Military Review

Fighter J-31: Problems identified in the implementation of China's "Project 310"

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Fighter J-31: Problems identified in the implementation of China's "Project 310"

Attempts to "bring to mind" the "Project 310" in China continue. We are talking about the creation of a new generation fighter J-31, which the PLA plans to use primarily as the basis for the future air wing of Chinese aircraft carriers. At the moment, the PRC cannot cope with several problems that are inherent in the "Project 310" at once.


One of the problems is the increase in the range of combat use and the missile and bomb load.

The maximum takeoff weight of the J-31, after numerous modifications, was increased to 28 tons. However, the mass of the mentioned missile and bomb load remained at the original level - up to 8 tons. The main focus was on increasing the fuel load in order to increase the range. Attempts to increase the payload are faced with insurmountable difficulties so far: either increase the volume of internal compartments, which will automatically lead to a decrease in the available volume for fuel tanks, or hang weapons on external suspensions, which will actually lead to the leveling of stealth characteristics, which they like to talk about in China. ...

The second problem is the engine. Although the Chinese press has recently almost constantly announced a "breakthrough" in aircraft engine building, they cite the example of the WS-15 engine with a thrust of 14,5 thousand kgf at a turbine temperature of 1400 degrees Celsius, using these power plants on new fighters generation J-31 has difficulties.

According to the Chinese press, "the task has been set to eliminate problems with the design and engine of Project 310 before the appearance of a flat-deck aircraft carrier in the PLA Navy." Recall that China is going to bring the composition of the aircraft carrier by 2030 fleet up to 6 units, three of which will have a flat deck. At the moment, China has two aircraft carriers - "Liaoning" and "Shandong", of which the second is of Chinese construction, carried out in fact according to a Soviet project.

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  1. Mavrikiy
    Mavrikiy 10 August 2020 07: 56 New
    +2
    Problems in China's implementation of "Project 310"
    The United States has constant problems with the F-35, so what to expect from China. crying
    1. Civil
      Civil 10 August 2020 08: 08 New
      +3
      The PRC will bring its plane, as the Soviet aircraft carrier was restored, as in one generation, the Communists (the second case after the USSR), brought the country to the world leaders.
    2. Zoldat_A
      Zoldat_A 10 August 2020 08: 14 New
      -4
      Quote: Mavrikiy
      Problems in China's implementation of "Project 310"
      The United States has constant problems with the F-35, so what to expect from China. crying

      Will the Chinese copier exactly copy the problems of the Ph-35 or add its own?.

      I think it depends on the quality of the copier ..

      And let the Chinese and fans of China not be offended. But if the country is a copier. What the hell is there to wait for advanced technical thought? By myself, from the construction site I know that the most ingenious uncommon non-standard comes to mind when the standard does not work. Why China? They ransacked, they drove a hundred million people from collective farms into production, we slap the working apparatus outwardly - and it's nice ... Whoever worked with the "Makita" (my favorite instrument) made in China will understand me ...
      1. Mavrikiy
        Mavrikiy 10 August 2020 08: 44 New
        +1
        Quote: Zoldat_A
        Will the Chinese copier exactly copy the problems of the Ph-35 or add its own?

        And copy and add. There are pens, need to bring brains into the country (there is money, there is no time)
      2. Lesorub
        Lesorub 10 August 2020 09: 00 New
        +4
        Quote: Zoldat_A
        They ransacked the people, drove a hundred million people from the collective farms into production, we slap the outwardly working apparatus - and gloriously.

        China does not hesitate to involve specialists from other countries in the development of certain technologies (they do not spare money for this), so when the problems will be fixed. (The main desire - and this cannot be taken away from the Chinese)
        1. Zoldat_A
          Zoldat_A 10 August 2020 09: 22 New
          -2
          Quote: Lesorub
          Quote: Zoldat_A
          They ransacked the people, drove a hundred million people from the collective farms into production, we slap the outwardly working apparatus - and gloriously.

          China does not hesitate to involve specialists from other countries in the development of certain technologies (they do not spare money for this), so when the problems will be fixed. (The main desire - and this cannot be taken away from the Chinese)

          Yes, yes. My comment is 5-7 years old. 10 years ago, China did not have that much dough. And now they are holding America by the kokoshkas. And the loot pile in - and the specialists will be. America went through this in the 60s and 70s. Until the 60s, America lived on Nazi developments, and then went to outbid brains. China is now following the same path, since money allows it. China can do anything. For some reason, only a high-quality analogue of "Kalash" has not yet been made. And they will not be able to. Hands are not so sharpened ...
          1. Mavrikiy
            Mavrikiy 10 August 2020 10: 58 New
            +1
            Quote: Zoldat_A
            China can do anything. For some reason, only a high-quality analogue of "Kalash" has not yet been made. And they will not be able to. Hands are not so sharpened ...

            Quite right, but .... Hands are normal with a head problem. And "Kalash" is as simple as 3 rubles, but the head also requires production culture. The Czechs, Bulgarians and Yugoslavs had not the only licenses, but replicas came out. Czechs are also gunsmiths and experience, knowledge, and know-how (spit 3 times over the left shoulder repeat ) did not master. The Chinese love to "optimize" costs. As a result, steel is made of ... chocolate, or not hardened, or not tempered ... or the ligature is optimized.
            1. Zoldat_A
              Zoldat_A 10 August 2020 16: 46 New
              +1
              Quote: Mavrikiy
              The Czechs are also gunsmiths both experience and knowledge, but they did not master the know-how (to spit 3 times over the left shoulder).

              Did you hold the Czech "Kalash" in your hands? I was "lucky" .... belay It seems to be tradition - the Wehrmacht was supplied with weapons. like intelligent specialists ... But somehow through F ...
            2. Zoldat_A
              Zoldat_A 10 August 2020 16: 51 New
              +3
              Quote: Mavrikiy
              As a result, the steel is like ... chocolate, or not hardened, or not tempered ... or the ligature is optimized.

              Last summer I uprooted a tree stump at the dacha - FOR THE FIRST TIME IN LIFE I BROKEN A FULL-SIZED CROWBAR. Chinese. I broke mounts, even titanium ones. BUT CROWBAR, CARL !!!! How did the Chinese manage to build such an economy with such a tool? How much did you take?
              1. Mavrikiy
                Mavrikiy 10 August 2020 16: 55 New
                +1
                Quote: Zoldat_A
                FOR THE FIRST TIME IN LIFE BROKEN A FULL-SIZED SCRAP. Chinese.

                belay Bad luck. The scrap was not chocolate, but glass. request The chocolate would bend or crumple.
                1. Zoldat_A
                  Zoldat_A 10 August 2020 17: 19 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Mavrikiy
                  The scrap was not chocolate, but glass.

                  Better at least with a taste of salmon ... laughing I would have eaten with beer .... And so - threw it out.
                  1. Mavrikiy
                    Mavrikiy 11 August 2020 05: 08 New
                    0
                    Quote: Zoldat_A
                    Better at least with a taste of salmon ...

                    good Get a patent. The Chinese will appreciate it.
              2. EnGenius
                EnGenius 10 August 2020 17: 01 New
                +1
                It is cheaper to produce five Chinese yellow steel than one normal one. Although now the whole world is moving towards the production of garbage instead of normal products. The West is using the same approaches today in military equipment - no one is planning to use it for decades. As a result, the world's resources are simply recycled into trash.
                1. Zoldat_A
                  Zoldat_A 10 August 2020 17: 16 New
                  0
                  Quote: engenius
                  the whole world goes to the production of garbage instead of normal products.

                  I recommend B. Zubkov. "A fragile, fragile, fragile world ..." Just about that. There's a little story. Read it - you will not regret it. I read it in the magazine "Young Technician" and since then I remember.
                2. Mavrikiy
                  Mavrikiy 11 August 2020 05: 09 New
                  +1
                  Quote: engenius
                  As a result, the world's resources are simply recycled into trash.

                  In parallel, screaming about ecology and nature. crying
            3. Podvodnik
              Podvodnik 12 August 2020 07: 25 New
              +1
              The Chinese like to "optimize" costs


              Learn from our experience. Many years ago, at one of our very famous enterprises, a new workshop was erected for the construction of a nuclear submarine. Someone suggested saving materials at the height of the workshop and building a cinema (or a club, I don't remember already). Urrrah! Built.
              They began to assemble a modern nuclear submarine in the workshop. And do not put the sliding ones, they rest against the ceiling. And I had to roll out the order from the new one and drive it into the old shop. It was worth it both time and a lot of money.

              So we are also happy to optimize what is needed and not.

              And China will cope, they are moving forward by leaps and bounds.
        2. Mavrikiy
          Mavrikiy 10 August 2020 10: 48 New
          0
          Quote: Lesorub
          to involve specialists from other countries in the development of certain technologies, so that when the problems will be corrected.

          Someday so sho chew ... Another thing - options. If fans of dancing hopak are brought in, they will get a Stronghold, amers will be enticed - they will get Abrasha, but if our fool question.
        3. Runoway
          Runoway 10 August 2020 12: 00 New
          +2
          China does not hesitate to attract specialists from other countries in the development of certain technologies (they do not spare money for this),

          In essence, the same specialists from Antonov, given a good contract, what holds?
          Yes, those of ours, to work hard on the welfare of top managers? And in response, "there is no money, but you hold on." Not to mention how the "main specialists" in general were allowed in the world in the 90s, there is such an insult, no patriotism will block, and where to get it in the days of such capitalism (your gasoline and gas on the domestic market is more expensive than on the external to plow home for an idea ?!)
      3. Aleksandr21
        Aleksandr21 10 August 2020 09: 01 New
        +5
        Quote: Zoldat_A
        By myself, from the construction site I know that the most ingenious uncommon non-standard comes to mind when the standard does not work.


        Here, after all, China should not be belittled, in the sense that they have huge resources spent on science and education, their scientists receive / received education in the West, and in general they take from the world only the best in terms of knowledge and skills. Is it possible that a country with such a huge human resource and huge resources in all spheres will not find those who can apply their knowledge and skills outside the box? Another thing is that China in many areas acted as a catch-up (USA, USSR / Russia) where they did not have any developments at all, for example, their engines, aircraft ... but they are making great strides, and they will catch up, it's only a matter of time.
        1. Zoldat_A
          Zoldat_A 10 August 2020 09: 26 New
          -2
          Quote: Aleksandr21
          Another thing is that China in many areas acted as a catch-up (USA, USSR / Russia) where they did not have any developments at all, for example, their engines, aircraft ...

          Psychology .... It’s not the case. Bigger and faster - that's why engines are built from g .... and sticks .... Hence the result. What, on figs, engines, if they "Kalash" really can not otkserit?
          1. smart fellow
            smart fellow 10 August 2020 09: 52 New
            0
            It has long been removed from service in the PLA.
            1. Zoldat_A
              Zoldat_A 10 August 2020 17: 21 New
              +1
              Quote: smart fellow
              It has long been removed from service in the PLA.

              Do you think this is a plus for the PLA?
        2. Dmitry V.
          Dmitry V. 10 August 2020 10: 36 New
          +1
          Quote: Aleksandr21
          Here, after all, China should not be belittled, in the sense that they have huge resources spent on science and education, their scientists receive / received education in the West, and in general they take from the world only the best in terms of knowledge and skills. Is it possible that a country with such a huge human resource and huge resources in all spheres will not find those who can apply their knowledge and skills outside the box? Another thing is that China in many areas acted as a catch-up (USA, USSR / Russia) where they did not have any developments at all, for example, their engines, aircraft ... but they are making great strides, and they will catch up, it's only a matter of time.


          When you enter unexplored territory, where applied engineering is not enough, resources no longer solve anything.
          Here fundamental research is already needed - groping for a path using extensive knowledge, which is called a design school.
          Copying - when there is no understanding of how they arrived at the previous result - a lot of time will have to be spent looking for a direction for further development, repeating the mistakes of those who have already passed this path.
          Okay, they copied the finished turbine - improved and, by modernization, pulled out its design maximum from this design. Next, it is necessary to design a new one, and here the field of the unknown - from microresonances of turbines, to jumps in density and temperature, vortex flows, etc.
          https://sinref.ru/000_uchebniki/00660dvigateli/012_osnovi_teorii_avacionnih_turbo_dvagatelei_vlasenko/026.htm
          Of course, most of modern R&D is not published, is not taught at specialized faculties - this is what can be called an invaluable fund of knowledge, which is accumulated over many years, bright minds.
    3. Danila46
      Danila46 10 August 2020 09: 17 New
      +3
      how wonderful that Russia has no problems with the su-57 .............
  2. EvilLion
    EvilLion 10 August 2020 08: 11 New
    +2
    28 tons and 8 tons of payload - I'm sorry, but fairy tales. Or the machine is abnormal in strength and overweight. And on engines from the MiG-29 you will not fly far. The Americans with their miracle engine were able to reproduce the F \ A \ -18E at a new technological level. So-so interceptor, but functional. The Chinese initially have 2 engines - this is a much larger mass fraction of the power plant, but the thrust is even less. J-31 is simply stillborn initially.
    1. d4rkmesa
      d4rkmesa 10 August 2020 08: 51 New
      0
      The problem is that, in a given standard size, only the Americans have modern engines so far (F414), and maybe the British (EJ-2x0) will.
      1. dauria
        dauria 10 August 2020 19: 16 New
        0
        The problem is that in the given type size ....


        Size. That is the question so question. After all, the F-18 and F-16 were born as competitors to each other.
        And for a simple reason - the F-15 is very good, but too expensive. Make it smaller and cheaper. Then Shershen lost and went to the sailors. Two engines and a sturdy glider came in handy there.
        The F-35 is good both on land and for sale. And the tendency to increase in size is not yet visible, the warrior is satisfied with both the radius and weapons. It looks like the aviation has decided on the size.
        Then the Chinese did everything right in their position. There is a glider with a low ESR, while it will serve its term, the engines will change more than once. I think a car with a future Two engines is not very elegant. But they didn't have a Pratt & Whitney F135.
        1. voyaka uh
          voyaka uh 11 August 2020 09: 44 New
          +3
          I agree. They will make a deck boat, not a suite, but a worker.
          For an aircraft carrier to work effectively, it takes years of training, thousands of takeoffs and landings. You just need a reliable, not a record aircraft.
  3. rocket757
    rocket757 10 August 2020 08: 18 New
    +2
    if it suffers for a long time, whatever happens.
    they are just developing a real, efficient design school! it takes time and a lot, a lot of smart heads, which the computer, so far, cannot replace. Design, among other things, is creativity, imagination, intuition and everything else that a computer cannot do.
    1. rocket757
      rocket757 10 August 2020 08: 55 New
      +2
      Iteresno. There are disagreements, but WHAT will they justify their point of view?
  4. Ros 56
    Ros 56 10 August 2020 08: 23 New
    +1
    So the Russians did not give all the technologies to the Chinese, that's the problem. You don't even need to go to school here, they remind me of old Hottabych, in form everything is correct, but in essence, alas.
    1. rocket757
      rocket757 10 August 2020 09: 02 New
      +2
      Learn, give time.
      After the well-known global events, we also had to learn a lot !!! And they started with licenses, repetition of tsuzu experience and best practices. The scientific school in Russia WAS, as you know, after 1917 it became significantly impoverished .... I had to go through the path, if not anew, then a lot of time and effort was spent. But then great things began, victories !!!
  5. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 10 August 2020 08: 52 New
    -1
    How many degrees ??? 1400 C? This is unlikely.
  6. czes
    czes 10 August 2020 09: 53 New
    -1
    Why is this vyser? Pour shit on China? The Chinese will solve all the problems - a powerful scientific potential has already been formed. And in 20 years they will replace the United States as the world gendarme ...
    1. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 11 August 2020 09: 46 New
      0
      Perhaps yes. The Corona seriously crippled America. And will accelerate the Chinese economy overtaking America. And where the economy is, there is the army.
  7. Kosh
    Kosh 10 August 2020 10: 02 New
    +2
    The main problem of the J-31 is that this is an initiative development of AVIC, or, more precisely, the Shenyang Aircraft Corporation, which is part of it, and they still have not been able to convince the military to take the project under their wing and invest in it, roughly speaking, nationwide resources.
    The difficulty of using WS-15 on J-31 is that they simply don't fit. WS-15 are being created for J-20 and in terms of weight and size characteristics they are clearly not less than our AL-31 and Chinese WS-10. For the J-31, powerful engines with the mass and dimensions of the RD-33 are needed.
  8. Oleg133
    Oleg133 13 August 2020 19: 28 New
    0
    I am reporting. The British do not clean guns with bricks (c) In chemistry and chemical engineering, China is already covering the Russian Federation, like a bull, not even a sheep, but a mouse. First hand infa