Central Research Institute "Burevestnik" showed a photo of the new CJSC "Malva"

A photo of a new self-propelled gun "Malva" on a wheeled chassis has appeared in the Russian media. The image was provided by the Central Research Institute "Petrel", leading the development of a new artillery gun in the framework of the R & D "Sketch".

The first image of SAO 2C43 "Malva" (figure) appeared in mid-October last year. At the same time, the first information about the new wheelbase artillery was announced. As reported, the 152-mm 2A64 cannon used in the Msta-S self-propelled guns is used as a firing component at Malva. It is possible to install an upgraded version of this gun, but the data is not available due to the secrecy of the development. Also, the developer has not yet disclosed the characteristics of the new complex.

The presence in the new CAO of elements of already produced artillery systems will significantly reduce the cost of mass production of the Malva and will facilitate its development in the troops if this novelty is adopted by the Russian army. It should be noted here that wheeled artillery systems are not widely used in Russia, while in the West this technique is very popular.

The Malva chassis is the BAZ-6010-027 all-terrain vehicle with an 8x8 wheel arrangement manufactured by the Bryansk Automobile Plant, and not the Belarusian MZKT tractor, traditionally used in the Russian army as a platform for placing various weapons. As stated, the use of a Russian all-terrain vehicle with a high cross-country ability and reliability as a chassis will allow the Russian army to get rid of foreign components in military equipment, which greatly simplifies operation.

As previously reported, in the framework of the R&D project “Sketch” a whole flower garden is being developed, which, in addition to “Mallow”, includes 120-mm Flook SAO on the Ural-VV chassis, 120 mm Arctic Magnolia self-propelled guns on the chassis of a two-link tractor DT-30MP and 82-mm mortar "Drok" on the chassis "Typhoon-VDV".

Comments

[Doccor18]

As part of the ROC "Sketch" a whole "flower garden" is being developed ...

And all this "flower garden" in the "flower bed" of the army, but more lively ...

[Bar1]

Mallow? What the hell again, for a foreign army? Maybe Malvina or Malvina?

[Varaga]

Why for a stranger? Mallow is a flower. Our artillery is replete with "flower" names.

[Insurgent]

Quote: Doccor18

And all this "flower garden" in the "flower bed" of the army, but more lively ...

A beautiful flower, "Mallow forest", in a bouquet of "Carnations", "Chrysanthemums", "Tulips", "Peonies" and "Acacia" - will look great

In our Donbass, not often and densely, but found in the wild ...

[Varaga]

In Siberia, malva began to grow - it became warmer. I have a whole flower bed under my windows.

[VO3A]

Why is it needed? It will be like everyone else from the trench to shoot with direct fire, or shoot at stationary rechecked targets that do not change their position in space and time!
We do not even include UAVs in the states of such systems and their SLAs ... We do not have target designation systems for such ART systems, and missile systems, too, in real time ... Each Chinese terminator has a full-time UAV and two kamikaze drones .. . And we have not only that there are no real-time target designation systems without people on the front end, including primitive full-time SLAs with ridiculous characteristics and people in them, so all UAVs are put in shelves .... The stupidity of our leaders is off the scale! They produce not what is needed, but what they know how ... and what it is and how it will work and whether it is necessary at all they do not know ... And the military in the person of the leaders, like rams follow the Supreme ... and that's all ... Stupid, but but the devotees ..

[Piramidon]

Quote: VO3A

The stupidity of our leaders goes through the roof ...

And the military, represented by the leaders, follow the supreme like rams.

Dumb, but loyal

The "cleverness" of some sofa experts has no boundaries at all. Well, all the types, except for them.

[VO3A]

But in essence? Are you a political scientist or political officer?

[Piramidon]

Quote: VO3A

But in fact?

I spoke in essence of your expressions.

[VO3A]

All the same ... politically ... I read your comments, you ... lucky chatterbox, no more ... Empty replicas of an empty man ...
\

[poquello]

Quote: VO3A

Empty replicas of an empty man ...
\

specifically here

Quote: VO3A

We do not even include UAVs in the states of such systems and their OMS ... We do not have target designation systems for such ART systems, and missile systems too, in real time ...

gee gee, unlucky chatterbox, when the UAV was not in the name, they were already

[VO3A]

when the UAV was not in the name, they were already

Learn to express your thought at least logically! While a set of words without communication and thought ... You are not mistaken forum? He's not medical ...

[Lopatov]

Quote: VO3A

Learn to express your thought at least logically!

Great tip.
And it is also worth knowing at least at the minimum level of materiel, isn't it?

[poquello]

Quote: VO3A

when the UAV was not in the name, they were already

Learn to express your thought at least logically! While a set of words without communication and thought ...

non-Russian or what? The Smerchevsky airplane was developed in the 90s, when the name "UAV" was coined?

[Piramidon]

Now, this is what I was talking about. You have hypertrophied conceit with a great deal of boorishness. Don't go into your pocket for insults. I gave quotes from your posts.

[YOUR]

Try yourself in a different genre. Speak out on the essence of the material under discussion.
On my own, in essence, the material under discussion. As in everything, the top-top is in place. Well, they put the gun on a wheeled chassis, so what? Msta is, was it somehow improved? Not. Well, what is it for? another sawmill and laundry, budget development.

[Lopatov]

Quote: YOUR

Well, what is it for? another sawmill and laundry, budget development.

Well, yes, it is much cheaper to change soldiers, because "women still give birth"

Quote: YOUR

Msta is, was it somehow improved? Not.

This is not true.
Between this one:

and this

the difference is very large, and it is definitely not in favor of the thirty-four-year-old 2A65, which at the time of its appearance was lagging behind its "classmates"

[Bad_gr]

Just now I noticed that there is an ejector on the gun. This is the first time I see him on a gun that is not installed in the turret.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Bad_gr

Just now I noticed that there is an ejector on the gun. This is the first time I see him on a gun that is not installed in the turret.

Apparently, the development of the weapon is far from complete.

[race]

Explain, please, to me, what is the advantage of this self-propelled gun over the towed one, if you do not take into account the characteristics of the guns themselves, since they are different?

[alexander 2]

In the speed of putting on alert. And in the speed of changing positions. Possibly guided by satellite. And the drone will not be included in the composition for a long time. After all, this is just a prototype.

[race]

Quote: Alexander 2

Possibly guided by satellite. And the drone will not be included in the composition for a long time. After all, this is just a prototype.

This upgrade can be used to equip a classic towed weapon. And what remains in the bottom line? Time to deploy and back? And even then, not a fact. Because Malva will also have to be prepared to open fire, as well as a towed weapon. And if you still need to lay ammunition on the ground, then this advantage will be minimal.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Rasen

Please explain to me what is the advantage of this self-propelled gun over a towed one.

Time.
Transfer from field to combat and back. Time to be ready to fire. Higher mobility. And so on ...

As a result, it makes sense to carry out a counterfire maneuver with the Malva. to get away from retaliation, but with Msta-B it makes no sense.

[race]

Quote: Spade

As a result, it makes sense to carry out a counterfire maneuver with the Malva. to get away from retaliation, but with Msta-B it makes no sense.

But, nevertheless, the calculation of Malva, as well as the calculation of Msta-B, is completely unprotected, and in case of falling under the enemy's artillery fire, it has no more chances to survive than the calculation of the same Msta-B. Or am I wrong?

[Lopatov]

Quote: Rasen

But, nevertheless, the calculation of Malva, as well as the calculation of Msta-B, is completely unprotected.

I agree.
But this does not change the fundamental difference.

[HUNTERDON]

comment is superfluous, you need to grow up

[VO3A]

You sat in the water and started bubbles .... This is how your comment is characterized ....

[Lopatov]

Quote: VO3A

You sat in the water and started bubbles .... This is how your comment is characterized ....

About bubbles ...
Name at least one modern weapon, the control system of which includes a UAV.

[parusnik]

The Malva chassis is the BAZ-6010-027 all-terrain vehicle with an 8x8 wheel arrangement manufactured by the Bryansk Automobile Plant, and not the Belarusian MZKT tractor, traditionally used in the Russian army as a platform for placing various weapons. As stated, the use of a Russian all-terrain vehicle with a high cross-country ability and reliability as a chassis will allow the Russian army to get rid of foreign components in military equipment, which greatly simplifies operation.

.... This is how it should be ... On the other hand, the Union State of Russia and Belarus turned out to be a premature baby who ordered to live long ...

[AUL]

As previously reported, an entire flower garden is being developed as part of the Sketch R&D project, which, in addition to the Malva, includes the 120-mm Floks SAO on the Ural-VV chassis, the 120-mm Arctic ACS Magnolia

What is the caliber? Why not 122 or 125, which are common with us? 120 - I know the mortar. Or am I behind the times?

[Lopatov]

Quote from AUL

Or am I behind the times?

Aha
And it is very strong.
Here is the first representative of the family that entered service:

General Margelov got his bearings at that time and was the first to do it.
Then there were 2B18 "Nona-M", 2B16 "Nona-K", 2S23 "Nona-SVK", 2B23 "Nona-M1",
2C31 "Vienna", 2C34 "Hosta", 2C40 "Phlox", "Magnolia" and 2C42 "Lotos"

[AUL]

Well, I've heard about them. But this is a mortar gun, a specific weapon. Or Phlox and Magnolia from the same row?

[Lopatov]

Quote from AUL

But this is a mortar gun, a specific weapon.

More like a mortar howitzer. Or a "rifled mortar". And officially they pass as a "weapon", except for "Nona-M" and "Nona-M1"

Quote from AUL

Or Phlox and Magnolia from the same row?

Ага.
And "Magnolia" is generally "Vienna", just on a different base, a joint instead of an BMP

[AUL]

Thanks for clarifying!

[Lopatov]

As far as I understand, "Vienna", "Khosta", "Phlox", "Magnolia" and "Lotos" use different modifications of the same 2A80 gun

[Bad_gr]

Quote: Spade

And "Magnolia" is generally "Vienna", just on a different base, a joint instead of an BMP

[Bad_gr]

Video on this topic:

[Bad_gr]

Quote: Bad_gr

Video on this topic:

Strange, the video is not what I threw here. It was according to our designs.
(this is missing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRb3K28ZQl0&feature=emb_logo)

[svp67]

Wow, what a "Beauty" you are ... Well done "Petrels". And you can see the stock for a longer barrel "Msta-M" or "Coalition"

[alexmach]

Why did they take the aging Msta as a basis?

[Lopatov]

I would not call it "obsolete"
Apparently, it's all about the ammunition. Which are on the "Mstu". Unlike the "Coalition"

And apparently this self-propelled guns should go to replace 2A65. Of which there are many that are actively used, including and in Syria and which are hopelessly outdated.

[alexmach]

I would not call it "obsolete"

I tried to be softer.

And apparently this ACS should go to replace the 2A65

Well, in that case, a self-propelled gun is of course an improvement.

[Lopatov]

Quote: alexmach

I tried to be softer.

This is a modern, world-class ACS.

Quote: alexmach

Well, in that case, a self-propelled gun is of course an improvement.

Not always.
Some modern towed guns will be better than other SPGs ...

[Genry]

Quote: Spade

Some modern towed guns will be better than other SPGs ...

The advantage of self-propelled guns in the speed of leaving the position.
She does not need to fold into the stowed position, cling to the tractor and the speed of movement on the car chassis is much higher. There are also fewer servants.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Genry

The advantage of self-propelled guns in the speed of leaving the position.

Modern towed guns can do it too

Quote: Genry

She doesn't need to fold into the stowed position

Necessary.

Quote: Genry

cling to a tractor

Modern towed vehicles can do without a tractor, moreover, their cross-country ability when coupled with a tractor is higher, since they can help it with their propeller.

Quote: Genry

There are also fewer servants.

This is a highly controversial advantage. Especially in local wars.
It is more difficult to organize security and fire self-defense, watch, it is more difficult with engineering equipment, with the maintenance of guns and ammunition, and so on.

[Genry]

Quote: Spade

Quote: Genry
The advantage of self-propelled guns in the speed of leaving the position.

Modern towed guns can do it too

Did they mean such a miracle? Or what?

Quote: Spade

Modern towed vehicles can do without a tractor, moreover, their cross-country ability when coupled with a tractor is higher, since they can help it with their propeller.

Quote: Spade

Quote: Genry
There are also fewer servants.

This is a highly controversial advantage. Especially in local wars.
It is more difficult to organize security and fire self-defense, watch, it is more difficult with engineering equipment, with the maintenance of guns and ammunition, and so on.

Why is all this necessary, if after your work, the whole position is mixed with ..... In modern warfare, question number one: where is the goal, and its processing is no longer a problem.
Therefore, we need ACS with a short leaving time ...
Once you move to your safe location, you will automatically find yourself inside guards and supplies and ....

[Lopatov]

Quote: Genry

Did they mean such a miracle? Or what?

Modern towed. Almost all are self-propelled.

Quote: Genry

..... In modern warfare, question number one: where is the goal, and handling it is no longer a problem.

It is not a question of "target processing". The question is that a dozen militants in rubber slippers and with rusty machine guns will easily destroy a modern self-propelled battery firing. Therefore, "fewer servants" translate into a heap of infantry, which will guard the area of ​​firing positions.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Genry

For example, this function was possessed by the Swedish FH1978 gun created back in 77.

If the tractor stuck, it was possible to start the power plant of the gun, and using the hydraulic drive on the wheels to help pull the tractor out.

[Genry]

Quote: Spade

Modern towed. Almost all are self-propelled.

In fact, they are under-SPGs.
And they move poorly and turn slowly and hide in an ambush is difficult / impossible and there is no way to survive under fire.

Quote: Spade

For example, this function was possessed by the Swedish gun created back in 1978

Your 77 FH1978 has already been forgotten (like a bad dream). Instead, there is already a new "Archer" and what is it towed by?

Quote: Spade

It is not a question of "target processing". The question is that a dozen militants in rubber slippers and with rusty machine guns will easily destroy a modern self-propelled battery firing. Therefore, "fewer servants" translate into a heap of infantry, which will guard the area of ​​firing positions.

You have confused something. Such systems are used before reaching the front line. They quickly shot home and a new position - this has already become a highlighted target.
It would be necessary to protect your under-self-propelled guns, since they unfold for a long time and leave for a long time, but only a weak "partner" will allow them ...

Quote: Spade

If the tractor stuck, it was possible to start the power plant of the gun, and using the hydraulic drive on the wheels to help pull the tractor out.

And I have already shown the nervously twitching "Bofors" with dancing Indians ...
This idiot with her "hole" can hardly move herself, and pull herself out with a tractor ... (there are no suitable emoticons for you ).

[Lopatov]

Quote: Genry

In fact, they are under-SPGs.
And they move poorly and turn slowly and hide in an ambush is difficult / impossible and there is no way to survive under fire.

And they move in the same way as self-propelled guns on a car chassis off-road, and "turn around" as fast as they
But it is easier to "hide in ambush" them. How to ensure safety during shelling.

Quote: Genry

Your 77 FH1978 has already been forgotten (like a bad dream). Instead, there is already a new "Archer" and what is it towed by?

Yah?
Learn materiel ... The first three Indian-made FH77s were handed over to the Indian army just two years ago. And the total order for "Danush" is 144 guns

Well, what about the "new archer" Sweden was so eager to make money on a corrupt Indian contract that it wrote off all of its 155mm artillery. And for almost 10 years I sat without her, only with mortars
And now, after a long break, supplies for their own army have begun. Moreover, only 48 guns were ordered. This is less than three Russian divisions.
And that is by accident. To the great joy of the Swedish military, 24 guns intended for Norway, the government was forced to purchase in order to "support the domestic"

Quote: Genry

You have confused something. Such systems are used before reaching the front line. They quickly shot home and a new position - this has already become a highlighted target.

No, it is you "beguiled something" For there is such a concept as "the continuity of fire on the enemy." Therefore, the tactics of artillery units is fundamentally different from the tactics of militants, who run away after a couple of volleys from mortars, and make the next attack in a few days.
And the new position is located hundreds of meters from the previous one, again for the sake of this "continuity"

Quote: Genry

It would be necessary to protect your under-self-propelled guns, since they unfold for a long time and leave for a long time, but only a weak "partner" will allow them ...

Be honest. Have you ever seen how "fast" a truck travels on a country road?

Quote: Genry

And I have already shown the nervously twitching "Bofors" with dancing Indians ...
This fool with her "hole" can hardly move herself, and pull herself out with a tractor ... (there are no angry emoticons for you).

Well .... defining the stats of a weapon from this youtube video is not a level of serious discussion.

[1976AG]

Since the development is secret, it means that we need to be updated. The main caliber is good, and the rest will follow.

[Bad_gr]

Quote: svp67

Wow, what a "Beauty" you are ... Well done "Petrels".

Two approaches. How harmonious "Malva" is, so controversial is the option with the wheeled "Coalition".

[Lopatov]

Quote: Bad_gr

Two approaches. How harmonious "Malva" is, so controversial is the option with a wheeled "Koalitz"

On the contrary.
"Malva" - a controversial option, albeit simpler and cheaper
"Coalition" is more adequate for local wars, but the choice of chassis is very embarrassing because of its obvious tendency to overturn.

[Bad_gr]

Quote: Spade

"Malva" - a controversial option, albeit simpler and cheaper

In my opinion, the logical development of towed artillery. And "Malva" is a competent implementation of the plan (transition from a towed installation to a transportable one).

Quote: Spade

"Coalition" is more adequate for local wars, but the choice of chassis is very embarrassing because of its obvious tendency to overturn.

Wheeled "Coalition" - installation of a machine gun on a wheeled chassis - I agree that such an option is needed, but its current embodiment in metal is 100% unsuccessful.
I think so.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Bad_gr

In my opinion, the logical development of towed artillery.

The problem is that to change the shooting sector, she needs to move.
And this kind of manipulation is extremely common for modern local wars. Accordingly, the "Coalition" has no such problem

[Bad_gr]

Quote: Spade

The problem is that to change the shooting sector, she needs to move.

Clear. Thanks for the information.

[sanek45744]

Do you think that the enemy will let you shoot for a long time from one position !?

[Lopatov]

Quote: sanek45744

Do you think that the enemy will let you shoot for a long time from one position !?

What will he do?
In Afghanistan, for example, previously Soviet, and now NATO artillery has been standing in the same positions for years.

[sanek45744]

I am more interested in the Donbass experience.

[Lopatov]

The question is not "interest", but that. that the tools must be versatile enough.

[Kaw]

If in the second self-propelled gun only the layout is unsuccessful, then in the first everything is unsuccessful. I would understand if this was done for sale in poor African countries, but judging by the gigantic and expensive chassis, it was done for us. Apparently they could not master the production of the Coalition. The coalition will probably remain in the plans for 2100.

[sanek45744]

and what is the 2nd option inconvenient yes in everything!?

[Lopatov]

Quote: Kaw

If in the second self-propelled gun only the layout is unsuccessful, then in the first everything is unsuccessful.

Very couch.
How poor and African do you think a country like France is?

[Genry]

Quote: Bad_gr

Two approaches. How harmonious "Malva" is, so controversial is the option with the wheeled "Coalition".

Yes, KamAZ is too narrow here. And the twin tires aren't off-road.

It can be assumed that the "Coalition" is better adapted for longer shooting, and "Malva" is more sharpened for the operational finishing of newly discovered ...

[Lopatov]

Quote: Genry

and "Malva" is more focused on efficiently finishing off newly discovered ...

"Malva" is simpler and much cheaper.

[Genry]

Quote: Spade

"Malva" is simpler and much cheaper.

Nuuuu ...., judging by the chassis, they didn't save on it at all.
Now they are more oriented in terms of functionality. She is more youthful-aggressive in comparison ...

[Lopatov]

Quote: Genry

Nuuuu ...., judging by the chassis, they didn't save on it at all.

Nevertheless, this arrangement provides a much lower cost than a "tower" type ACS.

Quote: Genry

Now they are more oriented in terms of functionality.

The functionality with this layout is limited. Due to the limited sector of fire. Plus the lack of protection of the crew during combat work

Quote: Genry

She is more youthful-aggressive in comparison ...

On the contrary, it is a striking representative of the previous generation of self-propelled guns on an automobile chassis. Presented machines such as "Caesar" or ATMOS

[Old Operator]

It is strange, why is there an ejector nozzle on a gun without a closed fighting compartment? Who is there to ventilate?

[nks]

So this 2A64 from MSTA-S was taken (possibly with minimal changes in the breech). There probably AZ is supposed

[PValery53]

With such a barrel length, "Malva" should "reach" for 40-45 km.

[Hermann]

A cannon from Msta-S, a 29km active-rocket projectile, it’s all about charges from howitzers from WWII.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Herman

it's all about the charges from howitzers during the Second World War.

?
No, "Msta" has its own charges, excellent from the earlier ones.

It's just that we have never chased records. And the guns shoot at the range provided by the standard accessory.

[Hermann]

So the charges from Acacia are not suitable?

[Lopatov]

Quote: Herman

So the charges from Acacia are not suitable?

No.
Shells are suitable and used, but require their charge. As far as I remember, initially, during the USSR, it was a long-range charge in a long plastic sleeve, a full variable and a reduced variable

[Hermann]

If you can ask another question: Are the charges from ML-20 to D-20 / Acacia suitable?

[Lopatov]

As far as I know, no

[novel66]

Well, so, in appearance, what range would you define for her?

[Lopatov]

I have no idea if it's a word.

[garri-lin]

But in theory there Msta is unchanged. And the characteristics must be appropriate. Judging by the presence of the ejector, there are no changes.

[Alexga]

https://topwar.ru/163694-pojavilos-izobrazhenie-rossijskoj-sao-malva.html
It looks like a regular reprint of an old article for 2019.

[loki565]

Only the loading mechanism is not clear, it may be something like CAESAR

[Bad_gr]

Quote: loki565

maybe something like CAESAR

Interestingly, and where does he put the spent cartridge cases?

[loki565]

Interestingly, and where does he put the spent cartridge cases?

There are no cases, this is a powder cap, it completely burns out.

[Bad_gr]

Quote: loki565

There are no cases, this is a powder cap, it completely burns out.

Clear. And the system for igniting this charge?

[Swan]

I think that a certain number of such CAOs in the troops are fully justified. In any case, it will not be superfluous.

[Alex777]

I think that a certain number of such CAOs in the troops are fully justified. In any case, it will not be superfluous.

It seems to me that the place of this fluff in our conditions is in the National Guard.
She arrived quickly, dispersed someone and home, saving the asphalt.
Therefore, the shells - those that are, and the barrel, the one that already exists.

[your1970]

Has dispersed anyone for 20-30 km ???
Who are we fighting with?

[Alex777]

Read what, in the second Chechen, the village of Komsomolskoye was stormed.
And then beat yourself as much as you want.

[your1970]

Quote: Alex777

Read what, in the second Chechen, the village of Komsomolskoye was stormed.
And then beat yourself as much as you want.

pardon - mistook you for a screeching liberalist ....

[Alex777]

I am not him even once.

[Alex777]

For the fact that the Russian Guard called the National Guard of the minuses like fleas picked up ...
Only in the morning I figured out what I wrote wrong ...

[strannik1985]

Seems to me

The Russian Guard does not have systems with a caliber of more than 120 mm (not counting the D-30).

[Alex777]

What is your version of the possible application of the wheeled artillery system?

[strannik1985]

In the army, just like towed guns.

[Alex777]

The advantages of a towed gun known to me are the price and the ability to throw it (including on the hands) where the self-propelled gun will not go.
Can you imagine this system in high intensity combat?

[strannik1985]

Advantages I know of being towed

Only for wars with the Papuans who do not know how to organize a counter-battery fight, i.e. where you can not bother with the anti-fire maneuver.
http://militaryarticle.ru/voennaya-mysl/1993-vm/8505-v-inostrannyh-armijah-2

[Alex777]

Well, you smoothly moved on to what I was hinting at ...
That in conditions of war with a professional army, this tool is of little use.
Expensive (one chassis costs money) and vulnerable to counter-battery combat.
Therefore, I suggested it in Rosguard. Or for export.
Although, of course, I could be wrong.

[strannik1985]

That in conditions of war with a professional army, this tool is of little use.

Two ways - equipping conventional towed guns with ASUNO kits, self-referencing (relatively cheap) allows you to disperse the battle formation by placing guns individually, and not with batteries - divisions, as before.
The second one is self-propelled guns, the engine + hydraulics allows the gun to independently switch from the combat position to the stowed position and vice versa, as well as to perform the POG. Those. shoot in the mode: short fire raid (1 minute) - move - short fire raid.

[Alex777]

Vladimir!
I understand about the towed guns. I agree with everything you say.
But this chariot on the battlefield is for me a white elephant.

[cat Rusich]

Alexander, Msta-B 152mm in the stowed position 7000kg - throw on hands ?! D-30A 122mm stowed 3290kg - Mi-8 carrying capacity 4kg

[Alex777]

I agree!
Our 152mm guns must be moved by the engine.
As a colleague rightly pointed out strannik1985 (vladimir):

self-propelled guns, engine + hydraulics allows the gun to independently switch from the combat position to the stowed position and vice versa, as well as to perform the POG

The 155 mm howitzer M777 weighs 4218 kg.

[cat Rusich]

M 777 - $ 3 (737 data).

[Alex777]

It would be cheaper with us. Our titanium is the best.

[cat Rusich]

Pat-B - 4 kg, only a range of 350 km ...

[Alex777]

Error is error.

[Alexey-74]

Powerful thing !!!!

[Fedorov]

It should be noted here that wheeled artillery systems are not widely used in Russia, while in the West this technique is very popular.

Explainable why. Lupanet Oktyablsky rain, And in our open spaces and European horseradish on wheels. Only a goose. Not stupid "Carnations and" Acacia were created.

[novel66]

since the last war, the number of roads has increased slightly

[Fedorov]

I agree. But for whom?

[novel66]

so, for everyone

[Fedorov]

That’s if I’m a tourist. And suddenly, God forbid, a T-72 column, pret. There are just roads.

[strannik1985]

If you are talking about the Second World War, then in that war the spacecraft did not have artillery self-propelled guns.

[Fedorov]

Don't beoo. There is no doubt.

[Sanichsan]

Quote: strannik1985

If you are talking about the Second World War, then in that war the spacecraft did not have artillery self-propelled guns.

excuse me, but what is SU122, SU152 and ISU152?

[strannik1985]

Assault, technically, PDO can shoot, but the main purpose is direct fire.

[Sanichsan]

Quote: strannik1985

Assault, technically, PDO can shoot, but the main purpose is direct fire.

and you are not confused? it seems like the main purpose is just like an ACS, but with the ability to use it as an assault. and in the name of the SU and in all sources it is classified as an ACS.
but the SU-76 is definitely not an assault gun

[strannik1985]

and you are not confused?

http://www.teatrskazka.com/Raznoe/SbornikBoevyhDokumentov/Issue21/Issue21_27.html
300-600 meters behind tanks or infantry.

[Sanichsan]

Quote: strannik1985

300-600 meters behind tanks or infantry.

and?
hmmm ... the very first lines:
"Until now, tank and combined-arms commanders use self-propelled artillery often incorrectly, using it without fire and tactical interaction with tanks, infantry and artillery, in front of the battle formations of infantry and tanks, that is, using self-propelled artillery installations (ACS) like tanks. "
and you say that they are not Note that it is the self-propelled artillery mounts (ACS), not the assault guns. the USSR really did not have such a class of equipment as assault guns. re-read the text of the document at your link. there is not a single mention of a shooter weapon.

[strannik1985]

and you say that they are not

These are the nuances of the designation - ACS NPP (direct infantry support) or an assault gun, the essence is the same. The conversation began with a mention of the "last war" and the patency of vehicles on a tracked base.

[Sanichsan]

Quote: strannik1985

These are the nuances of the designation - ACS NPP (direct support of the infantry) or an assault gun, the essence is the same.

understandably. I will not insist I see you are ready to write everything that ever fired directly into assault guns

[strannik1985]

Not me, but MO.
https://encyclopedia.mil.ru/encyclopedia/dictionary/details.htm?id=11930@morfDictionary
Are you fundamentally not interested in the beginning of the conversation?

[strannik1985]

Explainable why.

In theory, regimental (brigade) / divisional guns are better on a tracked base in order to pass tanks and infantry, and above the level, army ones are wheeled, operational mobility is better.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Fedorov

Explainable why.

Inexplicable. For the cross-country ability of the numerous towed artillery is even lower.

[Zaurbek]

Take action in Syria, Afghanistan, the Caucasus ... why pull a tracked howitzer there .... In Syria, Msta with a KamAZ tractor is successfully firing with might and main. And Baz will pass even more.

[garri-lin]

More information. Details.

[Reserve buildbat]

There is a suspicion that this "Malva" will be tested with 2A64, and will go into production with 2A83
Which would be very good

[Genry]

Quote: Stroibat stock

There is a suspicion that this ...

I wonder which doctor treats suspicions?

[rocket757]

Artillery is the GOD OF WAR !!!
Schaub was not invented there by couch "experts", real military men do not think that it is time to be scrapped!

[Zaurbek]

I wonder why the new gun, like on KamAZ, was not installed? And so, the idea is sane. The French put their 155mm cannon on 6x6 Renault and 8x8 Tatras with armored cabins.

[strannik1985]

Cheaper, 2A88 - a modular charge, new fuses, and under 2A64 the entire infrastructure is already there, and export.

[Zaurbek]

They wrote that the main weapon will be a new one.

[Pavel57]

BAZ-6010-027 with an 8x8 wheel arrangement produced by the Bryansk Automobile Plant, and not the Belarusian MZKT tractor - the option of import substitution, plus Bryansk must be loaded.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Pavel57

the option of import substitution, plus Bryansk must be loaded.

The entire Almaz-Antey is now working on loading Bryansk - BAZ is to replace all the chassis of the MZKT in the air defense.

[Zaurbek]

Their mass is different. MZKT 8X8 will be heavier.

[Tugarin]

There is something similar in Coast Defense.

[Denis Medvedev]

Coastal artillery complex "Bereg" on the MAZ-543 chassis

[Zaurbek]

KZKT .... which is no longer there.

[5-9]

I like the flower names of our artel .... But ... How is it better than Msta-B plus Kamaz or Ural? Is there any kind of mechanization there?

[Zaurbek]

Did you carry the gun? MT-12 for 3 tons weighs ... and here is a 152mm howitzer

[Ryaruav]

why one and the same howitzer cannon and towed both on a tracked chassis (the best option) and on a car chassis, I think this money would be for the further development of missile defense systems with high-precision ammunition, well, and close, medium distances for armored chassis

[Motorhead]

A beautiful product. Based on BAZ, a big plus.

[Kaw]

It seems that they were going to put the Coalition tower (with automatic loading and other buns) on a wheeled chassis. Instead, they made the most simplified version in which the calculation would have to carry 50 kg with their hands. shells, and even installed an obsolete gun from Msta

[Kaw]

This is how our plans differ from real life. They began to build a death star, and they built a corncob.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Kaw

It seems that they were going to put the Coalition tower (with automatic loading and other buns) on a wheeled chassis. Instead, they made the most simplified version in which the calculation would have to carry 50 kg with their hands. shells, and even installed an obsolete gun from Msta

Not instead of, but in parallel. "Petrel" made both "Coalition" on the basis of "Kamaz", and "budget" wheeled "Mstu" on the chassis of BAZ.

[Lara Croft]

As reported, as a firing component at the Malva Joint Stock Company is used 152-mm cannon 2A64 used in the Msta-S self-propelled guns. It is possible to install an upgraded version of this gun, but no data due to development secrecy.

The author of the article is apparently joking ...

2S19 "Msta-S" (S - self-propelled, in contrast to the towed gun 2A65 "Msta-B", adopted for service in 1986 year and having a swinging part similar to 2C19).

https://topwar.ru/4127-152-mm-samoxodnaya-gaubica-2s19-msta-s.html

[Denis Medvedev]

A good concept, but not new ... There was a project in the USSR on the basis of KRAZ, then at MAZ, on the 4-axle KAMAZ, the artillery component itself was the same 152 mm-MSTA

[Denis Medvedev]

In fact, the "Coalition" is a deep modernization of the "MST", compatible in terms of shells

[Kaw]

This is not a modernization. This Mstu was put on a wheeled chassis and greatly simplified. At Msta, at least, the charging process was partially mechanized.

[Zaurbek]

But in fact, they were loaded from the ground .... here, most likely there are some rammers. For such machines, the main thing is a long-range gun and corr shells.

[Kaw]

Quote: Spade

Very couch.
How poor and African do you think a country like France is?

Well, why be equal to the worst, and then, this self-propelled gun and Caesar is inferior in almost everything and in the firing range and the bulkiness and weight of the chassis.
They tried, did as the worst of what they do, just a little worse.

[V1er]

A-222 "Bereg" - Soviet and Russian coastal self-propelled artillery system (coastal defense artillery system) of 130 mm caliber

[Bad_gr]

Quote: V1er

A-222 "Beach"

As a variant of the layout for the wheeled "Coalition".
Only instead of the Mazov chassis to put BAZ.

[Cyril G ...]

And I personally like the flower ......... And what about her with horizontal guidance by the way. Sector 15-20 degrees? Who knows?

[Morglenn]

I really don't understand why a gun was stuck on it from the msta, if there is a better one from the coalition. Let's hope that this is just a prototype for running in systems

[paco.soto]

Neutral opinion: I tried to google the photo - this "Malva" is nowhere else. I was a little confused by the stability of the platform.

[Crimean partisan 1974]

Neutral opinion: ..... and I have a negative one ... the only thing that can be wished for the crews of these Malma so that the shovels would be strong, dig, there is no digger like on Msta, you have to dig the caponier for a long time and with diligence

[paco.soto]

Photo of the French counterpart on the platform and a slightly larger caliber.

[Evil 55]

Just for the desert ... I hope the vertical load and its implementation with a wheeled propeller will allow it to move at least on roads with improved surfaces.

[Zaurbek]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOXLT-EsZss&t=492s

[Normal ok]

I remember that only the lazy did not speak negatively about wheeled SPGs. It turns out that the matter was in the absence of its own.

[Radical]

Quote: VO3A

Why is it needed? It will be like everyone else from the trench to shoot with direct fire, or shoot at stationary rechecked targets that do not change their position in space and time!
We do not even include UAVs in the states of such systems and their SLAs ... We do not have target designation systems for such ART systems, and missile systems, too, in real time ... Each Chinese terminator has a full-time UAV and two kamikaze drones .. . And we have not only that there are no real-time target designation systems without people on the front end, including primitive full-time SLAs with ridiculous characteristics and people in them, so all UAVs are put in shelves .... The stupidity of our leaders is off the scale! They produce not what is needed, but what they know how ... and what it is and how it will work and whether it is necessary at all they do not know ... And the military in the person of the leaders, like rams follow the Supreme ... and that's all ... Stupid, but but the devotees ..

Respect!