Military Review

Young people do not want to live in Siberia and the Far East. And rightly so!

456

For several years now I have been in the camp of those who are trying to break the wall of misunderstanding of the problems of the Russian East. There are not many of us at the federal level. Most donors of their own foreheads are limited to local media and government agencies. And attempts to clarify the situation lead to the fact that people simply give up. They stop fighting with time. It's hard enough to be the voice of one crying in the wilderness.


Siberia and the Far East have really turned into a deserted desert for many years. What was created by many generations of our ancestors today is disappearing at an alarming rate. Disappears for a simple and understandable reason even for babies: there are no people!

How many times have I heard a fairly widespread opinion that there is absolutely no reason to live in conditions that are not suitable for life, when it is possible, for example, to develop minerals or cut taiga, using shift workers. People arrived for 3-6 months, robbed the Siberian nature and mineral resources, and left home. And there is no need to build cities, roads, pull power lines ...

How many times have I heard that there is no need in Siberia and the Far East to have a mobilization reserve for the possible deployment of military units. Units and formations from Central Russia will arrive and drive the enemy from their native land. Well yes. They will come and chase. Especially from somewhere in the steppe zone in the Siberian taiga and on the Far Eastern hills, these parts will be effective.

I really like the government's actions to increase interest in Siberia and the Far East through global megaprojects. Let's build a house with all amenities for ten million inhabitants in the middle of taiga or permafrost! Let's build. But why? Who will need this house? 40% of residents of Siberia and the Far East want to leave their homes! Not to live in a mega-home, but to go beyond the Urals, to Moscow and the Moscow region, to St. Petersburg, to the Krasnodar Territory, to the Crimea ...

60% of the territory of Russia is deserted or sparsely populated places! Everything that our ancestors did over the centuries turned out to be unnecessary for us. We will shout with pleasure: "We will not give up an inch of our native land!" But immediately we will be ashamed not to notice how the ethnic composition of Siberian and Far Eastern cities is changing. Moreover, foreigners do not seize our territories, do not displace Russians from their places of residence. They come at the invitation of the authorities and business. They come to empty lands, to empty cities.

Compare the two numbers. Moreover, it should be compared taking into account the fact that in the first case it is necessary to add those who live in the territory illegally, without registration, and in the second, on the contrary, to take away those who actually left the region, but did not officially sign out.

So, the population of Moscow is officially 12 678 079 people. Let's add here the population of the Moscow region: 7 people. This data is for 690. We got the first number. The population of Siberia and the Far East, let me remind you, is 863% of the country's territory, 2020 million people (60). Need some more words?

Far East


The figure that I will announce now may shock unprepared readers, but residents of the Far Eastern region know about it. During the period from the collapse of the USSR to the beginning of the 21st century, up to 60% of the population left some of the Far East cities! So much for taking care of the development of nature's pantries. The process continues! People do not want to “heroically master” and wait for the state to have resources for the development of their homeland. They just want to live like a human being.

Very often (especially from residents of Central and South Russia) I hear the phrase that if a person is used to living in such conditions, then he will not leave. Recently I spoke with a representative of the Sakha people. Remember the Republic of Sakha (Yakutia)? He and all his relatives were born and live in Yakutia. People accustomed to local conditions. However, the youth of Sakha and other small peoples are leaving the republic.

I looked at the official numbers. From 1989 to 2010, Russia lost 3,5% of its population. And the Far East, or rather the Far Eastern Federal District, - 20%! Of course, you can try to refer to the low birth rate. But it doesn't work. Fertility and mortality rates in the Far Eastern Federal District are practically the same as the average indicators for Russia. But the migration indicators ...

I don’t know if you have noticed the disappearance of anecdotes about some northern peoples. I will mention the terrible numbers. Do you know how many residents of Chukotka, more precisely, Chukotka Autonomous Okrug, left the region? 168 people for every thousand of the population! In general, the population of Chukotka has decreased by more than three times! From 164 thousand people to 51 thousand people! This is about the loss of Belarus in the Great Patriotic War!

This is what I read in one of the materials of local journalists. This is the opinion of the first deputy chairman of the board of the Asian-Pacific Bank Sergey Tyrtsev:

“Whole villages were leaving, military units were disbanded. Now the Far East has its own migration: for people who live in Chukotka, Kamchatka, Magadan, the “continents” where they would like to go are the Amur Region, Primorsky and Khabarovsk Territories. At the same time, many of them leave for the south of Russia, and Moscow for many active people remains the goal of their lives. "

By the way, I looked at the figures for the above-mentioned Magadan region. Everything is "well" there. Only 120 people left per 1000. And the population has decreased quite "slightly". From 392 thousand people to 157 thousand people. Everything is fine. We will not give up our native land to anyone! Let the wolverines catch wild reindeer on a land free from man!

Now a simple question for the government of the country. What economic reforms and breakthroughs in the Far East are you talking about? Who will reform and break through? One can state about excellent plans for the development of regions, including economic ones. Only for the implementation of these plans, an economically active population is needed, and not old pensioners who remain in abandoned cities and towns!

The indicator of the economically active population in the Far Eastern Federal District is already hopelessly negative! I can cite quite a few numbers. But if I have already started talking about the Magadan region, then I will end with this particular region. The number of people who are actually employed in the economy has decreased by 1989% since 70 (in 2010)!

Siberia


Things are a little better in Siberia. A more comfortable environment for life affects. The number of economically active population is higher here, and in percentage terms too. Simply put, there are indeed more people in Siberia who are able to work. The birth rate, as I wrote above, is quite consistent with the all-Russian indicators.

But the problem with the really employed in the economy. There are people, they can work, but ... nowhere. In Russia as a whole, the decline in the number of people actually employed in the economy is about 10%. For the Siberian Federal District this figure is 14%. Hence the level of wages, and the dictates of entrepreneurs, and, ultimately, the departure of young people in whole families for the Urals.

The Siberian Federal District is among the leaders in terms of migration loss. The Omsk region generally takes the "honorable" second place in Russia in terms of this indicator. Kemerovo region and Altai are not far behind Omsk. I talked with Omsk demographers about the demography in the region. Alas, most of them quite definitely expressed that the point of no return has already been passed. Young people will continue to leave the region.

In order to stabilize the situation, it is necessary to take measures at the federal level. Now it is fashionable to conduct all kinds of polls. The results of these polls are not officially recorded simply because various methodologies are violated. I wanted to know why they were leaving. One thing is one's own thoughts, another thing is what the departing people say. So, what we see from the polls of bloggers from different Siberian regions ...

Why are young people leaving? Money comes first. Low incomes with high costs. A young specialist receives a salary sometimes several times less than in Moscow. At the same time, the costs, especially in winter, are significantly higher. Further - a cold unfavorable climate. Everything is clear here. When the December rain in Moscow is shown on the TV screen, and it is below minus thirty outside your window, you involuntarily think about the climate.

Young people are very concerned about the problem of poor ecology. It is no secret that in most Siberian cities there are quite serious industries, which, to put it mildly, do not improve the ecological situation in cities. Oncological diseases, lung diseases, etc. are almost the norm for Siberia. As well as periodic exceeding of the maximum permissible emission standards. For example, I no longer even pay attention to the sometimes swirling air, but the newlyweds, who recently had a child, pay attention to ...

There are also social problems. In particular, young people are not satisfied with the quality of education and the lack of interesting specialties in universities. Siberian cities are truly student paradise. Universities of almost all specialties are right at hand. So what's the problem? The problem is that universities are focused on local problems. "Polytech" trains personnel for local factories, "med" - doctors for local hospitals, "ped" - teachers for local schools, and so on.

This is a normal, still Soviet practice. But then, in the USSR, a young specialist came to production and had not only a good salary, especially at closed factories, of which there are many in Siberia, but the prospect of growth. Today it is just a "cog" that will never become a "mechanism". And when you move to another region, most of the knowledge gained is simply not needed.

Well, the last important reason is the underdeveloped structure of leisure. Young people whose incomes are not so great simply have nowhere to go. Concert of a Moscow star? Though shabby, but Moscow, from the TV? Sure, not a problem. Today the province has been mastered by pop and theater stars. Only the prices for these concerts bite. For a young family to shell out 8-10 thousand for a couple of tickets for the performance is problematic.

I have something to compare with. I remember my city then, in Soviet times, and I see it now. A large industrial center with many closed businesses, theaters, concert halls, many palaces and houses of culture. Garden City, this official name was written on many posters back then. A city truly buried in flowers.

A large river port, which supplied the entire North of the Tyumen region with the necessary cargo. The steamers went in a continuous stream along the Irtysh to the north and back. There was a wonderful river station, which we were very proud of. And from which they sometimes went on river cruises to the north, to Tobolsk. On large white three-deck ships. And the "Rockets" and "Meteora" rushed past in the direction of Tara. Only 200 kilometers. Three hours, and you're almost in the north of the region.

Do you want faster? No problem. Two airports: international and local. You can fly to any regional center by An-2 or a helicopter. Well, to Moscow or somewhere else - this is a large airport. Get somewhere? Bus, trolleybus, tram to any part of the city. I did not remember about the taxi then. A ruble and three to five kopecks - the difference is significant.

Forty years have passed. I won't talk about theaters and concert halls. Something was closed, something was built. The garden city was reborn into the exhibition "Flora 20 ...", which for some reason is held in the fall. And the flower beds in the courtyards are equipped by local grandmothers. Savvy and adventurous. What "arts" you will not see. Figures made from cut car tires, empty plastic bottles, discarded stuffed toys ...

River? The port stands still, dejectedly bowing the noses of its huge cranes to the rusted barges. The building of the river station now houses a hotel, a bowling alley, a cinema and other "leisure facilities". There are no more white ships and "Rockets" and "Meteors" flying on the wings. Young people probably don't even know what they were. Occasionally a tugboat with a barge filled with sand for the construction of a dam sails.

There are no small nimble airplanes now either. As there is no local airport and most airports in regional centers. True, they say that in Maryanovka the capital's lover aviation and the pilot Leonid Yakubovich keeps his planes ...

But we now have a sports arena where the most famous hockey team played. I had to destroy. The team is still in Balashikha. We are building a new one. We now have a subway. True, after the construction of four stations, it had to be covered with sand. Some 20 billion in total ... We have a huge international airport in Fedorovka. True, they decided not to finish building it and abandoned it. Again, some 20 billion.

I wonder what our grandchildren will remember in forty years?

Instead of a conclusion


We are used to speaking in slogans. We are accustomed to the fact that if necessary, we will do it, no matter what. The way it is. Let's do it. We will lie down with bones, but we will do it. And for whom shall we lie down? For whom will we do it? For "future generations"? But we will not have these future generations. They left for warm lands. In a comfortable environment and a favorable climate. And they did the right thing!

If I, you, all of us do not care that young people want not only to exist, eat, drink, have children, but also to live like a human being, to feel their own need for their native country, the need for their small homeland, then we deserve that children just spat on our "achievements".

The modern world is global. You can leave anywhere. There would be a desire. And our task, the task of those who can do this, the authorities, is to create a situation where young people would not like to leave, but to come.

Many people talk to me about the American and Canadian experience. About the north of Canada and Alaska. Here's the solution! Of course a solution. Leave a small number of people in difficult territories and pay them a certain amount for this. Only the north of Canada and Alaska are not Siberia and the Far East. Far from Siberia!

Americans and Canadians do not have as much wealth in the depths of their "north" as we have in Siberia and the Far East. There are not so many unique deposits, there is not so much oil and gas, there is not so much clean water and forest. That is why they divide our land from time to time "justly" in the West. That is why they are striving to our bowels, to our Baikal, to our Yakutia.

We are again coming up with global projects. Let's build a bridge to Kamchatka! Let the three remaining inhabitants there ride to the mainland across the bridge! Isn't it easier to bring a new two-story steam locomotive from somewhere from Kazan or Moscow to show Siberians what a railway is in the XNUMXst century? ..
Author:
Photos used:
Ksenus, pixabay.com
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  1. Mavrikiy
    Mavrikiy 29 August 2020 05: 02 New
    12
    Isn't it easier to bring a new two-story steam locomotive from somewhere from Kazan or Moscow to show Siberians what a railway is in the XNUMXst century? ..
    belay It will probably be hard to drag him so far. He was not seen in the Urals either. repeat
    1. 210ox
      210ox 29 August 2020 05: 33 New
      50
      A two-story steam locomotive is certainly strong ... However, the author raised a burning topic. It seems that natural resources are no longer needed by the ruling ... They roll by inertia. And what do people mean to them? For corporations, banks? Why pull social media? Yes, shift workers do not need kindergartens or schools. But here in Krasnodar, 33 first grades are being opened at school ... True, there is no work.
      1. carstorm 11
        carstorm 11 29 August 2020 05: 41 New
        19
        because DV) with children is moving to Krasnodar. young people. I already lost count of how many friends have moved there. in second place is Peter. but Krasnodar is the leader)
        1. Doctor
          Doctor 29 August 2020 09: 08 New
          +1
          because DV) with children is moving to Krasnodar. young people. I already lost count of how many friends have moved there. in second place is Peter. but Krasnodar is the leader)

          It's good. They would rather try to squeeze out Krasnodar than Siberia.
        2. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 29 August 2020 09: 29 New
          22
          Quote: carstorm 11
          because DV) with children is moving to Krasnodar. young people. I already lost count of how many friends have moved there. in second place is Peter. but Krasnodar is the leader)

          And not only Krasnodar and St. Petersburg. Smolensk region Ozerny settlement, after the collapse of the Union, the guys from the Murmansk trawl fleet bought at a meager price two 9-storey unfinished ones, completed and transported their families there, they themselves walk the seas, and the families live there. Then others started buying apartments. The guys provided the rear for themselves, after the collapse of the fishing industry, when the fleet was reduced at times, the sailors had where to retreat, they had housing. The same picture is at the DVK. My senior mech and electromech, guys from Magadan, one went to Belgorod, the other to Sevastopol. And how many of them departed from the regions of the North and the DVK, highly qualified sailors. Thousands of MRKh vessels went to waste, tens of thousands of specialists were left without work, and they can only work at sea, on the shore they are just children.
          1. Mareman Vasilich
            Mareman Vasilich 7 September 2020 10: 31 New
            0
            The key in this issue is the motivation that the state should create.
        3. The comment was deleted.
      2. _Sergei_
        _Sergei_ 29 August 2020 06: 38 New
        +5
        And in Soviet times, young people from Altai left for Togliatti, for Tutaev for a motor vehicle, for Ishimbay (I was offered, but I was lazy), for KAMAZ. So there was always young people who were ready to go and whose young people were at home. In 2010, assemblers were recruited to Angola (BMP to collect). We offered to our son. He said that he was well at home. And now young people mostly go to the North. Many of us work in Chukotka, Yakutia, Yamal and in the oil industry.
        1. Greenwood
          Greenwood 29 August 2020 13: 27 New
          30
          Quote: _Sergey_
          And now young people mostly go to the North. Many of us work in Chukotka, Yakutia, Yamal and in the oil industry.
          You have worded the phrase a little bit. They do not "work", they "earn" there. They earn money for housing, for the future, etc. They will work for 5-10 years, buy a house in the same Krasnodar, Crimea or Moscow region and get dumped from your Yamal.
          1. _Sergei_
            _Sergei_ 29 August 2020 15: 31 New
            +1
            My neighbor in Novy Urengoy bought an apartment and moved there to live. And in 2015 he sold and bought it in Sevastopol. He told me when I came to my parents this year. The nephew went on watch to Yamal, and now he is somewhere in Tyumen. He still lives with us, but is going to Sochi. But mostly they stay at home or just move to another city, but in the region. An acquaintance generally moved to Gorny Altai in the village. You can live on a watch in the village.
          2. Vik ganz
            Vik ganz 5 September 2020 13: 38 New
            0
            And what's wrong with that? During these 5-10 years, the infrastructure will be built, the next ones will arrive. They will also work for 5-10 years.
          3. tihonmarine
            tihonmarine 7 September 2020 10: 42 New
            0
            Quote: Greenwood
            They will work for 5-10 years, buy a house in the same Krasnodar, Crimea or Moscow region and get dumped from your Yamal.

            Well, it is impossible to live all your life on Yamal, and indeed in the North. And it is normal to work for 10-15 years, and then return to the climate in which you were born. For example, I cannot live either in Krasnodar or in the Crimea (I can rest for a month), but my middle band.
        2. Lynx2000
          Lynx2000 29 August 2020 17: 27 New
          +2
          There are many compatriots from Altai in the Far East. For example, in Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky there is a street. Biysk, and there seems to be Altai.
          Pensioners go to the mainland, Kamchadals mostly go to Belgorod, St. Petersburg is the second most popular. Children are left with an apartment in Kamchatka.
          There is a need for working specialties: locksmiths and ship repair turners, gantry crane operators, etc., a salary worthy by local standards, but young people do not want to "freeze snot" ...
          1. _Sergei_
            _Sergei_ 29 August 2020 18: 13 New
            +2
            My son-in-law works as a watch in Chukotka. For us, the salary is good from 100 thousand. Someone here takes a mortgage, pays off quickly and finds work at home. A friend worked for his son in Yakutia, then in Chukotka. He paid for the apartment and bought himself a Chinese jeep and quit his job. Works here now
            1. Lynx2000
              Lynx2000 30 August 2020 15: 42 New
              +1
              100 thousand rubles salary is good for Moscow. The fact is that for Tyumen, Salekhard, Norilsk, Dudinka, Tiksi, Pevek, Anadyr, P-Kamchatsky, Sev-Kkrilsk, Magadan (where I was), back in Soviet times, the mentality of "temporary workers" was formed, the idea is to make money " a long ruble ", and to equip everyday life at home (Ukraine, Belarus, Russia).
              I myself live in two regions, Kamchatka, Altai, Gorny Altai ...
              1. _Sergei_
                _Sergei_ 30 August 2020 17: 43 New
                +3
                My son-in-law was not satisfied with a salary of 150 thousand Muscovite. They have been looking for this position for three months and two more are the same. For some reason, they are looking for in Moscow and the Moscow region. If they started looking in Siberia, then probably there would be plenty of people willing to get such a salary.
              2. Nikolai Korovin
                Nikolai Korovin 30 August 2020 21: 31 New
                +4
                For the overwhelming majority of residents of fattening Moscow, 100 thousand is not just a good salary, but an unattainable dream. Astronauts receive around 200 thousand, well, with experience and an increase in the number of flights and space walks, their salaries are growing, maybe more than 300 thousand.

                I also know the pilot of the coolest two-story watermelon - they cut him somewhere from 250 thousand to 200 thousand, they do not allow him to rest between flights. The rate of a senior researcher at the Academy of Sciences is about 26 rubles now, I won't say more precisely, I have a little more part-time work, so about 000 rubles there, 100 rubles here, I'm not particularly worried. But sometimes, of course, I think - after all, I’m already 100, it’s time to take a little rest ... For example, so that there would be enough salary and pension for a good life, and there would be no need to earn extra money. The pension in connection with all the cataclysms turned out to be very small. And it turns out, like in a joke, why a teacher and a doctor work at one and a half rates. And there are also just scientific, junior scientific, even laboratory assistants ... And there are much more of them than the elders. Of course, there are grants, but as a part-time job, not everyone has it, and it is necessary to try very hard, say, to the manager to get him registered. Maybe they will register, or maybe not. And also by no means Eldorado turns out.

                A seller in Dixie, an ad hangs, gets something like 28 thousand, or something ... He gets something, but they detain, they do not receive it, they are fined, etc. The staff turnover is huge. As for the huge Moscow salaries for a job lighter than that of a cosmonaut, several tens of thousands of people receive them.

                And yes, that's right. In the summer it is a pleasure to walk along the Sayan or even much further north, but it is short. Infrastructure was extremely undeveloped in Soviet times. All life in big cities along the Transsib and its branches. "Give way to Kiya-Shaltyr!" Everything else is essentially depressing, as a rule, only by plane, indeed, and you can fly. In the village of Khamsara (a couple of An-2 flights a week to Saryg-Sep is good; or even a couple of weeks due to the weather there is no plane at the pass) ladies in French boots for 200 rubles, but in the store there are only noodles and biscuits from edibles, "for meat" locals go to the taiga. He brought, however, from there a completely cool forging of a cleaver, but he never planted it.

                And in the tundra in winter it is not good - you need to have a lot, for example, an enthusiasm for skiing and an adventurous vein in order to roam there in winter. And in Soviet times, that's right, Muscovites or residents of the middle lane, having worked in the north, returned. I have two such friends. They earned extra money in a dozen years - they did not pay for the smaller northern allowance to the pension even in Soviet times. If you have worked for 9 years and 11 months - from the point of view of calculating the pension, you were not, did not participate. As a result, in connection with all the cataclysms, they acquired, in fact, only hemorrhoids.

                So I don't see any particular tragedy. Those who came only for a ruble and did not love these endless expanses, taiga, mighty rivers, who do not like to sit by a fire under a cedar ... I love it all, but I also love my small homeland - Moscow and the middle lane, but the strength to go to Siberia has long been gone, the sores have overcome. Here's a friend recently, at 62, hit the road on an expedition to the Yenisei. No, he says, I can't take it anymore. Even 50-year-olds are inferior in everything. And such was the Votyak ...

                The Chinese and others come with the same purpose as their own. They will not sit still. Will pull them to their historical homeland, to look at the wall and the crystal bridge. They replace those who have dropped out, where there is infrastructure, and they go deeper only for predatory purposes. In general, it is good everywhere where we are not. Over time, the local population will stabilize, and there will be more shift workers. Here in Myasnov, for example, we have a thoroughbred Kyrgyz woman who speaks purely Russian. He leaves every year for a month, keeps on working. The rest of the contingent is very fluid - apparently, they do not pay much or are fined. Headmistress yes she. The headmistress herself works in the hall and at the checkout - she watches. And the Kyrgyz woman will earn extra money - she will become a big person in Kyrgyzstan.

                In general, small aircraft will be restored, the infrastructure will be restored, where it was, but it has broken down - everything will stabilize. There was not so much of all this, but in one day, of course, you cannot restore what was broken in the "holy 90s". I believe that the outflow is temporary. You have to believe in a Russian peasant.
                1. Nikolai Korovin
                  Nikolai Korovin 1 September 2020 09: 52 New
                  0
                  Someone minus. I don’t understand what I didn’t like. It seems only facts, well, it's true, more private and a little emotionally colored. But on the whole it still turns out that "if I don't like facts, so much the worse for facts."
              3. tihonmarine
                tihonmarine 7 September 2020 10: 44 New
                0
                Quote: Lynx2000
                I myself live in two regions, Kamchatka, Altai, Gorny Altai ...

                And that's okay, even good.
          2. begemot20091
            begemot20091 29 August 2020 20: 52 New
            -1
            in kaliningrad boom I myself am a Siberian - retired. medicine is worthless, but otherwise, no "harmful" industries, warm climate. and housing prices are very reasonable. here is a bunch of
            https://kaliningrad.etagi.com/zastr/?u
            or here
            https://www.stroytrest.spb.ru/kvartiry-v-novostroikah/gorodmasterov/
            and Novosibirsk, and Chelyabinsk ... a lot from Krasnoyarsk
            1. Lynx2000
              Lynx2000 30 August 2020 15: 45 New
              +3
              Well, I don’t know, Siberians over 30 have a hard time living in the seaside climate.
              1. begemot20091
                begemot20091 30 August 2020 17: 52 New
                +1
                To be honest, the sea only "smells" in the morning. There is no sea in Kaliningrad. you need to go 32 km wink
                1. saygon66
                  saygon66 30 August 2020 18: 54 New
                  0
                  - In КAlinigrad not only lacks the sea, but much more ... I wonder why everyone is drawn here ... wink
                  1. begemot20091
                    begemot20091 31 August 2020 16: 20 New
                    0
                    in siberia, too, much that is not. + on - and climate and ecology outweigh.
                    1. saygon66
                      saygon66 31 August 2020 20: 20 New
                      0
                      -Well, ecology is not for long ... The resources of the region are strictly limited - geographically, including ... The climate is eternal autumn, potatoes will give birth every other time, and the land is not Altai black soil. What's going on beyond the Urals now ?! wink
          3. kyznets
            kyznets 4 September 2020 01: 01 New
            0
            In Petropavlovsk Kamchatsky, ship repair was killed. What remains is the level of the workshops. Salaries in ship repair are on average about 50-60 thousand rubles. There are really few turners. They earn mainly by covens, tk. the official is small. In general, there is a shortage of skilled and highly skilled workers. Some retired, some left for the mainland, their earnings there are not much less than here. There are generally a dozen or a half portal cranes in the city, no more. And many people want to leave for the mainland. Not everyone has the opportunity. The people keep on building and repairing, in trade, seasonal fishing and in the seas, gold mining. But the average earnings are 40-50 tr. The military and officials do not live badly. This is much easier.
        3. Orca
          Orca 1 September 2020 08: 31 New
          +1
          Quote: _Sergey_
          Many of us work in Chukotka, Yakutia, Yamal and in the oil industry.

          Sergey, on a rotational basis? Well, about that and speech. They work, but they are not going to live there, start families, raise children-grandchildren. is no longer, and will not be neither in Chukotka, nor in Yamal, nor even in Yakutia with its diamonds of infrastructure, cultural and scientific centers that allow to live like a human being, developing in all aspects of normal human existence. And all these "golden bridges", "forces of Siberia", "Eastern" those who live there need the same as the dog's fifth leg - they have practically nothing from this, while paying for their life-living in those conditions much more than those who "come in large numbers" to St. Petersburg, Moscow, Krasnodar, and the Crimea.
      3. frolov andrey
        frolov andrey 29 August 2020 10: 07 New
        23
        Wealth is not needed in the crumb! The owners need - the elite! Shift workers are developing subsoil, paravozi are transported to the west for processing. The owners make a profit - Putin took over the soda factory. Even the first iron even broadcasts that this is a drop in the bucket and so everywhere in fact.
        And so that he does not hold a referendum: on the nationalization of the previously clever way of wealth and enterprises, and retribution to these entrepreneurs for fraud, shot. In China, they were not afraid to return the material to the people, something that their smart-ass squeezed out of society.
        I often think that our ancestors would simply kill such descendants. This is how bureaucrats would now look into the eyes of their great-grandfathers who gave their strength, and some of their lives for the sake of the benefits of those living now.
        Well, and a suggestion: We need a government and a party that will not be afraid to identify enemies of the people and parasites in society at the legislative level and destroy them at the physical level!
        1. Rubi0
          Rubi0 29 August 2020 19: 19 New
          0
          Why is the watch method not suitable for you? For the young, from 20 to 30, in 10 years he filled up money for an apartment and a car and went to where he got a more comfortable family. What is the point of torturing yourself and your family for what and what, so that then send children to the center?
          1. dauria
            dauria 29 August 2020 22: 36 New
            0
            What is the point of torturing yourself and your family for what and what, so that then send children to the center?


            The people have forgotten how it was under "socialism". Born near Chita - live and die there. Chances to get out - study, get distribution (where they will send), work and wait for an apartment. They will give - you are the king. The exchange is theoretically possible. But you won't find fools to change Moscow, say, to Tyumen.
            They will not take to work without registration, not to work - the police will come and tell about the article for parasitism. The word "limit" has also been forgotten.
            Selling, buying a house is nothing, this is socialism. I signed out - they may not even be registered back to relatives. (If the norms do not allow) laughing
            So they filled the area beyond the Urals. And they gave free rein - everything fell into place.
            Pay, "nasyalnika", I will work and dump.
            In the USA there is Alaska - one to one. Temporary workers for an excellent salary. Well, and minuscule "nature lovers"
            1. Rubi0
              Rubi0 30 August 2020 09: 22 New
              -13
              People still cannot understand the charm of capitalism, that you can not just be content with a minimum salary of 120 rubles, but also swing at a villa with a yacht in Crimea or Italy, and now the state gives you the opportunity and does not limit you. All new buildings in Moscow are half-filled with bloggers with huts of 150 squares or more, and here everyone is chewing snot and groaning how good it was in sociolism.
              1. Aag
                Aag 30 August 2020 18: 41 New
                +5
                Quote: Rubi0
                People still cannot understand the charm of capitalism, that you can not just be content with a minimum salary of 120 rubles, but also swing at a villa with a yacht in Crimea or Italy, and now the state gives you the opportunity and does not limit you. All new buildings in Moscow are half-filled with bloggers with huts of 150 squares or more, and here everyone is chewing snot and groaning how good it was in sociolism.

                I’m only FOR! So that all these bloggers, and other adherents of capitalism, dumped to its charms In Italy, where else, just as far away ...
                The problems raised by the author of the article are depressing (a separate THANKS!). But even more upsetting is the fact that a large number of commentators do not share the author's pain. Moreover, these problems, in a broad sense, do not consider them his own. ... Oh, it can backfire, oh how much ...
                1. Rubi0
                  Rubi0 30 August 2020 19: 46 New
                  -4
                  That is why we all go there, because people like you cannot come to terms with the reality where enterprising people can easily give $ 100 thousand, as a vivid example of Google, where a professor gave his students money for their now multi-billion dollar company. How is this possible under socialism with a salary of 120 rubles from a teacher at the university? But in no way, because they will make money out of thin air on subscriptions on YouTube, and in socialism you work in Siberia at minus 40 and wait for the northern allowances of 1 ruble, and then the mythical pension laughing
                  1. Aag
                    Aag 2 September 2020 21: 02 New
                    0
                    Quote: Rubi0
                    That is why we all go there, because people like you cannot come to terms with the reality where enterprising people can easily give $ 100 thousand, as a vivid example of Google, where a professor gave his students money for their now multi-billion dollar company. How is this possible under socialism with a salary of 120 rubles from a teacher at the university? But in no way, because they will make money out of thin air on subscriptions on YouTube, and in socialism you work in Siberia at minus 40 and wait for the northern allowances of 1 ruble, and then the mythical pension laughing

                    I suppose that this is your age ... I have heard this many times ... Including: "Until all the Soviets die, we will not see luck!" And? What will happen? Will you share life hacks like using a bunch, sex with two, three (who, or what) to heat the apartment? Sorry, maybe I went too far ...
                    But, do you think, let the fools get you hydrocarbons for a penny, defend them from other unheated ones, at minus forty? Well, for a while it will take you. ..Even in front of fathers and grandfathers it will turn out "ugly" - if it touches you ...
              2. frolov andrey
                frolov andrey 30 August 2020 19: 59 New
                +5
                I live in the regional center of the Volga region. I understand capitalism - it's not a question of earning a living for myself. But every day I see people retired climbing in the trash can. Don't be homeless !!! Just not enough to eat and medicine!
                Of course, private opinion and legislative initiative, but there is such an upsurge and a desire to thank the modern Russian elite following the example of China. I'm ready to pull the trigger myself. And a bunch of people around are not opposed. Read about China's retaliation against thieving and ineffective officials.
                Tell them about the delights of capitalism! Halle garage!
                Turn your gaze to your and our common great-grandfathers and ancestors to the past - and tell how the grandchildren exchanged their inheritance and works (sometimes health and lives for the well-being of subsequent generations).
                Show how grateful you can be to them!
                1. Rubi0
                  Rubi0 31 August 2020 08: 03 New
                  -2
                  So I just can't understand how 100 years ago our family lost a 2-storey building in the city center, thanks a lot to the ancestors of the Bolsheviks. Yes, if you look at 40 years ago, then I agree it was good under socialism, but if you take 100 years, then you clearly understand that we turned the wrong way, pulled a bunch of talented engineers, artists, and in general, just traditions and you propose to do exactly the same thing now ...
                  1. Orca
                    Orca 1 September 2020 09: 04 New
                    +1
                    Quote: Rubi0
                    ... if you look at 40 years ago, then I agree it was good under socialism, but if you take 100 years, then you clearly understand that we turned the wrong way, pulled a bunch of talented engineers, artists, and indeed just traditions ...

                    It is very strange that 40 years ago it was good, despite the fact that 100 years ago we turned the wrong way. That is, do you think that what was 40 years ago appeared by itself, out of nowhere - by the wave of a magic wand? Obviously you have a template break. And ... you at least sometimes check what you tapped on the keyboard before spreading it out for general viewing; your writings look like some kind of illiterate Albans.
                    Quote: Rubi0
                    you suggest doing exactly the same thing now.

                    What, who and where is proposing to do the same thing? Here, it seems, no one is calling and is not going to carry out a revolution, dispossession, or take away from someone a 2-storey house. If there is such a person, let him apply - I will give him time, and he will receive everything that is due to him in full.
            2. begemot20091
              begemot20091 30 August 2020 17: 55 New
              +1
              I don’t know about you, but under socialism I changed at least 5 cities. lived, got used to, worked. He returned to his Siberia only after 50, only to leave in 10 years.
            3. Nagaibak
              Nagaibak 30 August 2020 18: 39 New
              +5
              dauria "The people have forgotten, as it was under" socialism. "Born near Chita - live and die there. Chances to get out - study, get distribution (where they will send), work and wait for an apartment."
              This is some kind of nonsense.))) There was no chance to get out? Come on ... also tell us about the lack of passports about workdays.)))
              1. dauria
                dauria 30 August 2020 19: 37 New
                -4
                This is some kind of nonsense.))) There was no chance to get out? Come on...

                Yes, get out, just first sign out, get off the military register. Find a place of work where you will be given a residence permit along with work. Get registered in the military registration and enlistment office of the plant. And work, wait for an apartment. If you get it, move with your wife and kids from Aunt Nyura in the private sector and live. I was drawn to Moscow, al to Sochi - repeat this action. And the apartment you earned, well, you can leave your wife registered there, let him keep watch. She will not be able to work in a new place and let her visit there once every six months. Otherwise thrown out.
                Freedom ... laughing
                Eh guys. It's hard for you to understand what an apartment in the USSR was like. Not an anchor, and you will not come off. Especially if you have plowed for her half your life.
                1. Nagaibak
                  Nagaibak 31 August 2020 19: 00 New
                  +3
                  dauria "Eh, guys. It's hard for you to understand what an apartment in the USSR was."
                  Come on ...))) Who wanted those went where they wanted. My parents went to the north without any problems. We rented out an apartment and left. They got another one.))) Young people have no problems at all. I worked on the distribution and you want to stay ahead, you want to go further. There were apartment exchanges between big cities. Private houses were bought and sold in general. There were so-called cooperative apartments. They were sold and bought freely, and now it is necessary to be registered, removed from the military registration and registered and registered. Or do you not know? All the same.)))
                  1. dauria
                    dauria 31 August 2020 20: 06 New
                    -5
                    We rented out an apartment and left. They got another there.


                    Neighing, thanks ... laughing Freedom in the USSR was for those who ran away from their families and alimony. Children, students and convicts were also free (when they were not in prison). Working family people were tied up with a residence permit. All were discharged - and goodbye. Either leave a relative registered (underage children will not work), or go only where it is allowed to book.
                    The cooperative did not belong to a person, but to a cooperative laughing The same as for the state, only in profile.
                    Not well, if you are so cool that after plowing for fifteen years at the machine for an apartment (and this is happiness), then spit and leave it to the state - they will only say thank you. There was an exchange. there was a family exchange. Long and dreary. But sell-buy ... laughing However, the house is in the village. But the land belongs to the collective farm, not to you.
                    1. Nagaibak
                      Nagaibak 31 August 2020 20: 58 New
                      +2
                      dauria "Neighing, thanks."
                      Yes, I, too, am amazed at your answers.))) Write fables and believe in them.))) And that now there is no registration? And no one is tied to her?))) You can't get a normal job without her. And you can't do anything at all. Well, if only for the money. You can't get enough of them. Do not get up on the register?))) Creepy catching up. Cooperative apartments were sold. calmly. No need to invent. Not everyone could get into the cooperative. But if you bought this apartment, you could resell it freely. Maybe in your area you couldn't go anywhere. My family moved from place to place several times without any problems. And someone sat on the priest exactly and did not twitch. And now they tell us how unbearable it was for them to live.)))
                      1. dauria
                        dauria 31 August 2020 22: 23 New
                        -4
                        write fables and believe in them

                        How old are you, young man? Then you can talk. Your parents' problems did not concern you. You lived from them in blissful ignorance. I saw how mine moved to the city. I know what my corner is after a communal apartment. What were the difficulties to register a wife !!!! to the apartment where you grew up. And you lose the right to it when you graduate from military school. You are discharged automatically. And after the death of relatives there is nowhere to return. Now all problems with the section are solved once or twice. I sold it, I divided the money and that's it. Moved - bought. Previously, because of this, siblings became enemies.
                      2. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 31 August 2020 22: 51 New
                        +1
                        Quote: dauria
                        What were the difficulties to register a wife !!!! to the apartment where you grew up. And you lose the right to it when you graduate from military school. You are discharged automatically.

                        Was your wife also discharged automatically?
                      3. dauria
                        dauria 31 August 2020 23: 08 New
                        -4
                        Was your wife also discharged automatically?

                        Is it funny? No, these tricks of the Soviet law did not apply to wives. Unlike the officers. It was he who was supposed to present a certificate to the KECh that he had no corner in the USSR for his soul. I handed over everything I had - get it. What, it's hard to believe? So ask around the old men whose wives were guarding their apartments "to the Urals." laughing
                        It was for this that it was necessary to register a wife. There was only one old woman left. And fortunately, they wandered around the garrisons with the right to book. So he kept his father's corner.
                        Appreciate capitalism and Boris Yeltsin and don't whine. wassat
                      4. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 31 August 2020 23: 14 New
                        +1
                        Quote: dauria
                        Is it funny?

                        It's not funny, I just give up on people like you who want to eat fish and hand over bottles. The ass is not cracked, as I can see.
                  2. Nagaibak
                    Nagaibak 2 September 2020 21: 28 New
                    0
                    dauria "How many Godkov, young man?"
                    No matter how many are all mine))) ... girl.
                    dauria "Then you can talk."
                    I have nothing to talk about with you.)))
              2. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 31 August 2020 23: 02 New
                +3
                Quote: dauria
                having plowed for fifteen years at the machine for an apartment (and this is happiness),

                Crap. Now and in 15 years you cannot save up at the machine. On average, after 7 years they gave it to us. And it happened - six months later. Dreary section? No need to whistle.
    2. Amin_vivec
      Amin_vivec 30 August 2020 17: 10 New
      11
      You have your own truth. And I live in the north, I know about the watch firsthand, I have nowhere to go - if only to nowhere.
      The watch is killing the northern cities and northern infrastructure - the temporary worker came, earned his own, did not leave a penny and went to his place. A local takes children to kindergarten, school, tries to settle down on the spot - gives work to others. The shift worker does not give anything.
      The watch takes work from the locals. In the north, the costs are higher than in Russia - that's why the northerners are paid regional and northern salary increments. The shift worker does not need to pay these coefficients, he simply does not produce them - his labor is cheaper than the labor of a northerner - it is profitable for an employer to a private trader.
  • NEXUS
    NEXUS 29 August 2020 11: 07 New
    17
    Quote: 210ox
    However, the author raised a burning topic.

    I will put it this way ... this question of depopulation of Siberia, the Far East, and the Urals in the near future (20-30 years) will come back to haunt us not childishly. Yes, indeed, Siberia, the Urals, the Far East are a large part of our immense, but the population, like those ants, huddled together in the European part. But cimis is that we feed and develop for the most part not at the expense of the European part of the Russian Federation, but precisely at the expense of Siberia, the Urals, etc.
    Young people are leaving Siberia, the Far East, the Urals ... but what should they do there? Infrastructure is observed mainly in large cities. There is not much work, electricity, gas, water in some villages do not even think to lay. The lack of doctors, teachers, and even simple workers adds color to this picture.
    The USSR developed the infrastructure of Siberia, the Urals and the East ... cities were built, railways were built, LEB stretched not only to cities, to villages.
    And now all this is not. The ruling helmsmen don't care. Capitalism, as I have said more than once, does not imply concern for people. Only profit is important. And when there, in the offices of the Kremlin, a roasted rooster pecks, then they begin to stir, but not for the people, but for the profits of a narrow circle of citizens.
    Placing the population on the map of the country follows one law - where there is a greater concentration of money, there are people. As well as ants, where there is more food, there is more crowd.
    I was always puzzled by one moment ... why the same locksmith, say, in some Siberian small town receives several times less than his colleague working in St. Petersburg or Moscow? Isn't he doing the same job? And teachers who work in villages where there is no gas or running water, shouldn't they receive many times more than those teachers who work in Moscow, for example? The same goes for doctors too.
    So how is the distribution of wages and money in general in the country? Maybe in order to prevent Siberia, the Urals, D.Vostok from dying out, it is necessary to first reconsider the issue of wages in these regions, towards a DIFFERENT increase in salaries in comparison with their colleagues who work in the greenhouse conditions of the same St. Petersburg, N. Novgorod, Moscow and so on?
    1. Eug
      Eug 29 August 2020 13: 09 New
      +2
      As you propose, it is impossible to do under capitalism - in sparsely populated areas "productivity" is several times less than in densely populated areas, and taking into account the population's ability to pay (for example, the indicator is the total daily salary of patients served by a doctor) is ten times lower. Many times I came across the fact that the main factor in promoting development projects is not social and social expediency, but the "solvency of a unit of area" of the proposed territory of the project. That is, roughly speaking, the amount of money per square meter of area. And this approach is becoming more common. So, sparsely populated territories cannot be populated without active economic intervention of the state. I am a supporter of economic methods, first of all, cheap transport - the west and east coasts of the United States unites and promotes industrial and trade cooperation, first of all, cheap
      logistics. But to introduce it in a directive manner - to step on the throat (wallet) of the oil and gas kings ...
      1. Amin_vivec
        Amin_vivec 30 August 2020 17: 17 New
        +5
        This can be done under capitalism. There is no way to increase salaries in the regions. But to reduce them in Moscow three times - you can easily)))) Capitalism, however. Close public hospitals, schools and kindergartens, private, poor quality and terribly expensive ones will proliferate - and then the regions will become attractive))))
        1. Eug
          Eug 30 August 2020 18: 32 New
          0
          An interesting option, but Moscow will revolt.
          1. Doliva63
            Doliva63 31 August 2020 23: 00 New
            +2
            Quote: Eug
            An interesting option, but Moscow will revolt.

            And to hell with her. What is it to us?
          2. Yngvar
            Yngvar 3 September 2020 07: 09 New
            0
            And if this option is not realized, the whole Trans-Urals will revolt!
      2. Aag
        Aag 30 August 2020 18: 51 New
        +4
        Quote: Eug
        As you propose, it is impossible to do under capitalism - in sparsely populated areas "productivity" is several times less than in densely populated areas, and taking into account the population's ability to pay (for example, the indicator is the total daily salary of patients served by a doctor) is ten times lower. Many times I came across the fact that the main factor in promoting development projects is not social and social expediency, but the "solvency of a unit of area" of the proposed territory of the project. That is, roughly speaking, the amount of money per square meter of area. And this approach is becoming more common. So, sparsely populated territories cannot be populated without active economic intervention of the state. I am a supporter of economic methods, first of all, cheap transport - the west and east coasts of the United States unites and promotes industrial and trade cooperation, first of all, cheap
        logistics. But to introduce it in a directive manner - to step on the throat (wallet) of the oil and gas kings ...

        Here they are, the delights of capitalism!
        Hence the influx of migrants from the former Soviet Union. The oligarhat needs a cheap labor force, preferably without claims to social services. Further, the grass (taiga) is not nearly! ...
    2. ssergey1978
      ssergey1978 29 August 2020 14: 26 New
      -5
      You contradict yourself. Russia does not live thanks to the Far East and Siberia, since it is in the European part that is why people are fleeing and housing is more accessible and the climate is milder. Fewer guest workers. An inexpensive overseas vacation is available.
    3. Sertorius
      Sertorius 30 August 2020 00: 45 New
      +2
      Maybe in order to prevent Siberia, the Urals, D.Vostok from dying out, it is necessary to first reconsider the issue of wages in these regions, towards a DIFFERENT increase in salaries in comparison with their colleagues who work in the greenhouse conditions of the same St. Petersburg, N. Novgorod, Moscow and so on?

      Of course, you can increase it. They are still higher in the Far East than the national average. Only good? For salaries, prices for everything will immediately rise.
  • siberalt
    siberalt 29 August 2020 06: 19 New
    48
    Muscovy is a good country, and Russia is the best! All revolutions (counter-revolutions) start in the capitals, and riots in the colonies. We are told that the Independent is a US colony. Is the Kremlin so independent? Someone promised to give 2% of the offshore for the treatment of children. Yes, just not to happen. Nabullina and Siluanov imposed a moratorium on these dreams until the end of the term of office of the "Kremlin dreamer" until 2024. They said that this is not the business of the guarantor, let him protect his amendments to the Constitution and not meddle in finances. As for Siberia and other zamkadye, who wants to live in the impoverished colonies of the Moscow metropolis?
    1. Uncle lee
      Uncle lee 29 August 2020 08: 10 New
      33
      Quote: siberalt
      in impoverished colonies

      I started working in 69 in Kholmsk, Sakhalin UMRZF ... There were more than 100 mining and fishing vessels, in the shipping company - the same. In the area there were three fishing collective farms, two fur farms, two paper processing plants, two SRZs, a fish and sea port, three port points, a lacobank, five collective farms, a stroydetal plant, Selkhozkhimiya and Selkhoztekhnika, ATP, Mechanization, Shakhtostroy, a winery, a brewery, and that's all. don't remember ...
      The port remained empty, three ferries are really running, and the oil industry took the fishing port, and a dozen steamers in the NSR. AND EVERYTHING , the rest was covered with a copper basin. The forest was cut down, it ended, the fish were cut out, the rivers are empty. Coal is loaded in Shakhtersk and straight over the hill. Oil leaked through pipes. Gas is driven through a pipe to Prigorodnoye, compressed, into gas carriers and over the hill ... And what kind of development? Bridge? To nowhere ... And a hectare ... Yeah ... the stupider idea is just a tunnel in Hokkaido! Yes, and PRICES! And how many people left .... Maybe life is better there. hi
      1. Nehist
        Nehist 29 August 2020 08: 48 New
        11
        Hello terma !! Chekhov was there next to you, you know what happened to him ... And at one time it was even a district town ...
        1. Uncle lee
          Uncle lee 29 August 2020 09: 01 New
          14
          Sanya hi Both Chekhov and Pravda were urban settlements, but became a rural settlement! You have to think about it! I'm not even talking about the former industry and the current infrastructure ... But the road ... of federal significance! Primer! I haven't been going there for a long time, sorry for the car.
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 29 August 2020 09: 55 New
        12
        Quote: Uncle Lee
        And a hectare ... Yeah ... only a tunnel in Hokkaido is stupider! Yes, and PRICES! And how many people left .... Maybe life is better there.

        My brother Nikolai and his five friends in 1973, after graduating from the LMU, decided to go to Sakhalin to Nevelsk, no matter how much I asked him to take a direction to the Baltic States, but the romance took its toll. More than a hundred fishing vessels and floating bases, he worked for SRT, salaries were half more than ours, but there was no clearance with housing, and the supply was also low. I came on vacation three years later, dressed in some kind of blue suit, we do not wear such a simple hard worker, and in sandals. I ask him "Kolya, what kind?" and he told me "What was in the warehouses to the office." But people worked, and few left back. Of my 43 classmates, more than half of my classmates also went to work from Vladivostok to Petropavlovsk. The salaries were more than those of our "Westerners", especially those who went to the RCS. And then everything went like a snowball. I managed to pick up my brother in Tallinn on time. Many stayed, where to go at the age, and for what. And who needs them here, all the Union fleets have been torn apart like a "Tuzik hot-water bottle". We who are in the west, at least somehow settled down, and what to do for those who are in the east.
        1. Uncle lee
          Uncle lee 29 August 2020 11: 53 New
          +9
          After the sailor, everyone stayed on Sakhalin. And I would not say that there was nothing to put on and put on ... After practice, all over Nevelsk, I and the head of the school had Japanese shoes! And the houses were built at an accelerated pace, I got an apartment after 7 years, others got it earlier. Everything began to fall apart under Gorbachev, the fleet was sold, the enterprises simply closed. The only Lacobanka in the entire Far East supplied the entire fleet with a bank. There were no floating factories and LKB began to wither. Businessmen arrived, offered to buy, reorganize and continue work, but the local authorities balked. In short, the equipment was sold, even though it was taken to Shikotan, it will be launched there, and not for metal. The buildings will be demolished and a recreation area will be made. What to rest from? Didn't bother!
          1. Kisa
            Kisa 29 August 2020 16: 16 New
            +5
            well, you all burn correctly. but the sailors did indeed become temporary passengers in the Far East. all my classmates with DVIMU moved to St. Petersburg Krasnodar. right now, there is not much difference for a sailor from where to fly on a contract and a family in civilization and children have prospects.
            about the harsh climate - it is also true, but even the chic climate of the south of Primorye (Vladik Nakhodka at the latitude of Sochi) with its swimming season on the coast of Japan - even from there, the population has decreased by a third. one single correct phrase - people are no longer work. ship repair giants PSRZ NSRZ Dalzavod killed. Shipping company PMP DVMP is pitiful scraps ... there are no empty transshipment ports ... the entire Soviet past was flushed down the toilet and only a pipe was brought to Kozmino to replace it, and they were poured raw under the flag.
            I found the time when Luch Okean SKA played grandiose local events in the Major League - Muscovites were shocked to fly 9 hours one way per game. and even options were considered to play with the Japanese Koreans to make their own league ... everything is dead
            I am touched by the position of the local experts from the Moscow region - not an inch of Kunashir Shikotan. Furgala to disperse the protestors ... I propose to send all violent patriots here at VO to the Far East at least on a tour to see reality
      3. Backbone
        Backbone 29 August 2020 16: 32 New
        +2
        Hello, Holmchanin! I also left after earning a pension. I often watch Kholmskie news on TNT on YouTube.
      4. krillon
        krillon 29 August 2020 23: 24 New
        +4
        Greetings to fellow countrymen! I was promoted only at 65, Uglegorsk. It was: a pulp and paper plant, mines, a meat and dairy plant, a bread plant, three state farms, Remained: two seaports and the Nikolsky coal mine. All. A couple of years ago, he left his trench and also moved to the mainland. It hurts to realize that nobody needs us there, and the places are wonderful.
        1. Cyril G ...
          Cyril G ... 30 August 2020 22: 23 New
          +2
          Quote: Krillon
          And the places are wonderful.


          The places are wonderful in the Far East. But I personally left Kamchatka because of the prices for everything ...
  • Vol4ara
    Vol4ara 30 August 2020 09: 37 New
    -1
    To the author about the weather - when it rains in December, I dream of minus 30 and snow
    1. Aag
      Aag 30 August 2020 19: 02 New
      +1
      Quote: Vol4ara
      To the author about the weather - when it rains in December, I dream of minus 30 and snow

      Well, you are welcome, as the saying goes! Not skiing, it's possible for six months a year, but living, working, if you find a job ...
  • Lech from Android.
    Lech from Android. 29 August 2020 05: 04 New
    36
    I can agree with the author ... the incomes of ordinary citizens in these regions are low and the costs of maintaining living standards are high ... this imbalance has an extremely negative effect on the well-being of people ... the State Duma adds fuel to the fire by introducing new taxes, fines, bans, restrictions, various extortions ... in general, the situation is not happy.
    1. Vladimir Mashkov
      Vladimir Mashkov 29 August 2020 09: 50 New
      23
      Alexander (it looks like he is from Omsk) raised the topic of capital and serious. It's time to stop grinding and blow off dust particles from Moscow, St. Petersburg and a dozen more cities, and really start developing Russia. Of course, something is being done now. But not enough! And the revolt of the Khabarovsk residents speaks volumes about this.
      1. Asad
        Asad 29 August 2020 10: 31 New
        14
        Renovation in Moscow! Five-storey buildings will be demolished, twenty storey buildings will be built and another five million will be invited for a mortgage!
        1. Military77
          Military77 29 August 2020 17: 13 New
          +9
          I will upset you. The renovation has merged ... Stretched out until 2032. Believe it or not, Moscow has ceased to be an attractive city for life. The level of education or medical care, during the reign of the dog, decreased significantly. In the polyclinic, even for children, even for adults, there are only Tuldy Muldy Kirgizstan. It's okay in schools and kindergartens, but it's temporary. In general, people stayed in Kyrgyzstan? I have a feeling that all of Kyrgyzstan filmed and moved to Moscow))) I have nothing against it, but somehow they suddenly became a lot everywhere.
          1. your1970
            your1970 29 August 2020 21: 41 New
            -2
            Quote: Military77
            Tuldy Muldy Kirgizstan. It's okay in schools and kindergartens, but it's temporary. In general, people stayed in Kyrgyzstan? I have a feeling that all of Kyrgyzstan filmed and moved to Moscow)))

            Do you know that due to the depreciation of the ruble, citizens of the CIS countries left the Russian Federation en masse, and what is left is less than a third of what was? That there were those who received a passport or were children born here?
            That
            Quote: Military77
            Tuldy Muldy Kirgizstan
            may well be a Buryat, a Kazakh, or anyone, even a Kyrgyz, but who has lived here all her life and never had any other citizenship besides the Russian Federation ?? That along the border with Kazakhstan there are settlements - where many Kazakhs always lived, even during the Russian empire?
            And yes, I don't like the doctor - there are many ways to ruin his career / salary / life
          2. Vadim237
            Vadim237 29 August 2020 22: 38 New
            0
            In addition to the renovation in Moscow, by 2027, they plan to reorganize the Rusty Ring of 196 abandoned industrial zones to build in their place new parks, residential quarters, industrial parks, production kindergartens, schools, hospitals - for this they plan to attract investments in the amount of 7 trillion rubles to create 500000 jobs with an annual profit of up to 3 trillion rubles.
          3. Aag
            Aag 30 August 2020 19: 09 New
            +3
            Quote: Military77
            I will upset you. The renovation has merged ... Stretched out until 2032. Believe it or not, Moscow has ceased to be an attractive city for life. The level of education or medical care, during the reign of the dog, decreased significantly. In the polyclinic, even for children, even for adults, there are only Tuldy Muldy Kirgizstan. It's okay in schools and kindergartens, but it's temporary. In general, people stayed in Kyrgyzstan? I have a feeling that all of Kyrgyzstan filmed and moved to Moscow))) I have nothing against it, but somehow they suddenly became a lot everywhere.

            You are wrong.))) Not all of Kyrgyzstan (Central Asia) has moved to Moscow! There are also enough in the discussed regions. In some primary grades, MOST!
        2. Antiliberast
          Antiliberast 29 August 2020 18: 52 New
          0
          Quote: ASAD
          Renovation in Moscow! Five-story buildings will be demolished, twenty stories will be built and another five million will be invited for a mortgage!Consider the area will move.

          https://www.mk.ru/incident/2020/08/05/vygnat-russkikh-iz-rossii-zhurnalistka-rasskazala-o-lozungakh-migrantov-v-moskve.html Пусть область начинает переезд или не куда ехать будет, тут уже и не знаю даже, что лучше- либо Сибиряки пусть уезжают сюда из Сибири, либо нам ехать в Сибирь отдав столицу request
  • apro
    apro 29 August 2020 05: 07 New
    -40
    I don't understand that the author is raising a wave ... in Russia today, market relations ... to everything ... and if it is not economically feasible ... then it is not necessary. The people agree with this and take an active part in this. language ... and where and with their feet ... the authorities today are concerned not with stupid projects of the times of the USSR, but with defending the interests of the leading class so that they do not accidentally lose weight ...
    1. Lech from Android.
      Lech from Android. 29 August 2020 05: 17 New
      33
      Yeah market relations belay ... that deserted territories should be traded for profit?
      1. apro
        apro 29 August 2020 05: 22 New
        -35
        Quote: Lech from Android.
        .. deserted territories what to trade for the sake of profit?

        The price would be reasonable ... but what's wrong?
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 29 August 2020 09: 57 New
        15
        Quote: Lech from Android.
        Yeah, market relations ... unpopulated territories, perhaps to trade for profit?

        The people are leaving the East, and the Chinese are taking their place. How many of them are already in my native Transbaikalia.
        1. Husit
          Husit 29 August 2020 10: 06 New
          +2
          Quote: tihonmarine
          Quote: Lech from Android.
          Yeah, market relations ... unpopulated territories, perhaps to trade for profit?

          The people are leaving the East, and the Chinese are taking their place. How many of them are already in my native Transbaikalia.

          They are not in the Urals yet. But everything can be .. Tajikistan over there is already paying off its debts with its territory .. Kazakhstan is next in line!
          1. tihonmarine
            tihonmarine 29 August 2020 10: 56 New
            +1
            Quote: Husit
            Kazakhstan is next in line!

            Yes, the Big Dzhangarsky passage is nearby.
        2. krops777
          krops777 29 August 2020 11: 55 New
          +2
          The people are leaving the East, and the Chinese are taking their place. How many of them are already in my native Transbaikalia.


          I'm wondering how many Chinese people do you have now? True, they have always been there since pre-revolutionary times. We have now, and this is the north of the Irkutsk region, there is practically no left, at first we also were, the forest was sawed but they quickly deflated, Siberia broke, however.
          1. tihonmarine
            tihonmarine 29 August 2020 17: 19 New
            0
            Quote: krops777
            True, they have always been there since pre-revolutionary times.

            After Damansky, all the Chinese were evicted and introduced 30 km. zone. After the collapse of the Soviet Union, everything went to pieces.
          2. Andrey Krasnoyarsky
            Andrey Krasnoyarsky 30 August 2020 13: 39 New
            +1
            In Krasnoyarsk, you need to look for Chinese. Very little is left. Mostly migrant workers come from Central Asia and the Caucasus. In the PRC, living standards are rapidly growing along with the economy, Russia has ceased to be attractive for Chinese workers. And none of them stay for permanent residence in Siberia. So the cries about the "dominance of the Chinese" in Siberia are more from the field of demagoguery than a real danger.
          3. Aag
            Aag 30 August 2020 19: 32 New
            +1
            Quote: krops777
            The people are leaving the East, and the Chinese are taking their place. How many of them are already in my native Transbaikalia.


            I'm wondering how many Chinese people do you have now? True, they have always been there since pre-revolutionary times. We have now, and this is the north of the Irkutsk region, there is practically no left, at first we also were, the forest was sawed but they quickly deflated, Siberia broke, however.

            It seems that in the north of the Irkutsk region (judging by the aerial photographs of the Bratsk district), the forest first ended, and only then the Chinese.
            In Irkutsk itself, they were strongly "blown away" with the outbreak of the pandemic ... Together with them, some construction companies were blown away. Some were saved by the Central Asians ...
            Economists attribute the outflow of Chinese to the increased standard of living in China itself, so that a number of enterprises in the Russian Federation under domestic brands, in fact, to a large extent, work for China.
        3. ssergey1978
          ssergey1978 29 August 2020 14: 41 New
          +2
          All right, the Chinese, mainly Central Asia.
    2. Modun
      Modun 29 August 2020 09: 29 New
      +2
      If market relations, then start selling land, since there is nothing else left according to the author
    3. Rostislav
      Rostislav 29 August 2020 14: 56 New
      +6
      Quote: apro
      I do not understand that the author is raising a wave ... in Russia today there is market relations ... to everything ... and if it is not economically expedient ...

      This can be answered with the words of an Indian leader, when his tribe was driven from the earth:
      "When the last tree is cut down, when the last river is poisoned, when the last bird is caught - only then will you understand that money cannot be eaten."
      1. Aag
        Aag 30 August 2020 19: 36 New
        +1
        Quote: Rostislav
        Quote: apro
        I do not understand that the author is raising a wave ... in Russia today there is market relations ... to everything ... and if it is not economically expedient ...

        This can be answered with the words of an Indian leader, when his tribe was driven from the earth:
        "When the last tree is cut down, when the last river is poisoned, when the last bird is caught - only then will you understand that money cannot be eaten."

        A plus!
        Only this when One Tribe!
        And when the problems of the Indian leader (the shaman and their friends) do not ... worry ...
        We get what the author wrote about.
  • Far B
    Far B 29 August 2020 05: 15 New
    51
    We used to speak in slogans
    And exactly this we used to speak in slogans? As far as I understand, the unsinkable rower is throwing slogans at us. It has been casting for 20 years. And before him, 10 years old, his godfather had thrown slogans at him.
    I live in the north of the Far East. I'm not going to leave. But if my daughter leaves, I will understand her and will not condemn her. A simple layout: the minimum wage (taking into account the northern and regional) - about 24 thousand. Bread - 85. Cigarettes (the cheapest) - 150. The price tag for everything except the list of 20 items, which are subsidized from the budget, is 1,5-2 times higher than on the mainland. Winter - from October to April inclusive. Spring - May-June. Summer ... Well, you can count. Temperature 25 degrees - already hot))) Planes do not fly for weeks - it's a common thing. (Only a third of flights were operated in June). There is a constant shortage of specialists at school, in the hospital, and indeed everywhere. As a loner, it's okay for me - here is fishing, mushrooming, berries, and crab ... But for families, especially with children - here the ass is complete. Until the government returns the "long ruble" for the North, no one will come here. Moreover, the population decline will continue. For reference: in the districts (I don’t think the demographic decline is so noticeable there), in the countryside, the population decline in the Far East is about 75% compared to 1990. I have the opportunity to judge: I lived in Primorsky and Khabarovsk territories, in the Jewish Autonomous Region and on Sakhalin, in Kolyma.
    P.S. And Staver cho - began to see clearly? He always drowned for Putin, said that all his decisions are correct, because they are Putin?
    1. Ragnar Lodbrok
      Ragnar Lodbrok 29 August 2020 05: 38 New
      25
      Mikhail ... In the Urals, the villages are also emptying, everyone is leaving for the cities, there is at least somehow something ... I am not leaving, because the old one. Where to me, and the churchyard with my family, does not allow to them there soon. I do not blame the young, in big cities they may have something.
      1. Rostovchanin
        Rostovchanin 29 August 2020 06: 30 New
        19
        Yes, migration from the countryside is a trend throughout the country, everyone is drawn to the city. Urbanization is a trend. Well, there is nothing for young people to do in the countryside. I come from the outback of the Rostov region, a small town 200 km from Rostov on the border with Kolmykia. There were 6 schools in the city, now there are 5 of them. When I finished school, I studied 900 there, 25 years later, now there are 350 students, ate-ate 2 first grades are gaining. But in the regional center there are 7-12 first grades at school this year. There are only old people and state employees in the village, so this is not only a problem in the Far East.
        1. IS-80_RVGK2
          IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 11: 56 New
          +9
          This would not be a problem if there were real socialism in the country. And not just emerging from a state of extreme savagery capitalism. Urbanization is currently an inevitable process in any socio-economic formation. But only within the framework of socialism it can be organized for the benefit of the whole society, and not a handful of capitalists who are crazy with greed.
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 29 August 2020 10: 06 New
        10
        Quote: Ragnar lodbrok
        Mikhail ... In the Urals, the villages are also emptying, everyone is leaving for the cities, there is at least somehow something ... I am not leaving, because the old

        And in the most central Russia, the same. Last time we went with my brother through the Kalinin region. to Smolensk, so on the way all the villages are empty, or several old people live. Young people and who can leave for the cities. The village is dying out, life is still glowing in the regional centers.
    2. carstorm 11
      carstorm 11 29 August 2020 05: 43 New
      -21
      Do you think your daughter will stay here forever because of the money? save money and still leave because of the climate and banal boredom.
      1. Doccor18
        Doccor18 29 August 2020 07: 10 New
        35
        because of the climate and banal boredom.

        Something earlier, because of boredom and frost, no one really left. Quite the opposite. The settlement became an urban-type settlement, and then the settlement assumed the status of a city ...
        The whole problem is in work and salary. There is work, decent wages and people will live. My parents once went to the far north to live. No one drove them there with sticks. And I was born, studied and served there and also had no intention of leaving anywhere. But perestroika and the collapse of the country broke out. Enterprises began to close one by one. They endured for a long time, but then we gave up, and we moved.
        And you say the climate, boredom ...
        1. carstorm 11
          carstorm 11 29 August 2020 07: 14 New
          -2
          Why didn't they leave?) I lived with my parents in a military town in the center of Khabarovsk. our neighbors changed often. officers retired and moved west. the former Minister of Defense of the Republic of Belarus Maltsev, our neighbor, also dumped as soon as he could. both under the Soviet Union and after people left constantly. of course they did not drive them with sticks. like my parents. but left for any reason. the climate is the most important. I remember very well how my mother dragged him west before he was fired. that she is tired and can no longer. scandals ... swearing ...
          1. Doccor18
            Doccor18 29 August 2020 07: 54 New
            21
            I don’t even know that the climate is not to our taste. The seaside nature, hills and rivers would not be exchanged for anything.
            our neighbors changed often. officers retired and moved west. the former Minister of Defense of the Republic of Belarus Maltsev, our neighbor, also dumped as soon as he could ...

            Of course, they left, but mostly those who are not local. An officer came from Tver or Vladikavkaz, served on Sakhalin for 10-15 years, and of course he will return to his little homeland. And those who were born there never thought of leaving. Everyone is in love with their nature.
            1. carstorm 11
              carstorm 11 29 August 2020 08: 04 New
              +7
              no one has anything against nature. the beauty is immense. only June the midge eats and from poplar fluff the child goes crazy from coughing. 30 degrees plus with a hundred percent humidity, the children just lie flat ... in winter, at least it became much less cold than when I was little. but minus 20 with such humidity is completely different minus 20 than in other regions. a lot of things ... Westerners generally get used to life here through suffering and this is not a turn of speech. people leave because they get tired of going through all this every year. not everyone is given this.
              1. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 29 August 2020 08: 38 New
                +4
                Quote: carstorm 11
                from poplar fluff, the child goes crazy with a cough.

                Cut down poplars and you will be happy.
                1. carstorm 11
                  carstorm 11 29 August 2020 09: 05 New
                  +1
                  yeah) in the whole city) here they are just everywhere
                  1. Mordvin 3
                    Mordvin 3 29 August 2020 09: 13 New
                    11
                    Quote: carstorm 11
                    yeah) in the whole city) here they are just everywhere

                    We were cut down. A few years ago, the guys set fire to fluff with might and main, and now it is almost gone. So this is a purely urban problem of the authorities and residents.
                    1. carstorm 11
                      carstorm 11 29 August 2020 09: 24 New
                      -3
                      they crop. something new is even planted instead of them. but the city was simply planted with poplars in Soviet times. lungs of the city and everything like that. all if and change that in 30 years probably. the logic in this was - they grow quickly and clean the air perfectly. but then everyone apparently forgot about the allergic people. and there are a lot of them. in general, summer is extreme for the elite) fluff midges and mosquitoes and all this with a heat of 30 degrees and humidity at the same time)
                      1. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 29 August 2020 09: 29 New
                        +6
                        Quote: carstorm 11
                        but the city was simply planted with poplars in Soviet times. lungs of the city and everything like that. all if and change that in 30 years probably.

                        We had a similar picture. Gradually everything changed. And not in thirty years, but much less.
                      2. carstorm 11
                        carstorm 11 29 August 2020 09: 45 New
                        -2
                        I don't know where you live, but our city is not the smallest. and there are a lot of trees in it. like planting and not very little. I often see gardeners plant new trees. but apparently you can't replace everything at once instead of huge poplars equally. there seems to be some kind of system. it is necessary to wait until some grow up to clean others. but it is IMHO of course.
              2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
                Kote Pan Kokhanka 29 August 2020 09: 30 New
                +8
                Quote: mordvin xnumx
                Quote: carstorm 11
                from poplar fluff, the child goes crazy with a cough.

                Cut down poplars and you will be happy.

                Quote: carstorm 11
                yeah) in the whole city) here they are just everywhere

                Near Omsk there is the village of Svetly, where a military unit is located. The wife of the head of the military unit developed an allergy to poplar fluff. So all the poplars were cut down at the root in a month !!!
                That is the main reason !!!
                I was surprised by something else, but are there no poplars and mosquitoes in the Urals and Europe?
                Maybe the problem lies elsewhere!
                1. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 29 August 2020 09: 39 New
                  +8
                  Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
                  I was surprised by something else, but are there no poplars and mosquitoes in the Urals and Europe?

                  That's just the point that is. I’m smoking out the window, I don’t hang the net, and then I suffer, fucking these bloodsuckers.
                  Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
                  So all the poplars were cut down at the root in a month !!!

                  The main thing is that they planted something instead. And there will always be dissatisfied people. They plant birch trees, so some people won't like May beetles, chestnuts fall on cars and on skulls, and so on.
                  1. carstorm 11
                    carstorm 11 29 August 2020 09: 50 New
                    0
                    in Europe, of course) they are far from ours) and in quantity and size. midge that's the worst thing.
                  2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
                    Kote Pan Kokhanka 29 August 2020 09: 54 New
                    +3
                    Quote: mordvin xnumx
                    Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
                    I was surprised by something else, but are there no poplars and mosquitoes in the Urals and Europe?

                    That's just the point that is. I’m smoking out the window, I don’t hang the net, and then I suffer, fucking these bloodsuckers.
                    Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
                    So all the poplars were cut down at the root in a month !!!

                    The main thing is that they planted something instead. And there will always be dissatisfied people. They plant birch trees, so some people won't like May beetles, chestnuts fall on cars and on skulls, and so on.

                    Willow, Ash, Maple !!!
                    Poplar has only one big plus, it grows quickly.
                    1. nickname7
                      nickname7 29 August 2020 20: 12 New
                      +3
                      There are pyramidal poplars without fluff.
                    2. vlad106
                      vlad106 30 August 2020 10: 41 New
                      +1
                      Quote: nickname7
                      There are pyramidal poplars without fluff.



                      very brittle tree. often falls on the roof of private houses when it falls.
                      and unsuitable for construction. a poplar board rots at once. in general, builders do not use poplar. spit
                    3. nickname7
                      nickname7 30 August 2020 11: 31 New
                      +1
                      a poplar board rots at once. in general, builders do not use poplar. spit

                      What does the construction have to do with it, we are talking about the greening of the city, the poplar is an excellent gardener, but the fluff is a big hindrance, but there is a kind of poplar without fluff, and it should be planted.
                    4. saygon66
                      saygon66 30 August 2020 19: 01 New
                      0
                      - Yes, straight ... All of Uzbekistan specially plants such poplars - on the rafters and overlapping of private houses is going ...
              3. ycuce234-san
                ycuce234-san 29 August 2020 18: 32 New
                +1
                I’m smoking out the window, I don’t hang the net, and then I suffer, fucking these bloodsuckers.


                In the kitchen, there is usually a mechanical cooker hood. And if necessary, a separate hood is hung through a tee with a valve from the main and on a long gas duct, it can be located almost anywhere, for example, in the corridor-bath, storage room.
              4. vlad106
                vlad106 30 August 2020 10: 37 New
                +2
                Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
                So all the poplars were cut down at the root in a month !!!

                The main thing is that they planted something instead. And there will always be dissatisfied people. They plant birch trees, so some people won't like May beetles, chestnuts fall on cars and on skulls, and so on.


                right! maple for example neat wood, linden, ash.
                they plant here instead of worthless poplars
                1. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 30 August 2020 10: 42 New
                  0
                  Quote: vlad106
                  Linden

                  It sticks to the car, you will be tortured to wash. crying
                2. vlad106
                  vlad106 30 August 2020 10: 44 New
                  +1
                  Quote: mordvin xnumx
                  Quote: vlad106
                  Linden

                  It sticks to the car, you will be tortured to wash. crying



                  got it. remember one more malicious tree)
          2. Edward Vashchenko
            Edward Vashchenko 29 August 2020 10: 11 New
            +7
            Vladislav welcome!
            An interesting question about poplars. Indeed, when they were planted, we, for example. in the Crimea, in a city where everything, including the trees, was demolished by the war, these were light cities, rapidly growing.
            Nobody remembered about allergy sufferers, since there were very few of them.
            If anyone paid attention, today allergy is the number one problem, since birth, children without exception are allergic, a consequence of the modern ecological environment, and therefore there are claims to poplars.

            And if it is serious, of course, the problem raised in the article is our reality.
            And those, if such appear, who will have to really solve these problems - this is hellish, unbearable work.
            1. IS-80_RVGK2
              IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 12: 04 New
              +4
              To put the system anew on a socialist track, taking into account past mistakes when opposing a fully formed class of Atlanteans who have straightened their shoulders with bright faces and with a completely dull passive population at the moment, this is really something from the category of fantasy.
            2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
              Kote Pan Kokhanka 29 August 2020 12: 31 New
              +6
              Edward, you are right urbanization entails loss of basic skills and health !!!
              If the problem of migration to megalopolises is serious for more than a century, and it can be solved if the comfort in the periphery is no worse than in the center!
              The conclusion should be the decentralization of economic and components! Including the transfer of federal authorities from the capital !!!
              I understand that they will peck me, but this is one of the solutions to the problem !!! Since the choice is obvious, it is easier to wipe your pants in the office than in a combine in the Ryazan region!
              1. vlad106
                vlad106 30 August 2020 10: 49 New
                +2
                Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
                there should be decentralization of economic and components! Including the transfer of federal authorities from the capital !!!
                I understand that they will peck me, but this is one of the solutions to the problem !!! Since the choice is obvious, it is easier to wipe your pants in the office than in a combine in the Ryazan region!


                and the capital should have been moved to some small town on the plain long ago
              2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
                Kote Pan Kokhanka 30 August 2020 11: 05 New
                +1
                Quote: vlad106
                Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
                there should be decentralization of economic and components! Including the transfer of federal authorities from the capital !!!
                I understand that they will peck me, but this is one of the solutions to the problem !!! Since the choice is obvious, it is easier to wipe your pants in the office than in a combine in the Ryazan region!


                and the capital should have been moved to some small town on the plain long ago


                Why on the plain and not in the mountains?
              3. vlad106
                vlad106 30 August 2020 11: 37 New
                +1
                I myself live in the mountains)))
          3. Postum
            Postum 31 August 2020 05: 13 New
            0
            Decentralization of the economy is impossible without the decentralization of politics in relation to the subjects. But we only have a federation in words with the exception of a few subjects
        2. nickname7
          nickname7 29 August 2020 20: 18 New
          +2
          today allergy is the number one problem, since birth, children without exception with allergies, a consequence of the modern ecological environment

          This is a consequence of chemical food, which is obtained by mixing components, all sorts of emulsifiers, leavening agents, soy, dextrin, and maspo is obtained.

  • nikvic46
    nikvic46 29 August 2020 09: 23 New
    +2
    Alexander: You're right, but it happens differently. My friend from Kuibyshev traveled around the USSR like a rolling stone. I met him. He has been living in Kamchatka for 8 years. "As I saw nature, I realized, this is my homeland." But basically you are right.
  • Aag
    Aag 30 August 2020 19: 45 New
    0
    Quote: carstorm 11
    Why didn't they leave?) I lived with my parents in a military town in the center of Khabarovsk. our neighbors changed often. officers retired and moved west. the former Minister of Defense of the Republic of Belarus Maltsev, our neighbor, also dumped as soon as he could. both under the Soviet Union and after people left constantly. of course they did not drive them with sticks. like my parents. but left for any reason. the climate is the most important. I remember very well how my mother dragged him west before he was fired. that she is tired and can no longer. scandals ... swearing ...

    You are somewhat confusing concepts. If we talk about the retired officers, this is a slightly different topic. Or rather, a completely different one.
  • tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 29 August 2020 10: 11 New
    +7
    Quote: Doccor18
    No one drove them there with sticks. And I was born, studied and served there and also had no intention of leaving anywhere. But perestroika and the collapse of the country broke out. Enterprises began to close one by one.

    That's the whole story. Give people jobs, wages, infrastructure, and make normal living conditions, people will not leave. I have been to Canada in the north of the country, the same frosts, the same winter, but people live and do not want to leave. In any small village everything is there, as in the city, the conditions are even very good, why should they leave.
    1. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 12: 06 New
      0
      Quote: tihonmarine
      Give people jobs, wages, infrastructure, and make normal living conditions, people will not leave.

      Give it good. Where do you get it? Get it out of your pocket?
      1. Nehist
        Nehist 29 August 2020 16: 12 New
        +6
        It is enough to stop at least 50 percent of the income from oil and gas production !!! For example, the Sakhalin region has only 5 percent, everything else goes to Moscow
        1. Sergej1972
          Sergej1972 30 August 2020 13: 31 New
          +1
          But in Siberia and the Far East there are a lot of territories and even regions where there are no hydrocarbons or other valuable resources! Or they are, but it is not profitable to get them, at least for now. And they really need federal subsidies! And you do not think that within the same Sakhalin region, oil-producing regions will declare: why should we share with other regions of the region and give money to the regional budget?
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 30 August 2020 17: 59 New
        +1
        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
        Where do you get it? Get it out of your pocket?

        Well, I realized that we all live in a state, and Canadians live in a state, and the climate of the North is the same. And Norway also lives in the North even better than Canada, and the Finns, and the Swedes, and the Faroese, and the USA. I have named only those countries which I have been to many times, probably there are others.
      3. Aag
        Aag 30 August 2020 19: 49 New
        +1
        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
        Quote: tihonmarine
        Give people jobs, wages, infrastructure, and make normal living conditions, people will not leave.

        Give it good. Where do you get it? Get it out of your pocket?

        I hesitate to ask, for whose pocket are you so worried?)))
    2. Quadro
      Quadro 29 August 2020 23: 35 New
      +1
      Quote: tihonmarine
      Quote: Doccor18
      No one drove them there with sticks. And I was born, studied and served there and also had no intention of leaving anywhere. But perestroika and the collapse of the country broke out. Enterprises began to close one by one.

      That's the whole story. Give people jobs, wages, infrastructure, and make normal living conditions, people will not leave. I have been to Canada in the north of the country, the same frosts, the same winter, but people live and do not want to leave. In any small village everything is there, as in the city, the conditions are even very good, why should they leave.

      Maybe you don't need to talk about Canada. In the north they have an ass that we have. There, almost all shift workers do, the salaries of the locals are the same minuscule, everyone goes to the south. It is not necessary to lie that there is paradise.
  • Doctor
    Doctor 29 August 2020 10: 23 New
    -16
    Something earlier, because of boredom and frost, no one really left. Quite the opposite. The settlement became an urban-type settlement, and then the settlement assumed the status of a city ...
    The whole problem is in work and salary. There is work, decent wages and people will live. My parents once went to the far north to live. No one drove them there with sticks. And I was born, studied and served there and also had no intention of leaving anywhere. But perestroika and the collapse of the country broke out. Enterprises began to close one by one. They endured for a long time, but then we gave up, and we moved.
    And you say the climate, boredom ...

    You don't see the picture globally. The country needed currency all the time, under the tsar they sold wheat, under Stalin they created slave colonies (otherwise it was simply unprofitable) and began to drive timber and gold, and later - oil and gas.
    The development of the North and the Far East has always been on the verge of profitability and went at the expense of the rest of the territories.
    When the bubble burst and everything became clear, they returned to the normal path of development.

    Exaggerating - it's like mining coal in Antarctica or gold on the moon - it is possible, but pointless.
    1. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 12: 10 New
      10
      Yes Yes. But now every correct capitalist official, the colonel, has a couple of billion rubles in his pocket. Well, and other Atlanteans. And rightly so, why do we need to develop the country if we can rob it to a song about bloody komunyaki and patriotism and other rallying around Vekselmovich's yacht.
      1. Doctor
        Doctor 29 August 2020 22: 29 New
        -2
        Yes Yes. But now every correct capitalist official, the colonel, has a couple of billion rubles in his pocket. Well, and other Atlanteans. And rightly so, why do we need to develop the country if we can rob it to a song about bloody komunyaki and patriotism and other rallying around Vekselmovich's yacht.

        This is a different question. But it does not negate the sense of profitability. And no one will work at a loss.
        1. IS-80_RVGK2
          IS-80_RVGK2 30 August 2020 01: 29 New
          +2
          Well, what is the other? The same question. System efficiency issue. These billions could be directed to the development of the country, to support demographic projects, to science, education, medicine. But as a result, a lot of money is deposited in bank accounts, poured into speculation, spent on all sorts of expensive trinkets. And around this shit we are offered to rally. A fucking solid foundation for patriotism. According to the same project as the one that could not stand it and fell apart in 1917.
          1. Doctor
            Doctor 30 August 2020 07: 07 New
            0
            Well, what is the other? The same question. System efficiency question.

            The question of the economic feasibility of the development of the North and the Far East in general is being discussed.

            If there is oil somewhere in the iben and after pumping it out, delivering it to the market and selling it in a normal way, it turned out to arrive, then yes.

            And if, in order to be in the blacks when mining nickel in the Norilsk industrial region, you need to drive there 33 thousand slaves who work only for soldering, then no.
            1. IS-80_RVGK2
              IS-80_RVGK2 30 August 2020 11: 20 New
              +1
              Quote: Arzt
              The question of the economic feasibility of the development of the North and the Far East in general is being discussed.

              Here we are talking about the fact that with such a distribution of the profit received, there will always be not enough money to solve the acute problems facing the country. And they are just a sea. And the development of the Far East and the North as well. And they also need to be developed even if we switch to a rotational method of work. Plus, the inevitable shrinkage and concentration of the population in agglomerations raises the question of control over territories, which requires a whole range of measures, a satellite constellation, drones, and modernization of the border control system. The problem with demography, the measures that are now being taken to address it are absolutely insufficient. And if you remember the wild lag in various technologies, then the Stalinist "must run for 10 years or they will crush us" immediately comes to mind.
          2. Aag
            Aag 30 August 2020 19: 53 New
            0
            Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
            Well, what is the other? The same question. System efficiency issue. These billions could be directed to the development of the country, to support demographic projects, to science, education, medicine. But as a result, a lot of money is deposited in bank accounts, poured into speculation, spent on all sorts of expensive trinkets. And around this shit we are offered to rally. A fucking solid foundation for patriotism. According to the same project as the one that could not stand it and fell apart in 1917.

            I take off the question about the pocket hi
    2. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 29 August 2020 12: 31 New
      +4
      Quote: Arzt
      The development of the North and the Far East has always been on the verge of profitability and went at the expense of the rest of the territories.

      Before the revolution, butter was sold from Siberia for the amount of gold mined there.
      1. Doctor
        Doctor 29 August 2020 22: 30 New
        0
        Before the revolution, butter was sold from Siberia for the amount of gold mined there.

        Maybe. This proves the unprofitability of gold mining in the region using normal methods.
      2. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 30 August 2020 13: 38 New
        0
        This is the current Altai Territory. Southern part of Western Siberia. Siberia, but not that. And not so far from the political and economic center of the country. Even now, the problems of the Trans-Urals and Western Siberia, especially its southern part, are quite different from the problems of East Siberia and the Far East.
    3. ssergey1978
      ssergey1978 29 August 2020 14: 48 New
      0
      Everything is correct. The harsh reality put everything in its place.
    4. Siberian54
      Siberian54 29 August 2020 15: 23 New
      +4
      And nothing that the Stalinist prisoner received a salary at free rates?
      1. Doctor
        Doctor 29 August 2020 22: 32 New
        -1
        And nothing that the Stalinist prisoner received a salary at free rates?

        This is how the line of those wishing to work as convicts is seen. laughing
      2. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 30 August 2020 13: 43 New
        0
        First, it’s not true. Secondly, economic incentives in the camps began to be used on a large scale only from the end of the 40s. It was in the late 40s and early 50s, even under Stalin, that a certain humanization of the camp order took place.
        1. Siberian54
          Siberian54 31 August 2020 08: 09 New
          -1
          My father had been in prison since 1938 (a fight over a woman, an injured crop commissioner) and received a decent salary during the war and until the end of the term it was issued in bonds, there was some kind of lottery and four bonds won about one and a half thousand rubles in 65-71 They received 6000 rubles for them (as he recalled, he lost about half when moving), and that's how much the "slaves of Stalin" received in 7 years under Article 58)
          1. Sergej1972
            Sergej1972 31 August 2020 08: 31 New
            0
            Was he in a camp or a colony? Most of the bonds were not winners. This is luck.
    5. nickname7
      nickname7 29 August 2020 20: 27 New
      +3
      The development of the North and Far East has always been on the verge of profitability

      If it were your opinion, it would be unprofitable to explore the vast expanses of the United States, but they have mastered it, from a thin strip on the west bank they spread to the whole continent, the method exists, but the liberals do not know it.
      1. Doctor
        Doctor 29 August 2020 22: 23 New
        +1
        If it were your opinion, it would be unprofitable to explore the vast expanses of the United States, but they have mastered it, from a thin strip on the west bank they spread to the whole continent, the method exists, but the liberals do not know it.

        Have you looked at the latitude of the States? Seattle, the northernmost large city, at the latitude of Rostov-on-Don, if anything. Everything else is farther south.

        The Americans have mastered the most favorable climatic zone.
        Alaska, on an area comparable to Mexico, is home to 740 thousand cold lovers. laughing
        1. nickname7
          nickname7 30 August 2020 11: 46 New
          +1
          Americans have mastered the most favorable climatic zone

          This is so, their climate is not bad, although the heat in the deserts is not much better than the cold, but nevertheless, the development of space shows that capitalism can be creative, can be effective.
        2. Nehist
          Nehist 30 August 2020 13: 36 New
          +3
          Do not believe Sakhalin to be located at the latitude of the Crimea. The saying is such-Latitude Crimean, Longitude Kolyma
          1. Doctor
            Doctor 30 August 2020 14: 44 New
            +1
            Do not believe Sakhalin to be located at the latitude of the Crimea. The saying is such-Latitude Crimean, Longitude Kolyma

            I will believe it. But unlike Seattle, this is the South of Russia.
            1. Nehist
              Nehist 30 August 2020 15: 01 New
              +1
              Are you talking about Crimea? I'm talking about Sakhalin in general
              1. Doctor
                Doctor 30 August 2020 16: 43 New
                +1
                Are you talking about Crimea? I'm talking about Sakhalin in general

                About both. Of course, it can be cool on Sakhalin)), but it could be experienced if the rest of Russia lay further south, like in the United States.
                Unfortunately, you have to master the other way.
    6. nickname7
      nickname7 29 August 2020 20: 34 New
      +3
      wheat was sold under the king

      Which grew at the expense of corvee, on the lands of the landowner (corvée slave labor), as well as quitrent from the peasant. Under the tsar, just the same part of the GDP was produced by slave labor, draft people and state people, this system went to the communists, it cannot be rebuilt in a year, but they rebuilt it over time.

      went at the expense of other territories.

      And now, due to Russian territories, there is an increase in the number of billionaires and the number of yachts.
  • Doctor
    Doctor 29 August 2020 09: 21 New
    -1
    Simple layout: .....
    But family, especially with children - here the ass is complete.

    I read it. Horrified.
    Honestly, I don't understand what you are doing there.
    1. ssergey1978
      ssergey1978 29 August 2020 14: 50 New
      +6
      They were born there, they have no housing, so there is nothing to sell to move. They are afraid it will get worse.
      1. krillon
        krillon 29 August 2020 23: 52 New
        +4
        Anecdote in the subject. There are two worms in a man, a father and a son. The son asks: Dad is it true that the sun is outside and the grass is green. True, Dad says. So why are we in the ass? Yes, because this is our Motherland, sonny .. Not so long ago there were big reductions in Okha, and some took mortgages, who will need this housing and calculate how ..
  • IS-80_RVGK2
    IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 11: 51 New
    +4
    Quote: Far In
    P.S. And Staver cho - began to see clearly? He always drowned for Putin, said that all his decisions are correct, because they are Putin?

    Rather, denyuzhku should be earned, and the money received for campaigning for amendments to the constitution tends to end.
  • anjey
    anjey 29 August 2020 05: 21 New
    15
    It was in vain that our ancestors mastered Siberia and the Far East, so that we would all sleep today, but it is not profitable for energy consumption, but this is a strategic field of the state and only it should develop a draft of new "Stolypin" reforms and involve industry, entrepreneurs and interest the population, not to abandon these lands not to go to the notorious monotowns, but to build cottage-type urban settlements with new infrastructure for those who wish, or, apparently, it is easier for someone to sell or lease to our Chinese friends with all that it implies in the future.
    1. Grandfather
      Grandfather 29 August 2020 05: 37 New
      22
      and from the "north" how the people run, already losing their slippers.! in Vorkuta apartments with furnishings cost "ruble kg". "a wise policy of those who care for Russia ..." yeah.
    2. Whatislove
      Whatislove 29 August 2020 05: 37 New
      20
      "Stolypin reforms." The problem is that under Stolypin there were specific goals - to provide land to the peasants, reduce social tension, etc. And now the state is unlikely to be able to explain to young people why you need to stay in the Far East and Siberia, when there is the Volga region and the South Russia.The enthusiasm of the masses will not leave, even in the USSR they understood this and supported them financially.
      1. mat-vey
        mat-vey 29 August 2020 06: 14 New
        +2
        Quote: Whatislove
        The problem is that under Stolypin there were specific goals - to provide land to the peasants

        Are you sure that this was exactly the goal of the "Stolypin reforms"?
        1. mat-vey
          mat-vey 29 August 2020 06: 32 New
          +5
          How nice, judging by the downsides, people don't even want to have an idea of ​​Stolypin's reforms ...
          1. tihonmarine
            tihonmarine 29 August 2020 10: 13 New
            0
            Quote: mat-vey
            How nice, judging by the minuses, people do not even want to have an idea of ​​Stolypin's reforms

            You have correctly noticed this.
            1. mat-vey
              mat-vey 29 August 2020 10: 23 New
              0
              Quote: tihonmarine
              You have correctly noticed this.

              It's so hard not to notice ... Moreover, nowadays there is an analogue - Chubais ..
              1. tihonmarine
                tihonmarine 29 August 2020 10: 57 New
                +2
                Quote: mat-vey
                Moreover, in our time there is an analogue - Chubais ..

                This figure is the purest antipode of Stolypin.
                1. mat-vey
                  mat-vey 29 August 2020 11: 05 New
                  +4
                  Yes, never once - only one wanted to rely on kulaks, and the other Soviet factories to distribute to crooks, so that they themselves would have driven the people into the yoke ... And that one or the other did not "fit into the market" - your problems .. ...
      2. nikvic46
        nikvic46 29 August 2020 09: 24 New
        +3
        Vladislav. Young people also flee from the Volga region to Moscow.
      3. IS-80_RVGK2
        IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 12: 15 New
        +6
        And how recently various scum promoted the Far Eastern hectare. I then said that all this is pure nonsense. But the scum posing as patriots did not stop shouting that it was hoo. Almost the salvation of the Far East. But it all ended naturally with zilch. All the steam went off into the whistle.
        1. Nehist
          Nehist 29 August 2020 16: 16 New
          +6
          When this initiative about the Far East hectare appeared, our local forum was neighing at the top of its lungs !!! There were under two thousand comments ... It was originally a crazy idea, but whoever's tone was not bad for her
          1. krillon
            krillon 30 August 2020 00: 01 New
            +5
            We are looking at where the Ministry for the Development of the Far East and the Arctic is located. Moscow. Burdenko 14. I think the problems are better seen from there. As there: "Eye to eye face can not see. Big is seen at a distance" A well-fed does not understand the hungry.
    3. Whatislove
      Whatislove 29 August 2020 05: 38 New
      16
      And you can't blame the young either, you can understand them
    4. Nehist
      Nehist 29 August 2020 05: 40 New
      26
      When the pension reform was adopted, someone sensibly suggested not to raise the age for residents of the north and equivalent regions. An amendment was even passed in the first reading. And then the smart ones rejected it. Here is another incentive to flee the regions. They wrote about the prices above ... In general, no one is going to develop anything. But people from the near abroad are coming here.
      1. Ragnar Lodbrok
        Ragnar Lodbrok 29 August 2020 06: 24 New
        22
        If the people were hard-working, it would be entirely hucksters and drug traffickers.
        1. nickname7
          nickname7 29 August 2020 20: 54 New
          +3
          If the people were hard-working, otherwise they were all hucksters and drug traffickers

          Several families of Old Believers from Brazil moved to the Far East, so the land was bought by someone, they could not develop, while in Brazil they were rich millionaire farmers, cultivated thousands of hectares.
          The very mentality of bureaucrats and the economy system of the Far East cannot develop and create, they can only master and cut the state budget, and into petty fraud. Apparently the decades of extinction and degradation of the region affected.
          And if things went well, then other Old Believers are ready to move, they have 7-10 children and they are strong business executives, but they are not needed.
          1. anjey
            anjey 30 August 2020 10: 24 New
            +2
            The fact of the matter is that they do not need a real owner of the land, a farmer, and such an estate, in my opinion, is capable of raising Russia to a new level, including the welfare and civic position of the people.
            1. Obliterator
              Obliterator 30 August 2020 12: 27 New
              +1
              Quote: anjey
              The fact of the matter is that they do not need a real owner of the land, a farmer, and such an estate, in my opinion, is capable of raising Russia to a new level, including the welfare and civic position of the people.

              Well, according to the logic of many brought up in owls. time, these are all vile fists with which to fight. It is not clear why, but still it is necessary. Moreover, Old Believers, especially from Brazil itself, will generally be perceived as foreigners, even their Russian language will be different.
              1. anjey
                anjey 30 August 2020 14: 14 New
                +1
                And in our time, a self-sufficient people-owner, which actually produces and manages on their land, is for some reason not profitable for many at the top ...
    5. ism_ek
      ism_ek 29 August 2020 06: 27 New
      -17
      Quote: anjey
      It was in vain that our ancestors mastered Siberia and the Far East,
      Our ancestors, for example, killed 30 fur seals in 1300000 years of the so-called development of Alaska.
      We need a comprehensive state approach for the development of these lands, which is what our leadership is doing now. Not fast, of course. Well, how else.
      1. Doctor
        Doctor 29 August 2020 09: 45 New
        -11
        Our ancestors, for example, killed 30 fur seals in 1300000 years of the so-called development of Alaska.
        We need a comprehensive state approach for the development of these lands, which is what our leadership is doing now. Not fast, of course. Well, how else.

        Ilya, such things are not perceived here, you will simply be neglected, like Greta Thunberg. wink

        Given that the above comrade is surprised:
        The forest was cut down, it ended, the fish were cut out, the rivers are empty.


        My classmate in my small homeland is also surprised when I come there:
        "Before, I could catch half a bucket of fish on a fishing rod in half a day, but now this requires 4 km of the river on oars with a net" laughing

        The inhabitants of Easter Island are no longer surprised ...

        P.S. And do not flatter yourself about the state entrance, the small chest opens with a key called "profitability".
        Kolyma gold was discovered under the tsar, but in order to dig it up profitably, it was necessary to create a slave colony.
        1. nickname7
          nickname7 29 August 2020 20: 56 New
          +2
          needed to create a slave colony.

          You've seen enough of Dudya's video, and it's a lie in the video.
          1. Doctor
            Doctor 29 August 2020 22: 11 New
            -1
            You've seen enough of Dudya's video, and it's a lie in the video.

            Can you tell me the video where to see the Kolyma truth?
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 29 August 2020 12: 14 New
        +7
        Quote: ism_ek
        Our ancestors, for example, in 30 years of the so-called development of Alaska, killed 1300000 fur seals

        And the Anglo-Saxons killed all the buffalo and almost completely exterminated the local population of North America.
        1. ism_ek
          ism_ek 29 August 2020 14: 46 New
          +2
          Quote: tihonmarine
          Anglo-Saxons killed all the buffalo

          There is a difference. The Anglo-Saxons invested the money received in their country, and did not lose in Paris casinos.
      3. IS-80_RVGK2
        IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 12: 20 New
        +7
        Really. Why hurry? All who need to live well already. And the rest don't care. It is true that the slaves have been running wild lately, rebelling about something. They do not understand their happiness to starve bones after a lordly dinner.
    6. Edward Vashchenko
      Edward Vashchenko 29 August 2020 10: 13 New
      +3
      the state and only it should develop a draft of new "Stolypin" reforms and involve industry

      So the current policy is the "Stolypin" reforms in action.
      It is not for nothing that a monument to Stolypin stands in front of the Council of Ministers.
      1. IS-80_RVGK2
        IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 12: 22 New
        +7
        That gives the state of the 21st century a fair amount of schizophrenia.
      2. Obliterator
        Obliterator 30 August 2020 12: 30 New
        +1
        Quote: Edward Vashchenko
        So the current policy is the "Stolypin" reforms in action.
        It is not for nothing that a monument to Stolypin stands in front of the Council of Ministers.

        Only the current reformers, in their personal qualities, are even close to P.A. Stolypin is not worth it. In the same way, you will not find socialists like the fathers of the Soviet state in the daytime with fire.
    7. ssergey1978
      ssergey1978 29 August 2020 14: 55 New
      0
      Do you think your Chinese friends really need DV?
      1. anjey
        anjey 29 August 2020 16: 18 New
        +4
        Raw materials of the DV. Territory for their production.
      2. nickname7
        nickname7 29 August 2020 21: 08 New
        +3
        Do you think your Chinese friends really need DV?

        If you use the method, profit for export, and not local costs, then it is needed, but it seems this method is used by oligarchs.
    8. Vadim237
      Vadim237 29 August 2020 22: 48 New
      0
      One of these new industrial facilities under construction in the Far East
      "Sibur has begun implementation of the project of the Amur Gas Chemical Complex (AGHK). In the future, until 2040, the project will increase the volume of non-resource exports of the Russian Federation by 4,6 trillion rubles.

      Investments in the construction of the Amur Gas Chemical Complex are tentatively estimated at $ 10-11 billion. The expanded configuration of the AGHK assumes a production capacity of up to 2,7 million tons of polymers per year (approximately 2,3 million tons of polyethylene and 0,4 million tons of polypropylene). The main feedstock will be ethane fraction and liquefied petroleum gases from Gazprom's Amur Gas Processing Plant (AGPP), which will be supplied in a volume of up to 3,5 million tons per year. The Amur Gas Chemical Complex itself is being built in close proximity to the Amur Gas Processing Plant under construction by Gazprom.

      The capacity of the complex is 1,35 times higher than the total volume of Russian exports of polymers in 2019. "And at least 37 more such large-scale projects in the Far East and Siberia will be implemented until 2035.
  • Pessimist22
    Pessimist22 29 August 2020 05: 22 New
    19
    Under the tsar, only peasants and artisans were sent beyond the Urals, "forever", under the communists they were voluntarily forced to work on construction sites and deposits, but they were paid more money, but now there are no fools, mineral resources and enterprises belong to oligarchs, that is, his friends, they pay no more than in the center or south, and the costs are higher, and not everyone is eager to live in harsh conditions, so the trend can only be stopped by creating conditions, otherwise the outflow of the population will continue.
    1. siberalt
      siberalt 29 August 2020 06: 23 New
      28
      Under the communists, they went to Siberia and the north to work. And now to Moscow streets to sweep, and to deliver pizza. belay
    2. HaByxoDaBHocep
      HaByxoDaBHocep 29 August 2020 07: 36 New
      14
      No one voluntarily forcibly sent, do not invent, I myself was born, grew up and live in the north of the Irkutsk region in the city of Ust-Ilimsk, my parents, like everyone else, came here to the Komsomol construction sites, built a railway, then a hydroelectric power station, timber industry complex, a city, roads, bridges, under Soviet rule, we did not feel deprived here, and the living conditions were difficult, but there was a full supply of goods for stores, and at fixed prices, who remembers there were such "belts", there were good salaries, every summer I or parents, or one went to the south for a vacation, an airport was built from which they flew throughout the country, a bunch of educational institutions, and now ..... only hydroelectric power stations and timber industry complex are working, the rest of the factories are closed, almost all collective and state farms have been liquidated, the fields are overgrown with grass and trees, prices are the same as in Moscow, planes have not flown for many years, now they have restored the runway, and then, thanks to the capitalists from St. Petersburg, who do not want to travel along the killed highway from Bratsk, there are not a single institution, there are only but a maximum of PU and colleges, almost all young people leave to study in other cities and do not return back in 1992, our population was 114 thousand in the city, now 80, I generally keep quiet about the villages and settlements of the district, for another 20 years and the city will come a kerdyk, how the forest will be mowed, there will be nothing to do here
      1. depressant
        depressant 29 August 2020 09: 08 New
        +4
        For you, colleague. For all of us...

        Over Moscow ...
        unfamiliar winds sing
        Over Moscow ...
        the clouds float like letters
        I follow your route on the map
        I'm looking for this strange word - Ust-Ilim ...

        Ust-Ilim ...
        On a distant taiga river ...
        Ust-Ilim!
        From the city lights in the distance
        Your green stars smell like pine needles
        and in an undertone
        pines read poetry ...
        Call!
        I will come through the dense taiga!
        Call !!
        I will come through a blizzard and blizzard!
        Look around! ...
        Inconspicuous taiga pine
        I've been standing behind your back for a long time ...

        Ust-Ilim ...
        Your winds are singing over Moscow
        Ust-Ilim ...
        Your winds are calling for the road!
        Ust-Ilim - two stars in the sky
        and the fire and longing in his red eyes
        Ust-Ilim ...

        Don't forget who else remembers!
        And let's sing together:
        Ust-Ilim ...
      2. d4rkmesa
        d4rkmesa 29 August 2020 10: 41 New
        +7
        Hello fellow countrymen! It has been 12 years since I left for Rostov-on-Don from Ust-Ilimsk. Institutions all ended along with demography - in the 2000s, many young people left in all directions, the baby boom generation of the 80s, and then everything, failure. Although, I spoke with the head of the Department of Informatics of KSTU (now Siberian Federal University), if desired, it was possible to keep the branch in some form. But the extreme head of the branch really wanted to move to Krasnoyarsk and work at the parent university, which he did. In general, the graduates of the branches still mostly left - they stayed, subjectively, either those who were lucky enough to get a job (some in the timber industry, only a few in the energy sector), or "troeshniks" who didn't care about their profile. Recently I was surprised - a former classmate-troeshnik in the administration is in charge of housing and communal services. On the other hand, now all the provinces are needed, others are simply not there often.
        1. ssergey1978
          ssergey1978 29 August 2020 20: 48 New
          +2
          Hello fellow countryman, I left Irkutsk for Ulyanovsk.
      3. viktor_ui
        viktor_ui 29 August 2020 13: 05 New
        +3
        Hello Vital ... and I'm from Ust-Ilimsk (an evil city for Muscovites by the standards of the 90s) drinks
    3. nickname7
      nickname7 29 August 2020 21: 05 New
      +2
      voluntarily compulsory

      These were the Komsomol construction sites people were driving because of the romance as it is sung in the song "I am going for dreams,
      Behind the fog and the smell of taiga. "

      there are no fools, subsoil and enterprises belong to oligarchs

      Here you are right, only oligarchs export money from raw materials abroad.
      This is the first measure that will prevent the degradation of the Far East, limit the withdrawal of capital from the country, and leave taxes in the region.
  • carstorm 11
    carstorm 11 29 August 2020 05: 34 New
    -11
    you will not force people to live in the Far East with any economy. all the more young. neither apartments nor salaries. save up money and leave anyway. take Krasnodar as an example. there is a bunch of people coming down from the Far East. is there a better economy or opportunities? yeah. shaz. the city has doubled in 10 years practically in terms of population. here's the migration. who does not live here does not understand the motivation of people. after all, it is not poor people who are leaving. with a good job and education. among my friends there are already hundreds of them. the reasons are banal and simple, the climate and the rhythm of life in general. everything is complicated here. to raise children . live. with humidity under 100 percent. my older daughter was just withering in summer. allergies are eternal. midges and mosquitoes. the breath was just awful. and so every year until she moved to Moscow. now all the rules. even if here now everyone will raise a salary and give a bunch of buns here they will go but for a while. call it a rotational method. units will remain permanently.
    1. Igoresha
      Igoresha 29 August 2020 09: 53 New
      -5
      everything is difficult here

      yes, right, why sit in the cold. There are empty villages in the Belgorod region, where the climate is heavenly and the land is good. Disadvantages to you, apparently, were instructed by those who believe that others should perform and endure deeds.
      1. Doctor
        Doctor 29 August 2020 22: 44 New
        -2
        There are empty villages in the Belgorod region, where the climate is heavenly and the land is good.

        It is better not to consider Belgorod in the future. Ukraine is nearby, sooner or later the hack will begin.
        For fans of the middle lane - Voronezh.
    2. Essex62
      Essex62 29 August 2020 11: 16 New
      0
      Yes, the climate in the Far East is hellish. And the midge is generally unbearable, I read it, they tied it up as punishment in the openings, in the taiga, naked. And after a short time, the person died. I experienced what it is in the Krasnoyarsk Territory, on an urgent one. Sentinels, at the post only in the mosquito nets, otherwise it will be chopped up And if you dig something, so on a damp earth, it is in the heat, in general a paragraph. We did not react to mosquitoes at all, we got used to it.
    3. vindigo
      vindigo 29 August 2020 14: 28 New
      +5
      I have no idea what people in large numbers are doing in Krasnodar. Plants (ZIP, RIP, Sedina) are destroyed. In the service sector, the salary is 25. They say that the economy is being raised, but in fact only crime is being raised.
  • avia12005
    avia12005 29 August 2020 05: 38 New
    16
    If the Constitutional Court lives in St. Petersburg, then the Russian government must live in Chita.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  • Whatislove
    Whatislove 29 August 2020 05: 40 New
    19
    The author, what you said is understandable for all more or less smart people. The authorities have a different point of view that everything is fine with us, and whoever says something else is a Ukrainian, maydanuty, an agent of the State Department, etc. Well, they called me that when I tried to explain in one group in VK that everything is not so rosy here as they say on TV.
    1. Dimy4
      Dimy4 29 August 2020 08: 57 New
      0
      The author, what you said is understandable for all less intelligent people. The authorities have a different point of view,

      Cleverly you called them durachkami wink
  • kig
    kig 29 August 2020 05: 44 New
    17
    A super-icebreaker was laid in Bolshoy Kamen at the Zvezda superplant. Have you forgotten to lay the welders?
    1. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 29 August 2020 12: 26 New
      +1
      Quote: kig
      A super-icebreaker was laid in Bolshoy Kamen at the Zvezda superplant. Have you forgotten to lay the welders?

      Let's put it simply, workers and engineers will be brought later.
  • nikolaj1703
    nikolaj1703 29 August 2020 05: 44 New
    13
    Enemies are slamming across the Moscow region, across St. Petersburg - Russia is empty, without a population. Come whoever wants - take what you want, there is no one.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 29 August 2020 22: 55 New
      -2
      Who will crash - everyone who can know that they will die first when they shoot.
  • prapor55
    prapor55 29 August 2020 06: 02 New
    +6
    Thanks to the author for the article about our dealing with the city, you could also attach a few photos for clarity. hi
  • rocket757
    rocket757 29 August 2020 06: 09 New
    -8
    Heavy topic.
    It is possible to speculate, but it is pointless.
    Urbanization, it cannot be stopped just like that.
    1. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 12: 34 New
      +2
      And why the heck stop her? Maybe we’ll curtail all scientific and technological progress at the same time? After all, urbanization is its consequence.
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 29 August 2020 13: 39 New
        +2
        Do not confuse hot and sour.
        A city, a megalopolis, as a human habitat, can exist almost by itself ... but it will be a miserable existence. For objective reasons, by the way.
        Understanding comes ... then, late, as a rule, but that is how a person is arranged, until they peck in one place, I don’t want to think about the vital ..... we prefer to soar in the clouds.
        1. IS-80_RVGK2
          IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 13: 41 New
          -3
          Is it possible more clearly? While your strange reasoning reminds the delirium of a madman.
          1. rocket757
            rocket757 29 August 2020 13: 55 New
            0
            Who, why? Apparently, it is the most, not intelligible, and they clung ...
            1. IS-80_RVGK2
              IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 14: 56 New
              -6
              Let’s sober up a little, then we’ll talk about it.
              1. Vadim237
                Vadim237 29 August 2020 23: 08 New
                0
                And the topic is such in Siberia and the Far East, never before there was a developed infrastructure, and the climatic conditions are more severe than in the European part of Russia with all the consequences for life in these parts, plus a rather highly extended logistics, it is clear why
                addiction is present
                people tend to go where it is comfortable and warm.
                1. IS-80_RVGK2
                  IS-80_RVGK2 30 August 2020 01: 37 New
                  +1
                  Who wants to look for opportunities. Who does not want to look for reasons. How are you going to control such a huge territory and with such a shitty demographic as we have? I have an idea of ​​what the socialist future of the country might look like. Do you have anything to offer other than AML, the colossal inequality of the dictatorship and the class contradictions of wars, degradation and post-apocalyptic pictures of a disfigured planet?
                  1. Vadim237
                    Vadim237 30 August 2020 14: 51 New
                    0
                    How to control such a territory - with the help of satellites of robotic systems and UAVs - they found the same problem for me, this is all the sinker that is indicated on the lower map in blue, no one will ever fucking need it, because one day it will all melt and this whole territory will turn into a giant super swamp with numerous cryovolcanoes like the Yamal funnel methane emissions into a thousandfold growth of mosquitoes and midges and a cherry on the cake ancient viruses that are now bound by this permafrost into our biosphere - the process has already begun
                    no one will live in those places where underfoot at any time such
                2. Aag
                  Aag 30 August 2020 20: 34 New
                  0
                  Quote: Vadim237
                  And the topic is such in Siberia and the Far East, never before there was a developed infrastructure, and the climatic conditions are more severe than in the European part of Russia with all the consequences for life in these parts, plus a rather highly extended logistics, it is clear why
                  addiction is present
                  people tend to go where it is comfortable and warm.

                  First, punctuation marks become unnecessary, "unprofitable", followed by territories ...
                  1. Vadim237
                    Vadim237 30 August 2020 23: 34 New
                    0
                    And in essence there is anything - besides punctuation quibbles?
                    1. Aag
                      Aag 31 August 2020 07: 41 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Vadim237
                      And in essence there is anything - besides punctuation quibbles?

                      In a sense, I see it as links of one chain ...
                      ... There are examples in the world when people out of necessity "improved" and not such territories. The article says that in the discussed regions industry, agriculture, acceptable living conditions were created with sweat and blood. And suddenly, everything became unnecessary, unprofitable .Of course! Logistics! If hydrocarbons are pumped here, processed at the western petrochemical complexes, then we get diesel fuel at 50 r / l. Those living near the gas pipelines were allowed to collect deadwood ... Good! then by trucks to the Russian regions bordering on that same China ...
                      1. Vadim237
                        Vadim237 31 August 2020 18: 46 New
                        0
                        .. There are examples in the world when people out of necessity "improved" and not such territories. Examples of not such territories landscaped in a studio just do not give as an example Canada, the USA with Alaska and Greenland in Canada, the entire population in the southern part of the country is clustered in Alaska with an area of ​​almost 2 million square kilometers, only 790000 people live Greenland The Gulf Stream heats up - in Siberia and in the Far in the east, they are already building infrastructure and industry, as well as developing agriculture not as quickly as we would like, but still there is no complete stagnation Zvezda Shipyard Amur Gas Processing Plant Amur Gas Chemical Complex ZapSib Neftekhim construction of a bridge across Lena to Yakutsk, the same bridge to Magadan, by the way, the entire railway infrastructure the tracks there have already been converted to the Russian gauge standard are now discussing the construction of a road to Magadan now Rosatom is creating a project for the construction of a new plant on the basis of the former Khimprom in the notorious Usolye Sibirskoye after everything is cleaned up and removed there and many other projects - and what the Chinese are bringing from us open market they are goods to us we do not m to other countries, and the territory is huge from expensive and complex logistics in Russia.
                      2. Aag
                        Aag 31 August 2020 19: 44 New
                        0
                        Vadim237, do you understand that it is difficult to communicate with you? I, for now, again, not about the essence of the dialogue, but about your disregard for grammar. It is "technically" problematic to understand what you wanted to express. True, I am more interested in the essence than the form ... I will try to answer what I understood (guessed) ...
                        In terms of the scale (area of ​​territories) there are NO analogues in the world! On the other hand, there are countries in which some issues of life support are much more acute because of the limited territories! Agree, large areas, a variety of climatic zones, etc. etc., can be both a plus and a minus in development. Lyubom. It depends, IMHO, on the approach.
                        Examples "in the studio": Venice; artificial islands in Dubai, China, Japan ...; the most powerful desalination plants in Saudi Arabia, Israel, Malaysia.; States, most of which are below sea level ... Note, Canada did not mention) ))). And also Finland! (The ban on the use of studded tires, the illumination of seemingly deserted highways, "overpasses" in the places of reindeer migration ...)
                        "... in Siberia and the Far East, they are already building infrastructure and industry, as well as developing agriculture not as quickly as we would like, but still ..."
                        Where did you get this from? WHO is engaged ?! For the Far East people have already written .. I have not been, I don’t know. But friends, acquaintances, write (Sakhalin, Vladik), - unfortunately, everything is drawn to the bitter truth.
                      3. Vadim237
                        Vadim237 1 September 2020 15: 54 New
                        0
                        "You ... where did you get it" I saw with my own eyes. "Examples" in the studio ": Venice; artificial islands in Dubai, China, Japan ...; the most powerful desalination plants in Saudi Arabia, Israel, Malaysia.; States, most of which are located below sea level ..." There are no permafrost and such climatic contrasts as in Russia - there is no point in comparing them with them at all.
                    2. Aag
                      Aag 31 August 2020 20: 39 New
                      +1
                      Vadim, optimism and idiocy are not the same thing!
                      You can chant slogans to me from the leading media channels, report successes ... (Right now, Vesti FM is on the radio). What I see around me (Irkutsk) does not fit !!!
                      Usolye-Sibirskoye? Have you heard the figures announced by the media? Exceeding the MPC for mercury by 35 thousand (!) Times in water. In the air, -3 "kopecks" thousand. I could be wrong with tenths (thousand), but not with the order. It was announced in the media. And this is ten years after the closure of the plant! Before that, did you ignore the reports of doctors, GO, RKhBZ? Take an interest in the activities of "Radon" near Angarsk (disposal of nuclear waste, including from Europe). Look at the amount of nuclear weapons in the Irkutsk region.
                      You mentioned Lena ... There was a town of Kachug on this river. Now there was a working village ... There was a shipyard. They built icebreakers! They went north on their own along the Yenessey River. Now, depending on the season, you can't go by motorboat! Aero boat only. Northern delivery. Several seasons broke down, - the barge does not work. And what, someone did not know that if people were deprived of work, they would do anything! And the forest was chopped down, and the pontoon bridges were handed over for metal. As a result, Lena became shallow ... People I got sick, - for the sake of "dear guests" I am ready to sell my small homeland. The guests, as a rule, are from the capital, departmental ... And you can understand people (see the title of the article) ...
                      Vadim237, you are on the site for more than mine, at least for registration. I think you can appreciate the changes (IMHO, not positive in the majority), and, a serious split in society. This is already alarming ... Everything, I have lagged behind, the topic is different st hi atya ...
                    3. Vadim237
                      Vadim237 1 September 2020 16: 01 New
                      0
                      Usolye-Sibirskoye? Have you heard the figures announced by the media? Exceeding the MPC for mercury by 35 thousand (!) Times in water. In the air, -3 "kopecks" thousand. I could be wrong with tenths (thousand), but not with the order. It was announced in the media. And this is ten years after the closure of the plant! Before that, did you ignore the reports of doctors, GO, RKhBZ? Take an interest in the activities of "Radon" near the city of Angarsk (disposal of nuclear waste, including from Europe). Look at the amount of nuclear weapons in the Irkutsk region. All this is now solvable and the equipment is there, and people who will be engaged in cleaning all this and will now more or less carefully deal with nuclear waste, processing it into new materials and fuel, of course, the tails remain, but in the future they will learn to process them. And the fact that Lena has become shallow is due to nature and weather conditions this year a lot of things have become shallow.
                    4. Aag
                      Aag 1 September 2020 18: 07 New
                      0
                      If we are talking about the outflow of the population, then people want to live in acceptable conditions today, now, and not when everything is working out. And when there is no visible progress in a positive direction, we have what we have.
                      "... And the fact that Lena has become shallow is due to nature and weather conditions this year a lot of things have gone shallow."
                      It's not about the last year, but the reason is deforestation ...
  • KCA
    KCA 29 August 2020 06: 10 New
    +8
    This is not only a problem of Russia with its "anti-popular greedy stupid, etc. regime" (if you wish, you can add your own epithets), look at the population density in the PRC, Canada, the USA, and other large countries, in the PRC on the east coast not even on they live on each other's heads, but on the heads of those who are on the heads of others, who are on the heads of others, and in the northwest, if you land from a helicopter at an arbitrary point, it is not a fact that you will meet people alive
    1. ism_ek
      ism_ek 29 August 2020 06: 32 New
      +3
      There are also population problems in the northern provinces of China. People are specially paid extra so that they do not leave the Chinese hinterland.
      1. depressant
        depressant 29 August 2020 09: 31 New
        +7
        Moreover, now a program is being developed in China - something like "Mastering the West". But not the West in our understanding, but a program for the development of the desert western regions of China itself. And after all, they will develop and master, build factories, factories, cities, create a suitable habitat, and ultimately settle in. The will and labor of man are wondrous divas create. The main thing is an iron will. Plus the state system.
        Where is the iron for the will of our state? As you think about it, you are immersed in the stinking stream of his lazy and fearful lack of will, his glance at the West - “whatever happens,” in his futile efforts to preserve the stability of the unstable shaky state structure called the “Power Vertical”. And she, the structure, is rotten through and through. Every day, someone is grabbed, jailed, and in place of those who have dropped out, they are replaced by the same - there are no others! They are also useful in doing so.
        And the people here - "North ... Far East ..."
        1. rocket757
          rocket757 29 August 2020 13: 59 New
          +2
          In China, some programs have stalled ... there are objective reasons for this.
          They, of course, are determined to play for a long time, but right now they are greatly undercut by external factors.
      2. krillon
        krillon 30 August 2020 00: 14 New
        +1
        There cities are being built for resettlement, google, they stand empty, waiting for residents.
  • Iskazi
    Iskazi 29 August 2020 06: 11 New
    +8
    sad picture ..., in reality it is even worse, the American and Canadian experience is highly doubtful, the author is right. The problem of developing and living not only in Siberia and the Far East, but in the non-black earth and beyond everywhere is very relevant, but this is not only a Russian problem ... unfortunately the bearded classics turned out to be right in some ways ..., the concentration of finance and production and the corresponding infrastructure - disables vast territories and not only in Russia, on the one hand it is a natural process - living in comfort is pleasant, on the other hand it is fraught, covid evidence of this ... for the purpose of enrichment, but after all, someone went there for the sake of will and freedom, the author raised many problems ..., however, a large anus loomed on the horizon, and unfortunately these problems within the framework of the existing system are insoluble.
    1. depressant
      depressant 29 August 2020 09: 47 New
      +8
      Do you remember?

      ... Airplanes rush above the clouds,
      They rush, a little like big eagles,
      They rush over you, and you know, dear,
      Fly to us in Taezhny for several hours!

      There was something spilled in the air that penetrated even the most remote corners of the Motherland and formed a BIG GURT.
      An impulse to go somewhere, it is useful and joyful to invest in the work of the country with your work, to connect your future with what is being created ...
      And settlements, cities, airfields, ports, industry appeared in the most inaccessible geographical places - a young impulse of the victorious country for a future in which apple trees were supposed to bloom on Mars ...
      Gloomy, cold triumph of dough, the Epoch of the Big Hapka does not need impulses. She only needs that she is herself with the addition of a small number of servants, which must be digitized and generally replaced with robotics. The layer of the state completely separated from the layer of the people, only in words denoting unity.
  • Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx 29 August 2020 06: 33 New
    14
    Problems in Siberia and the Far East are over the roof.
    The main one is that all enterprises and industries do not belong to the residents of the region, and profits and taxes go to Moscow, where these 12 678 079 people “fast and vegetate”. I will no longer offer solutions to problems, I just do not understand WHERE IS IT FROM?
    In general, the population of Chukotka has decreased by more than three times! From 164 thousand people to 51 thousand people! This is about the loss of Belarus in the Great Patriotic War!

    What did you mean? Losses of Belarusian servicemen alone amounted to 252 people.
    According to the census data, the population of Belarus in 1941 was 9 092 000 people, and in the nearest post-war count in 1950 - 7 709 000 people.
    I live in Kemerovo. There are problems in the region. Home, as I said, nothing belongs to the people in Kuzbass. Everything was overbought (even I know how, at what prices and in exchange for what positions) by representatives of different "business unions". The ruined ecology, neglected (in the sense of neglect and ruin) production, the extinction of the population are the main troubles of the region.
    I will not deny that recently Kemerovo has begun to pay more attention to the improvement of the city, in particular, the repair of sidewalks and roads. But only ...
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 29 August 2020 06: 49 New
      +5
      Quote: ROSS 42
      From 164 thousand people to 51 thousand people! This is about the loss of Belarus in the Great Patriotic War!

      What did you mean?

      It is believed that Belarus lost about a third of its population in the Second World War.
      1. Errr
        Errr 29 August 2020 10: 19 New
        +3
        Quote: mordvin xnumx
        It is believed that Belarus lost about a third of its population in the Second World War.
        Just remember the song "Pesnyarov" "Every fourth", ending with the words:
        The sound of this song, a sad song
        Forever with me, forever in me.
        Every fourth of Belarusians
        Every fourth fell in the war.
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 29 August 2020 11: 19 New
          +4
          Quote: Herrr
          Every fourth of Belarusians
          Every fourth fell in the war.

          Rastorguev also sings about the Race from the Volga to the Yenisei and Catherine and Alaska.
    2. Tatyana Pershina
      Tatyana Pershina 29 August 2020 08: 15 New
      +6
      Quote: ROSS 42
      From 164 thousand people to 51 thousand people! This is about the loss of Belarus in the Great Patriotic War!

      The author either expressed it incorrectly or wanted to confuse the reader. It meant that every third inhabitant was gone, as in Belarus after the Second World War. In terms of this, of course, Belarus lost about 3 million people.
    3. Pilat2009
      Pilat2009 29 August 2020 10: 11 New
      +1
      Quote: ROSS 42
      the population of Belarus in 1941 was 9 people, and in the nearest post-war count in 092 - 000 people.

      Only Belarusians lived in Belarus?
      1. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 29 August 2020 12: 36 New
        +4
        Quote: Pilat2009
        Only Belarusians lived in Belarus?

        Then a counter question: "Didn't Belarusians live in other republics of the USSR?"
        I focused the attention of the author so that he expressed his thoughts more clearly, and in addition, users:
        Mordvin 3 (Vladimir), Errr and Tatiana Pershina (Barracuda) have already given explanations ...
        yes
    4. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 12: 45 New
      +5
      Capitalists, especially pro-government prostitutes, love these stories about how everything has become prettier. Here are just stories about where it got sick and where it could be better, they do not like at all, right to hysteria.
  • Andrey Posietsev
    Andrey Posietsev 29 August 2020 06: 48 New
    30
    As a resident of the Far East, I will say that the author is absolutely right. But he writes somehow gently. We have long been talking about evacuation rather than migration. And of course, don't believe a word from the authorities. If any "megaprojects" are being built here, then only guest workers work there, and any bosses (starting from the lowest "bosses") are completely imported. For a year, two, three ... Like, such a business trip. Many come without families (apparently, they feel sorry for their wives and children). No one will ever hire a local specialist. Only blat! FEFU somehow opened a specialty related to oil production, so none of the graduates could get a job in the specialty. And even if they hire locals, their salaries are set at the level of Ryazan and Tula. Like, province. And the fact that prices here are 2-3 times higher than in Moscow does not bother anyone. Such mega-enterprises also transfer taxes entirely to Moscow, where the profits also go. No bonuses, no 13 salaries ... Business is simply killed by tariffs and goes bankrupt after the attacks of hungry security officials who are trying to somehow prove themselves, so that they are noticed and transferred to work outside the Urals. Sucked out of the finger cases - all the time. In Vladivostok, from each ruble of taxes collected here, only 9 kopecks remain in the city budget! The rest is confiscated directly to Moscow or distributed throughout the region to maintain villages and villages, in which 10-100 people still live. Even the capital of the region is in convulsions. It is almost impossible to fly to Moscow - 70, 10, 240 thousand for a ticket in high season. Don't believe in the benefit tales. They are only for children and seniors. And there are so few of them that people have to stand in lines for days. Burning fires (XXI century!), There are even fights. It is clear that this case was immediately overgrown with corruption. Schemes, schematics, envelopes ... But you have to fly. With reports - only to Moscow. For approval - only to Moscow. To be treated - only to Moscow. "DV hectare" was recruited mainly by residents of the center of the country. Yes, they abandoned it, because it is even impossible to get here. Local people just twist their fingers at their temples when they say about the Far East hectare. Around there is a huge wasteland - plant what you want. Nobody will notice. TOP and Free port is used only for washing headstock. In the lists of residents you can find cafes, packers of nuts, a diaper manufacturer ... But you will not find factories there. And at this time, huge megalopolises are literally growing across the Amur. For China, this is the north, therefore, Beijing gives both people and businesses huge benefits in all positions. I think it’s too late to do something. Therefore, the rest are learning Chinese on the sly. The language of a country where the authorities think about people!
    1. portnoy
      portnoy 29 August 2020 07: 34 New
      16
      I will support Andrey, I myself was born here from Khabarovsk, almost all my friends were leaving, I don’t want to leave, I’m holding on, but I understand that the current government of the Far East does not need it, my grandfather came to the Far East from Penza after the war, since it was better housing here, the salary was like this that they were considered rich when they came to Penza on vacation, but now ... we get a penny and at such prices the family needs to be fed somehow, there is no intelligible state policy in the Far East and no one needs it, they only export from here, salmon in Moscow stores cheaper than in Khabarovsk how to explain it?
      1. kepmor
        kepmor 29 August 2020 07: 55 New
        19
        After listening to the Far Easterners, the famous saying somehow naturally comes to mind ... to burn Moscow in order to save Russia ...
        maybe this is really a panacea ??? ...)))))
        1. Husit
          Husit 29 August 2020 08: 55 New
          -4
          Quote: kepmor
          After listening to the Far Easterners, the famous saying somehow naturally comes to mind ... to burn Moscow in order to save Russia ...
          maybe this is really a panacea ??? ...)))))

          And you are not alone .. Moscow is now a kind of Babylon and a pump of resources .. How many human destinies it has broken from the provinces .. We will see films about "beautiful life" and the rod goes there in whole echelons .. And they return with empty eyes and broken souls when they see everything is really .. "Our media" will ruin Russia completely.
        2. IS-80_RVGK2
          IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 12: 51 New
          +6
          No, not a panacea. In Moscow, too, the majority does not earn billions or even millions. And the system is such that even if you burn Moscow, then one fig will be St. Petersburg, Kazan, Novosibirsk, Rostov-on-Don, any other city in return. If you want to change something, change the system.
        3. Iskazi
          Iskazi 29 August 2020 15: 05 New
          +1
          an extremely accurate remark ..., Moscow is a cancerous tumor on the body of Russia. The country needs not reforms, but revolution ... and real independence. Unfortunately, the policy pursued by the Kremlin is flawed ..., within the framework of the modern model of the economy and social structure, the problems of Russia are insoluble
      2. depressant
        depressant 29 August 2020 10: 10 New
        +8
        Colleagues Andrey Posietsev and portnoy - thank you! These are exactly the comments that I have been waiting for - from the inhabitants of the Far East, with which I have unforgettable and enthusiastic childhood experiences. But a warm sadness about times gone by is replaced by anger. We are continuously lied to about the titanic efforts being made to revive the Far East. But it is already finally clear that efforts degenerate only into the allocation of a certain amount of dough, the mechanism of transferring which to offshore has long been mastered and impeccably honed. That is how it ends, leaving behind abandoned Far Eastern hectares and rare inefficient production facilities as a token of the spent "efforts" ...
        But here, they tell me, here's a video, look how the Far East blossomed! It blossomed ... Only at the same time, as colleagues rightly note, for some reason they forget to move the camera towards China.
  • A. Privalov
    A. Privalov 29 August 2020 06: 51 New
    +5
    The author is Omsk. It is clear. I had to visit those places at the very beginning of the 80s. CHP-5 still smokes? We put a big turbine there ...
    The city was peculiar in those years. Concerned by some. The business trip was somehow not comfortable there. I can not explain. The summer was good. In the fall, I went to the academy several times ...
  • From Tomsk
    From Tomsk 29 August 2020 07: 12 New
    19
    The Tomsk region has been transferring to the budget of the Russian Federation for more than one year as much as the Omsk, Novosibirsk, Kemerovo (regions), the Republic of Altai and the Altai Territory combined. And in return we received decommissioned trams from Moscow. Everyone knows that the Tomsk governor Zhvachkin actually lives in the Krasnodar Territory, and comes to Tomsk, like many officials, on a "rotational basis". And then these people somewhere in a Moscow tavern talk about patriotism. The news about how the Tomsk forest was sold to the Chinese for a penny was even on the central canals. The price tag for everything horse, starting with products and ending with housing. To make money you need a car, and an SUV, since instead of roads, one direction, the suspension has long become a consumable. In Tomsk at night, the silence is like in a village, because all the factories were destroyed. That's all development.
    1. Aleksandr1971
      Aleksandr1971 29 August 2020 11: 35 New
      +4
      It's just that oil is being produced in the Tomsk region. And there is no oil in the other regions you named. However, this is not an excuse for the ruminant.
    2. Antonio_Mariarti
      Antonio_Mariarti 29 August 2020 13: 08 New
      -2
      Tomsk is made a student city, not an industrial one. The project is a large university confirmation of this, but the rest of the city is true.
  • Archon
    Archon 29 August 2020 07: 16 New
    13
    Yes, in the coming years I am going to move to the west, maybe to Novorossiysk. I don't want to go to Moscow, as there is no sea there and the city is too huge. But I am also considering working in Moscow.
    My salary is 30tr, and renting a hotel in Vladivostok costs 15-17tr. He left science due to poor funding, lack of instruments and reagents. Almost all of the relatives have already moved west.
    1. HaByxoDaBHocep
      HaByxoDaBHocep 29 August 2020 07: 43 New
      +1
      I would also dump where it is warm, but my parents are old, I have a pension of 28 thousand, somewhere in the Kuban I can live without working)
      1. aglet
        aglet 29 August 2020 08: 22 New
        +2
        "I have a pension of 28 thousand, somewhere in the Kuban I can live without working)"
        you cannot live on the Kuban on this money, you can only exist. the prices there are also horse
        1. aglet
          aglet 29 August 2020 14: 17 New
          +3
          Here are the chmens that they gave me cons, it's just interesting, do you live in the Kuban, and you know that prices are low there, practically, like in Moscow, or do you think, not knowing that it is cheaper to live in the Kuban?
          1. vindigo
            vindigo 29 August 2020 15: 17 New
            +1
            I compared the price of gasoline with a friend from Omsk. For some reason, gasoline is more expensive in the Krasnodar Territory.
          2. Mordvin 3
            Mordvin 3 29 August 2020 22: 01 New
            0
            Quote: aglet
            these are the chmens that they gave me cons, just wondering, you live in the kuban,

            I have set. My uncle, who retired at 19 thousand, lived there quietly, about three years ago he left there because there are a lot of non-Russians.
            1. aglet
              aglet 30 August 2020 08: 38 New
              0
              "my uncle retired at 19 thousand. He lived there quietly,"
              Explain, please, that, according to your uncle's words (see, again from other people's words, and not your personal impressions), it means "to live in peace"? and where exactly did he "live quietly"? somewhere in a village of a dozen houses?
              1. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 30 August 2020 08: 51 New
                +1
                Quote: aglet
                Explain, please, that, according to your uncle's words (see, again from other people's words, and not your personal impressions), it means "to live in peace"?

                Didn't starve. There was enough for a communal apartment, clothes, equipment.
                Quote: aglet
                somewhere in a village of a dozen houses?

                Some kind of village.
                What does it mean
                Quote: aglet
                "I have a pension of 28 thousand, somewhere in the Kuban I can live without working)"
                you cannot live on the Kuban on this money, you can only exist.
                ?
                Below they write:
                Quote: vindigo
                Don't count on big salaries in Novorossiysk. Likewise, 25-30. Something serious needs a pull.

                Here, in the Tula region, this is considered a decent salary with the same minimum wage as in the Kuban. And a pension of 20 tons. - very good.
          3. Cyril G ...
            Cyril G ... 30 August 2020 22: 29 New
            0
            Quote: aglet
            you live in the kuban, and you know that prices are low there,


            I live in Temryuk. I did not put a minus. And you haven't seen the horse prices.
            1. aglet
              aglet 31 August 2020 08: 45 New
              0
              "I live in Temryuk."
              oh yes, temryuk. I forgot, there is still bread for 20 kopecks, and gasoline for 40 kopecks. I just don’t remember how much meat is in the store? and fish?
              1. Cyril G ...
                Cyril G ... 31 August 2020 09: 54 New
                0
                My dear friend came from Kamchatka a few years ago. In my opinion, prices are quite low, and bread costs around 30 rubles, sour cream - 40-50 rubles. bank, and the rest I do not know like that. The wife goes to the store. I firmly know how much beer only costs drinks
      2. vindigo
        vindigo 29 August 2020 14: 59 New
        0
        you are cruelly mistaken
    2. vindigo
      vindigo 29 August 2020 14: 58 New
      +5
      Don't count on big salaries in Novorossiysk. Likewise, 25-30. Something serious needs a pull. And by themselves, there are not very many vacancies. Unless of course you are applying for an unskilled job. And you will get tired of the sea in a couple of years, you won't even go swimming. Yes. Do you know that in Novorossiysk water is given for 2-3 hours in the morning and evening? Sometimes she is gone for several days. There are also frequent blackouts with electricity, sometimes half the city sits without electricity for several days. Especially in summer it is pleasant.
  • demo
    demo 29 August 2020 07: 28 New
    10
    Dear Mr. Staver.
    And let me send you my new article.
    Place it on the site?
    And you will no longer ask questions in the form of a "voice crying in the wilderness"!
    Otherwise you, or someone on your behalf, refused to publish my articles!
    Do not be silent. Answer.
    1. depressant
      depressant 29 August 2020 10: 42 New
      +9
      I join the colleague demo requirement!
      I have no doubt that his article will be uplifting. And then my spirit has fallen, lies, does not breathe. I got confused to go through the articles of the Author "Made with us" and give him pluses. It's all about the fact that 188 new enterprises were built, and Power Machines created a turbine of high power, and someone else built a plant for the production of engines, and someone else - screwdrivers and other useful iron. And so - in a circle, constantly bumping into what has already been read, in different versions. And involuntarily I begin to look closely: this new enterprise has only 25 jobs, this is 24 (workshops, or what?), And the like. And all - with foreign participation, the localization is zilch, it is not there, they will be subject to sanctions, the project will be canceled, and they will leave. And the turbine of enormous power - only one and on testing, and Simmens did not want to localize and not because of the Crimea, but because of, as her employees put it, the strange behavior of Russian colleagues (corruption or deception?). And we need those turbines - the sea and even the ocean, the country is cold, heating is everything.
      Let a colleague demo tell me how narrow my mind is.
      1. Iskazi
        Iskazi 29 August 2020 15: 13 New
        0
        25 people at the plant are already a lot, times are like that ... automation, and corruption is the scourge of the country ..., as well as the wrong people in power ... and the power is wrong.
      2. Nehist
        Nehist 29 August 2020 16: 27 New
        +4
        then I remembered why the Chinese refused to conduct the rasschet in national currencies !!! We looked at how the ruble was in a fever and told the nafig people such happiness ...
  • parusnik
    parusnik 29 August 2020 07: 40 New
    10
    The author, yes you are all lying ... Here you are, the last interview of the President, in principle, everything is fine in the country, it is developing by leaps and bounds, but there are some shortcomings, but they are surmountable. Powerful federal programs have been launched. A year or two and a bright future will come, which will become lighter than the present. smile PySy ... Here we have in the Krasnodar Territory, a small-town "ministry" of culture, made a voyage to regional cultural objects - DC, she was not interested in the miserable wages of workers, lack of funds for cultural events, the condition of the premises, etc. the main thing is the fight against covid with all the consequences ... masks, equipment, more than three not to gather at events ... The main thing is people's health .... Yes, at the same time she demanded a lot to acquire ... to fight for health ..
    1. 41st region
      41st region 29 August 2020 08: 17 New
      +9
      Daush. People are fleeing from here. Basically, really in the "rubber" cities: Krasnodar, St. Petersburg, Moscow.
      But that's okay. The climate will change and we will have bananas growing. laughing Then we will heal.
      And so, yes, the prime minister of the Russian land, as he visited our regional hospital, so they say, shouted: "Let me out of here!" lol
      1. aglet
        aglet 29 August 2020 14: 23 New
        +3
        "Daush. People are fleeing from here. Basically, really in the" rubber "cities: Krasnodar, St. Petersburg, Moscow."
        about the rubber Krasnodar. there is not only no work, but there is also a climate in no arc. in summer up to +45, eimo up to -25, plus wind, up to 30 m
        1. Nastia makarova
          Nastia makarova 31 August 2020 13: 37 New
          0
          Krasnodar is full of work
    2. andreykolesov123
      andreykolesov123 29 August 2020 09: 23 New
      +5
      Quote: parusnik
      Here we have in the Krasnodar Territory, a small-town "ministry" of culture, made a voyage to regional cultural objects - DC, she was not interested in the miserable wages of workers, lack of funds for cultural events, with

      why are you all about money, but about money as Jews. What about patriotism?
      1. parusnik
        parusnik 29 August 2020 09: 51 New
        11
        Yes, indeed, it is not patriotic to somehow disperse from their regions, here soon a bright future will come, and the people are scattering .. And is it true and why money? Money is evil, and it’s not that happiness ... At such a turning point, when we all, as one, have to work for others for free, just for food ... I came to work, you were fed and that's enough ... But the country will grow stronger ... smile
      2. Oleg Skvortsov
        Oleg Skvortsov 29 August 2020 10: 37 New
        18
        Andrey, For 1% of the country's citizens to be rich, the remaining 99% need to be patriots.
      3. IS-80_RVGK2
        IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 12: 58 New
        +4
        Quote: andreykolesov123
        What about patriotism?

        Patriotism and other braces are now for suckers, and for the right guys, Europe from Lisbon to Vladivostok and a minimum investment for maximum profit.
  • 7,62h54
    7,62h54 29 August 2020 08: 09 New
    +1
    And what will the Krasnodar Territory and other "prosperous" regions do when the flows of migrants from the Far East and Siberia run out?
    1. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 12: 59 New
      +2
      Indians and blacks can be imported. Them even to hell. Well, some Vietnamese.
    2. aglet
      aglet 29 August 2020 14: 29 New
      +3
      "And what will the Krasnodar Territory and the rest of the" prosperous "regions do when the flows of migrants from the Far East and Siberia run out?"
      in the Krasnodar Territory there is no work even for their own people, and even for migrants, especially
      1. vindigo
        vindigo 29 August 2020 15: 27 New
        +3
        It is useless to explain. They are like a flock of rams here. Every day in our urban groups in contact there are posts "We want to move to you. How are you with your salary, weather, work?" In order not to bother to paint a special picture for them every time.
        1. saygon66
          saygon66 30 August 2020 00: 04 New
          +1
          - So this is, consider, a standard form .... Even a universal one ... At least recommend it to the migration service! laughing
      2. Nastia makarova
        Nastia makarova 31 August 2020 13: 38 New
        0
        grab to lie !!! full of work
        1. saygon66
          saygon66 31 August 2020 20: 28 New
          0
          - I'm embarrassed to ask - work or earnings? These are two different categories ... smile
          1. Nastia makarova
            Nastia makarova 1 September 2020 07: 17 New
            0
            30-50 thousand, not very much, of course, but better than in other regions, and besides, there is a lot of work
            1. saygon66
              saygon66 1 September 2020 14: 33 New
              0
              - It's better than ours ... smile
          2. vindigo
            vindigo 1 September 2020 11: 34 New
            0
            There are many job offers in Krasnodar. If there are 1300 vacancies in Novorossiysk for headhunter, then in Krasnodar there are 13000.
    3. Sergej1972
      Sergej1972 30 August 2020 14: 23 New
      +1
      The population of the region is already outrageous, it is time to take restrictive measures.
  • Vitaly Tsymbal
    Vitaly Tsymbal 29 August 2020 08: 18 New
    +3
    "Oh, calm down, calm down the melancholy in my chest. This is just a song, a fairy tale ahead (!!!)" - this article caused me to feel melancholy. People "run" to where it is better, especially young people ... They run not only from Siberia, but also from the North Caucasus, from the European Sevres ... They run in search of their happiness, but it has always been that way. The author shouldn't have summarized both the Far East and Siberia. These are different regions within which there are both "oases" and "wastelands" - too huge territory .... I just want to write that the author is another "all-fairer", but this is not so. The author correctly identified the problem that while Moscow will "seem like a paradise", where "everything is close by", including "zagarnitsa", people will move to this "illusory paradise", instead of "creating paradise" themselves where you live ... The author did not touch upon one more problem emanating from our current government - this is the desire to drive everyone to megalopolises. They say this is more economically profitable and better for the people. So such a policy is being pursued, although strangers come to the lands of those who left for big cities ...
    1. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 13: 03 New
      +1
      Quote: Vitaliy Tsymbal
      The author did not touch upon another problem emanating from our current government - this is the desire to drive everyone to megalopolises. They say this is more economically profitable and better for the people. So such a policy is being pursued, although strangers come to the lands of those who left for big cities ...

      There is no need to look for conspiracies where there are none. Whether the government wants it or not, this process will continue regardless of its desire.
    2. Vadim237
      Vadim237 29 August 2020 23: 14 New
      0
      Strangers come who is - unless nature takes its own.
  • Professor
    Professor 29 August 2020 08: 22 New
    +4
    Why are young people leaving? Money comes first. Low incomes with high costs. A young specialist receives a salary sometimes several times less than in Moscow. At the same time, the costs, especially in winter, are significantly higher. Further - a cold unfavorable climate. Everything is clear here. When the December rain in Moscow is shown on the TV screen, and it is below minus thirty outside your window, you involuntarily think about the climate.

    Young people are very concerned about the problem of poor ecology. It is no secret that in most Siberian cities there are quite serious industries, which, to put it mildly, do not improve the ecological situation in cities. Oncological diseases, lung diseases, etc. are almost the norm for Siberia. As well as periodic exceeding of the maximum permissible emission standards. For example, I no longer even pay attention to the sometimes swirling air, but the newlyweds, who recently had a child, pay attention to ...

    There are also social problems.

    One-to-one reasons for those leaving the Russian Federation:
    Better living conditions, wellbeing abroad
    Unstable economic situation in Russia
    Desire to provide children with a dignified and secure future
    Lack of protection in Russia from the arbitrariness of the authorities, officials
    Possibility of getting better quality medical services abroad
    Lack of opportunities for professional growth in Russia
    Crime, terrorism, threat to life in Russia
    Family circumstances
    Feeling that most people around you do not share your values


    As you can see, the problem of migration is more global and is not limited to Siberia or the Far East. Everyone wants a "better life". Someone goes to Moscow, and someone is already further from Moscow. This is a normal process. The danger for the Russian Federation in two points:
    1. Young Russians are more likely to emigrate. The largest number of immigrants is among people between the ages of 20 and 34. At the same time, the youngest are chosen by foreign countries - people from 20 to 24 years go there. In the CIS countries are most often sent to those for 30.

    2. Russians do not create communities and dissolve among the locals already in the second generation.

    PS
    Emigration from Russia by region
    1. Igoresha
      Igoresha 29 August 2020 09: 43 New
      +7
      2. Russians do not create communities
      my friend from sunny Finland confirms. Having moved there with my daughter from Estonia, she received social housing in a purely Finnish region, at first she even regretted a little that she was not in the Russian quarter, until she was convinced that the Russians who had arrived earlier did not welcome the arrival of new arrivals, to put it mildly. At the forum there, a woman asked how to come to Finland for permanent residence, instead of help she received a stream of abuse - they say, sit in Russia, there is nothing to open ort to our Finnish social network
  • 7,62h54
    7,62h54 29 August 2020 08: 24 New
    +3
    After all that I have read, "Deputy Nalivkin" seems to be the most sane official.
  • And why do you need
    And why do you need 29 August 2020 08: 25 New
    +3
    A huge plus for the author, everything is correct.
  • Husit
    Husit 29 August 2020 08: 38 New
    0
    While on TV they will advertise "beautiful life" in megalopolises, etc. Russia will become empty ..
    During the Soviet era, there was a cult of the working class, builders, conquerors of Siberia, young people rushed to all-Union construction sites and not for money, but for Romance (now it is like a dirty word among young people) .. Remember BAM, geological expeditions .. and so on.
    Here is a good song and it touches the strings of the soul ..
    1. parusnik
      parusnik 29 August 2020 09: 56 New
      11
      Our oligarchs sing this song at parties abroad ... According to the text, everything fits together about the alarming distance, and about storms and everything else ... laughing
      1. Husit
        Husit 29 August 2020 10: 25 New
        +1
        Quote: parusnik
        Our oligarchs sing this song at parties abroad ... According to the text, everything fits together about the alarming distance, and about storms and everything else ... laughing

        They miss Romance and the hardships of life .. laughing Vaughn Berezovsky even hanged himself from longing for Russia in London .. bully
        But seriously, this song very well describes the Russian soul rushing about and demanding space and great goals .. We are not stupid consumers and we are not used to walking around the shops for sales .. The soul is yearning, and especially when every libbery spits at it, etc. .And I want so much already in my old age, but RAPE for a breakthrough with a saber bald. soldier
  • Captivity
    Captivity 29 August 2020 08: 58 New
    +8
    Taxes should be reduced for Siberians. Or they can be canceled altogether by the inhabitants of the Trans-Urals. It is necessary to interest the population to stay and live there. And businessmen will become more interested. Otherwise, China will take a bite. A holy place is never empty.
    1. Aleksandr1971
      Aleksandr1971 29 August 2020 11: 33 New
      +1
      Probably for residents and legal entities of Siberia and the Far East, it is necessary to abolish ALL taxes and fees, except for those related to the extraction of minerals.
      But this is not enough to keep the region attractive to people. After all, the majority do not pay taxes anyway, being in the "gray zone".
  • Million
    Million 29 August 2020 09: 01 New
    10
    With the Putin and the Chubais, we can lose these territories altogether, not immediately, but gradually.
  • sergo1914
    sergo1914 29 August 2020 09: 16 New
    +7
    The plan is as follows. Collect the Duma and the Federal Assembly. Divide everyone according to the principle of a girl-boy (some will resist, then handcuff them in pairs). Divide the territory by hectare. Fence with a thorn around the perimeter. Give a saw, an ax, and a bowler to each pair. Leave for 20 years. All.
  • Igoresha
    Igoresha 29 August 2020 09: 33 New
    +2
    good article, sad from the realization of hopelessness
    Donetsk woman's view of the Far East
    https://www.politnavigator.net/iz-donbassa-v-khabarovsk-chem-nedovolen-dalnijj-vostok.html
  • Sancho_SP
    Sancho_SP 29 August 2020 09: 36 New
    +4
    There is a lot of scribble, but the answer is simple: today's outflow of the population from the Urals is a consequence of the breakdown and restructuring of the Soviet economic model.

    There will be enough population there, which will be necessary to fulfill the economic tasks of the region. But what we are going to do there is an open question.
    1. Aleksandr1971
      Aleksandr1971 29 August 2020 11: 30 New
      0
      I absolutely agree.
      But the only question of what to do is not just open, but extremely difficult, requiring a comprehensive study at the Government level.
      1. Sancho_SP
        Sancho_SP 30 August 2020 10: 42 New
        0
        And in this matter one can think of sedition: are these territories needed at all ... In the current government they can definitely.
  • nikvic46
    nikvic46 29 August 2020 09: 42 New
    +6
    Under the Soviet Union, there was an opportunity to make big money in the North and remote regions. The northern surcharge on food was trivial. But there was no shortage of food. Now everything has changed. Home-grown leaders survive under various pretexts. Only something will be restored to its place from And the former leader knew the needs of the people well. Here we have a new mayor in Samara (it was a long time ago) and immediately reduced utilities (price) by as much as 50%. For us he was the best mayor. And no one was interested in his personal life. .Then other leaders came and explained - it is impossible to live like this. And why?
    1. Aleksandr1971
      Aleksandr1971 29 August 2020 11: 29 New
      +2
      I wonder how it was possible to reduce the communal flat? If at the expense of trying to reason with the poor management companies - then honor and praise! And if the communal flat was reduced at the expense of city subsidies, then this is stupid.
      But the main thing that makes the city attractive is not the size of the communal apartment, but the amount of income. Has your mayor in Samara done something to increase the income of the population?
      1. nikvic46
        nikvic46 29 August 2020 15: 48 New
        +1
        Alexander: Do you really think that a communal apartment is calculated one to one. The fact that we lived with a lowered price for a communal apartment suggests that we are being badly ripped off.
    2. sniperino
      sniperino 29 August 2020 11: 55 New
      0
      Quote: nikvic46
      Here we have a new mayor in Samara (it was a long time ago) and immediately reduced utilities (price) by as much as 50%.
      Intrigued. Could you name the mayor, who is fondly remembered by the residents of the city? Could it be that Sysuev, during the hyperinflation of the 90s, turned this PR campaign and immediately flew to Moscow as Deputy Prime Minister for Social Affairs?
      1. nikvic46
        nikvic46 29 August 2020 15: 45 New
        +1
        Sysuev did not fly to Moscow. He was slandered, and after him came a thief in law.
        1. sniperino
          sniperino 29 August 2020 17: 31 New
          +1
          Quote: nikvic46
          Sysuev did not fly to Moscow. He was slandered
          They also immediately went to Moscow: on December 31.12.91, 01.04.97, by the decree of the President of the Russian Federation, Oleg Sysuev, secretary of the party committee of the Kuibyshev united air squadron (for some special merits) was appointed head of the administration of the city of Samara; 1998/1999/1999 dismissed from the post of the head of the city in connection with the appointment to the Government of the Russian Federation (maybe, did not fly away, but took away with baggage speed, I do not know), where a month and a half later he became Deputy Prime Minister. From September XNUMX to June XNUMX he worked as First Deputy Head of the Presidential Administration of the Russian Federation, and in July XNUMX he became First Deputy Chairman of the Board of Alfa-Bank.
          Being honest is beneficial. Alfa Bank
          Concurrently, he is a member of the advisory board of LLC MC Rosvodokanal (probably passing on the experience of reducing water tariffs).
  • Alexy
    Alexy 29 August 2020 09: 46 New
    +8
    Young people leave for a better life from everywhere and from the south too. And our country is poor, not rich.
    1. Aleksandr1971
      Aleksandr1971 29 August 2020 11: 26 New
      +5
      As a rule, rich countries are those where there are no natural resources (except for the countries of the Persian Gulf).
      1. Vadim237
        Vadim237 29 August 2020 23: 17 New
        -2
        And a small population as well as favorable climatic conditions.
      2. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 30 August 2020 14: 29 New
        +1
        The United States has huge natural resources, and so does Canada.
  • Leha667
    Leha667 29 August 2020 10: 35 New
    +3
    Correct and necessary topic.
    To the author plus.
    It is a pity that they will not publish this in a Russian newspaper ...
  • 1536
    1536 29 August 2020 10: 58 New
    +3
    Perhaps this is already senile for me, but it seems that our youth do not want to do anything at all, either with their own hands or with their heads. Are they waiting for the manna from heaven? A la handouts from their peers from abroad? From the old people there who like young Russians? Not everything, of course, but, alas, a very large percentage of young people want everything at once, and in such a way as to do nothing. How can you get it? Yes, in different ways, but you can. The state is to blame for one thing: that there is no long-term planning, forecasting, there are no global state projects, and those that are offered to the people are immediately subjected to derogatory criticism from all sorts of "mass media" and some "experts" of unkempt appearance, who, apparently , instructed to make our youth infantile and incapable of anything. And the state does not oppose this, it has withdrawn itself. Even the safety of people cannot be ensured from bandit arbitrariness, all these swindlers, thieves, cheats, bribery, pimps, etc. a criminal element that often hides under the guise of "government organizations and institutions." What this leads to we see on the example of Ukraine and Belarus.
    Therefore, the main problem is that young people, and not only young people in our country, do not see prospects, they are afraid to live relying on their own strengths, because there is a stronger one and will take away everything that they have managed to do, or you will go to prison yourself. because he fought back the villain. Another aspect is that a certain "nightingale robber" is sitting, through which you cannot pass, which you cannot jump, he is stupid, but with his whistle he guards his trough and what is around him. What to do with him, where is "Ilya Muromets"?
    It will be necessary and will heal in all territories of Russia when order in the country is restored. And let them give up the theory of "10 megacities" in Russia! Then everything is normalized.
    1. Aleksandr1971
      Aleksandr1971 29 August 2020 11: 25 New
      +5
      Young people do not wait for manna from heaven. Young people in Siberia grease their heels with lard and bring them to hell.
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 29 August 2020 15: 12 New
        +2
        This situation has long been, not only young people are looking for where it is warmer and more satisfying.
        Capitals, megalopolises, draw away not only resources, but also people!
        What remains as a result, everyone will see and not so much time will be needed for this., All this began to happen too intensively.
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 29 August 2020 23: 17 New
          +1
          This trend is happening all over the world.
  • d4rkmesa
    d4rkmesa 29 August 2020 11: 06 New
    +3
    Yes, the question is serious. I myself once "fled" from the then 100-thousandth city in the north of the Irkutsk region. The main issue, of course, is the lack of money and work. Although, maybe then it was not as critical there as somewhere in Vorkuta. But even then, in 2007, it was clear that 10-12 sput salaries were very small. A friend of mine quit a few years ago from the local IT department of a large sawmill, the boss was very surprised - 30 tyr "normal salary" in his opinion for a developer who can Java, Oracle and PL SQL. The children grew up a little and left for Novosibirsk. Yes, there is also not smeared with honey, but in this regard it is better.
    Then - security. 20 years later, AUE was banned, and since 1998, "polite" gopniks began to appear in the city, offering to chip in for "heating". I think this infection still ruins the lives of teenagers. The local police are powerless, the maximum district police officer will speak to schoolchildren and that's it. I'm not talking about larger crimes, organized crime has not gone anywhere, most likely, and the timber is still exported to China.
    The third question is the climate. Waiting for a bus at -35-40 is so-so pleasure. The pressure there jumps from 720 to 760mm, which is rather unpleasant. With this, of course, nothing can be done, although due to climate change the climate has already become a little milder.
    What to do with the problems of the province and the north is a difficult and mostly rhetorical question. I think it is necessary to some extent switch to "controlled compression" in the issue of regional policy. Those. take depopulation for granted and develop infrastructure for a smaller population, but develop it! Roads, regional aviation are needed in any case. And the redistribution of income, of course.
  • Aleksandr1971
    Aleksandr1971 29 August 2020 11: 24 New
    -3
    Dear author ....

    I fully agree with the statement of facts. I live in Barnaul myself. And Barnaul is at least twice as bad as Omsk.

    But the question is - what do you propose to do? Fill Siberia with federal money? Will it pay off? No, it won't pay off. With current technology, cities can be built on the seabed. But is it really necessary? No, it doesn `t need. You need to spend money on something that will pay off. The USSR went bankrupt to a large extent precisely because it kept a lot of planned unprofitable processes and industries. In the Altai Territory, we had 40 airports in the villages and regional centers. Small aircraft and "Rockets", "Zarya" were all subsidized. And this is stupid. The state should treat people's money rationally. Something like that, no matter how a specific non-stupid person would manage his own money, that is, he would invest it for his real benefit, and not squander on "Manilov projects."

    Siberia and the Far East will continue to depopulate and you will not do anything here. Nature will do. Global warming will come, in which the majority of the local members of the forum, contrary to reality, do not believe. Then production costs in Siberia will decrease, and new enterprises will start producing GDP and spoil the air, and the land will begin to fertile up to Salekhard. Southern Europe, China, India, Middle East, USA will suffer from droughts. And in Siberia and the Far East, the population will start to increase again. Only we don't need a stranger. Let us breed ourselves. And there is no need to be afraid of the Chinese (they say they will oust the Russians). I do not see Chinese in Siberia, although I have been living here for half a century.
    1. aglet
      aglet 29 August 2020 14: 50 New
      +5
      "We in the Altai Territory had 40 airports in the villages and regional centers. Small aircraft and" Rockets "," Zarya "were all subsidized. And this is stupid. The state should treat people's money wisely."
      now it rationally otnosti- on the train tickets are more expensive than on the plane, all the missiles and sarin-scrap metal. Nowhere to go, only by bus, and not every day. "Oh, I ought to run, but there is no transport."
    2. d4rkmesa
      d4rkmesa 30 August 2020 14: 44 New
      +1
      Subsidies subsidies strife. There are a lot of taxes in the price of jet fuel, why? Agriculture, again, is quite efficient in Southern Siberia, but it is not necessary to tax it in the same way as Kuban agricultural firms, since conditions are simply not comparable. Small aircraft may well provide for itself and benefit the region, under certain conditions.
  • crabkiller
    crabkiller 29 August 2020 11: 24 New
    10
    The situation in Murmansk is no better either.
    The fishing port has been reformed, Murmansk ships are in Norway, where parking is cheaper and there are no heaps of supervisory authorities.
    The Murmansk shipyard is divided into pieces, each shop has its own individual entrepreneur, the docks are sunk. The commercial port was sharpened for the transshipment of coal and apatite. The center of the city is covered with coal dust (a wall built around the terminal for loading coal, with an irrigation system, with our winds - millions to the wind). In the center, I clean the rabble from the windowsill every week.
    Now the governor of Chibis, in a city with kapets roads, we have summer from mid-June to mid-August, now the season of rains and storms will begin, and in some places the asphalt was laid in July and has not yet been completed. I drive a car and I feel sorry for pedestrians with wheelchairs and the rest - the sidewalks are pre-hammered and thrown in place, legs can be broken. And they change in the same place where they changed it last year. Some promises, changes are visible only from entropy. You can drive through the yards only in an SUV, the rest are belly-pounding (the asphalt has gone to look for a better life.
    Novotek went to Belokamenka, brought in a lot of people from Asia. Oddities began in the city: on Lake Semyonovskoye, young horsemen are standing in the bushes and waving their end.
    For children and women (women in their concept is not a person) is scary. Horsemen do not go one by one and behave defiantly. This is starting to strain. Our salaries are higher than in the middle lane, but don't worry about prices either, fruits and vegetables are expensive, and even plastic. Watermelons are the third year, I take one for a sample, I throw them out the next day, it is impossible to eat, grass is grass. The last time I took it on the lower road, near the entrance to the South Berths. The horsemen claimed that the Astrakhan watermelons (although they looked different), took, tasted and threw out the grass ...
    Gasoline at Lukoil 49 rubles.
    For an apartment of 47 sq.m. monthly ~ RUB 7
    Most of the acquaintances left for Kaliningrad for St. Petersburg. Many are planning to repeat their path too. It is a pity for the youth, they have not yet formed, the work is low-paid. With a higher education, they get a job in any job, since they often cannot get a job in their specialty. And the state is not involved in the education of young people ...
    You can get a good job only by acquaintance.
    Sadness.
    1. crabkiller
      crabkiller 29 August 2020 11: 41 New
      +3
      Explain why I was banned?
      1. Mordvin 3
        Mordvin 3 29 August 2020 22: 41 New
        +1
        Quote: crabkiller
        Explain why I was banned?

        Probably the comment was written, and then they tried to either fix it or add it. Five minutes after the comment was sent, you cannot correct it, a stupid inscription like: "You are not allowed to write comments" appears. Never mind.
    2. aglet
      aglet 29 August 2020 14: 55 New
      0
      "You can get a good job only by acquaintance. Sadness."
      you can't get a good job anywhere. work is inherited.
  • IS-80_RVGK2
    IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 11: 42 New
    +8
    The author, weren't you here campaigning for amendments to the constitution? For amendments to please the power of capital. The same one who built this system with a shitty demography, pumping people's money into a private pocket, with a reluctance to develop territories, nodding his head in the State Duma at the president's calls to make a breakthrough in the economy and then sabotaging this very breakthrough for years and executing decrees in 10 years by the tea house spoon. Why are you now whining about the weathervane that everything is gone? Now you decided to make money on HYIP?
    1. sniperino
      sniperino 29 August 2020 12: 55 New
      -11
      Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
      The author, weren't you here campaigning for amendments to the constitution? For amendments to please the power of capital. The one who built this system with a shitty demographic ...
      What kind of capital are the amendments working for? International, who actually built "this system with shitty demographics"? This is a lie: the amendments - on the contrary - take the country out of his influence. National? This is good: the amendments create the legal conditions for the transformation of the national. capital from speculative to developing, creating new systems of production and consumption.
      1. IS-80_RVGK2
        IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 13: 14 New
        +7
        Come on, you won't tell me about correct capitalism. Sell ​​this demagogic shit to someone else boy.
        1. sniperino
          sniperino 29 August 2020 14: 55 New
          -5
          Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
          Come on, you won't tell me about correct capitalism. Sell ​​this demagogic shit to someone else boy.
          Beguiled the boys, little girl? Demagogues pick up clichés ("for the sake of the power of capital"), and they cannot figure out what to what, so they will be rude from impotence if someone demands proof.
          1. IS-80_RVGK2
            IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 14: 59 New
            +3
            Repeat again? Didn't get it the first time? Don't push this stupid shit to me. I perfectly understand what, why, how and for what. And these amendments are fucking shit designed to mothball this whole rotten system. But as the history of nichrome shows, it never rolled.
  • iouris
    iouris 29 August 2020 11: 50 New
    +2
    Quote: "The modern world is global. You can leave from wherever wherever. There would be a desire." End of quote.
    For whom is "the world global"? Who can go from anywhere, anywhere? Who has the urge to go anywhere? Why doesn't the author work for CNN, but is engaged in propaganda on this site?
  • Alexander F.
    Alexander F. 29 August 2020 12: 06 New
    +2
    Part 1 "Fluid" eats not only time, but also the brain.
    "The locomotive is gone, but the carriages remain"

    The new acting governor of Khabarovsk, Mikhail Degtyarev, is a new man, and it is still too early to judge whether he is good or bad.
    But what he said is that the Khabarovsk Territory will feel an improvement in the next two years, and at the same time did not disclose how this will happen. And this is alarming.

    But let's try to help him.
    Attracting federal funds to solve global problems is, of course, very good, but not all and not the main thing, these are injections that will bring relief, but only for a short time, and will help to solve only part of the problems.

    What are the successes of the leaders of the Khabarovsk Territory, Cherny A.K. and Ishaev V.I., they were realists and did not create illusions that all the problems of the region could be solved at the expense of federal funds, and therefore they “hoped for God, but at the same time they themselves did not do it. "
    They built long-term plans for the development of the Khabarovsk Territory, based on the initial economic, natural, labor resource data, geographical and climatic conditions, and at the same time did not forget about the most important attribute of the sales market.

    "What is needed and what can be done from what is" and worked on how "can" be brought closer to what is needed. "

    What is China's success - they are quite profitable selling their labor resources to the most capacious US market.

    Naturally, this concept does not fit the Khabarovsk Territory. It is a dead end to build hopes that it is possible to load the entire laboring local population for the extraction of natural and biological resources, "limitless expanses and a handful of brave people" will not allow this. Accordingly, there is only one realistic option, the extraction of natural and biological resources should be left as it is, as the main means of filling the budget, and the free "hands" are simply loaded into the production sector with a minimum surplus value, but only for the budget. And the interest here is simple, even if the budget directly in the form of taxes will receive less from this, then through the increased purchasing power, and then through the retail network, they will more than compensate for the lost surplus value "lost money funds of taxes" And the main thing is that with With this tax approach, people will have an interest in living in the Far East.

    And there is such an area, there is also a sales market.

    On which the economic success of the management of V.I. Ishaev was built, he had a concept for the development of the Khabarovsk Territory in extreme conditions in the 90s, zero years. The idea is simple, the creation of a basic production (FSUE "Dalspetsstroy"), the main purpose of which was to create the main consumer of private business services, which in turn would serve as a driver for the entire self-regulating economy of the Khabarovsk Territory. And it was the successful implementation of this concept that caused the very rapid growth of the entire economy.

    But FSUE "Dalspetsstroy" was destroyed as a locomotive, but the cars remained.
    I.e. there are people who know how and who are willing to work, and what is not unimportant they have, some of them, but working capital. And not to use such a unique resource, it means finally and consciously to bring down the entire economy.

    But the "locomotive" will no longer be, and it is not needed in the realities of today. The concept of economic development, today we need to build a different one.

    Maybe the authorities should think and understand that the time has come
    - and it's time for the "cars" to be given the opportunity to become locomotives, and they need to be given exactly as much as they can lead, as well as tell them what to drive, and show the way?

    And this will help to get out of the "peak" in which the Khabarovsk Territory found itself. and this is all real, and there is no conspiracy here, but there is only one pragmatic and mathematical calculation!

    It's simple, the circulating capital that small and medium-sized businesses have, which will allow them to become locomotives, will be sufficient mainly in the so-called depressed areas, such as Vyazemsky, Birobidzhan, and in other remote settlements and settlements.
    True, its realism can be achieved only on condition that local administrations work and not defend their seats. This will create the necessary and sufficient conditions for them to become the drivers of economic growth in the Khabarovsk Territory.

    The question remains, what should they do there and what is their interest.

    But even here everything is simple.
    Khabarovsk Territory is harsh and "funny", and so "funny" that Central Asian melons are cheaper than local greenhouse tomatoes grown on glass wool.

    So the idea arose of how to solve this problem with the help of small and medium-sized businesses, and make this project interesting for them, and not only, but for everyone who wants to live with dignity on their land.

    The task is simple, how for the production of vegetables and not only for them, to create similar production conditions, as for example in Krasnodar.

    You will probably laugh, but there is such a technical solution. Moreover, this project is quite simple to implement and would make the Far Eastern hectare program commercially attractive. An opportunity would be created within the framework of one hectare, remote settlements, etc. to receive quite acceptable profits and within the framework of reasonable investments, even for ordinary citizens.

    And here there is no fantasy, but simply observation and experience, and there is practice of application.

    There is only a desire of the authorities to do this.

    “The main asset of the Project:“ the possibility of creating an industrial franchising!
    An insignificant constructive addition introduced to the standard solution to the aboveground structure gives qualitatively new characteristics to the aboveground structure, sufficient to compensate for the natural heat loss of the structure, a passive thermal control system capable of maintaining a constant positive temperature in all periods of the climatic seasons, without forced power supply
    This significantly reduces operating costs for some types of facility use. "

    In simple language. It is possible to build greenhouses without electronic and technical "bells and whistles" of the type that would allow the season of vegetable production in difficult areas of the Khabarovsk Territory to be comparable to the season in the Krasnodar Territory.

    And if the authorities also help, then this project will be pulled by a simple man in the street who just wants to live and earn decent money. And an ordinary city dweller will like the fact that he lives, albeit in a harsh region, but in a prosperous region where simple and natural food is not a luxury.

    This is so, while improvisation, later I will "refine" the text and content.
    1. aglet
      aglet 29 August 2020 15: 12 New
      +1
      "the idea is simple, the creation of a basic production (FSUE" Dalspetsstroy "), the main purpose of which was to create the main consumer of private business services, which in turn would serve as a driver for the entire self-regulating economy of the Khabarovsk Territory. And it is the successful implementation of this concept and caused the very rapid growth of the entire economy. "
      the idea is really very simple. after all, about the invisible hand of the market, who just did not tell us. But only Putin could declare about creating a consumer of services, in his famous speech - about 17 tr. create, do not create a driver, it will not create an economy. to produce something, it is something that needs to be sold. and first sell and then produce. and this is anywhere, even in Krasnodar, even in Khabarovsk
    2. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 29 August 2020 15: 27 New
      +1
      This is all basically manilovism. But you have something right. Small and medium businesses want to eat and do not want to eat it. And when they tell me that we are preparing the Maidan komunyaki and liberals with the money of the State Department, I just find it funny. In the country, objectively, a situation has developed when this very Maidan is ready to arrange this very medium-sized small business that really wants to become large, but successful grandfathers from the 90s interfere. laughing
      1. depressant
        depressant 29 August 2020 16: 30 New
        +2
        Correct judgment! New generations of people have come, ready to prove themselves in business and politics. But they are squeezed by the framework of laws created by the oligarchs from the 90s so that they, the oligarchs, would not be taken by anyone. And so as not to encroach on the government trained by them.
        This is how it was in the 80s. It was said: "Cooperatives! .. Produce what you can!"
        And then they trampled those leaning out under the pretext of the lack of regulatory laws. Trampled by thousands a day. And maybe that's why the 90s happened. One of the reasons. They say, we will change the system, they will let produce. What is there! The current government does not reflect on the phenomenon, does not teach lessons. Or teaches? Then what is her aim?
        1. businessv
          businessv 29 August 2020 19: 45 New
          +4
          Quote: depressant
          Then what is her aim?

          Her sight has long been knocked down towards personal well-being. Our government is interested in the state of the country and its citizens only in the case of collecting taxes, or receiving other types of profit from it. It has long been necessary to demolish and change everything, and it would be even better not to allow such power in the country.
      2. Nehist
        Nehist 29 August 2020 16: 37 New
        +4
        Things are going like in 1917 !!! Small business, that is, the bourgeoisie threw off Nikolashka, and then ... Well, you know the story
  • Diviz
    Diviz 29 August 2020 12: 27 New
    +1
    I will come to Siberia and what will I do there. Where are the relatives and where will I be.
    It’s really something to think about and create conditions for life for researchers and romantics. Designate this area with a special status. And so what to do there - where the gas pipe goes, people will live there. And the remaining 80% of the territory of Russia is not needed by anyone. Can amerikosy rich to build bunkers as on the moon with Mars.
    1. iouris
      iouris 29 August 2020 14: 00 New
      +1
      Quote: DiViZ
      I will come to Siberia and what will I do there. Where are the relatives and where will I be.

      First, what am I doing here and now, surrounded by relatives? Second, the economy begins to develop only when workers are forced to break with patriarchal life, leaving for places where jobs have been created. Thirdly, Margaret Thatcher (of the "iron lady" type) allegedly said (he was not present himself) that 16 million people are enough for them on the territory of the USSR. Consequently, the rest will be scattered.
      The article may be called "the young do not want to live."
      1. aglet
        aglet 29 August 2020 15: 19 New
        +1
        "The economy begins to develop only when workers are forced to break with patriarchal life, leaving for places where jobs have been created."
        Well, where are these places created?
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 29 August 2020 23: 23 New
          -3
          At least in the Far East and Siberia, they began to create them, but it takes a lot of time and tens of trillions of rubles to create not only jobs but the entire infrastructure.
          1. aglet
            aglet 30 August 2020 08: 32 New
            +2
            "At least in the Far East and Siberia, they began to create them"
            can you give an example? not a hairdressing salon, or a nail salon for 2-3 people, but a small enterprise for the production of something, processing, or agriculture, small, people for 200-400? Or will we wait for "a lot of time"? and what, everything is from scratch under construction, if you also need to create infrastructure? effective managers will not build a new Komsomolsk, or any other garden city. they can only optimize, destroy and steal. they cannot create, they are not sharpened for that
          2. Diviz
            Diviz 31 August 2020 21: 08 New
            0
            Why Walk Far A model for the development of a soda plant appeared. What can I say - Lukashenka is not enough for them.
        2. iouris
          iouris 30 August 2020 14: 28 New
          -1
          Quote: aglet
          Well, where are these places created?

          IN THE USSR. Read a short study by Max Weber, "Protestant Ethics and the Spirit of Capitalism." You will be surprised how far Russia has "moved" back not only from the USSR, but also from Germany at the end of the XNUMXth century.
    2. d4rkmesa
      d4rkmesa 30 August 2020 14: 49 New
      0
      As it was in the 80s: relatives are somewhere in the Kuban, and what to see them - there is a long vacation of 2+ months and travel compensation. By the way, they seem to be formally compensated for travel even now, but de facto enterprises often sabotage the acceptance of applications for compensation.
  • mmaxx
    mmaxx 29 August 2020 12: 40 New
    +3
    In Transbaikalia and when owls. the authorities did not live very well. Now there is how the war has passed.
    You are in Mokva, talking with the locals. They: "Well, at least you have clean air." And they don't believe when you tell them that the air in Irkutsk is SIGNIFICANTLY worse. It is felt immediately. How many friends and acquaintances have already left from oncology ... One child has already left for the European part, the second intends. They don't see prospects. They are being felled in Irkutsk from the region. And so the people are being pulled over.
    1. ssergey1978
      ssergey1978 29 August 2020 21: 21 New
      0
      In Irkutsk, a coal-fired CHP, the private sector on wood and constant traffic jams from ancient cars. So the air is bad.
      1. mmaxx
        mmaxx 30 August 2020 05: 38 New
        +1
        The CHP plant has a very high chimney. And it is unlikely that the city gets it. Nobody has been heating with firewood for a long time. It is expensive. Old Zhiguli, etc. have been gone for a long time. If a rarity comes from where, you get a gas attack. It stinks really hard. In terms of cars, things got better. Since I used to ride a bike, that is, with what to compare. But the chemical and metallurgical industries around, the tightness of the city and the stupidity of its planning - cars are in constant traffic jams and the space is not blown out - give their results.
        1. ssergey1978
          ssergey1978 30 August 2020 07: 29 New
          -1
          Ask the residents of Sinyushennaya Gora and Kai who will get it from the NovoMarkovskaya CHPP. In Irkutsk, they just heat with wood and coal, there is nothing else, and since the city is on the mountains, it still stinks. The majority of Japanese cars in Irkutsk are rarely less than 10 years old.
          1. mmaxx
            mmaxx 30 August 2020 15: 52 New
            0
            I don't need lala. I live there
            1. ssergey1978
              ssergey1978 30 August 2020 16: 27 New
              0
              Where is there? Do you want to say you shouldn't smog over a cheeky one? Doesn't it smell of dirty socks in calm weather? No daily traffic jams in the stream area? Where do you live?
              1. mmaxx
                mmaxx 30 August 2020 17: 31 New
                0
                And what does the thermal power plant have to do with it? Slow down, buddy. The fat factory smells like soy. It's bullshit, natural laughing laughing
                And traffic jams have nothing to do with the CHP. Don't mix everything up.
                Back in Soviet times, those who built the CHPP pipe said that soot was poured from it somewhere in the steppes of Kazakhstan.
                1. ssergey1978
                  ssergey1978 30 August 2020 17: 47 New
                  0
                  Come on, about Kazakhstan. Do you live on the senyushki? I lived on Kai. Until he left.
                  1. mmaxx
                    mmaxx 30 August 2020 17: 59 New
                    0
                    Exactly. Not noticeable, tunnels on knowledge of the issue?
        2. d4rkmesa
          d4rkmesa 30 August 2020 14: 51 New
          0
          "chemical and metallurgical industry around" - Well, minus BPPM and Usoliekhimprom - there should have already been tangible benefits for the air.
          1. mmaxx
            mmaxx 30 August 2020 15: 54 New
            0
            The issue of non-working or non-working industries. And the issue of cleaning up emissions. It's all at the 60-70s level.
            And with the BPPM operating, snow in Baikalsk was the standard of whiteness. Pussies turned yellow a little laughing
  • Antonio_Mariarti
    Antonio_Mariarti 29 August 2020 12: 42 New
    +3
    As a Siberian and a youth representative, I agree with the author, but you forgot to add one more main argument - this is the state of the urban infrastructure. When young people look at what the urban environment looks like in Moscow, in St. Petersburg (I am already silent about the West) and they want to live the same way, bike paths, unbroken sidewalks, comfortable public transport, and so on. They certainly want to leave, what is the benefit of living in Siberia and the Far East? It would be one thing if the northern coefficient was paid in addition everywhere, but I pay it extra where, by the standards of Siberia, there are few people. And I know many of those who could easily stay in the city (as they work remotely), but left for Kaliningrad-Moscow-Peter because of the better urban environment.
    1. Nehist
      Nehist 29 August 2020 16: 41 New
      +3
      So this coefficient is paid extra at state enterprises, private traders do not bother themselves with this, they take a moth across the region, put a coefficient on it, and in the end you get like a resident of the same Krasnodar where a kilo of fresh pork costs two and a half times cheaper
  • depressant
    depressant 29 August 2020 12: 59 New
    +7
    I have to return to the question, which, in my opinion, is the main one. By now, it has developed so that our society has divided into two almost non-contiguous layers, namely: the governing layer (state) and the subordinate layer - the rest of the population. The points of contact between the state and the people arise only as the state descends down the hierarchical ladder, but even below there are few such points. The contradictions that arise as a result of contact are practically not resolved by the courts, the prosecutor's office, local authorities of the Presidential Administration, and law enforcement officers. Addressing them is often useless, which we see from life practice. And the further, the fewer such points become due to the continuous expansion of the bureaucratic layer of the state, hence, the erosion of each simple authority into a number of its imitations. The constantly tightening legislative base, which increasingly focuses the ordinary citizen on his own guilt before the state, also contributes to the decrease in the number of points of contact. It tightens around the people's neck like a noose. Step to the left, step to the right, and you're already to blame. Better freeze and don't flap. That's right, some say. Don't break it and you're happy. But over time, the noose tightens more and more, the separation of the state from the people is more and more obvious, the people are less and less fluttering, and for some reason happiness on a national scale does not come. The state does not hear us, does not accept the tasks that we tried to set before it, but it seems that we are no longer trying, and we, in turn, do not understand what tasks the state is living with, if any exist at all, and we only see crime in its behavior ... Two layers, two non-contiguous worlds. And only a riot, an uprising, ignoring the laws, which is tantamount to breaking the noose from the neck, makes the state, surrounded by a protective layer of law enforcement agencies, to hear us, but hardly understand. Our need for happiness is still assessed by him at the level of the same cattle corral and, as it believes, regulated by one-time selective handouts. And the further, the more. By creating huge plans, it only creates a way of using the money that it pulls from the population, giving almost nothing in return. Without giving the main thing - development. And, I repeat, if something is being done, built, discovered and created in a country, it is often only by the people themselves - in spite of the state, and not thanks to it, only through its oversight. But as time goes on, new generations of people bring to life the creative potential of a new type, corresponding to the stage of development of technologies - industrial and social, a stage that the state, living in its ossified form, does not need. How does he answer? What's his reaction? Yes, we are watching ...
    1. Obliterator
      Obliterator 30 August 2020 13: 23 New
      0
      Quote: depressant
      I have to return to the question, which, in my opinion, is the main one. By now, it has happened that our society has divided into two almost non-contiguous layers, namely: the governing layer (the state) and the subordinate layer - the rest of the population. The points of contact between the state and the people arise only as the state descends down the hierarchical ladder, but even below there are few such points. The contradictions that arise as a result of contact are practically not resolved by the courts, the prosecutor's office, local authorities of the Presidential Administration, and law enforcement officers. Addressing them is often useless, which we see from life practice. And the further, the fewer such points become due to the continuous expansion of the bureaucratic layer of the state, consequently, the erosion of each simple authority into a number of its imitations. The constantly tightening legislative base, which increasingly focuses the ordinary citizen on his own guilt before the state, also contributes to the decrease in the number of points of contact.

      Yes, there is no separation. They are all one people. These officials, security officials, big business - they did not come from Nibiru, and they were not grown in a test tube by the Judeo-Masonic-Illuminati. They have not ceased to be part of the people, because it is impossible. It's just that in that spiritual vacuum, when religion and traditions have lost their significance, and the ideologies of building a happy society are of no interest to anyone, the majority of people just don't give a damn about everything. Everything except their own personal interests. Kidalovo and negligence are present at all levels. And those in power differ little from ordinary people here, just the results of their "labor" are seen better. Some cunning Petya, who steals in wagons, because the position allows, does not differ much from the same conventional worker Vasya, who carries non-ferrous metal from the factory in his pockets. They are essentially the same.
      1. depressant
        depressant 30 August 2020 14: 37 New
        +1
        Colleague, the psychology of a person who has ascended even to the smallest, lowest rung of power changes noticeably. Just that he was in the team the same as him, and now he is taller. His task is to subordinate the team to himself, but he has no established methods. Old capitalism has developed such methods in Western countries, but we have not. How to make sure that people recognize you as a leader without showing rudeness on your part, rudeness, contempt for your subordinates, pressure, breaking your will? So that you are not just formally recognized as a leader, but obeyed without question? How to behave? Some have a natural gift, most of those nominated for leadership do not. The result is a kind of swagger, even for the secretary of the smallest boss. And if this boss has the ability to seduce a superior, then he confidently climbs the service steps higher and higher, and all the more rudeness, rudeness, contempt for the lower ones, pressure on them, the desire to break the will become stable features of his personality - they become himself. Of course, at higher levels of power, such a person acquires a certain gloss, learns from others the ethics of communicating with his own kind, and makes the above more elegant. But it is no longer simple hard workers who obey him! And the higher he climbed, the more skillfully he manages his subordinates, but the less he sees connections with the hard workers who have gone into his past, having preserved in himself the initial attitude towards them that he had at the bottom of his career. He tries to forget about those hard workers who, by the simplicity of their soul, mocked his wrong decisions, because they still saw in him the same as they themselves, and in the end he manages to forget about them. He decides for himself that the people are dark and stupid, demands a whip and contempt, and, as is typical for all of us, prefers not to remember the unpleasant, it is easier for him to live. Such is self-belief, self-programming. There are no more common ground ...
        Have you forgotten the story with "macaroshkas" and many other similar ones? But in these stories, not so big bosses from the bureaucracy showed themselves. They are not us, colleague. We are not them. And the irony is that we depend on them, but they do not depend on us. They have a stranglehold in their hands for us - law enforcement officers and laws written by them in such a way that we are always to blame before one of these bosses, starting with the smallest. And then the behavior of the authorities becomes ideology. After all, any ideology written on paper is just paper. Ideology becomes a reality when there are examples to follow. This is how the people do life with those who put themselves forward as such examples. Unwittingly imitating them, each of us subconsciously neglects the interests of others like ourselves. I see manifestations of such neglect every day. We are atomized ...
        But, you know, in the last two years something has moved. The people seemed to have realized that we are all in one layer and interdependent. The drunks have disappeared from the streets. People try not to litter. No smoking outside. Everyone is polite. On occasion, help on trifles.
        And in families - scandals. Poverty. Epidemic. There is no gap.
        1. Obliterator
          Obliterator 30 August 2020 15: 43 New
          0
          Quote: depressant
          Colleague, the psychology of a person who has ascended even to the smallest, lowest rung of power changes noticeably. Just that he was in the team the same as him, and now he is taller.

          Yes, it does not change so much. It's just that for the bosses, former colleagues who have become subordinates, from the category of "friends" are transferred to "outsiders." And these same subordinates also have a negative attitude towards people who are below them, for example, towards low-skilled personnel. And yet there is no respect for people of other directions. Ordinary citizens also have no respect for the work of janitors, cleaners, and what is really there - for doctors, teachers and police too. Psychology in society is from the category - everyone around is bad and does not work, but we are just great. The bosses are a slice of society.
          Quote: depressant
          people are dark and stupid

          Not that far from the truth, unfortunately.
          Quote: depressant
          Have you forgotten the story with "macaroshkas" and many other similar ones? But in these stories, not so big bosses from the bureaucracy showed themselves. They are not us, colleague. We are not them.

          In the same way, a representative of one profession does not understand a representative of another profession. The leaders among themselves have exactly the same graters. In our country it is not that the bosses are separated from the people, but that the people themselves are disunited. Under the window of an apartment building, a person will be killed for a long time, and no one will even call the police - there are precedents. Or not everyone even knows their neighbors by name.
          Quote: depressant
          Ideology becomes a reality when there are examples to follow.

          When there are charismatic people-guides who can influence the masses. And they are not.

          Quote: depressant
          The constantly tightening legislative framework, which increasingly focuses the ordinary citizen on his own guilt before the state, also contributes to the reduction in the number of points of contact. It tightens around the people's neck like a noose. Step to the left, step to the right, and you're already to blame. Better freeze and don't flap. That's right, some say. Don't break it and you're happy. But over time, the noose tightens more and more, the separation of the state from the people is more and more obvious, the people are less and less fluttering, and for some reason happiness on a national scale does not come. The state does not hear us, does not accept the tasks that we tried to set before it, but it seems that we are no longer trying, and we, in turn, do not understand what tasks the state is living with, if any exist at all, and we only see crime in its behavior ... Two layers, two non-contiguous worlds. And only a riot, an uprising, ignoring the laws, which is tantamount to breaking the noose from the neck, makes the state, surrounded by a protective layer of law enforcement agencies, to hear us, but hardly understand. Our need for happiness is still estimated by him at the level of the same cattle corral and, as it believes, regulated by one-time selective handouts.

          The history of the twentieth century with the two collapses of the country teaches us that citizens are more likely to lose from revolution and riots. The Bolsheviks, unlike modern leaders, were smart guys, and then, before normal conditions for life in the USSR were created, they spent more than a dozen years. Well, in the current world order, any revolution will also become a start for the geopolitical plunder of the country, because the technologies have been worked out, and the methods of modern communication will allow this to be done remotely without risking the life of the puppeteers.
          1. depressant
            depressant 30 August 2020 16: 55 New
            +2
            Colleague!! I am not calling for a revolution!
            Day after day here, at VO, criticizing the government and Putin, I appeal to them: do you understand, leadership, your country! She's not a shift camp!
            Putin positions himself as the leader of a great country, but limits himself only to signs of greatness, not filling the country with a great essence. He is trying to make a showcase of greatness: world championships, rallies, beautiful embankments, ten-million-strong cities with obvious signs of Western-level civilization on the central streets, but devastation in the backyards, as well as in the regions, all kinds of summits, trips of our leaders to Davos and pompous homegrown ones held annually " Davos "at home, direct lines with the people, hours-long interviews with more than a thousand journalists ... And what are our legislative authorities - the Duma, the Federation Council, the Security Council - supposedly showcases of" democracy "! Again, the Prosecutor General's Office, the Investigative Committee - everything is like people have, like abroad, as expected ...
            Do you know what it looks like? On the efforts of some relatively not poor, but not very rich African American to be like a billionaire. Let's say, to become on a par with Bezos - after all, he is known to the whole world, we respect. Here, they say, and I, struggling to impoverish the family budget, will dress in a precious suit from a famous couturier, on my finger - a ring with a 4-carat diamond, sit in maybach - why am I not Bezos? Not Bezos. Because the house is desolate due to unbearable purchases, even if the house is decent, and the money did not come, but disappeared. And Bezos - he worked with his brains and, in order to become a billionaire, created a huge number of jobs.
            Imitation ... Imitation of greatness.
            And greatness is achieved by great industrialization on the basis of our own and not other people's technologies, as well as the tireless work of millions of small and medium-sized enterprises and ordinary farms. Greatness is when each person can find a worthy use of his creative potential due to the greatness and simplicity of the state's legislative framework.
            1. Phil77
              Phil77 30 August 2020 18: 00 New
              +4
              My God! Lyudmila Yakovlevna! With what pleasure and pleasure I read your, always smart and sharply sharpened comments !!!!! good
              But the fact that our current * top * are capable of evolution ?????
              Alas, alas, alas! Probably, we are not destined to see this ...
            2. Phil77
              Phil77 30 August 2020 18: 09 New
              +3
              Quote: depressant
              Imitation ... Imitation of greatness.

              Exactly, in all spheres, even in sports!
              Our authorities are confidently marching towards devolution. What is sad, not for them! For they and their households have everything in the regime, it cannot be better. But for us, ordinary citizens.
              1. depressant
                depressant 30 August 2020 18: 14 New
                +1
                Glad to see you, colleague! love )))
                1. Phil77
                  Phil77 30 August 2020 18: 19 New
                  +2
                  This is mutual! love love love
                  Again, your comments are amazing!
                  1. depressant
                    depressant 30 August 2020 18: 57 New
                    +1
                    Oh, Seryozha, don't exaggerate! Plus, I can't stand praise well. Easy - vilification)))
                    1. Phil77
                      Phil77 30 August 2020 19: 20 New
                      +2
                      Quote: depressant
                      do not exaggerate!

                      Nope! Statement of fact. No more.
            3. Obliterator
              Obliterator 30 August 2020 22: 14 New
              +2
              Quote: depressant
              Do you know what it looks like? On the efforts of some relatively not poor, but not very rich African American to be like a billionaire. Let's say, to become on a par with Bezos - after all, he is known to the whole world, we respect. Here, they say, and I, struggling to impoverish the family budget, will dress in a precious suit from a famous couturier, on my finger - a ring with a 4-carat diamond, sit in maybach - why am I not Bezos? Not Bezos. Because the house is desolate due to unbearable purchases, even if the house is decent, and the money did not come, but disappeared. And Bezos - he worked with his brains and, in order to become a billionaire, created a huge number of jobs.
              Imitation ... Imitation of greatness.

              Yes, that's exactly what it looks like.
              The only problem we have with you is that we are small people, on whom almost nothing depends. We can only live and hope that the mind will someday conquer greed. At least temporarily.
      2. g1washntwn
        g1washntwn 31 August 2020 09: 59 New
        +1
        Quote: Obliterator
        The ideologies of building a happy society are of no interest to anyone; the majority of the people simply do not give a damn about everything. Everything except their own personal interests.

        Why did you so cruelly trample the main ideological basis of liberalism?
        lol
  • Knell wardenheart
    Knell wardenheart 29 August 2020 13: 00 New
    +6
    In our country, they are always trying to somehow contrive and come up with some kind of new variation of serfdom, well, at least a little, well, at least a little)) As far as I know the essence of the question is that people settled in all these unfavorable areas due to a number of factors, and not because they are masochists or murdered patriots.

    Someone fled to the east from religious and legislative oppression - these people went there for FREEDOM and the absence of stick control, so that they had the right to live by their own rules and on more or less their own land. The "loving state" always found them there, to strangle them with their furry paws, and they went on, mastering these territories.

    Someone was sent there by force - firstly, far from the capital's affairs and "decision-making centers", and secondly, the blue dream of our power-lovers of all times - the possibility of increasing control over human needs and pressure through them. Without the state / capital, it was difficult to survive there, to feed oneself, there was also nowhere to escape - one had to break one's own backbone and bend under any power and any of its undertakings, of varying degrees of adequacy.

    There was an indigenous population, not very numerous and whimsical, who historically ended up in these places not because of a good life, but because the neighbors were pressing.

    Finally, yes, there were "adventurers", adventurers, industrialists, hunters, Cossacks - in general, people were ready to go there for concrete or abstract gesheft in conditions of exchange of a highly competitive environment for an increase in the complexity of the environment. Since these people were often "attached" to a significant amount of forced force (and historically, we have quite a lot of forced people, in fact, were always ready to "drown" until they lost their pulse for ideas they did not understand or against abstract enemies) - they often achieved success.

    So here's the history of the matter! No special heroics or romance. And now the author laments that the descendants of these people are so eager to leave the places in which the indigenous, natural population was historically much smaller than now. Probably not from good living conditions, sir! You are talking about some kind of interests of the country - but most people do not particularly like living in such a climate when beaches, palm trees, the sea, or, at worst, some kind of Europe are twisting around the zombie day and night. So the desire to leave is a natural human desire.
  • seacap
    seacap 29 August 2020 13: 21 New
    +8
    I have already said for a long time that, in my opinion, the average person, such a concentration of everything and everything in one metropolis, especially capital, extracting all funds from the regions is a direct threat to the territorial integrity and existence of the country. Moreover, the capital city, possessing all the power and capital, is pursuing a policy in the regions as a colonial metropolis; after the activities of the "Muscovites", "scorched dead land" remains in the regions. This threat is already visible to the child, and if our "boyar" class, stupefied by the dough, impunity and irresponsibility, does not see this, then this only confirms that their intellectual abilities are too small to understand this, and most likely they do not associate their future with this country and people whom they sincerely despise and hate.
    1. mmaxx
      mmaxx 30 August 2020 06: 03 New
      +1
      That is why the capital must be moved from this place. And wherever and further away. So that the whole Moscow shushara does not want to run across.
  • Aleks2000
    Aleks2000 29 August 2020 13: 24 New
    0
    Somehow this is close to Bulk. With his stories about projects and saws.
    Really the author is against the GDP and the NUCLEUS?

    Well, throw off, they will bring a steam locomotive there, train, stand up, get punished and rust ...

    Many times they wrote this. Instead of shipbuilding plants in the Far East, there is now a Primorsky Boulevard named after the murdered Tsarevich ... and churches at the state expense ...

    So what? Norneikel is registered over the hill and the oligarchs go to London to resolve their disputes about it. (and Putin, of course, is worried ...)