Military Review

Intelligence services of tomorrow: the tensions of the thirties of the twentieth century

72

Yes, some tension caused by the latest actions of the country's power structures causes both fears and tension at the same time. All this reminds me too much of one who died in stories country. Soviet Union. Everything was about the same there at one time.


And today, to our great regret, more and more analogies arise. And one of the first - in the work of the special services.

A fresh example: the arrest of Ivan Safronov.

Specifically highlighted like this, on a separate line. Simply because this case perfectly illustrates everything that is happening in the country.

Yes, today the Internet is full of sayings "If someone was taken, then there is a reason." And as a continuation, if they took someone from the journalistic community, all the writing fraternity stand up like a mountain for their own, and it does not matter whether it is fair or not. The main thing is to raise a cry.

I absolutely do not urge you to shout. On the contrary, I urge you to think, think and think. This is more effective than jumping and shouting.

Although, if you think about it, the work of the "party" has its own logic. Let's just think: what if tomorrow someone is “accepted”, well, say, for a bag of white powder “found” in a pocket / car / house, apart from money, there are options not to end up behind bars?

Here ... It will not just be difficult for a common man in the street. It is incredibly difficult to get out of the situation, which we have already written on our pages more than once regarding the same Basov, Gorin, Zolotarev.

I support Ivan Safronov. That's right, yes. And not because it is a colleague in the shop. And because in his business there are not just a lot of "white" spots, but this whiteness cuts his eyes. As in the Golunov case, as in the Furgal case.

And, speaking in support of Ivan Safronov, I personally advocate not forgiveness of espionage in favor of our potential adversaries, but for the transparency of the work of our special services. Maximum, if possible.

“Treason to the Motherland” is a very cruel article. And if a person really betrayed his Motherland, then he should be punished in full. But in the event that everything is transparent, it is obvious and proven.

To make it clear that a person really, out of selfish or political motives, caused damage to our country by his actions. His guilt is proven, red-handed, and so on.

And we, excuse me, have a kindergarten, a younger group. The terribly classified "SVR general" said something like that. Terribly classified. But enough for the arrest of a journalist who began to work at Roscosmos. No security clearance. And the question is: what could Safronov convey to the Czechs? That everything is bad at Roscosmos? Yes, everyone knows this anyway, sorry.

Sorry, but this is more like a mess. Especially when you consider that Safronov not only does not admit at least some guilt, he is frankly impartial about the charges brought against him. And I predict that the investigation will have to work hard to make Ivan admit his guilt.

This level of "secrecy" is a very large field for various abuses. Or, as an option, - to neutralize the unwanted.

Which is basically the same thing.

For some reason I really do not want it in the 30s of the last century. It is strange, it seems that in the modern trend, many representatives of the authorities, including the president, speak out as critically as possible to everything that happened in those difficult Soviet times.

And - the same course? To arrests in the style of the NKVD, to "troikas"? What next?

I am not at all opposed to our special services being strong, skillful and well equipped. Capable of performing any task anywhere in the world.

But it is absolutely useless to transform the employees of all our abbreviations into gods, who, once in the "cage", will decide the fate of people with one stroke of the pen. And to that and goes, by the way.

All these "operational interests", "the need for secrecy" and other "leftist" documents, fictitious names and registration numbers are, of course, necessary. Until a certain time.

But the fact that the "treason", which still needs to be proved to Safronov (yes, so far, he will have to prove to the investigators that he cheated on the country), was discovered by some secret and unidentified "SVR general" - this creates tension ...

And here you can question a lot, and first of all the "general". It may well turn out that this is not a general, but, for example, a captain. From whom Safronov took the girl away. For example. Or that “general” was asked by some other persons interested, for example, in that Safronov vacated a post in Roscosmos for someone else.

In fact, you can assume anything, from personal motives to pointing from above. Because, apart from speculation, there is no evidence. The fact that Safronov encrypted data using a special program is not at all proof of his guilt.

And in general, why should we take the special services at their word? This, you know, after the Golunov case, which was rather illiterately fabricated, and therefore fell apart, is even somewhat naive.

Our special services, you know, can do some pretty strange things. As an example - the message about the works of the Investigative Committee of Russia.

Investigative Committee reported details of the investigation into the murder of Nicholas II and his family.

No, of course, it’s probably necessary to bring the matter to the end. Therefore, the investigators are working tirelessly together with the experts, figuring out whether it was possible to kill 11 people in that room or not.

"The Investigator for Highly Important Cases reported that 2015 forensic examinations have been ordered since the case was reopened in 37, including forensic (anthropological), molecular genetic, traceological and handwriting examinations."

Is it clear what the UK is doing? While we and a number of other patriotic media have been raising the issue of the illegal burial of the remains and the monument to the Italian fascists in the center of Rossosh for several years.

No, the Investigative Committee has something to do, rather than deal with the monument to the Nazis. I'll get better: monuments, since the Italians have erected more than one monument to their combat ancestors, as we wrote. Both the Voronezh and Belgorod regions were splashed with cock feathers.

But others are at war with the fascists. Investigative Committee of the Russian Federation is more interesting to establish with an accuracy of 200% the identity of Romanov Nikolai Alexandrovich. The rest ... Difficult to comment. One hope is that after the adoption of the new Constitution, things will go where they are supposed to go: to the expulsion of the fascists from the Russian land.

In general, today it is somehow a little ... reckless to take the intelligence services at their word. Considering that not everything is beautiful and smooth in their work. I would like more openness and transparency in work. Especially when it concerns our fellow citizens accused of serious crimes.

I would not like to make comparisons and analogies, but in the entire civilized world there exists and rules the presumption of the defendant's innocence. And the need to prove his guilt. But in totalitarian regimes, it is common for the special services to have the presumption of innocence.

We went through this in the time of Yagoda, Yezhov and partly Beria. Liked?

Since already today in the comments to many articles there have appeared “absolutely confident” in Safronov's guilt, it is possible, unfortunately, to conclude that the thinking among the masses has not changed much since those times.

But if so, then what should one expect the same attitude of the special services to each individual citizen?

Secret and unaccountable activities of the special services without proper coverage and analysis of actions, impunity and lack of discussion - this is the path that we already went through in the thirties. This is a path to a dead end, this is a path to rampant impunity, abuse, and the impossibility of properly influencing the work of special services. That is the way back.

As if somewhat not something worth striving for. Although, of course, the idea of ​​returning to the thirties may be very pleasant for some.

In the digital age, not only the life of every citizen, but also those who control it, must be accountable.
Author:
Photos used:
Anatoly Zhdanov, kommersant.ru/doc/4407012, ru.wikipedia.org
72 comments
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  1. Sidor Amenpodestovich
    Sidor Amenpodestovich 21 July 2020 12: 10 New
    +1
    Secret and unaccountable activities of special services without proper coverage and analysis of actions, impunity and lack of discussion - this is the path that we have already passed in the thirties.

    And in the war, the USSR won in spite of what is indicated in the quote, or thanks to?
    Or the actions of the special services in the thirties and forties, were not related to the war everywhere, not always and not in everything?
    1. Insurgent
      Insurgent 21 July 2020 12: 19 New
      +5
      Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
      And in the war, the USSR won in spite of what is indicated in the quote, or thanks to?

      Are you looking forward to an answer? Most likely it will not be no The article is hysterical, but it is not clear why it would be belay ?
      After all, especially, nothing beyond the usual work of the special services (with minor exceptions, where there really was a mean "setup") did not happen no .
      1. Sidor Amenpodestovich
        Sidor Amenpodestovich 21 July 2020 12: 22 New
        0
        Quote: Insurgent
        Are you looking forward to an answer?

        I would like to.
        I asked a simple question. It would be interesting to see the answer.
        1. NIKN
          NIKN 21 July 2020 13: 15 New
          +4
          The answer will not differ in competence, even if they deign to answer. You will only appreciate the arguments of the author, who confuses the special services, dumping everything in one heap, arrest for espionage is one thing, drugs is another. I especially liked
          Let's just think: what if tomorrow someone is "mistaken" for, say, a bag of white powder "found" in your pocket / car / home, ......

          Here ... It will not just be difficult for a common man in the street.
          It really won't be easy. Only the author has forgotten that there are special services that are fighting with these quotes and also like the special services.
          I would like to find out what exactly the author was so afraid of the special services, is there a reason? Or he, like all others like him, is concerned with protecting others, which is not up to himself, others would be good.
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          3. Insurgent
            Insurgent 21 July 2020 13: 44 New
            +3
            Quote: NIKNN
            I would like to find out what exactly the author was so afraid of the special services, is there a reason?

            Do you think that the author was "pinched" something? Hardly no
            It's just that he suddenly became generally terrified for the liberal get-together, which was slightly shaken.

            And to make everything described in the article look more terrible, he mixed together politics, and outright crime, and treason ...

            So, in his opinion - more satisfying ...
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        2. credo
          credo 21 July 2020 13: 49 New
          +2
          Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
          Quote: Insurgent
          Are you looking forward to an answer?

          I would like to.
          I asked a simple question. It would be interesting to see the answer.

          Yes, here is the answer of the "professional journalism" -
          "... And we have, forgive me, a kindergarten, a junior group. A terribly classified" SVR general "told something like that. Awfully classified. But enough to arrest a journalist who began to work at Roscosmos. Without access to secret And the question is: what could Safronov convey to the Czechs? That everything is bad in Roscosmos? Yes, everyone knows that anyway, sorry .... ".
          It is immediately clear who we know best of the investigative business and jurisprudence, the space industry and access to classified materials, the methods of work of intelligence agencies of different countries, including Russia, where he went, what he did and what materials Safronov I. was allowed to use in Roscosmos, etc. .d. etc. - this is the author of the article, Roman Skomorokhov.
          Maybe, after all, such a professional should sometimes read the Constitution of the Russian Federation and bylaws, where it is written in black and white about the presumption of innocence and other "trifles" of a legal nature, which are now used by I. Safronov and his lawyers.
          No hysteria. If you have any valuable and reliable information that can refute the arguments and evidence of the investigation, you should have presented it to I. Safronov's lawyers, and not sprinkle everyone and everything with utter nonsense, just because they "encroached" on the holy of holies white and furry journalists.
        3. Doctor
          Doctor 21 July 2020 17: 55 New
          +6
          I asked a simple question. It would be interesting to see the answer.

          The answer is also simple. The special services have patted the beginning of the war.
          Because of this, the end of the state almost came.

          Excuses like "Sorge warned ..." do not roll. Today reports from agents are open, they are extremely contradictory and changeable.

          The state leadership did not have convincing information about Hitler's intentions, and even more so about the timing - this is a fact.
      2. Senka naughty
        Senka naughty 21 July 2020 18: 01 New
        +2
        If "liberalism" shouts about "white spots in the case", about the lack of transparency of the investigation, then they have taken the right person! Protecting the traitors, pests and enemies of the country should be included under the article, so that these defenders do not muddy the waters and openly provoke the masses to revolt. After all, not one of them, there is no irrefutable evidence of the innocence of the accused, only slogans .. And this is already political sabotage, I do not understand why it is still not punishable in Russia, as is done in all "democratic" countries of the West, and at what very long and hard.
    2. Svarog
      Svarog 21 July 2020 13: 10 New
      11
      Since already today in the comments to many articles there have appeared “absolutely confident” in Safronov's guilt, it is possible, unfortunately, to conclude that the thinking among the masses has not changed much since those times.

      Today, trusting the authorities or the executors is absolutely stupid ... I would say hopelessly stupid. In a country where money and connections rule, where justice works as the customer needs .. the internet is full of videos showing how judges, officials and even FSB graduates live and spend their leisure time ..
      And in general, to question and be critical is normal .. here is to swallow what the media chew for you .. without thinking and not looking at alternative versions .. this is not normal
      And I totally agree with that:
      And here you can question a lot, and first of all the "general". It may well turn out that this is not a general, but, for example, a captain. From whom Safronov took the girl away. For example. Or that “general” was asked by some other persons interested, for example, in that Safronov vacated a post in Roscosmos for someone else.
      1. aleksejkabanets
        aleksejkabanets 21 July 2020 14: 02 New
        +5
        Quote: Svarog
        Today, trusting the authorities or the executors is absolutely stupid ... I would say hopelessly stupid. In a country where money and connections rule, where justice works as the customer needs .. the internet is full of videos showing how judges, officials and even FSB graduates live and spend their leisure time ..
        And in general, to question and be critical is normal .. here is to swallow what the media chew for you .. without thinking and not looking at alternative versions .. this is not normal

        The "guards" are not interested at all. Their program is laid down: "Everything that the authorities do, under the leadership of the great Pu, is correct, but there is no room for criticism and doubts. Otherwise, you are a liberal and are financed by the insidious State Department."
        1. Normal ok
          Normal ok 21 July 2020 18: 27 New
          +1
          The site's defenders of the FSB somehow miss such an important point as the staff of the current FSB. And these are exactly the same graduates of the FSB academy who in 2016 cut across Moscow in Gelendvagens (and their comrades from senior courses). Then they showed well what they consider the most important in life: money and power. Therefore, to move upwards, they will catch 100500 "spies", even where they are not. And now they have been given practically uncontrollable power. And this is really dangerous for the state and society.
    3. aleksejkabanets
      aleksejkabanets 21 July 2020 14: 11 New
      +8
      Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
      And in the war, the USSR won in spite of what is indicated in the quote, or thanks to?

      And the USSR won the war not in spite of or thanks to it, but because the USSR managed to develop a powerful economy, military industry, built food and medical security, which, by the way, today's Russia cannot boast of. And also the Soviet man fought for the conquests of October (which have now been destroyed), and not for the interests of the Chubais and Potanins.
      Did I answer your provocative question?
      1. Sidor Amenpodestovich
        Sidor Amenpodestovich 21 July 2020 14: 18 New
        -7
        And the USSR won the war not in spite of or thanks to it, but because the USSR managed to develop a powerful economy, military industry, built food and medical security,

        What was the role of the special services in securing everything you have listed?
        And also the Soviet man fought for the conquests of October (which have now been destroyed), and not for the interests of the Chubais and Potanins.
        Did I answer your provocative question?

        Didn't answer. Because they slipped from an attempt at an objective assessment of the actions of the special services, in particular, to an assessment of the political system in general. "Before everything was good, but now everything is very bad."
        If you want, I can explain why you think that it was better before than now.
        1. Svarog
          Svarog 21 July 2020 14: 20 New
          10
          Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
          "Before everything was good, but now everything is very bad."

          Previously, it was different, but there was a result .. and now the result is not just not there .. it is negative.
          1. Sidor Amenpodestovich
            Sidor Amenpodestovich 21 July 2020 14: 28 New
            -5
            Quote: Svarog
            Previously, it was different, but there was a result .. and now the result is not just not there .. it is negative.

            I have repeatedly asked you a question to which you have never answered.

            What do you personally lack? Neither the president, nor the government, nor the state apparatus in general.
            Personally, what are you missing?
            1. Svarog
              Svarog 21 July 2020 14: 39 New
              +8
              Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
              Personally, what are you missing?

              If you really wanted to know this, then from my comments it would not be difficult to guess laughing
              about repeatedly .. it's strange, you can see under different nicknames write .. But I will answer, in general, when they are not rude, I always answer .. well, if this is not explicit trolling and there is time laughing ..
              Just not what is missing .. but what I personally need ..
              -In a socially oriented state
              -In a state that I could be proud of .. science, education, medicine, high technology, developed industry and other attributes of a developed state .. but not African countries ..
              -In a state where the rule of law is not idle chatter .. but reality
              -In a state in which resources are fairly distributed, and not owned by a narrow group of persons by prior conspiracy ..
              -In a state where everything possible is done for the development of a citizen
              -In a state where everyone has equal opportunities
              -In a state where my children and grandchildren can find their purpose ..
              In general, the list can be long .. hi
              1. Sidor Amenpodestovich
                Sidor Amenpodestovich 21 July 2020 14: 56 New
                -6
                You propose general criteria, provisions, but my question was quite specific.
                Please answer it.
                What do you personally lack? No nostalgia. What do you personally lack now?

                My nickname is the same as it was indicated at the first - and, at the moment, the last - registration. You can freely verify this. I don't use multiacchi.
                1. Svarog
                  Svarog 21 July 2020 14: 59 New
                  +8
                  Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
                  What do you personally lack?

                  Below Igor supplemented my comment .. But it is organic and in tune with mine .. one follows from the other ..
                  1. Sidor Amenpodestovich
                    Sidor Amenpodestovich 21 July 2020 15: 15 New
                    -2
                    I understand that you are not against modern Russia, but against your slowly fading forces. But such is the flow of time, nothing can be done about it.
                    "Yes, there were people these days,
                    Not that the current tribe.
                    Heroes are not you! "
            2. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 21 July 2020 14: 42 New
              10
              Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
              Personally, what are you missing?

              Let me answer your template question. Personally, I lack confidence in the future, happy faces on the streets, because people are clouded with financial instability.
              I also miss the feeling of pride in my country, which was in the late 70s. The country is degrading in all areas.
              You are asking rhetorical questions. For if I'm full at the moment, this does not mean that I do not care about a starving neighbor. And that I have no right to resent the fact that he is being starved.
              1. Sidor Amenpodestovich
                Sidor Amenpodestovich 21 July 2020 14: 54 New
                -6
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                I also miss the feeling of pride in my country, which was in the late 70s. The country is degrading in all areas.

                How old were you then? A little over twenty? Full of strength and health, cheerfulness. Not like now, right?
                Once you were twenty, and now over sixty. But is the state to blame for this?
                1. Ingvar 72
                  Ingvar 72 21 July 2020 14: 59 New
                  11
                  Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
                  Not like now, right?

                  And why should I understand and forgive the fact that free medicine, free sections, education have not become? Should I look calmly at how my homeland is being sold and my people harassed? belay
                  1. Sidor Amenpodestovich
                    Sidor Amenpodestovich 21 July 2020 15: 24 New
                    -3
                    Quote: Ingvar 72
                    free medicine is gone

                    For example, I recently pulled three teeth completely free of charge. My friend's mom gets a bunch of drugs for free.
                    Another friend's niece is studying for free at the university.
                    And this is by no means trolling. I know you exclusively within this site. I absolutely don't need to lie to you. I know I am telling the truth. And how you perceive it is always up to you.
                    With all due respect.
                    1. Fitter65
                      Fitter65 21 July 2020 16: 23 New
                      +8
                      Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
                      For example, I recently pulled three teeth completely free of charge.

                      And where can such happiness be? In our village hospital, it seems like there is a dentist's office, but the doctor was reduced, I apologize, optimized. And all questions with acute pain either to the district clinic, by appointment, or at the same time to a paid stomatology.
                      Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
                      My friend's mom gets a bunch of drugs for free.

                      And my wife's mom is also entitled to a bunch of free drugs, but she does not receive it. NOT AVAILABLE. I also got some medications, free of charge, but first I had to go through a commission every year to confirm that my bronchial asthma had not resolved, and the medication was prescribed for me. Well, the commission is true, too, you don't have to go through thanks, and at work for this couple of days (at best) you take at your own expense - even a minus from the family budget. Moreover, medicines are given out only in one pharmacy, at best you receive or the expiration date ends in 3-4 days, or in general, there are no medicines for the beneficiaries.
                      Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
                      Another friend's niece is studying for free at the university.

                      My friend's son also graduated from the university for free. True, it was a Higher Military Educational Institution ... But to enter budgetary places in a civilian university is a problem ...
                      1. Sidor Amenpodestovich
                        Sidor Amenpodestovich 21 July 2020 16: 28 New
                        -4
                        I tell you how it is. Hope you don't think I'm wishful thinking.
                        In any case, I am not able to convince you of the veracity of my words. Therefore, you have to either believe me or not. Your will.
                      2. Ingvar 72
                        Ingvar 72 21 July 2020 21: 50 New
                        +3
                        Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
                        I tell you how it is

                        Where do you live? Can I bring my wife to you for removal? wink
                    2. Svarog
                      Svarog 21 July 2020 16: 43 New
                      +7
                      Quote: Fitter65
                      And where can such happiness be?

                      In Moscow, most likely, there is still free medicine ... and not bad.
                      I lived for 5 years I know .. I was amazed that you can get to a narrow specialist, for example, an ultrasound scan within a week ..
                      I also got some medications, free of charge, but first I had to go to go through a commission every year - to confirm, h

                      My mother died of oncology .. so nerves and time were spent on medications not measured .. On New Year's Eve, the vital medicine always ran out and there was no two months, while there was a choice to buy for big money (one ampoule, if the memory is not changes 20 t) .. or wait for it to arrive ..
                      But to enroll in budgetary places in a civilian university is a problem ...

                      And in 2025 it will become practically impossible, according to the plan, there will be a reduction in budget places and there will be some meager percentage of applicants.
                  2. Ingvar 72
                    Ingvar 72 21 July 2020 21: 48 New
                    +3
                    Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
                    For example, I recently pulled three teeth completely free of charge.

                    They demanded 12 tons from my wife. For the removal of a complex wisdom tooth. And this is not official. Officially 17.
              2. Svarog
                Svarog 21 July 2020 15: 02 New
                +7
                Quote: Sydor Amenpospestovich
                Once you were twenty, and now over sixty. But is the state to blame for this?

                Either you have a bad perception of information and in such cases I always offer to pass a non-verbal test .. there are a lot of them on the Internet, if you wish, you will find .. it will help you to know yourself and your abilities .. or is it stupid trolling
                1. Sidor Amenpodestovich
                  Sidor Amenpodestovich 21 July 2020 15: 21 New
                  -4
                  Quote: Svarog
                  or is it dumb trolling

                  Dumb trolling can, if desired, explain any uncomfortable questions.
                  But does this have anything to do with reality, other than the desire to self-justify?
  2. Vlad T
    Vlad T 22 July 2020 21: 16 New
    0
    Strange anxiety of the author, who did not read the full accusation, all the more so of the whole case. Safronov has repeatedly been invited to talks with the FSB about activities and military secrets. It means not a beginner, he could not but know the consequences of treacherous actions. And a person familiar to the FSB is delayed with the presentation of a charge of a crime connected, as it was said earlier, - treason. Why is the author so embarrassed, after all, it was not the powder that was planted, information crimes should always have a foundation, the sources of such information for accusation are often unspoken, or rather classified foreign ones, - the specifics of the crime ... Perhaps the author has something that causes nervous tremors with such " innocent victims, "and such concern ...
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  • Livonetc
    Livonetc 21 July 2020 12: 19 New
    +2
    Article quality farce.
    Guard, hooligans are depriving of sight!
    1. WIKI
      WIKI 21 July 2020 12: 27 New
      0
      It seems to me that all the same, in the end, they will find an extreme in the case of a drilled hole.
    2. neri73-r
      neri73-r 21 July 2020 14: 01 New
      -3
      Quote: Livonetc
      Article quality farce.
      Guard, hooligans are depriving of sight!

      Yes, I agree, the author is far from operational work, reasoning on this topic at the level of a kindergarten. "Some unidentified" SVR general "" that's a blunder. Here recently an article was posted on the resource as one photo of the control room, all the secret objects in the Urals were calculated by experts in the states, and here give transparency fool The author does not think that then somewhere beyond the hill our scout will be shod with sandals? This is a question of transparency, but of course there are questions about the professionalism of our operational and investigative bodies, and of the courts. Especially when people are judged, for example for bribes, only on the testimony of persons who have concluded a pre-trial agreement, in the absence of other evidence, this is already 37th (in a liberal interpretation) smacks of.
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  • Cyril G ...
    Cyril G ... 21 July 2020 12: 38 New
    0
    To arrests in the style of the NKVD, to "troikas"? What next?

    Mr. Skomorokhov, what do you know about "troikas" and arrests? Here's what I'm really interested in.
  • Fibrizio
    Fibrizio 21 July 2020 12: 46 New
    -2
    I read the comments, the impression is that the most active questions not to the author of the article, but to the current socio-economic system, or rather its denial and rejection. And under the motto "it used to be better", everything is assessed.
    1. Insurgent
      Insurgent 21 July 2020 13: 00 New
      -2
      Quote: Fibrizio
      I read the comments, the impression is that the most active questions not to the author of the article, but to the current socio-economic system, or rather its denial and rejection.

      What other questions can there be for the author, if with this article he turned all his insides on display?

      I read the article, and everything became clear to me both about its direction and about the author's political position.

      Comments From him superfluous yes
  • Krasnoyarsk
    Krasnoyarsk 21 July 2020 12: 51 New
    +9
    = And, speaking in support of Ivan Safronov, I personally speak not for forgiveness of espionage in favor of our potential adversaries, but for the transparency of the work of our special services. Maximum, if possible. =
    That is, Roman, are you not satisfied with the current level of transparency of the special services? Who will determine the degree of transparency? You? Or the leaders of these same special services?
    No, I am asking the question without intent. Who defines this very level and in what units of measurement?
    And another question - if you were an employee of these special services, would you also stand up for this very transparency?
    = And the question is: what could Safronov convey to the Czechs? =
    And on your assumption that he could not convey anything, did you build your line of defense for Safronov and accusations against the special services? Famously!
    = This level of "secrecy" is a very large field for various abuses. Or, as an option, - to neutralize the unwanted. =
    Is Safronov objectionable to the authorities? Yes, this is a bump out of the blue, how could he threaten the authorities? That's not the point. And in what? The court will answer this question. I suppose Safronov will have good lawyers?
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    1. Alexey RA
      Alexey RA 21 July 2020 13: 55 New
      +1
      Quote: Vovan
      Another, with the owl's ears stretching over the globe, is agitation from the category - liberals can do anything, they can just go on.

      Not to liberals - to media workers. They are, by definition, crystal clear people and should be above suspicion. Better yet, be immune from all persecution. And then freedom of speech in our country will reach unprecedented heights. smile
  • BARKAS
    BARKAS 21 July 2020 13: 06 New
    +3
    And I wonder how the author knows that there are blank spots in the criminal case, he read it? And what does it mean that they were arrested without having evidence, evidence is presented in court and not during arrest, while in the west the evidence is often classified so much that even the accused are not introduced to it.
    1. Insurgent
      Insurgent 21 July 2020 13: 12 New
      +3
      Quote: BARKAS
      And I wonder how the author knows that there are blank spots in the criminal case, he read it?

      Author,I've been everywhere, I've seen everything, and knows everything about everything yes
      He knows how to properly heat a hospital, how to make a rocket to Mars, how to manage special services, how to administer justice, and in the end - of course, "How to equip Russia", exactly" according to Solzhenitsyn "...
  • Cruorvult
    Cruorvult 21 July 2020 13: 16 New
    0
    I / We Safronov performed by Skomorokhov, when to wait for I / We are Furgal ?!
    1. The comment was deleted.
  • Woodman
    Woodman 21 July 2020 13: 28 New
    0
    A fresh example: the arrest of Ivan Safronov.

    Specifically highlighted like this, on a separate line
    It would be better if they remembered the anniversary of the 80 Olympics ... But there was not a single line ...
    The 1980 Summer Olympic Games (the official name is Games of the XXII Olympiads) were held in Moscow, the capital of the USSR, from July 19 to August 3, 1980. These were the first ever Olympic Games in Eastern Europe, as well as the first Olympic Games held in a socialist country.
    1. Insurgent
      Insurgent 21 July 2020 13: 33 New
      +2
      Quote: Lesovik
      It would be better if they remembered the anniversary of the 80 Olympics ... But there was not a single line ...

      The article was.
      https://topwar.ru/173244-40-let-nazad-startovali-letnie-olimpijskie-igry-v-moskve.html#comment-id-10605731
      1. Woodman
        Woodman 21 July 2020 13: 38 New
        0
        Quote: Insurgent
        The article was.

        Thank you, you see, I missed it ... At home, repairs, emergency at work ...
        PS Claims to VO on this matter are removed)
    2. bar
      bar 21 July 2020 14: 49 New
      -2
      It would be better if they remembered the anniversary of the 80 Olympics ... But there was not a single line ...

      In the club of all-propals, the mention of something good is bad manners.
  • Kochegarkin
    Kochegarkin 21 July 2020 13: 30 New
    +2
    A very strange article, "... horses, people mixed in a heap ...". The author also mentioned Safronov, and Furgal, and Nikolai ... why would that be?
    Not being an ardent supporter of the current government, I will always oppose the revolution in the state, from which I will add my 5 kopecks to the criticism of the article.
    At all times, all the special services of all states worked for the good of the government, and occasionally for the good of themselves, with the aim of becoming the government itself. It has already been said about the "level of transparency" - who will determine? The question is also that writing about involvement and innocence without knowing the material of the case is not a very rewarding occupation.
    So, for example, in the Furgal case, very unpleasant facts emerge, and the bribery of employees of the Khabarovsk Investigative Committee, and witnesses in the case of organizing murders, and documentary evidence of Furgal's involvement in crimes, and not just involvement, but directly organizations, and what will they say to this those who went to the rallies the truth believing in the innocence of Furgal? The same with Safronov can happen, and maybe the situation with Golunov will repeat itself. Therefore, one should not rush things, and it would be worth waiting for the court's decision, which will make it, a decision based on all the facts and evidence, most of which the public should not know. If you say - "we do not trust our courts and investigators" - then everyone who says so is one way - to the station, and look for "honest" courts and investigative bodies, on the Moon or Mars. or in the constellation Ursa Major and Ursa Minor. Well, we do not have absolutely honest and incorruptible, and will not be ("... I have no other writers for you ..." I. Stalin) ... but this is not a reason to disbelieve absolutely everyone.
    A person is weak in spirit and greedy for money and power, it is possible to bribe both the judge and the investigator - in the Furgal case, there is evidence of bribery of snoopers in favor of Furgal, now let snoopers and judges bribed by the state work ...
    I do not know...

    author - what are you talking about?
  • Knell wardenheart
    Knell wardenheart 21 July 2020 13: 33 New
    +2
    Like it or not, as information technology develops, the issues of "secrecy" will become increasingly blurred ..
    In general, I am very interested in how a person who is a journalist got access to such classified information. It's a pure conflict of interest
    1. iouris
      iouris 21 July 2020 13: 40 New
      +1
      Quote: Knell Wardenheart
      as information technology develops, the issues of "secrecy" will become increasingly blurred.

      More precisely, you need to express your thought: the state - the Russian Federation will be "blurred", and, in the end, it will be "blurred".
      1. Knell wardenheart
        Knell wardenheart 21 July 2020 14: 19 New
        +3
        I am afraid that I will express a rather sad point of view, which is being rejected at the root by the mass of the VO reading public - but I have fears that in the 21st century our country may be overtaken by the fate of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. This is a natural result for states that are unable to effectively assimilate all their constituent parts to a single ethnic group, on the one hand, and incapable of organizing effective mechanisms for the growth of regions and human well-being within a single country, on the other. The collapse of the USSR was a prophetic model of what we can get in the future - if we don't get down to work in the most serious way, turning 180 degrees from the current course / pace and habits. When an empire is held by military strength or the passivity of the population, these are all negative integration factors that drain the economy, stand in the way of innovation and in the choice of "effective development" always lead such a country along the path of a controversial compromise (less harmful) or political populism (more harmful). The chanting and mythologization of the history of a common, while maintaining the degree of freedom of identity of individual ethnic groups and their cultures, creates a bad precedent for potential nationalist speculations and fertile ground for rejecting the entire common layer in one day - which we observe in a significant proportion of the former republics of the USSR, in one generation turned everything inside out. It is foolish and dangerous to think that our republics are insured or immune to this. In the issue of "development or further brainwashing" we increasingly rely on the latter, allowing our political system, media, law enforcement agencies to degrade - all this has a limit of strength. History gave us 30 years so that we could comprehend the lessons of the collapse of the USSR and draw conclusions - we are not made them, continuing to be in the mood of vigorous id * otism and relying on nasyalnike as a lamp of competence and a source of grace.
        So information security is the least of all our problems, which today have accumulated a little less than a mountain.
        1. iouris
          iouris 21 July 2020 14: 23 New
          +1
          Quote: Knell Wardenheart
          in the 21st century, our country can be comprehended by the fate of the Austro-Hungarian Empire

          Can not. Austria-Hungary is Europe. Only the fate of the Indians of North America can "comprehend" us (they will deprive us of resources, sew up our pockets and tear off our collars).
  • parusnik
    parusnik 21 July 2020 13: 58 New
    +7
    Roman, take off your glasses with pink lenses ... For example, the Serdyukov case, has long put everything in its place ... And not only it ...
  • Operator
    Operator 21 July 2020 14: 06 New
    -2
    "I support Ivan Safronov, who is accused of espionage," - R. Skomorokhov, foreign agent.
  • Glory1974
    Glory1974 21 July 2020 14: 12 New
    +7
    a year in Russia about 150 people are tried for treason. It's just that this journalist is a famous person, so he got into the newspapers.
    More questions as to why the FSB does not deal with obvious pests who refuse to restore the production of our aircraft, roof casinos in the Moscow region, send money to offshore companies, deceive equity holders, etc.
    Everything is according to the Antibiotic principle, from the famous filmmaker: "Steal a sack of potatoes and you will lose your health in prison. Steal in wagons and you will be a respectable businessman."
    1. iouris
      iouris 21 July 2020 14: 21 New
      0
      Quote: glory1974
      More questions as to why the FSB does not deal with obvious pests

      To ask such questions, you urgently need to become president.
    2. iouris
      iouris 22 July 2020 13: 21 New
      0
      Quote: glory1974
      in Russia about 150 people are tried for treason.

      I don't know who is being tried, but state traitors every day teach me how to live in rating programs.
  • The comment was deleted.
    1. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 21 July 2020 14: 55 New
      +7
      Quote: ioan-e
      And persons oh won't it crack?

      And what is the problem of openness in the area of ​​the accusatory and evidentiary part? Without voice acting of classified information? All the more, crimes are charged while working as a journalist.
      It's just that this is not the first time that journalists have "arrived" for the fact that they poke their noses into the financial affairs of the FSB and the Ministry of Defense, and not professional ones.
      And there are suspicions that this case is no exception. hi
      1. ioan-e
        ioan-e 21 July 2020 15: 38 New
        +3
        The problem is that the materials of the criminal case during the investigation are not disclosed even for a banal pickpocket, and here we are talking about treason!
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        Quote: ioan-e
        And persons oh won't it crack?

        All the more, crimes are charged while working as a journalist.

        Is a journalist some kind of a privileged caste in a special position? Can he not be responsible for his actions, and even more so for what he writes?
        1. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 21 July 2020 21: 35 New
          +1
          Quote: ioan-e
          the materials of the criminal case during the investigation are not disclosed even by a banal pickpocket,

          Have you read the Criminal Procedure Code at least once? About access to the case file?
          Quote: ioan-e
          Can he not be responsible for his actions, and even more so for what he writes?

          Should answer. But strictly according to the law. And within the framework of the law.
          1. ioan-e
            ioan-e 22 July 2020 10: 12 New
            0
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            Have you read the Criminal Procedure Code at least once? About access to the case file?


            Criminal Procedure Code of the Russian Federation Article 161. Inadmissibility of disclosing the data of preliminary investigation

            Quote: Ingvar 72
            Should answer. But strictly according to the law. And within the framework of the law.


            So wait until the end of the investigation and the transfer of the case to the court!
            1. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 22 July 2020 12: 51 New
              +1
              Quote: ioan-e
              Code of Criminal Procedure Article 161.

              Is it weak to disassemble the article point by point? wink After all, there are stipulated cases when publicity is allowed and when not.
              Preliminary investigation of criminal cases and, moreover, judicial consideration are not secret activities, unless, of course, the content of the criminal case itself is not related to information constituting a state secret
              1. ioan-e
                ioan-e 22 July 2020 13: 45 New
                -1
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                Is it weak to disassemble the article point by point? After all, there are stipulated cases when publicity is allowed and when not.

                It's even interesting, but what do you think, the investigation of espionage and treason falls under state secrets? What more do you want? Wait for the trial, then be indignant!
  • depressant
    depressant 21 July 2020 15: 48 New
    +3
    The first thought that arose when they took Safronov was digging under Rogozin. He became displeased - a journalist, not an engineer, not Musk, frankly speaking, things are not going well in Roscosmos, but, in fact, they don't get along so well that the blogger boils and constantly mocks the name, the figure becomes odious, and now , see for yourself: come in whoever you want, steal what you want and even top-secret information.
    On the other hand, Rogozin is extremely loyal to Putin and once in one of the programs on Echo of Moscow called himself the president's watchdog. It seems that this was when the Rodina party, which he headed, had just been liquidated. The Echovites called him in the hope that they would say a lot in the direction of Putin, and he took and called himself a dog, for which he received the post of a representative from Russia to some NATO structure. So, Rogozin, at least in words, is extremely loyal to the president, and therefore it will not be easy to remove him and put a more sensible person on Roscosmos - the "friends" will be terrified and fearful. Although they know that everyone walks under special folders, an uncontrollable panic with unpredictable consequences may begin ...
    After being exiled to NATO, the career of "the president's watchdog" went up: Putin loves dogs, they are loyal to the owner. But Rogozin, in my opinion, is not so simple. This work in the structure of NATO ... I do not know how anyone, but I still have a sediment. Although the spoons seem to be in place. It seems to be. And Rogozin's work looks like outright sabotage. Under Stalin, they would definitely put them up against the wall. Who is Rogozin really? The arrest of a journalist from the Rogozin office is not a hint? Like, leave yourself, while in an amicable way. I wouldn't be surprised.
    And how could Safronov get comfortable in that office in two months so that he began to receive secret information and pass it on to the Czechs? From whose hands did you receive it? This is important.
    If we assume that he was not transmitting space information, but military information obtained earlier, why did they not take it at the same time - when he had been quietly extracting for a long time? Everything magically cleared up as soon as you got a job with Rogozin? A very useful person to discredit the bosses! Without knowing it. Or knowing?
    And quite banal - someone crossed the road, there was a competition for applicants for a place. Someone did not like Rogozin's decision. But then it turns out: someone doesn't like a person, a whistle to the special services, and - there was a person, there is no person, they rolled it up. What kind of special services are they? Hard to believe.
    In general, this is a dark matter. And so far, the journalist looks like a victim of intra-clan showdown.
  • nikvic46
    nikvic46 21 July 2020 16: 24 New
    +3
    I cannot say anything about the Safronov case. The head of Roscosmos spoke positively about him. The author mentioned fascism. About this phenomenon everything seems to be clear. But now there is a permission to use the fascist swastika for educational purposes. Is there nothing else to do with education? The presenter of the Russia-1 channel spoke interestingly about the leader of the Italian fascists. If he had shortcomings, it was his interest in women.
  • nikvic46
    nikvic46 21 July 2020 16: 51 New
    +1
    Nice photo. We had a general speaking. "I keep telling my border guards at the checkpoint. Why are you checking foreign citizens with such stern faces. I went abroad. He will check you with a smile so there is no doubt, he is a real professional."
  • Vovan
    Vovan 21 July 2020 19: 11 New
    +1
    :) Ha-ha, I see that the 30s have already arrived in the comments: freedom of speech is only for the right guys - we will consume the comments of the others in the best tradition of liberalism.
  • Gray-haired
    Gray-haired 21 July 2020 22: 25 New
    0
    @we already passed once in the thirties @ after, and who are we, and when you graduated from kindergarten with honors, what are you peculiar?
  • igorra
    igorra 22 July 2020 08: 31 New
    0
    It is interesting to watch the respected Roman slide into rabid criticism of the Putin government. Cofucius said to mine - everything is not what it seems and not vice versa. Judging by the modern media about something is the height of idiocy.
  • Maxim364364
    Maxim364364 22 July 2020 09: 01 New
    0
    In general, the hysteria in the media is not understandable, he himself is inclined to think that the special services do not hold fools, to sign a verdict in incompetence by arresting an employee of Rogozin's apparatus without rechecking the evidence base 100 times, it means that he was bargaining for information. The rest of the court will sort it out.
  • depressant
    depressant 22 July 2020 09: 40 New
    +1
    And I am not abandoned by the thought of Roscosmos itself. After all, among other things, it is also "defense".
    In the early 80s, there was such an engineer - Adolf Tolkachev. He worked in the top-secret research institute of radio engineering "Phazotron". The thirst to live beautifully, although by Soviet standards he lived so beautifully, but he wanted more, pushed him to betrayal, and he gave the CIA information about radar stations for fighters and means of detecting and targeting guided missiles of the "air-to-air" and "air-to-air" type. - Earth". At that time, the USSR was seriously ahead of the States in this kind of development. The United States achieved a breakthrough much later and not without Tolkachev's help. As a result, further modernization and production of the MiG-23 and SU-17 were discontinued due to the loss of meaning, and these are a series of fighters of 10 thousand units (then such was the scale). Through the efforts of Tolkachev, some important information about the MiG-31, SU-24, SU-24M, SU-27 leaked ...
    According to the testimony of specialists, Tolkachev turned huge aviation regiments into a heap of metal in several years, their combat effectiveness was reduced to zero.
    This is how the USSR was destroyed.
    I believe that from this point of view, Roscosmos deserves the closest attention from the side of the special services, taking into account the fact that now a beautiful life is its meaning. But do we still have impeccable counterintelligence agents loyal to the country? You can't forbid them to live beautifully, too.

    To create a comment, an article from LIFE magazine dated August 10, 2019 "The Killer of the Defense Industry" was used. How an ordinary engineer helped the CIA to destroy the Soviet Union. "
  • iouris
    iouris 22 July 2020 17: 37 New
    0
    Quote: "And - on the same course? To arrests in the NKVD style, to troikas? And then?" End of quote.
    Churchill interned half of the British aristocracy, and threatened the former King Edward VIII with a military tribunal because it was a war. Hey, Churchill, come!
  • Skifotavr
    Skifotavr 3 August 2020 00: 36 New
    -1
    FSB and SBU today imprison ordinary people for a purchased Chinese pen or lighter with a built-in video camera. It is accused as an illegal spyware. And it's not a joke. Is it worth explaining what is in the power of these two countries?