people in robes - I have no idea: both options break the will.

          Quote: Hagen
          And if he manages to find human contact with a soldier or sergeant, called up from far away and homesick, then this is any better than a crossbow on guard because of the "departed" girl.
          That's it! The commander just broke to deal with subordinates! We have officially won the hazing. This? So who is the boss over the personnel?
          1. Hagen
            Hagen 31 August 2020 08: 23 New
            -2
            Quote: Simargl
            And children are unlikely to jump higher. And he will pull those around him into faith.

            The child has not yet jumped, and you have already put a frame for him. This is your speculation, sucked from the finger.
            Quote: Simargl
            The commander just broke to deal with subordinates!

            You have no idea what subordinate work is. There is nothing to talk about ...
            1. Simargl
              Simargl 31 August 2020 19: 01 New
              +1
              Quote: Hagen
              The child has not yet jumped, and you have already put a frame for him.
              I put the frame ?! Religion is not only a belief system, but also a taboo. First of all, on competing knowledge.

              Quote: Hagen
              This is your speculation, sucked from the finger.
              Actually, no. This is the truth of life, which is also used by religion. And in the history of examples - a huge number.

              Quote: Hagen
              You have no idea what subordinate work is.
              In the army, maybe. In civil society ... this is your speculation.
    2. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 30 August 2020 13: 33 New
      -3
      Quote: Hagen
      Quote: Reptiloid
      He asked. Lies! Nobody drove anyone anywhere!

      Of course they didn't. Who will drive a lifelong janitor to the CPSU? But if you want to become a foreman of janitors, then without membership in the Komsomol it will be "very difficult". And a company / battalion commander without membership in the CPSU is not possible. So it all depends on who you asked. Ask the plant manager or shop manager - one answer; ask the turner - another. Sociology is a science ... you have to learn it. laughing (of course, if you are interested in the truth).

      wassat wassat when Yavlinsky assumed that Yabloko would take the majority in Moscow in the elections, he spoke on TV ----- that even plumbers would be recruited on the basis of party affiliation. Did not work out negative
      Any state tries to protect itself. There have always been filters.
      1. Hagen
        Hagen 31 August 2020 08: 25 New
        +1
        Quote: Reptiloid
        There have always been filters.

        Are you convincing me, or are you stating your own insight? laughing
        Quote: Reptiloid
        when Yavlinsky assumed that Yabloko would take the majority in Moscow in the elections, he spoke on TV ----- that even plumbers would be recruited on the basis of party affiliation.

        Yavlinsky is a mediocrity, and that is why the game in ... well, you understand how deeply it failed.
        1. Reptiloid
          Reptiloid 31 August 2020 09: 46 New
          0
          I state Yavlinsky wink lol and other modern, ..... will find a common feature .....
          I wrote a big comment yesterday, cited examples of different times, from the property qualification of the Great French ........ and when I put a smiley ---- everything was gone! Therefore, I rewrote it in a reduced form. hi
  • The leader of the Redskins
    The leader of the Redskins 30 August 2020 08: 27 New
    +5
    "This is just what we lacked ..." - as the wife said to her husband, having learned that he "brought" home a venereal disease.
    But in essence, my opinion is that medical workers and, if there is such a need, priests should not be in camouflage at the front line, but, on the contrary, stand out as much as possible so that the enemy, in the presence of conscience, would cease fire!
  • Cyril G ...
    Cyril G ... 30 August 2020 08: 56 New
    10
    Quote: Tatiana
    And, for sure, they are already being driven.

    This is already being done, about 10 years ago, our units in an orderly order collected "donations" for the temple. And they tried to drive all the servicemen into the temple, regardless of faith and so on ...
    1. Simargl
      Simargl 31 August 2020 05: 01 New
      +2
      Quote: Cyril G ...
      This is already being done, about 10 years ago, our units in an orderly order collected "donations" for the temple.
      They do it everywhere. And I got. I had to write a donation application ... to an orphanage. It seems that he did not "squeeze", but did not give to the temple.
  • nickname7
    nickname7 30 August 2020 09: 54 New
    +3
    Certification in educational work - it smelled like the Soviet Union from the heart.


    attended parent-teacher meetings, where I heard the same thing: we teach, you educate. The school is not obliged to engage in education and stuff like that.

    The author himself needs to decide, then he smacks of union, then the school does not educate and there are no political politicians.
    You can not reinvent the wheel, but turn to the experience of, for example, the country of migrant states, where education in school is a key thing, more important than academic performance, it is imperative to observe certain formal rules in society, and the disobedient, not trained, are immediately deprived of future career growth. So you smelled like a union.
    You just need to decide who to grow the creator or consumer and draw up programs, and the methods have already been invented.
  • Region-25.rus
    Region-25.rus 30 August 2020 13: 08 New
    +4
    why soon? already doing so. A colleague at work, demobilized three or four years ago. So he told me that they were actually driven to the service. That's when I realized - it's good that I also had a political officer!)))) soldier
    1. Olgovich
      Olgovich 30 August 2020 18: 53 New
      -11
      Quote: Region-25.rus
      I realized - it's good that I still had zampolit!

      How can you sincerely talk about any "usefulness" of these real idlers, parasites, cynics, drunks, fooling people with stupid raunchy agitation, which no one listened to, did not believe (first of all, they themselves), did not want to listen and ran away from it as soon as possible? request

      How passionately our political officer taught the Motherland and the Party to love!

      Now he still loves his homeland. But ..... already another-Israel, where he moved ...
  • astepanov
    astepanov 30 August 2020 13: 11 New
    12
    If you cross yourself earnestly,
    And then wash with holy water,
    sins will immediately disappear, melt away -
    you will become pure (well, like these verses)!

    If holy water on "Protons"
    a fellow churched will splash,
    will not fall, will not explode "Proton",
    for he is protected by a heavenly hand!

    We walk with banners, wave censers
    we are with the bearded and long-maned,
    Himself, the Patriarch and the country pray -
    no fucking thing yet.
  • kyznets
    kyznets 30 August 2020 13: 35 New
    -18
    One atheist wrote nonsense, other atheists also comment on this nonsense. Green candles - and green in Orthodoxy - the color of the Holy Life-Giving Trinity. And for the Trinity in the Temple, the priests dress in green. This, of course, has nothing to do with army camouflage clothes. But why are you so agitated? All of you do not like Orthodox priests and the church, you will look and already look at the universal Islamic prayers under your windows on Islamic holidays or Buddhist prayers on their holidays UNDER YOUR WINDOWS, ON YOUR STREETS, IN YOUR HOUSES. And also, worst of all - already look at drug addicts in your yards and your entrances. They drive you into churches, they demand money from you, they force you to pray, observe the fasts? You have no one to fight with? Or impunity for the fight against the Orthodox Church stimulates. They will not spit in return, they will not hit you. The last of Khrushchev, Trotsky, Lenin, Bukharin, Gorky and others like them fighters against religion climbed out. And the thousand-year-old unique culture of Russia - painting, architecture, literature, music, itself somehow without Orthodoxy and the church, how did the grass along the road itself grow? You spit on yourself and your past, people! Do not believe, do not believe, well, this is not given to you yet. At least fight sodomites, not only sexual ones, but also those who delay salaries and do not pay, who increase the retirement age, who transfer children to correspondence courses in schools, who transfer pension payments from the first decade of the month to the second and even to the third "in order to optimize payments", which increase utility bills, the cost of electricity, water and heat, and who find a logical and correct explanation for all this, for which we are the "hawking" electorate. Or does it not stop you from living? But the church and Orthodoxy bothers you.
    1. BAI
      BAI 30 August 2020 14: 05 New
      14
      And for the Trinity in the Temple, the priests dress in green.
      And on other holidays - in white, red, gold. Plus a black casual. Did Christ have the same amount of clothing?
      1. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 31 August 2020 05: 39 New
        +3
        Quote: BAI
        And on other holidays - in white, red, gold. Plus a black casual. Did Christ have the same amount of clothing?

        Jesus Christ wore rags, and his servants today walk in gold and offer God's servants to wear rags ...
    2. astepanov
      astepanov 30 August 2020 16: 10 New
      12
      Quote: kyznets
      You have no one to fight with? Or impunity for the fight against the Orthodox Church stimulates. They will not spit in return, they will not hit you. The last of Khrushchev, Trotsky, Lenin, Bukharin, Gorky and others like them fighters against religion climbed out. And the thousand-year-old unique culture of Russia - painting, architecture, literature, music, itself somehow without Orthodoxy and the church, how did the grass along the road itself grow? You spit on yourself and your past, people!
      What kind of Orthodox painting are you talking about? About several frescoes and icons of Rublev and Theophanes the Greek? But they are not visible against the background of painting, the foundations of which were borrowed from the west - and these are Tropinin, Bryullov, all the Itinerants, Savrasov, Repin and hundreds of other glorious names. And their predecessors were not Theophanes the Greek and Rublev, but their contemporaries: Raphael, Da Vinci and Michelangelo. Music, you say? But even during the time of Patriarch Nikon, with his direct participation, all musical instruments were burned on pain of injury - and therefore we know nothing about Russian music before Alexei Mikhailovich. Church music in Orthodoxy has always been a capella, gloomy and did not allow going beyond the canonical forms. The first Russian composers - Verstovsky and Bortnyansky - studied in Italy, and their forerunners were not gloomy priests, but Bach, Mozart, Handel. The church fought the theater just as fiercely, the nostrils of the raeshniks and buffoons were torn out - and to hard labor. Church censorship of literature (including scientific) existed until the end of the 19th century. What kind of church literature are you talking about? Where are they, your church Shakespeare? Our literature flashed brightly only under Pushkin, and he noted, among other things, things in which he laughed at the church fairly. And it was the church that banned in Russia, for example, the publication of Copernicus's works. Architecture, you say? Well, there is almost no other ancient architecture, except for the cult, in Russia. And almost all of the secular is from the West, both by technology and artistic techniques.
      Quiet, you say, and unrequited? Do you want to say anything about the "Orthodox activists"? Those who are trying to ban performances, exhibitions, concerts? And what about those who publish textbooks like "Orthodox Biology" by Vertyanov? Those foaming at the mouth preaching creationism? Those who build temples in universities at public expense? In my native Saratov university they chopped off a piece of municipal land and at the expense of the university (with poor auditoriums and antediluvian equipment!) A hefty church. Before the revolution, architect Ludwig Müfke did not consider a temple on campus appropriate - and these "innovators" got in without soap.
      There is no need to lie about the special value of Orthodox culture and the humility of the Church: this is a fierce and cunning public that has always spread rot on culture and stood guard over the interests of the authorities.
      1. polar fox
        polar fox 31 August 2020 07: 46 New
        0
        Quote: astepanov
        there is almost no other ancient architecture, except for the cult, in Russia. AND

        Well, with this, too, not everything is going smoothly: the captured Temples of the Old Believers are confirmation of this, they still have not sued.
    3. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 30 August 2020 16: 27 New
      +6
      Some kind of mess in your head. On the one hand, for you, Lenin is a scoundrel, on the other hand, you are crying for utility bills and transfer payments of pensions, which is just a consequence of the struggle with the heavy legacy of bloody komunyak. Hand face.
      1. kyznets
        kyznets 31 August 2020 13: 32 New
        0
        I have never cried about utility bills and pension transfers. No need to juggle. All right, convinced comrades speak out to the best of their convictions against religion and "priestly propaganda." And you, a citizen with the nickname "IS-80_RVGK2", just gloated not very nicely. They spat on the shoe of an Orthodox person. For me, Lenin is a scoundrel, like Trotsky, and the Zinovievs, Kamenevs, Bukharins, who fought not for Russia and the people, but for personal power. Gorbachev and Yeltsin are also communists by the way, not priests and priests. And perestroika, privatization, collapse and sale of the country were organized and carried out not by "clergy", but by the communists, and not small in ranks and positions. And they come to priests from the people, they come from us and you, not from America and not from the bright and holy future. They are what we are. And, too, someone believes, and someone follows well-being. And the percentage of those and those cannot differ from the general in the country, in our people. "There is nothing to blame on the mirror ...".
        1. IS-80_RVGK2
          IS-80_RVGK2 31 August 2020 16: 53 New
          -1
          Quote: kyznets
          And perestroika, privatization, collapse and sale of the country were organized and carried out not by "clergy", but by the communists

          A mess, a big, big mess in your head. The privatization, collapse and sale of the country were not arranged by the communists. By 91, there were practically no communists left. For do you know it is difficult to call people who are apologists of capitalism communists.
          1. kyznets
            kyznets 1 September 2020 07: 00 New
            0
            For your second time, the dialogue begins with worries about the order in MY head. Have you tried to think a little about yourself? Learn to communicate with strangers, for example. To express your thoughts in a more accessible and logical way, without insults and rudeness?
            1. IS-80_RVGK2
              IS-80_RVGK2 1 September 2020 12: 35 New
              0
              And you don't write any nonsense and everything will be fine.
          2. kyznets
            kyznets 1 September 2020 07: 15 New
            0
            The overwhelming majority of privatizers were precisely communists and Komsomol members, with crusts, with party and Komsomol positions. There is no need to cast a shadow over the fence. And then your priests are all smeared with one world - all scoundrels, and by 91 there were practically no party members left. And until 91, who were these non-party reformers of yours? Parishioners of the capitalist church? Underground priests and part-time "apologists of capitalism" accidentally, through a misunderstanding, graduated from the highest party schools?
            1. IS-80_RVGK2
              IS-80_RVGK2 1 September 2020 12: 38 New
              0
              And if I put a sign "donkey" on you, will you become a donkey? So don't write nonsense boy. This is not your kindergarten. Your noodles won't work.
              Who they were before '91 is all the same. What matters is who they were in 91.
              1. kyznets
                kyznets 2 September 2020 00: 24 New
                0
                I was a boy in the 70s. I see no point in further communication. I'm not going to respond to rudeness. I personally feel sorry for you.
                1. IS-80_RVGK2
                  IS-80_RVGK2 2 September 2020 08: 08 New
                  -1
                  Pity yourself a merged demagogue. Happy piping trip to the sump.
    4. Simargl
      Simargl 31 August 2020 05: 07 New
      +2
      Quote: kyznets
      Green candles - and green in Orthodoxy - the color of the Holy Life-Giving Trinity.
      Pixel art is for special reverence.

      Quote: kyznets
      And also, worst of all - already look at drug addicts in your yards and your entrances.
      It is already clear that all atheists are drug addicts and murderers.
      ... although ... it's like those who stumbled begin to beg for forgiveness. True, not in people (victims). And then they stumble. And they beg ...
  • horus88
    horus88 30 August 2020 05: 51 New
    29
    The people are not as stupid as our leaders think. They, of course, need patriotism. But they confuse patriotism with blind faith. It is impossible to educate patriots only by remembering the exploits of their ancestors. And planting religion won't help here either.
    If a country is strong in the world arena, and people’s well-being grows inside the country, then patriotism will develop on its own. The state will only need to remove various garbage from TV and the Internet. This was the case in the USSR. So in China, so in Europe. So it is in the USA. And our well-being falls from year to year, people have nowhere to work, pensions have been stolen, medicine is available only in large cities. It's better not to talk about education at all ...
    Where does patriotism come from? Why love our state and its rulers?
    And instead of addressing the issue of improving the welfare of citizens, creating products that are in demand on world markets, developing medicine and education, making them available to people, or at least just not interfering and not harming the population, the state decided to waste money and time on religion.
    This is the road to nowhere and the country is confidently walking along it.
    1. Tatyana
      Tatyana 30 August 2020 06: 50 New
      +7
      Quote: horus88
      The people are not as stupid as our leaders think. They, of course, need patriotism. But they confuse patriotism with blind faith. It is impossible to educate patriots only by remembering the exploits of their ancestors. And planting religion won't help here either. If a country is strong in the world arena, and people's well-being grows within the country, then patriotism will develop on its own. The state will only need to remove various garbage from TV and the Internet.

      And for some reason, "sovereign" servants do not really want to remove garbage from TV and the Internet. Enemy information units are working in our country in full.

      Navalny and "Navalnism" | The situation in Belarus | Whom does Pashinyan not love? | SMERSH | # 13 • Live: 28 Aug. 2020
      1. Tatyana
        Tatyana 30 August 2020 08: 30 New
        +1
        The church is now no match for the Internet. Namely.

        In China, the Internet is accessed through 7 channels - and they are all controlled by China to ensure the national security of the state. This is not just about censorship. But because the Internet is not just a wire - it is a part of the state border that needs to be protected.
        If you are not guarding the Internet, then this is a hole into which the enemy can launch any information to destabilize the country, as is the case in Belarus.
        More than 5 thousand channels go to Russiaand they are hardly controlled. Then some of them could simply be closed, if it is not possible to control all channels from 5 thousand.
        For Russia in its scale is not even R.Belarus, and the Russian Maidan can be 14 times more powerful than the now Maidan attempted STATE REVOLUTION in R.Belarus.
        1. Fan-fan
          Fan-fan 30 August 2020 11: 48 New
          +8
          Why, then, are Western countries not afraid of anything and do not restrict the Internet? Why doesn't the US cut off the Internet and are not afraid that someone will launch destabilizing information?
          I myself will answer - yes, because almost everything is transparent with them and the authorities have nothing to hide from their people.
          1. Motorist
            Motorist 30 August 2020 13: 21 New
            +1
            Quote: Fan-Fan
            because almost everything is transparent with them and the authorities have nothing to hide from their people

            Fresh food, as they say ... Vaughn, just the other day it was announced that a black drug addict actually died of an overdose. Although it was known almost immediately.
          2. Rebe haim
            Rebe haim 30 August 2020 13: 51 New
            +2
            How cruel you are belay
            An administrative post would be soldered to you (at least) for seditious speeches, to a break in the template and to cognitive dissonance leading to mental torment over the issue of insoluble respectable patriotic citizens, causing am
          3. IS-80_RVGK2
            IS-80_RVGK2 31 August 2020 17: 50 New
            0
            Quote: Fan-Fan
            Why doesn't the US cut off the Internet and are not afraid that someone will launch destabilizing information?

            Is this a joke?
    2. Oleg133
      Oleg133 30 August 2020 07: 30 New
      +5
      The leaders of the Russian Federation need patriotism ... It's funny
    3. nickname7
      nickname7 30 August 2020 10: 14 New
      +6
      Where does patriotism come from? Why love our state and its rulers?

      In the Russian Federation, pseudo patriotism, on the one hand, the liberals who are in power and teaching, do not accept patriotism and ridicule, on the other hand, the English citizen Brilev, arriving on duty, teaches the patriotism of Russians. Again, if we compare with the West, then they have real patriotism, not pseudo, there those who ridicule patriotism do not work in universities. And going to foreign embassies is a criminal offense.
    4. anykin
      anykin 30 August 2020 12: 15 New
      0
      Quote: horus88
      Where does patriotism come from? Why love our state and its rulers?

      Love for the Motherland in exchange for benefits? And what to do when the choice is life or death, because having received the benefits and giving your life, you lose all the benefits? Is your shirt closer?
      1. Revival
        Revival 30 August 2020 13: 25 New
        +5
        No, love for the homeland in exchange for care, when you see that everything is being done for the people.
        And not when the billionaire minister tells you that we have a hard time, what exactly for you, but just not he needs to shrink and tighten his belts.
        And, most importantly, they love the Motherland! Power and homeland are often not the same thing, and sometimes there may be a direct "opposite"!
        1. anykin
          anykin 30 August 2020 20: 41 New
          -2
          Quote: Revival
          No, love for homeland in exchange for care

          These are the blessings.
          Quote: Revival
          They love their homeland anyway! Power and homeland are often not the same thing, and sometimes there may be a direct "opposite"!

          This is patriotism. And you bind him to the authorities, not to the Motherland.
          1. Revival
            Revival 30 August 2020 22: 22 New
            +3
            So I just bind him to the Motherland and only
  • The comment was deleted.
  • AK1972
    AK1972 31 August 2020 08: 37 New
    0
    Quote: Stas157
    and the church, broadcasting that a better life will come only in the afterlife.

    Not for all. On the oath of office in the unit where the son of the priest serves, he categorically stated that all unbaptized and non-Orthodox will burn in hell, and in the unit there are many Muslims.
  • Gardamir
    Gardamir 30 August 2020 08: 07 New
    +9
    Religious cult is shoved everywhere, but in the courtyard of the 21st century
    Yet it is simply explained. Someone after reading perestroika Ogonyok ended up in power. First, the deputy of one of the major cities of Russia, and then Himself in Russia. Nothing has changed for him. He rules over "Ogonyok".
  • Mikhalych
    Mikhalych 30 August 2020 09: 40 New
    -9
    Religious cult is shoved everywhere, but in the yard of the 21st century, as it says "God's servants", the more obedient slaves the better.

    They shove drugs into Hollywood, fornication and other sins, and the Orthodox Church fights against this, which is not to the liking of people like you - victims of the illiterate XXI century.
    And the communists rested on education, and in the army they taught the political situation in the world.
    .
    The communists cut off the tsarist education, and what they taught is not to discuss with snotty people.
    Yes, and these parasites are full of divorced, they do what they want, about any modesty, humility and fasting, on luxury cars, with belly and glossy mugs

    And you see how you plow a bee. All fingers about Klava were worn out. Take a trip and look around the villages at priest's Mercedes and do not pour pus on the Internet. And about the shiny hari, look in the mirror.
    1. Revival
      Revival 30 August 2020 13: 30 New
      +4
      "They shove drugs into Hollywood, fornication and other sins, and the Orthodox Church is fighting this."

      That is, the right hand shoves, and the left fights?
      All right ...
    2. polar fox
      polar fox 31 August 2020 07: 51 New
      0
      Quote: Mikhalych
      Take a trip and look around the villages at priest's Mercedes and do not pour pus on the Internet.

      come to us, look ... really, not a gelding, but a Korean (a new one again, the old drunk broke), a small log house, for 6 lam ... and the church is private (though the prosecutors do not "see" this, how and much more.
  • solzh
    solzh 5 September 2020 13: 03 New
    17
    Quote: Pessimist22
    The religious cult is shoved everywhere, but in the courtyard of the 21st century, as it says "God's servants", the more obedient slaves the better

    Karl Marx was right when he said: "Religion is opium for the people."
  • horus88
    horus88 30 August 2020 05: 19 New
    11
    I am afraid that in 2020 it is too late to raise spirituality through religion.
    Of course, it would be good for the authorities to return the people to Orthodoxy, for better control. But, there will be no return to mass obscurantism.
    So there is no reason to waste heaps of money on chaplains and other nonsense.

    Although there is one reason for all this, to cut some money ...
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 30 August 2020 05: 57 New
        24
        Quote: Dead Day
        Putin's policy looks disgusting, all around deception, fraud, corruption.

        Quote: Stas157
        The Church, being the support of power, was the fetters for the people

        Quote: horus88
        I am afraid that in 2020 it is too late to raise spirituality through religion.

        Quote: apro
        The most convenient ideology today is religion. After all, everything is by the will of God ... and the people ... the slaves of God ..

        good yes
        New priorities enter our life in even and close ranks: cynicism, greed, adultery, arrogance, hypocrisy, idolatry, lies, slander (of the past) ... A state built on plunder, impoverishment of some and on theft, satiety of others requires new bonds ... It is useless to talk about material things (examples are painfully incomprehensible), so we turned to abstract (spiritual) ones.
        And here pixel robes and camouflage candles come in handy ...

        ... militarized temples with portraits-icons, as well as: long-term plans, spurts and just breakthroughs; moaning with simultaneous zeroing and corrections; little gingerbread and big whip ...
        And all this is only for one purpose:
        Quote: Pessimist22
        the more obedient slaves, the better.

        hi
      2. Maki Avellevich
        Maki Avellevich 30 August 2020 06: 29 New
        -18
        Quote: Dead Day
        Putin's policy looks disgusting, all around the deception, eyewash, corruption. and yes, these priests are fucking in the edge. yes nafig such "braces" ...

        your photo looks disgusting.
        1. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 30 August 2020 09: 27 New
          11
          Quote: Maki Avellievich
          your photo looks disgusting.

          Because there, among others, the Star of David flies into the urn? wink Come on Dmitry, your religion, like "ours", was created with one purpose - to manage people. All monotheistic (are they all Abrahamic by chance? wink ) religions are artificially created, in contrast to pagan religions, which deified the forces of nature, and identified man as part of nature.
          So the photo is super! good
          1. Maki Avellevich
            Maki Avellevich 31 August 2020 05: 33 New
            0
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            Because there, among others, the Star of David flies into the urn?

            because you think faith is rubbish.
            1. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 31 August 2020 06: 22 New
              +2
              Monotheistic religions are the work of human hands, not of God. And they have a distant relationship to faith.
            2. Greenwood
              Greenwood 31 August 2020 11: 36 New
              +1
              Quote: Maki Avellievich
              because you think faith is rubbish.
              So it is. And you are a very narrow-minded person, if in the 21st century you think differently and respect this obscurantism. laughing
              1. Maki Avellevich
                Maki Avellevich 2 September 2020 06: 27 New
                0
                Quote: Greenwood
                So it is. And you are a very narrow-minded person, if in the 21st century you think differently and respect this obscurantism.

                I understand that you are an advanced person. you consider yourself enlightened and your ancestors fools.
                that is, your father, grandfather, great-grandfather and all on tiptoe did not understand anything in life and were just blind obscurantists?
                I think you just suffer from arrogance, narrow thinking and a little rudeness.

                I have the honor.
                1. Greenwood
                  Greenwood 2 September 2020 14: 32 New
                  0
                  Quote: Maki Avellievich
                  that is, your father, grandfather, great-grandfather and all on tiptoe did not understand anything in life
                  Let's continue the chain even further. Our ancient ancestors believed they were pagans, worshiped the god Perun, and even more ancient ones ran after mammoths and did not know anything about the world around them. Let's follow their traditions, we respect our ancestors. Why do we need development, why do we need science, why do we need progress and the evolution of reason? So we will remain in the darkness of obscurantism, because our ancestors lived like that. It is remembered in the Middle Ages that the church actively hindered the development of the exact sciences, and many prominent scientists and thinkers paid with their careers and even their lives for their progressive views. Do you think this is justified and the church should be respected for it?
                  Live your mind, not the mind of your father-grandfather-great-grandfather, etc. Progress does not stand still, human knowledge is accumulating, and many erroneous judgments of the past have no place in the 21st century.
                  PS And yes, my great-grandfather and grandfather were ideological communists and did not respect religion even then, at the beginning or middle of the last century.
                  1. Maki Avellevich
                    Maki Avellevich 2 September 2020 20: 18 New
                    0
                    Quote: Greenwood
                    PS And yes, my great-grandfather and grandfather were ideological communists and did not respect religion even then, at the beginning or middle of the last century.

                    before your great-grandfather, you have no ancestors, or they were "ideological communists" in the 17th century?

                    If you are interested, you will find out to your surprise that many theoretical physicists, for example, over the years, begin to think about the fact that perhaps the universe is still the work of a "creator" and not a spontaneous product of nature.

                    and they pay attention to people of science, supposedly had to shake off the "obscurantism".
                    everything is possibly a little more complicated than you express in your posts.

                    today cosmologists describe quite reasonably the chronology of the evolution of the universe, but only from a non-zero point. they are sure that they know how elementary particles began to form in 1/1000000 second after the birth of the world, but they cannot even roughly imagine what was at point zero, not to mention what happened before the birth of the universe.
                    and they usually have enough imagination, but not for that.
                    I myself cannot call myself a believer, but your categorism provokes presenting balancing opinions /
                    1. Greenwood
                      Greenwood 4 September 2020 15: 52 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Maki Avellievich
                      before your great-grandfather, you have no ancestors, or they were "ideological communists" in the 17th century?
                      There are, but their worldview is unknown to me and does not affect my own.
                      Quote: Maki Avellievich
                      If you are interested, you will find out to your surprise that many theoretical physicists, for example, over the years, begin to think about the fact that perhaps the universe is still the work of a "creator" and not a spontaneous product of nature.
                      Which for example?
                      Quote: Maki Avellievich
                      and they pay attention to people of science, supposedly had to shake off the "obscurantism".
                      everything is possibly a little more complicated than you express in your posts.
                      Far-fetched.
                      Quote: Maki Avellievich
                      I myself cannot call myself a believer, but your categorism provokes presenting balancing opinions /
                      I believe that in the 21st century there is no place for all kinds of fictional gods. The 21st century is the century of science and technology, the century of the development of the human mind and the rise of mankind to a new technological level. And all these religions should remain where their ancient Egyptian, Greek, Sumerian and Roman predecessors remained - in history.
                      1. Maki Avellevich
                        Maki Avellevich 4 September 2020 17: 06 New
                        0
                        Quote: Greenwood
                        I believe that in the 21st century there is no place for all kinds of fictional gods. The 21st century is the century of science and technology, the century of the development of the human mind and the rise of mankind to a new technological level.

                        Blessed is he who believes.
          2. Glaaki
            Glaaki 22 September 2020 23: 49 New
            0
            Eklmn, another Heroslav. There is probably no one worse than ebzyniks.
        2. Fan-fan
          Fan-fan 30 August 2020 11: 55 New
          16
          Gundyaev's dacha on the Black Sea coast, which even has a pier for yachts, also looks disgusting. However, all the palaces of officials who teach us about patriotism look disgusting.
      3. Hagen
        Hagen 30 August 2020 08: 54 New
        -3
        Quote: Dead Day
        and even these priests are crazy to the edge

        According to various studies, about 70% of the Russian population consider themselves Orthodox, of which "30% are really Christians, 35% want to be Christians, but are not yet firm in moral principles." A very serious number of people consider this to be an important part of life. Looking at the photo you gave, I want to ask you, tell me why you hate and despise them so much? Did a pop step on your foot or seduce your wife? Maybe progressive dementia is to blame? So you're about 55, it's too early.
        1. Fan-fan
          Fan-fan 30 August 2020 11: 59 New
          10
          Pop lives on public money, i.e. and on mine, so I don't like the priests, since I personally do not benefit from them. And the fact that they receive money from the budget is widely known and is not hiding, although some say (lie) that the ROC exists only on voluntary donations from people.
          1. Hagen
            Hagen 30 August 2020 12: 24 New
            -6
            Quote: Fan-Fan
            I do not like priests, since I personally do not benefit from them.

            You never know what you don't like ?! The democratic principle is the priority for the decision of the majority. You are not lucky enough to be in the minority. Your opinion is not counted. Most don't mind. But this majority does not force you to anything, and therefore you just have to come to terms with the opinion of the majority of fellow citizens.
            1. Fan-fan
              Fan-fan 30 August 2020 13: 58 New
              11
              And what was the vote of some sort, where it was decided to give out money from the budget to the priests or not? What majority are you talking about?
              1. Hagen
                Hagen 30 August 2020 14: 05 New
                -6
                Quote: Fan-Fan
                What majority are you talking about?

                You are still one against, and those who are "for" even if there are two, then already the majority. And by the way, where did you get the salaries of the priests from the budget? In which line of the painting did you see it? On the website of the Ministry of Finance, the budget of the Russian Federation for 2020 is there, show me. If you don't want to be a gibberish. I don't mind agreeing with you at all if you are convincing on the documents. wink I know about the help of the Russian Orthodox Church in taxes and in kind, in the form of buildings and structures. But for money - doubts are sorted out.
          2. Revival
            Revival 30 August 2020 13: 35 New
            +5
            So our secular court, without batting an eye, makes a decision that they do not trade in the church, but give out for donations, they say, you can go up and just take everything that is on the counter! Nobody just knows! So, armed with a court decision with the official position of the Russian Orthodox Church, you can go and try to take something (everything) just like that or for a symbolic ruble !?
            Or will it fail?

            PS
            The decision of the court with this official position of the ROC is widely known, I can post it in confirmation.
            1. Hagen
              Hagen 30 August 2020 14: 08 New
              -6
              Quote: Revival
              Or will it fail?

              And if a parishioner "pleases" with a candelabrum on the head, it will be fair, isn't it? Didn't bring anything, don't ask for anything, and even less take ...
              1. Revival
                Revival 30 August 2020 14: 50 New
                +3
                This is the official position of the Russian Orthodox Church, what a candelabrum.
                And if they are simply inadequate, and even contrary to the position of the church, they will simply be brought to justice
                1. Hagen
                  Hagen 30 August 2020 16: 04 New
                  -3
                  Quote: Revival
                  This is the official position of the Russian Orthodox Church, what a candelabrum.

                  You will be able to take it when they give you ... You will steal - the police and the court, you want to take it arbitrarily by force - a candelabrum as self-defense.
                  1. Revival
                    Revival 30 August 2020 16: 06 New
                    +5
                    Once again, the official position of the Russian Orthodox Church, recorded in the court decision. You come and take it!
                    Not mine, but ROC officially!
                    1. Hagen
                      Hagen 30 August 2020 16: 07 New
                      0
                      Quote: Revival
                      Once again, the official position of the Russian Orthodox Church, recorded in the court decision. You come and take it!

                      Let's give a court decision ....
                      1. Revival
                        Revival 30 August 2020 16: 08 New
                        0
                        A minute, I'll find it right now, downloaded it to a computer for interest
                      2. Revival
                        Revival 30 August 2020 16: 46 New
                        +2
                        Right now I'll try to lay out!
                        SOLUTION
                        RUSSIAN FEDERATION
                        On July 10, 2012, the Khamovnicheskiy District Court of Moscow, composed of the presiding judge I.V. Kananovich, under the secretary L.G. Khegai, examined in an open court civil case No. 2-1933 / 12 at the claim of the Interregional Public Organization Society for the Protection of Consumer Rights "Public control in action" in defense of the rights of an indefinite circle of persons to the Religious organization "Compound of the Patriarch of Moscow and All Russia Cathedral Cathedral of Christ the Savior of the Russian Orthodox Church (Moscow Patriarchate)" on the protection of consumer rights,
                        U S T A N O V I L:
                      3. Revival
                        Revival 30 August 2020 16: 47 New
                        +2
                        The plaintiff went to court with this claim, arguing that when carrying out verification activities in the retail premises located on the first floor of the Cathedral of Christ the Savior at the address: Moscow, st. Volkhonka, d. 15, multiple violations of consumer protection legislation were revealed regarding the rules for conducting trading activities. The plaintiff asks to oblige the defendant to stop unlawful actions that violate the rights of an indefinite circle of consumers, namely, the implementation of trading activities in the Cathedral of Christ the Savior at the address: Moscow, Volkhonka Street, 15 in the absence of a sign, lack of information about the seller, his name, location, operating mode; lack of information about the rules for the sale of goods; the absence of issued price tags indicating the name of the product, its grade, price per weight or unit of goods, the signature of the financially responsible person or the seal of the organization, the date of registration of the price tag; lack of information on the goods sold; non-use of cash registers, non-issuance of cash registers, sales receipts and other documents confirming the fact and conditions of purchase to customers in relation to goods that are not objects of religious worship and religious literature; and also oblige the defendant to publish information about the court decision in the Moscow Government newspaper "Tverskaya, 13".
                        At the hearing, the plaintiff's representative asked to satisfy the claim.
                      4. Revival
                        Revival 30 August 2020 16: 49 New
                        +1
                        The defendant's representatives appeared in court and objected to the satisfaction of the plaintiff's claims.
                        The representative of the Office of the Federal Service for Supervision of Consumer Rights Protection and Human Welfare in the city of Moscow in the court session gave a conclusion in which he indicated that the fact of the compensatory nature of the defendant's relations with citizens had not been proven, since the distribution of religious items among believers is a ritual, an established tradition , and also noted that the plaintiff violated the procedure established by Art. 45 of the Law of the Russian Federation "On Protection of Consumer Rights".
                      5. Revival
                        Revival 30 August 2020 16: 50 New
                        +1
                        In accordance with the Charter, the defendant is a religious organization within the structure and jurisdiction of the Russian Orthodox Church, is its canonical division. In accordance with clause 3.1 of the Charter, the aim of the defendant's activities is the realization by citizens of the right to joint confession and dissemination of the Orthodox faith.
                      6. Revival
                        Revival 30 August 2020 16: 52 New
                        +2
                        By virtue of Art. 17 of Federal Law No. 26.09.1997-FZ of 125 “On Freedom of Conscience and on Religious Associations”, religious organizations have the right to produce, acquire, export, import and distribute religious literature, printed, audio and video materials and other religious items.
                        When interpreting this norm in systemic unity with Art. 23 of the Federal Law of 26.09.1997 No. 125-FZ "On Freedom of Conscience and on Religious Associations", the court considers that the distribution by the defendant of religious literature, printed, audio and video materials and other religious items is not a commercial activity, since it is aimed at achieving statutory tasks related to the realization by citizens of the right to joint confession and dissemination of faith.
                        At the hearing the representative of the defendant explained that the building at the address: Moscow, st. Volkhonka, 15, is owned by the city of Moscow and by the order of the Government of the city of Moscow dated April 15.04.2004, 703. No. 01.02.2006-RP was transferred to the trust management of the non-profit organization "Fund of the Cathedral of Christ the Savior", with which the defendant signed an agreement dated 3697,27. on the joint use of the general cultural premises of the complex of the Cathedral of Christ the Savior. In accordance with the specified agreement, non-residential premises with a total area of ​​55692,00 sq.m. were transferred to the plaintiff for use. with a total area of ​​the complex XNUMX sq.m.
                        Also, the representative of the defendant indicated that the defendant held services on the premises provided, and there are also places for the distribution of religious items in accordance with the provided list on the basis of voluntary donations.
                        The court considers that the legal relationship in the field of human and civil rights to freedom of conscience and freedom of religion, as well as the legal status of religious associations, are not regulated by consumer protection legislation, and therefore the stated requirements should be refused.
                        Based on the foregoing, guided by Art. 194-198 Code of Civil Procedure of the Russian Federation, court
                        I DECIDED:
                        To satisfy the claim of the Interregional Public Organization Society for the Protection of Consumer Rights "Public Control in Action" in defense of the rights of an indefinite circle of persons against the Religious Organization "Compound of the Patriarch of Moscow and All Russia Cathedral Cathedral of Christ the Savior of the Russian Orthodox Church (Moscow Patriarchate)" to protect consumer rights to refuse ...
                        An appeal against the decision can be submitted within one month to the Moscow City Court.
                        Judge:
                      7. Revival
                        Revival 30 August 2020 16: 53 New
                        +2
                        link to the cassation of the IGU

                        https://www.mos-gorsud.ru/mgs/services/cases/cassation-civil/details/ab0d0ef8-1d5d-4bd4-ac6e-0baf12c19ddd?participants=%C2%AB%D0%9F%D0%BE%D0%B4%D0%B2%D0%BE%D1%80%D1%8C%D0%B5+%D0%9F%D0%B0%D1%82%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%85%D0%B0+%D0%9C%D0%BE%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B3%D0%BE+%D0%B8+%D0%B2%D1%81%D0%B5%D1%8F+%D0%A0%D1%83%D1%81%D0%B8+%D0%9A%D0%B0%D1%84%D0%B5%D0%B4%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B9+%D1%81%D0%BE%D0%B1%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B9+%D0%A5%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BC+%D0%A5%D1%80%D0%B8%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B0+%D0%A1%D0%BF%D0%B0%D1%81%D0%B8%D1%82%D0%B5%D0%BB%D1%8F+%D0%A0%D1%83%D1%81%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B9+%D0%9F%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B2%D0%BE%D1%81%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%B2%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B9+%D0%A6%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%BA%D0%B2%D0%B8+%28%D0%9C%D0%BE%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9
              2. Hagen
                Hagen 30 August 2020 18: 12 New
                -1
                Quote: Revival
                Right now I'll try to lay out!

                Well, what's not clear here? "the distribution of religious items is not a commercial activity ....... the distribution of religious items in accordance with the list provided on the basis of voluntary donations ....
                So, armed with a court decision with the official position of the Russian Orthodox Church, you can go and try to take something (everything) just like that or for a symbolic ruble !?

                So you read on the written - "provided based voluntary donations. ”What makes you think that you set the amount of donation yourself? Voluntariness, in this case, does not mean at all that you are free not to donate for what you have taken. Material relations (grounds for change of ownership) do not change. The legality of exchanging things for donations changes. But only.
              3. Revival
                Revival 30 August 2020 22: 21 New
                +1
                I understand that you are not a lawyer.
                So the established obligatory payment for a thing is trade, whatever you call it.
                They just denied the existence of such, otherwise they would fall under the law.
                Therefore, the term distribution is used for them, that is, distribution, not sale.
                And admitting that you have set a fixed price ("donation"), you will fall under trade with all that it implies.
                So the representatives of the Russian Orthodox Church in court knew what they were doing, they were more savvy, so to speak
              4. Hagen
                Hagen 31 August 2020 08: 16 New
                -1
                Quote: Revival
                Therefore, the term distribution is used for them, that is, distribution, not sale.

                Distribution implies voluntary action. Seeing the insignificance of your donation, the owner of the thing refuses to give you out. And all the cases. So if you are a lawyer, then um ... not very ...
              5. Revival
                Revival 31 August 2020 09: 22 New
                +2
                I watch you very ...
                And it makes no sense for me to discuss the absurdity that you write about the "refusal of voluntary distribution" with "a small amount of donation.
                This topic was the subject of a detailed legal analysis in 12, 13 years, in legal circles this decision has long received the status of "who needs a leg" ..
              6. Hagen
                Hagen 31 August 2020 11: 23 New
                -1
                Quote: Revival
                This topic was the subject of a detailed legal analysis in 12, 13 years, in legal circles this decision has long received the status of "who needs a leg" ..

                That's it. What other questions? So buy a church for a ruble, then share your experience. You contradict yourself. Indeed, the Wise One was right - our country will be ruined by lawyers. There are ten opinions for two lawyers ... And yes, you are right, I am not a theoretical lawyer, I am more of a law enforcement practitioner.
              7. Revival
                Revival 31 August 2020 12: 05 New
                +2
                Yes, very few people are interested in the law, this is understandable.
  • polar fox
    polar fox 31 August 2020 07: 55 New
    +1
    Quote: Revival
    So our secular court, without batting an eye, makes a decision that they do not trade in the church, but give out for donations, they say, you can go up and just take everything that is on the counter! Nobody just knows! So, armed with a court decision with the official position of the Russian Orthodox Church, you can go and try to take something (everything) just like that or for a symbolic ruble !?
    Or will it fail?

    register a non-profit organization and get rich)))) only do not write money anywhere, write donations or contributions ... as in payments for housing and communal services.
    1. Revival
      Revival 31 August 2020 09: 25 New
      +2
      good ))))))))))) hi
  • fyvaprold
    fyvaprold 30 August 2020 11: 27 New
    -2
    Quote: Dead Day
    Putin's policy looks disgusting, all around the deception, eyewash, corruption. and yes, these priests are fucking in the edge. yes nafig such "braces" ...

    Congratulations to Musya! Your "piccha" is quite attracted to "extremism", like "GrandfatherOld"and brains, like an unfortunate undergrowth. It is regrettable. Do not bother yourself with the answer, I have no desire to communicate with the" shit-spitters ". My contempt.
    Regarding the next skomorokhovsky vyser: - The novel has sunk to outright slander:
    In general, of course, the penetration of the ROC into the army evokes different emotions in everyone. I am already silent about representatives of other religions. In our army, everything is the same: if you want to send spiritual needs, get baptized. If you are a Muslim, a Catholic, a Buddhist, a Jew, or anyone else, these are your problems..

    I serve in the Southern Military District, half of the personnel are Muslims and no one forces them to be "baptized", there is also a chapel and a room for prayer, so this stuffing is pure slander, it will be necessary to give a special officer to read it, let him laugh, otherwise he was already covered with moss from idleness. Skomorokhov completely slipped into anti-Russian rhetoric, not "anti-Putin" or "liberal", but anti-Russian, at first "victoriousness", now about the "dominance" of clergy, what will happen next? Opuses about "S. r.a.n.yu K. a.ts.a.pn.yu" and "Ra ... ku - parashka"? It's time for Mr. Smirnov to take off his eyes and not be surprised at the fall in advertising revenue. With articles like this, ad placement is a direct reputational loss. Is it done for the fun of "kreaklam"? So they do not produce a real product, they themselves live on donations, from them advertising fees, like from a black sheep.
    PS: Maybe the SBU verbanula Skomorokhov when he brought humanitarian aid to the LPR, and now he twists the testicles, forcing him to take a mouthful of shit and spit on everything around? Yes, this is exactly "crap spitting", and not "autopsy of abscesses".
    PPS:By the way, army priests, we at least undergo training as sanitary instructors, that's right ... just for information.
    1. Revival
      Revival 30 August 2020 13: 39 New
      +3
      That is, I understood correctly that you have assigned premises for all religions, as it should be? Or just, but not for everyone?
      1. fyvaprold
        fyvaprold 30 September 2020 21: 52 New
        0
        Quote: Revival
        That is, I understood correctly that you have assigned premises for all religions, as it should be? Or just, but not for everyone?

        Yes, you understood correctly. For everyone who (in the person of the clergy) expressed such a desire. If you are (conditionally) not a representative of the "God Kuzi" or "Boko-Haram" cult, you will not have any problems with religion.
        PS:I apologize for the delay in answering, this is life stop
    2. Hagen
      Hagen 30 August 2020 14: 12 New
      -1
      Quote: fyvaprold
      PPS: By the way, army priests, we at least are trained as sanitary instructors, that's right ... just for information.

      Thanks for the interesting addition. Did not know... hi
  • Reptiloid
    Reptiloid 30 August 2020 07: 17 New
    +3
    Quote: horus88
    I am afraid that in 2020 it is too late to raise spirituality through religion.
    Of course, it would be good for the authorities to return the people to Orthodoxy ... Although there is one reason for all this, to cut some money ...
    not only one, in my opinion. And just to emphasize our merits, they say, we care. And it would be better if medical and children's institutions were built, in my opinion.
    1. rocket757
      rocket757 30 August 2020 07: 46 New
      +2
      Dmitriy soldier
      Any stick, as always, has two ends .... there are more, sometimes.
      To consider only your opinion as the most correct ... is futile.
      In OUR society, there is a lot of confusion, little in common, holding together!
      To go in search of something, it is not clear what, just waste time ... while you can use something time-tested.
      Yes, it WILL NOT work as it used to, time-tested ... we ourselves have changed too much! but what is good about it, time-tested, it knows how to adapt to new conditions !!!
      There will be at least some kind of unity, there will be something that we need right now!
      1. Errr
        Errr 30 August 2020 08: 48 New
        +6
        Quote: rocket757
        There will be at least some kind of unity, there will be something that we need right now!
        belay No. negative
        Sorry for the brevity, but IT no way DOES NOT WORK... This train has left, and time simply does not have a reverse. Development takes place in a spiral, and each next round is not an exact copy of the previous one. The religious factor, as a consolidating factor, will never work again precisely because, as you yourself prudently noted:
        Quote: rocket757
        we ourselves have changed too!
        yes
        1. rocket757
          rocket757 30 August 2020 09: 00 New
          +1
          You won't try, you won't know!
          I have no illusions about this, but some of our fellow citizens consider faith an important part of their life. You shouldn't dismiss it for nothing ....
          Everything can be used wisely.
          By the way, one should not focus only on the "progressive" Western world, there is also a strongly religious East and other countries, which are right next to us! It would be a big mistake to ignore the religious factor !!!
          1. Errr
            Errr 30 August 2020 09: 16 New
            +4
            A big mistake in overcoming obstacles is using unsuitable means. "Do no harm" is the main commandment not only of a doctor. smile
            1. rocket757
              rocket757 30 August 2020 09: 50 New
              +1
              Yes, yes, at least one progressive method, name that has shown itself in countries with significant religious influence?
              Right here and now, or at least yesterday ...
              1. Errr
                Errr 30 August 2020 10: 16 New
                +6
                The Russian Federation is not a "country with significant religious influence." And on a global scale, this very religiosity at the moment is not a natural trait of every person, but a factor shamelessly implanted by rogue solicitors of all stripes in order to disunite peoples and subordinate the will of people to their loved ones in order to extract their own benefit from this. However, nothing new. It has always been that way.
                And you have very little left to put the squeeze on me until the moment I utter: "Workers of all countries, unite!" laughing
                Thank you for unwittingly reminding me of the episode in the jail from the movie "Passport". smile [https://youtu.be/p3rBWFx6kAU] I love this movie. hi
                1. rocket757
                  rocket757 30 August 2020 11: 21 New
                  +1
                  Yes, yes, it was so eradicated that it completely disappeared.
                  It is possible to separate the church from the state, it is more difficult to reduce the significance and influence, but you can cut it down with an ax, and even then not everywhere, as an instructive example, but again, this is temporary ... a bad example, not convincing, because everything began to return to square one its own, albeit in a limited amount, by the way, long before the persecutors disappeared completely or disguised themselves, who's like.
                  And now the MUSLIM EAST !!! What, where and how, Western, "progressive" infidels there were able to change even by mm ???
                  And Islam is coming all over the world !!! Now, in any city, consider a gayropean city, you can hear a mullah ..... what else are cool, in former Christian churches !!!
                  By the way, I am not an atheist in which knee! I do not accept religion in any form, but I will never encroach on people’s FAITH.
                  My wife is a believer, children are baptized, BUT, I will not tolerate a single object of worship in the house, I will not let my children into church, then, when they grow up, let them decide on their own choice.
                  1. Fan-fan
                    Fan-fan 30 August 2020 12: 05 New
                    +9
                    The greater the share of influence on the country of the priests, the poorer the country, the more backward the country in technology and science.
                    Well, you will not argue here that there is a God?
                    Let the one who wants to believe in this, but this belief cannot be imposed on everyone.
                    1. rocket757
                      rocket757 30 August 2020 13: 14 New
                      0
                      You cannot impose faith, you can impose religion. By the way, the denial of everything and everyone can also be imposed ... but then the emptiness of faith has to be filled with something, otherwise, in an empty place, the line will nestle !!! A risky option.
                    2. Fan-fan
                      Fan-fan 30 August 2020 14: 05 New
                      +7
                      Here's how, it turns out if there is no faith and you deny religion, then immediately emptiness and the devil knows what?
                      You are mistaken, but what about faith in goodness, in justice, in decent people? Yes, yes, I believe that there are decent people in Russia, but I don't see such people in power.
                    3. rocket757
                      rocket757 30 August 2020 15: 50 New
                      0
                      Everyone "goes crazy" in their own way !!!
                      For me, FAITH is not a duty to fulfill any religious cult!
                      I have ALL concessions, religious movements are equally EXACTLY, but the faith of people, if it does not go, frankly, against a person, society, MY COUNTRY, in general, I am also exactly, but with respect!
                      I have my own FAITH, it’s just different, not connected with religion in any way.
                      BUT, many religious postulates are very reasonable, human, useful and in no way contradict my worldview !!!
                      In this case, we are on the same path and can be allies, so that in the empty heads of people, the devils do not start !!!
                      Belief in good is what you need.
                      Belief in bad things is unacceptable!
                      Therefore, at this moment in time, I admit, any concessions that help our people, the whole society, take the path of CREATION, it is better than NOTHING at all!
              2. Revival
                Revival 30 August 2020 13: 43 New
                +4
                And now east ...
                And what are their achievements of the invention ...?
                1. Fan-fan
                  Fan-fan 30 August 2020 14: 09 New
                  +5
                  Japan and South Korea are also east, and they have many achievements in high technologies. Maybe just because religion is not imposed on their people, but science is "imposed".
                2. Revival
                  Revival 30 August 2020 14: 52 New
                  +2
                  Well, this is another "east", the commentator meant Arabic, that's what I answered
              3. rocket757
                rocket757 30 August 2020 14: 10 New
                -1
                Quote: Revival
                And now east ...
                And what are their achievements of the invention ...?

                Was there any talk about ACHIEVEMENTS, INVENTIONS? And in what area, let me know, should there be achievements when the conversation is for faith and religion?
              4. Revival
                Revival 30 August 2020 14: 54 New
                +2
                The conversation was about the consequences and possible relationship
              5. rocket757
                rocket757 30 August 2020 15: 58 New
                0
                The conversation was about spiritual, faith and religion, about the strong influence of religion on the life of the inhabitants of BV !!! The question was about where and how the Western countries managed to change this very situation!
                You discussed scientific and technological progress with someone else.
                Themes are interrelated, but worthy of a separate discussion!
                I can consider both, but jumping from one topic to another is not comme il faut!
              6. Revival
                Revival 30 August 2020 16: 01 New
                +1
                No, that's what I mean!

                "The conversation was about the spiritual, faith and religion, about the strong influence of religion on the life of the inhabitants of BV."

                So, it seems to me that, in particular, it affects that
                "And what are their achievements of the invention ..?"
              7. rocket757
                rocket757 30 August 2020 16: 14 New
                0
                You again about yours.
              8. Revival
                Revival 30 August 2020 16: 17 New
                +1
                About a stranger, it would be strange ...
              9. rocket757
                rocket757 30 August 2020 17: 21 New
                +1
                Religion is not an absolute reason that inhibits development or, on the contrary, contributes to the intensive development of the scientific and innovative sphere of any state.
                It is a tool of influence, management and, like most tools, can be used for good or bad!
                It all depends on whose hands he will be!
                In each case, it must be considered individually.
  • Reptiloid
    Reptiloid 31 August 2020 00: 06 New
    +1
    Victor! The bell didn't work! I would have answered earlier. Here not far, at a distance, on the street 1,5 km --- 2 churches. An even larger Cathedral is under construction. And they wanted 2 big Cathedrals. If there are 4 stops from this place, there is a church. On the other side of the same place there are 7 stops --- a church. On the third side there are 7 stops ----- church more. And then there is the church, but not to explain. And on the same territory there are also other confessions. Children's institutions on the ground floors of residential buildings. Or instead of a stroller, or an apartment .... But sometimes several apartments are on the 1st floor.
    1. rocket757
      rocket757 31 August 2020 07: 44 New
      +1
      Dmitriy soldier
      There is a ostentatious, pretentious event, behind which they are trying to hide a very terrible phenomenon ... Our society is losing the goals, tasks, ideas that hold it together !!! And nothing in return! And by the way, all this has nothing to do with faith ...
      1. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 31 August 2020 09: 20 New
        +1
        Quote: rocket757
        Dmitriy soldier ... Our society is losing its bonds, goals, objectives, ideas !!! And nothing in return! And by the way, all this has nothing to do with faith ...
        hi hi Greetings Victor!
        I totally agree with you! Ambiguity and lies will not lead to anything good! To begin with, the Church would have stopped feeling sorry for Tsar Nicholas 2
        1. rocket757
          rocket757 31 August 2020 09: 38 New
          +1
          I am not interested in all such events ... like most citizens.
          There is no soul in them, so all of this will end on its own, it will die off as unnecessary.
          1. Reptiloid
            Reptiloid 31 August 2020 09: 50 New
            +1
            Quote: rocket757
            Me all such events. .... There is no soul in them, so all of this will come to the side, it will end by itself, it will die out as unnecessary.
            I would be glad if this happens. I'll be leaving soon. Until the evening! hi
            1. rocket757
              rocket757 31 August 2020 09: 52 New
              +1
              Everything is repeated one more time, one more time ...
  • Mikhalych
    Mikhalych 30 August 2020 09: 42 New
    -6
    it would be good for the authorities to return the people to Orthodoxy, for better control.

    You this baidu about control, better tell the Orthodox martyrs, from the authorities for the faith of the victims.
    1. rocket757
      rocket757 30 August 2020 09: 54 New
      +2
      People either have faith or they don't.
      At the expense of religion and its accompanying attributes .... it is very for an amateur.
      Command methods cannot return this, you should not even try.
      1. Uncle lee
        Uncle lee 30 August 2020 11: 01 New
        14
        Is this called the development of society?
        1. rocket757
          rocket757 30 August 2020 12: 54 New
          -1
          Suppose it was different before!
          Showy events now cause rejection !!! They have nothing to do with faith, patriotism, or life itself!
      2. Revival
        Revival 30 August 2020 16: 17 New
        +1
        And here, I completely agree
    2. Revival
      Revival 30 August 2020 13: 44 New
      +2
      Only those who did not fit in suffered
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 30 August 2020 14: 12 New
        0
        Those who did not find a job suffered always, everywhere, regardless of religion.
        1. Revival
          Revival 30 August 2020 14: 55 New
          +1
          Here, even more so
  • ximkim
    ximkim 30 August 2020 05: 28 New
    11
    The Inquisition project will soon be launched .. The Russian Orthodox Church was turned into the FITs (financial investment center), which means that the money must be used in circulation at minimal cost .. Making candles is not costing factories. sad
    1. GTYCBJYTH2021
      GTYCBJYTH2021 30 August 2020 07: 35 New
      +3
      Quote: ximkim
      The Inquisition project will soon be launched .. The Russian Orthodox Church was turned into the FITs (financial investment center), which means that the money must be used in circulation at minimal cost .. Making candles is not costing factories. sad

      Not candle factories, but PLANTS, too, must be built ..... No wax, paraffin and stearin will go into business ...... here is oil refining ...... laughing
    2. Husit
      Husit 30 August 2020 09: 33 New
      -6
      Quote: ximkim
      The Inquisition project will soon be launched .. The Russian Orthodox Church was turned into the FITs (financial investment center), which means that the money must be used in circulation at minimal cost .. Making candles is not costing factories. sad

      To whom what, and for some the toad strangles, that someone donates to temples, etc.
      You see, there is such a simple statement, “THERE ARE NO ATHEISTS IN THE MINES!” This is a very deep thought and proven by Russia more than once or twice in its history ..
      Think about it better and remember the 90s, when various Western sects poured into Russia, so they really duped the Russian people .. They almost choked with blood. God is your judge hi
      1. Fan-fan
        Fan-fan 30 August 2020 12: 19 New
        +6
        some are strangled by the toad, that someone donates to temples, etc.

        It does not stifle, since everyone spends personal money as he wants, but from the state budget money cannot be given to the priests: “According to RBK estimates, in 2012–2015, the Russian Orthodox Church and related structures received at least 14 billion rubles from the budget and from state organizations.

        Read more at RBC:
        https://www.rbc.ru/investigation/society/24/02/2016/56c84fd49a7947ecbff1473d"
        1. Husit
          Husit 30 August 2020 12: 27 New
          -8
          Quote: Fan-Fan
          some are strangled by the toad, that someone donates to temples, etc.

          It does not stifle, since everyone spends personal money as he wants, but from the state budget money cannot be given to the priests: “According to RBK estimates, in 2012–2015, the Russian Orthodox Church and related structures received at least 14 billion rubles from the budget and from state organizations.

          Read more at RBC:
          https://www.rbc.ru/investigation/society/24/02/2016/56c84fd49a7947ecbff1473d"

          RBC is a media libre, like "Echo of the State Department" is only even more boring than even "Radio Liberty" .... Did you find something to surprise me? wassat But I can surprise you with the events in Berlin, they got sick of their tolerance and so on)))))) They are already chanting Merkel to Siberia, Putin to Berlin!
          How do you like it all .. Probably korezhit? And rightly so ..

          And "our-your" RBC and other echoes about this silence)))))
          1. Revival
            Revival 30 August 2020 13: 48 New
            +3
            That is, do you think that not a penny was allocated from the budget?
          2. Fan-fan
            Fan-fan 30 August 2020 14: 12 New
            +2
            No, it doesn’t bother, on the contrary - I would be very happy to change Putin to Merkel.
      2. Revival
        Revival 30 August 2020 13: 46 New
        +2
        It seems that there was no talk about Voluntary Donations, but the talk was about the budget money of the secular state.
        1. Husit
          Husit 30 August 2020 16: 24 New
          -6
          Quote: Revival
          It seems that there was no talk about Voluntary Donations, but the talk was about the budget money of the secular state.

          And do not the Catholics unfasten the state on faith? On the crusades, etc.
          Or the Jews, with the Muslims .. Why is Orthodoxy worse and why is this faith so rotten in all the world's media ..? Why are you so up in arms in the last five years, for everything connected with the traditions of Russia and faith !!!! I'm watching you ...
          1. Revival
            Revival 30 August 2020 16: 44 New
            +4
            I didn't take up arms against anything.
            I am against hypocrisy.
            Or then change the constitution and write directly, there will be no questions.
            Or not to break it
  • Wwk7260
    Wwk7260 30 August 2020 05: 33 New
    +5
    The chaplain's kit must be supplemented with a wig with greasy patches, a quick-detachable beard and a buckled belly, so that any appointed warrant officer can pretend to be a priest, and a corporal deacon, a warrant officer and a buckled belly will not be needed.
  • ANDREW1987
    ANDREW1987 30 August 2020 05: 36 New
    -19
    By the title of the article and the chosen topic, I immediately understood who the author is ... You, Roman, have a peculiarity - to take an interesting topic and go into complete negativity. Why do you propagandize your hostility towards the Russian Orthodox Church, the President of Russia ...? Fashionable, probably ... Easy! And most importantly, nothing will happen for this! Golden time for you.
    1. apro
      apro 30 August 2020 05: 42 New
      -6
      Quote: ANDREY 1987
      And most importantly, nothing will happen for this! Golden time for you.

      Is it either specifically for the author .... or to change the situation?
    2. Stas157
      Stas157 30 August 2020 06: 58 New
      +7
      Quote: ANDREY 1987
      You, Roman, have a peculiarity - to take an interesting topic and go to complete negative.

      Here is a completely wrong estimate. In fact, Roman acts positivelylike a healer. Takes a painful, burning topic and opens an abscess, shows the reasons for the occurrence of negative phenomena. And there is no other way to fix anything if no one signals it. The path of appeasement, ignoring serious problems, what you offer, leads only to degradation.
      1. Hagen
        Hagen 30 August 2020 09: 28 New
        0
        Quote: Stas157
        The novel acts positively as a healer. Takes a painful, burning topic and opens an abscess, shows the reasons for the occurrence of negative phenomena

        The novel acts as a charlatan and a dropout doctor. He lies as he breathes. Well for example:
        Putin's current stakes on the ROC as a substitute for the institution of political workers and army psychologists looks twofold.

        Where does this rate come from? Have chaplains replaced the deputies for educational work? Completed? Yes. But they didn't replace it.
        Refusing to train political workers

        The form of training and the amount of required personnel have changed. Obviously, Roman is not familiar with the corresponding order of the Ministry of Defense on the selection and training of these very deputies for BP. And he has been since the 90s. And today the role of deputies for military-political work is recognized and strengthened in the Army. And it was not Kirill who was appointed chief of the Glavpur, but the military general Kartapolov.
        I would have preferred an extra carriage of shells to a good liturgy.

        It is, of course, his business what he wants. However, let us remember how many carriages of shells were left to the enemy in 1941. So a carriage is not always a panacea for all troubles. But loyalty to one's country, based on no matter what, on love for the party, Stalin / Putin or the Cathedral of Christ the Savior, is the guarantee of our past and future victories.
        And here we have the oppression from the ROC of all other confessions.

        Well, here is a frank attempt to oppose the ROC to other confessions. An attempt to drive a wedge into religious tolerance. The communists would call such an ideological sabotage. It's just that the ROC showed such an initiative, and the rest - not very ... What is oppression? In their laziness?
        Not so long ago, being "in business" myself, I attended parent-teacher meetings, where I heard the same thing: we teach, you educate. The school is not obliged to engage in education and stuff like that.

        Of course, in a particular class, personally to Roman, something similar may have been said. Nobody can prove the absence of such a phrase, as well as its presence. Here you can lie "with three boxes." But the function of education is entrusted to the school by the law on education. And how long. And here the author is outright lying, hoping that none of the readers of the article of this law has seen or read. And it is precisely from such authors-disinformers that the opinion that today education is a simple service without educational goals walks over the heads of gullible citizens of Russia.
        Therefore, I believe that only funeral service firms flourish from such "healers".
        1. Stas157
          Stas157 30 August 2020 10: 10 New
          +5
          Quote: Hagen
          The novel acts like charlatan and doctor-dropout. Lies as he breathes.

          Quote: Hagen
          here is the author straight lies, hoping that none of the readers of the article of this law has seen or read. And it is from similar authors-disinformerov walks over the heads of gullible citizens of Russia

          Why is it bombing you as if you received a personal insult? Roman wrote everything correctly, but you can always get attached to some details (inaccuracies). This may be a reason for discussion, and not for such a nervous reaction.

          In general, whatever the authorities do, no matter what their efforts, nothing worthwhile comes out. And it cannot come out in principle. Because the servants of the people, first of all, serve themselves to their loved ones at the highest level, and for the people there are only songs about braces, patriotism, and jerks with breakthroughs. And this will never change as long as our government remains a seal for the oligarchs. That's all you need to know where we are now.
          1. Hagen
            Hagen 30 August 2020 10: 55 New
            -3
            Quote: Stas157
            Roman wrote everything correctly, but you can always get attached to some details (inaccuracies). This may be a reason for discussion, and not for such a nervous reaction.

            Where did you see this nervousness? In giving examples of lies and attempts to manipulate other people's opinions? I'm at the age when it's just silly to be nervous over trifles. The resource clearly defines the contingent of authors cursing modernity with or without reason. Their level is not high, and they do not affect the general state of the public. It's just that sometimes my eyes hurt from outright disinformation. The contingent of members of the forum supporting his opinion is also quite constant and limited. If someone likes to sprinkle ashes on their heads and revel in the thought that everything is lost, then that is their right. You like it? No problems. There are not so many of you, we can endure ...
        2. Husit
          Husit 30 August 2020 10: 25 New
          -9
          Quote: Hagen
          The novel acts as a charlatan and a dropout doctor. He lies as he breathes. Well for example:
          Putin's current stakes on the ROC as a substitute for the institution of political workers and army psychologists looks twofold.

          I agree .. One can feel the "school of Western protestors" To shatter the situation, force and leave negatively to everything, sow confusion in the souls, etc. This is what we Born in the USSR "have something to compare and analyze, but our youth is prone to believe what they write and call especially accusatory ..
          The propaganda has intensified and very much, an example of that is Belarus (the author tried to remember in this topic too) Who raged there and waved Nazi flags, provoking the security forces and quickly dissolving in the crowd of onlookers .. The beginning was beautiful, but failed when the people already came out in years, a family working and remembering the 90s and the situation in Ukraine! So, guys, think about what they are inclining you very subtly and cunningly ..
          Remember Dales "We will replace their faith and values ​​with our ..."?
  • apro
    apro 30 August 2020 05: 37 New
    -4
    Because the state cannot offer anything more to a young man.

    This is why? It may well. The status of a qualified consumer ...
    Today, the most convenient ideology is religion, because everything is by the will of God ... and the people ... are God's servants ..
  • The comment was deleted.
  • evgen1221
    evgen1221 30 August 2020 05: 53 New
    12
    Everywhere where (the elite) of the state is lazy, uncontrollable and left to serve itself, and only to itself, such atvism manifests itself as a shock corral of the population into religion. It's easy, stress-free and beneficial. Usually no one is interested in the opinion of the driven ones. Sadness however. And the farther the more stuffy it is to live in such a country.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Vitaly Tsymbal
    Vitaly Tsymbal 30 August 2020 06: 06 New
    14
    Wonderful are your deeds, O Lord! In general, camouflage is needed for combat, and in battle a cassock is a hindrance, no matter what color it is ... And the sniper (what if this happens ???) will aim not at the candle, but at the light from the candle ... So it turns out that all these priestly-militarized quirks are not intended to "save the souls of sinners", but to "cut down the dough" ... but it all started with a "candle factory" ... The priest communicates with people through the soul, and the main thing for the soul is not outfit and not huge golden crosses, and a GOOD WORD ...
    1. cost
      cost 30 August 2020 07: 54 New
      +7
      Regimental priests of the First World War must be treated with respect and awe.

      Here are some old photos of the regimental priests (priests) of the Republic of Ingushetia. There were no protective or camouflage robes, and there were no candles at all.




  • Ragnar Lodbrok
    Ragnar Lodbrok 30 August 2020 06: 06 New
    30

    “The powerlessness of the exploited classes in the struggle against the exploiters inevitably gives rise to faith in a better afterlife, just as the powerlessness of the savage in the struggle with nature gives rise to faith in gods, devils, miracles, etc. Religion teaches the one who works and is in need all his life humility and patience in earthly life, consoling the hope of a heavenly reward. And those who live by someone else's labor, religion teaches charity in earthly life, offering them a very cheap excuse for their entire exploitative existence and selling tickets to heavenly well-being at a reasonable price. Religion is the opium of the people Religion is a kind of spiritual fuzz, in which the slaves of capital drown their human image, their demands for a life worthy of a human being. "

    Vladimir Ilyich Lenin
    1. bober1982
      bober1982 30 August 2020 06: 39 New
      -11
      To give a picture with a quote from B. Shaw, in my opinion, is unfortunate.
      Bernard Shaw is a well-known master of realistic drama, so to speak, he was good at conveying images, like Eliza, a poor flower seller.
      Where should he go to the experts in theology.
      1. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 30 August 2020 09: 32 New
        +5
        Quote: bober1982
        Where should he go to the experts in theology.

        Likewise, Kirill should not be dishonored by congratulating him on June 22! wink
      2. dauria
        dauria 30 August 2020 15: 54 New
        +6
        To give a picture with a quote from B. Shaw, in my opinion, is unfortunate.

        On the contrary. A very accurate comparison. Vodka and religion serve one thing - to protect the psyche from irreversible brain damage. The perception of reality is distorted and the very fact of turning on the protection is not realized.
        So the phrase "opium for the people" is also true. It remains to add that drugs are legally used by doctors, vinzo - by priests laughing Hardly anyone can do without faith in critical moments.
        But the ROC has already begun to resemble a drug dealer, not a doctor. He is already selling drugs by force in huge doses.
  • bober1982
    bober1982 30 August 2020 06: 28 New
    -8
    ...... respecting the priests of the First World War and their work, .. end of the quote.
    Respecting the author of the article, we can say that the article cheered up in the morning, although I did not finish reading it to the end, some conclusions cause laughter.
    By the way, the political schools at the end of the last century collapsed on their own, the army leadership at that time threw away their party cards themselves. So, the author is wrong to reproach the then leadership of the army and the country.
    A squadron without a political officer, like a village without a duchk, ​​has sunk into summer.
    And, sorry, there was someone to entertain.
    1. apro
      apro 30 August 2020 06: 32 New
      -7
      Quote: bober1982
      By the way, political schools at the end of the last century collapsed by themselves,

      As it is in Russian ... everything fell apart by itself and we have nothing to do with it ... just tell the master you wanted to.
      1. bober1982
        bober1982 30 August 2020 06: 41 New
        -9
        And, were these schools even needed?
        1. apro
          apro 30 August 2020 06: 47 New
          +2
          Quote: bober1982
          And, were these schools even needed?

          In the USSR, of course, but no modern Russian Federation, but they did not fall apart, but were destroyed like dozens of command and technical military schools of the country ..
    2. Vitaly Tsymbal
      Vitaly Tsymbal 30 August 2020 06: 54 New
      18
      You dear bober1982 (vladimir) do not confuse party secretaries with political workers, and even more so do not confuse them with political officers. I can remind the secretary of the party committee worked with the communists, and the political officer with the staff was never a "village idiot" who amused those around him, but performed specific duties, the main of which was to explain to a soldier why he should go into battle and, if destined, die. And to convince not only by word, but also by personal example. Sorry, but those who replicate lies about political politicians look "village ...." Do not be like them. By the way, if you don’t know, or you haven’t read something to the end, political officers have been "revived" in the Russian army today ... I hope that military-political schools will be revived. I have the honor !!! A graduate of the Novosibirsk Higher Military-Political Combined Arms School, a veteran of military operations in Afghanistan and the Caucasus.
      1. bober1982
        bober1982 30 August 2020 07: 07 New
        -12
        Quote: Vitaly Tsymbal
        I have the honor !!!

        Do not be foolish
        1. Vitaly Tsymbal
          Vitaly Tsymbal 30 August 2020 07: 16 New
          11
          bober1982 (vladimir) DO NOT BE HUGE! Not knowing the person personally !!! Or are you from that breed of "commentators-provocateurs" who can only smear everything with mud ???
          1. bober1982
            bober1982 30 August 2020 07: 20 New
            -8
            Quote: Vitaly Tsymbal
            DO NOT BE HUGE!

            Nobody is rude to you, just good advice. After all, they did not serve in the imperial army.
            1. Vitaly Tsymbal
              Vitaly Tsymbal 30 August 2020 07: 36 New
              11
              My great-grandfathers served in the imperial army ... including in officer positions. By the way, the expression "I have the honor" is not a charter, but rather a moral one and was widespread in the USSR (at least during the years of my service in the USSR and RF Armed Forces). If an officer says, "I have the honor," he emphasizes that he is responsible for his deeds and words. "I have the honor" - this refers to the personal qualities of an officer in whose hands are responsible for the lives of subordinates, and not the desire to "make a career" at any cost. Soviet writers, many of whom were not career soldiers, gave this expression a tint of "whiteguardism".
              1. Husit
                Husit 30 August 2020 09: 40 New
                -3
                Quote: Vitaly Tsymbal
                "I have the honor" is not a charter, but rather a moral one and was widespread in the USSR (at least during the years of my service in the USSR and RF Armed Forces). If an officer says, "I have the honor," he emphasizes that he is responsible for his deeds and words. "I have the honor" - this refers to the personal qualities of an officer in whose hands are responsible for the lives of subordinates, and not the desire to "make a career" at any cost. Soviet writers, many of whom were not career soldiers, gave this expression a tint of "whiteguardism".

                Thank you Vitaly! I agree with you, I myself sometimes use this phrase to emphasize my life and moral principles!
                I have the honor! hi
                1. bober1982
                  bober1982 30 August 2020 12: 54 New
                  -3
                  Quote: Husit
                  to emphasize your life and moral principles!

                  Meat, fish, a glass of Burgundy wine, good mood!
                  This also applies to moral principles, good gentlemen.
                  I have the honor, gentlemen!
      2. GTYCBJYTH2021
        GTYCBJYTH2021 30 August 2020 08: 49 New
        +3
        I hope that military-political schools will be revived. I have the honor !!! A graduate of the Novosibirsk Higher Military-Political Combined Arms School, a veteran of hostilities in Afghanistan and the Transcaucasus. [/ Quote]
        I have the honor !!!! Senior warrant officer ..... Ratkevich Andrey Mikhailovich, how many enemies have you personally destroyed, Tsymbal?
        1. Vitaly Tsymbal
          Vitaly Tsymbal 30 August 2020 09: 50 New
          +2
          Comrade senior warrant officer !!! Those who have been in combat conditions will never answer your question !!! Silly question, you might think that during the clashes the soldiers are only engaged in counting the enemies they destroyed))) Do not confuse "hollywood" with real life !!!! Although if you served in the financial unit or in a warehouse, then it is understandable - everything is there in quantitative terms - accounting and control))) You, judging by the form of the question, are asking it for the purpose of provocation. Come to my "Odnoklassniki" where you can understand who I am and what I do.
          1. GTYCBJYTH2021
            GTYCBJYTH2021 30 August 2020 09: 58 New
            +2
            Keep "classmates" for yourself, man ..... I asked you, did you shoot at people, even enemies? And so, at the headquarters, sitting, but on a business trip for 10 days, the masses of such veterans and combatants .......
            1. Vitaly Tsymbal
              Vitaly Tsymbal 30 August 2020 10: 04 New
              +2
              Afghan 82-84 is enough ???
      3. Cyril G ...
        Cyril G ... 30 August 2020 09: 11 New
        +5
        Quote: Vitaly Tsymbal
        and a political officer with personnel and was never a "village idiot" who amused others, but performed specific duties,


        Well you are responsible for everyone in a crowd .. You don't have to answer for everyone.
        For 27 years of service, I saw political officers, village fools, saw just stupid clowns, was a political officer with the rank of captain of the 2nd rank, who sat down for 3 years for assault, There was a political officer who sat down on the commander's head and began to command everything, and there were also adequate people doing their job.
        In my opinion, no special schools are needed. See how military counterintelligence officers are doing. They themselves select people from the troops, train them in one-year courses, then distribute them back ...
        Similarly, it is necessary to decide on political officials, for that matter ...
        1. Vitaly Tsymbal
          Vitaly Tsymbal 30 August 2020 10: 01 New
          +1
          People who already have a military education are taken into counterintelligence, and political officers were trained from scratch, out of 4 years of study at a political school, only 15% of the subjects were "purely political work", and military subjects, tactics, fire, PMP, technical, etc., accounted for 70 percent. the rest are general education (history, international relations, foreign language, etc.). Yes, and the first internship we took place as a platoon commander, and only after the third year did we do an internship as a political officer of a company. After graduating from college, I had a certificate of mechanized control of BMP and armored personnel carriers + the right to a car, fired motorized riflemen from all types of weapons, was trained to command (without additional courses) to the battalion. And from "political work" I received only one certificate - a projectionist !!! This is exactly how political workers were trained in the SA.
          1. ycuce234-san
            ycuce234-san 30 August 2020 17: 12 New
            0
            Political politicians were trained from scratch, out of 4 years of study in a political school, only 15% of subjects were "purely political work", and military subjects, tactics, fire, PMP, technical, etc., accounted for 70 percent, the rest were general education (history, international relations, foreign language etc.). Yes, and the first internship we took place as a platoon commander, and only after the third year did we do internships as political officers of a company. After graduating from college, I had a certificate of mechanized control of BMP and armored personnel carriers + the right to a car, fired motorized riflemen from all types of weapons, was trained to command (without additional courses) to the battalion. And from "political work" I received only one certificate - a projectionist !!! This is exactly how political workers were trained in the SA.


            All this and even more have all kinds of veterans and retirees of the armed forces. Therefore, it is more logical to take difficult and conflicting confessional issues outside the armed forces in general, and to admit secular public veteran organizations to educational work. The state now "does not pull" a full-fledged system of political work, and various social activists have already shown themselves well in many useful things - in the search for missing people (including soldiers and participants in various conflicts), organizing medical treatment abroad, preserving historical memory and organizing war memorials dead defenders, etc.
        2. Husit
          Husit 30 August 2020 10: 38 New
          -3
          Quote: Cyril G ...
          See how military counterintelligence officers are doing. They themselves select people from the troops, train them in one-year courses, then distribute them back ...
          Similarly, it is necessary to decide on political officials, for that matter ...

          Sound thought! I agree .. hi It was not for nothing that before the collapse of the USSR, political instructors and security officers and the Army in general were exhibited, and even now they are exhibited in “our” media by such stupid and bloodthirsty monsters, as in Western Hollywood films .. And why? Nobody thought about it? Now we have begun to rebuild the Army, traditions a little, and again the ecumenical scream and the persecution of everything connected with our Army, history, traditions began ...
          Demons do not sleep ..
  • Thrifty
    Thrifty 30 August 2020 06: 56 New
    +3
    I went over here with such robes, and with camouflage candles!
  • Errr
    Errr 30 August 2020 07: 00 New
    12
    From the article:
    In theory, then a mosque, a church, a prayer house, and so on should stand next to the church, which is in each part. Because, according to the Constitution, we all have the same rights. And Muslims, and Jews, and Orthodox. All.
    True, the army will then finally turn into a religious mess, but then everything will be according to the Constitution.
    In order for everything to be in accordance with the Constitution, but at the same time there was no mess, one must remember about its article number 14:
    It is necessary to drive all these "figures" in cassocks away from literally all state structures! This is my atheistic opinion on this matter. Personally, I would go into battle without any blessing, since the latter is useless. And the faint-hearted in a fight has nothing to do at all; At best, they can only give their souls to God there, some sense from them. Even if they better work in the rear to the best of their strength for the benefit of the armed forces, this is all better than stupidly putting down their little head "in the name of the Fatherland."
  • nikvic46
    nikvic46 30 August 2020 07: 03 New
    +2
    Any idea requires the right approach. And it is also important how to show it all. I am not going to judge anyone. But there are still some comments. The mention of God where needed and where not needed is striking. And it reaches the point of absurdity. When the pandemic appeared, some TV people began to say "All from God. "You have to think what you say. That is, this is the will of the Most High? And the vaccine means against His will? The rite itself is often not observed - patting the clergy officials on the shoulder. The church itself assumes equality in the parish. If this is the trend of the century, then the main thing is not to slip into Western customs, where there are private churches, and they accept it according to their clothes.
  • Observer2014
    Observer2014 30 August 2020 07: 04 New
    +3
    They baptize those who wish, conduct services, sprinkle holy water on a variety of military equipment, from ballistic missiles to submarines.

    Make the fools pray to God; they'll smash their heads! The candles are green !!! .....laughing wassat
    Okay, now about the serious. The main thing is that the priests in camouflage do not influence the fate of the boys. Well, they did not express all sorts of characteristics and opinions. They also found a replacement for political officers. But what to do with other confessions? What do you order everyone in each unit, ship ... ?
    1. Observer2014
      Observer2014 30 August 2020 07: 20 New
      11
      I will add a piece of iron to the account of baptism. I propose to punish the priest who performed the ceremony financially. If the equipment breaks down. If a catastrophe occurs, the punishment should be criminal. Since these services are paid for. And the priest did not fulfill his duties in good faith. Everything should be according to the law of the modern world. He was unfair. paid services. Get and sign.
      1. nickname7
        nickname7 30 August 2020 10: 34 New
        +2
        I propose to punish the priest who performed the ceremony financially. If the equipment breaks down.

        Quite right, even if the money is returned, or if some rituals do not work, the proton has fallen, then we must switch to other rituals, call shamans, Jehovah's witnesses, etc.
  • parusnik
    parusnik 30 August 2020 07: 09 New
    11
    ..... and monks in dusty robes will silently bow over me. smile An amendment was made to the Constitution about God and now Article 14 of the Constitution should read as follows: Russia, by God's grace, is a secular state .. laughing Patriotism is brought up on examples, and on positive. What positive examples for education can modern Russia offer? Except how to get rich in any way, and when you get rich, bring down abroad. For example, today's modern films bring up patriotism, not many good films about the war, I do not mean .... And on what to educate? The Soviet past is not in trend, it is a "terrible, bloody, totalitarian" era. Only one thing remains, the church, it fills the ideological vacuum that has formed over the past 30 years ... 30 years ago, Russia returned to the past ...
  • Oleg133
    Oleg133 30 August 2020 07: 33 New
    +8
    In the 17th year, when the obligatory trip to the priest was canceled, everything fell on its own 1.5-5% of visitors.
    Pop in Russian fairy tales is always a negative hero. Than today the priests confirm this rule
    1. Pessimist22
      Pessimist22 30 August 2020 08: 39 New
      +8
      From the first click
      Pop jumped to the ceiling;
      From the second click
      Lost pop language;
      And from the third click
      The old man's mind was knocked out.
      And Balda condemned with reproach:
      "You would not chase, pop, for cheapness."
      A.S.Pushkin.
  • Nehist
    Nehist 30 August 2020 07: 38 New
    11

    We have already come to this. What's next?
    1. Uncle lee
      Uncle lee 30 August 2020 11: 17 New
      +2
      And my grandfather felt better at once!
      Land hi
  • thinker
    thinker 30 August 2020 07: 49 New
    +3
    Quote: Observer2014
    The candles are green !!! .....

    Exactly hee hee and ha ha. Hypanut in the picture is so easy!
    Why buy green wax candles in Moscow? ...Traditionally, green candles are lit to attract money and wealth to the house.

    https://www.svechy-vosk.ru/blogs/tserkovnye-svechi/svechi-zelenye-voskovye
    1. Observer2014
      Observer2014 30 August 2020 09: 20 New
      -3
      Quote: thinker
      Quote: Observer2014
      The candles are green !!! .....

      Exactly hee hee and ha ha. Hypanut in the picture is so easy!
      Why buy green wax candles in Moscow? ...Traditionally, green candles are lit to attract money and wealth to the house.

      https://www.svechy-vosk.ru/blogs/tserkovnye-svechi/svechi-zelenye-voskovye
      And don't say. All gee-gee, yes ha-ha! lol And this is a serious matter! "ORTHODOX STORE" I monitored it on your link.
      Traditionally, green candles are lit to attract money and wealth to the house.
      yes Yes it is. Cleverness where hidden! Even the color for real money is matched with the head!
      The local priest will need a little greenery in the baptismal font for coloring holy water. As an additional function when baptizing babies. So to say, an investment in a person's wealthy future repeatWell, we’ll raise money. This is normal now.
  • tralflot1832
    tralflot1832 30 August 2020 08: 26 New
    +1
    Green candles have always been sold, I don't know what holidays. My wife has been sleeping, I've been buying her for 10 years. And then suddenly they are military? To God, even atheists enrich themselves when a loved one is sick, as if to help doctors, repeat
  • nikvic46
    nikvic46 30 August 2020 08: 37 New
    +2
    I used to think and now I will say that Orthodoxy carries a lot of positive things. Another thing is how politicians treat it. For example, liberals do not recognize it at all. Catholicism is closer to them. On the basis of Orthodoxy, the "Moral Code of the Builder of Communism" was created. And no need to laugh. ... In many respects, the leaders adhered to this. True, I still live in a communal apartment. But many received a comfortable corner. The main thing is to live, observing the ethical standards of this idea.
  • igorra
    igorra 30 August 2020 09: 05 New
    +2
    Introduce nvp in schools, again hang portraits of pioneers - heroes, and hammer - hammer the fragile minds of children with the feat of our ancestors and military and workmen. To oppose the aye fashionable in some youth circles, to show how during the war, while the fathers were at war, the thieves robbed and killed the remaining mothers and children, how they worked for the Nazis.
  • Boris55
    Boris55 30 August 2020 09: 06 New
    0
    Priests give faith... "Zampolites" give hope... Which one is more terrible, whether they are telling the truth or for personal interests they fool us ...



    "... Freedom from ideologies is a self-deception, however, not spontaneous psychological, but purposefully cultivated by the conceptual power. Ideology can be understood or not understood, accepted or denied, but members of society are always faced with manifestations of one or another ideology, which is a shell the concept of society management by the holders of power conceptual ... ".
    1. Boris55
      Boris55 30 August 2020 13: 23 New
      0
      YouTube has blocked the video again. Here is a link to mail.ru:
      https://my.mail.ru/mail/bit-04/video/_myvideo/92.html
  • Livonetc
    Livonetc 30 August 2020 09: 06 New
    0
    It's better than designing a uniform, with some differences, for a dozen other "sexes" besides male and female.
  • Oleg Skvortsov
    Oleg Skvortsov 30 August 2020 09: 07 New
    +3
    You need to separate flies from cutlets. Religious business and believers. Everyone believes what he wants. Any religion (sect) makes money on believers. And the believers themselves must decide whether to give up their pennies or not. I don't want to discuss the political regime at all - they are not on their own, but the people are on their own
  • Husit
    Husit 30 August 2020 09: 20 New
    -5
    Again they run into Orthodoxy .. All itching to do some! Something in the west no one comes to the Catholic Church, and religion there occupies the most important place in the life of the state, even and the US anthem contains the words "God bless America" ​​And Catholic Christmas is a direct public holiday, going to church is a family routine .. And as in Russia they began to support the Orthodox faith, so at once the priests in all "our" media allegedly litter the brains of people, etc. Why is that?
    Nobody makes you go to church and accept faith .. In the same Army!
    Orthodoxy is one of the pillars on which Russia rests! There will be no Orthodoxy, there will be no Russia! Stalin realized this in time, but Khrushch again began to fight religion and everything ended with the collapse of the USSR.
    PS Here is an interesting author of what religion? I will not believe that but an ardent atheist ..
    1. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 30 August 2020 09: 37 New
      +4
      Quote: Husit
      Here is an interesting author of what religion?

      Soviet. And this is the best religion. hi
      1. Husit
        Husit 30 August 2020 10: 00 New
        -4
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        Quote: Husit
        Here is an interesting author of what religion?

        Soviet. And this is the best religion. hi

        Are you sure of this Igor? I doubt something, and especially about the Soviet .. hi
        Being born in the USSR and Being a Soviet person are two different things!
        I remember many former ideologues who made their way to the very top, then tore and burned party cards and USSR passports in the cameras of Western journalists under the shouts of "veri good" and slapping on the shoulder ..
        1. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 30 August 2020 12: 02 New
          +3
          Quote: Husit
          Are you sure of this Igor?

          Yes I am sure. Roman has drawbacks (from my point of view, this is touchiness, a small power complex), but all this is more than covered by a heightened sense of justice. It was this person who, at his own expense, went to Donbass, and took away the funds collected here. Not you, not me. hi
          1. Husit
            Husit 30 August 2020 16: 17 New
            -6
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            Quote: Husit
            Are you sure of this Igor?

            Yes I am sure. Roman has drawbacks (from my point of view, this is touchiness, a small power complex), but all this is more than covered by a heightened sense of justice. It was this person who, at his own expense, went to Donbass, and took away the funds collected here. Not you, not me. hi

            Well, well ... We know we know .. Everything is clear with you Igor
            1. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 30 August 2020 16: 20 New
              +3
              But in fact, Kisa? wink
              1. Husit
                Husit 30 August 2020 17: 38 New
                -5
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                But in fact, Kisa? wink

                I will give you parabellum and leave me alone ..))))
  • Alexander X
    Alexander X 30 August 2020 10: 01 New
    -1
    Well, Skomorokhov is again trying to
    HYIP to catch. "I do not understand the desire of a person to take any undertaking and smear with feces ... Internal complexes? ... If people turn to priests, then people need it. And for some reason, non-believers are talking about matters of religion. They are absolutely far from the church. IMHO ...
  • Zaurbek
    Zaurbek 30 August 2020 10: 02 New
    +2
    The next Svd is the king (president) the anointed of God. The masses must be poorly educated and religious. It's easier to manage that way.
  • mi ah
    mi ah 30 August 2020 10: 11 New
    +4
    In the name of the father of the son and the holy of the spirit, the rocket "Satan" is consecrated ... Nonsense !!
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 30 August 2020 10: 25 New
      +1
      Quote: Mih-ai
      In the name of the father of the son and the holy of the spirit, the rocket "Satan" is consecrated ... Nonsense !!

      Well, for them she is Satan.
    2. iouris
      iouris 30 August 2020 11: 27 New
      0
      Quote: Mih-ai
      the rocket "Satan" is consecrated ... Nonsense !!

      This is your nonsense. There is no such rocket and there never was.
      1. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 30 August 2020 12: 07 New
        +5
        Quote: iouris
        There is no such rocket and there never was.

        If the Greeks called us Scythians, then it means that we were not there? belay
  • Fedorovich
    Fedorovich 30 August 2020 10: 15 New
    +5
    Religions have exhausted their cultural and civilizational potential in the nineteenth century. What we are seeing now (and no, I'm not only talking about camouflage robes, which is heresy in the truest sense of the word) is not even the galvanization of a corpse, it's just necrophilia. Are you so interested in this type of perversion? ..
  • ximkim
    ximkim 30 August 2020 10: 22 New
    0
    Quote: Husit
    Quote: ximkim
    The Inquisition project will soon be launched .. The Russian Orthodox Church was turned into the FITs (financial investment center), which means that the money must be used in circulation at minimal cost .. Making candles is not costing factories. sad

    To whom what, and for some the toad strangles, that someone donates to temples, etc.
    You see, there is such a simple statement, “THERE ARE NO ATHEISTS IN THE MINES!” This is a very deep thought and proven by Russia more than once or twice in its history ..
    Think about it better and remember the 90s, when various Western sects poured into Russia, so they really duped the Russian people .. They almost choked with blood. God is your judge hi

    God is the judge by the fact that the sect has settled in the Kremlin ... I will soon ask for donations to prevent the 90s via SMS. Do not forget to send a donation hi
  • Zum
    Zum 30 August 2020 11: 24 New
    +1
    Do not bother ..... just do not participate in this .... I say this to myself when I see no point in what is happening. This is another round of "creativity" ..... yes .... I can't find another word ....... the era of consumption ....
  • iouris
    iouris 30 August 2020 11: 26 New
    +1
    Insanity grows stronger. Attention! It could end badly.
  • Alsur
    Alsur 30 August 2020 11: 26 New
    0
    Strange article. It seemed to me that the author is engaged in mimicry like a patriot. I respect the priests of the First World War, but further clarifies my thought that they are condemned.
    For example, one paragraph from the article:
    In fact, endlessly respecting the priests of the First World War and their work, I would have preferred an extra carriage of shells to a good liturgy. I am sure that everyone at the front at that time would also have preferred it. It is clear that there are no atheists in trenches under fire, and the word of the shepherd, parting words - it is not superfluous. But in conjunction with a good portion of porridge with meat, a couple of extra pomegranates and hundreds of rounds. Then - the case.

    And who is against these postulates, the leadership of the army, the state? But you are against the priests in the army, so you want to remove them from there.
    It seems to me that the author had only one task, to make readers negatively towards a priest in the army. Everything was stretched under this task. Otherwise, the article should have been more balanced, for example, it would have been possible to give the floor to the Orthodox Church itself. How does she relate to the priest in the army, how does she relate to the green and camouflage color of the robe. It would be possible to post photos of priests in the units of a Chechen company in Syria. For example, search the Internet and read this article:
    Military priests in Syria: to remind the warrior of the soul Churches at the Russian military bases in Khmeimim and Tartus are always open

    PS My personal opinion, the author is working on a cookie.
    1. andreyvazmtp
      andreyvazmtp 31 August 2020 13: 17 New
      +1
      Rather, the author is just a hypozher-mnogostanochnik. Ships, tanks, airplanes, politics, economics, medicine and so on - he is well versed in everything. His articles reminded me of the times of perestroika, when this was a wonder for the people and this criticism was perceived almost as a heavenly revelation ...
  • Radikal
    Radikal 30 August 2020 12: 05 New
    +3
    Quote: fyvaprold
    Quote: Dead Day
    Putin's policy looks disgusting, all around the deception, eyewash, corruption. and yes, these priests are fucking in the edge. yes nafig such "braces" ...

    Congratulations to Musya! Your "piccha" is quite attracted to "extremism", like "GrandfatherOld"and brains, like an unfortunate undergrowth. It is regrettable. Do not bother yourself with the answer, I have no desire to communicate with the" shit-spitters ". My contempt.
    Regarding the next skomorokhovsky vyser: - The novel has sunk to outright slander:
    In general, of course, the penetration of the ROC into the army evokes different emotions in everyone. I am already silent about representatives of other religions. In our army, everything is the same: if you want to send spiritual needs, get baptized. If you are a Muslim, a Catholic, a Buddhist, a Jew, or anyone else, these are your problems..

    I serve in the Southern Military District, half of the personnel are Muslims and no one forces them to be "baptized", there is a chapel and a room for prayer, so this stuffing is pure slander, it will be necessary to give a special officer to read it, let him laugh, otherwise he was already covered with moss from idleness.
    Be sure to let me read, just do not forget to show this comment of yours, if you are so pricky! lol
    1. fyvaprold
      fyvaprold 30 September 2020 22: 18 New
      0
      Quote: Radikal
      Quote: fyvaprold
      Quote: Dead Day
      Putin's policy looks disgusting, all around the deception, eyewash, corruption. and yes, these priests are fucking in the edge. yes nafig such "braces" ...

      Congratulations to Musya! Your "piccha" is quite attracted to "extremism", like "GrandfatherOld"and brains, like an unfortunate undergrowth. It is regrettable. Do not bother yourself with the answer, I have no desire to communicate with the" shit-spitters ". My contempt.
      Regarding the next skomorokhovsky vyser: - The novel has sunk to outright slander:
      In general, of course, the penetration of the ROC into the army evokes different emotions in everyone. I am already silent about representatives of other religions. In our army, everything is the same: if you want to send spiritual needs, get baptized. If you are a Muslim, a Catholic, a Buddhist, a Jew, or anyone else, these are your problems..

      I serve in the Southern Military District, half of the personnel are Muslims and no one forces them to be "baptized", there is a chapel and a room for prayer, so this stuffing is pure slander, it will be necessary to give a special officer to read it, let him laugh, otherwise he was already covered with moss from idleness.
      Required let me read just do not forget to show this comment of yours, if you are so pricky! lol

      Dal, my dear, has already read it. I didn't drink "glass" with you, keep yourself in control. And, yes, what's wrong with my comment, that he should be of interest to a special person?
  • SovAr238A
    SovAr238A 30 August 2020 12: 06 New
    +2
    The most important thing is that patriotic education is prohibited by the Federal State Educational Standard in kindergartens.
    And it is at this age that the basis is created, the basis of Love for the Motherland is formed.
    And if you start to develop real Patriotism after elementary school, at the age of 10-11, then it's too late ...
  • German Titov
    German Titov 30 August 2020 12: 09 New
    +2
    Somehow it was clearer at the institute of political politicians. Maybe I was lucky during the "deadline" with the commissioners. We found the right words for everyone. May God grant them health and happiness. By the way, I was baptized at 40.
  • BAI
    BAI 30 August 2020 13: 55 New
    +4
    1.
    but the commander-in-chief is blessed.

    The patriarch blesses (and other ranks of the ROC).
    2. With the collapse of the USSR, the communist ideology went away. A huge free niche has been formed in the ideological sphere. But a holy place is never empty, and the ROC is actively filling this niche. The old slogan "For God, Tsar and Fatherland" is being restored. The fatherland did not disappear anywhere, God is being restored, only the king remained.
  • pereselenec
    pereselenec 30 August 2020 14: 10 New
    -1
    Cassocks in the "pixel" and green candles.


    As I wrote earlier, I don’t understand why we need robes in camouflage on the front line. After all, if the Lord wants to save the priest, he will shield him from the sight of an enemy sniper. And if not, then the connivance of God and in heaven the Russian Host will have another intercessor.
  • lis-ik
    lis-ik 30 August 2020 14: 15 New
    +5
    Well, now, the robes and candles of the appropriate color. To be honest, I do not quite understand how the “civilian” candle differs from the “military” one, and therefore I cannot explain it with anything other than another way to make money.

    Gundyaev very successfully fit into the vertical of power. Literally "smeared with one world." There is no need for the Antichrist (God forgive me), everything is already sold and bought, about the soul, they do not remember there. Everything is according to plan, everything is carbon copy.
  • faterdom
    faterdom 30 August 2020 14: 38 New
    0
    This is a dead end. Ideas that are relevant for Constantine the Great and Theodosius II to be put on the globe of the XXI century ... Even Mohammed is 300-400 years more relevant ... somehow.
    No, the ideas are good, only they must be: 1. Put on a modern and convenient form; 2. Start with yourself at the top to fulfill (the commandments of God, suras from the Koran, the Code of the builder of communism - underline the necessary); 3. Any ideology, religious, or any other, if it is constructive, radically or not very much, but directed against usury (apparently we walk in a circle and this sin caused by greed has covered more than one civilization with a basin). Therefore, a sharp restriction of privileges and indulgence to banks and financial capital can serve as an indicator of recovery.
  • raif
    raif 30 August 2020 14: 50 New
    +5
    "It is clear that there are no atheists in trenches under fire, and the word of the shepherd, parting words - it is not superfluous." - bullshit, invented by some lover of Internet statuses. During my service in the 201st Motorized Rifle Division, my commander, a Belarusian by nationality, said very correctly: "I need people who will fulfill their duties in battle, and not pray!"
    The ostentatious wearing of religious symbols of any religion with complete ignorance of the foundations of their religion and the most elementary prayers is what characterizes 90% of “such“ believers. ”The funniest and most surprising is that with the official ban on religious propaganda, churches are built in units, priests are invited, etc. They destroyed the institute of political politicians at the same time as the USSR, but nothing was invented to replace it.
  • Viktor Sergeev
    Viktor Sergeev 30 August 2020 14: 51 New
    -1
    When the author has nothing to write, he begins to speck about religion.
  • VIP
    VIP 30 August 2020 15: 02 New
    0
    Camouflage candles are of course nonsense.
    A priest in the army is a difficult question and touches on an even more complex issue: religion and modernity.
    About religion and modernity and regimental priests a separate conversation. Since the priest appeared in the army, it is quite reasonable to dress him in camouflage.
    Imagine a situation like this: a low-intensity hostilities began, such as the Chechen campaign. A sniper would rather notice a priest in a cassock than in camouflage
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Aviator_
    Aviator_ 30 August 2020 15: 28 New
    +4
    It is clear that there are no atheists in trenches under fire

    I hasten to upset the author. It happens. The people, born in 1915-1927, who participated in the Great Patriotic War, were atheistic, no matter how surprising it may seem to the Russian Orthodox Church. My father, born in 1922, who was seriously wounded for three days in a downed plane on the no-man's land, did not pray to God. Here is an older age - he could trust in God, and even then, not everyone. My grandfather, born in 1893, returned from WWI as an atheist. During the Patriotic War, he was non-combatant, worked in a front-line weapons workshop.
    1. Aviator_
      Aviator_ 30 August 2020 16: 38 New
      +4
      Well, the priest came running and set a minus. It's better for me to know whether my father prayed during the war or not ..
  • Pushkar
    Pushkar 30 August 2020 15: 57 New
    +2
    I am an atheist and I am very glad that Orthodoxy is being implanted in the army and at school (Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Shinto - all the same). Overfeed, guys, the religion of our children and grandchildren. Overfeed to vomit, to "tobacco in the butt pie". Instill disgust in them, build three churches a day, show them the Patriarch's watch, which is more expensive than their apartment. After all, it was not aliens who destroyed churches in 1905 and 1917, but peasants, local peasants. After all, if people lay down three churches a day and raise the retirement age, then the country may once again collapse.
    1. solzh
      solzh 5 September 2020 13: 20 New
      18
      Quote: Pushkar
      then the country can collapse once again

      Country? Maybe the existing system in the country?
      Quote: Pushkar
      After all, not aliens smashed churches in 1905 and 1917, but peasants, local peasants

  • The comment was deleted.
  • tank64rus
    tank64rus 30 August 2020 19: 49 New
    +4
    Make the fool pray, and he will break his forehead. Further there will be a crucifix - a pistol and a censer with a built-in grenade launcher.