Military Review

Is Roscosmos no longer a competitor to NASA? What projects is the Russian Federation developing in space and what is their main problem?

206

Roskosmos and NASA are the two largest structures in the world that manage space projects in Russia and the United States. Naturally, they can be perceived as the main competitors in the industry. But what projects have been recently implemented by Roscosmos?


There is a fairly widespread and well-founded, incidentally, opinion that the Russian space industry is, in fact, “eating up” the legacy of the Soviet state. At one time, the USSR confidently led the world space industry, but Russia, initially retaining its leading position, eventually began to yield to the United States. One of the main reasons for this situation is the lack of adequate funding from the state. But even in such a situation, Roscosmos still launches certain projects.

One of the first projects of Roscosmos, which should be noted, is the development of the manned spacecraft Orel (formerly the Federation ship). True, the development time is delayed. It has been under way since 2005, but is still incomplete. According to the project, they want to make the spacecraft capable of flying in the orbit of the moon. The cost of creating the first sample is estimated at 57,56 billion rubles.

Now the ship, which still does not exist, is planned to be adapted to making money: to deliver space tourists. But can such a strategy be called a worthy great power? It is one thing when the businessman Elon Musk talks about making money with the help of tourists, and quite another when they talk about it at the state level.


Will the new spacecraft have clear goals other than space tourism?

Of course, there is nothing wrong with space tourism, it is a good and decent income, but it cannot be considered either among the main directions of development of the space industry, or among the important areas of financing space activities. Many experts analyzing the development of the space industry believe that the increased attention to space tourism is just evidence of the absence of other, more significant, goals for a promising spacecraft, the construction of which will cost a rather serious amount.

Another very important project for Roscosmos is the Angara rocket. Its first launch took place six years ago, but so far the rocket has not entered serial production. However, they expect to do this in the very near future. The main obstacle is also of a financial nature: one rocket after the start of production will cost 4 billion rubles. At least, this is exactly the price they call it in Roscosmos.

The third important project supervised by Roskosmos is the Sphere global satellite communications system. It is assumed that by 2030 the Russian satellite network should include 638 spacecraft, including 334 communication satellites, 55 navigation satellites and 249 Earth remote sensing devices. To put them into orbit, 88 medium Soyuz-2.1b missiles, 36 Angara-1.2 light missiles and 24 Angara-A5 heavy missiles will have to be used. Roscosmos expects that Sphere will be able to compete with OneWeb and Starlink.


Construction of the second stage of the Vostochny cosmodrome - a launch complex for carrier rockets of the Angara family

In 2016, the construction of the Vostochny cosmodrome was completed. Unlike the promising projects listed above, the cosmodrome has become a reality. It is located in the Far East in the Amur Region, near the town of Tsiolkovsky. On April 28, 2016, the first successful launch of three artificial earth satellites took place from the cosmodrome. In 2022, they expect to launch an unmanned spacecraft. At the same time, in the coming decades, the Vostochny cosmodrome will not be able to replace the main Baikonur cosmodrome.

As you can see, Roskosmos has projects, but the Russian space corporation is now struggling to withstand competition with NASA. In the same United States, they do believe that Roscosmos is no longer a competitor either in terms of funding or in the number of simultaneously implemented projects. Even the head of Roscosmos, Dmitry Rogozin, has repeatedly spoken about the difficult situation associated with the underfunding of projects, although he emphasized that this is not so much a lag in development, but rather a gap in Roscosmos projects of 10-12 years. But for the modern space industry, this is a global term. Moreover, not only American, but also Chinese, as well as Indian, Japanese, and European competitors are on the way. If today Russia is still holding its positions, then what will happen in the future, and in a rather foreseeable, serious question.
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Twitter / Roscosmos
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  1. mag nit
    mag nit 2 August 2020 13: 36 New
    37
    It doesn't matter. Change the management of Roskosmos to specialists. Let the journalist Rogozin sell trampolines on the Moscow market.
    1. paul3390
      paul3390 2 August 2020 13: 42 New
      60
      Will not help. For noneshnikh bourgeois - nothing but the momentary acquisition of dough is not interested. It is not the furniture in the institution that needs to be changed, but the girls .. Under the existing system, space has not surrendered to anyone .. So, the Soviet remnants are still kept for force, nothing more .. And only the restoration of Soviet power can return us the primacy in the exploration of the universe. Like many other, no less important ..
      1. Dart2027
        Dart2027 2 August 2020 14: 14 New
        -12
        Quote: paul3390
        Under the existing system, space has not surrendered to anyone .. So, the Soviet remnants are still kept for force, nothing more .. And only the restoration of Soviet power can return us to the primacy in the exploration of the universe.

        Equality with whom? Bourgeois?
      2. mole
        mole 2 August 2020 15: 32 New
        +7
        Quote: paul3390
        Will not help. For noneshnikh bourgeois - nothing but the momentary acquisition of dough is not interested. It is not the furniture in the institution that needs to be changed, but the girls .. Under the existing system, space has not surrendered to anyone .. So, the Soviet remnants are still kept for force, nothing more .. And only the restoration of Soviet power can return us the primacy in the exploration of the universe. Like many other, no less important ..

        Well, mag nit said so, "change girls."
        Replacing "girls" who think with their left palm ("to money") will give positive changes. For some reason, designers do not lead the media (do not take specialized into account). But journalists, please! So we have what we have.
      3. mdsr
        mdsr 2 August 2020 15: 44 New
        22
        Quote: paul3390
        With the existing system - space has not surrendered to anyone .. So, for the force, the Soviet remnants are still kept, nothing more.

        yes
        In the same United States, they do believe that Roscosmos is no longer a competitor either in terms of funding or in the number of simultaneously implemented projects. Even the head of Roscosmos, Dmitry Rogozin, has repeatedly spoken about the difficult situation associated with the underfunding of projects.
        Here are the hands of the leaders of Roscosmos all the time complaining about the lack of funding. Only, I’m wondering how many billions of rubles it will cost to build this huge building on the territory of the Khrunichev plant in Moscow, comparable in size to the main building of Moscow State University on Vorobyovy Gory, for which Rogozin “drowns” so much and all these ineffective hands of Roscosmos executives moved there ?
        1. Aviator_
          Aviator_ 2 August 2020 20: 24 New
          +8
          Something similar has already been done by M.A. Poghosyan, built a huge corps for the KLA next to the LII. However, something went wrong here: the building has been empty for 5 years already (because no one needs anything), and Poghosyan just in 2015 fled from the post of President of PJSC UAC. Since then, he has been the "ambassador to Mongolia" (crossed out) - rector of the Moscow Aviation Institute. This hit hardest of all on his son born in 1986, who after graduating from the Higher School of Economics, as Vika writes, On March 18, 2013, 27-year-old Artyom Poghosyan was appointed senior vice president for economics and finance at Sukhoi Civil Aircraft [4]. Mikhail Poghosyan denies any involvement in this appointment, according to him, he “did not lobby for the appointment of his son... After his father resigned from senior positions in the United Aircraft Corporation, Artyom (for some reason, suddenly) ceased to hold the post of vice president for economics and finance at SCAC. But he did not remain without work - now he holds the position of Investment Director at the Russian Helicopters holding
          1. Boris ⁣ Shaver
            Boris ⁣ Shaver 3 August 2020 03: 24 New
            +2
            Quote: Aviator_
            But he did not remain without work - now he holds the position of Investment Director at the Russian Helicopters holding

            Serdyukov pulled up. Tom needs such personnel.
        2. Aleksey60
          Aleksey60 3 August 2020 06: 17 New
          -4
          Only, I'm wondering how many billion rubles will it cost to build this huge building.
          You will be surprised, but Roskosmos will cost nothing to build the National Space Center.
          Firstly, construction is carried out at the expense of funds allocated by the city. Roscosmos does not invest its funds. Secondly, it is not an “office” that is being built, but a modern, equipped with “the latest technology” engineering center for Russian missile engineers.

          https://forbes-ru.turbopages.org/s/forbes.ru/tehnologii/402477-eto-ih-voyna-ne-nasha-dmitriy-rogozin-otvetil-na-zapusk-crew-dragon-ilona-maska
          By the way, it will look completely different.
          1. Dmitry V.
            Dmitry V. 5 August 2020 16: 15 New
            -1
            Quote: Aleksey60
            You will be surprised, but Roskosmos will cost nothing to build the National Space Center.


            The rocketeers need stands, laboratories, equipment and machines for prototyping new products, and not "offices" for managers of "d..effective"
        3. fruit_cake
          fruit_cake 3 August 2020 12: 16 New
          0
          looks like provincial traders
      4. Snail N9
        Snail N9 2 August 2020 15: 49 New
        23
        For noneshnikh bourgeois - nothing but the momentary acquisition of dough is not interested.


        1. BAI
          BAI 2 August 2020 16: 31 New
          +9
          Something strange. With almost the same length, the displacement differs by almost 3 times. Moreover, warships have never suffered from empty internal volumes. It is unlikely that the yacht is made of gold. Somewhere crap.
          1. Snail N9
            Snail N9 2 August 2020 16: 55 New
            +2
            I think the displacement is exaggerated by 10000 tons. Most likely, the picture showed that the yacht, in terms of displacement and size, is still larger than a frigate.
            1. Grazdanin
              Grazdanin 2 August 2020 18: 30 New
              12
              162,5 meters 13 tons
              https://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eclipse_(яхта)
            2. Malyuta
              Malyuta 2 August 2020 18: 40 New
              +6
              Quote: Snail N9
              I think the displacement is exaggerated by 10000 tons. Most likely, the picture showed that the yacht, in terms of displacement and size, is still larger than a frigate.

              Evil tongues argue that the displacement of the yachts of Putin's oligarchs is greater than the displacement of surface ships of the Russian Navy.
              1. Grazdanin
                Grazdanin 2 August 2020 18: 48 New
                +4
                The main thing is that the oligarchs' submarines do not become larger than the Russian Navy
                https://www.avito.ru/moskva/vodnyy_transport/podvodnaya_lodka_1790682624?utm_campaign=native&utm_medium=item_page_ios&utm_source=soc_sharing
                1. Malyuta
                  Malyuta 2 August 2020 18: 53 New
                  +5
                  Quote: Grazdanin
                  The main thing is that the oligarchs' submarines do not become larger than the Russian Navy

                  Abramovich, Usmanov, Deripaska definitely have underwater vehicles on their yachts. And also there are some elements of air defense.
          2. Blackmokona
            Blackmokona 2 August 2020 20: 20 New
            +1
            Height and width
          3. Ross xnumx
            Ross xnumx 2 August 2020 20: 30 New
            +4
            Quote: BAI
            Somewhere crap.

            Calculate:
            Dilbar is ranked in the top 5 superyachts by most of the main parameters, while boasting the world's largest internal volume and a record displacement of 15917 gross tonnes. Much more interesting can be noted in this technically super-complicated huge luxury:
            - construction took 52 months, cost about $ 650 million;
            - length 156 meters, 60 cabins, more than 80 crew members;
            - maximum speed 42 km / h, cruising speed 33 km / h;
            - 2 helipads and a 25-meter swimming pool;
            - comfortable accommodation for 36 guests.
          4. lazy
            lazy 4 August 2020 09: 06 New
            0
            crap in the Russian-language wikipedia, in the English-language version the displacement is 4000t https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Raya_(yacht). and the fact that the one who sculpts these pictures confuses displacement and gross tonnage (volume) either because of illiteracy or on purpose
          5. nickname7
            nickname7 6 August 2020 13: 19 New
            0
            ... With almost the same length, the displacement differs by almost 3 times

            This is a confusion in terms, in this case the gross tonnage is indicated, and the displacement of the Dilbar yacht is 4100 tons. But Usmanov has another smaller yacht, Ona, which is 110m long. The total displacement of the oligarch's mini-fleet will be greater than the frigate. It would be interesting to calculate the total tonnage of the Russian oligarchs' megayachts.
        2. lazy
          lazy 4 August 2020 09: 01 New
          0
          firstly, she is no longer Usmanov since the age of 18. secondly, in the English version of Wikipedia, where one does not need to be propagandistic, its displacement is reduced to 4000 tons.
      5. Consul
        Consul 3 August 2020 01: 36 New
        14
        Quote: paul3390
        With the existing system

        Under the existing system, we will not be able to do anything great, as it was in the USSR.
        Quote: paul3390
        So, for the force the Soviet remnants are still kept, nothing more

        Only all the Soviet belongs to a handful of oligarchs.
        Quote: paul3390
        only the restoration of Soviet power

        good
      6. Boris ⁣ Shaver
        Boris ⁣ Shaver 3 August 2020 03: 20 New
        +6
        Quote: paul3390
        noneshnikh bourgeois - nothing but the momentary acquisition of dough is not interested.

        Quote: paul3390
        the restoration of Soviet power can return us to primacy

        The only problem is that it was the representatives of this very Soviet power that once decided that henceforth they want to be bourgeois, who are not interested in anything other than making money. Here we need to think more deeply - unfortunately, there are no ready-made solutions today.
      7. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
        Kuzmich Sibiryakov 3 August 2020 14: 05 New
        +1
        Do you understand what you are writing about? What bourgeoisie, Roskosmos is a state-owned firm, and an official appointed by the President is driving it.
        Further. What Soviet groundwork are you talking about? Soviet iron, with the most desperate desire to do, will not work. There are no materials obtained using Soviet technologies, no equipment, it has died for twenty years already, no components for electrical radio elements, no hydraulics, no pneumatics, no management programs of those near computers that control all modes ... There is only what has already been adapted to the present.
        1. Boris ⁣ Shaver
          Boris ⁣ Shaver 3 August 2020 14: 43 New
          0
          Quote: Kuzmich Sibiryakov
          Roscosmos is a state-owned firm and is run by an official appointed by the President.

          So this is what is especially alarming. Really ...?! In business ...
        2. nickname7
          nickname7 6 August 2020 13: 43 New
          +1
          ... What Soviet groundwork are you talking about?

          The main machines, technologies, spacecraft, as well as the Soviet cosmodrome. The proton was developed in 1967. Unlike Falcon, newly designed and built from scratch.

          ... Soviet iron, with the most desperate desire to do, will not work

          It is true that the ancients did not have time to finish the "science" module, and it is still gathering dust in the warehouse.
          ... no equipment, it has died for twenty years already, no electrical components, no hydraulics, no pneumatics,

          So what we are talking about, without the USSR they cannot launch the rover, but something else remains from the ancient civilization, then we have to use it. Effective fundamentally cannot be new.
          1. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
            Kuzmich Sibiryakov 6 August 2020 19: 10 New
            -2
            Quote: nickname7
            ... What Soviet groundwork are you talking about?

            The main machines, technologies, spacecraft, as well as the Soviet cosmodrome. The proton was developed in 1967. Unlike Falcon, newly designed and built from scratch.

            ... Soviet iron, with the most desperate desire to do, will not work

            It is true that the ancients did not have time to finish the "science" module, and it is still gathering dust in the warehouse.
            ... no equipment, it has died for twenty years already, no electrical components, no hydraulics, no pneumatics,

            So what we are talking about, without the USSR they cannot launch the rover, but something else remains from the ancient civilization, then we have to use it. Effective fundamentally cannot be new.


            The machines of the Soviet period rotted away already in 1970. Remained only in the village forges.
      8. Trotil42
        Trotil42 4 August 2020 12: 35 New
        +1
        Quote: paul3390
        Will not help. For noneshnikh bourgeois - nothing but the momentary acquisition of dough is not interested. It is not the furniture in the institution that needs to be changed, but the girls .. Under the existing system, space has not surrendered to anyone .. So, the Soviet remnants are still kept for force, nothing more .. And only the restoration of Soviet power can return us the primacy in the exploration of the universe. Like many other, no less important ..

        God ... what nonsense ...real bourgeois... like Bill Gates bequeathed their fortune to the state ..Real bourgeois like Masks ..For 18 years, from scratch, the reusable Falcon 9 launch vehicle and the Falcon Heavy launch vehicle, the Dragon reusable unmanned cargo ship, the Crew Dragon reusable manned spacecraft, have been created. Now we are assembling the Dragon 2nd generation cargo ship. Created own engines Merlin, Kestrel, Draco, SuperDraco and Raptor. Plus a spacesuit and the construction of a cosmodrome ... Plus Tesla ..Don't confuse thieves with bourgeois ...
        https://avatars.mds.yandex.net/get-zen_doc/3524431/pub_5efa3f6eecb0ad052b7c89ff_5efa3fb55448d17a7e76f4b4/scale_2400
        1. vvnab
          vvnab 5 August 2020 07: 40 New
          0
          They are not real. The real ones are in the shade and use masks and gates as bait for fools.
      9. nickname7
        nickname7 6 August 2020 12: 18 New
        0
        Roscosmos does not exist by itself, it depends on the state of the economy, education, finances of the Russian Federation, and with this it is sad, since the basis of the economy is the export of raw materials.
        At the same Musk in the rear, the most technologically developed and richest country, hence the success. The raw materials appendage cannot compete with the technical leader.
        The RF needs to move to reindustrialization, but this is not possible with compradors.
        1. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
          Kuzmich Sibiryakov 6 August 2020 19: 14 New
          -2
          Quote: nickname7
          Roscosmos does not exist by itself, it depends on the state of the economy, education, finances of the Russian Federation, and with this it is sad, since the basis of the economy is the export of raw materials.
          At the same Musk in the rear, the most technologically developed and richest country, hence the success. The raw materials appendage cannot compete with the technical leader.
          The RF needs to move to reindustrialization, but this is not possible with compradors.

          Who brought to the state of the raw materials economy? Who hasn't developed modern, competitive production? This is not done for a year, not two, not ten. This was done all 80 years of Soviet power, when it was not the goods that were important, in the physical sense, but the report in the reports, when the postscripts, deception and concealment of opportunities ... When the borders of the USSR WERE, it was possible to somehow live, cooking in a boiler with own juice. But when the borders were gone, it became clear to everyone where we were and what we were worth ...
    2. aleksejkabanets
      aleksejkabanets 2 August 2020 13: 44 New
      12
      Quote: mag nit
      Change the management of Roskosmos to specialists. Let the journalist Rogozin sell trampolines on the Moscow market.

      I'm afraid this is not enough.
      1. Svarog
        Svarog 2 August 2020 14: 40 New
        18
        Quote: aleksejkabanets
        Quote: mag nit
        Change the management of Roskosmos to specialists. Let the journalist Rogozin sell trampolines on the Moscow market.

        I'm afraid this is not enough.

        The development of astronautics, as well as other serious industries, be it microelectronics, pharmaceutical industry, mechanical engineering ... is impossible without the active participation of the state. In order to develop the above industries, first of all, it is necessary to have a state, not an LLC .. and for this, in turn, statesmen are needed at the helm, and not swindlers. Well, the goal, the ideology should be. Now there is no goal, no ideology, no people capable of creating for the good of the country and the people.
        1. Malyuta
          Malyuta 2 August 2020 18: 41 New
          +4
          Quote: Svarog
          Now there is no goal, no ideology, no people capable of creating for the good of the country and the people.

          Theft and sawing are the main braces.
        2. Ross xnumx
          Ross xnumx 2 August 2020 20: 34 New
          +7
          Quote: Svarog
          Now there is no goal, no ideology, no people capable of creating for the good of the country and the people.

          Now the main tasks: to get access to the cut of the budget dough; apply for citizenship and stake out real estate abroad; withdraw maximum funds abroad; leave the place of residence with minimal losses (arrests, confiscations, landings) ...
          yes
          1. nickname7
            nickname7 6 August 2020 12: 28 New
            +1
            .tasks: get access to the cut of the budget dough; apply for citizenship and stake out real estate abroad; withdraw maximum funds abroad

            There was funny news, a certain mother-in-law was suing her son-in-law in California, as the son-in-law stole her property. It was a family of bureaucrats who were withdrawing money from the Russian Federation.
        3. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
          Kuzmich Sibiryakov 3 August 2020 14: 14 New
          0
          Delusion. Roscosmos is precisely the state. What is needed is not officials who, by virtue of their skill, rule the industry, but simply loot. Changing the very concept of space exploration - the growth in the size and carrying capacity of rockets and ships became a dead end for the USSR and Russia. We have launch sites on land, in the interior of the continent. Transportation of bulky items for general assembly by rail is not possible. To do this, we went to crazy expenses - they made a transport superplane - ANT 225. The States carry their oversized cargo by sea. They concentrated their start-ups and production on the coast. Baikonur fell off, and there will no longer be an opportunity to launch not only poisonous Protons, but any. The most southern starting points are in the Far Eastern taiga, where cities and factories need to be set up again. Again trillions of expenses. So, think before you write nonsense.
          1. Narak-zempo
            Narak-zempo 4 August 2020 08: 33 New
            -1
            So now Crimea is ours - there we need to build a cosmodrome. Not Cape Canaveral, of course, but more profitable than in the taiga. All that remains is to make Yuzhmash ours. Yes, there, too, you have to invest in building the "Angara". But the Dnieper is at hand - load on a barge and carry it to the Crimea by sea.
            1. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
              Kuzmich Sibiryakov 4 August 2020 10: 44 New
              +1
              Quote: Narak-zempo
              So now Crimea is ours - there we need to build a cosmodrome. Not Cape Canaveral, of course, but more profitable than in the taiga. All that remains is to make Yuzhmash ours. Yes, there, too, you have to invest in building the "Angara". But the Dnieper is at hand - load on a barge and carry it to the Crimea by sea.

              Nonsense. We need take-off routes, mainly to the north of the launch point, free for the fall of parts of carriers, stages, both in normal mode and in emergency mode. To the distance of launching into orbit, and this is hundreds of kilometers. In Crimea, free zones are only to the south. And this makes the launches categorically unprofitable from the point of view of the launch energy. It is good to start up only to the north, counting your own coordinates as the beginning. From THIS point of view, the Northern Arctic is good. But, the launch coordinates themselves are far from the equator, which again reduces the mass of the satellite launched by the same carrier. The best place in the USSR was just Baikonur. Desert, and the most southern location. Lack of settlements near neighbors, on the takeoff route outside the USSR, in which case, suffering from ..... Desert areas in the landing zones of descent vehicles.
              1. Narak-zempo
                Narak-zempo 4 August 2020 11: 06 New
                -1
                Quote: Kuzmich Sibiryakov
                We need take-off routes, mainly to the north of the start point, free for the fall of parts of the carriers

                Isn't there a free territory? For 500 km in a straight line to the Belgorod region - country 404.
                1. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
                  Kuzmich Sibiryakov 6 August 2020 19: 17 New
                  -2
                  Quote: Narak-zempo
                  Quote: Kuzmich Sibiryakov
                  We need take-off routes, mainly to the north of the start point, free for the fall of parts of the carriers

                  Isn't there a free territory? For 500 km in a straight line to the Belgorod region - country 404.

                  Disgusting joke.
              2. Narak-zempo
                Narak-zempo 4 August 2020 11: 10 New
                -1
                Quote: Kuzmich Sibiryakov
                The best place in the USSR was just Baikonur

                Well, it's time to remember whose cities are Akmolinsk and Verny, and whose Turkestan in general.
                1. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
                  Kuzmich Sibiryakov 6 August 2020 19: 19 New
                  -2
                  Quote: Narak-zempo
                  Quote: Kuzmich Sibiryakov
                  The best place in the USSR was just Baikonur

                  Well, it's time to remember whose cities are Akmolinsk and Verny, and whose Turkestan in general.

                  I remembered. And what has changed from this? Sculpting a humpback is not a rewarding business. Nobody will buy.
          2. nickname7
            nickname7 6 August 2020 12: 31 New
            0
            ... Roscosmos is precisely the state.

            You cannot distinguish an organization from a country?
            Roscosmos is not a country or a state.
            It is more convenient to launch from the equator, this is their advantage.
            1. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
              Kuzmich Sibiryakov 6 August 2020 19: 21 New
              -2
              Quote: nickname7
              ... Roscosmos is precisely the state.

              You cannot distinguish an organization from a country?
              Roscosmos is not a country or a state.
              It is more convenient to launch from the equator, this is their advantage.

              Are you quite already? .... Where is the wallet, that is the thing. So how does Roscosmos differ from a state thing? Who pays him and who dances him? About the equator, of course. For this, Sea Launch was bought from private traders. So as not to be scrapped. Not only because you can shoot from the equator. And from anywhere in the water area. That is, with any angle of inclination of the orbit. This allows you not to waste fuel there in orbit. You can't drag much there.
      2. Consul
        Consul 3 August 2020 01: 38 New
        14
        Quote: aleksejkabanets
        Quote: mag nit
        Change the management of Roskosmos to specialists. Let the journalist Rogozin sell trampolines on the Moscow market.

        I'm afraid this is not enough.

        Indeed, this is not enough. It is necessary to completely change the entire existing system.
    3. Ilshat
      Ilshat 2 August 2020 14: 18 New
      +5
      Plant the reptile.
      He has so much theft that it suggests a fish and a head.
      1. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 2 August 2020 20: 36 New
        +5
        Quote: Ilshat
        Plant the reptile.
        He has so much theft that it suggests a fish and a head.

        Nice man! Yes, we would have planted! Yes, you did not write - what a bastard! wassat
        1. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
          Kuzmich Sibiryakov 3 August 2020 14: 27 New
          +1
          The Scottish poet of the time of Alexander I, Robert Burns, wrote: “The king will appoint his lackey general.
          But he will not be able to appoint anyone an honest fellow. "
      2. skullcap
        skullcap 3 August 2020 18: 08 New
        0
        Plant the reptile.

        In any matter, you need to know the history.
        I want to remind you that the last Soviet leader of space programs was academician Sagdeev. Under his leadership, several missions to Mars, Halley's comet, and others were ruined in a row. On the spacecraft to the comet, according to an official message, one of the instruments was completely forgotten to turn on.
        Immediately after perestroika, he moved to the United States, where he once received citizenship and married the granddaughter of US President Eisenhower.
        Uncle was so unexpectedly lucky.
        In general, the story is muddy and Sagdeev's personnel probably still control our space industry.
        So Rogozin, most likely, is only reaping the fruits of Sagdeev's crops.
        1. Ilshat
          Ilshat 3 August 2020 21: 21 New
          -1
          Still, Sagdeev was a director in 1973-1988.
          Who started then - retired, 32 years have passed ...
          Is it too?
        2. A.TOR
          A.TOR 4 August 2020 17: 39 New
          0
          The Soviet history of SCIENTIFIC interest in space research is associated with Roald Sagdeev to an absolute and unconditional degree. It was he who insisted on carrying out truly scientific programs to study the planets of the solar system, and it was he who promoted the first Soviet programs for the exploration of deep space. SCIENTIFIC, i.e. interested in the structure of the universe, and not in military-applied acts. Koi burned immeasurable funds on often sucked out of thin air "threats" and tales, told to members of the Politburo by interested comrades
        3. nickname7
          nickname7 6 August 2020 12: 48 New
          0
          ... academician Sagdeev. Under his leadership, several missions to Mars were ruined in a row,

          This is not his personal fault, at 90 they did not pay salaries, they turned off the electricity, the leading engineers dropped everything and emigrated.
          It was impossible to give up and it was impossible to do, as a result there were enough opportunities for a raw product.
    4. Svetlana
      Svetlana 2 August 2020 14: 21 New
      -10
      The top management bench is not that big. And changing for the sake of changing will only aggravate the situation. Moreover, the lag of the space industry is not based on spaceports and launches, but on the production of space-class microchips.
      1. Ilshat
        Ilshat 2 August 2020 14: 38 New
        +6
        Oh really?!!
        "Linux and conventional x86 processors are the brain of the most advanced SpaceX Falcon 9 rocket" - https://itc.ua/blogs/linux-i-obychnye-x86-proczessory-mozg-samoj-peredovoj-rakety-spacex-falcon -nine/

        Chips are important, but not so and not in this context.
        I heard a ringing but you don't know where he is.
        1. Svetlana
          Svetlana 2 August 2020 14: 40 New
          +2
          Read up on Space-type chips, and then pounce.
          1. Ilshat
            Ilshat 2 August 2020 14: 47 New
            +1
            And so I know!
            They are not needed for rockets, this is not an opinion - practice has shown falcon-s fly!
            And they fly on consumer goods.
            And for satellites there are different requirements depending on ... a lot can be written, but for a space cab driver like Roscosmos, this is certainly not the main thing.
        2. UserGun
          UserGun 2 August 2020 15: 42 New
          0
          And what, in the Russian Federation have already learned how to make x86 processors and real, and not on paper for executives, realtime core ?! )))
          1. Ilshat
            Ilshat 2 August 2020 17: 00 New
            +1
            Quote: UserGun
            realtime core ?!

            I did not understand this.

            There are Russian processors and linux is ported to them.
            1. UserGun
              UserGun 2 August 2020 22: 44 New
              0
              Quote: Ilshat
              There are Russian processors and linux is ported to them.


              They emulate work x86))) Another architecture, which they love to boast about))) If you understand this ... By the way, because of this, they also slow down not childishly in applications where the native code for x86 is required))) Well this understandably, miracles do not happen, "miracles" are for suckers and stupid propaganda)))
              1. Ilshat
                Ilshat 3 August 2020 02: 40 New
                +1
                Do not write what you do not understand at all.
                Have a phone?
                Most of them are on android, that is, on linux, with arm architecture ...
                And it does not emulate anything, android is built for arm, natively.
                And apple on arm, their axis, based on freebsd, is also assembled under arm.
                In general, you are absolutely not in the subject, fence complete nonsense.
                1. UserGun
                  UserGun 3 August 2020 12: 10 New
                  -2
                  You are a narrow-minded person))) Only now you said that arm has its own software compiled for the given architecture ))) Got the difference ?! ))) Well, try to run the software for your phone on a PC))) Have you laughed at yourself ?! ))) There are cross-platform applications, but! they are vanishingly few compared to the total amount of software for this architecture. ALL software will never be recompiled by anyone in their right mind and memory... That is why, inside processors of widespread use (and this is exactly how your "super-duper" processors are positioned) they sew instructions emulating the native code of another architecture at the hardware level ))) Finished my short course?
                  1. Ilshat
                    Ilshat 3 August 2020 12: 18 New
                    0
                    You weren't even close to developing.
                    It's about Russian processors and missiles.
                    Emulators are of limited use and are not used in such applications.
                    There is no ready-made software for a rocket or a welding machine.
                    The developer (s) write it themselves and compile it for the target architecture.
                    Got it?
                    No need to show your nonsense - the rocket is not a telephone at all.
                    1. UserGun
                      UserGun 3 August 2020 12: 21 New
                      -2
                      Hey-hey !!! You are even more stupid than I thought. Goodbye!
                      1. Ilshat
                        Ilshat 3 August 2020 12: 22 New
                        0
                        Roll with sausage and do not litter on the forum.
                      2. aiden
                        aiden 7 August 2020 00: 37 New
                        0
                        Dita, and another question for you, why are the coolest super computers built on a architecture similar to Elbrus? I am ashamed of you and your generation. Such as you are really a godsend for Intel and AMD.
                2. UserGun
                  UserGun 3 August 2020 12: 19 New
                  -1
                  And apple on arm, their axis, based on freebsd, is also assembled under arm.
                  In general, you are absolutely not in the subject, fence complete nonsense.


                  This is where you saw mac OS on arm? Is your head all right ?! ))) No, well, now apples are going to abandon Intel, but they are only going to. Which of us has nonsense in our heads, this is still a question))) Goodbye, my dear naive boy kull-hatskir, who hears the ringing, but does not know where he is.
                  1. Ilshat
                    Ilshat 3 August 2020 12: 22 New
                    0
                    Stop raving!
                    The iPhone 11 features an Apple A13 processor with six ARMv8 processing cores!
                    If it is zero at all - fucking litter the topic?
                    1. UserGun
                      UserGun 3 August 2020 12: 24 New
                      -2
                      And do you despise poppies on the table and laptops in Kull-hatskir style ?! Yyyyyy !!! )))
                      1. Ilshat
                        Ilshat 3 August 2020 12: 26 New
                        -1
                        It was about the telephone.
                        Verbal diarrhea doesn't go away, does it?
                      2. UserGun
                        UserGun 3 August 2020 12: 32 New
                        -1
                        What is the phone number in FIG))) You are here an expert on processors installed on rockets, started talking nonsense about Rushen's "super-duper" stones, but as it turned out later they turned out to be a layman))) And on the fly changed into sneakers to carry other nonsense about phones ))) Do not try to seem better than you are, you are not Kisselt. you are far from them. So now for sure GOOD BYE!
                      3. Ilshat
                        Ilshat 3 August 2020 12: 34 New
                        0
                        I am burned, yes you are a sclerotic campaign!
                        The phone was, for example, a non-x86 architecture.
                        And "Rushen super-duper stones" exist and are used, and even if you shy away, there will be no sense!
                      4. UserGun
                        UserGun 3 August 2020 12: 50 New
                        0
                        Quote: Ilshat
                        And "Rushen super-duper stones" exist and are used, and even if you shy away, there will be no sense!


                        YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY !!!!



                        "Even at the design stage of MP Elbrus, the developers had an understanding of the importance of supporting software written for the Intel x86 architecture. For this, a system of dynamic (ie, during program execution, or "on the fly") translation of x86 binary codes into Elbrus processor codes was implemented... In fact, the binary translation system creates a virtual machine that runs an x86 guest OS. Thanks to several levels of optimization, it is possible to achieve a high speed of the translated code (see diagrams above). The quality of x86 architecture emulation is confirmed by the successful launch of more than 20 operating systems (including several versions of Windows) and hundreds of applications on the Elbrus platform. "

                        http://elbrus.ru/elbrus_arch

                        Hospad, how many such idiots who do not know anything, but have a narrow-minded opinion and carry nonsense in the name of something that others instilled in them ...
                      5. Ilshat
                        Ilshat 3 August 2020 13: 12 New
                        +1
                        Stupid, for missiles no finished software.
                        What is not clear?
                        In rockets, broadcast is not needed or used.
                        So in rockets and in some kind of IoT, do not care!
                        Discover the word embedded
                      6. UserGun
                        UserGun 3 August 2020 13: 19 New
                        -2
                        Quote: Ilshat
                        Discover the word embedded


                        ABOUT! Embedded Windows XP is running at my booth. laughing Old, of course, like mammoth dung, but nevertheless laughing laughing laughing
                      7. Ilshat
                        Ilshat 3 August 2020 13: 21 New
                        0
                        Woooo!
                        It can be seen, foolishly.
                        Put a centos and don't be fooled.
                      8. UserGun
                        UserGun 3 August 2020 13: 26 New
                        -1
                        Does this mean that all the software needs to be redone all over again ?! Monsieur knows a lot about perversions laughing Above I have already spoken about idiots.
                      9. Ilshat
                        Ilshat 3 August 2020 13: 27 New
                        0
                        You still don't know how.
                        It is evident that he is not a programmer ...
                      10. UserGun
                        UserGun 3 August 2020 13: 33 New
                        -1
                        In the same way, you can say that you are not an intelligent person if you are offering deliberate nonsense, without even offering another axis. And I have VxWorks spinning on the controller there. Such are the pies.
                      11. Ilshat
                        Ilshat 3 August 2020 13: 35 New
                        -3
                        Also a gamna mammoth.
                        QNX 2 in your trash heap?
                        Why talk to you, so ...
                      12. UserGun
                        UserGun 3 August 2020 13: 41 New
                        -1
                        Of course of course! In such cases, I say that there are two packets TCP / IP and UDP wink One with guaranteed delivery, the other, as God will put on his soul))) I do not need to portray a kull-hatskir at work laughing
        3. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
          Kuzmich Sibiryakov 4 August 2020 10: 53 New
          0
          Ah, well, hot guys. Set up a dump somewhere off to the side and fight there. This is not about processors.
  • aiden
    aiden 7 August 2020 00: 18 New
    0
    Lover of detective games. Why is Elbrus architecture bad? And I will answer you with your own game examples. Why on consoles. Playstation 3 has a processor similar to Elbrus, 256 MB of RAM and 256 MB of video memory. And at the same time, there are no hints of freezing. And why even modern processors with tons of gigahertz and video cards with 8 gigabytes of memory can't handle ps3 games normally. Why a piece of iron with much low technical characteristics makes a piece of hardware huge numbers
    You still write about x86 emulation. Do you even know what it is? My advice to you is not to write your nonsense anywhere else. And then they will take you for the mother's technician. By the way, intel and amd are welded on people like you thanks to gigahertz.
  • Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx 2 August 2020 20: 42 New
    +3
    Quote: Svetlana
    The executive bench is not that big.

    The defendant's bench is even smaller. Few (Ulyukaev) and not for long (Serdyukov) managed to get to it from the manager's bench ...
    We are throwing thunder and lightning at the head of the Central Bank (the gorged Nabiullina), but the leadership has other thoughts:

    Maybe the work of Roscosmos does not suit (upset) only us? belay
  • Kuzmich Sibiryakov
    Kuzmich Sibiryakov 6 August 2020 20: 13 New
    -1
    Quote: Svetlana
    The top management bench is not that big. And changing for the sake of changing will only aggravate the situation. Moreover, the lag of the space industry is not based on spaceports and launches, but on the production of space-class microchips.

    The basis, of course, is not the chips. Don't write nonsense. The basis is precision engineering. Precision equipment, mathematics, complex control systems, which can be assembled on anything. What have so many swooped down on? On American or Korean chips?
  • Grading
    Grading 2 August 2020 16: 22 New
    +8
    The change in leadership will not affect the result, it's time to say goodbye to space
    1. dSK
      dSK 2 August 2020 18: 52 New
      0
      And not only space -
      MOSCOW, Aug 2 - RIA Novosti. The Ministry of Finance proposed to reduce the amount of funding for the state program "Ensuring the country's defense"for the next three years by about 323 billion rubles.
      1. dSK
        dSK 2 August 2020 19: 00 New
        -3
        When China completes its ISS, Roscosmos will carry Chinese astronauts there. Expansion of cooperation with China is inevitable.
        In schools, it is necessary to learn not only English but also Chinese.
        1. Grazdanin
          Grazdanin 2 August 2020 19: 27 New
          10
          Only Chinese cosmonauts will fly to the Chinese station, only on Chinese rockets. For them, we are suppliers of technologies and some components. All.
  • Yun Klob
    Yun Klob 2 August 2020 22: 23 New
    +1
    Rogozin let the trampolines weave.
  • nickname7
    nickname7 6 August 2020 12: 03 New
    0
    A competitor, but only in terms of top managers' salaries.
  • Dizel200
    Dizel200 2 August 2020 13: 39 New
    +2
    "effective" managers, fig)))
    1. paul3390
      paul3390 2 August 2020 14: 12 New
      14
      "Effective" managers at the head of the entire state are really scary .. And Roscosmos is just a consequence ..
  • Phoenix
    Phoenix 2 August 2020 13: 43 New
    -10
    Roskosmos delivers astronauts to the ISS in 6 hours from more northern, less convenient spaceports. NASA in 19 hours from spaceports close to the equator. Who is not a competitor to whom? Are the evaluation criteria taken from Musk's commercial posters?
    1. Zeev zeev
      Zeev zeev 2 August 2020 13: 59 New
      +8
      Well, you know, in 50 years of Soyuz flights and in 20 years of flights to the ISS (a little less, but still), you can still calculate the most favorable flight trajectory and work it out. It is rather strange to expect the same in the first manned launch.
      1. Aleksey60
        Aleksey60 3 August 2020 06: 42 New
        -1
        for 50 years of flights of "Soyuz" and for 20 years of flights to the ISS (a little less, but still), you can still calculate the most advantageous flight path and work it out. To expect the same in the first manned launch is rather strange.
        Musk, what's the first time you launch a rocket? lol
        It all depends on the accuracy of the derivation. The Soyuz-2 launch vehicle makes it possible to achieve accuracy in altitude placement with an error of no more than 5 kilometers. This indicator for the Soyuz-FG launch vehicle, using an analog system, was up to plus or minus 42 km.
    2. snucerist
      snucerist 2 August 2020 14: 56 New
      20
      The question "Who is not a competitor to whom?" delivered correctly.
      Roscosmos is no longer a competitor not even to NASA, but to Mask alone.
      Delivery time is the only (so far) argument that testifies to the epochal achievements of today's Roscosmos (on Soviet carriers, by the way)?
      The assessment criteria are available in many sources, including Russian ones. Why flood?
      Are you having a hard time finding the launch price of a nine for a commercial flight? Information is the sea. With a new stage and with those who have already flown. Google to the rescue. Or do you not know how much the same Roscosmos began to tear from the same HASA for a passenger seat immediately after the announcement of the closure of the Space Shuttle program? Let me remind you: about twice as much. Immediately and without explanation. This gave Obama a reason to give the command to revive the manned sector and led to the emergence of Musk, who is laying the Russian state astronautics on its blades today. How can we not recall our prophetic "greed of a frayer destroys"?
      As for the article - you can agree with something, with something not.
      Why mention QC Eagle / Federation? What can you talk about there? About the plastic model at the exhibition? Or that KK eventually gained such weight in the calculations that there was no carrier for it in Russia? SpaceX began development of the Dragon spacecraft in late 2004. On October 8, 2012, the Dragon ship has already departed for the International Space Station as part of a cargo mission. And on May 30, 2014, Musk presented a manned version of the Dragon spacecraft, called the Dragon V2. The flooding of which is expected today.
      The Russian monopoly on passenger transportation in space, apparently, is coming to an end. As for commercial cargo, you can forget about them completely and irrevocably, here Musk completely cut off the oxygen.
      Angara, yes, a failed project. Both in terms of price and weight of withdrawn PN. In the civilian sector, she is not in a position to compete with the Mask; only the RF Ministry of Defense can be in demand.
      Can Sphere compete with Starlink? Well ... it's not even funny.
      As for the East - to the point. So far, this is wasted money, judging by the planned modernization of the Baikonur launch pads. Miscalculations with logistics do not fit into the head at all.
      What is the bottom line in the asset?
      Oh yes, Mr. Rogozin is successfully building a new rocket. True, for some reason, stone and not for the needs of specifically space.
      1. Grazdanin
        Grazdanin 2 August 2020 15: 09 New
        +7
        Quote: snucerist
        Roscosmos is no longer a competitor not even to NASA, but to Mask alone.

        Quite right. The comparison is based on Musk, not NASA. For example, Thedrive published an interview with a scientist about a system launched on an orbiting aircraft X-37B to collect solar energy and transfer it to earth. https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/35167/we-talk-to-the-scientist-whose-revolutionary-power-beaming-experiment-is-flying-on-the-x-37b
      2. Vadim237
        Vadim237 2 August 2020 22: 57 New
        +2
        Well, in this project, the construction of a building in the form of a rocket will not be
        and the rocket will be inside
        half of the premises will be rented out for offices.
      3. Aleksey60
        Aleksey60 3 August 2020 06: 50 New
        -4
        Are you having a hard time finding the launch price of a nine for a commercial flight?
        What is "nine" and what does a commercial launch have to do with it?
        Let me remind you: about twice as much.
        twice what?
        And then you carry a blizzard.
        1. snucerist
          snucerist 3 August 2020 09: 56 New
          +3
          Satisfy curiosity.
          1. "Nine" - this is the RN Mask of the Falcon 9 by analogy with the royal "seven". Which displays both commercial aircraft and manned spacecraft.
          2. Double the price originally stated. Is this unclear from the context? I can clarify: in 2006, a seat in the Union cost the US $ 21,3 million. Immediately after the closure of the Space Shuttle program, the price suddenly jumped and by 2020 reached $ 86 million. Not sickly, right? On average, the United States paid Russia $ 55,4 million for a seat.
          3. I do not accept any further arguments about the blizzard. This is a childish conversation. Be so kind as to provide specific counterarguments with numbers and calculations.
    3. Topgun
      Topgun 3 August 2020 10: 45 New
      -1
      "northern latitudes" are not beneficial for launching into geostationary orbit, in other cases the loss is either not large or not at all
      and now open Google and google the history of the ISS and find out that its orbit was not just taken from the ceiling, but thought out for the convenience of flights from Baikonur ...
    4. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
      Kuzmich Sibiryakov 4 August 2020 11: 00 New
      -1
      Quote: Phoenix
      Roskosmos delivers astronauts to the ISS in 6 hours from more northern, less convenient spaceports. NASA in 19 hours from spaceports close to the equator. Who is not a competitor to whom? Are the evaluation criteria taken from Musk's commercial posters?

      There is a breed of humanoid, worshiping a foreign sticker, but, nevertheless, devouring their own, native lard with appetite. For them, the achievements of this rogue, who made the ONLY launch in the history of manned space exploration. But these results are nothing to them.
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  • alex aircraft
    alex aircraft 2 August 2020 13: 46 New
    12
    The gdp strategy is an energy power. (A raw material appendage of the EU and China) why do we need space then? Pipelines are our everything!
    1. Split
      Split 2 August 2020 13: 53 New
      -15
      Would you personally have an oil rig on your site? Would you ... say ... it's mine and won't sell it to anyone? Weakly believe. Personally, I have nothing against it. The China you mentioned exports almost half of the oil it produces.
      And the USA, etc. they would not quarrel with us about SP2 if the aforementioned EU did not need oil ... demand creates supply. Banal law
      1. Ilshat
        Ilshat 2 August 2020 14: 03 New
        +6
        Quote: Split
        China exports nearly half of the oil it produces

        This is something!
        China buys oil everywhere, including from Russia, and has exported nothing to it since 1993 !!
        Are you a foreigner?
        Or do you live on another planet?
        1. Split
          Split 2 August 2020 14: 09 New
          -5
          Yep, on the other, at least google ... 1/6 of the export
          1. Ilshat
            Ilshat 2 August 2020 14: 13 New
            +3
            This is from a previously purchased, isolated case.
            China's consumption has been higher than production for a very long time.
            1. Split
              Split 2 August 2020 14: 20 New
              -7
              Well, at the moment, yes, the deposits are exhausted. I mean that we have not yet been exhausted. As long as there is, you can sell
      2. Qas
        Qas 2 August 2020 14: 42 New
        +1
        This is a common law for an ordinary baker. And there are state interests, there are different criteria and laws.
        1. Split
          Split 2 August 2020 14: 43 New
          -1
          But a colleague accuses me of the fact that the interests of the baker are somehow too similar to the interests of the state. laughing
      3. Azis
        Azis 2 August 2020 20: 06 New
        +1
        Quote: Split (Anatoly
        And the USA, etc. would not have argued with us about SP2, if the aforementioned EU did not need oil ..
        SP-2 is gas, isn't it? Oil - "Friendship", "enmity" and others, ground
    2. Split
      Split 2 August 2020 14: 02 New
      -5
      After all that we did first ... even then people understood that the future was not in manned flights. Specifically, you are protected by 100 km of nitrogen and oxygen and ozone from the harsh galactic rays. Only automatic equipment can work there, not video from NASA. Therefore, for more than 50 years a person has not climbed above 5xx km from the surface.
    3. Split
      Split 2 August 2020 14: 11 New
      -9
      I mean, in fact, the point is only in the study, and they require money. We are not that rich country. Space is just "Prestige" and nothing more ... there is no return from it. Have you personally donated even a ruble to charity? I think not ... At the current stage of development, koskos is charity ... especially considering how much they stole during the construction of the same Eastern
      1. Lannan Shi
        Lannan Shi 2 August 2020 15: 21 New
        15
        Quote: Split
        I mean, in fact, the point is only in the study, and they require money. We are not that rich country.

        Come on. The most expensive yacht in the world is Russian. As well as a third of the 30 most expensive yachts. And suddenly there is no money? Oha, oha. In Russia, money is more than normal. But with their distribution .... Here, yes. Here everything is like a sikos-nakos arranged. On yachts there are, on ships for the Navy not. There is money for mansions at the cost of 2-3 hangar rockets, but not for space. Yeah.
    4. Svetlana
      Svetlana 2 August 2020 14: 24 New
      -4
      You are wrong. That was Yeltsin's strategy. It was in his time that people started talking about an energy power. And they did not pay attention to the fact that agriculture was destroyed .. Let's sell kilowatts, buy Bush legs.
      1. Split
        Split 2 August 2020 14: 30 New
        -9
        Yeah, in the 7th USSR emnip overtook the USA in oil production. We had so many cars just like now
        1. Svetlana
          Svetlana 2 August 2020 14: 34 New
          +4
          Yes overtook. And a canister of 92 gasoline cost 3 rubles. But the very concept of "Energy Power" was not even heard at that time. It was invented later.
          .
          UPD.
          Stop .. in the late seventies you mentioned gasoline was even cheaper. Jemnip: 9 kopecks per liter.
          1. Split
            Split 2 August 2020 14: 41 New
            -5
            Here we are not really working on nuclear power, but the population is almost 2,5 times less. How to judge? But we can recycle what has already been used in fast neutron reactors ... they are not. Yes, the share of nuclear power (15-20% of emnip) is small, but it, IMHO, allows you to free up resources. Personally, I see no reason not to sell. We have a huge country, although we are not Saudi Arabia, I think there will be enough resources until the share of nuclear energy increases.
            1. Svetlana
              Svetlana 2 August 2020 14: 45 New
              -1
              Um .. we started about the concept of Energy Power and Russia's strategy. But you got carried away. Sorry, I'm leaving.
              1. Split
                Split 2 August 2020 14: 48 New
                -5
                We will stay with her. Any country that has resources will sell them. Demand creates supply. We are not Germans who drove synthetic gasoline in 4x
              2. Split
                Split 2 August 2020 15: 29 New
                -13
                If we cancel oil supplies right now, well, not half, a third of the United States will rise. At the beginning of the year, Russia was at 2X as an oil supplier. So the column, who depends on whom?
          2. AU Ivanov.
            AU Ivanov. 2 August 2020 15: 00 New
            -2
            Starting in 80, for a private trader, AI-93 began to cost as much as 40 kopecks / liter. If we translate into the current ones - about 80 rubles. Therefore, the craftsmen reworked Zhiguli engines for the A-76.
    5. Kuzmich Sibiryakov
      Kuzmich Sibiryakov 4 August 2020 11: 07 New
      -1
      Quote: alex aircraft
      The gdp strategy is an energy power. (A raw material appendage of the EU and China) why do we need space then? Pipelines are our everything!


      Turn on your brains. if you have them.
  • sedoj
    sedoj 2 August 2020 14: 01 New
    -5
    At the same time, in the coming decades the Vostochny cosmodrome will never be able to replace the main Baikonur cosmodrome.

    The author, with such pessimism just right to think about the eternal. To do everything at once - this does not happen. Slowly is yes. But still something is moving forward. Complete stagnation did not come. And I hope it won't. Wait and see.
  • Ilshat
    Ilshat 2 August 2020 14: 10 New
    -1
    With "Angara" some kind of horror ...
    Disperse the manual!
    Ruined everything, damned accountants!
    1. Split
      Split 2 August 2020 14: 52 New
      -4
      Who needs it? The project is old, it was created more than 2 decades ago. In the current realities ... there is a Proton (although they will withdraw it), Unions. They'll cover her. With the development of the Internet, a lot of information became available and just like in the USSR, ezhe just can't close anything
      1. Ilshat
        Ilshat 2 August 2020 14: 56 New
        +4
        A replacement?
        Proton does not roll - fuel.
        The union is completely obsolete ...
        There is no hydrogen-oxygen at all ...
        Where is something else?
        1. Split
          Split 2 August 2020 15: 05 New
          -11
          And what would you personally change an old car for a new one if it drives properly and is inexpensive? For what? Only one thing - prestige, as I said. Even if there is money. What do we do? The first satellite, the first man in space, the first space walk, the first group flight, the first woman in space, the first moon rover, the first spacecraft on Mars and Venus? The first space station ... What else needs to be proved? They even filmed a Fike on the moon. We no longer need to prove anything. And this fuel in a capsule version has kept your personal safety for decades, so that you can live and raise children.

          Hydrogen oxygen? Do you even know how even the purging of channels occurs? How heavy is hydrogen to use? That is why it is used to a limited extent, no one wants to. Hydrogen hates you
          1. Ilshat
            Ilshat 2 August 2020 15: 09 New
            +9
            Quote: Split
            They even filmed a Fike on the moon.

            All clear.
            I’m happy to stay, I don’t communicate with such persons.
            1. Split
              Split 2 August 2020 15: 12 New
              -8
              Well, yes, beautiful muddy pictures showed, we already believe. I have enough education not to look after the same swing cone everything else. Apollo's speed was not enough, and there is a video of the full launch, when the facts do not match the telemetry. Surdin was reviewed, I understand
              Do you know that all the main photos supposedly from the moon were taken in the 90s?
              "This is one small step for man, but a giant leap for mankind" yeah, people invented photoshop
              1. Zeev zeev
                Zeev zeev 2 August 2020 15: 40 New
                +7
                And what, in all 9 missions to the Moon (6 of them landings), telemetry does not coincide with the facts? And how was this allowed in the USSR, how was it not used in its propaganda? How did Marshal Kamanin and Alexei Leonov not expose the "American forgery"?
                1. Split
                  Split 2 August 2020 15: 43 New
                  -7
                  From the well-known, and the numbers do not allow me to lie. Same delivery. The Mach cone does not match, when Apollo passes through the clouds, it also does not match ... well, you probably know about capsules and so on
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                2. 3danimal
                  3danimal 3 August 2020 04: 50 New
                  +4
                  Someone from the adherents of the theory of the "lunar conspiracy" will say that the United States bought the silence of the USSR leadership smile
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          2. Zeev zeev
            Zeev zeev 2 August 2020 15: 34 New
            10
            Are you proud of what happened 40-50 years ago? Well then, the Americans also have something to be proud of. The first docking, stations to the borders of the solar system, the first flyby and the first landing (yes, yes, they landed on the moon, even though you don’t believe it) on another celestial body, the first reusable ship (by the way, for 30 years these reusable ships flew on that the most hating hydrogen), rovers, reusable first stages, the first commercial ship ... Oh, this is not 40 years ago, this is happening now. At this particular moment, American astronauts are returning after three months in orbit.
            1. Split
              Split 2 August 2020 15: 40 New
              -7
              Oh, and this is not 40 years ago, this is happening now.
              The key word, 40 years, when we no longer need to prove something, but at least the landing on Pluto. Although they still cannot go to the moon No. I will not disturb your mind
              Regarding the landing on the moon ... I personally don't give a damn about whether they were or not, it won't feed my child. There are abjective facts and 1-2% of them know them, who studied at technical faculties, and not at ... lawyers
          3. nickname7
            nickname7 6 August 2020 14: 01 New
            0
            ... The first satellite, the first man in space

            It will look pitiful when a Chinese-made cruise liner starts flying to Mars.
            The past is erased over time.
  • Rostislav
    Rostislav 2 August 2020 14: 11 New
    +4
    Even the head of Roscosmos Dmitry Rogozin has repeatedly spoken about the difficult situation associated with the underfunding of projects.

    It is necessary to steal less.
  • pytar
    pytar 2 August 2020 14: 14 New
    +6
    Roskosmos and NASA are the two largest structures in the world that manage space projects in Russia and the United States.

    And why is it released from the mind of the Chinese National Space Administration (CNSA) 国家 航天 局?
    Their successes are impressive, in some ways they have bypassed Rosskosmos and are looking for NASA!
    1. donavi49
      donavi49 2 August 2020 15: 05 New
      10
      JAXA was also forgotten. While Rogozin talks about the bright future and the AMS to the asteroid in the 30s and 40s, the Japanese are already doing this. They fly to the ISS, too, both as astronauts (if they splash down today, Soichi Noguchi will fly in September) and by truck (and the world's largest Kounotori truck). They have a laboratory module on the ISS. They have their own site at the future lunar station. They have a complete map of the moon - by the Kaguya probe.

      They have BepiColombo - a mission to Mercury.

      They have a mission to Venus, although it did not work out as dreamed of, but nevertheless they took a good picture in the IR, they carried out studies of layers and weather (AMC still works, albeit according to the principle - turn off everything - leave the drive and cameras = turn off the cameras, turn on computer, analyzing the data on the drive, etc. In general, dancing with a tambourine 5-7% of the work, but this is already 10 years AMC). They have an apparatus flying on solar sails.
      1. Narak-zempo
        Narak-zempo 4 August 2020 11: 16 New
        0
        But we have the Kuril Islands, and no matter how many samurai start everything, they will continue to burn laughing
  • mark2
    mark2 2 August 2020 14: 18 New
    -2
    I probably will not surprise you all here, but I will remind you: Roscosmos is not a private commercial store, it is the STATE CORPORATION whose purpose I quote:
    ensures the implementation of state policy in the field of space activities and its legal regulation, and also places orders for the development, production and supply of space technology and space infrastructure objects.
    The functions of the state corporation also include the development of international cooperation in the space sector and the creation of conditions for the use of the results of space activities in the social and economic development of Russia.

    Those. it fully and completely fulfills only orders of the State and the Ministry of Defense in particular.
    Roskosmos will not launch tourists, will not launch Lada-Vesta into space, will not build lunar and Martian bases until it is in the interests of the State. Roscosmos is not looking for clients to launch commercial satellites. These clients are "spurred on" by the State. And the same will not compete with Mask Roskosmos. There are 12 more Russian private commercial companies for this.
    The plans that are described in the article are aimed at State interests, and not "chop money" from wealthy tourists.
    Require Roscosmos to compete with Mask ... Well, if the domestic ubiquitous creakliate and
    All-fingered people want Musk to have a competitor in Russia, then any of the 12 Russian private companies can chip in.
    But I think no one will fold. Everyone is greedy, but at the same time they want the state to spend resources on all sorts of nonsense.
  • Nikolay87
    Nikolay87 2 August 2020 14: 25 New
    +3
    I would even agree with everything and even agree with Rogozin about underfunding, if corruption schemes in his department were not revealed from time to time.
  • Courier
    Courier 2 August 2020 14: 41 New
    -2
    Launch private business into the Russian space industry. And that's all.
    Development monopoly is not needed and NASA is still an agency and it orders work at of private companies.

    Living with the Soviet view of space, without the Soviet Union, is a dead end.
    1. Brancodd
      Brancodd 2 August 2020 14: 57 New
      +6
      Who's stopping them? Prokhorov, Kerimov, Usmanov, Mamut, etc.? The Filevs tried it and immediately ditched. "Private business" is not about that. He's a little about something else.
  • AML
    AML 2 August 2020 14: 56 New
    +2
    Quote: Courier
    Launch private business into the Russian space industry. And that's all.


    That's it, that's all. If NASA hadn't poured its work and staff to Musk, I would have seen how far he has come.
    1. Brancodd
      Brancodd 2 August 2020 15: 39 New
      -6
      Considering Space X as a private company and Falcon as an initiative development is a big stretch.
    2. Narak-zempo
      Narak-zempo 4 August 2020 11: 27 New
      -1
      Quote: AML
      That's it, that's all. If NASA hadn't poured its work and staff to Musk, I would have seen how far he has come.

      Oh well.
      Because of the crooked legislation, they had to inflate a big, big condom a bubble called "Elon Musk", and to drain his patents in order to pour money into the space industry through a "private" company.
      But how does this cancel the fact that a huge team of engineering and technical personnel is concentrated there, capable of solving complex tasks such as landing steps on a barge (an innovation of dubious value, but the professionalism of the developers was so robust)? And this team is not allowed to get bored without work. This means that the touch of a brain that can give birth to something really breakthrough does not dry out, but quite the opposite.
  • Brancodd
    Brancodd 2 August 2020 14: 59 New
    0
    Since August 2006, NASA has spent $ 16,7 billion on the creation of the lunar-Martian manned spacecraft Orion, an analogue of which, according to Roskosmos, is the Federation (Eagle), said in a report by the inspector general of the space agency Paul Martin.
    The total expenses for Orion, including the production of serial spacecraft, by the end of 2030, as the inspector calculated, will amount to $ 29,5 billion, that is, they will cost almost 12 Roskosmos budgets for 2020 (in the open part, that is, excluding the defense order).
    According to the document, most of these funds went to the world's largest military-industrial corporation Lockheed Martin, which develops and manufactures Orion. The funding did not include work on the spacecraft service module, which is being developed by the European Space Agency (ESA).
    1. Knell wardenheart
      Knell wardenheart 2 August 2020 16: 32 New
      +6
      It is somewhat incorrect to compare the efficiency in terms of spending. Each participant in the labor activity in the United States associated with space earns more than his Russian colleagues (excluding, probably, top management) - while, of course, he spends more, is more credited, etc. If we compare the cost of developing Orion in man-hours with the cost of the Federation, there will be a chasm, but for the most part this chasm will be associated with the involvement of the labor of a highly paid labor force and the products produced by such labor force. Spot small-scale products in the conditions of our country will cost MUCH cheaper than also in the USA - and although technologically this product will (possibly) be produced of better quality or cheaper, our product will benefit from the cost of manufacturing it.
      I am leading to the fact that it is impossible to unambiguously write off everything to funding. The spacecraft in the presence of developed comput. systems and mathematical models are just a piece of iron with a lot of bureaucracy. Our bureaucracy is larger than the American one and it is less efficient - we spend more on this and it eats our advantage in the cost of labor.
  • Strannik_GO
    Strannik_GO 2 August 2020 15: 15 New
    +6
    Space can be developed by people like Tsiolkovsky, Brown, Korolev, Musk. An official can only perform administrative work, he is not capable of more. Therefore, until we have a person who wakes up to "burn" with space, we wake up to lag behind the world's progress. And to change, as in Krylov's fable, bureaucrats in places are an unproductive task, and even harmful ...
    1. Brancodd
      Brancodd 2 August 2020 18: 03 New
      -9
      Tsiolkovsky is a scientist theorist. Among his contemporaries, he was known as an urban madman. Korolev possessed practically the resource of the USSR space program, but did not have front teeth knocked out by the investigator. Brown is a convinced Nazi, worked for the idea in the form of a Browning at the temple, lived in a cardboard house in Huntsville with practically no right of movement. Musk is the appointed space guru with transferred technology (15 years from DARPA and contractors) and the genius Müller to boot. Such are the things. It turns out that without a fist, Browning and similar convincing arguments, it is impossible to overcome the Earth's gravity ...
  • UserGun
    UserGun 2 August 2020 15: 47 New
    12
    In general, the most real trouble for the Russian Federation is not rogozins and not individuals, but the regime itself and its derivative - Putinomics. Therefore, while the zero will rule, it is unlikely that there will be some mythical "breakthroughs" with no less idiotic "import substitution" with five-year plans and three years and endless lies.
    1. Snail N9
      Snail N9 2 August 2020 16: 11 New
      11
      Well, why are you so ... Here, some write that this is the "heavy legacy" of Yeltsin (who has not been at the helm for 20 years), and before that there was a heavy legacy of the USSR, which, as one said, very "important" (VIP ) the man - "did not produce anything but rubber galoshes," and before that there was a "heavy legacy" of the tsarist regime and the First World War, and even before that, the Polovtsy and Pechenegs tormented us, and before them the Pithecanthropus chased us, and so on before the creation of the world .... Russia had a hard time, why is there ... but now - we will live, here is the constitution "for" or "under" this is the very thing - "we shall live", adjusted ....
      1. donavi49
        donavi49 2 August 2020 17: 37 New
        +9
        And the picture is just a plus, not a minus.

        What were these workshops doing?
        DT-75M, DT-75N and DT-75MV.


        And crumbling VTshki, where all sane imports (the same engine, for example), and everything that the craftsmen did at the plant, just throw away (well, the chassis from the DT75 - in the 21st century, this is a sentence right away, you could not even strain with the deployment of the release).


        No one in their right mind will buy it today. The plant simply has no load and no desire to receive it. If they took a license for Versatil, Challenger, or even the Chinese YTO started collecting, they would have survived.


        Workshops and staffs are not a reason for pride. It's the same in the rocket industry. Where in the cinema of Roskosmos they expose old women of retirement age who climb into the tank with a carrier to check the seams, in other countries there is a robotic stand with objective control and micron precision. Where 500 people are working on the rocket, in the future 1-2 operators will work, and this is already being created in Relativity Space.
        1. Knell wardenheart
          Knell wardenheart 2 August 2020 19: 20 New
          +3
          We had the time and opportunity to take over a solid segment of the commercial launch niche from the Americans. And to have good money from this - with which we could easily carry out more than one modernization. But we did not hesitate to do this, preferring that our space was spherical-military-in-a-vacuum, but not purely efficient-commercial, so that it would always graze at the left leg of the state, ready to bark cheerfully when needed.
          In the 90s, we finally got out of this quagmire of foreign policy adventures and mutual obligations, we could chop coupons and crush all competitors at 0 launch costs, load related enterprises - but we did not do this for at least a decade and a half. As a result, such cheerful guys as Indians / Chinese / Japanese and even American private traders have already rushed in advance ...
        2. Aviator_
          Aviator_ 2 August 2020 20: 36 New
          +2
          Nobody calls for the production of antiques at the tractor plant, so here you are wrong. And the fact that instead of reconstruction of production in our country Skolkovo and Rusnano is a problem.
        3. Topgun
          Topgun 3 August 2020 12: 59 New
          +1
          partly you are right, but astronautics is the top of the pyramid of science and industry of the country, it then works well when there is a wide base (even from such "ineffective" industries - I saw a video of how a large blank is forged in China on a "hammer" assembled from trash, a lot such "sharashok" turn into quality - it is corny where to get a blacksmith who has at least some experience)
          Let me remind you: the wheels for the lunar rover were made at a bicycle factory ...
      2. Vadim237
        Vadim237 4 August 2020 23: 16 New
        0
        I counted only 3764 enterprises closed from 2000 to 2018 - factories of large and medium-sized factories are numerous: concrete products, chemical industries, biosynthesis, instrument-making factories, machine-building metallurgical textile manufacturers of synthetic fiber, repair factories, feed enterprises of the military-industrial complex, etc. - there are no 50000 closed in the RSFSR so many large and medium-sized enterprises never had 17000 state and collective farms - maybe the lion's share of them ceased to exist back in the 90s when cattle were put under the knife en masse - new enterprises continue to build, like new hospital schools, kindergartens, some of them are quite large with a capacity from 300 people to 3000 and more in the agricultural sector Russia has already caught up with the 1989 RSFSR in the production of grain and meat.
  • Knell wardenheart
    Knell wardenheart 2 August 2020 16: 22 New
    10
    In my opinion, we have ceased to be a competitor of the West for space since the late 80s and early 90s. What is a "competitor"? It’s not just when someone breathes in your back - it’s when you invest and develop projects that you don’t have in peers, while maintaining a certain parity in key areas. In the 80s, we had good practices on Buran-Energia - Energia had the potential scalability of the project in the form of a Vulcan rocket, as far as I remember - that is, we were potentially ahead in the super-heavy niche in terms of actual developments. At the beginning of the 80s, we had quite fresh groundwork for AMC (Vega-1, Vega-2) - and, accordingly, for the design of all this. Although it can be assumed that by that time we had already pulled ahead on only a few key projects (relative to the USA) of a utilitarian nature - after all, in matters of the reliability of space technology and the same AMS, in matters of the quality of filling, photographic equipment, computing power, they were already ahead of us qualitatively. Voyager and Pioneers and Vikings have already flown - what can I say, at the moment 99% of space-related photos of the solar system are a product of US activities. By the end of the 80s, for financial and political reasons, our projects were reduced to Earth's orbit - we were lagging behind in computers, radio equipment, photographic equipment. Our space did not have a saving shoulder in the form of abundant commercial orders - so, in fact, even before the collapse of the USSR, we had already lagged behind, making a last breakthrough.

    Further, there is no need to say that we were serious competitors - in terms of share in the commercial market at one time - yes, for some military developments - yes, in terms of the scientific component, the scale and seriousness of the activity - definitely not. Of course, we had our own station, the Americans flew to it, including, there were experiments, a huge reserve of competence and space-related inventions - but if we are talking about competition, then we were no longer competitors - neither in AMS, nor in research Mars, nor on the creation of space modules - all this was lost. Soon we lost our advantage in the development of engines and missiles - in composites, in environmentally friendly fuel vapors, in the manufacturability of engines and in the issue of their reuse.

    The scale, leadership competence and funding of our space. activity, as well as the political request and the residual archaism of military orientation inherited from the USSR - all this prevented us from being competitors for the United States, all expanding the gap between us. And now it is a strategic abyss into which we can throw as many "Federations" or "Hangars" as we like.
    1. Brancodd
      Brancodd 2 August 2020 16: 30 New
      -5
      Very pretentious. But they are unsubstantiated.
      1. Knell wardenheart
        Knell wardenheart 2 August 2020 16: 37 New
        +6
        The proof is a comparison of the volume and magnitude of the success of our space activities and American space activities from 1986 to the present day.

        Success should be understood as superiority in scientifically and commercially significant issues. If it is important for science, then it is recognized int. community, if it is important for commerce, then it is evaluated by the consumers of the product through monetary mechanisms.

        If you look at the above period, in this way, you will understand that we are not a competitor.
        1. Brancodd
          Brancodd 2 August 2020 18: 26 New
          -9
          Yes, curious. It is the "International Community" itself that last week became very concerned about the "competition" of our inspector satellites. A real hysteria of the "community" .. In every smartphone, in a row with GPS receivers, there are GLONASS receivers. And they are also present in caliber guidance systems and not only We have the second largest space group.
          Well, the "monetary mechanisms" of the "exceptional" are known. And they are based on the same principle as the injection of 2 trillion. $. into the economy this spring. That, however, does not help them for 12 years to create an analogue of RD 180., to develop a gas centrifuge, to build at least one reactor in 35 years, or to lay at least one km. express roads. Against this background, NASA really looks like an island where something else can be done ... We congratulate them on their successful scientific programs and closely follow the military preparations. And we also wish them resilience, as they are entering a cheerful period of their own restructuring. Let's wish and observe from the side. And we will implement our own space program ...
    2. Vadim237
      Vadim237 2 August 2020 23: 04 New
      +2
      We ceased to be competitors to the West in the space sphere in the early 70s as soon as work on the Lunar rocket and the entire program were curtailed.
  • BAI
    BAI 2 August 2020 16: 26 New
    10
    Roskosmos and NASA are the two largest structures in the world that manage space projects in Russia and the United States. Naturally, they can be perceived as the main competitors in the industry.

    Nothing of the kind. Russia is no longer the largest space power. Here the window of flights to Mars has opened. Who flew? The United States with a record-breaking rover of 1250 kg in weight (which should return to Earth in 10 YEARS), China sent 850 kg and the United Arab Emirates - 450 kg (The weight of the vehicles that will explore Mars is indicated). What is Russia doing? That's right, jumping on a trampoline. Although we (the USSR) reached Mars first. Who in 1971 thought the Arabs would become a space power? And now, we even concede to them.
    1. vadimtt
      vadimtt 3 August 2020 11: 51 New
      +1
      Quote: BAI
      USA with a record-breaking rover of 1250 kg (which should return to Earth in 10 YEARS)

      Correct, only capsules with collected samples will return hi
  • U-58
    U-58 2 August 2020 16: 28 New
    +5
    The first problem is indicated correctly: underfinancing.
    But enterprises also grab such projects in order to simply survive.
    That is, we have been living for 3-5 years, and then it will be seen where the curve will take.
    The second problem is the "inappropriate" increase in funds. Including at enterprises operating under programs with the same underfunding.
    That is, it is scary to think about how much they will drag with (let us imagine) sufficient funding. And no "authorities" can cope with theft.
    The schemes for pumping money into individual pockets are too well developed.
    Moreover, it seems that even persons close to the Chief's body are being dragged along skeet.
    The third problem is that there is no flight of thought precisely because of the expectations of future underfunding.
    That is, we will come up with it, but they won't give money.
    The fourth problem: a clear lag in general scientific developments and technology. For 20-25 years.
    And this is, in fact, a collapse.
    Already the Chinese have mastered the casting of thin-walled parts with outstanding quality, but in our country, as 40 years ago, either the walls are curved or "holes" in the casting on 38 out of 40 castings.
    No radiation resistant electronics. There is none at all - from the word at all. No.
    And the point is not at all in Rogozin (whom I very much dislike).
    It's about the system.
    We need to forget about the ambitions of space pioneers, roll up our sleeves and work.
    20-30 years old. No holidays and weekends. 15 hours a day. To everyone: in science, and in metallurgy and in machine-tool industry.
    Then we'll stay in the top ten ...
    1. Snail N9
      Snail N9 2 August 2020 16: 40 New
      +7
      Yeah, we’ll hold on ... if we work hard for 15 hours ..... I’m already in my warehouse for 10-12 hours a day, and seven days a week, .... but what's the point? The salary fell by 5000 rubles, like a "crisis", although the shipments only increased with the reduced staff ... "You will wait for the cakes from the cat from the dog-pancake" ... their "zits-chairman" ....
    2. Dkuznecov
      Dkuznecov 5 August 2020 20: 20 New
      0
      I will subscribe to every word. And the one who came up with 44-FZ,
      earned a couple of thousand years (this is the minimum) in hell.
      The Federal Law itself is - there is still no accounting system.
      Each company writes its own (and we write).
      Who in Ekselik maintains the cost structure, who is in access, who is in 1C ...
      A mountain of court programmers.
      Neighbors bought 14 (fourteen) ERP 2.0 boxes with a hundred
      user licenses - for each department
      on the box, but to implement - no strength. Court programmers -
      not implementers. So they keep records in BP3 plus ekseliki.
      The main thing is that the budget has been used.

      In general, the entire budget accounting system pushes
      talentless spending of earmarked funds,
      if only within the budget. "Not mine" - do not mind.

      An example is the purchase of paper for 500 rubles. for a pack (!) five years ago -
      "the budget is laid down, and everything is good with the supplier's papers"
      (i.e. rollback).

      Until there is a competitive environment and commercial vein,
      government money will be wasted.
  • dgonni
    dgonni 2 August 2020 16: 28 New
    +3
    The problem is not in financing, but in the availability of personnel. And not managers, but engineers! Given the gap in wages, the new growth will not go into science and the old staff will not last forever.
    P.S. On the same decaying order of things, when a specialized specialist receives an order of magnitude more than a leader. But this is clearly not about Rosskosmos.
    1. shinobi
      shinobi 2 August 2020 17: 30 New
      -5
      Who is this who told you such a fairy tale? You should have watched the videos of the Yankees themselves for a start on YouTube. Who, how much and for what gets. "An effective manager" is not a Russian invention.
    2. U-58
      U-58 2 August 2020 17: 39 New
      0
      I support. It's like that.
    3. U-58
      U-58 2 August 2020 18: 46 New
      -1
      Payment gap? That is, financing is it?
      After all, the price of any product is ultimately someone's salary ..
      1. dgonni
        dgonni 2 August 2020 21: 19 New
        +5
        Yes, salary affects the cost of the final product. But if it is invested in the brain, then this is a work for the future. And if in effective management, then in the end it produces yachts and villas beyond the rebirth and no prospects in the industry
        1. U-58
          U-58 3 August 2020 04: 38 New
          0
          Yes it is
          There are examples.
  • Grading
    Grading 2 August 2020 16: 29 New
    +4
    Quote: paul3390
    Will not help. For noneshnikh bourgeois - nothing but the momentary acquisition of dough is not interested. It is not the furniture in the institution that needs to be changed, but the girls .. Under the existing system, space has not surrendered to anyone .. So, the Soviet remnants are still kept for force, nothing more .. And only the restoration of Soviet power can return us the primacy in the exploration of the universe. Like many other, no less important ..

  • AML
    AML 2 August 2020 16: 44 New
    -3
    Quote: UserGun
    with no less idiotic "import substitution" with five-year plans and three years and endless lies.


    Ie the fact that Trump is trying to return production to the United States is not import substitution? Or is it idiotic only for Russia, but for the United States of America?

    The planned economy was always and everywhere. Both in state-owned companies and in private ones. At a minimum, you need to understand what working capital the company will own at some stage and what to do next. Even the social unit deals with the planned economy in order to understand whether it will go to the Canary Islands or to Berdichev in the summer.

    And the fact that in the USSR there is a five-year plan in 3 years is not a good life. Although, yes, some would like to drink Bavarian now.
  • paco.soto
    paco.soto 2 August 2020 17: 21 New
    -1
    Comical - shaking his beard angrily: is it possible not to leave a comment under this news? !!
  • shinobi
    shinobi 2 August 2020 17: 25 New
    -6
    Chasing the Americans? Why? Space tourism? I beg you! At that price for 1 kg of payload, it is not profitable in principle. PR and no more. Chemical-fueled rockets have a future only within the orbit of the moon. Maximum. With a big stretch. Korolev and Fonbraun spoke about this back in the 60s, when they only learned to crawl into orbit. Where is Musk going to Mars? Well, God help me! So far, in the bottom line, there is nothing but a talking shop in the media. In terms of orbital flights in general. rolled back to the era of the Apollo. The base on the moon? Seriously? And who will pay for the maintenance, not to mention the fact that at the first and second stages it will be necessary to import everything. A trillion or two greens? Just think what kind of garbage.
    PS: All this is very reminiscent of an information attack in the style of Reagan's "Star Wars". As for the presentation of the material and the characters. And most likely it will end the same, nothing. And yes, Rogozin must be driven. And not because he is a chatterbox , but because he does not cope well with his role as a talker.
  • Aleks2000
    Aleks2000 2 August 2020 17: 40 New
    +3
    And, only the lazy one does not write about this in recent years.
    And before that there were victorious reports and the cancellation of terms. Have you punished anyone?
    No.
    Here is the answer.
    Allegedly, the salary of the Moscow office is equal to the salary of the rest of Roscosmos (transmitted by ultra-patriots). The bottom line is clear.
  • DrEng527
    DrEng527 2 August 2020 18: 07 New
    -6
    It should be noted that there are also breakthrough projects - a space tug with an ion engine and a nuclear power plant ...
    If they do, then you can fly not only to the moon
    1. nickname7
      nickname7 6 August 2020 14: 26 New
      0
      . space tug with ion engine and nuclear power plant

      Comrades from okollkosmos argue that it did not go well. Tug everything.
      1. DrEng527
        DrEng527 6 August 2020 21: 39 New
        -1
        Quote: nickname7
        Tug everything.

        please share the source? or personal?
  • Klingon
    Klingon 2 August 2020 18: 19 New
    +5
    Quote: paul3390
    Will not help. For noneshnikh bourgeois - nothing but the momentary acquisition of dough is not interested. It is not the furniture in the institution that needs to be changed, but the girls .. Under the existing system, space has not surrendered to anyone .. So, the Soviet remnants are still kept for force, nothing more .. And only the restoration of Soviet power can return us the primacy in the exploration of the universe. Like many other, no less important ..

    quite right. PU & Co. space is interesting except in military performance nothing more. Our Elves are interested in hydrocarbons and everything where it is possible to cut babos they nafig did not fit in an unfavorable scientific space ... the exploration of Mars and Venus? AMC? rovers? all this was possible in the USSR because there were goals and interests ... right now they will start poking and bending what and how much we have "launched" in recent years, and besides, they will poke on some Russian components, bolts and nuts on strangers spacecraft
  • Brancodd
    Brancodd 2 August 2020 19: 15 New
    -3
    Quote: Knell Wardenheart
    I am leading to the fact that it is impossible to unambiguously write off everything to funding

    I agree. But this factor cannot be simply discarded. They have an almost unlimited source of funding. This allows you to use, for example, the labor of foreign companies, buy ready-made patents. But in general, the American economy is a cost economy. And the costs are fantastic in terms of volume. Failed projects, misuse of funds, constant missed deadlines, loss of competencies, aging staff and lack of management control are the hallmarks of the current US industry. NASA is probably one of the few exceptions. Where the efficiency is much higher than, for example, in the nuclear industry. But they would let this industry float freely, would be where GE and Westinghouse are now
  • iouris
    iouris 2 August 2020 20: 35 New
    +1
    Roskosmos is its own competitor. At the beginning of 1990, the question was: space is not needed. How is it now?
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 2 August 2020 23: 07 New
      +1
      And now space is needed - but there is no money for it.
  • ximkim
    ximkim 2 August 2020 21: 10 New
    +2
    Where is far in the same galaxy, where there are no storms and no wars raging. There Roscosmos (united in a corporation) suppressed everything, and NASA separatist forces took refuge on another planet
  • Klingon
    Klingon 2 August 2020 22: 09 New
    +5
    Quote: Split
    Ooooo minosophists came running. You can listen to the hub and military satellites on the channel of the same Kanonikhin. The RG spectrum is a fairly unique apparatus

    yes, you have already lifted your RG spectrum, besides it, what do we have? bolts and nuts on other devices ?? Soon Nigeria will surpass us in space exploration, I am already silent about China and India! India damn it! lunar rover managed to launch (crashed, okay, the first pancake is lumpy) and Israel! China is a rover! you are welcome!
    And Rogozin is a skyscraper from his trampoline! and drawings with layouts!
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 2 August 2020 23: 13 New
      +5
      Roskosmos has a lot of models for everyone - let's hope at least a tenth will come to life by 2030.
  • UserGun
    UserGun 2 August 2020 23: 33 New
    +4
    Quote: AML
    Ie the fact that Trump is trying to return production to the United States is not import substitution? Or is it idiotic only for Russia, but for the United States of America?


    No, this is not "import substitution". It's no secret that the same narrow-eyed people still use patents and licenses of the same Americans, Europeans, and Japanese with might and main. Those. they only produce, as do other countries too. No one in their right mind calls production in their country "import substitution", including the same Chinese))) Prior to that, only we "thought of" the figurative in words managers and hand-leading))) The worst thing is that others, including you, begin to think so, thanks to propaganda. That's what it is. in what, but in propaganda and PR, as well as unbridled lies and substitution of concepts, the current government has advanced far. But I wouldn't call it a plus.
  • Alex66
    Alex66 3 August 2020 09: 45 New
    0
    Of course, there is nothing wrong with space tourism, it is a good and decent income.
    Now, with our space, everything is clear, Korolev is now probably complaining to Lavrenty that the new bourgeoisie in Russia has done something wrong. Yes, the groundwork ends, as Putin said: galoshes are running out. The old generation of ideological people has left, but Putin and Rogozin do not have enough money for a new one.
  • camo ridges
    camo ridges 3 August 2020 11: 02 New
    0
    We need a new Korolev
  • ont65
    ont65 3 August 2020 12: 21 New
    0
    Good, correct publication. If someone is not in the subject, with an 8-year amortization cycle, the time from the task to the launch in the series cannot exceed 4 years, otherwise the developer will crash. In fact, underfunding is a bureaucratic stranglehold on the throat of science and science-intensive industries. It seems that money is released, but there is no exhaust. - Economic sabotage. There is no Cheka on them.
  • Jurkovs
    Jurkovs 3 August 2020 13: 17 New
    -2
    And what is this article about? A collection of well-known facts not even from highly specialized sites, but simply from the pages of the yellow press.
  • place
    place 3 August 2020 18: 45 New
    0
    They say there are two troubles in Russia .... In fact, there is only one trouble. Any management in Russia is a system without feedback or even with positive feedback.... Whatever the boss does, "" approvals "are guaranteed, as a result, as the Tsars ruled all life, so did the General Secretary and the Presidents. Under any legislation. The people can be very, very dissatisfied, BUT" approvals "will not matter! How to manage anything in such a society?

    It is known that a system without negative feedback is doomed to a catastrophic scenario. This is a mathematical fact that Russia has never avoided either in politics, or in the wars of 1812 or 1941, or in technology, nowhere and in any way. We just have to wait until the space is completely covered and (according to Saltykov-Shchedrin) we will all see that the chief has a different place instead of his head. We must endure a little more, the Russian people have not yet invented another way.
    1. Nikolai Korovin
      Nikolai Korovin 5 August 2020 00: 45 New
      0
      Some strange arguments. Just in 1812, and in 1941-45, they dealt with the armed forces of the beloved heart of home-grown philosophers, starting with Chaadaev, a united Europe. There was a catastrophe, of course, but not internal, but from outside. By the way, Prussia and Austria-Hungary, militarized to the limit, collapsed under the blows of Napoleon, just like Poland and France under the blows of Hitler, England in both cases sat out on her island until Russia coped with the aggressor. What does this have to do with space exploration? Where is the lack of feedback? In both cases, there was very much this connection, otherwise they would have been drinking Bavarian beer now, so to speak. If the soap drinks beer.

      Whoever visited factory workshops in Soviet times not on an excursion, but at least had a real industrial practice at the workplace, and has the opportunity to compare with what is observed in workshops now, as well as compare the average quality of products, will give preference to the present time. The culture of production, product quality and concern for the convenience of the consumer in terms of products for general use have grown significantly. The final production is still not enough, but the energy sector has not only been restored, but also increased its capacity by about 30%. And electricity is produced by 15% more than in 1990 in the RSFSR. The capacities are underutilized, so we have to dump to China for the time being, which many are genuinely indignant with.

      But - there is simply nowhere to go, the introduced capacities cannot work with less load. If there is energy, there will be a powerful industry. An essential point is an increase in the depth of oil refining. No more than 40% of the produced is exported, the production of high-octane gasoline has increased greatly. This, coupled with a giant leap forward in road development, is the foundation on which a new economy, including the space industry, will grow. Someone really does not like all this. So the roads, in general, have basically already been put in order, at least in the densely populated European part of Russia, but we cannot cope with fools so far. In this country, they say, nothing good can be. Tired for 30 years with a hook.

      And in the USSR, unfortunately, fuel oil accounted for 30% of the output of oil products, and it was burned mainly in small boiler houses. The river cargo fleet, which was quite numerous, was also mainly on fuel oil. It is very environmentally unfriendly. An unforgettable sight of the fields of torches between Angarsk and Irkutsk - associated gas was burned almost completely. The train runs at night, and it is light, almost like during the day. And also - maybe someone thinks that they did not drive round timber from the USSR with might and main, and their own paper, on average, was not very so-so, and there was not enough of it? In general, there is a feeling that the postulate, fixed at the 80th Congress of the RCP (b) in 1939, was still valid in the XNUMXs - "the natural resources of the USSR are inexhaustible." Well, at that moment such a thesis was timely, but nevertheless it turned out that this was not the case. They caught themselves: "The economy must be economical." Well, they did something like that ... We wanted the best, but it turned out, as always. But it seems that this aphorism of our unforgettable Chrysostom, over which many made fun of foolishly, is gradually losing its relevance.
  • Mimino
    Mimino 4 August 2020 07: 55 New
    0
    What projects are there. Only transportation to orbit-back. Some kind of scientific launches only in dreams.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 4 August 2020 23: 19 New
      0
      Within 10 years, Rosatom will complete a megawatt-class nuclear power plant for an interplanetary space tug - then we will fly.
  • certero
    certero 5 August 2020 02: 04 New
    0
    Quote: paul3390
    With the existing system - space has not surrendered to anyone

    Then the question is why the Americans with the same system manage to develop space?
    Why American distant stations have already left the solar system, why are American rovers exploring the surface of Mars, why are American space telescopes looking into the depths of galaxies? And at Roscosmos, only one radio telescope project was cool, and even then it has already ended.
    1. NordUral
      NordUral 8 August 2020 20: 19 New
      0
      Then the question is why the Americans with the same system manage to develop space?

      Those in the Kremlin have a completely different system.
  • Dmitry V.
    Dmitry V. 5 August 2020 15: 51 New
    +1
    Let's remember only NASA's interplanetary programs in recent years:
    - Galileo 1989 (exploration of Jupiter and its moons)
    - NEAR Shoemaker 1996 (study of the asteroid Eros, landing on the asteroid)
    - Cassini station 1997 (study of Saturn and satellites, landing of a probe on Titan)
    - Deep Space 1 1998 (The main purpose of the flight was to test twelve samples of the latest technologies - including an electrostatic ion engine, Autonav - an autonomous navigation system that minimizes the need to adjust the movement of the vehicle from the Earth, etc.
    - 3 rovers (2003 Opportunity, Spirit 2003, 2011 Curiosity - exploring Mars, searching for water to place the future Martian base)
    - New Horizons 2006 (exploration of Pluto and the Kuiper belt)
    - mission “Dawn 2007 (exploration of the asteroid Vesta and the dwarf planet Ceres)
    - Juno, Jupiter Polar Orbiter 2011 (exploration of Jupiter)
    - MAVEN -1 2013 (Mars Atmosphere and Volatile EvolutioN - "Evolution of the atmosphere and volatiles on Mars") - American artificial satellite for the study of the atmosphere of Mars
    - InSight 2018 (Interior Exploration using Seismic Investigations, Geodesy and Heat Transport, formerly called Geophysical Monitoring Station - GEMS) - delivery to Mars of a lander with a seismometer. the study of the internal structure and composition of Mars).
    - Parker Solar Probe 2018, previously also Solar Probe, Solar Probe Plus or Solar Probe + (study of the outer corona of the Sun)
    - OSIRIS-REx (Origins Spectral Interpretation Resource Identification Security Regolith Explorer) 2016-2023 designed to deliver soil samples from asteroid (101955) Bennu. The station was launched on September 8, 2016. The station reached the asteroid on December 31, 2018. Soil sampling is scheduled for August 25, 2020 [5], and return to Earth - September 2023
    - Mars 2020 Rover Mission - the mission of the Mars rover, developed by NASA, the launch was carried out on July 30, 2020, arrival on Mars - in February 2021
    - James Webb Telescope 2021 (in preparation)
    The guys from NASA are stubbornly pursuing their goal - to land humans on Mars in 2030.


    How can the pygmies of Roskosmos be compared in terms of solved problems?
  • kris_67
    kris_67 6 August 2020 14: 43 New
    0
    "and what is their main problem" - in everything! It is easier to ask where Roscosmos has no problem. Moreover, the problems of Roscosmos do not begin in Roscosmos.
  • aiden
    aiden 6 August 2020 23: 47 New
    0
    There is no need to write nonsense that there is not enough funding. Good money goes there, it just ends up in the pockets of effective menageries. it is the scourge of Russia, fools and roads.
  • NordUral
    NordUral 8 August 2020 20: 17 New
    0
    While the loot triumphs in the country, Russia will not have any space. As, however, and everything else that the country and the people need, like air.
    Only a change in the social system will change the situation for the development vector.